Question:

Will be fishing on the lake the next two weeks. I was wondering if  should take my fly fisshing gear?. Jim

Response:

Will be fishing on the lake the next two weeks. I was wondering if  should take my fly fisshing gear?. Jim

Nah, bugger the proprieties, take some wormss and sppinning gear. TL MC

Response:

"Jim McNinch" wrote… Will be fishing on the lake the next two weeks. I was wondering if  should take my fly fisshing gear?. Jim

There’s a chance to catch Northern Pike on the fly.  Give it a shot. Joel Axelrad **DFD**

Response:

Will be fishing on the lake the next two weeks. I was wondering if  should take my fly fisshing gear?.

It’s been about 25 years since I fished that area, but I remember some great evening fishing for Smallmouths with small poppers. Willi

Response:

Question:

Lets hope he doesn’t also "teach" her how to wade.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That’s exciting Dave – I hope you can guide my girlfriend into a couple of those fish in September!  Looking forward to it…. Regards, Jeff

Response:

Yeah that’s a good point , she truly does not like swimming. Lets hope he doesn’t also "teach" her how to wade. That’s exciting Dave – I hope you can guide my girlfriend into a couple of those fish in September!  Looking forward to it…. Regards, Jeff

Regards, Jeff

Response:

He has to save you some fish. The rapid is no-kill on brook trout. Why do you think there are such big fish. Also at the time we’ll be there it’s no-kill on salmon also. Paul

i guess that means t-bone ain’t coming. waldo

Response:

He has to save you some fish. The rapid is no-kill on brook trout. Why do you think there are such big fish. Also at the time we’ll be there it’s no-kill on salmon also. Paul

What a great report Dave. Good luck in Labrador, you lucky son-of-a-gun. I can’t wait to join ya up there in Sept…. save us some fish! Walt

[snip]

Response:

Great report. I’d love to get into some big brookies like that but Maine is SO far.

That is what’s so great about Maine! — — MrG/American Sportsman http://www.gink.com/rod_facts/bastardjun00.html  LATEST BAMBOO FACTS "the saga continues"

Response:

Willi Loehman writes: Do you see this over population and stunting in your smaller waters?  

Yes.  But the Rapid is a large stream with very swift water.  It’s elevation drop is very steep, and because it is a tailwater, it is cold.  It has plenty of food, so the brookies thrive in its waters.  Five years ago you rarely saw a fish bigger than 15 inches, but since C and R has been  enforced, 3 pounders are common.   On the smaller streams in NH, VT and ME, you will see native brookies that are stunted for the reasons you state.  Pond brookies tend to be a little bigger than the small stream brookies.  I fished ponds in the Allagash Wilderness Area of Maine last year and caught many 15 – 18 inch fish.  An interesting aside:  I am used to the trout coming up directly under the fly for the "take".  The pond brookies that I fished for  came out of the water and took the fly on the way down.  Screws up your timing, that’s for sure!  <g Dave LaCourse

Response:

 For bigger brookies try fishing near the large boulder that is on the south side of Echo lake on Mt Evans.12-15 inch is not uncommon. —  Don Thompson  Zoomie(BushBug)  ACA#3460  TLCB#335  Any Time, Any Place  Pull the chocks, lets get this kite in the air. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Great report. I’d love to get into some big brookies like that but Maine is SO far. I assume the river you’re describing is a large one?  In the Rockies, for the most part, Brookies are confined to the smaller headwater streams.  Except for those streams that have beaver ponds on them, these stream Brookies are very small. Many of the streams and some of the ponds and lakes, tend to be over populated. The result is that the fish are stunted. Often 5 and 6 inch large headed fish are sexually mature and may be the largest that the stream produces. This is PARTLY due to the size and fertility of the streams. However, comparable streams with Browns, Rainbows or Cutts tend to have larger fish. Do you see this over population and stunting in your smaller waters? Willi

Response:

Great report. I’d love to get into some big brookies like that but Maine is SO far. I assume the river you’re describing is a large one?  In the Rockies, for the most part, Brookies are confined to the smaller headwater streams.  Except for those streams that have beaver ponds on them, these stream Brookies are very small. Many of the streams and some of the ponds and lakes, tend to be over populated. The result is that the fish are stunted. Often 5 and 6 inch large headed fish are sexually mature and may be the largest that the stream produces. This is PARTLY due to the size and fertility of the streams. However, comparable streams with Browns, Rainbows or Cutts tend to have larger fish. Do you see this over population and stunting in your smaller waters?   Willi

Response:

when the revolution comes, when all us peons will extract our revenge.  

You can have all the revenge you want; meanwhile I’ll be collecting their stuff<g. — Charlie…

Response:

What a great report Dave. Good luck in Labrador, you lucky son-of-a-gun. I can’t wait to join ya up there in Sept…. save us some fish! Walt

You took the words right off my screen.  The old bugger will have ‘em all before we get there. Peter good luck in Labrador

Response:

That’s exciting Dave – I hope you can guide my girlfriend into a couple of those fish in September!  Looking forward to it…. Regards, Jeff

Response:

Monday, June 20. Jeff, Brian and I arrived at Lakewood and had a wonderful lunch

        great report, laplac!         your indulgence in the paradise that you described, together with the wretched excess of the labrador trip, *plus* having that angel to come home to has placed you soundly at the side of stephen barnes when the revolution comes, when all us peons will extract our revenge.  if i were you, i’d practice my blindfolded cigarette smoking technique.         wayno, long time student of madame defarge

Response:

Monday, June 20. Jeff, Brian and I arrived at Lakewood and had a wonderful lunch before "suiting up" and heading to the river. Jeff was using an Orvis Rocky Mountain 6 weight, and Brian a Courtland 8 1/2 ft. 5 weight. I settled for my 4 weight Sage 9 footer. Instead of going down river, we settled on the dam and immediately were into some nice salmon (15+ inches). Neither Jeff nor Brian have a landing net, so they learned a trick or two on safely releasing big fish. Christmas is coming….. Tuesday morning we headed down-river and had the place to ourselves. Two locals  walked in about 9, but fished downstream from us. Both boys caught and landed 18 and 19 inch brookies on a size 20 bubble emerger. I stood by and took the fish off the hook and safely released them. What marvelous examples of brook trout! We fished the wing dam and first and second current all day and never caught a big salmon. Most were in the 10 – 12 inch range. Wednesday we again went down-river, and again, both boys got into some big trout using the same emerger. We discovered a new "holding area" for the brookies, fished it steadily for a couple of hours, but without success. These fish were difficult to catch. I watched a "regular" to the river, a terrific fly fisherman  who lives nearby and walks in a couple of days a week. He tried every trick and  fly he knew, but failed in getting even a small one to take his lure. We finished the day by going to the dam after lunch. I landed a 22 inch salmon  that broke the water 8 times — a guest at the camp counted, I didn’t. It was a terrific afternoon with all three of us landing several salmon in the 16+ range. Thursday morning, back to the wing dam and the large brookies. I took a 20 incher and Brian an 18 incher. Jeff wasn’t feeling well and spent the morning in bed. He did, however, go to the dam with us after lunch. I found my way out to my favorite "perch" and took about 20 salmon from 12 – 20 inches, all on a cream colored caddis worm, size  16 and 18 fished slow and deep. About 5 o’clock, I went after brookies that I knew were holed-up in the white bubbly water at the bottom of one of the dam shutes. The boys had heavily fished this spot on previous days, but were unsuccessful in raising any of the behemouths that live in the bubbles. It would have been easier if I had a ten foot rod, because I really couldn’t reach the current and bubbled water with my 9 footer. I wasn’t casting — dabbing would be a more accurate description. To get closer, I got in the water — mistake #1!  I had a senior moment when I slipped and went head first into a pool about 6 feet deep. Well, now that I was completely soaked, there was no sense in "taking it easy". I managed to get upon the rock I wanted, and on my second "dab" a giant, monster of a brookie took the emerger. He took two laps of the small pool and headed into the fast water. And I imagine he is still there, laughing at me. I fished for another 20  minutes before I attempted to leave. Not thinking, I had my second senior moment of the day, and went into the same pool backwards. Does Orvis sell water-wings? Friday was slow, both down-river and at the dam. Very few fish were being taken.  All three of us did manage to get our brookies on the wing-dam, but they were small ones – about 14 inches. We went to what I have named the "V" current, and stood within five feet of the largest brookie I have ever seen in these waters. It was at least 24 inches long. And it was feeding — the boys watched it for several minutes as it moved a couple of inches one way and then the other to pick up morsels of  food floating down stream. I was using the cream colored caddis in a size 18, hoping that small was what he wanted. I set the hook on a take, and saw that it was a six inch chub. I didn’t bother to put it on the reel — I wanted him off as quickly as possible, so I stripped in the few feet of line, only to have it ripped from my hand. Jeff yelled that the big brookie had taken my chub. He could see the head of the chub sticking out of the trout’s mouth. Off he went, ripping off line like there wasn’t any drag. The "fight" lasted about 30 seconds before he let go.  I landed the small chub and it had teeth marks on both sides right behind its gills. There was some blood. The same thing happened to Brian within an hour — he wanted to "fish" with the fish. An ethics conversation followed. I have always fished this river using 75% dries and 25% nymphs.  However, this week it was almost exclusively nymphs.  I think I caught two salmon on traditional dry fly patterns.  Although there were several hatches during the week, the fish were not actively rising to them.  I watched several emerging caddis struggling to get airborne, safely drifting over water that I knew contained both trout and salmon.  Friends in camp, traditionally dry fly fishermen, were at a loss as to what to do.  I convinced a couple to try nymphing and gave them a couple of successful patterns.  Voila!  They caught fish.   Emergers and nymphs — the only way to travel!  Don’t leave home without them. It was a great week of fishing — not because I caught some wonderful fish on flies that I tied ,but because I saw my grandsons have such a memorable time catching big brookies and salmon, nymphing like their grandpa showed them. It doesn’t get much better than that. Jeff and I fly out of Logan next Thursday for 8 days in Labrador.  And it is all dry fly fishing, including a mouse pattern for *really* big brookies.  <g Dave LaCourse

Response:

What a great report Dave. Good luck in Labrador, you lucky son-of-a-gun. I can’t wait to join ya up there in Sept…. save us some fish! Walt – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Monday, June 20. Jeff, Brian and I arrived at Lakewood and had a wonderful lunch before "suiting up" and heading to the river. Jeff was using an Orvis Rocky Mountain 6 weight, and Brian a Courtland 8 1/2 ft. 5 weight. I settled for my 4 weight Sage 9 footer. Instead of going down river, we settled on the dam and immediately were into some nice salmon (15+ inches). Neither Jeff nor Brian have a landing net, so they learned a trick or two on safely releasing big fish. Christmas is coming….. Tuesday morning we headed down-river and had the place to ourselves. Two locals  walked in about 9, but fished downstream from us. Both boys caught and landed 18 and 19 inch brookies on a size 20 bubble emerger. I stood by and took the fish off the hook and safely released them. What marvelous examples of brook trout! We fished the wing dam and first and second current all day and never caught a big salmon. Most were in the 10 – 12 inch range. Wednesday we again went down-river, and again, both boys got into some big trout using the same emerger. We discovered a new "holding area" for the brookies, fished it steadily for a couple of hours, but without success. These fish were difficult to catch. I watched a "regular" to the river, a terrific fly fisherman  who lives nearby and walks in a couple of days a week. He tried every trick and  fly he knew, but failed in getting even a small one to take his lure. We finished the day by going to the dam after lunch. I landed a 22 inch salmon  that broke the water 8 times — a guest at the camp counted, I didn’t. It was a terrific afternoon with all three of us landing several salmon in the 16+ range. Thursday morning, back to the wing dam and the large brookies. I took a 20 incher and Brian an 18 incher. Jeff wasn’t feeling well and spent the morning in bed. He did, however, go to the dam with us after lunch. I found my way out to my favorite "perch" and took about 20 salmon from 12 – 20 inches, all on a cream colored caddis worm, size  16 and 18 fished slow and deep. About 5 o’clock, I went after brookies that I knew were holed-up in the white bubbly water at the bottom of one of the dam shutes. The boys had heavily fished this spot on previous days, but were unsuccessful in raising any of the behemouths that live in the bubbles. It would have been easier if I had a ten foot rod, because I really couldn’t reach the current and bubbled water with my 9 footer. I wasn’t casting — dabbing would be a more accurate description. To get closer, I got in the water — mistake #1!  I had a senior moment when I slipped and went head first into a pool about 6 feet deep. Well, now that I was completely soaked, there was no sense in "taking it easy". I managed to get upon the rock I wanted, and on my second "dab" a giant, monster of a brookie took the emerger. He took two laps of the small pool and headed into the fast water. And I imagine he is still there, laughing at me. I fished for another 20  minutes before I attempted to leave. Not thinking, I had my second senior moment of the day, and went into the same pool backwards. Does Orvis sell water-wings? Friday was slow, both down-river and at the dam. Very few fish were being taken.  All three of us did manage to get our brookies on the wing-dam, but they were small ones – about 14 inches. We went to what I have named the "V" current, and stood within five feet of the largest brookie I have ever seen in these waters. It was at least 24 inches long. And it was feeding — the boys watched it for several minutes as it moved a couple of inches one way and then the other to pick up morsels of  food floating down stream. I was using the cream colored caddis in a size 18, hoping that small was what he wanted. I set the hook on a take, and saw that it was a six inch chub. I didn’t bother to put it on the reel — I wanted him off as quickly as possible, so I stripped in the few feet of line, only to have it ripped from my hand. Jeff yelled that the big brookie had taken my chub. He could see the head of the chub sticking out of the trout’s mouth. Off he went, ripping off line like there wasn’t any drag. The "fight" lasted about 30 seconds before he let go.  I landed the small chub and it had teeth marks on both sides right behind its gills. There was some blood. The same thing happened to Brian within an hour — he wanted to "fish" with the fish. An ethics conversation followed. I have always fished this river using 75% dries and 25% nymphs.  However, this week it was almost exclusively nymphs.  I think I caught two salmon on traditional dry fly patterns.  Although there were several hatches during the week, the fish were not actively rising to them.  I watched several emerging caddis struggling to get airborne, safely drifting over water that I knew contained both trout and salmon.  Friends in camp, traditionally dry fly fishermen, were at a loss as to what to do.  I convinced a couple to try nymphing and gave them a couple of successful patterns.  Voila!  They caught fish.   Emergers and nymphs — the only way to travel!  Don’t leave home without them. It was a great week of fishing — not because I caught some wonderful fish on flies that I tied ,but because I saw my grandsons have such a memorable time catching big brookies and salmon, nymphing like their grandpa showed them. It doesn’t get much better than that. Jeff and I fly out of Logan next Thursday for 8 days in Labrador.  And it is all dry fly fishing, including a mouse pattern for *really* big brookies.  <g Dave LaCourse

– Walter G. Winter Ezflyfish.com:  http://www.ezflyfish.com Blue Ridge Book Gallery: http://www.crosswinds.net/~brbg/books/brbg-2.html

Response:

Question:

The Saw Doctors

Question:

Dear r.o.f.f. ers, I’m in Scotland and have received an invitation to Utah by a non-flyfishing pal. When would be good times for ffing the Green? Will my standard kit for the Scottish Lochs be about right (9ft, 7 weight, DT line). Do I hire a guide? Bank or boat fishing? How expensive is it? Pete Marrow   work:  http://www.gsrg.nmh.ac.uk/   play:  http://www.gorp.com/gorp/activity/scottish_ff_faq.htm

Response:

Try <http://expo.flyshop.com/~troutcrk/index.html for info regard the Green. The page details the sections of the river as well as guide pricing. They can also help you with gear selection. Another great resource for the Green is Western Rivers Flyfishers <http://www.citysearchslc.com/E/V/SLCUT/0003/90/32/ . They are a shop located in Salt Lake City, but have guider service on the River. Don’t miss your chance to visit, the Green offers spectacular fishing and scenery. Scott

|Dear r.o.f.f. ers, | |I’m in Scotland and have received an invitation to |Utah by a non-flyfishing pal. When would be good |times for ffing the Green? Will my standard kit for |the Scottish Lochs be about right (9ft, 7 weight, DT |line). Do I hire a guide? Bank or boat fishing? How |expensive is it?

Response:

Question:

I’m still exploring the alphabet for new fishing locales.  Someone suggested the upper reaches of the Zuni River, on the reservation in New Mexico, might contain a few fish. It looks like pretty dry country, to me. Anybody know anything about it? Otherwise, I may be forced to travel to South America, or Africa. I think the X river will only be found, overseas.

Response:

I’m still exploring the alphabet for new fishing locales.  Someone suggested the upper reaches of the Zuni River, on the reservation in New Mexico, might contain a few fish. It looks like pretty dry country, to me. Anybody know anything about it? Otherwise, I may be forced to travel to South America, or Africa. I think the X river will only be found, overseas.

The Zymoetz River of British Columbia (aka the Copper), near Terrace, BC, contains runs of salmon and steelhead. –Steve Otto

Response:

Question:

How about some Montana freemen, Tim? They’re coming to take you away, they’re coming to take you away, oh boy. Don B. FREEMEN? Aren’t those the guys that just got put in jail? Bronco

Jail? We don’t have jails anymore. They’re going to urban recreation centers. <g Don B.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How about some Montana freemen, Tim? They’re coming to take you away, they’re coming to take you away, oh boy. Don B. FREEMEN? Aren’t those the guys that just got put in jail? Bronco Jail? We don’t have jails anymore. They’re going to urban recreation centers. <g

That’s true and just think of how many Adams you could tie doing 5-10. TimW

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How about some Montana freemen, Tim? They’re coming to take you away, they’re coming to take you away, oh boy. Don B. FREEMEN? Aren’t those the guys that just got put in jail? Bronco Jail? We don’t have jails anymore. They’re going to urban recreation centers. <g That’s true and just think of how many Adams you could tie doing 5-10. TimW

The problem is making good hooks from spoons! Musconet

Response:

Just received Orvis’s gift and clothing catalog. There is an African American model on just about every other page. It may not be their fishing catalog, but it goes to show that they are not racist. Lets hope that this dispenses with this valuable but(now)tiresome thread that has occupied so much of the bandwidth on ROFF over the last few weeks.

Yeah…but I saw NO asians pal !  Damned if there wasn’t a SINGLE Aleut ! Can you beleive that ?!?!?  And Mongols…? Ha ! nowhere in sight… you know what, I saw no dwarves or midgets eithers… Orvis, those Eskimidgetmongolphobic bastards… TimW

Response:

Seriously…no midgets!!! God that makes me angry. I’m going to write Perk Perkins and give that bastard hell.

Response:

Just received Orvis’s gift and clothing catalog. There is an African American model on just about every other page. It may not be their fishing catalog, but it goes to show that they are not racist. Lets hope that this dispenses with this valuable but(now)tiresome thread that has occupied so much of the bandwidth on ROFF over the last few weeks.

Response:

writes: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  Oh Well….. Just received Orvis’s gift and clothing catalog. There is an African American model on just about every other page. It may not be their fishing catalog, but it goes to show that they are not racist. Lets hope that this dispenses with this valuable but(now)tiresome thread that has occupied so much of the bandwidth on ROFF over the last few weeks. Yeah…but I saw NO asians pal !  Damned if there wasn’t a SINGLE Aleut ! Can you beleive that ?!?!?  And Mongols…? Ha ! nowhere in sight… you know what, I saw no dwarves or midgets eithers… Orvis, those Eskimidgetmongolphobic bastards… TimW

Response:

Just received Orvis’s gift and clothing catalog. There is an African American model on just about every other page. It may not be their fishing catalog, but it goes to show that they are not racist. Lets hope that this dispenses with this valuable but(now)tiresome thread that has occupied so much of the bandwidth on ROFF over the last few weeks.

I totally agree!  I used to live near Manchester, VT and got to know many of the Orvis people (I also did some of the catalog photography). They’re nice people and _not_ racist, like most people aren’t. Jim Benenson Los Alamos, NM "To save your rivers, save your mountains" Emperor Yu of China, circa 1600 BC

Response:

Just received Orvis’s gift and clothing catalog. There is an African American model on just about every other page. It may not be their fishing catalog, but it goes to show that they are not racist. Lets hope that this dispenses with this valuable but(now)tiresome thread that has occupied so much of the bandwidth on ROFF over the last few weeks.

Maybe it also shows that they read r.o.f.f…. — Richard W. (Dick) Lander; sportsman, Macintosh devotee, proponent of personal liberty. *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *

Response:

Just received Orvis’s gift and clothing catalog. There is an African American model on just about every other page. It may not be their fishing catalog, but it goes to show that they are not racist. Lets hope that this dispenses with this valuable but(now)tiresome thread that has occupied so much of the bandwidth on ROFF over the last few weeks.

AMEN!!!       Gene

Response:

writes: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just received Orvis’s gift and clothing catalog. There is an African American model on just about every other page. It may not be their fishing catalog, but it goes to show that they are not racist. Lets hope that this dispenses with this valuable but(now)tiresome thread that has occupied so much of the bandwidth on ROFF over the last few weeks. Yeah…but I saw NO asians pal !  Damned if there wasn’t a SINGLE Aleut ! Can you beleive that ?!?!?  And Mongols…? Ha ! nowhere in sight… you know what, I saw no dwarves or midgets eithers… Orvis, those Eskimidgetmongolphobic bastards… TimW

How about some Montana freemen, Tim? They’re coming to take you away, they’re coming to take you away, oh boy. Don B.

Response:

This is my first post to a newsgroup, so bear with me if I blunder. I attempted, with little success, to tie a Dark Hendrickson Nymph this evening.  All aspects of tying the fly are understandable, and I am able to accomplish them except dubbing.  Is this a concept with which most beginners (like myself) have trouble? Specifically, I cannot get the Muskrat fur to "adhere" to the thread.  I use dubbing wax and dab the fur onto it, but it never gets thick enough to tighten into something that will form the body/thorax. Can someone provide some much-needed advice/hints on how I can make this happen? Thanks in advance…

Response:

. . . Specifically, I cannot get the Muskrat fur to "adhere" to the thread.  I use dubbing wax and dab the fur onto it, but it never gets thick enough to tighten into something that will form the body/thorax.

There are several different methods, described in books by Eric Leiser, Poul Jorgensen, Peter Gathercole etc. e.g. single thread or double loop (chenille) depending on factors like your thread (silk or nylon or polyester) and aims:  so feel free to experiment, if you cannot get to the library.   E.g. you can sprinkle cut fur on a clean cloth on your knee, take a separate piece of waxed thread, and roll it on the fur until it picks up a smooth "sausage" of dubbing.  If your dubbing goes onto the nymph but fails to stay on, counter-winding with self-coloured ribbing may be all you need. Some people tie successfully without ever using wax, especially wets because they should sink, not float.  Saliva holds many furs well enough to many threads. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -This is my first post to a newsgroup, so bear with me if I blunder. I attempted, with little success, to tie a Dark Hendrickson Nymph this evening.  All aspects of tying the fly are understandable, and I am able to accomplish them except dubbing.  Is this a concept with which most beginners (like myself) have trouble? Specifically, I cannot get the Muskrat fur to "adhere" to the thread. I use dubbing wax and dab the fur onto it, but it never gets thick enough to tighten into something that will form the body/thorax. Can someone provide some much-needed advice/hints on how I can make this happen? Thanks in advance…

  Try spinning the dubbing onto the thread.  Dabbing creates a spikey dubbed body.  Try this – dab the fur onto the waxed thread, and pinch the dubbing between your forefinger and thumb and spin the fur onto the line.  Be careful to spin in one direction only.  this should create a nicely formed "noodle" which you then wind on. You can also form the "noodle" loosely, before dabbing.  lay out the fur (or better a mixture of several colors layered, then pinch it onto the thread, and wind on. This gives you a nicely mottled thorax. good luck,

Response:

Specifically, I cannot get the Muskrat fur to "adhere" to the thread.  I use dubbing wax and dab the fur onto it, but it never gets thick enough to tighten into something that will form the body/thorax.

Gary, In addition to the suggestions made by J. J. Gordon, you might want to try using a dubbing loop:  Form a loop of thread that is several inches long at the rear of the fly.  Wind the bobbin to the front of the fly where the dubbing will end.  Hang a dubbing twister on the end of the loop.  I made a simple dubbling twister using a couple of paper clips and a bell sinker–it’s essentially a hook of wire with a weight.  Wax the loop and place the dubbing in the loop.  Spin the twister until the dubbing has formed a chenille-like strand of the desired tightness.  If you "twang" the thread as you are twisting it, hair-type dubbing will tend to stand out more, making a more "spiky" body.  Then just wind the loop onto the hook like chenille and tie it off. I’ve found loops to be easier to handle than the single thread methods. Good luck! –Stephen Wong P.S. You might want to check out the flytying newsgroup: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly.tying.

Response:

How about some Montana freemen, Tim? They’re coming to take you away, they’re coming to take you away, oh boy. Don B. FREEMEN? Aren’t those the guys that just got put in jail? Bronco

Response:

Geecee, Dubbing’s a bitch for beginners. Just keep at it, soon you will be able to do it without wax. Suggestion: after dubbing onto a single thread, loop back to the body of the hook. Then twist the bottom of the newly formed loop. That tends to hold the dubbing on the thread snugly. Bronco

Response:

. . . Specifically, I cannot get the Muskrat fur to "adhere" to the thread.  I use dubbing wax and dab the fur onto it, but it never gets thick enough to tighten into something that will form the body/thorax.

I have never used wax… well, except to experiment. I just pull off the bits of muskrat and make certain I didn’t also pull off some hide . Then, while holding it between my index finger and thumb, I roll it around the thread. You can add as much or as little as you want and there is no waste. If you roll it loosely, it sticks out and is nice and buggy looking. If you roll it tightly, it looks more like a dry fly dubbing job. Maybe I am being too vague about my technique… I pull the hairs off with the standard thumb and forefinger method any child would employ. Grab some and pull. Then I kind of slide the tying thread into the hairs (parallel to the hairs) and start to roll my fingers as though I was trying to twist the thread one way, then the other. I work my fingers up and down the thread to evenly distribute the hair quantity and this also allows me to taper the body quite well. I can adjust the weight of the bug by changing how much hair I put on at a time. Less hair means more thread and more wraps, more weight and more strength to the finished fly but the body is also harder when the fish bites. Opinions may fly rampant here but the fish never seem to comment on it one way or the other. Hope this helps, David Buschhorn Known on IRC as "Dubbing"

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writes: Can someone provide some much-needed advice/hints on how I can make this happen?

    Everybody’s right and nobody’s wrong on this.  I don’t think any two tyers do this exactly the same way.  I prefer the single thread to the loop for most patterns, but that’s me.  I’m also not as good or consistent as I may sound in postings.  My hint: put a big hook in the vise and work on dubbing for an hour without trying to tie a fly.  Try different threads, waxes, furs, and methods.  Your way will come to you.  In the long run it will save you time and frustration.  Also, join us on ROFFT — good stuff every day, all are welcome.   –Roger

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In addition to the other methods you may want to look at the thread you are using and the way you apply the wax. If you are using a pre-waxed thread there is no need to add wax to the thread. Instead put the wax on your fingers. Most of the times that I have seen people having problems with dubbing it has been fixed by keeping the fingers dry a bit of low tack wax works well.

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Question:

One method that works fairly well is to tie the end of the leader (not tippet) to the center of the piece of yarn using an improved cinch knot.  Then tie the tippet to the leader just above the yarn also using an improved cinch knot.  The  obvious disadvantage to this method is that it’s not very easy to change depths. John Johnson Atlanta, GA

A second disadvantage is that it requires two knots instead of one. Next time I think that I’ll try the simple overhand knot that others have suggested. John Johnson Atlanta, GA

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I am trying to use yarn instead of foam, BioStrike, etc. What is the best knot and method to use to attach the yarn to the leader?

Hi Jay, The question is, do you want effectiveness and are you willing to work for it, or do you want convenience and are willing to settle for not as effective? If you want the most sensitive and best casting system, use a fairly stout leader 2X or 3X  (~6 to 7 1/2 ft. in length) and tie your yarn on to the end with an *improved* clinch knot (the regular clinch knot will slip). Then attach your tippet (depth of the water or slightly longer) to the leader with an improved clinch knot behind the indicator and slide it up against the indicator.  Test the connection (don’t bounce your knots!).   Attach split shot ~6" away from your fly (no closer than 4" and no farther away than 8")   If you keep at least 2 "X" numbers difference between the leader and the tippet size, the break will be at the fly and not at the yarn.  You have to keep adjusting the  length of the tippet as the water depth changes, and that’s a pain.  But, it is deadly.  The stout leader makes casting the indicator much easier and the 90 degree tippet gives you great control over placement.  This is often called "the hinged nymphing system" and was developed by the gentleman I teach fishing schools with, Dean Schubert, and his ex-roomate Dave Hickson.   If you don’t want to go through all these machinations you can tie your yarn on with a clove hitch which will allow you to loosen up the knot and slide the yarn up  or down, and it won’t score the line or weaken it.  It also won’t cast as well and you won’t get the 90 degree hinge that you get with the other system so it won’t be as sensitive and your fly may actually be quite a ways from your indicator (instead of within a 2 ft. circle), but it is more convenient and in fast water it works OK.                                        Good Fishing!                                                Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

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I am trying to use yarn instead of foam, BioStrike, etc. What is the best knot and method to use to attach the yarn to the leader? — Jay Thomas

I don’t know what type of water you are fishing but in New Zealand’s North Island, on the larger rivers eg. the Tongariro or Rangitikei, I use a 1" piece of Glo-bug yarn. Soak the yarn in a dry fly floatant and allow to dry. My leader is joined to the fly line by a pair of interlocking loops and the Glo-bug yarn indicator is placed in between the loops before they are pulled up tight. Lime green is easy to see at the change of light and hot pink when the sun is on the water. This indicator does not affect casting but there is some distance between it and the fly. For these waters this distance is not a problem. Jim Learmonth

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While yarn works great for indicating strikes, I find it interferes tremendously with casting. — -Wayne Trzyna

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While yarn works great for indicating strikes, I find it interferes tremendously with casting.

Hi Wayne, Your right if your talking about those golf ball and larger sized sized chunks of yarn that people toss around.  However, if you get the right yarn, you don’t need huge pieces of it and I find it easier to cast than any other indicator I’ve found (so far).  The yarn you want to find comes in your choice of colors and can often be found at macrame shops.  It is a braided polypropylene yarn.  One of the brand names out there is Bonnie Braid, I’m sure there are plenty more. However, all polypropylene yarns are not created equal and different skeins of the same brand and the same color can perform differently.  The type that works best is coarse and shiny.  Not shiny and soft, not coarse and dull, but coarse and shiny.  Get it in a color you like as waterproof markers won’t penetrate the fibers and will wash off quickly.  It usually comes in 50 or 100 yard skeins depending on the thickness of the braid.  I prefer the 100 yard skeins because the braid is smaller and easier to seperate.  Use about 4 strands of the braid, tie it on and comb out the fibers.  Cut to the desired size (dime to quarter size depending on amount of weight used), and treat with paste floatant.   I use the Orvis Hy-flote paste floatant because it liquifies when I rub it between my fingers. Don’t use too thick a paste or it won’t work well.  I’ll then stroke it on the fibers and comb it out again.  If you did it right this should look like a very small open flower floating on the water.  If the flower is tipping forward – your fly is dragging behind it, if it is tilting backwards – it is in front of the indicator.  If it floats straight up, you are getting a very good drift.  If you did it wrong it will look like a dense golf ball or bigger.  Dense doesn’t cast or float as well as the "open flower".  Goldilocks strikes again, not to thick, not too thin, just right!                             Good Fishing,                                   Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

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dont

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dont

nonsense. make a standard overhand loop with the yarn inside, breaking strength is 100% of the tippet. The advantage of yarn (you can also use small pieces of etafoam, a few CDC feathers etc.) is that you can adjust the size of the strike indicator and the depth of fishing (in shallower water just move the indicator closer to the fly). An easier strike indicator is Orvis Strike Putty, a resin you can mold to any shape and you can us as much as you really need (from very small for midge fishing in shallow water to really big to fish a deep run with a stonefly, highly visible colors and even night glowing!).       If this was your question…                                       Thomas

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I am trying to use yarn instead of foam, BioStrike, etc. What is the best knot and method to use to attach the yarn to the leader? — Jay Thomas

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Tie a slip-knot in the leader. Insert yarn and pull tight. Trim yarn to size and apply a small amount of floatant. This has worked for me for years. It is also easy to adjust the fly depth and has minimal effect on the leader stregth. Good luck. Jack

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Path: news.itd.umich.edu!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!realti me.net !news.mindspring.com!jpthomas.mindspring.com!user Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly Organization: MindSpring Enterprises Lines: 6 NNTP-Posting-Host: jpthomas.mindspring.com X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.1.8 I am trying to use yarn instead of foam, BioStrike, etc. What is the best knot and method to use to attach the yarn to the leader? — Jay Thomas

Try a knittingneedle knot.

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I am trying to use yarn instead of foam, BioStrike, etc. What is the best knot and method to use to attach the yarn to the leader? — Jay Thomas

Jay, Around here we tie an overhand knot at the area where you want the indicator to be, but leave it loose. Then put the yarn in the knot an tighten it. This way it is easy to backl the knot off and roll it to a different spot depending on how deep the water is. It won’t be a weak link since it is way up the leader where it is thick anyway. Martin Allen

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Tie a slip-knot in the leader. Insert yarn and pull tight. Trim yarn to size and apply a small amount of floatant. This has worked for me for years. It is also easy to adjust the fly depth and has minimal effect on the leader stregth. Good luck. Jack

   Our knot testing machine (which, as Lefty says, "has no bias") shows that yarn slip knotted to leader will reduce the leader strength by up to 50%. A much better way is to tie a simple overhand knot in the leader and put in a piece of yarn before cinching up.    Without the yarn this would result in a "wind knot" which is not very strong (reduces leader strength by about 15% . . . it’s not nearly as bad as many have been led to believe).     Our strain gauge device measures accurately down to 1/100 of a pound and it shows zero reduction of strength in an overhand knot cinched around a piece of yarn. Your leader will always break at the yarn because it creates a focus of energy; however, there is no reduction in the strength of the leader.    -Ralph —

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I am trying to use yarn instead of foam, BioStrike, etc. What is the best knot and method to use to attach the yarn to the leader?

One method that works fairly well is to tie the end of the leader (not tippet) to the center of the piece of yarn using an improved cinch knot.  Then tie the tippet to the leader just above the yarn also using an improved cinch knot.  The  obvious disadvantage to this method is that it’s not very easy to change depths. John Johnson Atlanta, GA

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I am trying to use yarn instead of foam, BioStrike, etc. What is the best knot and method to use to attach the yarn to the leader?

I learned a nice method from a guide on the San Juan River in New Mexico. You form a loop up in the fat part of the leader, then reach through the loop and pull another loop of the same leader through it. You put the yarn halfway through this second loop and pull on the leader to tighten it up. If you need to change depths, you just push the leader to open the loop, get your yarn out and do it again somewhere else. I hope I have explained this so you can understand it. It’s a pretty simple method, though it will leave a bend in the leader if you leave the yarn in too long. Doesn’t seem to affect the strength of the leader though. — | Michael P. Thompson – Liberty Communications | |           * Spreading the Word *             |

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[snip] Your leader will always break at the yarn because it creates a focus of energy; however, there is no reduction in the strength of the leader.   -Ralph

I didn’t realize from your previous posts that you were a "New Age" kind of guy Ralph.  That focus of energy must be some variation of the pyramid effect.  :-) BTW, I love to read your magazine articles! See ya, John Johnson Atlanta, GA

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Question:

Hello Dcoop,    I’ve been flyfishing for only a few years now here in NY state. I live in Rensselaer near Albany, NY and don’t get to as much fishing as I would like to, but I do fish the adirondacks once in a while. I do have some friends though that fish it quite a bit up on the Ausable and Scroon rivers. What would you like to know? Maybe I can help. Email me at – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  I writing this article to see if there is anyone on the web who flyfishes the Adirondacks. I’m looking to chat about fly hatches and fishing conditions in the great northeast. Thanks’ Dcoop

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  I writing this article to see if there is anyone on the web who flyfishes the Adirondacks. I’m looking to chat about fly hatches and fishing conditions in the great northeast. Thanks’ Dcoop

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Question:

Hi gang: Since moving to Oregon I have been doing alot more fly fishing and I began to see the advantages of a drift boat or the like.  However Drift boats take up alot of space and require a trailer and cost$$$.  I have always enjoyed rafting and surf kyaking so it seemed logical to look at canoes.  What I need is something that can handle the equipment for fishing and camping for a few days and the ability to handle upto class III rapids. Am I dreaming?  Do any of you folks fish from a canoe and have some suggestions on what to look for.  I am willing to give up some initial stability for whitewater capability as most of the rivers I fish have at least a couple of class III and IV rapids. Thanx in advance! charles.

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Hey If you find one let me know..I love fishing bones in a canoe..use an electric troller… and I’m due for a new one.

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Canoes are great watercraft, but not the best fishing craft on streams.  I have a Mad River Explorer which I love, but it is quite difficult for a single person, i.e. stern paddler to manage the canoe in fast water and at the same time place the fisherman in the bow in optimal position to fish holding water.  This is particularly true if the canoe is loaded down with camping gear.  If fishing is you primary use, I would recommend a raft with rowing frame.  It takes up less space than a canoe or driftboat and you could probably pick up one at an end-of-season sale for little more than you’d spend for a canoe capable of negotiating whitewater safely.  On the other hand, if you mostly want to float and *stop* to fish likely areas, the canoe is faster and more fun.  Hope this helps.  One thing to remember is that you won’t stop at Class III if you’re like most of us.   Longspeer

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I fish from canoes quite a bit but in somewhat different waters (ozark streams). My  experience is  that flyfishing while solo paddling required a canoe with good tracking otherwise one ends up having to correct my course during almost every cast. However note that  to run class III rapids you will probably want a play boat with plenty of rocker unless you are exceptionally good on a canoe. I have no solution for this opposing requirements. For what is worth, I use a Mad River Malacite. RioSimpson.

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I used to have an Old Town Katahdin that I could stand in easily.  It has a 41" beam and is a good buy for the money!

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writes: Canoes are great watercraft, but not the best fishing craft on

streams.  I……Longspeer   I Have to Agree that a canoe of any type would be less than ideal for fishing in most faster water.  Rafts are much more stable and forgiving when your attention is on that HUGE trout you have on.  We used to count on going swimming if we took a canoe, and we were on pretty tame waters.  I usually fish from a drift boat, but have fished from rafts and, if set up right, they are great! Steve May

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Check out Aquaterra’s kayaks: Keowee, Keowee II and Gemini or Jocasse. I’ve had a Gemini, a two person 16′ kayak with a single 6′ opening, for six years or so. The big advantage over a canoe is that it’s less influenced by wind. It’s very stable and has a comfortable seating position. Downside: a little on the heavy side 65# and not very practical to carry overhead like a canoe but you can drag it just about over any type of terrain without worrying about damage. Glenn Lemke Manchester, VT

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I agre with Glenn on the advantage of a Sea Kayak over a canoe.  I have an Aquaterra Chinook, BUT–if you ever hook into the bow portion, and I’ve done it with a clumsey cast, you’re screwed!  For all around use in flatwater of 50acres or less–the float tube is probably the way to go.

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Charles: I’ve done considerable fishing from my Mad River "Courier" and it would be an excellent boat for what you want. It was designed to be an extended wilderness tripping boat. It is tough and handles rapids very well and has a semi-v bottom characteristic of Mad River canoes. The construction is of Royalex (or Mad River’s equivalent) so it will take a beating and keep on ticking. I use mine for camping, fishing and just tooting around. I would definitely buy another. Richard Warren Raleigh, NC

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I am the one that suggested a Mad Rive Courier canoe. I forgot to add that this is a solo canoe. Buy yourself one of those cheap short paddles about 24" long to correct your drift with. It is a lot easier than reaching for a long heavy paddle. Richard Warren Raleigh, NC

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Question:

Chuck,          I have a BBS devoted to fly fishing and have several nice pictures of rainbows, and a nice brown,  all in the 20" range.  The number is 303-530-2331. No charge.  See ya, Terry

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Can anyone tell me where I can download nice color pictures of Brown or rainbow trout?

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