Question:

Hi All: Well, the wife didn’t quite understand the Visa bill at first, but all has turned out well. (I tried to head it off at the pass as several of you suggested, but she’s too quick for me.) My sister is getting married in NH in June, so we’re headed up to Conway. Apparently forgot to stop off at the Kittery Trading Post last year, so I will have to make amends this time. Will also be dropping in on Ogunquit for a couple of days.  Need some advice and information on what is available from a fly fishing perspective preferably fresh water…? Any advice, information, directions, suggestions-clean ones, children read these posts-popular flies, etc. would be most welcomed. Regards, BobA The Allens of Allentown, PA (For e-mail, drop the first A)

Response:

The Ogunquit River has sea run browns in it, as does the lower Mousam in Kennebunk.  For directions and advice on flies, I recommend Eldrige Bros. Fly Shop on Rt. 1. Eric

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All: Well, the wife didn’t quite understand the Visa bill at first, but all has turned out well. (I tried to head it off at the pass as several of you suggested, but she’s too quick for me.) My sister is getting married in NH in June, so we’re headed up to Conway. Apparently forgot to stop off at the Kittery Trading Post last year, so I will have to make amends this time. Will also be dropping in on Ogunquit for a couple of days.  Need some advice and information on what is available from a fly fishing perspective preferably fresh water…? Any advice, information, directions, suggestions-clean ones, children read these posts-popular flies, etc. would be most welcomed. Regards, BobA The Allens of Allentown, PA (For e-mail, drop the first A)

Response:

Hi Eric: Thank you for that information, I will stop in at the Eldrige Bros Fly Shop for sure. BobA

Response:

Question:

Been doing some smallmouth fishing myself.  Its not well known out here; I had a number of trout fisherman try my drift without catching any trout at all.  Imagine that!   They gave up and left and I continued to catch an occasional 2lb smallie.  I have only recently discovered this fishery myself and it makes for  a really nice change of pace.  In fact I am going to leave the stone fly hatch on the South Fork to the YUFFIES and go looking for more smallie water.  I really like those fish… John.

Response:

 The little 10 inch smallie inhaled Dale’s bug but Dianna was able to release with a twist of the wrist without lifting the fish from the water.  It was interesting to note that this section of river has excellent big Bluegill but all the strikes she had came from smallmouth!

I am sorry that the bluegill did not cooperate. I have a hard time testing the flies on smallmouth because there are so few around here. I am sure she had a smile on her face. Thanks for the trip report…I felt like I was there. Big Dale

Response:

 At last, this past weekend saw the Rappahannock water levels fall enough to allow for safer wading.  My wife and I set out early (5:15 am) Sunday morning to be on the river before 6.  I had to make BIG promises about the rest of the day to get her up that time of the morning (4:30).  She actually beat me out the door and we arrived at the river as the sun was coming up over the river.  A long legged wading bird stood sentry on the water, his reflection mirrored in a quiet pool.  Two pair of Mallards moved noisily away from the bank as we walked down the trail.  Dianna carried the Connor rod to gain the advantage of the extra 2 ft. of rod length on this river and the extra weight of the line for larger smallmouth bugs.  I started with a Murray’s Leadeyed Hellgrammite behind an AirFlo super-fast sinking leader and 3 ft. of 1X tippet.  Dianna rigged the Connor up with a floating leader and a BIG DALE FOAM SPIDER.  Being nearly a foot shorter, Dianna fished closer to the bank and I took the middle of the river.  We worked downstream together.  She had the first three strikes and first fish.  Smallmouth bass were eager that morning.  The little 10 inch smallie inhaled Dale’s bug but Dianna was able to release with a twist of the wrist without lifting the fish from the water.  It was interesting to note that this section of river has excellent big Bluegill but all the strikes she had came from smallmouth!  In the meantime, I worked the deeper sloughs fishing the Hellgrammite across and down stripping back in slow twitches.  WHAM!!  A 14" fish!  WHAM!! his grandfather!   WHAM!! the fist fish’s sister/girlfriend (West Virginia?).  The morning was going beautifully.  Dianna paused after a few fish to sit on a large rock and just watch the river.  She spotted a muskrat swimming across and soon a Bald Eagle made his appearance. All fishing action stopped to watch that bird wing gracefully upriver. We fished a while longer then headed out to IHOP for a big breakfast of eggs and Harvest Grain and Nut pancakes.  The hubbub of civilization was just 5 minutes away from our wilderness jaunt on the river. — Wayne To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

Response:

At last, this past weekend saw the Rappahannock water levels fall enough to allow for safer wading.

        (neat report snipped) thanks for reviving some great memories of that gorgeous river! wayno

Response:

thanks for reviving some great memories of that gorgeous river! wayno

We were fishing just about 200 yards downstream of where we were wading when Anthony caught his first smallie.  Warmer weather but that pink glow in the sky from sunrise and water temperature about 75.  Nice caddis hatch coming off. — Wayne To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

Response:

Question:

I’m taking an intermediate fly-fishing class at our local university this Saturday.  :-) Good idea?  Yes. They teach flyfishing at a university? Do they offer advanced degrees? Can you get a PhD in flyfishing? Are you studying entomology and physics (i.e., casting)?

This class covers entomology, learning to read the water, river and lake methodology, and casting clinic for corrections.  It’s just one of those extra classes not for any degree. — Vern My ROFF page: http://msnhomepages.talkcity.com/ResortRd/v_deloy/ROFFintro.html Before you buy.

Response:

Sid’s ded, but Messrs. Cook and Lydon can be had…Anyone know where Biafra is at?

I’m not dead, man. Now where’s that damn Nancy? I coulda sworn she was just here…. – sid

Response:

They teach flyfishing at a university? Do they offer advanced degrees? Can you get a PhD in flyfishing? Are you studying entomology and physics (i.e., casting)? I think they’ve had fly fishing offered at Penn State for many years. Maybe Frogspritz can shed some light on this.

By the most remarkable coincidence, I was at a TU picnic with Frogspritz, aka Mark Faulkner, a coupla hours ago. As  you may have noticed, he has been too busy loyering lately to be on the net.  So perhaps I may be permitted to respond. All undergraduate students at PSU, except veterans and perhaps a few others, must take a couple of credits in physical education.  I think that’s true of most colleges and universities. Many many years ago, before most of you were born, (almost before *I* was born), George Harvey began teaching fly casting and tying as one of the many physical education courses.  That was mentioned in George Leonard Herter’s book on fly tying, published at least 30 years ago. To the best of my knowledge, neither a BA, a BS, an MA, an MS, nor a Ph.D. in fly fishing is offered.   I’m happy to report that George Harvey was also at the picnic, in good health. vince norris

Response:

Many many years ago, before most of you were born, (almost before *I* was born), George Harvey began teaching fly casting and tying as one of the many physical education courses.  That was mentioned in George Leonard Herter’s book on fly tying, published at least 30 years ago. I’m happy to report that George Harvey was also at the picnic, in good health.

Wow, he’s got to be almost 90, that’s cool.  Joe Humphreys told me it was George who passed the baton to him for teaching the fly fishing course.  If I remember right he just recently retired (Joe).  I wonder if anyone is, or will be, teaching next.  Wish my school had that.  Shouldn’t gripe though, I got a credit for spending a long weekend at a beautiful Adirondack lodge on Racquette Lack cross country skiing and hanging by the fireplace with a bunch of girls I hadn’t met yet. Those were the days….. Regards, Jeff

Response:

Hi guys! I drive by a river on most days, and I keep thinking…. hmmmmm I would love to try fly fishing…. But of course I dont know the first thing.. is there any resourses I should look at? I found sites with stuff, that I will need ot get started, but what about technique? is it something special? or back and forth?

It’s a _little_ more involved than that. You also have to remember that you’re supposed to be having fun instead of stressing. Seriously, though, we’re fishermen, and therefore opinionated bastards who will turn any question into a holy war. Try to remember that it’s nothing personal. I recommend a real live casting lesson. If you can find a guide who will include one in a day’s guiding, that might be even better. If not, ask at a local fly shop. I tried to teach myself from a video from Orvis, and I’m not entirely happy with that method. As far as gear…for starter gear, I would personally look at St. Croix, Cabelas, or the lower-end Sage rods.  If you can find a local shop that stocks them and doesn’t hard-sell the more expensive stuff, then go there. But remember: fly shops are all too often trying to sell rods, rather than selling you the _right_ rod for your needs. (I knew one exception, in Overland Park, KS. But supposedly there’s a really good one in Loveland, CO, if you’re anywhere near there.) "My father said to be strong, ‘that a good man could  never do wrong’ in a dream I had last night in America"                             -Los Lobos

Response:

I’m happy to report that George Harvey was also at the picnic, in good health. Wow, he’s got to be almost 90, that’s cool.  Joe Humphreys told me it was George who passed the baton to him for teaching the fly fishing course.

That’s right. If I remember right he just recently retired (Joe).

 Joe retired ten or so years ago, IIRC. He was succeeded by Vance McCullough, who either retired or just left the faculty to run a bar-restaurant (mostly a student hangout) with his brother. I’ve heard the name of the present instructor, but I don’t recall it. vince norris

Response:

   see, goddammit, ken *can* be nice.  *we* can be nice!  isn’t that nice?

Snip a bunch of nice shit. All this nice shit is enough to make me want to dye my hair pink, join a punk rock band and throw up on the audience. Big Dale

Response:

       see, goddammit, ken *can* be nice.  *we* can be nice!  isn’t that nice? Snip a bunch of nice shit. All this nice shit is enough to make me want to dye my hair pink, join a punk rock band and throw up on the audience. Big Dale

KEEEEWL….Can I play bass?  If you gots a bass player, can I play harpsicord? Got my Funksteiner all tuned, my Rit and safety pins, and ready to go….Sid’s ded, but Messrs. Cook and Lydon can be had…Anyone know where Biafra is at? JELLO…is you out there? GOD SAVE THE QUEEN AND HER FACIST REGIME!!! we gonna make jake and elwood look like pikers!

Response:

I’m taking an intermediate fly-fishing class at our local university this Saturday.  :-) Good idea?  Yes.

They teach flyfishing at a university? Do they offer advanced degrees? Can you get a PhD in flyfishing? Are you studying entomology and physics (i.e., casting)? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

Response:

Nice post, Wayne. Willi

Nice of you to go the trouble to post that, Willi. Regards, Jeff

Response:

They teach flyfishing at a university? Do they offer advanced degrees? Can you get a PhD in flyfishing? Are you studying entomology and physics (i.e., casting)?

I think they’ve had fly fishing offered at Penn State for many years. Maybe Frogspritz can shed some light on this. Mu

Response:

They teach flyfishing at a university? Do they offer advanced degrees? Can you get a PhD in flyfishing? Are you studying entomology and physics (i.e., casting)? I think they’ve had fly fishing offered at Penn State for many years. Maybe Frogspritz can shed some light on this.

Oregon State has had it for at least the last 8 years.  Never took it oddly enough, saw them out casting to the "grass trout" on sunny days though.      - Ken

Response:

I believe you may have struck a nerve, Vern!  However, I must say you egged this one on. So much for the niceness that Wayne Harrison wrote about. Let the *Games* begin. Op

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The URL is on my web-site which is bellow.  Other than that, I’m not going to say a word.  Is that okay with you Ken? Oh, blow it out yer ass, you despicable cretin. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

        see, goddammit, ken *can* be nice.  *we* can be nice!  isn’t that nice?  oh, god, it’s so nice!!  and now the entire web will know us as nice guys!  and all our sins of arrogance and impatience will be forgiven, all because ken is nice, now!  and maybe dozens of nice guys will learn about how nice it is to flyfish, and how nice the guys who flyfish really are!  and, with luck, they will come in their thousands to fish with us, bringing their children, and their golden labs, all driving relentlessly toward the fast running blue cold water, driving in their discos and ‘ru’s and ernie bauers, until we join together in one surging mass of deliriously happy nice people, all wealthy, healthy and wise, because we are, in the final analysis, so deeply *nice*!

Nice post, Wayne. Willi

Response:

Deleted some good advice I recommend seeking out a mentor, a flyfishing friend or some willing member of a local Trout Unlimited or Federation of Fly Fishers chapter to teach you the basics. Failing that, hire a guide that’s willing to teach you the rudiments.

Finding someone to help you will definitely save you alot of trial and error, mostly error. I had been fly fishing on and off for a number of years before I found another fly fisherman to fish with (my family were spin fishermen). I learned the first couple of days fishing with this person than I had learned over several years on my own and through reading. Back to watch the Avs beat the Wings Willi

Response:

 see, goddammit, ken *can* be nice.

Nah.  Some alien stole Ken’s keyboard and his body…….OH and chiggers with a fucking ALIEN!!!  Oh man, I DON’T wanna do this anymore!

Response:

       see, goddammit, ken *can* be nice.  *we* can be nice!  isn’t that nice? Snip a bunch of nice shit. All this nice shit is enough to make me want to dye my hair pink, join a punk rock band and throw up on the audience. Big Dale

LMAO! Man, *that’s* imagery! /daytripper (bringing a rain coat to NC for sure ;^)

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –      see, goddammit, ken *can* be nice.  *we* can be nice!  isn’t that nice? Snip a bunch of nice shit. All this nice shit is enough to make me want to dye my hair pink, join a punk rock band and throw up on the audience. Big Dale KEEEEWL….Can I play bass?  If you gots a bass player, can I play harpsicord? Got my Funksteiner all tuned, my Rit and safety pins, and ready to go….Sid’s ded, but Messrs. Cook and Lydon can be had…Anyone know where Biafra is at? JELLO…is you out there? GOD SAVE THE QUEEN AND HER FACIST REGIME!!! we gonna make jake and elwood look like pikers!

Remember, the drummer gets to choke to death on someone else’s vomit! Squiggy

Response:

The URL is on my web-site which is bellow.  Other than that, I’m not going to say a word.  Is that okay with you Ken?

Oh, blow it out yer ass, you despicable cretin. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

Hi guys! I drive by a river on most days, and I keep thinking…. hmmmmm I would love to try fly fishing…. But of course I dont know the first thing.. is there any resourses I should look at? I found sites with stuff, that I will need ot get started, but what about technique? is it something special? or back and forth? Thanks in Advance Dan

Response:

Hi guys! I drive by a river on most days, and I keep thinking…. hmmmmm I would love to try fly fishing…. But of course I dont know the first thing.. is there any resourses I should look at? I found sites with stuff, that I will need ot get started, but what about technique? is it something special? or back and forth?

We generally recommend the _Curtis Creek Manifesto_ by Sheridan Anderson   Frank Amato Pubns; ISBN: 0936608064 and a trip to your local flyshop for gear help. Lately some folks have been recommending inexpensive mail order gear. Flyfishermen tend to be an opinionated and cantankerous lot so you’ll probably not find a consensus on this topic, or any other for that matter, in this forum. We do have a FAQ and hopefully someone that knows the URL will point you to it. I recommend seeking out a mentor, a flyfishing friend or some willing member of a local Trout Unlimited or Federation of Fly Fishers chapter to teach you the basics. Failing that, hire a guide that’s willing to teach you the rudiments. Good luck. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

We do have a FAQ and hopefully someone that knows the URL will point you to it.

The URL is on my web-site which is bellow.  Other than that, I’m not going to say a word.  Is that okay with you Ken? — Vern My ROFF page: http://msnhomepages.talkcity.com/ResortRd/v_deloy/ROFFintro.html Before you buy.

Response:

I would try checking out your local video store or public library for an "intro to flyfishing" video. There’s alot more than just "back and forth", although you’d never guess it by reading ROFF…

I’m taking an intermediate fly-fishing class at our local university this Saturday.  :-) Good idea?  Yes. — Vern My ROFF page: http://msnhomepages.talkcity.com/ResortRd/v_deloy/ROFFintro.html Before you buy.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -We generally recommend the _Curtis Creek Manifesto_ by Sheridan Anderson   Frank Amato Pubns; ISBN: 0936608064 and a trip to your local flyshop for gear help. Lately some folks have been recommending inexpensive mail order gear. Flyfishermen tend to be an opinionated and cantankerous lot so you’ll probably not find a consensus on this topic, or any other for that matter, in this forum. We do have a FAQ and hopefully someone that knows the URL will point you to it. I recommend seeking out a mentor, a flyfishing friend or some willing member of a local Trout Unlimited or Federation of Fly Fishers chapter to teach you the basics. Failing that, hire a guide that’s willing to teach you the rudiments. Good luck. — Ken Fortenberry

        see, goddammit, ken *can* be nice.  *we* can be nice!  isn’t that nice?  oh, god, it’s so nice!!  and now the entire web will know us as nice guys!  and all our sins of arrogance and impatience will be forgiven, all because ken is nice, now!  and maybe dozens of nice guys will learn about how nice it is to flyfish, and how nice the guys who flyfish really are!  and, with luck, they will come in their thousands to fish with us, bringing their children, and their golden labs, all driving relentlessly toward the fast running blue cold water, driving in their discos and ‘ru’s and ernie bauers, until we join together in one surging mass of deliriously happy nice people, all wealthy, healthy and wise, because we are, in the final analysis, so deeply *nice*!         wayno

Response:

Question:

I’ve seen a necklace with beads, clips and zingers for carrying fly fishing tools, etc.  Can anyone tell me where I can get one?  Point me to a web page if possible.

Maybe it’s just me, but I wouldn’t wear a necklace while wading. One slip near a low tree branch and the current will hang you. Hey, to each his own,      - Ken — "Many go fishing all their lives without knowing that it is not fish  they are after."             – Henry David Thoreau

Response:

[deleted] Maybe it’s just me, but I wouldn’t wear a necklace while wading. One slip near a low tree branch and the current will hang you.

I pierced my nipples for just this purpose… I’ve got an Orvis Zinger, forceps and clippers on the right and a tape measure / bottle of gink on the left. Your pal, — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

Response:

[deleted] Maybe it’s just me, but I wouldn’t wear a necklace while wading. One slip near a low tree branch and the current will hang you. I pierced my nipples for just this purpose…

OUCH!  I think I’d rather be hanged.  :-)      - Ken — "Many go fishing all their lives without knowing that it is not fish  they are after."             – Henry David Thoreau

Response:

The Fly Shop in Redding California carries that product.  The web addy is http://www.theflyshop.com   phone number is 800-669-3474    Be sure to get a couple of those nifty Holdzit products to go on the lanyard. Sharp hooks, Pat    Holdzit.com Bob Grahm asked:I’ve seen a necklace with beads, clips and zingers for carrying fly fishing tools, etc.  Can anyone tell me where I can get one?  Point me to a web page if possible. You might try Larry Notley at Pockit Sports Co.in Dallas. I am not aware of his web site, but his address is 7235 Syracuse Dr., Dallas, Texas 75214 Phone 214-553-1845 and his Fax is 214-553-0347 Big Dale

Response:

I’ve seen a necklace with beads, clips and zingers for carrying fly fishing tools, etc.  Can anyone tell me where I can get one?  Point me to a web page if possible.

Aloha Bob, Feather-Craft Fly Fishing of St. Louis has one of these in their catalog: Item 621. FLYFISH NECK LANYARD features a super-comfortable neck pad with a dual break away design (no way to hang yourself in this one). Four swivel snaps … yadda yadda yadda. A must for float tubers ! and so on and so forth. http://www.flyfishamerica.com/Ads/National/FeatherCraft98JF.html — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

You’re an animal Timbo Waldo – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – [deleted] Maybe it’s just me, but I wouldn’t wear a necklace while wading. One slip near a low tree branch and the current will hang you. I pierced my nipples for just this purpose… I’ve got an Orvis Zinger, forceps and clippers on the right and a tape measure / bottle of gink on the left. Your pal, — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

–          The Blue Ridge Book Gallery      P.O. Box 5112  Banner Elk, NC 28604 http://www.abebooks.com/home/BLUEBOOKS/HOME.HTM

Response:

one question…. where do you hang your priest? waldo

Response:

I pierced my nipples for just this purpose… I’ve got an Orvis Zinger, forceps and clippers on the right and a tape measure / bottle of gink on the left.

    I’ve seen it.  Not pretty.  Functional, but not pretty. JE

Response:

one question…. where do you hang your priest?

Why would I need two ? — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

Response:

Maybe it’s just me, but I wouldn’t wear a necklace while wading. One slip near a low tree branch and the current will hang you. Hey, to each his own,      - Ken If I remember right they have a fairly low test breaking point built in.

              Jim

Response:

[deleted]    I’ve seen it.  Not pretty.  Functional, but not pretty.

How was Delaney ? — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

Response:

Well I made mine with some fishing beads and other beads and some snaffles for casting tackle.  Of course if you want to pay $30 to 40 bucks,…… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The Fly Shop in Redding California carries that product.  The web addy is http://www.theflyshop.com   phone number is 800-669-3474    Be sure to get a couple of those nifty Holdzit products to go on the lanyard. Sharp hooks, Pat    Holdzit.com Bob Grahm asked:I’ve seen a necklace with beads, clips and zingers for carrying fly fishing tools, etc.  Can anyone tell me where I can get one?  Point me to a web page if possible. You might try Larry Notley at Pockit Sports Co.in Dallas. I am not aware of his web site, but his address is 7235 Syracuse Dr., Dallas, Texas 75214 Phone 214-553-1845 and his Fax is 214-553-0347 Big Dale

Response:

They’re called lanyards.  I’ve seen them used in the salt and by some steelhead guides.  Make one. Use a piece of wire leader mtl., about 60+lb; cut some 2"/3" pieces of thin vinyl tubing.  Slip on a clip, a pc of tubing, a clip, tubing, etc..  Put the cable together with crimp sleeves, cover it with a pc of vinyl and go fish. BTW; make the thing big enough that you can pull your head out of it if it got caught on something.  Heard of a fellow…Ah, long story. BB

Response:

I usually wear my best pearl string. But if you ask the ‘dudes’ out here they’ll tell you they usually wear a snot covered faded bandana. Your pal, — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

Response:

I’ve seen a necklace with beads, clips and zingers for carrying fly fishing tools, etc.  Can anyone tell me where I can get one?  Point me to a web page if possible. Aloha – bob    ooo_ — http://www.aloha.net/~bgraham

Response:

Bob Grahm asked:I’ve seen a necklace with beads, clips and zingers for carrying fly fishing tools, etc.  Can anyone tell me where I can get one?  Point me to a web page if possible.

You might try Larry Notley at Pockit Sports Co.in Dallas. I am not aware of his web site, but his address is 7235 Syracuse Dr., Dallas, Texas 75214 Phone 214-553-1845 and his Fax is 214-553-0347 Big Dale

Response:

I’ve seen a necklace with beads, clips and zingers for carrying fly fishing tools, etc.  Can anyone tell me where I can get one?  Point me to a web page if possible.

Bob you naughty boy, don’t you know you can get leather thongs & beads at an arts & craft store  An alternative to leather is to use a boot lace. Lot’s of great stuff at the crafts stores BTW (for less than the cost at fly shops).  Speaking of beads, beading wire is useful for ribbing on nymphs.  Also available at craft stores are 5 mm pom poms for mini glo-bugs, 1/4" elastic for making leader spool tenders, doll eyes for streamers, etc.   Some bead stores are popping up at shopping malls; metallic alphabet beads to spell out your name or initials are a nice touch.  You can get the zingers and clippers at the fly shop.  I don’t like wearing my fishing necklace anymore since it tends to get in the way of my chest pack but if you wear a vest such a device can be very convenient. Mu Young Lee      Ann Arbor, MI   USA

Response:

Question:

If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether ? — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

Response:

If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether ?

Would it be edible ? — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether

    Certainly C&R, but I just got my smoker!!!  Fish is brain food!! JE

Response:

If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether ? — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

depends big guy….your last foray into robotics had quite a few bugs waldo

Response:

If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether ? Tim Walker

Well Moe Timwalker, Sooner or later I figured you’d have to ask that question or a variant thereof. If we could develop virtual reality that plugged directly into our brains and appeared indistinguishable from "reality" would you give up living "normally"? Would you believe such a thing were possible eventually? Or would you just commit suicide if such a thing were ever developed?  Do you believe in the existence of a spirit inside living (or even inanimate) things? If we could develop a computer that was powerful enough to exceed the human brain in all aspects, would it have a soul?  Do we have souls? You are asking a question that is too deep for anyone to reply in a satisfactory manner on a newsgroup.  The responses will just end up being fodder in a feeding frenzy like so much food pellets being thrown into a pond full of hatchery trout(*).   Mu Young Lee         Ann Arbor, MI   USA (*)I have seen this at Kananaskis Lodge in Alberta.  The old guy with the feed pail from the gift shop walks out to the articifial pond.  Before he even chucks his first handful of fish chow, all the rainbow trout begin violently jockeying for position.

Response:

If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether ?

If I could develop a robotic version of your wife, that would act very much like your real wife, but that would never nag you about the time you spend fishing, would you ever go home? — something bogus to avoid spam)

Response:

If grasshoppers had machine-guns, would the birds fuck with them? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether ? — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

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anyone truly interested in this sort of question would do well to read Phillip K. Dick’s brillant sci-fi novel "Do Android’s Dream of Electric Sheep", the book that "Blade Runner" was based upon. But that movie struck me as warm pablum after the biting ambiguity of PK Dick. Ralphbot (who may or may not have a soul) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether ? — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

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If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether

That’s all we need now,a Stepford trout. Ah, can we fish them with Walt’s

Response:

If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether ?

Would there be little robotic birds and bugs and stuff? And maybe a robotic Ranger too? — Charlie…

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If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether

Only if it was mandatory catch and release.  A robotic trout is too valuable to catch only once.  :-)      - Ken — "To listen to some devout people, one would imagine that God never laughs."         – Ghose Aurobindo

Response:

Ken Janik wrote If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether Only if it was mandatory catch and release.  A robotic trout is too valuable to catch only once.  :-)

Unfortunately, if T-bone is to be believed, the C&R’d robots wouldn’t give as good a fight on subsequent catchings because after all, they’re "very much like a real trout" and as we all know from sir Bone’s tracts, no trout once released is ever worth being caught again. But no, in answer to the original question.  I’d rather fish for the real thing. —                                                       -dnc-

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether ? Tim Walker Well Moe Timwalker, Sooner or later I figured you’d have to ask that question or a variant thereof. If we could develop virtual reality that plugged directly into our brains and appeared indistinguishable from "reality" would you give up living "normally"? Would you believe such a thing were possible eventually? Or would you just commit suicide if such a thing were ever developed?  Do you believe in the existence of a spirit inside living (or even inanimate) things? If we could develop a computer that was powerful enough to exceed the human brain in all aspects, would it have a soul?  Do we have souls? You are asking a question that is too deep for anyone to reply in a satisfactory manner on a newsgroup.  The responses will just end up being fodder in a feeding frenzy like so much food pellets being thrown into a pond full of hatchery trout(*).   Mu Young Lee         Ann Arbor, MI   USA

  I think you put a bit too much paint on that motionless rock Mu. The question didn’t seem to require a view into existence. More like a yes, no, or a maybe or what kind of chip… you know, mundane shit. (*)I have seen this at Kananaskis Lodge in Alberta.  The old guy with the feed pail from the gift shop walks out to the articifial pond.  Before he even chucks his first handful of fish chow, all the rainbow trout begin violently jockeying for position.

I have seen grown men reduced to fisticuffs on The Fork over a rising fish. I guess Pavlovian responses are in the eyes of the beholder, I know a few fish that are still laughing thief ventrals off at me. Hm

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If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether ? Tim Walker

        (snip)         the profundity of that question is breathtaking.  mu young is right.  i don’t know if one can formulate a full response in the newsgroup forum.  the image goes to the very heart of why we fish.  it makes jon’s signature (we are fishermen, we kill fish, or something like that) come into focus.  i say to all of you that the vast majority of us would answer tim’s question:  "no"; because a very important part of fishing is the act of "taking", either by subduing and releasing, or killing, the fish.  a bot fish could not be conquered, or killed.  it would not feel alive in our hands.  we would not be gods for a moment, which i think is at the heart of why we fish.         just a start. wayno

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether ? Tim Walker    (snip)    the profundity of that question is breathtaking.  mu young is right.  i don’t know if one can formulate a full response in the newsgroup forum.  the image goes to the very heart of why we fish.  it makes jon’s signature (we are fishermen, we kill fish, or something like that) come into focus.  i say to all of you that the vast majority of us would answer tim’s question:  "no"; because a very important part of fishing is the act of "taking", either by subduing and releasing, or killing, the fish.  a bot fish could not be conquered, or killed.  it would not feel alive in our hands.  we would not be gods for a moment, which i think is at the heart of why we fish.    just a start. wayno

No,  it would remove  feel from the touch, the heart from the act, the I from me.  It would be a handful of dirt in a domain of gold, of no value,no place  a continuation of a start HM

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Hey T-Bone,      If you made some robotic animals, maybe some of us blood thirsty people could shoot fake animals and tie flies with their wires to catch these magical robotic fish.  Then we could sit down to a wonderful feast of circuits, metal, and vegetables with our wonderful android wives.  Yeah, that is a great idea.  Try living in the real world with the rest of us for awhile, you dimwit.  Thanks for your time. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If I could develop a robotic trout that would act very much like a real trout and I put these things in pond and stream and allowed you to cast for them, would you consider quitting fishing for the living version altogether ? — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

Response:

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (snip) the profundity of that question is breathtaking.  mu young is right.  i don’t know if one can formulate a full response in the newsgroup forum.  the image goes to the very heart of why we fish.  it makes jon’s signature (we are fishermen, we kill fish, or something like that) come into focus.  i say to all of you that the vast majority of us would answer tim’s question:  "no"; because a very important part of fishing is the act of "taking", either by subduing and releasing, or killing, the fish.  a bot fish could not be conquered, or killed.  it would not feel alive in our hands.  we would not be gods for a moment, which i think is at the heart of why we fish. just a start. wayno

Amen! Wayne Tim Apple " Always one step closer to going Postal! "

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Hey T-Bone,     If you made some robotic animals, maybe some of us blood thirsty people could shoot fake animals and tie flies with their wires to catch these magical robotic fish.  Then we could sit down to a wonderful feast of circuits, metal, and vegetables with our wonderful android wives.  Yeah, that is a great idea.  Try living in the real world with the rest of us for awhile, you dimwit.  Thanks for your time.

While I appreciate the thoughtful and kind comments Rick… I’m dead serious.  We are currently soliciting venture capital for the research.  I currently have friends at the Trident submarine research center evaluating the economivc feasibility of the project.  As it stands now, we will need to get the production cost of each fishbot under about ~$2500 to make this venture profitable, and I am optimistic that we can do that.  I am really hoping that some of the people in the semiconducter and firmware businesses here will become partners once we have established their worthiness.  Ken Janik is fairly high on our candidacy list. With my ‘alive’ post I was looking for a little marketing input from this group of flyfishermen, who I trust will tell me the truth.  That is, would the engage in the sport at all.  Does the quarry have to be alive to make flyfishing interesting ?. This is proprietary, discussion, please leave it here (I trust you guys). I have developed a game…and posted the detailed rules over 8 years ago.  I will summarize it here for you.  I intend to name the game FLOG, for starters.  It will be conducted on a FLOG course and consist of a variety of challenging lies to test your flyfishing prowess.  As you approach a hole, be it a spring creek, pond, rapid or what have you, a small reset button is pressed and the fishbots are reset to an initial ‘unspooked’ state.  This will ensure parity on the course, for each player. Each hole will have a ‘par’ that is, the number of casts allowed. When you catch a fish, you stop and count your strokes and weigh the fish.  The winner is a combination of low strokes and pounds of fish released. We had originally intended to use living animals for this game, but they are too unpredictable to make it fair and we are afraid that this will cause us problems with animal rights groups in the future. Do you have any suggestions that might help us make this work ? Your pal, — TimW President Pisces Simulation Systems

Response:

(unfair attack on a great american entrepernuer snipped) While I appreciate the thoughtful and kind comments Rick… I’m dead serious.  We are currently soliciting venture capital for the research.  I currently have friends at the Trident submarine research center evaluating the economivc feasibility of the project.  As it stands now, we will need to get the production cost of each fishbot under about ~$2500 to make this venture profitable, and I am optimistic that we can do that.  I am really hoping that some of the people in the semiconducter and firmware businesses here will become partners once we have established their worthiness.  Ken Janik is fairly high on our candidacy list.

        great choice, tim.  dr. janik is a legendary botboy. With my ‘alive’ post I was looking for a little marketing input from this group of flyfishermen, who I trust will tell me the truth.  That is, would the engage in the sport at all.  Does the quarry have to be alive to make flyfishing interesting ?. This is proprietary, discussion, please leave it here (I trust you guys).

        (fascinating proposal snipped)         we here at little wayno’s guide service (we never close) would certainly appreciate the opportunity to lend the considerable weight of our own capital resources to the exciting effort you at pisces systems have inaugurated.  it would be our hope that we might be considered as a franchise holder for the smokey mtn natl park.  while the exact amount of the investment must await approval by our board of directors, i think it is safe to predict a number sufficient to purchase the state of rhode island. for the firm wayno

Response:

If I could develop a robotic version of your wife, that would act very much like your real wife, but that would never nag you about the time you spend fishing, would you ever go home?

    Is she programmable? JE – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – — something bogus to avoid spam)

Response:

depends big guy….your last foray into robotics had quite a few bugs

Yeah, but it looks like we’ve worked most of them out. And unlike the mythical story of (?) who escalated gift giving each time, I will stop now and simply say thank you for the early colorado mining images. They now grace my office wall. Your pal, — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

Response:

I’m dead serious.  We are currently soliciting venture capital for the research.  I currently have friends at the Trident submarine research center evaluating the economivc feasibility of the project.  As it stands now, we will need to get the production cost of each fishbot under about ~$2500 to make this venture profitable, and I am optimistic that we can do that.  I am

 <snip Please convince your backers to put up some money for development of fembot fishing wives. Mu Young Lee, feeling like 6 Million Dollars on a great winter day.

Response:

Hey T-Bone,     If you made some robotic animals, maybe some of us blood thirsty I’m dead serious.  We are currently soliciting venture capital for the research.  I currently have friends at the Trident submarine research center evaluating the economivc feasibility of the project.  As it stands now, we will need to get the production cost of each fishbot under about ~$2500 to make this venture profitable, and I am optimistic that we can do that.  I am really hoping that some of the people in the semiconducter and firmware businesses here will become partners once we have established their worthiness.  Ken Janik is fairly high on our candidacy list.

I’m afraid I will have to decline.  Currently I’m working on a robotic PETA-droid.  It will post neverending articles to usenet to allow all lowlife hunters, fishermen, and meat-eaters to realize the horrible pain and torture they inflict on the poor innocent little creatures. Don’t tell anyone, but the code name is Tiresome-BOring Neverending Excrement. SSSHH, for your eyes only.      - Ken — "To listen to some devout people, one would imagine that God never laughs."         – Ghose Aurobindo

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Do you have any suggestions that might help us make this work ? Your pal, — TimW President Pisces Simulation Systems

Stay at home and play Trophy Rivers on your damn box. Now would I be ashamed to poach a few? May be with a hunting rifle from above the pool. Always willing to help out and change the odds. You ought to here about the gophers that I’m sending to the clave. — Doug Knight                                     metalfab<atpacbell.net Junk e-mail, solicitation, sales, products and services gladly accepted at $500.00 per mailing and billed directly to your ISP.

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Question:

   He he, my wife’s back-up deer rifle is a Dragunov SVD. It does seem to get odd looks from other hunters:-) Dino in Reno

Hey dino:   My wifes weapon of choice for deer is my formerly pristeen Toyota Pick-up truck! And why does somebody named Tamela have a wife??????? — Carl Johansson, Guardian of Yahoo Central  "J-3 frontseater, P-51 backseater" Avid Mark IV N2114N

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – She’s just upset ’cause the last one I got was less than 25 yards away, through the PA Brush, in the rain, 15 minutes in the season with a Marlin 336 30-30. The last one I got was at 50 yards from home — in between the house and the shop.  I got him at blank point range with a model 94 Ford Ranger.  Bambi Jerky, yum yum To alleviate that problemn I’ve moved to the residential airpark and my new shop (i.e., hangar) is right outside my back door.

John, I generally recommend something that uses less expensive projectiles! HF

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor…. Got to practice somehow Uncle HF.  It pays to be in shape, and be a good (long-range) marksman to boot.  Never know with the Mongolians or the Turks will come over the mountain! BWB    He he, my wife’s back-up deer rifle is a Dragunov SVD. It does seem to get odd looks from other hunters:-) Dino in Reno

Mine is an aging Winchester chambered for 45-70.  It has been in the family since it was new.  It is a little short for BWB’s sniper hunting, but it is the absolute ticket for brush popping the darn critturs. HF

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She’s just upset ’cause the last one I got was less than 25 yards away, through the PA Brush, in the rain, 15 minutes in the season with a Marlin 336 30-30.

The last one I got was at 50 yards from home — in between the house and the shop.  I got him at blank point range with a model 94 Ford Ranger.  Bambi Jerky, yum yum To alleviate that problemn I’ve moved to the residential airpark and my new shop (i.e., hangar) is right outside my back door. – John Ousterhout – Cessna driver, Flybaby builder, RV Wantabe

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Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor…. Got to practice somehow Uncle HF.  It pays to be in shape, and be a good (long-range) marksman to boot.  Never know with the Mongolians or the Turks will come over the mountain! BWB

   He he, my wife’s back-up deer rifle is a Dragunov SVD. It does seem to get odd looks from other hunters:-) Dino in Reno

Response:

Haa Haa got you there!!  you can’t count my thumb.  Since it spends so much time inserted in my rectum it cannot – repeat cannot be counted as a digit – and that is by international decree my friend – "the Warsaw thumbsitting act of 1987 to be exact)

Just a minor correction there Carl,it was the "Warsaw left handed Thumbsitting act of 1987" to be exact. It was authored by Stanislaw Podgorski who also authored the "Right foot in Mouth Act of 1982" and the "It’s not Sex,but an inapporiate Act, Act of 1998" often cited by bill clinton… Just a minor detail. Chuck(Polish Historian)Slusarczyk..author of the "He’s not Crazy he’s Nuts act of 1997.

Response:

Haa Haa got you there!!  you can’t count my thumb.  Since it spends so much time inserted in my rectum it cannot – repeat cannot be counted as a digit – and that is by international decree my friend – "the Warsaw thumbsitting act of 1987 to be exact)  – Carl Johansson, Guardian of Yahoo Central "J-3 frontseater, P-51 backseater" Avid Mark IV N2114N

Just one of many "acts" I’ve heard you are so intimately familiar with. And I don’t care if you like it or not, you’re still my Good Buddy, John Stricker — why I had to put it in.  If one of you real humans wants to contact me: "I didn’t spend all these years getting to the top of the food chain just to become a vegetarian"

Response:

Carl, FYI, I currently own four

Thats 4 POS scouts for those of you not keeping track  (that’s the same number of fingers you have left on your hand including your thumb since you lost that one in the barrel of BWB’s gun a while back you dimwit)

Haa Haa got you there!!  you can’t count my thumb.  Since it spends so much time inserted in my rectum it cannot – repeat cannot be counted as a digit – and that is by international decree my friend – "the Warsaw thumbsitting act of 1987 to be exact)   — Carl Johansson, Guardian of Yahoo Central  "J-3 frontseater, P-51 backseater" Avid Mark IV N2114N

Response:

Ahh!  You got it right John.  Carl is a crybaby.  I may have shot that buck from 700 yards.  It gets longer everyday that I think about it. What really griped me was Carl giving credit to Twyla.  Shit, she just sat, smoked Camels and bitched the whole time about Tommy Cooper.  I have no idea what her problem was.  

She’s just upset ’cause the last one I got was less than 25 yards away, through the PA Brush, in the rain, 15 minutes in the season with a Marlin 336 30-30. And I shot it in the head because you can’t eat the damm horns anyway. She was mad because I looked that Bambi in its sad eyes and KILLED IT ANYWAY. Miss Geeter thought for that fleeting moment I had a colder heart that she did but we all know that’s impossible. Tom "I might just use a 12 Ga. this year" Cooper

Response:

I haven’t been introduced to the gentile sport of BWB hunting, and don’t know the rules.  Are Gatling spud guns considered unsporting? "Lennie the Lurker"

No not unsporting, but bake ‘em first and it will be considered tasty. Tom "here we go talking about food again" Cooper

Response:

Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor young "Bambi" on his very first sortie away from his loving mother.  I know you don’t really need the groceries because you can buy hamburger already ground up and patted out into patties at Wal-Mart for MUCH less that a box of ammunition for those vicious weapons. Yah – so whats your point??????

Py Yimmeny, Mister Johansson, if YOU can go fishing,  I can go fishing! HF

Response:

I haven’t been introduced to the gentile sport of BWB hunting, and don’t know the rules.  Are Gatling spud guns considered unsporting? "Lennie the Lurker"

We currently have a crew of engineers working out the mounting points and the loading system for installation on a Mooney for rec.aviation flyin at Pink Knee in 1999.  We plan to usher in the millenium with a proper celebration.  All of the millenia. Since we have many programmers in the group, and programmers always start counting with "zero" their millenia is 2000.  For everyone else, who start counting with "one," the mellenia is 2001.  However, Arther C. Clarke already usurped that one. HF

Response:

Ahh!  You got it right John.  Carl is a crybaby.  I may have shot that buck from 700 yards.  It gets longer everyday that I think about it. What really griped me was Carl giving credit to Twyla.  Shit, she just sat, smoked Camels and bitched the whole time about Tommy Cooper.  I have no idea what her problem was.  You know, she just turned 94.  I guess when you are that old it’s impossible to reason with you.  She was ranting and raving that she made some deal with God that she can’t die until Carl, Me, Tommy, Tony,  Chuck and O’ring are in our graves.   We made the old bag sleep outside in a tent both nights that she was there.  One night it rained like hell.  I could hear her praying while we were in the RV with our heater on  in nice, warm and soft beds.  I thought to myself.  To Hell with you.  You old bag.  I’m glad to see you suffer, you old decrepit piece of crap.  The next day she came in for a shower and she was soaked to the bone.  Serves the old bag right I say. BWB – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -PS:  Nice shot Bill.  I notice there were nothing but excuses from old Carl here.  God what a whining baby.

Response:

Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor….

Got to practice somehow Uncle HF.  It pays to be in shape, and be a good (long-range) marksman to boot.  Never know with the Mongolians or the Turks will come over the mountain! BWB

Response:

I haven’t been introduced to the gentile sport of BWB hunting, and don’t know the rules.  Are Gatling spud guns considered unsporting? "Lennie the Lurker"

Response:

Badwater Bill wrote Got to practice somehow Uncle HF.  It pays to be in shape, and be a good (long-range) marksman to boot.  Never know with the Mongolians or the Turks will come over the mountain! BWB

The Real Truth about the hunting trip: BWB lurks in the shadows of the ridge mumbling softly to himself.  "I’ll get them this time.  Them Turks, they’re after me.  They’ve been after me for a long time but I’ll get them this time." Poor innocent Bambi strolls through his valley not far from where he was born, looking for nothing more than a tuff of dry grass in the late season. BWB sees the movement and says "There they are!  The Turks!  And they’re in disguise again!" BLAM!! Bambi’s blood stained body is thrown against a tree and the last thing he sees as the light fades from his eyes is a madman running down from the ridge screaming "I GOT THEM!  I GOT THEM!" Can nothing stop this maniac?  Who or what will he hit next?  Look forward to the next exciting episode of: "Let’s Go Hunting This Weekend.or I’m Going Settle This Suit One Way Or The Other" Rich Isakson

Response:

Phillips you ought to be ashamed of yourself. Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor young "Bambi" on his very first sortie away from his loving mother.  I know you don’t really need the groceries because you can buy hamburger already ground up and patted out into patties at Wal-Mart for MUCH less that a box of ammunition for those vicious weapons.  

Some lady asked me the other day as I got out of my truck dressed in my camo hunting outfit,"How could you kill a deer?" I said with a bow ,shotgun, muzzleloader(no not the drinking kind) or pistol. She then said"why do you do that?,don’t you like deer?" I said ,yes ma’am, I like ‘em… baked, fried, BBQ’ed, Roasted, made into sausage, cooked on a grill, made into spaghetti, chili,stew,…… She just shook her head in disgust walked away and went into Mac Dee to eat something someone else killed….Go figure… Chuck(my biggest was a 180# heavy rack 10 pt.)Slusarczyk PS Besides Bambi, I eat Porky Pig,Henny Penny,Mother Goose,Bugs Bunny,    Bossie the Cow and the rest .If God didn’t want me to eat’em He wouldn’t    have made ‘em taste good.

Response:

HF, With Carl on the operating end of the weapon, Bambi can sleep secure. John Stricker — why I had to put it in.  If one of you real humans wants to contact me: "I didn’t spend all these years getting to the top of the food chain just to become a vegetarian" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Phillips you ought to be ashamed of yourself. Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor young "Bambi" on his very first sortie away from his loving mother.  I know you don’t really need the groceries because you can buy hamburger already ground up and patted out into patties at Wal-Mart for MUCH less that a box of ammunition for those vicious weapons. Shame, shame, shame. HF

Response:

I’ve been nuts for at least 30 years that I’m aware of.  I actually think that O’ring drove me nuts because of my close contact with him for many years.

Denying any mental illness is itself a symptom of mental illness (see Zoom paradox no. 1).  Conversely if you claim that you’re nuts, you probably aren’t. I’ve met O’Ring and he seems quite normal to me.  Fortunately for O’Ring, being exposed (literally) to you hasn’t harmed him. Carl Johannson is of the same caliber as O’ring and myself.

I’ve met Carl and anyone that wears those beutiful Hawiian shirts has to be a mentally healthy person. Thank Dog, there is NO ONE else the same caliber as you. – John (44 caliber) Ousterhout –

Response:

A whole bunch of stuff – most of which was true – some of which is now Guess what.  I got the deer… and they got skunked!!!!

We did come out of the desert with one deer (this trip – openning day we had two more, and just last night we got a big one during the muzzleloader season – no Bob not that kind of Muzzleloader!!!! But Phillips in his scotch hazed memory has forgotten the real scenario. Were out in the desert just fooling around having some fun – when up pulls this beat up old 1966 international.  (BTW Stricker I’ll put my stock Defender up against that POS scout you have any day – I used to have one-  criminy what a ride!!!) Anyway out jumps this rickity old grandma who immediately starts ranting and raving about "that miscreant Billy Phillips".  It’s Miss Geeter!!!!! She followed the scotch fumes and a trail of empty Tecate cans to find that idiot!!!! Phillips tries to hide in the luggage compartment of the motorhome but Miss Geeter smells him out – grabs him by the ear and pulls him out of there (as we sit doubled over in laughter). Anyway Miss Geeter sits there by the fire with us – she’s smoking filterless camels and belching like a sailor, and tells us that the only failure she has ever encountered in her life is not being able to teach (or more correctly train) BWB anything of any value.  So now she has decided in a last ditch attempt to  teach Bedwetter Billy (as she calls him) anything at all, she figures she may be able to reach him through this hunting stuff. So we drop old BWB and Miss Geeter in the "badlands" the next morning. Turns out we put the SOB right in the middle of the action, as almost immediately this tiny – really stupid buck, full of testosterone, and no common sense pops up 25 yards in front of BWB and begs to be shot. I’m sitting up on top of the hill watching the soap opera unfold. So BWB attempts to put this deer in his sights and the gun barrel is moving around like a bamboo in a hurricane.  Suddenly Miss Geeter loses patience with Phillips and grabs the gun from him.  Phillips shrinks down into a fetal sitting position hiding behind a Joshua tree, shaking like a leaf and sucking his thumb!! So Geeter drops the hammer on the deer, and Phillips flinches like a nuclear bomb went off in his shorts.  Then he gets on the radio and starts crowing about how HE "got him –  he’s huge – 4 point".  turns out to be a little forky – and Phillips was cowering behind the tree while that Geeter Chick did the dirty work. Way to go Geeter Baby!!!!! This as you all know is the true story of BWB’s suposedly sucessfull deer hunt!!!!!! Phillips you ought to be ashamed of yourself. — Carl Johansson, Guardian of Yahoo Central  "J-3 frontseater, P-51 backseater" Avid Mark IV N2114N

Response:

Phillips you ought to be ashamed of yourself.

Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor young "Bambi" on his very first sortie away from his loving mother.  I know you don’t really need the groceries because you can buy hamburger already ground up and patted out into patties at Wal-Mart for MUCH less that a box of ammunition for those vicious weapons.   Shame, shame, shame. HF

Response:

Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor young "Bambi" on his very first sortie away from his loving mother.  I know you don’t really need the groceries because you can buy hamburger already ground up and patted out into patties at Wal-Mart for MUCH less that a box of ammunition for those vicious weapons.

Yah – so whats your point?????? Carl Johansson, Guardian of Yahoo Central  "J-3 frontseater, P-51 backseater" Avid Mark IV N2114N

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Phillips you ought to be ashamed of yourself. Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor young "Bambi" on his very first sortie away from his loving mother.  I know you don’t really need the groceries because you can buy hamburger already ground up and patted out into patties at Wal-Mart for MUCH less that a box of ammunition for those vicious weapons. Shame, shame, shame. HF

Hear, Hear Yoram Leshinski

Response:

Carl, While your most of your story is certainly believable and I heartily accept as the truth, there is one issue that I simply must address. Were out in the desert just fooling around having some fun – when up pulls this beat up old 1966 international.  (BTW Stricker I’ll put my stock Defender up against that POS scout you have any day – I used to have one-  criminy what a ride!!!)

FYI, I currently own four (that’s the same number of fingers you have left on your hand including your thumb since you lost that one in the barrel of BWB’s gun a while back you dimwit) (4) of these fine specimens of American Truck production.  Even the sorriest of the lot would be more than up to the task of defending it’s name against your baseless charges you wuss. And if by some miracle of divine intervention, they should fail, out comes the S1700.  And if IT fails in totally destroying whatever that junk example you drive, I’ll dolly up the semi trailer and finish you off with the CO9670 and 435 hp Detroit. However, I’m quite sure that it won’t come to that, as I don’t expect you to ever make good on your feeble claims of superiority.  Obviously, anyone that "used to have one" and got rid of it is at least half a bubble out of plumb. John "Give me 392cid of 1000# American Iron for an engine any day" Stricker PS:  Nice shot Bill.  I notice there were nothing but excuses from old Carl here.  God what a whining baby. — why I had to put it in.  If one of you real humans wants to contact me: "I didn’t spend all these years getting to the top of the food chain just to become a vegetarian"

Response:

I think the people who build and fly their own airplanes are for the most part nuts.  I’ve been nuts for at least 30 years that I’m aware of.  I actually think that O’ring drove me nuts because of my close contact with him for many years.  I was hanging on to certain threads of reality when I met him in 1972.  He’s a chemist by trade and everyone knows that chemists are nuts from birth.  I tried to remain calm and focused as a young physicist working in the same lab that housed O’ring.  But, as time went on and my association with him became closer he drove me over the edge.   Carl Johannson is of the same caliber as O’ring and myself.  Unlike me, however, he was probably was born nuts.  I notice no transition period in his life that caused him to become what he is.  I think he was always crazy.  For instance, he trained for decades to be an Olympian.  He did nothing but work out 8 hours each day for the Olympics, totally focused, totally committed, totally obsessed. Carl is strange in his own kind of way.  He told me a year ago, "Phillips, you come to Utah and I’ll take you fishing.  You WILL catch fish and you will catch a lot of fish in a short period of time."  I retaliated, "Gonzo, you’re full of crap.  I never catch fish unless I fish in the ocean."  Gonzo says, "Yeah, sure, you come to Utah and we’ll not only catch fish, we’ll catch enough fish in one afternoon to feed a party of ten people." Of course the only catch is that I had to walk through a river for two hours with water temps near freezing to get to an obscure canyon that no human has ever been to other than Carl.  Then if you were to try to walk up the canyon on the side of the stream you’d need a four foot machete to claw your way.  I said, "Yo Gonzo, there ain’t no way up this stream!"  Carl laughs, "You don’t walk along the side, you walk UP the stream in the center of the water.  Don’t worry about getting wet, you’ll be wet all day.  We need to cast into the ponds above us as we go. That’s where the fish are." Combat fishing is what it is.  We caught fish alright but the reason why is that no other human being would subject themselves to the torture of the environment to do it. SO!  What all this is head toward is the hunting trip we just took last weekend.  Here’s the Johannson thought process.  Last December Carl asked me if I wanted to go deer hunting with him and his brother this fall.  He asked me 9 months ahead of time because I’m a fat slob and I needed to get in shape to go with them.  I said, "Sure, I’d like to go, what do I do?"  Carl’s reply was, "See that mountain behind your house there?  You have to climb that mountain at least 4 times a week for about three months to start.  Then you have to climb it quickly  for about the next three months.  Then you have to push yourself and get anaerobic for the last three months.  Don’t worry about your weight loss.  You are a fat slob anyway and you need the exercise." Well, I did just that.  I climbed that mountain at least four times a week, even in the summer.  I lost 20 pounds, my heart felt good, my sex life improved, it all came together.  Then last weekend was the big hunt.  Two weeks ago I sighted my 300 Win-Mag in to be on target at 300 meters.  That put the round about 3 inches high at 100 meters, about   1.5 inches high at 200 meters, dead on at 300 meters, 4 inches low at 400 meters and 8 inches low at 500 meters.   You have no idea what it’s like to hunt with the Johannson brothers. You get up in the dark at 04:00 and drive for an hour to get to some canyon in the middle of the desert-nowhere.  You walk up and over about three mountains in the dark until you perch on some crestline where you use your binoculars to "Glass" the valley before you, searching for a lone buck.  You sit there in 25 degree temperatures at 9000 feet looking 300 to 600 meters away.  Carl pulls out an infrared laser distance measuring device. He hits a rock on the left in the center of the valley then an outcropping across the valley and another boulder on the right.  He leans over to me in a whisper and says, "He Phillips, that rock is 323 meters, the hill over there is 450 meters and that boulder on the right is 525 meters.  Get your ballistic table out and figure the drops.  If a deer comes along, hold the sighting point appropriately.  Got it dummy!" "Got it Gonzo.  You can count on me." This is not deer hunting, it’s being a sniper!  Sniper hunting is the only way to describe it.  These guys laugh at me for carrying a 300 Win-mag while they carry 220 swifts.  They shoot 50 grain bullets at 4200 feet per second with flat ballistics, while I shoot a CANNON!  I was using 180 grain hot loads in my sniper rifle, but my ballistics aren’t bad.  That gun can shoot the ass off a gnat at 300 meters. AND

Question:

Send your listings now for June postings on The Classified’s. Free listings for individuals. Still some good fly fishing equipment bargins listed. Andy

Response:

Sorry folks I posted the other day and was reminded I forgot to give the URL for The Classified’s. Nine categories. List your flyfishing equipment free. There are some good bargins on the list at present. http://www2.southwind.net/~amcminn/ads Check them out. Andy

Response:

Question:

I went with the Simms Gore-Tex Micro Fibers.   They’re expensive,  but super comfortable.   I also use them for backpacking with a pair of Tevas.

Response:

I just bought the new Orvis No-Sweat waders and couldn’t be happier.  They are super comfortable and you really don’t sweat.  Very lightweight also, they just fold up and are carried in a little bag that they come with. You can’t beat the guarantee either.  One year and if your waders have a hole for any reason, Orvis will replace them free.  Nobody else offers this.

Response:

Wondering if anyone could shed light on good choices for light weight waders. Mainly backpack in the Sierra’s to fishing holes/streams, so need waders that are very light yet durable. Any ideas on shoes? Thought of Teva sandles but those are heavy. Any info appreciated ! John

Just got Orvis stocking hippers and (so far) they’ve been ok (stay away from Fly Tech or other cheap brands).  I use Nike (or similar brand) Aquasocks which are light weight and very functional. hope this helps;  let me know if you hit agood spot in the Sierras–I go up often and am always looking for new places– aaron

Response:

Wondering if anyone could shed light on good choices for light weight waders. Mainly backpack in the Sierra’s to fishing holes/streams, so need waders that are very light yet durable. Any ideas on shoes? Thought of Teva sandles but those are heavy. Any info appreciated ! John

You might not need any for the small streams.  If you think you do I would William Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA

Response:

After five years of heavy fising I have just retired the lightweight Orvis stocking foot waders.  With some care, ie look out for thorns, branches in the woods, I have gotten a good five years of use.           Also the canvas boots from LLBeans is quite good.  Cheaper than Orvis too.  They cost about $50.  The orvis waders and hippers wore very well.  I am still using the hippers.  Good luck, FHK

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Wondering if anyone could shed light on good choices for light weight waders. Mainly backpack in the Sierra’s to fishing holes/streams, so need waders that are very light yet durable. Any ideas on shoes? Thought of Teva sandles but those are heavy. Any info appreciated ! John You might not need any for the small streams.  If you think you do I would William Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA

William, I am not Bob, am using his browser, he told me to say this because he is embaressed by my question, however,  I am new to this sport. and I want to purchase a good all around pair of waders. What do you recommend.  I see many many different brands.  I don’t want to spend a a lot, but don’t want to get wet either or buy a new pair next year when I learn more.  Your recommendations are appreciated!!!   Thanks Phyllis

Response:

: Wondering if anyone could shed light on good choices for light weight : waders. Mainly backpack in the Sierra’s to fishing holes/streams, so need : waders that are very light yet durable. Red Ball Supplex waders- superlight and tough. And don’t forget a patch kit –mike

Response:

Wondering if anyone could shed light on good choices for light weight waders. Mainly backpack in the Sierra’s to fishing holes/streams, so need waders that are very light yet durable. Any ideas on shoes? Thought of Teva sandles but those are heavy. Any info appreciated ! John

Response:

Question:

I’m considering adding outriggers to my 22′ fishing boat.  Before I do, however, I thought I might try out planer boards which are set up to plane out to the side as the boat moves forward.  I would then attach a release clip to the planer board so that the line would free up from the board if a fish strikes.  It would seem to me that this type of system would be more practical on a small boat than outriggers.  Has anyone out there tried out this approach?  What have been your experiences? regards, gs Gary Segal, MD; Dept. of Medicine, UCI/VAMC, 5901 E. 7th Street, Long Beach,                         "AYMATAI"

Response:

Sideplaners are very popular in the Great Lakes and probably the best bet as you use them when you need them and leave them when you don’t. Another easy option is some long rods.  I troll with 12 foot fly rod blanks turned out as trolling rods to get the separation I like. Another trick little item is a Downjigger — we’ll have some add pages on that in my Fine Fishing magazine — finefishing.com — in the next few days.  This sppeds and slows trolled lures to improve results. Sort of like rowing without blisters. Oh Fine Fishing has 600,000 words, 200+ articles, a half dozen recent awards etc. and like the NAOG material on our site, covers a lot of trolling if that’s what you like.  I’ll have a new So Cal saltwater editor on in the next couple of weeks too.a

Response:

: I’m considering adding outriggers to my 22′ fishing boat.  Before I do, : however, I thought I might try out planer boards which are set up to plane : out to the side as the boat moves forward.  I would then attach a release : clip to the planer board so that the line would free up from the board if a : fish strikes.  It would seem to me that this type of system would be more : practical on a small boat than outriggers.  Has anyone out there tried out : this approach?  What have been your experiences? : I tried outriggers on my 20′ boat. I wasn’t very happy with the result. The smaller boat simply rolls too much, whipping the outriggers, putting a lot of strain on the gunwale mounts and jerking the baits. About the only thing that planer boards can’t do as well is to trail surface baits a long way behind the boat. They are also a little harder to work; you should have two people in the boat to manage them easily. — We sense that life is a dark comedy and maybe we can live with that. However, because the whole thing is written for the entertainment of the gods, too many of the jokes go right over our heads.     (D. R. Koontz)

Response:

Question:

I know somewhere on the cyber-river, someone has come up with a cheap way to tie tube flies without paying $50 for a store bought tool.  If anyone can help with ideas for a jig to hold tubes when tying, I would appreciate it.  Thanks. *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * *   Skip Summer                     From somewhere in the      * *                                   fishing for smallmouth.    * *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *

Response:

Skip,     Most of the tubes I use have a plastic liner…I use a Regal vise and simply use a needle of an appropriate size, jam the needle point into plastic liner and put the "eye" end of needle in regal.                             Mike in PDX                "When the trout are lost, smash the state."                                            Tom McGuane

Response:

I know somewhere on the cyber-river, someone has come up with a cheap way to tie tube flies without paying $50 for a store bought tool.  If anyone can help with ideas for a jig to hold tubes when tying, I would appreciate it.  Thanks.

I’m obviously no help, but what the heck is a tube fly.   A sunny day,      a box of midges,         and a wandering stream…   Man, this MUST be heaven!   <    Steve Kulpa    <<

Response:

We need help from the europeans here!!!! What do you use over there…I brought back from Ireland  lots of tubes but I am still quite inept at tying anything resembling a fly. How do you hold the darn thing?  I remember seeing adds for special tools in the Kauffman catalog some years ago but as I was deleted from their mailing list (I guess I do not buy enough) I do not know if they are still available. In any case, does the $50 dollar gizzmo work?   Thanks. Rio Simpson

Response:

We need help from the europeans here!!!! What do you use over there…I brought back from Ireland  lots of tubes but I am still quite inept at tying anything resembling a fly. How do you hold the darn thing?  I remember seeing adds for special tools in the Kauffman catalog some years ago but as I was deleted from their mailing list (I guess I do not buy enough) I do not know if they are still available. In any case, does the $50 dollar gizzmo work?   Thanks. Rio Simpson

I have been tying tube flies for many years and with the tubing I use (1/8 " nylon) a carefully selected coat hanger works OK. If you want a real quality brass and steel tool there is one made by a gentleman in Tacoma WA and is available from Clearwater Angler, 620 Auburn Way So. Suite J, Auburn WA  98002, 939-1484 Brian Steel

Response:

: I’m obviously no help, but what the heck is a tube fly. It’s a fly tied on a plastic tube, rather than on a hook shank. To use, pass your leader through the tube (now dressed with the appropriate combination of feathers, fur, hair, etc) and fasten a hook on the end of the leader. Popular in Europe, some following in North America. Make excellent "long" streamers, e.g to imitate a sand eel. May not meet the definition of "fly fishing" under some regulations (just a warning). — 3798 Woodland Drive     voice: (604) 368-9315 Trail, BC               data:  (604) 368-9341

Response:

rio,     Have never had to bother with the $50 tool.  Try a large needle, jam point into tube until it grips, put eye end in vise and tie away…keep jaws quite close to end of tube or needle will flex too much…might also consider using 6/0 thread as too heavy a hand will cause tube to rotate on needle and/or bend needle.                                 Mike in PDX                "When the trout are lost, smash the state."                                            Tom McGuane

Response: