Question:

I’ve been lurking around these parts lately.  A while back I saw that ROFF was going to the San Juan.  That’s just over 3 hours from home, and I fish there pretty often, so I hooked up with Bruiser and made plans to be there for the Clave.  I fish lots of waters around northern New Mexico – some because of the fishing, others because of the beauty of the places. Off to the ‘Juan we went.  The SJ is a tailwater, behind a large earthen dam, flowing through a spectacular sandstone canyon in an exceptionally dry and arid region – it gets an average of 8" of precipitation each year.  It’s near the village of Navajo Dam, east of Farmington, at 6000′.  Willi’s pictures were great – but they still don’t capture the beauty of the area. I met Bob and Charlie, Willi, Bruce, and Dan’l when they arrived Friday night.  Chuck arrived in a little while.  We had dinner and a few beers, figured out where/when we’d meet the next morning, and turned in pretty early. We started fishing early Saturday morning.  Early enough to have ice in the guides and to break through ice in the sloughs next to the river. By the time I got my flies tied on, Willi had caught a couple of fish. I understand that’s pretty common.  Everyone caught fish on Saturday. Everyone but me, it seems.  I hooked up with a few, but not as many as I should have, and landing them was almost impossible.  I got tangled, I broke off, it was like I’d never done this before!  Of course, it was still fun, but here I am, on water I know pretty well, not catching much of anything. Sunday I slept in a bit.  I got down to the river at 9:30 or 10:00. Charlie and Bob are in the Kiddie Pool, and Bruiser shows up while I’m getting ready.  Things are going kind of slow, so I put my seine in the water to see what kind of bugs were around.  Lots of light-colored midges and midge larva showed up in the net, so we tied on light-colored patterns.  And fish were on!  I was catching my share, and everyone was having a good day.  We moved around the river, to the big holes, to the fast canyon water, to the flats – pretty much all over.  Fishing was good.  Chuck fished part of the day and went home.  He was replaced by Arni and Scott. One of the big thrills of fishing the SJ is catching large fish on tiny flies.  A 12" rainbow is a tiny fish there.  Most are 14-18".  Lots are bigger, with 20+" fish not uncommon.  And they take #20-#24 midge larva – basically thread on a hook.  We made the regular jokes about fishing a #76 paramecium.  But then we figured out that the fish really wanted egg patterns.  Midge eggs.  That’s about a #84 hook. Two exceptional things happened Sunday.  Fish at the SJ collect behind the fishermen.  They see so many fishermen every day that they don’t spook too easily.  They swim behind you, sifting through the junk that your feet stir up.  I’m fishing in the Texas Hole and a big fish starts tapping on my boot!  He’s bumping it with his head!!  We figured he was trying to tell me to move my feet some more, so I’d stir up some more food. The second thing was when a beautiful blue heron came to our pool in the evening and watched us fish.  He squawked at us for a while, then he just watched. One of the problems with fishing the SJ is the crowds.  It’s become really popular.  The normal rules of stream etiquette just don’t apply, and you’re always fishing in sight of someone, and in the popular spots, with people very close by.  Except between Thanksgiving and Christmas. Monday there wer 8 people on the top ~1.5 miles of the river, from Texas Hole up to the dam (not counting two duck hunters).  7 of them were us!   It was deserted.  But the fish seemed to want to ride the tilt-a-whirl, and with fewer anglers on the river, they viciously attacked our flies.  My flies, at least.  Monday was one of those days you hear about, but seldom have.  Fish after fish after fish.  Big fish.   No tangles.  No break-offs.  Spot a fish, get a good drift to him, and he’d take.  Toss your fly in the water as you waded to a new place, and they’d find it when you weren’t expecting it.  I caught what was probably the largest trout of my life – ask Dan’l how big it was.  We layed it up against my fly rod to measure it.  I measured the fly rod later – it was a 24-25" rainbow – a true denizen of the deep.  I caught at least 4 over 20" on Monday, and lots and lots of the "small" ones. That evening, I walked over to a hole we’d been fishing every evening. I was the only one there – I couldn’t even see anyone else.  By Monday we knew what would work in this particular hole – any midge larva with red in it.  Unable to understand how fish could find such tiny flies in the failing light, I tossed in a #22 Desert Storm and started catching fish.  Pretty soon the blue heron came over to watch me.  Just me, the heron, and the fish.  I caught 5 in ~30 minutes before I decided to call it quits and head for home. It was a great weekend.  Fishing was good to great.  The weather was spectacular – the storm that was predicted went to the south and we never saw it.  Everyone got along well, and there was plenty of comraderie When do we do it again?  I’d fish with these guys any time.  Thanks Bruce, for setting this up.         – Bryan

Response:

Bryan, After a great report like that, you will be in great demand around here. Everyone enjoyed meeting you and fishing with you.  Glad to hear you had a good time.  Once we heard the "everyothercast" echo down the river, we knew you were. And I’ve got some news for you:  next year you’re the co-host! bruce h

Response:

I’ve been lurking around these parts lately.  A while back I saw that ROFF was going to the San Juan.  That’s just over 3 hours from home, and I fish there pretty often, so I hooked up with Bruiser and made plans to be there for the Clave.

    thanks for a nifty report, bryan.     funny how much your experience reminds me of fishing up in the smokies….  :( yfitons wayno

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Bryan, [snip] And I’ve got some news for you:  next year you’re the co-host!

You realize that almost guarantees snow for next year, right? Sure, I’ll help.  If we act early, we can reserve most of Rizuto’s!         – Bryan

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Sure, I’ll help.  If we act early, we can reserve most of Rizuto’s!

  Rizuto’s wins out over Abe’s, don’t you think?  I asked Chuck if he’d give a discount if I could get all of the roffians at next year’s clave booked there and he said yes.  Something to remember.  I knew it was a bad sign when we pulled up to #52 at Abe’s and there was the plumber’s truck sitting in front. Still not fixed after a year:)   Another great clave.  Thanks, Bruiser.  Bryan, it was nice to meet and fish with you.  You fit right in.  (Scary, isn’t’ it?)   As others have given such nice trip reports, I don’t have much to add.  I did discover the joys of studded, felt waders.  Unbelievable traction.  Should have purchased them years ago. I also bought some of that high priced Rio Fluoroflex plus tippet.  5X with a 5 lb. test.  It worked very well and I didn’t break off as many fish.   The first two days were the best for me.  I don’t know when I’ve caught as many big fish.  You couldn’t beat the weather, either.  I had a lot of fun driving down with Willi and Charlie, again.  They weren’t much fun on the way back as I think they slept the whole way.  I only took short naps as I was driving:)  It was great to see my clave buddies again and I’ll see you next year. Snoop — —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

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    The first two days were the best for me.  I don’t know when I’ve caught as   many big fish.  You couldn’t beat the weather, either.  I had a lot of fun   driving down with Willi and Charlie, again.  They weren’t much fun on the way   back as I think they slept the whole way.  I only took short naps as I was   driving:)  It was great to see my clave buddies again and I’ll see you next   year. Get those pictures developed and out to me, please. Willi

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Get those pictures developed and out to me, please.

  They’re being processed as we speak.  Hopefully will have them Monday.  Send me your mailing address. Snoop — —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

  Rizuto’s wins out over Abe’s, don’t you think?

Abe’s is part of the "experience."  I’ve experienced the "experience." This was the first time I’ve stayed at Rizuto’s.  Definately nicer. Seeing all those picnic tables around, I think we’ll need to haul a BBQ grill up there and have a Clave Banquet in the parking lot!   Another great clave.  Thanks, Bruiser.  Bryan, it was nice to meet and fish with you.  You fit right in.  (Scary, isn’t’ it?)

Doesn’t that mean I should be flaming somebody?  Everybody? I left one thing out of my trip report.  There were these bait fishermen.  They were fishing below the quality waters, down by the campground.  But they were staying at Rizuto’s, in room #1. AND THEY BROUGHT THEIR OWN SATELLITE TV DISH! [for those who don't know much about northern NM - you only get one TV station in Navajo Dam, and the reception of that one is pretty poor]         – Bryan

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AND THEY BROUGHT THEIR OWN SATELLITE TV DISH!

Sounds like a good idea to me, assuming you have the time to watch TV. The local NM stations are the absolute worst.

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Question:

Not wishing to be a spoilsport or anything, and no offence to Sandy, but she is not the only lady posting. Cyli keeps getting forgotten it seems. She posts regularly.

I didn’t know I had an angling sister on this ng!  Cool!  Thanks for saying so, Mike. Sandy

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the *one* fine *lady*–quite serious–that graces this NG!

Now, Opie, you don’t want to leave Sandy out, do you? — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless remove invalid or hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

Response:

My most sincere apologies!  I had no idea?  I never considered?  Oh hell, before I get into any deeper shit.  Sorry, Cyli. Cyberspace can be so….um…damn….confusin’ sometimes! Actually, the waters have been nice and cool of late. Opie –the quite embarrassed–

‘Sokay.  I took it in good humour.  And responded in a way I hope is also taken as good humour. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless remove invalid or hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

Response:

Not wishing to be a spoilsport or anything, and no offence to Sandy, but she is not the only lady posting. Cyli keeps getting forgotten it seems. She posts regularly. I didn’t know I had an angling sister on this ng!  Cool!  Thanks for saying so, Mike. Sandy

My alias doesn’t seem to lend itself to thoughts of femaleness. Though the vixen part my sig file would be a clue to those who know something about wildlife. If my sig file still shows up. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless remove invalid or hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

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My alias doesn’t seem to lend itself to thoughts of femaleness. Though the vixen part my sig file would be a clue to those who know something about wildlife. If my sig file still shows up. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless

Sorry cyli, or vixen??  Guess it’s just because I don’t know what the rbc: stands for, so I wasn’t clear on what the word vixen was referring to.  And that, followed by Fairly harmless.  What would you have us call you? BTW — I checked out your link, and am very impressed by the emotional impact of your artwork!  Are those all pastels?  Are you still painting nowadays? Sandy

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My alias doesn’t seem to lend itself to thoughts of femaleness. Though the vixen part my sig file would be a clue to those who know something about wildlife. If my sig file still shows up. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless Sorry cyli, or vixen??  Guess it’s just because I don’t know what the rbc: stands for, so I wasn’t clear on what the word vixen was referring to.  And that, followed by Fairly harmless.  What would you have us call you? BTW — I checked out your link, and am very impressed by the emotional impact of your artwork!  Are those all pastels?  Are you still painting nowadays? Sandy

That’s impressive stuff – some of it reminds me of photos of Jupiter’s Red Spot – the word ‘fluid’ just doesn’t do it justice.  BTW, up here, rbc stands for Royal Bank of Canada – somehow, I don’t think that’s what you had intended.  <G (Soon to be coming to a bank near you.) Someone with an artistic mind would see fishing differently than would one (like me) who goes through life with a cold blooded, linear, analytical approach.  You should share your insights sometime – don’t be worried about your newbie fly fishing status – we were all there at some point in our lives.  A unique viewpoint would be very refreshing. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://members.home.net/pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

I’m afraid that I was also the victim of ignorance in this case.  I figured that rbc:  vixen was some sort of computer code, known only to those adept in such fields.  I am glad to know, now, that there are *at least* two fine ladies that frequent ROFF! Op

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My alias doesn’t seem to lend itself to thoughts of femaleness. Though the vixen part my sig file would be a clue to those who know something about wildlife. If my sig file still shows up. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless Sorry cyli, or vixen??  Guess it’s just because I don’t know what the rbc: stands for, so I wasn’t clear on what the word vixen was referring to. And that, followed by Fairly harmless.  What would you have us call you? BTW — I checked out your link, and am very impressed by the emotional impact of your artwork!  Are those all pastels?  Are you still painting nowadays? Sandy

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My alias doesn’t seem to lend itself to thoughts of femaleness. Though the vixen part my sig file would be a clue to those who know something about wildlife. If my sig file still shows up. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless Sorry cyli, or vixen??  Guess it’s just because I don’t know what the rbc: stands for, so I wasn’t clear on what the word vixen was referring to.  And that, followed by Fairly harmless.  What would you have us call you? BTW — I checked out your link, and am very impressed by the emotional impact of your artwork!  Are those all pastels?  Are you still painting nowadays?

Oh, it’s a rec.backcounty joke.  Many have animal callings over there and one day the net.ranger challenged me to name my animal.  I was feeling cute, fleet, and snappish.  The rbc stands for recbackcountry. Cyli is just fine.  It’s pronounced ’silly.’  I found I was becoming way too serious.  It’s been one heck of a job training all the people I work with to use my alias (there’s another person with the same real life first name as mine working near me.).  Takes about a week of my not answering to my real name.  As half the people (including two of the bosses) knew me for years on local BBSes by Cyli and called me by it (especially as one of the bosses married a woman of the same first name).  It’s a very relaxed place, as long as we get the work done.  I do recognize vixen, but only in text, I’d not respond to it in person. Thanks for the compliments on my art.  It’s all done in binary, but with imitations of real artists tools.  Not  with programming or the kind of image stuff that Web artists and advertising for magazines use (not that there’s anything wrong with either.  But I don’t have the tools or the inclination for it.).  I used Painter II and Corel PhotoPaint 3  to do them.  Mostly I used the oil paint and water colour tools.  One of the advantages of binary is that you can use water colour over or under oil. And clean up and set up are as simple as one or two clicks.  Nonetheless, they still take the same number of hours to do that they would in ‘real’ art. I’ve not done much recently.  I have some that I really should finish (where I do use usual Web style tools) by putting frames around them and so forth and put up as another page.  But my job and something about my mother’s death (even though it was 3 years ago) put me into stop mode on creating.  I expect to get back to it within a couple more years. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless remove invalid or hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

Response:

That’s impressive stuff – some of it reminds me of photos of Jupiter’s Red Spot – the word ‘fluid’ just doesn’t do it justice.  BTW, up here, rbc stands for Royal Bank of Canada – somehow, I don’t think that’s what you had intended.  <G (Soon to be coming to a bank near you.) Someone with an artistic mind would see fishing differently than would one (like me) who goes through life with a cold blooded, linear, analytical approach.  You should share your insights sometime – don’t be worried about your newbie fly fishing status – we were all there at some point in our lives.  A unique viewpoint would be very refreshing.

Thanks.  Fluid is pretty much what I aim for, as I sort of  paint emotions, which are always at least a little fluid.  No, not bank. Though I suspect I’d like to have a share of their vaults. I don’t know if I see fishing differently.  Maybe.  The beauty of a stringer of browns that I saw a year ago, lying on green weeds next to the stream may have stayed with me a bit longer than it would have with most.   Especially as they weren’t my browns.  I’m also pretty big on large trees that have been dead long enough for the bark to be gone.  I can sit on one and contemplate the far end of it very happily for some time.  Or sit on a stream bank and look at one that’s lying partly in and partly out of the stream.  They have interesting patterns and shapes and, like clouds, can form pictures in the mind. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless remove invalid or hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

Response:

I’m afraid that I was also the victim of ignorance in this case.  I figured that rbc:  vixen was some sort of computer code, known only to those adept in such fields.  

As explained above, it almost sort of maybe is… I am glad to know, now, that there are *at least* two fine ladies that frequent ROFF! Op

Thank you sir.  And probably wise of you to assume there might be lurkers of female status.  Who knows what / who lurkers may be. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless remove invalid or hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

Response:

Thanks for the compliments on my art.  It’s all done in binary, but with imitations of real artists tools.

Outstanding!! I’ve not done much recently.  I have some that I really should finish (where I do use usual Web style tools) by putting frames around them and so forth and put up as another page.  But my job and something about my mother’s death (even though it was 3 years ago) put me into stop mode on creating.  I expect to get back to it within a couple more years.

Let us know when you update your site.  I’m anxious to see more.  :^) Sandy

Response:

Brian don’t mind these freshmen!  One is from Montana and the other couldn’t find a stream in his own backyard. Are you a resident of NC?  If so, pick-up a Delorme’s map for NC.  I the front section you will find a list off NC trout streams with locations. If you hang out here long enough, you will inevitably end up fishin’ with myself or one of the many other ROFFians from NC, as long as you don’t insult the *one* fine *lady*–quite serious–that graces this NG!

Not wishing to be a spoilsport or anything, and no offence to Sandy, but she is not the only lady posting. Cyli keeps getting forgotten it seems. She posts regularly. If you are from outta state, let me know when you plan to visit and I will be happy to guide you to some fine steams in my area.  Free of charge of course!

That explains how you keep getting into hot water! TL MC

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Only on e-Bay! Op

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I will be happy to guide you to some fine steams in my area.  Free of charge of course! Do you sell bass bugs, too? <g — Charlie…

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My most sincere apologies!  I had no idea?  I never considered?  Oh hell, before I get into any deeper shit.  Sorry, Cyli. Cyberspace can be so….um…damn….confusin’ sometimes! Actually, the waters have been nice and cool of late. Opie –the quite embarrassed–

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Brian don’t mind these freshmen!  One is from Montana and the other couldn’t find a stream in his own backyard. Are you a resident of NC?  If so, pick-up a Delorme’s map for NC.  I the front section you will find a list off NC trout streams with locations. If you hang out here long enough, you will inevitably end up fishin’ with myself or one of the many other ROFFians from NC, as long as you don’t insult the *one* fine *lady*–quite serious–that graces this NG! Not wishing to be a spoilsport or anything, and no offence to Sandy, but she is not the only lady posting. Cyli keeps getting forgotten it seems. She posts regularly. If you are from outta state, let me know when you plan to visit and I will be happy to guide you to some fine steams in my area.  Free of charge of course! That explains how you keep getting into hot water! TL MC

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I will be happy to guide you to some fine steams in my area.  Free of charge of course!

Do you sell bass bugs, too? <g — Charlie…

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http//:www.wnctrout.com for good nc info…. –waldo If there are any NC resident, I would like to hear there suggestions for Good NC Streams. Thanks…

– Wilson Creek Outfitters, Ezflyfish.com, Inc. 115 East Union Street; Morganton, NC 28655 http://www.ezflyfish.com

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man, North Carolina has been fished out for years….. john

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If there are any NC resident, I would like to hear there suggestions for Good NC Streams. Thanks…

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If there are any NC resident, I would like to hear there suggestions for Good NC Streams. Thanks…

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  If there are any NC resident, I would like to hear there suggestions for Good NC Streams. Thanks…

First, tell us all about your home waters.  Where are the best places to fish, what flies do we use, when are the best hatches, when is the best time of year to fish, etc so we can add it to our dossier of places to fish so that we may have the info for future querries. Thanks in advance. Warren (Hopefully one of them NC boys will take pity on you and drop you a line via email with some suggestions.  If not, do a deja.com search under NC and get all the info they let slip:-)

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If there are any NC resident, I would like to hear there suggestions for Good NC Streams. Thanks…

We try to keep these smaller streams out of the headlines.  Drop me an email and I’ll tell you where I don’t catch any fish – at least you can cross those off your list

Response:

Brian don’t mind these freshmen!  One is from Montana and the other couldn’t find a stream in his own backyard. Are you a resident of NC?  If so, pick-up a Delorme’s map for NC.  I the front section you will find a list off NC trout streams with locations.  If you hang out here long enough, you will inevitably end up fishin’ with myself or one of the many other ROFFians from NC, as long as you don’t insult the *one* fine *lady*–quite serious–that graces this NG! If you are from outta state, let me know when you plan to visit and I will be happy to guide you to some fine steams in my area.  Free of charge of course! Opie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If there are any NC resident, I would like to hear there suggestions for Good NC Streams. Thanks…

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Question:

Ken you want to respond to this one?

I didn’t see the original post.  Wouldn’t have known about it except for your response.  Did my server overlook something on ROFF, or did you find this somewhere else? Wolfgang

Response:

<SNIPPED Is anyone else seeing the "Hard Working Latinos" thread?  And _I_ get branded a racist for a clearly over-the-top post in the midst of it all?  Sheesh… They are LONG posts, so here is some header info if anyone wants to go to Deja and read it the whole saga:

TC, R

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Original went out to 4 news groups rec.outdoors.fishing.saltwater, rec.outdoors.fishing.fly, rec.outdoors.national-parks, rec.outdoors.rv-travel So you must have missed all of Muskies posts

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Did it get filtered or did your server miss it. The original post went to a bunch of newsgroups. I replied to only this one. Bellsout.net filters out crossposted spam, I’m not sure how many crossposted newsgroups in a post it takes to get filtered – maybe 10 or so. — Charlie…

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So you must have missed all of Muskies posts

I filter them myself<g. This one must have met some other criteria, I know a lot of the really outrageous one’s I see replies to never get to me in their original form. — Charlie…

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Sorry, I had meant to snip it.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Geez, Paul, did you have to quote that thing?  My ISP was nice enough to filter it for me… <snipped

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Is anyone else seeing the "Hard Working Latinos" thread?  And _I_ get branded a racist for a clearly over-the-top post in the midst of it all?  Sheesh… Are you really unable to see why people would be more likely to respond to your posts than to an infrequent, obvious troll by someone who doesn’t participate in this newsgroup?

Well, no.  I didn’t post the joke for responses, I posted it as a commentary, hence the stuff before and after the "joke."  But when certain "hall monitors" got on their high horses, I did gig ‘em (No, that wasn’t an Aggie slur).   One thing I do find odd, however: most replies were cries of "Racist!" yet only one "race" was mentioned in the "joke" proper and two total in the entire post, and the "joke" didn’t overtly involve it as an issue.  I really believe these types are no better than real racists because they _think_ they are being righteous without even knowing much about the labels _they_ are so ready to go slapping on people. Richard, the joke you posted did not suprise me. What suprised me is that you apparently thought the joke was funny enough to share.

OK, time to come clean, I guess – the original joke was told to me without the race of the girl or the nationality of the others seemingly being important.  I think it was meant to be strictly a "Jewish lawyer" joke – told to me _by_ a Jewish lawyer, BTW.  I have no idea if the French and Italians (I think they were included because if the "Oo-la-la" and "Mama mia" factors – itself somewhat of a stereotype, however) were being purposefully stereotyped by the writer, but I am fairly sure they were not by the person who related it to me.  I happened to notice those somewhat less obvious stereotypes, and hence, it seemed a good basis for the point of my post. That said, you’re (obviously) free to continue to post whatever jokes you feel like posting. In the future, what would you have other members of the newsgroup do if they find those jokes offensive?

Well, that really isn’t my business – they are free to respond in any way they wish, as am I, or they are free to ignore it, as am I, or they can killfile all they want.  I guess ROFF is destined to become splintered groups who only see about 10% of the posts.  FWIW, I don’t believe in killfiles (other than in a case as discussed re: costs).  I have enough willpower to simply ignore what I don’t want to read, and certainly enough to not respond to what I don’t want to respond to _after_ having read it.  But I don’t begrudge anyone who wishes to use them. An aside:  IIRC, I have posted what would be termed as "Stereotype" humor 3 times – go back and look at what else was being posted at the time, and reread what I posted in light of that. TC, R – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text —Steve

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Is anyone else seeing the "Hard Working Latinos" thread?  And _I_ get branded a racist for a clearly over-the-top post in the midst of it all?  Sheesh…

Are you really unable to see why people would be more likely to respond to your posts than to an infrequent, obvious troll by someone who doesn’t participate in this newsgroup? Richard, the joke you posted did not suprise me. What suprised me is that you apparently thought the joke was funny enough to share. That said, you’re (obviously) free to continue to post whatever jokes you feel like posting. In the future, what would you have other members of the newsgroup do if they find those jokes offensive? –Steve

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These threads are obviously being filtered by somebody with a lot of sense at server propagation levels, probably due to cross-posting. I have seen no posts about racist poets or Latinos. If not for some of the replies here, I would not have known of them.  Really just another piece of useless knowledge I could happily dispense with. TL MC — "Where fishing is concerned, most anglers are basically manic excessives" http://www.mikeconnor.de – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is anyone else seeing the "Hard Working Latinos" thread?  And _I_ get branded a racist for a clearly over-the-top post in the midst of it all?  Sheesh…

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I started getting them again. The original was sent to many newsgroups and it gets picked up occasionally. Paul

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <SNIPPED

Response:

Did it get filtered or did your server miss it. The original post went to a bunch of newsgroups. I replied to only this one. I think rw may be correct since the host node that the message was sent from did not match any of the email addresses. The host was on Frontier Internet. Paul

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ken you want to respond to this one? Interesting that my newsgroup filter blocked the original message, but I’ve never filtered the supposed author.   Probably from some other regular troublemaker.   (Could have lived without the repost, though.) Joe F.

Response:

Did it get filtered or did your server miss it. The original post went to a bunch of newsgroups. I replied to only this one.

Bellsout.net filters out crossposted spam, I’m not sure how many crossposted newsgroups in a post it takes to get filtered – maybe 10 or so. — Charlie…

Response:

Geez, Paul, did you have to quote that thing?  My ISP was nice enough to filter it for me…

<snipped

Response:

Ken you want to respond to this one?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "the threat of negroe sperm"  Black and ugly  nigger sperm  get it in you  it grows like a worm  once inside  a maggot sprouts  nine months later  a monster jumps out!!!! — — Brookings, S.D. | My private address appears on the left.   itctel .com   | http://members.fortunecity.com/jvipond/

Response:

Paul G asked: Ken you want to respond to this one?<

Why bother?  Unless you respond to his ISP, of course.

Response:

Ken you want to respond to this one?

My guess is that someone is trying to screw James Vipond. No one in his right mind would attach his name to this sort of thing. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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Ken you want to respond to this one?

Interesting that my newsgroup filter blocked the original message, but I’ve never filtered the supposed author.   Probably from some other regular troublemaker.   (Could have lived without the repost, though.) Joe F.

Response:

Ken you want to respond to this one? Interesting that my newsgroup filter blocked the original message, but I’ve never filtered the supposed author.   Probably from some other regular troublemaker.   (Could have lived without the repost, though.)

I didn’t see the original either. — Charlie…

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Question:

Hi I

Question:

That says it all George, that says it all…… well done. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – _____  In the world of fly fishing, which R.O.F.F. really is basically about, the subjects involved in this world that really belongs to trout, waver like some kind of stellar magnetic field.  First you feel it and then you don’t.  Some plunge into black holes or abyss’s never seeming to be able to return to the art form again. Not that long ago, back in January the journey began.  With nothing but the promises offered by roff and the dares, I stood up to be counted . . . and I performed the dance of a monkey on strings.  I listened, I pouted, I reprimanded, I took and applied all sorts of advice that to this day are in the signature of each BastardBamboo.   I had stated that Bamboo Fly Rods were much too expensive for the common layman to afford.  I said that there were more people without a bamboo fly rod then those who had them and that, in my opinion ~ this was wrong.  I said, I could make a bamboo fly rod for only $150 (not including tax we overlooked at the time) that the majority COULD afford.  $300 plus excise was the goal.  That goal is alive and active. The promise has been kept. There are still the expensive fly rods ranging from well over this low, lowest commercial price to a range that touches $7,000.  Charges of between $1,000 to $3,000 is still unmoved.  This is good and these fly rods are certainly worth it to those that can afford them. No matter what, there are those who are watching the Bastard project in abstract interest.  When they ‘think’ there is money involved, they will enter this challenge thinking they can do it better then I.  The result, I promise, because of my willingness to try will be a drastic down spiral in Bamboo Retail Prices. Now, we all realize there are many that would love to see me fail.  So? I’ve failed before.  I have lots of experience in that arena.  Win or lose, this is going to end up being a win/win result for all of fly fishing in the entire world.  Wait and see.  The day may very well arrive when some of you will be fishing a "Sapphire Fly Rod,"  or a "Sweet Thing Fly Rod" or a "Presidential Fly Rod," but you will all be wrong.  No matter what, every one of them will really be "A Bastard Fly Rod."  I was there first.  I will always be there. Mr. G.

Response:

[dribble snipped]

A short note on the fine art of sarcasm: dribble:   To move a basketball down the floor by bouncing it repeatedly on that floor while walking or running.  May also be done while standing in one spot. dribble:  To allow saliva to escape from one’s pie hole while dribbling a basketball….or not. The nonsense which you accuse George of disseminating and which is also exemplified by endless repetition of SPAM SPAM SPAM…….is DRIVEL!!

Response:

_____  In the world of fly fishing, which R.O.F.F. really is basically about, the subjects involved in this world that really belongs to trout, waver like some kind of stellar magnetic field.  First you feel it and then you don’t.  Some plunge into black holes or abyss’s never seeming to be able to return to the art form again. Not that long ago, back in January the journey began.  With nothing but the promises offered by roff and the dares, I stood up to be counted . . . and I performed the dance of a monkey on strings.  I listened, I pouted, I reprimanded, I took and applied all sorts of advice that to this day are in the signature of each BastardBamboo.   I had stated that Bamboo Fly Rods were much too expensive for the common layman to afford.  I said that there were more people without a bamboo fly rod then those who had them and that, in my opinion ~ this was wrong.  I said, I could make a bamboo fly rod for only $150 (not including tax we overlooked at the time) that the majority COULD afford.  $300 plus excise was the goal.  That goal is alive and active. The promise has been kept. There are still the expensive fly rods ranging from well over this low, lowest commercial price to a range that touches $7,000.  Charges of between $1,000 to $3,000 is still unmoved.  This is good and these fly rods are certainly worth it to those that can afford them. No matter what, there are those who are watching the Bastard project in abstract interest.  When they ‘think’ there is money involved, they will enter this challenge thinking they can do it better then I.  The result, I promise, because of my willingness to try will be a drastic down spiral in Bamboo Retail Prices. Now, we all realize there are many that would love to see me fail.  So? I’ve failed before.  I have lots of experience in that arena.  Win or lose, this is going to end up being a win/win result for all of fly fishing in the entire world.  Wait and see.  The day may very well arrive when some of you will be fishing a "Sapphire Fly Rod,"  or a "Sweet Thing Fly Rod" or a "Presidential Fly Rod," but you will all be wrong.  No matter what, every one of them will really be "A Bastard Fly Rod."  I was there first.  I will always be there. Mr. G.

Response:

[dribble snipped] Mr. G.

SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM AND MORE SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM

Response:

Jeff has the right idea.

[The rantings of a pompous old windbag snipped] Mr. G.

SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM AND MORE SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM

Response:

BTW, I used nothing but Albolene at the Fall Ball.   In the words of George G, "It works!" Louie

Just out of curiousity, how well did it work? Better? Didn’t notice any difference?  Can you say without any bias that it works on par or better than what I use already? There are several products out there that work, some better than others.  I am always open to one of the "better than others."  Until I find a better, I will continue using what I am currently using. Warren Remember, men will come and men will go, but the streams and mountains go on forever. -Bob Carmichael

Response:

Warren F: <<BTW, I used nothing but Albolene at the Fall Ball.   In the words of George G, "It works!" Louie

Just out of curiousity, how well did it work? Better? Didn’t notice any difference?  Can you say without any bias that it works on par or better than what I use already? I am not a great proponent of floatants.  I like drying crystals and was just recently introduced to amadou, but on occasion I do use a floatant.  I have had a jar of Albolene for a couple of years and have used it off and on.  It works as well as *anything* I have tried.  Use very little of it (sound familiar?) and it does the job well. Louie

Response:

There are several products out there that work, some better than others.  I am always open to one of the "better than others."  Until I find a better, I will continue using what I am currently using.

Warren; Over the last fifteen years I have fished with many people.  When I lived in central Wisconsin some years ago there were 15 or 20 I fished with on a more or less regular basis.  Among us we tried every brand of floatant that any of us ever heard of and a great many home made concoctions as well.  Eventually everyone I knew used Albolene exclusively.  There were and are a number of others that seems to work about as well but none were found to be better and nothing except a few of the bathroom chemistry projects could touch Albolene for price. One other factor to consider:  Albolene is marketed as a skin cream, makeup remover, etc.  In our litigious society I suspect the manufacturers have taken some care to formulate a product that’s relatively safe to handle.  No telling what’s in some of the commercial floatants out there. Keep your bug on the meniscus!

Response:

Question:

Can anyone give me some information or hints about fishing for N. Pike in Sweden ? I’ve heard about pike fishing in the Baltic sea, but can’t find any information about it… Gertjan Gertjan Doedens The Netherlands

Response:

Can anyone give me some information or hints about fishing for N. Pike in Sweden ? I’ve heard about pike fishing in the Baltic sea, but can’t find any information about it… Gertjan

Try some of these sites for more info, but I know most of the pike fishing in the Baltic is lure fishing from boats with very little bait fishing.  If you need anymore help, e mail me direct as I have a few articles in mags here that cover the pike fishing in the Baltic. <UL <LI<A HREF="http://www.algonet.se/~henrik_b/"Baltic Sea Sportfishing</A <LI <A HREF="http://www.pi.se/magnus.ugander/fb_home.html"Specimen Group – Fina Biten Homepage</A <LI <A HREF="http://www.bahnhof.se/~jrpstrom/index.html"The Specimen Group – Team Cisco</A <LI <A HREF="http://hem1.passagen.se/birger1/index.html"Sportfiskeguiden</A <A HREF="http://www.capricorn.se/" Capricorn Fly-Fishing. </A <LI <A HREF="http://www.pi.se/magnus.ugander/carphome.html" Carp Invaders Homepage. </A <LI <A HREF="http://www.algonet.se/~fishhole/fishhole.htm" The Fishing Hole. </A <LI <A HREF="http://www.ts.umu.se/~widmark/lwfishxl.html" LW’s Fishing Site. </A <LI <A HREF="http://www.pi.se/magnus.ugander/mu_home.htm" Magnus Ugander Specimen Fishing Page. </A <LI <A HREF="http://pew.psy.gu.se/~psymarer/salmon.html?" Martin G. Erikson’s Homepage. </A </UL <P — Davy Holt Surfing from Clydebank,        *"O Sir, doubht not that angling is Scotland.                      * an art… The question is rather The Scottish Angling Homepage  * whether you are capable of http://www.dholt.demon.co.uk/  * learning  it?"     Izaack Walton  

Response:

Question:

How is the fishing on the Hiwasse in eastern Tennessee this time of year. Is it worth the drive from Columbus, Ohio, over the Presdient’s Day weekend?  I tried calling the Adams Fly Shop in Relience, but all I’ve gotten is an answering machine.  Would it be worthwhile to bring my driftboat?  Any information would be appreciated. Ed Orazen

Response:

How is the fishing on the Hiwasse in eastern Tennessee this time of year. Is it worth the drive from Columbus, Ohio, over the Presdient’s Day weekend?  I tried calling the Adams Fly Shop in Relience, but all I’ve gotten is an answering machine.  Would it be worthwhile to bring my driftboat?  Any information would be appreciated. Ed Orazen

Hi Ed – It can be good, but check with the folks at the Hiwassee Angler, 423 338-6263. — Visit Dave Teffeteller’s Fly Fishing Guides page http://www.olfart.com

Response:

Question:

A good friend of mine is an outfitter in Montana and has just finished   his new web site. He was to bashful to post the address on this BB, but I’m not! Check it out at: http://www.iigi.comos/montana/diamondn/diamondn.htm Catch ya later Dale Owens

Response:

Correction on the web site address: note that all slashes are forward. I typed one in as a back slash by mistake. Dale

Response:

Question:

Dear Casters .                         We are now taking bookings for the summer of 96 , for our Atlantic Salmon Fly Fishing School that is conducted at my three star lodge on the world famous Miramichi River , guests arive on sunday and depart the following sunday , the course is indepth with instruction covering all aspects of Atlantic Salmon Fly Fishing the true way , you will learn the true Miramichi WAY . The course starts with a tour of the Miramichi , the Atlantic Salmon mesume and hatchery , instruction in rod setups , casting , playing , landing , and care of fish , also river conduct , ecology , biology , life cycle , fishing the black and bright Salmon ,  and fly tying of the most deadly of the secret Miramichi flies , what works where and why , the art is opened up in this course . The course is $ 1050.00 american for all meals , three star graded accomidations , instruction and equipment supplied , no suprises or hidden costs . Book early by contacting . Thomas MacLean Miramichi Four Season Outfitters Inc RR # 2 Miramichi City Box 705 E1V-3L9 New Brunswick Canada   1-506-622-0089

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear Casters .                        We are now taking bookings for the summer of 96 , for our Atlantic Salmon Fly Fishing School that is conducted at my three star lodge on the world famous Miramichi River , guests arive on sunday and depart the following sunday , the course is indepth with instruction covering all aspects of Atlantic Salmon Fly Fishing the true way , you will learn the true Miramichi WAY . The course starts with a tour of the Miramichi , the Atlantic Salmon mesume and hatchery , instruction in rod setups , casting , playing , landing , and care of fish , also river conduct , ecology , biology , life cycle , fishing the black and bright Salmon ,  and fly tying of the most deadly of the secret Miramichi flies , what works where and why , the art is opened up in this course . The course is $ 1050.00 american for all meals , three star graded accomidations , instruction and equipment supplied , no suprises or hidden costs . Book early by contacting . Thomas MacLean Miramichi Four Season Outfitters Inc RR # 2 Miramichi City Box 705 E1V-3L9 New Brunswick Canada   1-506-622-0089

You’re asking for a flaming!!! Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

Response:

Question:

Bob,      Thanks.  I use the old pliers technique with no trouble.  Was just wondering if I could find lures (rather than flies) that came ready-barblessed.  But thanks for the reply!!                                             Hal

Response:

Anyone know if barbless hooks are available in US?  (Chinese and Japanese fishing is done with them.)                                Hal Kahn

Response:

Anyone know if barbless hooks are available in US?  (Chinese and Japanese fishing is done with them.)                                Hal Kahn

Hal: I believe you will find that barbless hooks are READILY available if you are tying flies or building tackle.   Also, this may be a very silly case of pointing out the obvious, but you can also make any hook barbless by simply smashing down the barb with a pair of pliers.  If you do, be careful to smash the barb only and don’t dull the point of the hook, but it’s real easy. Good luck, Bob

Response:

Anyone know if barbless hooks are available in US?  (Chinese and Japanese fishing is done with them.)

                                Hal Kahn Orvis sells them.  Any good flyfishing shop should carry them. — John Fereira Isis Distributed Systems – Ithaca, NY

Response: