Question:

Hello all, Now that it’s midwinter, I am doing much fishing in my mind, thinking about the season to come.  I have thought about how the focus on my fishing during the 10 years I have lived in New York has gone from nymphing to dry fly fishing.  I do all styles and approaches, but I do find that I seek out situations where I am most likely to get them on top. I probably should nymph more than I do, because you can do it without a hatch, and there are better chances of getting bigger fish.  I just get annoyed how deep nymphing is better suited with different rods, lines, and leaders than dry fly fishing.  I find it awkward to switch back and forth on the stream, and I refuse to carry 2 rods onto the water. One thing about the technique – I do most nymphing in close – with a rodlength or 2 of line out, no more.  I find it very hard to control the drift beyond that.  Can anybody give me some discussion about nymphing in close/far away?  About good nymphing leader recipies(I tie my own)?  About how spooky fish react to your closeness to them? Pete Collin

Response:

Peter, I think you’re doing the right thing restricting you line length, I’m very disciplined about that using a maximum of one myself while searching pocket water and runs.  If I see a fish, I will lengthen line as the circumstances allow rather than approach to close. It does take a fair bit of concentration which can be nice to alleviate with a dry fly presentation every now and then – often I find the fish taking the dry will take the nymph quite readily. I’m happy to use the same leader for both dry and nymph – adding or deleting tippett where required … length is a rod length (7.5 – 9ft) and thats it. Formulae is the simple 60 20 20 occasionally I’ll use a furled butt section of 4lb mono usually where there is room to swing the rod for a decent hook set.   What is important is the nymph swimming level, especially when searching water for fish that are not visible.  Usually tight to the bottom requires a fly somewhere down there to attract their interest. However you prefer to get the fly down, weight in the fly or a shotted up leader is immaterial as long as it is in the zone.   Casting might not seem important in such circumstance but it is … if you can cast (by whatever means) so that the leader doesn’t straighten properly the fly will sink further than if it does straighten.  I sometimes think it is forgotten that this is something that can be used to great effect in controlling the depth of a nymph for long or short distance nymphing with weighty flies. The Flies themselves are an interesting topic … Steve

Response:

One thing about the technique – I do most nymphing in close – with a rodlength or 2 of line out, no more.  I find it very hard to control the drift beyond that.  Can anybody give me some discussion about nymphing in close/far away?

No simple answers here, Peter. Nymphing is a big topic. It’s worth a few books and quite a few have been written. There are a variety of techniques that allow you to nymph in close, as far as you can cast, just under the surface, bouncing on the bottom, etc. etc. etc. It take times to learn the different techniques, more time to get decent with them, but what’s probably the most difficult to learn is where and when to use the different techniques. Like dry fly fishing, control is much easier if your casts are short. If the situation warrants it, you are going to be more successful fishing in close. Like Jeff and Dave pointed out, you can often get very close to fish when they are feeding on the bottom, especially in broken water. They are much more secure than fish feeding on the surface. However, there are several other things that dictate how close you can get. Because of a number of factors, trout in some streams and rivers are more spooky. Much tougher to get close to these fish without spooking them. On placid sections, it is often difficult to get close to fish without spooking them, etc. On big rivers, depth and current speed are going to prevent you from wading close enough for a short cast to many prime areas. For example, the most productive area we fished at Henry’s Fork this fall, required long casts to reach some of the best lies. I also dislike rerigging all the time on the water. IMO, for most nymphing, a short leader butt with a couple of long tippet sections is better for nymphing than a traditional tapered leader.  The thinner tippet sections allow the fly to sink more readily, act more naturally and also allow you to use less weight (which I like). However, more often, I just add a long tippet section to a regular tapered leader. That way it’s much easier to switch back to a dry. This does mean, at least when fishing deep water, my leader is very long. Willi

Response:

One thing about the technique – I do most nymphing in close – with a rodlength or 2 of line out, no more.  I find it very hard to control the drift beyond that.  Can anybody give me some discussion about nymphing in close/far away?

Another thing – learn the "tuck cast".  It’s great for shorter distance casting in pocket water when you need to get the nymph down to fish-catchin’ level ASAP.  Much easier with a split shot near the nymph or a weighted nymph.

Response:

One thing about the technique – I do most nymphing in close – with a rodlength or 2 of line out, no more.  I find it very hard to control the drift beyond that.  Can anybody give me some discussion about nymphing in close/far away?

A longer rod certainly helps.  In fact, I’m thinking of going to a 9.5 to 10 foot rod for heavy nymphing and might ask about that here soon.  For closer nymphing with a "high stick" (controlling depth and slack by raising and lowering your rod), I think you’re better off with no strike indicator. This is especially true in deeper, broken water with rocks where the depth keeps changing.  The farther away you get, especially if you are not sight nymphing in clear water, and especially if the depth is constant, the more a strike indicator will help you.  With steady water flow (not a lot of broken water and mixed currents), you can get in some fairly long casts with an indicator.  About good nymphing leader recipies(I tie my own)?

Tying your own is convenient if you use a foam indicator or other indicator that you can slide around, since you have a number of knots that act as "stops" for the indicator.  As far as material, Maxima works good but it’s not the strongest per diameter, so I’m looking for something else in the tippet.  Flouro is too damn expensive, and Orvis Super Strong has broken a lot on me – it’s strong, but it’s simply not very abrasion resistant IMO. Look up Borger’s "uni-body" leader if you want simplicity.  With a bit of lead on the leader, we’re not going to quibble over the whether the 6th section should be 15 or 17" for best turnover, eh?  About how spooky fish react to your closeness to them?

In bouldery pocket water with deeper runs and chop on top, you can get virtually on top of them (assuming you can’t see them).  In fact I’ve gone in with my arm up to my shoulder to pull out a snag, and continued to fish the run and catch fish.  In smoother spring creek type water, and for sight nymphing, ask elsewhere

Response:

I’m confused by this statement. Would you please elaborate? — Citizen Fisherman – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m happy to use the same leader for both dry and nymph – adding or deleting tippett where required … length is a rod length (7.5 – 9ft) and thats it.

Response:

Peter Collin writes: One thing about the technique – I do most nymphing in close – with a rodlength or 2 of line out, no more.  I find it very hard to control the drift beyond that.  Can anybody give me some discussion about nymphing in close/far away?  About good nymphing leader recipies(I tie my own)?  About how spooky fish react to your closeness to them? Pete Collin

Hi, Peter.  Most of my nymphing is within 15 feet of me, but there are the occasions (quite often, really) when an actual distance cast can be of some use.  Up and across (with or without an indicator) seems to work best for me. I am talking, maybe, 30 or so feet.   I have found that the nymph must get down to the bottom for best results.  The best way I have found to do this is to use non-toxic split shot.  If you do not know the water you will have to experiment with the size/amount of shot.  Your leader/line or indicator should move slower than the surface water (unlike dry fly fishing).  The water near the bottom of the pool/run/etc is moving slower than the surface water.  Therefore, you have to slow down your drift.  Gary Borger in a recent tutorial stated that if your indicator is moving the same speed as the surface water, you have to add more weight (split shot, bead head, whatever).  If I use an indicator, it is usually the yarn type with the o-ring attached.  Put some floatant on and it never sinks. I prefer a leader somewhere between 7 1/2 to 9 feet, with an additional 3 or so feet of tippet.  I generally use a 4x leader with 4x or 5x fluorocarbon tippet.  About 3 feet above the fly (at the leader/tippet knot), I place my shot.  I seldom fish a double. To switch over to dries, simply snip off the fluorocarbon tippet and add 3 feet of mono 5x.  I always use a floating line, btw.  It is easier to mend.  My favorite rod is a Sage SP 9 foot 4 weight. Spooky fish?  I’ve caught fish right at my feet on Maine, MA, NY, PA, and NM waters.  The fish in Idaho were a little more spooky and most of my hook-ups were at a distance, up and across.  The fish in Labrador were very spooky and in four years, I managed to catch only 2 small (2 – 3 pounds) brook trout on caddis worms.  It is a dry fly fisherman’s heaven!  d;0) A lengthy reply……sorry.  HTH Dave

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Question:

I set the hook and landed a beautiful brookie.  Someone once told me that trout are like women — find out what they want and give it to them!  Well, I found out what they wanted and  caught several more before leaving for dinner.   On Thursday there were 15 people at the island — mostly locals.  Fishing was tough.  I fished all my "spots" using the caddis with the emerger dropper, and caught a few fish.  I used an old trick – jiggling the Goddard caddis, and landed several nice salmon.  The brookies would not take a moving fly, but the salmon seemed to love it. I arrived at the island Friday morning to be greeted with a hefty hail from none other that ROFF’s very own Salmon Fly.  Paul emerged from the woods on the far side of the third current just as I was stepping out of the boat.  I made a mad dash to the wing dam and "my" spot before he could get there.  <g He fished his way over and a half hour later we took a break and talked for awhile.  He was catching fish and I was too, so we were happy.  It started to rain and I switched to a caddis nymph.  On the second or so cast my line stopped like it ran into a stone wall.  Fish!  I set the hook and could tell it was a big fish.  I told Paul I thought it was a big brookie.  Then I saw the yellow flash and knew it was a big fish, but not a brookie or a salmon.  A four pound sucker had taken my fly.  This was not a good thing, especially with Paul fishing next to me laughing.  I would not report such a catch, but Paul was there, saw the whole thing.  Soon the skies opened and it poured like hell for an hour or so.  Fishing was not good. The dam keeper lowered the water flow to 900 cfs, the "ideal" flow.  It usually takes a day for the fish adjust to a change in the water flow.  I took a nice 18 inch brookie out of the head of the pool (were the 23 inch trout was taken), and some small (10 – 14 inch) salmon before calling it a day. The lake is full and hopefully will remain so throughout the season.  Last year, they recorded a water temp in September of 72 degrees — the highest ever recorded.  Normal temp should be no higher than 66, with 62 the norm.  Here’s hoping the clave has good water come September!!!!! Our trip home on Saturday morning was uneventful.  We arrived home to a cavalcade of color — all of Jo’s rhododendron and mountain laurel were in full bloom.  And the lawn looks like a hay field!  Tomorrow’s another day. And then on Monday I head back to the Rapid, hoping the damn keeper hasn’t increased the flow. Dave LaCourse

Response:

… Here’s hoping the clave has good water come September!!!!!

As clavemeister you’re obligated to do more than "hope", damnit. Hell, Waldo put the triple whammy "no rain" mojo in the mail to Wolfgang knowing that we were riding down together and you saw what happened at Waldo’s Spring Fling. Get busy workin’ on that weather, Chief. Nice trip report. Trip reports are my favorite read, thank you, sir. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

Forty writes: Get busy workin’ on that weather, Chief.

We *want* rain to fill the lake.  But if the new owners of the dams do not know how to run their flow properly, all the rain in the world ain’t gonna help. Waldo’s got a mojo, huh? Forgot in the report: Two moose (one going in, one out), two deer, 1 eagle, 1 osprey, and a whole bunch of loons and ducks.  And it was cold:  40 degrees *in the cabin* on Tuesday morning! Dave LaCourse

Response:

 Dave,  I went "hunting" last week Got two rolls of Elk.One roll at about 40 yds.The other varies from 80-200 yds.Another roll of mountain goat. More fun than sittin home thinking about my ills. —  Don Thompson  Zoomie(BushBug)  ACA#3460  TLCB#335  Any Time, Any Place  Pull the chocks, lets get this kite in the air.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Forty writes: Get busy workin’ on that weather, Chief. We *want* rain to fill the lake.  But if the new owners of the dams do not know how to run their flow properly, all the rain in the world ain’t gonna help. Waldo’s got a mojo, huh? Forgot in the report: Two moose (one going in, one out), two deer, 1 eagle, 1 osprey, and a whole bunch of loons and ducks.  And it was cold:  40 degrees *in the cabin* on Tuesday morning! Dave LaCourse

Response:

Waldo’s got a mojo, huh?

that’s what the ladies down at pappy’s tell me… just returned from dinner at the Texas Roadhouse with Marie & IJ. Joe said he owed Jeffie a steak but he’d rather buy me one… I ordered that big 16 oz. Ribeye…. thanks Jeff…tater and salad were good also IJ and I fished the S. Toe today…. IJ was catching fish left and right where wuffie couldn’t nary a rise….. the water is at least a foot and a half lower than when trip, ken, wolf, and i went there during the clave. if we don’t get some serious rain soon, i might as well pack up the trout gear until fall. I caught a bunch (& missed a bunch) also including a spectacularly colored brookie of about 10-12 inches. All mine were caught on a size 14 black foam beetle. Man that’s a great summertime pattern. I fished the same fly the whole day and it’s none the worse for wear. we didn’t even fish upper wilson’s…. water was so low it was disheartening. great report dave…..congrats on the suckah …. see ya in september. walt

Response:

Waldo’s got a mojo, huh? that’s what the ladies down at pappy’s tell me…

        oh, for god’s sake.  let’s get back to reality…  if we don’t get some serious rain soon, i might as well pack up the trout gear until fall.

        that’s strange.  last week when dash riprock and i were up on eagle and snowbird, it was all we could do to wade.  high, murky water, and rains morning and night.  i kept thinking forty was fishing just ahead of us. I caught a bunch (& missed a bunch) also including a spectacularly colored brookie of about 10-12 inches. All mine were caught on a size 14 black foam beetle. Man that’s a great summertime pattern. I fished the same fly the whole day and it’s none the worse for wear.

        yeah, and a little prince nymph as a dropper puts the beetle in the film.  killer rig in low water.         waldo:  let’s slap the piggy week after next.  i got to try a case this coming week, but then a couple play days open up. wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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Waldo’s got a mojo, huh?

Correction:  Waldo HAD a mojo.  I got it now and you bastards ain’t gonna see it cuz I can’t make the fall ball.  Will save it for next spring and will only use it THEN if I get an iron clad guarantee that I will be treated better than I was this year.  To whit; Waldo, I want to see fish in the south Toe!  And I want to see some of these alleged Brookies y’all claim to have down there. Wolfgang who is beginning to feel petulant

Response:

So I guess the Upper Creek exercise regiment was not good enough for you! Opie     –Petulant and Frenzied, I’m in a petulant frenzy–

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Waldo’s got a mojo, huh? Correction:  Waldo HAD a mojo.  I got it now and you bastards ain’t gonna see it cuz I can’t make the fall ball.  Will save it for next spring and will only use it THEN if I get an iron clad guarantee that I will be treated better than I was this year.  To whit; Waldo, I want to see fish in the south Toe!  And I want to see some of these alleged Brookies y’all claim to have down there. Wolfgang who is beginning to feel petulant

Response:

Wolfgang who is beginning to feel petulant

Well, I guess that is better than when you were flatulent <g Warren X#-[

Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

Response:

Question:

Congratulations Dave

Response:

BTW: When replying to Codmarines posts we should use something other than "[snip]" to indicate we shortened the message

Auuuughhh! — Michael Era

Question:

Why write what you would like to express in such large letters?

It’s a question of a diciple to his / her beloved master Osho. In order to make a clear viewable difference the bookprinting company decided to choose this typo with large letters for the question.  It seems to me that you aren’t very confident of beliefs and that’s why you feel forced to "scream" your thoughts.

Who’m are you talking to? This was a question asked by an anonymous disciple at the 18th of August 1976 in the Buddha Hall of the Ashram in Poona / India and I’m not shure that this disciple will read your posting in this NG … However it’s fruitless to make assumptions because I don’t know you.

Indeed – we all don’t know this person. Or are you assuming that I’m – Hari Har Singh – Osho??? I don’t hope so … Arguing is worthless, if it’s knowledge we seek, then open-discussion is more appropriate.

There are many ways to knowledge. An open discussion is allways wellcomned. Who likes to be told that they’re wrong, anyway.

Better to be told that 1 time than running along the wrong way a whole lifetime, hm? We all have different points of view, different perceptions of things, so how could you tell someone that they are wrong?

Many ppl have been and are wrong. That’s nothing impossible. To make mistakes is human. And do you want to leave them in their mistake if you can give them a hint? Simply because you’re right doesn’t make someone else wrong, does it?

??? To who’m are you talking to?? I never said that I’m "right"! Science can’t be denied, I agree with that…however I feel something, an energy that I can’t describe personally through science.  If anyone would be felt by everyone.

Are the Ionsons possibly thinking that I’m Osho?? Shall I really write big QUOTE – QUOTE – QUOTE – QUOTE lines in the next Osho quote I send? The next time I quote Mr. Bill Clinton, Albert Einstein or the Pope maybe somebody thinks I’m one of these persons … That’s a nice trick!! )) — Sat Nam – Hari Har Singh The second question: Question 2

<snipped

Response:

Why write what you would like to express in such large letters?  It seems to me that you aren’t very confident of beliefs and that’s why you feel forced to "scream" your thoughts.  However it’s fruitless to make assumptions because I don’t know you.  Arguing is worthless, if it’s knowledge we seek, then open-discussion is more appropriate.  Who likes to be told that they’re wrong, anyway.  We all have different points of view, different perceptions of things, so how could you tell someone that they are wrong?  Simply because you’re right doesn’t make someone else wrong, does it?  Science can’t be denied, I agree with that…however I feel something, an energy that I can’t describe personally through science.  If anyone would be felt by everyone. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The second question: Question 2 EACH CENTER OPENING BRINGS A DIFFERENT JEWEL: KUNDALINI, BALANCE, LOVE, EXPRESSION, A DIAMOND MIND. THIS IS THE DILEMMA: WHICH TO CHOOSE? YOU SAY CHOICELESSNESS IS BLISS, BUT SOCIETY REWARDS SPECIALISTS. ALSO, ON THE CELLULAR LEVEL, THE EVOLUTION OF COMPLEX ORGANISMS ARISES OUT OF THE INCREASING SPECIALIZATION OF ITS CELLS. YES, my emphasis is not to choose — be choiceless. Because if you choose, you become narrow. Every choice narrows you down. Every choice says, "Now I will have a window to the sky, not the whole sky." Why? Why have a frame to the sky? The sky is frameless. When you stand at a window and look into the sky, you have falsified the sky — because your window-frame looks as if it is framed on the sky. Then you have only a limited vision, narrow. Why be poor? Why not come out of the house and see the sky as it is — infinite? To me, life is an infinite expanding energy. Don’t make any choice! That’s why I don’t put sannyas against the world. I say be a sannyasin and be in the world, because a sannyasin, if he chooses the life of the monk and escapes from the world, will be poorer for that — because the world has many things to give to you. It is a tremendously beautiful device of God’s — to help you grow, to give you challenges, to give you new adventures; to give you opportunities to test yourself, your awareness, your being. If you escape from the world you will be escaping from all these opportunities. Sitting in a cave in the Himalayas you will be very poor — poor in the sense that you will not have richness of experience. And by and by you will become stupid. You will become silent — that’s true — because there will be nothing to distract you. But that silence also is of the Himalayas, it is not yours. Come back to the world and in the marketplace you will see your silence has disappeared. It was not yours — it was part of the Himalayan silence. You were deceived by yourself. When silence happens in the marketplace then it is true, then it is yours — now nobody can take it away. Now no distraction can be a distraction to you. You can remain anywhere; whatsoever the situation, your silence will remain there as a deep substratum to your being. It is inner. So I don’t say leave the world. I say be in the world and yet be beyond it — so that you can have both the experiences of the sansari, the worldly, and the sannyasin, the other-worldly. When both are possible, why choose? Make life as big as possible. Don’t narrow it down. "Each center opening brings a different jewel… the dilemma is which to choose." No, no need to choose any center. All the centers, all the seven chakras of the body, have to function well. All the centers of the body have to function in a unity, in an organic unity. From sex to sahasrar, from the first to the seventh, they should vibrate like an orchestra. You can choose one center. That’s what people have done: some people have chosen the sex center — they remain, around and around they go. They move in a circle. Their whole life remains just a process of sexuality — very poor. I don’t call them sinners; I simply call them very poor people. And poor by their own choice — when more was possible. It is as if you have an aeroplane and you yoke bullocks to it and use it as a bullock-cart. You are poor — not a sinner. You are simply foolish, stupid! Or you can use the aeroplane like a truck, like a bus — a little better than the bullock-cart, but still you are foolish. Such a costly vehicle, and you are using it as a bus! A vehicle that can fly into the skies, you are using it as a truck on the road. That’s what is happening. You have a beautiful orchestra within you, the full range, all the colors, all the notes — all that is possible is possible within you, but you cling to one center: the sex. Somebody clings to some other center, somebody to some other. And then there are people who think: "Leave all this, and we should just remain in the ajna chakra — in the third-eye center." That too is narrowing down your being. Better than being a bullock-cart but still you are a truck on the road. Then there are a few who think that they have to use only the sahasrar against all the six — then again you are confining your being. Then you have an aeroplane, but you never get down on the earth. You are going to have a big accident sooner or later because sooner or later the gas will be finished, the petrol will not be there. Flying continuously is dangerous. Sometimes come back to the earth, down to earth; refill the petrol, rest, relax; get ready to fly again. That’s the way. And the earth is beautiful — as much as the sky. The stars are beautiful, but have you watched, sitting in an aeroplane? — you cannot look very long in the sky, it is boring. It is beautiful, but it is monotonous. People start falling asleep sooner or later. They look outside the window for a little while and then they feel bored — it is monotonous. Earth is tremendously beautiful, never monotonous. So many flowers, so many trees, s o many birds, so many people. My emphasis is to live in all the seven centers together. Never lose contact with the lowest, and never avoid flying with the highest. Use all the centers! Then your wings will be in the sky and your roots will be in the earth. And a perfect man is a meeting of heaven and earth — that’s what Taoists say: a meeting of heaven and earth. That’s what a perfect man is: meeting of the physical and the spiritual, meeting of the body and the soul, meeting of the world and renunciation, meeting of prose and poetry. AND THE questioner asks: "You say choicelessness is bliss but society rewards specialists." That’s true — society is not interested in your bliss: society is interested in its own efficiency. Society is not bothered whether you are ecstatic or not — that is none of its business. Society wants you to be just efficient mechanisms, robots. Do the work that society wants you to do, and then the society is finished with you. What you do with your own being is none of its business. In fact, the society wants you not to do anything on your own, because that can become a distraction from efficiency. A man who is very happy cannot be so efficient — because he is so bubbling with happiness that efficiency seems trivial. What does it matter whether you earn one thousand rupees a month or ten thousand rupees a month? If his needs are fulfilled, a happy man doesn’t bother. He stops at a point; he is not obsessed with money. If a happy man sees that five days working is enough, then two days he rests — goes fishing or to the mountains. If he sees that only two days working is enough, then he works two days — in five days there are many more important things to do. He has to compose poetry, and he has to play his guitar, and he has to dance; and he has to just sit with friends and gossip; he has to meditate, pray, dance — he has a thousand and one things. His work is a need he has to fulfill. He enjoys it, but he is not obsessed with it. A happy man is never a perfectionist. Only unhappy people are perfectionists, only unhappy people are obsessed with their work — because that is the only way they can avoid themselves, they can avoid facing themselves. they can avoid encountering themselves. They are continuously working; late hours they will go on working; unless they fall asleep they go on working. Why? because they are afraid. If they stop work, then what to do? Then they are left to themselves and they cannot face themselves. Society is, of course, interested in specialists. And specialists, more or less, become inhuman — because they know too much about too little. Their whole vision becomes narrow, narrow, narrow. I have heard — the story must belong to the twenty-first century: One man knocked at a doctor’s, an eye specialist’s office, and he said, "My left eye is hurting very much, and I cannot see rightly, my vision is blurred." The doctor said, "Excuse me, I am sorry, but I specialize only in right eyes. For the left eye you will have to go to some other specialist." Narrower and narrower goes on the path of the specialist. He never sees the tree; he only can see the leaf. The whole is lost in the part. And, of course, the part cannot exist without the whole. In fact, all divisions are arbitrary. The leaf is not separate from the branch; the branch is not separate from the tree; the tree is not separate from the roots; the roots are not separate from the earth. Everything is in organic unity. The specialist goes on dividing, and by and by those divisions, those demarcations, take on too much importance. A specialist becomes inhuman. I have heard: A doctor put an elderly man on a diet because of his weight problem. The man returned to his doctor in two months’ time and he had lost dozens of pounds. The doctor was very pleased with the result. The patient said, "I

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Response:

The second question: Question 2 EACH CENTER OPENING BRINGS A DIFFERENT JEWEL: KUNDALINI, BALANCE, LOVE, EXPRESSION, A DIAMOND MIND. THIS IS THE DILEMMA: WHICH TO CHOOSE? YOU SAY CHOICELESSNESS IS BLISS, BUT SOCIETY REWARDS SPECIALISTS. ALSO, ON THE CELLULAR LEVEL, THE EVOLUTION OF COMPLEX ORGANISMS ARISES OUT OF THE INCREASING SPECIALIZATION OF ITS CELLS. YES, my emphasis is not to choose — be choiceless. Because if you choose, you become narrow. Every choice narrows you down. Every choice says, "Now I will have a window to the sky, not the whole sky." Why? Why have a frame to the sky? The sky is frameless. When you stand at a window and look into the sky, you have falsified the sky — because your window-frame looks as if it is framed on the sky. Then you have only a limited vision, narrow. Why be poor? Why not come out of the house and see the sky as it is — infinite? To me, life is an infinite expanding energy. Don’t make any choice! That’s why I don’t put sannyas against the world. I say be a sannyasin and be in the world, because a sannyasin, if he chooses the life of the monk and escapes from the world, will be poorer for that — because the world has many things to give to you. It is a tremendously beautiful device of God’s — to help you grow, to give you challenges, to give you new adventures; to give you opportunities to test yourself, your awareness, your being. If you escape from the world you will be escaping from all these opportunities. Sitting in a cave in the Himalayas you will be very poor — poor in the sense that you will not have richness of experience. And by and by you will become stupid. You will become silent — that’s true — because there will be nothing to distract you. But that silence also is of the Himalayas, it is not yours. Come back to the world and in the marketplace you will see your silence has disappeared. It was not yours — it was part of the Himalayan silence. You were deceived by yourself. When silence happens in the marketplace then it is true, then it is yours — now nobody can take it away. Now no distraction can be a distraction to you. You can remain anywhere; whatsoever the situation, your silence will remain there as a deep substratum to your being. It is inner. So I don’t say leave the world. I say be in the world and yet be beyond it — so that you can have both the experiences of the sansari, the worldly, and the sannyasin, the other-worldly. When both are possible, why choose? Make life as big as possible. Don’t narrow it down. "Each center opening brings a different jewel… the dilemma is which to choose." No, no need to choose any center. All the centers, all the seven chakras of the body, have to function well. All the centers of the body have to function in a unity, in an organic unity. From sex to sahasrar, from the first to the seventh, they should vibrate like an orchestra. You can choose one center. That’s what people have done: some people have chosen the sex center — they remain, around and around they go. They move in a circle. Their whole life remains just a process of sexuality — very poor. I don’t call them sinners; I simply call them very poor people. And poor by their own choice — when more was possible. It is as if you have an aeroplane and you yoke bullocks to it and use it as a bullock-cart. You are poor — not a sinner. You are simply foolish, stupid! Or you can use the aeroplane like a truck, like a bus — a little better than the bullock-cart, but still you are foolish. Such a costly vehicle, and you are using it as a bus! A vehicle that can fly into the skies, you are using it as a truck on the road. That’s what is happening. You have a beautiful orchestra within you, the full range, all the colors, all the notes — all that is possible is possible within you, but you cling to one center: the sex. Somebody clings to some other center, somebody to some other. And then there are people who think: "Leave all this, and we should just remain in the ajna chakra — in the third-eye center." That too is narrowing down your being. Better than being a bullock-cart but still you are a truck on the road. Then there are a few who think that they have to use only the sahasrar against all the six — then again you are confining your being. Then you have an aeroplane, but you never get down on the earth. You are going to have a big accident sooner or later because sooner or later the gas will be finished, the petrol will not be there. Flying continuously is dangerous. Sometimes come back to the earth, down to earth; refill the petrol, rest, relax; get ready to fly again. That’s the way. And the earth is beautiful — as much as the sky. The stars are beautiful, but have you watched, sitting in an aeroplane? — you cannot look very long in the sky, it is boring. It is beautiful, but it is monotonous. People start falling asleep sooner or later. They look outside the window for a little while and then they feel bored — it is monotonous. Earth is tremendously beautiful, never monotonous. So many flowers, so many trees, so many birds, so many people. My emphasis is to live in all the seven centers together. Never lose contact with the lowest, and never avoid flying with the highest. Use all the centers! Then your wings will be in the sky and your roots will be in the earth. And a perfect man is a meeting of heaven and earth — that’s what Taoists say: a meeting of heaven and earth. That’s what a perfect man is: meeting of the physical and the spiritual, meeting of the body and the soul, meeting of the world and renunciation, meeting of prose and poetry. AND THE questioner asks: "You say choicelessness is bliss but society rewards specialists." That’s true — society is not interested in your bliss: society is interested in its own efficiency. Society is not bothered whether you are ecstatic or not — that is none of its business. Society wants you to be just efficient mechanisms, robots. Do the work that society wants you to do, and then the society is finished with you. What you do with your own being is none of its business. In fact, the society wants you not to do anything on your own, because that can become a distraction from efficiency. A man who is very happy cannot be so efficient — because he is so bubbling with happiness that efficiency seems trivial. What does it matter whether you earn one thousand rupees a month or ten thousand rupees a month? If his needs are fulfilled, a happy man doesn’t bother. He stops at a point; he is not obsessed with money. If a happy man sees that five days working is enough, then two days he rests — goes fishing or to the mountains. If he sees that only two days working is enough, then he works two days — in five days there are many more important things to do. He has to compose poetry, and he has to play his guitar, and he has to dance; and he has to just sit with friends and gossip; he has to meditate, pray, dance — he has a thousand and one things. His work is a need he has to fulfill. He enjoys it, but he is not obsessed with it. A happy man is never a perfectionist. Only unhappy people are perfectionists, only unhappy people are obsessed with their work — because that is the only way they can avoid themselves, they can avoid facing themselves. they can avoid encountering themselves. They are continuously working; late hours they will go on working; unless they fall asleep they go on working. Why? because they are afraid. If they stop work, then what to do? Then they are left to themselves and they cannot face themselves. Society is, of course, interested in specialists. And specialists, more or less, become inhuman — because they know too much about too little. Their whole vision becomes narrow, narrow, narrow. I have heard — the story must belong to the twenty-first century: One man knocked at a doctor’s, an eye specialist’s office, and he said, "My left eye is hurting very much, and I cannot see rightly, my vision is blurred." The doctor said, "Excuse me, I am sorry, but I specialize only in right eyes. For the left eye you will have to go to some other specialist." Narrower and narrower goes on the path of the specialist. He never sees the tree; he only can see the leaf. The whole is lost in the part. And, of course, the part cannot exist without the whole. In fact, all divisions are arbitrary. The leaf is not separate from the branch; the branch is not separate from the tree; the tree is not separate from the roots; the roots are not separate from the earth. Everything is in organic unity. The specialist goes on dividing, and by and by those divisions, those demarcations, take on too much importance. A specialist becomes inhuman. I have heard: A doctor put an elderly man on a diet because of his weight problem. The man returned to his doctor in two months’ time and he had lost dozens of pounds. The doctor was very pleased with the result. The patient said, "I feel so young. doctor. Only today I saw a girl’s bare arm and I felt like biting it!" The doctor said, "You could have done. It’s only about forty calories.’ A specialist is a specialist. All specialization becomes basically inhuman. It loses track of the whole. But the society is interested in efficiency. So beware of the society. Society is not interested in your happiness, in your joy. The interest of the society is more production, efficiency, more work — and don’t ask for what, because they don’t know for what. If you work hard they will say to create better situations — for what? — to work still harder. It is just like a man who earns money and you ask him "For what?" He says, "To earn more money. "And then you earn more money, then what?" He says "To earn still more money." The thing seems to be vicious. The individual has totally different interests from the society, because the society has no soul. The society is soulless. And if you become too much a part of the society, it will reduce your soul also to a … read more »

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Question:

Does anyone know where the cheapest mail order prices are on the WWW for flyfishing accesories-flyting supplies, line,rods,etc? Thanks in advance, Alan

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Go to WWW.HOOKHACK.COM, take 20% off prices by saying you saw the item on the web. They’re the best!!!!

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Question:

I was fishing a small creek last night and noticed anumber of large carp leaping as if trying to catch a fly. Some would get clear out of the water — these were 8-10 pound carp. What causes a carp to leap like that? By the way, there was no hatch. grant

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I was fishing a small creek last night and noticed anumber of large carp leaping as if trying to catch a fly. Some would get clear out of the water — these were 8-10 pound carp. What causes a carp to leap like

At this time of year, probably normal spawning behavior. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

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I was fishing a small creek last night and noticed anumber of large carp leaping as if trying to catch a fly. Some would get clear out of the water — these were 8-10 pound carp. What causes a carp to leap like that? By the way, there was no hatch. grant

Carp frequently jump like that during spawining.  However, Carp do surface feed where there is a natural food source.  e.g. my son and I catch such 8-10 lb. carp in our local river where a Mulberry tree overhangs the water and the berries drop in.  It is also common for us to enconter channel cats from 5 lbs and up in the same locale.  He has even caught several bass in this area.  

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I was fishing a small creek last night and noticed anumber of large carp leaping as if trying to catch a fly. Some would get clear out of the water — these were 8-10 pound carp. What causes a carp to leap like that? By the way, there was no hatch. grant

I don’t know, but my theory is that they are too dumb to know where the water ends and the air begins.  They just keep on swimming up! Eric Oden

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I was fishing a small creek last night and noticed anumber of large carp leaping as if trying to catch a fly. Some would get clear out of the water — these were 8-10 pound carp. What causes a carp to leap like that? By the way, there was no hatch.

It’s just a guess but I think that Carp jump, not to catch a fly, but as part of their mating ritual.  There are hundreds of carp spawning in one of the nearby streams and they have been jumping for the last couple of weeks.  Now they’re often seen thrashing about with each other near the shoreline.  I’ve seen several fish in the 20 pound range.  I’ve even caught a few that were in the 10-20 pound range and had a couple that broke me off before I could ever see them. John Fereira

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Carp will roll as part of their spawing activities. Carp will also rise  to insects or floating seeds/berries or other vegetarian food. I have caught carp on a dry fly tied to imitate the seeds of the Cottonwood tree.

Very interesting, what do you call it "Matching The Bloom".  When I am in the mountains fishing for trout and those cottonwood seeds are on the water I can’t get a trout to come up for a dry fly. Ernie Harrison

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I’ve also heard it described as "Matching the Thatch", at least as far as the grass carp is concerned. Rick — Richard Padgett – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Carp will roll as part of their spawing activities. Carp will also rise  to insects or floating seeds/berries or other vegetarian food. I have caught carp on a dry fly tied to imitate the seeds of the Cottonwood tree. Very interesting, what do you call it "Matching The Bloom".  When I am in the mountains fishing for trout and those cottonwood seeds are on the water I can’t get a trout to come up for a dry fly. Ernie Harrison

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I’ve also heard it described as "Matching the Thatch", at least as far as the grass carp is concerned.

God I love it.  Carp flyfishing slang.  You go man ! — TimW Halfordian Golfer

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I was fishing a small creek last night and noticed anumber of large carp leaping as if trying to catch a fly. Some would get clear out of the water — these were 8-10 pound carp. What causes a carp to leap like At this time of year, probably normal spawning behavior.

Maybe, they jump for the same reason whales jump.  They have an itch….. — Joseph J. Egry IV, CHMM          |         "Fate protects fools, small Environmental Scientist          |          children, and ships named Riker http://www.netcom.com/~jjegry/my_pages.html

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Carp will roll as part of their spawing activities. Carp will also rise  to insects or floating seeds/berries or other vegetarian food. I have caught carp on a dry fly tied to imitate the seeds of the Cottonwood tree.

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I was fishing a small creek last night and noticed anumber of large carp leaping as if trying to catch a fly. Some would get clear out of the water — these were 8-10 pound carp. What causes a carp to leap like At this time of year, probably normal spawning behavior. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

I just got back from musky fishing n the Chippewa flowage in nothern wisconsin and the carp were leaping out of the water all over in the shallows whilst nest building.  Unfortunately I snagged a redhorse in the middle of the back while casting a gold rapala.  Twenty minutes later and several hundred yards down the river where he dragged the boat he broke off.  I did not know what I had for the first fifteen minutes till he surfaced.  I had visions of making the cover of field and stream with my record musky and could hardly stand my knees were shaking so much.

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It’s just a guess but I think that Carp jump, not to catch a fly, but as part of their mating ritual.

For trout in the vicinity of spawning carp, a large peach or beige colored glow bug makes a good carp-egg imitation. — -Wayne Trzyna

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Question:

DEAR JIM: There is a remarkable difference in staying power between soft and weak southern strains of bass compared to damned yankee bass found in Lake Erie or let us say in Wisconsin, etc.  A lot of it has to do with oxygen content but overall, southern bass on the average are soft and mushy fleshed.  Many other fishermen have noticed this also.  So if you’re going to make a choice, go north where the real fighting bass hang out. — George Gehrke/President Gehrke’s World’s Best Fly Fishing Products Asotin, WA 99402 509-243-4100  FAX 4644

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…..and while this is probably just my imagination George, it has always seemed to me that bass that hang out in rivers are stronger fighters than those that fin lazily in lakes…..for pure excitement, a river smallie that slams your topwater bug would be hard to top!   Regards, – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – DEAR JIM: There is a remarkable difference in staying power between soft and weak southern strains of bass compared to damned yankee bass found in Lake Erie or let us say in Wisconsin, etc.  A lot of it has to do with oxygen content but overall, southern bass on the average are soft and mushy fleshed.  Many other fishermen have noticed this also.  So if you’re going to make a choice, go north where the real fighting bass hang out. — George Gehrke/President Gehrke’s World’s Best Fly Fishing Products Asotin, WA 99402 509-243-4100  FAX 4644

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overall, southern bass on the average are soft and mushy fleshed.  Many other fishermen have noticed this also.  So if you’re going to make a choice, go north where the real fighting bass hang out.

Ahhhh, but George, everyone wants that ten pound HAWG!  And to get a HAWG you have to go south.  No one really seems to care that it will wallow in the mud and then show its belly like its namesake!  Can’t tell how hard a fish fought by looking at a picture! Hell, here in California we can’t even say HAWG, properly… Not even in southern California!

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overall, southern bass on the average are soft and mushy fleshed.  Many other fishermen have noticed this also.  So if you’re going to make a choice, go north where the real fighting bass hang out. Ahhhh, but George, everyone wants that ten pound HAWG!  And to get a HAWG you have to go south.  No one really seems to care that it will wallow in the mud and then show its belly like its namesake!  Can’t tell how hard a fish fought by looking at a picture! Hell, here in California we can’t even say HAWG, properly… Not even in southern California!

____YOU make me smile! Thanks Mr. G. — George Gehrke/President Gehrke’s World’s Best Fly Fishing Products Snake River – Hell’s Canyon Asotin, WA 99402 / 509-243-4100  FAX 4644

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In California we can say"hawg" in Lake Co.The state record largemouth is over 18 lbs. caught in Hidden Valley reservoir. The reservoir is planted with pure strain Fla. largemouth and may only be fished with permission of a landowner from the surrounding gated community.

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So you say you want bass, eh? Want some really fiesty bass? Not huge hawgs like you get in the southern US, but the smallmout bass here in Ontario are awesome. Get yourself up around Georgian Bay and bring some smallish poppers, nymphs, wooley buggers, crayfish imitations, etc. and hang on. I use a 6 wt 9 foot rod and I am in heaven. but just tell me when to show up! — George Gehrke/President Gehrke’s World’s Best Fly Fishing Products Snake River – Hell’s Canyon Asotin, WA 99402 / 509-243-4100  FAX 4644

Hi George I agree, the smallmouth is one of the hardest fighting fish pound for pound I’ve ever caught. Also there are a few in the Snake river near someone I know but shhh! I’ll never say where. Good tying &… — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

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So you say you want bass, eh? Want some really fiesty bass? Not huge hawgs like you get in the southern US, but the smallmout bass here in Ontario are awesome. Get yourself up around Georgian Bay and bring some smallish poppers, nymphs, wooley buggers, crayfish imitations, etc. and hang on. I use a 6 wt 9 foot rod and I am in heaven.

but just tell me when to show up! — George Gehrke/President Gehrke’s World’s Best Fly Fishing Products Snake River – Hell’s Canyon Asotin, WA 99402 / 509-243-4100  FAX 4644

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overall, southern bass on the average are soft and mushy fleshed.  Many other fishermen have noticed this also.  So if you’re going to make a choice, go north where the real fighting bass hang out. Ahhhh, but George, everyone wants that ten pound HAWG!  And to get a HAWG you have to go south.  No one really seems to care that it will wallow in the mud and then show its belly like its namesake!  Can’t tell how hard a fish fought by looking at a picture! Hell, here in California we can’t even say HAWG, properly… Not even in southern California!

So you say you want bass, eh? Want some really fiesty bass? Not huge hawgs like you get in the southern US, but the smallmout bass here in Ontario are awesome. Get yourself up around Georgian Bay and bring some smallish poppers, nymphs, wooley buggers, crayfish imitations, etc. and hang on. I use a 6 wt 9 foot rod and I am in heaven.

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DEAR JIM: There is a remarkable difference in staying power between soft and weak southern strains of bass compared to damned yankee bass found in Lake Erie or let us say in Wisconsin, etc.  A lot of it has to do with oxygen content but overall, southern bass on the average are soft and mushy fleshed.  Many other fishermen have noticed this also.  So if you’re going to make a choice, go north where the real fighting bass hang out.

George,   I don’t know where you got your information on "southern" bass. There is a largemouth strain that is called "Florida bass" and have been transplanted to many other parts of the country, even to places outside the South. Are you saying that there is less oxygen in the lakes and rivers in the South than in the northern parts of the country and the causes the bass to become weak and mushy fleshed. Thats crazy. I’ve caught bass from Canada to Florida. Admittedly, a five-pound smallmouth in Canada (which is a whopper there) gives one heck of a fight. But tie into one like that in Dale Hollow (look it up on a map) or on the Holston and tell me about "weak southern fish". Go to Rodman (knowing about southern fish I’m sure that you know where this is) and hook-up with a big largemouth in the stump fields and tell me that he is weak and mushy.    As far as the flesh of the Florida bass goes, its as firm and good-tasting as any that I’ve eaten.    These are, of course, only my opinions which are based on anecdotal information. What are yours based on? A priori opinions, I suspect. —

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ryan(& rec.outdoors.fishing.fly), Note: This was a hoax a year ago and still is. You can not introduce a virus into your system by reading a Usenet message. For DOS it must be an executable file and must in fact be opened. Never rally thought about these things propagating over and over as new folks come online. Urban Myths have now become Cyber Myths. I have no intent to waste bandwidth but I felt I neeed to post this as well as contact Ryan directly. regards, Joe Webb Atlanta Mac User Group (AMUG)

Joe, your statement is not altogether true. Do you remember a few years ago of a virus spreading on a UNIX machines across the Internet ? As I recall the virus was spread in a ‘mail’ message and took advantage of an application bug which utilized gets to read the input. Understanding how stack frames are built and their relationship to buffers of automatic scope, it is easy to see how this was done. My apologies to the readers for deviating from FF’ing ! -Dan-

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Hi Group, A friend just advised me that a new virus is on the net which is supposed to have come from someone on AOL.  If you receive e-mail titled "Good Times" DELETE it immediately.  DO NOT read it.  If you do, your hard drive will be wiped clean. The virus can also damage your processor. It’s frustrating to have people out there doing this kind of stuff but at least we’ve been warned. Good Luck and don’t read Good Times Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT

The Goot Times Virus is a hoax. You can only get a virus if you download an executable file and run it. You won’t contract a virus by simply viewing e-mail

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This Good Times crap is just that-Pure BS. You cannot get any kind of virus through an email message. —

"A Bad Day Fishing Is Better Than A Good Day At Work" Web Page:  http://www.tiac.net/users/macaw

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A friend just advised me that a new virus is on the net which is supposed to have come from someone on AOL.  If you receive e-mail titled "Good Times" DELETE it immediately.  DO NOT read it.  If you do, your hard drive will be wiped clean. The virus can also damage your processor.

It’s a little known fact, but you can counter the effects of the "Good Times" virus by mailing a get well card to Craig Shergold. Be sure to include the recipe for Nieman-Marcus Toll House Cookies. Mike Rophone I never gave a fuck about the ‘net until I met Senator Exon

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Hi Group, A friend just advised me that a new virus is on the net which is supposed to have come from someone on AOL.  If you receive e-mail titled "Good Times" DELETE it immediately.  DO NOT read it.  If you do, your hard drive will be wiped clean. The virus can also damage your processor. It’s frustrating to have people out there doing this kind of stuff but at least we’ve been warned. Good Luck and don’t read Good Times Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT

Response:

Hi Group, A friend just advised me that a new virus is on the net which is supposed to have come from someone on AOL.  If you receive e-mail titled "Good Times" DELETE it immediately.  DO NOT read it.  If you do, your hard drive will be wiped clean. The virus can also damage your processor.

This is a well known hoax.  Here’s some additional info for the curious. -Dave  email virus is a hoax!       If anyone repeats the hoax, please show them the FAQ.             G o o d   T i m e s   V i r u s  H o a x        F r e q u e n t l y   A s k e d   Q u e s t i o n s                             by Les Jones                         Febraury 6, 1996      This information may be freely reproduced in any medium,             as long as the information is unmodified. February 6, 1995 Update The Good Times virus hoax keeps on going. I receive almost daily reports of hoax activity. I’m reposting the FAQ to relevant newsgroups, and I’ve set up my own web pages: http://www.usit.net/public/lesjones/goodtimes-faq.html http://www.usit.net/public/lesjones/goodtimes-mini-faq.html http://users.aol.com/macfaq/goodtimes-faq.html http://users.aol.com/macfaq/goodtimes-mini-faq.html The FAQ has been updated with current URLs and a new section discussing the Word macro virus. A call to educators and translators If you teach classes or write books about the Internet, I encourage to educate people about Good Times. The Good Times myth is not going away anytime soon, so we should start including it in Internet curriculum now. The FAQ is free for redistribution in any medium, so feel free to integrate it into any class materials or published works. Good Times has spread to many countries, and has been translated into many languages. If you are bilingual, you can help debunk Good Times by translating the FAQ into another language. If you do translate the FAQ, please let me know the URL so I can include it in the FAQ. Is the Good Times email virus a hoax? Yes. It was a hoax in November of 1994, and it’s still a hoax in February of 1996. America Online, government computer security agencies, and makers of anti-virus software have declared Good Times a hoax. See Online References at the end of the FAQ. Since the hoax began in November of 1994, no copy of the alleged virus has ever been found, nor has there been a single verified case of a viral attack. Why should I believe the FAQ instead of the hoax? Unlike the warnings that have been passed around, the FAQ is signed and dated. I’ve included my email address, and the email addresses of contributors, for verification. I’ve also provided online references at the end of the FAQ so that you can confirm this information for yourself. I’m new to the Internet. What is the Good Times virus hoax? The story is that a virus called Good Times is being carried by email. Just reading a message with "Good Times" in the subject line will erase your hard drive, or even destroy your computer’s processor. Needless to say, it’s a hoax, but a lot of people believed it. The original message ended with instructions to "Forward this to all your friends," and many people did just that. Warnings about Good Times have been widely distributed on mailing lists, Usenet newsgroups, and message boards. The original hoax started in early December of 1994. It sprang up again in March of 1995. In mid-April, a new version of the hoax that mentioned a FCC report began circulating. Worried that Good Times would never go away, I decided to write the FAQ. These worries proved valid when the hoax began popping up again in October of 1995. What is the effect of the hoax? For those who already know it’s a hoax, it’s a nuisance to read the repeated warnings. For people who don’t know any better, it causes needless concern and lost productivity. The virus hoax infects mailing lists, bulletin boards, and Usenet newsgroups. Worried system administrators needlessly worry their employees by posting dire warnings. The hoax is not limited to the United States. It has appeared in several English-speaking and non-English-speaking countries. One reader sent me an English transcription of a radio broadcast in Malta. ‘infection’ I came across all tended to result from the message getting into the hands of senior non-computing personnel. Those with the ability and authority to spread it widely, without the knowledge to spot its nonsensical content." Some of the companies that have reportedly fallen for the hoax include AT&T, CitiBank, NBC, Hughes Aircraft, Microsoft, Texas Instruments, and dozens or hundreds of others. There have been outbreaks at numerous colleges. The U.S. government has not been immune. Some of the government agencies that have reportedly fallen victim to the hoax include the Department of Defense, the FCC, NASA, the USDA, U.S. Census Bureau, and various national labs. I’ve confirmed outbreaks at the Department of Health and Human Services, though they had the good sense to question the hoax, and ask for more information on Usenet, before passing the hoax along to their employees. The virus hoax has occasionally escaped into the popular media. Tom Sullivan show on KFBK 1530 AM radio in Sacramento, California, a police officer warned listeners not to read email labeled "Good Times", and to report the sender to the police. Other radio stations, including Australia’s ABC radio, have also spread the hoax. There are scattered reports of the virus spreading via Faxnet, that low-tech network of secretaries and bored knowledge workers that traffics in cartoons and dumb blonde jokes. What was the CIAC bulletin? On December 6, 1994, the U.S. Department of Energy’s CIAC (Computer Incident Advisory Capability) issued a bulletin declaring the Good Times virus a hoax and an urban legend. The bulletin was widely quoted as an antidote to the hoax. The original document can be found at the address in Online References at the end of the FAQ. Note that the document went through several minor revisions, with 94-04c of December 8 being the most recent. Like all quoted material in the FAQ, it includes the original spelling and punctuation. Because some of the lines in the CIAC report are rather long, they will appear broken. —-Begin quoted material—- THE "Good Times" VIRUS IS AN URBAN LEGEND In the early part of December, CIAC started to receive information requests about a supposed "virus" which could be contracted via America OnLine, simply by reading a message. | Here is some important information. Beware of a file called Goodtimes.    | |                                                                          | |  Happy Chanukah everyone, and be careful out there. There is a virus on   | | America Online being sent by E-Mail.  If you get anything called "Good    | | Times", DON’T read it or download it.  It is a virus that will erase your | | hard drive.  Forward this to all your friends.  It may help them a lot.   | THIS IS A HOAX.  Upon investigation, CIAC has determined that this message originated from both a user of America Online and a student at a university at approximately the same time, and it was meant to be a hoax. CIAC has also seen other variations of this hoax, the main one is that any electronic mail message with the subject line of "xxx-1" will infect your computer. This rumor has been spreading very widely.  This spread is due mainly to the fact that many people have seen a message with "Good Times" in the header. They delete the message without reading it, thus believing that they have saved themselves from being attacked. These first-hand reports give a false sense of credibility to the alert message. There has been one confirmation of a person who received a message with "xxx-1" in the header, but an empty message body.  Then, (in a panic, because he had heard the alert), he checked his PC for viruses (the first time he checked his machine in months) and found a pre-existing virus on his machine. He incorrectly came to the conclusion that the E-mail message gave him the virus (this particular virus could NOT POSSIBLY have spread via an E-mail message).  This person then spread his alert. As of this date, there are no known viruses which can infect merely through reading a mail message.  For a virus to spread some program must be executed. Reading a mail message does not execute the mail message.  Yes, Trojans have been found as executable attachments to mail messages, the most notorious being the IBM VM Christmas Card Trojan of 1987, also the TERM MODULE Worm (reference CIAC Bulletin B-7) and the GAME2 MODULE Worm (CIAC Bulletin B-12). But this is not the case for this particular "virus" alert. If you encounter this message being distributed on any mailing lists, simply ignore it or send a follow-up message stating that this is a false rumor. Karyn Pichnarczyk CIAC Team —-End quoted material—- Note: Karyn is now with Cisco. Her new email address is The CIAC report was wrong when it stated that the hoax was started by "a user of America Online and a student at a university." See "Who started the hoax." What’s the first version of the warning (FYI)? I have an early version of the hoax … read more »

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drive will be wiped clean. The virus can also damage your processor.

A virus cannot damage your processor. It’s frustrating to have people out there doing this kind of stuff but at least we’ve been warned.

Agreed Tight lines, Jay Whitworth

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Regarding the good times virus: I just received an FYI forwarded through the university admin here at MSU-Bozeman, stating that the GOOD TIMES virus is a farce. Evidently, warnings about it were posted from an AOL user who was intentionally crying wolf. But, before that, I received a warning notice about the virus. My latest info says its a fake, but I’ve heard both sides. Anyone know the TRUTH about GOOD TIMES? Better safe than sorry till then, don’t read any mail which promises good times… Ryan Jordan J&J Flies http://www.erc.montana.edu/~ryan_j/jjflies/jjflies.htm & Center for Biofilm Engineering http://www.erc.montana.edu/~ryan_j/

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This Good Times crap is just that-Pure BS. You cannot get any kind of virus through an email message.

If there were such a thing as a Good Times virus, it would probably be a lot more dangerous if it were renamed the WARNING!!! virus. — Keep your stick on the ice.

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: It’s a little known fact, but you can counter the effects of the : "Good Times" virus by mailing a get well card to Craig Shergold. Sorry bud, Craig Shergold died about 3 years ago.  Guess he didn’t get enough cards.  This time it’s Biff Maloney, but the card still goes to the same address.  I guess it’s just a bad luck bed. : Be sure to include the recipe for Nieman-Marcus Toll House : Cookies. Yeah, because everyone has the Mrs. Fields cookie recipe.   : I never gave a fuck about the ‘net until I met Senator Exon                  ^^^^ Brought to you by the letters ACLU and EEF. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Assistant professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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Regarding the good times virus: I just received an FYI forwarded through the university admin here at MSU-Bozeman, stating that the GOOD TIMES virus is a farce. Evidently, warnings about it were posted from an AOL user who was intentionally crying wolf. But, before that, I received a warning notice about the virus. My latest info says its a fake, but I’ve heard both sides. Anyone know the TRUTH about GOOD TIMES? Better safe than sorry till then, don’t read any mail which promises good times… Ryan Jordan

Ryan(& rec.outdoors.fishing.fly), Note: This was a hoax a year ago and still is. You can not introduce a virus into your system by reading a Usenet message. For DOS it must be an executable file and must in fact be opened. Never rally thought about these things propagating over and over as new folks come online. Urban Myths have now become Cyber Myths. I have no intent to waste bandwidth but I felt I neeed to post this as well as contact Ryan directly. regards, Joe Webb Atlanta Mac User Group (AMUG)

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Question:

I’ve often seen the advice posted to ask a local fly shop about what flies are currently on a stream where I intend to fish and what a good stretch of water is.  If the fly shop is not near my home and therefore I don’t usually take my business there, what is the fair way to compensate them for their advice?  Should I buy a fly or two?  Some fur or feathers?

Sure that’d be good.  But lets say your headed there maybe next month.  In the mean time, give them a call and get their address.  Send them $20 or so, and ask them to gather up a few flies that should be working when you arrive and mail them to you.  Also ask them for a tip on locations, etc. Typically, you’ll get good stuff, probably more than what you actually paid for (lets say the $ covers 10 flies, most times you’ll get a dz anyway), plus you’ll have models for your own tying bench. When you get there, stop in.  You will be warmly greeted by the guy or gal who filled your order, and they’ll remember you as a friend.  Trust me on this- it always has been effective! — Mike Tucker- The Virtual Flyshop, The Complete Resource              Web Page:  http://rmii.com/~flyshop/flyshop.html              Tel. 970-498-8779   FAX 970-491-2585 If you try 970 and it doesn’t work use 303.  Leave it to US WEST to change our area code and not tell the rest of the world……

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I’ve often seen the advice posted to ask a local fly shop about what flies are currently on a stream where I intend to fish and what a good stretch of water is.  If the fly shop is not near my home and therefore I don’t usually take my business there, what is the fair way to compensate them for their advice?  Should I buy a fly or two?  Some fur or feathers?  (I tie my own flies.)  Or do they really not mind some guy coming in, asking about flies and good spots, then walking out? Thanks for the advice/opinions, Dave

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Braunegg) writes: I’ve often seen the advice posted to ask a local fly shop about what flies are currently on a stream where I intend to fish and what a good stretch of water is.  If the fly shop is not near my home and therefore I don’t usually take my business there, what is the fair way to compensate them for their advice?  Should I buy a fly or two?  Some fur or feathers?  (I tie my own flies.)  Or do they really not mind some guy coming in, asking about flies and good spots, then walking out? Thanks for the advice/opinions, Dave

Buy only what you need and try to give them some feedback on your experience so your not the only one getting something out of this. They aren’t running a community service, they are in business! Sharing good locations and tips keeps *customers* comming back so it makes good business sense, but, after a while, they may find that they take a bit longer to get to you…

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I’ve often seen the advice posted to ask a local fly shop about what flies are currently on a stream where I intend to fish and what a good stretch of water is.  If the fly shop is not near my home and therefore I don’t usually take my business there, what is the fair way to compensate them for their advice?  Should I buy a fly or two?  Some fur or feathers?  (I tie my own flies.)  Or do they really not mind some guy coming in, asking about flies and good spots, then walking out?

This is really a nice question to see.  Without deteriorating into a rant, if you go into a fly shop and someone won’t give you the time of day until you flash your AMEX, leave and go elsewhere.  There are too many people who run shops who simply don’t deal with anyone but their perceived "good customers."  Let ‘em starve.  In our shop, everyone I’ve hired remains employed primarily on a customer service basis.  The sales people are not commissioned.  In my mind and the vision of our store, we treat a purchase of a tippet and the purchase of an outfit are equally important.  If I catch someone short-answering any customer, I point out proper behavior. (and most of those guys got jobs with other fly shops . . . strange how that works.) Of course, store-folk are human.  We deal with the 20 questions about this knot, that fly, or those fisheries, many asked in the most unbelievably rude and offensive manner, and every once in a while, our heads start to whirl a bit.   So, as  a previous poster noted, it is nice to call back and return information.  Luckily, this business is still one in which relationships can develop between customers and shop owners.  As a customer, if you feel someone treated you well, return the favor.  If they were unhelpful and rude spend your money elsewhere.   Many times my eventual "best customers" came from a 15 minute phone conversation in which I didn’t make any money at all. Well, got to go open the shop — hope this helps –jim *                                                     *

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If I catch someone short-answering any customer, I point out proper behavior. (and most of those guys got jobs with other fly shops . . . strange how that works.) Luckily, this business is still one in which relationships can develop between customers and shop owners.  As a customer, if you feel someone treated you well, return the favor.  If they were unhelpful and rude spend your money elsewhere.  

Good to see this response from a fly shop owner. Where I live we have three fly shops.  I frequent two of them, and these tow are as happy to see a customer when he’s buying a sppol of tippet (or nothing at all) as when he’s buying a new rod.  The other shop just doesn’t have a friendly atmosphere.  I think the main thing that makes anyone a repeat customer in a fly shop is that they are comfortable there, even if they don’t spend their money.   As consumers, it’s only fair that we support the shops we like.  Don’t go cast a rod at your local shop, and the buy it through mail order because you can save a few bucks.  It’s low class, and it may result in the fly shop not being there the next time you really need something.  Want to wait three weeks for mail order when you need something for the weekend. Just my $0.02

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: I’ve often seen the advice posted to ask a local fly shop about what : flies are currently on a stream where I intend to fish and what a good : stretch of water is.  If the fly shop is not near my home and : therefore I don’t usually take my business there, what is the fair way : to compensate them for their advice?  Should I buy a fly or two?  Some : fur or feathers?  (I tie my own flies.)  Or do they really not mind : some guy coming in, asking about flies and good spots, then walking : out? : Thanks for the advice/opinions, : Dave         The easiest thing to do is to buy some of the flies that they recommend whether you tie or not there has to be something that you don’t have.         Rick

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Braunegg) writes: I’ve often seen the advice posted to ask a local fly shop about what flies are currently on a stream where I intend to fish and what a good stretch of water is.  If the fly shop is not near my home and therefore I don’t usually take my business there, what is the fair way to compensate them for their advice?  Should I buy a fly or two?  Some fur or feathers?  (I tie my own flies.)  Or do they really not mind some guy coming in, asking about flies and good spots, then walking out? Thanks for the advice/opinions, Dave Buy only what you need and try to give them some feedback on your experience so your not the only one getting something out of this. They aren’t running a community service, they are in business! Sharing good locations and tips keeps *customers* comming back so it makes good business sense, but, after a while, they may find that they take a bit longer to get to you…

Hi, I hate quoting quotes, but to follow this up… We welcome people just dropping in and chatting about NS and where to flyfish. I even went so far as to put in a map and a bl;ackboard and some markers for the map, and we made a "community fishing bulletin board- the old style not electronic!). Why I don’t mind, even if you don’t buy then, is that someday you will weant to buy, and hopefully you’ll remember us – In the meantime…. Tight Lines Bill Curry Tight Lines Tackle Shop and Guide Service Lockeport, Nova Scotia Canada   B0T 1L0 902-656-3329 (ph and fax)

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Question:

Chalk up another vote for Cargill Creek.  The shop I work in takes groups down every year in November – best time to go – and organizes trips for others at any other time.  Owner and manager are good friends with Millie and Joe.  Both have caught world class bones and have some kind of sixth sense about dem bones.  Call John or Wayne at The Troutfitter (Wayne’s is featured in a picture for Andros Island bonefishing, I think for a new Orvis ad) 315-446-2047, Syracuse, NY. Tell them Tom got you onto them through the computer (they still don’t believe this stuff is for real).  If nothing else, they will be a great source of information (John’s flies are also somewhat magic).  The trips we organize average about $2500 for a week (including, room, board, food, and guides daily – either wading the flats, poling through the back cays, or both).  John’s brother is also down there guiding full-time.  Another good person to look up if you go, and I hear his lobster/conch stew is pretty tasty.  Also, if you’re interested in Montana, these guys can provide the same information/assistance or put you on the spring creeks.  Unfortunately, their spring creek and bonefish trips are usually booked a year in advance.  Give it a shot, if you want, I’ll snail mail you some literature.  Email me back with an address or again, call the shop, they’ll be glad to set you up and get you on their trip mailing list. Best of luck, Tom Carroway

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interramp.com!psinntp!cmcl2!yale.edu!yale!zip.eecs.umich.edu!newshost.marca m.co
m!insosf1.infonet.net!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!gatech!howland.reston.ans.ne t!cs
utexas.edu!uunet!newstf01.news.aol.com!newsbf02.news.aol.com!not-for-mail
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<Can anybody give me recommendations on guides/lodges for bone fishing in
<the Bahamas.  We have a group of four that would like to go down there
<this spring.  What can we expect to pay for  a decent guide with our
<without lodging?  Any help would be greatly appreciated.

I stayed one week last July at the Great Abaco Bonefishing Club at Great Abaco. This particular destination has been featured in a few of the flyfishing magazines lately (Fly Fishing in Salt Waters Jan/Feb.’95 and Fly Fisherman March ‘95) so I won’t go into any details. As a whole, our group was pretty pleased with our stay…great lodge, good food, relatively experienced guides and some beautiful water. This is not a place to go for large numbers, but the average size was good (3-4 lbs) and we did catch some larger bones (at least I found them large) up 7-8 lbs. On a more general note, I can recommend a monthly newsletter I’m subscribing to called The Angling Report published by Don Causey out of Miami (305 670-1918). This newsletter covers flyfishing destinations worldwide, although with more emphasise on the US. The material is based on reports from subscribers as well as independant writers. This is the only publication I’ve come across that really tells you both "the good" and "the bad", where to go and even more important where not to go. Tight lines! Inge Solberg Houston, Texas

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Can anybody give me recommendations on guides/lodges for bone fishing in the Bahamas.  We have a group of four that would like to go down there this spring.  What can we expect to pay for  a decent guide with our without lodging?  Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

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<Can anybody give me recommendations on guides/lodges for bone fishing in <the Bahamas.  We have a group of four that would like to go down there <this spring.  What can we expect to pay for  a decent guide with our <without lodging?  Any help would be greatly appreciated. Try Andros Bonefishing Club or Cargill Creek on Andros. Fishing for a week with guides and room and food is about $1800-$2000. Good luck Dave

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