Question:

Petah: and wait till you see my version of the GRW

Carrie Stevens beatcha to it.  She calls it the Green Ghost.  <g Dave

Response:

Petah: and wait till you see my version of the GRW Carrie Stevens beatcha to it.  She calls it the Green Ghost.  <g Dave

ya, OK, no problem being one-upped by Carrie – but that pirate guy – sheesh. and this time, don’t buy out Lakewood’s entire supply of GGs.  Leave some for the guy who knows how to use it  <BSEG Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://members.home.net/pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

Petah: and wait till you see my version of the GRW Carrie Stevens beatcha to it.  She calls it the Green Ghost.  <g ya, OK, no problem being one-upped by Carrie – but that pirate guy – sheesh. and this time, don’t buy out Lakewood’s entire supply of GGs.  Leave some for the guy who knows how to use it  <BSEG

Thanks for thinking of me, Peter, but I tie my own. /daytripper (And leave HWMNBN out of this!

Response:

That’s my home water you’re talking about, Dave. Great to hear you had some good fishing. The Middle Fork from Indian Creek was the pits three or four weeks ago (for the reasons you mentioned), but the tributary fishing was superb. We missed you at the Yellowstone Clave. Despite (or maybe because of) various intolerable provocations and slights, I can’t recall of week when I had more fun. (Or caught a bigger fish Next time. San Juan in January? Meet you at the Kiddie Hole? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

[good time snipped] Dave LaCourse

Sounds like a great time – see you in a few weeks.  BTW, the granddaughter will out fish you too.  :) and wait till you see my version of the GRW. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://members.home.net/pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

<snipped awesome TR Next year Joanne and I will do Montana, perhaps with our 12 year old grand-daughter.  If we arrive on your doorstep with our 32 foot land yacht, Warren, I expect a cold beer, a big smile, and directions to the nearest trout waters.

I’ll leave a light on a cold one in the fridge for you.  I’ll make sure to leave a trout or two for you too.  I took lessons from Troutmaster Willi during the Clave so don’t expect many fish. . . . — Warren Findley Remove (nospamZZ) to respond via email http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt/

Response:

I’ll leave a light on a cold one in the fridge for you.

                /                and still need more sleep. . . . . . — Warren Findley Remove (nospamZZ) to respond via email http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt/

Response:

I’ll leave a light on a cold one in the fridge for you.                 /                and still need more sleep. . . . . .

Now, Warren, the biggest mistake people make when drinking premium beers (not Bud) is to drink them when they’re too cold. A light on a cold one might be just the thing. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Now, Warren, the biggest mistake people make when drinking premium beers (not Bud) is to drink them when they’re too cold. A light on a cold one might be just the thing.

Damn mother freakin’ confuser!  It’s out to get me, I swear! — Warren Findley Remove (nospamZZ) to respond via email http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt/

Response:

rw writes: Next time. San Juan in January? Meet you at the Kiddie Hole?

I’m planning on the SJ.  Haven’t told the Chief of Naval Ops yet, but I’m going.  And, you can believe I will not even wade through the Kiddie Hole.  Why anyone would want to catch those pathetic fish is beyond me.  I had planned on the Jellystone Clave, but made the Idaho reservations early.  I would have been out a lot of money if I didn’t follow through. Dave

Response:

In the past I have taken a grandson to Labrador for big brookies and landlocked salmon.  This year we went to Idaho for cutthroats.  I made the reservations before the Western Clave’s dates were set, so I missed it – we were in Idaho the same week. We arrived late Sunday afternoon aboard the owner’s Cesna 206.  Six cylinders, turbo-charged, putting out 310 hp.  Quite the aircraft. Wapiti Meadows Ranch in on Johnson Creek, south of Yellow Pine.  I was surprised to see chinook salmon in the creek.  Lots of them, and  all had been tagged by biologists.  They traveled about 900 miles up-stream, a 3-4 month trip, from the ocean to spawn and then die.  I was told that their numbers have increased over the past few years, so there is hope for the Chinook (King) salmon in this watershed. We fished Johnson Creek (skinny water this time of the year), the East Fork of the South Fork above Johnson Creek, and the East of the South below the confluence of Johnson.  Even though the water was skinny compared to what we are accustomed to, we caught many cutts on dries and nymphs.  When we first fished the East of the South, Brian was into his fifth rainbow or cutt before I had the water figured out.  He was up-stream of me fishing with the guide.  I was amazed to see him using an enormous Royal Wulff – must have been at least a size 10.   Small nymphs worked, but it seemed that the bigger ones worked better.  I caught most of my fish on a large yellow stone fly, but the dreaded Green Rock Worm also took a few, including the biggest of the trip – a cutt about 17 inches.   We were scheduled to fly into the Middle Branch of the Salmon at Indian Creek on Wednesday.  However, a very bad storm hit the area Monday night, dumping several inches of rain on the area. Four miles above Indian Creek is Pistol Creek.  There has been a fire on Pistol Creek for several weeks, so when the rains came they washed the ash into the creek and it was then dumped into the Middle Fork.  The water on Tuesday and Wednesday was a dirty gray.  We flew into the Middle Fork on Thursday after hearing that it was fishable. We walked up-stream about 2 miles to a large pool only to find it un-fishable.  The water was so cloudy that visibility was about two feet.  Downstream of Indian Creek the water was much better and we immediately go into some nice cutts.  My first cutt on this water had such vivid red colors that I thought it was a Rainbow. It was about 14 inches and absolutely beautiful.  The cutts on the other waters we fished had a green back and not much red (except for the "cut throat"), but this fish was brilliant.   After many fish caught and released, we settled into camp and made a "whiteman’s" campfire.  Our guide Andy grilled some steaks and baked some potatoes while I got into the white wine.  I took several pictures of my 16 year old grandson holding a beer can.  His mother has yet to see the pictures! <g.    We stayed up until about 11 p.m. watching the fire and observing the stars.  Life is good

Question:

You might want to fish Cliff and Wade lake from that float tube. Schuh-fly

Response:

Brian Nelson writes:

(snip good info) With closer inspection, one will find the seams and riffles just like any other freestone, only on a larger, more subtle, scale.

Thank you, Brian.  You have confirmed what I thought they might be like.  I am sure there are raging rivers out there, especially during run-off.  Thanks again. Dave LaCourse

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve been scanning through some books I have on the following rivers: Madison, Clark Fork, Henry’s Fork, Big Hole, and others.  I have noticed one thing about them –  they all seem to be slow moving rivers, ranging from small to large.   The absence of rapids is obvious.  In fact, in most of the pix, the water looks like it could be a pond or lake. Now, I am sure there is a current, otherwise it wouldn’t be a river <g.  But I get the impression that they are slow moving. Western Montana topography is characterized by what is called the Broad Valley Rockies. These glacially-carved u-shaped valleys are actually fairly easy gradient (not too steep). This results in rivers which typically are not raging torrents as some people may envision the northern Rockies. The Clark Fork (the largest of the rivers) and the Big Hole, with exceptions, are fairly ‘flat’ rivers. They are still freestone and

subsequently do flood and get scary during runoff, but during the low flow times, are great rivers for getting LONG drifts with a fly. The water is moving at 3 to 5 miles an hour but it is deceiving when it is a flat stretch. With closer inspection, one will find the seams and riffles just like any other

freestone, only on a larger, more subtle, scale. — Tight Lines! Brian D. Nelson Diamond N Outfitters, Missoula, Montana http://www.montana.com/dno/dno.htm 406-626-4022

Any time you want to floattube rivers just remember how much of you is underwater!! * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response:

The absolute, definitive, conclusive answer is, "It depends."  I have fished all of the rivers that you mentioned (not that it makes me an expert or anything), and I have to say that it depends on where you look and when you look there.  Henry’s Fork is a big open flat down on the Railroad Ranch section, but is whitewater a few miles upstream in Box Canyon.  Similarly, the Big Hole is pretty easy to wade in August, but is a raging torrent in June.  I fished the Stillwater last August, and it was a pretty gentle river at the time, but has a reputation for killing even expert whitewater kayakers during higher water. This is a broad generalization, but seems to be true for most of the rivers that I fish:  The downstream section is big, flat, and slow;  flows through a wide flat valley with a major highway running nearby, produces the biggest fish, and attracts the most fishermen, and is featured regularly in the flyfishing magazines.  The land is mostly privately owned, but there is usually good public access. The upper section is steeper, faster, and has more whitewater.  It is probably on Forest Service land, but it may be tricky finding a public access point. The fish are smaller and easier to catch, and you have to drive on some bad gravel road and possibly do some hiking to get to the river, so not as many fisherman (or photographers) get there. So anyway, if whitewater is what you like, you can find it on most of the rivers if you know where to look. Kevin – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve been scanning through some books I have on the following rivers: Madison, Clark Fork, Henry’s Fork, Big Hole, and others.  I have noticed one thing about them –  they all seem to be slow moving rivers, ranging from small to large.   The absence of rapids is obvious.  In fact, in most of the pix, the water looks like it could be a pond or lake.  Now, I am sure there is a current, otherwise it wouldn’t be a river <g.  But I get the impression that they are slow moving.  You can even float tube some of them.  If you float tubed the Rapid River in Maine, site of this year’s roff Maine Clave, you probably would die!  <g  On much  of the Rapid, a drag free drift will last but a few seconds, but on some of this Montana water, it *looks* like you can get a big long drift.  The difference is even greater when you consider a nymph drift.  Some of the pix show riffles and moderate "fast water", but nothing like I am used to. Now, I don’t mean to start a fight — this ain’t no flame baited post.  I would like to hear from you folks that fish these waters.  I will be at the Western Clave and will probably have my youngest grandson.  I am planning on fishing all of this water, and more if we can fit it in. Dave LaCourse

Response:

I’ve been scanning through some books I have on the following rivers: Madison, Clark Fork, Henry’s Fork, Big Hole, and others.  I have noticed one thing about them –  they all seem to be slow moving rivers, ranging from small to large.  

Dave, The only one I can talk about is the Henry’s Fork a.k.a. the North Fork (of the Snake).  It is a widely varying river.  It is true that there are places with slow moving water, such as on the Railroad Ranch section and much of the water upstream to Last Chance.  Above this, in Box Canyon, the water is considerably faster.  The water below Ashton Dam is not fast, but is very braided with little foam bubbles that are hard to distinguish from a white post on a parachute Adams <g.  In between these two locations you have Upper and Lower Mesa Falls, which are definitely fast!  They also provide an outstanding view, well worth the drive to see them.  There is a scenic loop off the highway between Island Park and Last Chance which will take you to the falls. I know this isn’t a definitive "fast"or "slow" answer, but the nature of the river changes frequently, depending mostly on the elevation gradient.  Much of the Henry’s Fork is wadeable, unlike the South Fork of the Snake which is a big, deep river.  If you come down to Island Park, Take a side trip to Big Springs, which is the headwaters of the Henry’s Fork.  You can drive to where the water bubbles out of the ground.  There are usually some very large trout there that you can throw worms to (no fishing allowed).  If you have any questions I can answer, let me know. Jeff

Response:

Dave,    After the rivers in Montana leave the mountains the gradient is fairly low as they flow east  Many of the rivers in Idaho have cut such deep canyons with sheer walls it scares the hell out of you when you drive over an old wooden bridge and look down. Ernie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’ve been scanning through some books I have on the following rivers: Madison, Clark Fork, Henry’s Fork, Big Hole, and others.  I have noticed one thing about them –  they all seem to be slow moving rivers, ranging from small to large.   The absence of rapids is obvious.  In fact, in most of the pix, the water looks like it could be a pond or lake.  Now, I am sure there is a current, otherwise it wouldn’t be a river <g.  But I get the impression that they are slow moving.  You can even float tube some of them.  If you float tubed the Rapid River in Maine, site of this year’s roff Maine Clave, you probably would die!  <g  On much  of the Rapid, a drag free drift will last but a few seconds, but on some of this Montana water, it *looks* like you can get a big long drift.  The difference is even greater when you consider a nymph drift.  Some of the pix show riffles and moderate "fast water", but nothing like I am used to. Now, I don’t mean to start a fight — this ain’t no flame baited post.  I would like to hear from you folks that fish these waters.  I will be at the Western Clave and will probably have my youngest grandson.  I am planning on fishing all of this water, and more if we can fit it in. Dave LaCourse

Response:

I’ve been scanning through some books I have on the following rivers: Madison, Clark Fork, Henry’s Fork, Big Hole, and others.  I have noticed one thing about them –  they all seem to be slow moving rivers, ranging from small to large.   The absence of rapids is obvious.  In fact, in most of the pix, the water looks like it could be a pond or lake.  Now, I am sure there is a current, otherwise it wouldn’t be a river <g.  But I get the impression that they are slow moving.  You can even float tube some of them.  If you float tubed the Rapid River in Maine, site of this year’s roff Maine Clave, you probably would die!  <g  On much  of the Rapid, a drag free drift will last but a few seconds, but on some of this Montana water, it *looks* like you can get a big long drift.  The difference is even greater when you consider a nymph drift.  Some of the pix show riffles and moderate "fast water", but nothing like I am used to. Now, I don’t mean to start a fight — this ain’t no flame baited post.  I would like to hear from you folks that fish these waters.  I will be at the Western Clave and will probably have my youngest grandson.  I am planning on fishing all of this water, and more if we can fit it in. Dave LaCourse

Response:

Jeff Shriver writes:

(good descriptions deletes for brev) If you have any questions I can answer, let me know.

Thanks, Jeff.  I am facinated by what I am seeing in these books.  I’ve had them for years and never really looked at them.  Again, thanks.   Dave LaCourse

Response:

I’ve been scanning through some books I have on the following rivers: Madison, Clark Fork, Henry’s Fork, Big Hole, and others.  I have noticed one thing about them –  they all seem to be slow moving rivers, ranging from small to large.

You’ve already got the right response on the Henry’s Fork from other postings.  The Madison River below Quake Lake is known as the "50 mile riffle."   It is very swift and can be difficult to wade.   The Clark Fork is a free stone river, too.  I’d say keep the float tube in the car, except for Quake Lake and Henry’s Lake.

Response:

I’ve been scanning through some books I have on the following rivers: Madison, Clark Fork, Henry’s Fork, Big Hole, and others.  I have noticed one thing about them –  they all seem to be slow moving rivers, ranging from small to large. You’ve already got the right response on the Henry’s Fork from other postings. The Madison River below Quake Lake is known as the "50 mile riffle."   It is very swift and can be difficult to wade.

I was about to post the same. I’ve fished the Madison a few times, always well past any sort of seasonal runoff, and once you get past the campground down to around Rt87 and the old Stagger Ranch section, there’s miles of bubbly stuff that can make drifting a fly a challenge. Trying to think of a section of the Rapid to compare it to…the closest I can think of is the water directly below Lower Dam up to the turn at the Summer House (and not the chub water along the north bank – I mean the roily stuff along the south bank). btw: If you don’t have one of those SOSuspenders Dave, I’d think seriously about investing in the larger one before you try wading the Madison… /daytripper

Response:

I’ve been scanning through some books I have on the following rivers: Madison, Clark Fork, Henry’s Fork, Big Hole, and others.  I have noticed one thing about them –  they all seem to be slow moving rivers …You can even float tube some of them.

Montana rivers are slow moving? Well maybe.   Dangerously fast white water is seldom good trout habitat. But that doesn’t mean drifting or float tubing Montana rivers is is safe for beginners. Nearly every river on your list does have dangerous stretches you need to know about. Log jams and irrigation dams kill more amateur floaters than white water. Note too that drifting a river is often more dangerous at low water that at high water because you have so little room to maneuver when drifting past tangles of cottonwood logs. I see more inexperienced, fool-hardy floaters every year. During the salmon fly hatch on the Big Hole in 1979 close to 20 driftboats where sunk and bashed to shreds at Brown’s Bridge alone. — /* Sandy Pittendrigh                  –oO0  * http://montana-riverboats.com  */

Response:

writes: Montana rivers are slow moving? Well maybe.   Dangerously fast white water is seldom good trout habitat.

Uh, where did I say it WAS good trout habitat.  From what I have seen in the River Journal books, the water IS slow moving, meadering thru meadows without very many rapids.   But that doesn’t mean drifting or float tubing Montana rivers is is safe for beginners.

Never said it was, Sandy. Never even said I was going to float tube.  If I bring my float tubes, I will used them on ponds/lakes.  What I did say was that the books show float tubers in very placid water.  Three are shown on the Clark Fork in what looks like a pond, not a raging river. Nearly every river on your list does have dangerous stretches you need to know about.

That’s why I have Warren.  <g Log jams and irrigation dams kill more amateur floaters than white water. Note too that drifting a river is often more dangerous at low water that at high water because you have so little room to maneuver when drifting past tangles of cottonwood logs. I see more inexperienced, fool-hardy floaters every year. During the salmon fly hatch on the Big Hole in 1979 close to 20 driftboats where sunk and bashed to shreds at Brown’s Bridge alone.

Dave L.  (not planning on floating anything except a home-tie)      —–  Posted via NewsOne.Net: Free Usenet News via the Web  —–      —–  http://newsone.net/ —  Discussions on every subject. —–    NewsOne.Net prohibits users from posting spam.  If this or other posts

Response:

I’ve been scanning through some books I have on the following rivers: Madison, Clark Fork, Henry’s Fork, Big Hole, and others.  I have noticed one thing about them –  they all seem to be slow moving rivers, ranging from small to large.   The absence of rapids is obvious.  In fact, in most of the pix, the water looks like it could be a pond or lake.  Now, I am sure there is a current, otherwise it wouldn’t be a river <g.  But I get the impression that they are slow moving.

Western Montana topography is characterized by what is called the Broad Valley Rockies. These glacially-carved u-shaped valleys are actually fairly easy gradient (not too steep). This results in rivers which typically are not raging torrents as some people may envision the northern Rockies. The Clark Fork (the largest of the rivers) and the Big Hole, with exceptions, are fairly ‘flat’ rivers. They are still freestone and subsequently do flood and get scary during runoff, but during the low flow times, are great rivers for getting LONG drifts with a fly. The water is moving at 3 to 5 miles an hour but it is deceiving when it is a flat stretch. With closer inspection, one will find the seams and riffles just like any other freestone, only on a larger, more subtle, scale. — Tight Lines! Brian D. Nelson Diamond N Outfitters, Missoula, Montana http://www.montana.com/dno/dno.htm 406-626-4022

Response:

Question:

Hi all, Just got back from the Maine Clave. While it was great to renew acquaintances from last years and make some new ones events of the week put a damper on things. The fishing was good and I was able to escape on the river. It was good not to have TV for the past three days. Driving home I saw the con trail of a jet and thought that things were starting to return to the daily routine. But, then I stopped to wonder how many kids no longer have parents to take them fishing. Paul

Response:

I was on the river near the dam when April, the dam keeper’s wife, began shouting at me to get out of the river and away from the dam.  She was extremely excited and agitated.  I gestured to John Russell who was fishing a little down-stream from me. We went to the dam keeper’s house to watch the news reports.  I was shocked at what I saw.  Simply unbelievable.  I knew that my life was to be changed drastically because of what was happening, and  I was immediately concerned because three roffians were at that moment flying – wayno, jeff miller, and Indian Joe.  Finally, finding out that the hijacked flights originated in Boston and Newark, we were at least somewhat relieved that our fishing buddies weren’t on the aircraft.   The briefest of trip reports follows mentioning those that attended,  in order of arrival: Stan Gula:  Stan’s knees were bothering him and he didn’t get to fish much, but at least he was there and having fun. John Russell:  JR flew from Oregon.  A gentle and sincere man, he caught fish on the Rapid.  After the WTC horror, John became concerned because a brother lived in NYC.  He eventually found him safe.  I hope I can fish with JR in the future. Vince Norris:  Another gentle and sincere man that I had the pleasure of meeting during May’s Penns Clave.  Vince flew his own aircraft to the clave, landing at Berlin, NH.  We were concerned that he would not be able to take off on Friday, but apparently the skies were cleared by then. Bill Laverty:  Vince’s friend who arrived with Vince.  First time fly fishing. He spent much of his time spin fishing in the lake. Dave Bottom:  This guy knows more about Maine fishing than any person I know. It was great seeing him again, and he and I will fish the Kennebec together next month. Dave Tatosian:  Has been to several claves.  Knows the river well.  Caught some fish. Dave Price:  AKA Nice Dave.  Tied flies, fished, caught fish, tied flies, fished, caught fish.  Great guy to be around. Paul Goodwin:  Got some nice trout and salmon on his home-made boo rod, with iddy biddy flies. Peter Charles and his wife Joanne:  Peter got to try some new streamer patterns and was successful by landing a nice (3 lb ?) brookie out of 2nd current.  I had the pleasure of netting it for him.  Joanne kept us in stitches with her humor and wonderful personality.  I will steelhead fish with Peter in October/Nov. Jeff Miller:  After much concern and worry, Jeffy shows up on Wednesday driving a 15 passenger van rented from the airport in Baltimore.  He fished the river NC style and was very successful.  Kessie watched out for his nutritional needs. Indian Joe:  Arrived with Jeff.  Full of jokes and humor.  I hope he caught fish because I did not spend any time with him. Joanne and me:  If it wasn’t for Joanne, we wouldn’t have had all those wonderful snacks every evening.  Me?  I managed to catch a few and had a good time drinking Peter Charles’ birthday present (18 year old  Scotch)  The bonfire was canceled for Wednesday evening because of the tragedy in NY.  All agreed we should have it, so on Thursday eventing Harry the dam keeper got a good blaze going.    Great fire. Great talk. Some observations: In every little Maine town we travel through today there was some sort of celebration – a celebration of being an American.  It was very touching.  On most over-passes on the turnpike and super hiways there were flags displayed. Many cars and trucks had patriotic words printed on their rear windows.  People were proud, but angry too.  I pity the poor bastards that did this, for their hell is just beginning and will last a long, long time.  God Bless America! Dave LaCourse Former Two Time Clavemeister Dave

Response:

I would hope that the North Carolina contingency not rely on Jeffy/wayno/IJ for representation.   It was poorly represented last year, so here’s hoping……

I beg your pardon? –Steve

Response:

Speaking for The Daves (even the honorary one) I believe we will accept your gracious offer. /a Dave – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I just booked Lakewood for Joanne and me, Sept 9 – 15. I have the following folks listed as going: Dave Bottom Dave Tatosian Dave Price Paul (Dave) Goodwin They want the same arrangement as last year, so if youse guys haven’t already called, I will do it for you. Wayno Harrison    room by himself Indian Joe             room by himself (Note:  One person/cabin will be tolerated by Sue if there are not that many. This is a clave, so doubling up with others would be nice.  <g) Big Cabin (Camp Comfort – non-smoking dudes only) So far there is: Jeffy Miller (I have your booze from last year) Peter Charles Frank Church  (Wed – Sat) Comfort sleeps six, but last year we had 4 or 5 in it.  It is the biggest camp and centrally located, so it becomes Clave Central by default.   I would hope that the North Carolina contingency not rely on Jeffy/wayno/IJ for representation.   It was poorly represented last year, so here’s hoping…… There is room for at least 10 other folks.  For more info, go to www.lakewoodcamps.com If you want, I will make your reservations.  But, *you* will be responsible for getting your $100 deposit to Sue to confirm your reservations. Let me know. Dave LaCourse Pirate and Bottom Dweller

Response:

Dave  I would like to share part of a cabin,  just better off having a bedroom (not cabin ) to myself so the others can sleep. My wife says I snoore. Put me in big cabin if there is a small room. I will talk to Jeff about dates as perhaps we can combine  dates.  IJ

Response:

IJ writes: Dave  I would like to share part of a cabin,  just better off having a bedroom (not cabin ) to myself so the others can sleep. My wife says I snoore. Put me in big cabin if there is a small room. I will talk to Jeff about dates as perhaps we can combine  dates. IJ

You got it, IJ.  Will put you in the big camp upstairs. Dave

Response:

Are Jeffy Miller and Peter Charles "safe", I mean, will I be safe from them when the lights go out?  If not, can I have Mildred? Will you make my reservations?   I will send them a ru…ah…check next week. Frank (bouncy bouncy) Church

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I just booked Lakewood for Joanne and me, Sept 9 – 15. I have the following folks listed as going: Dave Bottom Dave Tatosian Dave Price Paul (Dave) Goodwin They want the same arrangement as last year, so if youse guys haven’t already called, I will do it for you. Wayno Harrison    room by himself Indian Joe             room by himself (Note:  One person/cabin will be tolerated by Sue if there are not that many. This is a clave, so doubling up with others would be nice.  <g) Big Cabin (Camp Comfort – non-smoking dudes only) So far there is: Jeffy Miller (I have your booze from last year) Peter Charles Frank Church  (Wed – Sat) Comfort sleeps six, but last year we had 4 or 5 in it.  It is the biggest camp and centrally located, so it becomes Clave Central by default. I would hope that the North Carolina contingency not rely on Jeffy/wayno/IJ for representation.   It was poorly represented last year, so here’s hoping…… There is room for at least 10 other folks.  For more info, go to www.lakewoodcamps.com If you want, I will make your reservations.  But, *you* will be responsible for getting your $100 deposit to Sue to confirm your reservations. Let me know. Dave LaCourse Pirate and Bottom Dweller

Response:

Frank Church writes: Are Jeffy Miller and Peter Charles "safe", I mean, will I be safe from them when the lights go out?  If not, can I have Mildred? Will you make my reservations?   I will send them a ru…ah…check next week. Frank (bouncy bouncy) Church

Jeffy and Peter are ok.  And they do not snore.  Indian Joe will also be in your camp.  Mildred is old and tired.  I have retired her.  <g Dave

Response:

Are Jeffy Miller and Peter Charles "safe", I mean, will I be safe from them when the lights go out?  If not, can I have Mildred?

To Miss Jo in New Zealand: Mildred is a goat.  Please do not worry.  She is well.  <g

Response:

Mildred is a goat.  Please do not worry.  She is well.  <g

Check out http://bbs.bianca.com/mforums/w/whiteshadow/posts/2000_Jul_03/97734/9… — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

I just booked Lakewood for Joanne and me, Sept 9 – 15. I have the following folks listed as going: Dave Bottom Dave Tatosian Dave Price Paul (Dave) Goodwin They want the same arrangement as last year, so if youse guys haven’t already called, I will do it for you. Wayno Harrison    room by himself Indian Joe             room by himself (Note:  One person/cabin will be tolerated by Sue if there are not that many. This is a clave, so doubling up with others would be nice.  <g) Big Cabin (Camp Comfort – non-smoking dudes only) So far there is: Jeffy Miller (I have your booze from last year) Peter Charles Frank Church  (Wed – Sat) Comfort sleeps six, but last year we had 4 or 5 in it.  It is the biggest camp and centrally located, so it becomes Clave Central by default.   I would hope that the North Carolina contingency not rely on Jeffy/wayno/IJ for representation.   It was poorly represented last year, so here’s hoping…… There is room for at least 10 other folks.  For more info, go to www.lakewoodcamps.com If you want, I will make your reservations.  But, *you* will be responsible for getting your $100 deposit to Sue to confirm your reservations. Let me know. Dave LaCourse Pirate and Bottom Dweller

Response:

dave, are those the camps located just north of middle dam, i have fished the rapid a few times and usualy rent a camp site further up lake [ towards upper richardson same side of lake], i’ve always wondered about the camps

Yes, "Lakewood Camps" is located within a ten minute walk directly north of Middledam. Great place, awesome food, friendly and capable hosts. Hope you can join us, Chris. /daytripper

Response:

dave, are those the camps located just north of middle dam, i have fished the rapid a few times and usualy rent a camp site further up lake [ towards upper richardson same side of lake], i’ve always wondered about the camps

Yes, "Lakewood Camps" is located within a ten minute walk directly north of Middledam. Great place, awesome food, friendly and capable hosts. Hope you can join us, Chris. Yes, I second that, Chris.  Those camp sites usually close the week-end after Labor Day.  But If you can make it to Lakewood, please join us.  See www.lakewoodcamps.com for more info. Dave LaCourse

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – To date I have received deposits from Steve Z., Peter and Charlie Choc.  I need to send deposits asap after the 1st of the year (if we’re all alive by then).  Sooooooooo, those of you who are sitting on the can and not doing anything, send your deposit to: Dave LaCourse 120 Brook St. Hudson, MA  01749 A nice message with the check would be appreciated.  You know, like, "Stick this, LaPlac", or something else appropriate for a roffer to say. Unless otherwise stated, I will have you arriving before lunch on the 10th, and leaving before lunch on the 16th. Dave L., who is doing this either because he is insane or ’cause              "he cares:". Early results are in, and "Insane" looks like a shoo-in… /daytripper ("The check’s in the mail!" ;^

It takes one to know one. Paul

Response:

Early results are in, and "Insane" looks like a shoo-in…

Isn’t that sort of like saying Charles Manson is ‘peculiar’?<g. — Charlie…

Response:

Paul (Salmon Fly) writes: Early results are in, and "Insane" looks like a shoo-in… /daytripper ("The check’s in the mail!" ;^

It takes one to know one. Paul Thank you, Paul.  Said like the gentleman I know you are Dave L.

Response:

Your being hard on yourself agian Paul Dave – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – To date I have received deposits from Steve Z., Peter and Charlie Choc.  I need to send deposits asap after the 1st of the year (if we’re all alive by then).  Sooooooooo, those of you who are sitting on the can and not doing anything, send your deposit to: Dave LaCourse 120 Brook St. Hudson, MA  01749 A nice message with the check would be appreciated.  You know, like, "Stick this, LaPlac", or something else appropriate for a roffer to say. Unless otherwise stated, I will have you arriving before lunch on the 10th, and leaving before lunch on the 16th. Dave L., who is doing this either because he is insane or ’cause              "he cares:". Early results are in, and "Insane" looks like a shoo-in… /daytripper ("The check’s in the mail!" ;^ It takes one to know one. Paul

Response:

 Ever since the meniscus

Understood<g. — Charlie…

Response:

dave, are those the camps located just north of middle dam, i have fished the rapid a few times and usualy rent a camp site further up lake [ towards upper richardson same side of lake], i’ve always wondered about the camps chris smith porter maine – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Chris Smith: <<dave, could you post the info for the clave again, i some how spaced it chris smith porter maine Hi, Chris. The Maine ‘Clave will be held from September 10 thru the 16 at Lakewood Camps on Lower Lake Richardson.  We will be fishing the famous Rapid River for big brookies and land locked salmon. Lakewood Camps is on the American plan – for $95/day you get a rustic cabin circa 1920, with electricity from 6:30 a.m. until 11 p.m.   The three meals a day that Jan and her crew provide are excellent.  If you do not want to come back to camp for lunch, a bag lunch to your specifications is provided, including thermos. It is a wonderful place to spend time, let alone fishing. The Rapid River is the output of Lower Lake Richardson and flows into Umbagog.  (The output of Umbagog  is the Androoscoggin River.) It is a catch and release river on brook trout, with one salmon allowed/day (14 inches) until Aug. 1 when they also become C&R. The river has been written up in many publications and is wonderfully fast and beautiful.  It is a fairly large river with large brookies and ll’s, fly fishing only. To date 13 roffers have signed up.  I have met and fished with them all, and they are a fine bunch of n’er do wells.  You wouldn’t bring any of them home to meet your family, but to fish with, they ain’t all *that* bad. There is still room and I hope other roffers will take this opportunity to sign up. Dave L.

Response:

Isn’t that sort of like saying Charles Manson is ‘peculiar’?<g. Um……isn’t he? It was meant as an understatement, and hopefully his parole board will continue to feel the same way.

Thanks Charlie.  Always thought he was a bit peculiar myself.  Just wanted to be sure I wasn’t the Lone Ranger on this one.  Ever since the meniscus

Response:

Chris Smith: <<dave, could you post the info for the clave again, i some how spaced it chris smith porter maine Hi, Chris. The Maine ‘Clave will be held from September 10 thru the 16 at Lakewood Camps on Lower Lake Richardson.  We will be fishing the famous Rapid River for big brookies and land locked salmon. Lakewood Camps is on the American plan – for $95/day you get a rustic cabin circa 1920, with electricity from 6:30 a.m. until 11 p.m.   The three meals a day that Jan and her crew provide are excellent.  If you do not want to come back to camp for lunch, a bag lunch to your specifications is provided, including thermos. It is a wonderful place to spend time, let alone fishing. The Rapid River is the output of Lower Lake Richardson and flows into Umbagog.  (The output of Umbagog  is the Androoscoggin River.) It is a catch and release river on brook trout, with one salmon allowed/day (14 inches) until Aug. 1 when they also become C&R. The river has been written up in many publications and is wonderfully fast and beautiful.  It is a fairly large river with large brookies and ll’s, fly fishing only. To date 13 roffers have signed up.  I have met and fished with them all, and they are a fine bunch of n’er do wells.  You wouldn’t bring any of them home to meet your family, but to fish with, they ain’t all *that* bad. There is still room and I hope other roffers will take this opportunity to sign up. Dave L.

Response:

Wayno took it in the shorts at the Carolina Clave, and it ain’t gonna happen this time.   Uh, I thought we weren’t going to talk about that…

Well, now at least we know just who’s shorts Louie was wearing… /daytripper

Response:

dave, could you post the info for the clave again, i some how spaced it chris smith porter maine – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – To date I have received deposits from Steve Z., Peter and Charlie Choc.  I need to send deposits asap after the 1st of the year (if we’re all alive by then).  Sooooooooo, those of you who are sitting on the can and not doing anything, send your deposit to: Dave LaCourse 120 Brook St. Hudson, MA  01749 A nice message with the check would be appreciated.  You know, like, "Stick this, LaPlac", or something else appropriate for a roffer to say. Unless otherwise stated, I will have you arriving before lunch on the 10th, and leaving before lunch on the 16th. Dave L., who is doing this either because he is insane or ’cause              "he cares:".

Response:

The Wonderful Counselor from the Great North State, wayno, has volunteered to do the t-shirts (with the help of his son, Anthony, the artist of the Carolina Clave T-shirt). However, orders will be taken and money will pass hands before any shirts are handed/mailed out.  The same with the hats I will have done.  Wayno took it in the shorts at the Carolina Clave, and it ain’t gonna happen this time.  Money up front, folks. Dave L.

Response:

Wayno took it in the shorts at the Carolina Clave, and it ain’t gonna happen this time.  

Uh, I thought we weren’t going to talk about that… — Charlie…

Response:

Early results are in, and "Insane" looks like a shoo-in… Isn’t that sort of like saying Charles Manson is ‘peculiar’?<g.

Um……isn’t he?

Response:

Early results are in, and "Insane" looks like a shoo-in… Isn’t that sort of like saying Charles Manson is ‘peculiar’?<g. Um……isn’t he?

It was meant as an understatement, and hopefully his parole board will continue to feel the same way. — Charlie…

Response:

To date I have received deposits from Steve Z., Peter and Charlie Choc.  I need to send deposits asap after the 1st of the year (if we’re all alive by then).  Sooooooooo, those of you who are sitting on the can and not doing anything, send your deposit to: Dave LaCourse 120 Brook St. Hudson, MA  01749 A nice message with the check would be appreciated.  You know, like, "Stick this, LaPlac", or something else appropriate for a roffer to say. Unless otherwise stated, I will have you arriving before lunch on the 10th, and leaving before lunch on the 16th. Dave L., who is doing this either because he is insane or ’cause               "he cares:".

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -To date I have received deposits from Steve Z., Peter and Charlie Choc.  I need to send deposits asap after the 1st of the year (if we’re all alive by then).  Sooooooooo, those of you who are sitting on the can and not doing anything, send your deposit to: Dave LaCourse 120 Brook St. Hudson, MA  01749 A nice message with the check would be appreciated.  You know, like, "Stick this, LaPlac", or something else appropriate for a roffer to say. Unless otherwise stated, I will have you arriving before lunch on the 10th, and leaving before lunch on the 16th. Dave L., who is doing this either because he is insane or ’cause              "he cares:".

Early results are in, and "Insane" looks like a shoo-in… /daytripper ("The check’s in the mail!" ;^)

Response:

Question:

Patagonia supports many environmental groups.  I’m not sure if they support an anti hunting group, since the owner of the company is an avid fisherman himself.  I’m sure they would let you know if asked. Anyway you are correct about their products, they are the best! Forrest FlyFishingREVIEW http://www./flyfishingreview.com Does anybody know the politics of the Patagonia Corp? I read or heard something a couple of years ago that Patagonia is a financial contributor to some anti hunting groups. I have not been able to verify this information. I hope it is incorrect as Patagonia makes some of the best flyfishing and outdoor gear that I have seen but I will not use or purchase anything from groups that suppport anti hunting. Any info is appreciated. bruce

Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

Does anybody know the politics of the Patagonia Corp? I read or heard something a couple of years ago that Patagonia is a financial contributor to some anti hunting groups. I have not been able to verify this information. I hope it is incorrect as Patagonia makes some of the best flyfishing and outdoor gear that I have seen but I will not use or purchase anything from groups that suppport anti hunting. Any info is appreciated. bruce

No, this is definitely not true at all. The atmosphere of any company inevitably reflects the personality of owners/leaders. The Patagonia brass are a brassy bunch, that like elk hunting, whiskey bottles and a good smoke every now and then. — /* Sandy Pittendrigh                  –oO0  * http://www.nervana.montana.edu/~sandy  */

Response:

No, this is definitely not true at all. The atmosphere of any company inevitably reflects the personality of owners/leaders. The Patagonia brass are a brassy bunch, that like elk hunting, whiskey bottles and a good smoke every now and then.

  Well, this is not definitely not true at all–if that makes any sense. Patagonia supports a number of environmental and conservation groups some of which may or may not include an anti-hunting component.  The bottom line, nevertheless, is that Patagonia, on top of making the best outdoor gear on the market, should be lauded in their continual efforts to be a corporate good citizen.  Patagonia is active in fisheries restoration (the Big Hole grayling restoration project, to name just one Montana project) and wilderness preservation, as well as promoting recycling and alternative materials usage.  Patagonia makes a commitment to annually donate a certain percentage of their profits to their various causes.  I have no qualms (even though I often can’t really afford it) buying Patagonia even if it costs a little more, because I know that they’re making an effort to have a postive impact on things like fisheries and habitat that I value.  (No, I don’;t, nor have I ever worked for the company.) Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

Does anybody know the politics of the Patagonia Corp? I read or heard something a couple of years ago that Patagonia is a financial contributor to some anti hunting groups. I have not been able to verify this information. I hope it is incorrect as Patagonia makes some of the best flyfishing and outdoor gear that I have seen but I will not use or purchase anything from groups that suppport anti hunting. Any info is appreciated. bruce

Response:

Hmmm… you could ask them.   They have a web site at www.patagonia.com (who’d have figured THAT out?).   Me, I can’t afford that stuff anyway; but if I worried too much about single-issue politics of every company I did business with, it’d be a race between starving and freezing to death. .02, Joe F. who meant to boycott grapes, but never got around to it. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anybody know the politics of the Patagonia Corp? I read or heard something a couple of years ago that Patagonia is a financial contributor to some anti hunting groups. I have not been able to verify this information. I hope it is incorrect as Patagonia makes some of the best flyfishing and outdoor gear that I have seen but I will not use or purchase anything from groups that suppport anti hunting. Any info is appreciated. bruce

Response:

Question:

Anyone have an aluminum jon boat that they can recommend?

Rich, If it’s just for yourself try a ten foot aluminium jon boat.  Sea Nymph is a good brand.  It’s very light and doesn’t draw much water.   I believe you can get one new for about $500.00 – if it’s used, in my neck of the woods (Sullivan County, New York), they go for about $150 to $200 though the newspapers.   Plus, you can stand in them  when you cast which you really can’t do in a kayak or, for that matter, in a canoe. Merry Christmas, Tony Ritter – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

Seconding another poster, have you considered a kayak?  Simple, light (50-80 pounds), easy to carry single-handed (simply hold it over your head and trot along), much faster than other paddle-powered boats (you will leave a rowboat in the dust, metaphorically speaking, and a canoe too), and stable enough if you get the right one.  If you get enthusiastic and skilled enough, you can even paddle these out into the ocean and saltwater fish. I would particularly look at the Folboat (sp?) brand of folding sea kayaks. These have a frame that you assemble and then insert into a rubber/fabric skin.  The advantages over regular kayaks are: the cockpit is open (your legs are exposed, rather than being tucked into a round coaming) which would make it easy to stash tackle bags, small coolers, the paddle, the rod, etc. which otherwise have to be strapped to the rounded top of the boat; these are beamy (wide) boats and hence very stable — not as stable as a jonboat and you won’t stand up in it, but if you have a minimum of coordination you’ll find it just fine to paddle, fish, even snooze in a seated position; because they break down and fit into a large duffel bag, you can stuff it in the trunk of your car or a closet or even check it on a plane; and, as folding kayaks go, it’s inexpensive (in the ballpark of $500-700 used for a single boat, I *think* — check out rec.boats.paddle.)  Hardcore sea kayakers may tell you the Folboat isn’t tough enough: they’re talking about multi-day ocean trips loaded with 100 pounds of food and water and launching through heavy surf, which isn’t too relevant for your usage.   Another folding kayak with a similar design, but tougher and more expensive, is the Klepper series.  (Kleppers have crossed the Atlantic, in fact.)  Overkill for fishing on a lake, and older ones might need too much TLC, but if you found one used for cheap enough it’d be OK. Yet another is the Feathercraft series.  I think these are tremendous for ocean use (I have two Feathercraft K-1’s) but they have a traditional hard cockpit coaming (not an open cockpit) and are definitely overkill (used price is like $3000).  I have flyfished from my Feathercraft off the California coast and found it a pain, since there was no handy place to put my rod when I picked up the paddle or vice versa. Another idea along the kayak line would be one of the surfboard style kayaks.  I don’t recall the actual name for this type.  They are molded out of a single piece of plastic, you sit in a molded depression, they are really quite cheap and capable but you do not stay dry so unless you like wearing wetsuits or fish in warm water . . . but might be a way to try out the concept for cheap, by renting one for a weekend. If you do choose a kayak, take a course in handling them and safety.   — Using Virtual Access http://www.soft-shop.com

Response:

I’m looking for ideas and info. on what you all think is the ideal boat/pram for fly fishing.   I plan to fish small lakes that I will need to row, or use an electric or gas motor (if allowed).  The boat needs to be somewhat light (100# thereabouts) because I will have to lift and carry it maybe 100 yards to launch in some cases.  I can car top or trailer, does not matter. I have seen the dinky prams in the magazines, but I think I need more room. Anyone have an aluminum jon boat that they can recommend? Appreciate any help Rich

Response:

If I were you I would look into a kayak. I upgraded from a float tube and think it’s great! If you want  I have some group postings I can email you. They helped me make my decision. Lot’s of good people in the group so you will get more good input, maybe more than you want. Mike – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m looking for ideas and info.

Response:

Question:

You might try using a hypodermic needle to inject some epoxy between the grip and rod. — Ernie Harrison Remove NOSPAM to send E-Mail Selling my Fly Fishing Books Go to: http://users.ccnet.com/~emh – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I built a GL3  7 1/2 ft 4 wt last winter, but the cork grip was just a bit loose before epoxying it to the blank. The lower 1/2 of the grip toward the reel seat was a pretty good fit, but the upper half has developed a squeak.   The grip is not actually loose but it is starting to feel sloppy (for lack of a better word).  Any ideas about how to fix this problem?  The fellow at the rod shop just looked at me knowingly and nodded his head saying "yup, I kin fix’er fer ye".  Which means stripping off the guides and replacing the grip. I’d like to try something less invasive but can’t figure a way to get the epoxy between the grip and blank. Patrick  

Response:

I built a GL3  7 1/2 ft 4 wt last winter, but the cork grip was just a bit loose before epoxying it to the blank. The lower 1/2 of the grip toward the reel seat was a pretty good fit, but the upper half has developed a squeak.   The grip is not actually loose but it is starting to feel sloppy (for lack of a better word).  Any ideas about how to fix this problem?  The fellow at the rod shop just looked at me knowingly and nodded his head saying "yup, I kin fix’er fer ye".  Which means stripping off the guides and replacing the grip.  I’d like to try something less invasive but can’t figure a way to get the epoxy between the grip and blank.

The only sure cure is a new cork grip that fits correctly with no voids (empty space inside.) Glue is needed only in the thinnest film, to prevent the inside surface of the cork from separating from the rod blank at any point, under whatever stress, so that no void can begin.  Building with voids and filling them will be unsatisfactory in the long run.  The glues react to bending and stretching differently from both blank material and cork, and if more rigid than both will probably wear away the softest i.e. the cork, depending on blank butt stiffness and actual use. I.e. do it right or not at all, if you want to use this rod with pleasure and confidence for a long time.  A repair by injecting glue may be acceptable on a spare rod, used only intermittently, I suppose. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

Response:

[deleted] but the upper half has developed a squeak.

[deleted] Duct tape usage #309. — TimW – Halfordian Golfer Guilt replaced the creel…

Response:

I have successfully repaired a grip by doing the following: 1) Get some 2 ton epoxy glue. Do not use the 5 minute stuff or super glue. This glue will take at least 24-36 hours to completely setup. It usually comes in 2 hypodermic syringes that are fused together. 2)I put these syringes close to a heat source like a light bulb to heat the solutions which will make them less viscous. 3) Get a 10 cc hypodermic syringe from a physician friend, dentist or vet. Be sure it is clean. You will ruin this syringe.Get a 20 gauge hypo needle at least 1 inch long. 4) Mix glue while it is warm and insert into the syringe. 5) Insert needle into the cork handle and push the glue into the space. You may need to inject in several places. Put rod aside for at least 24 hours before you flex it. I have used this technique on several rods successfully. The holes made by the needle in the cork are small and have been no problem You can repair them as needed. The first time I tried this, I used a 2cc syringe. I was unsuccessful until I used the larger syringe with a bigger bore needle. The 10 cc with the 20 gauge has worked OK, especially after the warming of the solutions. Good luck and let me know how it works out. Regards, J.

Response:

Snip 2)I put these syringes close to a heat source like a light bulb to heat the solutions which will make them less viscous.

I think Jack means "more viscous" and he’s right, warm it up slightly first. You can also use a hair dryer.

Response:

With all due respect, the viscosity of a solution is, according to physic textbooks:  " the property of a fluid which resists change in the shape or molecular arrangement during flow"  As stated in my post, we heat these solutions in order that they become less viscous and more "runny" if you will. A solution that is more viscous has a greater tendency to resist a change in its shape. Water for instance, is less viscous than molasses. My two cents worth. Jack.

Response:

More viscous, less viscous…. I got the point.  Thanks for the advice all the same.  I’m planning on giving this a try this weekend.  Will let you know how it turns out. Patrick

Response:

All the advice is good. I’d just be careful that you don’t hurt the blank itself when you do this. I could imagine having the rod splinter at the grip from a flaw you put into the blank. Of course it would happen on the 24 inch brown. FlyFisherRay

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I built a GL3  7 1/2 ft 4 wt last winter, but the cork grip was just a bit loose before epoxying it to the blank. The lower 1/2 of the grip toward the reel seat was a pretty good fit, but the upper half has developed a squeak. The grip is not actually loose but it is starting to feel sloppy (for lack of a better word).  Any ideas about how to fix this problem?  The fellow at the rod shop just looked at me knowingly and nodded his head saying "yup, I kin fix’er fer ye".  Which means stripping off the guides and replacing the grip.  I’d like to try something less invasive but can’t figure a way to get the epoxy between the grip and blank. The only sure cure is a new cork grip that fits correctly with no voids (empty space inside.) Glue is needed only in the thinnest film, to prevent the inside surface of the cork from separating from the rod blank at any point, under whatever stress, so that no void can begin.  Building with voids and filling them will be unsatisfactory in the long run.  The glues react to bending and stretching differently from both blank material and cork, and if more rigid than both will probably wear away the softest i.e. the cork, depending on blank butt stiffness and actual use. I.e. do it right or not at all, if you want to use this rod with pleasure and confidence for a long time.  A repair by injecting glue may be acceptable on a spare rod, used only intermittently, I suppose. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

  Yah, Don is correct. But if you want to a better half-assed job inject one of the new polyurethane bond  glues. These glues expand in cavities and fill gaps. About 10 years ago I used this type glue for mounting grips. However, the company that mad it took it off the market because of poor shelf life problems. Now there is a new generation of these glues, one Brand Is Elmer’s Pro Bond. These glues have a good open time and a tremendous bonding ability (ask Norm Abrams). Good Luck -Doug Easton

Response:

<snip But if you want to a better half-assed job inject one of the new polyurethane bond  glues.

<rest deleted for brevity Yeah, thats me… half an ass.  My wife keeps telling me the seat of my pants look like a family of Bedouins have recently moved out. Patrick  (suffering from no-ass-itis)

Response:

got to your local pharmacy and get a syringe (disposable plastic) and then stop by your local fire station or even a vetrinarian’s office and get a GREAT BIG needle.  just shoot that grip down in there full of glue…..    At least, it seems reasonable to me… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I built a GL3  7 1/2 ft 4 wt last winter, but the cork grip was just a bit loose before epoxying it to the blank. The lower 1/2 of the grip toward the reel seat was a pretty good fit, but the upper half has developed a squeak. The grip is not actually loose but it is starting to feel sloppy (for lack of a better word).  Any ideas about how to fix this problem?  The fellow at the rod shop just looked at me knowingly and nodded his head saying "yup, I kin fix’er fer ye".  Which means stripping off the guides and replacing the grip.  I’d like to try something less invasive but can’t figure a way to get the epoxy between the grip and blank. Patrick

Response:

Go to a local woodworking store if there is one near you. They sell a hypodermic looking glue injector that is used to push glue into a joint to glue it. If there are no stores near you, go to http://www.todayswoodworker.com I believe you can order it from them. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I built a GL3  7 1/2 ft 4 wt last winter, but the cork grip was just a bit loose before epoxying it to the blank. The lower 1/2 of the grip toward the reel seat was a pretty good fit, but the upper half has developed a squeak. The grip is not actually loose but it is starting to feel sloppy (for lack of a better word).  Any ideas about how to fix this problem?  The fellow at the rod shop just looked at me knowingly and nodded his head saying "yup, I kin fix’er fer ye".  Which means stripping off the guides and replacing the grip.  I’d like to try something less invasive but can’t figure a way to get the epoxy between the grip and blank. Patrick

Response:

I built a GL3  7 1/2 ft 4 wt last winter, but the cork grip was just a bit loose before epoxying it to the blank. The lower 1/2 of the grip toward the reel seat was a pretty good fit, but the upper half has developed a squeak.   The grip is not actually loose but it is starting to feel sloppy (for lack of a better word).  Any ideas about how to fix this problem?  The fellow at the rod shop just looked at me knowingly and nodded his head saying "yup, I kin fix’er fer ye".  Which means stripping off the guides and replacing the grip.  I’d like to try something less invasive but can’t figure a way to get the epoxy between the grip and blank. Patrick  

Response:

Question:

Dan – years ago, Orvis had a 3 piece 8′ for 6wt Traveler graphite rod – back in the mid ’70’s tl – les

Response:

Hi there, I do believe that all of the graphite fly rods produced by Orvis are 2 or 4

piece. There are currently two 3 pc. rods available from Orvis in the US.  One is the PM-10 8614-3 (8 1/2 ft. 14 wt. 3 pc.)and the other is a Silver Label 10ft. 7wt. 3pc.  Otherwise the current Orvis rods ar all either 2 or 4 piece.    There may be some 3 pc. rods currently in production for the UK market as there are a number of different rods that Orvis makes specifically for that market that are not sold here.  Most of them are much longer than 8 ft. though. There was a 3 piece 6 wt. available a number of years ago called "The Osprey" but it was 9 1/2 ft. long if I remember correctly.                           Dan Dan Gracia Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools

Response:

WANTED: LOOKING FOR A 3 PIECE-8FT. 6WT. ORVIS

Response:

WANTED: LOOKING FOR A 3 PIECE-8FT. 6WT. ORVIS

Call John Valk at Grindstone Angling at (905) 689-0880.  I know he has an old Orvis three piece something or other.  It may be a 6 wt.  I don’t remember. Peter

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WANTED: LOOKING FOR A 3 PIECE-8FT. 6WT. ORVIS

Hi there, I do believe that all of the graphite fly rods produced by Orvis are 2 or 4 piece. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY

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Question:

Your drift boat awaits you!

It is images of that which help me to ecsape these walls every day George…I thank you. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Groups …snip —   Tim Walker, if I get close to your home (my travel plans are real loose and unscheduled) I’ll call a couple of days in advance — would love to meet you, maybe even fish. You all take care & …   — snip — Damned right you look me up Al.  Maybe some of it will rub off on me… — TimW Halfordian Golfer        Your drift boat awaits you! GeorgeG Halfordian Caster

Ha!  and *now* we know that George G. is actually Tim Walker! (or else it’s the other way around…) Tim

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Hi Groups I’ll be off line for the next week or ten days field testing products and researching articles in MT, ID, NV, UT, CO, WY, NM, & AZ. Tim Walker if I get close to your home (my travel plans are real loose and unscheduled) I’ll call a couple of days in advance — would love to meet you, maybe even fish. You all take care & … Tight Lines ….. Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Catalog,Tips & Tricks, Fishing Reports, & NeverSink at: http://www.btsflyfishing.com

just testing, sorry

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Tim Walker if I get close to your home (my travel plans are real loose and unscheduled) I’ll call a couple of days in advance — would love to meet you, maybe even fish. Damned right you look me up Al.

Al, When you get back, tell us what he’s like, what he’s really, really like! — Phil Jones

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Groups I’ll be off line for the next week or ten days field testing products and researching articles in MT, ID, NV, UT, CO, WY, NM, & AZ. Tim Walker if I get close to your home (my travel plans are real loose and unscheduled) I’ll call a couple of days in advance — would love to meet you, maybe even fish. You all take care & … Is this guy the ORIGINAL or what ?  I’ve been developing mission critical software in a goddamned 6 x 6 windowless cubicle all spring and Al’s out field testing products and researching flyfishing articles… What a guy !!! Damned right you look me up Al.  Maybe some of it will rub off on me… — TimW Halfordian Golfer

        Your drift boat awaits you! GeorgeG Halfordian Caster

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Hi Groups I’ll be off line for the next week or ten days field testing products and researching articles in MT, ID, NV, UT, CO, WY, NM, & AZ. Tim Walker if I get close to your home (my travel plans are real loose and unscheduled) I’ll call a couple of days in advance — would love to meet you, maybe even fish. You all take care & …

Is this guy the ORIGINAL or what ?  I’ve been developing mission critical software in a goddamned 6 x 6 windowless cubicle all spring and Al’s out field testing products and researching flyfishing articles… What a guy !!! Damned right you look me up Al.  Maybe some of it will rub off on me… — TimW Halfordian Golfer

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Hi Groups I’ll be off line for the next week or ten days field testing products and researching articles in MT, ID, NV, UT, CO, WY, NM, & AZ. Tim Walker if I get close to your home (my travel plans are real loose and unscheduled) I’ll call a couple of days in advance — would love to meet you, maybe even fish. You all take care & … Tight Lines ….. Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Catalog,Tips & Tricks, Fishing Reports, & NeverSink at: http://www.btsflyfishing.com

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Question:

Can anyone suggest an inexpensive rod and reel for salt water fly fishing. Line weight, tippets, etc. No Orvis recommendations please.

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Can anyone suggest an inexpensive rod and reel for salt water fly fishing. Line weight, tippets, etc. No Orvis recommendations please.

Yea.  A St. Croix 9 ft. 8 wt., Lamson Model 3, Dacron backing (20#), and a WF8F line.  Use tough leader material. So.. what do you have against Orvis?  I think a lot of their stuff is has a good price/performance ratio and the local salesguys have been very helpful even though I don’t spend big bucks there. Andy Schreckenghost

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Paul Ruff writes: Can anyone suggest an inexpensive rod and reel for salt water fly

fishing. Line weight, tippets, etc. No Orvis recommendations please.

Paul, Look for a so called fast action  (more tip than whole rod bend)… as you will need to be able to cast 80 feet plus to do well in salt water.  It is true you can get some casts in under 50 feet by stalking….. and have, but tarpon, bonefish and especially permit are spooky on the flats and require extra long casts to reach.  A fast tip action will help this.  In addition, practice 5 to 10 minutes a day for 3 to 4 weeks to strengthen the specific shoulder and arm muscles you will use….. makes a big difference after fishing…Also use the very best salt water line you can afford….. more important than the rod.   I have not used other than Orvis, Sage and Scott and all are not

inexpensive…. so I will pass on a specific recommendation of a rod…. I have seen and cast in a yard the St. Croix series and they look promising…. but have not fished them. have fun Alan E. Hoover Anglers’ Rest Powhatan, Va        *the trout teach many, lessons*

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Question:

As a last resort he started to dog paddle,and managed to get enough air (and a bit of water)in his lungs to keep going.He managed to make it to shore. I always assumed that if my tube turned over, I would use the Kayakers’ last restort: a wet exit.  I.e., calmly reach down (or is it up?), pull my feet out, and exit the tube.  Anyone see a problem with this assumption? Wet exits are the one and only facet of kayaking I’m proficient at, having had lots of practice while trying to learn to roll.

I for one am going to take my tube out in the lake in a controlled situation and flip it until I am comfortable with this "wet exit". I didnt even realize flipping my tube was possible- It’s pretty wide. You got my attention! Jack Jack Wheeler

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Maybe you/they don’t need a hand (i.e. is there a lawsuit pending against the tube manufacturer?

You know, it wasn’t till several hours after I read this comment that it occured to me how offensive it is.  Why is it that every time somebody hurts themself we assume it is someone else’s fault? Sue the float tube manufacturer?  Come on.  Do you really think the float tube is to blame? — -Wayne Trzyna

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On March 29, 1996 my younger brother Bill died when his float tube Sheesh: you write a post like that to a group consisting of thousands of

… paragraph of inappropriate sarcasm deleted … know? Geez, I mean I might have to put off buying that new  reel I want for a whole month or so but I think I could swing it….

You insensitive bastard.  I gather no one will shed a tear when your tube flips. Bob Luneski

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Maybe you/they don’t need a hand (i.e. is there a lawsuit pending against the tube manufacturer? You know, it wasn’t till several hours after I read this comment that it occured to me how offensive it is.  Why is it that every time somebody hurts themself we assume it is someone else’s fault? Sue the float tube manufacturer?  Come on.  Do you really think the float tube is to blame? — -Wayne Trzyna

Wayne has a good point, unless of course the manufacurer designed a tube that would obviously flip under normal operation. i.e. shaped like a kayak.  If an angler choses to forego a PFD and drowns because the tube completely deflated before going ashore, then too bad. (Which is a different circumstance than the subject victim) I personally limit my use of the float tube to calm still waters on small lakes with land very accessible.  I view my tube as the "only" option as a boat on a small pond or lake where a regular boat would be less intimate.  Larger waters require a normal boat or even a pram, a tube is not viewed as my "poor man’s boat".  No white water adventures here because no fish is worth my life. My condolences to the familiy of the unfortunate angler. — Howard

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Maybe you/they don’t need a hand (i.e. is there a lawsuit pending against the tube manufacturer? You know, it wasn’t till several hours after I read this comment that it occured to me how offensive it is.  Why is it that every time somebody hurts themself we assume it is someone else’s fault? Sue the float tube manufacturer?  Come on.  Do you really think the float tube is to blame?

If it was a manufacturing or design defect, then yes, there is every right to sue, provided that it was being used as intended. It might very well be a design which places the rider COG too high…the lawsuit might 1) get it fixed and 2) save more lives. Something that seems really ludicrous to me is the price of some of the tubes…like Browning…around $50…imagine that, really, something for $50 that has such serious implications, a $50 boat. Hmmmm…boggles the mind…freaking fly line costs more… TimW

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Wheee!

If you can maintain this attitude, you will survive the flip. — -Wayne Trzyna

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: I have spent many an hour in a float tube ,and I must tell you : that I am amazed that anyone has had one flip over on them????? It _CAN_ be done!!  I have not managed to do so yet, but there have been times where I leaned way over the side of tube to reach for a snagged line. I would have the opposite side of the tube lift out of the water and start to roll. I am only about 175#, but I used to flip truck tire tubes in the pool when I was a kid by leaning on one side of them. There were times when I had to worry about this, but they are several pounds

ago. My COG is pretty safely placed, now.   I did flip once, getting into the water, because I was careless, and tried to walk forward rather than back.  Really scary for about 10 seconds.  I am really careful, now. I have to say, seems like the carrying straps add to the danger.  I don’t use them.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : I have spent many an hour in a float tube ,and I must tell you : that I am amazed that anyone has had one flip over on them????? It _CAN_ be done!!  I have not managed to do so yet, but there have been times where I leaned way over the side of tube to reach for a snagged line. I would have the opposite side of the tube lift out of the water and start to roll. I am only about 175#, but I used to flip truck tire tubes in the pool when I was a kid by leaning on one side of them. The trick is to stay reasonably centered and keep your butt in the water. Even when I get a big wake from a boat, I easily stay upright and ride it out. Wheee! Jon Porter

In reflection, my previous post might be considered to be flippant and callous regarding the original incident.  I meant no disrespect, and extend my sympathies to the family and friends of the unfortunate tuber.

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: I always assumed that if my tube turned over, I would use the Kayakers’ : last restort: a wet exit.  I.e., calmly reach down (or is it up?), : pull my feet out, and exit the tube.  Anyone see a problem with this : assumption? You should be able to _drop_ out of a tube. I can get into my Caddis with the seat strap buckled while wearing fins. I figure that getting out (even upside down) should not be much harder. The trick is to keep your wits about you when the thing flips! Jon Porter

Your waders will be tough to pull under water upside down.  You might give it a try (with help nearby) and let us know how it goes.  Sobering thought being upside down with your neoprenes, all snug and airtight, waving around in the breeze.  Perhaps the open-ended tubes have more to recommend them than easy entry. John Porter, I’m truely sorry for your loss and appreciate the warning. Good fishing!  J. Rice

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With regard to an earlier post of mine to the fellow who’s brother drowned a "Bob" [Last name omitted to protect the guilty] apparently skimmed same and, thinking I was being sarcastic/insensitive, submitted a post of his own with a  few of the lines from my post he misconstrued. For the opportunity to restate the point of my original post will gladly forego asking for mea culpa from Bob for wrongful skimming/snipping me to make me sound like a bastard/calling me a bastard/etc., etc. since I also know his heart was in the right place. Thus, again: Here’s hoping the fellow who lost his brother will tell us if his brother’s two boys are in financial straits and, if so, whether and where there’s a trust fund where those of us who are interested can send something. (And oh, Bob, re your calling me a bastard: No hard feelings (Though I hope you didn’t hurt my father’s feelings, whoever he is….)

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On March 29, 1996 my younger brother Bill died when his float tube over turned in a small pond near Prineville, Oregon. I don’t know what made the tube flip – but I know I will never use one again. Bill left two small boys – Sam, 2 and Jake, 7. Bill was an avid fly fisherman, moving to Prineville to teach science and be closer to the rivers he loved to fish. His last project, about two weeks ago,  was to take his class out and they planted 800 trees bordering a stream that had suffered from cattle grazing. I hope the stream recovers… If you have any information on why or how tubes can flip – please drop me a note.

Response:

On March 29, 1996 my younger brother Bill died when his float tube over turned in a small pond near Prineville, Oregon. I don’t know what made the tube flip – but I know I will never use one again. Bill left two small boys – Sam, 2 and Jake, 7. Bill was an avid fly fisherman, moving to Prineville to teach science and be closer to the rivers he loved to fish. His last project, about two weeks ago,  was to take his class out and they planted 800 trees bordering a stream that had suffered from cattle grazing. I hope the stream recovers… If you have any information on why or how tubes can flip – please drop me a note.

I’m sorry to hear about your brother,I offer my condolences.My brother did the same thing,luckily he survied.I was to far from him to help and I just stood there in disbelief.I think he was trying to get out of the water to take a leek,and tripped on a rock and fell forward. Being a steep dropoff right next to shore he could not reach the bottom with his hand.  As a last resort he started to dog paddle,and managed to get enough air (and a bit of water)in his lungs to keep going.He managed to make it to shore.  I now fish with a floater vest or a floater collar,and so does my brother, we enjoy our fishing trips together and especially float tubing. It’s a very exciting sport and I hope you do not give it up. BTW he is my twin brother,and I don’t want to lose him. Just sharing my experience with everybody and maybe it hits home to some people. Tight lines,Frank

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On March 29, 1996 my younger brother Bill died when his float tube over turned in a small pond near Prineville, Oregon. I don’t know what made the tube flip – but I know I will never use one again. Bill left two small boys – Sam, 2 and Jake, 7. Bill was an avid fly fisherman, moving to Prineville to teach science and be closer to the rivers he loved to fish. His last project, about two weeks ago,  was to take his class out and they planted 800 trees bordering a stream that had suffered from cattle grazing…..

Sheesh: you write a post like that to a group consisting of thousands of lunatics who by definition sit around staring at their $2000 and up computertoys and fairly regularly drop $300-$500 on flyrods, $100-$400 on reels, take fly-in trips around the world, etc., etc., and you don’t tell us if the boys’ mother and you and whatever other family is involved could use a hand with the expenses of raising the boys and whether a trust fund has been set up for them and the address….? Maybe you/they don’t need a hand (i.e. is there a lawsuit pending against the tube manufacturer?) but if they do why don’t you let us know? Geez, I mean I might have to put off buying that new  reel I want for a whole month or so but I think I could swing it….

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: On March 29, 1996 my younger brother Bill died when his float tube : over turned in a small pond near Prineville, Oregon. I don’t know what : made the tube flip – but I know I will never use one again. Bill left : two small boys – Sam, 2 and Jake, 7. Bill was an avid fly fisherman, : moving to Prineville to teach science and be closer to the rivers he : loved to fish. His last project, about two weeks ago,  was to take his : class out and they planted 800 trees bordering a stream that had suffered : from cattle grazing. I hope the stream recovers… : If you have any information on why or how tubes can flip – please drop : me a note. Sorry to hear of your loss. Can the tubes be flipped while leaning backwards with one arm extended to the rear and feet out in front of you? Suggestion for discussion: When diving, I wear a large dull knife strapped to my leg. This is mostly to impress the tourons. However, after having managed to get all tangled up in a monoline fishing net once, there is now a small, double-edged, very sharp, serrated (sp?) edged knife fastened to my shoulder strap. Next time I’ll leave all that equipment down there with a few quick strokes of that knife when the release buckles are all tied up. Maybe it is just me, but after a couple of emergency situations, you go prepared. When upside down in a tube, can an escape be managed with a slash to the tube and a couple cuts on shoulder straps? I know, like you don’t have enough junk hanging on your vest already. Also, there are ankle weights for divers that don’t like diving upside down. I assume tubers have these also to help paddle around? Bill

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On March 29, 1996 my younger brother Bill died…

Rich: My sincerest condolences to you and your family… very sorry to hear this tragic news.

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As a last resort he started to dog paddle,and managed to get enough air (and a bit of water)in his lungs to keep going.He managed to make it to shore.

I always assumed that if my tube turned over, I would use the Kayakers’ last restort: a wet exit.  I.e., calmly reach down (or is it up?), pull my feet out, and exit the tube.  Anyone see a problem with this assumption? Wet exits are the one and only facet of kayaking I’m proficient at, having had lots of practice while trying to learn to roll. — -Wayne Trzyna

Response:

I always assumed that if my tube turned over, I would use the Kayakers’ last restort: a wet exit.  I.e., calmly reach down (or is it up?), pull my feet out, and exit the tube.  Anyone see a problem with this assumption? Wet exits are the one and only facet of kayaking I’m proficient at, having had lots of practice while trying to learn to roll.

The panic factor and 35 degree water might be a problem with this assumption.  Keeping your wits about you would be difficult.  I assume you practiced rolling your kayak under somewhat controlled conditions.  I never practiced flipping my tube. Does a PFD really help if you are flipped over.  Will it keep your head up when the tube is flipped over and your legs are pointed to the sky, or will it keep you from flipping in the first place?.  Just curious if anyone has experienced a flip while wearing a life jacket. John

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: I have spent many an hour in a float tube ,and I must tell you : that I am amazed that anyone has had one flip over on them????? It _CAN_ be done!!  I have not managed to do so yet, but there have been times where I leaned way over the side of tube to reach for a snagged line. I would have the opposite side of the tube lift out of the water and start to roll. I am only about 175#, but I used to flip truck tire tubes in the pool when I was a kid by leaning on one side of them. The trick is to stay reasonably centered and keep your butt in the water. Even when I get a big wake from a boat, I easily stay upright and ride it out. Wheee! Jon Porter

Response:

: I always assumed that if my tube turned over, I would use the Kayakers’ : last restort: a wet exit.  I.e., calmly reach down (or is it up?), : pull my feet out, and exit the tube.  Anyone see a problem with this : assumption? You should be able to _drop_ out of a tube. I can get into my Caddis with the seat strap buckled while wearing fins. I figure that getting out (even upside down) should not be much harder. The trick is to keep your wits about you when the thing flips! Jon Porter

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I have spent many an hour in a float tube ,and I must tell you that I am amazed that anyone has had one flip over on them?????

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First for safety I would say we need to wear PFD’s of some type.  Second we should never be without a good readily available knife.  Third it isn’t a bad Idea to try to flip one with a friend present and try a water exit. Not panicing is probably the key.  Neoprene waders are very bouyant and can hinder a water exit plus they are cumbersome.

Response:

If you have any information on why or how tubes can flip – please drop me a note.

I find that the lower I set my self in the tube the better control I have over it  This may take away some of my casting ability but I feel safer. Condolences on your loss

Response:

On March 29, 1996 my younger brother Bill died when his float tube over turned in a small pond near Prineville, Oregon. I don’t know what made the tube flip – but I know I will never use one again. Bill left two small boys – Sam, 2 and Jake, 7. Bill was an avid fly fisherman, moving to Prineville to teach science and be closer to the rivers he loved to fish. His last project, about two weeks ago,  was to take his class out and they planted 800 trees bordering a stream that had suffered from cattle grazing…..

   First of all, let me say I’m very sorry for your loss.    This should be a heads-up for float-tubers and anyone thinking about buying one.  A friend of mine flipped his in the Green River and fortunately was able to right himself in shallow water while I watched helplessly from fifty yards away.  He is 6′2" and 250 lbs and was in a Browning tube which is way too small and carries you way too high, especially if you are his size.  He will never use that tube again.  In the same year a boy drowned in that river when his tube flipped.  Tubing in rivers is especially dangerous because the current can make it even more difficult than it already is to free yourself from a flipped tube, not to mention hazards like rocks.  If you flip, don’t try to right yourself.  Try to remain calm and just swim out.    For what it’s worth, I have a Caddis tube.  It is about the largest diameter tube I have ever seen and I sit quite low in it.  I am 6′ and 170 lbs. and I don’t think I could flip it if I tried unless I was standing in very shallow water.  I also always wear a lifevest. -alan

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On March 29, 1996 my younger brother Bill died when his float tube over turned in a small pond near Prineville, Oregon. I don’t know what made the tube flip – but I know I will never use one again. Bill left two small boys – Sam, 2 and Jake, 7. Bill was an avid fly fisherman, moving to Prineville to teach science and be closer to the rivers he loved to fish. His last project, about two weeks ago,  was to take his class out and they planted 800 trees bordering a stream that had suffered from cattle grazing. I hope the stream recovers… If you have any information on why or how tubes can flip – please drop me a note.

Tragic.  Deepest, deepest condolences. You did not mention the use of a life jacket.  Was your brother wearing one ? TW

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On March 29, 1996 my younger brother Bill died when his float tube over turned in a small pond near Prineville, Oregon.  

        (Snip) Sheesh: you write a post like that to a group consisting of thousands of

lunatics who by definition sit around staring at their $2000 and up computertoys and fairly regularly drop $300-$500 on flyrods, $100-$400 on reels, take fly-in trips around the world, etc., etc., and you don’t tell us if the boys’ mother and you and whatever other family is involved could use a hand with the expenses of raising the boys and whether a trust fund has been set up for them and the address….? Maybe you/they don’t need a hand (i.e. if there a lawsuit pending against the tube manufacturer?) but if they do why don’t you let us know? Geez, I mean I might have to put off buying that new   reel I want for a whole month or so but I think I could swing it….

        Well, . very crass, but I think your heart is in the right place. I think its a super idea. If, after they recover some from the shock of their loss, the family would accept some help from others who shared your brothers passion, I for one would be very willing to help.  

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