Question:

I have no idea of your motives BUT one thing I do know, DO NOT EVER SEND ME a private email again. 14 who was just wonder what your original post was meant to convey and who is now pissed that you sent me a private post.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –     This is confusing.  Did you believe me to have a nepharious motive?  I don’t know what your motive is since I don’t know you.  I don’t believe you know me.  Let’s keep it that way shall we? 14 Hi all,     This posting was kindly provided to me by Lynda Cunningham. -snipped to save bandwidth-

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    This is confusing.  Did you believe me to have a nepharious motive?  I don’t know what your motive is since I don’t know you.  I don’t believe you know me.  Let’s keep it that way shall we?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – 14 Hi all,     This posting was kindly provided to me by Lynda Cunningham. -snipped to save bandwidth-

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14

Hi all,     This posting was kindly provided to me by Lynda Cunningham.

-snipped to save bandwidth-

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    I did not realize it would upset you.  You can be certain I won’t send you a private e-mail again.  I promise.  But you do not have any right whatsoever to show such agression to me about it.  If you wish to protect your privacy then don’t include your e-mail address.  It is a simple matter to remove it.     My original post was intended to be helpful and interesting, nothing more.  It arose from the presence of the very disagreable post concerning cr**lty to animals.  I feared that a cross-posted item like that would harm the "nice" (I was sure fooled) atmosphere I found here.     You go ahead and be "pissed" at me.  But if you don’t want to recieve e-mails again in future it is your responsibility to remove your e-mail something.     Don’t worry.  I have removed you from my contacts list as I reserve that for friends.  And since I intend to forget about you, it doesn’t matter a tinker’s damm if you are "pissed" at me. Peter

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have no idea of your motives BUT one thing I do know, DO NOT EVER SEND ME a private email again. 14 who was just wonder what your original post was meant to convey and who is now pissed that you sent me a private post.     This is confusing.  Did you believe me to have a nepharious motive? I don’t know what your motive is since I don’t know you.  I don’t believe you know me.  Let’s keep it that way shall we? 14 Hi all,     This posting was kindly provided to me by Lynda Cunningham. -snipped to save bandwidth-

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Dear Peter… I have been a member of this ng for a very long time.  I don’t post as frequently as I’d like so I will say this to you… I was not threatening you, I told you not to do it again, which is not a threat, it is a request. If you ask other members of this ng about private postings that are uninvited I’m sure you will get as much information as you need to know, it’s a very tricky proposition here.  It is very scary for people to get unsolicited private email from people they do not know, especially when it appears to be a flame. Check it out… As for my email address… it has always been used on this ng and will continue to be used on this ng.  For you to tell me not to use it is absurd and I will NOT remove it, is that clear?  You have an obligation on this ng to check out whether or not a person will accept private emails before you send one. And BTW Itchy is one of my insiders, it’s not a joke as you make it out to be and I resent it.  My name is 14, a name, not a number. As for the animal post, I was not and will not be a part of that thread so I don’t know the history of it since I didn’t read it. 14 who is trying to not lose her temper because you are an new comer to the group. PS I never asked to be on your contact list!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –     I did not realize it would upset you.  You can be certain I won’t send you a private e-mail again.  I promise.  But you do not have any right whatsoever to show such agression to me about it.  If you wish to protect your privacy then don’t include your e-mail address.  It is a simple matter to remove it.     My original post was intended to be helpful and interesting, nothing more.  It arose from the presence of the very disagreable post concerning cr**lty to animals.  I feared that a cross-posted item like that would harm the "nice" (I was sure fooled) atmosphere I found here.     You go ahead and be "pissed" at me.  But if you don’t want to recieve e-mails again in future it is your responsibility to remove your e-mail something.     Don’t worry.  I have removed you from my contacts list as I reserve that for friends.  And since I intend to forget about you, it doesn’t matter a tinker’s damm if you are "pissed" at me. Peter I have no idea of your motives BUT one thing I do know, DO NOT EVER SEND ME a private email again. 14 who was just wonder what your original post was meant to convey and who is now pissed that you sent me a private post.     This is confusing.  Did you believe me to have a nepharious motive? I don’t know what your motive is since I don’t know you.  I don’t believe you know me.  Let’s keep it that way shall we? 14 Hi all,     This posting was kindly provided to me by Lynda Cunningham. -snipped to save bandwidth-

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Hi all,     This posting was kindly provided to me by Lynda Cunningham. What is a troll? The term "troll" has several meanings on usenet. You have the Real Life[tm] meanings as given to us by Merriam Webster: troll (trol) v. 1.To fish for by running a baited line behind a slowly moving boat n 1. A creature of Scandinavian folklore variously portrayed as a dwarf or giant living in caves or under bridges. And then there’s the usenet meanings – which are actually rather similar to those above. In the case of the verb, the definition is close – with one small twist; _you_ are the thing that someone is trying to catch – and catch you they will if you aren’t wary. For bait, the troll will often take the form of a derogatory post – one that is designed to incite as much reaction as possible. For each person who responds, the poster will consider that person "caught". The troll is considered to have been a complete success if it disrupts the normal traffic on a newsgroup. In extreme cases, trolls are posted by groups of people and crossposted to unrelated newsgroups in an attempt to destroy those groups by flooding them with flames and off-topic ranting. Then, there is the noun, which again is nearly dead on, but this type of troll has an e-mail account, a global bridge to hide under, and a fishing pole to match – beware, for the hills are full of ‘em. How can I spot a troll? Most trolls take the form of blanket statements designed solely to generate as many irate responses as possible. Posts with subject lines such as: "Macs suck Worse than Amiga’s!" or "Mac Users are pathetic losers" Are most likely trolls. Also, trolls love to generate mayhem by crossposting derogatory statements to two rival groups and watching the sparks fly as the groups flame each other into oblivion. That being the case, it is usually a good idea to think _very_ long and hard before responding to anything that is crossposted. If you must reply to a crossposted message – edit the header to only include one newsgroup; otherwise, take it to e-mail – or risk being branded a weenie for life. Trolls can also pop up in existing threads. These are usually the most distressing as they are unsuspected. Suddenly, you are confronted with someone you believe to be a mac user , who has taken a ridiculous position which just pisses you off from here to hades.  Remember, if you find yourself thinking, "I can’t believe this guy", it’s a good chance that the post is a troll. You’ll know for sure if the same person is consistently stupid and infuriating throughout the majority of his posts to the newsgroup. Are trolls made by real people? Nope. Trolls are made by nasty little people who crave far more attention than they deserve. Most of them are inadequate losers with absolutely_no_lives_what_so_ever! Remember that, a troll, by virtue of their lack of a life, will always have more time on his hands than you – it’s part of the inhuman nature of the beast. Also, be advised that trolls will also band together. There is a group of people known as alt.syntax.tactical who make it their life’s work to destroy as many groups as they can. They consider a group destroyed when more than three quarters of the threads on a group have been started by them; and the group is unusable for normal traffic. Why do trolls troll? Ah, good question. While there is no way of knowing why all trolls troll, there are some good theories. The general concensus is that the troll is trying to build up a flaccid ego; the troll sees himself as superior to anyone who responds to the bait. The worst thing you can do, in the eyes of the troll, is not respond at all – to absolutely ignore them. By not reacting, you have completely defeated their purpose in life. In other words, the troll sees his self-worth in how much of a reaction he can inspire – ignore him, and you confirm his worthlessness. It’s your best weapon. What’s the best way to deal with a troll? Contrary to most people’s natural instincts, the best tactic is to do absolutely nothing. In other words, _DO_NOT_ respond to a troll. To do so is to play entirely into the trolls hands. I cannot stress this enough. If left alone, the troll will usually get bored and go away – leaving many happy Mac Users to ride off into the sunset doing various backwards and forwards victory dances. Read that last paragraph carefully. It is of the highest importance if we are to keep trolls at bay. So, remember, a troll’s greatest joy is to piss _YOU_ off. Unless you deny him what he wants, he will stay around for more – gleefully feasting off your frustration, anger, indignation and vain attempts to reason with him. If you look right through him like everyone else in his miserable stinking life has, then he will usually slither back into his cave and/or find his prey elsewhere. I can flame with the best of ‘em – shouldn’t I just drive them off? Unfortuantely, no. The above assumption is based on the premise that trolls are actually like real people. They are not; they thrive off of negative input. Input in any form makes them feel more important and will only cause them to stay. Sure, you may be able to successfully spank a troll here or there if you are good – and we mean DAMN good. Flaming is an art that many, many, try, few master, and nearly all think they are good at. As a rule, DON’T flame ‘em, it does NOT work and will only prolong the agony for everybody else. But they make me so mad I want to scream – can I? By all means no! If you must scream, do so at your neighbors cat or the PC at work. It will be much more effective than screaming at the troll. If you absolutely must respond due to some personal neurological disorder, please do so in email and not on the group. Admitedly screaming at the troll via e-mail isn’t always possible because of certian troll tactics, but it is your only recourse. To respond to the troll on the newsgroup will only invite alt.mac members to flame you and b*at you about the head, – and not necessarily in that order. The troll won’t go away – there must be *something* I can do? YES! Some trolls just don’t know when to give up. These can be referred to as "klingons" – as they keep "clinging on" to the notion that their continued presence his going to eventually make somebody snap. You have several lines of defense at your disposal. The first, and possibly the best, thing that you can do is learn how to use a k*llfile. A k*llfile is a list of people and places that you want your newsbrowser to ignore. Thus, if you add the troll to your k*llfile, you’ll barely know they exist. It’s like magic (amazing, eh?). The second major thing you can do is complain to their postmaster. The postmaster is the person who has the job of making sure that everything runs smoothly at a given news/internet provider. Since a postmaster is often overworked, the last thing he wants to deal with is some weenie on his site causing all kinds of problems. Thus, the only way to fix the problem is to get rid of the source. That’s right, enough complaints to the postmaster, and the nasty little trolls are gone – tossed onto the streets and looking for another cave to be miserable in. -BUT- and this is a big but, if the troll is using a forged account, your complaints either won’t mean a thing, or will get someone else (other than the troll) in hot water.  So, be careful and don’t do try it unless you know what you’re doing. Okay, then how do I contact a postmaster? really pissed you off for the last time and you feel it’s time to complain. To complain to his postmaster you would end it to: this, though, is many trolls use fake addresses or anon. remailers; so getting the trolls real address is impossible. If the address is fake (rather than a remailer), checking the header can often give you the originating site Also, a good letter to a postmaster should start with a brief and polite comment, saying that the troll in question is causing trouble on the newsgroup with his off-topic rantings. Most postmasters will not yank accounts just for offensive behaviour (thank goodness, since anything you say has the potential to offend -someone-); but they will yank accounts for persistent off-topic posting. Lastly, the letter should then include the -entire- text of the offensive post, WITH HEADERS INTACT. Do not edit. But, I want to rip the troll’s throat out so hard it makes his whole family hurt for years – what else is there that I can do? Well, while I don’t officially advocate it, you _can_ engage in "A Slight Case of Overbombing." That is: The Mail Bomb- a nasty weapon usually reserved for the nastiest of trolls and is best when done by many people working in concert with one another. Mailbombs _can_ blow up in your face, even if they are successful. Once a "person’s" mailbox is full, all mail sent is often reflected back at the sender. There are also other nastinesses that can transpire, but they are beyond the scope of this. What’s a flame? Well, the following is taken from the EFF’s Guide to the Internet, v.2.21 -it seems to sum it up the best: "A flame is a particularly nasty, personal attack on somebody for something he or she has written. Periodically, an exchange of flames erupts into a flame war that begins to take up all the space in a given newsgroup (and sometimes several; flamers like cross-posting to let the world know how they feel). These can go on for weeks (sometimes they go on for years, in which case they become "holy wars," [-usually on such groundbreaking topics as the relative merits of Macintoshes vs. IBMs]. Often, just when they’re dying down, somebody new to the flame war reads all the messages, gets upset and issues an urgent plea that the flame war be taken to e-mail so everybody else can get back to whatever the … read more »

Response:

I can’t make it okay for you, I’m sorry.  The only thing that has upset me is the private post, can you understand?  I don’t know Peter, he may be a really great guy, but I won’t accept the fact that he posted me privately, unsolicited.  That’s my only point in all this. Hope you are ok. 14

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – hopw we can stop now we like peter adn eveybody so make it ok ok?

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hopw we can stop now we like peter adn eveybody so make it ok ok?

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Question:

Can anyone help, I’m a British fly fisherman and on a recent trip to the states I noticed how much cheaper fly lines etc. are. I was wondering whether anybody knew of how you can get fly flishing equipment by internet order

Start a search in one of the search engines (Yahoo, Alta Vista, Infoseek, etc.) for flyfishing equipment and supplies. There are many out there on the web to seek out. Also, keep an eye out in this group, people do list their web sites quite often – even though some do object to that. — Jon Porter

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Cold Spring Anglers in Carlisle, PA also produces a nice catalog and does a lot of mail order business (including to foreign addresses).  Their phones numbers are 717 245-2646, fax 717 245-2081.  Their snail mail address is 419 East High Street, Suite A; PO Box 129; Carlsile PA 17013 17013–129.

Visit my mail order info page at http://www.public.usit.net/skulpa/mailord.htm lots of address for catalogs, plus e-mail addresses and urls where applicable. Steve — Steven S. Kulpa Project Leader Environmental Systems Corp. Knoxville, Tennessee http://www.envirosys.com/ Remove NO_S*P*A*M_ from reply address —

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Cold Spring Anglers in Carlisle, PA also produces a nice catalog and does a lot of mail order business (including to foreign addresses).  Their phones numbers are 717 245-2646, fax 717 245-2081.  Their snail mail address is 419 East High Street, Suite A; PO Box 129; Carlsile PA 17013 17013–129. — Anti-spamming measure in use.  To reply, remove one "z" from email address.

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Can anyone help, I’m a British fly fisherman and on a recent trip to the states I noticed how much cheaper fly lines etc. are. I was wondering whether anybody knew of how you can get fly flishing equipment by internet order Paul mannu cambridge UK

Paul: Why not just order from catalogs, etc.?  The biggest disadvantage would be shipping costs, but still, if the stuff is cheaper here, it would probably be worthwhile.  Also, for merchandise that can’t be found in a national catalog (Simms waders, Sage rods, Airflo fly line, whatever else), many stores have web pages and their own "personal" catalogs. Examples here in the East would be AA Pro shop and Tulpehocken Creek Outfitters, (tcoflyfishing.com) to name 2.  Any fly shop would fill your order, even those that do not ususally do such business.  One of the best fly shops in the East is Fred Reese’s.  He does all his own dubbings, dyeing, etc.  Give him an extra $10 US and I’m sure he’ll ship. JB

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Can anyone help, I’m a British fly fisherman and on a recent trip to the states I noticed how much cheaper fly lines etc. are. I was wondering whether anybody knew of how you can get fly flishing equipment by internet order Paul mannu cambridge UK

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Question:

I’m planning of visiting Yosemite and Kings Canyon National Parks at the end of September.  Any advice on rivers and fly selection would be appreciated!  I’ll be staying in Three Rivers and Bass Lake.   Thanks Very Much!

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I’m planning of visiting Yosemite and Kings Canyon National Parks at the end of September.  Any advice on rivers and fly selection would be appreciated!  I’ll be staying in Three Rivers and Bass Lake.  

The streams in that end of Yosemite will be too low at the end of Sept. , but it’s about an hour over to the Merced just outside the park at El Portal.  The Merced has been ok in some years and poor in others, but fishes best at this time of year.  Check with Bob at Sierra Anglers in Modesto for an up to date report.  Out of Three Rivers your best bet is the Middle Fk. of the Kaweah above Buckeye Flat campground.  Both rivers are free stone streams with lots of pocket water.  Use Elk Hair Caddis , stimulators or Humpies, the basic western Sierra drill. Good luck. …Dick

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Question:

Does anybody mark their lines and leaders for identification? What kind of markers do you use and how do you code the marks? Examples: 3. Leaders can be kept in wallets. However, they are left on the line sometimes and I forget what they were when I put them on. What other methods do you folks use to keep your lines/leaders organized in your shop and/or on the waters? B.

Brian,         I tie my own leaders.  When I tie a leader, I wrap a short strip of paper around it with the length, weight, and formula source listed on it.  When I use the leader, the slip of paper goes into my reel pocket on my vest.  That way, when I fish next time, I can see what leader I have on.  This only gets me in trouble when I use more than one spool.  But, the leaders are usually substantially different for different lines, so I can figure it out. — Tight Threads,         Charley Renn         Corvallis, OR

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anybody mark their lines and leaders for identification? What kind of markers do you use and how do you code the marks? Examples: 1. I have heard that it is a good idea to mark your dry line about 30′ from the end. This is typically the ideal amount of line to load a rod. 2. Although a label comes with lines to be placed on the inside of the spool/reel, they do come off. It would be nice to mark the line somehow. 3. Leaders can be kept in wallets. However, they are left on the line sometimes and I forget what they were when I put them on. 4. How old is that line/leader? Date code? What other methods do you folks use to keep your lines/leaders organized in your shop and/or on the waters?

Lefty Kreh recommends using an indelible marker somewhere near the end and uses a code of a long stripe is 5 and a short mark is one. Then he identifies wt. forward by putting the short mark or marks in front (toward the end) of the 5 mark. For example a 7 wt forward line would be _.. (long short short) but a 7 wt. double taper would be .._ I imagine you could use an offset color for numbers less than 5 (ie. the off color short mark would be on one end or the other to show wt. forward or double taper). He never does explain how he would mark a 5 wt. line to show DT or WF. Perhaps 5 short marks to allow an off color mark on one end. I would imagine you could mark the 30 ft. spot the same way with indelible marker. I usually put the sticker on the spool when I attach the line. However, this is only convenient if you intend to leave the line on the spool always. $.02 Jon

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Try Cortland Lazer Lines,they are marked as to size. Also Climax Double Doubles are marked. Climax WF fly lines have a telemark on the line at the optimum pick up point.In lay terms the line changes color at that point. Tight Loops KW —

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anybody mark their lines and leaders for identification? What kind of markers do you use and how do you code the marks? I don’t mark my lines as the way I figure it if I can’t remember what line is on a reel or in a spare spool; I’ve got too many lines. Could have used that money to take the kids to a movie! Marking distance can be good when you’re learning to cast if you need to know how much line you need off the top of the rod to load; (just try to spot that mark as you false cast!) but in practice how much is in the air depends on what you’re doing. I’ve never done it in about 20 years of flyfishing and I never missed it.  It may be usefull if you want to be able to say to yourself " hoo-eee, I just made an 80 foot cast" and tells the boys in the Bar you’re finally an ‘expert’ As if they’d care. 8^) Ralph H replace "spamsucks" with direct for email reply.

I find marking full sinking line in 10ft intervals is helpful in determining how much line is out, especially if you want to repeat a depth after a fish.  I use a sharpie and add one ring for each ten feet of depth. — The views expressed are my own and does not represent those of my employer.

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Does anybody mark their lines and leaders for identification? What kind of markers do you use and how do you code the marks?

I don’t mark my lines as the way I figure it if I can’t remember what line is on a reel or in a spare spool; I’ve got too many lines. Could have used that money to take the kids to a movie! Marking distance can be good when you’re learning to cast if you need to know how much line you need off the top of the rod to load; (just try to spot that mark as you false cast!) but in practice how much is in the air depends on what you’re doing. I’ve never done it in about 20 years of flyfishing and I never missed it.  It may be usefull if you want to be able to say to yourself " hoo-eee, I just made an 80 foot cast" and tells the boys in the Bar you’re finally an ‘expert’ As if they’d care. 8^) Ralph H replace "spamsucks" with direct for email reply.

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I mark all my fly lines in the first foot or two by using a series of magic marker lines. A wide line (approx 1/2") equals five, a thin line (approx 1/8") equals one, if the small marks are closer to the tip subtract from the five marker(s) and if the small marks are towards the belly add to the five marker(s). This system has worked for me for over five years. I use a color coded magic marker system for saltwater leaders as well. I keep a notebook in my tacklebag which contains all my notes as to what color is what weight, etc. HTH. — Tom Dougherty A.K.’s Fly Tying Tools http://www.aks-flytools.com – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anybody mark their lines and leaders for identification? What kind of markers do you use and how do you code the marks? Examples: 1. I have heard that it is a good idea to mark your dry line about 30′ from the end. This is typically the ideal amount of line to load a rod. 2. Although a label comes with lines to be placed on the inside of the spool/reel, they do come off. It would be nice to mark the line somehow. 3. Leaders can be kept in wallets. However, they are left on the line sometimes and I forget what they were when I put them on. 4. How old is that line/leader? Date code? What other methods do you folks use to keep your lines/leaders organized in your shop and/or on the waters? B.

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Does anybody mark their lines and leaders for identification? What kind of markers do you use and how do you code the marks?

I mark my lines at each end to show the line wt, mainly because I use a loop to loop connection between the line and backing. I use a Banford Sharpie permanent marker and use a wide mark for five and a narrow mark for one. I put the wide marks towards the front of the line. (I read this in a Lefty Kreh book but don’t know who invented the system).  I don’t use distance marks, the casting here in Georgia is usually pretty tight and the times I have fished the salt I just cast as far as I can and hope the fish can swim to my fly<g. FWIW. — Charlie…

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Does anybody mark their lines and leaders for identification? What kind of markers do you use and how do you code the marks? Examples: 1. I have heard that it is a good idea to mark your dry line about 30′ from the end. This is typically the ideal amount of line to load a rod. 2. Although a label comes with lines to be placed on the inside of the spool/reel, they do come off. It would be nice to mark the line somehow. 3. Leaders can be kept in wallets. However, they are left on the line sometimes and I forget what they were when I put them on. 4. How old is that line/leader? Date code? What other methods do you folks use to keep your lines/leaders organized in your shop and/or on the waters? B.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anybody mark their lines and leaders for identification? What kind of markers do you use and how do you code the marks? Examples: 1. I have heard that it is a good idea to mark your dry line about 30′ from the end. This is typically the ideal amount of line to load a rod. 2. Although a label comes with lines to be placed on the inside of the spool/reel, they do come off. It would be nice to mark the line somehow. 3. Leaders can be kept in wallets. However, they are left on the line sometimes and I forget what they were when I put them on. 4. How old is that line/leader? Date code? What other methods do you folks use to keep your lines/leaders organized in your shop and/or on the waters? B.

Hi Brian For years I’ve marked my lines for length just because I’m such a louse judge of distance and for no other reason. I use an indelible felt tip marker — at 30′, one mark, at 40′, two markes, at 50′, three marks and so on out to 80′. From there I know it a short distance to the and and very honestly though I can throw the line when needed I seldom have to use that much line for normal fishing conditions here in Montana. Regarding what line is on what spool I’ve had no problem keeping the little sticker on the inside of the spool if I place a small piece of clear "shipping tape" over the line weight sticker. Take care &… — Tight Lines ….. Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Catalog,Tips & Tricks, Fishing Reports, & NeverSink at: http://www.btsflyfishing.com

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1. I have heard that it is a good idea to mark your dry line about 30′ from the end. This is typically the ideal amount of line to load a rod.

I tried this when a beginner.  It soon becomes a waste of time.  The "ideal amount of line" is not something you see with the conscious eye — it is something you feel unconsciously in your hand and arm, while the eye is on the fish and the water. 2. Although a label comes with lines to be placed on the inside of the spool/reel, they do come off. It would be nice to mark the line somehow.

Yes, until you have identified which line types you trust.  Once you prefer particular brands of floaters, tapers, sink tips etc. you can buy (most) in distinctive colours, i.e. use the manufacturers’ color codes to keep track. 3. Leaders can be kept in wallets. However, they are left on the line sometimes and I forget what they were when I put them on. 4. How old is that line/leader? Date code?

These questions do not arise for people who use a permanent leader butt, which lasts as long as the line.  Nylon is cheaper than time; you put on a fresh tippet at the start of each session anyway; and it is easy to replace the intermediate tapered section once a year or more often if you feel the need, e.g. using a trout outfit for salmon. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

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Question:

Anyway, my default setting is to fish with a sink tip line, casting towards shore with a wolly bugger, sometimes a gold ribbed hair’s ear [though I've yet to catch anything with this].  Both are hauled in with a slow steady retrieve.  

You might be better off casting parallel to the bank if the bottom drops off fairly quick (and *especially* if there are rushes sticking out of the water.)  You’ll cover more water that way and you’ll be better able to keep your fly down near the bottom.  If you’re casting in towards the bank with a sink-tip, your fly will swim away from the bottom unless you pause or retrieve slower as you fish the cast out.  Personally, I think full uniform sinkers are a lot more useful for fishing wet flies, unless you want the fly to swim up pretty quick (i.e., up a drop-off.) Also, try varying your retrieve.  That’s always the first thing I change if I’m searching and nothing’s going on.  Besides, I always have better bugger luck if I fish them with at least a little snap to get the hackle pulsing. As for flies, one of my best lake patterns is just a small marabou leech, fished right off the bottom and kind of slow.  Keep your eyes out for the local bug life, though, and fish the ones that interest you. Good luck, Dave DeLacey Corvallis,Or. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Aaron W.

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Any other ideas?  Flys?  I am fishing in Southwest Washington, and possibly will go near Mt. St. Hellens.

        Though we don’t see a lot of tubers here in Maine(other than potatos – yuk,yuk), we do a lot of pond and lake fishing for brook trout from canoes. Common to almost all of these ponds are Callibaetis (hatch 3 times a season and matched with Adams dry) and damselflies, both of which may be indigenous to your waters. Also present here are Hexigenia, stoneflies similar to Acroneuria, generic BWO’s, and some giant caddis species.  We have a lot of other  options as well(leeches, flying ants, scuds, cress bugs, sow bugs,etc.). I fish a pond that stays cool enough for dry flies all summer and I never fish much deeper than 8 or 10 feet, and then only because I have to.         Techniques run the gamut. 90% of my fishing is done with a floating or intermediate line.Checking with local fisherman (and observing), doing a stomach check on fish kept (yes, we will eat one now and then), using a nymph net to check for samples, are all integral to fitting the pieces of the puzzle. We give a close watch to dropoffs (potential byways for big fish) and the weedbeds (home to most of the insects.I’m sure your water may have some differences, but there may be more similarities than anyone realizes. Hope I’ve given you some ideas. Good luck….

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would love to hear some advice about float tube fly fishing for trout.  I have read my share of books, had fair experience, but am still not that satisfied with the results I get.  Still love it though. Anyway, my default setting is to fish with a sink tip line, casting towards shore with a wolly bugger, sometimes a gold ribbed hair’s ear [though I've yet to catch anything with this].  Both are hauled in with a slow steady retrieve. Any other ideas?  Flys?  I am fishing in Southwest Washington, and possibly will go near Mt. St. Hellens. Thank you. Aaron W.

A really good lake is Coldwater Lake, near St Helens.  People do well with various things; it would be hard to go wrong with a small black or olive wooly bugger (size 10 to 14).  I use a full sinking shooting head, in type II or IV, for most of my lake fishing in the area.  Try different retrieves, try waiting different times to let the line sink to different depths, try points and dropoffs, try fishing where the codger factor is high.   Oh, you don’t know what the codger factor is?  That’s the average age of the fisherfolk within a 100 yd radius.  Anything over 50 is a good bet. A fly that does well for me in the cascade lakes in the spring is an olive brown wooly worm, with brown hackle, in size 8 or 10,  Matter of fact, that or the wooly bugger will be on the sinking line just about any time I can’t see something else in particular to match.   Caught 10 feet of cutthroats with the wooly bugger yesterday, in 8 to 10 inch increments.  Beautiful day, beautiful fish, and a great way to start the season.

Response:

I would love to hear some advice about float tube fly fishing for trout.  I have read my share of books, had fair experience, but am still not that satisfied with the results I get.  Still love it though. Anyway, my default setting is to fish with a sink tip line, casting towards shore with a wolly bugger, sometimes a gold ribbed hair’s ear [though I've yet to catch anything with this].  Both are hauled in with a slow steady retrieve.   Any other ideas?  Flys?  I am fishing in Southwest Washington, and possibly will go near Mt. St. Hellens. Thank you. Aaron W.

Response:

Anyway, my default setting is to fish with a sink tip line, casting towards shore with a wolly bugger, sometimes a gold ribbed hair’s ear [though I've yet to catch anything with this].  Both are hauled in with a slow steady retrieve. Any other ideas?  Flys?  I am fishing in Southwest Washington, and possibly will go near Mt. St. Hellens.

I have never had much luck with sunk flies on sinking lines.  I usually cast toward shore to rocks, logs and grassy cuts with a small elk hair caddis or stimulator. -Burton — L. Burton Hawley           2330 NW Hummingbird Corvallis, OR

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Question:

Hello, I’m pretty new to the newsgroups and to southwest Idaho.  Parents do live in Buhl though. My question for anyone is for maybe any clues they would be will to give on good casting areas around Boise or within an hour or less. I was hoping to kinda get a few of those secrets people let die with themselves and still am crossing my fingers.  I anyone decides to help a poor lost soul like myself you could e-mail me directly to leave it off the group and I would appreciate it tremendously.                                                         Thanks,                                                         Christian Keeley

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I’m pretty new to the newsgroups and to southwest Idaho.  Parents do live in Buhl though. My question for anyone is for maybe any clues they would be will to give on good casting areas around Boise or within an hour or less. I was hoping to kinda get a few of those secrets people let die with themselves and still am crossing my fingers.  I anyone decides to help a poor lost soul like myself you could e-mail me directly to leave it off the group and I would appreciate it tremendously.

I’m not from the Boise area but do get there several times per year. There are lots of places to wet a line including the Boise river, the many small ponds within the city (they are stocked with trout) and one of my favorite places the Wilson Ponds in Nampa.  Your best bet is to check into a fly shop and ask.  They are always happy to direct you to good fishing locations.

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I lived in boise for 2/3 years and caught many dumb fish on the boise, both in town and down river. There is also this little trickle called the S. Fork. and one called…oh shit man, you are in the thick of it! Get thee to a fly shop and snoop. Jezus! Don’t you know where you are! Ugh!!! Best… S. "The World is full of shipping clerks who read the Harvard Classics." –Bukowski, American writer, poet S. Duda Seattle, WA

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Question:

Hey all you whaco thread spinners, listen up.  Tired of all the crap floating around in this news group? Well so am I!   Lets begin the FlyTiers Corner.  It will be dedicated to those of us who are equally as enthused, maybe more, about our tying as our fishing.   It appears that a Fly Tying NG is not the answer at this time.  There should be enough interest to make FTC a success. One really great thing about the angling aspect of this sport is the willingness of most participants to share their knowledge and skills.  I find that to be more so in the tying end. Let’s give it a whack and see what happens.  Share your patterns, tips, techniques, sources (maybe) and ideas with the rest of us fanatic tyers. YOU WILL NEED TO GIVE TO RECEIVE. Hi-Vis Wing Material, Manufacturer – L&L Products – I first saw this stuff in National Feather Craft catalog several years and sent for a few bags. It is available in just about every imaginable color but I find that most of my work is with white, light dun and med. dun.  I tie hundreds of dz of parachutes and mayfly spinners per year and this material wonderful.  It is very light in weight, holds its color, has just the right stiffness, and is very visible.  Try it on a Adams Para and you will never go back to cafl body. Yippi tie one on, AuSable1

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Let’s give it a whack and see what happens.  Share your patterns, tips, techniques, sources (maybe) and ideas with the rest of us fanatic tyers. YOU WILL NEED TO GIVE TO RECEIVE.

OK. I have created a website for flytyers entitled "WWW Fly Tyer". It is not fully finished, but I feel there is enough content there to at least warrant a look. Check back as it will continue to improve from here. http://www.ns.net/~barnard Enjoy…Alan. PS – Don’t forget to sign the guestbook!   Alan Barnard   Kiene’s Fly Shop   Sacramento, Ca.   WWW Fly Tyer:   http://www.ns.net/~barnard

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey all you whaco thread spinners, listen up.  Tired of all the crap floating around in this news group? Well so am I!   Lets begin the FlyTiers Corner.  It will be dedicated to those of us who are equally as enthused, maybe more, about our tying as our fishing.   It appears that a Fly Tying NG is not the answer at this time.  There should be enough interest to make FTC a success. One really great thing about the angling aspect of this sport is the willingness of most participants to share their knowledge and skills.  I find that to be more so in the tying end. Let’s give it a whack and see what happens.  Share your patterns, tips, techniques, sources (maybe) and ideas with the rest of us fanatic tyers. YOU WILL NEED TO GIVE TO RECEIVE. Hi-Vis Wing Material, Manufacturer – L&L Products – I first saw this stuff in National Feather Craft catalog several years and sent for a few bags. It is available in just about every imaginable color but I find that most of my work is with white, light dun and med. dun.  I tie hundreds of dz of parachutes and mayfly spinners per year and this material wonderful.  It is very light in weight, holds its color, has just the right stiffness, and is very visible.  Try it on a Adams Para and you will never go back to cafl body. Yippi tie one on, AuSable1

Shut-up, form your new group & get out Life’s a fish, then you fry…..                      …     .—.     _…                  (  _. _.-’                   ____          ~~’                       …-’

Question:

How is the number 3 Hoffman for size 16 thru 24?  The Metz number 2s have them, but not in large quantities.

Response:

The #3 Hoffmans are excellent in these sizes.  And you won’t believe the length of the stems.

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How is the number 3 Hoffman for size 16 thru 24?  The Metz number 2s have them, but not in large quantities.

Don’t know about the Hoffmans, but the Metz #1 are loaded!  I had lots of 22’s over 1 inch long.   A sunny day,      a box of midges,         and a wandering stream…   Man, this MUST be heaven!   <    Steve Kulpa    <<

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How is the number 3 Hoffman for size 16 thru 24?  The Metz number 2s have them, but not in large quantities. Don’t know about the Hoffmans, but the Metz #1 are loaded!  I had lots of 22’s over 1 inch long.  A sunny day,     a box of midges,        and a wandering stream…  Man, this MUST be heaven!  <    Steve Kulpa    <<

From what I have heard and seen, the Hoffman #3 grade is equivalent to a Metz #1.  I know this is true on saddles from personal experience.   It just makes me wonder how good a Hoffman #1 neck would be!!! Tom Cavitt

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I own several metz and several Hoffman necks.  I can’t believe how much better the Hoffmans are than the Metz necks.  A number 3 Hoffman is a superior neck to a number 1 metz any day and far cheaper.

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I own several metz and several Hoffman necks.  I can’t believe how much better the Hoffmans are than the Metz necks.  A number 3 Hoffman is a superior neck to a number 1 metz any day and far cheaper.

I’ve read this and I couldn’t resist the impression that you have been blended by the number of feathers and their relativly low price. I’ve been a user of both Metz and Hoffman for some years now, and I DO see the difference between these two neck-types. Hoffman hackel is much more stiffer than Metz, they are very often U-formed – which makes parachute fly tying quite difficult. So .. to the point. In my opinion both brands are good as all purpose hackle. But Metz (in my humble opinion) gives you flexibility of use – no matter classification.

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been blended by the number of feathers and their relativly low price. I’ve been a user of both Metz and Hoffman for some years now, and I DO see the difference between these two neck-types. Hoffman hackel is much more stiffer than Metz, they are very often U-formed – which makes parachute fly tying quite difficult. So .. to the point. In my opinion both brands are good as all purpose hackle. But Metz (in my humble opinion) gives you flexibility of use – no matter classification. Well, the feathers are really flying now.  The idea that a Metz neck is better than a Hoffman for parachute tying could only be described as bird-brained.  Hoffman hackles are long and the stems are flexible, both essential characteristics for parachute patterns.  In my humble opinion they result in far neater flies than the Metz, and my parachute flies have certainly improved since I’ve switched over.  In fact, I have a #1 metz rooster neck in a medium dun that I will gladly sell for $30.00 (I’ve plucked less than two-dozen feathers between #14-18 on the neck)  so I can put the money toward a #3 Hoffman.  Any of you Metz fans can reach me at my E-mail address and make an offer.

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says… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -We sigh over the good old days, but… I still have many of the old Indian and Phillipine rooster necks that I bought during the sixties when I was learning to tie.  These were "first quality"  necks that sold for $4-$10 each depending mostly on color. Necks that aren’t worthy to share the same chicken ranch, let alone coop, with a #3 Metz or Hoffman.  Of course the color selection was quite limited–a dun neck was an extreme rarity, especially one in dry-fly quality.  $10 for a mediocre domestic grizzly neck in 1969 (if you could find one at all) is probably about the same as $60-$70 for a superb #1 grizzly today… …you can have the good old days. Thanks Mr. Hoffman, Mr. Metz, and all the others who are producing the best hackle ever Sean Barry

I solved most of my expensive hackle problems.  I tie and use almost exclusively the Comparadun style.  Easy to tie, floats  like a cork and seem to take trout as well as any Mayfly tied in the tradtional manner. Les

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:                       Man, what a difference! : Now to get a brown one … I just bought my first #1 Hoffman a few weeks ago: a beautiful fiery brown!  As you say, it’s a great treat to work with the best.  I’ll never buy anything less (well, hardly ever). — Laboratory for Applied Logic    Dept. of Computer Science University of Idaho             www: http://www.cs.uidaho.edu/~foster

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We sigh over the good old days, but… I still have many of the old Indian and Phillipine rooster necks that I bought during the sixties when I was learning to tie.  These were "first quality"  necks that sold for $4-$10 each depending mostly on color. Necks that aren’t worthy to share the same chicken ranch, let alone coop, with a #3 Metz or Hoffman.  Of course the color selection was quite limited–a dun neck was an extreme rarity, especially one in dry-fly quality.  $10 for a mediocre domestic grizzly neck in 1969 (if you could find one at all) is probably about the same as $60-$70 for a superb #1 grizzly today… …you can have the good old days. Thanks Mr. Hoffman, Mr. Metz, and all the others who are producing the best hackle ever Sean Barry

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I just opened my first Metz #1 neck the other day, and what a treat! I bought it last month when I was at my favorite fly shop cuz it just struck my eye.  A nice dark grizzly, real full and heavy.  I just sold the owner of the shop $70 worth of flys, so I went ahead and got it, even though I had no immeadiate use for it yet.  I still had a lot on my current #2 neck, so I just packed it away for later.  Well, the other night I needed some #20s and my current neck was out of ‘em, so I got out the new one and opened it up.                      Man, what a difference!

[snip] Steve: If somehow a #1 Herbert ever makes it out your way, take a good look at one of those critters. My second choice (and close behind the Hebert) would be Hoffman. Check out the flatness and suppleness of the stems, and check the barb count/stiffness on these two producers’ chickens, and compare them against the Metz. I won’t say that it’ll put a #1 Metz to shame (that would be cruel ;^) but suffice to say that I haven’t bought a Metz in many years once the Hebert’s and Hoffman’s became available out my way… /dave <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< < Digital Equipment Corp.    Alpha Server Engineering  < <           "Read this and nobody gets hurt"           < <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Response:

Jim,         In flyfishing, when we tie our own flies, we use the feathers from roosters for the hackle.  There are a number of fine folks who expend great quantities of money and effort to raise above average plummage for our addiction.  Once raised, they are graded and sold on the basis of their appropriateness to tying.  A number one (#1) neck indicates a slab of skin from the shoulder, neck, and head area of a rooster, bearing a high count of feathers having sufficient length, stiffness of barbules (those little things sticking out from the quill), and smallness of barbules to qualify for a top rating.  It is normally considered appropriate for use in tying a large number of very small dry flies.  A number two (#2) neck may have fewer smaller feathers or fewer barbules, or a problems with color.  It is still useful, just not best.  A number three (#3) is probably getting pretty webby and may only tie wet flies– lacking the stiffness to float a fly on its barbules.  The "neck" designation is to distinguish from a "saddle"– the back part of a bird (where you’d put a saddle if you wanted to ride it).  Saddles are generally considered appropriate for larger flies and often display the stiffness and barbule count of quality necks.  Hoffman and Metz both have demonstrated that saddles can be produced that are suitable for smaller flies.  Saddle feathers are generally much longer than neck feathers and somewhat less expensive. Hope that helps. Charley

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I just opened my first Metz #1 neck the other day, and what a treat! I bought it last month when I was at my favorite fly shop cuz it just struck my eye.  A nice dark grizzly, real full and heavy.  I just sold the owner of the shop $70 worth of flys, so I went ahead and got it, even though I had no immeadiate use for it yet.  I still had a lot on my current #2 neck, so I just packed it away for later.  Well, the other night I needed some #20s and my current neck was out of ‘em, so I got out the new one and opened it up.                       Man, what a difference! The top of the neck is LOADED with #20’s!  I picked out thirty or so and still have lots left, and most are 1 – 1.5 inches long.  I can’t even guess at the number of 22s.  I think I lucked out and got an exceptional #1.  I’m now convinced that #1’s are the way to go, providing you have a chance to look them over.  Now and then an exceptional one will come along. Now to get a brown one … Steve P.S.  Mr. Lum, I thought you’d like hearing this story!   A sunny day,      a box of midges,         and a wandering stream…   Man, this MUST be heaven!   <    Steve Kulpa    <<

Response:

Steve,         What’s a Metz #1 neck? I don’t speak ff so good yet.                                                         Jim

: I just opened my first Metz #1 neck the other day, and what a treat! : I bought it last month when I was at my favorite fly shop cuz it : just struck my eye.  A nice dark grizzly, real full and heavy.  I : just sold the owner of the shop $70 worth of flys, so I went ahead : and got it, even though I had no immeadiate use for it yet.  I : still had a lot on my current #2 neck, so I just packed it away for : later.  Well, the other night I needed some #20s and my current neck : was out of ‘em, so I got out the new one and opened it up. :                       Man, what a difference! : The top of the neck is LOADED with #20’s!  I picked out thirty or so : and still have lots left, and most are 1 – 1.5 inches long.  I can’t : even guess at the number of 22s.  I think I lucked out and got an : exceptional #1.  I’m now convinced that #1’s are the way to go, : providing you have a chance to look them over.  Now and then an : exceptional one will come along. : Now to get a brown one … : Steve : P.S.  Mr. Lum, I thought you’d like hearing this story! :   :   A sunny day, :      a box of midges, :         and a wandering stream… :   Man, this MUST be heaven! :   <    Steve Kulpa    <<

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Question:

I don’t know where you’re accustomed to fish, but it’s gonna be tough finding an uncrowded stream. If you want to catch fish, try Montauk State Park. It is a state-run trout park where you can fish in several miles of spring-fed streams heavily stocked with rainbows. There’s a flies-only section that can be somewhat challenging. Downstream from Montauk, the Current River is a popular float-trip destination, so the aluminum hatch is severe on weekends. But there are some sizable browns and rainbows in the upper sections of the river. Montauk has good camping and lodging facilities. Let me know what you do! Bob

Response:

I don’t know where you’re accustomed to fish, but it’s gonna be tough finding an uncrowded stream. If you want to catch fish, try Montauk State Park.

        I just would like to know what state you are talking about!                                         Thank you,                      

Response:

Missouri

Response:

My brother-in-law and I are heading to the Rolla, MO area next weekend. We are interested in finding an uncrowded river with a healthy rainbow and brown trout population. Any suggestions?   We are also interested in any information concerning appropriate patterns for spring-time fishing in the Ozarks. Camp sites?

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Question:

On Saturday Jan. 1 at noon my brother and I put up two batches of beer. One is an export pilzner and the other is a lager. 18 hours later, both fermenters took off for the moon, bubbling their little air locks so actively that it reminded us of an aquarium filter bubbler. At one point the plizner blew all the water out of its air lock and we got some yeast foam up into the base of the air lock tube.  Both had slight, minor leaks of foam at a couple of points on the bucket lid, but they seem to have sealed themselves up nicely. Whew!  I don’t know what we did to these two batches to get such active fermentation.  Maybe it was the use of dried malt extract instead of sugar or a second can of malt.  Maybe the yeast was especially active, even though we used the cheapest stuff we could find at the brew supply store [M&F Ale dried yeast, 2 packs per batch-1 pack each was rehydrated and the other packs were used dry.] Well, it’s very exciting and impressive to watch the forces of nature at work. Frank

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – On Saturday Jan. 1 at noon my brother and I put up two batches of beer. One is an export pilzner and the other is a lager. 18 hours later, both fermenters took off for the moon, bubbling their little air locks so actively that it reminded us of an aquarium filter bubbler. At one point the plizner blew all the water out of its air lock and we got some yeast foam up into the base of the air lock tube.  Both had slight, minor leaks of foam at a couple of points on the bucket lid, but they seem to have sealed themselves up nicely. Whew!  I don’t know what we did to these two batches to get such active fermentation.  Maybe it was the use of dried malt extract instead of sugar or a second can of malt.  Maybe the yeast was especially active, even though we used the cheapest stuff we could find at the brew supply store [M&F Ale dried yeast, 2 packs per batch-1 pack each was rehydrated and the other packs were used dry.] Well, it’s very exciting and impressive to watch the forces of nature at work.

If you really want to be impressed, next time ferment in a glass carboy (with a blow-off of course). The violent churning of the beer as it ferments never ceases to amaze me. –Russ

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One is an export pilzner and the other is a lager. [M&F Ale dried yeast...]

Not to be picky, but you’re not making a lager if you’re using ale yeast… =S — =Spencer W. Thomas              |  Info Tech and Networking, B1911 CFOB, 0704    "Genome Informatician"     |  Univ of Michigan, Ann Arbor, MI 48109

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