Question:

   Back to the pond today

(snipped) These are lots of fun to read.  Thank you. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless remove invalid or hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

Response:

Stan, Do you have a link to a gurgler pattern? Do I have links!

excellent!! Thanks, Rob

Response:

crystal chenille or Estaz body instead of a palmered hackle.

I seldom use anything but crystal chenille or estaz for body material. This includes the gurglers I tie for the huge hoppers we get around here about every other year. Those tied iin size 2/0 have caught 8 pound channel cats off the surface for me. They hove not been out this year, so I guess I have till next year till I die of a heart attack as I battle a huge catfish on a gurgler. I also have enjoyed this thread a hell of a lot. It has been tough for me this year as my favorite bluegill lake was drained a few months ago.  They also drained the lake where I have caught more bluegill that actualy weigh over a pound. Seems like my favorite waters are being ruined by folks that don’t know what the hell they are doing. Big Dale  

Response:

Back to the pond today to worry the panfish population.

<… Todd, I’ve been enjoying your bluegill posts.  I’m a long time bluegill junkie myself – living in a place where the pond is 15 minutes from my door, and the nearest trout water is over twice that (also the only fishable trout water for 3/4 the population of Massachusetts in the summertime…). I went out three days this week, and had three completely different experiences.  There’s a saying about the weather in Massachusetts… Sunday was cold and rainy and the fish just weren’t interested in surface bugs, but I persisted.  I do like to fish subsurface, but I had my 4 wt. and didn’t want to mess with weighted nymphs.  I plugged away with my green gurglers and caught about a dozen fish – missed dozens more.  It was mostly small fish making a big show – coming out of the water to grab the fly, and being to small to take it under water.  I could just leave it sitting next to the rapidly fading lily pads, and several dinks would play with it, until finally a decent fish would make it’s move.  Funny, and lots of fun. I went out again Tuesday.  It had rained steadily all day Monday so I stayed dry and tied up a few more gurglers.  Tuesday was a real change in the weather.  In the mid 80s and mostly sunny.  When I got to the pond at 4:30 there was a huge midge hatch going on and bluegills were rising all over the pond.  So, I got to fish to risers all evening.  These fish aren’t fussy, and I would just plop the gurgler into a patch where there were working fish, and one would immediately jump on the fly.  The bluegills and orange and blue damsel flies were gorging on tiny red midge emergers and adults. The pond surface was almost carpeted by the bugs.  The fish were fat and happy, as was I. Wednesday was different again.  No midges coming off, no surface risers, but the big gills were back in shallow water.  The orange damsel flies were out in number and I switched to an orange gurgler.  Another 30+ fish evening. It’s supposed to be back into the low nineties over the weekend, so I’m looking forward to several more warm evenings out on the pond this week, –Stan

Response:

The orange damsel flies were out in number and I switched to an orange gurgler.  Another 30+ fish evening.

Stan, Do you have a link to a gurgler pattern?  I just hit a local lake this week.  Could only stop by quickly on the way home 2 eves., last night picking up 4 bluegills in 20 minutes.  Two of them were nice sized…about the biggest I can recall catching…although they weren’t large fish.  One was probably about 6" or so and nice and fat.  Thinking about it some more, I’m not sure what type of [sun, pan] fish it was.  Nevertheless, the 2 big ones took hard causing my 4 wt click&pawl to sing for a second or so. — Rob

Response:

Stan, Do you have a link to a gurgler pattern?

Do I have links! Here’s the one I tied for the Dog Days Swaps (hey Paul…). http://gula.org/roffswaps/recipe.php?page=DD2002&id=8 Dale W tied a purple version, and Larry Schmitt tied a bumblebee variant. The ultimate source is Jack Gartside’s page: http://www.jackgartside.com/step_gurgler.htm There are lots of variants.  Most I see for smaller fish use a crystal chenille or Estaz body instead of a palmered hackle.

Response:

        Back to the pond today to worry the panfish population. Had the place to myself early.  Caught 8 on the Chironomid, but seemed the fish were deep.  It’d been cloudy most of the day, and calm.  Sun came out before I got off work, but was still relatively calm when I headed to the pond, and I thought I might get some dry fly action.  Of course, by the time I got there (< 10 minutes), the wind had picked up and no surface action to be seen.  Tied on my last bead-head scud, and picked up 10 more bluegill. Then the action took a break.         About that time, a somewhat scruffy looking young couple arrived on scene.  The guy asked me if the trout were biting (of course, to the uninitiated, fly fishing is for trout… .  Told him I was working the bluegill, and had brought in 18 to that point. He asked how deep, etc.  Clued him in as to what I thought the proper depth was, and he and his wife/girlfriend rigged up their bobber rigs and set about attempting to catch some for themselves.  They didn’t look like they had the proveribal pot to pee in, or a window to throw it out.  Asked me what an "eating size" bluegill would be.  Figured they were there to get some subsistance eats.         Got the bead-head scud hung up in cattails, and lost it. Back to Chironomids.  Went to the opposite side of the pond so as not to worry them with my casting.  Figured out the proper retrieve to connect with fish again, and proceeded to get a good run going.  The couple weren’t having much luck that I could tell, watching out of the corner of my eye.         In the span of about 40 minutes, I brought another 22 bluegill to hand.  Fast and furious action.  Even managed to catch a couple big ones.  Walked over to the couple and handed the two big ones to them, and said "these ought to be good eating size".  They thanked me profusely, and I packed up my rod at that point and went home. Felt a good bit guilty that I was hauling fish out of the water right and left when they weren’t getting much action, and probably in need of some victuals (not to mention releasing all of mine).         I hope they enjoyed the fish dinner.  Know all too well how it was to be young and hungry.  Game & Fish is going to kill out the pond later this fall anyhow and restock it in the spring, so better to give a few fish to someone in need than have them all go to waste, as it were.  Went home feeling good in more than a few ways. Todd

Response:

Question:

I just graduated from a boat building school here in Maine and have got several job offers along the east coast. Now that I’ve taken up fly-fishing I’ve found that a potential job MUST include good fishing waters. One job is in St. Micheals, MD, several are on the Mass coast (Buzzard’s Bay and Cape Ann) and one in York County, ME. I’m sure all of these are great for striper, but would anyone know about freshwater opportunities?

Response:

I just graduated from a boat building school here in Maine and have got several job offers along the east coast. Now that I’ve taken up fly-fishing I’ve found that a potential job MUST include good fishing waters. One job is in St. Micheals, MD, several are on the Mass coast (Buzzard’s Bay and Cape Ann) and one in York County, ME. I’m sure all of these are great for striper, but would anyone know about freshwater opportunities?

As a MD resident, I can offer that St. Michael’s is a thoroughly beautiful little town, full of history, and surrounded by some of the best sailing, fishing, and crabbing anywhere.   The surrounding area is mostly rustic, farmlands, salt marsh and chicken houses, except for the nearby town of Easton. It’s also some of the best seafood eatin’ anywhere.   You’re only about a half-hour drive from Annapolis, one of the sailing capitals of the world. People spend hours driving and sailing to St. Michales for recreation, relaxation, and honeymoons.   And you’d be *living* there.   Cool.   Downsides – In reality, it’s boring.   They roll up the sidewalks after dark, and you’re a hundred miles from the nearest trout (there are, however, some big bass in farm ponds.) I’ve visited both Cape Ann, MA and York, ME and loved both places.   Love Gloucester, love Maine in general.   I’d jump at the chance to work in either; but the grass is always greener, eh? Joe F.

Response:

I just graduated from a boat building school here in Maine and have got several job offers along the east coast. Now that I’ve taken up fly-fishing I’ve found that a potential job MUST include good fishing waters. One job is in St. Micheals, MD, several are on the Mass coast (Buzzard’s Bay and Cape Ann) and one in York County, ME. I’m sure all of these are great for striper, but would anyone know about freshwater opportunities?

If you have to ask this question with regards to Maine, you’d best stay down in Maryland as you clearly won’t be able to pass the entrance exam… /daytripper

Response:

James Carroll: I just graduated from a boat building school here in Maine and have got several job offers along the east coast. Now that I’ve taken up fly-fishing I’ve found that a potential job MUST include good fishing waters. One job is in St. Micheals, MD, several are on the Mass coast (Buzzard’s Bay and Cape Ann) and one in York County, ME. I’m sure all of these are great for striper, but would anyone know about freshwater opportunities?

Maine offers great freshwater fishing in many of its cold rivers and ponds.  I live in Massachusetts; I fish in Maine.  I go to Maryland for crabs. Dave LaCourse

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Maine offers great freshwater fishing in many of its cold rivers and ponds.  I live in Massachusetts; I fish in Maine.  I go to Maryland for crabs.

Much to the consternation of The Lovely Joanne ;^)

Response:

I just graduated from a boat building school here in Maine and have got several job offers along the east coast. Now that I’ve taken up fly-fishing I’ve found that a potential job MUST include good fishing waters. One job is in St. Micheals, MD, several are on the Mass coast (Buzzard’s Bay and Cape Ann) and one in York County, ME. I’m sure all of these are great for striper, but would anyone know about freshwater opportunities?

Maryland does indeed have fresh water.  Pay no attention to that sulphur smell.  The water does not leave those rusty stains like it does in Mass.  Main has fresh water also.  I just never figured out why those people wear rubber boots at all hours day and night!??! — Wayne To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

Response:

Tripper writes: Maine offers great freshwater fishing in many of its cold rivers and ponds. I live in Massachusetts; I fish in Maine.  I go to Maryland for crabs. Much to the consternation of The Lovely Joanne ;^)

My living, fishing, or crabbing?   Ahhhh, all three — I see, I see.  <g D.

Response:

Maine offers great freshwater fishing in many of its cold rivers and ponds.  I live in Massachusetts; I fish in Maine.  I go to Maryland for crabs. Dave LaCourse

        Funny, I moved to MD three weeks ago and I haven’t had a case of crabs yet.                       Frank "got the hammer ready" Reid

Response:

Frank Reid writes: Maine offers great freshwater fishing in many of its cold rivers and ponds.  I live in Massachusetts; I fish in Maine.  I go to Maryland for crabs. Dave LaCourse        Funny, I moved to MD three weeks ago and I haven’t had a case of crabs yet.                      Frank "got the hammer ready" Reid

That is probably  because you are not "active", Frank.  I’ve seen you Air Force types on liberty in Japan, the Phillipines, Taiwan, Singapore, Hong Kong, Cape Town, Cadiz, Rome, Paris, Bremen, London, Rio, Panama City, and T-town.  Youse guys knit too much and play too much cribbage!   <g Dave L. "The sag is getting *really* bad!"

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Dave,      Its not liberty when you live there.                 Frank "ah, not another night on the town in the P.I.!" Reid – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That is probably  because you are not "active", Frank.  I’ve seen you Air Force types on liberty in Japan, the Phillipines, Taiwan, Singapore, Hong Kong, Cape Town, Cadiz, Rome, Paris, Bremen, London, Rio, Panama City, and T-town. Youse guys knit too much and play too much cribbage!   <g Dave L. "The sag is getting *really* bad!"

Response:

 I’ve seen you Air Force types on liberty in Japan, the Phillipines, Taiwan, Singapore, Hong Kong, Cape Town, Cadiz, Rome, Paris, Bremen, London, Rio, Panama City, and T-town.  Youse guys knit too much and play too much cribbage!   <g

That’s weird. I’ve been in a few ‘liberty’ areas and never saw any Air Force guys at all, but then that’s not what I was looking for<g. — Charlie…

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Frank Reid: Dave,     Its not liberty when you live there.

I lived in many of those places too.  It is *still* liberty.  <g Dave LaCourse

Response:

James, I live in NH and fish ME and MA frequently.  My advice is if you are looking or freshwater fishing opportunities, stay in Maine…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I just graduated from a boat building school here in Maine and have got several job offers along the east coast. Now that I’ve taken up fly-fishing I’ve found that a potential job MUST include good fishing waters. One job is in St. Micheals, MD, several are on the Mass coast (Buzzard’s Bay and Cape Ann) and one in York County, ME. I’m sure all of these are great for striper, but would anyone know about freshwater opportunities?

Response:

I resent that remark you swab, I caught the worse case of clap I ever had, in Bankok Thailand, and it twern’t from knitting, it came from laying Thais….(we called that "playing railroad")  [as in, "c'mon, let's go lay a few Thais]  My God, that *do* bring back the memories! Frank (almost cured) Church

|Frank Reid writes:

| | Maine offers great freshwater fishing in many of its cold rivers and |ponds.  I | live in Massachusetts; I fish in Maine.  I go to Maryland for crabs. | Dave LaCourse | |        Funny, I moved to MD three weeks ago and I haven’t had a case of |crabs yet. |                      Frank "got the hammer ready" Reid | |That is probably  because you are not "active", Frank.  I’ve seen you Air Force |types on liberty in Japan, the Phillipines, Taiwan, Singapore, Hong Kong, Cape |Town, Cadiz, Rome, Paris, Bremen, London, Rio, Panama City, and T-town. Youse |guys knit too much and play too much cribbage!   <g | |Dave L. |"The sag is getting *really* bad!" | | |

Response:

I resent that remark you swab, I caught the worse case of clap I ever had, in Bankok Thailand, and it twern’t from knitting, it came from laying Thais….(we called that "playing railroad")  [as in, "c'mon, let's go lay a few Thais]  My God, that *do* bring back the memories!

Thanks Frank!  Anybody out there know how to clean coffee off a keyboard?     Wolfgang wondering where my tai went

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I resent that remark you swab, I caught the worse case of clap I ever had, in Bankok Thailand, and it twern’t from knitting, it came from laying Thais….(we called that "playing railroad")  [as in, "c'mon, let's go lay a few Thais]  My God, that *do* bring back the memories! Thanks Frank!  Anybody out there know how to clean coffee off a keyboard?     Wolfgang wondering where my tai went

        i will never again  look upon a christmas thai in the same frame of mind.         wayno

Response:

Question:

There is a great article in February’s California Fly Fisher about Mas Okui who has fished Hot Creek since the 1940’s.  The unusual thing about it is he uses a dry fly with great success.  I had always thought the only way to catch Hot Creek trout was with a nymph.  Limber up your old fiberglass rods, tie up a few 18 foot leaders, some of his Tan Killer flies and use his casting methods to turn Hot Creek into a dry fly fishery. Ernie Harrison Want to make tapered leaders?  http://home.pacbell.net/ernie2

Response:

Ernie Harrison wrote The unusual thing about it is he uses a dry fly with great success.  I had always thought the only way to catch Hot Creek trout was with a nymph.  Limber up your old fiberglass rods, tie up a few 18 foot leaders, some of his Tan Killer flies and use his casting methods to turn Hot Creek into a dry fly fishery.

After fishing Hot Creek a couple times, I cannot imagine why one would use anything but dry flies … with perhaps a short dropper off the dry…given the degree of vegetation in the stream.  Certainly, if you use the conventional indicator-splitshot-attractor-dropper rig, you’d be continually getting hung up in the weeds.  I guess I’ll have to come watch you do it sometime … I still haven’t ’solved’ Hot Creek … given all that vegetation and the self-imposed taboo against wading….it’s been a real challenge for me. —                                                       -dnc-

Response:

Fiddle Away,    Hot Creek is not easy for me either.  Trying to drift a nymph down through those channels of acquatic weeds is a real pain.  That is one of the reasons I really liked the Article in California Fly Fisher. Ernie FiddleAway wrote – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -After fishing Hot Creek a couple times, I cannot imagine why one would use anything but dry flies … with perhaps a short dropper off the dry…given the degree of vegetation in the stream.  Certainly, if you use the conventional indicator-splitshot-attractor-dropper rig, you’d be continually getting hung up in the weeds.  I guess I’ll have to come watch you do it sometime … I still haven’t ’solved’ Hot Creek … given all that vegetation and the self-imposed taboo against wading….it’s been a real challenge for me. —                                                      -dnc-

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Question:

I’ll be in Cork, Ireland the week of May 10th and am trying to decide whether or not to stay a few extra days for some flyfishing for native browns. I ran the standard searches thru dejanews and hotbot and found some interesting March salmon info but not much for May browns. I called the Cork fisheries guy for some info but any suggestions for books or web sites or guides or lodges? Thanks, Doug

Response:

Get hold of PeterO’Reilly’s books on the Rivers; Loughs and Flies of Ireland (all published by Merlin Unwin books). The Suir, in Co. Waterford (east of Co. Cork) is -in many opinions- one of the best wild brown trout rivers in Europe. Try Andrew Ryan at www.flyfishingireland.com Tight lines Tony D – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ll be in Cork, Ireland the week of May 10th …. etc. (snipped)

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Question:

I have recently begun fly fishing and am from the New Orleans area. Can anyone offer some specific areas to fish near here. I know there are many places around here, I just don’t know where they are. I am looking for places to fish both from a boat and from shore or wading. I’ve been with a guide, but it won’t take long to run out of money if I use one every time I want to fish. Thanks. Larry

Response:

My suggestion is to go see Tom at Bayou Specialties in Jefferson–he can point you in the right direction–and tell him Jeff Boudreaux sent you. Jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have recently begun fly fishing and am from the New Orleans area. Can anyone offer some specific areas to fish near here. I know there are many places around here, I just don’t know where they are. I am looking for places to fish both from a boat and from shore or wading. I’ve been with a guide, but it won’t take long to run out of money if I use one every time I want to fish. Thanks. Larry

Response:

Lake Calcasieu (sp.?) near Lake Charles is supposed to be excellent for salt water.  You can contact Dave at Orvis Houston 713-783-1111 or an Orvis shop if you have one in N.O. for more info & good guides info. Tight lines Al Carlton

Response:

Larry… was just going through the newsgroups postings and found your request…hope you don’t mind some advice. In order to be successful you need to find an area that you like and get to know it….well! No one can just pull into somewhere they’ve never been before and expect to put fish in the boat. It takes time to learn a spot geographically, as well as the tidal effects, fly selection, etc. Even though I am a guide and have fished all over the US for the last 30 years or so….I always hire a guide the first day or two I go somewhere new. When I feel I know what’s going on, then I strike out on my own…it’s the only way to optimize your chances. As far as the guide thing goes, yes…I agree it is expensive. However, there are ways to captilize on your investment. First…find a good guide who works in the area you want to learn. In New Orleans, I’d call Capt. Kirby LeCour (540-464-1697..tell him I recommended you). Tell him you want to learn the area so you can fish on your own. When you go out, ask a LOT of questions…pay attention to WHERE you go….and spend your time LEARNING…not worrying about how many fish you put in the box. By the way, one gentleman referred you to the ORVIS store in Houston. He also suggested you fish Calcasieu Lake in SW Louisiana. I agree with one of his points…Calcasieu is a great area. I know…I guide here. As for contacting them…well, caveat emptor. If I can be of any help, lemme know. Capt. Briant Smith Lake Charles, LA

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Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I have only been flyfishing for a few months, most of my trips have been in the Townsend area of the Smokies.  I have fished the Tremont (Middle Prong of Little River)  area several times with limited success.  I have the opportunity this weekend to fish Deep Creek (Bryson City, NC) and I have decided to swallow my pride and ask for advice here so I hopefully won’t get "blanked" and ruin my vacation!  For Tremont, I have used 6X tippets and patterns of caddis, adams, black gnats, beadhead phesant tail nymph. My specific questions:  What time of day should be the most successful in either of these areas (Tremont or Deep Creek)?  What patterns are most effective for Deep Creek?  Any advice on presentation to these skittish mountain trout?  Any particular areas of Deep Creek that anyone has had experience fishing before? Thanks very much, Dan Please reply to group

Dan, This time of the year you want to fish very early or very late in the day….most trout I know take long siestas when the water warms up during the day. The patterns you are using are fine…I might add a black ant and a yellow sally to your arsenal. Good luck…. –Walt

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have very good luck with elk hair caddis. I fish Tremont usually in the afternoon but not always. And don’t forget those wooly buggers! Bryce I have only been flyfishing for a few months, most of my trips have been in the Townsend area of the Smokies.  I have fished the Tremont (Middle Prong of Little River)  area several times with limited success.  I have the opportunity this weekend to fish Deep Creek (Bryson City, NC) and I have decided to swallow my pride and ask for advice here so I hopefully won’t get "blanked" and ruin my vacation!  For Tremont, I have used 6X tippets and patterns of caddis, adams, black gnats, beadhead phesant tail nymph. My specific questions:  What time of day should be the most successful in either of these areas (Tremont or Deep Creek)?  What patterns are most effective for Deep Creek?  Any advice on presentation to these skittish mountain trout?  Any particular areas of Deep Creek that anyone has had experience fishing before?

Hi! Tremont should be good early in the morning or late at night. I stay away from the lower portion of Deep Creek this time of the year, due to all  the tourists and tubers. Go above Indian creek. Also try West prong of Little River while you are over in that area. Go backcountry away from Laurel creek rd. Try a Thunderhead dry, it’s a NC pattern that’s very similar to an Adams Wulff. Hans

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have very good luck with elk hair caddis. I fish Tremont usually in the afternoon but not always. And don’t forget those wooly buggers! Bryce I have only been flyfishing for a few months, most of my trips have been in the Townsend area of the Smokies.  I have fished the Tremont (Middle Prong of Little River)  area several times with limited success.  I have the opportunity this weekend to fish Deep Creek (Bryson City, NC) and I have decided to swallow my pride and ask for advice here so I hopefully won’t get "blanked" and ruin my vacation!  For Tremont, I have used 6X tippets and patterns of caddis, adams, black gnats, beadhead phesant tail nymph. My specific questions:  What time of day should be the most successful in either of these areas (Tremont or Deep Creek)?  What patterns are most effective for Deep Creek?  Any advice on presentation to these skittish mountain trout?  Any particular areas of Deep Creek that anyone has had experience fishing before? Hi! Tremont should be good early in the morning or late at night. I stay away from the lower portion of Deep Creek this time of the year, due to all  the tourists and tubers. Go above Indian creek. Also try West prong of Little River while you are over in that area. Go backcountry away from Laurel creek rd. Try a Thunderhead dry, it’s a NC pattern that’s very similar to an Adams Wulff. Hans

I fished Deep Creek a coupla years ago and ran across a native of the area who was having great luck on a parachute Adams morning and late afternoon.  I might add that he was quite stealthy and could read water very well.

Response:

I have very good luck with elk hair caddis. I fish Tremont usually in the afternoon but not always. And don’t forget those wooly buggers! Bryce – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I have only been flyfishing for a few months, most of my trips have been in the Townsend area of the Smokies.  I have fished the Tremont (Middle Prong of Little River)  area several times with limited success.  I have the opportunity this weekend to fish Deep Creek (Bryson City, NC) and I have decided to swallow my pride and ask for advice here so I hopefully won’t get "blanked" and ruin my vacation!  For Tremont, I have used 6X tippets and patterns of caddis, adams, black gnats, beadhead phesant tail nymph. My specific questions:  What time of day should be the most successful in either of these areas (Tremont or Deep Creek)?  What patterns are most effective for Deep Creek?  Any advice on presentation to these skittish mountain trout?  Any particular areas of Deep Creek that anyone has had experience fishing before?

Response:

Thanks to all who replied to my original post.  Your advice will be very helpful.  I plan to spend the next couple of days on Deep Creek, so I will try to give you a report (to the group) next week.   Thanks again, Dan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have very good luck with elk hair caddis. I fish Tremont usually in the afternoon but not always. And don’t forget those wooly buggers! Bryce I have only been flyfishing for a few months, most of my trips have been in the Townsend area of the Smokies.  I have fished the Tremont (Middle Prong of Little River)  area several times with limited success.  I have the opportunity this weekend to fish Deep Creek (Bryson City, NC) and I have decided to swallow my pride and ask for advice here so I hopefully won’t get "blanked" and ruin my vacation!  For Tremont, I have used 6X tippets and patterns of caddis, adams, black gnats, beadhead phesant tail nymph. My specific questions:  What time of day should be the most successful in either of these areas (Tremont or Deep Creek)?  What patterns are most effective for Deep Creek?  Any advice on presentation to these skittish mountain trout?  Any particular areas of Deep Creek that anyone has had experience fishing before? Hi! Tremont should be good early in the morning or late at night. I stay away from the lower portion of Deep Creek this time of the year, due to all  the tourists and tubers. Go above Indian creek. Also try West prong of Little River while you are over in that area. Go backcountry away from Laurel creek rd. Try a Thunderhead dry, it’s a NC pattern that’s very similar to an Adams Wulff. Hans I fished Deep Creek a coupla years ago and ran across a native of the area who was having great luck on a parachute Adams morning and late afternoon.  I might add that he was quite stealthy and could read water very well.

Response:

I have only been flyfishing for a few months, most of my trips have been in the Townsend area of the Smokies.  I have fished the Tremont (Middle Prong of Little River)  area several times with limited success.  I have the opportunity this weekend to fish Deep Creek (Bryson City, NC) and I have decided to swallow my pride and ask for advice here so I hopefully won’t get "blanked" and ruin my vacation!  For Tremont, I have used 6X tippets and patterns of caddis, adams, black gnats, beadhead phesant tail nymph. My specific questions:  What time of day should be the most successful in either of these areas (Tremont or Deep Creek)?  What patterns are most effective for Deep Creek?  Any advice on presentation to these skittish mountain trout?  Any particular areas of Deep Creek that anyone has had experience fishing before? Thanks very much, Dan Please reply to group

Response:

Question:

There are two schools of thought on this: !.  Too many guides restrict the rod’s action. 2. Too few guides allow the line to drag against the rod when it flexes. Take your pick. — Ernie Harrison Remove NOSPAM to send E-mail GO TO http://users.ccnet.com/~emh FOR TRAVEL TIE BOX PLANS Hi there! I am building a 7 foot 2-3wt st.croix rod. The problem is that I have found 2 different guide spacing charts for 7 footers. One used 8 guides the other 9. Which one should I use? Jarkko —

—                                             |    Jarkko Karvinen                            |    Student of biochemistry                    |  E. coli happens  University of Turku, Finland               |    tel. +358 (0)2 3338059                        |

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am building a 7 foot 2-3wt st.croix rod. The problem is that I have found 2 different guide spacing charts for 7 footers. One used 8 guides the other 9. Which one should I use?<BR The general rule of thumb is one guide for every foot plus the stripper, so 8 is the general rule of thumb.  One thing you might try is to tape the guides on with both the spacing for the 9 guides and the 8 guides and them string a line trhough them and see how the rod flexes.  Basically, the more guides the more friction.  But fewer is not better either – find a hapy medium by flexing the rod with line through the guides and make sure there are no dead spotsor places where the line touches the rod. Or – you might try calling St Croix.  I bet they would give you the guide spacing they use on the factory rod. Al Manchester, NH

      I know you are not the original poster but he may read this. I have an 8′ 8wt, a 7′6" 3wt and a 6′6" 5wt. The question gave me food for thought so I counted the guides on each, they all have 8, stripper included. with the exception of stripper and tip-top are all snake guides, all are factory. I also looked up the guide kits all are 8 guide.                                                              John Popp                                                           in Sanford Fl.

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I know you are not the original poster but he may read this. Ihave an 8′

8wt, a 7′6" 3wt and a 6′6" 5wt. The question gave me food forthought so I counted the guides on each, they all have 8, stripperincluded. with the exception of stripper and tip-top are all snakeguides, all are factory. I also looked up the guide kits all are 8guide. I don’t doubt that all your rods in various lengths have the same amount of gudes.  This is a subjuect that is debated as much as anythng in fly fishing. As I said "the general rule of thumb" is one per foot plus a stripper guide. Many manufacturers leave a guide or two off to save money, some rods cast better with fewer or more guides. There are a couple of ways to determine guide spacing.  Clemens and Anglers Work Shop as well as some otheres I would guess sell a tool that will allow you to test the spacing of the guides with the rod under load.  There is a program that Cane rod builders use that was written by Wayne Catanach that calculates the spacing based on the number of guides you choose and the placement of the stripper guide.  Several books list guide placement charts as well, and Blue Ridge Rod Company includes a very good one in their catalog. I personally have always used the 1 guide per foot plus the stripper for my rods.   In Skip Morris’s book "The Custon Graphite Rod" and in Handcrafting Custom Graphite Fly Rods" by L.A. Garcia, this is the information that they provide, although the spacings are a bit different and Skip Morris provides some good insight as to the actuual placement of guides based on the rod and the fishermam it is intended for, as well as some general guide lines for placement of guides on soft and fast action rods.  It is interesting reading. The mark of a true custom rod may be going to the extra step of testing the guide placement with the rod under stress.  I have done this a few times but the standard guide placements on the graphite rods I have built have all been so close that I dont worry about it any more. It’s an interesting debate for rod builders.  Could you tell me where you looked up the guide kits for these rods?  Might just be a catalog I am missing:))))) Al Manchester, NH

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Hi there! I am building a 7 foot 2-3wt st.croix rod. The problem is that I have found 2 different guide spacing charts for 7 footers. One used 8 guides the other 9. Which one should I use? Jarkko —                                             |    Jarkko Karvinen                            |    Student of biochemistry                    |  E. coli happens  University of Turku, Finland               |    tel. +358 (0)2 3338059                     |

Response:

I am building a 7 foot 2-3wt st.croix rod. The problem is that I have found 2

different guide spacing charts for 7 footers. One used 8 guides the other 9. Which one should I use?<BR The general rule of thumb is one guide for every foot plus the stripper, so 8 is the general rule of thumb.  One thing you might try is to tape the guides on with both the spacing for the 9 guides and the 8 guides and them string a line trhough them and see how the rod flexes.  Basically, the more guides the more friction.  But fewer is not better either – find a hapy medium by flexing the rod with line through the guides and make sure there are no dead spotsor places where the line touches the rod. Or – you might try calling St Croix.  I bet they would give you the guide spacing they use on the factory rod. Al Manchester, NH

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Hi there! I am building a 7 foot 2-3wt st.croix rod. The problem is that I have found 2 different guide spacing charts for 7 footers. One used 8 guides the other 9. Which one should I use? Jarkko

I don’t know how prevelent St Croix rods are in Finland, but your best bet would probably be to find an assembled rod from the manufacturer and copy their guided size and placement. There are some rod shop owners on this group, maybe one of them can measure it for you if you can’t find the rod in your area. Good luck,      - Ken

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Hi there! I am building a 7 foot 2-3wt st.croix rod. The problem is that I have found 2 different guide spacing charts for 7 footers. One used 8 guides the other 9. Which one should I use?

Jarkko, here’s the spacing (and 7 Fuji guides) that I use on a 7ft fly rod. Note that the last (8mm2) is a 2-footed guide, the rest are single foot guides, and the measurements are in inches starting from the tip. If I recall, I got these recommendations from L.G. Custom Tackle (G. Loomis dealer and custom rod builder) many years ago. IMHO I think 9 guides is way too many for anything under 8′. I prefer the single footed Hardloy or SIC Fuji’s to the traditional snake guides which allow the line to slap against the blank. 7′ – 4(6mm), 9(6mm), 15(6mm), 22(7mm), 30(7mm), 40(8mm), 52(8mm2) Now you have 3 choices David E. Malone All opinions expressed are my own.

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Question:

        Has anyone used a PM-10+ made by orvis I’m thinking about buying one and would like advise if you have used this rod                                         Thanks                                                 Jeff

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –         Has anyone used a PM-10+ made by orvis I’m thinking about buying one and would like advise if you have used this rod                                         Thanks                                                 Jeff Step up to Trident Series fly rods by Orvis, for that kind of money Don’t look back. Nothing wrong with PM-10, but you will be much happier with the newer series fly rods.

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        Has anyone used a PM-10+ made by orvis I’m thinking about buying one and would like advise if you have used this rod                                         Thanks                                                 Jeff Step up to Trident Series fly rods by Orvis, for that kind of money Don’t look back. Nothing wrong with PM-10, but you will be much happier with the newer series fly rods.

The PM-10+ are Trident series rods and are only available in the Trident series.  They are very fast action rods that will pick up and toss a lot of line with very little effort if you use a forearm casting stroke.  If you use a lot of wrist you probably won’t like this series with the possible exception of the 8 1/2ft. 4wt.  As always, best to cast these rods if possible and see if you like them.  The 9ft. 5wt.,9ft. 6wt., 9ft. and 9 1/2ft. 8 wt.’s, 8 1/2ft. and 9 ft. 9 wt.’s are very aggressive tapers best suited to throwing long lines and/or casting in windy conditions, although you can easily tip cast with very little line out the tip-top.  The 8 1/2ft. 4 wt. is not quite as steep a taper as the rest and very smoothly moves deeper into the mid-section than the rest of the series.  The 4 wt. is a great all around trout-stream rod.  The 5 wt. is a better choice if you want to also fish lakes.   The 6 wt will throw a heavily weighted stonefly nymph right into the teeth of the wind.  They are not for everybody, but I would add the 5 wt. to my arsenal if I thought I could get it past my wife (I have four other 5 wt. rods).   Hmmmmm …. I only have one other 6wt. maybe I should go for that                                Good Fishing,                                        Dan Dan Gracia Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools

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Question:

Pick up the latest edition of Western Fly Fishing. There is a piece on "Wine Country Steelhead" that might interest you.

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I’m looking for information on fly fishing in the California "Wine country" area.  Where to go during early April.

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I’m looking for information on fly fishing in the California "Wine country" area.  Where to go during early April.

The Russian river has smallmouth bass, maybe some early shad and maybe a couple of stripers at this time? Good bass pond if you can get on them. Coastal winter steelheading is over in March. Trout season in Sierras opens the last Saturday in April but water will be high. Some lake will be OK for trout. William Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY

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Question:

The guys at Marriott’s Shop in Fullerton have had some advice on So.Cal. saltwater chances in the past.  Their telephone is 714-525-1827.  Address is 2700 West Orangethorpe.Last time I was in there they had a stack of orange and grey flies designed to immitate some sort of surf crab.  They will also, of course, recommend King Harbor. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am interested in saltwater fly fishing in the Los Angeles and Santa Barbara area in early March.  Are there stripers in the aqeduct and how does one get access?  Is there any beach fishing and wading?  What fish and what flies.  Thanks King Harbor at Redondo Beach can be good at that time.  Rent a skiff from Rocky Point marine and throw deceivers or other anchovy-like flies on fast sinking shooting heads for bonito and calico bass.  Let me know if you need more info. John Woodling Sacramento, CA

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While we are at salt water fly fishing, what is a salt water fly like? I have some idea of fresh water fly fishing, but knows absolutely nothing about salt water fly fishing.  Obviously, at least seems to me, something like the little fresh water flies will not attract too many fish, at least nothing big.  If you do use something bigger or heavier, then you can’t really call it a fly any more, can you?  Do you still use a fly reel?  I am not a fly fisherman, but I am interested in any kind of fishing, just haven’t gotten to fly fishing yet. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -King Harbor at Redondo Beach can be good at that time.  Rent a skiff from Rocky Point marine and throw deceivers or other anchovy-like flies on fast sinking shooting heads for bonito and calico bass.  Let me know if you need more info. John Woodling Sacramento, CA

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I am interested in saltwater fly fishing in the Los Angeles and Santa Barbara area in early March.  Are there stripers in the aqeduct and how does one get access?  Is there any beach fishing and wading?  What fish and what flies.  Thanks

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I am interested in saltwater fly fishing in the Los Angeles and Santa Barbara area in early March.  Are there stripers in the aqeduct and how does one get access?  Is there any beach fishing and wading?  What fish and what flies.  Thanks

King Harbor at Redondo Beach can be good at that time.  Rent a skiff from Rocky Point marine and throw deceivers or other anchovy-like flies on fast sinking shooting heads for bonito and calico bass.  Let me know if you need more info. John Woodling Sacramento, CA

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