Question:

All in all, a nice weekend; only 12 months until the next one. Jack will be here, as always, probably Randall Kauffman too, and a large number of flyfishing books from Australia for the collection.

  Thanks for the info.  Let us know the date of next year’s event. Snoop — —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

This Friday and Saturday, Jack Dennis and Mike Lawson will be at the University of Wyoming (in Laramie, about 50 miles east of Cheyenne).

  Oh, no.  They moved Laramie?  I really liked the old location:)   Boy, that sounds like a good time.  If I wasn’t all traveled out, I’d go. Also, the ice is going off.  Time to do some local fishing, finally. Snoop — —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

i think you mean west of cheyenne….. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This Friday and Saturday, Jack Dennis and Mike Lawson will be at the University of Wyoming (in Laramie, about 50 miles east of Cheyenne).

Response:

  Oh, no.  They moved Laramie?  I really liked the old location:)   Boy, that sounds like a good time.

    Drag your sorry ass down; me and Willi are going.

Response:

    Drag your sorry ass down; me and Willi are going.

  Well, that’s just not fair.  The two guys I know who least need any education in the fly fishing field get to go and the guy who could really benefit has a severe case of jet lag and there’s no way I could have made it to Laramie.   Man, I’m beat.  On March 6th & 7th, I was on the Bighorn.  On the 8th, I drove home to Buffalo, changed gear and drove to Denver so I could be airborne to Orlando on Sat. am.  I went with my retired pilot friends to the EAA fly in at Lakeland.  I got to fly first class both ways and got to drink some first class gin & tonics.  (I’m back on the wagon, now.)  I went from 10 degrees on the ‘horn to 85 degrees with big time humidity in Fla.  How the heck to folks live down there?   The fishing on the Bighorn was really slow.  Everyone caught some fish on Wed. when we floated from mile 3 to Bighorn.  No surface action and the fly rod guides didn’t stay thawed out to about 2:00 pm.  We stayed at Cottonwood and noticed the place was packed.  We decided to float the lower river, Bighorn to Mallard, in the hopes there wouldn’t be a crowd.  That panned out.  But, there were no fish caught by the 5 in our group.  We’d never fished that stretch so it was interesting to see some new country.  There was a lot of "fishy" looking water and the water was pretty clear.  There are some pretty good fishermen in our group so I was very surprised that there were no fish caught.  I guess the buys did pretty good on Friday when they fished from afterbay to mile 3 but the river was very crowded.   Has anyone heard of any talk about a pretty heavy fish kill on the ‘horn?  A couple of months ago, we saw a large number of dead fish on the bottom.  There’s been some talk of last years low flows impacting the fish population.   The stream in town is ice free and I’m going out this afternoon to see if any local lakes have opened up.  Life is good:) Snoop — —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

This Friday and Saturday, Jack Dennis and Mike Lawson will be at the University of Wyoming (in Laramie, about 50 miles east of Cheyenne).

~^beancounter~^ added: i think you mean west of cheyenne…..

the wind can blow pretty hard up here…. — Rusty Hook Laramie, Wyoming

Response:

This Friday and Saturday, Jack Dennis and Mike Lawson will be at the University of Wyoming (in Laramie, about 50 miles east of Cheyenne).

  So tell us about the seminar. Snoop — —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

What is the TITLE of this tape and who is selling it I wonder? Does anyone know? George – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That streamer footage is awesome. Saw it in Wichita in Feb. This Friday and Saturday, Jack Dennis and Mike Lawson will be at the University of Wyoming (in Laramie, about 50 miles east of Cheyenne).   So tell us about the seminar. Snoop Friday was a combination of casting demos, tying demos, and presentations on fishing tactics. All of the tying demos took place in the student union lobby; Jack Dennis would tie for an hour, then Mike Lawson for another hour and so on. While one was in the lobby tying flies, the other would either be outside casting or else upstairs giving a fishing seminar. Saturday morning was more of the same. The most memorable parts for me were Jack’s seminar on streamer fishing (consisting largely of video footage of trout eating mice, frogs, and baitfish. gotta get a copy of that.), and getting enough pointers from Lawson on tying the no-hackle to actually start tying them myself. The Colorado Delegation arrived too late for the streamer video, but just in time for the panel discussion on instream flows. Not as entertaining as watching trout eat live mice, but still very worthwhile. The Saturday night banquet was very nice. Good food, good company, and lots of raffle loot. Jack and Mike hosted an excellent presentation on fly fishing literature to dedicate the establishment of the Gary LaFontaine Book Collection at UW’s Centennial Museum. This collection will complement the Toppan Collection, which has been a feature of every symposium we’ve held, and one of Gary LaFontaine’s favorite attractions during his visits here. The new collection is off to a good start, with donations from Jack Dennis, Stan Bradshaw, John Gierach, and many others. Finally, it was time to go home, so we all did. The next morning the organizers had planned (as usual) to go on a float trip to celebrate, but weather intervened and Sunday mornings festivities consisted of an early morning drive down a long narrow road, standing around in a parking lot talking about how windy it was today and where we planned to fish later in the season, followed by a midday trip back home on that same road, only with stronger crosswinds. All in all, a nice weekend; only 12 months until the next one. Jack will be here, as always, probably Randall Kauffman too, and a large number of flyfishing books from Australia for the collection. — Rusty Hook Laramie, Wyoming

Response:

That streamer footage is awesome. Saw it in Wichita in Feb. What is the TITLE of this tape and who is selling it I wonder? Does anyone know?

It’s something of his own that Jack had, and as much as he’d like to incorporate it into a complete video, one of the key people involved in making it is hard to locate. Until he can get this person’s permission to borrow the footage for a new video (on streamer fishing), there won’t be one. I wouldn’t say never, but I would say to be patient and watch for it. Until then, if you’re at any sports show where Jack is doing a seminar on streamer fishing, go to it and you’ll probably see the footage. — Rusty Hook Laramie, Wyoming

Response:

    So tell us about the seminar.     I picked Willi up at the Rancho de Peros at about eleven and we headed north, soothed by the soundtrack to "Oh Brother Where Art Thou" (Willi said he had to get used to that kind of music because he’s soon going to be sharing living accommodations with a bunch of banjo pickin’ hillbillies), we arrived at the UW campus just as some famous people were breaking for lunch. The afternoon was spent at a symposium where more famous people talked about progressive water right laws like we’ll NEVER see in Colorado, but before you knew it, it was about beer-thirty, so Willi and I headed downtown and killed a little time before the banquet. The banquet was very nice, the food was excellent and Rusty’s chapter even threw in a host bar (my chapter would be in the red if they ever did anything as foolhardy), I spent an hour juggling free booze while trying not to look too interested in the silent auction painting I was determined to take home. After dinner Jack Dennis and Mike Lawson gave a very touching slide show, which dedicated the Gary Lafontaine library collection. I won a bunch of cool junk I have no use for at the raffle, so I’ll probably send some of it with Willi to the Penn’s Clave. Enjoyed a great Fuente on the drive home.

Response:

    So tell us about the seminar.     I picked Willi up at the Rancho de Peros at about eleven and we headed north, soothed by the soundtrack to "Oh Brother Where Art Thou" (Willi said he had to get used to that kind of music because he’s soon going to be sharing living accommodations with a bunch of banjo pickin’ hillbillies)

That’s Charlie’s joke, not mine! Willi

Response:

    So tell us about the seminar.     I picked Willi up at the Rancho de Peros at about eleven and we headed north, soothed by the soundtrack to "Oh Brother Where Art Thou" (Willi said he had to get used to that kind of music because he’s soon going to be sharing living accommodations with a bunch of banjo pickin’ hillbillies),

jeff can’t play da ‘jo worth sheet. only din tom picks iz heez nose. no worry willi, afta a few swigs of the mountain brew, ya ain’t gonna hear the music…. gusto..

Response:

Clave. Enjoyed a great Fuente on the drive home.

Just took delivery from London of a dozen Opus X’s, and a box of Romeo and Julietta’s. Came right through customs marked "cigars". Now if I just had a damn trip to a stream to smoke a few.

Response:

Just took delivery from London of a dozen Opus X’s, and a box of Romeo and Julietta’s. Came right through customs marked "cigars". Now if I just had a damn trip to a stream to smoke a few.

  I’ll bet Charlie and I could fix you up with more streams than you could imagine.  That is, of course, as long as you bring along your latest shipment:) What about it Charlie?  Wanna split some X’s and R&J’s? Snoop — —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

  I’ll bet Charlie and I could fix you up with more streams than you could imagine.  That is, of course, as long as you bring along your latest shipment:)

Perhaps you might better explain "fix you up". Where I come from it means you are either about to have a blind date with the ugliest girl in the county or you had better not bend over without looking back first. But ifin I can get out of a fundraising committment I have this weekend by just writing a check instead, then some of them ceegars should be parked on the South Platte this weekend. I think I might make the Penns thingie for a couple of days at least and I need a little practice, if only I can make sure I can get the fly onto the water. Wayne

Response:

Perhaps you might better explain "fix you up". Where I come from it means you are either about to have a blind date with the ugliest girl in the county or you had better not bend over without looking back first.

  She wouldn’t be that ugly.  Trust us. But ifin I can get out of a fundraising committment I have this weekend by just writing a check instead, then some of them ceegars should be parked on the South Platte this weekend. I think I might make the Penns thingie for a couple of days at least and I need a little practice, if only I can make sure I can get the fly onto the water.

  Ummm.  South Platte is a long way for me to go to fish or smoke a cigar.  I guess I’ll just have to stay home and smoke one or two of my maduro Double Chateau Fuente’s:) Snoop — —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

This Friday and Saturday, Jack Dennis and Mike Lawson will be at the University of Wyoming (in Laramie, about 50 miles east of Cheyenne).   So tell us about the seminar. Snoop

Friday was a combination of casting demos, tying demos, and presentations on fishing tactics. All of the tying demos took place in the student union lobby; Jack Dennis would tie for an hour, then Mike Lawson for another hour and so on. While one was in the lobby tying flies, the other would either be outside casting or else upstairs giving a fishing seminar. Saturday morning was more of the same. The most memorable parts for me were Jack’s seminar on streamer fishing (consisting largely of video footage of trout eating mice, frogs, and baitfish. gotta get a copy of that.), and getting enough pointers from Lawson on tying the no-hackle to actually start tying them myself. The Colorado Delegation arrived too late for the streamer video, but just in time for the panel discussion on instream flows. Not as entertaining as watching trout eat live mice, but still very worthwhile. The Saturday night banquet was very nice. Good food, good company, and lots of raffle loot. Jack and Mike hosted an excellent presentation on fly fishing literature to dedicate the establishment of the Gary LaFontaine Book Collection at UW’s Centennial Museum. This collection will complement the Toppan Collection, which has been a feature of every symposium we’ve held, and one of Gary LaFontaine’s favorite attractions during his visits here. The new collection is off to a good start, with donations from Jack Dennis, Stan Bradshaw, John Gierach, and many others. Finally, it was time to go home, so we all did. The next morning the organizers had planned (as usual) to go on a float trip to celebrate, but weather intervened and Sunday mornings festivities consisted of an early morning drive down a long narrow road, standing around in a parking lot talking about how windy it was today and where we planned to fish later in the season, followed by a midday trip back home on that same road, only with stronger crosswinds. All in all, a nice weekend; only 12 months until the next one. Jack will be here, as always, probably Randall Kauffman too, and a large number of flyfishing books from Australia for the collection. — Rusty Hook Laramie, Wyoming

Response:

That streamer footage is awesome. Saw it in Wichita in Feb.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This Friday and Saturday, Jack Dennis and Mike Lawson will be at the University of Wyoming (in Laramie, about 50 miles east of Cheyenne).   So tell us about the seminar. Snoop Friday was a combination of casting demos, tying demos, and presentations on fishing tactics. All of the tying demos took place in the student union lobby; Jack Dennis would tie for an hour, then Mike Lawson for another hour and so on. While one was in the lobby tying flies, the other would either be outside casting or else upstairs giving a fishing seminar. Saturday morning was more of the same. The most memorable parts for me were Jack’s seminar on streamer fishing (consisting largely of video footage of trout eating mice, frogs, and baitfish. gotta get a copy of that.), and getting enough pointers from Lawson on tying the no-hackle to actually start tying them myself. The Colorado Delegation arrived too late for the streamer video, but just in time for the panel discussion on instream flows. Not as entertaining as watching trout eat live mice, but still very worthwhile. The Saturday night banquet was very nice. Good food, good company, and lots of raffle loot. Jack and Mike hosted an excellent presentation on fly fishing literature to dedicate the establishment of the Gary LaFontaine Book Collection at UW’s Centennial Museum. This collection will complement the Toppan Collection, which has been a feature of every symposium we’ve held, and one of Gary LaFontaine’s favorite attractions during his visits here. The new collection is off to a good start, with donations from Jack Dennis, Stan Bradshaw, John Gierach, and many others. Finally, it was time to go home, so we all did. The next morning the organizers had planned (as usual) to go on a float trip to celebrate, but weather intervened and Sunday mornings festivities consisted of an early morning drive down a long narrow road, standing around in a parking lot talking about how windy it was today and where we planned to fish later in the season, followed by a midday trip back home on that same road, only with stronger crosswinds. All in all, a nice weekend; only 12 months until the next one. Jack will be here, as always, probably Randall Kauffman too, and a large number of flyfishing books from Australia for the collection. — Rusty Hook Laramie, Wyoming

Response:

This Friday and Saturday, Jack Dennis and Mike Lawson will be at the University of Wyoming (in Laramie, about 50 miles east of Cheyenne). There will be tying and casting demos, along with other presentations on both fishing and conservation issues. There is a banquet and raffle on Saturday night ($20 per person); everything else is free. Things get started at 9AM both days, and all events will take place in the Wyoming Student Union, except for a reception on Friday at the Toppan Angling Books Collection, which will take place at the American Heritage Center. For further information call the Wyoming Union Ticket Office at 307-766-3160, or contact me by email (after de-munging the addy. This event is sponsored by the University Flycasters and the Wyoming Student Chapter of the American Fisheries Society. This is the seventh one of these we’ve done, and they’re always a good time. Make it if you can. — Rusty Hook Laramie, Wyoming

Response:

Question:

You left off the part about not being able to go fishing tomrrow Paul

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We have this office.  The biggest branch we have.  It has an NT server with a Raid 5 array and a duplex..  The container keeps getting "lost."  We reloaded the OS two weeks ago.  We put in the manufacturer’s monitoring software.  It went ppffffffth.  The manufacturer says, "Sorry, it can’t be uninstalled."  We have to replace the OS again.  I am not happy.  Replaced it this morning. Also packed the steelhead stuff. Went out to the parking lot for tools.  Dropped the tailgate and my school ring made a funny noise against the metal of the tailgate.   No stone.  I am not happy.  I search high and low, no stone.  Even took the server apart again, looking for it.  No stone.  I am sad. After, I went to the Credit River.  The winds were very high, the water was very high, fast and dirty.  I didn’t catch squat. I really not happy.   Went to the liquor store and bought a distiller’s edition 1984 Cragganmore speysider. Not so sad anymore. Will be tomorrow. Peter

Response:

You left off the part about not being able to go fishing tomrrow Paul

well, that and the Salmon River weather was the topper. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://members.home.net/pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

The cat thought the fly was some sort of new plaything. She grabbed

it hooked herself and took off running OWW!!My mother in law caught the family dog one day,while on her way fishing back home n Louisiana.Dumb dog saw the line dangling from the rod over her shoulder,and hooked herself TWICE!!!My wife said that was the dumbest hunting dog they ever had.        Sorry bout your day btw,it always sucks when rotten stuff like that happens.Bout the best you can do is see that it could have been worse.My wifes a nurse,I’m a printer for a bank.I come home with stories of highstrung rude investment bankers,and she tells me about a patient that coded and died after 40 minutes of revival attempts.So I have a constant source of proof that it can always be worse.

Response:

"So I have a constant source of proof that it can always be worse." I know. A few years ago my daughter died from RSV (a respiratory virus). My wife and I soon divorced though not a messy one. I would send a picture but this isn’t a binary group. I did learn to fly fish though in an effort to cope with Ashlynn’s death. Now I am back in school about to complete my associates in eletrical technology and I am thinking of moving to Idaho to start my electrical apprentice. Better flyfishing there then in Alabama. I wish everyone all the best in life Michael

Response:

…well, if you can talk crappy, i can talk bass… yesterday, was the maiden voyage of the new gheenoe in search of ol bucketmouth.           for several months, i’ve been looking for a good fishing boat i could paddle and handle alone, but that was more stable than a canoe and offered more room than a kayak. i wanted a gheenoe, but couldn’t find one at any of the boat places i had visited in the area.  harley gheen designed the boat in the early 70s, and they have an excellent reputation as a shallow draft, easy paddling (though not as easy as a canoe), stable fishing boat. They are made in titusville, florida, and are used in the florida flats for bone and tarpon fishing, in the inland waterways, and on lakes and canals. the 15′ 4" model accomodates 2 very comfortably, with plenty of room for all the necessities.  it has a small squared stern that will hold up to a 9 hp outboard.  while not exactly light at 120 pounds, i can lift and slide it into the back of my truck, and i can drag it to the canals and waters i like to fish for bass. the draft of only 3-4" is a real asset too.         anyway, while up in windsor, nc on business, i planned a short diversion to the cashie river for an hour of shad fishing from the shore. on the way to the river, i saw them – gheenoes sitting like daffodils in the yard of a boat and tackle dealership on the cashie. 20 minutes later, the gheenoe was loaded in my truck bed and my weekend was shaping up.           on saturday, me and charlie adams headed for hyde county.  we were in the impoundment by 9 am and fished until dark.  the gheenoe is a fantastic boat for paddling in the shallows where the bass hang out, and it will move along at a good clip in the deeper water with two average paddlers. we took our fly rods along just in case the anticipated warm weather stimulated some top water bugz action. charlie spent a while standing up with his flyrod tossing bugz without success… but, the test ride proved the gheenoe to be an ideal flyfishing platform and a nice, stable ride.  i recommend it as a very versatile boat.   …and peter, it’s a good boat for a day of crappie too… jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <snipped the canuck’s lament ad lame excuse for gettin tipsy)

Response:

We have 8< Peter

stiff upper lip and all that ‘ole chap! –waldo…. wishin peter a big fish…pdq.

Response:

I’ll trade ya for replacing the shower stall I promised my wife I’d do tomorrow instead of goin’ steelheadin’….  ;-)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We have this office.  The biggest branch we have.  It has an NT server with a Raid 5 array and a duplex..  The container keeps getting "lost."  We reloaded the OS two weeks ago.  We put in the manufacturer’s monitoring software.  It went ppffffffth.  The manufacturer says, "Sorry, it can’t be uninstalled."  We have to replace the OS again.  I am not happy.  Replaced it this morning. Also packed the steelhead stuff. Went out to the parking lot for tools.  Dropped the tailgate and my school ring made a funny noise against the metal of the tailgate.   No stone.  I am not happy.  I search high and low, no stone.  Even took the server apart again, looking for it.  No stone.  I am sad. After, I went to the Credit River.  The winds were very high, the water was very high, fast and dirty.  I didn’t catch squat. I really not happy.   Went to the liquor store and bought a distiller’s edition 1984 Cragganmore speysider. Not so sad anymore. Will be tomorrow. Peter

Response:

Oh been there, I guess we all have. Let me share a story with you about a crappy day I had about a year ago. I caught a cat. I bought a StCroix UFT906 rod and hadn’t had it about week when I was practicing my casting a bit in the front yard. Then set the rod against the side of my car. I had a little fly of some sort on there (should have removed it before practicing in the yard). Well the tippett and fly was dangling as I was getting ready to put it up. The cat thought the fly was some sort of new plaything. She grabbed it hooked herself and took off running through my carport. My new 9 foot rod with my Ross Canyon reel went through a 3 foot door. All I saw was the rod come apart. I guess it could have been worse, the only part of the rod that was actually broke the end piece (littlest). Now instead of a 9′ rod it became a 8′6 rod. I did get the piece replaced so its back to 9′. Couple of scratches on the Ross:-( Hang in there good days will acome. At least that is what they tell me. Oh yeah I really thought of killing the cat but I can’t totally blame her. It was hit by a car several months later. michael

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We have this office.  The biggest branch we have.  It has an NT server with a Raid 5 array and a duplex..  The container keeps getting "lost."  We reloaded the OS two weeks ago.  We put in the manufacturer’s monitoring software.  It went ppffffffth.  The manufacturer says, "Sorry, it can’t be uninstalled."  We have to replace the OS again.  I am not happy.  Replaced it this morning. Also packed the steelhead stuff. Went out to the parking lot for tools.  Dropped the tailgate and my school ring made a funny noise against the metal of the tailgate.   No stone.  I am not happy.  I search high and low, no stone.  Even took the server apart again, looking for it.  No stone.  I am sad. After, I went to the Credit River.  The winds were very high, the water was very high, fast and dirty.  I didn’t catch squat. I really not happy.   Went to the liquor store and bought a distiller’s edition 1984 Cragganmore speysider. Not so sad anymore. Will be tomorrow. Peter

Response:

We have this office.  The biggest branch we have.  It has an NT server with a Raid 5 array and a duplex..  The container keeps getting "lost."  We reloaded the OS two weeks ago.  We put in the manufacturer’s monitoring software.  It went ppffffffth.  The manufacturer says, "Sorry, it can’t be uninstalled."  We have to replace the OS again.  I am not happy.  Replaced it this morning. Also packed the steelhead stuff. Went out to the parking lot for tools.  Dropped the tailgate and my school ring made a funny noise against the metal of the tailgate.   No stone.  I am not happy.  I search high and low, no stone.  Even took the server apart again, looking for it.  No stone.  I am sad. After, I went to the Credit River.  The winds were very high, the water was very high, fast and dirty.  I didn’t catch squat. I really not happy.   Went to the liquor store and bought a distiller’s edition 1984 Cragganmore speysider. Not so sad anymore. Will be tomorrow. Peter

Response:

Question:

Ken you want to respond to this one?

I didn’t see the original post.  Wouldn’t have known about it except for your response.  Did my server overlook something on ROFF, or did you find this somewhere else? Wolfgang

Response:

<SNIPPED Is anyone else seeing the "Hard Working Latinos" thread?  And _I_ get branded a racist for a clearly over-the-top post in the midst of it all?  Sheesh… They are LONG posts, so here is some header info if anyone wants to go to Deja and read it the whole saga:

TC, R

Response:

Original went out to 4 news groups rec.outdoors.fishing.saltwater, rec.outdoors.fishing.fly, rec.outdoors.national-parks, rec.outdoors.rv-travel So you must have missed all of Muskies posts

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Did it get filtered or did your server miss it. The original post went to a bunch of newsgroups. I replied to only this one. Bellsout.net filters out crossposted spam, I’m not sure how many crossposted newsgroups in a post it takes to get filtered – maybe 10 or so. — Charlie…

Response:

So you must have missed all of Muskies posts

I filter them myself<g. This one must have met some other criteria, I know a lot of the really outrageous one’s I see replies to never get to me in their original form. — Charlie…

Response:

Sorry, I had meant to snip it.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Geez, Paul, did you have to quote that thing?  My ISP was nice enough to filter it for me… <snipped

Response:

Is anyone else seeing the "Hard Working Latinos" thread?  And _I_ get branded a racist for a clearly over-the-top post in the midst of it all?  Sheesh… Are you really unable to see why people would be more likely to respond to your posts than to an infrequent, obvious troll by someone who doesn’t participate in this newsgroup?

Well, no.  I didn’t post the joke for responses, I posted it as a commentary, hence the stuff before and after the "joke."  But when certain "hall monitors" got on their high horses, I did gig ‘em (No, that wasn’t an Aggie slur).   One thing I do find odd, however: most replies were cries of "Racist!" yet only one "race" was mentioned in the "joke" proper and two total in the entire post, and the "joke" didn’t overtly involve it as an issue.  I really believe these types are no better than real racists because they _think_ they are being righteous without even knowing much about the labels _they_ are so ready to go slapping on people. Richard, the joke you posted did not suprise me. What suprised me is that you apparently thought the joke was funny enough to share.

OK, time to come clean, I guess – the original joke was told to me without the race of the girl or the nationality of the others seemingly being important.  I think it was meant to be strictly a "Jewish lawyer" joke – told to me _by_ a Jewish lawyer, BTW.  I have no idea if the French and Italians (I think they were included because if the "Oo-la-la" and "Mama mia" factors – itself somewhat of a stereotype, however) were being purposefully stereotyped by the writer, but I am fairly sure they were not by the person who related it to me.  I happened to notice those somewhat less obvious stereotypes, and hence, it seemed a good basis for the point of my post. That said, you’re (obviously) free to continue to post whatever jokes you feel like posting. In the future, what would you have other members of the newsgroup do if they find those jokes offensive?

Well, that really isn’t my business – they are free to respond in any way they wish, as am I, or they are free to ignore it, as am I, or they can killfile all they want.  I guess ROFF is destined to become splintered groups who only see about 10% of the posts.  FWIW, I don’t believe in killfiles (other than in a case as discussed re: costs).  I have enough willpower to simply ignore what I don’t want to read, and certainly enough to not respond to what I don’t want to respond to _after_ having read it.  But I don’t begrudge anyone who wishes to use them. An aside:  IIRC, I have posted what would be termed as "Stereotype" humor 3 times – go back and look at what else was being posted at the time, and reread what I posted in light of that. TC, R – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text —Steve

Response:

Is anyone else seeing the "Hard Working Latinos" thread?  And _I_ get branded a racist for a clearly over-the-top post in the midst of it all?  Sheesh…

Are you really unable to see why people would be more likely to respond to your posts than to an infrequent, obvious troll by someone who doesn’t participate in this newsgroup? Richard, the joke you posted did not suprise me. What suprised me is that you apparently thought the joke was funny enough to share. That said, you’re (obviously) free to continue to post whatever jokes you feel like posting. In the future, what would you have other members of the newsgroup do if they find those jokes offensive? –Steve

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These threads are obviously being filtered by somebody with a lot of sense at server propagation levels, probably due to cross-posting. I have seen no posts about racist poets or Latinos. If not for some of the replies here, I would not have known of them.  Really just another piece of useless knowledge I could happily dispense with. TL MC — "Where fishing is concerned, most anglers are basically manic excessives" http://www.mikeconnor.de – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is anyone else seeing the "Hard Working Latinos" thread?  And _I_ get branded a racist for a clearly over-the-top post in the midst of it all?  Sheesh…

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I started getting them again. The original was sent to many newsgroups and it gets picked up occasionally. Paul

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <SNIPPED

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Did it get filtered or did your server miss it. The original post went to a bunch of newsgroups. I replied to only this one. I think rw may be correct since the host node that the message was sent from did not match any of the email addresses. The host was on Frontier Internet. Paul

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ken you want to respond to this one? Interesting that my newsgroup filter blocked the original message, but I’ve never filtered the supposed author.   Probably from some other regular troublemaker.   (Could have lived without the repost, though.) Joe F.

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Did it get filtered or did your server miss it. The original post went to a bunch of newsgroups. I replied to only this one.

Bellsout.net filters out crossposted spam, I’m not sure how many crossposted newsgroups in a post it takes to get filtered – maybe 10 or so. — Charlie…

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Geez, Paul, did you have to quote that thing?  My ISP was nice enough to filter it for me…

<snipped

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Ken you want to respond to this one?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "the threat of negroe sperm"  Black and ugly  nigger sperm  get it in you  it grows like a worm  once inside  a maggot sprouts  nine months later  a monster jumps out!!!! — — Brookings, S.D. | My private address appears on the left.   itctel .com   | http://members.fortunecity.com/jvipond/

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Paul G asked: Ken you want to respond to this one?<

Why bother?  Unless you respond to his ISP, of course.

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Ken you want to respond to this one?

My guess is that someone is trying to screw James Vipond. No one in his right mind would attach his name to this sort of thing. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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Ken you want to respond to this one?

Interesting that my newsgroup filter blocked the original message, but I’ve never filtered the supposed author.   Probably from some other regular troublemaker.   (Could have lived without the repost, though.) Joe F.

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Ken you want to respond to this one? Interesting that my newsgroup filter blocked the original message, but I’ve never filtered the supposed author.   Probably from some other regular troublemaker.   (Could have lived without the repost, though.)

I didn’t see the original either. — Charlie…

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Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Flypaint writes: I thought near the ends of the canoe were more stable for tying off and hauling up the anchor. -Patrick They probably are ,because your’e pulling your anchor line along a stable central axis point.I personally don’t prefer to do it that way because I don’t like to have to lean back every time I want to raise or lower the anchor.We’re talking about anchoring on slow lazy rivers or lakes,not on raging rapids.Their would have to be one hell of a wind kicking up to put me under just because I tied off on the center support.I also find it gives me better boat positioning.Anyway,my main reason in responding to the post was to share a tip about using the plastic barbell.You can tie your anchor anywhere you want as far as I’m concerned.I don’t recommend tying it to your ankle however. Tight Lines,Shawn

:All the canoes that I have used on rivers have had a pulley mechanism connected to the bow of the canoe with the rope running through a channel in the mechanism with a hammer-like piece coming down to hold it fast while at anchor.  The rope can be reached by any seat in the canoe.   Ken Fortenberry writes about using an onion bag with rocks — excellent idea and one used by Maine Guides.  When hiking into a remote pond, all they have to haul is the onion bag and a piece of rope — the rocks to fill the bag are already there!  Actually, it ain’t an onion bag but a bag designed for scuba divers.  You can find them in most dive shops. Achoring a canoe from the side in any kind of current can be unstable and could cause a turn-over.  But, of course, that’s JMHO. Dave LaCourse: These anchor control pulleys are great, but the single point of control often results in the stern being swung back and forth by the current or the wind.   We use the motor at the square stern of the canoe to act as a rudder.  When we are in rocky rivers (and hence no motor), I just use plastic bar bells and a small piece of chain, like one other poster mentioned, and drop a line off the stern.  The stern anchor doesn’t have to be very heavy, but the line has to be tight to dampen the pendulum effect.  I just tie it off the back; no anchor control necessary. JB

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I thought near the ends of the canoe were more stable for tying off and hauling up the anchor. -Patrick

They probably are ,because your’e pulling your anchor line along a stable central axis point.I personally don’t prefer to do it that way because I don’t like to have to lean back every time I want to raise or lower the anchor.We’re talking about anchoring on slow lazy rivers or lakes,not on raging rapids.Their would have to be one hell of a wind kicking up to put me under just because I tied off on the center support.I also find it gives me better boat positioning.Anyway,my main reason in responding to the post was to share a tip about using the plastic barbell.You can tie your anchor anywhere you want as far as I’m concerned.I don’t recommend tying it to your ankle however. Tight Lines,Shawn

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Flypaint writes: I thought near the ends of the canoe were more stable for tying off and hauling up the anchor. -Patrick They probably are ,because your’e pulling your anchor line along a stable central axis point.I personally don’t prefer to do it that way because I don’t like to have to lean back every time I want to raise or lower the anchor.We’re talking about anchoring on slow lazy rivers or lakes,not on raging rapids.Their would have to be one hell of a wind kicking up to put me under just because I tied off on the center support.I also find it gives me better boat positioning.Anyway,my main reason in responding to the post was to share a tip about using the plastic barbell.You can tie your anchor anywhere you want as far as I’m concerned.I don’t recommend tying it to your ankle however. Tight Lines,Shawn

All the canoes that I have used on rivers have had a pulley mechanism connected to the bow of the canoe with the rope running through a channel in the mechanism with a hammer-like piece coming down to hold it fast while at anchor.  The rope can be reached by any seat in the canoe.   Ken Fortenberry writes about using an onion bag with rocks — excellent idea and one used by Maine Guides.  When hiking into a remote pond, all they have to haul is the onion bag and a piece of rope — the rocks to fill the bag are already there!  Actually, it ain’t an onion bag but a bag designed for scuba divers.  You can find them in most dive shops. Achoring a canoe from the side in any kind of current can be unstable and could cause a turn-over.  But, of course, that’s JMHO. Dave LaCourse

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How do you anchor a canoe for flyfishing when there’s a breeze that keeps moving you off your spot? Thanks!

Well…if you’re not portaging …grab a large coffee can..fill it with cement/concrete…stick in a large eye bolt.  The can will pick up far less muck when in a weedy/muddy bottomed pond/bog/lake. $.02, steve d.

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: All the canoes that I have used on rivers have had a pulley mechanism connected : to the bow of the canoe with the rope running through a channel in the : mechanism with a hammer-like piece coming down to hold it fast while at anchor. :  The rope can be reached by any seat in the canoe.   : Ken Fortenberry writes about using an onion bag with rocks — excellent idea : and one used by Maine Guides.  When hiking into a remote pond, all they have to : haul is the onion bag and a piece of rope — the rocks to fill the bag are : already there!  Actually, it ain’t an onion bag but a bag designed for scuba : divers.  You can find them in most dive shops. : Achoring a canoe from the side in any kind of current can be unstable and could : cause a turn-over.  But, of course, that’s JMHO. : Dave LaCourse Hi; As a Illinois EPA volunteer, we go out often. We’ve been out in days when we have waves coming over the sides of our kayak. We use a two seater and one person handles the anchor (which we just drop over the side) and writes the results and the other (me) lowers the secchi disk and leans over the opposite side (from anchor) of the kayak to take measurments. We do end up going back to work sometimes smelling kind bad, but we have yet to tip… — John Nelson                       Chicago Area Paddling/Fishing Page        http://www.chicagopaddling.org   http://www.chicagofishing.org  (A Non-Commercial Web Site: No Sponsors, No Paid Ads and Nothing to Sell)

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How do you anchor a canoe for flyfishing when there’s a breeze that keeps moving you off your spot? Thanks!

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How do you anchor a canoe for flyfishing when there’s a breeze that keeps moving you off your spot? Thanks!

I use an onion sack full of rocks. — Ken Fortenberry

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How do you anchor a canoe for flyfishing when there’s a breeze that keeps moving you off your spot? Thanks! I use an onion sack full of rocks. — Ken Fortenberry

Scott, he’s also been known to use his fishing partner. Peter (promising never to call it an "aluminum monstrosity" again)

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I tie a 5 pound maul (sledge hammer) off the back.  Easy to lift and adjust. Opie  **Panhandling for a better tomorrow!**

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How do you anchor a canoe for flyfishing when there’s a breeze that keeps moving you off your spot? Thanks! I use an onion sack full of rocks. — Ken Fortenberry

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Ken,    The holes in the onion sack are too big to put corn in. Ernie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How do you anchor a canoe for flyfishing when there’s a breeze that keeps moving you off your spot? Thanks! I use an onion sack full of rocks. — Ken Fortenberry

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How do you anchor a canoe for flyfishing when there’s a breeze that keeps moving you off your spot? Thanks!

Scott, FLOAT TUBE ANCHOR SYSTEM: www.woodrivercompany.com/accessor.htm I have one of these for my float tube and I use with the canoe also…I really like it and I don’t have to haul those muddy rocks that dirty and scratch up my precious and prestine Old Town canoe (that looks like it was dropped by UPS…..Cargo Jet, that is). Padishar Creel

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How do you anchor a canoe for flyfishing when there’s a breeze that keeps moving you off your spot? Thanks!

I use a 1 gal detergent jug filled with sand. You might want two, for when you want to keep the craft sideways to the wind. Pops **** Armed and Safe(tm) **** "By US Code Title 47, Sec.227(a)(2)(B), a computer/modem/printer meets the definition of a telephone fax machine. By Sec.227(b)(1)(C), it is unlawful to send any unsolicited advertisement to such equipment.   By Sec.227(b)(3)(C), a violation of the aforementioned Section is punishable by action to recover actual monetary loss, or $500, whichever is greater, for each violation."

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: How do you anchor a canoe for flyfishing when there’s a breeze that keeps : moving you off your spot? Thanks! I have a <ducking head JetSki anchor that I bought from Overton’s.  It’s small, comes with it’s own storage bag and has a little float on the end just incase you lose the rope.  It also has a clip so I just loop it over a thwart and clip it on. P.S. I do not own a jetski — John Nelson                       Chicago Area Paddling/Fishing Page        http://www.chicagopaddling.org   http://www.chicagofishing.org  (A Non-Commercial Web Site: No Sponsors, No Paid Ads and Nothing to Sell)

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How do you anchor a canoe for flyfishing

Hey Scott, I like to use a plastic barbell weight,about eight pounds.I tie a rope through the center and tie the end to the center support bar in mycanoe.The good thing about the barbell weight is because it.s round it’s not likely to hang up on anything.If your anchor hangs up even the least little bit you will have trouble freeing it without flipping your canoe.When pulling your anchor up you want to pull the rope over the side from the center while seated in a stable position.If you lean over the side to haul the anchor you will soon find yourself and all your equipment in the water. Good Luck,Shawn

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I use an onion sack full of rocks.

Yeah, but what yuppie boy isn’t telling you is that those rocks were individually swallowed and pooped out by a rare strain of African wildebeast. Helps ‘em sink faster apparently. –Steve (don’t worry Ken, I’ll get one with a large fridge)

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Scott,   I also like the rock in an onion sack solution, it doesn’t take up much space when not in use so I usually have it with the canoe.   However, I would not tie it to one of the center thwarts.  If there is a current, or a strong wind, this can tip a canoe over.  Also it it easier to tip a canoe when raising the anchor.  It is better to tie to the end of the canoe, I have a carry handle at the bow and stern of my 18′ Wenonah.  It is inconvenient to raise and lower if I am by myself, but I have had a sudden breeze come up and have been happier. Joe – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How do you anchor a canoe for flyfishing when there’s a breeze that keeps moving you off your spot? Thanks!

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Reminds me of my first scuba diving buddy (a college roommate). He insisted that he always carried a scuba knife and dove with a partner for safety reasons. That way, if he saw a shark, he could stab his buddy and swim for shore.

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 i use old window sash weights.  lead bars about 10 inches long with hole already in the end for your cord.  rig pulley off front and you can hold canoe in place during ‘gentle’ winds. fishworship – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How do you anchor a canoe for flyfishing when there’s a breeze that keeps moving you off your spot? Thanks!

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<snip When pulling your anchor up you want to pull the rope over the side from the center while seated in a stable position. <snip I thought near the ends of the canoe were more stable for tying off and hauling up the anchor. -Patrick

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Question:

Anyone out here from Oregon?  Would like to know a few good spots for flyfishing in the Portland Metro area. Thanks! Brent

–I vote that you drive the Columbia river gorge to the mouth of the Deschutes river.   It’s exactly 100 miles from Portland, it should take you 1 and 3/4 hours.  In the latter part of July the summer fish will be there….hang on and be ready to swim, these are some of the meanest steelhead around. Sharp Hooks, Pat Holdzit Fishing Products Inc. http://www.holdzit.com Before you buy.

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Anyone out here from Oregon?  Would like to know a few good spots for flyfishing in the Portland Metro area. Thanks! Brent

Trillium Lake for stcok trout or Hagg Lake southwest of metro area for smallmouth bass.

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<< Anyone out here from Oregon?  Would like to know a few good spots for flyfishing in the Portland Metro area. Thanks! Brent How far from the Metro area would you go? "Reality is an escape for people who don’t (fly) fish"

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… "Reality is an escape for people who don’t (fly) fish"

"Reality is the leading cause of stress among those who are in touch with it."                        -Jane Wagner- — Ken Fortenberry

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Anyone out here from Oregon?  Would like to know a few good spots for flyfishing in the Portland Metro area. Thanks! Brent

I  would make the drive to the Deschutes.  Or an hour closer is the McKenzie.  If you just want to kill an hour or two, head down to where the Clackamas meets the Willamette and catch a few warmwater fish.  If you feel like chasing steelhead, then the Clackamas, Sandy, Salmon are all good. Now if you would just like to sit back and cyber-fish,  click this link and see if you can figure out how to catch the trout swimming across your PC monitor… http://www.AquaHabitat.com/cyberquarium.html There is one other alternative: build your own lake and catch great fish  right out your backdoor. enjoy! Before you buy.

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Anyone out here from Oregon?  Would like to know a few good spots for flyfishing in the Portland Metro area. Thanks! Brent I  would make the drive to the Deschutes.  Or an hour closer is the McKenzie.

The McKenzie is an hour closer than the Deschutes from Portland??? Isn’t the McKenzie down by Eugene?      - Ken

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone out here from Oregon?  Would like to know a few good spots for flyfishing in the Portland Metro area. Thanks! Brent I  would make the drive to the Deschutes.  Or an hour closer is the McKenzie. The McKenzie is an hour closer than the Deschutes from Portland??? Isn’t the McKenzie down by Eugene?      - Ken

Yeah the McKenzie is at the north end of Eugene,  it takes me about an hour and a half to get there from portland, if the cops aren’t thick! Before you buy.

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Anyone out here from Oregon?  Would like to know a few good spots for flyfishing in the Portland Metro area. Thanks! Brent

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Anyone out here from Oregon?  Would like to know a few good spots for flyfishing in the Portland Metro area.

The Sandy and Salmon rivers to the east and the Trask and Wilson rivers to the west.  Some will tell you to go to the Deschutes, but I have a problem calling a 3 hour drive being in the Metro area. There are a ton of rivers within a 3 hour drive. Good luck,      - Ken

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Question:

I’m considering getting a spey type rod for SW fishing in Maine.  I fish a lot of tidal rivers.  Any suggestions on types of lines to consider (shooting heads or just a plain floating line ?)  My main reason for considering a 2 handed rod is to not get so worn out flailing the water with my conventional 9 wt rod.   I’ve never used a 2 handed rod but understand that it can be more efficient. Or should I just sit down and smoke a cigarette instead of beating the water to a froth when the fish aren’t biting ; ^). Thanks John

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I’m considering getting a spey type rod for SW fishing in Maine.  I fish a lot of tidal rivers.  Any suggestions on types of lines to consider (shooting heads or just a plain floating line ?)  My main reason for considering a 2 handed rod is to not get so worn out flailing the water with my conventional 9 wt rod. I’ve never used a 2 handed rod but understand that it can be more efficient. Or should I just sit down and smoke a cigarette instead of beating the water to a froth when the fish aren’t biting ; ^). Thanks John

John, Spey rods can work great in northeast saltwater. Doug Jowett, a well-known and respected guide in the Brunswick, Maine area recommends them. I haven’t used one yet, but I know what you mean about wearing out your shoulder on the 9 wt.

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Hi ! PFMJI, but the theme touches me too. I just ordered a two-handed rod, that felt very easy to throw and is a good overhead casting machine, but I doubt it’ll be a good Speycasting device, nor I expect it to be good at windy conditions. Mine will be a G.Loomis GLX 11′ 6" 8/9 wt. Does anybody have expierience with casting such short 2-handed sticks? Isn’t, for Speycasting in particular, a longer Doublehanded rod nesseccary ? Thus, I doubt, a twohanded rod is a _good_ SW-Rod because of it’s _average_ length linked with the mostly windy conditions. So I expect it to be more tiring than a shorter rod. Any expieriences ? Thanks for your time

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Just bought an Orvis Silver 15′  10 wt. fast action for sw use in Florida, both for shore fishing fast tide water in passes and for casting to Tarpon, Redfish and Snook from a boat. Neat thing of the two hander is the ability to throw 60′ to 80′ with no backcast ( a modified roll cast) thereby not jeprodizing beach walkers and others on board when fishing from a boat. Have spent 4 to 5 hours at a time blind casting with a conventional 9 ft.12 wt. for Tarpon and a 9 ft. 9 wt. for Snook and Reds and can verify that the two hander, while a bit unwieldy to store and handle aboard a small boat, is sure a lot less tiring to use for extended periods. Largest fish so far was a 25# Sting Ray(ugh) on a 12# tippet which was beached and released in about 10 minutes, and a long line release of a Tarpon (50#??) after two jumps and about 10 minutes. I’m sold on it for certain conditions.

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Just bought an Orvis Silver 15′  10 wt. fast action for sw use in Florida, both for shore fishing fast tide water in passes and for casting to Tarpon, Redfish and Snook from a boat. Neat thing of the two hander is the ability to throw 60′ to 80′ with no backcast ( a modified roll cast) thereby not jeprodizing beach walkers and others on board when fishing from a boat. Have spent 4 to 5 hours at a time blind casting with a conventional 9 ft.12 wt. for Tarpon and a 9 ft. 9 wt. for Snook and Reds and can verify that the two hander, while a bit unwieldy to store and handle aboard a small boat, is sure a lot less tiring to use for extended periods. Largest fish so far was a 25# Sting Ray(ugh) on a 12# tippet which was beached and released in about 10 minutes, and a long line release of a Tarpon (50#??) after two jumps and about 10 minutes. I’m sold on it for certain conditions.

Hi Jay, We will be using two handed, 14′ rods for Shad in the American River this spring. I think it will be good practice for Steelhead and Atlantic Salmon fishing. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY www.kiene.com

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My little book is a Yachting reprint dated 1954. "The Best of Darrell McClure." Yeah…But that was when "Yachting" was still worth reading, not the coffee table magazine for yuppie millionaires it has turned into. John

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Yeah, but adding a $1,200 charter bill on top of airfare for four (another $1,200) brings the weekend tariff to $2,500 easy, vs. maybe $150 for towing your baby 300 miles and back.  Hardly the same thing unless you are Bill Gates.  Truth is, when you trailer you do kinda feel like the guys who fly into the Vineyard on a seaplane to meet their captained 90-footers. I too enjoyed cruising local waters for over 15 years.  But then it got a little old.  It’s still fun to zip across the Sound for lunch once in while, or wet a fishing line, but it’s not cruising. Ken

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I don’t run around at anything near full speed 99% of the time, although I hear that sailboats try to do that *all* the time .

*ROTFL* Omygot, David! You’ve got us! flo

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have sail-cruised for 25 years  and power-cruised for 10 years.  I wasn’t getting much further from home on my 40 mph stink pot than I was on the rag boat.  You just can’t get all that far in the time most of us have for our hobby.  Plus 40 mph is not a reality once you leave the inner harbor.  I probably spent more time at 10 mph in the power boat than any other speed, which was a fast as I could move her in 3 ft. seas and still keep my kidneys. My solution:  use a trailer to get to the new places.  55 mph is a lot faster than a sailboat can go and 10 mpg in your Suburban is a lot better than the 2 mpg a powerboat gets.  I found trailer boating to be more of a "thing" than either sailing or powering, as far as distinctiveness of experience was concerned.  It’s just a hoot to spend a weekend on your boat in exotic waters 300 miles from home. Ken

Very well said! — Skipper

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Charming note! But if the truth be known, God probably owns a MacGregor 26X so that he can motor, sail or drift. (Sorry….couldn’t resist that opportunity.) Actually, I’ve always been amused by the division between ragbaggers and stinkpotters. It’s boating and being on and enjoying the water that are important, or should be. I’ve solved the dilemma by having both – a 25′ Bayfield sailboat for peace and pleasure and relaxation and a 25′ Carver powerboat for getting from here to there when I want. Both have their merits and drawbacks. I can’t stand powerboaters who go too damn fast and screw things up and create unreasonable risks for themselves or others. I also can’t stand sailors who put on that air of superiority and pedantry while always seeming to list 10 degrees to port. I think a little mutual appreciation would go a long way and might even help with the never-ending Mac 26X debate. (Sorry again.) Harry

Wow! You are in for it… As soon as Capt Neal (one of nine) reads this you will be in for a good thrashing… Why is it that the level of boating know how seems to be inversely proportional to the size of the boat?

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Charming note! But if the truth be known, God probably owns a MacGregor 26X so that he can motor, sail or drift. (Sorry….couldn’t resist that opportunity.) Actually, I’ve always been amused by the division between ragbaggers and stinkpotters. It’s boating and being on and enjoying the water that are important, or should be. I’ve solved the dilemma by having both – a 25′ Bayfield sailboat for peace and pleasure and relaxation and a 25′ Carver powerboat for getting from here to there when I want. Both have their merits and drawbacks. I can’t stand powerboaters who go too damn fast and screw things up and create unreasonable risks for themselves or others. I also can’t stand sailors who put on that air of superiority and pedantry while always seeming to list 10 degrees to port. I think a little mutual appreciation would go a long way and might even help with the never-ending Mac 26X debate. (Sorry again.) Harry

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -My hat’s off to an apparent purist. The vast majority of sail boats in our area, based upon observation, spend very little time with their sail up unless a sailboat race is on. Most of them motor from point to point, stopping in between for a little recreational sailing when the wind permits. On a breezy afternoon they do congregate just outside the breakwater and do some sailing as well, but they’re primarily just tacking back and forth within a mile or so of the marina.  Much of our inland type boating involves narrows and channels where a stiff current can develop that would require a sail boat to wait for a slack or alternate tide if not running under power; so perhaps there are other areas where the sail boaters actually spend the majority of the time sailing.

"Majority" might be stretching it, but here in the Great Lakes, we can and do cruise under sail for 8 hour runs if the wind is cooperative.  We’ve covered as much as 120 miles without turning over the engine.  We’ve also had to motor for 12 hours or more when the breeze failed to appear, or worse, when it was from a contrary direction. It will depend greatly on your locale and the routes available, but one can "have the sail up" a reasonable amount of the time.

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I have sail-cruised for 25 years  and power-cruised for 10 years.  I wasn’t getting much further from home on my 40 mph stink pot than I was on the rag boat.  You just can’t get all that far in the time most of us have for our hobby.  Plus 40 mph is not a reality once you leave the inner harbor.  I probably spent more time at 10 mph in the power boat than any other speed, which was a fast as I could move her in 3 ft. seas and still keep my kidneys. My solution:  use a trailer to get to the new places.  55 mph is a lot faster than a sailboat can go and 10 mpg in your Suburban is a lot better than the 2 mpg a powerboat gets.  I found trailer boating to be more of a "thing" than either sailing or powering, as far as distinctiveness of experience was concerned.  It’s just a hoot to spend a weekend on your boat in exotic waters 300 miles from home. Ken

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|Why is it that the level of boating know how seems to be inversely proportional to the size of the boat?| It may be a result of the size and capacity of the brain doing the seeming. Is that another way of saying that small boats can only carry people so small as to have such small brains that only think they are smart enough to come to such a conclusion without missing the important point regarding the presumption that one’s opinion regarding others’ ability vis a vis boating knowhow somehow corresponds to some true vision of the universe? I suppose then that a mosquito on a floating leaf fragment would logically possess most of the boating know how in the world, leaving little for the larger vessels, and of course explains the Exxon Valdise situation, which apparantly still stinks. Terry K Has anyone tried putting a sailboard sail on a wheelchair, then employing teams to propel a four foot ball through a soccer sized goal in competition?

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A zillion years ago there was a Darrell McClure cartoon about this very thing. For those of you who don’t remember, Darrell McClure was a regular cartoonist in the Boston Herald. The cartoons were always on boating, and I guess it says something about Boston in those days. They also ran in Yachting. My little book is a Yachting reprint dated 1954. "The Best of Darrell McClure." Anyway, there is John Truesalt (his name is on his seabag) in his bedroom, which is filled with models of grand sailing boats and a bookcase full of sailing books. He is on his knees by his bed obviously in great anguish of soul. The caption says: "Oh Lord — I went cruising in a power boat and I LIKED IT!" Another one has a group of people lounging in the cockpit of a sailboat. The superciliuous twit at the tiller says: "My brother? We don’t mention my brother anymore….. He bought a motor boat."

We Swamp Yankees here in the North East have something similar.  It is a cartoon called Bousquet (pronounced Bos’kay).  It shows a guy in the cockpit of his little sailboat.  The name on the back of the vessel is "Hazard to Navigation II".  Reminded me of a ragbagger I raft with on Block Island. Excuse the plug for my own page, but feel free to visit my page for a couple of ‘toons about us wooden boaters with a link to the cartoonists’ page as well. Dave Carlile Classic Wooden Boats http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/8110

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…  I can’t stand powerboaters who go too damn fast and screw things up and create unreasonable risks for themselves or others. I also can’t stand sailors who put on that air of superiority and pedantry while always seeming to list 10 degrees to port.  …

Know what you mean.  However, it does seem a bit strange coming from someone named Harry.  The other Harry has a much longer list of gripes. You always know when his underwear don’t quite fit correctly. — Skipper

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Why is it that the level of boating know how seems to be inversely proportional to the size of the boat?

Now THAT one I won’t touch with either a 1′ or 10′ boat hook! Harry

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I’ve been cruising on a powerboat, and I too enjoyed it, except for guilt about the thousand gallons plus of fuel we burnt in a long weekend.  But we did cover about five hundred miles of open sea and visit three ports.   I learned a lot too.  If you’re accustomed to navigating a sailing cruiser it can be a shock to you to do complex pilotage at speed. Normally I never bother to plot courses etc. in advance – I don’t get seasick so I can work out courses at the chart table as and when I need them, and in a sailing boat you can never predict the wind.   John Wilson

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John Wilson commented: I’ve been cruising on a powerboat, and I too enjoyed it, except for guilt about the thousand gallons plus of fuel we burnt in a long weekend.  But we did cover about five hundred miles of open sea and visit three ports.   I learned a lot too.  If you’re accustomed to

In other words, "If this is Saturday afternoon this must be Catalina?" Doesn’t sound like a lot of fun. If you spent any time sleeping or actually in the three ports you would have needed to be doing about what, maybe 20 knots?, the rest of the time to cover a 500 mile itinerary in a weekend. Your experience was an odd way to spend time on any boat, not a typical powerboat experience.  Many powerboats operate almost as economically under power as do similar size sailboats. Your skipper must have been fairly wealthy to burn up $1200 worth of fuel for a weekend. Most of us would not be able to afford that. How many people were aboard? A vessel getting half a mile per gallon isn’t all that inefficient if its carrying 40 people and it’s looked at on a per-passenger-mile basis. Mr. Wilson also commented: I learned a lot too.  If you’re accustomed to navigating a sailing cruiser it can be a shock to you to do complex pilotage at speed. Normally I never bother to plot courses etc. in advance – I don’t get seasick so I can work out courses at the chart table as and when I need them, and in a sailing boat you can never predict the wind.  

My hat’s off to an apparent purist. The vast majority of sail boats in our area, based upon observation, spend very little time with their sail up unless a sailboat race is on. Most of them motor from point to point, stopping in between for a little recreational sailing when the wind permits. On a breezy afternoon they do congregate just outside the breakwater and do some sailing as well, but they’re primarily just tacking back and forth within a mile or so of the marina.  Much of our inland type boating involves narrows and channels where a stiff current can develop that would require a sail boat to wait for a slack or alternate tide if not running under power; so perhaps there are other areas where the sail boaters actually spend the majority of the time sailing.

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Sail vs. Power. It would be nice to think that the law of Equal Stupidity applies here; or that 1. The number of sailboaters with the ‘nose in the air self-righteous disdain’ for power boaters is a small but vocal and noticable contingent of an otherwise decent group of people and….. 2. The number of powerboaters who charge around way too fast and clueless (annoying a lot of other powerboaters with their antics as well) is also a small but noticable contingent of an otherwise decent group of people. Anytime we make a judgement about another boater’s attitudes, skills, or human worthiness based upon the motive power of his/her vessel or (dare I say it?) the brand name thereon we lose an opportunity to perhaps get to know somebody who would make a postive contribution to life.  Human nature is just that however, human and natural, and we will probably react emotionally and contribute to be discriminatory in our attitudes, rather than be compelled by intelligence and logic to go through the extra work of making our judgements one at a time based upon observed behaviors. More’s the pity.

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        …My little book is a Yachting reprint dated 1954. "The Best         of Darrell McClure."… So that’s where that cartoon came from. I saw it many many years ago, and in fact I had just gone on a powerboat cruise (up Hudson River, Lake Champlain, canals almost to Montreal) and I did enjoy it, and it did cause considerable anguish of soul. But I got over it. Meanwhile I’ll keep a weather eye for the book. — http://www.well.com/~pk/fishmeal.html                                               -"Call me Fishmeal"-

Response:

A zillion years ago there was a Darrell McClure cartoon about this very thing. For those of you who don’t remember, Darrell McClure was a regular cartoonist in the Boston Herald. The cartoons were always on boating, and I guess it says something about Boston in those days. They also ran in Yachting. My little book is a Yachting reprint dated 1954. "The Best of Darrell McClure." Anyway, there is John Truesalt (his name is on his seabag) in his bedroom, which is filled with models of grand sailing boats and a bookcase full of sailing books. He is on his knees by his bed obviously in great anguish of soul. The caption says: "Oh Lord — I went cruising in a power boat and I LIKED IT!" Another one has a group of people lounging in the cockpit of a sailboat. The superciliuous twit at the tiller says: "My brother? We don’t mention my brother anymore….. He bought a motor boat."

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Received the following message from a fellow boater.  Will protect the authors anonymity but the tale and his honest, self-effacing writing style are just too good not to share. Hope a positive response to his tale will prompt additional posts from this author.   I live on the British Columbian Gulf Islands.  After 7 years of sailing (and I loved my little Catalina 27) I’d been everywhere, man. At least everywhere I could get in a weekend at 6 knots (in a gale) or motoring. An honest sailor in coastal waters will tell you he motors 50% of the time anyway. Spring and fall I spent my sailing days in full rain gear and boots.  Summers the wind rarely blew.  There seems to be a certain eleteism in the sailing fraternity… now I’m not sure why.  In my sailing days I knew that God was a Sailor. My revelation, after the sailboat had to go (divorce), was that my bliss was linked to experiences on the water and had little to do with the conveyance.

Exactly. I like to go out on the water, period, and spend most of my time actually not moving, rather than blasting around upsetting sailboats (as some people would have it). What galls me most are the smug self-righteous types who put down powerboat owners as "people who are more interested in the destination than the journey". I took up boating precisely *because* I wasn’t interested in going anywhere fast (I sold my airplane to buy my boat). I don’t run around at anything near full speed 99% of the time, although I hear that sailboats try to do that *all* the time . And now the sailboaters, claiming the moral high ground as always, may end up being the only ones left in California legally allowed to use their two-stroke engines to pollute lakes and reservoirs. Figures. I bet the guy writing that bill owns a sailboat. — David (Dragon) Fiedler, Infobahn Warrior, Bf.D, CRS, ONS Find me at http://www.innercite.com/~dragon/ Please change "nospam" in my header address to "david" in order to reply. ** Pursuant to US Code, Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II,

Question:

can you tell me anything about fly fishing

"Fly fishing is a simple game.  You cast the fly.  You retrieve the fly. You catch the fish"                                                    My apologies to the movie "Bull Durham" — Gordon Churchill Flyfish NC http://www.planet-nc.com/flyfishnc/ Striped Bass on the Roanoke River, Hybrids on Jordan Lake, Largemouths on surface.  Pickup and dropoff in Research Triangle Park

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can you tell me anything about fly fishing

It can be expensive

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can you tell me anything about fly fishing

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Hi Peter, Could you be a little more specific? Fly Fishing is a method of fishing that has a span from 2 oz blue gills to 150 pound tarpon and just about any fish you can think of? Do you want to get started? First suggestion hang around and read this news group. Second take a trip to the library. Third come on back to the group and post your questions. Good fishing, Dennis — Dennis C. Aron Independent Representative #13921 Champion Fishing Co., Ltd e-mail for business opportunity – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – can you tell me anything about fly fishing

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any recommendations or advice on flyfishing in/around the Yellowstone area in June? Thanx. Gregg.  Gregg  From what I hear, find some not still frozen lakes. Water will be everywhere, not that one cannot fish  during the run- off, it is just limiting. Harry June is usually a good month for dry flies on the Firehole inside the Park. Snow pack is at 200% in most of the Yellowstone area. Most rivers and tributaries will be high until Aug. Stick to the lakes. Guy

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June is usually a good month for dry flies on the Firehole inside the Park.

There is no Firehole outside the Park. <g  -AR

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Any recommendations or advice on flyfishing in/around the Yellowstone area in June? Thanx. Gregg.

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Expect Snow! Any recommendations or advice on flyfishing in/around the Yellowstone area in June?

– Brian D. Nelson, Missoula, Montana Montana Flyfishing and Hunting Outfitter http://www.montana.com/dno/dno.htm http://www.montana.com/dno/hunt.htm

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Any recommendations or advice on flyfishing in/around the Yellowstone area in June? Thanx. Gregg.

 Gregg  From what I hear, find some not still frozen lakes. Water will be everywhere, not that one cannot fish  during the run- off, it is just limiting. Harry

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My wife and I fished Yellowstone the last week of June 2 years ago when they had an unusually high run-off.  The only river fishable was the Firehole.

I can give you updates from time to time, but the snowpack here in the wyoming mountains is very high this year- I will not be a pretty spring. I plan on starting my fishing in August (no, I’m not joking)

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My wife and I fished Yellowstone the last week of June 2 years ago when they had an unusually high run-off.  The only river fishable was the Firehole.  We had pretty good luck about 3 miles below Old Faithful Inn – can’t remember the names of the river sections.  Every other river we tried was so full of water you couldn’t reasonably fish them. I suggest you wait until after 15 July. J. Bjostad John Bjostad Columbia Heights, MN Retired avionics engineer – full time fly fishing addict

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any recommendations or advice on flyfishing in/around the Yellowstone area in June? Thanx. Gregg.  Gregg  From what I hear, find some not still frozen lakes. Water will be everywhere, not that one cannot fish  during the run- off, it is just limiting. Harry

June is usually a good month for dry flies on the Firehole inside the Park.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any recommendations or advice on flyfishing in/around the Yellowstone area in June? Thanx. Gregg.  Gregg  From what I hear, find some not still frozen lakes. Water will be everywhere, not that one cannot fish  during the run- off, it is just limiting. Harry June is usually a good month for dry flies on the Firehole inside the Park.

 Hi Steve   You are right, PMD’s are in full swing, as well as the Winnabago emergence and the evening Mini Van fall. Makes for some real fun back casting, at Fountain Flats one can hook a  tuna sandwich and a Brown on the same cast     HM

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Question:

The house of Rep. in washington is considering a bill to establish a national fishing license, (snip) What do you think about the idea of a national fishing license?

        It will probably do the same thing the Federal commercial drivers license did!  I held a class A license since I was 21, but at $13 a year I could afford it even though I was no longer driving "big rigs".  The "Fed" came in and now the class A in Texas is $40!  I went back to a class c!         There is NO WAY I want the Federal Gov’t involved in "our" fishing, and if you take a look at what the NFWS is doing, you won’t either!!!

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The house of Rep. in washington is considering a bill to establish a national fishing license,  at this point it is only a bill to althorize the study of feasability of a national fishing license ( H.R. 406 ih) to read the actual bill go (http://thomas.loc.gov) do a search on the subject fishing.   At first I was upset at the thought of more goverment fees and regulations in order to enjoy my favort pasttime, but after really reading the bill, it may be a pretty good idea, we will be able to fish more than one state without having to buy out-of-state licenses What do you think about the idea of a national fishing license?

Up until a few years ago we had different licences for different areas in the UK. It’s a lot better now that there is only one license and only slightly more expensive. IMO one of the best things that happened to fishing in the UK. Compuserve:       100520,2042 Do not use a hatchet to remove a fly from your friend’s forehead. (Apparently a Chinese proverb)

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: What if the cost of a state license was around $16.25 (N.J. 1995 price) : and the cost of a Federal license were $18.00.

 in your example such a state would get 1/51 of $1.75, less the enormous amount the Federal government would pocket. Faced with a loss of revenue, the management programs such as stocking, would suffer in those places.  I personally would rather pay more, to fish some place good, than pay a little more just to be able to fish in more, mediocre places. As to those people who are not concerned the Federal government wouldn’t siphon off the money, check out Social Security. Last, the Federal government has no authority for creating such a law. Unless it is strictly a tax. If the states want to agree amoung themselves that’s another matter.

Each state would get 1/51 of 18.00 less the siphoned off funds (I would persume) not 1/51 of 1.75  why would the gov give the state 16.25? just because thats what they themselfs charge for a resident license? Most likely what will happen is the Fed gov will take over stocking operations, which will no doubt get mucked up and turn into a SUPERFUND waste.  Even though you say you will pay a little more for a state license in order to get better fishing,  others will not, and will be fishing right along side of you. there will be  no stocking done, the EPA will start screaming about LEAD,  the Attorny General will be screaming about Mercury, in the fish.   of course youll have to buy a saltwater license after that…. Personally I am begining to feel that it is not a good idea for the Gov to get involved within state fishing licenses.  the savings in order to fish in more than one state, does not compair to the costs that will be incurred with headaches.

Response:

: What if the cost of a state license was around $16.25 (N.J. 1995 price) : and the cost of a Federal license were $18.00.

 in your example such a state would get 1/51 of $1.75, less the enormous amount the Federal government would pocket. Faced with a loss of revenue, the management programs such as stocking, would suffer in those places.  I personally would rather pay more, to fish some place good, than pay a little more just to be able to fish in more, mediocre places. As to those people who are not concerned the Federal government wouldn’t siphon off the money, check out Social Security. Last, the Federal government has no authority for creating such a law. Unless it is strictly a tax. If the states want to agree amoung themselves that’s another matter.

Each state would get 1/51 of 18.00 less the siphoned off funds (I would persume) not 1/51 of 1.75  why would the gov give the state 16.25? just because thats what they themselfs charge for a resident license? Most likely what will happen is the Fed gov will take over stocking operations, which will no doubt get mucked up and turn into a SUPERFUND waste.  Even though you say you will pay a little more for a state license in order to get better fishing,  others will not, and will be fishing right along side of you. there will be  no stocking done, the EPA will start screaming about LEAD,  the Attorny General will be screaming about Mercury, in the fish.   of course youll have to buy a saltwater license after that…. Personally I am begining to feel that it is not a good idea for the Gov to get involved within state fishing licenses.  the savings in order to fish in more than one state, does not compair to the costs that will be incurred with headaches.

Response:

Personally I am begining to feel that it is not a good idea for the Gov to get involved within state fishing licenses.  the savings in order to fish in more than one state, does not compair to the costs that will be incurred with headaches.

Is it even legal?  The Constitution gives the federal government power to regulate interstate commerce.  Other powers it reserves for the states.  Is there some sort of precedent for this?  If there is, I’d think they’d want to make a national driver’s license before a national fishing license. | |                                                                       | | | John H. Kim          "Just try telling the IRS you don’t feel like    | | | Keeper of the Fishing FAQ        ftp://tuna.mit.edu/d/pub/fishing/faq |

Response:

Personally I am begining to feel that it is not a good idea for the Gov to get involved within state fishing licenses.  the savings in order to fish in more than one state, does not compair to the costs that will be incurred with headaches. Is it even legal?  The Constitution gives the federal government power to regulate interstate commerce.  Other powers it reserves for the states.  Is there some sort of precedent for this?  If there is, I’d think they’d want to make a national driver’s license before a national fishing license.    John, they did!  It is the federal comercial drivers license (CDL)

and now costs $40 as opposed to the former class a license in Texas, which was $13!  Everything is legal if it’s unopposed!

Response:

The house of Rep. in washington is considering a bill to establish a national fishing license,  at this point it is only a bill to althorize the study of feasability of a national fishing license ( H.R. 406 ih) to read the actual bill go (http://thomas.loc.gov) do a search on the subject fishing.   At first I was upset at the thought of more goverment fees and regulations in order to enjoy my favort pasttime, but after really reading the bill, it may be a pretty good idea, we will be able to fish more than one state without having to buy out-of-state licenses What do you think about the idea of a national fishing license?

Response:

The problem with a national license is that all of the funds that are now generated by individule states for their particular fisheries managment programs would disapear.  

What if the cost of a state license was around $16.25 (N.J. 1995 price) and the cost of a Federal license were $18.00.  would you buy the federal license for a few more dollars and be able to fish anywhere,  or would you buy the state license?   I agree that there is much room for revenue abuse,  but would you make the purchase? Wally

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The house of Rep. in washington is considering a bill to establish a national fishing license,  at this point it is only a bill to althorize really reading the bill, it may be a pretty good idea, we will be able to fish more than one state without having to buy out-of-state licenses What do you think about the idea of a national fishing license?

The problem with a national license is that all of the funds that are now generated by individule states for their particular fisheries managment programs would disapear.  I’m sure that once Washington got ahold of the money it would somehow get diverted to some other use rather than fisheries managment.  Even though it would be nice to be able to fish anywhere with only one license, I think that this is a bad idea. MHO Bryan Stafford

Response:

: The problem with a national license is that all of the funds that are : now : generated by individule states for their particular fisheries managment : programs would disapear.   : What if the cost of a state license was around $16.25 (N.J. 1995 price) : and the cost of a Federal license were $18.00.  would you buy the federal : license for a few more dollars and be able to fish anywhere,  or would : you buy the state license?   This overlooks the fact that less populous states with good fishing benefit from the influx of non-resident license dollars. While it might save you some bucks, in your example such a state would get 1/51 of $1.75, less the enormous amount the Federal government would pocket. Faced with a loss of revenue, the management programs such as stocking, would suffer in those places.  I personally would rather pay more, to fish some place good, than pay a little more just to be able to fish in more, mediocre places. As to those people who are not concerned the Federal government wouldn’t siphon off the money, check out Social Security. Last, the Federal government has no authority for creating such a law. Unless it is strictly a tax. If the states want to agree amoung themselves that’s another matter.

Response:

       It will probably do the same thing the Federal commercial drivers license did!  I held a class A license since I was 21, but at $13 a year I could afford it even though I was no longer driving "big rigs".  The "Fed" came in and now the class A in Texas is $40!  I went back to a class c!        There is NO WAY I want the Federal Gov’t involved in "our" fishing, and if you take a look at what the NFWS is doing, you won’t either!!!

The way the bill reads ( H.R. 406) is that the Federal license would not replace the state license,  it would be available as an alternive. you could still opt to purchase the state license and fish only within the state,  or you could buy the Federal license and fish in any state.  also you would need to buy any additional spieces stamps that the state you wanted to fish in imposed, if you were going to fish for that spieces or in waters that were stocked with that spieces ( in N.J. you need to buy a trout stamp to fish for trout,   it costs about 8.75 and looks like a postage stamp,  you affix it to your license)

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