Question:

 A light rain throughout could result in an awesome trip, The Finn

Cool, changing clothes and heading out now!!! WOO WOOOOO! — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply

Response:

Actually, I think it is T.S. Eliot, but could easily have been used by others. Mike

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "Here I am, an old man in a dry month, Being read to by a boy, waiting for rain" I just read two books lately & damned if I can remember which one that (great) story was out of.    I’m thinking Jerry Dennis.   Do I win? Joe F.

Response:

Actually, I think it is T.S. Eliot, but could easily have been used by others.

It’s entirely possible that the story I’m thinking of quoted Eliot, & I completely ignored the reference.   Now I gotta go find where I saw it. Joe F.

Response:

 By the way,  is there game plan for fishing on Friday, in case I get a few hours…

— Frank Reid Reverse email to reply

Response:

Bring your rods and flies with you to Bal’more.  We can do an afternoon on the Patapsco. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply

Response:

"Frank Reid" Are there fall backs in case Isadore comes north (I know it will)?

http://forecast.accuweather.com/adcbin/local_index.asp?thisZip=16832&… Go&nav=home Accuweather says the forecast for Friday in Coburn is:  Pouring Rain, windy and 68 degrees.  God, I hope this doesn’t blow out the river.  At least I won’t be in my tent.  DavePA has kindly offered up a bunk in his cabin. Time to go finish packing the truck. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply

Response:

If the Creek is as low as I think it is, it will clear up fast.  The trouble we had this spring is that it was soo high, it was washing the banks into the creek, bringing the mud/silt with it.  It may actually work in your favor, as the reports were indicating low and clear conditions, which can be very tough anywhere, an inch of rain mmay be perfect.  A light rain throughout could result in an awesome trip, The Finn

"Frank Reid" Are there fall backs in case Isadore comes north (I know it will)?

http://forecast.accuweather.com/adcbin/local_index.asp?thisZip=16832&… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Go&nav=home Accuweather says the forecast for Friday in Coburn is:  Pouring Rain, windy and 68 degrees.  God, I hope this doesn’t blow out the river.  At least I won’t be in my tent.  DavePA has kindly offered up a bunk in his cabin. Time to go finish packing the truck. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply

Response:

Sorry you can’t make it Vince would have been nice to see you again. But then May will be here soon and you will be up to see us i am sure.  Beer ??? we don’t need no stinking beer wraps whos got the wraps??? we need wraps lots of wraps. See ya all in a couple of days.                    Handyman Mike           Standing in a river waving a stick

Response:

Arriving Wednesday ’round supper-time. Will bring Bass,  Amber/Bock something brown, Vermouth, Gin and olives…and a finger. ..john

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Who’s bringing the beer?  Who else will be there?  Are there fall backs in case Isadore comes north (I know it will)?  Mr. Makela, aka The Nymph Master, what will be the nymph of choice?  Who’s bringing the beer?  Is there a lobster night this Thursday?  Anyone gonna be there?  Who’s bringing the beer? — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply

Response:

Very envious of you guys!  I would love to be there but I’m buried in a refueling outage.  With the weather looking good, temperatures perfect, and trout boxs full, I really hate to miss this one.  Right now I’m off Saturdays only and working 6/12’s.  Oh well, all the better to visit the fly fishing show in January!!  I am sneaking out October 5-7 for a little side trip but even that was tough to get approved! Wayne to fish is human….to release Divine!! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Who’s bringing the beer?  Who else will be there?  Are there fall backs in case Isadore comes north (I know it will)?  Mr. Makela, aka The Nymph Master, what will be the nymph of choice?  Who’s bringing the beer?  Is there a lobster night this Thursday?  Anyone gonna be there?  Who’s bringing the beer?

Response:

I have yet to unlock the locks on my chains, so getting up there is mere impossible for this weekend,  hell I’m still trying to find time to finish my trip report from May.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Frank asks the essential questions: Who’s bringing the beer? You are…..4 cases of Yeungling should suffice. Who else will be there? Possibles include: myself, Mike Shaw, asadi, Vince Norris, Mark Faulkner, DavePA, Lefty Kreh(just checking if you were still awake) and George Gherke. Mr. Makela, aka The Nymph Master, what will be the nymph of choice? the Nymph Master has been virtually unreachable, as he is chained to his new desk. Stoneflies always work, Pheasant Tails and Caddis Pupae are an idea as well. Who’s bringing the beer? we covered this one Is there a lobster night this Thursday? no clue, we could call the Millheim, but are basically lazy and shiftless, so will find out then. Who’s bringing the beer? alright, I will stop for some Lagers on the way up Weds night.                               Tom

Response:

Frank!!! What’s happenin!! I have to make a business trip down to Baltimore (Inner Harbor-Wyndham) for an  industry conference on September 29th-October 4th, HL7 data protocol conference (a.k.a. The Geek Conference – should be plenty of trekkies mixed in).  This makes it very interesting in the area of getting the wife to let me out to play, since she will inherit the madness of the two youngyens while I am in Baltimore those 5 days. As a last ditch effort, I’m actually trying to schedule a client stop in the area on Friday,  but it’s not looking too good.  If I make it up, it will only be for the day.  The other possibility may be Sunday, as a side trip on the way to Baltimore, but I assume most attendees will be gone by then. Just as a warning, my luck this year has been horrendous weather-wise whenever I get out to fish, so you may want to make sure you have the inflatable boat in the tent on Thursday/Friday night.  In addition to the obvious 2nd annual Clave,  I have seen 15 foot waves at Boca Grande Pass (another trip report yet posted concerning an unsuccessful/successful outing ending in a 250 lbr), and severe drought on the local streams.  When I was in the Outer Banks earlier this year, where it hadn’t rained for weeks, it decided to rain (w/ near gale force wind) on the two days I had to fish. I may leave the rod home, just to keep from destroying everyone else’s trip. Let’s see, Friday-Sunday is probably the time both of the remnants from ISIDORE and LILLI will converge over central Pennsylvania. Talk to ya, The Finn "Here I am, an old man in a dry month, Being read to by a boy, waiting for rain"

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Who’s bringing the beer?  Who else will be there?  Are there fall backs in case Isadore comes north (I know it will)?  Mr. Makela, aka The Nymph Master, what will be the nymph of choice?  Who’s bringing the beer?  Is there a lobster night this Thursday?  Anyone gonna be there?  Who’s bringing the beer? — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply

Response:

"Here I am, an old man in a dry month, Being read to by a boy, waiting for rain"

I just read two books lately & damned if I can remember which one that (great) story was out of.    I’m thinking Jerry Dennis.   Do I win? Joe F.

Response:

By the way,  is there game plan for fishing on Friday, in case I get a few hours…

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is there a lobster night this Thursday? no clue, we could call the Millheim, but are basically lazy and shiftless, so will find out then.                               Tom Called the Millheim.  No dice on the lobster.  It is seafood night on Thursday. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply

Response:

Is there a lobster night this Thursday? no clue, we could call the Millheim, but are basically lazy and shiftless, so will find out then.                               Tom

Called the Millheim.  No dice on the lobster.  It is seafood night on Thursday. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply

Response:

Frank asks the essential questions: Who’s bringing the beer? You are…..4 cases of Yeungling should suffice. Who else will be there? Possibles include: myself, Mike Shaw, asadi, Vince Norris, Mark Faulkner, DavePA, Lefty Kreh(just checking if you were still awake) and George Gherke.

I had planned to bring a supply of Chesterfield Ale; it seemed to go over pretty well on previous occasions. But now, I’m sorry to say, I can’t come.  My daughter has announced she and her family will be arriving Thursday for a long weekend.  I can’t very well bug out because they don’t get here that often. She works in a hospital and getting a weekend off is not easy. I phoned Mark Faulkner a few days ago to remind him, but got only a recorded message.  He hasn’t returned the call so I don’t know if he plans to come. Best wishes to all for a superduper time! vince

Response:

Who’s bringing the beer?  Who else will be there?  Are there fall backs in case Isadore comes north (I know it will)?  Mr. Makela, aka The Nymph Master, what will be the nymph of choice?  Who’s bringing the beer?  Is there a lobster night this Thursday?  Anyone gonna be there?  Who’s bringing the beer? — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply

Response:

Frank asks the essential questions: Who’s bringing the beer?

You are…..4 cases of Yeungling should suffice. Who else will be there?

Possibles include: myself, Mike Shaw, asadi, Vince Norris, Mark Faulkner, DavePA, Lefty Kreh(just checking if you were still awake) and George Gherke. Mr. Makela, aka The Nymph Master, what will be the nymph of choice?

the Nymph Master has been virtually unreachable, as he is chained to his new desk. Stoneflies always work, Pheasant Tails and Caddis Pupae are an idea as well. Who’s bringing the beer?

we covered this one Is there a lobster night this Thursday?

no clue, we could call the Millheim, but are basically lazy and shiftless, so will find out then. Who’s bringing the beer?

alright, I will stop for some Lagers on the way up Weds night.                               Tom

Response:

Question:

This reel seems to have left the market. Anyone have any info about what, where and how I could find another?

Response:

This reel seems to have left the market. Anyone have any info about what, where and how I could find another?

Todd Vivian at Lamiglas is a good guy.  Drop him a line, he might know of someone who still has some in stock.  His email address is: Ian Scott http://www.about-flyfishing.com/

Response:

Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My home river has been alternating on a daily basis between running high and muddy and high and clear with an amber tinge. When it is running amber, the fishing is pretty good, but with the heavy flows, traditional dry techniques aren’t productive. In this heavy flowing, colored water, I’ve been having good success with a technique that was shown to me by an old rancher about twenty years ago. The technique is a fun one and is often productive when the trout are reluctant to come up for traditionally fished dries. It’s a technique geared for fishing fast, heavy water. I use it mainly in pocket water, but it also works on the streamside edges of heavy, deep water and in around any obstructions in deep strong runs. The flies I use are a high floating dry with a wet fly or soft hackle on a dropper of about 2 feet. I generally use a dry about two sizes bigger than I normally would and use a fly two sizes smaller than the dry as a dropper. The dropper is optional but will result in more hookups. I’ll describe the technique for a pocket water situation where I mainly use it. Casts can be short or long, but since you can approach fish closely in pocket water, often surprisingly close, and short casts give you much more control, I use casts of under fifteen feet 90% of the time. The only time I use longer casts is when the water is too deep or heavy to get to an area I want to fish. I try to fish an area thoroughly, even spots where there doesn’t appear to be any rocks that could break up the current, but I concentrate the casts to run through any visible areas where larger rocks provide calm water cushions. I generally a cast up and across stream and immediately raise the rod tip to lift all the fly line off the water and get direct contact with the fly.  I then begin dragging and skipping the fly across the current. I vary the action of the fly but the key is lots of action.  When the flies get in a position just below me, I begin maneuvering them through each small pocket I can find.  I skitter them upstream and down, back and forth through any pockets below. This technique will bring good fish to the surface that ignore more placid, traditional techniques. The quick moving flies result in strikes that are aggressive, vicious, slashing, fast, exciting etc. and you will get many more misses than hookups. Setting the hook at the strike usually results in pulling the fly away from the trout. Strikes need to be delayed but because of the tight line, the fish will usually hook themselves. Since there are a large percentage of missed fish with this technique, the feeding locations and holding areas that are revealed, need to be fished again. Since most of these missed strikes, refusals etc. are to the larger, more visible dry, the next thing I do is to try to maneuver the small dropper through the area trying to skip it across the surface. If this doesn’t work, I do a number of traditional drag free drifts through the area, paying close attention for hits on the dropper. This technique is definitely a kick when it’s working.  It elicits strikes from trout more akin to those of a bass or a pike to a popper than a typical sedate sip to a dry. I tend to ignore the technique when the fish are rising to more typical techniques but maybe I shouldn’t. Willi Interesting technique Willi.  I think most of us have used a similar

approach for pocket water, but not with a dropper, and not with a systematic plan.  For me its been an approach used out of necessity at times for fishing pocket water, especially casting over currents or boulders.  I’ll try it next opportunity. Pat K Before you buy.

Response:

My home river has been alternating on a daily basis between running high and muddy and high and clear with an amber tinge. When it is running amber, the fishing is pretty good, but with the heavy flows, traditional dry techniques aren’t productive. In this heavy flowing, colored water, I’ve been having good success with a technique that was shown to me by an old rancher about twenty years ago. The technique is a fun one and is often productive when the trout are reluctant to come up for traditionally fished dries. It’s a technique geared for fishing fast, heavy water. I use it mainly in pocket water, but it also works on the streamside edges of heavy, deep water and in around any obstructions in deep strong runs. The flies I use are a high floating dry with a wet fly or soft hackle on a dropper of about 2 feet. I generally use a dry about two sizes bigger than I normally would and use a fly two sizes smaller than the dry as a dropper. The dropper is optional but will result in more hookups. I’ll describe the technique for a pocket water situation where I mainly use it. Casts can be short or long, but since you can approach fish closely in pocket water, often surprisingly close, and short casts give you much more control, I use casts of under fifteen feet 90% of the time. The only time I use longer casts is when the water is too deep or heavy to get to an area I want to fish. I try to fish an area thoroughly, even spots where there doesn’t appear to be any rocks that could break up the current, but I concentrate the casts to run through any visible areas where larger rocks provide calm water cushions. I generally a cast up and across stream and immediately raise the rod tip to lift all the fly line off the water and get direct contact with the fly.  I then begin dragging and skipping the fly across the current. I vary the action of the fly but the key is lots of action.  When the flies get in a position just below me, I begin maneuvering them through each small pocket I can find.  I skitter them upstream and down, back and forth through any pockets below. This technique will bring good fish to the surface that ignore more placid, traditional techniques. The quick moving flies result in strikes that are aggressive, vicious, slashing, fast, exciting etc. and you will get many more misses than hookups. Setting the hook at the strike usually results in pulling the fly away from the trout. Strikes need to be delayed but because of the tight line, the fish will usually hook themselves. Since there are a large percentage of missed fish with this technique, the feeding locations and holding areas that are revealed, need to be fished again. Since most of these missed strikes, refusals etc. are to the larger, more visible dry, the next thing I do is to try to maneuver the small dropper through the area trying to skip it across the surface. If this doesn’t work, I do a number of traditional drag free drifts through the area, paying close attention for hits on the dropper. This technique is definitely a kick when it’s working.  It elicits strikes from trout more akin to those of a bass or a pike to a popper than a typical sedate sip to a dry. I tend to ignore the technique when the fish are rising to more typical techniques but maybe I shouldn’t. Willi

Response:

Question:

i am going fishing in june lake from september 1-6, and i was wondering if anyone could give me recommended spots or suggestions for fly- fishing and spinner baits.         thanks, david dimond

Response:

I am assuming that your referring to June Lake Loop, in California. June lake itself has been good to me and my family for trolling and bait soaking along the south east shore. Silver Lake offers protection from foul weather as you can hide behind the island and is my favorite in the loop. If you fish Silver lake you MUST fish Rush Creek which runs between Silver and Grant lake. If you have the time and appreciate your surroundings, I would head north on 395 and float tube Virginia Lakes (top of the summit above Mono Lake). For lunkers you should head south to Lake Crowley and again this lake is best float tubed, though you can fish from shore (alligator point). I prefer float tubing lakes which should justify my preferences. Best lure is Panther Martin "pm4,pm6 I think?" black with red dots, gold flash. Streamers would be olive matuka (with red throat), olive, black and purple wooly buggers. Terrestrial’s (hopper,cricket, ant) should be considered this time of year (rush creek), look around you. Caddis, adams and mosquito on the dry flies and if all else fails use the zug bug. Best of luck to you. There are just too many places to fish and enjoy life in that general area of the eastern sierra’s.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i am going fishing in june lake from september 1-6, and i was wondering if anyone could give me recommended spots or suggestions for fly- fishing and spinner baits.  thanks, david dimond

Response:

Question:

I’m rather new to fly fishing and I currently carry my daily supplies in a hiking fanny pack.  This does not always seem real convenient as it does not seperate items efficiently.  Most of my fishing is in the eastern Sierra Nevada – small lakes and streams.  Some float tubing. What are the pros and cons to other methods of carrying your supplies – vests, specially made packs, shirts with lots of pockets, etc?

A fishing vest allows one to carry a prodigious amount of "stuff" – one heck of a lot more than you can carry using virtually any other method (that’ll still let you actually fish ;^) That’s a Pro *and* a Con. It’s soooooooo easy to end up with your vest stuffed with enough gear to open your own fly shop. If you’re the kind of person that never wants to wonder whether he should’ve brought that <fill in the blank, a vest is definitely for you. Even my "shorty" wading vest has 29 pockets! And you simply can’t have an empty pocket, dontcha know! By the end of the season it’s so overstuffed with gear it’ll stand up on its own – and if I’ve got my "lightweight" raingear and lunch stuffed in the back, the whole works weighs more than 10 pounds (whoof!) Obviously, having an entire store on-stream is the advantage (I’m talking 400+ patterns in sizes from 0 to 28, a second, matched, reel and a pair of loaded spools (four different lines total), a leader kit,  floatants, dessicant, sinkers, insect seine, bug dope, a chunk of TP in a baggy ;^)  a gooseneck light, magnifier, thermometer, various small tools and zingers). Just as obviously, carrying all that weight is the down side… OTOH, I occasionally leave the vest (and the waders) in the truck, and wet wade while wearing one of those Jungle Jim shirts. Enough room for a couple of tippet spools, a small box of flies, a bottle of floatant, a pair of snips, and a hemostat, smokes and a lighter, and the keys to the truck. Depends on where I’m fishing and whether I know the water well enough to pick out just what I need. It’s definitely enjoyable to fish "light"! Somewhere in between there’s a good compromise. Buying a vest with a more sane number of pockets is probably a step in the right direction ;^) Good luck! /daytripper

Response:

—–BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE—– I’ve got a very simple way: I don’t carry much stuff. If it doesn’t fit in the two large handwarmer pockets on my Carhartts jacket and the one on my t-shirt, it doesn’t go. That cuts my load down to one fly box for wets and dries[1], one fly box for everything else[2], sunglasses, a spool of tippet material, a knife, and my smokes if that’s one of the weekends that I forget that I’m supposed to have quit. [1] I’m not sure that they’re supposed to be wet, but what else do you call a #12 parachute Adams when it sinks? [2] Yes, I’ve even used bass bugs on trout streams. They worked when _NOTHING_ else would. It’s the damdest thing. —–BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE—– Version: 2.6.2 iQEVAwUBNx18oZdiUzdLFqlpAQHouAf+LPT5ZqFPwmLeqi0J2/sGfDBvDXG/RV8e J5afy/mrSMGIJDBna0vecEfieL+njqYrRLQMXmJT9UM6c8yuXAW72KO8Nn8QA3Xk DVhpOZ72CQ9yipgFowbL13OLyygrnY5rLp3t/fO0TJxlqOrARN/jbtsNawy7g6HQ tWN70EmzQtMCfStPAs/g4DJD6a0gWFWaad+xSaQJ1BYoqQSz2N3HlyAlioG7hICf VQYyw5ociZDoZ12piVPiDaLsAOzChvKx6g3SvNZyEstR5QX9BP7l8zpQKMFi/hCq gH09LK7dp+6lkMUuf1e6925QWMQeS4lI7p8stUGfCud0BHWvHctxfg== =Qcla —–END PGP SIGNATURE—– Mike S. Medintz, http://www.grapevine.net/~medintz "You have the right to freedom of religion. You have the  responsibility to not knock on my door on Sunday morning." -Bill Maher

Response:

Float tubes have their own vests (most of them, except the cheapies) in the form of side pockets.  No vest or pack required.  On stream, though, a vest is still the answer for me.  Organized, roomy and comfortable.  The tendency is to overstuff. We all start to use every pocket because…well, because it is there.  Stuff like George’s different products, thermometers, two sizes of hemostats and all 6 weights of tippet can add up. A short vest is worth the investment for me.  Of course, I don’t give a rat’s behind about what is fashionable among the yuppie scum, God bless ‘em. They keep my local fly shop open and I still have fun catching fish.  As long as you’re happy… Babel

Response:

Skiroc asked:What are the pros and cons to other methods of carrying your supplies – vests, specially made packs, shirts with lots of pockets, etc?

  General rule:  The more room you have to put stuff in, the more stuff you’re going to haul around with you.  You don’t need that much stuff.   I’ve been happy as a clam carrying my stuff around in my little Patagucci fishing fanny pack for the past four or five years.

Response:

Stick with your fanny pack. The best piece of advice I can give you is to keep your kit down to a sensible minimum. The worst thing you can do is be persuaded into buying a vest with dozens of pockets, which you’ll feel duty-bound to fill with uneccessary items. You really don’t need the kitchen sink (in duplicate). Honest! It has taken me over thirty years to pare things down, but I’m getting there. I now travel much lighter than I used to and fishing is so much more fun. Keep it simple! Tony

Response:

(snip) I know people who use all the methods you describe for carrying their FFing gear. I’m an equipment freak instead of a minimalist so I wear a vest.

        (snip) .  Big bass bug boxes won’t fit just anywhere.

        and besides, where would a guy keep all those hilarious lawyer jokes?         wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Frank Church USAF Retired Elkhart, IN

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (snip) I know people who use all the methods you describe for carrying their FFing gear. I’m an equipment freak instead of a minimalist so I wear a vest.         (snip) .  Big bass bug boxes won’t fit just anywhere.         and besides, where would a guy keep all those hilarious lawyer jokes?         wayno And as the French say, "tooshay" Wayno.  :-) Frank Church USAF Retired Elkhart, IN

Response:

I’m rather new to fly fishing and I currently carry my daily supplies in a hiking fanny pack.  This does not always seem real convenient as it does not seperate items efficiently.  Most of my fishing is in the eastern Sierra Nevada – small lakes and streams.  Some float tubing. What are the pros and cons to other methods of carrying your supplies – vests, specially made packs, shirts with lots of pockets, etc?

Response:

Skiroc asked:What are the pros and cons to other methods of carrying your supplies – vests, specially made packs, shirts with lots of pockets, etc?

Since I live in Texas where it is often hotter’n hell I seldom wear a vest. I use a fanny pack that was made to carry a handgun. It has four pockets which give me enough separation to easily find things. If I leave the 44 at home,that one pocket holds more fly boxes than I need for any one day. I have been known to use empty hook boxes which used to hold 100 hooks hold a lot of flies of the size useful for trout or bluegill. Big Dale

Response:

I’m rather new to fly fishing and I currently carry my daily supplies in a hiking fanny pack.  This does not always seem real convenient as it does not seperate items efficiently.  Most of my fishing is in the eastern Sierra Nevada – small lakes and streams.  Some float tubing. What are the pros and cons to other methods of carrying your supplies – vests, specially made packs, shirts with lots of pockets, etc?

I know people who use all the methods you describe for carrying their FFing gear. I’m an equipment freak instead of a minimalist so I wear a vest.  Things are organized the same way, so there is no fumbling around looking for that tippet spool, nippers, etc.  If you decide on a vest, do two things before buying. . . since you float tube, consider getting a ’shorty’ vest, this will keep the lower pockets in the vest out of the water, and if you wade fish will do the same thing and, take your fly boxes with you when buying the vest to make sure they will fit the pockets.  I made that mistake once, and had to return the vest.  Big bass bug boxes won’t fit just anywhere. Frank Church USAF Retired Elkhart, IN

Response:

We had a thread on this about a month ago, which attracted dozens of responses.  You may want to try to dig it out, if it’s still up on your ISP. One basic piece of advice, avoid packs that use Velcro to seal pockets (this will eliminate most fishing vests).  The Velcro will wear out in a year of two of use, well before anything else.  Then you’ll start losing things, until you get around to replacing the Velcro or the item. As to which is better, vest or packs, I don’t think there is a single perfect answer.  It’ depends on the fishing you do. Vests are perfect if, a) all you need to carry is fishing gear — and a lot of it; and b) it’s not too hot.  Again, look for vests that use zippers not Velcro to seal pockets.  This will eliminate almost all of the less expensive vests. Chest packs are great if you don’t need to carry a lot of gear, and you get one that is comfortable (pay a lot of attention to the harness).  I have a large Orvis chest pack which, when loaded fully, is uncomfortable after an hour or so.  Other pack harnesses seem much better designed. However, more often than not I need to carry more than fishing gear, e.g. raincoat, lunch, water bottle.  If you like to fish small streams in the Eastern Sierra, and walk any distance from you car, you’re probably in the same boat. I’ve adopted a combined back-pack/chest pack by JW Outfitters.  It’s a small daypack in back, with elastic webbing to carry a jacket on the outside if the compartment fills up, and two vertical chest packs, one on each back-pack strap.  Each chest pack is large enough to hold two or three medium-large fly boxes, and there are plenty of little pockets with zippers, etc, to carry tippet, hemostats, leaders, etc., etc., etc.  Everything I used to carry in my vest (I’m neither a minimalist nor a gear-head) fit into the chest packs.  There are two built in retractors, one on the outside of each chest pack.  Minimal use of Velcro.  Cabela’s sells it in their fly fishing catalog, if your dealer can’t get if for you. Obviously designed by a fly-fisherman, I continue to  be pleased with it and to learn about little features that enhance it.  Patagonia makes a similar pack, with a larger back-pack section, but it’s much more expensive and uses Velcro to seal pockets. Michael

Response:

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Here’s something to think about.  I saw this message on a sailing newsgroup: A guy went into the water in Elliott Bay as part of a [simulated rescue situation]. He was wearing a survival suit (the water *is* cold up here), and made the mistake of diving in head-first.  All the trapped air in the suit collected at the highest point once he was in the water, which was the feet.  He was not able to get himself rightside-up, and drowned before the boat could get back to him. I’ve never seen a survival suit except in pictures, but I understand it to be something like a dry suit with insulation and flotation built-in. I guess there *IS* a reason why I ritualisticly squeeze all the air out of my suit before each time I get into my boat.

Doesn’t sound like much of a problem for paddlers’ dry suits to me.  At least decked boaters are wearing a spray skirt which ought to be tight enough to keep air passing that quickly between upper body and legs. And everyone I’ve seen putting on dry suits burps as much air out as possible simply for the reason of making them more flexible.

Response:

: Here’s something to think about.  I saw this message on a sailing : newsgroup: I should have mentioned:  these survival suits (when I owned one) did not have neck gaskets; the only way I remember that air/water could get in our out was from around the neck.

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(KCKaddis) writes: sounds like an urban legend to me … you’d think that a suit designed to save

your life would have floatation in the right spot to float you head up if unconciuos Actually, this is a common problem with dry suits. SCUBA divers often wear additional weight on their ankles to prevent a feet up uncontrolled ascent. … by the by , while fly fishing , I learned of the same prob with waders…

the solution , if you find yerself in this fix , is to pull your knees to your chest & burp the air out… or stay dry  ; ) More likely, it is a case of pulling your chest up toward your feet. Still, a dry suit has air stored up to the neck with a gasket that is intended to be leakproof. This is a whole lot different than a pair of waders which allow air to freely flow in/out. SCUBA suits have valves to allow air to escape at roughly chest level, but survival suits or the dry suits used when paddling do not. This should not be a life threatening situation with proper training, but few know of this risk and even fewer practice how to escape from this situation (the logical escape procedure would involve raising the body toward the surface in as flat a plane as possible, thus allowing the  the air to redistribute evenly in the suit – not having the opportunity to practice this, I’d imagine strong swimming/sculling skills and good breath control would come in handy). Whether or not this particular even is an urban legend is moot. There is a potential when wearing a dry suit for the air to redistribute in this fashion as the suit does nothing to prohibit the motion of air. Thus, bleeding the things before entering the water is important. Rick

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Actually, [air trapped in legs, floating you head down] is a common problem with dry suits. SCUBA divers often wear additional weight on their ankles to prevent a feet up uncontrolled ascent. This should not be a life threatening situation with proper training, but few know of this risk and even fewer practice how to escape from this situation (the logical escape procedure would involve raising the body toward the surface in as flat a plane as possible, thus allowing the  the air to redistribute evenly in the suit – not having the opportunity to practice this, I’d imagine strong swimming/sculling skills and good breath control would come in handy).

I’ll be helping to run a pool session this winter, and I plan to try it.  My dry suit has ankle gaskets, so the easiest escape for me probably will be to reach for my ankles and burp them.  Who knows, maybe the pressure inside the suit will be enough for it to happen without my help.  If that’s the case, then I’ll try to borrow a suit that has booties built in, or I’ll try taping my ankle seals to make them tighter.

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KCKaddis writes :: << sounds like an urban legend to me I remember when dry suits first appeared in the UK (early 70’s) – they were made out of latex rubber and actually worked pretty well while they lasted (which wasn’t long). They had a roll waist attachment and glued on booties. I would wear mine snorkeling and if I didn’t burp the suit my flippers would pop off my feet whenever I dove (my feet would turn into balloons). I don’t remember any problems getting stuck upside down though. The clear latex suits (mine was pink) were the worst looking things in the world – looked like they should have come out of a giant dispensing machine in the public toilets<g Mick Evans

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        I did run across one survival rescue suit in a catalog a coupla years ago that had rings embedded in the legs so that they wouldn’t expand if air rushed there in an upside down position.  Blurb suggested that indeed it had been a problem.   KCKaddis wrote – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – … you’d think that a suit designed to save your life would have floatation in the right spot to float you head up if unconciuos… by the by , while fly fishing , I learned of the same prob with waders… the solution , if you find yerself in this fix , is to pull your knees to your chest & burp the air out… or stay dry  ; )

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: Here’s something to think about.  I saw this message on a sailing : newsgroup: … I owned one of these, though never tried it out in the water, when I fished in Bristol Bay.  I no longer remember the details about them except that the suits are like toddler’s pajamas, and are bulky and awkward to get in and out of.   I find the story to be quite credible.

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Sportsmansguide actually has some surplus survival suits   for $200. They have huge airbladder on the back, apparently to prevent this sort of mishap. I once read of a similar fatal accident involving a fat woman with an inner tube around her waist.

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sounds like an urban legend to me … you’d think that a suit designed to save your life would have floatation in the right spot to float you head up if unconciuos… by the by , while fly fishing , I learned of the same prob with waders… the solution , if you find yerself in this fix , is to pull your knees to your chest & burp the air out… or stay dry  ; )

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Here’s something to think about.  I saw this message on a sailing newsgroup: A guy went into the water in Elliott Bay as part of a [simulated rescue situation]. He was wearing a survival suit (the water *is* cold up here), and made the mistake of diving in head-first.  All the trapped air in the suit collected at the highest point once he was in the water, which was the feet.  He was not able to get himself rightside-up, and drowned before the boat could get back to him.

I’ve never seen a survival suit except in pictures, but I understand it to be something like a dry suit with insulation and flotation built-in. I guess there *IS* a reason why I ritualisticly squeeze all the air out of my suit before each time I get into my boat.

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Question:

Is there such an event sceduled and what is it going to consist of. Central Coast Bob

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Robert, Yes, there is such an event.  Cost is $25.00 per individual and there will be many activities.  If you are the Bob I’m thinking about, you can just stop by Central Coast Fly Fishing on Carmel Valley Road and pick up a flyer on the "conclave" with all the goodies and costs listed. Bob Moss Landing, Ca. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is there such an event sceduled and what is it going to consist of. Central Coast Bob

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Is there such an event sceduled and what is it going to consist of. Central Coast Bob

Try this link  http://www.calflytech.com/nccfff/conclave/index.html I’ll be there tying Saturday afternoon, — Doug Knight                            metalfab<atpacbell.net Junk e-mail, solicitation, sales, products and services gladly accepted at $500.00 per mailing and billed directly to your ISP.

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Is there such an event sceduled and what is it going to consist of. Central Coast Bob

Hi All, This is an annual event at North Shore Lake Tahoe. You can sit face to face with some of the best west coast fly tyers and fly fishers. You can watch them tie and talk fishing. It is a  fabulous time for all interested in the sport. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY www.kiene.com

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Question:

I have had this happen to me on occasion. I use a hemostat and open the gap of the hook a small amount as well as off-setting the point a bit. This seems to occur most often when I’m using very small flies, 18-24. Just my 2 cents worth and it helps my hook ups when I can’t seem to hook anything.

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Mike, Maybe you should talk to your Doc.  I just had knee surgery and my Doc said fishing and in particular float tubeing is great therapy.  i.e. cold water for swelling and good low impact excercise.  Talk to a sports medicine specialist.  Which is all We have in Tahoe.   As to missed hook ups?  I miss just as many from a boat as from a tube go figure. Dick W.

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Soft mouths may be part of the problem, it seems when this occurs, the sharper the hook, the larger the tear it makes in the tissue, resulting in a larger oblong hole, enabling the hook to let itself work free easier. Another problem may be fish caught and released rather frequently whose hmouth hasn’t had a chance to heal yet….I mean, I’m sure we’ve all been in a place where we’ve caught the same fish twice in one outing and you know what I’m talking about. What’s the answer? Hell, I dunno…it’s not barbed or duller hooks, that’s fersure! Larry #:)#

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I have seen people dunk the rod tip in the water to prevent the fish jumping. Never tried it myself preferring to keep the tension on the line as the fish jumps. That is quite difficult, I don’t need to tell you. Good observation on the angle in a float tube. I had never thought about that

In salmon fishing, it is normal to "bow to the fish" by dropping the rod tip (not necessarily into the water) when he jumps.  With such large fish, it is prudent to reduce sudden shocks to the hook hold. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

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Hi Dennis, Nice to see you on this newsgroup.  Sounds like you had a nice day fishing!!! As you can see, I am fairly limited this year due to the leg but still plan on taking my trip to the Mill Hole on the Kettle River this Summer!

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I had a really strange occurance happen to me this weekend.   I was fishing one of my favorite lakes from a raft (tore up the ligaments in my left knee so no float tube for me this Summer!) with my Sage SP+.  The fishing was really good and I hooked into about 18 fish.  Of these 18, 4 got off via jumping and tossing the barbless fly, 1 actually made it to the boat and the rest of them had the fly pull out of their mouths during the fight.   My hooks were sharp and I didn’t feel like I was doing anything different then normal.  The only thing I can think of is the combination of the odd angle I had to sit in the raft combined with using my 9 foot SP+ (The wrong rod choice for this situation in hind sight.  Should have used my softer DS II.)  I did speak to another angler who reported that his fishing party was having the same problems.   I know fish will develop soft mouths when the water gets really warm but this is a high mountain lake and the water was still quite cool.  Any other ideas? Mike

Mike I wouldn’t think the rod or the angle has much to do with it.  Sunday, I couldn’t get a hookup or land a fish to save my life.  I think it has more to do with what the fish are taking.  Emergers and duns they have to rush, spinners and cripples they can take their time. Yesterday, they were feeding on spent trico spinners.  In retrospect, I should have been slower on the hook set.  I was probably yanking the fly out of their mouths’.  I know, it’s tough to slow down when you’re keyed for the strike.  The previous few times that I have been out, the fish were consistently taking duns and emergers and I missed only a few. Worth a try. Peter

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We have a different problem in the small streams in New Mexico and Colorado.  3 to 6 " small fish jump all over a dry fly and when you snap your wrist from the sudden and violent strike, the 3" to 6" small trout flies by your ear (right ear if right handed, etc.) and lands behind you.  We have found that these "flying" fish will shoot off when released so we assume they enjoy this. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I don’t know if this applies to your situation, but I’ve found that if you apply direct pressure when a fish is facing you, pullouts are much more likely.  I apply pressure to the side when a fish is facing me and try to get it turned and fighting away from me. This is especially true in streams and rivers where you want the fish fighting the current instead of using it to their advantage. Willi I had a really strange occurance happen to me this weekend.   I was fishing one of my favorite lakes from a raft (tore up the ligaments in my left knee so no float tube for me this Summer!) with my Sage SP+.  The fishing was really good and I hooked into about 18 fish.  Of these 18, 4 got off via jumping and tossing the barbless fly, 1 actually made it to the boat and the rest of them had the fly pull out of their mouths during the fight. My hooks were sharp and I didn’t feel like I was doing anything different then normal.  The only thing I can think of is the combination of the odd angle I had to sit in the raft combined with using my 9 foot SP+ (The wrong rod choice for this situation in hind sight.  Should have used my softer DS II.)  I did speak to another angler who reported that his fishing party was having the same problems.   I know fish will develop soft mouths when the water gets really warm but this is a high mountain lake and the water was still quite cool.  Any other ideas? Mike

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Hi Mike, How are you? Sounds like you haven’t given up FF! Either have I, got several 20 to 22 inch brookies and bows last Monday on the Connetquot River. It was a great day. As for fast vs slow rods. I like slow rods for casting drys and faster rods for streamers. As for loosing fish. I can loose as many fish on a fast rod as can on a slow rod. Still casting flies and telling lies. Dennis

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -<<I don’t want to start a rod fight but I’ve seen fishermen of various experience levels have problems with Sage RPL+ and other very fast rods. As I understand it the SP+ is even faster. I watched a fishing friend last year on the Madison above Quake Lake lose fish after fish with a brand new RPL+. I gave him my Loomis GL-3 and he started landing fish. I admit last month I would have given my left something for the RPL+ on Gray Reef with the wind howeling in my face and the Loomis just wasn’t enough gun to reach fish that under normal circumstances would have been easy to cast to. I have used my SP+ for two years now and haven’t ever felt I lost a fish due to the rod being too stiff until this particular weekend.  In fact, on rivers, it is my rod of choice. Like I mentioned in my previous post, I normally fish in my float tube. Sitting in the tube is similar to standing thus I haven’t had a problem hooking and keeping fish.  This occurance in the raft was just unique enough that I thought I would share it and see if anybody else has ever has this type of problem who wasn’t in a full leg brace and sitting at an angle in a rubber raft <grin The most likely cause was my sitting position combined with having a stiffer rod but I wanted to find out if anybody had ever run across trout who seemed to have really soft mouths like a Silver does.  This particular lake was just rehabilitated last year so this is a different gene pool of trout and it is possible that this is a genetic characteristic of the trout that were planted in the lake. Anyway, it really doesn’t matter much.  I had a great time and the one fish I did land was the largest of the year so I have nothing to complain about. Mike

Response:

I have seen people dunk the rod tip in the water to prevent the fish jumping. Never tried it myself preferring to keep the tension on the line as the fish jumps. That is quite difficult, I don’t need to tell you. Good observation on the angle in a float tube. I had never thought about that before. Gary

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I had a really strange occurance happen to me this weekend.   I was fishing one of my favorite lakes from a raft (tore up the ligaments in my left knee so no float tube for me this Summer!) with my Sage SP+.  The fishing was really good and I hooked into about 18 fish.  Of these 18, 4 got off via jumping and tossing the barbless fly, 1 actually made it to the boat and the rest of them had the fly pull out of their mouths during the fight. My hooks were sharp and I didn’t feel like I was doing anything different then normal.  The only thing I can think of is the combination of the odd angle I had to sit in the raft combined with using my 9 foot SP+ (The wrong rod choice for this situation in hind sight.  Should have used my softer DS II.)  I did speak to another angler who reported that his fishing party was having the same problems.   I know fish will develop soft mouths when the water gets really warm but this is a high mountain lake and the water was still quite cool. Any other ideas? Mike

Response:

<<I don’t want to start a rod fight but I’ve seen fishermen of various experience levels have problems with Sage RPL+ and other very fast rods. As I understand it the SP+ is even faster. I watched a fishing friend last year on the Madison above Quake Lake lose fish after fish with a brand new RPL+. I gave him my Loomis GL-3 and he started landing fish. I admit last month I would have given my left something for the RPL+ on Gray Reef with the wind howeling in my face and the Loomis just wasn’t enough gun to reach fish that under normal circumstances would have been easy to cast to. I have used my SP+ for two years now and haven’t ever felt I lost a fish due to the rod being too stiff until this particular weekend.  In fact, on rivers, it is my rod of choice.   Like I mentioned in my previous post, I normally fish in my float tube. Sitting in the tube is similar to standing thus I haven’t had a problem hooking and keeping fish.  This occurance in the raft was just unique enough that I thought I would share it and see if anybody else has ever has this type of problem who wasn’t in a full leg brace and sitting at an angle in a rubber raft <grin The most likely cause was my sitting position combined with having a stiffer rod but I wanted to find out if anybody had ever run across trout who seemed to have really soft mouths like a Silver does.  This particular lake was just rehabilitated last year so this is a different gene pool of trout and it is possible that this is a genetic characteristic of the trout that were planted in the lake. Anyway, it really doesn’t matter much.  I had a great time and the one fish I did land was the largest of the year so I have nothing to complain about. Mike

Response:

I don’t want to start a rod fight but I’ve seen fishermen of various experience levels have problems with Sage RPL+ and other very fast rods. As I understand it the SP+ is even faster. I watched a fishing friend last year on the Madison above Quake Lake lose fish after fish with a brand new RPL+. I gave him my Loomis GL-3 and he started landing fish. I admit last month I would have given my left something for the RPL+ on Gray Reef with the wind howeling in my face and the Loomis just wasn’t enough gun to reach fish that under normal circumstances would have been easy to cast to. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I had a really strange occurance happen to me this weekend.   I was fishing one of my favorite lakes from a raft (tore up the ligaments in my left knee so no float tube for me this Summer!) with my Sage SP+.  The fishing was really good and I hooked into about 18 fish.  Of these 18, 4 got off via jumping and tossing the barbless fly, 1 actually made it to the boat and the rest of them had the fly pull out of their mouths during the fight. My hooks were sharp and I didn’t feel like I was doing anything different then normal.  The only thing I can think of is the combination of the odd angle I had to sit in the raft combined with using my 9 foot SP+ (The wrong rod choice for this situation in hind sight.  Should have used my softer DS II.) I did speak to another angler who reported that his fishing party was having the same problems.   I know fish will develop soft mouths when the water gets really warm but this is a high mountain lake and the water was still quite cool.  Any other ideas? Mike

Response:

I don’t know if this applies to your situation, but I’ve found that if you apply direct pressure when a fish is facing you, pullouts are much more likely.  I apply pressure to the side when a fish is facing me and try to get it turned and fighting away from me. This is especially true in streams and rivers where you want the fish fighting the current instead of using it to their advantage. Willi – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I had a really strange occurance happen to me this weekend.   I was fishing one of my favorite lakes from a raft (tore up the ligaments in my left knee so no float tube for me this Summer!) with my Sage SP+.  The fishing was really good and I hooked into about 18 fish.  Of these 18, 4 got off via jumping and tossing the barbless fly, 1 actually made it to the boat and the rest of them had the fly pull out of their mouths during the fight. My hooks were sharp and I didn’t feel like I was doing anything different then normal.  The only thing I can think of is the combination of the odd angle I had to sit in the raft combined with using my 9 foot SP+ (The wrong rod choice for this situation in hind sight.  Should have used my softer DS II.)  I did speak to another angler who reported that his fishing party was having the same problems.   I know fish will develop soft mouths when the water gets really warm but this is a high mountain lake and the water was still quite cool.  Any other ideas? Mike

Response:

I had a really strange occurance happen to me this weekend.   I was fishing one of my favorite lakes from a raft (tore up the ligaments in my left knee so no float tube for me this Summer!) with my Sage SP+.  The fishing was really good and I hooked into about 18 fish.  Of these 18, 4 got off via jumping and tossing the barbless fly, 1 actually made it to the boat and the rest of them had the fly pull out of their mouths during the fight.   My hooks were sharp and I didn’t feel like I was doing anything different then normal.  The only thing I can think of is the combination of the odd angle I had to sit in the raft combined with using my 9 foot SP+ (The wrong rod choice for this situation in hind sight.  Should have used my softer DS II.)  I did speak to another angler who reported that his fishing party was having the same problems.   I know fish will develop soft mouths when the water gets really warm but this is a high mountain lake and the water was still quite cool.  Any other ideas? Mike

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Question:

Howdy, I had to make a trip from N. Idaho to Kalispell, MT over the weekend for my daughter’s soccer tourn. and was quite interested in the look of the St. Regis River. I haven’t seen much mentioned about it here so I thought I would ask. What’s the scoop?? Looks VERY FINE to say the least. I sometimes come over to St. Regis to take the Gold Creek road over to the St. Joe. If the fishing is worth while, I would venture a few hours enroute. Anyone in the know?? Smilin’ in North Idaho, Jerry

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Howdy, I had to make a trip from N. Idaho to Kalispell, MT over the weekend for my daughter’s soccer tourn. and was quite interested in the look of the St. Regis River. I haven’t seen much mentioned about it here so I thought I would ask. What’s the scoop?? Looks VERY FINE to say the least. I sometimes come over to St. Regis to take the Gold Creek road over to the St. Joe. If the fishing is worth while, I would venture a few hours enroute. Anyone in the know?? Smilin’ in North Idaho, Jerry

Hi Jerry I saw the river the other day and it was dropping.  I would suspect it will be fishable soon.  It’s a great brown trout fishery but also a very early in am and late pm as well. Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (96 catalog)

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Question:

Re carp on dry flies.  I know that in Sydney, Australia, some people (Christ only knows why) fish for carp using a dry fly which imitates bread crumbs being thrown on the water.  Carp of up to 30 pounds are caught. Incidentally they are caught in a park where other people make a habit of feeding the fish bread.  Please tell me do you guys really fish for carp or do you just catch them by accident.  In Australia they are classified as vermin and you are required by law to kill any carp you catch.  There’s nothing worse that spending a morning fishing for trout in a lake and catching about 100 carp. Peter W

We’ve had a thread going on about defining a good fisherman recently. You get my vote for defining "BAD fisherman."                                 Mark — <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Harris Space Systems            ::                         Melbourne, FL

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Re carp on dry flies.  I know that in Sydney, Australia, some people (Christ only knows why) fish for carp using a dry fly which imitates bread crumbs being thrown on the water.  Carp of up to 30 pounds are caught. Incidentally they are caught in a park where other people make a habit of feeding the fish bread.  Please tell me do you guys really fish for carp or do you just catch them by accident.  In Australia they are classified as vermin and you are required by law to kill any carp you catch.  There’s nothing worse that spending a morning fishing for trout in a lake and catching about 100 carp. Peter W

A few months ago I was talking to Michael Clark at his shop in Lyons Colorado, and he told me about a competition that some of his friends were at at the time in (I think) Montana. It was a weekend event of Flyfishing for Carp! It started out as a joke, but it caught on among some serious flyfishers and now it gets competitors from all over the place. I would love to attend some time. I wonder if any trout got in the way of the Carp they were after? Someone out there must know more about it. Perhaps I’ll ask Mike for more details in case anyone is interested. It was in May or June I think. John Geirach was part of the Lyons contingency and his team placed 3rd or so. —     o,  ,,   ,      | Bernie Bernstein                    | ,    ,,     LO/  `,/ `    ,| University of Colorado at Boulder   |/ `,,/  `    O./  ’  / . `, / | home: 303-444-3168                  |     / ` `  ,.

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Amazingly, it is true. Carp hit dry flies. My neighbor and I each had ponds in our yard with bass, trout, and carp. In the late summer, the carp would come to the surface to feed on willow leaves from a tree that hung down over the pond. I tried everything to catch those fish without success (the bass and trout were easy but much smaller!). Finally, I put on a Hornberg – its a goofy looking fly that is normally fished wet but vaguely resembles a willow leaf, so I fished dry. Wham! I got several 5 to 15 pound carp on the surface. Careful stalking and reasonable casting were also important. My opinion of the fish did change a bit. Chris Beatty

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Re carp on dry flies.  I know that in Sydney, Australia, some people (Christ only knows why) fish for carp using a dry fly which imitates bread crumbs being thrown on the water.  Carp of up to 30 pounds are caught. Incidentally they are caught in a park where other people make a habit of feeding the fish bread.  Please tell me do you guys really fish for carp or do you just catch them by accident.  In Australia they are classified as vermin and you are required by law to kill any carp you catch.  There’s nothing worse that spending a morning fishing for trout in a lake and catching about 100 carp. Peter W

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