Question:

I have several week-long gigs coming up in February in Colorado Springs, CO.  It’s a 5 or 6 hour drive from ABQ.  I could also cram my fat butt into a RJ and it is a 1 hour flight (Mesa), or I could take a more comfortable (for me) 737 from ABQ-DEN-COS (United), or ABQ-PHX-COS (America West) and it would take 5 or 6 hours. Of course, that does not include the time spent driving to the airport, parking, checking in, going through security, and then waiting on my half-moons for departing flights / connections. You know what?  I’m driving a rental car.  No revenue for the airlines.  You can blame the TSA – final straw.  If the time spent is more-or-less equal, I’ll drive from now on.  Far less hassle. Of course, I’ll still be flying a lot – some places are just too far away to drive to reasonably.  But when I can, I’ll drive.  Screw the TSA. Best Regards, Bill Mattocks

Response:

fat butt into a RJ and it is a 1 hour flight (Mesa), or I could take a more comfortable (for me) 737 from ABQ-DEN-COS (United), or ABQ-PHX-COS (America West) and it would take 5 or 6 hours.

Or you could make an even bigger statement and take Amtrak Depart Albuquerque at 13:00, arrive Raton at 17.53, leave Raton by bus at 18:00 arrive Colorado Springs at 21:00 Yeah, longer than by car, but on the train ride, you get to travel in a long-haul train with all its services (dining car etc), and I believe that the coach to Cos is a garanteed connection. And your added business to amtrak will be noticed by the government much more than just riding your car which won’t show up in any real statistic. Greyhound  code-shares on T.N.N & O Coaches on a direct Albuquerque -Colorado Springs service with a few departures per day. But they take about the same time as the train. (about 8 hours). I am curious, when you say 5 or 6 hours, does that involve seriously going over the speed limit without any stops ? I am curious as to why a bus would take so much longer (it doesn’t have many stops, check www.greyhound.com) Another option you may consider is to drive around the ABQ airport to get a list of private charter operators (the small planes/airlines nobody knows about). perhaps they run some taxi services or low cost charters which might be feasable for you.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have several week-long gigs coming up in February in Colorado Springs, CO.  It’s a 5 or 6 hour drive from ABQ.  I could also cram my fat butt into a RJ and it is a 1 hour flight (Mesa), or I could take a more comfortable (for me) 737 from ABQ-DEN-COS (United), or ABQ-PHX-COS (America West) and it would take 5 or 6 hours. Of course, that does not include the time spent driving to the airport, parking, checking in, going through security, and then waiting on my half-moons for departing flights / connections. You know what?  I’m driving a rental car.  No revenue for the airlines.  You can blame the TSA – final straw.  If the time spent is more-or-less equal, I’ll drive from now on.  Far less hassle. Of course, I’ll still be flying a lot – some places are just too far away to drive to reasonably.  But when I can, I’ll drive.  Screw the TSA.

   Yup.  Went to Savannah in Dec.  Someone asked why we weren’t flying. It’s a 5 hour trip tops.  To fly means a half hour drive to the airport.  Getting there 1.5 hours prior to departure.  An hour gate to gate.  half hour to collect baggage.  Ya gotta arrange transport to your hotel.  Tops you save maybe an hour flying, and you have to travel on their schedule.  Ya drive, you leave when you want to leave.  You have a car when you get there.  No air traffic delays or weather holds.  No one groping you up and down unless you want them too.  You can carry your swiss army knife with you.  The only really down side is the drive is dull as hell.       For me break even is somewhere around 5 hours.  7 hours is a tad long but in certian situations, preferable.

Response:

I have several week-long gigs coming up in February in Colorado Springs, CO.  It’s a 5 or 6 hour drive from ABQ.  I could also cram my fat butt into a RJ and it is a 1 hour flight (Mesa), or I could take a more comfortable (for me) 737 from ABQ-DEN-COS (United), or ABQ-PHX-COS (America West) and it would take 5 or 6 hours.

No big deal… Twice in the last 15 months, we’ve driven from Central Texas to the castle Rock area North of COS.  850 miles, a really long day’s run, but split between two drivers, not bad, and both times stimulated by the amount "stuff" (and two dogs) we were taking. In late August/early September, Central Texas-Ocala-Orlando- Cocoa-Jax and back, after fuguring projected rental car and air travel costs and considering two weeks worth of luggage including both beach and some rerquiried "dress-up", a decent tradeout. To the coast fishing once a month, a five hundred mile RT, to a destination unserved by air, and why would anybody fly on a business trip that required more than two flights each way yet was less than 4-500 miles away, easy and comfortable one day drives. I suspect that I’m not alone and that a number of business travelers have increased their driving.  Certainly, pleasure travel seems to have to some extent returned to the "car".  The cruise line folks certainly admit to it when they begin to berth cruise ships around the Gulf instead of all in Florida. …and cars are not unlike airlines.  Give me AA economy seat pitch and a larger more comnfortable vehicle. Reductions in service and potential delays now make it very difficult and often very costly for me to get to Chicago, a 4 times a year jaunt, in time to do any business or make an afternoon meeting (except by getting up long pre-dawn and driving 100+ miles to DAL or DFW, not worth the effort), so like Bill, I’ve "slowed" my trips, adding an extra day, leaving late AM and not arriving until the cocktail hour, a less stressful approach. TMO

Response:

You know what?  I’m driving a rental car.

Why a rental car instead of your own car? — Timothy J. Lee Unsolicited bulk or commercial email is not welcome. No warranty of any kind is provided with this message.

Response:

You know what?  I’m driving a rental car. Why a rental car instead of your own car?

I am on an expense account.  I get reimbursed for money spent to rent a car, not for driving my own.  And yes, I know I could declare my milage on my income tax return, but my itemized deductions come out WAY less than the standard deduction.  So, best deal for me is to rent.  Plus, I don’t want to wind the miles onto my old beater. Best Regards, Bill Mattocks

Response:

I am curious, when you say 5 or 6 hours, does that involve seriously going over the speed limit without any stops ? I am curious as to why a bus would take so much longer (it doesn’t have many stops, check www.greyhound.com)

Speed limit out here in the Wild West is 75 mph.  For cars.  Trucks and busses have a 65 mph limit.  I set the cruise control at 80 and away I go. Bus?  Um, no.  Train I could do, and have in the distant past.  But no to the bus. I tend to stop in Raton for lunch, get to the Springs by dinner. Works great! Plus, in New Mexico one can carry loaded guns concealed in the car legally.  Considered an extension of hearth and home.  I have to unload and lock it away at the Colorado border, or alternatively keep it in plain sight. Best Regards, Bill Mattocks

Response:

I have several week-long gigs coming up in February in Colorado Springs, CO.  It’s a 5 or 6 hour drive from ABQ.  I could also cram my fat butt into a RJ and it is a 1 hour flight (Mesa),

you sure ’bout that, Bill?  I’d assume that if you flew Mesa ABQ-COS, which would NOT be an HP code-share, but under Mesa’s own code (YV), your fat butt would get to experience the aerial joys of a lovely 19-passenger Beech 1900D rather than a CRJ. On the upside, you’d get to leave ABQ from one of the ground-level commuter gates, which upon my last trip to your home airport seemed to have much less of the TSA, er, ‘presence’.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am curious, when you say 5 or 6 hours, does that involve seriously going over the speed limit without any stops ? I am curious as to why a bus would take so much longer (it doesn’t have many stops, check www.greyhound.com) Speed limit out here in the Wild West is 75 mph.  For cars.  Trucks and busses have a 65 mph limit.  I set the cruise control at 80 and away I go. Bus?  Um, no.  Train I could do, and have in the distant past.  But no to the bus. I tend to stop in Raton for lunch, get to the Springs by dinner. Works great! Plus, in New Mexico one can carry loaded guns concealed in the car legally.  Considered an extension of hearth and home.  I have to unload and lock it away at the Colorado border, or alternatively keep it in plain sight. Best Regards, Bill Mattocks

That’s real good about being able to conceal the gun in New Mexico. You never know when someone may be fucking with you and then you can blast them away to oblivion. John

Response:

What time "going through security"? I haven’t had a security wait of longer than 5 minutes in months. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have several week-long gigs coming up in February in Colorado Springs, CO.  It’s a 5 or 6 hour drive from ABQ.  I could also cram my fat butt into a RJ and it is a 1 hour flight (Mesa), or I could take a more comfortable (for me) 737 from ABQ-DEN-COS (United), or ABQ-PHX-COS (America West) and it would take 5 or 6 hours. Of course, that does not include the time spent driving to the airport, parking, checking in, going through security, and then waiting on my half-moons for departing flights / connections. You know what?  I’m driving a rental car.  No revenue for the airlines.  You can blame the TSA – final straw.  If the time spent is more-or-less equal, I’ll drive from now on.  Far less hassle. Of course, I’ll still be flying a lot – some places are just too far away to drive to reasonably.  But when I can, I’ll drive.  Screw the TSA. Best Regards, Bill Mattocks

Response:

That’s real good about being able to conceal the gun in New Mexico. You never know when someone may be fucking with you and then you can blast them away to oblivion. John

Mr. Novicki, People who live in glass houses should not throw stones. Best Regards, Bill Mattocks

Response:

That’s real good about being able to conceal the gun in New Mexico. You never know when someone may be fucking with you and then you can blast them away to oblivion. John Mr. Novicki, People who live in glass houses should not throw stones. Best Regards, Bill Mattocks

Geez, Bill. That sounds ominous. Does that mean you are coming after me? John

Response:

Traveled in the area a couple months ago; traffic gets heavy around Pueblo, stop and go, with long stop stretches, from south of Colorado Springs to Fort Collins.  According to the local folks, I-25 clears a bit between Fort Collins and Cheyenne, and below Pueblo, the rest is very heavy to stop and go. Bus?  Um, no.  Train I could do, and have in the distant past.  But no to the bus. I tend to stop in Raton for lunch, get to the Springs by dinner. Works great!

– wf. Wayne Flowers Randee Greenwald

Response:

Geez, Bill. That sounds ominous. Does that mean you are coming after me? John

Of course not.  Go on being the angry, vulgar old man you’ve always been, and I’ll go on ignoring you as I did in the past. Best Regards, Bill Mattocks

Response:

Question:

there’s a chance some smaller schoolie stripers will still be in the river. Shad will most likely be gone, but the smallmouth action should be fantastic. Oh yeah, when Rick and I got to the dock on Sunday afternoon " Dock Lady " ( you have to meet her in person, words can’t really adequetly describe her ) … Is she the one who is in the last Sage catalog ?

Haven’t seen the latest Sage catalog but I can guarantee that’s not her.

Response:

Fishing out of Fletchers Sunday and Monday: lots of BIG hickory shad, caught on the outgoing tide-using Teeny 250 or 300 lines, 6′ hunk of 12lb test Maxima for a leader ( God bless Maxima but I hate those fucking archaic spools theyl put the stuff on ) casting slightly upstream and usually getting a hit on the start of the swing. Flies on the small side-size 6 to 8 clousers with short tails-white with gold flash and chartruese with gold flash . I was getting alot of misses till I chopped off the tails to within about 3/8" of the hook bend , after that it was Heaven.Last cast of the day Monday I hooked an American shad, about 3 or 4 times the size and heft of the hickories. Last couple years the Americans were running about as big as that species can get, up to 30"s. This one took me into my backing about 50-75′. It took a long damn time to wind all that line in after it threw the hook that’s for sure. The Americans should be starting to come on strong now, the water’s warming up and clearing. They like the stretch of water just up from Fletchers dock area, on a rising tide and then right up till slack tide. They come there to spawn. Most of the hickory action’s been on the falling tides. The female stripers are running up to 40lbs. and the cut herring/bottom fishing guys have been hauling in a bunch. I keep trying for them but all I do is lose expensive flies in the rocks. Would it be that terrible to soak a fly or two in a bucket of herring chum and then run my leader through a slip sinker and just sorta drop it over the side of the boat while I eat lunch or something ? I’ll have to sleep on that. Anyway the male stripers are expected by the end of the week and they’ll be possible to catch using ethical methods The river should be low enough for safe wading by the end of the week too if the levels keep dropping at a steady clip. Oh yeah, when my Rick and I got to the dock on Sunday afternoon " Dock Lady " ( you have to meet her in person, words can’t really adequetly describe her ) told us everyone coming off the river was pissed at us because we two flyrodders were taking shad right and left all day and they, the spinning guys were only hitting them off and on and "they said you two bastards must be doing something illegal ". Even allowing for "Dock Ladys" habit of slight exageration it still was good to hear. It’s usually the other way around. cheers, Bob nursing a painfully pleasant case of "shad elbow"

Response:

Hello East Coasters, We are catching Stripers in the Sacramento, Feather and American Rivers now too as our big spring spawning run has started (April/May/June). This is south(downstream) and north(upstream) of Sacramento. The main runs will go all the way upstream (north) to Colusa and above on the Sacramento River. We fish them wading and from boats. Some of our friends caught some Stripers on flies yesterday and today. The American Shad are just behind the Stripers and will be thick in a few weeks. PS: Thanks for bringing those Stripers and Shad over here to the west coast in 1877. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento, California, USA www.kiene.com

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Fishing out of Fletchers Sunday and Monday: lots of BIG hickory shad, caught on the outgoing tide-using Teeny 250 or 300 lines, 6′ hunk of 12lb test Maxima for a leader ( God bless Maxima but I hate those fucking archaic spools theyl put the stuff on ) casting slightly upstream and usually getting a hit on the start of the swing. Flies on the small side-size 6 to 8 clousers with short tails-white with gold flash and chartruese with gold flash . I was getting alot of misses till I chopped off the tails to within about 3/8" of the hook bend , after that it was Heaven.Last cast of the day Monday I hooked an American shad, about 3 or 4 times the size and heft of the hickories. Last couple years the Americans were running about as big as that species can get, up to 30"s. This one took me into my backing about 50-75′. It took a long damn time to wind all that line in after it threw the hook that’s for sure. The Americans should be starting to come on strong now, the water’s warming up and clearing. They like the stretch of water just up from Fletchers dock area, on a rising tide and then right up till slack tide. They come there to spawn. Most of the hickory action’s been on the falling tides. The female stripers are running up to 40lbs. and the cut herring/bottom fishing guys have been hauling in a bunch. I keep trying for them but all I do is lose expensive flies in the rocks. Would it be that terrible to soak a fly or two in a bucket of herring chum and then run my leader through a slip sinker and just sorta drop it over the side of the boat while I eat lunch or something ? I’ll have to sleep on that. Anyway the male stripers are expected by the end of the week and they’ll be possible to catch using ethical methods The river should be low enough for safe wading by the end of the week too if the levels keep dropping at a steady clip. Oh yeah, when my Rick and I got to the dock on Sunday afternoon " Dock Lady " ( you have to meet her in person, words can’t really adequetly describe her ) told us everyone coming off the river was pissed at us because we two flyrodders were taking shad right and left all day and they, the spinning guys were only hitting them off and on and "they said you two bastards must be doing something illegal ". Even allowing for "Dock Ladys" habit of slight exageration it still was good to hear. It’s usually the other way around. cheers, Bob nursing a painfully pleasant case of "shad elbow"

Response:

Question:

Well if ROFF is rec.outdoors.fishing fly then! Vern

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If anybody is interested I started posting a couple of picts on ABPF If ABPF was something I knew of, then I’ve forgotten what it is. Regards, Jeff

Response:

What is the web address? I have never been able to find them. Big Dale

Response:

What is the web address? I have never been able to find them. Big Dale

Newsgroup:  alt.binaries.pictures.fishing — All fishermen are liars ‘cept you n me, and I’m starting to have doubts about you! www.fishticker.com

Response:

If anybody is interested I started posting a couple of picts on ABPF from the Maine Clave and will do a few every night ( unless someone has a problem with having there pict posted there, let me know). There is a couple of pictures up from yesterday at Salmon River when I meet Joe F. and his freind Craig. Had a great time with them and the fishing was great! Vern

Response:

If anybody is interested I started posting a couple of picts on ABPF from the Maine Clave and will do a few every night ( unless someone has a problem with having there pict posted there, let me know). There is a couple of pictures up from yesterday at Salmon River when I meet Joe F. and his freind Craig. Had a great time with them and the fishing was great! Vern

I have saved most of them for wallpaper!  Great job Vern.  Thanks!! — A question debated and left unanswered is better than a question answered without debate.

Response:

If anybody is interested I started posting a couple of picts on ABPF

If ABPF was something I knew of, then I’ve forgotten what it is. Regards, Jeff

Response:

If anybody is interested I started posting a couple of picts on ABPF If ABPF was something I knew of, then I’ve forgotten what it is.

alt.binaries.pictures.fishing — Charlie…

Response:

Question:

   In the first place Mike didn’t do anything any decent person would have done. I sent an E-mail to Dianna telling her my opinion of the article and received a reply which was negative and did not sound like her.  I did not know about the injury to her husband and the pressure she was under at the time.  As the Editor she did have a responsibility to place a disclaimer to state FAOL’s position on Old Ruff’s article, which she did not do.  This made it appear that they condoned this inflammatory article.  Then she removed the negative comments about it from FAOL which further indicated FAOL’s position was to agree with the article.  Deanna made some serious errors and her actions led to the current situation.    Mike’s reputation is even better with me because he has the courage of his convictions.  If I had to chose between Mike and FAOL, Mike would win every time. Ernie Harrison – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a certain reputation to uphold here, and elsewhere.< Not any more. Oh, I think Mike still enjoys a pretty good reputation on ROFF.  Of course, my supposition hinges on the assumption that you don’t speak for all of us…….I could be wrong.

Response:

ROFF is the one place, FAOL cannot censor opposing points of view. < And one YOU cannot censor.

And what have I censored? bc.

Response:

HRBlain writes: I could be wrong.< You often are.

Careful, HR, or you’ll end up in Bmabia, which is right next to Bmalia.  In fact, they share the same fire and police dpts.  The young ladies in Bmabia, however, are small titted, unlike the lucious dolls of Bmalia.  Something about the water I suspect. Dave L.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Mike,   Ok, already! Perhaps it is only me, but I see no need to burden ROFF with ongoing matters on FAOL. For days on end, we get a bombardment of threads, the vast majority started by yourself, to discuss your beef with folks who don’t regularly contribute here. Wasn’t it you who had to depart us once before over needless bulk caused by other threads? You seem to be taken with the need to justify on this forum why you shouldn’t be blamed for the demise(if indeed such happens)of FAOL. It is perfectly rational that some blame you. Get over it. Get back to the insightful and well written stuff that has endeared you to many. I miss your angling writing, and hope not to offend with these observations.                         regards,                          Tom Littleton "Every now and then when your life gets complicated and the weasels start closing in, the only real cure is to load up on heinous chemicals and then drive like a bastard from Hollywood to Las Vegas."

Tom: I am little more than a lurker here with very few posts to my credit. I have, however, read Mr. Connors and many others posts over the last 6 months. In this time I’ve found him to be free with his knowledge, a prolific contributor to the group, and above all, a reasonable and courteous gentleman. He now finds himself in a position of being slandered, quoted out of context, and generally maligned by persons who aren’t qualified to carry his creel. His integrity has been called in to question by persons with less than honourable methods. I think he has handled himself with more restraint than I could. If he feels that posting to a public forum is the best way to defend his name, I am willing to afford him some lattitude. IMHO, ROFF is a forum for educated (formal or otherwise) and sometimes opinionated, gentleman to gather for thought provoking discussion with fly fishing being the tie that binds (if not always the main topic <G). When I get tired of a thread I just move to the next subject header. Rick O. "Children are born with an innate sense of justice; it usually takes twelve years of public schooling and four more years of college to beat it out of them." "Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell."

Response:

Like I said in another post… "Crusty Factor" — Michael Era

Question:

I vote we change the name of ROFF to Alt. M. Skeeter seems much more appropriate lately. Willi

Response:

I vote we change the name of ROFF to Alt. M. Skeeter seems much more appropriate lately. Willi

Over in the comp.* newsgroups, they have something called "advocacy" groups.  The idea is that all of the "Mac sux, PC Rulz!" and "Bill Gates is the Great Satan" threads should be limited to comp.*.advocacy, leaving the technical newsgroups for discussion of technical issues.  If you don’t like having the "M. Skeeter" threads in ROFF, you might consider forming ROFF.advocacy. Having said that, let me make it clear that I am not taking aim at Tim W. In my opinion, his posts are as relevant as those from the spokespersons for the flyfishing industry, any of the posts on the morality of C&R, debates about whether real flyfishers use indicators, condemnations of shuffling, condemnations of fishing for spawning salmon, or the thread on jet skis.  You just need to decide where you want this stuff to appear. If you want any of it in ROFF, then you should be prepared for all of it. — Frank

Response:

Question:

I fish in the Chattahoochee River around Atlanta,GA.  Its fairly large and has some deep holes so some sort of float tube is very useful. I have had no problems with the donut style.  Though I can see the advantages of the U-boat, they do tend to be larger than the donut. I’m not a particulary large person (5′7′, 160 lbs) so I have not really seen the need for the U-boat.  Also part of this is that I do not do a lot true floating.  It serves more as a safety device and a way to float over to a mid-stream rock. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve been tubing for about 12 years here in Michigan and like my good old ‘donut’ boat. The only thing I don’t like about it is getting in and out, and while flippin’ through thin, weedy and silty shorelines. I found the U-Boats to not support my legs underwater. I was always forcing my legs into the water where the donuts rest across the top of your legs. Others I’ve spoken to don’t feel as secure in the U-boats. I prefer a U-Boat. I don’t have either of the probs you mentioned. The U-Boat is much easier to get in and out of and I find ‘em generally more comfortable (then again I’m a pretty large mammal 6′4" ~230 . I can’t think of any reason to recommend a donut over a U for full sized adults. I have one made by the Creek Company. Quality is excellent. In general though, I’d say float tubes are just an awesome fishing tool and will enhance your experience no matter what type you decide to go with.

Response:

have three doughnut tubes….all of which go unused since my purchase of a quality U boat.  Granted, mine was custom built for me….but my wife has a stock U boat and loves her as much as I love mine.  Neither of us would ever consider going back to a round tube.

Hi All float tubers, The U or V type boats have taken over here in Northern California. If you like to float tube lakes, then go look at a new Outcast ‘Super Fat Cat’ in person. Get it on the floor and really look at it. They have the same raised front end as a ‘Zodiac’ type boat has, so the water runs under the boat causing way less drag. This is the hottest thing to happen to the belly boat market in years. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY www.kiene.com

Response:

  By the way, the "stock model Stealth Riders ("V" boats from Wood River) are great.  I purchased one for my wife and she’s been really happy with it. Barry

I have to second this in a big way.  I have used a round tube for about ten years, and still cannot believe how much I like the wood river boats.   Probably the best part is how much easier they are to launch and land.   — Andrew Brunette

Response:

Some valve types require you to push and hold something for them to deflate. Tire-type valves fall into this category.  This means while your buddies watch their tubes deflate while sipping apprez-fishing drinks, you’ll be on the ground holding the valve and squeezing the air out. My old JW Outfitters has a Roberts valve like this but I think new ones are improved.

Just wanted to let you know that tire tube valves can be removes using a special wrench.  I have valve covers on mine that have the wrench built it.   Take the cover off, turn it over, take out the valve, go have a drink, and your tube will be deflated.  The wrenches/caps should be available at all car parts stores.  I think they’re under $2.  Make sure you get extra stems too as you’ll probably lose atleast a couple in a lifetime. Matthew           Matthew W Kaphan    http://home.sprintmail.com/~mwk            Silverdale, WA

Response:

As long as we’re on this thread, perhaps some folks would be willing to weigh in on the question — U-tube versus standard (doughnut)  float tube. I’m in the market, and trying to decide which way to go. I’ve used a standard tube, the U tube would be something new to me. David Shaffer Minneapolis, MN

Response:

Some time ago, Pete Ross (Wood River Products), was seeking feedback on various tube designs and options.  Because I had used tubes for so many years, he sent prototypes to me to try out and make suggestions.  During this process, I found out what was best for me and had Pete build two of them….one for me and one for my father (who is 80 yrs old and still is an active float tuber).  By the way, the "stock model Stealth Riders ("V" boats from Wood River) are great.  I purchased one for my wife and she’s been really happy with it.

I’ve yakked some with Pete and his brother Greg myself. Nice guys – killer product. It’s neat you were part of the field test program. I have a couple of JW Outfitter pontoon boats,  plus their "Ultimate" model belly boat. Of the three, I prefer the old donut. Pontoons are a pain as far as I’m concerned- big, awkward, totally uncontrollable in wind. I’m unloading both of them for Wood River V-boats. For the kind of stillwater fishing I like to do  (small, high lakes) – Pete’s boats are the best: They’re fast, maneuverable, lightweight and comfortable. And of course, they’re a heck of a lot easier to get in and out of than the old donut. Thanks for the info, Dennis

Response:

have three doughnut tubes….all of which go unused since my purchase of a quality U boat.  Granted, mine was custom built for me….but my wife has a stock U boat and loves her as much as I love mine.  Neither of us would ever consider going back to a round tube. Barry, how do you go about getting a float tube custom-built? Are you friends with the manufacturer? – or is this something anyone can have done? I’m really curious. Regards, Dennsi

Some time ago, Pete Ross (Wood River Products), was seeking feedback on various tube designs and options.  Because I had used tubes for so many years, he sent prototypes to me to try out and make suggestions.  During this process, I found out what was best for me and had Pete build two of them….one for me and one for my father (who is 80 yrs old and still is an active float tuber).  By the way, the "stock model Stealth Riders ("V" boats from Wood River) are great.  I purchased one for my wife and she’s been really happy with it. Barry

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I’ve been tubing for about 12 years here in Michigan and like my good old ‘donut’ boat. The only thing I don’t like about it is getting in and out, and while flippin’ through thin, weedy and silty shorelines. I found the U-Boats to not support my legs underwater. I was always forcing my legs into the water where the donuts rest across the top of your legs. Others I’ve spoken to don’t feel as secure in the U-boats.

(snip) Perhaps you’re not using the right U Boat or the one you tried was not the right size for you.  I’ve fished with float tubes for 40 yrs and have three doughnut tubes….all of which go unused since my purchase of a quality U boat.  Granted, mine was custom built for me….but my wife has a stock U boat and loves her as much as I love mine.  Neither of us would ever consider going back to a round tube. Different strokes for different folks, I guess. Barry

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writes: Perhaps you’re not using the right U Boat or the one you tried was not the right size for you.  I’ve fished with float tubes for 40 yrs and have three doughnut tubes….all of which go unused since my purchase of a quality U boat.  Granted, mine was custom built for me….but my wife has a stock U boat and loves her as much as I love mine.  Neither of us would ever consider going back to a round tube. Different strokes for different folks, I guess. Barry

I was out last week with a buddy and a "newbie" we brought along.  My buddy had a spare tube and was going through the rigamarole of getting the newcomer situated with fins, etc and telling him to be careful walking with the fins while he waddled towards the water.  I chuckled, grabbed my U-tube, fins and rod, walked into the thigh deep water, sat down, pulled on the fins and paddled away. I too, would never go back to a round tube. Brent

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As long as we’re on this thread, perhaps some folks would be willing to weigh in on the question — U-tube versus standard (doughnut)  float tube. I’m in the market, and trying to decide which way to go. I’ve used a standard tube, the U tube would be something new to me.

Take a long hard look at the "V" boats too. Wood River, in particular, has a hell of a product, and the Ross brothers are good people. Pete Ross invented the original U-boat, then "re-invented it in the form of the V-boat – only this time he patented the design before somebody else beat him to the punch. Check it out before you write your check.

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I’ve been tubing for about 12 years here in Michigan and like my good old ‘donut’ boat. The only thing I don’t like about it is getting in and out, and while flippin’ through thin, weedy and silty shorelines. I found the U-Boats to not support my legs underwater. I was always forcing my legs into the water where the donuts rest across the top of your legs. Others I’ve spoken to don’t feel as secure in the U-boats. The only time I would consider a pontoon (despite considerable pressure from those who sell them) is if I planned on fishing a lot of heavier running water. On lakes and ponds you have little directional stability without dropping your rod and paddling, and you are very much at the mercy of the wind. I ask a buddy on one of the pontoons where he was going as he paddled away, he said he was paddling up-wind so by the time he drifted (sailed!) back to our fishing area he would have a new fly tied on. With a float-tube you can fin like a fish, holding your direction while fishing or tying. You can chomp on a sandwich while finning to as new location or otherwise keep your feet busy while your hand do something else. That, to me, is the #1 drawback of pontoons. (the others being windage, cost, bulk, weight and complication. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – After wrestling my canoe around today, I’ve decided that a float tube or pontoon outfit looks like a pretty good idea.  Funny.  I couldn’t handle the canoe on & off the vehicle as well as I did 20 years ago and, without an anchor to use when it’s windy, a canoe is a real handfull. I’ve watched fly fishermen on various lakes around here with both the tubes and pontoons.  I get the idea from visiting with various fishermen that the pontoons work a bit better.  But, it seems they’d be harder to haul.  I have a Jeep Grand Cherokee and a pontoon would kind of fill it up.   I would appreciate any ideas from those of you who have experience with either tubes or pontoons.   As always, please respond by e-mail as well as to the group.  I’d hate to miss any info because of my unreliable server.   Thanks, To reply, remove one "bs" from E-mail address

  I have a tube and will have a pontoon soon.  (also have a canoe, drift boat, and jet boat). The other posts are on the money on the relative merits of each.  I have demo’ed some pontoons and like the speed,  and warmth during the winter,  but they just aren’t as good of "fishing" platform.  They are not stealthy, require a lot of handling, won’t stay oriented so that you can pay attention to where the fish are.  I use a power boat to get to the general area where the fish are and then launch the tube for a more stealthy approach.  I think this is best on large waters.  On ponds and small lakes you might need the mobility of the pontoon, and of course on creeks and small rivers a pontoon is the only choice. Why choose?  Buy both.  Life if too short to have to live with only one or two "boats"

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 As always, please respond by e-mail as well as to the group.  I’d hate to miss any info because of my unreliable server.  Thanks,

Bob,         I’ve had a Browning Predator float tube for years and years, and really love it.  The only disadvantage I can find with the float tube is its inability to cover long distances quickly.  Otherwise, they are made for fly fishing!  It’s so nice being able to move, manuever,  WHILE  using both hands to fish.  I used to get so frustrated trying to pick up/put down paddles and anchor lines while trying to cast, retrieve, set the hook, etc., when fishing from my canoe.  It seems if you had to set down the paddle for a minute, the wind would spin you around in the most awkward direction, or blow you away from where you had to be.  Not so with the float tube. Bob Scott

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Tubes are better: 1. In high wind because they don’t have lots of area. Really important out west in Wyoming 2. Are cheaper 3. Easier to move, backpack 4. More stealthy during fishing. The fish are concerned about whats above them out of the water but seamingly unconcerned about your legs and flippers under the water. Pontoons are better 1. Can use oars and can move you around faster 2. More comfortable and keeps your butt out of cold water 3. Easier to cast from (your higher up) 4. Only way to go on a river 5. Can move you into shallower water since your body isn’t under the bladers I have a friend who owns a small Hobby hardside pontoon craft that he lashes down with four straps to his Grand Cherokee’s roof rack. Its much quicker then any belly boat. It also works well in the wind since it only sits about 4 inches above the water when he is in it. Perfect for lakes but it would be terribly dangerous on a river. I have both but put the pontoon boat (8 ft with large inflatable bladders) in rivers only. It killed me on Wyoming lakes. The wind pushed me so hard that the day turned into rowing exercise and not fishing. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – After wrestling my canoe around today, I’ve decided that a float tube or pontoon outfit looks like a pretty good idea.  Funny.  I couldn’t handle the canoe on & off the vehicle as well as I did 20 years ago and, without an anchor to use when it’s windy, a canoe is a real handfull. I’ve watched fly fishermen on various lakes around here with both the tubes and pontoons.  I get the idea from visiting with various fishermen that the pontoons work a bit better.  But, it seems they’d be harder to haul.  I have a Jeep Grand Cherokee and a pontoon would kind of fill it up.   I would appreciate any ideas from those of you who have experience with either tubes or pontoons.   As always, please respond by e-mail as well as to the group.  I’d hate to miss any info because of my unreliable server.   Thanks, To reply, remove one "bs" from E-mail address

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Bob, I have tried a few kinds so I’ll give some opinion on pros and cons. About the shapes, the advantages are also drawbacks; as in any boat design you have to decide what you want and compromise. A boat that can be easily propelled will help you get where you want, but will be harder to hold still in the wind to fish accurately. Float tube success with dries, nymphs, and leeches often depends on your staying as still as possible to present your fly as intended. All tubes are pretty good at this compared to a canoe fished solo. Anchors are a great equalizer but are objectionable for pulling up and leaving a mess of weeds.  All tube types are also great for trolling very slowly which will catch you a lot of fish. No matter what kind you pick, the type of valve is very important. It is a little bit of effort but you can blow up most non-donut types by mouth tight enough to fish. Someday this will make the difference between your tubing or not because pumps break or get forgotten. Tire type valves used in donut tubes I have seen cannot be blown up by mouth (please tell me different anyone who knows a way).  In my opinion the best valves are a large grey plastic thing with a spring button release, as used on whitewater rafts. The opening is very wide so you can blow them up by pump or mouth quickly, then you attach a fitting for a pump to bring it to very tight pressure. The spring release lets it deflate very quickly too.  I have seen these on SuperCat and Wood river tubes, and expect they are on many other models now.  Some valve types require you to push and hold something for them to deflate. Tire-type valves fall into this category.  This means while your buddies watch their tubes deflate while sipping apprez-fishing drinks, you’ll be on the ground holding the valve and squeezing the air out. My old JW Outfitters has a Roberts valve like this but I think new ones are improved.  Here are ones I have tried and the pros and cons: JW Outfitters – Osprey (their original model pontoon). Seat sits 4"+ from water, but sags and is slowed down if tubes and straps are not tight. You can just barely blow it up by mouth tight enough for good performance. Sitting so high is great for fishing, great in winter, this boat can be kicked pretty fast, but paddling it causes more surface commotion that you would if sitting deeper. It gets blown around in the wind as there is very little underwater resistance. But I can troll a half mile across a lake. The metal frame breaks down and it packs pretty small for travel, but not something you’d fit in a pack. Price was around $300 in 1994. Bucks Colt – this is a small stubby pontoon boat. The valves can be blown up by mouth but it is a contortion getting your mouth to them but it can be done. The seat is molded plastic and sits right at the surface, so your butt is colder and you miss the catamaran speed advantage of the real pontoon boats. The rigid seat makes this not the best for traveling.  Price was around $190 in 1996. Wood River V Boat – Faster than a donut tube but slower than a pontoon. Seat down in the water.  Very light and compact, about five pounds for the basic model with no pockets; this is the best tube I could find for backpacking. I think the V or U boat best for windy lakes as they have some of the directional stability of a pontoon with enough of you underwater to help hold in place. Needs to be pumped very tight for best performance because this one has no crossbar. Prices range from $180 to $250. Sevylor donut polyvinyl-$10-20 -the diaper tube. One last tip – to really get a tube tight by mouth only, blow it up in the cold night, or at elevation two to three thousand feet below where you will fish, and let temperature or elevation do the work for you. Are we tubers yet? Mark Vinsel www.vinsel.com   I would appreciate any ideas from those of you who have experience with either tubes or pontoons.   As always, please respond by e-mail as well as to the group.  I’d hate to miss any info because of my unreliable server.   Thanks, To reply, remove one "bs" from E-mail address

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After wrestling my canoe around today, I’ve decided that a float tube or pontoon outfit looks like a pretty good idea.  Funny.  I couldn’t handle the canoe on & off the vehicle as well as I did 20 years ago and, without an anchor to use when it’s windy, a canoe is a real handfull.   I’ve watched fly fishermen on various lakes around here with both the tubes and pontoons.  I get the idea from visiting with various fishermen that the pontoons work a bit better.  But, it seems they’d be harder to haul.  I have a Jeep Grand Cherokee and a pontoon would kind of fill it up.   I would appreciate any ideas from those of you who have experience with either tubes or pontoons.   As always, please respond by e-mail as well as to the group.  I’d hate to miss any info because of my unreliable server.   Thanks, To reply, remove one "bs" from E-mail address

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Bob, My preference is the tube. I feel I can maneuver a tube a little bit better than I can the pontoon. Although on long floats I always take the pontoon. Sitting in the water all day, especially in the winter, can be sort of a pain. Keep in mind that I’m float in rivers mostly. I think if I fished in lakes I would go with the pontoon. J.W. Outfitters has a pontoon called the "Scout" that weighs about 20lbs. The step up weighs 42lbs. but has a few more features, like the load capacity is greater. Hope this helps. Kevin – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – After wrestling my canoe around today, I’ve decided that a float tube or pontoon outfit looks like a pretty good idea.  Funny.  I couldn’t handle the canoe on & off the vehicle as well as I did 20 years ago and, without an anchor to use when it’s windy, a canoe is a real handfull. I’ve watched fly fishermen on various lakes around here with both the tubes and pontoons.  I get the idea from visiting with various fishermen that the pontoons work a bit better.  But, it seems they’d be harder to haul.  I have a Jeep Grand Cherokee and a pontoon would kind of fill it up.   I would appreciate any ideas from those of you who have experience with either tubes or pontoons.   As always, please respond by e-mail as well as to the group.  I’d hate to miss any info because of my unreliable server.   Thanks, To reply, remove one "bs" from E-mail address

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I am considering purchasing a float tube.  Any suggestions or comments as to brand or model?

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I am considering purchasing a float tube.  Any suggestions or comments as to brand or model?

I’ve used a Buck’s Bag model "Hi & Dri" for four years now and am very happy with it.  I’ve avoided "buying up" to the more expensive (and cumbersome) u-tubes, pontoons, etc.  I haven’t seen anyone mention it yet but I find the front of the donut shaped tube acts as a good fulcrum to brace your knee against when paddling. For fins I’d recommend the Caddis version that you lace on.  They’re a lot less expensive than the Force Fins and just as efficient (and they float).  I own both types and never use the Force Fins anymore. I use Cabella’s 3 mm waders.  They are relatively inexpensive, durable and comfortable.  I’d also recommend getting a pair of Glacier Boots to save wear on the waders. Good Luck – float tubing’s great fun. Mike

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I am considering purchasing a float tube.  Any suggestions or comments as to brand or model?

I own a Buck’s Bag and am happy with it.  However, many ff’ers are starting to go with kick boats instead of float tubes.  They are much safer in whitewater but are tougher to carry to a remote lake.

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I am going to get one.  I have a friend that wants to sell his or I might spend a little more on a "V" shape one. — Vern My ROFF page: http://msnhomepages.talkcity.com/ResortRd/v_deloy/ROFFintro.html Before you buy.

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I saw 2 float tubes in sportsmans guide, one was a pontoon style, 70 bucks, and the other was a traditional style, 50 bucks? something in that range… www.sportsmansguide.com     i think

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I am going to get one.  I have a friend that wants to sell his or I might spend a little more on a "V" shape one. –

Vern, Have you tried his tube out? Just wondered since you describe yourself as vertically challenged and I find in my tube that I like the crotch strap as tight as possible so I sit up as high as possible in the tube. That way my elbows don’t have to be raised up to cast over the tube which is more tiring. I’m 6′4". Now this is likely a peculiarity of my own since I am above average height but if you are below average you might not enjoy being down inside the tube donut- just in general.  It might be that you would enjoy the V type more since they provide better flotation and you aren’t as enclosed. Just a thought. Cheers. Jon

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Thanks for the info. — Vern My ROFF page: http://msnhomepages.talkcity.com/ResortRd/v_deloy/ROFFintro.html Before you buy.

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choc…hot dog??  i got the vienna sausage lecture. jeff   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was at a place in the tropics that liked to feed hot dogs to a moray eel by the reef. They cautioned people not to point their finger at it and, of course, recommended that the males leave their trunks on. — Charlie…

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Vern –         I’ve always had really good luck with my Buck’s Bags float tubes.  I own a Hi&Dry Giant and a Top Gun, and both have proven to be real workhorses.   I use them primarily on small warmwater lakes and ponds, and other than a Cottonmouth trying to climb in with me once, I haven’t had any problems with the quality or workmanship. There’s a downside to float tubes, though, and it may be a bigger issue for you than some others.   You’ve been quite open about your size, and while I’m not trying to offend, you might have a few problems with a traditional float tube as a result.   I’m 5-10, and I have problems launching one.   I have a much bigger problem in that if you do manage to lose a fin, or get discarded monofilament wrapped around your legs, or something similar,  it can be a total bitch to deal with unless you have long arms.   The tube itself is VERY difficult to reach around, and trying to reach down through it doesn’t work well either.         I saw a couple of very nice designs out on Ebay recently, and both are designed around the concept of "pontoon" craft.  Caddis has one that is similar to a traditional belly boat, but rather than having a donut-shaped tube, it has a pontoon down either side. There’s also one out there that is made by the Creek Company, which has a fairly common "U-Boat" design but uses pontoons that are several feet long,  This unit actually looks to give you a seat about 5" above the water, which can make a lot of difference if you’re fishing cold-water lakes for trout.   I haven’t fished out of one, but it looks quite good.         No matter which boat you get, you’ll love it.  Once you get used to controlling the boat with your feet, it’s like having the ultimate mind-reading guide to put the boat "just exactly" where you want it at all times.  I use mine a lot, and wouldn’t give them up.                                 Michael – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’m in the search of my first float tube.  So, all this information is very nice.  What I wanted to say was, I saw a man using a small trolling motor.  Another man that I saw was using a depth gauge/fish finder.  What are the problems using either of these to items in a float tube?

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_____  Nice read Mike.  Thank you. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Vern –         I’ve always had really good luck with my Buck’s Bags float tubes.  I own a Hi&Dry Giant and a Top Gun, and both have proven to be real workhorses.   I use them primarily on small warmwater lakes and ponds, and other than a Cottonmouth trying to climb in with me once, I haven’t had any problems with the quality or workmanship. There’s a downside to float tubes, though, and it may be a bigger issue for you than some others.   You’ve been quite open about your size, and while I’m not trying to offend, you might have a few problems with a traditional float tube as a result.   I’m 5-10, and I have problems launching one.   I have a much bigger problem in that if you do manage to lose a fin, or get discarded monofilament wrapped around your legs, or something similar,  it can be a total bitch to deal with unless you have long arms.   The tube itself is VERY difficult to reach around, and trying to reach down through it doesn’t work well either.         I saw a couple of very nice designs out on Ebay recently, and both are designed around the concept of "pontoon" craft.  Caddis has one that is similar to a traditional belly boat, but rather than having a donut-shaped tube, it has a pontoon down either side. There’s also one out there that is made by the Creek Company, which has a fairly common "U-Boat" design but uses pontoons that are several feet long,  This unit actually looks to give you a seat about 5" above the water, which can make a lot of difference if you’re fishing cold-water lakes for trout.   I haven’t fished out of one, but it looks quite good.         No matter which boat you get, you’ll love it.  Once you get used to controlling the boat with your feet, it’s like having the ultimate mind-reading guide to put the boat "just exactly" where you want it at all times.  I use mine a lot, and wouldn’t give them up.                                 Michael I’m in the search of my first float tube.  So, all this information is very nice.  What I wanted to say was, I saw a man using a small trolling motor.  Another man that I saw was using a depth gauge/fish finder.  What are the problems using either of these to items in a float tube?

– Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

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Wolfgang wrote;snip  I have, on three separate occasions been bitten on the nipple by blue gills while wading at beaches in different parts of the country.

I have no nipple patterns, but I think you can see why I believe that if there were 10 pound bluegills no one would swim in the lakes. Big Dale

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In a related note, has anyone used those tubes which seem to be a composite between the pontoon boats and the float tubes? They are more or less like pontoon boats but have no frame, are lighter and generally smaller and cheaper. Any good? Jon

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Might I recommend instead that you simply wear a shirt next time. I’d hate to think what would have happened had you not been wearing any shorts.

I was at a place in the tropics that liked to feed hot dogs to a moray eel by the reef. They cautioned people not to point their finger at it and, of course, recommended that the males leave their trunks on. — Charlie…

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<< Fred, interesting you mention this.   I have found that the fish ignore my presence when in a float tube.   I have noticed the same thing.  One of the lakes I fish is a high pressure C&R lake.  While pondering the meaning of life, where my beer was and when I was going to stop for lunch one day, I had a 20+ rainbow come up and sip a midge not more then a foot away from my tube.  The water was relatively shallow here too. One of the great pleasure of float tubing has been the ability to observe fish cruising and feeding. You miss most of this while in a boat. Mike

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Fred, interesting you mention this.   I have found that the fish ignore my presence when in a float tube.  The lakes that I fish are pretty clear and I have had fish swim under me several times.  A couple have even stayed under me.

Warren, I agree that fish can and do ignore us, including me standing still in my boat, on occasion, but not when rowing or, I suspect, you come along kicking those big, black, cormorant-like fins.  But I have also seen a person kicking in a tube just move the school along at a constant distance until the fish disperse.  I fish a shallow lake, Davis (Oregon) at 8-9 ft mostly, and the fish that my boat do not spook are the smaller ones.  If I want to sneak up on something 5-6+ lbs, I have to get down on my knees and just paddle with an oar over the side.  And I can just about guarantee you that tubers never, or very rarely, get into a really large fish unless they are well into their backing on a slow troll. Fred

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…I have found that the fish ignore my presence when in a float tube….

And it seems that the deeper you are in the water, the less likely fish are to be disturbed by your presence.  I have, on three separate occasions been bitten on the nipple by blue gills while wading at beaches in different parts of the country.

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And it seems that the deeper you are in the water, the less likely fish are to be disturbed by your presence.  I have, on three separate occasions been bitten on the nipple by blue gills while wading at beaches in different parts of the country.

Might I recommend instead that you simply wear a shirt next time. I’d hate to think what would have happened had you not been wearing any shorts. –Steve | Support project KILLFILE for the chance to win | a new bamboo flyrod! Remove meniscus from my | email address to contact me regarding the project.

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    Hi, Am new to the newsgroup and have not seen anything about float tubing.

Some folks like to carry an onion sack and fill it with rocks for an anchor.  I reserve the float tube for warm calm days in the summer when I can sit around in the tube wearing shorts and t-shirt.

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very nice.  What I wanted to say was, I saw a man using a small trolling motor.  Another man that I saw was using a depth gauge/fish finder.  What are the problems using either of these to items in a float tube?

Personally, it seems like too much of a hassle.  I like the float tube because of its simplicity.  I leave it partly inflated in the garage. Throw it in the back of the truck with a pair of snorkel fins and I’m ready to fish.  I typically borrow a canoe if I need to cover more water. As far as the sonar device is concerned, most of the ponds I fish are small enough that I can ususally figure out after a few trips what the underwater topology is like.   Mu

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Just one suggestion.  Since you will probably not learn to cast (that’s OK, just a fact), don’t ever try and troll close to a school of rising fish, surrounded by folks standing in boats casting maybe 50-70 feet to those fish. Don’t ever believe that since you are close to the water the fish can’t see you, as all you will do is either put the feeding off, or just move the fish out of range of the casters, and the language can then make a mess of a beautiful day.  Have fun, and put ‘em back when you are through playing with them. Fred. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –     Hi, Am new to the newsgroup and have not seen anything about float tubing.Went out for the first time and spent whole time finning to stay correctly to the wind. Must do more of it. You’re right down there with the fish close to the water and peace abounds. Any oldtimers with tube experience please respond/  Hugh

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Don’t ever believe that since you are close to the water the fish can’t see you, as all you will do is either put the feeding off, or just move the fish out of range of the casters, and the language can then make a mess of a beautiful day.

Fred, interesting you mention this.   I have found that the fish ignore my presence when in a float tube.  The lakes that I fish are pretty clear and I have had fish swim under me several times.  A couple have even stayed under me.  I ended up jigging for them and caught one.  My friend and I are always amazed when we see the cutts and grayling swim underneath us.  We tend to be able to spot the fish we would most like to catch and kind of keep track of them and the rest of the pod. As a matter of fact, one time I was out of woolly buggers except for the one I had on and got hung up on a log.  I ended up finning my way into position so I could retrieve my bugger and went right over the pod of fish.  When I was done I went to another position, not wanting to tempt fate twice, and proceeded to catch fish who were still in the same position. Maybe in waters where the fish are constantly being buzzed by boats and such things are different.  The lakes I tube require hiking and have no boat launches so maybe are unaccustomed to floating objects. If nothing else, my experience shows the other end of the spectrum I guess. But I do agree with the part about getting too close to rising fish surrounded by people and just rising fish in general.   Warren Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

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I’m in the search of my first float tube.  So, all this information is very nice.  What I wanted to say was, I saw a man using a small trolling motor.  Another man that I saw was using a depth gauge/fish finder.  What are the problems using either of these to items in a float tube? — Vern My ROFF page: http://msnhomepages.talkcity.com/ResortRd/v_deloy/ROFFintro.html Before you buy.

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_______  You ask some very interesting innocent questions Vern. I happen to own one of those electric trolling driven float tube motorized systems.  There are some who are physically incapable or who need help to get around a pond or lake because of leg problems, heart problems, or whatever.  The gauge/fish finder is a bit much regarding using too much technology in a sport that requires we use our wits, we experiment and we suffer the slings and arrows in order to be successful.  Those who use fish finders in float tube are basically fishing for the wrong reasons but in my opinion, sae-la-vie!  To each his own.  (I imagine I spelled that wrong and I will hear about it?) Did I say . . . "slings and arrows?"   Duck!  Here they come Vern! LOL! Mr. G. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m in the search of my first float tube.  So, all this information is very nice.  What I wanted to say was, I saw a man using a small trolling motor.  Another man that I saw was using a depth gauge/fish finder.  What are the problems using either of these to items in a float tube? — Vern My ROFF page: http://msnhomepages.talkcity.com/ResortRd/v_deloy/ROFFintro.html Before you buy.

– Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

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Hi Vern, I have used a Buck’s Bag belly boat for some 15 odd yrs now and find it a relaxing way to fish.  A lower back problem has plagued me for 20 yrs or more (too many hrs on the road!) but after 1 or 2 hrs in the float tube all the pain or discomfort are magically gone.  My first Buck’s Bag was stolen out of my hatchback Toyota while I was at work one day, and it was immediately replaced. (I couldn’t be without it) The only damage ever suffered was one day I left it in my Toyota inflated (in Florida, no less) and came back 8 hrs later to find the denier outer-covering split wide open by the heat-expanded truck inner tube. A quick trip to an awning shop had it sewn up and good as new. Living in LV could produce the same results if you store your tube fully inflated in the sun. I still have and use my Buck’s Bag, the denier outer covering is sun-faded, but all the zippers still work and the stitching is still in place.  As a safety precaution, replace the inner tube at least once every 2 yrs or so, and never store it completely deflated (the creases in the tube will eventually start to show small cracks) and that ain’t good. I don’t have a problem with mounting "gadgets", ie: trolling motor or depth finder, but that is just something else for your flyline to catch on when casting. BTW, the depth finder *is* sort of a "fish finder" as it’s primary use is to let you see bottom structure, thus in an obtuse way, is a "fish finder." I’ve always had the notion of mounting a depth finder, but just can’t bring myself to add stuff to a "clean" platform. Cabela’s sells 1 and 3 pound anchors just for float tubes and/or pontoon boats, a good investment IMO. Just one other caveat, buy flippers that are designed for float tubes, not something meant for scuba diving. The droopy tips on the scuba fins will trip you up in fine style on your first attempt to get in the tube.  Be sure to draw a crowd and sell tickets if you use the wrong fins, because you will surely put on a fine comic act in just getting in your tube!  Get one Vern, you won’t regret it. Frank Church Elkhart, IN USAF RETIRED I’m in the search of my first float tube.  So, all this information is very nice.  What I wanted to say was, I saw a man using a small trolling motor.  Another man that I saw was using a depth gauge/fish finder.  What are the problems using either of these to items in a float tube? — Vern My ROFF page: http://msnhomepages.talkcity.com/ResortRd/v_deloy/ROFFintro.html

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Excellent thread started by Hugh: Snipped some to save space: The final step is choosing where you want to fish.  Look for structure areas like points, bays and rock slides.  Weed beds are also a great place to fish over and around.  I usually put on a wooly bugger and fish deep as I paddle towards my destination (forgive me George, I know you consider this trolling but I find it highly effective!).  This lets me search the water and experiment with patterns as I move around.  Once you find your hot spot you can cast into and work the bank with either line. If you have any more questions feel free to email me. Mike, Spokane, WA

______  Mike, you reminded me of another thing I do sometimes and that is to carry a compass with me when tubing in a lake or large pond. Paddling backwards, sometimes can be difficult because one may have to keep turning around to keep on coarse. I will make this example simple.  If I want to paddle backwards 360 degrees we know we only have to look down at the compass and keep the needle on 180 degrees or the reciprocal of the heading you want.  Its not often we need to do this, but there are times getting around an area is made easy by simply having one.  No big deal, but I usually have one in one of my storage bags . . . just in case Hugh, and Mike. Nuff said. — Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

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<<   Hi, Am new to the newsgroup and have not seen anything about float tubing.Went out for the first time and spent whole time finning to stay correctly to the wind. Must do more of it. You’re right down there with the fish close to the water and peace abounds. Any oldtimers with tube experience please respond/  Hugh Hugh, welcome to one of the most relaxing ways to fish.  I float tube extensively during the warm months and sometimes during the not so warm months. George pretty much covered the how to’s of using a tube.  The only thing I might add is that take a bit of time before you launch to determine where you want to go and observe what is happening. It is a lot like fishing a river. Turn over a few rocks in the shallows to see what insects are living there. Like George mentioned, scuds are often quite abundent.  Are the chironimids hatching or is there a mayfly hatch occuring.  If you figure that out you can form your strategy. Having an idea how you want to fish really comes in handy in choosing a floating vs. sinking line.  If little to no surface action then I go with a sinking line and a wooly bugger or scud imitation.  Lots of chironimids or other surface action then I go ontop.  I prefer to carry a second rod in my rod holder strung up with a floating line and use a sinking line on my primary rod.  Changing lines in a float tube is a drag!! The final step is choosing where you want to fish.  Look for structure areas like points, bays and rock slides.  Weed beds are also a great place to fish over and around.  I usually put on a wooly bugger and fish deep as I paddle towards my destination (forgive me George, I know you consider this trolling but I find it highly effective!).  This lets me search the water and experiment with patterns as I move around.  Once you find your hot spot you can cast into and work the bank with either line. If you have any more questions feel free to email me. Mike, Spokane, WA

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    Hi, Am new to the newsgroup and have not seen anything about float tubing.Went out for the first time and spent whole time finning to stay correctly to the wind. Must do more of it. You’re right down there with the fish close to the water and peace abounds. Any oldtimers with tube experience please respond/  Hugh

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    Hi, Am new to the newsgroup and have not seen anything about float tubing.Went out for the first time and spent whole time finning to stay correctly to the wind. Must do more of it. You’re right down there with the fish close to the water and peace abounds. Any oldtimers with tube experience please respond/  Hugh

Tubing has had many books written about the subject and I suppose I could write a few chapter here and now myself for you. The primary secret to float tubing is staying warm.  If the tube is moving, you’re trolling.  If your still in the water and casting, you’re fly fishing.  You have to think in patterns that imitate lake and pond life.  Leaches and minnow patterns and thinking more like a lake rather than a river will assist you into that direction.  Look into having and/or tying fairy shrimp and Crawdads patterns.  The flesh of the fish you’re catching will tell you what they are usually eating.  If the flesh is pink, their primary diet are crustaceans which contain predominantly aquatic arthropods such as crabs, shrimps and shelled exoskeleton forms of life.  These have high protein value.  The fact that few tubers tie flies to imitate snails amuses me. You may wish to carry a light anchor and if you know the wind, and the lake is large, you may want to think about using two vehicles, the second is the one the wind will eventually carry you two which could be two three miles away. You will use a lot of calories to stay warm.  As warm as the water will feel, any time it is below your ambient body temperature, body heat is slowly being sucked out of your body.  You will need to pack carbohydrates such as bread sandwiches to keep your calorie count up. Getting cold is the one thing that can ruin tubing.  Another thing is always wear a life vest and always carry a RAZOR SHARP knife on your person.   Make sure you can get out of a damaged tube and that may not be as easy as you think.  Until you are highly experienced, stay close together and fish in a buddy system.  Your fishing buddy should never be more than a minute paddling from you. Another thing is you will do best with a long fly rod like a 9.5′er for a 5 WT.  You really don’t need a long rod but to have a casting advantage because your butt is setting in the water, a longer fly rod is a big help.  Also, you have fighting leverage. Remember, you can tie into a huge fish with a tube then you may know and sooner than you think. Look at your tube design and make sure you have straps you can pull to set you free if necessary.  If the design isn’t safe to get in and out of, consider other designs. Also, while fishing, you may want to make sure you can change fly lines from floating, to sink tip to full sinking.  The STH cassette design may be just the ticket for you to look at next time you go to your pro shop.  The STH is an excellent float tube design reel.  You have all your spools in storage and its a simple matter to change them while in the middle of a lake or pond.  Always safety your fly rod somehow so that if you drop it in the water you have a thither on it somewhere, somehow.   I’m just rambling here as I think of things for you to know and maybe this will get others to add onto the thread what I cannot possibly recall in one setting. I don’t know what the latest books are, but ordering from Barnes or Amazon a couple of them might be wise.  I’m sure other fly fishermen will be more up to date in that area than I. Hope this is enough to get you kick started, but I think you should ask for some good fly patterns for ponds and lakes in ROFFT.  You will need a good dragon fly and damsel fly pattern including the nymphs.  The subject is endless. Good luck to both of you.  You sound like my kind of people.  If I can help in any other way, please feel free to contact me via E-Mail.  Don’t forget to take pictures and don’t forget to buy a water proof camera and don’t forget to get real close to each other when you take that picture.  Count one,two,three – lift the fish, snap the picture with water still streaming off it, and bingo!  You’ve got it! — Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

Response:

Does anyone out ther have any idea where I can find a set of plans to make my own float tube? The truck inner tube is no problem but I need help in getting the covering material to the right shape so it covers the shape of the tube without kinks and folds. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Joe

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: Does anyone out ther have any idea where I can find a set of plans to : make my own float tube? : The truck inner tube is no problem but I need help in getting the : covering material to the right shape so it covers the shape of the : tube without kinks and folds. For all the bother it would take, I think that it would be better and almost no extra cost to just buy one. Prices start at about $100 for a decent tube with two air chambers. — Jon Porter

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Question:

I’m interested in submitting some pictures for magazines but not sure how to do it.  Anyone know anything about this? bruce

Response:

I’m interested in submitting some pictures for magazines but not sure how to do it.  Anyone know anything about this? bruce

Hi Bruce Most of the magazines I deal with request slides of the topic. One of the things I discovered caused me to start shooting my slide differently. Before working for magazine editors I always shot my slides for inclusion in slide shows and preferred them to be a little denser rather than the opposite. The editors I work with prefer a slide that a bit lighter than what I used to call normal. I now shoot my slides at a lower ASA rating than the film calls for (ASA 400 shot at 375). One way to sell your photo’s is to call the editor, let him know what you have, and arrange to send him/her samples. Good luck. If you want me to look your photo’s over, email me and we’ll see what we can arrange. — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (97 materials catalog) http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

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Your best bet is to shoot slow speed slide film.  KR64 is the the traditional favorite and you can’t go wrong with this. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m interested in submitting some pictures for magazines but not sure how to do it.  Anyone know anything about this? bruce

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Bruce The first thing you do is write the magazine you’re interested in–typically the managing editor–and ask for a copy of their editorial guidelines. Some buy most of their pictures from outside sources, many only use pictures shot by the folks writing the story. Just depends. Most will prefer you write a letter describing what you want to sell rather than getting a box of slides–no one wants to be responsible for your slides unless they ask for them. yeah most won’t buy prints but  some will. Once you see rates you may give up on this by the way. Only a relative handful of folks pay enough for pictures to justify owning a camera. Good luck — www.geocities.com/~tarponguide

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: Most of the magazines I deal with request slides of the topic. One of the : things I discovered caused me to start shooting my slide differently. : Before working for magazine editors I always shot my slides for inclusion : in slide shows and preferred them to be a little denser rather than the : opposite. The editors I work with prefer a slide that a bit lighter than : what I used to call normal. I now shoot my slides at a lower ASA rating : than the film calls for (ASA 400 shot at 375). I’m sure my experience with magazine photos is much more limited than Al’s but I agree with the advice about lighter photos… at least I think that is what Al was saying by making the photos less dense.  Dark negs or slides I’ve submitted print up even darker in a magazine.  But I might have Al’s comments wrong, because I underexpose my film to make a lighter slide, which translates into moving the ASA setting on the camera a notch higher (e.g. 425 rather than 400) rather than Al’s suggestion to go lower. Did I miss something Al? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Leitheiser) writes: Normally "best" results are obtained with reversal films by overexposing a 1/2 stop or so, ie. shoot a 400 film at EI 350 or so. This keeps the shadows from being too dark…course it depends a bit <<snip   : Most of the magazines I deal with request slides of the topic. One of the : things I discovered caused me to start shooting my slide differently. : Before working for magazine editors I always shot my slides for inclusion : in slide shows and preferred them to be a little denser rather than the : opposite. The editors I work with prefer a slide that a bit lighter than : what I used to call normal. I now shoot my slides at a lower ASA rating : than the film calls for (ASA 400 shot at 375). I’m sure my experience with magazine photos is much more limited than Al’s but I agree with the advice about lighter photos… at least I think that is what Al was saying by making the photos less dense.  Dark negs or slides I’ve submitted print up even darker in a magazine.  But I might have Al’s comments wrong, because I underexpose my film to make a lighter slide, which translates into moving the ASA setting on the camera a notch higher (e.g. 425 rather than 400) rather than Al’s suggestion to go lower. Did I miss something Al? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –  

Dense NEAGATIVES "print" lighter…Dense SLIDES "print" darker. I think you guys are meaning to say the same thing but are mixing positives and David Jones

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1) There is a simple way of keeping "exposures" straight when dealing with any camera: bracket your shot: that is shoot three shots, one normal, one a half-stop over exposed and one a half stop underexposed. 2) If you cannot bracket here are some basic guidelines:    For color slides, "open up a stop, especially in clear sunny weather where the shadows will loose their detail quite quickly because they are 2 to three stops darker than sunlight. This is particularly with Kodachrome film, which is processed differently than the E-6 films such as Fuji or Ektachromes. And despite what most people say, no E6 processed film can be as sharp as Kodachrome because of the way it’s processed. 3)  For prints, there is more latitude in overall exposure because some exposure problems can be corrected when printing. 4)  Like Al Beatty, always "open" up a stop for photographs intended for publications. Magazines – and slide shows for that matter – do not like black shadows! Good shooting! 3)

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Bob makes some good suggestions, especially about using a fill-in flash for outdoor slide work with close-up subjects.  Although art departments can "improve" a sloppy slide, I believe editors generally like the slides to be good to begin with….  Helps you get past the gate keeper. Once upon a time, Kodachrome 64 (and to a lesser extent Kodakchrome 25) were standards for outdoor magazine work.  Most outdoor magazine photographers that I knew would set the ASA at one setting under when shooting kodakchrome so as to slightly underexpose the slide and get rich, deep colour tones for printing in magazines. Nowadays, many (if not virtually all) outdoor photographers shooting for magazine publication use one of the modern E-6 films, for example Velvia 50 or Provia 100.  Most shoot this modern E-6 film dead on.  [It has taken me a while to adjust from Kodachrome--expensive in film .] A friend of mine who is a professional outdoor and nature photographer in PEI, will occasionally shoot the Velvia 50 *slightly* over-exposed in order to reduce the contrast (i.e., the surrealistic drenching colours).  I hear that Velvia 50 shoots well "pushed" but have yet to experiment with it. Boy, it sure gives nice results if you get the exposure right! Anyhow, this might all be of historic curiosity value if what I hear is true, in another few years, computer technology will have made slide and other film obsolete! One last thing:  whether for magazine publication, books or slides shows that you put on at your local club, I would encourage everybody to take as nice slides as possible of this your _favourite_ sport.  A good picture is worth a 1000 words and I believe that tasteful, good quality pictures of our favourite outdoor recreation help politically promote this sport and mobilize the political and economic resources to preserve (and if necessary restore) habitat–vital to good sport fisheries. Off my box!

: Been following this thread and thoght I’d throw my two pennies in. I : publish a magazine so I’ve had a smidgeon of experience re reproducing : photos, both slide and prints. : All slides, for that matter even all prints, will be scanned by a computer : operator into Photoshop, where they can be lightened, darkened, made more : contrasty, do color corrections, whatever the art department determines is : necessary preparatory to going to press. My opinion: shoot it normal, just : like you were gonna use it for  slide show. Or if you can afford a lot of : shots, then bracket the shot both sides of normal exposure. : I really like to keep things simple, and shooting normally is the : simplest. Let the art department make any corrections they want or need : and don’t try to do it with altering ASA numbers. If you find that the : photos are coming out dark in the printed magazine, it is because the art : department has not adjusted the contrast or brightness correctly. It’s : generally not the photographers fault. In fact, a good art department can : improve the looks of a bad photo to make it look good, probably as much as : 50% better. : Also, just a suggestion, when shooting outdoors, I use a fill flash on : almost every shot. It makes a world of difference and really gives a three : dimensional feel to the shot. Try it and you’ll see. : Bob Vorel — Burnaby, BC

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: Most of the magazines I deal with request slides of the topic. One of the : opposite. The editors I work with prefer a slide that a bit lighter than : what I used to call normal. I now shoot my slides at a lower ASA rating have Al’s comments wrong, because I underexpose my film to make a lighter slide, which translates into moving the ASA setting on the camera a notch higher (e.g. 425 rather than 400) rather than Al’s suggestion to go lower.

This corresponds, I think, to what I have seen reccomended, i.e., use of a high contrast film.  Underexposure should produce a higher contrast image. -Burton

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I’m sure my experience with magazine photos is much more limited than Al’s but I agree with the advice about lighter photos… at least I think that is what Al was saying by making the photos less dense.  Dark negs or slides I’ve submitted print up even darker in a magazine.  But I might have Al’s comments wrong, because I underexpose my film to make a lighter slide, which translates into moving the ASA setting on the camera a notch higher (e.g. 425 rather than 400) rather than Al’s suggestion to go lower. Did I miss something Al? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/

I believe Al is correct, Rick.  By setting the ASA lower the camera thinks you are using slower film and will open the lens up more, or tell you to open the lens up,to compensate. This will give you a less dense,lighter slide.  TRy it.  I think you’ll like it. Paul

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Been following this thread and thoght I’d throw my two pennies in. I publish a magazine so I’ve had a smidgeon of experience re reproducing photos, both slide and prints. All slides, for that matter even all prints, will be scanned by a computer operator into Photoshop, where they can be lightened, darkened, made more contrasty, do color corrections, whatever the art department determines is necessary preparatory to going to press. My opinion: shoot it normal, just like you were gonna use it for  slide show. Or if you can afford a lot of shots, then bracket the shot both sides of normal exposure. I really like to keep things simple, and shooting normally is the simplest. Let the art department make any corrections they want or need and don’t try to do it with altering ASA numbers. If you find that the photos are coming out dark in the printed magazine, it is because the art department has not adjusted the contrast or brightness correctly. It’s generally not the photographers fault. In fact, a good art department can improve the looks of a bad photo to make it look good, probably as much as 50% better. Also, just a suggestion, when shooting outdoors, I use a fill flash on almost every shot. It makes a world of difference and really gives a three dimensional feel to the shot. Try it and you’ll see. Bob Vorel

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : Most of the magazines I deal with request slides of the topic. One of the : things I discovered caused me to start shooting my slide differently. : Before working for magazine editors I always shot my slides for inclusion : in slide shows and preferred them to be a little denser rather than the : opposite. The editors I work with prefer a slide that a bit lighter than : what I used to call normal. I now shoot my slides at a lower ASA rating : than the film calls for (ASA 400 shot at 375). I’m sure my experience with magazine photos is much more limited than Al’s but I agree with the advice about lighter photos… at least I think that is what Al was saying by making the photos less dense.  Dark negs or slides I’ve submitted print up even darker in a magazine.  But I might have Al’s comments wrong, because I underexpose my film to make a lighter slide, which translates into moving the ASA setting on the camera a notch higher (e.g. 425 rather than 400) rather than Al’s suggestion to go lower. Did I miss something Al? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

Actually,  to make a slide lighter (thinner, less dense) you expose it more; that is, you set a lower ASA.  That way the camera gives it more exposure.  The same for negatives.  As you give them more exposure the negative itseld gets denser, which when printed results in a lighter print.  All within limits, of course.  Bill Mack

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Normally "best" results are obtained with reversal films by overexposing a 1/2 stop or so, ie. shoot a 400 film at EI 350 or so. This keeps the shadows from being too dark…course it depends a bit on your metering technique.  So many publications are scanning direct from the negative or slide now that it shouldn’t make any difference because of all the digital manipulation (now there is a catchy phrase) that they can do with the original.  Is that what reading how to/where to go complete with illustrations is?  FFing digital manipulation?   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : Most of the magazines I deal with request slides of the topic. One of the : things I discovered caused me to start shooting my slide differently. : Before working for magazine editors I always shot my slides for inclusion : in slide shows and preferred them to be a little denser rather than the : opposite. The editors I work with prefer a slide that a bit lighter than : what I used to call normal. I now shoot my slides at a lower ASA rating : than the film calls for (ASA 400 shot at 375). I’m sure my experience with magazine photos is much more limited than Al’s but I agree with the advice about lighter photos… at least I think that is what Al was saying by making the photos less dense.  Dark negs or slides I’ve submitted print up even darker in a magazine.  But I might have Al’s comments wrong, because I underexpose my film to make a lighter slide, which translates into moving the ASA setting on the camera a notch higher (e.g. 425 rather than 400) rather than Al’s suggestion to go lower. Did I miss something Al? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

Mike in PDX "When the trout are lost, smash the state."                           Tom McGuane

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Question:

If you fish, boat, camp, hunt or anything to do with the great

outdoors and have friends that do the same, why not start your  OWN business with little or know cost to you? < The IRS does make a distinction between a hobby business and a real business. You may be asked to demonstrate that it is a real business and not just supporting your hobby. Just because you have the legal paperwork that shows it to be a "business" doesn’t mean that the IRS has to accept it. The small tax savings will be more than offset by the cost of an audit. You are just making yourself a target.

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My name in Norm Larsen and I’d like to tell you a fishing story!! A couple of week ago a friend of mine came to me and asked me if I fished, I said sure I fish, why? Well he said: " if I could show you how you can deduct your fishing, camping, boating and hunting expenses from your income tax AND earn an income would you like to here about it? That was a no-brainer  for me, so I asked him to show it to me. He proceeded to show me of the most  interesting companies I had ever seen, The companies called Champion Fishing    Co.  based out of  Texas. They have a 197 page catalog that is full of outdoor  equipment. All name brand gear like Mitchell, Fenwick, Remmington etc. By October of this year they’ll have golfing, mountain bike and organized sporting equipment too!! I thought it made since to buy my gear from myself than from someone else! They have the simplest compensation plans I have ever seen too! There’s no start-up fees, no inventory, no quota’s , no organizational  tracking and no weekend deliveries!! Everything is shipped direct to the buyer. The recreational fishing industry is a $69.4 BILLION dollar a year business with 60 million people. That doesn’t include the Pro- Fishing industry, boating, camping or hunting!! Champion Fishing Co. has been growing at a fantastic rate. The number of reps has tripled since last October. Some states only have a few reps so were talking ground floor, "once in a life time opportunity"! If you fish, boat, camp, hunt or anything to do with the great outdoors and have friends that do the same, why not start your  OWN business with little or know cost to you? If would like more info on this program, please contact me by return email with your address and I’ll send you some info. If you give me your phone number I’ll call you a week or so after I send to answer any questions you may have. Sincerely, Norm Larsen

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Question:

In mid October we’re headed from San Francisco up to fish the Olympic Peninsula and then on up to fish the Kispiox in upper BC.  I need a pair of hip boots, 5mm with lug soles (don’t wade deep any more so hippers should do fine).  Gear such as this are not available here in Hawaii. We’ll be going thru Portland.  Can anyone tell me where I can buy such an animal there, the address of the shop, and their phone number. Aloha, |Robert (aka: Bob) B. Graham – NINC-HON [retired]   Office: gone fishing  | |(Nerd-In-Chief Honolulu)                             Home: (808) 395-9360| |City & County of Honolulu         Prodigy: WTKW87A                       | I have a vice, that vice is fishing – time stops, I’m in a different world.

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Im sure you’ve heard it before- but Kaufmann’s streamborn is located in tigard (basically portland) at 8861 SW Commercial in tigard- Just a little ways off of I 5. You can call (503) 639-6400 for more info and directions. Id really reccomend Kaufmann’s – im sure theyll have whatever you need. tight lines -matt petkun

: In mid October we’re headed from San Francisco up to fish the Olympic : Peninsula and then on up to fish the Kispiox in upper BC.  I need a pair : of hip boots, 5mm with lug soles (don’t wade deep any more so hippers : should do fine).  Gear such as this are not available here in Hawaii. : We’ll be going thru Portland.  Can anyone tell me where I can buy such an : animal there, the address of the shop, and their phone number. : Aloha, : |Robert (aka: Bob) B. Graham – NINC-HON [retired]   Office: gone fishing  | : |(Nerd-In-Chief Honolulu)                             Home: (808) 395-9360| : |City & County of Honolulu         Prodigy: WTKW87A                       | : I have a vice, that vice is fishing – time stops, I’m in a different world.

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Bob, I’m going to have to disagree with Mary. Kaufmann’s does not carry hip waders. (They believe them dangerous and/or undesireable). If you are just looking for a place during a layover, then grab a cab and go to GI Joe’s at Jantzen Beach. Any cabbie should know where that is. Actually, I would suggest GI Joe’s even if it will be an extended stay. I might suggest getting felt sole waders, though. The rocks in shallow water are the most slippery, usually. Sean Williams Student, Teacher, Angler Portland, Ore., USA

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You can also check with the Larry’s Sporting Goods in Oregon City or in Gresham.  There is also a GI Joes and another Larry’s Sporting Goods in Gresham, plus one more GI Joes in the Rockwood area (somewhere around 182nd and Burnside) in Portland.  That is presuming they are all still open, it’s been 8 years since I lived in the area. Do you really want 5 mil neoprene hippers?  They’re real warm.  Also, keep in mind that if you are trying to be stealthy around trout or steelhead you can’t kneel down with hippers as they will fill up even in shallow water.                                                                   Dan Dan Gracia Schools Coordinator Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

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Question:

Any Ideas on what’s hot and what’s not??  Please post them.  Thanks

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From what I’m told the Deerfield is one of the best rivers in the East for fly fishing. It’s up in North Western MA. Best points of entry along Route 2.

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