Question:

days.  I would guess the tire needed more brakes for some reason in each case. You said it was the home base and the base is notorious for the effect of sudden brakage.

The first plane was a Fed-Ex A-300 out of Newark. They stopped in less than 4000′ of runway. All 8 main tires were blown. Jacks had to be trucked in to raise it up to change the tires. Once it was raised, the brakes wouldn’t disassemble. It was on the runway about 12 hours. Interestingly, it isn’t in the FAA’s incident listings. The second plane was a DC-3 based at nearby airport. Flat tires on taildraggers can be tricky. Fortunately they didn’t ground-loop it. The local newspaper reported that no flights had to divert. You know I sent a sarcastic e-mail to that editor. D.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It was a clear calm morning. The sun was just coming up over the ocean. The temperature was around 70F. I had an easy commute in to work. The employee parking shuttle bus driver waited for me to walk over and board instead of making me wait 15 minutes for the next one. I had only one Jeppeson update to do. There weren’t any nasty memoes from the chief pilot. No one was running their noisy APU, so I did the pre-flight exterior inspection. For once, I didn’t find any discrepencies. The only way it could have been better is if I started the day fishing instead of waiting until I got off work to go fishing. After the pre-flight, I was standing next to the plane chatting with a friend. He and I used to tow banners together. As we were talking, a big cloud of smoke rolled across the airfield. It was tire smoke but too much for a normal landing. Then a gate agent motioned for me to come up the jetway because the boarding passengers were concerned about the smell. I gave them an explanation that worked. After I hung up the PA, my helper-pilot told me that the main runway was shut down because of a disabled aircraft. We made a bet on which airline it was. It turned out to be my turn to buy lunch. Our departure time is at the start of the morning rush of departures, but the morning rush wasn’t happening because many flights were having headaches trying to get their weight down so they could use the short runway. We launched from the short runway in good time. The trip up to the Northeast was pleasant. We called the field insight from 60 miles out. Our turn time was good. We were ready to board when my intuition made the other pilot call clearance. Sure enough, we had a 2 hour gate hold because of delays due to a disabled airplane at our destination. That was going to cut into my fishing time. After the first hour passed, and the greasy spoon diner they call a restaurant had started serving lunch, I sauntered up to the gate area to get a bite to eat. I was surrounded by anxious passengers wanting more information. The gate agent had been instructed not to say anything. A certain irritable streak deep inside was starting to wiggle around because, unlike management, I know how to run an airline. I picked up the PA and gave the folks the information they craved. Just as my speech was winding down, the gate agent wispered to me that our gear-up time had been moved up. I keyed the PA again and told everyone that we had 20 minutes to be in the air or else ATC would send us to the end of the list. Those people must have liked my speech. They ran down the jetway. They stuffed bags in the overheads with super-human strength. I think I saw them shove the last standing passenger into a seat. We set a record for boarding a full plane. They must have liked my speech. Number 2 engine was lit and spooling up as we ran the runway. We made it into the air with less than a minute left of our edict. Maybe I should use that speech more often. The flight southbound was just as nice. ATC was giving vectors and speed restrictions to other traffic in order to get the required in-trail spacing, but they left us alone. All was going well. Too well. On the arrival, 30 miles from the airport, we were given holding instructions. It caught us by surprise. I had to fly the first orbit by hand until my helper-pilot programmed the hold into the FMS. Then he called the tower for more information. He turned to me and said, "What are the odds?". The main runway was still shutdown because it still had an airplane on it with 8 blown tires. The second runway was now shutdown because it also had an airplane on it with blown tires. What are the odds? The second plane was a DC-3. I know that the last DC-3 towbar left the airport a long time ago. The first disabled plane was still on it’s axles. The airport wouldn’t be open anytime soon. We decided that holding wouldn’t change anything, so we diverted to another airport. I never did get to go fishing that day. It was a beautiful day for fishing and I was stuck at the airport. What are the odds? D.

Two blown tire incidents in one days.  I would guess the tire needed more brakes for some reason in each case. You said it was the home base and the base is notorious for the effect of sudden brakage. And fishing at your homebase is a passtime so maybe it has to do with water near the end of the runway. I remember Boston for this problem in the news papers. Is Boston your base?? I remember the Massacheustts solution for the Boston runway problem was to keep the old one and add a second without water as the overrun. Except the new one solved the noise polution problem only and is a poor use for the new North End. Somebody had Mayor White’s old crowd mad at them way back.

Response:

It was a clear calm morning. The sun was just coming up over the ocean. The temperature was around 70F. I had an easy commute in to work. The employee parking shuttle bus driver waited for me to walk over and board instead of making me wait 15 minutes for the next one. I had only one Jeppeson update to do. There weren’t any nasty memoes from the chief pilot. No one was running their noisy APU, so I did the pre-flight exterior inspection. For once, I didn’t find any discrepencies. The only way it could have been better is if I started the day fishing instead of waiting until I got off work to go fishing. After the pre-flight, I was standing next to the plane chatting with a friend. He and I used to tow banners together. As we were talking, a big cloud of smoke rolled across the airfield. It was tire smoke but too much for a normal landing. Then a gate agent motioned for me to come up the jetway because the boarding passengers were concerned about the smell. I gave them an explanation that worked. After I hung up the PA, my helper-pilot told me that the main runway was shut down because of a disabled aircraft. We made a bet on which airline it was. It turned out to be my turn to buy lunch. Our departure time is at the start of the morning rush of departures, but the morning rush wasn’t happening because many flights were having headaches trying to get their weight down so they could use the short runway. We launched from the short runway in good time. The trip up to the Northeast was pleasant. We called the field insight from 60 miles out. Our turn time was good. We were ready to board when my intuition made the other pilot call clearance. Sure enough, we had a 2 hour gate hold because of delays due to a disabled airplane at our destination. That was going to cut into my fishing time. After the first hour passed, and the greasy spoon diner they call a restaurant had started serving lunch, I sauntered up to the gate area to get a bite to eat. I was surrounded by anxious passengers wanting more information. The gate agent had been instructed not to say anything. A certain irritable streak deep inside was starting to wiggle around because, unlike management, I know how to run an airline. I picked up the PA and gave the folks the information they craved. Just as my speech was winding down, the gate agent wispered to me that our gear-up time had been moved up. I keyed the PA again and told everyone that we had 20 minutes to be in the air or else ATC would send us to the end of the list. Those people must have liked my speech. They ran down the jetway. They stuffed bags in the overheads with super-human strength. I think I saw them shove the last standing passenger into a seat. We set a record for boarding a full plane. They must have liked my speech. Number 2 engine was lit and spooling up as we ran the runway. We made it into the air with less than a minute left of our edict. Maybe I should use that speech more often. The flight southbound was just as nice. ATC was giving vectors and speed restrictions to other traffic in order to get the required in-trail spacing, but they left us alone. All was going well. Too well. On the arrival, 30 miles from the airport, we were given holding instructions. It caught us by surprise. I had to fly the first orbit by hand until my helper-pilot programmed the hold into the FMS. Then he called the tower for more information. He turned to me and said, "What are the odds?". The main runway was still shutdown because it still had an airplane on it with 8 blown tires. The second runway was now shutdown because it also had an airplane on it with blown tires. What are the odds? The second plane was a DC-3. I know that the last DC-3 towbar left the airport a long time ago. The first disabled plane was still on it’s axles. The airport wouldn’t be open anytime soon. We decided that holding wouldn’t change anything, so we diverted to another airport. I never did get to go fishing that day. It was a beautiful day for fishing and I was stuck at the airport. What are the odds? D.

Response:

Question:

Tim, Bad move guy.  PLEASE, never send a picture to a newsgroup. Huh ? alt.flyfishing accepts binaries in its charter.

He said ‘newsgroup’<g. — Charlie…

Response:

alt.flyfishing accepts binaries in its charter.

as does alt.binaries.pictures.fishing. — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…" B.M.P.I.A.

Response:

Wayne reprimands in message: Tim, Bad move guy.  PLEASE, never send a picture to a newsgroup…

- Hmmmm….. and *I* was thinking about sending a few photos of Sharon Stone on the Upper Delaware River on a hot muggy August afternoon when the mercury hit 95 wearing a *wet* ROFF t-shirt and a big smile. – Oh well…. Tony Ritter Narrowsburg, New York

Response:

Tim, Bad move guy.  PLEASE, never send a picture to a newsgroup. Huh ? alt.flyfishing accepts binaries in its charter. He said ‘newsgroup’<g.

Ouch! That’s gonna leave a mark…

Response:

Wayne reprimands in message: Tim, Bad move guy.  PLEASE, never send a picture to a newsgroup… – Hmmmm….. and *I* was thinking about sending a few photos of Sharon Stone on the Upper Delaware River on a hot muggy August afternoon when the mercury hit 95 wearing a *wet* ROFF t-shirt and a big smile. – Oh well….

Send ‘em to George. He could use the company…

Response:

Wayne reprimands in message: Tim, Bad move guy.  PLEASE, never send a picture to a newsgroup… – Hmmmm….. and *I* was thinking about sending a few photos of Sharon Stone on the Upper Delaware River on a hot muggy August afternoon when the mercury hit 95 wearing a *wet* ROFF t-shirt and a big smile. – Oh well…. Tony Ritter Narrowsburg, New York

        post or die, yankee devil! wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

Forget it Wayno!  You wouldn’t like her.  She just lays there! — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – post or die, yankee devil! wayno

Response:

Forget it Wayno!  You wouldn’t like her.  She just lays there!

Ever seen Basic Instinct?  Michael Douglas called her "the fuck of the century".  And he get’s around, from what I hear. — Levi Life is anything that dies when you stomp on it.                                                         — Dave Barry

Response:

Forget it Wayno!  You wouldn’t like her.  She just lays there!

        in a display of courage that has been a lifetime hallmark, i am willing to give her a shot. wayno

Response:

– Hmmmm….. and *I* was thinking about sending a few photos of Sharon Stone on the Upper Delaware River on a hot muggy August afternoon when the mercury hit 95 wearing a *wet* ROFF t-shirt and a big smile.

What, who, huh? BTW, I once mistakenly looked up www.teeny.com thinking it was Jim Teeny’s web site.  For the record, it’s www.teeny-nymph.com. Mu

Response:

Mu Young Lee sets us straight: What, who, huh? BTW, I once mistakenly looked up www.teeny.com thinking it was Jim Teeny’s web site.  For the record, it’s www.teeny-nymph.com.

- Which shouldn’t be confused with: alt.teeny.nymphs 8)* – Sorry….couldn’t resist.

Response:

Tim, Bad move guy.  PLEASE, never send a picture to a newsgroup.  Ask any who wish to view it to contact you directly and ship it individually.  Some of our members pay per usage on the connection.  If my Queensland buddy in Brisbane gets wind of this he may take a break from "swimming the bar" and hunt you down just for the sport.  Damn near declared ‘roos endangered in parts of Australia because of his over-eagerness! — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

Response:

Tim, Bad move guy.  PLEASE, never send a picture to a newsgroup.

Huh ? alt.flyfishing accepts binaries in its charter. — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…" B.M.P.I.A.

Response:

Question:

George, also help me. when no one else did. I put up a post. (no one answered) George replied on a private E-mail.  and I thank you again. George keep it up.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hey George All I want to say is that George gave me a break when I was struggling on this newsgroup.  I have only been on a week or so and therefore I am now getting a feel for it. Where were all you guys when I had a query, come on ‘Live And Let Live’ George helped me out and I appreciate that. Stop arguing….Lets Fish Pete Derbyshire, England ______ I want to make this perfectly clear to everyone.  Wayne Chan made the same mistake that I made a few weeks ago.  Mr. Chan is a dear, sweet man and he is a Chinese American who deals in Bamboo.  Mr Chan wrote me a letter and hit the wrong carbon button because the letter was supposed to go to a second party also.  You guessed it, he blew it! Just two minutes ago, I finished explaining to Mr. Wayne Chan his error and how everyone is furious at me (which is all right) but I am concerned about sincere people leaving due to a misunderstanding.  This man, Mr. Wayne Chan, is terribly sorry.  The man is about in tears for all the orders this will cost me and the change in heart regarding my name and place in ROFF. I am NOT a spammer and neither is Mr. Chan.  Two like errors have occurred and shit happens in life.  I will go so far as to say if there is anyone in this world that wants me to pay for a week’s worth of their ROFF time because of any spams resulting from this one time error, I will pay it.  I will be responsible.  Just figure out how many minutes X the rate and I will cover any hardship anyone in ROFF has suffered.  I can’t do any better then that. I would like to also state to this beautiful group that I will not tolerate anyone trying to black mail this group or this person. Some of you have known me my entire fly fishing career.  I don’t lie and I don’t do mean things.  We all make errors.  But we are surrounded by individuals that envy us and who want to destroy us.  This is the time for all of us to come together. I want to tell everyone in public here that I am not the bad guy here and that I do not want Mike Connor or anyone to leave this wonderful chat room.  There is too much history surrounding us.  Your real enemy is Ken Fortenberry and his plant in this group.  Stop and think ladies and gentlemen.  Do your all really think I would do such a thing to hurt anyone here?  Who is the new blood that arrived recently that suddenly, we have these kinds of problems? Mike, I love you, we all love you.  Don’t leave.  None of us here did this too you.  How could we?  Why would we want too? Anyone that wants to talk to me personally, may call me collect in the next six hours.  I’ll pay for the phone bill.  Everyone that is, except Ken Fortenberry. All of this is bullshit, and no one here is perpetuating it.  Believe this.  I am a friend.  If you don’t believe that, then anyone who says they won’t use my products because they believe I’m doing this can go to hell.  I will not admit to something I am not guilty of.  I am innocent.  I deserve the benefit of the doubt. Sincerely, George Gehrke/American Sportsman (Now excuse me for about a half hour because I’m going to talk to my attorney about stalkers and black mailers) —

Question:

Watching ESPN2 recently I chanced across a young lady (seemingly well accomplished in the fly-fishing arts) guiding the show host on a snowy winter stream near Cooke City Montana.  She was fishing dry flys downstream. According to her "when the water is clear and the fish spook easily this prevents ""lining the fish"".

Hi Hart, I didn’t read any of the other post yet, but I am sure there are some good answers. I know that on smooth water that is moving slowly the fishing can be tough on the surface. I usually add on 3 feet of 6x or 7x tippet with a #16 or 18 dry, like a Spinner, Parachute, Cripple or Sparkle Dun. I get 30 to 50 feet above the fish and cast my fly downstream  ~3 feet above it’s rise form. Stop the rod high and shake down some slack so it won’t drag. We learned this from guide Bob Quigley in the 70s on California’s Hat Creek. This way the first thing the fish sees is the fly! If you rent or buy Doug Swisher 3M video, ‘Advanced Strategies for Selective Trout’, you will see Doug demonstrate presenting a fly from any point 360 degrees to the fish. I think this is a standard technique on any western spring creek? Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY www.kiene.com

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Watching ESPN2 recently I chanced across a young lady (seemingly well accomplished in the fly-fishing arts) guiding the show host on a snowy winter stream near Cooke City Montana.  She was fishing dry flys downstream. According to her "when the water is clear and the fish spook easily this prevents ""lining the fish"". Being a new student of the art, everything I read or listen to tells me dry flys Upstream, wet flys up or down stream and nymphing requires years of experience.  Now I wonder how far a trout is seeing upstream.  I have recently experienced "lining the fish" with a pod of three browns while fishing a streamer upstream.  The floating leader alone spooked the fish. Any thoughts on downstream dry fly fishing and range of sight for trout? As a side note: I have caught a couple of lesser fish when allowing the dry fly to float 20 to 30 feet behind me as I moved up stream in the hole.  I don’t consider this a method I wish to regularly adopt but peaks my curiosity about fish sight range. Wayne To fish is human…to release devine.

Response:

The book "Trout and the Fly" by John Goddard offers some interesting insight into a trout’s sight window.   You will line a trout on a downstream drift if the trout does not take the fly and you allow the fly to continue its drift well past the fish. Clint

Response:

Interesting, I started fly fishing in 1948 and find that fishing a dry fly upstream to be the most successful method.  Only in special circumstances where the water is smooth and clear and the trout are "educated" do I use the downstream method. — Ernie Harrison Remove NOSPAM to send E-Mail Selling my Fly Fishing Books Go to: http://users.ccnet.com/~emh – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I started fly fishing in 1952, and the only hard and fast rule I have discovered is that in order to be succesful, you have to adapt your method to suit the current conditions.  As far as dry flies go, I find direct upstream fishing to usually be the least successful method because you will "line" the fish, and drag is difficult to control.   Usually a quartering upstream or side approach is best. If the surface of the water is not smooth, such as a riffle, the downstream method can be quite effective. As far as what other people think of your method, if it is legal, and you are not crowding or otherwise disturbing them, don’t worry about what they think. Tight Lines!!! George

Response:

Ernie, Just goes to show that there are no *right* answers.  Jeez, was I ever bagged when I wrote my first post on this thread.  It’s a miracle I made any sense at all.  Blame it on the Sleemans and keeping bad company (in-laws.) Peter – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Interesting, I started fly fishing in 1948 and find that fishing a dry fly upstream to be the most successful method.  Only in special circumstances where the water is smooth and clear and the trout are "educated" do I use the downstream method. — Ernie Harrison Remove NOSPAM to send E-Mail Selling my Fly Fishing Books Go to: http://users.ccnet.com/~emh I started fly fishing in 1952, and the only hard and fast rule I have discovered is that in order to be succesful, you have to adapt your method to suit the current conditions.  As far as dry flies go, I find direct upstream fishing to usually be the least successful method because you will "line" the fish, and drag is difficult to control.   Usually a quartering upstream or side approach is best. If the surface of the water is not smooth, such as a riffle, the downstream method can be quite effective. As far as what other people think of your method, if it is legal, and you are not crowding or otherwise disturbing them, don’t worry about what they think. Tight Lines!!! George

Response:

_______ Are you sure you’re not a professional troller Mr. Hart because I think you know the subject of dabbling a dry fly downstream. Mr. G. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Watching ESPN2 recently I chanced across a young lady (seemingly well accomplished in the fly-fishing arts) guiding the show host on a snowy winter stream near Cooke City Montana.  She was fishing dry flys downstream. According to her "when the water is clear and the fish spook easily this prevents ""lining the fish"". Being a new student of the art, everything I read or listen to tells me dry flys Upstream, wet flys up or down stream and nymphing requires years of experience.  Now I wonder how far a trout is seeing upstream.  I have recently experienced "lining the fish" with a pod of three browns while fishing a streamer upstream.  The floating leader alone spooked the fish. Any thoughts on downstream dry fly fishing and range of sight for trout? As a side note: I have caught a couple of lesser fish when allowing the dry fly to float 20 to 30 feet behind me as I moved up stream in the hole.  I don’t consider this a method I wish to regularly adopt but peaks my curiosity about fish sight range. Wayne To fish is human…to release devine.

Response:

Wayne Hart: <<Wayne To fish is human…to release devine. Uh oh!  Glad I’m not gonna be around for awhile. Dave L.

Response:

Being a new student of the art, everything I read or listen to tells me dry flys Upstream, wet flys up or down stream and nymphing requires years of experience.  Now I wonder how far a trout is seeing upstream.  I have recently experienced "lining the fish" with a pod of three browns while fishing a streamer upstream.  The floating leader alone spooked the fish.

The library will help: the books of Vince Marinaro include up-to-date experiments on what fish can see and how far (studied since approx. 1875); Leonard Wright’s Fishing the Dry Fly as a Living Insect (about 1973) explains at length a method of fishing a dry caddis across and downstream, and the times when this produces better than other methods. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

Response:

Wayne:  I can’t add much to the series of informative replies already posted, but can share my experience that the hooking of trout when floating a dry downstream is trickier than with the upstream or across presentations.  I have always assumed that this is because when you strike, you are pulling the fly right out of the mouth.  When fishing upstream, a strike pulls the fly back into the side of the mouth.  Thus, my hooking rate declines when fishing downstream, even though I try to set the hook more softly. Mark Faulkner – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Being a new student of the art, everything I read or listen to tells me dry flys Upstream, wet flys up or down stream and nymphing requires years of experience.  Now I wonder how far a trout is seeing upstream.  I have recently experienced "lining the fish" with a pod of three browns while fishing a streamer upstream.  The floating leader alone spooked the fish. The library will help: the books of Vince Marinaro include up-to-date experiments on what fish can see and how far (studied since approx. 1875); Leonard Wright’s Fishing the Dry Fly as a Living Insect (about 1973) explains at length a method of fishing a dry caddis across and downstream, and the times when this produces better than other methods. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – She was fishing dry flys downstream. According to her "when the water is clear and the fish spook easily this prevents ""lining the fish"". Being a new student of the art, everything I read or listen to tells me dry flys Upstream, wet flys up or down stream and nymphing requires years of experience.  Now I wonder how far a trout is seeing upstream.  I have recently experienced "lining the fish" with a pod of three browns while fishing a streamer upstream.  The floating leader alone spooked the fish. Any thoughts on downstream dry fly fishing and range of sight for trout? As a side note: I have caught a couple of lesser fish when allowing the dry fly to float 20 to 30 feet behind me as I moved up stream in the hole.  I don’t consider this a method I wish to regularly adopt but peaks my curiosity about fish sight range.

Hi Wayne, Trout see best in front, and slightly above them.  They have binocular vision and can judge distances very well in about a 30

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Md and Va saltwater licenses are recipocle (sp) — bob D&B Marine http://www.tqci.net/~dbmarine 888-535-BOAT Big Gunpowder Falls River in Maryland has some very nice Browns and Rainbows.  Lots of catch and release stretches.  There is a good fly shop in Monkton I will be relocating to the Washington, DC area next month and I would love to have any fishing info for the area (including Chesapeake Bay).  Bait shops for advice, public fishing areas, tackle choices, where to get a fishing license for Virginia/Maryland (do I need both states and fresh and saltwater?), time of year to catch certain fish.  I’ll take anything related please respond via e-mail Barry

I think you will find this helpful… <http://www.gmu.edu/bios/bay/links.htm

Response:

Big Gunpowder Falls River in Maryland has some very nice Browns and Rainbows.  Lots of catch and release stretches.  There is a good fly shop in Monkton

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I will be relocating to the Washington, DC area next month and I would love to have any fishing info for the area (including Chesapeake Bay).  Bait shops for advice, public fishing areas, tackle choices, where to get a fishing license for Virginia/Maryland (do I need both states and fresh and saltwater?), time of year to catch certain fish.  I’ll take anything related please respond via e-mail Barry

Response:

Md and Va saltwater licenses are recipocle (sp) — bob D&B Marine http://www.tqci.net/~dbmarine 888-535-BOAT – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Big Gunpowder Falls River in Maryland has some very nice Browns and Rainbows.  Lots of catch and release stretches.  There is a good fly shop in Monkton I will be relocating to the Washington, DC area next month and I would love to have any fishing info for the area (including Chesapeake Bay).  Bait shops for advice, public fishing areas, tackle choices, where to get a fishing license for Virginia/Maryland (do I need both states and fresh and saltwater?), time of year to catch certain fish.  I’ll take anything related please respond via e-mail Barry

Response:

I will be relocating to the Washington, DC area next month and I would love to have any fishing info for the area (including Chesapeake Bay).  Bait shops for advice, public fishing areas, tackle choices, where to get a fishing license for Virginia/Maryland (do I need both states and fresh and saltwater?), time of year to catch certain fish.  I’ll take anything related please respond via e-mail Barry

Response:

Check out worldwideangler.com or chesapeakeangler.com different name same site. Good luck

I will be relocating to the Washington, DC area next month and I would love to have any fishing info for the area (including Chesapeake Bay).  Bait shops for advice, public fishing areas, tackle choices, where to get a fishing license for Virginia/Maryland (do I need both states and fresh and saltwater?), time of year to catch certain fish.  I’ll take anything related please respond via e-mail Barry — Flyfish NC                                                   Gordon Churchill http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Rapids/3853                                                                    

Response:

Question:

How about some Montana freemen, Tim? They’re coming to take you away, they’re coming to take you away, oh boy. Don B. FREEMEN? Aren’t those the guys that just got put in jail? Bronco

Jail? We don’t have jails anymore. They’re going to urban recreation centers. <g Don B.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How about some Montana freemen, Tim? They’re coming to take you away, they’re coming to take you away, oh boy. Don B. FREEMEN? Aren’t those the guys that just got put in jail? Bronco Jail? We don’t have jails anymore. They’re going to urban recreation centers. <g

That’s true and just think of how many Adams you could tie doing 5-10. TimW

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How about some Montana freemen, Tim? They’re coming to take you away, they’re coming to take you away, oh boy. Don B. FREEMEN? Aren’t those the guys that just got put in jail? Bronco Jail? We don’t have jails anymore. They’re going to urban recreation centers. <g That’s true and just think of how many Adams you could tie doing 5-10. TimW

The problem is making good hooks from spoons! Musconet

Response:

Just received Orvis’s gift and clothing catalog. There is an African American model on just about every other page. It may not be their fishing catalog, but it goes to show that they are not racist. Lets hope that this dispenses with this valuable but(now)tiresome thread that has occupied so much of the bandwidth on ROFF over the last few weeks.

Yeah…but I saw NO asians pal !  Damned if there wasn’t a SINGLE Aleut ! Can you beleive that ?!?!?  And Mongols…? Ha ! nowhere in sight… you know what, I saw no dwarves or midgets eithers… Orvis, those Eskimidgetmongolphobic bastards… TimW

Response:

Seriously…no midgets!!! God that makes me angry. I’m going to write Perk Perkins and give that bastard hell.

Response:

Just received Orvis’s gift and clothing catalog. There is an African American model on just about every other page. It may not be their fishing catalog, but it goes to show that they are not racist. Lets hope that this dispenses with this valuable but(now)tiresome thread that has occupied so much of the bandwidth on ROFF over the last few weeks.

Response:

writes: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  Oh Well….. Just received Orvis’s gift and clothing catalog. There is an African American model on just about every other page. It may not be their fishing catalog, but it goes to show that they are not racist. Lets hope that this dispenses with this valuable but(now)tiresome thread that has occupied so much of the bandwidth on ROFF over the last few weeks. Yeah…but I saw NO asians pal !  Damned if there wasn’t a SINGLE Aleut ! Can you beleive that ?!?!?  And Mongols…? Ha ! nowhere in sight… you know what, I saw no dwarves or midgets eithers… Orvis, those Eskimidgetmongolphobic bastards… TimW

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Just received Orvis’s gift and clothing catalog. There is an African American model on just about every other page. It may not be their fishing catalog, but it goes to show that they are not racist. Lets hope that this dispenses with this valuable but(now)tiresome thread that has occupied so much of the bandwidth on ROFF over the last few weeks.

I totally agree!  I used to live near Manchester, VT and got to know many of the Orvis people (I also did some of the catalog photography). They’re nice people and _not_ racist, like most people aren’t. Jim Benenson Los Alamos, NM "To save your rivers, save your mountains" Emperor Yu of China, circa 1600 BC

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Just received Orvis’s gift and clothing catalog. There is an African American model on just about every other page. It may not be their fishing catalog, but it goes to show that they are not racist. Lets hope that this dispenses with this valuable but(now)tiresome thread that has occupied so much of the bandwidth on ROFF over the last few weeks.

Maybe it also shows that they read r.o.f.f…. — Richard W. (Dick) Lander; sportsman, Macintosh devotee, proponent of personal liberty. *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *

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Just received Orvis’s gift and clothing catalog. There is an African American model on just about every other page. It may not be their fishing catalog, but it goes to show that they are not racist. Lets hope that this dispenses with this valuable but(now)tiresome thread that has occupied so much of the bandwidth on ROFF over the last few weeks.

AMEN!!!       Gene

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writes: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just received Orvis’s gift and clothing catalog. There is an African American model on just about every other page. It may not be their fishing catalog, but it goes to show that they are not racist. Lets hope that this dispenses with this valuable but(now)tiresome thread that has occupied so much of the bandwidth on ROFF over the last few weeks. Yeah…but I saw NO asians pal !  Damned if there wasn’t a SINGLE Aleut ! Can you beleive that ?!?!?  And Mongols…? Ha ! nowhere in sight… you know what, I saw no dwarves or midgets eithers… Orvis, those Eskimidgetmongolphobic bastards… TimW

How about some Montana freemen, Tim? They’re coming to take you away, they’re coming to take you away, oh boy. Don B.

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This is my first post to a newsgroup, so bear with me if I blunder. I attempted, with little success, to tie a Dark Hendrickson Nymph this evening.  All aspects of tying the fly are understandable, and I am able to accomplish them except dubbing.  Is this a concept with which most beginners (like myself) have trouble? Specifically, I cannot get the Muskrat fur to "adhere" to the thread.  I use dubbing wax and dab the fur onto it, but it never gets thick enough to tighten into something that will form the body/thorax. Can someone provide some much-needed advice/hints on how I can make this happen? Thanks in advance…

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. . . Specifically, I cannot get the Muskrat fur to "adhere" to the thread.  I use dubbing wax and dab the fur onto it, but it never gets thick enough to tighten into something that will form the body/thorax.

There are several different methods, described in books by Eric Leiser, Poul Jorgensen, Peter Gathercole etc. e.g. single thread or double loop (chenille) depending on factors like your thread (silk or nylon or polyester) and aims:  so feel free to experiment, if you cannot get to the library.   E.g. you can sprinkle cut fur on a clean cloth on your knee, take a separate piece of waxed thread, and roll it on the fur until it picks up a smooth "sausage" of dubbing.  If your dubbing goes onto the nymph but fails to stay on, counter-winding with self-coloured ribbing may be all you need. Some people tie successfully without ever using wax, especially wets because they should sink, not float.  Saliva holds many furs well enough to many threads. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -This is my first post to a newsgroup, so bear with me if I blunder. I attempted, with little success, to tie a Dark Hendrickson Nymph this evening.  All aspects of tying the fly are understandable, and I am able to accomplish them except dubbing.  Is this a concept with which most beginners (like myself) have trouble? Specifically, I cannot get the Muskrat fur to "adhere" to the thread. I use dubbing wax and dab the fur onto it, but it never gets thick enough to tighten into something that will form the body/thorax. Can someone provide some much-needed advice/hints on how I can make this happen? Thanks in advance…

  Try spinning the dubbing onto the thread.  Dabbing creates a spikey dubbed body.  Try this – dab the fur onto the waxed thread, and pinch the dubbing between your forefinger and thumb and spin the fur onto the line.  Be careful to spin in one direction only.  this should create a nicely formed "noodle" which you then wind on. You can also form the "noodle" loosely, before dabbing.  lay out the fur (or better a mixture of several colors layered, then pinch it onto the thread, and wind on. This gives you a nicely mottled thorax. good luck,

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Specifically, I cannot get the Muskrat fur to "adhere" to the thread.  I use dubbing wax and dab the fur onto it, but it never gets thick enough to tighten into something that will form the body/thorax.

Gary, In addition to the suggestions made by J. J. Gordon, you might want to try using a dubbing loop:  Form a loop of thread that is several inches long at the rear of the fly.  Wind the bobbin to the front of the fly where the dubbing will end.  Hang a dubbing twister on the end of the loop.  I made a simple dubbling twister using a couple of paper clips and a bell sinker–it’s essentially a hook of wire with a weight.  Wax the loop and place the dubbing in the loop.  Spin the twister until the dubbing has formed a chenille-like strand of the desired tightness.  If you "twang" the thread as you are twisting it, hair-type dubbing will tend to stand out more, making a more "spiky" body.  Then just wind the loop onto the hook like chenille and tie it off. I’ve found loops to be easier to handle than the single thread methods. Good luck! –Stephen Wong P.S. You might want to check out the flytying newsgroup: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly.tying.

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How about some Montana freemen, Tim? They’re coming to take you away, they’re coming to take you away, oh boy. Don B. FREEMEN? Aren’t those the guys that just got put in jail? Bronco

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Geecee, Dubbing’s a bitch for beginners. Just keep at it, soon you will be able to do it without wax. Suggestion: after dubbing onto a single thread, loop back to the body of the hook. Then twist the bottom of the newly formed loop. That tends to hold the dubbing on the thread snugly. Bronco

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. . . Specifically, I cannot get the Muskrat fur to "adhere" to the thread.  I use dubbing wax and dab the fur onto it, but it never gets thick enough to tighten into something that will form the body/thorax.

I have never used wax… well, except to experiment. I just pull off the bits of muskrat and make certain I didn’t also pull off some hide . Then, while holding it between my index finger and thumb, I roll it around the thread. You can add as much or as little as you want and there is no waste. If you roll it loosely, it sticks out and is nice and buggy looking. If you roll it tightly, it looks more like a dry fly dubbing job. Maybe I am being too vague about my technique… I pull the hairs off with the standard thumb and forefinger method any child would employ. Grab some and pull. Then I kind of slide the tying thread into the hairs (parallel to the hairs) and start to roll my fingers as though I was trying to twist the thread one way, then the other. I work my fingers up and down the thread to evenly distribute the hair quantity and this also allows me to taper the body quite well. I can adjust the weight of the bug by changing how much hair I put on at a time. Less hair means more thread and more wraps, more weight and more strength to the finished fly but the body is also harder when the fish bites. Opinions may fly rampant here but the fish never seem to comment on it one way or the other. Hope this helps, David Buschhorn Known on IRC as "Dubbing"

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writes: Can someone provide some much-needed advice/hints on how I can make this happen?

    Everybody’s right and nobody’s wrong on this.  I don’t think any two tyers do this exactly the same way.  I prefer the single thread to the loop for most patterns, but that’s me.  I’m also not as good or consistent as I may sound in postings.  My hint: put a big hook in the vise and work on dubbing for an hour without trying to tie a fly.  Try different threads, waxes, furs, and methods.  Your way will come to you.  In the long run it will save you time and frustration.  Also, join us on ROFFT — good stuff every day, all are welcome.   –Roger

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In addition to the other methods you may want to look at the thread you are using and the way you apply the wax. If you are using a pre-waxed thread there is no need to add wax to the thread. Instead put the wax on your fingers. Most of the times that I have seen people having problems with dubbing it has been fixed by keeping the fingers dry a bit of low tack wax works well.

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Question:

: What is the proper method for fishing the San Juan Worm? Put a real worm on the hook of the San Juan Worm for weighting.  Sink it deep.  If that fails to catch fish, dynamite always works. Relax…just a joke. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Assistant professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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What is the proper method for fishing the San Juan Worm? Floating line, sink tip, splitshot?

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Hi! I can tell you what the our guide on the San Juan told us about rigging for that river: At your floating flyline attach about a 6" section of rad Amensia in the middle of which you’ve attached a yarn strike indicator.  The guides prefer black poly yarn and the red Amnesia enables you to see which way your leader is drifting with respect to your flyline (it should make a 90 degree bend straight down at the indicator). Then attach 9′ of level 4X leader.  This is to provide the minimum resistance to the water and enbable the fly to sink as quickly as possible.  12"-18" above the end of the leader attach a size BB split shot.  Attach the San Juan Worm ( Glo bug, Wooley worm, etc) and then add another 12" segement tied to the ey of the fly.  (4X works, though I prefer 5X ) On the end of that tippet, put a size 20 or smaller Chirominid, Desert Storm, WD40, etc type nymph.  The idea here is that if the trout is attracted to, but doesn’t take the larger San Juan Worm, then maybe it will take the smaller nymph.  This was definitely true last week, where either fly by themselves wouldn’t work, but in combination, the trout was taking the smaller fly the majority of the time. These settings are for the San Juan river which has 4′-10′ deep holes and a moderate current.  I found that when trying to fish the very head of the pool, where the trout were coming up to pick of the incoming food, that I had to move the indicator closer to the the slip shot to get more reliable strike detection.  The rig is not the most elegant in the world to cast, but it does work.  I also cheated a little and put a 3 foot 3X "butt" section in place of the first 3 feet of the 4X leader to help it turn over when casting.  This is not an issue when you’re in a drift boat. Good luck! Stephen Wong – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What is the proper method for fishing the San Juan Worm? Floating line, sink tip, splitshot?

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On the end of that tippet, put a size 20 or smaller Chirominid, Desert Storm, WD40, etc type nymph.  The idea here is that if the trout is attracted to, but doesn’t take the larger San Juan Worm, then maybe it will take the smaller nymph.  This was definitely true last week, where either fly by themselves wouldn’t work, but in combination, the trout was taking the smaller fly the majority of the time.

Interesting.  I too use a varitation on the same strategy, with an attractor/non-attractor combination.  I’ll compliment the color of one fly with the other.  For example with a big orange scud I might use a tiny WD40 for the dropper.  On the other hand, if I’m fishing a red San Juan worm, I’ll choose an olive-colored scud for the dropper. — -Wayne Trzyna

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Question:

I have updated my homepages with more fly patterns, info about the 20th Canadian Fly Fishing Forum, and links to TU and the Credit Valley Conservation Authority.  Have fun. Bob Lundy IWFFC Mississauga, ON

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I have updated my homepages with more fly patterns, info about the 20th Canadian Fly Fishing Forum, and links to TU and the Credit Valley Conservation Authority.  Have fun. Bob Lundy IWFFC Mississauga, ON

brendan

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I have updated my homepages with more fly patterns, info about the 20th Canadian Fly Fishing Forum, and links to TU and the Credit Valley Conservation Authority.  Have fun. Bob Lundy IWFFC Mississauga, ON

Sounds great, I’d like to visit. What is the URL? I rented a table at the IWFFC convention a few years ago and enjoyed meeting everyone. Anne Harnack http://home.earthlink.net/~ecoedit/flyprints.htm

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I have updated my homepages with more fly patterns, info about the 20th Canadian Fly Fishing Forum, and links to TU and the Credit Valley Conservation Authority.  Have fun. Bob Lundy IWFFC Mississauga, ON

Bob: What is your site’s address? Stefan M. http://rampages.onramp.net/~smarc

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Ever have one of those days when you find out later you’ve had just too much coffee?  I clearly left off my URL on an earlier post:    http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rlundy/ Sorry about that… Bob Lundy IWFFC Mississauga, ON

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Question:

I’ve heard Montauk State Park is located on the headwaters of the Current River and has access to trout flyfishing area.  Looking for more info from someone who knows this area.  I’m thinking of going there in May. Regards to all, Robert

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Try: http://www.agron.missouri.edu/flyfishing/ John Nesselrode Shawnee, KS

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You’re right. Montauk is the head of the current river, and offers considerable amount of trout water. But it’s going to be fairly crowded, even on the stretch of flies-only water. –

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I’ve heard Montauk State Park is located on the headwaters of the Current River and has access to trout flyfishing area.  Looking for more info from someone who knows this area.  I’m thinking of going there in May. Regards to all, Robert

Go! The fishing in the park is mostly corn etc, yet there are some sections for flies only. Good if you want to go fishmarket fishing. Nice place. Great place for kids. The park has a couple of places for catch and release fishing, a small stream and a lake. Current river itself is beautiful. There are a couple of access points just downstream of the park. (get a map and a sturdy vehicle) "Baptist Camp" is the one I usually go to and fish up and down stream. I have had some great days upstream under the canopy of trees. Generally it’s best to find a guide and float the river (canoe) if you want to get the most out of it due to somewhat limited access due to purposeful design. The canoe is used mainly for transportation to wade spots, although I have caught a few from the boat. I have never caught any really large fish on the Current, but normally catch quite a few in the 14 to 25 category. I used a guy by the name of Tom Shipley. Don’t know his wherebouts these days. Maybe you will get some names on this posting. Kevin Williams

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Question:

I’m new to fly fishing and planning to be in Yosemetie national park in the end of august.Does anyone know where I should go for good fishing? How about any rules or regulations I should be aware of? I also hope to do

Best fishing at end of August will be in the many backcountry lakes. Plenty of water this year, most high lakes will not thaw until August. Many secluded areas, but they entail a little extra work to reach. Those areas in North Boundry Country can be quiet and some along east side.  Tuolumne Meadows is a good base.  Campground reservations call 800 365 2267.  Permits required for backcountry overnight trips, 50% on a first come bases, 50% in advance (March-May31).  Great hikes and fishing within 3-7 miles. Try the following flies: Timberline Emerger, Stimulators,  Chironomid Pupas, Black Matuka, Mini Leech, Bright Butt Woolly Worm.  Rainbows, brooks, browns, and golden trout, up to 14 inches, most smaller. Goldens , if you haven’t seen them, they are the most beautiful in the world.  I’ll be fishing this country myself early August.  Give me a Randall Kaufmann

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: I’m new to fly fishing and planning to be in Yosemetie national park in : the end of august.Does anyone know where I should go for good fishing? How : about any rules or regulations I should be aware of? I also hope to do : Best fishing at end of August will be in the many backcountry lakes. : Plenty of water this year, most high lakes will not thaw until August. : Many secluded areas, but they entail a little extra work to reach. : Those areas in North Boundry Country can be quiet and some along east : side.  Tuolumne Meadows is a good base.  Campground reservations call : 800 365 2267.  Permits required for backcountry overnight trips, 50% : on a first come bases, 50% in advance (March-May31).  Great hikes and : fishing within 3-7 miles. : Randall Kaufmann Randy and Andy, I will be in the Yosemite backcountry working at the Vogelsang highcamp.  Friends of mine who have worked there in the past say there are some really nice lakes with excellent fishing contrary to the fishing in the valley.  Also, my spies say there is a lake up there that has some beautiful cutthroats.  Most of these lake are sort secret gems tucked away in the cover of the mountains. I would be happy to talk with anyone interested in the Yosemite backcountry.  C&R only.  Maybe we can go fishing together.  I’ll be up there all summer long until middle September. BTW, Mike Tucker, if you are reading this.  Thankyou for the great outfit you set me up with.  It really is the perfect Sierra backcountry trout setup.  Another VERY satisfied customer of Grizzly Creek Trading Company am I.   Regards, George Chan — *George M. Chan                         * "Yea, but bacon tastes good,  * *                                       *                               *

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I’m new to fly fishing and planning to be in Yosemetie national park in the end of august.Does anyone know where I should go for good fishing? How about any rules or regulations I should be aware of? I also hope to do

I was in Yosemite last August and had mixed feelings.  The senery is spectacular, but the throngs of crowds are hard to take.  I felt like I was still in the city, the only difference, we were robbed by bears instead of people (I think I’d prefer people, more predictable).  Anyway, fishing in that area is tough due to a lack of water in the late summer.  Don’t even think about fishing in the Valley, no water, too many people and probably very few fish. We did manage to fish in the east end of the park.  There are fewer people in that area.  There is a big lake near the pass, just east of the park boundry (can’t rember the name) with good fishing from the bank all around it.  There is also a tiny creek that runs along the road a few miles west of the lake.  We had a blast catching tiny Golden Trout.  They were only about 6" to 8" long but were really hard to fool. Happy Trouting!

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I’m new to fly fishing and planning to be in Yosemetie national park in the end of august.Does anyone know where I should go for good fishing? How about any rules or regulations I should be aware of? I also hope to do

My advice is to avoid Yosemite Valley in the Summer.  It’s a zoo. There are many other beautiful but lower-key areas of the Sierra Nevada. While I haven’t been there in 5 or 6 years, the Devil’s Postpile/Red’s Meadow area east of Yosemite used to be a less crowded alternative, and the scenery is spectacular.  

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I’m new to fly fishing and planning to be in Yosemetie national park in the end of august.Does anyone know where I should go for good fishing? How about any rules or regulations I should be aware of? I also hope to do

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