Fly Fishing Fisherman Wiki » Fly Fishing » ISE Show in Pomona
Yo, Any ROFFers headed to the International Sportsmen’s Expo in Pomona at the Los Angeles County Fairgrounds next week? peace, Mu
Would love to Mu, was born there but gonna have to settle for the Maryland Fly Fishing Show. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any ROFFers headed to the International Sportsmen’s Expo in Pomona at the Los Angeles County Fairgrounds next week? peace, Mu
Fly Fishing Fisherman Wiki » Fly Fishing » Custom Fly Rods since 1940
Cal Harvey, has been making & selling custom fly rods since 1940. He uses Sage blanks & Struble reel seats.Cal doesn’t have internet access, for more info contact him at 806-385-4298 ,Littlefield,Tx I’ve put up a web page for Cal at http://members.tripod.com/~BradBanner/flyrod.html It has many fishing links.
He makes a darn nice rod from what I hear. How’s it goin Brad? Jerry http://www.jerryhadden.com
Going great except for this blasted respiratory crud everyone around here,including me, has. Good to hear from you Jerry. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – He makes a darn nice rod from what I hear. How’s it goin Brad? Jerry http://www.jerryhadden.com
Fly Fishing Fisherman Wiki » Fly Fishing » fishing in Panama
(GSWheaton) writes: Can anyone suggest a good guide / charter service in Panama? I’ll be there for several days in late January, and I’d like to do some fishing, preferably on the Pacific side.
The best fishing lodges are in remote parts of Panama and only book full week trips, and they are most likely all booked for January by now. However, there is a new land based operation based on Coiba Island that will book as few as two days at around $2000 per person, complete. Another choice would probably be to go to Contadora Island. You can book a charter at the yacht club there, but the fishing isn’t what you expect when you think of Panama. Capt Gene Kelly Tropical Fishing Adventures
Can anyone suggest a good guide / charter service in Panama? I’ll be there for several days in late January, and I’d like to do some fishing, preferably on the Pacific side.
Can anyone suggest a good guide / charter service in Panama? I’ll be there for several days in late January, and I’d like to do some fishing, preferably on the Pacific side.
There are at least two famous saltwater operations I’m aware of that book week long trips. Try Tropic Star Lodge (Pinas Bay) at http://www.tropicstar.com/index.html or Coiba Explorer at http://tucson.com/fishing/ Tropic Star often fills up early though, check the available dates on the web site. Tropic Star is a deluxe fly-in lodge and more world records have been set there than any other locale (according to their brochure anyway). It’s famous mostly for light-tackle billfish and pelagics off the Zane Grey reef. Coiba is a live-aboard operation and has perhaps more variety with plenty of inshore exotics as well as good offshore fishing at Hannibal Banks (and other reefs). Both are expensive. We fished Tropic Star last winter when fishing was supposedly poor due to the El Nino but still caught 5 marlin and a couple sails. Friends of ours fished Coiba a few weeks later and caught many smaller fish but only a couple of sails, no marlin. Usually better than that at either place. Hope so as we’re going back this winter 
I just saw an ad in Marlin Mag for a new land-based operation at Coiba as well run by Tom Yust, who set up the original Coiba mothership deal (I was told). He advertises ‘flexible 2-7 day itineraries’ and has a 31 ft Bertram, and might be a good fit for you if you can’t fish an entire week. He’s at 800-800-0907. Good luck, it’s an adventure down there. Bill Hilton
Fly Fishing Fisherman Wiki » River Fly Fishing » Adirondack Info Needed
Michael, Give Fran Betters a call at 518 946 2605. I’ll let you know about the Mettawee. Best regards, James Uncle Jammer’s Guide Service Vermont Fly Fishing, Hunting, River and Woodland Outings
I’ll be in Crown Point, NY this Saturday morning on business, and am hoping to fish in the PM. Any info on conditions and recommendations of rivers and/or guides will be greatly appreciated. I’m particularly interested in the Bouquet, Schroon or WB Ausable Rivers for landlocked salmon (if the runs have begun) or trout. Thanks in advance. MZ
Fly Fishing Fisherman Wiki » Fly Fishing » C&R Heritage ? Consider this…
I would view pure C&R as a really mean act in this situation, wouldn’t you ? No. You would not view the practice of C&R on starving fish a mean act ? Really ?
What would anyone do with a ’starving’ fish – bury it in their garden to fertilize the tomatoes? Feed it to the cat? Cat might not eat it! Ralph H
I would view pure C&R as a really mean act in this situation, wouldn’t you ? No. You would not view the practice of C&R on starving fish a mean act ? Really ? You would throw a starving dog a rubber bone ? You are a mean man Mr. Tatosian, IMO.
Tim, that was clearly a sarcastic remark in as short a form as I could provide, in response to this totally contrived troll of yours (which didn’t merit the response you would like to have received)… Yours is a tiresome routine – starting one thread after another all aimed at repeating your philosphy ad nauseum – and self-sanctified as being preferable to more civilized/less contentious topics of discussion… To what ends, I ask? Frankly I’m surprised you have any time left to actually fish – if you actually *do* fish… /dave
For all that we praise the "intelligence" of trout (mostly because sometimes we can’t catch them) they are really creatures of habit. Research studies (not fairy tales or anecdotes) have shown that trout may take several days to switch to a larger (hence more energy efficient), equally abundant, prey after several days of feeding on smaller prey. Also, sorry to insult anyone, there has been some serious c**p thrown out in this thread. Atlantic salmon ascend long rivers, take no food and undergo physiological changes (requiring energy) related to spawning, spawn, spend an entire winter under the ice, and then head back to sea. In the process they lose from 1/3 to 1/2 their body weight. On the way out they feed, take flies well, often fight as hard as a bright fish, and recover quickly (studies show well over 90% survival, probably because of the cold oxygen-rich water). Based on this I seriously doubt that trout are harmed by being caught providing they are landed quickly and THE WATER TEMPERATURES ARE LOW. Paul Marriner
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For all that we praise the "intelligence" of trout (mostly because sometimes we can’t catch them) they are really creatures of habit. Research studies (not fairy tales or anecdotes) have shown that trout may take several days to switch to a larger (hence more energy efficient), equally abundant, prey after several days of feeding on smaller prey. Also, sorry to insult anyone, there has been some serious c**p thrown out in this thread. Atlantic salmon ascend long rivers, take no food and undergo physiological changes (requiring energy) related to spawning, spawn, spend an entire winter under the ice, and then head back to sea. In the process they lose from 1/3 to 1/2 their body weight. On the way out they feed, take flies well, often fight as hard as a bright fish, and recover quickly (studies show well over 90% survival, probably because of the cold oxygen-rich water). Based on this I seriously doubt that trout are harmed by being caught providing they are landed quickly and THE WATER TEMPERATURES ARE LOW.
Paul, Would the same hold true in a non-anadromous population with a sparser food base ? Please accept that the high altitude freestone creeks are not the big food suppliers as an oceanic watershed, almost barren in some cases. I do so wish that you would not call the postings of myself and our friends ‘c**p’. Also, you have compared this to one of the most strenuous acts of reproduction in nature. A required one and one of major literary & philosophical meaning. The desparate act of a fish NOT making it over the falls in some cases. The desparate act of an old cock on its last trip upstream. The desparateness of losing 1/2 of their body weight in this struggle. Not really on the same plane as hooking and playing it for fun, is it ? Respectfully, TimW
Fish have to dash away from predators all the time; they have energy stores that help them deal with that. Trout, steelhead and salmon go through frequent and often lengthy periods when they feed little or not at all. You’d have us believe that a "sprint around the block" followed by a fast lasting a few hours will lead to death by starvation.
But… When you’re fishing a hatch, you play the fish buring one of those *brief* periods when food is abundant. If the sprint around the block is always at diinertime, and the food is gone by the time you return, it can add up. I’m not saying, "don’t fish," I’m just saying that there are impacts involved in c&r, just like any style of fishing. (Besides, during a heavy hatch, it can be a lot of fun to lean the rod against a tree and watch the fish work, without trying to catch them. Can improve your fishing, too.) CQ
A fish feeding selectively is a fish wallowing in luxury, isn’t it? I mean, you’re more likely to find a selective fish in some rich, artificial tailwater than you are in a high-county lake or stream, aren’t you?
Not when a hatch is on. High country fish can be very selective then. It makes sense for a trout to become selective when mayflies are hatching because it’s a temporary abundance. The nymphs, baitfish, et al, will still be there after the hatch is over. CQ
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For all that we praise the "intelligence" of trout (mostly because sometimes we can’t catch them) they are really creatures of habit. Research studies (not fairy tales or anecdotes) have shown that trout may take several days to switch to a larger (hence more energy efficient), equally abundant, prey after several days of feeding on smaller prey. Also, sorry to insult anyone, there has been some serious c**p thrown out in this thread. Atlantic salmon ascend long rivers, take no food and undergo physiological changes (requiring energy) related to spawning, spawn, spend an entire winter under the ice, and then head back to sea. In the process they lose from 1/3 to 1/2 their body weight. On the way out they feed, take flies well, often fight as hard as a bright fish, and recover quickly (studies show well over 90% survival, probably because of the cold oxygen-rich water). Based on this I seriously doubt that trout are harmed by being caught providing they are landed quickly and THE WATER TEMPERATURES ARE LOW. Paul, Would the same hold true in a non-anadromous population with a sparser food base ? Please accept that the high altitude freestone creeks are not the big food suppliers as an oceanic watershed, almost barren in some cases. I do so wish that you would not call the postings of myself and our friends ‘c**p’. Also, you have compared this to one of the most strenuous acts of reproduction in nature. A required one and one of major literary & philosophical meaning. The desparate act of a fish NOT making it over the falls in some cases. The desparate act of an old cock on its last trip upstream. The desparateness of losing 1/2 of their body weight in this struggle. Not really on the same plane as hooking and playing it for fun, is it ? Respectfully, TimW
Sorry Tim I think this little bit of work from your imagination is a clunker. But then nobody bats 100. I posted my reponses previously so won’t repeat them. hope you don’t mind me asking but did you base this on any study or work that shows fish in those alpine streams you fish are so stressed by lack of food? BTW a fish with a big head and small body isn’t starving it’s just lean like a marathon runner or a cheetah. Starving fish have shrunken concave bellies. You wouldn’t want to eat one either. Ralph H
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For all that we praise the "intelligence" of trout (mostly because sometimes we can’t catch them) they are really creatures of habit. Research studies (not fairy tales or anecdotes) have shown that trout may take several days to switch to a larger (hence more energy efficient), equally abundant, prey after several days of feeding on smaller prey. Also, sorry to insult anyone, there has been some serious c**p thrown out in this thread. Atlantic salmon ascend long rivers, take no food and undergo physiological changes (requiring energy) related to spawning, spawn, spend an entire winter under the ice, and then head back to sea. In the process they lose from 1/3 to 1/2 their body weight. On the way out they feed, take flies well, often fight as hard as a bright fish, and recover quickly (studies show well over 90% survival, probably because of the cold oxygen-rich water). Based on this I seriously doubt that trout are harmed by being caught providing they are landed quickly and THE WATER TEMPERATURES ARE LOW. Paul, Would the same hold true in a non-anadromous population with a sparser food base ? Please accept that the high altitude freestone creeks are not the big food suppliers as an oceanic watershed, almost barren in some cases. I do so wish that you would not call the postings of myself and our friends ‘c**p’. Also, you have compared this to one of the most strenuous acts of reproduction in nature. A required one and one of major literary & philosophical meaning. The desparate act of a fish NOT making it over the falls in some cases. The desparate act of an old cock on its last trip upstream. The desparateness of losing 1/2 of their body weight in this struggle. Not really on the same plane as hooking and playing it for fun, is it ? Respectfully, TimW
Sorry time but IMO this work from your imagination is a clunker. I’ve posted my responses elsewhere and won’t repeat them. However let me ask did you base this post on any kind of study on the alpine streams in your area that indicated the fish were so stressed by lack of food? BTW a fish with a big head and small body isn’t starving; it’s just lean like a marathon runner or a cheetah. Starving fish have concave shrunken bellies. You wouldn’t want to eat one either. Ralph H
: That the fish is feeding selectively speaks to the difficulties of : being a fish. : A fish feeding selectively is a fish wallowing in luxury, isn’t it? I have to agree here; the arguments being made of the average fish fight being so life-threatening is kindof ridiculous. This "1/2 energy/wieght/whatever lost" being mispresented. As (I think) another poster said, think of it as a sprint. Even if you are out of shape, a sprint won’t kill you — in fact, 10 minutes later you won’t even feel the effects. Same for the trout. You use up your short-term energy — sugar in the cells — but this doesn’t effect your fat reserves or anything to any large degree. Now, a prolonged fight, and environmental stresses (such as warm water) are worse, but I don’t think from an energy loss standpoint its much worse — the problems come from the fish needing more time to recuperate and can’t orient itself during this time (unlike us, who would just lay down on the ground and *breathe*; a fish can’t do that). We’ve all had hard releases — I held a fish for 20 minutes one time (actually stopped him from swimming away a couple of times), and eventually he looked just fine, swam away and took a position behind a rock — was still there later in the day. I don’t think the energy loss hurt him one bit. I’ll second that a big-head/little-bodied fish mean there’s too many fish for the food base, and you should keep it anyways. JonCook.
A guy who works in a fly shop just told me this evening about a guy who said he played a steelhead for 3 and a half hours. I asked him how big it was and he told me the guy claimed 8 pounds. Slightly less than a
Good Grief! What kind of rod could he have been using. I have landed steelhead this size on a 4 wt. rod in less than 20 minutes. Three and a half hours is torture! -Burton
While you guys are debating C&R vs.C&K and skinny fish, and how much time landing a fish is too much time…THEY ARE BUILDING A GOLD MINE ON THE BLACFOOT RIVER IN MONTANA….and it has the potential to render all your arguments moot… I have taken the liberty of changing the thread title for you, if you want a serious discussion of the mine possibility and its detriment. This is a different thread… TimW
Nah…I just wanted to remind you that there are bigger fish to fry.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : That the fish is feeding selectively speaks to the difficulties of : being a fish. : A fish feeding selectively is a fish wallowing in luxury, isn’t it? I have to agree here; the arguments being made of the average fish fight being so life-threatening is kindof ridiculous. This "1/2 energy/wieght/whatever lost" being mispresented. As (I think) another poster said, think of it as a sprint. Even if you are out of shape, a sprint won’t kill you — in fact, 10 minutes later you won’t even feel the effects. Same for the trout. You use up your short-term energy — sugar in the cells — but this doesn’t effect your fat reserves or anything to any large degree. Now, a prolonged fight, and environmental stresses (such as warm water) are worse, but I don’t think from an energy loss standpoint its much worse — the problems come from the fish needing more time to recuperate and can’t orient itself during this time (unlike us, who would just lay down on the ground and *breathe*; a fish can’t do that). We’ve all had hard releases — I held a fish for 20 minutes one time (actually stopped him from swimming away a couple of times), and eventually he looked just fine, swam away and took a position behind a rock — was still there later in the day. I don’t think the energy loss hurt him one bit. I’ll second that a big-head/little-bodied fish mean there’s too many fish for the food base, and you should keep it anyways.
Ok then. What I am hearing… Our [flyfishermen's] definition of the ethics of catch and release… "We may cause indiscriminate harm to a wild animal, so long as the animal does not normally die as a result, in our search for happiness. Our metric will only include mortality and will not include incidental suffering or non-fatal injury" Or, something like that… I laugh at our free usage of the term ‘respect’ for a wild animal. It is really, really laughable (if it weren’t so sad). Wham !!! Set the Hook !!!! Wham, Lay the rod into it !! she’s runnin’ for the rapids…then this thoughtful ‘respectful’ release…sometimes with an accompanying little kiss on the lips. Respect ? I don’t think so. Cause for self-congratulation, perhaps. TimW
While you guys are debating C&R vs.C&K and skinny fish, and how much time landing a fish is too much time…THEY ARE BUILDING A GOLD MINE ON THE BLACFOOT RIVER IN MONTANA….and it has the potential to render all your arguments moot…
Finally the real meat of the issues. Isn’t it time we humans get a little more ,NO! a lot more involve with the issues of rectifying and push for the preservation of our current watersheds. When their all gone who will be there to make new ones? The issues may vary from state to state, but they are the sum of all the parts. Trout are a good indicator for water quality and the quality of life to which we an ultimately attached. Seems to me that a new thread needs to be started here. Our fingers are dancing on the very tools that could start a very positive movement. What do you say guys? How about it, Tim, George, and Al? On another sad note, my ISP really sucks and I only receive less than half of the news posting and feel like a mushroom on lost thread portions. If anybody felt like CC me on your postings I would sure appreciate it. — Doug Knight metalfab<atefaxinc.com Junk e-mail, solicitation, sales, products and services gladly accepted at $50.00 per mailing and billed directly to your ISP.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would view pure C&R as a really mean act in this situation, wouldn’t you ? No. You would not view the practice of C&R on starving fish a mean act ? Really ? You would throw a starving dog a rubber bone ? You are a mean man Mr. Tatosian, IMO. Tim, that was clearly a sarcastic remark in as short a form as I could provide, in response to this totally contrived troll of yours (which didn’t merit the response you would like to have received)… Yours is a tiresome routine – starting one thread after another all aimed at repeating your philosphy ad nauseum – and self-sanctified as being preferable to more civilized/less contentious topics of discussion… To what ends, I ask?
I’ll be happy when the popularity of the sport subsides by say, 80%. I’ll be patting myself on the back all the way down to the deep run behind Pat’s rock, which will be devoid of people and clogged with fish. TimW
While you guys are debating C&R vs.C&K and skinny fish, and how much time landing a fish is too much time…THEY ARE BUILDING A GOLD MINE ON THE BLACFOOT RIVER IN MONTANA….and it has the potential to render all your arguments moot… I have taken the liberty of changing the thread title for you, if you want a serious discussion of the mine possibility and its detriment. This is a different thread… TimW
OK Tim, You were reading my mind. What are we playing with here, threads, fish, or environmental action? Isn’t it time we all get involved. Where do I sign up? It’s time to give something back. Please make note to CC, my ISP really sucks. — Doug Knight metalfab<atefaxinc.com Junk e-mail, solicitation, sales, products and services gladly accepted at $50.00 per mailing and billed directly to your ISP.
Tim pardon me but this is vapour ware to the nth degree. You’re expounding proifically on a hypothetical situation about which nothing is known. Fish have to dash away from predators all the time; they have energy stores that help them deal with that. Trout, steelhead and salmon go through frequent and often lengthy periods when they feed little or not at all. You’d have us believe that a "sprint around the block" followed by a fast lasting a few hours will lead to death by starvation. If you’re going to fabricate something please at least make it credible and believable. from Your Biggest fan Ralph H – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -The pinnacle of our sport is catching a wild trout feeding selectively on dries. That the fish is feeding selectively speaks to the difficulties of being a fish. It is important that the energy expended to consume an insect must not exceed the energy gained by this insects consumption. It is tough row to hoe for a fish eating this minutae. What percentage of fish even make it to this stage ? Along comes, O.M.I. Gudd the world famous dry fly man with his 2 wt and and exact imitation. Bingo. Fish On. The fight lasts 10 minutes, and the fish is going…"damned, now I gotta eat an additional 1000 midges just to get back to my fighting weight !"…well we don’t really know WHAT Mr. Brown thinks, but it would be true that he is now in an energy deficit situation…this could kill him…have you ever caught a starving fish ? Big head, tiny emaciated snake like body ? Now you tell me…how many days will it take for that fish to get to where it was before you hooked, played and released it ? Considering that it was possibly very nearly starving when you laid that Adams out. Maybe in the unnatural tailwaters where food is abundant this is less of a problem then a freestone creek at 12,000 ft., but I would view pure C&R as a really mean act in this situation, wouldn’t you ? TimW
The pinnacle of our sport is catching a wild trout feeding selectively on dries. That the fish is feeding selectively speaks to the difficulties of being a fish.
A fish feeding selectively is a fish wallowing in luxury, isn’t it? I mean, you’re more likely to find a selective fish in some rich, artificial tailwater than you are in a high-county lake or stream, aren’t you? Along comes, O.M.I. Gudd the world famous dry fly man with his 2 wt and and exact imitation. Bingo. Fish On. The fight lasts 10 minutes, and the fish is going…"damned, now I gotta eat an additional 1000 midges just to get back to my fighting weight !"…well we don’t really know WHAT Mr. Brown thinks, but it would be true that he is now in an energy deficit situation…this could kill him…have you ever caught a starving fish ? Big head, tiny emaciated snake like body ?
(I remember reading that a trout uses something like half of its stored energy in 15 seconds when it’s at full throttle.) Now you tell me…how many days will it take for that fish to get to where it was before you hooked, played and released it ? Considering that it was possibly very nearly starving when you laid that Adams out. Maybe in the unnatural tailwaters where food is abundant this is less of a problem then a freestone creek at 12,000 ft., but I would view pure C&R as a really mean act in this situation, wouldn’t you ?
It seems like the folks fishing the rich tailwaters are more likely to be using too light of a rod for the fish that live there, so the benefit of plentiful food could be offset by the fish being played way longer than it should have been. It may die anyway. The starving fish in the sterile alpine creek can’t be underpowered, but there is hardly any food for it to eat once it’s released. What? If it was an overcrowded stream, you’re right. If there are so many fish in the creek that the one you just caught is starving, kill and eat it. That population sounds like it needs to be thinned, in my no-expert opinion. A lot of the higher streams I’ve fished have what seem to be normal numbers of fish – they are healthy, active, and not swarming all over each other. I’d imagine that at least some of them have native fish, and they *are* all wild fish. There seems to be plenty of food. The only fish I’ll take out of a small, highish creek around here are brook trout or the rare brown; no cutts or rainbows. I don’t feel bad about that, because these fish aren’t monsters and they are generally not starving. The fight is quick and one-sided, and they are undoubtedly more stunned than exhausted when it’s over. Of any trout, these are the ones I like to lay eyes on the most. C&K seems like a bad idea to have catch on when it comes to these streams. If you fish a heavier rod while practicing C&R, you release a healthier fish but probably shouldn’t call it ’sport.’ If you fish a really light, sporting rod; play the trout for ten minutes; kill, keep, and eat it, you have a fish that tastes bad. I don’t call what I do with those little cutts and redsides ’sport,’ and the brook trout I keep are delicious. The part of C&R that bugs me is hearing of 15# steelhead caught on four-weight rigs, people fishing for huge trout with two-weights, etc. Small, alpine trout are probably bothered by C&R the least, and they are the ones that need it the most. In my opinion. Dave DeLacey Corvallis, Or. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – TimW
I would view pure C&R as a really mean act in this situation, wouldn’t you ?
No.
The hypothesis goes (it isn’t even ‘theory’) that the fish becomes selective to cope with abundance. It makes it more efficient to focus om midges in Tim’s example so it doesn’t get distracted by say a sculpin on the bottom. I don’t get it. Why would it be better for a trout to concentrate on midges and ignore a juicy sculpin, as long as it was big enough to eat one?
because the midges are abundant thr fish gains more calories than it expends by feeding exclusively on midges and ignoring the sculpin. It’s a hypothesis used to explain selectivity Also, why would the fish have to concentrate if there was a lot of food in the water? Isn’t that where the phrase ‘easy pickins’ comes from? You don’t mean that trout are easily confused, do you?!?
It’s not my idea. No I don’t mean they are confused. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (I remember reading that a trout uses something like half of its stored energy in 15 seconds when it’s at full throttle.) what exactly is it’s stored energy? The energy you store in your body is fat. Do you mean to say a trout burns up half it’s stored fat swimming at full throttle for 15 seconds? Sounds proposterous. It is proposterous if you watch salmon moving up stream or jumping a falls Consider many stocks migrate hundreds of miles without feeding for months I think this whole line of reasoning falls on it’s keester. But a tip of the hat to Tim for trying. You’re right, that didn’t make any sense. It’s the stored glycogen in the muscle that they use up so fast. The book I just checked that in claims that the white muscle used for burst speed may take up to 18 hours to get rid of the lactic acid that results from the gas-guzzling, while the muscles used for regular, sustained swimming do it in an hour or less. So you probably can’t compare swimming vs. fighting fish and then say that there isn’t any truth to what Tim Walker was saying. Also, salmon are making a one-way trip. They don’t have to budget their energy, really. I wouln’t be supprised at all to hear that salmon use more energy trying to get over a single tough falls than a typical trout does in a month of dodging predators, but the salmon probably dies sooner for doing it.
Salmon don’t always make a one way trip. Atlantics and steelhead usually return to the sea. Also salmon don’t stare to death they are genetically programed to die after spawning. Some stocks that are as sea fat as other go only a few yrds above tide water. Pacific salmon die of multiple organ failure that can’t simply be explain by starvation. Also genetically they can make the switch from salt to fresh water only once. The die off could be an adaption to transfer rich ocean nutrients to their native streams and enhance their offsprings chances for survival. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – if it were nearly starving and being caught put it at death’s door the whole stock in the stream simply wouldn’t last long. The first good drought or flood or an unusually hard winter would wipe them out. That’s true. It’s strange that some of the more obviously-overcrowded lakes that I’ve seen are also shallow. If any lake was going to winter-kill, it seems like they’d be the ones. Dave DeLacey Corvallis, Or. Ralph H
Ralph H – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
I would view pure C&R as a really mean act in this situation, wouldn’t you ? No.
You would not view the practice of C&R on starving fish a mean act ? Really ? You would throw a starving dog a rubber bone ? You are a mean man Mr. Tatosian, IMO. TimW
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : That the fish is feeding selectively speaks to the difficulties of : being a fish. : A fish feeding selectively is a fish wallowing in luxury, isn’t it? I have to agree here; the arguments being made of the average fish fight being so life-threatening is kindof ridiculous. This "1/2 energy/wieght/whatever lost" being mispresented. As (I think) another poster said, think of it as a sprint. Even if you are out of shape, a sprint won’t kill you — in fact, 10 minutes later you won’t even feel the effects. Same for the trout. You use up your short-term energy — sugar in the cells — but this doesn’t effect your fat reserves or anything to any large degree. Now, a prolonged fight, and environmental stresses (such as warm water) are worse, but I don’t think from an energy loss standpoint its much worse — the problems come from the fish needing more time to recuperate and can’t orient itself during this time (unlike us, who would just lay down on the ground and *breathe*; a fish can’t do that). We’ve all had hard releases — I held a fish for 20 minutes one time (actually stopped him from swimming away a couple of times), and eventually he looked just fine, swam away and took a position behind a rock — was still there later in the day. I don’t think the energy loss hurt him one bit. I’ll second that a big-head/little-bodied fish mean there’s too many fish for the food base, and you should keep it anyways. JonCook.
While you guys are debating C&R vs.C&K and skinny fish, and how much time landing a fish is too much time…THEY ARE BUILDING A GOLD MINE ON THE BLACFOOT RIVER IN MONTANA….and it has the potential to render all your arguments moot…
The hypothesis goes (it isn’t even ‘theory’) that the fish becomes selective to cope with abundance. It makes it more efficient to focus om midges in Tim’s example so it doesn’t get distracted by say a sculpin on the bottom.
I don’t get it. Why would it be better for a trout to concentrate on midges and ignore a juicy sculpin, as long as it was big enough to eat one? Also, why would the fish have to concentrate if there was a lot of food in the water? Isn’t that where the phrase ‘easy pickins’ comes from? You don’t mean that trout are easily confused, do you?!? (I remember reading that a trout uses something like half of its stored energy in 15 seconds when it’s at full throttle.) what exactly is it’s stored energy? The energy you store in your body is fat. Do you mean to say a trout burns up half it’s stored fat swimming at full throttle for 15 seconds? Sounds proposterous. It is proposterous if you watch salmon moving up stream or jumping a falls Consider many stocks migrate hundreds of miles without feeding for months I think this whole line of reasoning falls on it’s keester. But a tip of the hat to Tim for trying.
You’re right, that didn’t make any sense. It’s the stored glycogen in the muscle that they use up so fast. The book I just checked that in claims that the white muscle used for burst speed may take up to 18 hours to get rid of the lactic acid that results from the gas-guzzling, while the muscles used for regular, sustained swimming do it in an hour or less. So you probably can’t compare swimming vs. fighting fish and then say that there isn’t any truth to what Tim Walker was saying. Also, salmon are making a one-way trip. They don’t have to budget their energy, really. I wouln’t be supprised at all to hear that salmon use more energy trying to get over a single tough falls than a typical trout does in a month of dodging predators, but the salmon probably dies sooner for doing it. if it were nearly starving and being caught put it at death’s door the whole stock in the stream simply wouldn’t last long. The first good drought or flood or an unusually hard winter would wipe them out.
That’s true. It’s strange that some of the more obviously-overcrowded lakes that I’ve seen are also shallow. If any lake was going to winter-kill, it seems like they’d be the ones. Dave DeLacey Corvallis, Or. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ralph H
Now you tell me…how many days will it take for that fish to get to where it was before you hooked, played and released it ?
A guy who works in a fly shop just told me this evening about a guy who said he played a steelhead for 3 and a half hours. I asked him how big it was and he told me the guy claimed 8 pounds. Slightly less than a half hour a pound… Phil
A fish feeding selectively is a fish wallowing in luxury, isn’t it?
The hypothesis goes (it isn’t even ‘theory’) that the fish becomes selective to cope with abundance. It makes it more efficient to focus om midges in Tim’s example so it doesn’t get distracted by say a sculpin on the bottom. You’re right a starving fish is unlikley to be selective. (I remember reading that a trout uses something like half of its stored energy in 15 seconds when it’s at full throttle.)
what exactly is it’s stored energy? The energy you store in your body is fat. Do you mean to say a trout burns up half it’s stored fat swimming at full throttle for 15 seconds? Sounds proposterous. It is proposterous if you watch salmon moving up stream or jumping a falls Consider many stocks migrate hundreds of miles without feeding for months I think this whole line of reasoning falls on it’s keester. But a tip of the hat to Tim for trying. very nearly starving when you laid that Adams out.
if it were nearly starving and being caught put it at death’s door the whole stock in the stream simply wouldn’t last long. The first good drought or flood or an unusually hard winter would wipe them out. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -It seems like the folks fishing the rich tailwaters are more likely to be using too light of a rod for the fish that live there, so the benefit of plentiful food could be offset by the fish being played way longer than it should have been. It may die anyway. The starving fish in the sterile alpine creek can’t be underpowered, but there is hardly any food for it to eat once it’s released. What? [snip] The part of C&R that bugs me is hearing of 15# steelhead caught on four-weight rigs, people fishing for huge trout with two-weights, etc.
This bugs me too and I think many have pushed the light tackle envelope too far, way too far. Small, alpine trout are probably bothered by C&R the least, and they are the ones that need it the most. In my opinion. Dave DeLacey Corvallis, Or.
Ralph H
The pinnacle of our sport is catching a wild trout feeding selectively on dries. That the fish is feeding selectively speaks to the difficulties of being a fish. It is important that the energy expended to consume an insect must not exceed the energy gained by this insects consumption. It is tough row to hoe for a fish eating this minutae. What percentage of fish even make it to this stage ? Along comes, O.M.I. Gudd the world famous dry fly man with his 2 wt and and exact imitation. Bingo. Fish On. The fight lasts 10 minutes, and the fish is going…"damned, now I gotta eat an additional 1000 midges just to get back to my fighting weight !"…well we don’t really know WHAT Mr. Brown thinks, but it would be true that he is now in an energy deficit situation…this could kill him…have you ever caught a starving fish ? Big head, tiny emaciated snake like body ? Now you tell me…how many days will it take for that fish to get to where it was before you hooked, played and released it ? Considering that it was possibly very nearly starving when you laid that Adams out. Maybe in the unnatural tailwaters where food is abundant this is less of a problem then a freestone creek at 12,000 ft., but I would view pure C&R as a really mean act in this situation, wouldn’t you ? TimW
Fly Fishing Fisherman Wiki » Fly Fishing Tackle » PANAMA FLY FISHING–NEED ADVICE
I’M NOT SURE MY LAST MESSAGE WAS SENT PROPERLY. I’M NEW TO THIS INFERNAL CONTRAPTION THEY CALL A COMPUTER! I AM GOING TO PANAMA FOR A FEW MONTHS AND NEED ADVICE ON TACKLE AND LOCATIONS FOR SALT WATER FLY FISHING. I KNOW THAT THE MOUTHS OF THE RIVERS HAVE TARPON AND GATUN LAKE HAS PEACOCK BASS. ANY ADVICE WOULD BE WELCOME.
: I’M NOT SURE MY LAST MESSAGE WAS SENT PROPERLY. I’M NEW TO THIS INFERNAL : CONTRAPTION THEY CALL A COMPUTER! : I AM GOING TO PANAMA FOR A FEW MONTHS AND NEED ADVICE ON TACKLE AND : LOCATIONS FOR SALT WATER FLY FISHING. I KNOW THAT THE MOUTHS OF THE : RIVERS HAVE TARPON AND GATUN LAKE HAS PEACOCK BASS. ANY ADVICE WOULD BE : WELCOME. I was born there, but I don’t remember much since I moved away when I was young. I would be interested to here how you did when you get back. Someday I hope to return. BTW, typing in all caps is hard on the eyes and difficult to read. It is also considered shouting in the computer world. I just wanted to let you know before somebody gets on your case. ;-) Good Luck! Jon Porter
Fly Fishing Fisherman Wiki » Flyfishing » Novice Question
I have done only a little flyfishing. I just bought a cheapo Berkley flyfishing kit with a 7 1/2 foot rod which came with #6 double taper line. When I use it, the line slams into the water like a log. I remember when I was younger, I tried out my Dad’s flyrod which was made of bamboo and used level line. I could make it lay down on the water real nice. What is my biggest problem, the rod or the line. If I switch to a better or different line will that help. I normally fish on small waters like the Owens River above Bishop, CA. Mark Rubin — This is a test of the signature file. Had this been a real sigature file, it would contain cute graphics and a catchy phrase. This is only a test…
I have done only a little flyfishing. I just bought a cheapo Berkley flyfishing kit with a 7 1/2 foot rod which came with #6 double taper line. When I use it, the line slams into the water like a log.
Hi Mark- You might try casting the line toward the tree line rather than the horizon or worse yet, the water. When the line straightens out, follow the line with your rod tip as the line settles to the water. This should soften the landing. Also you might try some roll casts that direct the fly into the air rather than attempting to nail it to the water ar trying for max distance. Despite what the pictures in the magazines show, casting is not nearly as important your ability to mend and control line once it’s on the water.Try not casting at all! Spend some time simply drifting your fly downstream and steer it into fishy spots by practicing your mends. You will quickly find that a longer rod is easier to mend with because it keeps you farther from the fish and it picks up more line from the water. Good luck and soft landings-Ralph
Also, as a new fly fisherperson, I’ve found that the cast comes off better when it is done "almost willfully slowly." And it is even better yet when I’m not thinking about it. My suggestion would be to slow down a lot and see what happens. Also start with shorter casts and work up. My limited experience has shown that most fishing on streams is done in the 15 to 30 foot range . . . sometimes closer. My friend "Doc" keeps telling me "less line" and it is beginning to sink in. Really the best deal would be to spend even 15 minutes with a competent flyfisher . . . who can tell you what is going wrong. Your casting can improve a million percent in even that short amount of time. Bob Vorel
First of all if you havent ever been to VanCampens I strongly suggest that you check it out because the Trout there are BIG and beutiful…..(Browns,Rainbows,Brook…..and its in the Del. Water.Gap) Anway I was wondering….I am a novice Fly-Fisherman and I want to know what Flies I should be using between hatches on this and other coldwater streams….and what will attract them even when they are not really that hungry….. Any Info you can give me on Flies that usually hatch up there or Flies that work would be greatly appreciated….. Thanks Matt,
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have done only a little flyfishing. I just bought a cheapo Berkley flyfishing kit with a 7 1/2 foot rod which came with #6 double taper line. When I use it, the line slams into the water like a log. Hi Mark- <snip Despite what the pictures in the magazines show, casting is not nearly as important your ability to mend and control line once it’s on the water.Try not casting at all! Spend some time simply drifting your fly downstream and steer it into fishy spots by practicing your mends. Good luck and soft landings-Ralph
Good advice indeed, although if I may add a small contribution … Being more a lake angler that the faster water, the Lake Trout of NZ would be long gone, unless they were deep water dwellers, with a noisy line entry such as Mark is describing. I have spent many many hours perfecting my casting (as well as retrieving .. <grin) whilst not actually having been anywhere near the water. I found it invaluable to practice on my own (without annoying fellow anglers, or scaring the fish) in the back yard or local park and to learn to *air* cast ( rather than rip) blind in order to become not only accurate, but to lay out a effecient, long and delicate roll when stalking the elusive NZ Rainbow. Casting practice is also invaluable when sandwiched on both sides by equally feverish anglers, or faced with an annoying and pesky breeze blowing over your right shoulder. Not for the faint hearted, nor inexperienced .. <grin Regards .. Tim.D Wellington, New Zealand.
Too muchfalse casting is a detrriment to accurcacy. I roll the line foward,pick it up and cast it out with one or at the most two false casts. I slight lifting motion to get the line off the water helps too. Practice or get Joan Wulff’s video or both will help. Call my radio show any Sat. morning from 6-7am eastern time toll free at 1-800-298-8255 and tell us how you are doing. Tight lines, The Fishin’ Zone Steve Sloan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Also, as a new fly fisherperson, I’ve found that the cast comes off better when it is done "almost willfully slowly." And it is even better yet when I’m not thinking about it. My suggestion would be to slow down a lot and see what happens. Also start with shorter casts and work up. My limited experience has shown that most fishing on streams is done in the 15 to 30 foot range . . . sometimes closer. My friend "Doc" keeps telling me "less line" and it is beginning to sink in. Really the best deal would be to spend even 15 minutes with a competent flyfisher . . . who can tell you what is going wrong. Your casting can improve a million percent in even that short amount of time. Bob Vorel
Fly Fishing Fisherman Wiki » Fly Fishing Rods » Info: Cortland Fly Lines
I turned back to the 444SL after I tried othrs. The LASER line is very nice to cast and floats very high (makes line pickup easier), but: all this only for a very short time (I used it for only one season!). The hard coating is worn out very fast and you have to replace the line. The Wulf Triangel taper is very nice to fish, too. I used it in the 3/4 and 5/6 weight. Rollcasting is much fun and, especially with the 3/4, presentation of drys to very shy trout is terrific. The disadvantage, especially for the 3/4, is that it is very hard to transport heavier or more wind resistant flies. I now returned to the 444SL which can do the job much better: Very long casts are much easier with the 444SL, rollcasting nearly as good as with the TT, but if the situation requires it, I can also tie on a heavy stremer or a heavy weigthed nymph with a few split shots with still comfortable casting. Thomas
If anyone needs a Cortland Fly line or has any questions about
I used a 444SL for many trouble-free years. In fact, I wore it out — the first line that I ever killed. I’ve been thinking about giving the Lazer line a try, but have been playing around with Lee Wulf’s Triangle taper, as well as a few others. Give me your pros and cons on the 444SL and the Lazer Line, with regard to durability, floatability. Thanks.
I used a 444SL for many trouble-free years. In fact, I wore it out — the first line that I ever killed. I’ve been thinking about giving the Lazer line a try, but have been playing around with Lee Wulf’s Triangle taper, as well as a few others. Give me your pros and cons on the 444SL and the Lazer Line, with regard to durability, floatability. Thanks.
According to the folks at FEATHER-CRAFT Fly Fishing in St. Louis, 444SL is designed specifically for fast-action rods, is stiffer than most lines and is considered 1/4 weight higher than it’s rating. The Lazer line are supposed to be best for light action rods because it loads the rod quickly for short casts.
Fly Fishing Fisherman Wiki » Fly Fishing » airlines/full-sized rods?
writes: writes: … I have also made large rod tubes for my one piece rods. … How long is the longest tube that you’ve taken on an airplane ? I am asking because I have received conflicting info from agents. I have taken a 9 ft two piece rod on numerous trips and put the rod
case in the overhead. Most of the airlines have overheads with two doors, however there is no divider between the two sections. A 9 ft rod just makes it provided there isn’t a lot of luggage in there already. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
I apolgize for the repetition here, but this is an important topic for those who are not regular travelers with flyrods. There is nothing that will spoil a trip like lost or broken rods — insurance just won’t help. Never check rods!!! First, I have only had one occasion where an agent tried to get me to check the rods, and I insisted on carrying them on board. If you run into that problem, don’t give in. Raise hell and they will let you on. Second, I have always been able to get the rods (up to 9′ two piece) in the overhead bins, except on the smallest of commuters; then they went in the hanging bag compartment. Lyman Hughes Ennis,MT Dallas, TX
writes: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -This is a good question. I am travelling by plane for the first time with my fly rod, which a two piece 8 1/2 footer. I have one of the 1 1/2" aluminum rod cases with the sock inside, which doesn’t lock. Can I claim it as carryon? SHould I just tape up the cover? Or should I paste a label over the brand name on the case and label it Blueprints? Any advice would be appreciated. Chris Bernard (508)640-2016 days (617)979-0464 home
Do not check your rods. Continental lost my rod case for a day, even when I checked it in as oversized. Apparently, some baggage systems lose long items because they fall off the system at the turns. Fight like hell to take it on as luggage. I start kissing the butts of the check in people and then plead with the flight attendants and it always works. I use alum. rod tubes inside a nice looking Bean Maine Guide rod bag that actually looks like luggage. Wear some god awful fishing hat with a TU catch and release pin and they’ll treat you as an eccentric and let you do what you want. Musconet
Everything we do up here is by air. Have a rod cases called the "Bazooka" model. Hold 5 rods is bright red, easy to see and monitor, and is indestructable. Have take it all over the world and have not had a problem. — Gene Dobrzynski, Eagle River, Alaska
writes: writes: … I have also made large rod tubes for my one piece rods. … How long is the longest tube that you’ve taken on an airplane ? I am asking because I have received conflicting info from agents.
I have made tubes to carry one piece casting rods. Longest rod is 7′6", and the rod tube is a couple of inches longer. It’s in the attic at the moment, but, if I remember correctly, it is a 4" ID tube. (ABS – sched 40). I I checked that with no problem ….. The longest I have carried on board is 54". I put it in the hanger bag closets. Dee Crabtree DeeCrab*ibm.net
(508)640-2016 days (617)979-0464 home Do not check your rods. Musconet
Many of you have said the same as the note ref’d above. Maybe I’m just lucky, or don’t travel as much as you, (hmmm – nah!) but I have never had a rod tubes damaged, opened, lost or delayed – can’t say the same for my luggage (clothes) though!! I mark the tubes well, the ends are secure (bottom cap glued & top cap drilled & tied with a large nylon bundling tie) and the rods padded inside. Dee Crabtree DeeCrab*ibm.net
I’ve flown twice with my rods. United insisted that I check them, but then required that I sign a waiver of responsibility for loss or damage. Horizon Airlines insisted that I carry them onboard. Thanks Horizon.
writes: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -This is a good question. I am travelling by plane for the first time with my fly rod, which a two piece 8 1/2 footer. I have one of the 1 1/2" aluminum rod cases with the sock inside, which doesn’t lock. Can I claim it as carryon? SHould I just tape up the cover? Or should I paste a label over the brand name on the case and label it Blueprints? Any advice would be appreciated. Chris Bernard (508)640-2016 days (617)979-0464 home
I’ve been flying with rods <g for a few years. Normally I carry them on, unless I have too much stuff. I have checked them on several occaisions, both in an aluminum tube and 3 tubes in a bag. Never had a problem. Perhaps I’m justlucky (on planes more than streams)! I’ve never been convinced a lock does much (for rods or bags), if someone wants it it’s gone. So I just make sure my insurance covers the important things. BTW I do carry older cane rods as well. David
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -This is a good question. I am travelling by plane for the first time with my fly rod, which a two piece 8 1/2 footer. I have one of the 1 1/2" aluminum rod cases with the sock inside, which doesn’t lock. Can I claim it as carryon? SHould I just tape up the cover? Or should I paste a label over the brand name on the case and label it Blueprints? Any advice would be appreciated. Chris Bernard (508)640-2016 days (617)979-0464 home
I’ve always carried my rod tube (and all my fishing gear for that matter! if my luggage gets lost…I can still fish!!) onto the plane. If it’s too long for the overhead…the attendant will put it in the standup closet.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -This is a good question. I am travelling by plane for the first time with my fly rod, which a two piece 8 1/2 footer. I have one of the 1 1/2" aluminum rod cases with the sock inside, which doesn’t lock. Can I claim it as carryon? SHould I just tape up the cover? Or should I paste a label over the brand name on the case and label it Blueprints? Any advice would be appreciated. Chris Bernard (508)640-2016 days (617)979-0464 home
If you can carry it on, great, but if not I would advise buying one of those travel bags that hold rod tubes rather than checking just the tube. Why ? Because tubes do get lost; I spent an hour in a Mexican airport once looking for mine and trying to describe it (in my limited Spanish) to the people who worked there. Turns out it fell off a conveyor type rack and was sitting on the floor underneath it. The travel bag looks more like a suitcase, is less likely to roll around and will probably be treated with more care (of course using the word ‘care’ in any description of baggage handling is risky…) If it does get lost it’s easier to describe and find than a piece of aluminum pipe or PVC. jc
Does someone have a recommendation about how to pack regular, two piece rods for airline travel?
Never, I repeat NEVER check your rods, unless you want new ones and want to claim them on your insurance. They will eventually be broken or disappear if you check them. When carrying rods on, try to board early before the flight attendants are swamped by people with 400 pound duffle bags looking for a place to stow them. Be vnice to the flight attendants and they will generally find you a place to stow your rods. In most cases they will fit in the overhead bin. / / John Woodling / Sacramento, CA < <
If I understand correctly, the question is can you carry 2-piece rods as carry-on or must you check them. I have traveled a few times with my 7′11 2-piece in the 1.5" tube and my 9′ 2-piece in a larger tube. Although they are larger than what the regulations allow, I have never had anybody stop me. In fact the flight attendants were helpful in stowing them. I don’t know what I would do if they decided to be a hard ass about it. There’s no way I would check through a $300+ rod! Tight Lines, Gerry
I took two two piece fly rods and a two piece long musky weight bait casting rod from NJ to Miami to Quito to rainforest, overhead bin until I hit the Ecuadorian prop plane to the river port and the flight attendant there didn’t care where I stowed the rods. No guarantees but no one twitched about the tubes.
Bob – Never, never, never check your rods. That’s my advice. The overheads will handle a standard size rod case. On the one or two occasions that I have had a problem on an odd plane, I have always found a spot — usually in the hanging bag bin. Lyman Dallas, TX Ennis, MT
Does someone have a recommendation about how to pack regular, two piece rods for airline travel? I have a large rod tube which can hold several rods of various sizes, but has no locking mechanism. Should I just securely seal the thing with tape (over the regular latch) and insure the daylights out of it? Any other suggestions? thx…. Bob Bob Sturtz "We have met the enemy – Traverse City, MI and he is us." – Pogo
Bob, I have carried rods across the country in home made and in commercial rod carriers. I insert my aluminum fly-rod tubes into 1-1/2 in ABS tube which works just great to protect tube and contents. (no damage since I start doing that!) On my casting and spinning rods, I have carried them in a commercial rod case with a latch (which can have a pad lock attached.) I just secure the latch with a nylon tie. I have also made large rod tubes for my one piece rods. I attached a drawer handle, capped one end and put a screw cap on the other end. I insert foam inside both caps to protect the rods and also insert the rods into homemade sleeves. For the price of the commercial tube, I could build lots of custom tubes! Dee Crabtree DeeCrab*ibm.net
This is a good question. I am travelling by plane for the first time with my fly rod, which a two piece 8 1/2 footer. I have one of the 1 1/2" aluminum rod cases with the sock inside, which doesn’t lock. Can I claim it as carryon? SHould I just tape up the cover? Or should I paste a label over the brand name on the case and label it Blueprints? Any advice would be appreciated. Chris Bernard (508)640-2016 days (617)979-0464 home
Does someone have a recommendation about how to pack regular, two piece rods for airline travel? I have a large rod tube which can hold several rods of various sizes, but has no locking mechanism. Should I just securely seal the thing with tape (over the regular latch) and insure the daylights out of it? Any other suggestions? thx…. Bob Bob Sturtz "We have met the enemy – Traverse City, MI and he is us." – Pogo
Fly Fishing Fisherman Wiki » River Fly Fishing » Arkansas FF
I heard that the Lil’ Red and the White River are good trout rivers. I’m looking for some information on how and where to go, are they wadable and is there any decent camping on the rivers or nearby. I would also love a good appraisal from anyone familiar with river. Any info would be greatly appreciated.
I’m not all that familiar with the Little Red, but I’ve been fishing the White and North Fork rivers for 20 years or more. They are world-class trout streams, and as of 1/1/95 boast lengthy sections of catch and release water. Wading is *very* tricky, and since they are tailwaters, you must play the "water-game." Your best bet is to contact Blue Ribbon Fly Shop in Mountain Home, Arkansas for the latest water conditions. Beware they have been running a great deal of water lately, so fishing conditions have been poor. –Jeff
In response to: I heard that the Lil’ Red and the White River are good trout rivers. The Little Red is not a good trout river. It is a great trout river.
I’ve heard the same about the White but haven’t fished it. The Little Red is best during winter. Nov.-January. There are good camping facilities. Try an area called "Cow Shoals". It is wadable, but dependant upon Corps of Engineers and the water releases from the dam.
There is a good campground near the bridge in Cotter, Arkansas. I have worked with several men who were serious fly fishermen and that was their favorite place. I have been there and you can rent canoes and go down the White River at your leisure, fly fishing as you go. Cotter, Arkansas is dubbed the "Trout Capital of the World." Of course there are probably other cities that call themselves the same. I think there is an old hotel in Cotter, and eating places as well as antique shops, etc. It is a neat place. When I was there years ago, the Corps of Engrs would open up the locks at the dam, and it was unbelievalbe how fast and high the water would rise and how furiously it rampaged. They sound an alarm before they open the dam gates, and usually it was in the evening after dark. In the daytime the water was crystal clear, ice cold, and shallow (wadeable) in a lot of places. Cotter is a beautiful area in the Arkansas mountains.