Question:

I rented a felluca for day sailing. I think that it would be little trouble to get one for a fair cruise.

Excellent idea, and definitely in my style. —      Mark Anderson – DBA Riparia Resources    www.riparia.org Medical info for cruisers and woodworkers.  Boatbuilding plans. Artistic photography       Landscapes – Nautical and marine – Abstracts, extracts and themes.

Response:

I’m curious as to whether it is practical to cruise up and down the Nile R. with a private yacht. Legalities and other hassles: Practical draft limitations: Safety and pleasurability of your reception by the Egyptians: Any other information that may be of interest: —      Mark Anderson – DBA Riparia Resources    www.riparia.org

I rented a felluca for day sailing. I think that it would be little trouble to get one for a fair cruise. It would avoid all the problems of a rich-looking yacht. I’d not worry too much about piracy or big-deal problems. It’s petty theft that gets you. — Bernard W. Joseph     http://www.appliedgrammar.com   "Speak to us of Emailia."    James Joyce    FINNEGANS WAKE

Response:

Last month I sailed a felucca from Aswan to Edfu, so based on limited knowledge of this stretch of water:

Thanks Tony, yours was the kind of info I was looking for.  As to the political climate, those responses are taken in mind, and as expected. For my own purposes, however, the time I might be taking this cruise will be at least several years into the future, so I’ll hope that the political situation might change by then.  In any event, it’ll be taken into account whenever, and probably I’d get the opinion of the state dept. first. —      Mark Anderson – DBA Riparia Resources    www.riparia.org Medical info for cruisers and woodworkers.  Boatbuilding plans. Artistic photography       Landscapes – Nautical and marine – Abstracts, extracts and themes.

Response:

A rich American cruising his flashy yacht in the Middle East…… Now THERE’s a TARGET of OPPORTUNITY for you. Hated by millions of Arabs because of our undying support for the Israeli War Machine…..tearing up Palestinians. Can you answer your own question?  PLEASE DON’T!

When I was in Egypt a quite few years ago (just after Egypt and Israel "normalized" relations) the average Egyptian on the street preferred Israeli money to Egyptian money for the small cash purchases.  And that was after a 10 to 1 devaluation of Israeli money. Things certainly may have changed in the past 20 years but back then they were very friendly to American tourists.  The only thing that had me feeling unsafe was the way they drive, especially in and around Cairo.  You probably heard about driving in Italy.  Cairo is much worse. Steve

Response:

Oh, I think the average Egyptian is still "American friendly".  Most Arabs I ever met when I lived there were very pro-American and simply LOVED Yankee dollars.  However, times have changed, not the people. This Al Queda network is only one of many anti-American networks with supporters across a wide spectrum of Arab countries.  Bombs are going off almost every day, now. Flashing the big yacht in their faces, and all the cash that goes along with it, attracts attention.  Word is passed to the network from the supporters who will never see their own cars, much less a flashy yacht.  The damned thing is a great "target" and would be a prize on any terrorist’s list.  Egypt is eat up with anti-Israeli, and therefore anti-American, groups. It just seems stupid to put the family, the boat and his personal safety in harm’s way flashing that yacht in their faces after 9/11. Middle East changed that day.  Until the "brothers" in Afghanistan get the word spread out that America is NOT the enemy, and saved them from the gangsters who were killing the country, I’d pick a nice, quiet island someplace for the flashy yacht full of Yankees.  With so MANY beautiful places on the planet, why take the chance? Larry We fail, miserably, to see how hated we are because of our support for Israel, no matter who they kill, no matter what they do.  You have to live in an Arab country to really feel it.

Response:

Yotties are not tourists – we aren’t treated as tourists in most places, don’t use the same visas, don’t follow the same rules, processes, etc.  Most countries treat yotties same as commercial ships, fishing vessels, etc – crew lists, clearances, paid for visas, etc   They know we don’t stay in hotels, buy loads of tourist crap, spend big in restaurants, etc.  We’re not "respected" and "protected" in the same way at all.  We aren’t part of that industry. On Egypt – many cruising friends have transited the Suez and universally agreed (much to my disappointment) that Egypt is a miserable shithole of a country to cruise.  Big theft and bribe problems. They get through there as quickly as possible with as short and few stops as necessary. It’s much easier and safe to park the boat in Cypress in a marina and fly in/out of Egypt – as a respected and protected tourist. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – [...] It just seems stupid to put the family, the boat and his personal safety in harm’s way flashing that yacht in their faces after 9/11. Middle East changed that day.  Until the "brothers" in Afghanistan get the word spread out that America is NOT the enemy, and saved them from the gangsters who were killing the country, I’d pick a nice, quiet island someplace for the flashy yacht full of Yankees.  With so MANY beautiful places on the planet, why take the chance? Personally, I don’t think it would be all that much of a chance.  At least compared to many other beautiful places people cruise to.  Egypt definitely had a problem a while ago with terrorists attacking visitors.  But from what I’ve heard, they cracked down on them pretty hard.  A large part of their economy is based on tourism, so there’s a big incentive to keep tourists safe. Larry We fail, miserably, to see how hated we are because of our support for Israel, no matter who they kill, no matter what they do.  You have to live in an Arab country to really feel it. That’s just not true for the average person you meet in many Arab countries, including Egypt, especially Egypt. Steve

Response:

[...] It just seems stupid to put the family, the boat and his personal safety in harm’s way flashing that yacht in their faces after 9/11. Middle East changed that day.  Until the "brothers" in Afghanistan get the word spread out that America is NOT the enemy, and saved them from the gangsters who were killing the country, I’d pick a nice, quiet island someplace for the flashy yacht full of Yankees.  With so MANY beautiful places on the planet, why take the chance?

Personally, I don’t think it would be all that much of a chance.  At least compared to many other beautiful places people cruise to.  Egypt definitely had a problem a while ago with terrorists attacking visitors.  But from what I’ve heard, they cracked down on them pretty hard.  A large part of their economy is based on tourism, so there’s a big incentive to keep tourists safe. Larry We fail, miserably, to see how hated we are because of our support for Israel, no matter who they kill, no matter what they do.  You have to live in an Arab country to really feel it.

That’s just not true for the average person you meet in many Arab countries, including Egypt, especially Egypt. Steve

Response:

Last month I sailed a felucca from Aswan to Edfu, so based on limited knowledge of this stretch of water: Draft limitation: most of the cruise boats had a draft of 4 feet or 4′ 6".  Our felucca had a centre board so that we could pull into the bank. Buoyage: Almost non existent.  There are shallows and a few rocks. Local knowledge desirable. Wind:  Prevailing wind in this Southern stretch is Northerly (i.e. against the stream) so one can tack North with the stream or run South against it. Height:  The bridge North of Aswan is not yet complete – awaiting the final span.  When finished this would restrict mast height to that of the big cruise boats (30 – 40 feet at a guess). Formalities: I don’t know details, but almost certainly Yes.  Our felucca captain had to advise the police of our trip. Pleasure:  Definitely!  We swam in the river (no crocs below the High Dam), saw water buffalo, ibises etc.  We found people universally friendly, although a strong feeling that America would do anything to support Israel to the detriment of Arab states. Tony Boas Sadler 34 – Bold Warrior – Southampton, UK.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m curious as to whether it is practical to cruise up and down the Nile R. with a private yacht. Legalities and other hassles: Practical draft limitations: Safety and pleasurability of your reception by the Egyptians: Any other information that may be of interest: —      Mark Anderson – DBA Riparia Resources    www.riparia.org Medical info for cruisers and woodworkers.  Boatbuilding plans. Artistic photography       Landscapes – Nautical and marine – Abstracts, extracts and

themes.

Response:

Irving Johnson did his "TwiLight" cruise through the canals of Europe and up the Nile just before the Aswan dam was complete. I have the video here and it looks like a nice cruise. His boat was about 50 ft and moderate draft (not over 5 ft or he wouldn’t have been able to do the canals of Europe). I went to Egypt for a visit back in the mid 80s while I was working in Saudi Arabia. There was no problem as long as you didn’t have any Israeli stamps in you passport. I would imagine the climate is rather hostle now-a-days. I’d be more worried about stopping in Alexandria or transiting the Red Sea and it wouldn’t be the Egyptions that i would be afraid of. My opinion and experience, FWIW. Steve s/v Good Intentions

Response:

A rich American cruising his flashy yacht in the Middle East…… Now THERE’s a TARGET of OPPORTUNITY for you. Hated by millions of Arabs because of our undying support for the Israeli War Machine…..tearing up Palestinians. Can you answer your own question?  PLEASE DON’T! larry I’d love to back to the Middle East where I lived and worked in Iran, Saudi Arabia, and Bahrain.  But, not now.  Not after 9/11/2001, PLEASE DON"T! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’m curious as to whether it is practical to cruise up and down the Nile R. with a private yacht. Legalities and other hassles: Practical draft limitations: Safety and pleasurability of your reception by the Egyptians: Any other information that may be of interest: —     Mark Anderson – DBA Riparia Resources    www.riparia.org Medical info for cruisers and woodworkers.  Boatbuilding plans. Artistic photography      Landscapes – Nautical and marine – Abstracts, extracts and themes.

Response:

I’m curious as to whether it is practical to cruise up and down the Nile R. with a private yacht. Legalities and other hassles: Practical draft limitations: Safety and pleasurability of your reception by the Egyptians: Any other information that may be of interest: —      Mark Anderson – DBA Riparia Resources    www.riparia.org Medical info for cruisers and woodworkers.  Boatbuilding plans. Artistic photography       Landscapes – Nautical and marine – Abstracts, extracts and themes.

Response:

Question:

It’s the newbies I’m concerned about. I’ll give you a piece of advice: don’t worry about the newbies. They are a dime a dozen.  Novices have died in the outdoors for thousands of years.   Well, it’s the newbie net.ers that I’m talking about, not newbies to the backcountry. Some of these newbies could have some valuable input if they’d stick around the group.

Too big a "could."  Anyone really knowledgeable doesn’t have to stay here. The majority of posters don’t think that they are newbies (they are).   When you *know it all*, you are dead. No more data processing.

Well it’s not quite like that.    "Like a chicken playing a card game". ???   Newbie net.ers cocking their heads and giving them cards a good smart look. Still, a chicken is a bird brain.   I think Sam got the visuals.

Oh! Yeah, last time I played poker with a chicken, I lost all my feathers. Hey, I thought when she lowered her head and did that one eyed blink that she was bluffing, I swear! Need more chlorine in the gene pool.

Chickens do what chickens do best.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s the newbies I’m concerned about. I’ll give you a piece of advice: don’t worry about the newbies. They are a dime a dozen.  Novices have died in the outdoors for thousands of years.    Well, it’s the newbie net.ers that I’m talking about, not newbies to the backcountry. Some of these newbies could have some valuable input if they’d stick around the group. The majority of posters don’t think that they are newbies (they are).    When you *know it all*, you are dead. No more data processing. I have this image of a newbie wandering into traffic on the Information Superhighway, blindfolded. Better than a physical superhighway.    "Like a chicken playing a card game". ???    Newbie net.ers cocking their heads and giving them cards a good smart look. Still, a chicken is a bird brain.    I think Sam got the visuals. Yeah, last time I played poker with a chicken, I lost all my feathers. Hey, I thought when she lowered her head and did that one eyed blink that she was bluffing, I swear! Need more chlorine in the gene pool.    Ed Huesers    http://www.grandshelters.com

More likely too deep a dive in the White Russian Sea, oh well, it happens…<B stoopid G Sam

Response:

It’s the newbies I’m concerned about. I’ll give you a piece of advice: don’t worry about the newbies. They are a dime a dozen.  Novices have died in the outdoors for thousands of years.

   Well, it’s the newbie net.ers that I’m talking about, not newbies to the backcountry. Some of these newbies could have some valuable input if they’d stick around the group. The majority of posters don’t think that they are newbies (they are).

   When you *know it all*, you are dead. No more data processing. I have this image of a newbie wandering into traffic on the Information Superhighway, blindfolded. Better than a physical superhighway.    "Like a chicken playing a card game". ???

   Newbie net.ers cocking their heads and giving them cards a good smart look. Still, a chicken is a bird brain.    I think Sam got the visuals. Yeah, last time I played poker with a chicken, I lost all my feathers. Hey, I thought when she lowered her head and did that one eyed blink that she was bluffing, I swear! Need more chlorine in the gene pool.

   Ed Huesers    http://www.grandshelters.com

Response:

It’s the newbies I’m concerned about.

I’ll give you a piece of advice: don’t worry about the newbies. They are a dime a dozen.  Novices have died in the outdoors for thousands of years.  The majority of posters don’t think that they are newbies (they are). I have this image of a newbie wandering into traffic on the Information Superhighway, blindfolded.

Better than a physical superhighway.    "Like a chicken playing a card game".

??? Yeah, last time I played poker with a chicken, I lost all my feathers. Hey, I thought when she lowered her head and did that one eyed blink that she was bluffing, I swear!

Need more chlorine in the gene pool.

Response:

It’s the newbies I’m concerned about. I have this image of a newbie wandering into traffic on the Information Superhighway, blindfolded.

   "Like a chicken playing a card game".    Ed Huesers

Response:

It’s the newbies I’m concerned about. I have this image of a newbie wandering into traffic on the Information Superhighway, blindfolded.    "Like a chicken playing a card game".    Ed Huesers

Yeah, last time I played poker with a chicken, I lost all my feathers. Hey, I thought when she lowered her head and did that one eyed blink that she was bluffing, I swear! Sam

Response:

DsrtTravlr – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Valley, Sunnyside, Baker Reservoir, Gunlock, Kane Springs Wash, Rainbow Canyon, Beaver Dam State Park, Desert National Wildlife Refuge, Bird Springs Range, Monitor Valley, West Grand Canyon, Gold Strike Hot Springs, Gold Butte, Delmar Playas, Tikapoo Peak and Area 51, Sharktooth Hill, Christmas Tree Pass, Piute Springs, Cold Creek, Death Valley, Lovell Canyon, Hurricane Cliffs, Virgin Canyon, Tassi Ranch, Aquarius Plateau, Box Death Hollow Wilderness Area, Kaibab Plateau, Kolob Reservoir, River Mountain Trail, <snip, snip, snip. Need I go on?  You could go to a different place every weekend for five years and not hit the same place twice. Go to Mercury Blueprint at Sahara and Highland and get the $15 DOT Nevada State Book of Maps.  It will show you most secondary roads in Nevada.  Join an outdoors group, or hook up with some people who go out, or just get off the couch and go explore.  Nevada has the highest percentage of federal land in the continental US, and there are few fences. Of course, you might wait until the weather cools off.  And then do these things…… take plenty of water, some extra food, tools and repair items and enough warm gear.  Tell someone where you are going, and when you will be back. Leave a map with them.  Nevada has incredible search and rescue, and it is a simple matter if they know where you will be.  If something happens, just stay with your vehicle, and wait for help.  Almost everyone who has died in the desert has tried to walk out instead of staying with the car.  Learn about desert critters, plants, and flash floods….. one of which we had

yesterday. Steve, I sent a copy of this to my neice who is moving to LV.  Thanks, it’s a good long list and I especially wanted her (family) to read the extra precautionary notes you included.  Nobody understands the desert until they have lived it for awhile and finally when they think they do it will surprise them… Bill

Response:

  I use netscape which does have the capability but I choose to use my brain to filter.   It’s the newbies I’m concerned about.

I have this image of a newbie wandering into traffic on the Information Superhighway, blindfolded. Happy trails, Gary "In three words I can sum up everything I’ve learned about life: it goes on." -Robert Frost- Gary D. Schwartz, Needham, MA, USA Please reply to: garyDOTschwartzATpoboxDOTcom

Response:

Flood the group with ON-topic posts.

   Oh, I try. I even resort to jokes once in a while. Ignore the off topic stuff. Some posters are difficult because they also post useful things. Others can be entirely ignored.

   Ack. Think of this as incentive to get a newsreader with filtering.

   I use netscape which does have the capability but I choose to use my brain to filter.    It’s the newbies I’m concerned about.    Ed Huesers

Response:

You are kidding, right?  I grew up in Las Vegas, and there are a zillion places within the three to five hours you mention where you can go and not hardly see another human.   You say you are "told" that some places are overrun with tourists.  Don’t believe everything you are told.  While it is entirely true SOME TIMES IN THE YEAR, even those places have their seasons, and going there the other times of the year is very uncrowded.  There are many many places around here where one can go camping out in the boonies on BLM land and have peace and privacy.  Just look around.   Valley, Sunnyside, Baker Reservoir, Gunlock, Kane Springs Wash, Rainbow Canyon, Beaver Dam State Park, Desert National Wildlife Refuge, Bird Springs Range, Monitor Valley, West Grand Canyon, Gold Strike Hot Springs, Gold Butte, Delmar Playas, Tikapoo Peak and Area 51, Sharktooth Hill, Christmas Tree Pass, Piute Springs, Cold Creek, Death Valley, Lovell Canyon, Hurricane Cliffs, Virgin Canyon, Tassi Ranch, Aquarius Plateau, Box Death Hollow Wilderness Area, Kaibab Plateau, Kolob Reservoir, River Mountain Trail, <snip, snip, snip. Need I go on?  You could go to a different place every weekend for five years and not hit the same place twice. Go to Mercury Blueprint at Sahara and Highland and get the $15 DOT Nevada State Book of Maps.  It will show you most secondary roads in Nevada.  Join an outdoors group, or hook up with some people who go out, or just get off the couch and go explore.  Nevada has the highest percentage of federal land in the continental US, and there are few fences.   Of course, you might wait until the weather cools off.  And then do these things…… take plenty of water, some extra food, tools and repair items and enough warm gear.  Tell someone where you are going, and when you will be back. Leave a map with them.  Nevada has incredible search and rescue, and it is a simple matter if they know where you will be.  If something happens, just stay with your vehicle, and wait for help.  Almost everyone who has died in the desert has tried to walk out instead of staying with the car.  Learn about desert critters, plants, and flash floods….. one of which we had yesterday. You can e mail me if you need any particulars.  And anyone else who reads this.  The area around here is awesome, and most people don’t even know it is there. I like it like that. Steve Pat O’Connell writes: We just moved to the Las Vegas area, though we don’t have a "permanent" home just yet–still house hunting. Summer is obviously not a good time to be outdoors here, unless we head for Mt. Charleston. What else is within a short (say within 3 to 5 hours) drive of here that’s worth visiting and hiking in summer? Zion, Bryce Canyon, etc. are that close, but I’m told are overrun with tourists. — Pat O’Connell Take nothing but pictures, Leave nothing but footprints, Kill nothing but vandals…

               ~ Illegitimi Non Carborundum ~

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – then suddenly we have collectivist look-alikes invading from one side while the jackbooted sound-alikes push in from the opposite side.  There’s a movie locked up inside this scenario Dodo’s?   If you mean extinct, yes.   I can make an educated guess and say that the readership of the group is only 20% of what it was.   Ed Huesers Flood the group with ON-topic posts. Ignore the off topic stuff. Some posters are difficult because they also post useful things. Others can be entirely ignored. Think of this as incentive to get a newsreader with filtering.

Here’s the first shot: We just moved to the Las Vegas area, though we don’t have a "permanent" home just yet–still house hunting. Summer is obviously not a good time to be outdoors here, unless we head for Mt. Charleston. What else is within a short (say within 3 to 5 hours) drive of here that’s worth visiting and hiking in summer? Zion, Bryce Canyon, etc. are that close, but I’m told are overrun with tourists. — Pat O’Connell Take nothing but pictures, Leave nothing but footprints, Kill nothing but vandals…

Response:

: The newsgroup rec.outdoors.national-parks was the same way until quite : recently. The posts were at least 75% political in nature. After looking at the subject list of r.o.n-p again (first time I’ve read it for a while) it seems to be back to its old self  unfortunately. There should be an alt.politics.environment newsgroup we could banish these people to, if there’s not already.

The group is named talk.environment. It is useful to know the hierarchy. It could have been talk.politics.environment. That’s not the issue.  As I informed Moore who proposed sci.environnment s.e. should be moderated and as he admitted it was an "I told you so." Can’t banish people. Nothing wrong with politics. And there’s no reason you can’t send followups there if you know how.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – then suddenly we have collectivist look-alikes invading from one side while the jackbooted sound-alikes push in from the opposite side.  There’s a movie locked up inside this scenario    "Birds Of A Feather". Lee wrote Maybe more like Hitchcock’s "The Birds"…: ) Dodo’s?    If you mean extinct, yes.    I can make an educated guess and say that the readership of the group is only 20% of what it was.    Ed Huesers

Yeah, but Ed, we’re the dedicated 20%. Survive we will. Sam Benson

Response:

then suddenly we have collectivist look-alikes invading from one side while the jackbooted sound-alikes push in from the opposite side.  There’s a movie locked up inside this scenario Dodo’s?   If you mean extinct, yes.   I can make an educated guess and say that the readership of the group is only 20% of what it was.   Ed Huesers

Flood the group with ON-topic posts. Ignore the off topic stuff. Some posters are difficult because they also post useful things. Others can be entirely ignored. Think of this as incentive to get a newsreader with filtering. Happy trails, Gary "In three words I can sum up everything I’ve learned about life: it goes on." -Robert Frost- Gary D. Schwartz, Needham, MA, USA Please reply to: garyDOTschwartzATpoboxDOTcom

Response:

I can make an educated guess and say that the readership of the group is only 20% of what it was. I don’t know about number of readers but my reading is about 20% of what it was.

   Well, I’m basing it on our web page counter.    You guys, the core of the group, aren’t going to check our site because you’ve probably been there enough already. The lurkers are also likely to have the same situation.    It’s the newbies that’ll check it and some of them are the core group of tomorrow. All I see is just another swing of the pendulum.  It’s been both better and worse in the past.

   Yeah, I can try and believe in that but this pendulum arm must be a long one. I just wait until it passes.

   Well, it’s a long wait. I was waiting for the election to get over with all last summer. The thing about emotionally laden postings is that it’s hard to maintain righteous fervor over an extended period [with one notable exception] so they tend to flame for months then vanish.

   "Exception" noted and I have to chuckle as it seems that even he has backed off due to his posts getting lost in the pile.  It’s just as bad in other groups, right now others I’m reading are civil but that wasn’t the case last year.

   Well, I suppose it’s the fact that I used to participate in r.o.n-p. until about 2 years ago and the group was doing great. Then along they came and destroyed the group.    Now, after destroying the group, they’ve moved over here.    Ed Huesers

Response:

[snip]   If you mean extinct, yes.   I can make an educated guess and say that the readership of the group is only 20% of what it was.   Ed Huesers

I don’t know about number of readers but my reading is about 20% of what it was.  All I see is just another swing of the pendulum.  It’s been both better and worse in the past.  I just wait until it passes. The thing about emotionally laden postings is that it’s hard to maintain righteous fervor over an extended period [with one notable exception] so they tend to flame for months then vanish.   It’s just as bad in other groups, right now others I’m reading are civil but that wasn’t the case last year.

Response:

: The newsgroup rec.outdoors.national-parks was the same way until quite : recently. The posts were at least 75% political in nature. After looking at the subject list of r.o.n-p again (first time I’ve read it for a while) it seems to be back to its old self  unfortunately. There should be an alt.politics.environment newsgroup we could banish these people to, if there’s not already. Michael

Response:

: Yeah, and falling fast probably.  It really isn’t the same group it was. : Look at groups.google.com and see what the topics were back in the : 1990’s : : Only about half of the posts are related to the backcountry.  Now this : is an unmoderated group. ALL things are on topic. But whet drew me (and : I suspect most) others to this group was the work backcountry. I do not : subscribe to any political groups, because I’m not interested in : caricatured liberal and conservative attacking each other. The newsgroup rec.outdoors.national-parks was the same way until quite recently. The posts were at least 75% political in nature. Some of the group members got fed up and complained to the offending persons’ ISPs for violating the newsgroup charter and they were forced to stop posting there. I’ve heard that’s what happened anyway. Most of those posts were being cross-posted here, and many of the political posts here are from the same people that posted there. The concentration here has definitely increased since r.o.n-p was "clensed". Maybe we need a similar rebellion here? Michael — Michael Caver Photography http://photos.mcaver.com/

Response:

 I can make an educated guess and say that the readership of the group is only 20% of what it was.

Yeah, and falling fast probably.  It really isn’t the same group it was. Look at groups.google.com and see what the topics were back in the 1990’s As I wrote that I wondered myself. Here are the titles from a randomly selected day in Jult  1998: 06 Jul 1998    Where to buy white kerosene in the US?

Question:

after two years of research and fishing i can now say with some authority,that yes,thick lip mullet,and golden grey mullet can be tackled on fly gear. i personally took numerous fish to 5lb 10oz last season here in Jersey (channel islands). we fish a place here on the south east that is best described as a tidal saltwater wetland. tides are large and racey,and they cannot be fished unless local knowedge is available. they behave much like bonefish,but with some marked differences.water temp, wind etc all playing a big factor,like with most species. I have read here that people have tried and failed with this species,but rest assured it can be done,and repeated. I`ll keep you all updated,with catch reports throughout the current season. — Keith.

Response:

Keith: If you had asked two years ago I coulda saved you the time. Floridians (those in the know) been catching mullet by cast net, seine, spinning tackle, and fly for a long time. Fact is in the old days they were a staple here. I’ve personally caught many with spin and fly. They are running little buggers and will come close to stripping all your backing off just as quick as you can set. Don’t know how it is now but they used to bunch up at the spill way after the rodman dam was built. (thats in the Oklawaha river before it empties into the St.Johns across from Buffalo Bluff near seven sisters islands just a tad south of Palatka. John Popp in Sanford Fl.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – after two years of research and fishing i can now say with some authority,that yes,thick lip mullet,and golden grey mullet can be tackled on fly gear. i personally took numerous fish to 5lb 10oz last season here in Jersey (channel islands). we fish a place here on the south east that is best described as a tidal saltwater wetland. tides are large and racey,and they cannot be fished unless local knowedge is available. they behave much like bonefish,but with some marked differences.water temp, wind etc all playing a big factor,like with most species. I have read here that people have tried and failed with this species,but rest assured it can be done,and repeated. I`ll keep you all updated,with catch reports throughout the current season. — Keith.

Response:

Hi John, What kind of flies and how do you fish for the mullet? aloha, Fred E. Nakaguma Aiea, Hawaii – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Keith: If you had asked two years ago I coulda saved you the time. Floridians (those in the know) been catching mullet by cast net, seine, spinning tackle, and fly for a long time. Fact is in the old days they were a staple here. I’ve personally caught many with spin and fly. They are running little buggers and will come close to stripping all your backing off just as quick as you can set. Don’t know how it is now but they used to bunch up at the spill way after the rodman dam was built. (thats in the Oklawaha river before it empties into the St.Johns across from Buffalo Bluff near seven sisters islands just a tad south of Palatka. John Popp in Sanford Fl.

– Fred E. Nakaguma Aiea, Hawaii

Response:

Keith: If you had asked two years ago I coulda saved you the time. Floridians (those in the know) been catching mullet by cast net, seine, spinning tackle, and fly for a long time. Fact is in the old days they were a staple here. I’ve personally caught many with spin and fly. They are running little buggers and will come close to stripping all your backing off just as quick as you can set. Don’t know how it is now but they used to bunch up at the spill way after the rodman dam was built. (thats in the Oklawaha river before it empties into the St.Johns across from Buffalo Bluff near seven sisters islands just a tad south of Palatka. John Popp in Sanford Fl.

My thoughts exactly regarding line catching.  Heck, for years, they were considered the worst of trash fish, from Mississippi around and down, even to the point of racial slurs.  Plus, in oyster season (cold weather), keep a few, gut them and slow smoke them head-on, bone-in over a hickory or equivilent (fruitwoods aren’t my favorite here) fire.  Then flake the flesh (no skin) and mix with cream cheese (about 1 to 1), Lea and Perrin (Worchestershire), thyme, salt, pepper, and lemon juice, and serve with Melba, Carr’s, or other firmer crackers and cold dry white wine. Yum, boy… R

Response:

Ok,Ok,OK, now that we know they can be caught…tell us what flies to use!! Very frustrating when fishing and see a 6-9 pounder jump and there is nothing I can do to hook it. Chuck

Response:

Ok,Ok,OK, now that we know they can be caught…tell us what flies to use!! Very frustrating when fishing and see a 6-9 pounder jump and there is nothing I can do to hook it. Chuck

here you go. The answer is neutral density. as you know mullet sift through sand and mud,and get their heads down to feed,and this is also true of our golden grey mullet. these fish operate on the very edge of the tide,sometimes in 5-6 inches of water,so you actually cast back to the shore,from maybe 75 feet,so as not to spook the fish or shoal. the fly is cast approx 5-6 feet in front of the feeding pattern, and this is something which is learned,as on different tides the fish often take different routes toward shore. but to cut a very long story short,a well presented fly in the size 10 and smaller size range is best. Bent back,and using a basically dusky dirty pink,body of wool,with plastic bead chain eyes,and with a trigger colored tail. i cannot really get more specific at this stage,but presentation,seems more important than shape,and color seems to be a factor also. in water thats less than 6 feet a red tail is effective,but in very shallow water a lime green tail is king. throughout the year,i`ll get the patterns standardised and publish them. along with the techniques required foer each fly. I know you americans loathe the mullet somewhat,but they are indeed a worthy quarry,in fact as hard to catch as any permit. I know,cause i`ve caught both,and they can be very very frustrating. — Keith.

Response:

Ok,Ok,OK, now that we know they can be caught…tell us what flies to use!! Very frustrating when fishing and see a 6-9 pounder jump and there is nothing I can do to hook it. Chuck

Well, maybe I misunderstood Mr Popp, but when I’ve caught them or seen them caught, it was by accident while fishing for something else.  I have no idea, other the a cast net, (when we want a couple to smoke ourselves ((Rather than buying)), we’ll carry a net while floundering) what one would use SPECIFICALLY to catch them.  I guess use a shrimp or streamer and pretend you’re after redfish or striped bass….a bone pattern and pretend you’re after bones….<G? R

Response:

good advice SNIPPED for bw.. I know you americans loathe the mullet somewhat,but they are indeed a worthy quarry,in fact as hard to catch as any permit. I know,cause i`ve caught both,and they can be very very frustrating. — Keith.

I’ll be damned!  I know of many old-timers that would be (be)mused…Fly-fishing specifically for mullet…hey, fishing is fishing, and this sounds fun, plus you can eat the catch…The only thing I can add is the above-mentioned pretense of being after game fish, as that usually insures at least one or two…<G.   One thought, however, is possible that we are talking about different species of fish?  I know of white and striped, but not golden, plus your mention of "hard to catch as any permit."  Your "mullet" isn’t some form of Pompano, is it? TC, R

Response:

Catching mullet on a fly is easily accomplished by chuming them with small bread balls and using small white/grey flies to immitate the bread balls. It is true that large mullet will take line, but they tire very quickly and are not at all like a bonefish. Bob E. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – after two years of research and fishing i can now say with some authority,that yes,thick lip mullet,and golden grey mullet can be tackled on fly gear. i personally took numerous fish to 5lb 10oz last season here in Jersey (channel islands). we fish a place here on the south east that is best described as a tidal saltwater wetland. tides are large and racey,and they cannot be fished unless local knowedge is available. they behave much like bonefish,but with some marked differences.water temp, wind etc all playing a big factor,like with most species. I have read here that people have tried and failed with this species,but rest assured it can be done,and repeated. I`ll keep you all updated,with catch reports throughout the current season. — Keith.

Response:

Catching mullet on a fly is easily accomplished by chuming them with small bread balls and using small white/grey flies to immitate the bread balls. It is true that large mullet will take line, but they tire very quickly and are not at all like a bonefish. Bob E.

Ah,yes you can catch mullet like this,but is it really fly fishing ?. i think not. you could also toss a hand grenade at the mullet,and stun them,walk on over and scoop them up in your hand. Unfortunatly,this would not be too much fun,for me or the mullet. I`m actually taking a purists view,that fly caught fish should be just that.Fly caught without the assistance of chum,or any other aid. One rod,one fly,one fish. At least thats the way i like to do it. Also in no way would i compare the fighting qualities to that of bonefish. i was refering to the habits of the fish. but then again,on the right gear,which seems to be a 6#wt outfit,they display fine fighting ability. Its like comparing a stock rainbow trout that weighs 8lb,and last saw a man feeding it trout pellets,to the wild rainbow of the mountain stream that weighs only 2lb. ask yourself which would be the better and most rewarding catch ?. Thats why i choose to flyfish in saltwater here.Its never been done on my doorstep,and its all a new and very rewarding experience,no matter what the species. — Keith.

Response:

Want to catch mullet on a fly without chuming? There’s a way to do that too. It’s much more challenging than the bread ball trick. Ask (better yet, hire) Capt. Steve Kantner from the Fort Lauderdale area. He’s the expert. Bob E. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Catching mullet on a fly is easily accomplished by chuming them with small bread balls and using small white/grey flies to immitate the bread balls. It is true that large mullet will take line, but they tire very quickly and are not at all like a bonefish. Bob E. Ah,yes you can catch mullet like this,but is it really fly fishing ?. i think not. you could also toss a hand grenade at the mullet,and stun them,walk on over and scoop them up in your hand. Unfortunatly,this would not be too much fun,for me or the mullet. I`m actually taking a purists view,that fly caught fish should be just that.Fly caught without the assistance of chum,or any other aid. One rod,one fly,one fish. At least thats the way i like to do it. Also in no way would i compare the fighting qualities to that of bonefish. i was refering to the habits of the fish. but then again,on the right gear,which seems to be a 6#wt outfit,they display fine fighting ability. Its like comparing a stock rainbow trout that weighs 8lb,and last saw a man feeding it trout pellets,to the wild rainbow of the mountain stream that weighs only 2lb. ask yourself which would be the better and most rewarding catch ?. Thats why i choose to flyfish in saltwater here.Its never been done on my doorstep,and its all a new and very rewarding experience,no matter what the species. — Keith.

Response:

Any small brown subsurface fly works. They are normally vegetarian but will on occasion think a fly floating vegetation. If it is slow going you can start a feeding frenzy with chicken feed. Take a handful, dip your hand in the water and mash the feed into a ball. Throw it out into the water. When the swirls are hot and heavy flip the fly into the melee and hang on. John Popp in Sanford Fl. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi John, What kind of flies and how do you fish for the mullet? aloha, Fred E. Nakaguma Aiea, Hawaii Keith: If you had asked two years ago I coulda saved you the time. Floridians (those in the know) been catching mullet by cast net, seine, spinning tackle, and fly for a long time. Fact is in the old days they were a staple here. I’ve personally caught many with spin and fly. They are running little buggers and will come close to stripping all your backing off just as quick as you can set. Don’t know how it is now but they used to bunch up at the spill way after the rodman dam was built. (thats in the Oklawaha river before it empties into the St.Johns across from Buffalo Bluff near seven sisters islands just a tad south of Palatka. John Popp in Sanford Fl. — Fred E. Nakaguma Aiea, Hawaii

Response:

When they are jumping they are ridding themselves of vermin and don’t give a fig for eating. Ever try to get a dog to do something in the middle of a flea scratch ? John Popp in Sanford Fl.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ok,Ok,OK, now that we know they can be caught…tell us what flies to use!! Very frustrating when fishing and see a 6-9 pounder jump and there is nothing I can do to hook it. Chuck

Response:

SNIPPED Heck, for years, they were considered the worst of trash fish, from Mississippi around and down, even to the point of racial slurs

Funny isn’t it! – Same thing the world over. If we fished near a sewer outlet, we used to laugh about catching a "blind mullet". Cheers JK

Response:

Question:

And Sandy, while occasionally getting snippy with one or another poster on roff, doesn’t hold a grudge forever and ever and go on and on.  Something to be learned there, I am sure.

Well, he can dish it out too, Rick.  The reason I really want to track him down in Montana is that I was his principal victim in one of the all-time great ROFF scams.  Do you remember (say, 1996 or so, on April Fools day) when Sandy posted an extended "quote" from the Missoula newspaper, reporting that the Big Hole had disappeared into the Rhone Puolanec (spelling ?) mine?  Perhaps it was because I had fished in that vicinity, but I fell for it completely.  By the end of the day, half the population of Pennsylvania had heard the "news". After I fish with him and buy him a few brews, I intend to wring his scrawny neck Mark Faulkner, holding a grudge forever and ever.

Response:

 Chained flies are far less prone to tangling than dropper flies, plus they are easier to cast. Try fishing a large grasshopper as a strike indicator (bobber) that catches fish, followed by one, two or three nymphs. Why use a pink foam indicator when you can use a grasshopper?

  I use this method, but three _dries_ daisy chained  has me wondering Drag must be a problem or is the water type such that drag is not an issue. Seems to me three dries on loops would be a nightmare to cast. One large and two small might be workable . Got to try it when I am full of patience. Harry

Response:

take a quick look at http://www.montana-riverboats.com/bhsf.html

An X- rated picture, that’s for sure. Mark faulkner

Response:

God bless the Parachute Adams!  Usually my first (and only) choice. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was down at Silver Creek, south of Ketchum Idaho last week. For those who don’t know, it’s a semi-famous spring creek, loaded with birds, big fish and well-equipped, competative-agressive flyfishermen. It is a beautiful stream. Moreover I was lucky to get there just in time for its legendary Brown Drake hatch…which only lasts for 5-10 days. (now over).   The big drakes hatch at night, starting just at dark, limited to those parts of the stream with enough silt to support their silt-loving nymphs. PUNCHLINE:   As dark approached, I shared the stream with wall-to-wall fishermen. It reminded my of openning day in New Jersey. I almost left. But once the hatch started, I forgot all complaints. Billions of mayflies as big as your thumb brought thousands of fish to the surface. The birds went nuts. I fished three dry flies simultaneously, and outfished everyone in sight. I caught a fish every third cast for nearly two hours.   I had a huge drake on, followed by a stimulator, followed by a #12 parachute adams. The drake made it easy to find my fly in the diminishing light. But nearly all the fish I caught took the #12 adams…despite the presense of billions of #4 mayflies. A few took the stimulator. Only one fish all   night took the big drake pattern. Everyone else around me fished big drake patterns, and despite the profusion of bugs….most of them worked hard for 2-3 fish. I must have caught close to 30. That’s fishin…

– I am who I am.  I am who I’ve learned to be.  I am Nothing.

Response:

God bless the Parachute Adams!  Usually my first (and only) choice.

I have to agree with that…the Adams seems to work pretty much everywhere. I caught a nice fat 18" rainbow on X creek just the other day using a #18 adams. -Greg – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was down at Silver Creek, south of Ketchum Idaho last week. For those who don’t know, it’s a semi-famous spring creek, loaded with birds, big fish and well-equipped, competative-agressive flyfishermen. It is a beautiful stream. Moreover I was lucky to get there just in time for its legendary Brown Drake hatch…which only lasts for 5-10 days. (now over).   The big drakes hatch at night, starting just at dark, limited to those parts of the stream with enough silt to support their silt-loving nymphs. PUNCHLINE:   As dark approached, I shared the stream with wall-to-wall fishermen. It reminded my of openning day in New Jersey. I almost left. But once the hatch started, I forgot all complaints. Billions of mayflies as big as your thumb brought thousands of fish to the surface. The birds went nuts. I fished three dry flies simultaneously, and outfished everyone in sight. I caught a fish every third cast for nearly two hours.   I had a huge drake on, followed by a stimulator, followed by a #12 parachute adams. The drake made it easy to find my fly in the diminishing light. But nearly all the fish I caught took the #12 adams…despite the presense of billions of #4 mayflies. A few took the stimulator. Only one fish all night took the big drake pattern. Everyone else around me fished big drake patterns, and despite the profusion of bugs….most of them worked hard for 2-3 fish. I must have caught close to 30. That’s fishin… — I am who I am.  I am who I’ve learned to be.  I am Nothing.

Response:

— I am who I am.  I am who I’ve learned to be.  I am Nothing.

        atta boy, richard; an early entry into the quarter-finals of the john asadi amazing post of the year award. wayno

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – God bless the Parachute Adams!  Usually my first (and only) choice. I was down at Silver Creek, south of Ketchum Idaho last week. For those who don’t know, it’s a semi-famous spring creek, loaded with birds, big fish and well-equipped, competative-agressive flyfishermen. It is a beautiful stream. Moreover I was lucky to get there just in time for its legendary Brown Drake hatch…which only lasts for 5-10 days. (now over).   The big drakes hatch at night, starting just at dark, limited to those parts of the stream with enough silt to support their silt-loving nymphs. PUNCHLINE:   As dark approached, I shared the stream with wall-to-wall fishermen. It reminded my of openning day in New Jersey. I almost left. But once the hatch started, I forgot all complaints. Billions of mayflies as big as your thumb brought thousands of fish to the surface. The birds went nuts. I fished three dry flies simultaneously,

and outfished everyone in sight.

I caught a fish every third cast for nearly two hours.   I had a huge drake on, followed by a stimulator, followed by a #12 parachute adams. The drake made it easy to find my fly in the diminishing light. But nearly all the fish I caught took the #12 adams…despite the presense of billions of #4 mayflies.

Hatch. A few took the stimulator. Only one fish all night took the big drake pattern. Everyone else around me fished big drake patterns, and despite the profusion of bugs….most of them worked hard for 2-3 fish. I must have caught close to 30. That’s fishin… — I am who I am.  I am who I’ve learned to be.  I am Nothing but a trot line fly fisherman.

______  I’m pleased you had a happy evening kind sir.  I wish I knew why they took the Adams instead.  Curious. — Mr. G. "Gink Keeps It Up" http://www.gink.com

Question:

Looking for info for group trip of about 12-18 people for fishing in August & Sept.

Response:

You can’t do better than Mike Lawson’s at Henry’s Fork.  He and his guys can take you into Montana, Yellowstone and fish the better parts of easter ID. Wonderful guides, all of them.  Henry’s Fork Lodge can handle your group in very nice style.  The best fishing I’ve done in years. SAB – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Looking for info for group trip of about 12-18 people for fishing in August & Sept.

Response:

Hi: I second the recomendation to Mike Lawson’s shop.  I took a trip with Mike Smith, Smitty, this summer and had a great time.  However, the shop is more expensive than any of the others in the area, so be aware.  The shop has a web site, I don’s know the url but know it is listed at www.davisbrown.com/fflnk.html Chris Brown

Response:

Question:

The main thing is, beef up your terminal gear. 0X fluorocarbon is a greatchoice. Nine foot is a goo length, tapered. Intermediate shooting head seems to be better than a floater – cuts wind and waves better. Charlies and gotchas are usually good, but when in doubt and in the usual 3-4 ft of water, I tie on a lightly weighted size 2 ultrashrimp. Nice chunk of meat substitute for big bones. Probably too big if the water is shallow. The Battenkill is a tough call. I caught bones on a Battenkill 8/9, but took care to clean out the salt afterward. If you hook a 9-10 lb bone, you might get spooled. I caught a 29 inch bone in Aruba (9.5lbs?) that almost spooled me with an Abel 3 reel (8wt head, 100 ft running line, 200 yds 30lb dacron backing). Think about it. One other thing: Before you make cast number one, just stand still and watch the ebb and flow of the water around you for 10 – 15 minutes (if you can stand it). Bones are like trout – find their feeding lanes and cruising lanes, and cast where they live. Be prepared for the time of your life. Salt water can ALMOST spoil you for anything else. FlyFisherRay

Response:

I have never been bonefishing before and I’m wondering if any of you have any advice for me. I have an 8wt Sage and regular floating line on a Orvis Battenkill reel. I don’t own any bonefish flies. I am wondering what I will need to make my trip this C-mas to the Bay islands of Honduras a successfull one. Will a regular floating line work? What type of leader size and length is typical? Can I wade in TEVAs or tennis shoes? Should I bring a 6wt rod as well? Has anyone been to or heard anything about the Bay islands? We will be at the largest one called Roatan or something like that. Any advice I could get that would help me get my first Bone would be appreciated. What about barracuda? I know some of you out there have experience in the salt, won’t you help a poor landlocked chump out? Brady

Hi Brady, Your outfit will be fine. I would get the stiffest 9′ 0x knot less tapered leaders with matching 0x tippet material. Use a bead eyed Charlie type bonefish fly for sand bottoms and a snapping shrimp type pattern for turtle grass flats. good colors are brown, tan, olive and pink. Take some small crab imitations in tan or olive for permit. Get a long needle fish imitation with a wire leader for cudas. I always take some light colored small/medium salt water poppers and some small/medium salt water streamers. A hat, Polarized glasses and sun screen are important.  Casting skill is very important in salt water fly fishing, so be sure to work on that a bit. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY www.kiene.com

Response:

I’ve been to Belize a few times but not Honduras. The 8wt should be fine but the Battenkill reel probably won’t hold up. Get a disk drag saltwater reel (SA System 2 or equivalent at least). The line should be OK too but there are some special lines made for salt water that you should look at. They tend to be more of a shooting taper and a little stiffer so they don’t sag as much in hot weather. I have had the best luck with Crazy Charlies and Permit Puffs as flies. For barracuda try a needlefish imitation and strip _real_ fast with both hands. As far as wading, it depends on the bottom. Some flats are very soft and can’t be waded very well. I fished primarily from a boat in Belize. Have a great time and try to see some ruins as well. I have never been bonefishing before and I’m wondering if any of you have any advice for me. I have an 8wt Sage and regular floating line on a Orvis Battenkill reel. I don’t own any bonefish flies. I am wondering what I will need to make my trip this C-mas to the Bay islands of Honduras a successfull one. Will a regular floating line work? What type of leader size and length is typical? Can I wade in TEVAs or tennis shoes? Should I bring a 6wt rod as well? Has anyone been to or heard anything about the Bay islands? We will be at the largest one called Roatan or something like that. Any advice I could get that would help me get my first Bone would be appreciated. What about barracuda? I know some of you out there have experience in the salt, won’t you help a poor landlocked chump out? Brady

– Charlie…

Response:

I have never been bonefishing before and I’m wondering if any of you have any advice for me. I have an 8wt Sage and regular floating line on a Orvis Battenkill reel. I don’t own any bonefish flies. I am wondering what I will need to make my trip this C-mas to the Bay islands of Honduras a successfull one. Will a regular floating line work? What type of leader size and length is typical? Can I wade in TEVAs or tennis shoes? Should I bring a 6wt rod as well? Has anyone been to or heard anything about the Bay islands? We will be at the largest one called Roatan or something like that. Any advice I could get that would help me get my first Bone would be appreciated. What about barracuda? I know some of you out there have experience in the salt, won’t you help a poor landlocked chump out?  Brady

Response:

Question:

Im looking for 3 patterns:  Bitch Creek, Yuk Bug, and a North Platte Special.  Any info would be greatly appreciated as I am fairly new to tying my own flies.  You can respond to the e-mail listed below: Again thanks for your help!

Response:

I’d suggest you spring for the Umpaqua Fly Pattern book, it has at least the first two. Not sure about the NP special. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Im looking for 3 patterns:  Bitch Creek, Yuk Bug, and a North Platte Special.  Any info would be greatly appreciated as I am fairly new to tying my own flies.  You can respond to the e-mail listed below: Again thanks for your help!

Response:

Im looking for 3 patterns:  Bitch Creek, Yuk Bug, and a North Platte Special.  Any info would be greatly appreciated as I am fairly new to tying my own flies.  You can respond to the e-mail listed below: Again thanks for your help!

That’s what fly fishing catalogues are for!  Between Kaufmann’s, Orvis, and LLBean (ugly flies in that one!) you can find a whole bunch of flies to copy

Response:

Question:

I recently began tying dry fly wings with antron yarn. Antron is a very easy material to work with. It provides a good silhouette and rigid post for parachute patterns. Divided and down wings are easy to tie with little bulk making the tying of smaller flies simpler with better proportion as well. Comparaduns are a breeze. Antron wings look aesthetically pleasing and appear to be somewhat translucent and light reflective at the same time. In short, antron seems too good to be true. Being that it’s -30  C outside as I write this, it is unlikely I will be able to test these flies for a few months yet. In the meantime, I’d like to tie flyboxes full of antron dries, but before I go whole hog on antron, I need to know if they fish as good as they look. Thanks Guy

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I recently began tying dry fly wings with antron yarn. Antron is a very easy material to work with. It provides a good silhouette and rigid post for parachute patterns. Divided and down wings are easy to tie with little bulk making the tying of smaller flies simpler with better proportion as well. Comparaduns are a breeze. Antron wings look aesthetically pleasing and appear to be somewhat translucent and light reflective at the same time. In short, antron seems too good to be true. Being that it’s -30  C outside as I write this, it is unlikely I will be able to test these flies for a few months yet. In the meantime, I’d like to tie flyboxes full of antron dries, but before I go whole hog on antron, I need to know if they fish as good as they look. Thanks Guy

Guy, I tried a similar tactic a couple of years ago using Orvis poly-wing material (usually used for spinner wings) which isn’t too different from antron.  Being a rather impatient and lazy tier I found this material easy and fast to use for tying upright wings. As a wing post for parachute patterns I found it worked well and fished as effectively as any other parachute patterns. I had the most hope for Comparaduns tied with this material because I fish them a lot, again partly because of the ease and speed of tying. However, these were not very effective at all.  During the summer of ‘95 I tried Comparaduns tied with this material alongside the standards and for some yet undetermined reason they just were not as effective.  This was not a very scientific experiment because of limited trips and I didn’t have any friends try them; so take my findings for whatever they are worth.  They were tried for the Hendrickson, Sulfur and various BWO hatches. I would encourage you to tie enough antron Comparaduns for an experiment and please let me know how they fish. Good luck, Steve

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I recently began tying dry fly wings with antron yarn. Antron is a very to tie flyboxes full of antron dries, but before I go whole hog on antron, I need to know if they fish as good as they look. I use antron on wet flies with partridge or hen soft hackle.  The flies are a real killer.  The antron seems to trap air bubbles and looks traslucent to the fish (more life like I suppose).  I catch some big fish on them. -Burton

DEAR BURTON: Would you send me a small sample of this new material to look at? Gehrke’s Gink Snake River – Hell’s Canyon Asotin, WA 99402 Would appreciate it. George — MZ

Response:

I recently began tying dry fly wings with antron yarn. Antron is a very to tie flyboxes full of antron dries, but before I go whole hog on antron, I need to know if they fish as good as they look.

I use antron on wet flies with partridge or hen soft hackle.  The flies are a real killer.  The antron seems to trap air bubbles and looks traslucent to the fish (more life like I suppose).  I catch some big fish on them. -Burton

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I use antron on wet flies with partridge or hen soft hackle.  The flies are a real killer.  The antron seems to trap air bubbles and looks traslucent to the fish (more life like I suppose).  I catch some big fish on them. -Burton DEAR BURTON: Would you send me a small sample of this new material to look at? Gehrke’s Gink Snake River – Hell’s Canyon Asotin, WA 99402 Would appreciate it. George

George: you can probably find a sample under your feet – it’s a pretty common synthetic carpet fibre that’s been used for flytying for at least 5 years or more. You’ll also find it sold as "sparkle yarn", etc… I’m actually surprised you never heard of this stuff (and that you didn’t invent it! ;^) Cheers! /dave

Response:

Went through an antron phase a couple of years ago. Overall the dries that I tied fished OK its hard to say whether or not they made a real difference. I think that the smaller flies that I tied worked well with antron wings. These were small gnats size 22 and 24. Antron wings are killer on wet flies though.

Response:

I use antron on wet flies with partridge or hen soft hackle.  The flies are a real killer.  The antron seems to trap air bubbles and looks traslucent to the fish (more life like I suppose).  I catch some big fish on them.

Burton, Try a rib of pearlescent krystal flash on some of them, especially the darker olives.  I swing these at last light.  They seem to almost glow. I really love fishing soft hackles. Ross Wilson

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Went through an antron phase a couple of years ago. Overall the dries that I tied fished OK its hard to say whether or not they made a real difference. I think that the smaller flies that I tied worked well with antron wings. These were small gnats size 22 and 24. Antron wings are killer on wet flies though.

Dear Sir; I concurr.  I really think antron used for wings, caddis stuff, emergent mayflies, midges and trailing shucks is great.  For shucks, instead of the more coarse Z-lon for the small flies, I use regular fine antron yarn and then use a heated metal wire to cause there to be consistent convolutions in the peeling "shuck". JB

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I use antron on wet flies with partridge or hen soft hackle.  The flies Burton, Try a rib of pearlescent krystal flash on some of them, especially the darker olives.  I swing these at last light.  They seem to almost glow. I really love fishing soft hackles. Ross Wilson

Ross, So do I!  I find myself doing it more and more these days, since it allows me to cast which I find relaxing.  As opposed to my chuck-and-duck nymphing with heavy weighted flies. Thanks for the tip, I’ll tie up a few and try them. -Burton

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Being that it’s -30  C outside as I write this, it is unlikely I will be able to test these flies for a few months yet. In the meantime, I’d like to tie flyboxes full of antron dries, but before I go whole hog on antron, I need to know if they fish as good as they look.

See, that’s just the kind of Sunday fly-fishing mentality that’s getting the sport a bad name! Andrew (-: – I’ve been tying wings with antron for several years now, and the fish seem to think it’s OK.

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George, -Sure, glad to do it!  What color would you prefer?  I find it most useful= =20 for wet fly caddis imitations and to wit think I have lt. brown,=20 blue-grey, yellow, grey and lt. olive (maybe even dark olive). -Burton =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I use antron on wet flies with partridge or hen soft hackle.  The flies are a real killer.  The antron seems to trap air bubbles and looks traslucent to the fish (more life like I suppose).  I catch some big fi= sh on them. =20 DEAR BURTON: =20 Would you send me a small sample of this new material to look at? =20 Gehrke’s Gink Snake River – Hell’s Canyon Asotin, WA 99402 =20 Would appreciate it. =20 George –=20 MZ=90 =20 =20

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I chop up sections of this and mix it with other dubbing materials for wet flies. I used one like this at the end of the season and it was destroyed by several large fish. Needless to say my vise has been crankin these out ! — "The true Angler is content to fish alone" Brian Di Carlo – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I recently began tying dry fly wings with antron yarn. Antron is a very to tie flyboxes full of antron dries, but before I go whole hog on antron, I need to know if they fish as good as they look. I use antron on wet flies with partridge or hen soft hackle.  The flies are a real killer.  The antron seems to trap air bubbles and looks traslucent to the fish (more life like I suppose).  I catch some big fish on them. -Burton

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Question:

 Does anyone out there have any idea of what the results of our recent  floods in Oregon will be on game fish?  How about our Salmon and  Steelhead populations, or even native trout?    Are there other resources on the internet more specifically for  northwest fly fishing?

I’ve found Creekside Flyfishing in Salem to have one of the best web sites on Oregon flyfishing resources.  You’ll find it at         http://www.halcyon.com/flyshop

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Does anyone out there have any idea of what the results of our recent floods in Oregon will be on game fish?  How about our Salmon and Steelhead populations, or even native trout?   Are there other resources on the internet more specifically for northwest fly fishing? Loren

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Does anyone out there have any idea of what the results of our recent floods in Oregon will be on game fish?  How about our Salmon and Steelhead populations, or even native trout?  

There are several threats to consider, sedimentation being top of my list.  Lots of reds were probably flushed away too– I’ve seen small fisheries destroyed by flooding due to logging, and they never recover.   There’s also the damage to the hatcheries, but that should only affect the age class that was to be released this year (although I’ve heard that the little game Congress played with the budget forced early release, and hence death, of millions of salmon).  I suppose the damge won’t be evident until spring… — Derek R. Larson           Indiana University        Dept. of History                 "Nothing interesting occurred today…"         -Meriwether Lewis at Ft. Clatsop, Oregon, Jan.4th, 1806

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Question:

Can anyone recommend a good book on knot tieing ?  Actually, what I’d REALLY like is a stream-side guide to knot tieing … something I can stick in my vest, preferrably water-proofed, that covers a few basic knots. Ken Boulder, CO.

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Can anyone recommend a good book on knot tieing ?  Actually, what I’d REALLY like is a stream-side guide to knot tieing … something I can stick in my vest, preferrably water-proofed, that covers a few basic knots. Ken Boulder, CO.

It’s a little large for a vest, but the best knot tying book I have seen is "Practical Fishing Knots II" by Mark Sosin and Lefty Kreh. // // Charlie… //

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Can anyone recommend a good book on knot tieing ?  Actually, what I’d
REALLY like is a stream-side guide to knot tieing … something I can
stick in my vest, preferrably water-proofed, that covers a few basic

Save the cash and buy the current issue of  Fly Fisherman. It has one of the best articles I’ve seen that actually tested the strength of some of the more popular knots. Learn to tie two of those knots and you won’t ever need to learn any more about knots.

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I have a ’stream guide’ on my  fly box – it’s the metal kind.  Pasted on the outer side of the cover is a schematic of about 8 popular knots. I never use it because I tie the same 3 knots for anything I do:  blood for joining tippets and leaders; nail for joining leader to flyline, and Duncan for tying on flies.  After several hundred times of tying these, one never forgets how.   Point:  Practice 3 – 4 of your favorite knots over and over and you won’t need a stream guide.  Leaves more time for fishing instead of debating which knot to use, how to tie, etc…. Have fun. Jim

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Orvis has just such a thing, the "Waterproof Vest Pocket Knot Booklet" written by Doug Truax. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Can anyone recommend a good book on knot tieing ?  Actually, what I’d REALLY like is a stream-side guide to knot tieing … something I can stick in my vest, preferrably water-proofed, that covers a few basic knots. Ken Boulder, CO.

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