As a person from a nation of 50,000,000 sheep… i have always thought of a Clark
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You can screw all the COWS you want. I want the good stuff (skinny, young, good looking and easy). <bseg — Warren (poonnanny connoisseur) A mohair goat? What is it with you guys and your goats? Some kind of eastern thing? — Warren change addy to yahoo for email Henry’s Fork Clave info and Bozeman, MT fishing info http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt3/HFclave.html
Hold that thought Warren, it will bring you a lifetime of fun. It seems to work for several people I have met on ROFF and in life. Figured what the hell, I’ll give it a try. 
I got carded buying a couple bottles of wine day before yesterday. Wolfgang it’s kind of a strange world out there.
@mcw.edu: Hold that thought Warren, it will bring you a lifetime of fun. It seems to work for several people I have met on ROFF and in life. Figured what the hell, I’ll give it a try. I got carded buying a couple bottles of wine day before yesterday. Wolfgang it’s kind of a strange world out there.
The guy behind the counter probably just wanted your name and address so he could consult with you on his major wine purchases 
Scott
The guy behind the counter probably just wanted your name and address so he
could consult with you on his major wine purchases < Nah, probably just wanted to hit on him. <g Harry last time I got carded I was 31
The guy behind the counter probably just wanted your name and address so he could consult with you on his major wine purchases < Nah, probably just wanted to hit on him. <g Harry last time I got carded I was 31
I was 28. My wife was 30. G.C.
last time I got carded I was 31
One of the metro Atlanta counties has a law that requires everyone to show ID to purchase alcohol. Come on down if you want to get carded again. <g — Charlie…
<< One of the metro Atlanta counties has a law that requires everyone to show ID to purchase alcohol. Come on down if you want to get carded again. <g Interesting. Damn sure ain’t the county the airport is in. Harry got drunk there once waitin for a flight to Little Rock
Wondering why George isnt posting to the newgroup..
His ISP finally wized up? Is he ok?
No. Never was. Anyone know whats up with him??
No. Couldn’t figure that out either. Thanks
HTH, Tim
George, is that you? –please remuv the ‘NOWAY2it’ from my email addy to email me–
He’s traveling andwon’t have access for a while. Paul
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Wondering why George isnt posting to the newgroup..Is he ok? Anyone know whats up with him?? Thanks Jimmy
Old fly fisherman don’t die, they just smell that way. — Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento, CA, USA www.kiene.com
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Wondering why George isnt posting to the newgroup..Is he ok? Anyone know whats up with him?? Thanks Jimmy
Old fly fisherman don’t die, they just smell that way.
Sure, that’s what all of you old farts say…… <bseg — Warren change addy to yahoo for email Henry’s Fork Clave info and Bozeman, MT fishing info http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt3/HFclave.html
Old fly fisherman don’t die, they just smell that way.
Sure, that’s what all of you old farts say…… <bseg As opposed to you young studs, right Warren? Harry old fart (ex young stud)
As opposed to you young studs, right Warren?
Nah, I already passed the young stud mark. I’m in that pre-40, getting older and knowing it while certain things don’t work as well as they used to, but trying to delay the transition for as long as I can stage. — Warren change addy to yahoo for email Henry’s Fork Clave info and Bozeman, MT fishing info http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt3/HFclave.html
As opposed to you young studs, right Warren? Nah, I already passed the young stud mark. I’m in that pre-40, getting older and knowing it while certain things don’t work as well as they used to, but trying to delay the transition for as long as I can stage.
If you discover this secret of staying forever young, as I have, you must *swear* not to tell the other roffians. As anyone who has met me can attest, I have discovered this secret and my Adonis-like, svelte profile and stunning good looks keep others wondering, "Just how does he manage to look that good and stay that fit?" Of course, this could be bullshit. — TL, Tim (everyone looks better over the Internet)
Old fly fisherman don’t die, they just smell that way. Sure, that’s what all of you old farts say…… <bseg As opposed to you young studs, right Warren? Harry old fart (ex young stud)
…walk down the hill —- all the cows.
…walk down the hill —- all the cows.
You can screw all the COWS you want. I want the good stuff (skinny, young, good looking and easy). <bseg — Warren (poonnanny connoisseur) change addy to yahoo for email Henry’s Fork Clave info and Bozeman, MT fishing info http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt3/HFclave.html
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – As opposed to you young studs, right Warren? Nah, I already passed the young stud mark. I’m in that pre-40, getting older and knowing it while certain things don’t work as well as they used to, but trying to delay the transition for as long as I can stage. If you discover this secret of staying forever young, as I have, you must *swear* not to tell the other roffians. As anyone who has met me can attest, I have discovered this secret and my Adonis-like, svelte profile and stunning good looks keep others wondering, "Just how does he manage to look that good and stay that fit?" Of course, this could be bullshit. — TL, Tim (everyone looks better over the Internet)
What bothers me at times is that I still get carded for buying a can of chew sometimes. You only have to be 18 to buy chew and the people selling the chew are a lot younger than I, but for some reason they think I am the younger one! WTF?!?!?! I wish my body felt as young as I look…. Bone spurs in the neck, hands and lower arms that go numb, a freaking vertebrae that has decided to slip due to an old injury which can’t be put back in place by a freaking chiropractor (says it will take surgery or a life of pain to deal with). Screw aging! I have better things to do….. — Warren (who just wishes he could convince his BODY to follow along with his mentality/mental outlook, but is still trying!) change addy to yahoo for email Henry’s Fork Clave info and Bozeman, MT fishing info http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt3/HFclave.html
You can screw all the COWS you want. I want the good stuff (skinny, young, good looking and easy). <bseg — Warren (poonnanny connoisseur)
A mohair goat? — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply.
You can screw all the COWS you want. I want the good stuff (skinny, young, good looking and easy). <bseg — Warren (poonnanny connoisseur) A mohair goat?
What is it with you guys and your goats? Some kind of eastern thing? — Warren change addy to yahoo for email Henry’s Fork Clave info and Bozeman, MT fishing info http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt3/HFclave.html
Screw aging! I have better things to do…..
Hold that thought Warren, it will bring you a lifetime of fun. Chas
Hold that thought Warren, it will bring you a lifetime of fun.
It seems to work for several people I have met on ROFF and in life. Figured what the hell, I’ll give it a try. — Warren change addy to yahoo for email Henry’s Fork Clave info and Bozeman, MT fishing info http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt3/HFclave.html
Hello Wondering why George isnt posting to the newgroup..Is he ok? Anyone know whats up with him?? Thanks Jimmy
Hello Wondering why HWMNBM isnt posting to the newgroup..Is he ok? Anyone know whats up with him?? Thanks Jimmy
Dammit, I suppose this will trigger another round of stupidity Flyfish – the stupidity line probably starts here
Hello Wondering why George isnt posting to the newgroup..Is he ok? Anyone know whats up with him??
Who knows? More to the point, who cares? — rbc: vixen Fairly harmless remove invalid or hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You’re missing something. A float tube in many states is considered a boat. And CG regulations require you to have a personal flotation device handy on the boat. When float tubes go bad, they often dont’ just leak a little, they deflate quickly. Every year it seems, at least one person dies because his float tube deflates and he/she panics and gets stuck getting out of it or can not swim. Or back home in the southeast, float tubes are a favorite way to fish the tailwaters, and it is not difficult to get careless and upended on moving waters, especially during unscheduled releases.. As long as you’re not stuck under a rock or a log, the floatation device will at least bring you back to the surface. Wayne Maybe I’m missing something, but I don’t see the point of wearing a life vest in a float tube. A float tube by definition floats, doesn’t it? If you fall out, can’t you just hang on to it?
Wayne makes some additional good points r.w. George
george.vcf
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You’re missing something.
Well, I’m not going to start wearing a life jacket in my float tube. I can always rely on the whistle I had to buy in Yellowstone if I get in trouble. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/
Well, I’m not going to start wearing a life jacket in my float tube. I can always rely on the whistle I had to buy in Yellowstone if I get in trouble.
Or maybe someone will happen by with 100 wine corks. <g — Charlie…
Anyhow r.w. I bought a couple of those minature, under the vest life-vests and I don’t go wading in water over my head without one on.
it’s statements like that one that make me question whether or not we could exist without you, george. really, though, i thought you could simply walk on top of water over your head. wayno
Well, I’m not going to start wearing a life jacket in my float tube. I can always rely on the whistle I had to buy in Yellowstone if I get in trouble. Or maybe someone will happen by with 100 wine corks. <g
Won’t be necessary. The little ball inside the whistle is made from cork. Given the well known crowding on Yellowstone waters, it should be obvious that a single toot on the whistle would cause everyone in the immediate area to hurl his or her own whistle at the poor unfortunate, thus providing enough little cork balls to float even the densest ROFFian until the appropriate rescue personnel arrive on the scene. Wolfgang ya gotta love that sense of selfless cooperation
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well, I’m not going to start wearing a life jacket in my float tube. I can always rely on the whistle I had to buy in Yellowstone if I get in trouble. Or maybe someone will happen by with 100 wine corks. <g Won’t be necessary. The little ball inside the whistle is made from cork. Given the well known crowding on Yellowstone waters, it should be obvious that a single toot on the whistle would cause everyone in the immediate area to hurl his or her own whistle at the poor unfortunate, thus providing enough little cork balls to float even the densest ROFFian until the appropriate rescue personnel arrive on the scene. Wolfgang ya gotta love that sense of selfless cooperation
Some people have been known to drown, while others were wetting their whistles. TL MC
As long as you’re not stuck under a rock or a log, the floatation device will at least bring you back to the surface.
…so your next of kin can claim the body before it gets all yucky. :-) Joe F.
Well, I’m not going to start wearing a life jacket in my float tube. I can always rely on the whistle I had to buy in Yellowstone if I get in trouble. Or maybe someone will happen by with 100 wine corks. <g
Man, have you guys got the wrong theory on this…pull the cork, drink the wine, put the cork back in the bottle, and then toss him both. You’d not need anywhere near 100 – I’d bet that the cork AND the bottle offer more flotation than just the cork, and that way, everyone is happy…. TC, R
rw wrote Maybe I’m missing something, but I don’t see the point of wearing a life vest in a float tube. A float tube by definition floats, doesn’t it? If you fall out, can’t you just hang on to it?
I think it’s pretty clear that if you only have one floatation device, in this case, your tube, and it fails… you’re sunk. I recommend one of the auto inflatable life vests as a back up…they have a little ‘panic’ cord that causes the vest to inflate immediatly from a CO2 cartridge. I understand they have these in models that are basically like suspenders until you need them. I’m not sure how bulky these are. Personally, I use an auto inflatable that packs nicely into a pouch approx 10"x6"x2" that easily fits into one of the large storage pockets on my tube. I would strongly recommend such a device to anyone, especially those who still use a donut style tube. Another word to the wise regarding donut tubes. Have you ever figured out what you’d do if you fell over in shallow water as you are stepping out of your tube? It’s a good idea to think, in advance, about what you’d do in this situation. I have heard that some people have drowned just this way. Personally, I use a U-boat that’s got a styrofoam block as a seat. The latter will float me even if the tube completely deflates. Given the fact that I wear neoprene waders, and I still keep my auto-inflatable vest in a storage pocket, I feel pretty unsinkable. (By the way, I keep a whistle too) (Just my luck, I’ll still figure a way to drown myself even with all that back-up!) FiddleAway
Oh boy BJC. If ever there was a river to have a Personal Floatation Device, I would think the Deschutes just about rates right up there. The least someone should do is put a small bottle of Gehrke’s Fly Floatation Device in their vest. At the last second, they can smear it on their face giving them a chance for a couple of last breaths and casts?
Oh man…if a whole bottle were to fall in a river…man…I shudder. That would have drastic consequences. Iimagine the whole river floating…higher and higher all the way to the jetstream where it flows ethereal and winds its way back to the dream. By the way? Do you need a free hat B.C.?
Yes, I was thinking it should say…. "Get some Ginkee on your Fingee" Your pal, — The Halfordian Golfer The deceipt ends with the lure.
Maybe I’m missing something, but I don’t see the point of wearing a life vest in a float tube. A float tube by definition floats, doesn’t it? If you fall out, can’t you just hang on to it? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – rw wrote Maybe I’m missing something, but I don’t see the point of wearing a life vest in a float tube. A float tube by definition floats, doesn’t it? If you fall out, can’t you just hang on to it? I think it’s pretty clear that if you only have one floatation device, in this case, your tube, and it fails… you’re sunk. I can swim. In fact, I can swim pretty well. If I couldn’t swim I probably wouldn’t use a float tube. Life in a series of tradeoffs. I think my chance of a catastrophic float-tube failure, leaving me somewhere from which I couldn’t swim to shore, is pretty remote. That chance doesn’t (in my opinion) merit me using a life vest. I’ll roll those dice, and if they come up snake eyes so be it.
Actually, I was addressing your original statement which was that you do not see the point of wearing a vest. Actually, I think you knew in advance why most people have backup floatation devices, but you wanted to make your fatalistic point about snake eyes. I see your point, and I can respect your attitude. In fact, if having backup weren’t so easy, low hassle, and inexpensive, I might even cop it myself. But, flotation backup is easy and cheap and death by drowning really gives me the creeps. So as long as I can imagine realistic situations (and I can), though unlikely, where having backup would save my life (when not having them would not), I’ll take it. That is the point for me and I suspect that’s the point for most people (which, as I said, I think you knew already, right?) FiddleAway
Actually, I was addressing your original statement which was that you do not see the point of wearing a vest. Actually, I think you knew in advance why most people have backup floatation devices, but you wanted to make your fatalistic point about snake eyes.
I didn’t mean to imply that someone who wears a life vest or a "backup floatation device" is stupid. I’m sorry if it came across that way. It’s just that in my personal experience I haven’t felt the need for one. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/
rw wrote Actually, I was addressing your original statement which was that you do not see the point of wearing a vest. Actually, I think you knew in advance why most people have backup floatation devices, but you wanted to make your fatalistic point about snake eyes. I didn’t mean to imply that someone who wears a life vest or a "backup floatation device" is stupid. I’m sorry if it came across that way. It’s just that in my personal experience I haven’t felt the need for one.
Er, well, I didn’t mean to imply that you meant to imply that… Actually I thought your subtext was more along the lines of …the less you worry about unlikely things, the more you enjoy whatever it is you’re doing … or something like that. Which happens to be a sentiment I agree with … still, we all have our own comfort level. FiddleAway
You’re missing something. A float tube in many states is considered a boat. And CG regulations require you to have a personal flotation device handy on the boat. When float tubes go bad, they often dont’ just leak a little, they deflate quickly. Every year it seems, at least one person dies because his float tube deflates and he/she panics and gets stuck getting out of it or can not swim. Or back home in the southeast, float tubes are a favorite way to fish the tailwaters, and it is not difficult to get careless and upended on moving waters, especially during unscheduled releases.. As long as you’re not stuck under a rock or a log, the floatation device will at least bring you back to the surface. Wayne
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Maybe I’m missing something, but I don’t see the point of wearing a life vest in a float tube. A float tube by definition floats, doesn’t it? If you fall out, can’t you just hang on to it? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/
Isn’t the backrest in your tube inflateable? Isn’t it in all of them? If so, then there is a floatation device right there. Ok, so it’s not CG approved, BFD. Darin
rw wrote Maybe I’m missing something, but I don’t see the point of wearing a life vest in a float tube. A float tube by definition floats, doesn’t it? If you fall out, can’t you just hang on to it? I think it’s pretty clear that if you only have one floatation device, in this case, your tube, and it fails… you’re sunk.
I can swim. In fact, I can swim pretty well. If I couldn’t swim I probably wouldn’t use a float tube. Life in a series of tradeoffs. I think my chance of a catastrophic float-tube failure, leaving me somewhere from which I couldn’t swim to shore, is pretty remote. That chance doesn’t (in my opinion) merit me using a life vest. I’ll roll those dice, and if they come up snake eyes so be it. Maybe if I were float tubing in the middle of the Great Slave Lake I’d feel differently. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/
Maine now requires that you carry, not necessarily wear, a USCG approved floatation device when fishing from a tube as they do with any type of boat and/or personal watercraft. I’ve taken to dragging one of those cheapie orange wall mart vests behind my tube since wearing it would be a pain in the ass. I’ve looked at the inflatable SOS-penders and the like and will probably one day get one since I’m not the swimteam type anymore Flyfish
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Maybe I’m missing something, but I don’t see the point of wearing a life vest in a float tube. A float tube by definition floats, doesn’t it? If you fall out, can’t you just hang on to it? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/
Not necessarily r.w. Cold water temperatures lower the body tempertures which tends to make the blood want to congeal which could result in a heart attack. One should always have a back up floatation device and it is also a good idea to take asprin the night before to help thin the blood. Asprin for older folks, each day is a good idea anyhow, if your doctor okays it for you. Float tube do go flat in the middle of a lake for no good reason at all. We should remember that tire tubes get punctured or spring leaks. Most systems are two chambered R.W. and all you need is one side to go flat on you and you’re leaning sideways and over you go. Often, in float tubes of various models, the user may fall into the water or need to get out of the floatation tube for various reasons. The worst thing anyone can do once in the water is to hold onto the fly rod. Unless someone is close enough to let them reach your butt section to drag you out or towards them, let the damned thing go. Fly rods are expendable but you’re not. Anyhow r.w. I bought a couple of those minature, under the vest life-vests and I don’t go wading in water over my head without one on. I also don’t go tubing or floating anywhere without wearing one. So the smart option is to always make a back up floatation device part of your main system. Be a ground hog, have a back door escape route planned or ready in case you may need it. Trying to swim with fly fishing thermo clothing, waders, flippers, vests, heavy coats, etc. on is not the same as trying to swim in a warm pool with just trunks on. (Or skinny dipping) Another factor is does the tuber smoke? Frailing around in ice cold lake water and worse yet, spring fed ponds with little or no good lung power doesn’t assure enough energy to reach shore. I know of one gentleman who was paddled himself right into a sharp stick that was just an inch under the water. Put a hole the size of a baseball into his tube and he sunk in seconds! If I wasn’t there, he would have drowned. Get one of those little CO2 life vests r.w. It’s wonderful life insurance. George Gehrke – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Maybe I’m missing something, but I don’t see the point of wearing a life vest in a float tube. A float tube by definition floats, doesn’t it? If you fall out, can’t you just hang on to it? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/
george.vcf
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Last I heard, here in Washington a float tube was considered a swim toy, therefore no PFD required. Darin
If you are in the deschutes in your pontoon boat you have to have a PFD, a trip permit and a container for waste ( that more that just candy bar wrappers ). I have heard from some people that it applies to float tubes also but have not had a chance to talk to the ODFG yet. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I never wear a life vest when I am in my float tube
Oh boy BJC. If ever there was a river to have a Personal Floatation Device, I would think the Deschutes just about rates right up there. The least someone should do is put a small bottle of Gehrke’s Fly Floatation Device in their vest. At the last second, they can smear it on their face giving them a chance for a couple of last breaths and casts? By the way? Do you need a free hat B.C.? ; } – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If you are in the deschutes in your pontoon boat you have to have a PFD, a trip permit and a container for waste ( that more that just candy bar wrappers ). I have heard from some people that it applies to float tubes also but have not had a chance to talk to the ODFG yet. I never wear a life vest when I am in my float tube
george.vcf
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I wouldn;t use a tube without a life vest system of some sort. I use a floater vest, made by mustang. It is inflatable, fits just like a fishing vest, is waterproof, and has a CO2 cartridge for inflation. Also has a mouth tube. Catsing is no problem, even when I weighed 250 lbs. Tim Lysyk
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I never wear a life vest when I am in my float tube. The reason, of course, is that you can’t cast with a life vest on over my 225 pounds of body. I saw an article that discussed flooding your waders to see what happens. At least with neoprene, you float and in fact it is hard to keep your feet down, even when it is completely filled with water. Since I use neoprene, exclusively, in my float tube that was an encouraging article. However, there are the fish & game folks out, very rarely, but sometimes and I don’t want a ticket and I don’t want to wear a life vest. I looked at the inflatable suspenders thingies ($75 a pair and coast guard approved), and they are a bother to cast around also (I tried them on at the fly shop, stepped outside with one of their rods and was not pleased, especially while I was sitting). My float tube, The Woodriver Gliderider, comes with a floatation cushion and it puts me too high up in the seat of my tube and I also lose some of the pinch effect of the pontoons that hold me in (besides the law is that I have to be ‘wearing’ the floatation device. I feel safe in my neoprenes; even if I have to swim in them (the article goes on to say that it was not much of a challenge to swim in waders, a little awkward, but not much). Also, my float tube has separate chambers for safety and I think that is good as well. I realize that there is an available safety inflatable cushion that you can put in a pocket, but the current law requires the angler to be WEARING the floatation device. What the hell do you guys, who use float tubes, do? Padishar Creel – Don’t mind the whistle part of the law, makes good sense…
I know that you did not like them, but I use the SOSpenders. I weigh a little more than you so it can be done. I find that in either the pontoon or tube I can cast while wearing them. As I’m a lousy swimmer, I sometimes wear them if I fish alone on the Deschutes. In Oregon, I think the law is to have one available in a floating device, but not specifically to be wearing it. That allows those hip pack inflatables to be used if they are Coast Guard approved. On swimming, here is a link on swimming in waders. It also shows the application of a hip pack inflatable. http://www.westernflyfisher.com/index.asp?i=0101p25v5&t=1 ra kane at gte dot net "BassCreel" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I never wear a life vest when I am in my float tube. The reason, of course, is that you can’t cast with a life vest on over my 225 pounds of body. I saw an article that discussed flooding your waders to see what happens. At least with neoprene, you float and in fact it is hard to keep your feet down, even when it is completely filled with water. Since I use neoprene, exclusively, in my float tube that was an encouraging article. However, there are the fish & game folks out, very rarely, but sometimes and I don’t want a ticket and I don’t want to wear a life vest. I looked at the inflatable suspenders thingies ($75 a pair and coast guard approved), and they are a bother to cast around also (I tried them on at the fly shop, stepped outside with one of their rods and was not pleased, especially while I was sitting). My float tube, The Woodriver Gliderider, comes with a floatation cushion and it puts me too high up in the seat of my tube and I also lose some of the pinch effect of the pontoons that hold me in (besides the law is that I have to be ‘wearing’ the floatation device. I feel safe in my neoprenes; even if I have to swim in them (the article goes on to say that it was not much of a challenge to swim in waders, a little awkward, but not much). Also, my float tube has separate chambers for safety and I think that is good as well. I realize that there is an available safety inflatable cushion that you can put in a pocket, but the current law requires the angler to be WEARING the floatation device. What the hell do you guys, who use float tubes, do? Padishar Creel – Don’t mind the whistle part of the law, makes good sense…
I never wear a life vest when I am in my float tube. The reason, of course, is that you can’t cast with a life vest on over my 225 pounds of body. I saw an article that discussed flooding your waders to see what happens. At least with neoprene, you float and in fact it is hard to keep your feet down, even when it is completely filled with water. Since I use neoprene, exclusively, in my float tube that was an encouraging article. However, there are the fish & game folks out, very rarely, but sometimes and I don’t want a ticket and I don’t want to wear a life vest. I looked at the inflatable suspenders thingies ($75 a pair and coast guard approved), and they are a bother to cast around also (I tried them on at the fly shop, stepped outside with one of their rods and was not pleased, especially while I was sitting). My float tube, The Woodriver Gliderider, comes with a floatation cushion and it puts me too high up in the seat of my tube and I also lose some of the pinch effect of the pontoons that hold me in (besides the law is that I have to be ‘wearing’ the floatation device. I feel safe in my neoprenes; even if I have to swim in them (the article goes on to say that it was not much of a challenge to swim in waders, a little awkward, but not much). Also, my float tube has separate chambers for safety and I think that is good as well. I realize that there is an available safety inflatable cushion that you can put in a pocket, but the current law requires the angler to be WEARING the floatation device. What the hell do you guys, who use float tubes, do? Padishar Creel – Don’t mind the whistle part of the law, makes good sense…
Danke. Any in striking distance of Portland (left coast)?
Danke. Any in striking distance of Portland (left coast)?
There will be for sure if you decide to host one. Regards, Jeff
Great responses, all. Wunnerfully creative minds at work (??) here. Now, anyone care to answer the original question itself? Thanks!
Great responses, all. Wunnerfully creative minds at work (??) here. Now, anyone care to answer the original question itself? Thanks!
I did sort of. Conclave – 1. a private meeting. 2a. the assembly of cardinals for the election of a pope. 2b. the meeting place for the conclave. (Hint: It ain’t meaning #2) Now the new definition, a ROFFian meeting of assorted reprobates, alocholics, and womanizers in a location near water known to hold trout. HTH Peter
"Clave" is an abbreviation of "Conclave", which is usually taken to mean the gathering of cardinals who assemble to elect a new pope. It also means any closed gathering. As far as ROFF is concerned, a clave is a get together where hopefully fun is had by all, and some fishing is done. TL MC — "If you have tried everything you know, and nothing works, then perhaps it is time to accept that you don
I may end up spending most of this summer in Sarajevo on business. Are there significant opportunities for fly fishing in Bosnia? More fundamentally, even if there is good fishing is it a reasonable thing to do, or are the chances of involuntarily aiding the demining operations too high? I was also wondering about fishing in Slovenia. I don
Our California rivers are full of lead and mercury. Fortunately it settles to the bedrock below the gravel and hopefully does little damage. My friend looks for gold in our Mother Load Rivers while I fish for trout. The lead is from bullets, the mercury was left by the 49ers. Quite often the mercury is attached to gold. Ernie
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sadly (for those of us who like to use it) real lead foil is fast becoming a thing of the past on wine bottles. Lead has caused the same level of concern in this arena as it has elsewhere. More and more wineries are changing over to other materials. Plastic, tin, aluminum, and perhaps a few other materials are becoming more and more common.
I’m afraid I have to disagree with Mike and Wolfgang here. These days, many of the flies tied in third world countries are pretty good.
I can’t think of the brand right now but there is one line of mass produced flies that seems decent. It comes in a yellow package and has somebody’s name on it but the logo/graphics look nearly identical to the old Fred Arbogast lure company logo. I think it might be Hank Roberts or something like that. Not sure about the matierals but the tying is better than the others. Most of the flies I have seen at K-Mart however are fairly crappy. Mu
I would agree actually Tony, especially as regards the Fulling Mill flies, and there are a couple of others which are not bad. I have seen a great deal of "Bubble packaged" stuff however, especially in big stores, which was absolutely awful. These things are often sold by the big chains, and not in tackle shops etc. These were what I meant. It certainly was not my intention to brand all these producers as "sweat shops". My apologies if I caused such an impression. TL MC — "In order to achieve what is possible, one must constantly attempt the impossible" http://www.mikeconnor.de
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m afraid I have to disagree with Mike and Wolfgang here. These days, many of the flies tied in third world countries are pretty good. I’m certain that the wages paid are pretty low by our standards, but to brand all third world manufacture as ’sweat shops’ is probably both unfair and inaccurate. The flies that are marketed here by ‘Fulling Mill Flies’ are (in many cases) quite excellent. They are tied in Kenya and Barry Unwin’s people are very good on product development and quality control. It doesn’t particularly matter that an African woman is never going to go fly fishing. If she’s nimble-fingered enough to tie good quality flies and it’s paying her a decent wage (by local standards), what’s the problem? I have often looked at some of Fulling Mill’s standard patterns (Muddlers, for example) and thought to myself: ‘Why the hell do I bother tying my own?’
I’m not familiar with Fulling Mill’s products Tony. Judging from what I have seen of the flies sold in the big discount stores like K-Mart they aren’t handling these products. None of the stuff I’ve seen sold in such places was made by anyone who shows much evidence of being nimble fingered or of being familiar with the patterns upon which their wares are allegedly modeled. In these products it is not unusual to see that the heads are already unraveling in the package. Feathers are mismatched, badly frayed, poorly dyed, and askew. This is merely the beginning of what could be a very long list of sins. And all of this is apparent just looking through the packaging. I think the best way for David to assess these flies is to buy a single package and then take them to a fly shop for comparison. Even a rank novice should easily be able to see and evaluate the differences.
Thanks for the info. I thought that by crimping the end of the solder, the rosin would be sealed inside, but it’s too thick to use anyway. Great idea about the lead foil though. I’m not much of a drinker, and had no idea that wrapping was made of lead. I went ahead and bought a few packs of cheap flies, just for casting practice, for when I finally get my rod and reel.
Sadly (for those of us who like to use it) real lead foil is fast becoming a thing of the past on wine bottles. Lead has caused the same level of concern in this arena as it has elsewhere. More and more wineries are changing over to other materials. Plastic, tin, aluminum, and perhaps a few other materials are becoming more and more common.
Re side question. Not sure but solder is possible contaminant which should not be used for weighting flies. Would probably be better if you bought the proper stuff from shop just to be safe unless someone can say for sure solder is safe. Regards from Montreal John Brkich
Re side question. Not sure but solder is possible contaminant which should not be used for weighting flies. Would probably be better if you bought the proper stuff from shop just to be safe unless someone can say for sure solder is safe.
Solder was traditionally made from various proportions of lead and tin. You can still get this stuff but it is being replaced by lead free solder. The new alloys are being distributed precisely because of concerns over lead poisoning. Presumably they are safer….at least until we hear otherwise. The old stuff, since it contains lead, is to be considered somewhat dangerous, but obviously no more so than the lead wire and weights which are still being sold and widely used. The lead foil wrappers from wine bottles are very useful but equally dangerous. Aside from the lead question, solder has another problem. Cored solder is hollow and filled with either rosin or acid, either of which works as a flux. This helps to keep work surfaces from oxidizing under heat, thus ensuring that the melted solder will stick. Both rosin and acids are corrosive and toxic. Prolonged or intense exposure to either is something of a health hazard, not to mention the damage they can do to fly tying materials. Given enough time, the acid from acid core solder will completely disintegrate steel hooks. You can imagine what it might do to more fragile materials.
Thanks for the info. I thought that by crimping the end of the solder, the rosin would be sealed inside, but it’s too thick to use anyway. Great idea about the lead foil though. I’m not much of a drinker, and had no idea that wrapping was made of lead. I went ahead and bought a few packs of cheap flies, just for casting practice, for when I finally get my rod and reel.
I do not know the specific flies you mention, but most of the chains carry flies made in Africa and other places using almost sweatshop labour Some of these are useable, many more are not. Materials are substituted, patterns are freely bastardised, the quality is often poor,
(etc., snipped) I’m afraid I have to disagree with Mike and Wolfgang here. These days, many of the flies tied in third world countries are pretty good. I’m certain that the wages paid are pretty low by our standards, but to brand all third world manufacture as ’sweat shops’ is probably both unfair and inaccurate. The flies that are marketed here by ‘Fulling Mill Flies’ are (in many cases) quite excellent. They are tied in Kenya and Barry Unwin’s people are very good on product development and quality control. It doesn’t particularly matter that an African woman is never going to go fly fishing. If she’s nimble-fingered enough to tie good quality flies and it’s paying her a decent wage (by local standards), what’s the problem? I have often looked at some of Fulling Mill’s standard patterns (Muddlers, for example) and thought to myself: ‘Why the hell do I bother tying my own?’ Tight Lines, Tony Deacon
The local K-Mart is being renovated into a Super K-Mart, and all their Blue Fox and Scientific Angler flies are marked down to about 50 cents per fly. Are these flies any good from the standpoint of (a) being well made and durable, or, (b) being useful "models" to emulate when tying my own? Side question: I have some resin core solder, .062" diameter. is this about the right size for making weighted nymphs?
The local K-Mart is being renovated into a Super K-Mart, and all their Blue Fox and Scientific Angler flies are marked down to about 50 cents per fly. Are these flies any good from the standpoint of (a) being well made and durable, or, (b) being useful "models" to emulate when tying my own? Side question: I have some resin core solder, .062" diameter. is this about the right size for making weighted nymphs?
a. no b. no c. no Any flies you can buy at K-mart are crap. These flies are all made in places where they have never been used for fly fishing; Kenya, Sri Lanka, etc., and the people making them have almost certainly never had the leisure to use anything like them. I’ve bought some over the years just to see how well they were made (despite the fact that a glance through the packaging spoke volumes). They are invariably shit. Many of them bear only a superficial resemblance to well known patterns whether or not they actually have a name of some sort printed on the package and many of them do not. .062" is a sixteenth of an inch. MUCH too large for most fly tying applications. Might be marginally useful for shaping and weighting huge woolly buggers or something similar but the vast majority of patterns in whatever size would never call for anything that large. Besides, either rosin or acid core solder is a very poor choice because of the effects the flux will have on all the other materials, none of which you are likely to find beneficial.
I do not know the specific flies you mention, but most of the chains carry flies made in Africa and other places using almost sweatshop labour Some of these are useable, many more are not. Materials are substituted, patterns are freely bastardised, the quality is often poor, the hooks are not good etc etc. Best to avoid such flies. The "bubble packaged" ones seem especially awful. The packaging probably costs a lot more than the content. Doubtless five hundred incensed anglers will now write and tell me that they use nothing else, and that the flies are basically perfect. Nevertheless, experience suggests you should avoid such flies unless you know the exact source and reputation of the manufacturer. The solder you mention is quite a bit too thick really. Also you do not know what effect the chemicals in the flux may have on your materials, and the resin core makes it considerably lighter than lead wire. Most fly-dressing supply houses supply suitable lead wire on bobbins. Save the lead sheet from your whisky and wine bottle tops, this can be cut into strips and used to wrap bodies etc. If you use lead to weight flies, then give it a coat of lacquer, cement, etc, before forming the body, as otherwise the lead will "bleed" through the body and ruin the fly. For weighting some flies you can use pieces of "paper clips". Cut these to length using side cutters, and then place them parallel to the hook shank on both sides, top and bottom as well if you like, and whip them on. This makes nicely formed bodies for some nymphs, and guarantees the exact same weight every time. This also works well with copper wire, even thicker stuff which you can not wrap normally. You can also form the lead foil from bottles etc using a set of old wing cutters. This makes really good consistent nymph bodies with the right shape for many nymphs in various sizes. Use one "lead wing" whipped to the top of the hook, or one under one over and then whipped etc. The weight is also very consistent on these flies, as the exact same amount of lead is used every time, assuming the foil is of the same thickness. TL MC — "In order to achieve what is possible, one must constantly attempt the impossible" http://www.mikeconnor.de
I’m getting away from DC for a weekend soon. Any recommendations for a good fly fishing spot near the Blue Ridge in VA or WV? Thanks.
J. A nice weekend would be one of three places. Closest to you would be a B&B in Edinburgh Va. over in the Valley. Harry Murray’s fly shop is there and he can direct you to Big Stony Creek and others. Next closest would be Warm Springs VA. about 3.5 hours away. For cheap lodging I recommend the Roselow Motel. About $40 or$50 a night and nice accommodations. Try the Steak house across the street next to the high school. To fish head to the Poor Farm Road (Rt. 621) area of the Jackson River. Follow the road to the end (becomes dirt) and park at the LAST possible parking area. Hike about 1/2 mile south along the river to the Special Regs. section. Lastly try Damascus Va. About 6 hours away. So many streams I can’t list them all. Try the South Fork of the Holston or Laurel Creek. Two trout streams converge in town. Several nice B&B’s in town. Now, Stay the hell off the Rappahannock this weekend! Above Fredericksburg the smallmouth WILL NOT be hitting everything you throw at them. The water temperature WILL NOT be perfect! The rains HAVE NOT flushed and oxygenated the water! The guy flailing the water fruitlessly with terrible casts knows NOTHING about fishing and is a danger to everyone around him. DO NOT GO THERE!!!! GO FAR AWAY!! Wayne (from Spotsylvania) To fish is human…to release Divine. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m getting away from DC for a weekend soon. Any recommendations for a good fly fishing spot near the Blue Ridge in VA or WV? Thanks.
Im looking for 3 patterns: Bitch Creek, Yuk Bug, and a North Platte Special. Any info would be greatly appreciated as I am fairly new to tying my own flies. You can respond to the e-mail listed below: Again thanks for your help!
I’d suggest you spring for the Umpaqua Fly Pattern book, it has at least the first two. Not sure about the NP special. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Im looking for 3 patterns: Bitch Creek, Yuk Bug, and a North Platte Special. Any info would be greatly appreciated as I am fairly new to tying my own flies. You can respond to the e-mail listed below: Again thanks for your help!
Im looking for 3 patterns: Bitch Creek, Yuk Bug, and a North Platte Special. Any info would be greatly appreciated as I am fairly new to tying my own flies. You can respond to the e-mail listed below: Again thanks for your help!
That’s what fly fishing catalogues are for! Between Kaufmann’s, Orvis, and LLBean (ugly flies in that one!) you can find a whole bunch of flies to copy
Hey, I’ve heard striped bass are starting to show up in the surf outside a couple of bays down south. Is anybody fishing for them from the beach? Dave DeLacey Corvallis, Or.
I think they are always in the lower Umpqua. Denny Hannah used to guide for them when he wasn’t guiding for salmon, steelhead and smallmouth bass. That river also has a good shad run. Great fishery – long way off. -Burton — L. Burton Hawley 2330 NW Hummingbird Corvallis, OR
Hey, I’ve heard striped bass are starting to show up in the surf outside a couple of bays down south. Is anybody fishing for them from the beach? Dave DeLacey Corvallis, Or.
Hey, I’ve heard striped bass are starting to show up in the surf outside a couple of bays down south. Is anybody fishing for them from the beach? Dave DeLacey Corvallis, Or.
Oh…I thought the post was about strippers in Oregon.
Hey, I’ve heard striped bass are starting to show up in the surf outside a couple of bays down south. Is anybody fishing for them from the beach? Dave DeLacey Corvallis, Or.
Hell, as Ken Hanely would say, " Go get ‘em." Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY
I am going to be in Islamorada, FL for part of the week of November 20 and am interested in spending a day fishing the flats. Can anyone recommend a good-quality guide who doesn’t charge a king’s ransom? MZ
Stop at Bonefish Bob’s shop. He is most helpful with questions. Best ? guide- Jim Lopez phone at Marathon. Expensive, tho. Ask Bob. Regards, CLiff
Johnson’s out of Baldwin, MI used to guide down there. I don’t know if they still do but they would be able to offer someone’s name.
I just went bone fishing with Capt. Steve Impallomeni (305) 292-9837 . and had a wonderful day with him! I also would suggest dealing with Capt. Jeffrey Cardenas of The Saltwater Angler (800) 223-1629 for bookings and information … they were the best help and friendliest people I dealt with in Florida! KStJ