Question:

All these other folks have helpful comments (well, most of them). After you’ve digested those, try this: why do the moons of Mars go in the "wrong" direction? I didn’t know that Mars has any moons, I do know that it has the largest volcano in solar system Olympus Mons or something like that any way.  Anyhow back to the martian moons, when you say go in the wrong direction do you mean their orbital paths are clockwise from a northern perspective?

Yep. Demios & Phobos. From our perspective where the Moon goes (slowly) right to left, the two bitty Martian moons (probably don’t create shadows at night as we’re accustomed to) go rather rapidly – one could see the apparent movement with a little patience – go left to right. Pete — If the assumptions are wrong, the conclusions aren’t likely to be very good.    R. E. Machol

Response:

Why was this initial cloud in a disk shape,  and why was it rotating?

Because it had angular momentum. (Watch out for Wayno’s nausea spasm!) — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – All these other folks have helpful comments (well, most of them). After you’ve digested those, try this: why do the moons of Mars go in the "wrong" direction? I didn’t know that Mars has any moons, I do know that it has the largest volcano in solar system Olympus Mons or something like that any way. Anyhow back to the martian moons, when you say go in the wrong direction do you mean their orbital paths are clockwise from a northern perspective? Yep. Demios & Phobos. From our perspective where the Moon goes (slowly) right to left, the two bitty Martian moons (probably don’t create shadows at night as we’re accustomed to) go rather rapidly – one could see the apparent movement with a little patience – go left to right.

Yes that’s strange and doesn’t fit in with the initial rotating disc theory at all.  Do you think that Mars aquired them in later life?  If they are orbiting that fast then they are probably smaller than our moon.  Do they interfere with each other in a gravitational sense?  I assume that they are in ecliptic plane too, so if they are orbiting at different heights from the planet’s surface they will pass close to each other now and then.  Could they possibly be 2 halves (or parts) of a small moon that was hit by a passing asteroid?

Response:

why do the moons of Mars go in the "wrong" direction?

From our perspective where the Moon goes (slowly) right to left, the two bitty Martian moons (probably don’t create shadows at night as we’re accustomed to) go rather rapidly – one could see the apparent movement with a little patience – go left to right.

    god is ambidextrious, i reckon. wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Did the early sun pull in a cloud of dust into a giant saturn-like ring of orbiting debris which would later congeal to form the present day planets,  or is there something else that I am missing? Well, yes and no.  Initially there was a rotating disk of dust and gas. The sun formed at the center of the disk, and later the planets and other orbiting bodies formed in orbits around the proto-sun. Why was this initial cloud in a disk shape,  and why was it rotating?

Response:

Why was this initial cloud in a disk shape,  and why was it rotating?

Angular momentum. TL MC

Response:

    god is ambidextrious, i reckon.

Nahh, assuming the existence of such a creature, devious at best. TL MC

Response:

Did the early sun pull in a cloud of dust into a giant saturn-like ring of orbiting debris which would later congeal to form the present day planets,  or is there something else that I am missing? Well, yes and no.  Initially there was a rotating disk of dust and gas. The sun formed at the center of the disk, and later the planets and other orbiting bodies formed in orbits around the proto-sun.

Why was this initial cloud in a disk shape,  and why was it rotating?

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I reckon someone on this NG might be able to answer this. Over the last few weeks, I have been checking out the recent planetary alignment  (Mercury, Venus, Mars, Saturn?) I can see all out (except mercury) of my skylight window in the attic ~ where I have my PC.  In the last few weeks I have developed an interest as to what our solar system is, and how was it formed to reveal itself to our eyes as it presently does…snip..? All these other folks have helpful comments (well, most of them). After you’ve digested those, try this: why do the moons of Mars go in the "wrong" direction?

I didn’t know that Mars has any moons, I do know that it has the largest volcano in solar system Olympus Mons or something like that any way.  Anyhow back to the martian moons, when you say go in the wrong direction do you mean their orbital paths are clockwise from a northern perspective?

Response:

Do you think it will make the fish bite better?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I reckon someone on this NG might be able to answer this. Over the last few weeks, I have been checking out the recent planetary alignment  (Mercury, Venus, Mars, Saturn?) I can see all out (except mercury) of my skylight window in the attic ~

Response:

Slarty Bartfast made them that way, It’s all in the book.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I reckon someone on this NG might be able to answer this. Over the last few weeks, I have been checking out the recent planetary alignment  (Mercury, Venus, Mars, Saturn?) I can see all out (except mercury) of my skylight window in the attic ~ where I have my PC.  In the last few weeks I have developed an interest as to what our solar system is, and how was it formed to reveal itself to our eyes as it presently does. My Psion 5MX has a program called Solun and predicts the positions  of the celestial bodies to an impressive display.  I find out that all planets (except pluto), the sun  & our moon form a plane called the "ecliptic".  I can understand why the moon orbits the earth keeping in between the gravitational pulls of the earth & sun  (I imagine that Jupiter’s moons do likewise), but I wonder why all of the other planets (except Pluto) do as well.  I know that the planets all orbit in the same direction (anticlockwise from my NH perspective), but why in the same plane?  I wonder about the directions all being the same being the key to the formation of the ecliptic plane.  Did the early sun pull in a cloud of dust into a giant saturn-like ring of orbiting debris which would later congeal to form the present day planets,  or is there something else that I am missing?

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I reckon someone on this NG might be able to answer this. Over the last few weeks, I have been checking out the recent planetary alignment  (Mercury, Venus, Mars, Saturn?) I can see all out (except mercury) of my skylight window in the attic ~ where I have my PC.  In the last few weeks I have developed an interest as to what our solar system is, and how was it formed to reveal itself to our eyes as it presently does…snip..? All these other folks have helpful comments (well, most of them). After you’ve digested those, try this: why do the moons of Mars go in the "wrong" direction? Pete — If the assumptions are wrong, the conclusions aren’t likely to be very good.    R. E. Machol

Sigh . . . . . . . I just wanted to go fly fishing on my planet . . . now I learn my universe has issues . . . who would of thunk it?  (as you are aware from my post, certainly not me) Going to the Arkansas River in central Colorado next week to get involved in the infamous "Mother’s Day Caddis Hatch". We eat them saut

Question:

… my current batch of hiking pals are dropping fast or becomin a mite surly.

Well, not surly so much…. Wolfgang who misses ya sorely    :)

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – get in shape zimbo.  i’ve still got a few places i’d like to prospect for ol’ mr. trout in graham and swain co… my current batch of hiking pals are dropping fast or becomin a mite surly. It’s a deal, Jeffie. I just bought me a Garmin eTrex Vista so’s I’ll be able to remember how to get back to all these beauty-filled streams Waldo’s taken me to over the last year. As for getting in shape, well I’m still a young-un and not old enough to know that fishing isn’t supposed to be a workout. You show me the trail and I’ll stay with ya. –Steve

well alrighty then… bring the digital camera too.   all too soon, as you’ll discover, with increasing age the mental pictures don’t last as long as they once did… let me know when you’d like to go… jeff

Response:

…it was the best of times… looking forward to the next of times.  it hurts so good, gotta do it again soon… there’s another nc mountain paradise to visit.  it’s a short boat ride and a bit of a walk… but it’s sure to fill up your soul for a while. jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – … my current batch of hiking pals are dropping fast or becomin a mite surly. Well, not surly so much…. Wolfgang who misses ya sorely    :)

Response:

…none of us knew when you were coming in or where you were staying. sorry we missed you. i was the last one out this afternoon. hope the rain let up for you…

How much rain did you get? Please lie and tell me it was the singular greatest fishing event of your entire life. That would sure help me sleep better at night. –Steve

Response:

I lived in West Virginia where I taught school for one school year.

Did you ever happen to catch "The Dancin’ Outlaw" on PBS? Seriously surreal piece documenting the life and strange times of one Jesco White, the self-proclaimed "Last of the True Mountain Dancers." Guaranteed to make you laugh exactly at the same time you’re cringing (and if you like that feeling, check out the short fiction of George Saunders). You can get a small taste of Jesco at http://www.pelsor.com/jesco_white.htm, though a Google search will give you plenty of options to sample. – Sid not even sure you miss WV, but thought a kick was in the offing

Response:

How much rain did you get? Please lie and tell me it was the singular greatest fishing event of your entire life. That would sure help me sleep better at night. –Steve

…well, this one is for you zimbo… the weather was great (til yesterday – my birthday, of course) and the fishin was incredible – the catchin, well… i haven’t been doin this as long as most around here, but if catching brookies and rainbows in nearly every pool promotes your sleep, i’ll wake you next week. …wolfgang has captured the essence of the week in his post, sorta.  he missed the boat trip across fontana lake to wayno’s "memento", but i made sure his hiking socks made it. i think they gave me a blister… get in shape zimbo.  i’ve still got a few places i’d like to prospect for ol’ mr. trout in graham and swain co… my current batch of hiking pals are dropping fast or becomin a mite surly. jeff

Response:

get in shape zimbo.  i’ve still got a few places i’d like to prospect for ol’ mr. trout in graham and swain co… my current batch of hiking pals are dropping fast or becomin a mite surly.

It’s a deal, Jeffie. I just bought me a Garmin eTrex Vista so’s I’ll be able to remember how to get back to all these beauty-filled streams Waldo’s taken me to over the last year. As for getting in shape, well I’m still a young-un and not old enough to know that fishing isn’t supposed to be a workout. You show me the trail and I’ll stay with ya. –Steve

Response:

Is that you George? Is that you Skunked?

Nice going Warren! Opie read this just before we went fishing on yet another stream no one would tell me the name of and was so depressed he jumped off the top of a 400 foot waterfall.  Nice pool at the bottom (I caught a beautiful 14 inch brown out of it a bit later) but he missed it by about 6 feet.  I am trying to console his mother while enjoying not only my own, but also Opie’s portion of the spaghetti she made for us. Wolfgang trying to save just a little room for dessert

Response:

Trust me Opus.  What I don’t know about fly fishing is infinitely greater then what I know,

HAH! A fig for those who say you are incapable of telling the truth! and no, that wasn’t me Opus.  

And no, Georgie, it ain’t ME Opus either. I’m just a Ghost of Fly Fishing Past.   My name hangs on the winds of time.  

Your name has broken the wind of time. You know me, you just don’t understand the whispered words.

You know me.  You just cain’t figgur it out (the words are in English, unless I’m badly mistaken). Not Pete

Response:

  Nice going Warren! Opie read this just before we went fishing on yet another stream no one would tell me the name of and was so depressed he jumped off the top of a 400 foot waterfall.  Nice pool at the bottom (I caught a beautiful 14 inch brown out of it a bit later) but he missed it by about 6 feet.  I am trying to console his mother while enjoying not only my own, but also Opie’s portion of the spaghetti she made for us. Wolfgang trying to save just a little room for dessert

Sounds like you are making due there Wolfie <g  Tell Opie he can catch fish tomorrow because I will say a small prayer to Norm, the god of fishing and luck, tonight asking him to watch over Opie. — Warren Findley www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt

Response:

Who asked you anything guy? And this is Pete.

  george.vcf

< 1K Download

Response:

 I lived in West Virginia where I taught school for one school year. Fall was immensely beautiful, but the rest of my experience there left much to be desired. Willi

        god made west virginia long before he came up with north carolina.  obviously, practice makes perfect. your friend in the old north state wayno

Response:

…none of us knew when you were coming in or where you were staying. sorry we missed you. i was the last one out this afternoon. hope the rain let up for you… jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –    don’t know where them boys are at exactly, but I’ve got a Tracker comin up from Georgia and goin to meet me at Popeye’s Restaraunt in Robbinsville and we’re goin to find them…. Probably won’t get there until Fri or Sat nite…….they me have all left by then….Fri Sat and Sun I’ll be at http://www.atcampground.com/index.html john

Response:

   don’t know where them boys are at exactly, but I’ve got a Tracker comin up from Georgia and goin to meet me at Popeye’s Restaraunt in Robbinsville and we’re goin to find them…. Probably won’t get there until Fri or Sat nite…….they me have all left by then….Fri Sat and Sun I’ll be at http://www.atcampground.com/index.html john

Response:

  don’t know where them boys are at exactly, but I’ve got a Tracker comin up from Georgia and goin to meet me at Popeye’s Restaraunt in Robbinsville and we’re goin to find them…. Probably won’t get there until Fri or Sat nite…….they me have all left by then….Fri Sat and Sun I’ll be at http://www.atcampground.com/index.html

I just got back from there, not sure how many are staying into the weekend. Just head up towards the Snowbird back country area and you should find Opie and Wolfgang’s tent city encampment. Back down towards the paved road is IJ and Big Dales cabin (just across the bridge from the road and up to the left, 2nd or 3rd cabin). Before you get to the back country turnoff you will see a bed and breakfast sign on the left. Turn in there and keep left and you will find Jeff, Walt and Tom’s cabin. Wayno is in the luxurious San Ran Motel in Robbinsville. The weather was great the two days I was there, and fish were being caught (some wild, some native, some just passing through<g). — Charlie…

Response:

Opie and Wolfgang have broken camp and just arrived back in Lenoir.  We will be fishing’s Upper Creek in the morn.  Tom has left, wayno and Walt will leave in the morn, but I think IJ, Big D, and Jeff will be stayin’ thru Sat. I won’t bore anyone with a piss poor TR, as I was the only one there that didn’t catch a fish! Op

  don’t know where them boys are at exactly, but I’ve got a Tracker comin up from Georgia and goin to meet me at Popeye’s Restaraunt in Robbinsville and we’re goin to find them…. Probably won’t get there until Fri or Sat nite…….they me have all left by then….Fri Sat and Sun I’ll be at

http://www.atcampground.com/index.html – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I just got back from there, not sure how many are staying into the weekend. Just head up towards the Snowbird back country area and you should find Opie and Wolfgang’s tent city encampment. Back down towards the paved road is IJ and Big Dales cabin (just across the bridge from the road and up to the left, 2nd or 3rd cabin). Before you get to the back country turnoff you will see a bed and breakfast sign on the left. Turn in there and keep left and you will find Jeff, Walt and Tom’s cabin. Wayno is in the luxurious San Ran Motel in Robbinsville. The weather was great the two days I was there, and fish were being caught (some wild, some native, some just passing through<g). — Charlie…

Response:

I won’t bore anyone with a piss poor TR, as I was the only one there that didn’t catch a fish!

It’s okay Opie!  I am here for you!  It seems that another difference between us is that my mentors know how to fish and help me catch fish! Perhaps you can borrow one of mine like Willi, Brian Nelson, RW,  etc. Or even George might be able to teach you something! <bseg — Warren Findley www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt

Response:

Is that you George? Op

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I won’t bore anyone with a piss poor TR, as I was the only one there that didn’t catch a fish! It’s okay Opie!  I am here for you!  It seems that another difference between us is that my mentors know how to fish and help me catch fish! Perhaps you can borrow one of mine like Willi, Brian Nelson, RW,  etc. Or even George might be able to teach you something! <bseg — Warren Findley www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt

Response:

Well, looks like I’ll have some rain…..what were you fishin with? john

Response:

Well, looks like I’ll have some rain…..what were you fishin with?

Mostly yellow humpies and parachute adams were what I used, not real sure about the others. Yellow typically works well there. My fall back fly up there is an orange stimulator but I didn’t try one this trip. — Charlie…

Response:

Is that you George?

Is that you Skunked?

Response:

Well, looks like I’ll have some rain…..what were you fishin with?

        a chemist from kansas by way of hotlanta, mostly.  tent shaped body and white hackle.  :)         naw, really, stimulators in both orange and royal style met with success on the beautiful little wild rainbows over on hazel. wolfgang, jeffie, and waldo slayed em (literally) on my former secret honey hole.         wayno         and if you don’t think carolina is just as pretty as colorado, come drive the cherohala skyway in mid october.

Response:

        wayno         and if you don’t think carolina is just as pretty as colorado, come drive the cherohala skyway in mid october.

People in Colorado drive to the mountains to see the changing Aspen. The scene is nice but it is a shadow of fall’s spendor back east. I lived in West Virginia where I taught school for one school year. Fall was immensely beautiful, but the rest of my experience there left much to be desired. Willi

Response:

   a chemist from kansas by way of hotlanta, mostly.  tent shaped body and white hackle.  :)

Certainly you meant to type "chiseled" and accidently typed "tent shaped". <g — Charlie…

Response:

Trust me Opus.  What I don’t know about fly fishing is infinitely greater then what I know, and no, that wasn’t me Opus.  I’m just a Ghost of Fly Fishing Past.  My name hangs on the winds of time.  You know me, you just don’t understand the whispered words. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is that you George? Op I won’t bore anyone with a piss poor TR, as I was the only one there that didn’t catch a fish! It’s okay Opie!  I am here for you!  It seems that another difference between us is that my mentors know how to fish and help me catch fish! Perhaps you can borrow one of mine like Willi, Brian Nelson, RW,  etc. Or even George might be able to teach you something! <bseg — Warren Findley www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt

  george.vcf

< 1K Download

Response:

Question:

http://www.infoarchitects.com/products.htm this address contains a demo of a shareware program called easy shop * Sent from AltaVista http://www.altavista.com Where you can also find related Web Pages, Images, Audios, Videos, News, and Shopping.  Smart is Beautiful

Response:

Sometime back I d/l a shareware version of a program called Shop Layout, at least that is what I think it was called <g. But, alas, my system has since crashed and now that I have purchased my new TS and some other pieces, I thought I would layout how I want my shop set up. This software allowed me to give the footprint of most any equipment, benches etc and move them around so as to get the best fit. Anybody know of something similar, or better yet, the web address to get the same program? Mark (as in fishing) Beautiful Oregon…

Response:

Question:

   In the first place Mike didn’t do anything any decent person would have done. I sent an E-mail to Dianna telling her my opinion of the article and received a reply which was negative and did not sound like her.  I did not know about the injury to her husband and the pressure she was under at the time.  As the Editor she did have a responsibility to place a disclaimer to state FAOL’s position on Old Ruff’s article, which she did not do.  This made it appear that they condoned this inflammatory article.  Then she removed the negative comments about it from FAOL which further indicated FAOL’s position was to agree with the article.  Deanna made some serious errors and her actions led to the current situation.    Mike’s reputation is even better with me because he has the courage of his convictions.  If I had to chose between Mike and FAOL, Mike would win every time. Ernie Harrison – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a certain reputation to uphold here, and elsewhere.< Not any more. Oh, I think Mike still enjoys a pretty good reputation on ROFF.  Of course, my supposition hinges on the assumption that you don’t speak for all of us…….I could be wrong.

Response:

ROFF is the one place, FAOL cannot censor opposing points of view. < And one YOU cannot censor.

And what have I censored? bc.

Response:

HRBlain writes: I could be wrong.< You often are.

Careful, HR, or you’ll end up in Bmabia, which is right next to Bmalia.  In fact, they share the same fire and police dpts.  The young ladies in Bmabia, however, are small titted, unlike the lucious dolls of Bmalia.  Something about the water I suspect. Dave L.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Mike,   Ok, already! Perhaps it is only me, but I see no need to burden ROFF with ongoing matters on FAOL. For days on end, we get a bombardment of threads, the vast majority started by yourself, to discuss your beef with folks who don’t regularly contribute here. Wasn’t it you who had to depart us once before over needless bulk caused by other threads? You seem to be taken with the need to justify on this forum why you shouldn’t be blamed for the demise(if indeed such happens)of FAOL. It is perfectly rational that some blame you. Get over it. Get back to the insightful and well written stuff that has endeared you to many. I miss your angling writing, and hope not to offend with these observations.                         regards,                          Tom Littleton "Every now and then when your life gets complicated and the weasels start closing in, the only real cure is to load up on heinous chemicals and then drive like a bastard from Hollywood to Las Vegas."

Tom: I am little more than a lurker here with very few posts to my credit. I have, however, read Mr. Connors and many others posts over the last 6 months. In this time I’ve found him to be free with his knowledge, a prolific contributor to the group, and above all, a reasonable and courteous gentleman. He now finds himself in a position of being slandered, quoted out of context, and generally maligned by persons who aren’t qualified to carry his creel. His integrity has been called in to question by persons with less than honourable methods. I think he has handled himself with more restraint than I could. If he feels that posting to a public forum is the best way to defend his name, I am willing to afford him some lattitude. IMHO, ROFF is a forum for educated (formal or otherwise) and sometimes opinionated, gentleman to gather for thought provoking discussion with fly fishing being the tie that binds (if not always the main topic <G). When I get tired of a thread I just move to the next subject header. Rick O. "Children are born with an innate sense of justice; it usually takes twelve years of public schooling and four more years of college to beat it out of them." "Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell."

Response:

Like I said in another post… "Crusty Factor" — Michael Era

Question:

Hi all, 1. The cost of fishing is going up, up, up. A good Sage rod can cost upwards of $600 for a piece of inexpensive graphite.  A day with a guide can cost above $300.  A night at a fishing lodge can cost $600.  (Firewood kindling can cost $40!<g)

Of course, we’ve always justified these things by pointing out how expensive cocaine is in comparison.  (just kidding) I am living proof that you can get an enormous amount of enjoyment from fishing for very little money.

Response:

Hi all, I’ve received a couple of nasty emails over the past few days which tell me at least a few people do not understand what I am saying in my posts under the thread "Orvis Bashing."  (Believe me, I understand that most do not care!)  I am concerned others who read what I write, but do not send me email believe I am complaining about my salary.  I am not.  Like almost everyone, I wish it were more, and I believe it should be, but I have plenty of options if I am really unhappy about salary.  I’m sorry if what I write comes off as complaining at all, but I assure you, I am not talking about my salary.  Let me try and be as clear with my ideas as possible. 1. The cost of fishing is going up, up, up.   A good Sage rod can cost upwards of $600 for a piece of inexpensive graphite.  A day with a guide can cost above $300.  A night at a fishing lodge can cost $600.  (Firewood kindling can cost $40!<g) 2. We, the consumers, are as guilty as Orvis or anyone in this game.   We do not critically examine what the return is for the cost.  We pay it, just like we pay for overpriced Nike shoes.  We have been marketed. This I think, is a relatively recent phenomenon in fishing. 3. We do not do this with all things, like taxes or education.   We want to know what we will get for increased expenditures and most of us are suspicious of those who ask for more.  Therefore, it is not an innate part of the human condition to automatically overpay for things we value.  There is no a priori connection. 4. In fact, public education (and the local library, etc., whatever your local taxes go towards) in this country is generally an outrageous bargain.  We do not recognize this (in part) because there is no slick brochure, no beautiful movie or hilarious TV advertisement that tells us it is true.  There is no marketing.   5. If we really thought about this stuff, there is no way most of us could justify paying more for our own recreation than our children’s needs. Summary: The real beef with Orvis (or Sage, etc.) is that they are great marketers. This is not a crime, and we as consumers are partners in the activity. We must first realize this.  I made some comparisons of things I know about in order to demonstrate how much we pay for things which need not be expensive.  "Costs more" is not always better, nor is it necessary. Fishing for trout is about standing in a beautiful river in a beautiful setting and that is still free.  Resist the rest.   — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

Response:

Rick Fletcher schrieb in Nachricht Hi all, I’ve received a couple of nasty emails over the past few days which tell

Hi Rick, I read all the Orvis bashing posts etc with interest. Understood your posts as well, in fact I invariably do understand your posts. Think it has to do with the fact that they are well composed and spelled, and you seem to know what you are talking about usually.  I think many people dislike being faced with moral issues, especially when this has to do with their passions and hobbies.   Some of the comparisons are a little hard to take, because they are obviously too close to the mark. I am bound to disagree with one or two of your points however, many people have no problem at all justifying the cost of their recreation as opposed to their childrens, or anybody elses needs for that matter, this is part of the problem. Also, one of the reasons many people go fishing, is to forget their problems for a while, and do not wish to be reminded of them in this context, because it probably makes them feel guilty as hell, having spent all that money which they shouldnt really have done in the first place !.  A lot of people are firmly convinced that it is not possible to enjoy anything much at all unless it is done using the " best" tools etc available, this all too often translates into the "most expensive" and I have actually heard people discussing tackle etc. in shops and the like, when somebody has said "it must be good, look how expensive it is ! ". This phenomenon is not new either, read some of the older literature, and you will see what I mean, Skues plugging Leonard rods etc. Hardys being praised to the skies for some perfectly ordinary ( but expensive ! ) bit of totally useless equipment etc. etc.  The high power marketing of today was not apparent of course, but then the market was far more limited. Even otherwise sensible people fall for "hype" when it has to do with their hobby, and this is what makes the market so attractive, the very fact that people will spend very large amounts of money for "names" etc, without really being able to judge whether it is worth it or not, and without making any appreciable difference to their capabilities, although pride of ownership etc might increase their enjoyment a little. Sorry you got nasty e-mails, but not everybody does things like that. Lastly, and on a somewhat lighter note, can you  tell me where this free beautiful river in a beautiful setting is ? ( just kidding ! ) Tight lines ! Mike Connor

Response:

Hi all, I’ve received a couple of nasty emails over the past few days

        ok, rick, send me their addresses, and i’ll have o.c. and the bad boys from rowan county, n.c. chill the bastards.  anything goes in the defense of literacy! T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

        a. wayne harrison

Response:

Hi Rick, You are trying to link your desire of a high end rod with Orvis marketing. And then blaming Orvis for your need of an expensive rod.  Am I getting close?  Hard to resist though.   My wife and I have two children about to enter college.  I surely want them in the Dennisons, Harvards, and the Dukes of this world but, guess what, it costs money.  My daughter wants to go into elementary education.  Talk about a return on her (my) money!  My son wants to be a flyfishing, rock climbing bum.  But he also realizes that after the good times, he might have the need to provide for a retirement. Rather than grip about the ‘high end’ colleges, we simply pay the costs (without grabbing an appropriate newsgroup and soap box) or we council a college priced fairly for the educational degree we are after. Buy a rod on sale and make it do and don’t worry yourself over the Orvis marketing that none of us can do anything about.   Hope this makes sense. Mike Warren, OH/Cook Forest, PA – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all, I’ve received a couple of nasty emails over the past few days which tell me at least a few people do not understand what I am saying in my posts under the thread "Orvis Bashing."  (Believe me, I understand that most do not care!)  I am concerned others who read what I write, but do not send me email believe I am complaining about my salary.  I am not.  Like almost everyone, I wish it were more, and I believe it should be, but I have plenty of options if I am really unhappy about salary.  I’m sorry if what I write comes off as complaining at all, but I assure you, I am not talking about my salary.  Let me try and be as clear with my ideas as possible. 1. The cost of fishing is going up, up, up. A good Sage rod can cost upwards of $600 for a piece of inexpensive graphite.  A day with a guide can cost above $300.  A night at a fishing

Response:

Well said Mike, I guess it really isn’t Orvis that I dislike, it is just their marketing, advertising and promotional methods. — Ernie Harrison Remove NOSPAM to send E-mail GO TO  http://www/ccnet.com/~emh FOR TRAVEL TIE BOX PLANS – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Rick Fletcher schrieb in Nachricht Hi all, I’ve received a couple of nasty emails over the past few days which tell Hi Rick, I read all the Orvis bashing posts etc with interest. Understood your posts as well, in fact I invariably do understand your posts. Think it has to do with the fact that they are well composed and spelled, and you seem to know what you are talking about usually.  I think many people dislike being faced with moral issues, especially when this has to do with their passions and hobbies.   Some of the comparisons are a little hard to take, because they are obviously too close to the mark. I am bound to disagree with one or two of your points however, many people have no problem at all justifying the cost of their recreation as opposed to their childrens, or anybody elses needs for that matter, this is part of the problem. Also, one of the reasons many people go fishing, is to forget their problems for a while, and do not wish to be reminded of them in this context, because it probably makes them feel guilty as hell, having spent all that money which they shouldnt really have done in the first place !.  A lot of people are firmly convinced that it is not possible to enjoy anything much at all unless it is done using the " best" tools etc available, this all too often translates into the "most expensive" and I have actually heard people discussing tackle etc. in shops and the like, when somebody has said "it must be good, look how expensive it is ! ". This phenomenon is not new either, read some of the older literature, and you will see what I mean, Skues plugging Leonard rods etc. Hardys being praised to the skies for some perfectly ordinary ( but expensive ! ) bit of totally useless equipment etc. etc.  The high power marketing of today was not apparent of course, but then the market was far more limited. Even otherwise sensible people fall for "hype" when it has to do with their hobby, and this is what makes the market so attractive, the very fact that people will spend very large amounts of money for "names" etc, without really being able to judge whether it is worth it or not, and without making any appreciable difference to their capabilities, although pride of ownership etc might increase their enjoyment a little. Sorry you got nasty e-mails, but not everybody does things like that. Lastly, and on a somewhat lighter note, can you  tell me where this free beautiful river in a beautiful setting is ? ( just kidding ! ) Tight lines ! Mike Connor

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Rick – thanks for the well thought out post. Based on your perspective of money and costs and value(s), I am certain that we could fish together. I could not agree more. Ben

Response:

Hi all, I’ve received a couple of nasty emails over the past few days which tell me at least a few people do not understand what I am saying in my posts under the thread "Orvis Bashing."  

[snip] Been there, fun eh? 3. We do not do this with all things, like taxes or education.   We want to know what we will get for increased expenditures and most of us are suspicious of those who ask for more.  Therefore, it is not an innate part of the human condition to automatically overpay for things we value.  There is no a priori connection. 4. In fact, public education (and the local library, etc., whatever your local taxes go towards) in this country is generally an outrageous bargain.  We do not recognize this (in part) because there is no slick brochure, no beautiful movie or hilarious TV advertisement that tells us it is true.  There is no marketing.  

These complaints work both ways. Canada has a universal health care system paid for by tax revenue.  I was at a party last year when one party goer (with a six figure income in anyone’s currency) whined and complained about how much he had to pay in taxes to support this system.  I wondered how many tens or hundreds of thousands he was willing to commit to an early death, just so he could become even filthier rich.  Neither was he willing to consider that the alternatives would have ended up costing the country and him, even more.  Limited minds don’t necessarily come attached to limited pockets. 5. If we really thought about this stuff, there is no way most of us could justify paying more for our own recreation than our children’s needs.

Only the most selfish would. Summary: The real beef with Orvis (or Sage, etc.) is that they are great marketers. This is not a crime, and we as consumers are partners in the activity. We must first realize this.  I made some comparisons of things I know about in order to demonstrate how much we pay for things which need not be expensive.  "Costs more" is not always better, nor is it necessary. Fishing for trout is about standing in a beautiful river in a beautiful setting and that is still free.  Resist the rest.   — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

What’s that old saying? Caveat emptor?  True in flyfishing as in anything else. Peter

Response:

Oy, an intelligent post.  I had to, like, read it. As a public school teacher I can relate.  I often do extra duty and spend summer days in curriculum development or whatever to make enough money to indulge in my addiction.  Regular money covers other luxuries like food.  I think of this extra money not as dollars but as flyrods, which are very expensive even if you get the "good guy" price. Dave

Response:

Question:

If you’ve got a message, or information which may be of interest to fly fishers in Louisiana, please post it to the Louisiana Fly Fishing web site bulletin board at www.laflyfish.org/laff/bboard.

Response:

Sorry, make that http://www.laflyfish.org/laff/bboard/wwwboard.html. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If you’ve got a message, or information which may be of interest to fly fishers in Louisiana, please post it to the Louisiana Fly Fishing web site bulletin board at www.laflyfish.org/laff/bboard.

Response:

Question:

Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit One thing I did find a problem was trying to stay orientated relative to the wind. The tendency was to rotate until I was head on to the wind. I was in a round bucks bag tube. Would a small droque help to keep you side on to the wind.

I use an oval Caddis float tube, and have occasion to run into the wind in the afternoons on the Sierra lakes I frequent.  A couple of years ago I picked up a nylon anchor bag, that comes with several fathoms of 3/8′ nylon rope.  It’s really changed the way I fish lakes. The bag allows me to determine how much weight I need to use depending upon the strength of the wind, but I’ve found that 2-3 fist sized rocks will usually do the job.  Even with rocks, the bag will fit into a pocket on my tube, so I needn’t drag it around as I travel.  If the wind is lighter than anticipated, I drop a rock, and if it picks up, I’m never very far from shore where I can grab another. I’ve attached a one-handed snap-swivel to the rope, and that makes it easy to change the attachment point to different d-rings on the tube, because the attachment point inevitably ends up upwind, although it’s not too difficult to maintain a casting position facing in any direction, once I’m anchored. My fishing buddy, an ex-swabby, says that for any given depth, the anchor line should be increased as the wind increases.  He gave me some sort of naval term for it, which I disremember, but a longer line helps the anchor hold better in heavier winds.  See illustration below. [Image] Many is the time I’ll anchor out in the middle of a lake, and cast upwind.  I’ll let the wind move my fly and I find that this method puts my fly over lots of fish.  When I want to move, I just pull the thing off the bottom, and either kick to a new location, or let the wind take me.  At first I worried that I wouldn’t know when the anchor hit bottom, but I find there’s no mistaking it. Tubing changed the way I fish lakes, and the anchor has changed the way I tube. Anglerboy — Trout fear me, Women want me. http://www.midtown.net/~angler/ Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit <HTML

<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITEOne thing I did find a problem was trying to stay orientated relative to <BRthe wind. The tendency was to rotate until I was head on to the wind. I <BRwas in a round bucks bag tube. <PWould a small droque help to keep you side on to the wind.</BLOCKQUOTE I use an oval Caddis float tube, and have occasion to run into the wind in the afternoons on the Sierra lakes I frequent.&nbsp; A couple of years ago I picked up a nylon anchor bag, that comes with several fathoms of 3/8′ nylon rope.&nbsp; It’s really changed the way I fish lakes. <PThe bag allows me to determine how much weight I need to use depending upon the strength of the wind, but I’ve found that 2-3 fist sized rocks will usually do the job.&nbsp; Even with rocks, the bag will fit into a pocket on my tube, so I needn’t drag it around as I travel.&nbsp; If the wind is lighter than anticipated, I drop a rock, and if it picks up, I’m never very far from shore where I can grab another. <PI’ve attached a one-handed snap-swivel to the rope, and that makes it easy to change the attachment point to different d-rings on the tube, because the attachment point inevitably ends up upwind, although it’s not too difficult to maintain a casting position facing in any direction, once I’m anchored. <PMy fishing buddy, an ex-swabby, says that for any given depth, the anchor line should be increased as the wind increases.&nbsp; He gave me some sort of naval term for it, which I disremember, but a longer line helps the anchor hold better in heavier winds.&nbsp; See illustration below. <PMany is the time I’ll anchor out in the middle of a lake, and cast upwind.&nbsp; I’ll let the wind move my fly and I find that this method puts my fly over lots of fish.&nbsp; When I want to move, I just pull the thing off the bottom, and either kick to a new location, or let the wind take me.&nbsp; At first I worried that I wouldn’t know when the anchor hit bottom, but I find there’s no mistaking it. <PTubing changed the way I fish lakes, and the anchor has changed the way I tube. <PAnglerboy <P– <BRTrout fear me, <BRWomen want me. <BR<A HREF="http://www.midtown.net/~angler/"http://www.midtown.net/~angler/</A <BR&nbsp;</HTML Content-Type: image/jpeg Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: inline; filename="C:tempnsmailRA.jpeg" <encoded_portion_removed RRQAUUUUAFFFFABRRRQAUUUUAFFFFAH/2Q==

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Dave I have been float tubeing now for 3 years, Although I don’t profess to being an expert I will gladly share with you my thoughts on the technique. No doubt other float tubers will have there own ideas, Inparticular the anglers that fish running waters. With regards to the techniqe I find that a  most satisfactory method to fish is a slow figure of eight but be careful of the all too common takes on the lift. When float tubeing I normally fish with two flies, Some anglers fish with one some with two it,s really what you feel most comfortable with. But bearing in mind you have not got the same luxury of extendable landing nets. This thought should hopefully help you with your selection of leader length. From what I have witnessed rod lengths again vary from angler to angler from say 9′ to 11′,  Again I’m talking still waters. River anglers may go down to 7′ or 8′, I personally use a 101/2′ rod which I find quite adequate. With referance to casting, As with any type of fly fishing you still have to load the rod. Again this depends on individual skills, Having said that many fish I have found are caught short lineing. Retrieving options are as varied as boat or bank angling, My advise on this would be to use them all. On the matter of loseing your rod whilst unhooking a fish or maybe having a sandwich, beer, ect. Most float tubes have two Velcro straps at the front of the tube to secure your rod. Additional tips. 1) Walk into the water backwards when launching. 2) Wear a bouyancy aid. 3) Tie your flippers to your ankles, (Individually of coarse). 4) Don’t drink too much fluid if you have a weak bladder, This can be most embarrassing but you can always blame it on leeking waders. 5) Observe all the safety guidlines set down by The Health and Safety Executive, Details can be obtained from The British Float Tube Association (See below). The British Float Tube Association Secretary Andre’ Russell 24 Merton Avenue, Syston, Leicester. LE7 2JP. Tel: 0116-260-6924. Hope this helps, Let us know how you get on. Tight lines. Tony Connor : Next week I am going float tubeing for the first time on a still water : and I need help with the answers to a few questions. : : What techniques are recommended. : : How many Flies do I fish, I will be using either an 8foot or 9 foot rod. : : In fact what is the best rod length. : : How long a leader. : : How far do I cast, do use enough line to load the rod from pickup or do : I cast further. : : Do I retieve or use loch style with a hang before a simple up and out : recast. : : How do I stop the rod falling into the water and sinking into the depths : when I change flies or land a fish, do I keep it attached to the tube. : : Any more tips. : : Dave Bolt : UK :

Response:

Dave I have been float tubeing now for 3 years, Although I don’t profess to being an expert I will gladly share with you my thoughts on the technique. No doubt other float tubers will have there own ideas, Inparticular the anglers that fish running waters. With regards to the techniqe I find that a  most satisfactory method to fish is a slow figure of eight but be careful of the all too common takes on the lift. When float tubeing I normally fish with two flies, Some anglers fish with one some with two it,s really what you feel most comfortable with. But bearing in mind you have not got the same luxury of extendable landing nets. This thought should hopefully help you with your selection of leader length. From what I have witnessed rod lengths again vary from angler to angler from say 9′ to 11′,  Again I’m talking still waters. River anglers may go down to 7′ or 8′, I personally use a 101/2′ rod which I find quite adequate. With referance to casting, As with any type of fly fishing you still have to load the rod. Again this depends on individual skills, Having said that many fish I have found are caught short lineing. Retrieving options are as varied as boat or bank angling, My advise on this would be to use them all. On the matter of loseing your rod whilst unhooking a fish or maybe having a sandwich, beer, ect. Most float tubes have two Velcro straps at the front of the tube to secure your rod. Additional tips. 1) Walk into the water backwards when launching. 2) Wear a bouyancy aid. 3) Tie your flippers to your ankles, (Individually of coarse). 4) Don’t drink too much fluid if you have a weak bladder, This can be most embarrassing but you can always blame it on leeking waders. 5) Observe all the safety guidlines set down by The Health and Safety Executive, Details can be obtained from The British Float Tube Association (See below). The British Float Tube Association Secretary Andre’ Russell 24 Merton Avenue, Syston, Leicester. LE7 2JP. Tel: 0116-260-6924. Hope this helps, Let us know how you get on. Tight lines. Tony Connor U.K. Lancashire. : Next week I am going float tubeing for the first time on a still water : and I need help with the answers to a few questions. : : What techniques are recommended. : : How many Flies do I fish, I will be using either an 8foot or 9 foot rod. : : In fact what is the best rod length. : : How long a leader. : : How far do I cast, do use enough line to load the rod from pickup or do : I cast further. : : Do I retieve or use loch style with a hang before a simple up and out : recast. : : How do I stop the rod falling into the water and sinking into the depths : when I change flies or land a fish, do I keep it attached to the tube. : : Any more tips. : : Dave Bolt : UK :

Response:

: One thing I did find a problem was trying to stay orientated relative to : the wind. The tendency was to rotate until I was head on to the wind. I : was in a round bucks bag tube. : I find the wind to be a real pain in the rear, and would be interested : in hearing about any type of anchor used by other belly boaters.  On a big : lake it is hard to maintain a steady position or to determine how fast : your fly is dragging due to the wind. The best way that I have to deal with the wind is to keep at my back. This allows me to slowly kick so that I can maintain postion and steer the tube back into the position I want. It does not take much effrot to do this, and I can stay "put" in any wind that I can cast in. Of course, this is not always possible with some spots that I want to fish. Then, I’ll drift like I would in a canoe and paddle back to drift again. And remember, whitecaps breaking over your casting apron is nature’s way of telling you to knock off the foolishness and head for shore. ;- — Jon Porter

Response:

Sue wants to know, will a big fish tow you round the water. Should we get in some water skiing practice

We have a local lake that the ODF&W (Oregon Dept. of Fish & Wildlife) puts the spawned out hatchery steelhead into each year.  A friend of mine hooked one last spring and spent two hours with it towing him around the lake.  He couldn’t do a thing about it.  And, he ended up taking the fish home for a few meals. — Tight Threads,         Charley Renn         Corvallis, OR

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Next week I am going float tubeing for the first time on a still water and I need help with the answers to a few questions. What techniques are recommended. How many Flies do I fish, I will be using either an 8foot or 9 foot rod. At once? One or more up to as many as you can handle. In fact what is the best rod length. Generally longer is better in a tube as you are so close to the water. How long a leader. for a surface presentation 12 feet is about average for sinking lines 5 or 6 feet is averge . How far do I cast, do use enough line to load the rod from pickup or do I cast further. however far away the fish are. You should be able to get closer to fish and hence cast a shorter line. Do I retieve or use loch style with a hang before a simple up and out recast. How do I stop the rod falling into the water and sinking into the depths when I change flies or land a fish, do I keep it attached to the tube. I stick the reel end of the rod sort of into my lap or between my knees. Many tubes have velcro bits on either side of the stripping apron lay your rod across these and fasten with the velcro before you start fiddling with fly boxes and cutting leaders Any more tips. Take a piss before you go out and take some water (NO BEER!) with you. I’ve had problems with leg cramps brought on by lack of fuids. Dave Bolt UK Ralph H

 I second the idea to take a piss before you enter the water!!! HEHEHE. Looks kinda silly kicking to the shore only to urinate all over your waders because you can’t pull em down fast enogh…

Response:

Next week I am going float tubeing for the first time on a still water and I need help with the answers to a few questions.

Just a couple general pointers. 1. Wear a lfe vest. 2. Scout the area and find a nice flat, firm bottom on which to enter. 3. Make sure you’re familiar with your tube. Think about how you’d get out in a problem. 4. Inflate it properly. Not too much and not too little. 5. Keep it close to shore – real close –  until you’re comfortable, and understand your ability. 6. Pee before you begin. 7. Narrow down your  tackle to the bear minimum. 8. Consider doing it on a small body of water on a calm day. Every spring, after a long winter of no physical activity, I get leg cramps my first time or two out. Keep it slow, stop and rest as soon as a cramp begins. Good luck, John Nesselrode Shawnee, KS

Response:

Next week I am going float tubeing for the first time on a still water and I need help with the answers to a few questions. What techniques are recommended. How many Flies do I fish, I will be using either an 8foot or 9 foot rod. In fact what is the best rod length. How long a leader. How far do I cast, do use enough line to load the rod from pickup or do I cast further. Do I retieve or use loch style with a hang before a simple up and out recast. How do I stop the rod falling into the water and sinking into the depths when I change flies or land a fish, do I keep it attached to the tube. Any more tips. Dave Bolt UK

Response:

Next week I am going float tubeing for the first time on a still water and I need help with the answers to a few questions. What techniques are recommended. How many Flies do I fish, I will be using either an 8foot or 9 foot rod.

At once? One or more up to as many as you can handle. In fact what is the best rod length.

Generally longer is better in a tube as you are so close to the water. How long a leader.

for a surface presentation 12 feet is about average for sinking lines 5 or 6 feet is averge . How far do I cast, do use enough line to load the rod from pickup or do I cast further.

however far away the fish are. You should be able to get closer to fish and hence cast a shorter line. Do I retieve or use loch style with a hang before a simple up and out recast. How do I stop the rod falling into the water and sinking into the depths when I change flies or land a fish, do I keep it attached to the tube.

I stick the reel end of the rod sort of into my lap or between my knees. Many tubes have velcro bits on either side of the stripping apron lay your rod across these and fasten with the velcro before you start fiddling with fly boxes and cutting leaders Any more tips.

Take a piss before you go out and take some water (NO BEER!) with you. I’ve had problems with leg cramps brought on by lack of fuids. Dave Bolt UK

Ralph H

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Question:

Hi, I am looking to buy a new fly rod.  Any suggestions or comments on certain brands of fly rods?  I would like to buy a rod under $300.00. Thanks, Ben Grady

I’d try a St. Croix Legend for around $200 you’re getting a great rod. The seats are kinda shitty but they fish just fine. Powell signature series is also nice and so are Loomis GL3. If you’re really tight like me try building one. You can get a kit through Angler’s Workshop in WA for about $150, I’ve buildt 2 of their " house" brand rods which were old IM6 blanks dumped by Loomis a few years ago.

Response:

Hi, I am looking to buy a new fly rod.  Any suggestions or comments on certain brands of fly rods?  I would like to buy a rod under $300.00. Thanks, Ben Grady

Sage DS       Gene

Response:

Regarding a fly rod for under $300, I spend a month every summer fishing the Livingston area of Montana and have used a rod that may suit you very well.  I have a 8′6" 5 weight Reddington rod that I enjoy.  It’s pretty fast and may load better (fish better) with a 6 weight line.  The "plus" is that it has a lifetime guarantee and over-the-counter "no questions asked" replacement policy.  I broke mine on the Missouri last summer (closed it in my truck tailgate) and Reddington "red-labeled" (UPS Second Day Air) me a new one.  They were very professional.  They run about $225-275.  Also, try the Sage Discovery Series.

Response:

For general all purpose use a 81/2 to 9foot sage II discovery rod will meet your requirements. But first go to a fly shop and test the rod first. All top notch shops will be glad to help you,if they dont leave.  

Response:

I am looking to buy a new fly rod.  Any suggestions or comments on certain brands of fly rods?  I would like to buy a rod under $300.00. Easy formula answer.  If you do not know what "IM6" means, buy the cheapest rod marked IM6 that suits your needs (right length and weight, feels good in the hand etc.)  The price will be between $50 and $100.  (If you know what IM6 means, you wouldn’t have asked exactly this question.  This was the latest and most expensive new rod material about 10 years ago.) — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

the answer is not quie so easy as the reply suggested.  IM6 is still very much in use in high end rods.  Pick up an IM6 Winston, and you will be holding $500+ worth of rod in your hands (and worth every penny).  On he other hand, there are other generations of graphite, such as IMX, that will be in your price range. The answer to your inquiry is to ry out al sorts of rods until you find what feels best to you and is in your price range.  No one can tell you what will be best for you. Lyman Lyman G. Hughes Dallas, TX Ennis, MT

Response:

Hi, I am looking to buy a new fly rod.  Any suggestions or comments on certain brands of fly rods?  I would like to buy a rod under $300.00. Thanks, Ben Grady

Response:

I am looking to buy a new fly rod.  Any suggestions or comments on certain brands of fly rods?  I would like to buy a rod under $300.00.

Easy formula answer.  If you do not know what "IM6" means, buy the cheapest rod marked IM6 that suits your needs (right length and weight, feels good in the hand etc.)  The price will be between $50 and $100.  (If you know what IM6 means, you wouldn’t have asked exactly this question.  This was the latest and most expensive new rod material about 10 years ago.) — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

Response:

Question:

Hi,   Sage now owns Lamson. Give them a call at 1-800-533-3004 and ask for Lamson Repairs and they will take care of you. Tight Lines, Jim, NV Jim’s Outdoor Sports, Elko, NV

Response:

Sage took over Lamson and your reel is warranteed for life by sage.   Contact them. cheers gp

: I have a Lamson reel that has never been used.  When loading fly line on : the unit that creates the clicking sound (pahl?) fell out.  It is simple : affair with a small screw that holds a triangular piece of metal that : clicks as the clogs turn.  What appears to be the screw came out and I : cannoth get it to hold.  The drag still works so the reel still functions : but I would like to produce sound as it was made. : Lamson has gone out of business.  Does anyone have any idea where I might : get this repaired? — gp

Response:

I have a Lamson reel that has never been used.  When loading fly line on the unit that creates the clicking sound (pahl?) fell out.  It is simple affair with a small screw that holds a triangular piece of metal that clicks as the clogs turn.  What appears to be the screw came out and I cannoth get it to hold.  The drag still works so the reel still functions but I would like to produce sound as it was made. Lamson has gone out of business.  Does anyone have any idea where I might get this repaired?

Actually, the good name Lamson is alive and well but now a part of through them, a suitable dealer/repair facility referral seems very likely. Regards,          Rx F Fish "For Your Good Health, Fly Fish" URL=http://www.xnet.com/~rxffish

Response:

I have a Lamson reel that has never been used.  When loading fly line on the unit that creates the clicking sound (pahl?) fell out.  It is simple affair with a small screw that holds a triangular piece of metal that clicks as the clogs turn.  What appears to be the screw came out and I cannoth get it to hold.  The drag still works so the reel still functions but I would like to produce sound as it was made. Lamson has gone out of business.  Does anyone have any idea where I might get this repaired?

Response:

I have a Lamson reel that has never been used.  When loading fly line on the unit that creates the clicking sound (pahl?) fell out.  It is simple affair with a small screw that holds a triangular piece of metal that clicks as the clogs turn.  What appears to be the screw came out and I cannoth get it to hold.  The drag still works so the reel still functions but I would like to produce sound as it was made. Lamson has gone out of business.  Does anyone have any idea where I might get this repaired?

Sage now owns Lamson, and are still producing the LP series of reels. David B.

Response:

Question:

we usually catch at least twenty big Browns (2-4 lbs) in an hour or so.

Curtis, I must have missed your first message where you gave the name of thr river you were fishing.  Just post it to me on private E-mail, we don’t want to bother all of the fishermen on this group with small talk. Ernie Harrison

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Fishing spawning beds ??? I dont know nuffink about the case in question guv, but fishing a spawning bed just does not seem to be a done thing old chap

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I think that’s a good assessment of the situation.  Thanks.

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I remember reading an article in either Trout or Fly Fisherman of a study that looked at the effect of wading across spawning beds on egg mortality. I don’t recall exact numbers, but more than 75% of the eggs were squashed in the study setting. Sounds like besides stressing this year’s fish, you are also impacting several years of fish classes.

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I remember reading an article in either Trout or Fly Fisherman of a study that looked at the effect of wading across spawning beds on egg mortality. I don’t recall exact numbers, but more than 75% of the eggs were squashed in the study setting. Sounds like besides stressing this year’s fish, you are also impacting several years of fish classes.

 Ditto!,   Flyfishing affords us the chance to think before we act..IF we choose to. sd

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Now that the Browns are spawning, I have been fishing the spawning beds quite heavily lately on our local river and have been wondering what effect it has on the spawing fish.  I’ve heard that if you’re careful where you step, the actual catching of the fish doesn’t have too much of an effect on them.  To give you an idea of what its like, we usually catch at least twenty big Browns (2-4 lbs) in an hour or so.  I would appreciate any comments or experience anyone might have.

  Curtis, think REAL hard now….does anyone go through your bed with corks on? Not  the best place to hook fish.   Harry

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writes: I would imagine that since fishing is allowed on this stream during the spawning period that the local biologists are not terribly worried about population level effects, either because the stream is heavilly stocked or there are adequate numbers of trout and spawning areas to compensate for the fish which are not able to complete spawning because of being caught.

I think that the Fish and Game departments are less concerned about numbers of fish and more interested in revenues. For a lot of people, the spawning periods and fishing on the beds are the only time that they can catch large numbers of fish on a lot of the heavily pressured rivers. The Wildlife Resource guys smile upon this because the happier their anglers are, the more liscenses they sell; the more liscenses they sell, the more money they make for their management needs. The problem with this is that resource management seems to be entirely about budgets rather than sensibility. Why protect a wild strain when you can make a bunch of money to stock the depleted river with hatchery fish the next year? One case which sticks out like a sore thumb is our local Provo River which has been so well advertised this year. Western Rivers Flyfisher {full service fly shop and outfitter} 867 East 900 South – SLC, UT 84105 (800)545-4312~~(801)521-6424~~fax(801)521-6329 Green River reports, Utah fishing conditions, and statewide guide info.

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As a non-scientist (but an avid angler) who follows this issue closely here in PA, I think Mark is dead on the money in his assessment…… Each individual stream is very much a situation unto itself in terms of population dynamics, recriutment, natural mortality, etc….  If wild trout in a freestone stream have a 40-70 percent annual natural mortality regardless of angling pressure, as I have read, then the effect of issues like catching and releasing spawning fish may be masked and indiscernable to the average angler from season to season……. However, in heavily pressured fisheries, I suppose every little bit hurts.   Additionally, it occurs to me that our measurement of fish abundance as anglers  tends to tell us very little in many cases…Here in PA, the prevailing management  strategy removes BT streams from the stocking list when they exceed a biomass of about 40 lb/surface acre of water.  Some of our better freestones hold in the 75-95 lb/acre range fairly consistently.  Now, if because of drought, flood, predation or fishing over spawners, stream A goes from 85 lb/acre last year to 60 lb/acre this year, do you think as anglers we would be able to tell the difference when we fished the stream?  60 lb/acre is still a lot of trout.  So the difference is kinda like waking up in the morning and finding 23 inches of snow on your car as opposed to 19 inches.  Either one is more than enough snow…  It’s all very subjective in my view….      

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Now that the Browns are spawning, I have been fishing the spawning beds quite heavily lately on our local river and have been wondering what effect it has on the spawing fish.  I’ve heard that if you’re careful where you step, the actual catching of the fish doesn’t have too much of an effect on them.  To give you an idea of what its like, we usually catch at least twenty big Browns (2-4 lbs) in an hour or so.  I would appreciate any comments or experience anyone might have.<<<<

The reproductive cycle, from the production of gonads thru the actual act of spawning, takes up a tremendous amount of energy for a trout.  In fact many trout will die within weeks of spawning.  The added stress of being caught and fought to the point of exhaustion probably increases that fishes chance of dieing within a few weeks.  Also that fish may not have enough left in it after the fight to finish spawning, therefore no prodigy will be spawned from that individual this year.  If ther is enough trout and enough prime spawning areas  in the stream to compensate for the fish which are not spawning because of being caught, then compensatory reproduction and survival of young should help to prevent  any noticible population level effects.  If, however, either there is so much fishing pressure, or so little adequate spawning areas for these fish then you could be having profound impacts on the population (or actually the future population) in this stream.  I would imagine that since fishing is allowed on this stream during the spawning period that the local biologists are not terribly worried about population level effects, either because the stream is heavilly stocked or there are adequate numbers of trout and spawning areas to compensate for the fish which are not able to complete spawning because of being caught.  it is worry some to me anyway that someone can catch "at least twenty fish in an hour".  This sounds to me like this spawning population is big time vunerable to anglers. But on the other hand if so many fish are available and this type of fishing has been common in th past then one could conclude that the population seems able to compensate for the increased mortality of spawning fish due to being caught.It is imporatnt to note that no two streams are alike and what may be fine on one stream could be devestating to the next.  Just my two cents anyway. Mark Arrigo SUNY College of Environmental Science and Forestry Syracuse, NY

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