Question:

"Bugger" As I suspected. Why don’t you guys just tell newcomers in the beginning that they are not welcome? This group is clearly a waste of time. Bug

Not sure that’s fair. In my time here (relatively short) I have been called a spammer, an asshole, a pompous git, a wanker, and a myriad of other things, but no one ever said I wasn’t welcome. Of course, I wouldn’t give a shit either way. It seems your response is a bit premature as you certainly don’t seem to have achieved a consensus about your being welcome or not at a clave. In fact I think you should turn up, I might actually spring for an airfare for that one myself. Clark

Response:

    Not sure that’s fair. In my time here (relatively short) I have been called   a spammer, an asshole, a pompous git, a wanker, and a myriad of other   things, but no one ever said I wasn’t welcome.     Of course, I wouldn’t give a shit either way. It seems your response is a   bit premature as you certainly don’t seem to have achieved a consensus about   your being welcome or not at a clave. In fact I think you should turn up, I   might actually spring for an airfare for that one myself. I’d make a point of being there too. I’d like to fish with you. Willi

Response:

Congrats, Mark. Keep the log book up to date, keep it between the lines, Just Say No To Overdrive, and best of luck. /daytripper (Hey! Now I can say "some of my best friends are truckers"!

Thank you kindly good sir! I will heed your advice, and look for you on my trips up North. yfitons, Op  –plagarist, just this once–

Response:

As I suspected. Why don’t you guys just tell newcomers in the beginning that they are not welcome? This group is clearly a waste of time. Bug

You seem to have discounted my reply? I suggest that you just show up at a ‘clave and be your *real* self.  Just ask Jeff C. about it. Op

Response:

This group is clearly a waste of time.

That’s why we stick around. Mu

Response:

This group is clearly a waste of time. That’s why we stick around. Mu

"What?  Did he expect Ichor?" GG :  ) www.gink.com

Response:

"What?  Did he expect Ichor?"

You mean Marty Feldman’s character in Young Frankenstein? Mu

Response:

If I am following this thread reasonably accurately, it appears that if I have the balls to show up, I will be granted some modicum of tolerance to demonstrate that the *real* me is very different from the *virtual* me. Feel free to correct me. (Rhetorical.) Bug et al. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – They sound like they could be a lot of fun. Are they by invitation only? Bug

Response:

If I am following this thread reasonably accurately, it appears that if I have the balls to show up, I will be granted some modicum of tolerance to demonstrate that the *real* me is very different from the *virtual* me.

I think eees got it! I think eeezzzzz got it! Now wherez the rhain in Spain? "In the p____!" (Fill in) "In the p____!" (Fill in) (Just don’t volunteer to run the raffle) Dave

Response:

(Just don’t volunteer to run the raffle)

And everyone count your fingers after shaking hands with him.

Response:

They sound like they could be a lot of fun. Are they by invitation only? Bug

Response:

They sound like they could be a lot of fun. Are they by invitation only? Bug

Not since I’ve been a part of ROFF! Just show-up and fish with lots-o-good folk. Op

Response:

They sound like they could be a lot of fun.

They are. Are they by invitation only? Bug

Yes.   Die. Wolfgang

Response:

They sound like they could be a lot of fun. They are. Are they by invitation only? Bug Yes. Die. Wolfgang

Now, now Wolfie.  I find it hard to believe that your last statement is heart-felt? Op  –say it ain’t so, Please.–

Response:

They sound like they could be a lot of fun. Are they by invitation only? Bug

Just do me one small favor, please, Collier. Stick to the claves out East.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – They sound like they could be a lot of fun. They are. Are they by invitation only? Bug Yes. Die. Wolfgang Now, now Wolfie.  I find it hard to believe that your last statement is heart-felt? Op  –say it ain’t so, Please.–

Sorry, Op, it’s my name.  I take it very seriously. Wolfgang and i mean it.

Response:

Sorry, Op, it’s my name.  I take it very seriously. Wolfgang and i mean it.

My mistake!  I was talkin’ about the other last statement, as you know I would never make light of you name.  Well not since the first and last time I did when first I found ROFF.  You remember, I’m sure. Op  –nonetheless, sure wish I could have made it to the anti-clave this year– P.S.  I begin truckin’ on the 19th of Nov., if all goes well with drug test, health exam (not mental, thankfully), and road test.  So I may be in your neck of the woods in the near future, as Cargo Transporters go everywhere in the US and Canada…..OK, they don’t do Hawaii or Alaska.

Response:

Sorry, Op, it’s my name.  I take it very seriously. Wolfgang and i mean it. My mistake!  I was talkin’ about the other last statement,

Oh, that.  Now, why in the world would anyone care what someone says to a tetherball? as you know I would never make light of you name.  

Well, as I said, I take it seriously.  That said though, I can’t imagine why anyone else should. Well not since the first and last time I did when first I found ROFF.  You remember, I’m sure.

Ah, those were some days, ainna?    :) Op  –nonetheless, sure wish I could have made it to the anti-clave this year–

P.S.  I begin truckin’ on the 19th of Nov., if all goes well with drug test, health exam (not mental, thankfully), and road test.  So I may be in your neck of the woods in the near future, as Cargo Transporters go everywhere in the US and Canada…..OK, they don’t do Hawaii or Alaska.

The next month or so will still allow swinging a fly line in much of Wisconsin (although opportunities to chase trout are severely limited) but after that it’s pretty much hard water fishing till some time in late March or April.  You get up this way, give us a holler.  We’ll see if we can roust Joel, George, and maybe even Kim out of hibernation for a bit…….they’re apt to be a bit surly when awakened at this late season but they can usually be calmed down with a handful of berries or a marmot or something. Wolfgang

Response:

They sound like they could be a lot of fun. They are. Are they by invitation only? Bug Yes.   Die.

<splork!

Response:

They sound like they could be a lot of fun. Are they by invitation only? Bug

Let’s just say you can be "not invited".

Response:

They sound like they could be a lot of fun. Are they by invitation only? Bug Just do me one small favor, please, Collier. Stick to the claves out East.

I dunno. He could be big on spontaneity. <g — TL, Tim

Response:

P.S.  I begin truckin’ on the 19th of Nov., if all goes well with drug test, health exam (not mental, thankfully), and road test.  So I may be in your neck of the woods in the near future, as Cargo Transporters go everywhere in the US and Canada…..OK, they don’t do Hawaii or Alaska.

Congrats, Mark. Keep the log book up to date, keep it between the lines, Just Say No To Overdrive, and best of luck. /daytripper (Hey! Now I can say "some of my best friends are truckers"!

Response:

As I suspected. Why don’t you guys just tell newcomers in the beginning that they are not welcome? This group is clearly a waste of time. Bug – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – They sound like they could be a lot of fun. Are they by invitation only? Bug Let’s just say you can be "not invited".

Response:

As I suspected. Why don’t you guys just tell newcomers in the beginning that they are not welcome?

    in your case, that condition should have been immediately clear.  This group is clearly a waste of time.

    no doubt. Bug

awh

Response:

We tell virtually all newcomers right from the start that they *are* welcome.  hint hint But what the hell – just show up and prove us all wrong.

As I suspected. Why don’t you guys just tell newcomers in the beginning that they are not welcome? This group is clearly a waste of time. Bug

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – They sound like they could be a lot of fun. Are they by invitation only? Bug Let’s just say you can be "not invited".

Response:

Question:

Depends on where you are (local species) . Price you are willing to spend. Local terrain of your most visited fishing water (overhanging trees vs open) Wading or bank fishing. However you can’t go wrong with the Cabelas 3forks 3wt 3piece 7.5′ combo as a starter. Ask anyone. John Popp – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I read the post on the brookie and checked out the world cup website. it seems to be a very novel idea. has this been around for a while or is it brand new….also i am interested more in flly fishing than spinning. could someone recomend a good starter setup for a novice?  thanks RJ —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

Lots of very favorable posts have surfaced recently about the rods John mentioned…they seem to be very good rods for the $$$.  The only change I would make is for starters I would suggest something in a heavier weight line, say a 5 or 6 weight.  It’s a little more versatile and easier casting heavy nymphs, streamers and bass type flys. Good luck and Tight Lines! Natty

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I read the post on the brookie and checked out the world cup website. it seems to be a very novel idea. has this been around for a while or is it brand new….also i am interested more in flly fishing than spinning. could someone recomend a good starter setup for a novice?  thanks RJ —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

Depends on where you are (local species) . Price you are willing to spend. Local terrain of your most visited fishing water (overhanging trees vs open) Wading or bank fishing. However you can’t go wrong with the Cabelas 3forks 3wt 3piece 7.5′ combo as a starter. Ask anyone.

You will quite certinly go wrong with a 3wt outfit for a complete beginner. Get a 5-6 wt first. The heavier line gives a much better feeling for the timing than a 3wt. Casting is easier with a heavier line. Wolfgang — shconnect Internet Service Grosse Strasse 17, 24392 S

Question:

Try hitting a beef shank bone if you want to hear shear pins in action… /daytripper (in a winter wonder land)

Here in Wisconsin we generally come up on the cow from behind.  Once the auger makes contact with the tail the cow invariably moves off  the driveway, post haste.  No need to hit ‘em in the shanks! Wolfgang in lala land

Response:

Fortenberry writes: Oh holey moley, THIS is what passes for trash talk amongst the geriatric set. One-upmanship over snowblowers fer cryin’ out loud. I’m still shovelin’ and still castin’ that 9′ bamboo. — Ken Fortenberry- neener neener neener

Just took the new car with the 255/45 17inch performance tires to the super market.  It does not like snow!!!  d;0) Bought some strawberries and water melon. Have lots of martini fixins. Everything is copesetic. Dave L.

Response:

Just took the new car with the 255/45 17inch performance tires to the super market.  It does not like snow!!!  d;0) Bought some strawberries and water melon. Have lots of martini fixins. Everything is copesetic. Dave L.

Wha’d ya buy?  (got check out what I’m likely gonna be chasin’) Peter

Response:

Peter Charles: Wha’d ya buy?  (got check out what I’m likely gonna be chasin’)

A 2000 Audi A6 with the 300bhp 4.2L engine.  Goes like stink, but not in the snow with 255/40-17 Y rated tires.  It’s actually scarey out there.  Jo’s got the farm implement. Dave L.

Response:

[a lot of snow whining snipped] The get a bit of snow and listen to the wusses. Nannook Peter Peter

Hey, now, don’t mistake my post for a complaint. Being snowbound gives me just the excuse I needed to work on the fly rod I’m building (since I’m not a fly tier, what else am I gonna do?). It is pretty amazing that we’ve had 17" of snowfall in the last 18 hours or so in Cary, NC. I grew up in Utah and can’t remember ever having that much snowfall in one day. Pass the back bacon, eh. –Steve

Response:

A 2000 Audi A6 with the 300bhp 4.2L engine.  Goes like stink, but not in the snow with 255/40-17 Y rated tires.  It’s actually scarey out there.  Jo’s got the farm implement. Dave L.

AWESOME – you will be bringing that up here won’t you <GGGGGGGG Peter

Response:

Just cleared six inches off the driveway.  My 15 year old Dukakus snowblower is still going strong. Hah! That’s a baby! My 30" 8hp Ariens was built in 1967. Bought it for $75 ten years ago, dropped all of $30 into it for a new carb, plug, and traction lock pin, and it starts first pull every time. They built this one to outlast a couple of owners ;^) Oh holey moley, THIS is what passes for trash talk amongst the geriatric set. One-upmanship over snowblowers fer cryin’ out loud.

Well, heck, what do you expect us geriatrics to be doing, anyway? We can’t even FIND open water under all this white stuff, never mind fish it! And actually, I thought that was one-downmanship, but what do I know. I was responding to someone who bought a $40000 accident-waiting-to-happen ;^) I’m still shovelin’ and still castin’ that 9′ bamboo.

If you put down the 9′ bamboo you’ll cast that shovel further ;^) /daytripper (snowblind in stow)

Response:

Day Tripper: If you put down the 9′ bamboo you’ll cast that shovel further ;^) /daytripper (snowblind in stow)

Farther. Dave, duckin’ in the snow five miles south of Dave. Dave L.

Response:

Day Tripper: If you put down the 9′ bamboo you’ll cast that shovel further ;^) /daytripper (snowblind in stow) Farther.

Oh well. I can spell just fine, but I need a context-checker! Dave, duckin’ in the snow five miles south of Dave.

I can still SEEEEEEE you! We didn’t get THAT much snow ;^) /daytripper (now comes the freezin’ rain…)

Response:

Out here in the beautiful Western end of Massachusetts, I just finished clearing the first 6" and it’s now turning to sleet.  Oh joy. Hope it clears up before I drive down to Somerset, NJ Friday.  Picture on the front page of the local paper is a snow plow clearing snow off one of the local ponds – time for skating, not fishing.  A friend tells me he caught a good sized pickerel through the ice on a black wooly bugger Saturday… –Stan

You and me both Stan… I plan on coming out on Friday to view with out the crowds and then again on Saturday to meet with abunch of others on I’ll be driving back and forth though… It was sleeting today in So.Jersey but the main roads were in good shape. Plan on a long drive. Most of the speed limits are heavily reduced. — Michael Era

Question:

I want information about flyfishing on the seychelles.

Response:

Three of us have booked a trip to the Seychelles next March through Indian Ocean Angling Adventures.  We need 2 or 3 more to join us or we will have to cancel as its too much $$ for three.  If you might be interested e-mail me at different groups who have gone there and they all said the same thing …way better than XMAS Island. Steve

Response:

I want information about flyfishing on the seychelles.

You can get all the info you want from us – Anna and martin lewis.  Fax us on (248) 344266 or We discovered and developed flyfishing in the seychelles – been in the business now for 10 years. Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

I want information about flyfishing on the seychelles. Dear Lasse,

We have been running a fishing operation in the Seychelles for 10 years.  For the past two years we have concentrated on saltwater flyfishing specifically for bone fish and trevally. We have been very successful over the past two years and now have four world records pending ratification. If you wish to visit our website – it will soon be changed – you will gain an idea of what we do.  Go to altavista and type in seychelles + flyfishing.  Tam Tam should come up. Look forward to hearing from you. Regards Martin and Anna Lewis Tam Tam Tel +248 344266 Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

Question:

Let’s go fishin soon, It’s been wonderfully nice here in Illinoise. Maybe we could meet up somewhere and just cast at whatever will take a fly. Up here toward rockford, there are quite a few dams with warm run off, we could maybe try to get some smallies. Let me know what you think. Tim Apple " Always one step closer to going Postal! "

Response:

Let’s go fishin soon, It’s been wonderfully nice here in Illinoise. Maybe we could meet up somewhere and just cast at whatever will take a fly. Up here toward rockford, there are quite a few dams with warm run off, we could maybe try to get some smallies. Let me know what you think.

Tim: After all these years, my own thread. I can do smallies by my house in Geneva in the Fox River if that’s what you want to do. Joel and I tried to track you down a few weeks ago. We’re thinking a mini trip to the Madison area either weekend of March 13th or March 27th. Early season opens March 1 for troutlets. You know, I never bought an Illinois fishing license. Email me with what you think you want to do. Wayne Knight Geneva IL                            

Response:

Let’s go fishin soon, It’s been wonderfully nice here in Illinoise.

        if you think it’s been nice in illinoise, you ought to get a taste of north caroliner. no malice, timmy. wayno

Response:

Wayne, You can get your Illinois license instantly on the Internet.  Go the the DNR site and links will take you to the license site (run by a contractor). I’ve done this the last two years.  I wish more states would put licenses online, it seems a simple thing to do. Also you might try the DuPage between the dam in Warrenville and the one in Naperville.  There are some really nice smallmouths in that stretch. — — Sherman Dunnam www.flyfishingjournal.com Stream Reports, Free Classifieds & More – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Let’s go fishin soon, It’s been wonderfully nice here in Illinoise. Maybe we could meet up somewhere and just cast at whatever will take a fly. Up here toward rockford, there are quite a few dams with warm run off, we could maybe try to get some smallies. Let me know what you think. Tim: After all these years, my own thread. I can do smallies by my house in Geneva in the Fox River if that’s what you want to do. Joel and I tried to track you down a few weeks ago. We’re thinking a mini trip to the Madison area either weekend of March 13th or March 27th. Early season opens March 1 for troutlets. You know, I never bought an Illinois fishing license. Email me with what you think you want to do. Wayne Knight Geneva IL

Response:

writes: Also you might try the DuPage between the dam in Warrenville and the one in Naperville.  There are some really nice smallmouths in that stretch.

Thanks, I think I know where that’s at. Wayne Knight Geneva IL                            

Response:

Question:

I’ve heard the same thing and don’t get it. I’ve fished the Nissitissit and Squannacook six times and never seen a fish, never seen a fly and never seen anyone catch anything with corn, worms or flies. I bought the TU book ages ago and Kaplan’s Middlesex County Rivers book last year, called the local shops and even changed my local TU chapter to the Squan-A-Tissit hoping to at least see a rising fish. I’ve decided it’s a scam supported by the local outfitters. They’re only an hour from my house but a waste of time when an extra hour will get me to the Deerfield, Farmington or N.H. Doug – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi I went to fish the Nissitissit this saturday.  I would appreciate any tips people night have.  I have been told that this one of the best trout streams near boston.  But it seemed ‘dead’ to me, still tannic water. I tried the prescott bridge area which seemed in better shape and also the Henry Columbo area.  Does the stream die off in the later summer? How is the fall/winter fishing?

Response:

I’ve heard the same thing and don’t get it. I’ve fished the Nissitissit and Squannacook six times and never seen a fish, never seen a fly and never [snip] While living in Boston, the Niss was a regular stop for me in the fall.  Caught

several large Brownies and saw more than I landed. What takes away from the river is that it warms up badly in the summer, and poaching. Poaching is a major problem in the FFO section.  The last time I was there, in the fall of 95′, a hunter told me that two guys and a can of worms took something like 60 fish out. We have similar problems in W. Pa.  Its a shame, because E. Ma has few opportunities for stream fishing for trout, and the Niss is perhaps one of the best.          good luck,          brad shuster

Response:

Question:

I’m an italian fly fisherman,i will be in Vancouver for the next August i need some address of fly fishing shops, thanks Massimiliano

Response:

I’m an italian fly fisherman,i will be in Vancouver for the next August i need some address of fly fishing shops, thanks Massimiliano i do not know which vancouver you are asking about (B.C. or WA), both have great fishing nearby.  if you meant vancouver, wa you might try The Greased Line Fly Shop at 360-573-9383.  i have been in a couple times and they are knowledgeable in the ways of steelhead. Enjoy the west coast while you’re out here.  If you meant BC, forget this message

Response:

I’m an italian fly fisherman,i will be in Vancouver for the next August i need some address of fly fishing shops, thanks Massimiliano

If Vancouver BC: Babcock’s 931-5044 Michael & Young’s 588-2833 Outdoors unlimited 463-0707 Ruddick’s 434-2420(Burnaby) or 681-3747 (Granville Island – downtown) Terminal Tackle 536-4665 B.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m an italian fly fisherman,i will be in Vancouver for the next August i need some address of fly fishing shops, thanks Massimiliano If Vancouver BC: Babcock’s 931-5044 Michael & Young’s 588-2833 Outdoors unlimited 463-0707 Ruddick’s 434-2420(Burnaby) or 681-3747 (Granville Island – downtown) Terminal Tackle 536-4665 B.

Ruddicks in Burnaby will be moving soon.  They have a sale on stuff ’til the end of the month. — The views expressed are my own and does not represent those of my employer.

Response:

  Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly   Ruddicks in Burnaby will be moving soon.  They have a sale on stuff ’til   the end of the month.

How does (did) the Burnaby branch compare to the Granville Island store in terms of selection etc.  I’ve never been to that branch. thanks,         -tony — Tony Gades. Seattle, WA.  USA http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades/Fishing/fish_page.html email: replace the "this_address_is_wrong" with "tgades"

Response:

SNIP How does (did) the Burnaby branch compare to the Granville Island store in terms of selection etc.  I’ve never been to that branch. thanks,         -tony — Tony Gades. Seattle, WA.  USA http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades/Fishing/fish_page.html email: replace the "this_address_is_wrong" with "tgades"

Burnaby store is older, larger, more stuff, more selection, less swanky.  They also offer fly tying classes there.                         -cheers — The views expressed are my own and does not represent those of my employer.

Response:

:   Ruddicks in Burnaby will be moving soon.  They have a sale on stuff ’til :   the end of the month. : How does (did) the Burnaby branch compare to the Granville Island : store in terms of selection etc.  I’ve never been to that branch. The store out in Burnaby was "the big one", while the one on Granville Island was a small one meant to snag a few bucks from the large number of folks who go down to the island daily. Not certain why they’re closing out that location. I like Michael & Young; I also visit a little place called "Hanson’s" (perhaps "Hansen’s") in the high-rent district in downtown Van (it’s on Hornby, I believe, only a couple of blocks from my employer’s corporate offices in the Waterfron Centre). Not big, few tying supplies, but you can buy a rod and a few flies, or book a guide who can speak Japanese or Cantonese or German. — 3798 Woodland Drive     voice: (250) 368-9315 Trail, BC               data:  (250) 368-9341

Response:

For Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada I would recommend my favorite, Michael & Young Flyshop in Surrey, a suburb of Vancouver.(604-588-2833) The shop is a short walk (1/2 mile) from the Surrey skytrain station by Surrey Centre Mall (30 min. skytrain ride from downtown).  They supply equipment and excellent advice to flyfishermen looking for action locally, at  not too distant hotspots like Kamloops, Merritt, or Vancouver Island (2-3 hrs drive) or even in exotic places like Mexico.  Ruddicks Fly Shop in Burnaby (another suburb) may be closer and is supposed to provide similar service, though I haven’t been there. (604-434-2420) Hope you enjoy your trip. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m an italian fly fisherman,i will be in Vancouver for the next August i need some address of fly fishing shops,

Response:

I’m an italian fly fisherman,i will be in Vancouver for the next August i need some address of fly fishing shops, thanks Massimiliano

For Vancouver BC try Hanson’s Fishing Outfitters, 102-580 Hornby Street, in downtown Vancouver. Ph 604 684 8988.  They also have a web site but I don’t know the URL. Peter Sealy

Response:

Question:

I will be fishing the Rock Creek Area the first week of August and am looking for an area with accomodations and good fishing someplace in between there and Seattle. I don’t want to "double-back" ie: fish the madison then go back towards Missoula. Any ideas?

Response:

I will be fishing the Rock Creek Area the first week of August and am looking for an area with accomodations and good fishing someplace in between there and Seattle. I don’t want to "double-back" ie: fish the madison then go back towards Missoula. Any ideas?

I don’t follow what you’re saying…Rock Creek..the one I know…is only 20 miles east of Missoula..the madison is 200 miles southeast…so are you saying you want to fish Rock Creek and then head down to the Madison and then on to Seattle?  If you fish Rock Creek stay with Doug at the Rock Creek Mercantile…down on the Madison the West Fork cabins are an excellent place to stay..between the Madison and Seattle i think you’ll find that it’s difficult to get there from there…have fun trying though…you’ll drive by some pretty good fishing in Idaho while you figure out the easiest way to cross that state from east to west.

Response:

: I will be fishing the Rock Creek Area the first week of August and am : looking for an area with accomodations and good fishing someplace in : between there and Seattle. I don’t want to "double-back" ie: fish the : madison then go back towards Missoula. Any ideas? : I don’t follow what you’re saying…Rock Creek..the one I know…is only : 20 miles east of Missoula..the madison is 200 miles southeast…so are : you saying you want to fish Rock Creek and then head down to the Madison : and then on to Seattle?   I think he is saying he wants to fish Rock Creek then head west.  Two options… stay on I-90 past Kellogg-Wallace, then head south down a bad road to the St. Joe.  Lots of tunnels blasted through rock and wonderful to drive, except when it washes out, which is often.  Look closely at a map and you will see the road I suggest.  There are some cabins down at the St. Joe Inn, but don’t expect a palace.   The easier (and I think you will find better fishing than Rock Creek) is to go through Missoula down to Lolo and head over into Idaho on Highway 12. This will run you along the Lochsa, which joins the Selway to form the Middle Clearwater which joins the South Fork, then the North Fork to form the Clearwater, which joins the Snake, which joins the Columbia which fills the entire Pacific Ocean.  As you might imagine, great fishing is found all along the road but it changes from a small stream to a fairly large stream (g) the farther you go. As for accomodations, I suggest you spend a day or two at Three Rivers Lodge, located at the bottom of the Lochsa at the confluence with the Selway.  This lodge is located about 90 miles from Missoula and has budget cabins or less modest cabins.  It is right on the Lochsa river, but you can also follow the Selway with a road that continues for 20 miles until it reaches the wilderness boundary.  There is also camping available all along the rivers.  The fishing tends to be better for cutthroat and ‘bows the higher you go on any of these rivers.  I should also mention there is the largest steelhead hatchery in the US on the Clearwater near Orofino and there is also a salmon hatchery near Kooskia on the same river.  (Salmon are extremely rare to find, though, but steelhead are a major trophy during the right time of the year.  The Clearwater is fairly large, and a drift boat is recommended.)  Both the Lochsa and the Selway are among the best whitewater rivers in the US.   To get back on the route to Seattle, you can take the long way along the Columbia river, or when you get to Lewiston take highway 195 to Pullman and then continue back up to I-90 in Spokane.  (Or take Highway 26 out of Colfax.)  Look at a map… but the fishing is great in N. Idaho. There you have it… better than a travel agent or and "adventure guide." — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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To get back on the route to Seattle, you can take the long way along the Columbia river, or when you get to Lewiston take highway 195 to Pullman and then continue back up to I-90 in Spokane.  (Or take Highway 26 out of Colfax.)  Look at a map… but the fishing is great in N. Idaho. There you have it… better than a travel agent or and "adventure guide." — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

There ya go! And you never mentioned fishing in my favorite M*nt*n* stream the B** *ol* !!

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Question:

Seeing the thread that started all this, it is rather clear that Mr. Gherke has confused ‘libel’ with ’satire’ and ‘parody’. He might wish to consider that his position as a ‘public figure’ here and as owner of the company makes it _much_ more difficult to prove libel, especially given his past posts, before further lining his attorney’s pockets to no avail.

I’m sure thousands of dollars are being spent in his lab right now to prove conclusively that the only way to serve papers is with the left hand, never never the right, and that those who do serve papers with the right loose their targets in the vital first few seconds of the process.  People just don’t appreciate what an atheletic feat it is to serve papers.

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[ Article crossposted from rec.arts.poems,rec.outdoors.fly.fishing ] [ Author was Tim Patterson ] Oops! I just noticed that you were worried about The Jerhk’s = reputation with regard to his PRODUCT. Now, you obviously weren’t referring to his execrable verse, so you must be talking = about his fishing products, in which case, you posted this on the wrong group, so I’ve sent it to where it belongs.

<<big snip Seeing the thread that started all this, it is rather clear that Mr. Gherke has confused ‘libel’ with ’satire’ and ‘parody’. He might wish to consider that his position as a ‘public figure’ here and as owner of the company makes it _much_ more difficult to prove libel, especially given his past posts, before further lining his attorney’s pockets to no avail. — Joe Ellis     o/~ The Synthetic Filker o/~ |  TesserAct Studios ()XDarwin(;        Now on the Web at      | Cincinnati, OH 45240 / /~LL~~LL~  http://shell.idt.net/~ellis69 |New Dimensions In Filk! Unsolicited commercial E-mail will be proofread at $25 hr/2 hr min.

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0] : [ Article crossposted from rec.arts.poems,rec.outdoors.fly.fishing ] : [ Author was Tim Patterson ] : : Oops! I just noticed that you were worried about The Jerhk’s = : reputation with regard to his PRODUCT. Now, you obviously : weren’t referring to his execrable verse, so you must be talking = : about his fishing products, in which case, you posted this on : the wrong group, so I’ve sent it to where it belongs. : <<big snip : Seeing the thread that started all this, it is rather clear that Mr. Gherke : has confused ‘libel’ with ’satire’ and ‘parody’. He might wish to consider : that his position as a ‘public figure’ here and as owner of the company : makes it _much_ more difficult to prove libel, especially given his past : posts, before further lining his attorney’s pockets to no avail. : — : Joe Ellis     o/~ The Synthetic Filker o/~ |  TesserAct Studios : ()XDarwin(;        Now on the Web at      | Cincinnati, OH 45240 : / /~LL~~LL~  http://shell.idt.net/~ellis69 |New Dimensions In Filk! : Unsolicited commercial E-mail will be proofread at $25 hr/2 hr min. While the original post was certainly scurrilous, Mr. G. may not wish to perform the necessary public demonstration to prove conclusively that it was libel Mike — Michael McGuire                     Hewlett Packard Laboratories Phone: (415)-857-5491               Palo Alto, CA 94303-0971

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[ Article crossposted from rec.arts.poems,rec.outdoors.fly.fishing ] [ Author was Tim Patterson ] Oops! I just noticed that you were worried about The Jerhk’s = reputation with regard to his PRODUCT. Now, you obviously weren’t referring to his execrable verse, so you must be talking = about his fishing products, in which case, you posted this on the wrong group, so I’ve sent it to where it belongs. Of course, you still have to show that the poem itself was libellous and that Gehrke’s penis size in some way relates to the quality of his product. You’ll probably also have to prove that his penis is not below avergae size, but I think that would require a specialist to determine (preferably a brave volunteer). This is all asuming that you were refering to my little ode and not one of the many other flames that "Mr. G." seems to have called down upon himself on rec.arts.poems. He sure has a winning way with folk, does ol’ George!         Tim the ever helpful  :) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – = Your libalist poetry is something we don’t think we care to bring to Mr= =2E Gehrke’s attention for we are sure you are as close to a libelous, lega= l law suit as you can get . . . and I can state for all certainty, you do= not want to pursue this line of defamation on a man that makes his living producing wonderful products for the American People.  He doesn’= t do it to you and your products and it isn’t fair,  that you do such a low-down, unkind thing to this wonderful, warm, giving human being. That you think (for Mr. Gehrke) that he should not take offense only speaks ill of those standards that are below him and the staff here at this company. = I would cease and disist if I were you.  I would not dare show him this= insult to his integrity and coarse you have embarked upon.  It really serves no purpose.  You do not want to test this man in court.  I assur= e you of this sirs. = Again, I strongly advise that you stop this deflamation of character immediately and post a retraction for your SLANDEROUS remarks.  I canno= t stress this important point to you strong enough. This company will not= tolerate this public abuse on a world-wide format. =  li=B7bel (l=BA=93b=85l) Law. n. 1.a. A false publication in writing, p= rinting, or typewriting or in signs or pictures that maliciously damages a person’s reputation. b. The act or an instance of presenting such a statement to the public. 2. The written claims presented by a plaintiff= in an action at admiralty law or to an ecclesiastical court. –li=B7bel= tr.v. li=B7beled or li=B7belled, li=B7bel=B7ing or li=B7bel=B7ling, li=B7= bels or li=B7bels. To communicate a false statement about in writing or by mean= s of signs or pictures. –li=93bel=B7er or li=93bel=B7ist n. = Sincerely, = Mr. W.H. / Executive Secretary & Mrs Gladys M. Gehrke with copies sent:= cc/Mr. H. Cross / Patent Attorney cc/ B. Schroeder/ Law Firm/Spokane Washington Federal Law Division

– =    Dr.Feelgood’s Amazing And Marvellous Poetic Panacea        Guaranteed To Cure All Ailments Of The Soul                       NO REFUNDS           http://condor.lpl.arizona.edu/~tim/

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Question:

I have been convinced that using dropper flies, though sometimes effective, is not a good practice.  Anyone who has used this technique will attest to the fact the many more fish are foul hooked than on single flies.  Foul hooking is harmful to the fish and adds to the motality rate.

Why would hooking fish in a fin be any harder on them thean hooking them in the mouth? — -Wayne Trzyna

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I’ve heard that nymph fishing can be more productive if one uses two flies. I would like to try this, but need to know where to tie the second fly on the tippet.

There are numerous ways to tie a dropper, but most are not that simple, and they tend to twist, etc.  The easiest and most effective way I’ve found to fish two nymphs is just to tie an additional length of tippet to the bend of the top fly using an improved clinch knot.  I seem to have no problem hooking fish on the top fly with this setup.  A little lead can be added between the two flies to keep them on the bottom.

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The most common two-fly technique that I have heard of is to tie a nymph on 18-24 inches of tippet after your dry fly.  Double clinch knot will do fine. Drag gets increased on the dry and snaggles happen more often, but its a good technique for covering lots of water. Regards, TM — "For the love of the fly, the cycle of spring, and all things that remind us of nature’s cruel dance."

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The most common two-fly technique that I have heard of is to tie a nymph on 18-24 inches of tippet after your dry fly.  Double clinch knot will do fine. Drag gets increased on the dry and snaggles happen more often, but its a good technique for covering lots of water. Regards, TM

Of course, make sure that the local regulations support the use of such a rig.  Maine fishing reg’s on FFO streams do not (single hook only). /dave (just back from a COLD weekend up in the Greater Rangely Area) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< < Digital Equipment Corp.    Alpha Server Engineering  < <           "Read this and nobody gets hurt"           < <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

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I’ve had success tying the tippet for the dropper to the bend of the hook of the upper fly, using an improved clinch.  I like this method because it casts easily without the dropper wrapping around the line, as usually happens to me when I tie the dropper’s tippet to a loop in the leader.

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Only one person has mentioned leaving a tag end on one of your tippet lengths when hand-tying your leader.  And, he suggested a 12" length.  I would recommend a 3" to 4" length, max.  This will tangle less frequently.  I’ve never tried the hook-bend hitch, but would expect the hook to tippet connection to lend itself to cut tippet materials in a battle. Charley

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I’ve heard that nymph fishing can be more productive if one uses two flies. I would like to try this, but need to know where to tie the second fly on the tippet. Additionally, what knot works best for this and how long should the leader for the second fly be? Thanks in advance for any advice.

Hi, Two flies at once is really a good technique, and a time honored thing here in Nova Scotia. The best way if going with two nymphs is to use a dropper. What you do is tie a second fly in at the point of your tippet ( if using a nine foot leader this would be atr about two feet up from the end). Tie about an 8 inch line from this point and your second fly. This puts the second fly about a foot and a bit from the end fly. You need at least this much space to get good presentation. Some people go up even further, but I find this can cause casting problems for the average caster- give it a try though ! I use a Guide’s knot, loopiong the second leader bit behind the knot (if you have a knotless leader, so much the better). Be careful to do this as you will break the line if you tie above the knot of a tippet and happen to get two fish on ! Tight Lines! Bill Curry Tight Lines tackle Shop and Guide Service Lockeport, Nova Scotia

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I’ve never tried the hook-bend hitch, but would expect the hook to tippet connection to lend itself to cut tippet materials in a battle.

never had a problem.

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The neat thing about two flies is that you can try two different patterns or the same pattern at two different depths. The use of two wieghted flies although requiring a more open loop cast can make it much easier to drift along the bottom. I use a tapered knotless leader, 9 foot. To this I tie a tippet section using an improved surgeon’s knot (three turns through before clinching). The dropper fly is tied to the remainder of the tippet section hanging out of the knot. The point fly is tied to the end of the tippet using the Palomar knot.

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The neat thing about two flies is that you can try two different patterns or the same pattern at two different depths. The use of two wieghted flies although requiring a more open loop cast can make it much easier to drift along the bottom. I use a tapered knotless leader, 9 foot. To this I tie a tippet section using an improved surgeon’s knot (three turns through before clinching). The dropper fly is tied to the remainder of the tippet section hanging out of the knot. The point fly is tied to the end of the tippet using the Palomar knot.

This has nothing to do with this post, but I just had to tell you. My friend Ed ties this pattern on a small 3x hook that has 2 extended body comparaduns on the same hook!  Coolest thing I ever saw.   A sunny day,      a box of midges,         and a wandering stream…   Man, this MUST be heaven!   <    Steve Kulpa    <<

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Most folk on Irish Loughs or Scottish Lochs would fish at least two flies and more likely three. The top (bob) fly is usually a bit bigger and very bushy and it is often dragged along the surface of the water, sometimes this can be very effective. Regards, Philip Blair. *** Nation Shall Peak Six Unto Nation. ***

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: The neat thing about two flies is that you can try two different patterns : or the same pattern at two different depths. The use of two wieghted flies : although requiring a more open loop cast can make it much easier to drift : along the bottom. As a kid flyfishing in PA limestone waters(about 25 years ago),  I was taught early on that wet fly fishing was a two to three fly exercise.  For instance, I would tie on a black ant pattern with various egg sack variants as droppers.  On occasion I would hook up with doubles and sometimes triples. I’ve been out west since 1986 and have found very few people that fish "wets".  They’re either nymphers or dry guys.  I’ve always found wet fly fishing to be very effective and fun.  Many happy days on Penns Creek! Sure miss those Pennsy streams, especially Fishing Creek in Centre County (check out the Bellefonte fish hatchery). deibs — Software Systems Quality Consulting           2269 Sunny Vista Drive Phone/Fax (408) 985-4476                         San Jose, CA  95128

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Rigging two, or even three, flies at once is a fairly common technique on western streams as well as elsewhere.  However, recently a lot of comment has been given to whether this is a good practice from the standpoint of the wellfare of our fisheries. I have been convinced that using dropper flies, though sometimes effective, is not a good practice.  Anyone who has used this technique will attest to the fact the many more fish are foul hooked than on single flies.  Foul hooking is harmful to the fish and adds to the motality rate.  This, of course, is not a concern if all fish caught are to be kept and killed, but it is a problem in catch and release streams.                                               Dallas, TX                                               Ennis, MT

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Big fly, little fly. Predator, prey. Light, Dark. Shiny, dull. Two flies at once is quite honorable. Tim Walker

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When fishing the trico spinner fall on the Missouri I use to tie on a #22, which is extremely difficult to see in the water.  Someone suggested tying on a #18 and tying in two sets of wings, making it look like two flys…….works great and is much easier to see and it floats much better. Rick Taylor

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When fishing the trico spinner fall on the Missouri I use to tie on a #22, which is extremely difficult to see in the water.  Someone suggested tying on a #18 and tying in two sets of wings, making it look like two flys…….works great and is much easier to see and it floats much better.

    I saw Jack Dennis on TV not long ago and he suggested fishing midges in     this way.  At the end of a 5x leader tie on a rather large (#12 or 14) dry     fly that is easy to see.  From the eye of that dry fly, tie 18" of fine     tippet onto which is tied your tiny midge.  Fish just as if you were     fishing the large dry fly but strike if you see a rise within 18" of your     large fly.  I thought it was a pretty good idea and a humpy works very     well.       Bob

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I’ve used two flies in many situations -even using a dry as a strike indicator forvery small dries. the easiest and most tangle free method is to use a Duncan loop and tie it to the bend of the first fly. Much less tangles than using a dropper. A dropper can be made by simply tying the tippet knot (blood or surgeons) with a long trailing line- perhaps 12-18 inches. Hope this helps

Response:

I’ve heard that nymph fishing can be more productive if one uses two flies. I would like to try this, but need to know where to tie the second fly on the tippet. Additionally, what knot works best for this and how long should the leader for the second fly be? Thanks in advance for any advice.

I can support the advise of the others who responded.  I have a friend who always tries to use a larger fly at the end of the leader to tie his dropper to.   The reason is that he can tie his dropper to the eye of the larger fly; the eye of the larger fly will have enough room to tie two clinch knots in it.  He claims that it makes it easier to hook fish on the top fly when the dropper is not tied to the bend.  I haven’t noticed any difference but this guy catches lots more fish than most.  

Response:

I’ve heard that nymph fishing can be more productive if one uses two flies. I would like to try this, but need to know where to tie the second fly on the tippet. Additionally, what knot works best for this and how long should the leader for the second fly be? Thanks in advance for any advice.

I have had good success in tying an 18" 6x tipit to the bend in the "top" fly (5x tipit) using a clinch knot. Then tying the "bottom" fly at the end of "18" section. Put your indicator up from the "top" fly to account for whatever depth your seeking. Watch your casting. This system is prone to tangling. The tipit sizes can be different than mine, of course, but make sure that the terminal piece is -1 size smaller than your leader. Good luck Johnny

Response:

I’ve heard that nymph fishing can be more productive if one uses two flies. I would like to try this, but need to know where to tie the second fly on the tippet. Additionally, what knot works best for this and how long should the leader for the second fly be? Thanks in advance for any advice.

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