Question:

Okay, so I am sure you are all pretty well starting to panic that I have up and left without so much as a good bye.  Well, you are wrong (I would have at least given an F you and the single finger salute).  Life has been busy and I have not had time to spend countless hours reading spam, garbage, and hate posts. As a matter of fact I tried coming back once before , but the time wasn’t right because I didn’t want to come back in the middle of a war. Anyways,  I will have the info everybody is seeking monday.  Sunday I am going fishing on the Madison and have planned a stop in Ennis to haggle with the innkeepers and inspect the premises.  Trying to do this shit over the phone really wasn’t working and I could only give rough estimates and was basically being blown off.  If you are camping there are several sites that are on a first come first serve basis for something like $5 a day.  Most fishing access also allow camping I have found.  There is one right on the edge of Ennis on the other side of the river where I have seen motorhomes, tents, ect.  This is where I am planning on setting up the base camp.  I will be arriving early to claim spots since they are first come first serve.   As far as hotels.  Monday will be the big announcement as to where.  If some kind of up front monetary fee is required then it will be each individual attendees responsible to make the arrangements.  I have fished this area a lot and it does get busy during the summer and people do make reservations a year in advance, but I have never found Ennis to be packed full with every motel, hotel, ect full.  I recommend that reservations be made though as I would like to keep everyone staying in rooms in one place for convenience sake. I have spent most of my time researching different fishing locations and what not. Don’t ask for names in advance because I am not giving them out until you show up at the clave.  Some are obvious like the Madison, but others do not get as much plublicity and are great fishing and I would like to keep them that way.  Pisses me off when I see more and more of my haunts starting to be advertised in ads here, in magazines and the fly shops and the crowds start growing.  I will not contribute to this disease! Don’t worry about bears.  If your number is up there is nothing you can do about it.  Bear spray (as with firearms) are more a comfort for the carrier than for effectiveness.  The reason I say bear spray as well is because the bear isn’t going to stop when you say "Time out!  The wind is coming from the wrong direction and will be ineffective unless you allow me to move over here."  Heard of some people doing more harm to themselves than what they did to the bear and all over a false charge to boot. Most of the places we will be fishing aren’t notorious bear hang outs.   I really do apologize for being out of touch for so long.  Hunting season kept me pretty busy and then life decided to get more complicated and I haven’t even had time to fish.  I sort of drifted off a little too far it seems.  But all is well and you will be seeing me around here more often (for better or worse). Now if I can only find a good worth while argument to get involved in. . . . . Time to start searching. Warren Warren Remember, men will come and men will go, but the streams and mountains go on forever. -Bob Carmichael

Response:

Due to the peculiarities of Usenet, I haven’t seen Warren’s original

Got it. Thanks. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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Vern, I have added your name.   Warren Remember, men will come and men will go, but the streams and mountains go on forever. -Bob Carmichael

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So George, now that you will be over here during that time will you or will you not be with the group?  I don’t know whether to you put your name down or not. Your other thread said you would be in the area but would not be mixing with the "bottom dwellers." Warren Remember, men will come and men will go, but the streams and mountains go on forever. -Bob Carmichael

Response:

Thanks for all of your hard work warren.  I’m still hoping to make it, it’s a long ways off for me yet though. I would be in the "camping" category. I’d be driving up from NM and probably bringing someone with me, maybe my significant other, or maybe someone who is a fly fisher. Thanks again Warren. bruiser aka bruce

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Due to the peculiarities of Usenet, I haven’t seen Warren’s original This sort of thing could be a problem in the future. Usenet in unreliable. It would be best to email people on the list directly (but also send a copy to ROFF). — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

Response:

I want one of those hats and shirts.  That is if you can get a shirt in my size, boys size 14.  Just tell me how much and I’ll send you a check.  Unless you demand a money order. Vern?  (The Big Little Man)

with stilts?  If not, I will bring you my motorized drift tube with trolling motor to get  you around the Henry’s Fork. No joke.  I will even provide the big marine battery and I bet you think I’m kidding!? If not, you will be welcome to command the front deck of my drift boat with a grand view of every prime trout you care to molest.  (If you find me) You will enjoy this trip Vern.   Mr.G. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would like to be put on the list.  I’ve already told work that I’m taking time off.  I’m tying flies.  I’ve talked a co-worker in coming up as well.  Well, I think he’s coming.  Please put my name on the list.  I will be there. Vernon D. Ursenbach If your name is not on the list or you want it taken off the list please let me know. Tim Walker Jeffrey Miller Stephen Barnard (RW) Ken Fortenberry Mike S. Medintz Mark Anderson Wayne Harrison William Loehman Mark Faulkner Bruce aka Bruiser                                     mr.g. will be over here Charlie Choc John Iding David Snedeker Dave LaCourse Peter Charles Daytripper Big Dale Indian Joe Tom Brown Jon Cook Darin Minor Ed Miller Before you buy.

– http://www.gink.com/chat

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Warren I will handle the hats and shirts thing if you want. Dave

It’s a deal!  I suggest money in advance BTW, glad to see you are still around.  This is kind of like coming back home after a long time and getting back together with old friends and stuff. Warren Remember, men will come and men will go, but the streams and mountains go on forever. -Bob Carmichael

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I want one of those hats and shirts.  That is if you can get a shirt in my size, boys size 14.  Just tell me how much and I’ll send you a check.  Unless you demand a money order. Vern Warren I will handle the hats and shirts thing if you want. Dave

Before you buy.

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I would like to be put on the list.  I’ve already told work that I’m taking time off.  I’m tying flies.  I’ve talked a co-worker in coming up as well.  Well, I think he’s coming.  Please put my name on the list.  I will be there. Vernon D. Ursenbach – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If your name is not on the list or you want it taken off the list please let me know. Tim Walker Jeffrey Miller Stephen Barnard (RW) Ken Fortenberry Mike S. Medintz Mark Anderson Wayne Harrison William Loehman Mark Faulkner Bruce aka Bruiser Charlie Choc John Iding David Snedeker Dave LaCourse Peter Charles Daytripper Big Dale Indian Joe Tom Brown Jon Cook Darin Minor Ed Miller

Before you buy.

Response:

Warren I will handle the hats and shirts thing if you want. Dave

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -One more thing.  Just so I get my numbers straight, how many people who are still interested in attending will be wanting rooms?  How many are willing/want to share?  I have the numbers from a few months ago, but need updated numbers. I was thinking that hats and tshirts for claves have all been done.  How about sweat shirts for the western clave?  Any volunteers to head this up? Here is the list of people I have who are interested in attending.  If your name is not on the list or you want it taken off the list please let me know. Tim Walker Jeffrey Miller Stephen Barnard (RW) Ken Fortenberry Mike S. Medintz Mark Anderson Wayne Harrison William Loehman Mark Faulkner Bruce aka Bruiser Charlie Choc John Iding David Snedeker Dave LaCourse Peter Charles Daytripper Big Dale Indian Joe Tom Brown Jon Cook Darin Minor Ed Miller Some people have indicated they are bringing guests/family members.  I am not responsible for any ethics that might be crossed or morals that  will be violated, for the record.  In no way am I responsible for anything other than fun and fishing and the other details for which I have voluntarily sacrificed myself. As far as meals go I was thinking that those will be taken care of by the individual.  We can make a nightly gathering at a local restaurant or cafe for those who want to show.  Other than that you are on your own.  After dinner perhaps drinking and debauchery by the fire at the campsites. I was also thinking that on one day, maybe the last day or the day before the last day we could have a BBQ after a morning fishing adventure followed by a fishing finale.  Maybe have some fresh caught BBQ’d fish, ribs, hamburgers ect. Maybe someone would be willing to organize a pot or something.  Gambling pot, not smoking substance or horticulture related pot.  Something like first fish of the day, biggest fish, smallest fish, stinky award for whoever gets skunked. Anyone want to volunteer for putting together a raffle or items for the raffle? Can’t have a clave without a raffle!  Don’t make me send my henchmen out to collect! Can anyone think of anything else?  Individuals or a group are welcome to volunteer for any of these ventures. That’s all for now. Warren Remember, men will come and men will go, but the streams and mountains go on forever. -Bob Carmichael

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Almost forgot.  For those of you who want to rent cars here is a list of places. Rentals: Avis 1-800-831-2847 or (406) 388-6414 (at Bozeman airport)         Free unlimited mileage rates available, weekend and weekly rentals, wide variety of fine GM cars, 4×4’s and mini vans, special local rates offered. Budget Rent A Car 1-800-527-0700 or (406) 388-4091 or www.drivebudget.com (at Bozeman airport)         Prearranged customer pick-up and drop-off available, 4×4 Explorers, 4×4 Suburbans, pick ups, mini vans, 15 passenger vans and cars of all sizes, unlimited mileage rates available. Enterprise Rent-A-Car 1-800-325-8007 or (406) 586-8010         Low everyday rates, plus weekend & holiday discounts, corporate and government rates, economoy to luxury cars, wagons, 4×4’s, ski-equipped vehicles, minivans, trucks and more, free pick-up from your home, office or repair shop. Hertz 1-800-654-3131 or (406) 388-6939 or hertz.com  (at airport)         4×4’s and minivans available National Car Rental 1-800-car-rent or (406) 388-6694 or national.car.com Warren Remember, men will come and men will go, but the streams and mountains go on forever. -Bob Carmichael

Response:

One more thing.  Just so I get my numbers straight, how many people who are still interested in attending will be wanting rooms?  How many are willing/want to share?  I have the numbers from a few months ago, but need updated numbers. I was thinking that hats and tshirts for claves have all been done.  How about sweat shirts for the western clave?  Any volunteers to head this up? Here is the list of people I have who are interested in attending.  If your name is not on the list or you want it taken off the list please let me know. Tim Walker Jeffrey Miller   Stephen Barnard (RW) Ken Fortenberry   Mike S. Medintz   Mark Anderson   Wayne Harrison William Loehman Mark Faulkner   Bruce aka Bruiser Charlie Choc John Iding   David Snedeker   Dave LaCourse   Peter Charles   Daytripper Big Dale   Indian Joe   Tom Brown Jon Cook   Darin Minor Ed Miller Some people have indicated they are bringing guests/family members.  I am not responsible for any ethics that might be crossed or morals that  will be violated, for the record.  In no way am I responsible for anything other than fun and fishing and the other details for which I have voluntarily sacrificed myself. As far as meals go I was thinking that those will be taken care of by the individual.  We can make a nightly gathering at a local restaurant or cafe for those who want to show.  Other than that you are on your own.  After dinner perhaps drinking and debauchery by the fire at the campsites. I was also thinking that on one day, maybe the last day or the day before the last day we could have a BBQ after a morning fishing adventure followed by a fishing finale.  Maybe have some fresh caught BBQ’d fish, ribs, hamburgers ect. Maybe someone would be willing to organize a pot or something.  Gambling pot, not smoking substance or horticulture related pot.  Something like first fish of the day, biggest fish, smallest fish, stinky award for whoever gets skunked. Anyone want to volunteer for putting together a raffle or items for the raffle? Can’t have a clave without a raffle!  Don’t make me send my henchmen out to collect! Can anyone think of anything else?  Individuals or a group are welcome to volunteer for any of these ventures. That’s all for now. Warren Remember, men will come and men will go, but the streams and mountains go on forever. -Bob Carmichael

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Question:

Introduce yourself and tell us the town you live in/near. Might be someone could arrange a lesson, but also would help with giving you advise and contacts. Dave

I’d second Dave’s advice.  The first time you go out, it’s best to go out with someone who knows what they’re doing.  If you can find a club, you may be able to find someone who’ll take you out. Worst case, if you can afford it, you may want to consider hiring a guide for a day.  He can generally lend (or rent) you the equipment you’ll need, and you’ll at least get an idea of what the sport is about.  You might even catch a fish or two.  The cost of guides varies by region, anywhere from about $150 to $300/day.  If he does a good job, it’s traditional to tip 15-20% (or more, if they’re on the low end of the pay scale).  You can find a guide through your local shop, via ads in fly fishing magazines, or over the Internet. Once you’ve been out once, you can make an informed judgement about whether this is something you want to do.  You could then consider a fly fishing school….Again, you’d have some guidance, and would also meet other beginners in the area. As someone else said, there’s no substitute for time on the water and making your own mistakes.  However, I’d argue you’re better off having some sort of foundation from a guide/school to jump-start your learning curve. Michael — www.geocities.com/yosemite/falls/3363 Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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I would suggest visiting your local fly shop.  They will have the staff and expertise to point you in the right direction.  You may also want to consider purchasing or looking at some books at the local bookstore.  What do you plan to fish for? Maurice Paquette

I was thinking about picking up the hobby of fly fishing, but i have no idea where to begin. Nor do i know of anyone who fly fishes. I was wondering if anyone could help me out here, it would be greatly appreciated. — Posted via Talkway – http://www.talkway.com Exchange ideas on practically anything ™.

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JAMFF Introduce yourself and tell us the town you live in/near. Might be someone could arrange a lesson, but also would help with giving you advise and contacts. Dave – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was thinking about picking up the hobby of fly fishing, but i have no idea where to begin. Nor do i know of anyone who fly fishes. I was wondering if anyone could help me out here, it would be greatly appreciated. — Posted via Talkway – http://www.talkway.com Exchange ideas on practically anything ™.

Response:

Books are fine, but just get out there on the water and fuck up time and again. There’s no substitute for experience. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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First of all you will have to tell us what type of fish you are going for and what kind of water you are going to fish. Ernie Harrison See Ernie’s Fly-Fishing Stuff:   http://home.pacbell.net/ernie2 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was thinking about picking up the hobby of fly fishing, but i have no idea where to begin. Nor do i know of anyone who fly fishes. I was wondering if anyone could help me out here, it would be greatly appreciated. — Posted via Talkway – http://www.talkway.com Exchange ideas on practically anything ™.

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I was thinking about picking up the hobby of fly fishing, but i have no idea where to begin. Nor do i know of anyone who fly fishes. I was wondering if anyone could help me out here, it would be greatly appreciated. — Posted via Talkway – http://www.talkway.com Exchange ideas on practically anything ™.

        looks like the start of a beautiful friendship… wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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And if you’re gonna buy a book and know absolutely nothing about FFing, buy: Curtis Creek Manifesto And if you’re gonna watch a video, don’t watch: A River Runs Through It

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I started out..and still basically have taught myself. Through reading books and watching videos. If possible though try to find a local shop or club and join in or just start chattin with people, most will be happy to help. If you put down the area you live in, maybe someone in this group is near enough to give you some instruction. But if all else fails, buy a book. Tim Apple — The fishing is always good, It’s the catching that’s sometimes bad"

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was thinking about picking up the hobby of fly fishing, but i have no idea where to begin. Nor do i know of anyone who fly fishes. I was wondering if anyone could help me out here, it would be greatly appreciated. — Posted via Talkway – http://www.talkway.com Exchange ideas on practically anything ™.

Response:

I was thinking about picking up the hobby of fly fishing, but i have no idea where to begin. Nor do i know of anyone who fly fishes. I was wondering if anyone could help me out here, it would be greatly appreciated. — Posted via Talkway – http://www.talkway.com Exchange ideas on practically anything ™.

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Question:

What is there to do in Belize? I have been told that it has the best fly fishing in the world. But I would like to more about the country. Is the snorkelling good, scuba diving and beaches worth the trip? And what about the Mayan ruins, tropical rain forest and anything else you can tell me?

Response:

What is there to do in Belize? I have been told that it has the best fly fishing in the world. But I would like to more about the country. Is the snorkelling good, scuba diving and beaches worth the trip? And what about the Mayan ruins, tropical rain forest and anything else you can tell me?

We stayed in Placencia in May 2000 and stayed at the Rum Point Inn.  The beaches were okay but not good for walking out into the water and swimming – full of turtle grass.  The Mayan ruins – we visited Lubantuum and Nimli Punit – were amazing, particularly Lubantuum.  There was no snorkeling from the beach, but a one hour boat ride got us out to some amazing places for both snorkeling and scuba diving.  Absolutely breathtaking.  We didn’t go on the Monkey River tour or to the Jaguar preserve (ran out of $$) but friends who did go said it was well worthwhile. May seems to be an off-season so it’s hard to tell whether we visited at the best time. We weren’t crazy about Placencia or the Rum Point Inn, but I’ve heard others extoll the virtues of both.  We definitely enjoyed the snorkeling and Mayan ruins, and would recommend it for that.

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Question:

: Can you help?  My brother-in-law enjoys flyfishing (mostly in Michigan where : he lives).  We will be vacationing together this August in Boothbay Harbor, : Maine and I would like to be able to point him to a good spot to go : flyfishing. : If you have any suggestions, I would be glad to pass them along.  He would : be most interested in a spot which would be an easy drive from Boothbay. : Thanks, : Bob LaMontagne : Cincinnati, OH The Atlantic Ocean. He can use his fresh water rod and 4 feet of 4 pound tippet with small clousers to catch macks and schoolies, which are likely to be 95%-100% of his hhok ups. If he hangs a big striper, he will have a hell of a great time trying to get him in. Tell him to be SURE to wash all his gear in fresh water after each trip. This means pop the spool out of the reel and wash all the rod guides.

Response:

Boothbay has a number of ponds that are very good fishing. Smallmouth bass will readily take poppers and yellow deerhair bugs in the early morning and evening hours. If he wants to try ocean fly fishing, there are stripped Bass that run 12 to 40 inches, mackerel run 8 to 20 inches and Bluefish up to 25 pounds.     I f he wants landlocked salmon and brook trout, he’ll have to fish tiny dries or nymphs on bottom. If you need to know more or want to purchase flies designed for the fishing here, you can contact me at http://www.kynd.com/~ronmcq/fsf/fsf.html Ron McKusick Featherside Flies Corinna Maine – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Can you help?  My brother-in-law enjoys flyfishing (mostly in Michigan where he lives).  We will be vacationing together this August in Boothbay Harbor, Maine and I would like to be able to point him to a good spot to go flyfishing. If you have any suggestions, I would be glad to pass them along.  He would be most interested in a spot which would be an easy drive from Boothbay. Thanks, Bob LaMontagne Cincinnati, OH

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Can you help?  My brother-in-law enjoys flyfishing (mostly in Michigan where he lives).  We will be vacationing together this August in Boothbay Harbor, Maine and I would like to be able to point him to a good spot to go flyfishing.

Grand Lake Stream (between two lakes in Washington Cty.) has (or used to have) landlocked salmon and trout as well as bass and may be the closest to Mount Desert I.  Check whether any of the Atlantic salmon rivers in August, possibly the Dennys or Machias. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

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Can you help?  My brother-in-law enjoys flyfishing (mostly in Michigan where he lives).  We will be vacationing together this August in Boothbay Harbor, Maine and I would like to be able to point him to a good spot to go flyfishing. If you have any suggestions, I would be glad to pass them along.  He would be most interested in a spot which would be an easy drive from Boothbay. Thanks, Bob LaMontagne Cincinnati, OH

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Question:

According to the Whittakers site, the release from the Beacon Hill Dam has been cut back to 2 gates.  This is still more water than can really be fished effectively with a fly rod without using running line and a very big slinky.  This is still more water than can be waded safely. If you do plan to fish it, look for seams along the edge and work them very quietly.  Steelhead will often hold well out of the flow of the river during periods of high water. Bob Davis

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Because of problems at the uppper reservoir, combined with the rainfall over the weekend, early on Tuesday morning, 11/4/97, Niagara Mohawk began releasing tremendous amounts of water into the lower Salmon River, rendering it currently unfishable.   For those of you who are familiar with the "gate system", the river is now running at 2 gates, plus an overflow spillway, plus the run-off from Trout and Orwell Brooks as the result of recent heavy rain.  Even with the heaviest slinky, it is almost impossible to get down to the fish, and the sudden change in water volume seems to have put them completely off of their feed. I drove up to the upper power plant and talked with some of the staff and found out that, due to repairs now underway, the water level will not be dropping before Friday 11/7/97.   Whittakers, probably the best of the fly fishing shops up there, has a web site at http://www.whitakers.com/, and they are the only one that seems to be giving the correct info about this problem.

Response:

There are a bunch of web sites which claim to cover the Salmon River, and this recent change in the water level gives us a good opportunity to test out their reliability.   The Oswego County Chamber of Commerce has not said anything about the abnormally high water releases, and is still talking about Salmon on their redds, and stating that the ebst fishing is around the 2-A Bridge. Well, the truth is that any salmon that is still on its redd is swimming very fast…and if they are around 2-A they have tied themselves to the bottom <g.  Bad info here… Salmon River Sportfishing Reports is a really well done site with all of the Java that anyone would want…but it was last updated on 10/31/97, well before the high water began. Bad info here too… Whittakers, at http://www.whitakers.com/ updated its report at 5:00AM this morning and says "Water is under two gates.  The level was supposed to be dropped at midnight tonight. Will update as soon as we know." Sounds like good info here….a page worth bookmarking, and a shop worth visiting.  Whittakers is heavily oriented toward flyfishing, Jim Rusher who owns the place is very knowledgeable and "user-friendly", and Duke and Dick also know their stuff. They are also telling us that "The North and South Sandys had a run of Rainbows and Cohoes the last two days."  I know fairly reliably that Sandy Creek had not yet gotten any significant run of fish this fall, and it was expected that the recent rains would have brought them in. they were not there on Tuesday – I fished Sandy Creek below the falls, an area that I know well, and saw no sign of fish. But I would expect them to be moving in. Lots of deer and game birds though… Let me put in a plug for my own site – if you invest in undervalued small-cap stocks, take a look at http://www.napeague.com Bob Davis

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Question:

I am planning a camping/Flyfishing trip to Colorado in July and am looking for suggestions on which region is the best and also need info on specific sights. Please e-mail your response if possible. Thanks Craig Cottrell

Response:

I am planning a camping/Flyfishing trip to Colorado in July and am looking for suggestions on which region is the best and also need info on specific sights. Please e-mail your response if possible. Thanks Craig Cottrell

It’s a pretty big state. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

Response:

I am planning a camping/Flyfishing trip to Colorado in July and am looking for suggestions on which region is the best and also need info on specific sights. Please e-mail your response if possible. Thanks Moe Skeeter writes: It’s a pretty big state.

The Rocky Mountains are the best. CQ

Response:

I am planning a camping/Flyfishing trip to Colorado in July and am looking for suggestions on which region is the best and also need info on specific sights. Please e-mail your response if possible. Thanks Moe Skeeter writes: It’s a pretty big state. The Rocky Mountains are the best.

Good point. Try them. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

Response:

: I am planning a camping/Flyfishing trip to Colorado in July and am : looking for suggestions on which region is the best and also need : info on specific sights. Please e-mail your response if possible. : Thanks : Moe Skeeter writes: : It’s a pretty big state. : The Rocky Mountains are the best. : Good point. Try them. Start in the south and work your way north, please. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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Question:

Limited to 12 students, we’ll have six guides, you’ll work with three. Covering everything from equipment (both spin and fly) to fly tying, reading water, proper presentation etc. Evening seminars after fishing, all equipment, meals, deluxe accommodations right on the river’s edge. $350./person Nov. 18, 19, and 20 E-mail for specifics — Bill Fling                     Tel. (315) 298-3044 SALMON RIVER ANGLERS LODGE     FAX  (315) 298-2619 P.O. Box 353                   Rt. 13, Rome Road Pulaski, NY 13142-0353   ‘SALMON RIVER/LAKE ONTARIO SPORTFISHING REPORTS’             ‘http://www.salmon-river.com’

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We’re putting together a Steelhead school to be held November 18-20 here on the Salmon River in Pulaski, NY Price includes upscale lodging, all meals, guides, equipment and related materials. Limited to 12 students. Will cover all aspects of steelhead fishing using both fly and spin tackle techniques. e-mail for details. Bill Fling Reg. ME Master Guide Lic. NYS Guide — Bill Fling                     Tel. (315) 298-3044 SALMON RIVER ANGLERS LODGE     FAX  (315) 298-2619 P.O. Box 353                   Rt. 13, Rome Road Pulaski, NY 13142-0353   ‘SALMON RIVER/LAKE ONTARIO SPORTFISHING REPORTS’             ‘http://www.salmon-river.com’

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Question:

writes: writes: … I have also made large rod tubes for my one piece rods.  …  How long is the longest tube that you’ve taken on an airplane ?  I am asking  because I have received conflicting info from agents. I have taken a 9 ft two piece rod on numerous trips and put the rod

case in the overhead. Most of the airlines have overheads with two doors, however there is no divider between the two sections. A 9 ft rod just makes it provided there isn’t a lot of luggage in there already. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

I apolgize for the repetition here, but this is an important topic for those who are not regular travelers with flyrods.  There is nothing that will spoil a trip like lost or broken rods — insurance just won’t help. Never check rods!!!  First, I have only had one occasion where an agent tried to get me to check the rods, and I insisted on carrying them on board.  If you run into that problem, don’t give in.  Raise hell and they will let you on.  Second, I have always been able to get the rods (up to 9′ two piece) in the overhead bins, except on the smallest of commuters; then they went in the hanging bag compartment. Lyman Hughes Ennis,MT Dallas, TX

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writes: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -This is a good question.  I am travelling by plane for the first time with my fly rod, which a two piece 8 1/2 footer.  I have one of the 1 1/2" aluminum rod cases with the sock inside, which doesn’t lock.  Can I claim it as carryon? SHould I just tape up the cover?  Or should I paste a label over the brand name on the case and label it Blueprints? Any advice would be appreciated. Chris Bernard (508)640-2016 days (617)979-0464 home

Do not check your rods.  Continental lost my rod case for a day, even when I checked it in as oversized.  Apparently, some baggage systems lose long items because they fall off the system at the turns.  Fight like hell to take it on as luggage.  I start kissing the butts of the check in people and then plead with the flight attendants and it always works.  I use alum. rod tubes inside a nice looking Bean Maine Guide rod bag that actually looks like luggage.  Wear some god awful fishing hat with a TU catch and release pin and they’ll treat you as an eccentric and let you do what you want. Musconet

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Everything we do up here is by air.  Have a rod cases called the "Bazooka" model.  Hold 5 rods is bright red, easy to see and monitor, and is indestructable.  Have take it all over the world and have not had a problem. — Gene Dobrzynski, Eagle River, Alaska

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writes: writes: … I have also made large rod tubes for my one piece rods.  …  How long is the longest tube that you’ve taken on an airplane ?  I am asking  because I have received conflicting info from agents.

I have made tubes to carry one piece casting rods.  Longest rod is 7′6", and the rod tube is a couple of inches longer. It’s in the attic at the moment, but, if I remember correctly, it is a 4" ID tube.  (ABS – sched 40).  I I checked that with no problem ….. The longest I have carried on board is 54".  I put it in the hanger bag closets. Dee Crabtree DeeCrab*ibm.net

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(508)640-2016 days (617)979-0464 home Do not check your rods. Musconet

Many of you have said the same as the note ref’d above.  Maybe I’m just lucky, or don’t travel as much as you, (hmmm – nah!) but I have never had a rod tubes damaged, opened, lost or delayed – can’t say the same for my luggage (clothes) though!!   I mark the tubes well, the ends are secure (bottom cap glued & top cap drilled & tied with a large nylon bundling tie) and the rods padded inside. Dee Crabtree DeeCrab*ibm.net

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I’ve flown twice with my rods.  United insisted that I check them, but then required that I sign a waiver of responsibility for loss or damage. Horizon Airlines insisted that I carry them onboard.  Thanks Horizon.

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writes: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -This is a good question.  I am travelling by plane for the first time with my fly rod, which a two piece 8 1/2 footer.  I have one of the 1 1/2" aluminum rod cases with the sock inside, which doesn’t lock.  Can I claim it as carryon? SHould I just tape up the cover?  Or should I paste a label over the brand name on the case and label it Blueprints? Any advice would be appreciated. Chris Bernard (508)640-2016 days (617)979-0464 home

I’ve been flying with rods <g for a few years. Normally I carry them on, unless I have too much stuff. I have checked them on several occaisions, both in an aluminum tube and 3 tubes in a bag. Never had a problem. Perhaps I’m justlucky (on planes more than streams)! I’ve never been convinced a lock does much (for rods or bags), if someone wants it it’s gone. So I just make sure my insurance covers the important things. BTW I do carry older cane rods as well. David

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -This is a good question.  I am travelling by plane for the first time with my fly rod, which a two piece 8 1/2 footer.  I have one of the 1 1/2" aluminum rod cases with the sock inside, which doesn’t lock.  Can I claim it as carryon? SHould I just tape up the cover?  Or should I paste a label over the brand name on the case and label it Blueprints? Any advice would be appreciated. Chris Bernard (508)640-2016 days (617)979-0464 home

I’ve always carried my rod tube (and all my fishing gear for that matter! if my luggage gets lost…I can still fish!!) onto the plane. If it’s too long for the overhead…the attendant will put it in the standup closet.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -This is a good question.  I am travelling by plane for the first time with my fly rod, which a two piece 8 1/2 footer.  I have one of the 1 1/2" aluminum rod cases with the sock inside, which doesn’t lock.  Can I claim it as carryon? SHould I just tape up the cover?  Or should I paste a label over the brand name on the case and label it Blueprints? Any advice would be appreciated. Chris Bernard (508)640-2016 days (617)979-0464 home

If you can carry it on, great, but if not I would advise buying one of those travel bags that hold rod tubes rather than checking just the tube. Why ? Because tubes do get lost; I spent an hour in a Mexican airport once looking for mine and trying to describe it (in my limited Spanish) to the people who worked there. Turns out it fell off a conveyor type rack and was sitting on the floor underneath it. The travel bag looks more like a suitcase, is less likely to roll around and will probably be treated with more care (of course using the word ‘care’ in any description of baggage handling is risky…) If it does get lost it’s easier to describe and find than a piece of aluminum pipe or PVC.                                                         jc      

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Does someone have a recommendation about how to pack regular, two piece rods for airline travel?

Never, I repeat NEVER check your rods, unless you want new ones and want to claim them on your insurance.  They will eventually be broken or disappear if you check them.  When carrying rods on, try to board early before the flight attendants are swamped by people with 400 pound duffle bags looking for a place to stow them.  Be vnice to the flight attendants and they will generally find you a place to stow your rods.  In most cases they will fit in the overhead bin.                  /                 /                   John Woodling                /                    Sacramento, CA                   <     <

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If I understand correctly, the question is can you carry 2-piece rods as carry-on or must you check them.  I have traveled a few times with my 7′11 2-piece in the 1.5" tube and my 9′ 2-piece in a larger tube.   Although they are larger than what the regulations allow, I have never had anybody stop me.  In fact the flight attendants were helpful in stowing them.   I don’t know what I would do if they decided to be a hard ass about it.  There’s no way I would check through a $300+ rod! Tight Lines, Gerry

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I took two two piece fly rods and a two piece long musky weight bait casting rod from NJ to Miami to Quito to rainforest, overhead bin until I hit the Ecuadorian prop plane to the river port and the flight attendant there didn’t care where I stowed the rods. No guarantees but no one twitched about the tubes.

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Bob – Never, never, never check your rods.  That’s my advice.  The overheads will handle a standard size rod case.  On the one or two occasions that I have had a problem on an odd plane, I have always found a spot — usually in the hanging bag bin. Lyman                                               Dallas, TX                                               Ennis, MT

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Does someone have a recommendation about how to pack regular, two piece rods for airline travel? I have a large rod tube which can hold several rods of various sizes, but has no locking mechanism. Should I just securely seal the thing with tape (over the regular latch) and insure the daylights out of it? Any other suggestions? thx…. Bob Bob Sturtz                           "We have met the enemy – Traverse City, MI                        and he is us." – Pogo

Bob, I have carried rods across the country in home made and in commercial rod carriers.  I insert my aluminum fly-rod tubes into 1-1/2 in ABS tube which works just great to protect tube and contents.  (no damage since I start doing that!)  On my casting and spinning rods, I have carried them in a commercial rod case with a latch (which can have a pad lock attached.) I just secure the latch with a nylon tie.  I have also made large rod tubes for my one piece rods. I attached a drawer handle, capped one end and put a screw cap on the other end.  I insert foam inside both caps to protect the rods and also insert the rods into homemade sleeves. For the price of the commercial tube, I could build lots of custom tubes! Dee Crabtree DeeCrab*ibm.net

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This is a good question.  I am travelling by plane for the first time with my fly rod, which a two piece 8 1/2 footer.  I have one of the 1 1/2" aluminum rod cases with the sock inside, which doesn’t lock.  Can I claim it as carryon? SHould I just tape up the cover?  Or should I paste a label over the brand name on the case and label it Blueprints? Any advice would be appreciated. Chris Bernard (508)640-2016 days (617)979-0464 home

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Does someone have a recommendation about how to pack regular, two piece rods for airline travel? I have a large rod tube which can hold several rods of various sizes, but has no locking mechanism. Should I just securely seal the thing with tape (over the regular latch) and insure the daylights out of it? Any other suggestions? thx…. Bob Bob Sturtz                           "We have met the enemy – Traverse City, MI                        and he is us." – Pogo

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Question:

I’ve been looking at the drift boats kits online from Greg Boats and Ray’s Dories. Has anybody built one of these boats for fly fishing? How did the building go, any tips? Also, who did you buy the kit from? Any info would be appreciated.

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Check out Greg Tatman’s kits.  I built the 12′ river pram.  After all said and done it cost a little over a grand to build and fully outfit. While a 2 person boat, it fishes best as one person rig.  Stable as well as maneuverable.  It fishes the steelhead rivers here on the Olympic Peninsula and Snake River drainages just fine. I would select it again in a heartbeat.  It came with a good set of instructions and when I got stumped, Greg was glad to answer questions.  It took about 4 months of week ends, maybe 80 hours. I do not have the number at hand, but call information and ask for Tatman Boats in Springfield Oregon. Bart Phillips

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’ve been looking at the drift boats kits online from Greg Boats and Ray’s Dories. Has anybody built one of these boats for fly fishing? How did the building go, any tips? Also, who did you buy the kit from? Any info would be appreciated.

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I built a Don Hill Drift Boat a 16 ft. Guide Boat, it is a great kit comes complete with video and instructions. The boat took about 120 hrs to build and Don has a 1- 800 Number if you have any questions. He and his staff aim to please the customer and if I was going to build another boat it would be his. Also Greg Tatman used to work for Don before going into business. Call Don Hill @ 1- 800878 – 5488 and tell him you heard about him from Kent Anderson in Nashville Tn. fly fishing

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I built a Don Hill Drift Boat a 16 ft. Guide Boat, it is a great kit comes complete with video and instructions.

Whadja pay ? — TimW Halfordian Golfer

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Thanks for the info. I’ll give him a call. Where do you use your boat in Nashville. I’m in KY.

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I am interested in building a drift boat.  If anybody has any information or experiences with drift boat kits I would appreciate any input.

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be careful. i had a drift boat, and i sold it.  it was very hard to do.  i actually cried as it left the driveway and turned the corner into someone else’s flyfishing reality. the problem was..the driftboat haunted me.  i would be leaving for work and it would be in the driveway saying "tim..how can you go off to work and leave me all alone in the driveway…". or, i’d be heading off on a wading adventure or with the belly boat and it would cry…"tim…how could you ?". and then, of course i’d feel guilty and this in turn would lead to a fishless day (happened a lot, actually). approach this driftboat thing with care my friend… Tim Walker

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Strongly suggest that anyone thinking about building a drift boat contact the Wooden Boat Shop in Seattle, and purchase a set of Tracy O’brien’s plans.  This plan set tells how to build a stitch and glue hull, which has no frames to trip over or take up space, is far stronger, and has fiberglass/epoxy chines, which is where the damage gets done.  I have built both a Don Hill (which is a lovely boat, BTW) and an O’Brien, and the O’brien is much sweeter.   Stitch and glue is a technique where you sew the plywood panels together with iron wire, brace the panels into shape, and then treat the seams with first a fillet of epoxy soaked sawdust and then epoxy soaked fiberglass tape.  This creates an extremely strong hull, and uses no ribs.  This gives you an open floor, which means nothing to trip over, and no floorboards to catch your fly line.  BIG advantage. You can buy a finished boat of this style by contacting Creekside Outfitters in Issaquah, WA.  They have somebody selling the hulls for about $1700.  Better to build yourself and have the pleasure.  Also, much as in rod building, by doing it yourself, you can use neat woods and get the extra cosmetic pleasure for minimal costs. Take care with the woods that you use.  Suggest that you get Hoadley’s book on hardwoods and use that to drive your materials selection

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: be careful. : the problem was..the driftboat haunted me.  i would be leaving for : work and it would be in the driveway saying "tim..how can you go : off to work and leave me all alone in the driveway…". I guess Tim hears a lot of voices.  I think we are the ones who should be careful. Ignore the voices, Tim.  They are only in your head.  Really. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Assistant professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    |  These University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    |  opinions Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. |  are mine.

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: Strongly suggest that anyone thinking about building a drift boat contact : the Wooden Boat Shop in Seattle, and purchase a set of Tracy O’brien’s : plans.  This plan set tells how to build a stitch and glue hull, which : has no frames to trip over or take up space, is far stronger, and has : fiberglass/epoxy chines, which is where the damage gets done.  I have : built both a Don Hill (which is a lovely boat, BTW) and an O’Brien, and : the O’brien is much sweeter.   Andrew, just how difficult are the techniques and effort required to do a good job?  Special tools, techniques, etc…? Thanks. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Assistant professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    |  These University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    |  opinions Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. |  are mine.

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My fly fishing buddy just bought a new drift boat for fishing the Green River. Unfortunately we have not been able to find any information on how to navigate the river well.  We don’t have much trouble when rowing backwards but when the boat is turned around to go through the rapids it is difficult to steer. We haven’t been able to find books, instruction, or anything else to make this any easier.  Has anyone had experience doing this?  Can you suggest any publications to assist us. Thanks! Jeff Dinsdale

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Call 1-800-541-9498 (Frank Amato Publications) Ask for "Floating Whitewater Rivers". This book should get you on the right track.

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I have a rule which has served me well. Never go down a river unless:     a) you have gone down it with someone who knows the river         and     b) you specifically intended to learn the river from that person. Rule number 2:  Always put the plug in before launching. Have fun!

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Question:

Hello all, I just wanted to let you know about a fine source of literature that covers the trout of the Sierra mountain range.  The book is:   _Sierra Trout Guide_   by Ralph Cutter   1991   Frank Amato Publications   Box 82112   Portland, Oregon   97282   (503) 653-8108   ISBN:  1-878175-02-5  (Softbound–$19.95)   ISBN:  1-878175-03-3  (Hardbound–???) For those that may have an earlier edition of this book, Mr. Cutter claims that this (revised) edition contains over 1200 changes in the trout distribution charts, more scientific genealogy, and more detailed insect information. This book comprises ten years of research over which Ralph Cutter has accumulated probably the most extensive collection of Sierra trout-related information to be found anywhere!  (When I read this book, I was seriously impressed.)  For each species of trout found in the Sierra mountain range, Mr. Cutter describes the history (including introduction and evolution), physique, location, and decline or possible extinction of its populations. Accompanying all descriptions are exceptional illustrations by Joe Tomelleri. Mr. Cutter also includes short chapters covering tackle and hiking in the Sierra environment. The most useful information for fishing persons is the incredible collection of trout location and feeding information.  Mr. Cutter has charts that list the trout that inhabit 550 rivers and 1700 lakes.  However, I was most impressed by the section on trout food which describes the reproduction cycle, physique, and habits of many insects and other life.  Some descriptions even include the time of day which some insects usually appear in the open!  There is also a time table for insect hatchings on the Truckee river. Mr. Cutter’s writing reflects a high sensitivity and appreciation for our (and the trouts’) environment.  This book would make a great gift, but more importantly, I think it’s a must for every Sierra trout angler! Good fishing, Randal

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Nice report – Thanks, –Alan

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Hello all, I just wanted to let you know about a fine source of literature that covers the trout of the Sierra mountain range.  The book is:  _Sierra Trout Guide_  by Ralph Cutter

I’d like to second the recommendation.   For those that may have an earlier edition of this book, Mr. Cutter claims that this (revised) edition contains over 1200 changes in the trout distribution charts, more scientific genealogy, and more detailed insect information.

I have both editions.  They bear little resemblance to each other.  The first edition had an interesting chapter on the history of trout Native to the Sierra.  It turned into a fairly diatribe that was more an expressing of opinions about C&R, river management, etc. than factual information.  Fortunately, his new edition focuses on facts rather than opinions.   One claim that Ralph Cutter makes is that Sierra trout do not feed on adult mosquitoes.  I don’t know if they do or not but they’ll hit an imitation. For each species of trout found in the Sierra mountain range, Mr. Cutter describes the history (including introduction and evolution), physique, location, and decline or possible extinction of its populations. Accompanying all descriptions are exceptional illustrations by Joe Tomelleri. the time of day which some insects usually appear in the open!  There is also a time table for insect hatchings on the Truckee river.

Ralph and Lisa Cutter live in Truckee.  I know a couple of people that have taken their flyfishing and flytying classes.  The general flyfishing/casting class got lots of kudos.  The flytying class didn’t. — John Fereira Viacom Cable Pleasanton, CA

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