Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Still up late putting the fourth coat on a run of fifteen Happy Hooker blanks for the San Mateo show.  I don’t think I will have enough time to do them all but at least this explains why I’m on the tapering computer tonight. (snip)         george, please allow me to take this opportunity on behalf of all the little people here on roff to express our undying gratitude for this thrilling opportunity to share in the astonishing excitement generated by your "blow by blow" report of the fascinating process of creating those little works of art that bear the timeless and classy name of "happy hooker".         it is a tribute to your matchless magnanimity that you would take even an instant out of the awesome undertaking of this  historic venture to bless us with these stunning insights in to your genius. we can only grovel at your virtual feet in gratitude for our own unworthiness, and offer up thanks on behalf  of our humble lineage, yet unborn, that will gaze with wonder upon  our printouts of the words and actions of a true legend.         for myself, a personal note, much in the style of gus mcrae: "magnum manurum victorum bordomdom est"!   and i mean that with all my heart, george. wayno

___–  Wayne, old chap.  Believe this or not but the following of greatness eludes you.  There are a hundred advocates to the project that started as a dare on ROFF and like it or not, you fool . . . the information of those who may wish to "roll their own" i.e. (make their own fly rods) will be possible at the San Mateo Show for a lot less money then any other bamboo fly rod maker in this entire world. If you could "afford" to come to San Mateo (which is like thinking a fool could become a genius) you would realize that your worst enemy is yourself and that here is a better friend then you could ever imagine. I know what your problem is and so do you.  The difference is, I know how to deal and correct mine.  YOU, on the other hand still live in a world of ’self denial’ and those that suffer your foolishness are the ones that love you best. Screw you and all your excuses.  You’re not man enough to return to reality pard. Think about it! In short Wayne, you’re drunk again.   — (C) George Gehrke 2001 http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html     fine bamboo flyrods & blanks

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Now, this was a long time ago, now, but as I remember it, George claimed he could mass-produce bamboo rods for under $300.  How long had he been thinking of trying before making the claim, or how serious was his pre-ROFF "planning"?  Who knows? Essentially, with much toing and froing, he was told by a number of people, "Bullshit.  Can’t be done.  Put your money where your mouth is."  A number of people agreed to buy rods at the proposed price if George built them.  My recollection is of not so much a challenge or wager as a dare–Roffians calling what they understandably thought was an empty bluff. OK, things went far and fast downhill from there (price, quality, customer relations, etc., etc.).  I’m not defending George as a rod-builder, businessman, or human being.  He’s certainly shown grave failings on all these counts.  His behavior on this NG is often far less than admirable and his behavior as a businessman appears to be purely reprehensible, hurting himself, probably, more than anyone else.  I too have stopped using Gink, in part because I discovered I "don’t like the management."  In the end, George proved that he could *not* do what he claimed he could, i.e., build a high-quality production rod for less than $300. Unhappily, he also appears to have proved along the way several other things about himself.  All I am saying is that–contrary to what I still maintain *everyone* thought at the time (that is, that George, being a blowhard, would not do anything at all, but would find some excuse to cop out)–he did put his money where his mouth was and made the attempt.  He failed; he treated customers, at least one employee, and potential friends abysmally in the attempt.  I’m not defending any of that, only saying that it’s pretty remarkable that any of this happened at all, rather than ending up just another NG thread full of b.s. that flares up in the ether then peters out. JR – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – George had plans to make the rod before he ever brought it up on roff. Contrary to popular myth, no one on roff "challenged" him to make the rod.  We all know what a bullshitter/liar he is, so how can you deal or "challenge" such a person?  BTW, he came nowhere near the price he first quoted.  At $583, he is way past what he originally quoted. rest snipped for brevity…

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Yes, real tragic, I went there twice and gave to the project on got screwed. Without me those first few rods would not exist. G couldn’t and wouldn’t pay attention. The mill is nothing special. He didn’t have the touch to pull it off by himself.

Yes, and I know the details and it sucks and I did and do feel sorry for what happened. [deleted] Tbone stick it in your ear you know nothing cause you wern’t there, I WAS!

I commented only on the empirical data I cited:  He had a line of production rods at a major fly show. Did the means justify the end ? I do not know, have no way of knowing. Question (not rhetorical) Hairy: Why don’t you do it ? Your talent is obvious and if you’re really resentful of George that would be the ultimate way to show it. Competition would be great and I’m still in the market for a servicable bamboo fly rod for under the price of a good graphite. — YBone

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[deleted] And maybe this Litte Brown Nose post of yours will get you one.

Personally, I think George only made one mistake…a spiritual one..with his first rod. He knows what it was and he has been paying ever since. — YBone

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Opey’s Dad’s "review that came through the virtual transom," offered "for the sake of good order and balance", as interesting as it is, would carry more weight if it were not anonymous. JR

Anonymous my ass, that as my dad! Opie  –wishing dad would write to me, seems as though I hardly know him–

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[deleted] And maybe this Litte Brown Nose post of yours will get you one. Personally, I think George only made one mistake…a spiritual one..with his first rod.

You can’t possibly be *that* clueless… can you? — Charlie…

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Question (not rhetorical) Hairy: Why don’t you do it ?

Tbone at least you figured out that I attacked what you wrote and not you. And forgive me for all my smilly faces..that I forgot… ;-);-);-) better? His little dirt mill he paid a fortune and it did not work. All total there was much less than $2K in materials in it. While there, I brought it through several versions and improvments. And it would and did work if he wasn’t in a hurry. If he knew everything, then why was I there? I have been very tight lipped on all the imporvements that should have been made for obvious reasons. Now Tbone, to answer your real question, "I Could Do It." What I want for my time and what G pays his sweat shop labors ($7) is a very big difference. Better quality and a much higer price. Compitition with G? I would be a hands down winner in an instant about quality. G gardens nickels. I would garden ben franklins. Big difference. G markets with a shitty product. I would have a quality product and no market. So right there is the rub. Dumb people that don’t know any better get sucked into spending money on his glorified tomato stakes. HT

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Personally, I think George only made one mistake…a spiritual one..with his first rod. He knows what it was and he has been paying ever since.

%50 correct, ad my son’s rod to the mix too! HT

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Ya know… [snip] Well….for one thing I’d like to declare that George won the bet. I mean…there WAS George, my friends, at the Denver Fly Fishing Show…by God.  In a booth with ginger/honey/burnt blanks there can be no doubt about it. Pay up your flies and shut up your traps busters.

Speaking of bets I’m stilling waiting for you to pay up a dozen yellow humpys from October of 1999. Paul

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Speaking of bets I’m stilling waiting for you to pay up a dozen yellow humpys from October of 1999.

Post the reference. — TBone

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Everybody on this forum, practically without reserve, supported Mr.Gehrke in his efforts, not only with his rods, but with his website and other things. Many defended him against all comers, even long after their better judgement should have advised them otherwise. They would doubtless still be doing so, if he had not extremely successfully alienated just about everybody who offered support. Quite a few congratulated him on his progress, and gave advice and support on many occasions. He simply failed to recognise it as such, and insisted that his 300$ rods were the equal of any 1000$ rods around. This is patent nonsense. In actual fact, competent observers were of the opinion that they were not even worth 300$. However this may be, and notwithstanding the possibility that the rods are now excellent value, anybody who has followed the saga would be a fool to buy one. Mr.Gehrke is his own worst enemy. Nobody else is at fault here. Defending him on this forum, in this manner, is absolutely ridiculous, as you must be aware, and I find myself asking why you are doing it ? Hope you get a rod anyway, and I hope you enjoy it if you do.   Even were I to receive one as a gift, ( which I would not accept in any case), I would associate so much bad feeling with it, that it would ruin my fishing, quite irrespective of its qualities as a fishing tool. TL MC — "Where fishing is concerned, most anglers are basically manic excessives" http://www.mikeconnor.de Ya know… It’s really too bad the days when folkes were making bamboo rods for the masses are gone.

<SNIP

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Speaking of bets I’m stilling waiting for you to pay up a dozen yellow humpys from October of 1999. Post the reference. — TBone

My mistake it was four(4) Irresistables. On 8-OCT-99 Louie claims in the thread "One Lie & Exaggeration Too Many by Daytripper" that " Day Tripper can *not* be egged on by anyone. " Shortly thereafter you posted a reply:         "Betcha 4 #18 Irresistables that he can…" Then I replied that I’d take the bet to which you replied:         "Ok…he responds to one of my trolls and you send me the dry flies…right ?         What’s my time limit ?" my reply to your time limit was:         "until Sunday the 17th, If you can’t get his goat by then no one can.         sf" On the 18th when I claimed victory you wanted to change the rules to 90 days. (Sounds like gore v. bush) Then in an email you sent me you said you’ld pay up. The message with headers is attached to the end of this post (although I did remove my street address). If anyone cares to verify this do a search on Deja of the past  post on ROFF. Paul Received: from ns1.aspenres.com (ns1.aspenres.com [204.131.50.1])  by eagle.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA26773 Received: from twalker (204.131.50.154) by ns1.aspenres.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;  charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-UIDL: f5d4ea1f8b0505fb39de6bced9c2f138 Status: RO I might just do that if for no other reason than Littleton, Co is my home town….but certainly not as the result of losing any bet !  Not yet…I have 78 days to go and (actually) I think the Mr.G setup/Big Brown Followup/Daytripper HOOK SWALLOW counts. But it’s weak at best so back to work… — TimW —–Original Message—– Hi Tim It’s Salmon_Fly You can send the Flies to Paul Goodwin

[snip]

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So along comes George and off a bet on the Internet

George was blowharding how there was no more that $50 material and workmanship in a modern bamboo rod. There was no bet. — Charlie…

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JR writes:

(snip) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Now, from what a lot of people have said, maintenance of quality control has been a big, big, big problem.  On the other hand, at least a few people, including one of the few Roffians I’ve met in person and whose opinion I trust, are happy with the rod they got, although otherwise no admirers of George’s persona here. So, is a company that can produce only one good final product out of five (or 10 or even 100) a viable concern?  Probably not, but this is a company that was started from a series of wagers and dares on a *newgroup* for Pete’s sake.  T-Bone is right about one thing:  George said–on the flimsiest of grounds, mind you–that he’d start a bamboo rod company, and he did it.  Everything else aside (and there is a quite lot, much of it unpretty, I admit), George deserves some credit at least for doing what *no one* believed he’d actually do. Opey’s Dad’s "review that came through the virtual transom," offered "for the sake of good order and balance", as interesting as it is, would carry more weight if it were not anonymous. JR

George had plans to make the rod before he ever brought it up on roff. Contrary to popular myth, no one on roff "challenged" him to make the rod.  We all know what a bullshitter/liar he is, so how can you deal or "challenge" such a person?  BTW, he came nowhere near the price he first quoted.  At $583, he is way past what he originally quoted.  For another $150 *or less*, you can get a *hand crafted* fly rod from a reputable rod builder, that looks, cast better, and has more value than anything George has made. George sent some rods to different people.  They *were not* production rods. They were rods that he very carefully built.  Steve sort of challenged George by saying if G would send a rod to him, he would give it an honest evaluation. What an opportunity for George!!!!  He worked hard and produced a fairly nice rod and sent it to Steve who gave it a good revue.  But, it was not a production rod.   George sent Dave Tatosian and me Bastard rods #11 and #12.  Because of George’s attitude and action I had canceled my order, but he sent it via Dave anyway.  I was touched that George would do such a thing.  It was a magnanimus gesture as far as I was concerned.  I took the rod and inspected it.  It was horribly constructed.  Twisted, curved, handle offset, glue lines, drips — it was horrible.  I put the rod together anyway and the ferrules did not fit.  He had given me the butt section with a  ferrule from XY company, and a tip with a ferrule from BX company — the rod was unfishable.  If you attempted to cast it, the tip would fly off. Dave’s #12 was no better.  It too was horrible and unfishable.  Dave had paid the freight – $40 – to receive these rods, and now he had to send them back – another $40.  Both of us had agreed to say nothing on roff about these rods. We did not want to embarass George.    We said nothing until George accused us of being provacateurs and sabataging his rods.  *WE* were responsible for the bent and twisted tips and butts.  *WE* were responsible for everything that was wrong with the rods.  *WE* took sandpaper to the ferrules so that they no longer fit properly.  Everything was *OUR* fault.  Everyone knew that it was plain bullshit on George’s part.  But the story doesn’t end with Dave and me.  Wish it did, but, uh uh. You see, George told everyone he destroyed the rods — burned em, he said.  But good old #12 returned and ended up in several peoples’ hands.  The first was Bob Smith (Plainties).  When Bob returned it (paying the freight both ways), George was insulted.  When another rod builder, a man of some fame, returned a set of blanks, George attacked both of them.  At one point he even verbally attacked Bob’s wife.   So you see, JR, why many of us have boycotted *anything* that George makes.  It appears from what I now hear that the boycot is well founded in that Gehrke continues to make crap.  But I do have a bottle of Gink.  No gink in it.  I fill it with Albolene (pain in the ass, I might add),  and it *thinks* it’s Gink.  Works just as well. Dave LaCourse Pirate and Bottom Dweller and so proud of it…..

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Paul Goodwin writes:

(snipped) Geeeeze.  Remind me never to bet with you!  And I’ll never borrow money off of you either!   <g Dave

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Still up late putting the fourth coat on a run of fifteen Happy Hooker blanks for the San Mateo show.  I don’t think I will have enough time to do them all but at least this explains why I’m on the tapering computer tonight. Another problem is not having enough time to run as many tips as we will need but that can be done after the show.  It takes nearly thirty minutes to dip each  coat and several hours after that to dry, but the blanks are looking good. — Mr.G. http://www.gink.com "the sage continues"

  gink.vcf

< 1K Download

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Still up late putting the fourth coat on a run of fifteen Happy Hooker blanks for the San Mateo show.  I don’t think I will have enough time to do them all but at least this explains why I’m on the tapering computer tonight.

(snip)         george, please allow me to take this opportunity on behalf of all the little people here on roff to express our undying gratitude for this thrilling opportunity to share in the astonishing excitement generated by your "blow by blow" report of the fascinating process of creating those little works of art that bear the timeless and classy name of "happy hooker".         it is a tribute to your matchless magnanimity that you would take even an instant out of the awesome undertaking of this  historic venture to bless us with these stunning insights in to your genius. we can only grovel at your virtual feet in gratitude for our own unworthiness, and offer up thanks on behalf  of our humble lineage, yet unborn, that will gaze with wonder upon  our printouts of the words and actions of a true legend.         for myself, a personal note, much in the style of gus mcrae: "magnum manurum victorum bordomdom est"!   and i mean that with all my heart, george. wayno

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Glad to hear from old Gus. Don"t think McMurtry"s new book ‘ "Boone’s Lick" will make it to screen unless he gets Opra  to play the mother. IJ

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Ya know… It’s really too bad the days when folkes were making bamboo rods for the masses are gone. Tragic, really. I can not afford a thousand bucks for a bamboo fly rod but think I would be happy with one of the commerical ones of yesteryear.  Maybe a "Sears & Roebuck Good’nuf" model.  Ya know what I mean ?  We can get an Ugly Stick, which is a damned good value of a tool…but nothing like it exists in the bamboo world today, that I’ve found anyway. So along comes George and off a bet on the Internet, in these very halls, says he *can* bring these back And ya know what…he does. We can grovel about the initial production run quality issues and some business decisions and stuff, but that’s what I’d expect from an initial production run. Wouldn’t you ? With millions of dollar backing you could throw away the first few runs. Not so when you gotta eat. They become prototypes. Something to build on. Next time…I’ll do ‘this’ with the finish. We know the history of this venture. This was no cake walk for George, who shared with us (and anyone of us who thinks they can do better) every [personal] sweat off his brow. He made some friends, he made some enemies. He started the Little Brown Truck (I’m still waiting…) You *literally* could publish a book just from the posts here.  Someone probably will. What does it mean ? Well….for one thing I’d like to declare that George won the bet. I mean…there WAS George, my friends, at the Denver Fly Fishing Show…by God.  In a booth with ginger/honey/burnt blanks there can be no doubt about it. Pay up your flies and shut up your traps busters. As for the boredom of this post.  Ya get out what you put in sometimes and I got out something really cool and what was probably really hard for George (George doesn’t whine so it’s hard to know)…the business decision of getting his ass in the show with some product and (what must be very difficult and take huge huevos) make the tip sections later. Real world stuff for a guy with a milling machine in the garage. He posted *from* his taper computer.  How freakin’ studly is that ? Bravo George. — TBone

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Still up late putting the fourth coat on a run of fifteen Happy Hooker blanks for the San Mateo show.  I don’t think I will have enough time to do them all but at least this explains why I’m on the tapering computer tonight. Another problem is not having enough time to run as many tips as we will need but that can be done after the show.  It takes nearly thirty minutes to dip each  coat and several hours after that to dry, but the blanks are looking good.

_______FOR the sake of good order and balance, here’s a review that came in through the virtual transom *a few weeks ago* (<== keep that in mind). Didn’t write it, just passing it along. But it seems appropriate, right here, right now. Take it or leave it… /Opey’s Dad   (…and have a SUPER day! "Even using the term Rodmaker around anything resembling the Bastard is insulting all rodmakers as well as all Bastards!   "I went to a fly-fishing show in Denver this morning and looked around for bargains and the usual "stuff" that a flyfisher needs from time to time. "Alas, who is there in full force but Hizzoner the Gink hiself!  Even had the kid with the entourage!  I looked at the rods, (whoa there feller, lets not insult rods) I mean Poles, that he had on display at the show.  I have five year old  grandson who could do a better job! "No Shit, guys -n- gals!  This guy turns out crap and it has a Capital C in big red letters!  Missed finishing several spots of the windings on every rod!!  NO winding check and the forward end of the cork grips looked as if it had been cut with a dull axe and then run over a few times. He told me he didn’t put checks on to save costs!!!!   "I am just a plastic builder who lurks here to learn all I can about the jillion or so aspects of the trade of rodbuilding, and I guarantee you that no rod of that caliber will EVER, EVER, EVER leave my shop!  Let alone be taken to a flyfishing show and displayed as craftsmanship.  What a joke! "If you real builders are concerned in the LEAST about this yahoo producing anything that might be remotely construed as a bamboo rod, worry NOT!!!  I venture that he was the complete laughingstock of the show and now 10,000 flyfishers know what his crap looks like!   I did not even bother to cast one of them, wouldn’t waste my time!!!  (And I’m Cheap!!!, just ask all the ladies!!)  I’m not one ti talk most folks down but this guy is out there a looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong ways! an average of NO rods/day!  This guy has not built one to date if his life’s work is like what I saw today.  I literally chuckled for four hours as I walked the show floor!  This guy wouldn’t make a pimple on a rodbuilder’s butt! "As I see it, any further ink about the Bastard Rod is a lie, there is no such thing!!  What I saw today is not, by any stretch of my imagination, a rod. sorta like the old riddle about what do you call a boomerang that doesn’t come back? "A stick!"

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And ya know what…he does. We can grovel about the initial production run quality issues and some business decisions and stuff, but that’s what I’d expect from an initial production run. Wouldn’t you ?

Certainly. Unfortunately, George wasn’t willing to accept or admit to the fact that they were only "initial production run" quality. And, two years later they’re still initial production run quality. If he had been willing to simply admit that the rods had problems–some of them serious–nearly everyone would still be championing his effort. 99% of the grief he’s taken on this forum can be directly attributed to his inability to be honest about the quality of his work. Period. End of story. We know the history of this venture. This was no cake walk for George, who shared with us (and anyone of us who thinks they can do better) every [personal] sweat off his brow. He made some friends, he made some enemies. He started the Little Brown Truck (I’m still waiting…)

And maybe this Litte Brown Nose post of yours will get you one. –Steve

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We know the history of this venture. This was no cake walk for George, who shared with us (and anyone of us who thinks they can do better) every [personal] sweat off his brow. He made some friends, he made some enemies. He started the Little Brown Truck (I’m still waiting…) And maybe this Litte Brown Nose post of yours will get you one.

Sorry to follow up my own post, but for all you out there awaiting delivery of a Bastard rod, I’ve got one I’ll sell you that is available for immediate delivery. It’s been used only a couple of times and I believe it represents the very best rod that the production line has ever produced. It’s in essentially new condition (except for the fact that I straightened the tip, which was a bit crooked when I received it). $350 plus shipping will deliver it right to your door. Contact me via email if interested. –Steve

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Well, I’ve never seen a Bastard rod, but I have followed the history of this business a bit.  In late 98, early 99, before taking off to Rwanda for a year, I read ROFF frequently and posted occasionally.  One of the most amusing shticks then was George declaring he would, then setting out to produce inexpensive mass-market bamboo rods.  There was a lot of nonsense about the name, price, guarantees, etc., but I think it safe to say that most, if not all people on ROFF assumed it was run-of-the-mill BS and would simply never happen.  When I came back to the U.S. in the summer of 2000, I was frankly astounded that rods had been built and at least some sold. Now, from what a lot of people have said, maintenance of quality control has been a big, big, big problem.  On the other hand, at least a few people, including one of the few Roffians I’ve met in person and whose opinion I trust, are happy with the rod they got, although otherwise no admirers of George’s persona here.  So, is a company that can produce only one good final product out of five (or 10 or even 100) a viable concern?  Probably not, but this is a company that was started from a series of wagers and dares on a *newgroup* for Pete’s sake.  T-Bone is right about one thing:  George said–on the flimsiest of grounds, mind you–that he’d start a bamboo rod company, and he did it.  Everything else aside (and there is a quite lot, much of it unpretty, I admit), George deserves some credit at least for doing what *no one* believed he’d actually do. Opey’s Dad’s "review that came through the virtual transom," offered "for the sake of good order and balance", as interesting as it is, would carry more weight if it were not anonymous. JR – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – _______FOR the sake of good order and balance, here’s a review that came in through the virtual transom *a few weeks ago* (<== keep that in mind). Didn’t write it, just passing it along. But it seems appropriate, right here, right now. Take it or leave it…

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Ya know… It’s really too bad the days when folkes were making bamboo rods for the masses are gone. Tragic, really.

Yes, real tragic, I went there twice and gave to the project on got screwed. Without me those first few rods would not exist. G couldn’t and wouldn’t pay attention. The mill is nothing special. He didn’t have the touch to pull it off by himself. He started the Little Brown Truck (I’m still waiting…)

Lies just lies, http://x67.deja.com/[ST_rn=ps]/getdoc.xp?AN=511646402&CONTEXT=980711354.2046099489&hitnum=2 You *literally* could publish a book just from the posts here.  Someone probably will.

Should be called, "Bullshit ‘n Bamboo" Well….for one thing I’d like to declare that George won the bet. I mean…there WAS George, my friends, at the Denver Fly Fishing Show…by God.  In a booth with ginger/honey/burnt blanks there can be no doubt about it. Pay up your flies and shut up your traps busters.

As far as I’m concern G lost the bet cause he did not do by himself! Real world stuff for a guy with a milling machine in the garage.

More correct than a bamboo studio….. He posted *from* his taper computer.  How freakin’ studly is that ?

TAPER COMPUTER!!!!!! Such bullshit…..try a #2 lead pencil. The  first H.H. was read justed with a #2 graphite pencil. All he had was data points from Paul Whitely, what fucking computer program? Walt Winters rod was the basis for what i felt needed to be changed, and so the #2 lead pencil computation change. Tbone stick it in your ear you know nothing cause you wern’t there, I WAS! HT

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Ya know… … Bravo George.

Prattle on if you wish Timbo, but his hubris, deceit, outright lies and character assassination cannot be brushed off as eccentricities or the foibles of an old curmudgeon. George Gehrke is a vile and vicious little man of no character and defending him in this forum is preposterous. — Ken Fortenberry

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Question:

central PA. Third week of July. Need guide and/or boat rental info,

http://www.billsguideservice.com/ RichZ

Question:

I’m moving to Pensacola FL and was wondering what kind of FF I can expect to find there.  Someone told me redfish.  Anything else, and what equipment am I looking at buying? — Work like you don’t need money Love like you’ve never been hurt Dance like nobody’s watching Keith Friesen

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writes: I’m moving to Pensacola FL and was wondering what kind of FF I can expect to find there.  Someone told me redfish.  Anything else, and what equipment am I looking at buying?

Redfish and speckled trout mostly for SW fly fishing tho other species are there including mackerals (sp?), bonita, and the rare sailfish comes into the shallow water. (I once hooked a small tarpon between Gulf Breeze and Fort Walton). Fresh water includes of course bass, bream. I would think a 7 weight would be a good all around rod down there though I carry a 6 and an 8 wt when I visit the family. There is an active FF program at the junior college, a good fff club and the SE FFF conclave is held there every two or three years (gulf breeze actually). Lots of fishing in the bay, the bayous, sound, and salt marshes from Appalachicola to Mobile Bay. Plus numerous fresh water ponds and rivers. Wayne Knight Geneva IL                            

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Question:

In response to Joe McClain One of the best videos to learn to fly cast is done by Chico Fernandez. His company goes by the name of penguin. But the best advice is to get up out of your chair, go to your nearest fly shop and have them pop the video in their VCR. Check it out before you buy it! Kathy Robinson Robinson & Sons Outfitters

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Hi Kathy, Where do you fit in the Robinson & Sons Outfitters? Where are you folks located? Counsel

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Question:

I am planning a trip to Mosquito Lagoon the weekend of July 24.  This is a trip I am very excited about since I’ve wanted to fish that area for a long time.  My primary target is reds but will take anything that bites.  I use both light tackle and fly gear, artificials only.  I will only have a 15′ canoe with trolling motor. Any areas that you could suggest including launch sites would be very much appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help. Dave Moore Dave’s South Florida Home Page http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Trails/9975

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am planning a trip to Mosquito Lagoon the weekend of July 24.  This is a trip I am very excited about since I’ve wanted to fish that area for a long time.  My primary target is reds but will take anything that bites.  I use both light tackle and fly gear, artificials only.  I will only have a 15′ canoe with trolling motor. Any areas that you could suggest including launch sites would be very much appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help. Dave Moore Dave’s South Florida Home Page http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Trails/9975

      I’d not worry about a boat, but instead hire a guide. There are any number, all listed in the yellow pages. Some even guarentee "fish or no fee". Make sure the guide is a light/fly guide. The average price last time I checked was $250/ 1/2 day. Even if you don’t fish, the view and wildlife is well worth the price, and a real bargain with fishing thrown in.                                                       John Popp                                                     in Sanford Fl.

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I am planning a trip to Mosquito Lagoon the weekend of July 24.  This is a trip I am very excited about since I’ve wanted to fish that area for a long time.  My primary target is reds but will take anything that bites.  I use both light tackle and fly gear, artificials only.  I will only have a 15′ canoe with trolling motor. Any areas that you could suggest including launch sites would be very much appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help. Dave Moore

DAve, There are only 2 access points to the lagoon both are on the Canaveral national seashore. The north entry point ( best fishing) is off of A1A in New Smyrna. The second is Eddy creek out of Titusville on rt 402. The primary fish in the lagoon are Reds, LAdyfish, Trout and Jacks with Tarpon and snook being there every once in a while. Hope this helps.      Jim Dave’s South Florida Home Page http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Trails/9975

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am planning a trip to Mosquito Lagoon the weekend of July 24.  This is a trip I am very excited about since I’ve wanted to fish that area for a long time.  My primary target is reds but will take anything that bites.  I use both light tackle and fly gear, artificials only.  I will only have a 15′ canoe with trolling motor. Any areas that you could suggest including launch sites would be very much appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help. Dave Moore DAve, There are only 2 access points to the lagoon both are on the Canaveral national seashore. The north entry point ( best fishing) is off of A1A in New Smyrna. The second is Eddy creek out of Titusville on rt 402. The primary fish in the lagoon are Reds, LAdyfish, Trout and Jacks with Tarpon and snook being there every once in a while. Hope this helps.     Jim Dave’s South Florida Home Page http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Trails/9975 I don’t understand that there are only two access points to the

Indian River Lagoon. The lagoon streaches from New Syrna to below Vero Beach There are literally thousands of access places. There are also some very good guides that work the river and the Banana River. If you are coming to Central Florida for the first time I strongly suggest you use a guide for your first experience. If you want the names and address of some guides Email me and I will supply you several. George Partridge Custom Rods – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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Dave’s South Florida Home Page http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Trails/9975 I don’t understand that there are only two access points to the Indian River Lagoon. The lagoon streaches from New Syrna to below Vero Beach

There are literally thousands of access places. There are also some very good guides that work the river and the Banana River. If you are coming to Central Florida for the first time I strongly suggest you

use a guide for your first experience. If you want the names and address of some guides Email me and I will supply you several. George

The Lagoon its self is only 23 miles long. it goes from New Smyrna to Titusville. The bannana river runs to Vero beach. Both are great fishing but the lagoon has most of the flats for reds. If you want snook ( big snook) head towards Vero. Hope this clears things up.      Jim Partridge Custom Rods

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Question:

you do not need pretty flies to catch fish.  Everyone I know started by tying an excruciatingly ugly mutant bugger creature.  Everyone I know also

I just tied my first fly around a month ago.  While I wouldn’t call it excruciatingly ugly (yet–it is looking uglier all the time), mutant bugger creature is a pretty good description. I decided to record my misadventures before I forget the specifics.   Here’s my description of that first fly. "  I’d been reading up on fly tying for a few months but it took a little while to get my fingers lacquered.  Since I had yet to get any of the normal tools or supplies, my first fly was tied with a size 10 bait hook, dark grey cat hair (under-fur), sewing thread, and two pheasant feathers picked up  from the local five and dime.  It’s a bit rough but not bad for a first attempt.  The cat hair appears to trap microscopic bubbles when under water and with the thread ribbing looks nicely segmented (if a bit uneven in spots).  I was going to put some hackle on it but the stem on the dime store hackle I was trying to use kept breaking."   _Rich_

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I like Lefty Kreh’s book "Advanced Flyfishing Techniques- Secrets of an Avid Fisherman." If you’re learning how cast or having casting problems, you should look into getting a lesson.

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anyone have the location of a book that teaches fly flying? e-mail me if any please!

Hi Jolivas – I used Jack Dennis’ Western Trout Fly Tying Manual, myself, and really found it helpful.  Good photos of the step by step process for tying very practical and useful flies, including dry flies, hair flies, nymphs, streamers, and wet flies.  Also a good discussion of tools and materials.  This is a great place to start, and from there there is no end to books on fly tying. Have fun with it this winter, and by this spring you should have a selection of very useful patterns. Charlie Miller

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anyone have the location of a book that teaches fly flying?

 They are in the LIBRARY..next to the books, that teach you Neurosurgery!!!…;)

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anyone have the location of a book that teaches fly flying?  They are in the LIBRARY..next to the books, that teach you Neurosurgery!!!…;)

Nancy Try Randall Kaufmann’s books or Skip Morris. Kaufman’s revised editions have about 15 or so colored plates illustrating steps in tying each fly. Skip Morris’s books also have colored plates. Hope this helps Ron

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Master Angler shows each step on your computer screen, a how-to video and /or a printout of each step in book form. Yours or someone else’s — Bob Sheedy Arctic Fire Software Home of THE FISHING LOG and MASTER ANGLER http://www.articfire.com/arcfire/fishing.htm

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anyone have the location of a book that teaches fly flying? e-mail me if any please!

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: anyone have the location of a book that teaches fly flying? : e-mail me if any please! Try a local bookstore. The shevles are loaded with them. If not that, try the library. Jon Porter

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Not learned from a book.  The young usually learn from the parents or other members of the hatch. anyone have the location of a book that teaches fly flying? e-mail me if any please!

Mike in PDX "When the trout are lost, smash the state."                           Tom McGuane

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Not learned from a book.  The young usually learn from the parents or other members of the hatch. anyone have the location of a book that teaches fly flying? e-mail me if any please!

Almost any fly tying manual will get you through the basics.   Besides, you do not need pretty flies to catch fish.  Everyone I know started by tying an excruciatingly ugly mutant bugger creature.  Everyone I know also caught fish with their first fly. Van Vliet’s "The Art of Fly Tying" is an attractive, comprehensive, and usefully illustrated book. — Keep your stick on the ice.

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Question:

i am still always amazed when i see farm raised goldens for consumption at safeway… TimW

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(AdFirmOne) writes: As you probably know, Goldens live above the 10,500 foot range.  I’ve fished for them quite a bit in the eastern Sierra.

<SNIP Not necessarily so, last year caught a nice 14" golden at a lake whose elevation was at 8200 ft.  Tough to find goldens in the Sierra below 10,000 ft., but they are there.  Check out Ralph Cutter’s Sierra Trout Guide.  It has all the fishable waters in the Sierra listed by county and whether a lake or a stream.  The listing not only includes what type of trout are in evidence there, but also what elevation and which topographical map it it can be found on.                                  Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

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I agree that altitude is not the govering factor.  I know a lake in the norther sierra’s with goldens.  The lake is at roughly 7000′. No I won’t tell where.  It gets too much fishing preasure as it is. | |…… Seek harmony and balance in the mountains, find harmony and balance within…..

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: I agree that altitude is not the govering factor.  I know a lake in : the norther sierra’s with goldens.  The lake is at roughly 7000′. I saw a mess of Goldens for sale in my local grocery store.  I couldn’t believe it!  I thought these fish were fairly rare? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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: I agree that altitude is not the govering factor.  I know a lake in : the norther sierra’s with goldens.  The lake is at roughly 7000′. I saw a mess of Goldens for sale in my local grocery store.  I couldn’t believe it!  I thought these fish were fairly rare?

Those aren’t the same "goldens" that are often sought after here.  They’re farm grown fish with almost a solid gold color the bares no resemblance to the Volcano Creek or Little Kern Golden trout.  I’ve seen some pictures of "golden" trout that have been introduced in some of the high country lakes in Wyoming and they also bare little resemblance to the High Sierra natives.  They’re complete devoid of par marks and don’t have the red fins of the V.C. or L.K. golden.   — John Fereira Isis Distributed Systems – Ithaca, NY

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I’ve seen some pictures of "golden" trout that have been introduced in some of the high country lakes in Wyoming and they also bare little resemblance to the High Sierra natives.  They’re complete devoid of par marks and don’t have the red fins of the V.C. or L.K. golden.  

That’s because they’ve grown to larger size.  I’ve caught small Goldens in Wyoming and Montana that fit your description.  The size of these smaller Wyoming trout matches the bigger California trout, and so does their coloration. Both rainbows and goldens loose their par marks as they get bigger. — -Wayne Trzyna

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Both rainbows and goldens loose their par marks as they get bigger.

Not so.  California (e.g. Kern) goldens keep the par marks through life. Matt Carey – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – — -Wayne Trzyna

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(AdFirmOne) writes: As you probably know, Goldens live above the 10,500 foot range.  I’ve fished for them quite a bit in the eastern Sierra. All the trips required at least a 8 hour hike in to get beyond the rainbows and brookies.  A short trip like yours doesn’t promise much when searching out these beautiful fish. Good luck tho. As I said, I know of one lake that contains goldens that can be reach by vehicle with sufficient ground clearance.  I also know of several others that require no more then an hour hike.  None of these are going to be high producers.  I would guess that none of these lakes are higher then 10,500′ in elevation either.  I’m not so sure that 10.5K or even 10K is some sort of magic number for Sierra Goldens.

Hi    Golden Trout were rainbow trout less than 50,000 years ago.  They evolved into goldens in the Kern River system as low as 7,000 ft. They are considered a high elevation fish largely because that was where we planted them in the mid 1800s and early 1900’s.  They have the ability to live in most waters that can support bows.    There are about a dozen roadside golden trout waters and many less than an hour from the car (don’t ask). You’ll need to do some sleuthing, but that’s half the fun!    Tight lines, Ralph —

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Hello, I tried to post something like this already, but it doesn’t seem to have made it. My family is going on a weekend trip camping and fishing.  We are looking for possible sites to find some golden trout, but with the tight constraints–we are on a 2-day weekend trip.  This limits how far we can pack in and how far from LA (where the rest of my family lives) we can go. Any information would be helpful and appreciated. Thanks, Matt Carey

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Matt      It has been a few years but about 30-40  miles north of Bishop is a lake called convict lake. It’s fising used to be outstanding. Hike above this lake they say about 3 miles and you come to some very high mountain lakes that used to have golden trout. I tried this hike once with may not so good leg and never reached these lakes but am told they are there and seen them on the maps.      I think Convict lake’s resort used to have an internet site. Look for it at any web search engine (webcrawler, altavista, infoseek, etc.). This used to be one of my favorite fishing spots. Watch the weather reports for the storms come upon this area VERY quickly. HTH Tom – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, I tried to post something like this already, but it doesn’t seem to have made it. My family is going on a weekend trip camping and fishing.  We are looking for possible sites to find some golden trout, but with the tight constraints–we are on a 2-day weekend trip.  This limits how far we can pack in and how far from LA (where the rest of my family lives) we can go. Any information would be helpful and appreciated. Thanks, Matt Carey

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In ‘89 I did a trip up to Lake Mildred (or Martha, not sure of the name)…it’s the first lake in the chain above Convict. That lake produced many fish, but no goldens…Convict Lake was terribly crowded and I’m sure it hasn’t gotten any better…. I’ll be fishing in the Lone Pine/Whiteny area the 4th of July weekend…hoping to get up to some of the higher lakes in that area…I’ll let you all know what happens.

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As you probably know, Goldens live above the 10,500 foot range.  I’ve fished for them quite a bit in the eastern Sierra. All the trips required at least a 8 hour hike in to get beyond the rainbows and brookies.  A short trip like yours doesn’t promise much when searching out these beautiful fish. Good luck tho.

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There are a few places that do not require 8 hour hikes. More like 15 minutes or less. (These places should be held dear, but they do not hold large goldens-if there are such a thing). Some of these are roads approaching the Kern River drainage and some of the Sierra mountain pass roads. Mail me directly and I can give you a little more info. -Don M.

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Matt     It has been a few years but about 30-40  miles north of Bishop is a lake called convict lake. It’s fising used to be outstanding. Hike above this lake they say about 3 miles and you come to some very high mountain lakes that used to have golden trout. I tried this hike once with may not so good leg and never reached these lakes but am told they are there and seen them on the maps.

There are quite a few lakes in this area along the eastern slope of the Sierra that are about the same distance from a lake that you can drive to.  Go up over Piute pass (out of Rock Creek) and you’ll get into some good Golden Trout country as well.  In the June Lake area Gibbs and Kidney lake are about the same distance *up* as the lake above Convict lake.  There are some golden trout lakes in the Mammoth Lakes and 20 Lakes Basin (near Saddlebag Lake). I even know of a lake that you can drive to that is a bit further north that has Golden trout in it. I’m a bit reluctant to provide a lot of details about a lot of these places however.  I wouldn’t have hesitated about 3-4 years ago but with the commercialization of the net I’m afraid that I’d see a pay-per-view web site or a 1-900 number with all the Golden trout lakes for anyone (and everyone) to use to find these spots.   — John Fereira Isis Distributed Systems – Ithaca, NY

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As you probably know, Goldens live above the 10,500 foot range.  I’ve fished for them quite a bit in the eastern Sierra. All the trips required at least a 8 hour hike in to get beyond the rainbows and brookies.  A short trip like yours doesn’t promise much when searching out these beautiful fish. Good luck tho.

As I said, I know of one lake that contains goldens that can be reach by vehicle with sufficient ground clearance.  I also know of several others that require no more then an hour hike.  None of these are going to be high producers.  I would guess that none of these lakes are higher then 10,500′ in elevation either.  I’m not so sure that 10.5K or even 10K is some sort of magic number for Sierra Goldens. — John Fereira Isis Distributed Systems – Ithaca, NY

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Stuff Deleted… As I said, I know of one lake that contains goldens that can be reach by vehicle with sufficient ground clearance.  I also know of several others that require no more then an hour hike.  None of these are going to be high producers.  I would guess that none of these lakes are higher then 10,500′ in elevation either.  I’m not so sure that 10.5K or even 10K is some sort of magic number for Sierra Goldens. — John Fereira Isis Distributed Systems – Ithaca, NY

Elevation isn’t the determining factor, as you have said. It’s the temp. and cleanness of the water. It’s just that you tend to find both at higher elevations. It also seems that you are fishing the same places I am. Please don’t post the locations. It took me years of hiking and searching to find these places. I would hate to see them become the next hot spot to go fly fishing. Darryl Hayashida

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AdFirmOne sandbags: : As you probably know, Goldens live above the 10,500 foot range.  I’ve : fished for them quite a bit in the eastern Sierra. All the trips required : at least a 8 hour hike in to get beyond the rainbows and brookies.  A : short trip like yours doesn’t promise much when searching out these : beautiful fish. Good luck tho. Nice try- Do you think the Kern is at 10.5K?  More like 6,000.  Basically, Goldens live in clean, cold water and are very sensitive to environmental impact.  There really is no altitude limit, as evidenced by their presence in many lakes and streams throughout the easter sierras.  Sure, you can hike to lakes at 9,000-10,000 ft. and catch goldens.  In fact, the DFG uses some remote lakes around cottonwood pass for hatcheries (*DO NOT* fish at these lakes- it’s illegal).  However, this does not mean that goldens aren’t found at lower elevations.  Many streams are within a few hours hike, and some lakes have parking lots a few miles from the shore- both contain goldens. Get a topo, and call some fly shops in the bishop area. Best regards, Hans — "The worst monotonous drone coming from a lectern or the most eye-splitting textbook written in turgid English is nothing in comparison to the psychological Sahara that starts right in your bedroom and spurns the horizon."         -Joseph Brodsky, from "In praise of Boredom"          delivered as a commencement address at Dartmouth College. Hans T.H. Beernink, Department of Biochemistry, University of Vermont

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Question:

Greenstone lake, the first that you get to, seems to have a small brook trout population but there are so many others that it’s hardly worth fishing.

One of the funnier things I’ve seen while fishing happened here.  A couple of spin fisherman were fishing Greenstone and one hooked about a 6" brookie.  His buddy got the net, which had a handle about three feet long and a rim about 2 feet in diameter.  It was big enough to net salmon for god’s sake. Well, as he went to lift the trout out of the water, it fell through the webbing on the net.  I got a good chuckle to say the least.

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A friend was in at Saddlebag two weeks ago and said the ground was still fairly soggy…..alot of the High Country won’t be opened up this year at all, as fall/winter is beginning to happen already (last week it got down to 35 deg 3 nights straight at 6870 ft. elevation. As far as fishing, it’s been suprising how few trout are actually surface feeding this year in the Sierra (Ralph Cutter- can you shed some light on this and/or confirm/deny ??).   All I’m able to attribute it to is the lower than customary temperature of the water. There *are* hatches, although they are much later than usual, but the fish seeem to be ignoring them. The few that I’ve kept have been **PACKED** with nymphs, hoppers, ants and beetles, but not alot of "surface bugs". I indicator nymphed and worked a pair of ants (one flying, one hardshell) and picked up a few fish….but certainly nothing to boast about. Tried soft-hackele wets for hours with no takers..upstream, down and across and downstream…..started to curse Dave Huges and Sylvester Nemes below my breath, but decided that I’d save that for my third and likely final attempt at this "old New Style" of flyfishing. Don’t know if it would be worth the effort of canoeing and then trekking farther; I’ve heard Mammoth has been pretty good this year, you may want to give it a go instead!!

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At the end of September I’m thinking of heading up to Saddlebage Lake, canoeing accross and hiking around the Conness Lakes/Glacier are to fish for Goldens.  Has anyone been up there lately or at this time of year.  I know it’ll probabaly be a bit cold since its above 10,000 feet. What flies should I bring?  Nymphs, Caddis, Terresterals?  Any advice would be appreciated.  

I haven’t been up there in a few years but this is one of my favorite areas.  I also used a canoe to get across the lake and  then carried it up on the shore a bit and stashed my oars up by a tree a bit up the trail. Greenstone lake, the first that you get to, seems to have a small brook trout population but there are so many others that it’s hardly worth fishing.  The next lake (Wasco) is a little better and I’ve caught fish of a decent size.  Steelhead lake (the biggest in the basin) has been hit and miss for me.  Cascade lake, and the small lake in between it and Steelhead are both real good.  The shallows at the south end of the lake are teeming with brookies in the evening.  There is another small lake (Towser) that is supposed to be a Golden trout only lake and I’ve caught a couple real small ones in it.  Shamrock lake has been one of the best producers for brookies for me and it’s probably the prettiest in the basin.  To the South of Shamrock as you head up the hill there are a couple of other small lakes that are supposed to be Golden trout lakes but I’ve never found them.  At the top of the hill in the center of the basin is Z-lake.  I have caught more brookies in that lake then any of the other lakes.  Helen Lake and Odell have produced much for me and I believe that Odell is supposed to be a golden trout only lake as well. I haven’t fished Hummingbird but I hear it has a large brookie population, so much so that the fish are stunted. There are three lakes up above the waterfall below the glacier that are worth the hike only because they are so pretty.  The first one is almost a tourquiose color.  Unfortunately I was told that these lakes froze solid a few years ago and have not been restocked.  That was about five years ago so it may have changed. If the fish are hitting the surface I have had the best luck with grey hackle peacocks, grey hackle yellows, Sierra brite dots, and coachmens. If they are not,  various nymphs like GR hares ears, prince nymphs, Birds nests, pheasant tails, and a few emerger patterns all seem to work.   I fished all of these patterns with an ultralight spinning rod and a casting bubble.  For the grey hackles, etc, I filled the bubble half full of water and fished them wet just below the surface with a *very* slow retrieve.   For the nymphs I fill the bubble up all the way and then cast and count down several seconds before begining the retrieve. As is the case with any of the areas in the Sierra you should be prepared for any kind of weather.  I’ve been there twice in September when it has snowed.  One time a friend of mine and I drove up and camped at Tioga lake campground because we arrived too late in the day.  He got up the next morning and went out in my canoe on Tioga lake.  He paddled out about 100′ and decided it was too cold.  He knocked on my camper shell window and said that he had to come in and warm up.  We ended up driving around a bit because the heater wasn’t warming fast enough.  It was probably a good three hours before he felt normal again.  Hypothermia is a very real possibility this time of year and it’s nothing to fool around with.  If we had camped out the night before in the basin like we had planned it could have been *real* serious. — John Fereira Isis Distributed Systems – Ithaca, NY

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At the end of September I’m thinking of heading up to Saddlebage Lake, canoeing accross and hiking around the Conness Lakes/Glacier are to fish for Goldens.  Has anyone been up there lately or at this time of year.  I know it’ll probabaly be a bit cold since its above 10,000 feet. What flies should I bring?  Nymphs, Caddis, Terresterals?  Any advice would be appreciated.   "Never get suckered into defending the cost of your fishing habit on a cost per pound basis.  It’ll only embarrass or depress you.  The only measurement that makes sense at all is the cost per cast…So, if you are long on effort and short on results, remember that the more you cast, the cheaper it gets."                                             -Tully Stroud Chris Anderson San Fransicko

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Question:

The Catskill Flyfishing Center and Museum opened a new building a few months ago. They have something going on almost every weekend. Give em your support. Phone 914-439-4810 for more info. Regards,

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Yes.  They have a beautiful new museum building which opened in November….I was there Saturday for their annual flea market.  It’s really a great spot to visit now….don’t miss it. Mike Coon Phoenicia, NY – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -The Catskill Flyfishing Center and Museum opened a new building a few months ago. They have something going on almost every weekend. Give em your support. Phone 914-439-4810 for more info. Regards,

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I’m planning a trip down to Roscoe NY for the annual fly fishing flea market at the flyfishing museum.  Anybody been? Rick

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I’m planning a trip down to Roscoe NY for the annual fly fishing flea market at the flyfishing museum.  Anybody been?

No, when is it?  I’m heading down that way Sunday (8/20) evening to fish the Delaware and staying over a day.  I’m not sure which way is "down" for you but I’m heading there from Ithaca. — John Fereira Isis Distributed Systems  Ithaca, NY

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On Saturday 8/26 there will be a fly-fishing flea market in Roscoe itself. See you there. Mike – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (Richard Nathan) writes: I’m planning a trip down to Roscoe NY for the annual fly fishing flea market at the flyfishing museum.  Anybody been? No, when is it?  I’m heading down that way Sunday (8/20) evening to fish the Delaware and staying over a day.  I’m not sure which way is "down" for you but I’m heading there from Ithaca. — John Fereira Isis Distributed Systems  Ithaca, NY

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On Saturday 8/26 there will be a fly-fishing flea market in Roscoe itself. See you there.

Is this an annual thing? —

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Question:

Yes, me again!  In addition to the firefighter brother, another brother and my father both fly small planes.  So… I’m looking for designs related to flying, pilots, small planes (like Cessna 172), sea/floatplanes (like deHavilland Beaver or Cessna 172 floatplane), etc.  The more detail the better, but I’d like to hear about *any* design you know of.

I saw a bunch of these at the crosstitch store I now frequent. Also firefighter, fishing, etc. designs you requested in your earlier post.  So rest assured they do exist.  Unfortunately I will not be heading out there in the near future. THe designs ranged from extremely simple (it was a Piper or a Cessna plane — just a stick figure really) to more detailed pictures of fishing and a fireman’s prayer. Check out the latest CS&CC and Just XStitch magazines.  I think I saw the firefighter patterns in there. Lucinda

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: Yes, me again!  In addition to the firefighter brother, : another brother and my father both fly small planes.  So… : I’m looking for designs related to flying, pilots, small : planes (like Cessna 172), sea/floatplanes (like deHavilland : Beaver or Cessna 172 floatplane), etc.  The more detail the : better, but I’d like to hear about *any* design you know of. Barbara, Try A&L Designs, 225 Fair View Street, Pottsville, PA 17901-1719 (717)622-6102 EST Jean Spenser showed me her chart of a Cessna last month and I can attest their designs are good.  Since then I’ve spotted their ads in the magazines with other models shown.  I think you will find what you want here.         Deborah

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another brother and my father both fly small planes.  So… I’m looking for designs related to flying, pilots, small planes (like Cessna 172), sea/floatplanes (like deHavilland Beaver or Cessna 172 floatplane), etc.  The more detail the better, but I’d like to hear about *any* design you know of.

fiance. The chart was only 3.75 or so, and I haven’t tried it yet, but since I can’t find anything else, this will do. Hope this helps! Chris Loria P.S. The folks at Stitchers Source are wonderful!! I highly recommend making purchases from them !

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Yes, me again!  In addition to the firefighter brother, another brother and my father both fly small planes.  So… I’m looking for designs related to flying, pilots, small planes (like Cessna 172), sea/floatplanes (like deHavilland Beaver or Cessna 172 floatplane), etc.  The more detail the better, but I’d like to hear about *any* design you know of. Thanks very much!  …and, as I’m saying in each of my "Looking for…" posts, I will summarize to the newsgroup if I get any email responses. Livermore CA  /  Weather always looks worse through a window                                 |   Mark & Barbara Laufersweiler  |          What is a weed?                                 |        not been discovered.

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