Question:

But,one can build the body into most of the bend, use hook shape to the advantage of simulation.

That’s true, especially for scuds, caddis pupae, etc.  Still, by far my most productive fly, a bead-head PT on a TMC 3761, has a pretty straight body that takes up no more than half the total hook length (eye to point). I agree with your earlier statement, "On many subsurface patterns, and even some  surface emerger types, the hook bend can serve to mimic the shape of the natural nymph, pupa or whatever", especially for those forms, like emerging pupae that have associated air bubbles.  The hook bend may correspond in the trout’s eye to the curved edge of the bubble or bubble mass.   Although it’s an uncommon fly, compare the picture of the daphnia fly Dave LaCourse found and posted on ROFT http://www.danica.com/flytier/hverhaar/daphnia.htm to photos of daphnia http://www.microscopy-uk.org.uk/mag/artjun99/wflea.html Without the hook bend, there’d be little resemblance.  Makes you wonder if all those tiny things on curved #24-28 hooks that we think are midge patterns aren’t really taken by the trout as daphnia (not that it really matters). JR

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Some manufacturers are now producing bright gold, green, red and blue salmon/steelhead hooks.  Why waste all that bare metal when you can dress it up?

One wonders if a little metallic paint added to make the hook look more like the tied bug would make a difference.  I might have to try that for fun just to see. Sandy

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Maybe that big curvy part looks like an ovipositor.  See my web site www.sluttyflies.com

Here’s the sex spam we were looking for.  Bugs waving their ovipositors around.  Hmmph. Sandy

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  One wonders if a little metallic paint added to make the hook look more like the tied bug would make a difference.  I might have to try that for fun just to see.

They are starting to make the colored hooks in trout sizes too.  I saw some at a fly shop on the Beaverhead River and Lou Teletski gave me a fly that used a red hook when we went fishing the other day.  I haven’t tried them yet, but I can see how they might benefit a fly tyer. — Warren Findley Remove (nospamZZ) to respond via email http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt/

Response:

They are starting to make the colored hooks in trout sizes too.  I saw some at a fly shop on the Beaverhead River and Lou Teletski gave me a fly that used a red hook when we went fishing the other day.  I haven’t tried them yet, but I can see how they might benefit a fly tyer.

Did you see who the hook’s maker was? If someone here’s interested in trying it for themselves, you can buy metallic paint (normally used for jewelry) here: http://www.fancifulsinc.com/ Sandy

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You’d think (regardless of your species-specific sense of perception) that this big ol’ ugly THING just hanging there off the bottom of our handiwork is a lot more obvious than the many fine details we obsess over.  Why on earth would any trout swimming not key on THAT?

Depending on the angle the fish sees it from, yes it’s very obvious and I have no doubt whatever that the trout sees it.  But trout are also very used to seeing things on insects – broken legs and wings, a sliver of leaf or filament of weed, or even a pebble and twig case on a caddis.  The trout sees it and just assumes it’s a harmless piece of flotsam, extra fiber if you will.  Only if a trout has been hooked a number of times would he actually recognize it as a "bad" insect, IMO.

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Did you see who the hook’s maker was? If someone here’s interested in trying it for themselves, you can buy metallic paint (normally used for jewelry) here: http://www.fancifulsinc.com/

The hooks I saw were not labeled.  It looked like the shop had bought them bulk and packaged them in little zip lock bags on their own.  I will call out there tomorrow and find out where they bought them at.  I do recall they were expensive (like $10 for 25 hooks if I remember correctly) so your metallic paint idea might be a very good alternative. — Warren Findley Remove (nospamZZ) to respond via email http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt/

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"The trout just assumes it’s a harmless piece of flotsam, extra fiber if you will." "Assumes", to deduce.  The ability to come to a logical conclusion based on facts.   "Trout", to be a genius.  The ability to attend college courses without paying tuitions.  To Trout, as to flaunt wonderful phrases upon non-thinking ass holes who fly fish as a reflex action. "Seeing Trout" extablishes the ability to understand languages such as English. "Feeding Trout", The need to eat with the foreknowledge that to not do so will result in death.   "Dieting Trout", as in "Free Rising" selective trout who know the difference between choosing either a protein insect over one burden with excessive carbohydrates and undesirable fiber. Flyfisherman:  That which has a brain the size of a pea and who talks to the fishes as in Mafia Fisherman.   All’s Fair With Fur or Feather gg

Response:

Warren Findley: One wonders if a little metallic paint added to make the hook look more like the tied bug would make a difference.  I might have to try that for fun just to see. They are starting to make the colored hooks in trout sizes too.  I saw some at a fly shop on the Beaverhead River and Lou Teletski gave me a fly that used a red hook when we went fishing the other day.  I haven’t tried them yet, but I can see how they might benefit a fly tyer. —

I’ve been using red nymph hooks for five or six years.  It’s the only color I’ve seen in the smaller sizes. As far as glitter is concerned, good old nail polish (Wet and Wild) with the silver or gold flecks in it works well.  Also, Orvis sells some head cement with silver flecks.   Dave

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I’ve been using red nymph hooks for five or six years.  It’s the only color I’ve seen in the smaller sizes. As far as glitter is concerned, good old nail polish (Wet and Wild) with the silver or gold flecks in it works well.  Also, Orvis sells some head cement with silver flecks. Dave

Do you think there’s an advantage in using colored hooks? The nail polish idea is a good one — you can get it in any crazy color these days, and Wet & Wild is pretty cheap, but the clerk at the store might look at you funny. Sandy

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Reading about colored hooks now is a revelation to me Jon and I suppose it makes sense to include the hook coloring of olive, for instance, to add to the tone of an olive caddis emerger, for instance.  It seems this is one of those rare instances where the present generation is going to drag me, screaming and kicking into the future.  I might be an old dog learning new tricks but it doesn’t mean I have to like it. Now if you please, would someone hold my hand down hard upon this table so it won’t lift that shot of Jack Daniels to my quivering lips? Mr. G. All’s Fair With Fur or Feather gg

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……. But trout are also very used to seeing things on insects – broken legs and wings, a sliver of leaf or filament of weed, or even a pebble and twig case on a caddis.  The trout sees it and just assumes it’s a harmless piece of flotsam, extra fiber if you will.  Only if a trout has been hooked a number of times would he actually recognize it as a "bad" insect, IMO.

Yes, that’s all plausible. JR

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Do you think there’s an advantage in using colored hooks? The nail polish idea is a good one — you can get it in any crazy color these days, and Wet & Wild is pretty cheap, but the clerk at the store might look at you funny.

I called up that fly shop in Dillon and they said the hooks are manufactured by Daiichi.  I checked the Daiichi website and they have red, black, nickel and gold hooks in a variety of styles.  Unfortunately they do not list their hooks that would be of use to fly fishermen so I emailed the company for more information.  Here is a link to their website if you care to take a look. http://www.daiichihooks.com/daiichi/index.html — Warren Findley Remove (nospamZZ) to respond via email http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt/

Response:

I called up that fly shop in Dillon and they said the hooks are manufactured by Daiichi.  I checked the Daiichi website and they have red, black, nickel and gold hooks in a variety of styles.  Unfortunately they do not list their hooks that would be of use to fly fishermen so I emailed the company for more information.  Here is a link to their website if you care to take a look. http://www.daiichihooks.com/daiichi/index.html

   Another manufacturer of colored hooks is Gamakatsu (www.gamakatsu.com). I’ve seen them in the local fly shops but never tied with them, but I’ll vouch for the quality of their product. I was a serious ocean/big game fisherman in a past life; Gamakatsu and Owner were the only hooks I’d use.

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Warren?  Wouldn’t you t hink a gold hook would most likely be like adding gold tinsel to a fly?  I don’t know. George All’s Fair With Fur or Feather gg

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I think, but have no proof for it, that hook recognition develops in fish over time and that this is a major part of what we anglers call "selective behavior". I feel this is mostly a factor with flies at/near the surface, and more an issue in slower, richer streams that offer more time for the fish to observe their prey. On many subsurface patterns, and even some surface emerger types, the hook bend can serve to mimic the shape of the natural nymph,pupa or whatever.

I agree it’s mostly a factor in slower, richer streams.  I’d have thought, though, it was also more important with subsurface flies than with dries, first because the "profile" of the bend is reduced when viewed from below, and second because, as well described by Peter in the Fly Perceptions thread, it may be that the bare part of the hook is somewhat masked by the dimples and associated halos caused by the hackle and tail. JR

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When I first read the header to this post I ignored because I thought it was sex site SPAM!!!!!!!

Sorry.  Fine state of affairs when we *expect* to see sex spam, ain’t it? What you say may very well be true, but like I said in another post, it’s something that confirms my opinion that fish perceive our flies in a very different way from the way we do. That "big-ass curvy part" is very evident to me and seems even more prevalent in smaller flies. Maybe they ignore it because they tend to look for certain things that are "right" about a fly or for a certain trigger instead of things that are "wrong." Maybe those "educated" fish have learned to look for things that are "wrong" as well???

Well, my speculations were just musings.  To me, it remains a great mystery that fish will overlook something so conspicuous.  On the other hand, say a fish ignores a nymph presented once, twice, and takes it on the third cast.  It might well be that, just by chance, the fly was turned the third time in a way to present a top or bottom view (with the bare hook bend hidden), while the first two times, again by chance alone, the fly passed the fish turned in a way that presented the fly more in profile, with the bend more exposed. When fishing the traditional downstream swing for steelhead here in the PNW, one tactic is to throw upstream mends to slow down the swing, allowing the fish the longest possible view of the fly (a good tactic when swinging soft hackles for trout, too).  A disadvantage is that unless you use a riffle hitch or some such, the view the fish has tends to be a butt-on, reduced view.  It addition to the riffle hitch, a greased line presentation also serves to give the fish a full profile view of the fly.  The difference (from fishing for trout) is that you just want the steelhead to see the very most of whatever silhouette the fly happens to have, to maximize the sheer provocation value of the fly–you’re not trying to imitate any particular natural foodstuff.  Here the more bare hook you have visible, maybe the better.  Some manufacturers are now producing bright gold, green, red and blue salmon/steelhead hooks.  Why waste all that bare metal when you can dress it up? JR

Response:

I’ve often wondered about that "big-ass curvy part", but most of the time it doesn’t seem to bother the trout’s attraction to the lure.

Good thing, too, otherwise we’d all have to find another sport.  ;)  I guess that’s what amazes me:  that it *doesn’t* bother the fish while very minor differences in other parts of the fly will make a difference. JR

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Maybe that big curvy part looks like an ovipositor.  See my web site www.sluttyflies.com

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I believe that many streams (I know of three) where the fish are "opportunistic" — that is, if it looks like it could be food, they will strike it.  On the rivers I recently visited in Idaho, there was no hatch, yet they readily took a humpy or a Klinkhammer, the bigger the better.  The guide gave my grandson a #10 red humpy and I marveled at its effectiveness.   This is just the opposite of another river I fish – when there is no hatch, the fish will rise to a very small, well presented dry.  Nymphing the rivers in Idaho was very successful, but again you had to give them a big nymph.  My #18s and 20s were useless.  Those same 18s and 20s on another river will catch many fish.

"Bigger is better" is right. I seldom use dries smaller than #12 or nymphs smaller than #14 in those Idaho waters you fished. I think the deal is that they’re relatively sterile freestone rivers. The fish jump on whatever they see that looks edible. Large, good floating Chernobyl patterns with dropper nymphs are very effective. So are large orange stimulators. You can catch these fish with an indicator attached to a bare hook. I only use the standard nymph patterns — pheasant tails, hare’s ears, prince nymphs, and lately copper johns. Also, the fish are mostly cutthroats, which are notoriously gullible. It doesn’t make for particularly challenging fishing (aside from the ass-busting hiking to get to the good spots), but it’s fun. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

John replies:  I’d have thought, though, it was also more important with subsurface flies than with dries, first because the "profile" of the bend is reduced when viewed from below,

But,one can build the body into most of the bend, use hook shape to the advantage of simulation. it may be that the bare part of the hook is somewhat masked by the dimples and associated halos caused by the hackle and tail.

I disagree. If you watch how a fresh, well hackled dry fly floats, the hook penetrates the surface,except for a tightly palmered hackle. Most dries settle right on top of the surface with the body, with some hackle tips in the water and the ones on the sides doing the work of holding the fly up. Anyhow, the hook will be seen, and quite distinctly from the body silhouette.                              Tom L

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John writes: just what do we imagine the fish make of that big long hook bend

I think, but have no proof for it, that hook recognition develops in fish over time and that this is a major part of what we anglers call "selective behavior". I feel this is mostly a factor with flies at/near the surface, and more an issue in slower, richer streams that offer more time for the fish to observe their prey. On many subsurface patterns, and even some surface emerger types, the hook bend can serve to mimic the shape of the natural nymph,pupa or whatever.                                Tom L

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John writes: just what do we imagine the fish make of that big long hook bend I think, but have no proof for it, that hook recognition develops in fish over time and that this is a major part of what we anglers call "selective behavior". I feel this is mostly a factor with flies at/near the surface, and more an issue in slower, richer streams that offer more time for the fish to observe their prey. On many subsurface patterns, and even some surface emerger types, the hook bend can serve to mimic the shape of the natural nymph,pupa or whatever.

When I first read the header to this post I ignored because I thought it was sex site SPAM!!!!!!! What you say may very well be true, but like I said in another post, it’s something that confirms my opinion that fish perceive our flies in a very different way from the way we do. That "big-ass curvy part" is very evident to me and seems even more prevalent in smaller flies. Maybe they ignore it because they tend to look for certain things that are "right" about a fly or for a certain trigger instead of things that are "wrong." Maybe those "educated" fish have learned to look for things that are "wrong" as well??? Willi

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Willi writes: John writes: just what do we imagine the fish make of that big long hook bend I think, but have no proof for it, that hook recognition develops in fish over time and that this is a major part of what we anglers call "selective behavior". I feel this is mostly a factor with flies at/near the surface, and more an issue in slower, richer streams that offer more time for the fish to observe their prey. On many subsurface patterns, and even some surface emerger types, the hook bend can serve to mimic the shape of the natural nymph,pupa or whatever. When I first read the header to this post I ignored because I thought it was sex site SPAM!!!!!!! What you say may very well be true, but like I said in another post, it’s something that confirms my opinion that fish perceive our flies in a very different way from the way we do. That "big-ass curvy part" is very evident to me and seems even more prevalent in smaller flies. Maybe they ignore it because they tend to look for certain things that are "right" about a fly or for a certain trigger instead of things that are "wrong." Maybe those "educated" fish have learned to look for things that are "wrong" as well??? Willi

I believe that many streams (I know of three) where the fish are "opportunistic" — that is, if it looks like it could be food, they will strike it.  On the rivers I recently visited in Idaho, there was no hatch, yet they readily took a humpy or a Klinkhammer, the bigger the better.  The guide gave my grandson a #10 red humpy and I marveled at its effectiveness.   This is just the opposite of another river I fish – when there is no hatch, the fish will rise to a very small, well presented dry.  Nymphing the rivers in Idaho was very successful, but again you had to give them a big nymph.  My #18s and 20s were useless.  Those same 18s and 20s on another river will catch many fish. I’ve often wondered about that "big-ass curvy part", but most of the time it doesn’t seem to bother the trout’s attraction to the lure. Dave

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The recent discussion about wings, fishes’ perception, etc., reminded me of something I’ve often wondered, even marveled about–one of those things that come unbidden to mind on the thousandth (or two thousandth) fishless cast of the day on a steelhead river. Those of us who agonize over the minutiae of wing size, or number of fibers in the tail, or shade of copper in the ribbing:  just what do we imagine the fish make of that big long hook bend that on some patterns constitutes 50% or more of the whole gestalt (if you’ll pardon the word) presented to the fish?  Think of some ties you’ve seen of English PTs or soft hackles on those short hooks with absolutely huge gaps; yet these are effective flies.  You’d think (regardless of your species-specific sense of perception) that this big ol’ ugly THING just hanging there off the bottom of our handiwork is a lot more obvious than the many fine details we obsess over.  Why on earth would any trout swimming not key on THAT? I’d imagine the influence of the hook bend is least when the fly is viewed from directly above (in which case for most flies, it’s invisible); almost as little when viewed from directly below; slightly greater when viewed at an oblique angle above, behind, or to side; and greatest when viewed at right angles from the side.   If this is right, could it be one reason (in addition to the commonly cited ones) a straight downstream presentation of a dry is successful when casting to selective fish on calm waters?  Could there be implications for presentation of nymphs in slower water?  A reason why LaFontaine’s sparkle pupa (with the bend shrouded) is so effective?  A reason to use nothing but the lightest wire hooks available? (A reason for me to get a life and think about more useful things?) JR

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey All, I’ve finally taken the plunge and decided to Build my first fly rod.I’ve ordered a St.Croix Avid nine foot seven weight.I figured I’d go with a kit for my first one so that at least all the components would match and I didn’t want to spend too much money in case I  f**k it up.This rod will fill nicely a gap in my rod collection.I like flyfishing for largemouths and my nine weight seems like overkill and my six weight not enough.I’m not buying any fancy tools (yet),I’m going to be doing it the old way using a heavy book for tension and turning the rod every few minutes while I watch t.v..I’d appreciate any tips on what usually goes wrong for first time rod builders. regards,Shawn

Several points to ponder: Get Garcia’s book on graphite rodbuilding. tons of good info there, especially if you’ll be turning the rod by hand. also: Instead of 5 minute epoxy for the reel seat, etc, go for something with a slightly longer cure time. I found some 15′ stuff that worked well, and was even stronger. makes you a bit less nervous about getting everything the way you want it in 5′ as well. Keep redoing the wraps until they’re just the way you want them. Wrap the winding check last; it’s the most visible wrap when you’re fishing, and by saving it for the end, you’ll have all that practice beforehand. Take one last look at the wraps and the guide alignment before you mix the rod finish. Once the epoxy goes on the rod, there’s no turning back. Use syringes to measure the epoxy and hardener, and use only syringes made/sold expressly for rodbuilding. Medical syringes, while cheap and abundant, have nothing to offer the rodbuilder but misery and regret. You *will* get bubbles in the finished wraps. Steam from a cup of hot water will make them go away. I’ve hand-turned all my rods and gotten nice results. Got nothing against the automatic turners, just don’t have one. Follow Garcia’s suggestions for turning intervals and you should be fine. I strongly suggest that you use an oven timer or something similar to remind you to get up and turn the rod, especially near the end, when the intervals have stretched to 30-60′. Finally, my overall advice is to be patient, and do a quality job. Your care (or haste) in building it will be evident for many years. — Rusty Hook Laramie, Wyoming

Response:

A * much * better solvent for epoxies is acetone. — Don Thompson Another Thompson Scion

Acetone must be used with great care near rods. It will eat into the blank and damage it irreparably. Alcohol is better for wiping off excess epoxy for this reason. TL MC

Response:

Thanks Guys,  I’m going crazy waiting for the damn thing to arrive in the mail.I was hoping to get it done this week while I’m still on vacation.I have a video and a pretty good book so I’m hoping things will go pretty smoothly, but no book or video can prepare you for my own personal style of screwups.My attitude is if I mess up I’ll just scrape it off and start over until I get it right. Regards,Shawn

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A * much * better solvent for epoxies is acetone. — Don Thompson Another Thompson Scion Acetone must be used with great care near rods. It will eat into the blank and damage it irreparably. Alcohol is better for wiping off excess epoxy for this reason. TL MC

Response:

Hey All, I’ve finally taken the plunge and decided to Build my first fly rod.I’ve ordered a St.Croix Avid nine foot seven weight.I figured I’d go with a kit for my first one so that at least all the components would match and I didn’t want to spend too much money in case I  f**k it up.This rod will fill nicely a gap in my rod collection.I like flyfishing for largemouths and my nine weight seems like overkill and my six weight not enough.I’m not buying any fancy tools (yet),I’m going to be doing it the old way using a heavy book for tension and turning the rod every few minutes while I watch t.v..I’d appreciate any tips on what usually goes wrong for first time rod builders. regards,Shawn

Response:

I’m not buying any fancy tools (yet),I’m going to be doing it the old way using a heavy book for tension and turning the rod every few minutes while I watch t.v..I’d appreciate any tips on what usually goes wrong for first time rod builders.

They watch some damn show that captures their interest and don’t turn the rod often enough. — Don Thompson Another Thompson Scion – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – regards,Shawn

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I’d appreciate any tips on what usually goes wrong for first time rod builders. It starts with opening the package and goes down hill from there. The bright side is…you learn from every mistake. Have fun…it really ain’t that hard. jim

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Its already been said –  Epoxy keeps flowing after you’r really sure it’s set up.  You may turn the thing for hours and be sure it set, so you put it up.  Next morning bumps where overnight the stuff has continued to flow.  If you can jury rig something to turn it do so ( I made one cheap using a dryer timing motor 6RPM) If you have never built or repaired a rod before I suggest going to Goodwill or Salvation Army and buying one.  Redo the guides and then give it back to them, it’s cheap practice. Good Luck

I’d appreciate any tips on what usually goes wrong for first time rod – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -builders. regards,Shawn

Response:

Hey All, I’ve finally taken the plunge and decided to Build my first fly rod.I’ve ordered a St.Croix Avid nine foot seven weight.I figured I’d go with a kit for my first one so that at least all the components would match and I didn’t want to spend too much money in case I  f**k it up.This rod will fill nicely a gap in my rod collection.I like flyfishing for largemouths and my nine weight seems like overkill and my six weight not enough.I’m not buying any fancy tools (yet),I’m going to be doing it the old way using a heavy book for tension and turning the rod every few minutes while I watch t.v..I’d appreciate any tips on what usually goes wrong for first time rod builders. regards,Shawn

Here’s a couple of items could save you some grief. Don’t use 5 minute epoxy to put on the reel seat or the handle. It can take longer than 5 minutes to get things properly situated. Use something with a longer pot life. Be real careful mixing up the wrap coating epoxy lest it set sticky. Use a minimum of 3 cc’s of each component when mixing. This will tend to minimize the error in measuring equal quantities. The stuff tends to be real sensitive to silicones which tend to be found in plastic measuring and mixing cups, stirring rods etc. There are these special syringes supplied by the coating maker for measuring the stuff which are guaranteed free of it. Don’t use any substitutes. Mix the stuff up in something made of glass like a shot glass and stir it with something like a stainless steel spoon handle. Denatured alcohol will work as a solvent to clean up afterward. good luck Mike — Michael McGuire                     Hewlett Packard Laboratories Phone: (650)-857-5491               Palo Alto, CA 94303-0971          

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Be real careful mixing up the wrap coating epoxy lest it set sticky. Use a minimum of 3 cc’s of each component when mixing. This will tend to minimize the error in measuring equal quantities.

Good advice all around.  Equal parts is a good thing.  I’ve been able to use steel kitchen measuring spoons to mix up 1 teaspoon at a time w/o problems. Mu

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey All, I’ve finally taken the plunge and decided to Build my first fly rod.I’ve ordered a St.Croix Avid nine foot seven weight.I figured I’d go with a kit for my first one so that at least all the components would match and I didn’t want to spend too much money in case I  f**k it up.This rod will fill nicely a gap in my rod collection.I like flyfishing for largemouths and my nine weight seems like overkill and my six weight not enough.I’m not buying any fancy tools (yet),I’m going to be doing it the old way using a heavy book for tension and turning the rod every few minutes while I watch t.v..I’d appreciate any tips on what usually goes wrong for first time rod builders. regards,Shawn Here’s a couple of items could save you some grief. Don’t use 5 minute epoxy to put on the reel seat or the handle. It can take longer than 5 minutes to get things properly situated. Use something with a longer pot life. Be real careful mixing up the wrap coating epoxy lest it set sticky. Use a minimum of 3 cc’s of each component when mixing. This will tend to minimize the error in measuring equal quantities. The stuff tends to be real sensitive to silicones which tend to be found in plastic measuring and mixing cups, stirring rods etc. There are these special syringes supplied by the coating maker for measuring the stuff which are guaranteed free of it. Don’t use any substitutes. Mix the stuff up in something made of glass like a shot glass and stir it with something like a stainless steel spoon handle. Denatured alcohol will work as a solvent to clean up afterward.

A * much * better solvent for epoxies is acetone. — Don Thompson Another Thompson Scion – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – good luck Mike — Michael McGuire                     Hewlett Packard Laboratories Phone: (650)-857-5491               Palo Alto, CA 94303-0971

Response:

… Denatured alcohol will work as a solvent to clean up afterward. A * much * better solvent for epoxies is acetone. — Don Thompson

There is some opinion out there that acetone attacks rod finishes. Denatured alcohol has worked quite well for me for cleaning up epoxy that’s still in the fluid state, and it’s arguably less toxic for skin contact and vapor too. But acetone may be the right answer if the stuff has started to set up and you need to get it off. Mike — Michael McGuire                     Hewlett Packard Laboratories Phone: (650)-857-5491               Palo Alto, CA 94303-0971          

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I’d rather throw a few spoons and shot glasses away than mess around with acetone in the  house.   Very flamable. Great stuff if your an arsonist because it leaves almost no residue. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A * much * better solvent for epoxies is acetone. — Don Thompson Another Thompson Scion good luck Mike — Michael McGuire                     Hewlett Packard Laboratories Phone: (650)-857-5491               Palo Alto, CA 94303-0971

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I’d rather throw a few spoons and shot glasses away than mess around with acetone in the  house.   Very flamable. Great stuff if your an arsonist because it leaves almost no residue. A * much * better solvent for epoxies is acetone.

Or just go to a charity store and buy a "china" (i.e., not plastic) dinner plate and a few dinner/butter knives.  The plate "palette" will lhave room for several batches. TC, R

Response:

Actually not.It leaves a distinct burn pattern that is readily aparent to an accomplished fire investigator. — Don Thompson Another Thompson Scion

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’d rather throw a few spoons and shot glasses away than mess around with acetone in the  house.   Very flamable. Great stuff if your an arsonist because it leaves almost no residue. A * much * better solvent for epoxies is acetone. — Don Thompson Another Thompson Scion good luck Mike — Michael McGuire                     Hewlett Packard Laboratories Phone: (650)-857-5491               Palo Alto, CA 94303-0971

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Question:

rw, You are beginning to sound like Forty and his objection to squaw,

You really think so? Never mind, then. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Which is one reason why I do it. TL MC — "Where fishing is concerned, most anglers are basically manic excessives" http://www.mikeconnor.de – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …to paraphrase Robert Lynd (who was talking about playing golf):  It’s almost impossible to remember how tragic a place the world is when one is flyfishing.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Have you seen the sponsored landmine site – sponsorship helps to repair the damage done by these amoral weapons – yeah yeah I know it is the user not the weapon but you get my drift. "Land mines." I feel I must call attention to a serious lack of sensitivity in the flyfishing community. I am of course referring to the use of the term "Chernobyl", as in Chernobyl Ant, Chernobyl Hopper, and several other so-called fly patterns of similar type. Don’t you people realize that over 70,000 Ukranians alone were killed or disabled by the tragedy of the Chernobyl nuclear accident, and that their descendants will continue to suffer the effects, including grotesque mutations and birth defects, for years to come? It is insensitive and irresponsible in the extreme to make light of that deplorable and tragic accident just to make a catchy name for something as frivolous as a fishing fly.

_____  gee r.w.?  You had to post this just when I was about to release the New 2001 products list: 1)  Chernobyl "First Strike" Glow Indicators 2)  Green Chernobyl Fish-Fuzz 3)  Chernobyl (half-life) Sun Tan Cream 4)  The Dirty Nuclear Green Machine Fly 5)  Heavy Hydrogen Sinking Chernobyl Tippets I have more, but out of respect to your point of view, I cannot release these products.

Response:

_____  gee r.w.?  You had to post this just when I was about to release the New 2001 products list: 1)  Chernobyl "First Strike" Glow Indicators

Great product name. George. You may be crazy, but you aren’t stupid. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

RW, I don’t think most of these guys would think it was funny if THEY were on the VA Agent Orange and/or Gulf War Syndrome registry. El Paso Bob – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Have you seen the sponsored landmine site – sponsorship helps to repair the damage done by these amoral weapons – yeah yeah I know it is the user not the weapon but you get my drift. "Land mines." I feel I must call attention to a serious lack of sensitivity in the flyfishing community. I am of course referring to the use of the term "Chernobyl", as in Chernobyl Ant, Chernobyl Hopper, and several other so-called fly patterns of similar type. Don’t you people realize that over 70,000 Ukranians alone were killed or disabled by the tragedy of the Chernobyl nuclear accident, and that their descendants will continue to suffer the effects, including grotesque mutations and birth defects, for years to come? It is insensitive and irresponsible in the extreme to make light of that deplorable and tragic accident just to make a catchy name for something as frivolous as a fishing fly. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

RW, I don’t think most of these guys would think it was funny if THEY were on the VA Agent Orange and/or Gulf War Syndrome registry.

This has nothing to do with anything, but RWJ’s post reminded me of the story: I’ve known a lot of stupid people in my life, but one guy stands out in my memory.   He was a coworker many years ago who, through little fault of his own, had apparently no concept of the world most of us consider normal. From our conversations over the years, I concluded that he’d been raised in a home situation lacking in intellectual stimulation, financial stability, and positive encouragement.   On top of that, he was of small stature, and seemed to feel a constant need to prove that he was both tough and smart. He was, in fact, insecure and not very bright.   But that’s only background. He took up body building, and I believe he seriously thought about pursuing a career as a "professional wrestler".   He began weight lifting, and in his desire to acquire the bodybuilder look, he decided that he needed a tan; and he answered one of those back-of-the-magazine ads for a product that allows you to "tan without the sun".   I don’t know what was in the pills he received, but he took them as directed (knowing him though, probably at twice the dosage).   He was encouraged that his skin did begin to darken, and he continued his regimen.   Ultimately, he turned orange.   Not brightly, of course, but as the color effect intensified over time, there wasn’t a hint of brown to be seen.   He was undoubtedly orange.   He, of course, saw this an a precursor to "tan" and kept taking the pills, until he was unmistakably orange right down to his fingernails. In the end, he only earned the nickname "Agent Orange" that stayed with him for the rest of the time we knew him.   What a character.

Response:

rw, You are beginning to sound like Forty and his objection to squaw, "rw" wrote – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I feel I must call attention to a serious lack of sensitivity in the flyfishing community. I am of course referring to the use of the term "Chernobyl", as in Chernobyl Ant, Chernobyl Hopper, and several other so-called fly patterns of similar type. Don’t you people realize that over 70,000 Ukranians alone were killed or disabled by the tragedy of the Chernobyl nuclear accident, and that their descendants will continue to suffer the effects, including grotesque mutations and birth defects, for years to come? It is insensitive and irresponsible in the extreme to make light of that deplorable and tragic accident just to make a catchy name for something as frivolous as a fishing fly.

Response:

…to paraphrase Robert Lynd (who was talking about playing golf):  It’s almost impossible to remember how tragic a place the world is when one is flyfishing. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "Land mines." — that one is funny until you think about it. Brought to mind the old M.A.S.H. episode in which the Korean family had their child out front when plowing the fields to make sure the family ox wasn’t killed by a land mine.. Joe F. Ya, it’s a realy sad commentary on extreme rural poverty – a child is more expendable than the ox.  Farmers, their children and their animals are still at risk from landmines in much of SE Asia and Africa.  Wonderful legacy of the arms merchants. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://members.home.net/pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

Before the Gulf War Barbara Walters did a story on gender roles in Kuwait. She noted that women customarily walked about 10 feet behind their husbands. She returned to Kuwait recently and observed that the men now walked several yards behind their wives. Ms. Walters approached one of the women for an explanation. "This is marvelous," she said, "what enabled women to achieve such respect?"  The Kuwaiti woman replied, "Land mines." — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Before the Gulf War Barbara Walters did a story on gender roles in Kuwait. She noted that women customarily walked about 10 feet behind their husbands. She returned to Kuwait recently and observed that the men now walked several yards behind their wives. Ms. Walters approached one of the women for an explanation. "This is marvelous," she said, "what enabled women to achieve such respect?"  The Kuwaiti woman replied, "Land mines." —

that one is funny until you think about it. Peter

Response:

"Land mines." — that one is funny until you think about it.

Brought to mind the old M.A.S.H. episode in which the Korean family had their child out front when plowing the fields to make sure the family ox wasn’t killed by a land mine.. Joe F.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "Land mines." — that one is funny until you think about it. Brought to mind the old M.A.S.H. episode in which the Korean family had their child out front when plowing the fields to make sure the family ox wasn’t killed by a land mine.. Joe F.

Ya, it’s a realy sad commentary on extreme rural poverty – a child is more expendable than the ox.  Farmers, their children and their animals are still at risk from landmines in much of SE Asia and Africa.  Wonderful legacy of the arms merchants. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://members.home.net/pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

I shoulda used this tactic with my ex-wife. The insurance money would have bought *several* nice bamboo rods. <g

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Before the Gulf War Barbara Walters did a story on gender roles in Kuwait. She noted that women customarily walked about 10 feet behind their husbands. She returned to Kuwait recently and observed that the men now walked several yards behind their wives. Ms. Walters approached one of the women for an explanation. "This is marvelous," she said, "what enabled women to achieve such respect?"  The Kuwaiti woman replied, "Land mines." — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Have you seen the sponsored landmine site – sponsorship helps to repair the damage done by these amoral weapons – yeah yeah I know it is the user not the weapon but you get my drift. "Land mines."

– Charles Reaves

Response:

Have you seen the sponsored landmine site – sponsorship helps to repair the damage done by these amoral weapons – yeah yeah I know it is the user not the weapon but you get my drift. "Land mines." — Charles Reaves

I’ve seen a few sites that cover landmines (I think I have them bookmarked somewhere) plus prgrams on Canadian and British demining teams at work in places like Bosnia.   Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://members.home.net/pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

Have you seen the sponsored landmine site – sponsorship helps to repair the damage done by these amoral weapons – yeah yeah I know it is the user not the weapon but you get my drift. "Land mines."

I feel I must call attention to a serious lack of sensitivity in the flyfishing community. I am of course referring to the use of the term "Chernobyl", as in Chernobyl Ant, Chernobyl Hopper, and several other so-called fly patterns of similar type. Don’t you people realize that over 70,000 Ukranians alone were killed or disabled by the tragedy of the Chernobyl nuclear accident, and that their descendants will continue to suffer the effects, including grotesque mutations and birth defects, for years to come? It is insensitive and irresponsible in the extreme to make light of that deplorable and tragic accident just to make a catchy name for something as frivolous as a fishing fly. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Question:

Got into Boiling Springs around 8:00 and decided to try the easy access to Yellow Breeches at the Allenberry Playhouse.  Turns out Joe Humphreys was having a FF school, starting that very night, through Sunday noon.  Well, I’m a Joe Humphreys "fan" I guess you could say, having met him a couple times and read his book and liked what I got out of it.  Ed Shenk was teaching with him (originator of the Letort Cricket, Letort Hopper, Shenk’s Sculpin, etc.)  About 120 years of experience there.  Even though I thought it was kind of pricey ($365) and I had already missed a couple hours, I decided to sign up on a whim.  My "review" of the school is a mixed one, as is my opinion of the stream (keep in mind this is the first time I ever fished there, and only a small stretch at that.) The catch and release stretch behind Allenberry gets unbelievable pressure.  At least I’m not used to that much pressure.  Friday evening there were about 8 people in sight within a hundred yard stretch or so.  They were flailing the water, but I never saw anyone catch anything.  This is a well stocked area by the way.  They were getting record heat, and the water temp was up to about 70, despite the cold spring flow from Boiling Springs.  Well, Joe walks out into the middle of all that to demo to us: "This is how you fish a wet fly", and he pulls out 2 trout in 10 minutes.  "This is how you fish a nymph", and pulls out 3 trout in 15 more minutes.  I guess the other fishermen are used to seeing that because no one raised an eyebrow.  Looked easy enough to me. Class was supposed to start 8:00 the next morning (at the breakfast table – not enough fishing time for me!)  So I got on the stream at 6:15 and fished the same area he did, with nymphs.  I was not alone, but had some elbow room.  By 8:00 I had caught 4, as well as foul hooked 2 more, which tells me they really must have been stacked in some of those feeding lanes.  These were stocked fish of about 9-11".  I thought it would be an easy weekend to fish (boy was I wrong.)  When I left, the stream was packed again. To make a long story short about the class, Joe and Ed are obviously good and experienced fishermen.  They went over all the stuff you would think, and with the obvious problems.  There were 5 beginners (4 had never cast a fly rod), and 3 of us who had fished at least a year.  The 3 of us had to hear a lot of things we already knew, while the raw beginners didn’t get the intro on some topics they needed.  While Ed was showing blood knots for tying tippet to leader, someone would lean over and ask me what a tippet was.  While Joe was talking about terrestrial dries, someone would ask me if they were called terrestrials because they float on the surface instead of sink. On the other hand, some of the casting and just plain fishing information was very informative in a sort of piecemeal way.  They each brought their own unique ideas on how to do things, and it didn’t always jibe with the traditional, popular ways.  Part of the fun was eating meals and just hanging out with these guys, and hearing stories, etc.  e.g. Joe mentioned that sometimes trout are right or left hand feeders.  Ed gave him shit about the "one-eyed trout".  Seems Joe had some students at a stream obsrerving a trout feeding to one side.  He explained why it might feed only to that side because of various conditions, and he cast to the other side repeatedly and couldn’t catch it.  Then he cast to the correct side, and hooked and landed it.  When showing the trout, it turns out it’s left eye was injured and completely blind.  I learned Joe used to coach wrestling, and I used to wrestle.  As we walked away from the table once he went to put his hand on my shoulder, and as a joke I threw in an arm lock.  He immediately wrenched me right back and said "You’ll never get it."  I got the distinct impression he could have ground me into the mat.  Not bad for a 71 year old guy.  Ed guides the area streams, such as the Letort (for a very reasonable rate by the way) and said we could give him a call if we wanted to go sometime.  I asked if he had an email address, at which point he called me "one of those wiseass computer guys."  (he does not have email, but email me and I’ll give you his phone number if you think you’d like to hire him.)  When I would make a bad double haul, Joe said he was gonna kick my ass.  Point being, they seemed to know what kind of ribbing each person could take, as each person seemed to feel like they got treated well by them in terms of instruction.  They were much gentler to the newbies Joe seems to have a competitive attitude toward fishing.  He considers every set of conditions a challenge, and he fishes with raw determination and will power when "the chips are down".  As I alluded to earlier, the fishing was tough.  Other than Joe and Ed, I only saw a few fish caught that weekend. Those fish were tough.  The highlight for me was fishing for about 2 hours on Sunday with various dries without getting so much as a look from a fish.  Joe took 3 of us fishing down the stream and it turned into us basically looking over his shoulder as he fished.  He really worked every pocket, every cast.  He caught 3 fish in 45 minutes, and 2 really left an impression on me.  The last one I never even saw, and I don’t know how he found it, but once he showed us we could just *barely* see it.  He could not raise the fish with about 10 drifts.  He said "You wanna see how to catch a fish like that?"  He cut off the dry and tied on a grey scud.  His cast was perfect the first time, about 3 feet ahead of the fish *directly* in its lane.  I never saw the fish take it, and neither did the other 2 guys, so we were surprised when he set the hook.  Yet he hooked it square inside the jaw.  That’s just one example we saw, but after having watched him for the weekend, I think the guy can just flat out *fish*. At one point during this period, we counted FIFTEEN other fishermen within view.  I really can’t say I cared much for this stream.  So much hard work for very fished over, finicky fish that when all was said and done were still just 8-12" stocked fish.  Again, I’m just talking about a quarter mile or so stretch at the Allenberry, and maybe other stretches would be better.  Also, as I said the water temps were getting up there and maybe the fish were just getting a bit stressed.  If it hadn’t been for my early morning jaunt I wouldn’t have caught a fish.  In fact only 1 guy (or maybe 2) in the group did, and I don’t think that’s a very good introduction for beginners.  On the other hand, the accomodations and food and easy stream access were pluses. As I left town, I stopped in the Yellow Breeches Fly Shop.  I thought this was a very nice shop, and the 2 guys in there were very helpful and personable. They also had a very impressive book collection – the biggest I’ve ever seen in one store, in fact.  I added a few to my collection – "In the Ring of the Rise" is of course a classic, and a couple chapters were what I expected, but that sure is a strange book.  Also got a nice Montana guide and map book (one more month!) Regards, Jeff

Response:

Yellow Breeches, PA and Allenberry FF school report

hello- please e-mail direct for some advice on trout streams near Allenberry where there is little or no pressure and lots of trout. A day after the stocking truck leaves, and the truck followers leave, the streams are mostly wide open.Cumberland county (Allenberry) has lots of mountain streams and lots of good fishing.I’d be pleased to give out info.

Response:

Got into Boiling Springs around 8:00 and decided to try the easy access to Yellow Breeches at the Allenberry Playhouse.  Turns out Joe Humphreys was

Very nice report again. Keep them coming Jeff. TL MC — "In order to know what is possible one must constantly attempt the impossible" http://www.mikeconnor.de "

Response:

I’ve fished two weekends with Joe Humphreys, trying to catch the Green Drake hatch on Pine Creek.  He’s not a startling distance caster.  But he is amazing with placement, on the water and around obstacles.  And he is beyond compare with tight line nymphing, which takes care of 90% of a trout’s diet.   In a place (Cedar Run?) where I had caught two little native Brook Trout, one still with parr marks, by approaching a little pool on my knees, he banged in three casts and took two 9" Brookies and a 14" Brown.   He did it by casting under a branch from more than 25 feet away, landing at the foot of the pool twice in the feeding lanes of trout that had spooked away when I approached the pool and then casting another 5 feet up the pool against a ledge where the dominant trout in the pool was hiding.  In an area where I couldn’t find room for a 15 foot backcast. On the Yellow Breeches, Herb Weigel of Cold Spring Anglers (717-245-2646) guided me into 5 or 6 well conditioned, bright colored holdovers or stockers while the rest of the assembly line of flyfishers in the special regulations area seemed to be coming up dry.  Bright dot midge dry fly.  I found the experience gratifying (I looked like I knew what I was doing) but I’d rather spook a merganser on a lesser stream than hit a crowd of fellow fishers. My 2 cents worth. GKT

Response:

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hi everyone,    I just received in the mail the chance to order Lefty’s Little Library of Fly Fishing.  Has anyone seen these books?  Or read them?  I am very interested in hearing your opinion.  I think I am going to order them but still wanted some ROFF thoughts.  Thanks. J. Koop McMinnville, OR.   </PRE</HTML

I’ve got the whole library. I’ve read them all. Most are pretty good. Some are very good. Some are so-so. I think it’s worth the price. They are easy to buy one book at a time. Good Luck! Joel Axelrad

Response:

Ditto                     Frank Reid – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve got the whole library. I’ve read them all. Most are pretty good. Some are very good. Some are so-so. I think it’s worth the price. They are easy to buy one book at a time. Good Luck! Joel Axelrad

Response:

I sent the bone fishing book back ’cause I figured if this old body gets down there it will be some one spreading my ashes on the water.  Got all the rest though and some pretty good words of wisdom.  I really love the tips and tricks book.                                     Frank Reid

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ditto                     Frank Reid I’ve got the whole library. I’ve read them all. Most are pretty good. Some are very good. Some are so-so. I think it’s worth the price. They are easy to buy one book at a time. Good Luck! Joel Axelrad

Response:

I’m a stream and lake trout fisher.  I purchased and kept the first 10 or so books and then cancelled the subscription because I noticed the books were changing to fishing styles I don’t need. As for reading the books, I’m saving that for retirement.  I’ve got the collection on the book shelf of my retirement home that I hope to occupy full time in about 4 years. Bob

Response:

Hi everyone,         I just received in the mail the chance to order Lefty’s Little Library of Fly Fishing.  Has anyone seen these books?  Or read them?  I am very interested in hearing your opinion.  I think I am going to order them but still wanted  some ROFF thoughts.  Thanks. J. Koop McMinnville, OR.  

Response:

Question:

A friend will be in the St Petersburg, FLA,  area next week and he would like to try his hand at what the local saltwater scene may have to offer for fly fishing opportunities. He only has 2 days and he doesn’t want to spend it on a wild goose chase. Any information you might be able to offer about the area would be greatly appreciated. He really can’t afford a professional guide. If someone has a day available next weekend and would like to play guide, he would gladly reciprocate and offer his services as a free guide if you ever make it to Maine and you are interested in learning about what our area has to offer. He’s a great guy and an excellent all around fly fisherman/tyer. Thanks in advance…Joel

Response:

Tell him to go to Floridasportsman.com They have great info and marked maps available, as well as info on local tackle shops.

Response:

Question:

I just received my latest rod purchase in the mail today, an old SQUARE fiberglass rod. The seller thinks its from the 1940’s. Its a seven foot rod in a cream color. On the butt it says-  " Pan Fish FLY ROD PF-7 For HDH or D" It has a green aluminum downlocking reel seat and the wraps are done with different color thread but its all mixed up, each guide has 4 or 5 colors of thread mixed.Its a cool looking rod. I fished it this evening and landed several fish, of course the biggest one shook the fly. Had my best luck with a 24 cream Griffith’s gnat. This thing’s a dream for midging… But HEAVY! Does anyone know of this rod, when it might have been built and what exactly does HDH and D mean? Any help would be appreciated….. Matt M. P.S.  No, Big Dale, it’s not for sale

Response:

… Does anyone know of this rod, when it might have been built and what exactly does HDH and D mean? Any help would be appreciated…..

Hey Matt, Don’t know much about 40’s fiberglas but HDH translates to DT6. — Ken Fortenberry Illini 3 – Tar Heels 1

Response:

does HDH and D mean? Any help would be appreciated….. Matt M.

This is a dimensional description.  The H corresponded, IIRC, to 0.025 inch diameter.  Each letter backward added 0.005.  Thus, D would be 0.045.  Accuracy in these dimensions was not a stron point for line manufacturers. Bill

Response:

Try calling Martin Keane of Classic Rods and Tackle in Ashley Falls, Mass.  Phone 413-229-7988.  He is an excellent authority on antique tackle. Ian Scott http://flyfishing.about.com/ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I just received my latest rod purchase in the mail today, an old SQUARE fiberglass rod. The seller thinks its from the 1940’s. Its a seven foot rod in a cream color. On the butt it says- " Pan Fish FLY ROD PF-7 For HDH or D" It has a green aluminum downlocking reel seat and the wraps are done with different color thread but its all mixed up, each guide has 4 or 5 colors of thread mixed.Its a cool looking rod. I fished it this evening and landed several fish, of course the biggest one shook the fly. Had my best luck with a 24 cream Griffith’s gnat. This thing’s a dream for midging… But HEAVY! Does anyone know of this rod, when it might have been built and what exactly does HDH and D mean? Any help would be appreciated….. Matt M. P.S.  No, Big Dale, it’s not for sale

Response:

Question:

hi! I’m gonna be in Philadelphia/Cherry Hill on Sunday, Sept. 13th. Would like some guidance on places to fly fish within a couple of hours radius. Or a local fly shop to contact for direction. tight lines, phil joffe

Response:

The Little Lehigh in Allentown should be pretty hot right now. Tricos should be dynamite! I haven’t fished this river in years, but the Fish for Fun stretch off Cedar Crest was always a challenge on humid August Tico mornings. Take 309 north to Allentown. Take Cedar Crest Blvd South and look for signs.

Response:

Question:

I have only recently picked up the art of Flyfishing and I have not gone fishing before the drought. Because of all the rain this year I am wondering if there will be areas that will be closed or just unfishable due to the excess of water. I live in the bay area, and Hat creek is about six hours from my house. If anyone has any sugestions about where I can go, within that same range, please respond. E-mail me or respond in this newsgroup.

Response:

I have only recently picked up the art of Flyfishing and I have not gone fishing before the drought. Because of all the rain this year I am wondering if there will be areas that will be closed or just unfishable due to the excess of water. I live in the bay area, and Hat creek is about six hours from my house. If anyone has any sugestions about where I can go, within that same range, please respond. E-mail me or respond in this newsgroup.

Hi Tim:  Try Lewiston Lake on the Trinity River during the spring.  It is about the same distance as Hat Creek.  Lewiston has lots of hatches, good access, and good flyfishing.  Its pretty well known, much like Hat Creek but there is always alot of room to fish.  Float tubes, prams, and canoes are great but there is good shore access too.  Get information and flies at the Fly Shop in Redding.  By the way, two years ago when we had a big winter, I can’t remember any problems with high water.  Streams that are regulated below reservoirs usually run pretty clear when other places are brown. Best of luck.

Response:

I tried Lewiston last Spring-May and was rather diasappoiunted. Only a few small planters. Was last year a bad year, flow through Lewiston was really up and maybe this had something to do with it?

Response:

I have only recently picked up the art of Flyfishing and I have not gone fishing before the drought. Because of all the rain this year I am wondering if there will be areas that will be closed or just unfishable due to the excess of water. I live in the bay area, and Hat creek is about six hours from my house. If anyone has any sugestions about where I can go, within that same range, please respond. E-mail me or respond in this newsgroup.

Right now, no. Later in mid July to late August, The Kings River and Kaweah River are pretty good. Both have lots of trout, but most are in the 10 inch range. There are also lots of 24 inchers but you really have to know where to go and how to fish them. Most people around here don’t. Both Rivers are about 2 hours south east of Fresno. The lower Kings opens up early in the year, and is only 20 minutes from Fresno, but I’m not real familure with that part of the river. Dave

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have only recently picked up the art of Flyfishing and I have not gone fishing before the drought. Because of all the rain this year I am wondering if there will be areas that will be closed or just unfishable due to the excess of water. I live in the bay area, and Hat creek is about six hours from my house. If anyone has any sugestions about where I can go, within that same range, please respond. E-mail me or respond in this newsgroup. Right now, no. Later in mid July to late August, The Kings River and Kaweah River are pretty good. Both have lots of trout, but most are in the 10 inch range. There are also lots of 24 inchers but you really have to know where to go and how to fish them. Most people around here don’t.

I’ve fished the South Fork of the Kaweah River quite a few times above Ladybug Camp but have never fished any of the other rivers in the area. Any suggestions? — John Fereira "Guru of Miscellany" Pleasanton, CA "i’m new to the internet and don’t know what i am doing."            – anonymous

Response:

Question:

Jeff: The cost of a fly-in to Northern Ontario lakes(walley/pike) typically runs $400-500 Canadian for a week.  That includes your fly-in from the local airport and accomodations(fairly rustic). Most remote lakes in N. Ontario are loaded with average  2 lb walleye, plus some trophy pike and walleye. I don’t have any recommendations handy, but 1-800-ONTARIO is a good start.  Let me know if you are really interested and I’ll see what I can do. remo

Response:

        Since I was little, I have dreamed of taking a fly-in trip to one of the remote lakes in Canada.  I think people will basically drop you off with a pontoon plane at a lake for a week or so, and you fish for big pike/ walleye/muskie.  I think I can camp- I don’t need a cabin.           Does anyone have any experience with this type of thing?  How much does it cost?  Any recommendations?  Are guides used?  I’m going to call 1-800-ONTARIO, but after Scott Maitland’s fiasco fishing vacation, I think I’d like to talk with someone who has had a positive experience with an outfitter.         Thanks much. -Jeff

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Smith) says:        Since I was little, I have dreamed of taking a fly-in trip to one of the remote lakes in Canada.  I think people will basically drop you off with a pontoon plane at a lake for a week or so, and you fish for big pike/ walleye/muskie.  I think I can camp- I don’t need a cabin.        Does anyone have any experience with this type of thing?  How much does it cost?  Any recommendations?  Are guides used?  I’m going to call 1-800-ONTARIO, but after Scott Maitland’s fiasco fishing vacation, I think I’d like to talk with someone who has had a positive experience with an outfitter.

 Jeff,     Thanks for the citation, though I can think of better ways to be cited. I don’t distrust the brochures and materials we received…I just learned to be much more wary of what I am reading (and listening to) and also that you are safer if you get a first-hand recommendation from someone you know you can trust.  It’s the classic "buyer beware" with the lodge owner looking out for his business. We have since contacted many more places in Ontario and..this time we looked at the much fancier resorts.  I think this past trip we managed to outwit ourselves into a place that was nothing that we were looking for..meaning that the place s was a dive, the fishing stunk, the boats leaked, etc. Next trip we are going to spend the extra $$.  Again…a STRONG personal recommendation can mean a lot but you also have to be able to trust the person.  For example, a co-worker of my brother in law swears that the place we stayed is great…the fishing wonderful, and he was ready to go back there again.  The catch:  he used to go 10 years ago, hasn’t been back lately, and maybe he’s the type who only wants some sort of roof over his head without concern for anything else?  When we told him how horrible our trip was he seemed shocked.  Either the place really went down hill during those ten years or he has a very different idea of a good vacation. Let me know what you find…also, does anyone out there know of a contact point in the Ministry of Tourism in Ontario?  We wanted to voice our concerns with the place we stayed but the only contact I was given (by the 1-800-ontario  number) was the Better Business Bureau.  Thanks,                                           Scott

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