Question:

Several people e-mailed, asking if these stories are true…….

Never doubted your veracity myself.  As a matter of fact, it never occurred to me to wonder whether or not any of your stories are true.  Now that the subject has been broached, I am forced to wonder why anyone would concern him or her self with such a question.  There is no doubt in my feeble little mind that "Huckleberry Finn", "Gulliver’s Travels", and perhaps even "A Midsummer Night’s Dream" would fail the test of scholarly historiography.  Should this prove to be the case, I suspect that they would all nevertheless continue to draw readers and furthermore, that it would not detract one whit from the truth contained in these timeless stories. In other words, fuck ‘em.  You go Mike. Wolfgang

Response:

Several people e-mailed, asking if these stories are true, and if so, how on earth such things could happen to me…

Hi Mike, I do enjoy this stuff: up to your usual form. I have tried to e-mail you privately, but have had no replies. Is it not getting through? Best & Tight Lines, Tony Deacon

Response:

Had a little problem with some software. Maybe that is the reason ?  I saw no posts from you recently. Lookout Distress is once again living up to its name, coupled with the arcane machinations of the German Telecom, it makes Brown trucks look like heavenly chariots. TL MC — "Where fishing is concerned, most anglers are basically manic excessives" http://www.mikeconnor.de – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Several people e-mailed, asking if these stories are true, and if so, how on earth such things could happen to me… Hi Mike, I do enjoy this stuff: up to your usual form. I have tried to e-mail you privately, but have had no replies. Is it not getting through? Best & Tight Lines, Tony Deacon

Response:

Thanks Chris,  very kind of you to say so. Care must be taken in some instances though, not all of my exploits and methods are suitable for emulation. My track record with poachers for instance is quite abysmal. TL MC – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – —- Mike, I for one enjoy your vast knowledge and experiences.  I never thought for a moment that they did not ring of truth and I have employed some of your past suggestions with success, I might mention.

Response:

I had trouble shooting Teel when I first started duck hunting.  It was because they fly much faster than the other ducks.  I consistently shot behind them.  I finally got so I could hit one, but never could hit a Snipe. Ernie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If you spend a great deal of time and energy on something, several things tend to occur. You  become fairly good at it, and you experience a lot more things than if you only occasionally did it. A few weeks ago, I was out duck hunting (OBROFF: gathering CDC feathers.)  I had just flushed a flock of mallards out of a slough, and I was crouched down in the grass hoping some of them might come back, when a pair of blue wing teal appeared out of nowhere, crossed in front of me and settled on opposite edge of the water, out of range. I sat still for another 15 minutes or so with one eye on the teal and one eye on the horizon, where the mallards were still flying.  There was a sound of wingbeats overhead and suddenly there was an enormous redtailed hawk, hot in pursuit of the teal.  The teal dove underwater, but the water was only a foot or so deep so the hawk had no trouble following them, hovering over the water, wings beating furiously like a huge kestrel.  The teal eventually made good their escape, flying right past me.  I suppose I could have shot them fairly easily, but it didn’t seem quite right.  I just stared, filled with awe and wonderment at my good fortune to have been a witness. I would have never seen it happen if I hadn’t been out there, and what possible other reason could I have to be crouched down in the weeds next to a slough out on the prairie?  I think I have posted before my belief that the reason we go out hunting or fishing or whatever is not so much to gather fish or game (unless we seriously need the food), but to gather interesting stories to tell.  The fishing is fun, but it is also a reason to get out of the house and out into the world and let things happen to us. Kevin

Response:

Several people e-mailed, asking if these stories are true, and if so, how on earth such things could happen to me.  I have attempted to explain this in the past, I seem to remember even on here, but for those who missed it the first time, ( assuming I did in fact explain it before on here), here it is again.

<snipped, but deeply appreciated —- Mike, I for one enjoy your vast knowledge and experiences.  I never thought for a moment that they did not ring of truth and I have employed some of your past suggestions with success, I might mention.  The reason some people may question your veracity could be that the have led colorless lives themselves and are judging your life experience against the standard of being a spector of life instead of participating in life as you have. In a given week, I tend to do a lot of different things.  When someone asked me how I did so many things, I told them, simply, "I do not own a television."  I have a VCR player hooked to a video monitor for some of my instructional videos that I own, but I NEVER watch television.  Since the average American, according to one source, watches an astounding 40+ hours of television a week, it is small wonder where I find the "extra" time to indulge myself in my many varied interests. —- Padishar Creel "I don’t want to achieve immortality through my work…I want to achieve it through not dying."  – Woody Allen

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Thanks Chris,  very kind of you to say so. Care must be taken in some instances though, not all of my exploits and methods are suitable for emulation. My track record with poachers for instance is quite abysmal.

—– So is my experience with Game Wardens, as it so happens <G — Padishar Creel "I don’t want to achieve immortality through my work…I want to achieve it through not dying."  – Woody Allen

Response:

Mike,   Some have doubted the veracity of my many misadventures, but any doubts were laid to rest at the Rappahanock Clave (read Frank meets tent stake).   Your stories are so wonderful because we, as a group, can identify with the situations.  As a whole, I’m sure it would take the combined experience of ROFF to match your own.  We thank you for sharing yours. We will not match yours (thinking about going beak to beak with an owl is a tough way to get into PETA’s bad boy book. Go strangle a pheasant me boyo.  Very proper that.).  We will however, experience that vicarious thrill of looking at the world through your eyes as we slog through the day-to-day life with our commutes and lousy jobs.    Your every story conjurs up the fun of a Guy Fawkesian tale.  You have the unwitting anti-hero (you), the protagonist (the sea,a crazed bus driver, a policeman), an injured victim (an owl or the bloomin bloomerless WI) and a common thread of life just outside of the bounds of control, a train wreck waiting to happen.    I will often piggy back on your stories.  Like stories around a campfire, or more properly, in front of a fire in a ghillie hut, single malt in hand, they become seeds for other stories and ROFF threads. I’m glad you’re back.      Frank Reid Before you buy.

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I would have never seen it happen if I hadn’t been out there, and what possible other reason could I have to be crouched down in the weeds next to a slough out on the prairie?  

That’s an astonishing observation, Kevin. I’ve felt the same thing on many occasions. People who don’t hunt or fish can’t really understand what it’s like to experience this stuff. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

I had trouble shooting Teel when I first started duck hunting.  It was because they fly much faster than the other ducks.  I consistently shot behind them.  I finally got so I could hit one, but never could hit a Snipe. Ernie

Too bad, Keith at Grindstone Angling has been bugging me about finding him some snipe.  I could’ve gotten a pretty penny out of him if you were any good.  :)  I was holding out on him, but he recently got his own computer and you’d never guess who he dug up all by hisself. Mike, truth always has been stranger than fiction.  I look on your stories as a life spent in an endless "Carry On" movie.  There are far worse fates.  :)   A rich life always appears untrue to those who rarely try to extend their lives beyond the poverty of their spirit. Peter

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If you spend a great deal of time and energy on something, several things tend to occur. You  become fairly good at it, and you experience a lot more things than if you only occasionally did it.

A few weeks ago, I was out duck hunting (OBROFF: gathering CDC feathers.)  I had just flushed a flock of mallards out of a slough, and I was crouched down in the grass hoping some of them might come back, when a pair of blue wing teal appeared out of nowhere, crossed in front of me and settled on opposite edge of the water, out of range. I sat still for another 15 minutes or so with one eye on the teal and one eye on the horizon, where the mallards were still flying.  There was a sound of wingbeats overhead and suddenly there was an enormous redtailed hawk, hot in pursuit of the teal.  The teal dove underwater, but the water was only a foot or so deep so the hawk had no trouble following them, hovering over the water, wings beating furiously like a huge kestrel.  The teal eventually made good their escape, flying right past me.  I suppose I could have shot them fairly easily, but it didn’t seem quite right.  I just stared, filled with awe and wonderment at my good fortune to have been a witness. I would have never seen it happen if I hadn’t been out there, and what possible other reason could I have to be crouched down in the weeds next to a slough out on the prairie?  I think I have posted before my belief that the reason we go out hunting or fishing or whatever is not so much to gather fish or game (unless we seriously need the food), but to gather interesting stories to tell.  The fishing is fun, but it is also a reason to get out of the house and out into the world and let things happen to us. Kevin

Response:

Several people e-mailed, asking if these stories are true, and if so, how on earth such things could happen to me.  I have attempted to explain this in the past, I seem to remember even on here, but for those who missed it the first time, ( assuming I did in fact explain it before on here), here it is again. Well, first of all, for quite a long time, I was so fanatical about fishing, that I often went seven days a week, I did not much care where, or for what, I simply took every available opportunity, and even if none was apparently available, I made one. Sometimes I only went for an hour, school, work, and other things allowing, ( and often even if they did not allow it, school bored me to death, and I rarely attended, I went fishing instead), and sometimes I disappeared for days, or even weeks. During these times, all I did was fish, and read, and what I read was also mostly about fishing. When I first started seriously fishing, the main reason was to catch fish for food. As it was absolutely imperative that I catch something to eat, I did not mess about very much, if at all, I made a point of discovering the best methods, ( for "best", read,  "most successful in terms of edible fish caught "), and applied them diligently, with considerable success. Not all of these methods were equally enjoyable, some were certainly not "fair", although to me all were enjoyable to some extent, (even hauling nets at sea, or longlining, which I also did for a while), but most were extremely successful, when correctly practiced, and as enjoyment was not the main driving factor, this did not really matter in any case. What I am trying to explain here, is that the enjoyment was more or less completely incidental initially. Fishing was not a way of "killing time", or "pursuing an interest", "a hobby", or all the other various euphemisms one often hears for various pastimes. It was a way of obtaining food for nothing, and it was also very cheap, healthy,  and fulfilling entertainment. I never considered fishing, or anything even remotely connected with it to be  work, although I knew a few who did. If you spend a great deal of time and energy on something, several things tend to occur. You  become fairly good at it, and you experience a lot more things than if you only occasionally did it. If the subject also interests you per se, and you also perhaps have a certain talent for it,  then you get even better at it, you really have no choice in the matter, it is a simple progression. One thing leads to another. Before I was twenty years old I had caught more fish, and spent more time on the water, often in the company of experts, than many men will ever do in their whole lifetimes. For years I gave lessons in tying and casting to various local clubs, spent weekends teaching fly-fishing for the local water authority, giving fly-dressing demos at various fairs, ( long before tying became as popular as it is now), etc etc etc. In the years that followed, the frequency of my trips decreased of course, you may play truant from school with relative impunity, but if you play truant from work you will eventually be sacked.( Fired ! ). Nevertheless, I still managed to spend a great deal of time on the water, or involved in some way. I had become firm friends with many other anglers, and people connected with angling, and because of this, I received opportunities which others did not. Anything to do with fishing interested me, and I went out of my way to be part of anything at all where fish or fishing was involved.  All the time my interest remained steady, and I read every book or magazine that I could lay my hands on. When I got the chance, I went fishing with others, some of them already world or at least nationally renowned experts at that time, others perhaps less well known, but experts nonetheless, and of course with lots of other people, who were neither well known nor experts. All contributed to my angling education. Much of what I read, learned, or simply saw,  I immediately put into practice. What I could not buy, I built, ( basically why I started tying flies as well ), insofar as it was within my capabilities to do so. Astoundingly enough, one discovers fairly early on that most things are not that hard to do, what one man can invent or design, another man can build, given reasonable intelligence,  time, persistence,  and materials. Simply attempting this, hones your capabilities automatically, until you reach a point where you find very few things difficult. At a fairly early point during these years, the need to catch fish for food decreased, and eventually disappeared entirely, but my enthusiasm for fishing did not, and I continued reading about it, and fishing a great deal, but now purely for enjoyment, the fish having become an incidental bonus to the entertainment, and so it has remained to this day. Apparently I have a very selective, but almost photographic memory, for things concerning fishing. It took me almost fifteen years before I finally managed to remember my wife’s birthday, but I only have to see a fly pattern once, and it is fixed forever in my memory.  I can not remember my own mobile phone number for more than a day, and constantly have to look it up, but I can remember every single run on every single river or stream I have ever fished with brilliant clarity. Even those I fished over thirty years ago. Although a fairly good navigator, and with an excellent sense of direction, I can not remember a street in a city which I visited last week, but I can find my way across the North York Moors, from any point you care to mention, to any stream or valley within hundreds of square miles with absolutely pin-point accuracy, in the pitch dark, with no moon or stars and in heavy snow or fog. I can do the same here, in the Lueneburger Heide. I have no idea why I can do this, or even how, I just can. I wish I did know, I would certainly apply the talent to something else if I possibly could. I can not remember whether it rained yesterday, but  I can remember  every sizeable fish I have ever caught, where I caught it, how I caught it, and what the weather conditions were at the time. I can "see" these things in my mind, like a film which may be rewound and replayed at will.  I could give more examples, but I suppose you get the drift. Regarding actually fishing, if I absolutely must catch a fish, then I do, I do not find it particularly difficult. Nowadays I do not bother with extremely productive methods much, as I find other methods more enjoyable, even though they are less productive.  The size of fish caught has ceased to bother me very much, although it is nice to catch a large one now and then, as the fight is simply more interesting and challenging. Somebody on here said ( I believe it was Willi actually ), some time ago now, that he had more or less ceased nymphing, as although it was extremely productive in terms of fish, it was hard work, and got boring after a while.  I feel much the same about some methods. It is just too easy, although perhaps hard work, and therefore not worth the bother.  This doubtless sounds extremely arrogant, but it is nevertheless simple fact. Catching one very difficult fish from a challenging position, or for other reasons, ( actually regardless of size ) is much more enjoyable than banging out a dozen in double quick time with an easy method, or because the fish are madly on the feed, and have thrown caution to the winds. Unfortunately this applies to many "new" methods as well. There are not many angling books I have not read, and there are not many methods, tackle, or materials,  I do not at least know something about. Once read or seen, never forgotten. I can even remember shotting patterns somebody once showed me, again over thirty years ago. Often I am quite amused when I read about some "new" method of tying flies, or casting, or a host of other things. Invariably these things are not new at all, and in all likelihood have been around for quite a while, in some cases for centuries. I remember being extremely crushed over thirty five years ago, when I sent in a parachute version of the Greenwell

Question:

I’ve got to tell ya, the dogs haven’t been real happy with me and my broken foot. No more rousing games of soccer, it takes me forever to even get up or down the stairs or across the room. We’re playing other games, but I’ve got to be careful for quite a while yet. Walking aross the yard is a trick; lumpy ground is really hard to deal with. And I was the one who played with the dogs the most. Sigh. So the other day, I’m upstairs and I hear the door open (must be husband coming in) and then I hear strange dog sounds. So I hobble downstairs and I see this strange tangle of dogs and a human on the floor sort of rolling around in a ball. They heard me and they suddenly all stopped and looked at me, my husband looking the most sheepish of all. Silly hub’n puppies!

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nice to know he can step in A fun doggy game for sitting humans is the cat intended fishing pole game  a stick a string (preferably strong ones with a sproingy stick) and a soft toy to fly around ahead of the galloping herd can be lots of fun the dog that catches it has to fetch and give so the game can continue Nancy

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve got to tell ya, the dogs haven’t been real happy with me and my broken foot. No more rousing games of soccer, it takes me forever to even get up or down the stairs or across the room. We’re playing other games, but I’ve got to be careful for quite a while yet. Walking aross the yard is a trick; lumpy ground is really hard to deal with. And I was the one who played with the dogs the most. Sigh. So the other day, I’m upstairs and I hear the door open (must be husband coming in) and then I hear strange dog sounds. So I hobble downstairs and I see this strange tangle of dogs and a human on the floor sort of rolling around in a ball. They heard me and they suddenly all stopped and looked at me, my husband looking the most sheepish of all. Silly hub’n puppies!

Response:

nice to know he can step in A fun doggy game for sitting humans is the cat intended fishing pole game a stick a string (preferably strong ones with a sproingy stick) and a soft toy to fly around ahead of the galloping herd can be lots of fun the dog that catches it has to fetch and give so the game can continue Nancy

I think it’s harder on me than on the dogs. WAAAAAAAAAA! I wanna go out and play doggie soccer! <snivel donna

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Question:

   He he, my wife’s back-up deer rifle is a Dragunov SVD. It does seem to get odd looks from other hunters:-) Dino in Reno

Hey dino:   My wifes weapon of choice for deer is my formerly pristeen Toyota Pick-up truck! And why does somebody named Tamela have a wife??????? — Carl Johansson, Guardian of Yahoo Central  "J-3 frontseater, P-51 backseater" Avid Mark IV N2114N

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – She’s just upset ’cause the last one I got was less than 25 yards away, through the PA Brush, in the rain, 15 minutes in the season with a Marlin 336 30-30. The last one I got was at 50 yards from home — in between the house and the shop.  I got him at blank point range with a model 94 Ford Ranger.  Bambi Jerky, yum yum To alleviate that problemn I’ve moved to the residential airpark and my new shop (i.e., hangar) is right outside my back door.

John, I generally recommend something that uses less expensive projectiles! HF

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor…. Got to practice somehow Uncle HF.  It pays to be in shape, and be a good (long-range) marksman to boot.  Never know with the Mongolians or the Turks will come over the mountain! BWB    He he, my wife’s back-up deer rifle is a Dragunov SVD. It does seem to get odd looks from other hunters:-) Dino in Reno

Mine is an aging Winchester chambered for 45-70.  It has been in the family since it was new.  It is a little short for BWB’s sniper hunting, but it is the absolute ticket for brush popping the darn critturs. HF

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She’s just upset ’cause the last one I got was less than 25 yards away, through the PA Brush, in the rain, 15 minutes in the season with a Marlin 336 30-30.

The last one I got was at 50 yards from home — in between the house and the shop.  I got him at blank point range with a model 94 Ford Ranger.  Bambi Jerky, yum yum To alleviate that problemn I’ve moved to the residential airpark and my new shop (i.e., hangar) is right outside my back door. – John Ousterhout – Cessna driver, Flybaby builder, RV Wantabe

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Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor…. Got to practice somehow Uncle HF.  It pays to be in shape, and be a good (long-range) marksman to boot.  Never know with the Mongolians or the Turks will come over the mountain! BWB

   He he, my wife’s back-up deer rifle is a Dragunov SVD. It does seem to get odd looks from other hunters:-) Dino in Reno

Response:

Haa Haa got you there!!  you can’t count my thumb.  Since it spends so much time inserted in my rectum it cannot – repeat cannot be counted as a digit – and that is by international decree my friend – "the Warsaw thumbsitting act of 1987 to be exact)

Just a minor correction there Carl,it was the "Warsaw left handed Thumbsitting act of 1987" to be exact. It was authored by Stanislaw Podgorski who also authored the "Right foot in Mouth Act of 1982" and the "It’s not Sex,but an inapporiate Act, Act of 1998" often cited by bill clinton… Just a minor detail. Chuck(Polish Historian)Slusarczyk..author of the "He’s not Crazy he’s Nuts act of 1997.

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Haa Haa got you there!!  you can’t count my thumb.  Since it spends so much time inserted in my rectum it cannot – repeat cannot be counted as a digit – and that is by international decree my friend – "the Warsaw thumbsitting act of 1987 to be exact)  – Carl Johansson, Guardian of Yahoo Central "J-3 frontseater, P-51 backseater" Avid Mark IV N2114N

Just one of many "acts" I’ve heard you are so intimately familiar with. And I don’t care if you like it or not, you’re still my Good Buddy, John Stricker — why I had to put it in.  If one of you real humans wants to contact me: "I didn’t spend all these years getting to the top of the food chain just to become a vegetarian"

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Carl, FYI, I currently own four

Thats 4 POS scouts for those of you not keeping track  (that’s the same number of fingers you have left on your hand including your thumb since you lost that one in the barrel of BWB’s gun a while back you dimwit)

Haa Haa got you there!!  you can’t count my thumb.  Since it spends so much time inserted in my rectum it cannot – repeat cannot be counted as a digit – and that is by international decree my friend – "the Warsaw thumbsitting act of 1987 to be exact)   — Carl Johansson, Guardian of Yahoo Central  "J-3 frontseater, P-51 backseater" Avid Mark IV N2114N

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Ahh!  You got it right John.  Carl is a crybaby.  I may have shot that buck from 700 yards.  It gets longer everyday that I think about it. What really griped me was Carl giving credit to Twyla.  Shit, she just sat, smoked Camels and bitched the whole time about Tommy Cooper.  I have no idea what her problem was.  

She’s just upset ’cause the last one I got was less than 25 yards away, through the PA Brush, in the rain, 15 minutes in the season with a Marlin 336 30-30. And I shot it in the head because you can’t eat the damm horns anyway. She was mad because I looked that Bambi in its sad eyes and KILLED IT ANYWAY. Miss Geeter thought for that fleeting moment I had a colder heart that she did but we all know that’s impossible. Tom "I might just use a 12 Ga. this year" Cooper

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I haven’t been introduced to the gentile sport of BWB hunting, and don’t know the rules.  Are Gatling spud guns considered unsporting? "Lennie the Lurker"

No not unsporting, but bake ‘em first and it will be considered tasty. Tom "here we go talking about food again" Cooper

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Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor young "Bambi" on his very first sortie away from his loving mother.  I know you don’t really need the groceries because you can buy hamburger already ground up and patted out into patties at Wal-Mart for MUCH less that a box of ammunition for those vicious weapons. Yah – so whats your point??????

Py Yimmeny, Mister Johansson, if YOU can go fishing,  I can go fishing! HF

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I haven’t been introduced to the gentile sport of BWB hunting, and don’t know the rules.  Are Gatling spud guns considered unsporting? "Lennie the Lurker"

We currently have a crew of engineers working out the mounting points and the loading system for installation on a Mooney for rec.aviation flyin at Pink Knee in 1999.  We plan to usher in the millenium with a proper celebration.  All of the millenia. Since we have many programmers in the group, and programmers always start counting with "zero" their millenia is 2000.  For everyone else, who start counting with "one," the mellenia is 2001.  However, Arther C. Clarke already usurped that one. HF

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Ahh!  You got it right John.  Carl is a crybaby.  I may have shot that buck from 700 yards.  It gets longer everyday that I think about it. What really griped me was Carl giving credit to Twyla.  Shit, she just sat, smoked Camels and bitched the whole time about Tommy Cooper.  I have no idea what her problem was.  You know, she just turned 94.  I guess when you are that old it’s impossible to reason with you.  She was ranting and raving that she made some deal with God that she can’t die until Carl, Me, Tommy, Tony,  Chuck and O’ring are in our graves.   We made the old bag sleep outside in a tent both nights that she was there.  One night it rained like hell.  I could hear her praying while we were in the RV with our heater on  in nice, warm and soft beds.  I thought to myself.  To Hell with you.  You old bag.  I’m glad to see you suffer, you old decrepit piece of crap.  The next day she came in for a shower and she was soaked to the bone.  Serves the old bag right I say. BWB – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -PS:  Nice shot Bill.  I notice there were nothing but excuses from old Carl here.  God what a whining baby.

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Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor….

Got to practice somehow Uncle HF.  It pays to be in shape, and be a good (long-range) marksman to boot.  Never know with the Mongolians or the Turks will come over the mountain! BWB

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I haven’t been introduced to the gentile sport of BWB hunting, and don’t know the rules.  Are Gatling spud guns considered unsporting? "Lennie the Lurker"

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Badwater Bill wrote Got to practice somehow Uncle HF.  It pays to be in shape, and be a good (long-range) marksman to boot.  Never know with the Mongolians or the Turks will come over the mountain! BWB

The Real Truth about the hunting trip: BWB lurks in the shadows of the ridge mumbling softly to himself.  "I’ll get them this time.  Them Turks, they’re after me.  They’ve been after me for a long time but I’ll get them this time." Poor innocent Bambi strolls through his valley not far from where he was born, looking for nothing more than a tuff of dry grass in the late season. BWB sees the movement and says "There they are!  The Turks!  And they’re in disguise again!" BLAM!! Bambi’s blood stained body is thrown against a tree and the last thing he sees as the light fades from his eyes is a madman running down from the ridge screaming "I GOT THEM!  I GOT THEM!" Can nothing stop this maniac?  Who or what will he hit next?  Look forward to the next exciting episode of: "Let’s Go Hunting This Weekend.or I’m Going Settle This Suit One Way Or The Other" Rich Isakson

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Phillips you ought to be ashamed of yourself. Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor young "Bambi" on his very first sortie away from his loving mother.  I know you don’t really need the groceries because you can buy hamburger already ground up and patted out into patties at Wal-Mart for MUCH less that a box of ammunition for those vicious weapons.  

Some lady asked me the other day as I got out of my truck dressed in my camo hunting outfit,"How could you kill a deer?" I said with a bow ,shotgun, muzzleloader(no not the drinking kind) or pistol. She then said"why do you do that?,don’t you like deer?" I said ,yes ma’am, I like ‘em… baked, fried, BBQ’ed, Roasted, made into sausage, cooked on a grill, made into spaghetti, chili,stew,…… She just shook her head in disgust walked away and went into Mac Dee to eat something someone else killed….Go figure… Chuck(my biggest was a 180# heavy rack 10 pt.)Slusarczyk PS Besides Bambi, I eat Porky Pig,Henny Penny,Mother Goose,Bugs Bunny,    Bossie the Cow and the rest .If God didn’t want me to eat’em He wouldn’t    have made ‘em taste good.

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HF, With Carl on the operating end of the weapon, Bambi can sleep secure. John Stricker — why I had to put it in.  If one of you real humans wants to contact me: "I didn’t spend all these years getting to the top of the food chain just to become a vegetarian" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Phillips you ought to be ashamed of yourself. Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor young "Bambi" on his very first sortie away from his loving mother.  I know you don’t really need the groceries because you can buy hamburger already ground up and patted out into patties at Wal-Mart for MUCH less that a box of ammunition for those vicious weapons. Shame, shame, shame. HF

Response:

I’ve been nuts for at least 30 years that I’m aware of.  I actually think that O’ring drove me nuts because of my close contact with him for many years.

Denying any mental illness is itself a symptom of mental illness (see Zoom paradox no. 1).  Conversely if you claim that you’re nuts, you probably aren’t. I’ve met O’Ring and he seems quite normal to me.  Fortunately for O’Ring, being exposed (literally) to you hasn’t harmed him. Carl Johannson is of the same caliber as O’ring and myself.

I’ve met Carl and anyone that wears those beutiful Hawiian shirts has to be a mentally healthy person. Thank Dog, there is NO ONE else the same caliber as you. – John (44 caliber) Ousterhout –

Response:

A whole bunch of stuff – most of which was true – some of which is now Guess what.  I got the deer… and they got skunked!!!!

We did come out of the desert with one deer (this trip – openning day we had two more, and just last night we got a big one during the muzzleloader season – no Bob not that kind of Muzzleloader!!!! But Phillips in his scotch hazed memory has forgotten the real scenario. Were out in the desert just fooling around having some fun – when up pulls this beat up old 1966 international.  (BTW Stricker I’ll put my stock Defender up against that POS scout you have any day – I used to have one-  criminy what a ride!!!) Anyway out jumps this rickity old grandma who immediately starts ranting and raving about "that miscreant Billy Phillips".  It’s Miss Geeter!!!!! She followed the scotch fumes and a trail of empty Tecate cans to find that idiot!!!! Phillips tries to hide in the luggage compartment of the motorhome but Miss Geeter smells him out – grabs him by the ear and pulls him out of there (as we sit doubled over in laughter). Anyway Miss Geeter sits there by the fire with us – she’s smoking filterless camels and belching like a sailor, and tells us that the only failure she has ever encountered in her life is not being able to teach (or more correctly train) BWB anything of any value.  So now she has decided in a last ditch attempt to  teach Bedwetter Billy (as she calls him) anything at all, she figures she may be able to reach him through this hunting stuff. So we drop old BWB and Miss Geeter in the "badlands" the next morning. Turns out we put the SOB right in the middle of the action, as almost immediately this tiny – really stupid buck, full of testosterone, and no common sense pops up 25 yards in front of BWB and begs to be shot. I’m sitting up on top of the hill watching the soap opera unfold. So BWB attempts to put this deer in his sights and the gun barrel is moving around like a bamboo in a hurricane.  Suddenly Miss Geeter loses patience with Phillips and grabs the gun from him.  Phillips shrinks down into a fetal sitting position hiding behind a Joshua tree, shaking like a leaf and sucking his thumb!! So Geeter drops the hammer on the deer, and Phillips flinches like a nuclear bomb went off in his shorts.  Then he gets on the radio and starts crowing about how HE "got him –  he’s huge – 4 point".  turns out to be a little forky – and Phillips was cowering behind the tree while that Geeter Chick did the dirty work. Way to go Geeter Baby!!!!! This as you all know is the true story of BWB’s suposedly sucessfull deer hunt!!!!!! Phillips you ought to be ashamed of yourself. — Carl Johansson, Guardian of Yahoo Central  "J-3 frontseater, P-51 backseater" Avid Mark IV N2114N

Response:

Phillips you ought to be ashamed of yourself.

Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor young "Bambi" on his very first sortie away from his loving mother.  I know you don’t really need the groceries because you can buy hamburger already ground up and patted out into patties at Wal-Mart for MUCH less that a box of ammunition for those vicious weapons.   Shame, shame, shame. HF

Response:

Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor young "Bambi" on his very first sortie away from his loving mother.  I know you don’t really need the groceries because you can buy hamburger already ground up and patted out into patties at Wal-Mart for MUCH less that a box of ammunition for those vicious weapons.

Yah – so whats your point?????? Carl Johansson, Guardian of Yahoo Central  "J-3 frontseater, P-51 backseater" Avid Mark IV N2114N

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Phillips you ought to be ashamed of yourself. Why all of you bad guys ought to be ashamed of yourselves for heading out into the desert armed with all those high powered assault weapons just hoping to assassinate some poor young "Bambi" on his very first sortie away from his loving mother.  I know you don’t really need the groceries because you can buy hamburger already ground up and patted out into patties at Wal-Mart for MUCH less that a box of ammunition for those vicious weapons. Shame, shame, shame. HF

Hear, Hear Yoram Leshinski

Response:

Carl, While your most of your story is certainly believable and I heartily accept as the truth, there is one issue that I simply must address. Were out in the desert just fooling around having some fun – when up pulls this beat up old 1966 international.  (BTW Stricker I’ll put my stock Defender up against that POS scout you have any day – I used to have one-  criminy what a ride!!!)

FYI, I currently own four (that’s the same number of fingers you have left on your hand including your thumb since you lost that one in the barrel of BWB’s gun a while back you dimwit) (4) of these fine specimens of American Truck production.  Even the sorriest of the lot would be more than up to the task of defending it’s name against your baseless charges you wuss. And if by some miracle of divine intervention, they should fail, out comes the S1700.  And if IT fails in totally destroying whatever that junk example you drive, I’ll dolly up the semi trailer and finish you off with the CO9670 and 435 hp Detroit. However, I’m quite sure that it won’t come to that, as I don’t expect you to ever make good on your feeble claims of superiority.  Obviously, anyone that "used to have one" and got rid of it is at least half a bubble out of plumb. John "Give me 392cid of 1000# American Iron for an engine any day" Stricker PS:  Nice shot Bill.  I notice there were nothing but excuses from old Carl here.  God what a whining baby. — why I had to put it in.  If one of you real humans wants to contact me: "I didn’t spend all these years getting to the top of the food chain just to become a vegetarian"

Response:

I think the people who build and fly their own airplanes are for the most part nuts.  I’ve been nuts for at least 30 years that I’m aware of.  I actually think that O’ring drove me nuts because of my close contact with him for many years.  I was hanging on to certain threads of reality when I met him in 1972.  He’s a chemist by trade and everyone knows that chemists are nuts from birth.  I tried to remain calm and focused as a young physicist working in the same lab that housed O’ring.  But, as time went on and my association with him became closer he drove me over the edge.   Carl Johannson is of the same caliber as O’ring and myself.  Unlike me, however, he was probably was born nuts.  I notice no transition period in his life that caused him to become what he is.  I think he was always crazy.  For instance, he trained for decades to be an Olympian.  He did nothing but work out 8 hours each day for the Olympics, totally focused, totally committed, totally obsessed. Carl is strange in his own kind of way.  He told me a year ago, "Phillips, you come to Utah and I’ll take you fishing.  You WILL catch fish and you will catch a lot of fish in a short period of time."  I retaliated, "Gonzo, you’re full of crap.  I never catch fish unless I fish in the ocean."  Gonzo says, "Yeah, sure, you come to Utah and we’ll not only catch fish, we’ll catch enough fish in one afternoon to feed a party of ten people." Of course the only catch is that I had to walk through a river for two hours with water temps near freezing to get to an obscure canyon that no human has ever been to other than Carl.  Then if you were to try to walk up the canyon on the side of the stream you’d need a four foot machete to claw your way.  I said, "Yo Gonzo, there ain’t no way up this stream!"  Carl laughs, "You don’t walk along the side, you walk UP the stream in the center of the water.  Don’t worry about getting wet, you’ll be wet all day.  We need to cast into the ponds above us as we go. That’s where the fish are." Combat fishing is what it is.  We caught fish alright but the reason why is that no other human being would subject themselves to the torture of the environment to do it. SO!  What all this is head toward is the hunting trip we just took last weekend.  Here’s the Johannson thought process.  Last December Carl asked me if I wanted to go deer hunting with him and his brother this fall.  He asked me 9 months ahead of time because I’m a fat slob and I needed to get in shape to go with them.  I said, "Sure, I’d like to go, what do I do?"  Carl’s reply was, "See that mountain behind your house there?  You have to climb that mountain at least 4 times a week for about three months to start.  Then you have to climb it quickly  for about the next three months.  Then you have to push yourself and get anaerobic for the last three months.  Don’t worry about your weight loss.  You are a fat slob anyway and you need the exercise." Well, I did just that.  I climbed that mountain at least four times a week, even in the summer.  I lost 20 pounds, my heart felt good, my sex life improved, it all came together.  Then last weekend was the big hunt.  Two weeks ago I sighted my 300 Win-Mag in to be on target at 300 meters.  That put the round about 3 inches high at 100 meters, about   1.5 inches high at 200 meters, dead on at 300 meters, 4 inches low at 400 meters and 8 inches low at 500 meters.   You have no idea what it’s like to hunt with the Johannson brothers. You get up in the dark at 04:00 and drive for an hour to get to some canyon in the middle of the desert-nowhere.  You walk up and over about three mountains in the dark until you perch on some crestline where you use your binoculars to "Glass" the valley before you, searching for a lone buck.  You sit there in 25 degree temperatures at 9000 feet looking 300 to 600 meters away.  Carl pulls out an infrared laser distance measuring device. He hits a rock on the left in the center of the valley then an outcropping across the valley and another boulder on the right.  He leans over to me in a whisper and says, "He Phillips, that rock is 323 meters, the hill over there is 450 meters and that boulder on the right is 525 meters.  Get your ballistic table out and figure the drops.  If a deer comes along, hold the sighting point appropriately.  Got it dummy!" "Got it Gonzo.  You can count on me." This is not deer hunting, it’s being a sniper!  Sniper hunting is the only way to describe it.  These guys laugh at me for carrying a 300 Win-mag while they carry 220 swifts.  They shoot 50 grain bullets at 4200 feet per second with flat ballistics, while I shoot a CANNON!  I was using 180 grain hot loads in my sniper rifle, but my ballistics aren’t bad.  That gun can shoot the ass off a gnat at 300 meters. AND

Question:

I am going to Lake Tahoe for a week in one week. Does anyone know anything about the fishing conditions this time of year? Is there any stream fishing in the vicinity in Late October?

Response:

Depends which end of the lake you are going to.  It’s been in the teen’s at night, so will be cold in the morning.  At North Shore (Tahoe City) there is the Truckee, and out of south Shore there are some streams, and the East Carson over the hill hwy 88.  Contact Trout Creek Fly’s in South Shore for up to date info on stream fishing.  The lake fishing will be good for Mackinaws, there are some charter boats available.  Kokanee will be heading up the streams.  Be sure to go to the stream chamber at Taylor Creek state park (near South Shore) to see the run.  Have an underwater viewing window. Bill – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am going to Lake Tahoe for a week in one week. Does anyone know anything about the fishing conditions this time of year? Is there any stream fishing in the vicinity in Late October?

Response:

Question:

get ahold of Lindwood Lodge which is located on Lake Neimeben which is northern Satc  you will have tired arms from catching Northerns all day long in a 45 mile long lake. and I will answer ? you may have. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -we just want to catch fish we just want to catch fish

Response:

for the past 10 yrs. my friends and i have gone to canada for pike fishing , each year the catch is less and less , we are looking for anything. fly-in, drive-in any ideas. we just want to catch fish

Response:

Often your best bet is to wait until you get there and buy what the resort recommends – or at least call the resort owner and ask him what he recommends. — – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -please help me answer some inquiries, i am going fishing in SE ontario canada and would like to know the best bait or lures to use.

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going pike fishing, wondering what is the best lures or bait to use in se ontario

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please help me answer some inquiries, i am going fishing in SE ontario canada and would like to know the best bait or lures to use.

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going pike fishing, wondering what is the best lures or bait to use in se ontario

You can’t go wrong with a weedless five od diamonds.  Red or Black!!

Response:

please help me answer some inquiries, i am going fishing in SE ontario canada and would like to know the best bait or lures to use.

Sorry for the spelling error.  That was the five OF diamonds for pike.   Weedless ones work the best.  Use the red on yellow or the black on yellow.  Good luck, but Pike will bite almost anything.

Response:

how late in the season can you fish for pike. is there any special tactics for cold weather pike fishing.Thanks Al Angling applied to business

Response:

how late in the season can you fish for pike. is there any special tactics for cold weather pike fishing.Thanks Al Angling applied to business

Pike prefer cold water and the fishing only gets better as the water cools down.  In deep water lakes the monsters stay deep when the water is warm.   Smaller pike are not as affected & will be caught all summer long in shallow water but the big ones only come in temps come down.  So until ice over you will see more pike in shallow.   As for tactics I prefer big bait for big fish.   7" or larger live suckers on either a circle hook or quick strike rig.  When you feel a strike you’ll need to give it time to eat it (less so for the quick strike rig).  Best to remain on top of it trolling to keep up with it as it moves.  Set your hook & hold on. For lures, spinner baits, suicks & big cranks can produce too. They continue to be catchable throught the ice but I seldom ice fish so I can’t advise there. DD

Response:

What is the best lure for pike fishing?

Response:

I like a chartruese Swim Wizz or Believer.   6" in the spring…..8" later.   Works for me. Rich

Response:

I don’t know if there is a "best lure" but I have had good luck with the Mepps #5 if you like to throw spinners. Also any wobbler, such as daredevel. What is the best lure for pike fishing?

– Fishing isn’t a matter of life or death, it’s more important than that!

Response:

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone Know of an economical method of making chum? Want to make my own ,but don’t want to spend $600 to $700 for a used Hobart type meat grinder. Anyone out there making their own? Any ideas are helpful.Thanks…. and tight lines!    Email  or post Sam, I use an old hand powered meat grinder that I picked up at an antiques auction for 25 bucks. Attach it to a 2×4 and then attach that to a fish tote. Works great… — Tight lines and sharp hooks, Capt. Mark Poirier <OOOO))’

I have made chum in the past using a hand grinder hooked to a motor using the fly wheel out of an old dryer, its big enough to make the grinder run slow. I have also used the same hand grinder hooked to a 12 volt engine started on the boat, its noisy but it works well, you can find the atachments near comm fishing docks that use shum. mine only cost about $50 by using used started and grinder. —   Not all chemicals are bad. Without chemicals such as hydrogen and oxygen, for example, there would be no way to make water,  a vital ingredient in beer.                             … Dave Barry   John & Donna Koterba http://www.olg.com/jkoterba

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone Know of an economical method of making chum? Want to make my own ,but don’t want to spend $600 to $700 for a used Hobart type meat grinder. Anyone out there making their own? Any ideas are helpful.Thanks…. and tight lines!    Email  or post Sam, I use an old hand powered meat grinder that I picked up at an antiques auction for 25 bucks. Attach it to a 2×4 and then attach that to a fish tote. Works great… — Tight lines and sharp hooks, Capt. Mark Poirier <OOOO))’ I have made chum in the past using a hand grinder hooked to a motor using the fly wheel out of an old dryer, its big enough to make the grinder run slow. I have also used the same hand grinder hooked to a 12 volt engine started on the boat, its noisy but it works well, you can find the atachments near comm fishing docks that use shum. mine only cost about $50 by using used started and grinder. —   Not all chemicals are bad. Without chemicals such as hydrogen and oxygen, for example, there would be no way to make water,  a vital ingredient in beer.                             … Dave Barry John & Donna Koterba http://www.olg.com/jkoterba

I once used a weed wacker to grind up some menhaden. We did have a sucessful trip but I would frown on the weed wacker idea from now on.

Response:

Anyone Know of an economical method of making chum? Want to make my own ,but don’t want to spend $600 to $700 for a used Hobart type meat grinder. Anyone out there making their own? Any ideas are helpful.Thanks…. and tight lines!    Email  or post

Response:

Anyone Know of an economical method of making chum? Want to make my own ,but don’t want to spend $600 to $700 for a used Hobart type meat grinder. Anyone out there making their own? Any ideas are helpful.Thanks…. and tight lines!    Email  or post

Sam, I use an old hand powered meat grinder that I picked up at an antiques auction for 25 bucks. Attach it to a 2×4 and then attach that to a fish tote. Works great… — Tight lines and sharp hooks, Capt. Mark Poirier – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -<OOOO))’

Response:

Anyone Know of an economical method of making chum? Want to make my own ,but don’t want to spend $600 to $700 for a used Hobart type meat grinder. Anyone out there making their own? Any ideas are helpful.Thanks…. and tight lines!    Email  or post

Here’s some ideas i’ve tried with success: 1. Cheapest fish favor cat food both dry or canned is ready made chum. Just dump into chum pot as is. 2. Use a blender with enough water to chop scraps, then pour into half gallon milk cartons and freeze.  To use, peal off carton and put in chum pot.  As it melts it releases. 3. Popular chum here in Hawaii is old white bread mixed with tomato sardines and water. Works for just about anything.  Mix sand into chum if you want it to sink faster. 4. Buy an inexpensive hand-crank meat grinder (plastic with stainless steel blades works best for saltwater applications).  Mount it on a plate with post (pipe) that fits a rodholder.  Attach a radiator hose to outlet of grinder (length of hose depends on the boat, diameter of hose depends on grinder).  Mount the grinder/plate in a rail rodholder and hang hose overboard.  As you grind fish scraps it will run down the hose overboard.  You can grind on demand.  Pour water into the grinder once in a while to clear grinder and hose. Chum pot easy to make.  Just get a plastic 5 gallon bucket with lid, drill ALOT of 1/4" wholes in the sides and bottom.  Tie a short length of rope to bucket handle.   Now just place some chum into bucket, put lid on and hang it over the side with rope tied to cleat of your boat. Chum leaches out of holes with the motion of the boat.                                                            Spy in Hawaii

Response:

I’ve tried several different chum methods: 1.  Learned this from a professional yellowtail snapper fisherman in the Keys – Buy a block of frozen menhaden, mix it with horse oats, water and fine white beach sand, into a slurry.  Dump it over the side a little at a time.  It makes a "cloud" in clear water that both attracts yellow tail and hides your hook (bait up a chunk of mullet or a menhaden – whatever you have, then toss it into the cloud). 2.  Canned catfood, the cheapest, stinkiest stuff you can find works well. Punch a bunch of holes in the can and hang it over the side of your boat. Or you can open a can, dump it into a bucket mixed with water and ladle it over the side. 3.  Same as above with cheap sardines. 4.  For fresh water, try hog pellets.  Here in Florida, we use ‘em to bait shiner nets.  They work fine. 5.  If you’re near the ocaen, go to a fishhouse and ask to buy their dead crabs.  smash ‘em up and ladle ‘em.  They’re terrific for redfish.

Response:

Anyone Know of an economical method of making chum? Want to make my own ,but don’t want to spend $600 to $700 for a used Hobart type meat grinder. Anyone out there making their own? Any ideas are helpful.Thanks…. and tight lines!    Email  or post

This may sound like BS but a guy told me to use an old lawn mower, you might piss off the neighbors but it might work He said he used it to for bluefish to make shark chum. You also might be able to use a leaf mulcher or wood chipper. Don’t laugh to hard at me I’m just passin it on

Response:

So far, I think this is a great line of discussion.  Does anybody mind if I use some of this as material in my articles?  Actually, some of it might be good for a comedy special on HBO.  "Lawn Mulchers for grass, grits, or chum" or something along those lines. Capt. Charlie Capt. Charlie Walker           Southern Charm Charters 813-546-7257                  http://www.flfish.com/fl

Aloha Charlie,   I almost forgot, the best chum maker of all was my younger sister, her first trip out in the ocean.  Her stomach was churning.  And Her timing was perfect.  We would be drifting and everytime she chummed with her breakfast, the fish would show and the action would get wild.  Just when the fish start drifting away, she would get up and chum some more (ralph!) and action all over again.  She ran out (of internal chum) eventually, and the fish left.  She was a real sport though.  I’ll always remember her reeling in fish while lying down.  Try as we might, we could not get her to eat anymore.  We tried not to think of the chum as we ate the fish that night.  Same thing happened with one of my Buddies on his first time out, too.  Now when I see him I say "you’re not just a friend… you’re a real chum".  We can laugh about it now.                                                 A hui hou, Spy in Hawaii

Response:

So far, I think this is a great line of discussion.  Does anybody mind if I use some of this as material in my articles?  Actually, some of it might be good for a comedy special on HBO.  "Lawn Mulchers for grass, grits, or chum" or something along those lines. Capt. Charlie Capt. Charlie Walker           Southern Charm Charters 813-546-7257                  http://www.flfish.com/fl

Response:

So far, I think this is a great line of discussion.  Does anybody mind if I use some of this as material in my articles?  Actually, some of it might be good for a comedy special on HBO.  "Lawn Mulchers for grass, grits, or chum" or something along those lines. Capt. Charlie Capt. Charlie Walker           Southern Charm Charters 813-546-7257                  http://www.flfish.com/fl

See Dan Akroyd in skit called "Bass-O-Matic" on Best of Sat. Nite Live video.  It slices, dices, and turns live bass into a wholesome and refreshing beverage.<g Mark

Response:

Anyone Know of an economical method of making chum?

Really the most economical system I ever heard of was a can of dog food. You buy a can. Use an Ice pick (everybody has one of these aboard) to punch holes in the can. Tie a line (string) around the can and through it in (tie the line to the boat stupid). I have used this for weakies and blues. Works well. Good luck. Michael W. Madden Technical Director, TekVantage The Chesapeake Bay Mariners’ Guide http://www.tekvantage.com/MarinersGuide/index.html The Far Horizons Sailing Search Engine http://www.tekvantage.com/FarHorizons/index.html Host to: The Havre de Grace Yacht Club http://www.tekvantage.com/hdgyc/index.html Host to: The Crazy Swede Restaurant and Bar http://www.tekvantage.com/crazyswede/index.html

Response:

Question:

Low impact fires in wilderness areas are essential to the experience where legal.  Especially if your whipping up some fresh trout burrittos.  heavy emphasis on LOW IMPACT.         Snagging Kokanee is a great way to get good, relatively wild, fresh food.  While snagging Kokanee in Gross Res. quite a few years ago I accidentally snagged a 15" rainbow.  The fish was in bad shape.  I mean it was ripped almost in half.  I was putting a bit of umph into my snagging back then.         Knowing the regs, I "released" the carcass back into the water immediately.  Wouldn’t that fish have been be better spent in the bushes where one of our furry fish eating critters might have benefitted? JE

Response:

       Snagging Kokanee is a great way to get good, relatively wild, fresh food.  While snagging Kokanee in Gross Res. quite a few years ago I accidentally snagged a 15" rainbow.  The fish was in bad shape.  I mean it was ripped almost in half.  I was putting a bit of umph into my snagging back then.        Knowing the regs, I "released" the carcass back into the water immediately.  Wouldn’t that fish have been be better spent in the bushes where one of our furry fish eating critters might have benefitted?

- if you had trolled for kokanee with the same vigour you do for flames the sorry incident wouldn’t have happened; and you wouldn’t have to ask such a stupid question. Ralph H remove "(take_this_out)" for email reply.

Response:

Ralph’s reaction: – if you had trolled for kokanee with the same vigour you do for flames the sorry incident wouldn’t have happened; and you wouldn’t have to ask such a stupid question. Ralph H remove "(take_this_out)" for email reply.         I am stupid.  Very very stupid.  But the question?  It’s just a question.         Now, The Kokanee in Colorado do not reproduce in the wild and die naturally after their third or fourth season.  Harvest them while they’re firm.  There is good reason why the limit on snagged kokes is 40.         Rec.outdoors.fishing.snag.  That’d be a hell fire newsgroup aye?         Sorry Ralph.  I’ll be quiet now. JE

Response:

Knowing the regs, I "released" the carcass back into the water immediately.  Wouldn’t that fish have been be better spent in the bushes where one of our furry fish eating critters might have benefitted?

I am sure that they could retrieve it from the water on their own if the needed. You did the right thing. Regards, J. Webb Atlanta Mac User Group

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*SNIP* Snagging Kokanee is a great way to get good, relatively wild, fresh food. While snagging Kokanee in Gross Res. quite a few years ago I accidentally snagged a 15" rainbow.  The fish was in bad shape.  I mean it was ripped almost in half.  I was putting a bit of umph into my snagging back then.  Knowing the regs, I "released" the carcass back into the water immediately.  Wouldn’t that fish have been be better spent in the bushes where one of our furry fish eating critters might have benefitted?

Hi Jon, Don’t think that trout was wasted.  Even though you didn’t get to eat it, nor did your/our furry friends, the algae and aquatic insects in the water did. It’s energy was recycled into the eco-system from which it came.  It just takes a place at the bottom of the aquatic food chain instead of at the top of it. If there are bears in your area, tossing fish in the bushes could also cause a problem with bears associating people with food.  That is never a good scenario and is a very real problem in CA. I hate to see incidental mortality like you describe, but when you’re snagging fish that’s going to happen.  I don’t like snagging and wouldn’t do it myself unless it was to keep from starving (big difference between subsistance and sport), but if it’s legal in your area, you have a right to do so.  The law requiring you to put back the incidentally caught trout is actually a good one.  If it allowed keeping incidentally snagged trout, pretty soon there would be a regular contingent out there specifically targeting the "incidental" trout.                                      Good Fishing,                                           Dan Dan Gracia Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools

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Question:

I would appreciate if someone would post chapter and verse the regulations regarding foul hooking (or snagging) of fish in Colorado. So far the only reference has been a brief ‘open season’ on the Gunnison to utilize Kokanee in the late fall. Is snagging generally allowed. Is it only allowed in only this or other specific instances? If only in limited circumstances what if anything do the regulations say about what an angler must do if he/she accidentally foul hooks a fish when it is not within the specific allowance of the regulation?

Ralph, I have read along this thread and waded through some of the off target posts. After reading you post and the follow up from  "Keith Bell" snagging rules are likely very different than what constitutes a legal catch and how a foul hook is defined. Here in Georgia this has been of concern to myself and several of my fellow anglers. On a trophy stream(the only one at the time) one of the regular anglers was suspected of snagging(which would be foul hooking) fish. Understand the the water here is small and in the summer it can be extremely shallow. This particular angler(whose name sadly became synonymous with foul hooking) used a fly rod with a VERY heavy leader, several full size split shot and a size six wolly worm. Amazingly he detailed how fish would strike repeatedly after actually being hooked and breaking off. It was more accurate to say that he stood over fish, dragging his terminal tackle along, under a fish and I guess near the head. Then he would give it a hook set. He regularly foul hooked fish as reported by those who fished with him. My partner came upon he and his son and kept out of site till they left. When we entered the hole we found a fish floating with a very noticable puncture wound in the belly; it was recently dead. Now, I must say that I have foul hooked fish. When that happens and I realize it I try to land the fish quickly and release it. The former stream mentioned allowed an angler to keep a single fish over 22"(17" Brook) per day(3/yr) but if it was foul hooked, it technically should have been released. I don’t know how to avoid foul hooking a fish in normal angling. Here in Georgia though, if you are fishing in put & take streams I suppose it does not matter. Streams with restrictions would be different but it still depends mostly on the ethics of the angler. Hope this is not too long. Good luck on your serach for information. Regrads, J. Webb Atlanta Mac User Group

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – [deleted] 7. SNAGGING:         Snagging is illegal unless permitted by the Division on specific waters during specific times. Those seasons are in the list of waters in this brochure. Snagged fish, except kokanee salmon, must be returned to the water immediately. Waters open to snagging include: Beaver Creek Res.; [list shortened] and Williams Fork Res. Snagging begins as early as Sept. 1 on some waters and runs to Jan. 31 on others. To be useful, though, Ken, you should have also posted the definition of Snagging. I didn’t think it was needed, but if it makes you feel better. From the following URL… http://www.canoecreek.com/CFF/p12.htm SNAGGING: Taking of fish by snatching with hooks, gang  hooks, artificial flies or lures or similar devices that hook  fish in part of its body other than mouth. Sounds like you’re pretty much busted on this one.  ;-( But, to be *truly* useful, now you will have to define "snatch". TimW

))))))))  I’m afraid that you’re stretching just a bit too far on that one.  (((((((-: Considering the original phrase in the regulation, "Snagged fish, except kokanee salmon, must be returned to the water immediately."  It leaves little room for anyone to believe that the intent of the regulation is anything other than if you happen to snag a fish you are supposed to release it. Regardless of whether you agree or disagree with the regulation, you technically were in violation. Sorry,      - Ken

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – [deleted] 7. SNAGGING:         Snagging is illegal unless permitted by the Division on specific waters during specific times. Those seasons are in the list of waters in this brochure. Snagged fish, except kokanee salmon, must be returned to the water immediately. Waters open to snagging include: Beaver Creek Res.; [list shortened] and Williams Fork Res. Snagging begins as early as Sept. 1 on some waters and runs to Jan. 31 on others. To be useful, though, Ken, you should have also posted the definition of Snagging. I didn’t think it was needed, but if it makes you feel better. From the following URL… http://www.canoecreek.com/CFF/p12.htm SNAGGING: Taking of fish by snatching with hooks, gang  hooks, artificial flies or lures or similar devices that hook  fish in part of its body other than mouth.   Sounds like you’re pretty much busted on this one.  ;-(

But, to be *truly* useful, now you will have to define "snatch". TimW

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By your definition’s oh great right and mighty ones, *All* active presentations of the lure would be illegal. And clearly, any self respecting flyfisherman would look the other way while I weeded out the ‘trash’ species. What do the flyfishermen in the valley call them as they hurl the mighty whitefish onto the bank…"Choabies" ? — TimW Halfordian Golfer

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By your definition’s oh great right and mighty ones, *All* active presentations of the lure would be illegal.

You’re twisting the words again. Here’s what was said, "Snagged fish, except kokanee salmon, must be returned to the water immediately."  This is straight from the Colorado regs.  What they are saying is that if you happen to snag a fish, you must return that fish to the water immediately. This doesn’t make any type of presentation illegal, it just says that regardless of how you happened to do it, you must let the fish go. Whether this is the correct thing to do or not is not at issue here, according to the regs you were doing the wrong thing. Just trying to keep things honest here,      - Ken — Due to USENET parsing SPAMmers, anti-spam measures are in place, reverse the letters in my login to reply (kinajk to kjan..). The opinions expressed do not necessarily indicate the opinions of my employer.

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[deleted] 7. SNAGGING:         Snagging is illegal unless permitted by the Division on specific waters during specific times. Those seasons are in the list of waters in this brochure. Snagged fish, except kokanee salmon, must be returned to the water immediately. Waters open to snagging include: Beaver Creek Res.; [list shortened] and Williams Fork Res. Snagging begins as early as Sept. 1 on some waters and runs to Jan. 31 on others.

To be useful, though, Ken, you should have also posted the definition of Snagging. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

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Question:

April is one of the peak months to fly fish for the large rainbows in the lower Sac from above Redding down to below Red Bluff. There is a giant hatch of caddis in the river at this time. If the flow is somewhere between 3,000 and 7,000cfs it should be ideal. If you need a good guide we can recommend one, as a drift boat is the best way to get around and fish the river. Fish over 5 pounds are not uncommon. Again, I hope that most of us understand the value of catch and release fishing in these wild fisheries. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY

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April is one of the peak months to fly fish for the large rainbows in the lower Sac from above Redding down to below Red Bluff. There is a giant hatch of caddis in the river at this time. If the flow is somewhere between 3,000 and 7,000cfs it should be ideal. If you need a good guide we can recommend one, as a drift boat is the best way to get around and fish the river. Fish over 5 pounds are not uncommon. Again, I hope that most of us understand the value of catch and release fishing in these wild fisheries. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY

          Hey Billy,    Been there done that.  Every one should experince the cadis hatch at least once in their life.                          Your Bud,                                     Harv

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April is one of the peak months to fly fish for the large rainbows in the lower Sac from above Redding down to below Red Bluff. There is a giant hatch of caddis in the river at this time. If the flow is somewhere between 3,000 and 7,000cfs it should be ideal. If you need a good guide we can recommend one, as a drift boat is the best way to get around and fish the river. Fish over 5 pounds are not uncommon. Again, I hope that most of us understand the value of catch and release fishing in these wild fisheries. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop

Thanks Bill, In the Redding area we can all agree to fish C&R only, because the fish are toxic with mercury from mine tailings runoff. Check your regulations for the warning.  These fish really give a good pull and use the current; a 15 inch fish can get into your backing. In Redding some of the locals might be eating them, or maybe there is some other explanation for the detritus one finds there. Mark Vinsel — http://www.lanminds.com/local/vinnie/gallery.html

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In the Redding area we can all agree to fish C&R only, because the fish are toxic with mercury from mine tailings runoff. Check your regulations for the warning.  These fish really give a good pull and use the current; a 15 inch fish can get into your backing. In Redding some of the locals might be eating them, or maybe there is some other explanation for the detritus one finds there.

I don’t know what you mean by detritus (I hope not our fellow human beings!), but I will second you on the toxicity of the water and food chain there.  No river I’ve ever encountered will bleach your waders like the lower sac.  I favor Double Tapers for the type of fishing I do on that water, and the first time I flip the line around I’m always amazed at the difference in color.  Scary!  And yes, sadly, people there do consume the fish.   Phil

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Question:

I am looking for anyone that remembers an old lure called the Blue River Spinner . Its origin is believed to be in Southern Indiana and the maker from Shelbyville. Any info would be greatly appreciated.

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Being from southern Indiana and having spent forty years in the tackle industry to boot, I am sorry to say that I only recall the name but not any of the specifics about the lure itself. I will certainly research it for you and if I come up with anything, I will pass it along. Best Regards, I am looking for anyone that remembers an old lure called the Blue River Spinner . Its origin is believed to be in Southern Indiana and the maker from Shelbyville. Any info would be greatly appreciated.

         Trent Roberson            Rx F Fish  For Your Good Health, Fly Fish URL=http://www.xnet.com/~rxffish

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