Question:

I didn’t see your original post so I don’tknow what your original questions were but I am pretty sure I can help you. — Capt Gordon Churchill http://www.flyfish-nc.com Guided flyfishing on the Roanoke River and the Crystal Coast of NC out of Atlantic Beach/Morhead City/Beaufort.

Response:

THanks for the reply. My wife and I are coming to Harkers Island in late October for 2 days of Albie fishing with Sarah Gardner. We plan to come a day early and spend a day seeing the sights, fishing from shore, visiting tackle shops, etc. My question was asking about places to fish, sights to see, and generally what to do in the area. We have a 4×4. Any info will be terrific! Peter G. Aitken I didn’t see your original post so I don’tknow what your original questions were but I am pretty sure I can help you. — Capt Gordon Churchill http://www.flyfish-nc.com Guided flyfishing on the Roanoke River and the Crystal Coast of NC out of

Atlantic Beach/Morhead City/Beaufort.

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Thanks so much, Tony. We are heading down on Oct 23 so we still have time to plan. Any other info you can send will be terrific. Peter

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Peter, I go to Harker’s Island every November for the ‘albert fishing and can offer some suggestions. 1. Places to eat: I always try the locally owned establishments. The Crab’s Claw and Sanitary Fish Market immediately come to mind. 2. All of the Core Banks is open to 4 wheel drive traffic, though you will have take one of the private commerical ferries over. I believe it cost me $120 for the vehicle and 2 people (round trip). Also there are a couple of services that will take you via boat to Core Banks (and I believe Shackleford Banks, wild horses on this one), for a small fee, maybe $25 or so. I know that one operates out of Harkers Island Marina.  This would allow you to walk the beaches, fish and  then be picked up in the afternoon. And I think the Park Service may operate one as well. I would also suggest you contact the guide or charter service you will be using, I’m sure they can provide you all of the information you need. I may be able to locate some of the info I originally dug up a few years ago when I started going there, if so I’ll let you know. Tony Minnick

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My wife and I will be doing a couple of days of charter fishing at Harker’s Island in late October. We have never been there and have some questions. 1. Recommendations on places to stay – or to avoid. 2. Restaurants. 3. We are considering going a day early to see the sights and do some from-the-shore fishing. What possibilities exist for this kind of fishing (either fly or surf casting)? Are there beaches that are open to trucks? Any and all information welcomed. THanks, Peter G. Aitken

Response:

Check with Gordon Churchill at  http://www.flyfish-nc.com. Tom — Tom Brown Wake Forest, NC When trouble arises and things look bad, there is always one individual who perceives a solution and is willing to take command.  Very often, that person is crazy.                                    …..Dave Barry – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My wife and I will be doing a couple of days of charter fishing at Harker’s Island in late October. We have never been there and have some questions. 1. Recommendations on places to stay – or to avoid. 2. Restaurants. 3. We are considering going a day early to see the sights and do some from-the-shore fishing. What possibilities exist for this kind of fishing (either fly or surf casting)? Are there beaches that are open to trucks? Any and all information welcomed. THanks, Peter G. Aitken

Response:

Peter, I go to Harker’s Island every November for the ‘albert fishing and can offer some suggestions. 1. Places to eat: I always try the locally owned establishments. The Crab’s Claw and Sanitary Fish Market immediately come to mind. 2. All of the Core Banks is open to 4 wheel drive traffic, though you will have take one of the private commerical ferries over. I believe it cost me $120 for the vehicle and 2 people (round trip). Also there are a couple of services that will take you via boat to Core Banks (and I believe Shackleford Banks, wild horses on this one), for a small fee, maybe $25 or so. I know that one operates out of Harkers Island Marina.  This would allow you to walk the beaches,  fish and  then be picked up in the afternoon. And I think the Park Service may operate one as well. I would also suggest you contact the guide or charter service you will be using, I’m sure they can provide you all of the information you need. I may be able to locate some of the info I originally dug up a few years ago when I started going there, if so I’ll let you know. Tony Minnick

Response:

Question:

Look, you ignorant fool.  I’ll mess with you until hell freezes over. If I remember correctly, (and I do) she wanted the address so we could send a massive surprise to everyone attending – Perhaps they had no reason to believe that. Perhaps Waldo wasn’t in the habit of giving out addresses over the phone to people who don’t identify themselves. I don’t blame him if that’s the reason. _____NO.  You are NOT an honest person and businessman.  You gripe too much, you have a temper that is unreasonable and you always make sure you get your pound of flesh when you’re wrong . . . which is often. THAT, my dear pal is a fact of life regarding you.

oh man, this is really rich. George, the "psycho" analyst see ya george, walt

Response:

There you go, sugar coating your anti-georgian diatribes agian. Com’on Wolfie.  Take the gloves off <g.

Georgie has always brought out the best in me, as he has in all of us. We have much to thank him for. Or, as the inimitable Mr. Johnson once put it, "No one could possibly think more highly of him than I do, and I do not think much of him at all."      :)

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[deleted] I have to go back to the Mayo Clinic this week end.  If I walk out of it, you have a date.

Don’t even think about not walking out. Ain’t an option. There’s damned few of us left as it is. I’m going to log off now and say the best prayer that I know how. We’re with ya George. Your pal. — TBone

Response:

I have to go back to the Mayo Clinic this week end.  If I walk out of it, you have a date.

Best of luck to you, George, you miserable sack of shit. Are you having your plumbing upgraded? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

Response:

Wolfgang Siebeneich wrote … Did it never occur to you, you miserable fucking excuse for a human being that there might be people on this planet to whom an added expense, however small, might actually be a burden?  And did it never occur to you that the contributions already made by the people who brought off this clave are already a great deal more than you could ever hope to do despite your wealth?  Remember the parable of the poor woman who gave all that she had, you worthless piece of excrement? "…one cents worth"?  You vastly overestimate your value.

There you go, sugar coating your anti-georgian diatribes agian. Com’on Wolfie.  Take the gloves off <g. —                                                       -dnc-

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I have to go back to the Mayo Clinic this week end.  If I walk out of it, you have a date. Best of luck to you, George, you miserable sack of shit. Are you having your plumbing upgraded?

medical center.  They not only love my money they love me as many doctors are fly fishermen.  If I have a chance at all, I’m in the right place rw. I could say I hope your wife leaves you, or your kids fails in school but the ultimate insult would be to wish your dog dies which I won’t do.  Therefore, I hope your wife leaves you and marries her boy friend and that I end up with your dog.  How’s that for miserable shit? : ) — Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

Response:

medical center.  They not only love my money they love me as many doctors are fly fishermen.  If I have a chance at all, I’m in the right place rw. I could say I hope your wife leaves you, or your kids fails in school but the ultimate insult would be to wish your dog dies which I won’t do.  Therefore, I hope your wife leaves you and marries her boy friend and that I end up with your dog.

That’s looking more and more probable all the time. You’ll never get my dog, though. Again, George, good luck. Listen to the doctors. Do what they say. Don’t be a pain in the ass. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – medical center.  They not only love my money they love me as many doctors are fly fishermen.  If I have a chance at all, I’m in the right place rw. I could say I hope your wife leaves you, or your kids fails in school but the ultimate insult would be to wish your dog dies which I won’t do.  Therefore, I hope your wife leaves you and marries her boy friend and that I end up with your dog. That’s looking more and more probable all the time. You’ll never get my dog, though. Again, George, good luck. Listen to the doctors. Do what they say. Don’t be a pain in the ass. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

_____  I am never that.  I’m the kind of patient doctors love.  I’m a fighter.  I walked out of the Mayo Clinic 13 years ago after my by-passes in five days and flew my own airplane home.  It was a new Mayo Clinic record.  If I die, it will be Walt Winters fault. — Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

Response:

George writes: I have to go back to the Mayo Clinic this week end.  If I walk out of it, you have a date. Good luck, George. Dave LaCourse

______  These will be the last words I will take with me when they apply the gas David. Thanks, — Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

Response:

  I know for a fact that Doug Knight donated some mighty fine flies and he never got a thank you, go to hell or kiss my ass.  If my memory serves me right, his flies never were delivered or there was a short-coming which really isn’t my business that upset him.  I know the man was not pleased the way his donation was handled.

George, Doug’s Flies were raffled at the Fall Ball as they didn’t reach Wayno’s clave in time. He was made aware of that. I know it’s none of my business, but since it concerns roff, have you paid back Doug yet all that money, it has been a year? I’m also annoyed that none of my prizes were not shipped to me.  Walt Winter kept them.

George, I kept your winnings from the first raffle and re-entered them in the fall ball in a moment of heartfelt concern. My mistake,  I should have sent them you… Various non-gink floatants and Orvis products. I guess I should have sent them to you so you could at least see what the hell a quality product is like. George, I would have guessed that you would know better by now not to mess with me. BTW, you spineless twit, having Gladys call me anonymously prior to the clave to acquire centrals address was really in poor taste. It was fun listening to her stammer as I kept asking her who I was speaking to. You go George, you really do, straight to hell. Unlike you George, I am an honest person and businessman. I repeat.  If you guys can’t afford the shipping of prizes, I will back the clave up.  Its the least I can do for the clave.

George, here’s a silver tael, buy yourself a casket.   I just had other matters to look after that were beyond my control. Dementia? See ya pal, Waldo

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Walt quotes and writes:   I know for a fact that Doug Knight donated some mighty fine flies and he never got a thank you, go to hell or kiss my ass.  If my memory serves me right, his flies never were delivered or there was a short-coming which really isn’t my business that upset him.  I know the man was not pleased the way his donation was handled. George, Doug’s Flies were raffled at the Fall Ball as they didn’t reach Wayno’s clave in time. He was made aware of that. I know it’s none of my business, but since it concerns roff, have you paid back Doug yet all that money, it has been a year? I’m also annoyed that none of my prizes were not shipped to me.  Walt Winter kept them. George, I kept your winnings from the first raffle and re-entered them in the fall ball in a moment of heartfelt concern. My mistake,  I should have sent them you… Various non-gink floatants and Orvis products. I guess I should have sent them to you so you could at least see what the hell a quality product is like. George, I would have guessed that you would know better by now not to mess with me. BTW, you spineless twit, having Gladys call me anonymously prior to the clave to acquire centrals address was really in poor taste. It was fun listening to her stammer as I kept asking her who I was speaking to. You go George, you really do, straight to hell. Unlike you George, I am an honest person and businessman. I repeat.  If you guys can’t afford the shipping of prizes, I will back the clave up.  Its the least I can do for the clave. George, here’s a silver tael, buy yourself a casket. I just had other matters to look after that were beyond my control. Dementia? See ya pal, Waldo

Doug Knight’s flies were won by someone at the fall ball and we all raved about the quality of the flies.  It was one of the most coveted of gifts.  I believe Doug won something, I can not recall what, and it was either shipped to him or he turned it down.   My biggest concern about Doug is wondering if he ever got paid for the rods he built.   George won one of my donations to the May Clave 1999.  I believe it was a bottle of floatant and some strike indicators, all marketed by Orvis.  If George would like, I will purchase more of the same and *gladly* send them to him.  But, he has to promise to use them and not throw them in the trash can. <g Dave  d;0)

Response:

< snipped a lot of vocal diarrhea Mr. G.

Damn, every time I think he is finally gone he shows up again. Turn on your filters. Ernie Harrison

Response:

  I know for a fact that Doug Knight donated some mighty fine flies and he never got a thank you, go to hell or kiss my ass.  If my memory serves me right, his flies never were delivered or there was a short-coming which really isn’t my business that upset him.  I know the man was not pleased the way his donation was handled. George, Doug’s Flies were raffled at the Fall Ball as they didn’t reach Wayno’s clave in time. He was made aware of that. I know it’s none of my business, but since it concerns roff, have you paid back Doug yet all that money, it has been a year?

______  Well frankly, it’s none of your business, is it?   I’m also annoyed that none of my prizes were not shipped to me.  Walt Winter kept them. George, I kept your winnings from the first raffle and re-entered them in the fall ball in a moment of heartfelt concern. My mistake,  I should have sent them you… Various non-gink floatants and Orvis products. I guess I should have sent them to you so you could at least see what the hell a quality product is like. George, I would have guessed that you would know better by now not to mess with me. BTW, you spineless twit, having Gladys call me anonymously prior to the clave to acquire centrals address was really in poor taste. It was fun listening to her stammer as I kept asking her who I was speaking to. You go George, you really do, straight to hell.

Look, you ignorant fool.  I’ll mess with you until hell freezes over. If I remember correctly, (and I do) she wanted the address so we could send a massive surprise to everyone attending – but because of YOU, you ungrateful moron, everyone didn’t get the shipment.  Talk about spineless twit, that best describes you and your continued name calling only lowers you.  I’ve had you figured out for a long time pal and you are frankly "a user."  As long as something benefits YOU, you’re all for it.  Anytime you touch anything, there has to be a hook in it so you can get your share.  Why is that Walt? Yes, I don’t care what the prizes were, you had no right to auction off the prizes, as you said.  The question is, where is my money?  Another way to ask it, is what did you DO with the money?  Use it to help pay shipping costs? What is so lousy about you is your sense of fun.   Unlike you George, I am an honest person and businessman.

_____NO.  You are NOT an honest person and businessman.  You gripe too much, you have a temper that is unreasonable and you always make sure you get your pound of flesh when you’re wrong . . . which is often. THAT, my dear pal is a fact of life regarding you.   I repeat.  If you guys can’t afford the shipping of prizes, I will back the clave up.  Its the least I can do for the clave. George, here’s a silver tael, buy yourself a casket.

______  Well, I’ll let you buy my casket with all the money you seem to squeeze out of everyone with your ’surprise tactics’.  I’m sure when I die, no one of your caliber will be able to fill the void.  Dying for me will be soon enough.  I’m sure that news will make your day.     I just had other matters to look after that were beyond my control. Dementia? See ya pal,

______ I’m sure when you do, the pleasure will be all yours.   Waldo (The cry-baby of ROFF) The man that always bites the hands that feed him.  

– Just remember this Walt.  This thread started with an offer by us to help with the prizes being shipped.  If you can’t handle it, let a man do the job next time.  I certainly was impressed with daytripper’s efforts and post this morning.  Why is that? Because its the WAY he does things.  He and I may have differences but at least he has a real ’sense’ for fairness.  That, I will give him. You, on the other hand, are nothing more than a hustler. This is my final answer. Mr.G http://www.gink.com

Response:

George, here’s a silver tael, buy yourself a casket.

Um, wouidn’t that be a pyre on a float boat?  Send it UPS…

Response:

_______  It appears to me that your false misgivings regarding others is a continued sham of lies.  

That you’re a miserable excuse for a person? That isn’t a lie. It’s an opinion. An extreme one, but defensible. I am not old

Just old enough to fly an F-86 upside down over the Kremlin during the Korean War… If shipping is a ball breaker, then there is such a thing as Shipping C.O.D. <snip I’m also annoyed that none of my prizes were not shipped to me.  Walt Winter kept them.

Maybe they shipped UPS? "My father said to be strong, ‘that a good man could  never do wrong’ in a dream I had last night in America"                             -Los Lobos

Response:

Dear Mr G    Have never hearde your biographicsal stories but hope you will join me at Western clave for some fishing time. You must have some good stories because the guys at the claves always mentiomn them. This last clave was sort of a bummer for me.  Only three or four of the guys were willing to give up a day of fishing with new friends to suffer thru a day watching me hang up in trees  and watching the fish exit the pools before I could get set up for casting standing in the middle of the pool. One guy even took pictures of me fishing and showed them to the crowd at night,  showing no real concern for a  brginner like me who is real bashful  and self conscinus.  I was not lucky at the raaffel as I won only a reel and a matching line, not a single fly!! And some of those guys a really cheap.  Tom  probably spent a couple of hundred dollars feeding everyone and Walt  only invest a couple of hundred in the clave package everyone received when they arrived.The worst thing was Palmico Jim  who drank one half of a boddle of Reserve Wild Turkey someone donated, that only left half a bottle for me.  Hope you western guys tread Indians a little better , and the fish are easier to catch,  Indian Joe

Response:

Look, you ignorant fool.  I’ll mess with you until hell freezes over. If I remember correctly, (and I do) she wanted the address so we could send a massive surprise to everyone attending –

Perhaps they had no reason to believe that. Perhaps Waldo wasn’t in the habit of giving out addresses over the phone to people who don’t identify themselves. I don’t blame him if that’s the reason. _____NO.  You are NOT an honest person and businessman.  You gripe too much, you have a temper that is unreasonable and you always make sure you get your pound of flesh when you’re wrong . . . which is often. THAT, my dear pal is a fact of life regarding you.  

Have you paid Doug Knight yet? "My father said to be strong, ‘that a good man could  never do wrong’ in a dream I had last night in America"                             -Los Lobos

Response:

That would be a waste of a good float boat, how about a box of matches and an old inner tube? Ernie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – George, here’s a silver tael, buy yourself a casket. Um, wouidn’t that be a pyre on a float boat?  Send it UPS…

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear Mr G    Have never hearde your biographicsal stories but hope you will join me at Western clave for some fishing time. You must have some good stories because the guys at the claves always mentiomn them. This last clave was sort of a bummer for me.  Only three or four of the guys were willing to give up a day of fishing with new friends to suffer thru a day watching me hang up in trees  and watching the fish exit the pools before I could get set up for casting standing in the middle of the pool. One guy even took pictures of me fishing and showed them to the crowd at night,  showing no real concern for a  brginner like me who is real bashful  and self conscinus.  I was not lucky at the raaffel as I won only a reel and a matching line, not a single fly!! And some of those guys a really cheap.  Tom  probably spent a couple of hundred dollars feeding everyone and Walt  only invest a couple of hundred in the clave package everyone received when they arrived.The worst thing was Palmico Jim  who drank one half of a boddle of Reserve Wild Turkey someone donated, that only left half a bottle for me.  Hope you western guys tread Indians a little better , and the fish are easier to catch,  Indian Joe

_____  Well Joe, you wouldn’t be pulling my chain now, would you?  LOL. If it is possible, I would be pleased to go fishing with you.  Just you and I.  Tom has a big heart and is a first class act.  No doubting that Joseph.   I have to go back to the Mayo Clinic this week end.  If I walk out of it, you have a date. — Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

Response:

Have you paid Doug Knight yet? "My father said to be strong, ‘that a good man could  never do wrong’ in a dream I had last night in America"                             -Los Lobos

_____ Do you still beat your wife Mike? — Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

Response:

George writes: I have to go back to the Mayo Clinic this week end.  If I walk out of it, you have a date.

Good luck, George. Dave LaCourse

Response:

My one cents worth gents…. If you guys are too cheap to handle the shipping, ship all the prizes and send me the bill.  I’ll pay for it.  Its the least I can do for my fellow "Sportsmen".

You know George, after determining that you truly are a sick man, I had promised myself that I would no longer respond to any more of your demented ravings, but this latest attempt to aggrandize yourself at the expense of someone who has gone to a great deal of trouble and expense to provide a wonderful experience to a lot of people to whom he owed nothing is really too much to bear silently.  Did it never occur to you, you miserable fucking excuse for a human being that there might be people on this planet to whom an added expense, however small, might actually be a burden?  And did it never occur to you that the contributions already made by the people who brought off this clave are already a great deal more than you could ever hope to do despite your wealth?  Remember the parable of the poor woman who gave all that she had, you worthless piece of excrement? "…one cents worth"?  You vastly overestimate your value.

Response:

_____  I was supposed to get my prize last year, which I never got. Guess SOMEONE must have sold it to start up his business? Frankly, I think there should be a silent auction AFTER Roff decides to support a faction regarding trout and/or streams.  I think using funds to support a newsletter or a favorite Catch and Release Stream (making T-Bone the President) might have merit. There is nothing wrong with Roff that thinking of improving our sport wouldn’t help. When a conclave has finished and so many complaints are written regarding "some thoughts" as found in a bad "After Drink" I would say the stream has some rogue fish in it. My one cents worth gents.  Anyone who bitches about shipping expenses is nothing more than a cheap date.  Ship the dang prizes because that is the department the prize holders KNEW was part of the deal.  Why cause trouble and make others feel they are trouble to others for winning?  I would think any one of the touted lawyers could afford at least that expense for the Conclave. If you guys are too cheap to handle the shipping, ship all the prizes and send me the bill.  I’ll pay for it.  Its the least I can do for my fellow "Sportsmen".   — Mr.G http://www.gink.com/chat

Response:

snipped stupidity: _______  It appears to me that your false misgivings regarding others is a continued sham of lies.  I am not old and I’m not demented and I’m certainly not stooping to silly ravings.  It’s you that goes over board to defame others you piece of worthless mouse shit.  It is not me that is crying about expenses and what you take to be an aggrandizement is indeed a false charge. Listen ace.  I’m not the one that is bitching and complaining about anything except the complaining that continues regarding the prizes at all the ‘Eastern Conclaves?’  I didn’t start it but I’m certainly able to assist in it.  Whoever is in control of distributing the prizes needs to pay for the shipping.  He or They KNEW that was part of the deal. Why cry in public about what it takes to ship things?  The shipping charges should be part of "That Person’s" donation to making the conclave a success.  Are you trying to tell me and everyone now that THAT wasn’t ‘assumed’ or known, or a fact of life issue?  If shipping is a ball breaker, then there is such a thing as Shipping C.O.D. No it doesn’t occur to me that anyone that can travel to a conclave to have fun with ‘the boys,’ is hurting financially.  I’m just tired of listening to the gripes and bickering and poor me alligator tears that continue since the first time around regarding prize problems.  I know for a fact that Doug Knight donated some mighty fine flies and he never got a thank you, go to hell or kiss my ass.  If my memory serves me right, his flies never were delivered or there was a short-coming which really isn’t my business that upset him.  I know the man was not pleased the way his donation was handled.  I’m also annoyed that none of my prizes were not shipped to me.  Walt Winter kept them.  Let’s call it the way it is. He never followed through.  I regard that as a cheap shot just like some who cannot afford to get the gifts to the people who won and deserved them.  Get it pal?  (Or hasn’t your elevator reached the top floor yet?) Look, its alright for me to donate expensive fly rods to charity and for worthwhile causes, right?  But when it comes my turn to get a cheap T-shirt – I don’t rate? Give me a break!  And that isn’t all of it pal. So I would appreciate it if you would continue to mind your own business Wolfgang and stop talking about those things you know little or nothing about.  Okay? I repeat.  If you guys can’t afford the shipping of prizes, I will back the clave up.  Its the least I can do for the clave. Incidentally Wolfgang, you stooping to name calling of others really is uncalled for. Sometimes, principle is more valuable and is the cement of friendships.  I certainly have the sense that there are some who are not happy about certain prize events.  All I’m saying is if there is a financial problem, I’m here to help with it even though I didn’t attend the conclave (as much as I wanted to).  I just had other matters to look after that were beyond my control. Mr. G.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – snipped stupidity: _______  It appears to me that your false misgivings regarding others is a continued sham of lies.  I am not old and I’m not demented and I’m certainly not stooping to silly ravings.  It’s you that goes over board to defame others you piece of worthless mouse shit.  It is not me that is crying about expenses and what you take to be an aggrandizement is indeed a false charge. Listen ace.  I’m not the one that is bitching and complaining about anything except the complaining that continues regarding the prizes at all the ‘Eastern Conclaves?’  I didn’t start it but I’m certainly able to assist in it.  Whoever is in control of distributing the prizes needs to pay for the shipping.  He or They KNEW that was part of the deal. Why cry in public about what it takes to ship things?  The shipping charges should be part of "That Person’s" donation to making the conclave a success.  Are you trying to tell me and everyone now that THAT wasn’t ‘assumed’ or known, or a fact of life issue?  If shipping is a ball breaker, then there is such a thing as Shipping C.O.D. No it doesn’t occur to me that anyone that can travel to a conclave to have fun with ‘the boys,’ is hurting financially.  I’m just tired of listening to the gripes and bickering and poor me alligator tears that continue since the first time around regarding prize problems.  I know for a fact that Doug Knight donated some mighty fine flies and he never got a thank you, go to hell or kiss my ass.  If my memory serves me right, his flies never were delivered or there was a short-coming which really isn’t my business that upset him.  I know the man was not pleased the way his donation was handled.  I’m also annoyed that none of my prizes were not shipped to me.  Walt Winter kept them.  Let’s call it the way it is. He never followed through.  I regard that as a cheap shot just like some who cannot afford to get the gifts to the people who won and deserved them.  Get it pal?  (Or hasn’t your elevator reached the top floor yet?) Look, its alright for me to donate expensive fly rods to charity and for worthwhile causes, right?  But when it comes my turn to get a cheap T-shirt – I don’t rate? Give me a break!  And that isn’t all of it pal. So I would appreciate it if you would continue to mind your own business Wolfgang and stop talking about those things you know little or nothing about.  Okay? I repeat.  If you guys can’t afford the shipping of prizes, I will back the clave up.  Its the least I can do for the clave. Incidentally Wolfgang, you stooping to name calling of others really is uncalled for. Sometimes, principle is more valuable and is the cement of friendships.  I certainly have the sense that there are some who are not happy about certain prize events.  All I’m saying is if there is a financial problem, I’m here to help with it even though I didn’t attend the conclave (as much as I wanted to).  I just had other matters to look after that were beyond my control. Mr. G.

ahh G, so good to have you back.  hope you’re doin ok. we all missed you at Waldo’s Spring Fling…there were waterfalls climbed in your absence. jeff

Response:

Question:

I’m looking to improve my midge presentations this year. There is a local lake that I fish often where midges appear to be a major food source and I keep getting skunked. I know, use, and tie only a couple of midge patterns: 1. Griffith’s Gnat for dry 2. Brassie for the pupa. Anyone have any killer patterns for midges? I’m especially interested in larva, pupa, and emerger type patterns. There don’t seem to be as many out there as for mayfly nymphs etc. As for presentation, I recently checked out Mike Croft’s stillwater book and found that midge larva and pupa imitations need to be presented in a near vertical presentation with very slow retrieve. I think this is part of my problem also. Any tips/techniques anyone has here would be appreciated as well!

Response:

This URL should help you out http://www.fishbc.com/adventure/angling/protalk/chan/confession.phtml TL MC — "In order to achieve what is possible, one must constantly attempt the impossible" http://www.mikeconnor.de

Response:

Wow. The article talks about using a 6 or 7 meter leader.  That seems like it would be impossible to cast? Keith – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This URL should help you out http://www.fishbc.com/adventure/angling/protalk/chan/confession.phtml

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m looking to improve my midge presentations this year. There is a local lake that I fish often where midges appear to be a major food source and I keep getting skunked. I know, use, and tie only a couple of midge patterns: 1. Griffith’s Gnat for dry 2. Brassie for the pupa. Anyone have any killer patterns for midges? I’m especially interested in larva, pupa, and emerger type patterns. There don’t seem to be as many out there as for mayfly nymphs etc. As for presentation, I recently checked out Mike Croft’s stillwater book and found that midge larva and pupa imitations need to be presented in a near vertical presentation with very slow retrieve. I think this is part of my problem also. Any tips/techniques anyone has here would be appreciated as well!

Hi Xochi, Someone else pointed you to Brian Chan’s page.  Its a very good start. There are a lot of midge patterns around, most all fly tying books show a few.  The Griffith’s Gnat is a good dry pattern, its just that lake fish aren’t on drys very often.  They are on the emergers, pupa, and larva much more often.  I like the suspended midge pupa patterns for the emergers, and the swannundase midge for the pupa.  Both are in Kaufmans book "Tying Nymphs".  You will need a variety of colors and sizes,  assume you will need black, olive, gray, and red pupa patterns.  Sizes cover a huge spectrum.  My box includes size 12 at the large end and goes to 18 at the small end. Smaller may be needed on occasion, but not so often I stock for it.   What you really need to do is spend some time watching the midges hatch in your lake.  Stock your box with the colors and sizes present at your lake.  I didn’t mention larva patterns because I don’t use any special patterns for the larva.  The pupa pattern is generally close enough. Most of my midging is done within 4 feet of the surface.  This might be peculiar to the lakes I fish.  I don’t go out of my way to use a long leader, and tippet size doesn’t need to go to the rediculous either.  A standard 9 foot leader ending in 4x is OK most of the time.  Lake fish run pretty big and while smaller tippets can be used to land them,  doing so usually exhausts the fish in the process.  Stay with the heavier tippets whenever you can. Slow is key, in fact if you can keep the line tight, no retrieve is best.  I use a strike indicator a lot so a tight line is not as critical.  Wave action provides more than enough action to the fly.  To catch a few on midges now and again is a simple matter.  To get really good at it is a whole nother story! Good luck John S.

Response:

I’m looking to improve my midge presentations this year. There is a local lake that I fish often where midges appear to be a major food source and I keep getting skunked. I know, use, and tie only a couple of midge patterns: 1. Griffith’s Gnat for dry 2. Brassie for the pupa.

snipped to save room. going to get spammed for spamming.  I have the answer, but I don’t know how to help you and others in a public forum such as ROFF. The price one pays for being an icon!  Sucks! — Mr.G Wildlife: An American Ideal & Her Values Thesis http://www.gink.com/environment/index.html

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Xochi, What about my favourite midge-emerger: Hook: TMC 2487 #’s 18-22. Tail: two strrands of twinkle flash, cut off short. Body: grey tyingthread – make a very, very thin body, tied well into the bend. Tie in a CDC-feather at the point. Wrap a small thorax with some peacock-herl Fold the CDC-feather losely over the thorax, thus forming a small buld on top. It’s OK to let some fibers point out. The idea is to get a small body with a rather messy thorax. Cut of. Just let this fly float in the surface, using a long leader-point, without too much casting. Hans van der Stroom – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m looking to improve my midge presentations this year. There is a local lake that I fish often where midges appear to be a major food source and I keep getting skunked. I know, use, and tie only a couple of midge patterns: 1. Griffith’s Gnat for dry 2. Brassie for the pupa. Anyone have any killer patterns for midges? I’m especially interested in larva, pupa, and emerger type patterns. There don’t seem to be as many out there as for mayfly nymphs etc. As for presentation, I recently checked out Mike Croft’s stillwater book and found that midge larva and pupa imitations need to be presented in a near vertical presentation with very slow retrieve. I think this is part of my problem also. Any tips/techniques anyone has here would be appreciated as well!

Response:

Greetings, Small Fly by Darrel Martin, try a search on http://www.addall.com/ for a source and the best price available. Graham

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m looking to improve my midge presentations this year. There is a local lake that I fish often where midges appear to be a major food source and I keep getting skunked. I know, use, and tie only a couple of midge patterns: 1. Griffith’s Gnat for dry 2. Brassie for the pupa. Anyone have any killer patterns for midges? I’m especially interested in larva, pupa, and emerger type patterns. There don’t seem to be as many out there as for mayfly nymphs etc. As for presentation, I recently checked out Mike Croft’s stillwater book and found that midge larva and pupa imitations need to be presented in a near vertical presentation with very slow retrieve. I think this is part of my problem also. Any tips/techniques anyone has here would be appreciated as well!

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The price one pays for being an icon!  Sucks!

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/0679887482.01.LZZZZZZZ.gif — Charlie…

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Not so, we use 20-22 ft leaders, in lakes, all the time.  A lot of people who use a bobber over their chironomids, cast these leaders very well….even with the cork. Fred – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Wow. The article talks about using a 6 or 7 meter leader.  That seems like it would be impossible to cast? Keith This URL should help you out http://www.fishbc.com/adventure/angling/protalk/chan/confession.phtml

Response:

TRY A FLY CALLED HALO MIDGE EMERGER.YOU WILL FIND THE PATTERN IN A BOOK WRITTEN BY GARY LAFONTAINE:TROUT FLIES PROVEN PATTERNS.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m looking to improve my midge presentations this year. There is a local lake that I fish often where midges appear to be a major food source and I keep getting skunked. I know, use, and tie only a couple of midge patterns: 1. Griffith’s Gnat for dry 2. Brassie for the pupa. Anyone have any killer patterns for midges? I’m especially interested in larva, pupa, and emerger type patterns. There don’t seem to be as many out there as for mayfly nymphs etc. As for presentation, I recently checked out Mike Croft’s stillwater book and found that midge larva and pupa imitations need to be presented in a near vertical presentation with very slow retrieve. I think this is part of my problem also. Any tips/techniques anyone has here would be appreciated as well!

Response:

Hi Xochi (how does one pronounce that anyway I read your post several times … these are the things that came to mind. The Grifiths Gnat and Brassie don’t really cover the few inches of water column beneath the surface unless you clip hackles or use greased leaders.   Last year Mike Connor suggested I try a snipe and purple on midging fish in lakes … I didn’t have snipe at the time and used magpie instead … both have worked for me.  But … I pick a fish and put the fly well infront and will strip the fly into the fishes path if necessary then leave it inert – I generally don’t have to fish the water.  Of course that was last year – this year may be completely different What species of fish?  Rainbows give me the most trouble with their speed, even seemingly slow rise forms are from fish moving at quite a clip. Do something radical … trick I use is to use a small attractor (size 16 or 14 at most) and fish this by casting to a rise and stripping slowly … Alexandras are good for this on the lakes I fish.  This isn’t a bad option when searching the water either.  I will also use bait fish imitations … it really depends a lot on the water. What fly do I start with? … 99% of the time the wrong one. Of course if your fish are totally switched on to a 3.75 mm pupae with a bluey-silver sheen  you may need a whole lot of luck as well… Its taken nine off-seasons to come up with couple of tactics and flies that work consistently on midge feeders during the middle of the day. steve — "Experience must be the teacher in this game – not only your own  but the other man’s" – Dick Wigram http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~steve/fush/

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m looking to improve my midge presentations this year. There is a local lake that I fish often where midges appear to be a major food source and I keep getting skunked. I know, use, and tie only a couple of midge patterns: 1. Griffith’s Gnat for dry 2. Brassie for the pupa. Anyone have any killer patterns for midges? I’m especially interested in larva, pupa, and emerger type patterns. There don’t seem to be as many out there as for mayfly nymphs etc. As for presentation, I recently checked out Mike Croft’s stillwater book and found that midge larva and pupa imitations need to be presented in a near vertical presentation with very slow retrieve. I think this is part of my problem also. Any tips/techniques anyone has here would be appreciated as well!

I don’t know if you’ve ever heard of "Whitlock’s Four-Phase Polymidge", but It is a simple and supposedly highly effective pattern.  I have never used it, but the design seems very good, and all the stories I’ve heard? Convincing!    Meroli

Response:

Steve Wrote <snip Of course if your fish are totally switched on to a 3.75 mm pupae with a bluey-silver sheen  you may need a whole lot of luck as well… Its taken nine off-seasons to come up with couple of tactics and flies that work consistently on midge feeders during the middle of the day.

Have any of you heard of the Silver Savior (as featured in Field and Stream)? It can barely be called a fly, It is supposed to work when trout seem to be "feeding on microscopic bubbles!" (pronounced with a tone of frustration). Unfortunately, I forgot how it is tied!  I can say that it is tied on a #22-#32 size hook, with almost no materials.  The author of the article said that he invented it to imitate a tiny air bubble.       Meroli

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AJ Bests patterns in FR&R about a year ago are interesting,  using  the edge from a zip lock baggie!  Will try them out in one week at Lees Ferry.  Report to follow.   Al Schuh-fly

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The best website for the San Juan,     www.ifly4trout.com    , has lots of midge patterns

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Question:

Really nice fly shop in Schroon Lake. Friendly, helpful shopkeeper. Adirondacks is God’s country. One warning, get repellent… the blackflies are big and hungry. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am planning a trip to New York’s Adirondacks this July and wonder if anyone had info on fishing in the area.  I have never been there but understand there are tons of rivers.  I’ll be in the Old Forge area near the Moose River (just west of Raquette Lake).  Any info on fly shops, public access to rivers and the hatches I might expect to see in late July would be appreciated. Thanks. Steve

Response:

I am planning a trip to New York’s Adirondacks this July and wonder if anyone had info on fishing in the area.  I have never been there but understand there are tons of rivers.  I’ll be in the Old Forge area near the Moose River (just west of Raquette Lake).  Any info on fly shops, public access to rivers and the hatches I might expect to see in late July would be appreciated. Thanks. Steve

Response:

Question:

I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies. I have tried a light coating of Scotchguard, which does not seem to do too much. I am wondering if soaking flies in Scotchguard would work better, or if there are other products that could to the trick. Please note the following: -my attractor patterns tend to float forever, especially when they are ignored by     the fish, I am more concerned with less heavily  dressed flies, especially     those that ride low on the water, or hackless patterns such as poly spinners     etc. etc. – IMHO, false casting is a good way of further spooking already spooky fish,     and not the best fly floatant, as I have seen mentioned from time to time.     Also, what if you do not have space for a backcast and you are forced to     rollcast your dries ? – a better floatant could be a solution, however what I currently use seems     to do the trick. Since it is a paste, it is hard to apply to details of small flies,     and this is the reason why I would like something that I apply once, that will     prevent the bodies of the flies from soaking up too much water Thanks -Vittorio

Response:

I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies. I have tried a light coating of Scotchguard, which does not seem to do too much. I am wondering if soaking flies in Scotchguard would work better, or if there are other products that could to the trick.

I hear Orvis has a GREAT floatant, you should try that. [Ducking],      - Ken — "Time is but the stream I go a-fishin in. I drink at it, but while I drink I see the sandy bottom and detect how shallow it is. It’s thin current slides away, but eternity remains."   – H.D. Thoreau

Response:

Other than Scotch Guard, the way you dress you pattern helps, meaning your hackle density, etc.  Variants of patterns such as a parachute or irresistable instead of a standard adams; CDC & Elk Hair vs a regular Elk hair caddis, etc..  Dress your flies to suit the water you will be fishing. A good dessicant can help, which is what I use when I can’t false cast. There is a brand of dessicant in a green translucent bottle called "Dry Shake" that dries off a fly quickly.  If you use that, and then hit it with your flotant of choice, its as good as starting with a fresh fly. I am going to mention it anyhow Vittorio, GG’s flotant really is good stuff. I used to use paste before switching.  It is worth the small investment of giving it a try.   Liquid floatants are better at getting into the details, which is the main reason I tried liquids, the liquids I tried didn’t work well enough until I used GG’s brand of flotant, no kidding. Good luck, let us know how your Scotch Guard soaking works.  I have found just spraying SG to be relatively useless. — Matt Blickensderfer * Piscaro itaque dicet mendacium *

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies. I have tried a light coating of Scotchguard, which does not seem to do too much. I am wondering if soaking flies in Scotchguard would work better, or if there are other products that could to the trick. Please note the following: -my attractor patterns tend to float forever, especially when they are ignored by    the fish, I am more concerned with less heavily  dressed flies, especially    those that ride low on the water, or hackless patterns such as poly spinners    etc. etc. – IMHO, false casting is a good way of further spooking already spooky fish,    and not the best fly floatant, as I have seen mentioned from time to time.    Also, what if you do not have space for a backcast and you are forced to    rollcast your dries ? – a better floatant could be a solution, however what I currently use seems    to do the trick. Since it is a paste, it is hard to apply to details of small flies,    and this is the reason why I would like something that I apply once, that will    prevent the bodies of the flies from soaking up too much water Thanks -Vittorio

Response:

Michael, I have tried the soaking in ScotchGuard trick. I found very little improvement on floatability. I soaked several flies in a container of Scotchguard for about a half hour then let them dry on a paper towel. I then took them and some flies I had not treated with Scotchguard fishing.  The flies soaked in Scotchguard floated only slightly longer than non-treated flies. To me it did not seem to be worth the extra effort and mess of soaking the flies in Scotchguard for what little extra floatability I got.The fliesI fished with floatant(Gink) floated just fine. I was experimenting with a parachute Adams. bruce – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -0] : : I have seen people claim that soaking in ScotchGuard works, although I : haven’t tried it. They said to spray some in a 35mm film cannister and : shake the flies in there, as I recall. : — : Charlie… I have tried that and come to the conclusion that Scotchgaurd  has no noticable effecton the flotation or soakability of my dry flies. I currently use old GG’s product at streamside and find that it works as advertised. Mike — Michael McGuire                     Hewlett Packard Laboratories (remove x’s from email if not      Palo Alto, CA 94303-0971  a spammer) Phone: (650)-857-5491

Response:

vittorio asked for advise on fly floatants. Anyone who tries Scotchguard might be tempted to try Rain-X. Please don’t that crap stunk up the garage for about a week. Big Dale

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Other than Scotch Guard, the way you dress you pattern helps, meaning your hackle density, etc.  Variants of patterns such as a parachute or irresistable instead of a standard adams; CDC & Elk Hair vs a regular Elk hair caddis, etc..  Dress your flies to suit the water you will be fishing. A good dessicant can help, which is what I use when I can’t false cast. There is a brand of dessicant in a green translucent bottle called "Dry Shake" that dries off a fly quickly.  If you use that, and then hit it with your flotant of choice, its as good as starting with a fresh fly. I am going to mention it anyhow Vittorio, GG’s flotant really is good stuff. I used to use paste before switching.  It is worth the small investment of giving it a try.   Liquid floatants are better at getting into the details, which is the main reason I tried liquids, the liquids I tried didn’t work well enough until I used GG’s brand of flotant, no kidding. Good luck, let us know how your Scotch Guard soaking works.  I have found just spraying SG to be relatively useless. — Matt Blickensderfer * Piscaro itaque dicet mendacium * I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies. I have tried a light coating of Scotchguard, which does not seem to do too much. I am wondering if soaking flies in Scotchguard would work better, or if there are other products that could to the trick. Please note the following: -my attractor patterns tend to float forever, especially when they are ignored by    the fish, I am more concerned with less heavily  dressed flies, especially    those that ride low on the water, or hackless patterns such as poly spinners    etc. etc. – IMHO, false casting is a good way of further spooking already spooky fish,    and not the best fly floatant, as I have seen mentioned from time to time.    Also, what if you do not have space for a backcast and you are forced to    rollcast your dries ? – a better floatant could be a solution, however what I currently use seems    to do the trick. Since it is a paste, it is hard to apply to details of small flies,    and this is the reason why I would like something that I apply once, that will    prevent the bodies of the flies from soaking up too much water Thanks -Vittorio

3M marketed a floatant years ago (20 yrs, maybe) and from what I heard it was scotchguard – I think the trick is to spray flies 24 hrs b4 there use and then apply a floatant, Daves bug float or whatever. The post b4 mine from Mr Matt Blickensderfer about dressing flies is probably most important.  http://www.newsfeeds.com/       The Largest Usenet Servers in the World!

Response:

tried gink? — Nicholas J. Slodki http://trampled.net/Nikolai0/

:I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies. :I have tried a light coating of Scotchguard, which does not seem to do :too much. :I am wondering if soaking flies in Scotchguard would work better, or if :there are other products that could to the trick. : lease note the following: : :-my attractor patterns tend to float forever, especially when they are :ignored by :    the fish, I am more concerned with less heavily  dressed flies, :especially :    those that ride low on the water, or hackless patterns such as poly :spinners :    etc. etc. :- IMHO, false casting is a good way of further spooking already spooky :fish, :    and not the best fly floatant, as I have seen mentioned from time to :time. :    Also, what if you do not have space for a backcast and you are :forced to :    rollcast your dries ? :- a better floatant could be a solution, however what I currently use :seems :    to do the trick. Since it is a paste, it is hard to apply to details f small flies, :    and this is the reason why I would like something that I apply once, :that will :    prevent the bodies of the flies from soaking up too much water : :Thanks : :-Vittorio : : :

Response:

I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies.

        in my twentysomething years of fishing for trout, i have found nothing that is as long lasting as gink. wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Thanks -Vittorio

Response:

(Frogspritz) writes: Someone gave me the bottle to try.  Haven’t tried it yet, however, so who knows? Unfortunately, I don’t know where it could be for sale.

The stuff works, it really works if you follow the instructions. And it is becoming available in many fly shops. Wayne Knight Geneva IL                            

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0]

: I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies. : I have tried a light coating of Scotchguard, which does not seem to do : too much. : I am wondering if soaking flies in Scotchguard would work better, or if : there are other products that could to the trick. : : I have seen people claim that soaking in ScotchGuard works, although I : haven’t tried it. They said to spray some in a 35mm film cannister and : shake the flies in there, as I recall. : — : Charlie… I have tried that and come to the conclusion that Scotchgaurd  has no noticable effecton the flotation or soakability of my dry flies. I currently use old GG’s product at streamside and find that it works as advertised. Mike — Michael McGuire                     Hewlett Packard Laboratories  (remove x’s from email if not      Palo Alto, CA 94303-0971   a spammer) Phone: (650)-857-5491              

Response:

I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies.         in my twentysomething years of fishing for trout, i have found nothing that is as long lasting as gink.

Speaking of Gink, you’re suposed to put it on a dry fly (I mean on a fly that’s not wet). No doudt that’s best, but I sometimes slather it on a soaked fly and it still seems to work pretty well. I’ll dry the fly out as well as I can with a few false casts, but the fly is still pretty damp. — something bogus to avoid spam)

Response:

<<I hear Orvis has a GREAT floatant, you should try that. And, Orvis sells a neat tub of dessicant (drying crystals).  Simply put you fly in the tub, close the lid, and shake a couple of times. Works wonderfully.  Then you wouldn’t need any of that sissy floatant stuff. Dave pushing Ken aside and also ducking.

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I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies.

I have before me a little bottle of stuff called "Water Shed", which is called "permanent waterproofing liquid".  Instructions call for a drop to be added to the fly at least one day before the fly touches the water for the first time. "It will not effect color, softness and is odorless after 24 hour cure period" says the label. Someone gave me the bottle to try.  Haven’t tried it yet, however, so who knows? Unfortunately, I don’t know where it could be for sale. Mark Faulkner

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I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies. I have tried a light coating of Scotchguard, which does not seem to do too much. I am wondering if soaking flies in Scotchguard would work better, or if there are other products that could to the trick.

"Watershed" permanent waterproofing liquid is recommended by and available from Feather-Craft Fly Fishing of St.Louis. http://www.flyfishamerica.com/Ads/National/FeatherCraft98JF.html I have no connection with Feather_Craft other than satisfied customer. — Ken Fortenberry

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Question:

Would appreciate any info on estimating weight of fish.eg:brook trout    18in long – 5in width =  lbs ?

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Hi Stephen-    You need to measure the girth of the fish at its thickest part. I’m taking a stab and guessing your "5in width" is about a 12" girth. An 18 inch trout with a 12 inch girth is a 4.9 pound fish.    Feel free to download our girth/length/weight table. Put some contact paper on it to keep it dry and stuff it in your vest.     Go to http://www.flyline.com. Scroll down two thirds of the page and select "tips and techniques". From there select "flyfishing tips". Scroll through the tips untils you find "weighing your catch with a tape".    Tight lines, Ralph Would appreciate any info on estimating weight of fish.eg:brook trout    18in long – 5in width =  lbs ?

Ralph Cutter, California School of Flyfishing. http://www.flyline.com

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Stephen writes: Would appreciate any info on estimating weight of fish.eg:brook trout

   18in long – 5in width =  lbs ? Stephen: Estimating the weight of a salmonid, I have used the following with some success: weight in lbs = length in inches x girth in inches squared all divided by 800.    an 18 inch brook trout with a 11 inch girth would be 18×11x11/800 = 2.72 pounds.  since you did not give the girth…. can’t tell about your particular fish… an 18 inch brook trout would be hugh in Virginia…. cheers, Alan E. Hoover Anglers’ Rest Powhatan, Va        *the trout teach many, lessons*

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Would appreciate any info on estimating weight of fish.eg:brook trout    18in long – 5in width =  lbs ?

Sounds like a lucy to me. You need the girth, the measurement around the fish at the widest point. This formula was posted here a few years ago by a fellow from BC who says the biologists there use it.  Length x (girth in inches squared) divided by 800=weight in pounds. i.e.  20 inch trout with 10 inch girth would figure out to 2000/ 800=2 1/2 pounds and so on. If you tell me where you caught it I’ll help you with the math. MV — http://www.lanminds.com/local/vinnie/gallery.html

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Would appreciate any info on estimating weight of fish.

Why estimate? If you’re keeping the fish, just weigh it directly.   If you’re going to release it, carry a small scale (hanging type) in your vest.  Once you’ve netted the fish, hook the scale into the net. Subtract the net weight to get the weight of the fish.   It’s easy, more accurate than an estimation formula, and is easier on the fish than taking a girth measurement, since you’re handling it less, and reviving/releasing it sooner. CQ

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Would appreciate any info on estimating weight of fish.

always carry with you a dead fish of known weight and then hold the fish you are weighing in one hand and the dead fish of known weight in the other hand and stand there with a thoughtful expression on you face as you estimate the weight of the unknown fish and look just like the scales of justice lady… — TimW Halfordian Golfer

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Would appreciate any info on estimating weight of fish. always carry with you a dead fish of known weight and then hold the fish you are weighing in one hand and the dead fish of known weight in the other hand and stand there with a thoughtful expression on you face as you estimate the weight of the unknown fish and look just like the scales of justice lady… — TimW Halfordian Golfer

You forgot to mention the calculation to allow for the growth mould and scale loss.. — Colin J. McPherson B.Eng. Design and Structures Group, School of Mechanical Engineering, University of Bath,Bath,U.K.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Would appreciate any info on estimating weight of fish. always carry with you a dead fish of known weight and then hold the fish you are weighing in one hand and the dead fish of known weight in the other hand and stand there with a thoughtful expression on you face as you estimate the weight of the unknown fish and look just like the scales of justice lady… — TimW Halfordian Golfer You forgot to mention the calculation to allow for the growth mould and scale loss..

Thank you for mentioning this.  You are quite correct, except that in the case of fishermen the rounding up error more then compensates for mould and scale loss. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

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you can estimate the weight with this formula.It seems to be right on.You measure the girth then multiply it by itself.then multiply that figure with the length.then divide by 800.example: a striper with a 22 1/2 girth and a length of 38 inches comes out to about 24.04 lbs.   22.5  x  22.5 =506.25 then multiply 506.25 by the lenght 38=19237.5 then divide by 800=24.04

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Question:

Hey guys,         When I tried to move to the other chat site, I got a message that I needed either Java support or use an IRC site.  It then gave me the name of an IRC site to click on.  When I tried this, it then told me that it couldn’t find it.  Please help. John

Hi John I did as well and was unable to get on. I know we’ve had a couple of false starts but I think with Joe Byrd’s help we will get a good and regular chat going — at least that’s what I’m working toward. — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

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Hey guys,         When I tried to move to the other chat site, I got a message that I needed either Java support or use an IRC site.  It then gave me the name of an IRC site to click on.  When I tried this, it then told me that it couldn’t find it.  Please help. John

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Question:

Hi folks, After many years of letting my old fly rod sit in the closet I’ve got this urge to go out and do some fishing again. Wondering if anyone has any reccomendations for any spots to try within a couple of driving hours of the Chicago area for panfish and trout? Thanks! Mark Lakomski Hoffman Estates, IL

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: Hi folks, : After many years of letting my old fly rod sit in the closet I’ve : got this urge to go out and do some fishing again. Wondering if : anyone has any reccomendations for any spots to try within a couple : of driving hours of the Chicago area for panfish and trout? Thanks! : Mark Lakomski : Hoffman Estates, IL Well, i’d suggest checking out the site listed below. Most likely there is a lake within 15 minutes of you that you can fish for panfish.       Chicago Area Paddling/Fishing Page:  http://www.ripco.com/~jwn/

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Mark, Get a copy of American Angler July/Aug’96. The article on pg 43 is "KANKAKEE smallmouths" –  Blur-ribbon smallmouth fishing an hour from Chicago!! Good fishing Dennis

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Get a copy of American Angler July/Aug’96. The article on pg 43 is "KANKAKEE smallmouths" –  Blur-ribbon smallmouth fishing an hour from                            ^^^^ Chicago!! Good fishing

Sometimes typos are revealing.  I just moved to the Chicago area from Portland, OR.  Saw the article before I came.  Don’t think you can hit the Kankakee and start nailing them.  It’s a big river, as I soon found out.   People in flyshops here are telling me that it’s a good idea to hire a guide to find fish the first time or two, and I believe them.  (Not that I’m going to.)  I’ve decided to spend some time, instead, exploring the Fox, which is a lot closer and has fair numbers of fish.  The day I went to the Kankakee recently, it was choked with bait fisherman, and *nobody* was catching–even though the river was supposed to be fishing hot.  Maybe you can dial it in over time, and it’s supposed to have bigger fish than the Fox, but it sure as hell didn’t look like the "Shangri La" it was depicted as in the article. (I’m obviously not dealing well with my relocation…) David

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David, I’ve had the same problem on the Kankakee.  Where are you finshing on the Fox?  I’m also new to the area, so any help will be appreciated. Bob McAnulty – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Get a copy of American Angler July/Aug’96. The article on pg 43 is "KANKAKEE smallmouths" –  Blur-ribbon smallmouth fishing an hour from                            ^^^^ Chicago!! Good fishing Sometimes typos are revealing.  I just moved to the Chicago area from Portland, OR.  Saw the article before I came.  Don’t think you can hit the Kankakee and start nailing them.  It’s a big river, as I soon found out.   People in flyshops here are telling me that it’s a good idea to hire a guide to find fish the first time or two, and I believe them.  (Not that I’m going to.)  I’ve decided to spend some time, instead, exploring the Fox, which is a lot closer and has fair numbers of fish.  The day I went to the Kankakee recently, it was choked with bait fisherman, and *nobody* was catching–even though the river was supposed to be fishing hot.  Maybe you can dial it in over time, and it’s supposed to have bigger fish than the Fox, but it sure as hell didn’t look like the "Shangri La" it was depicted as in the article. (I’m obviously not dealing well with my relocation…) David

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For a change of pace grab your fly rod (or spinning rod) and try fishing some of our other offerings in the Chicagoland area. The great lakes tributaries to Lake Michigan have excellent spawning runs for the following fish Chinook (King) Salmon Brown Trout (German) Coho Salmon Skamania Trout (Steelhead) Chambers Creek Trout (Steelhead) Ganaraska Trout (Steelhead) Just to name a few. Try the following rivers all within  1-3 hours from Chicago Wisconsin: Root River Milwaukee River Oak Creek Indiana: Trail Creek Salt Creek Michigan St. Joe River Black River Kalamazoo River Muskeegon River Cedar Creek White River The best fishing is a bit further in Michigan, and some of the best water in the nation Pere Marquete Little Manistee Big Manistee Baldwin River The Platte The Betsie In my opinion, you cann’t go wrong in Michigan. Tighten ‘em up, then release them. Tom Steele

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You mention possibly switching your interests to the Fox. It is excellent for smallmouth and other species. One of the very good, and well versed, sources for information on fly fishing this stream is Riverside Sports in Geneva.  The person to contact there is Tom Cebula who is only there on the weekends.  Others can give you excellent info on the river in general but Tom fly fishes it extensively and runs their fly fishing department. It is a full line shop and nice depth on the warm water stuff as well as trout/salmon. Their number is 630-232-7047. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Get a copy of American Angler July/Aug’96. The article on pg 43 is "KANKAKEE smallmouths" –  Blur-ribbon smallmouth fishing an hour from                       ^^^^ Chicago!! Good fishing Sometimes typos are revealing.  I just moved to the Chicago area from Portland, OR.  Saw the article before I came.  Don’t think you can hit the Kankakee and start nailing them.  It’s a big river, as I soon found out.   People in flyshops here are telling me that it’s a good idea to hire a guide to find fish the first time or two, and I believe them.  (Not that I’m going to.)  I’ve decided to spend some time, instead, exploring the Fox, which is a lot closer and has fair numbers of fish.  The day I went to the Kankakee recently, it was choked with bait fisherman, and *nobody* was catching–even though the river was supposed to be fishing hot.  Maybe you can dial it in over time, and it’s supposed to have bigger fish than the Fox, but it sure as hell didn’t look like the "Shangri La" it was depicted as in the article. (I’m obviously not dealing well with my relocation…) David

         Trent Roberson            Rx F Fish  For Your Good Health, Fly Fish URL=http://www.xnet.com/~rxffish

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Question:

With the current thread on the exploding float tube (Float Tube Safety – Near Drowning) I was thinking about the recent thread about the guy who drowned. It appeared that he was stuck in an upside-down float tube. A few have said that they would try to flip their tubes and see if they can get out. Has anybody tried this yet? Jon Porter

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With the current thread on the exploding float tube (Float Tube Safety – Near Drowning) I was thinking about the recent thread about the guy who drowned. It appeared that he was stuck in an upside-down float tube. A few have said that they would try to flip their tubes and see if they can get out. Has anybody tried this yet? Jon Porter

Hi Jon, Several years ago I accidently flipped my tube.  Thank god I had two friends right next to me and we were only about six feet from the bank.   I don’t think I could have gotten out of the tube by myself.  I promptly bought a pontoon boat with a rowing system (Water Otter) and have never been in a float tube since. After getting the Water Otter I purposely turned it over a couple of times to see how difficult it would be to get out of it (again with friends present to help).  I was able to free myself rather quickly on both occasions.  I’ve never had an unscheduled roll over as it seems to be quite stable.  I suppose a roll over is possible if I was not paying attention and ran one of the pontoon up on a rock in faster water. Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (96 catalog)

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Question:

I just purchased a mint condition South Bend bamboo 9′ fly rod.  Does anyone know the value of a rod like this, or know how I can find out the value.  

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I just purchased a mint condition South Bend bamboo 9′ fly rod.  Does anyone know the value of a rod like this, or know how I can find out the value.  

Len Codela of Turner’s Falls, Massachusetts can appraise it if you send it to him.  His current catalog lists South Bend rods anywhere from $100 or less to $400 or so.  There were many different levels of quality of South Bend rods. His prices are slightly high as he caters to collectors as much as fishers.  Call either 508 or 433-555-1212 to get his number I’m not sure which area code. As this is a fishing more than a collecting forum,  I say the real value is how it feels to fish.  Try out different lines with it if you can, then take it fishing.  If it sings the line out like poetry as smooth as twenty year Scotch, it’s priceless for fishing and that is it’s inspired destiny. Don’t incarcerate it. Mark Vinsel http://www.lanminds.com/local/vinnie/gallery.html

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I just purchased a mint condition South Bend bamboo 9′ fly rod.  Does anyone know the value of a rod like this, or know how I can find out the value.  

I’ve got one of these guys.  There more valuable as a fishing tool, albeit a very heavy one, than they are collectible.  Interestingly the South Bend company was started by Wes Jordan (later of Orvis fame) though the rods produced were mediocre at best.  Still, I fish mine a couple of times a year for half a day or so (really a heavy rod).  I’d say go fish it!                                                                      Dan

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