Question:

B-run slow and far in-between but large when you hook up.  A few 30 + inchers have been caught and released.  Ron Fudge released a 33 inch Buck but had to work two/three days for it.  Very slow fishing.  Run up the Snake is in cloudy water and the fish just aren’t interested in doing anything in this dry weather.  We need some rain to scent the water.  The mud is from the clear cutting up river as it continues to do excessive erosion damage in the cliffs and mountains. Today I pulled the big jet boat out and took it to town for a set of all new brakes, two new matching tires so all four are alike, and for all new wheel bearings.  We spent an hour in the power wash cleaning and waxing "The Professional" Jet Guide Boat.  I was surprised how dirty the boat was just sitting in storage and out of the sun all summer.  Of course we’ve been away a lot for the last three months. We will be taking pictures to post on the web site as soon as we get her into the water.  Some boaters are picking up six to eight fish a day using shrimp bait but they aren’t fly fishermen either.  These individuals are fishing at night and it seems the new battery lighted lures are catching more fishermen then fish anyhow.  Maybe next year the new lures will be playing Mozart underwater? Mr.G.

  george.vcf

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Response:

        (blather snipped out of concern for the honor of the newsgroup)         it is perversely fascinating that anyone, even you, george, would think that any other human being on the planet could possibly give a damn about the matters proffered in the preceding post. wayno  (ok, so me and willi loehman read it)

Response:

   (blather snipped out of concern for the honor of the newsgroup)    it is perversely fascinating that anyone, even you, george, would think that any other human being on the planet could possibly give a damn about the matters proffered in the preceding post. wayno  (ok, so me and willi loehman read it)

Heck, I read ‘em.  You never know what material might lurk.  Sorta like the kid and the barn full of horseshit, just certain there’s a pony under it all.  Actually, considering that Admiral Ginkstinks (hey, I think Gink Stinks – so sue me) is the source, a "full of horseshit" analogy is particularly apropos. For example, this one makes me wonder what kind of strange boat uses 4 matching (or even mis-matched) tires, new wheel bearings, or new (or old) brakes.  The only thing I can think of is that now that he’s without air support and de-Sabered – hmm, does that mean he’s "out of plane?" – he’s plotting to go capture a warm water port in Afghanistan to keep it out of the hands of them there godless commies….or them there ragheads….or somebody else that done him wrong….uh-oh…’tripper, better scratch parking your aircraft carrier in the Port of Kabul without battling a greasy little muppet and his lawyer, …and watch out for those flaming bamboo torpedoes….wait – damn the torpedoes, full stream ahead… TC, R

Response:

Question:

Maybe people from this area (Baltimore- Washington Corridor) could hook up for lunch, scope out some things together or just appreciate how plain stupid we probably look to one another.  Not that there’s really anything wrong with being ugly, I feel proud  that I am actually very good at practicing and exhibiting ugliness, it doesn’t take a lot of work ya know. Hell, if we were to hook up as a small clave of complete mullethead wearing, scudge head looking, biscuit head toting boneheads we just might be able to take over the place and buy some fine tackle.  I am sure the hucksters would gladly hook-up a collective group of biscuit head Roffians with good prices and great deals,  just to see us move away from their booth in a hurry. Having never visited the show before I have every intention of dragging this big ass unsightly looking numbnut over to the extravaganza in hope of meeting some other butt ugly Roffian brothers and see some way cool stuff and demos.  Who knows, even a non repugnant ugster like myself could grab some free FF lessons and/or instructions. Anybody interested at meeting one another at the show please post to the group or e-mail me, maybe someone who have been there before could indicate a good place to meet, at least for an introduction.  Keep in mind the uglier the better, attractive people need not apply. On the more serious side, if anybody is interest in car pooling from Columbia, MD, please give me a shout.  I’ll be glad to drive as long as my Jeep is out of the shop. Your One and Only Supreme Cheesehead. Tony Norton

Response:

Tony;    Got a bunch of us meeting at the front desk at noon on Saturday. Just look for the naked guys wearing pink or red carnations swilling Glen Livet from the bottle (anti-freeze doncha know).             Frank Reid – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Maybe people from this area (Baltimore- Washington Corridor) could hook up for lunch, scope out some things together or just appreciate how plain stupid we probably look to one another.  Not that there’s really anything wrong with being ugly, I feel proud  that I am actually very good at practicing and exhibiting ugliness, it doesn’t take a lot of work ya know. Hell, if we were to hook up as a small clave of complete mullethead wearing, scudge head looking, biscuit head toting boneheads we just might be able to take over the place and buy some fine tackle.  I am sure the hucksters would gladly hook-up a collective group of biscuit head Roffians with good prices and great deals,  just to see us move away from their booth in a hurry. Having never visited the show before I have every intention of dragging this big ass unsightly looking numbnut over to the extravaganza in hope of meeting some other butt ugly Roffian brothers and see some way cool stuff and demos.  Who knows, even a non repugnant ugster like myself could grab some free FF lessons and/or instructions. Anybody interested at meeting one another at the show please post to the group or e-mail me, maybe someone who have been there before could indicate a good place to meet, at least for an introduction.  Keep in mind the uglier the better, attractive people need not apply. On the more serious side, if anybody is interest in car pooling from Columbia, MD, please give me a shout.  I’ll be glad to drive as long as my Jeep is out of the shop. Your One and Only Supreme Cheesehead. Tony Norton

Response:

Tony;    Got a bunch of us meeting at the front desk at noon on Saturday. Just look for the naked guys wearing pink or red carnations swilling Glen Livet from the bottle (anti-freeze doncha know).             Frank Reid

HEY FRANK!  I just figured out HOW to hold that carnation!!!! — Wayne To Fish is Human….To Release Divine!

Response:

Tony;    Got a bunch of us meeting at the front desk at noon on Saturday. Just look for the naked guys wearing pink or red carnations swilling Glen Livet from the bottle (anti-freeze doncha know).             Frank Reid HEY FRANK!  I just figured out HOW to hold that carnation!!!! — Wayne To Fish is Human….To Release Divine!

ROFLMAO!  Somebody, anybody, have a video rolling when the carnation wielders arrive. If it’s drooping, does it mean it needs water? Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://members.home.net/pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

ROFLMAO!  Somebody, anybody, have a video rolling when the carnation wielders arrive. If it’s drooping, does it mean it needs water? Peter

GAAAWWWWD PETER!! You want pictures of the STRANGEST things! — Wayne To Fish is Human….To Release Divine!

Response:

So, Tony, after that last bit of visual cueing (god, I’ll need extensive therapy just to cleanse my brain, or a 4 pack of McAffrey’s), do you still want to meet with this bunch?           Frank Drink early, drink often. ROFLMAO!  Somebody, anybody, have a video rolling when the carnation wielders arrive. If it’s drooping, does it mean it needs water? Peter GAAAWWWWD PETER!! You want pictures of the STRANGEST things! — Wayne To Fish is Human….To Release Divine!

Response:

I’ll be there Saturday.  I’ll look for the ones wearing a "ROFF" sign around their neck about noon.  I’ll be the decrepit old coot wearing a non-fly fishing white baseball cap that has a small red, white and blue logo that says "owners day 2000" on the front.  If you don’t like what you see make believe that you never heard of ROFF Lou

Response:

Pink carnations!  We all need pink carnations.  The wiff promised to get some at work so I’ll pass them out (before I pass out).             Frank I’ll be there Saturday.  I’ll look for the ones wearing a "ROFF" sign around their neck about noon.  I’ll be the decrepit old coot wearing a non- fly fishing white baseball cap that has a small red, white and blue logo that says "owners day 2000" on the front.  If you don’t like what you see make believe that you never heard of ROFF Lou

Response:

"Frank Reid" wrote Pink carnations!  We all need pink carnations.

   And pick-up trucks!           Charlie, feeling a little out of luck.

Response:

Maybe people from this area (Baltimore- Washington Corridor) could hook up for lunch, scope out some things together or just appreciate how plain stupid we probably look to one another.

SWMBO & I will be there Saturday (I’m still amazed she’s going to do it.) If I can’t find pink carnations, I’ll be wearing a ROFF hat (yeah, and shirt & pants & shoes for you wise guys).   Probably won’t make a whole day of it; but noon Sat. at the entrance table works for me.   Counting spouses, that’s what, seven? Joe F.

Response:

Pink carnations!  We all need pink carnations.  The wiff promised to get some at work so I’ll pass them out (before I pass out).            Frank

I thought the title was A White Sport Coat and Pink Crustaceans. Parrot Head Big Dale

Response:

Well, in Maryland, we all got crabs, so that would be a bit outre.  We should do crab samiches for lunch.      Frank I thought the title was A White Sport Coat and Pink Crustaceans. Parrot Head Big Dale

Response:

Big Dale, Dianna and I were at one of his concerts last summer and had a blast.  Parrot Heads and fins everywhere!!! — Wayne wasting away in margaritaville To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I thought the title was A White Sport Coat and Pink Crustaceans. Parrot Head Big Dale

Response:

Question:

you bringin’ flourocarbon, Dave? Orvis. 3x, 4x, 5x, 6x, 7x.  Wouldn’t leave home without it.

hilarious. for a while i thought flourocarbon was the only way to go there, even for near surface fishing.  now i think it depends upon the conditions, but i’m still trying to figure out *which* conditions warrant using flourocarbon.  i know it’s superb for nymphing the faster water and you can use 4x and 5x no problem. that stuff is just so expensive, i call it an investment in tippet.  i’ll be packing 0x thru 10x nanocarbon and fishing dave’s new midge patterns, so i’m not too worried bruce h ps if you’ve sent me an sj related email – i haven’t been able to get to my email for a week or so.  i’ll reply soon — bare your soul let your spirit burn out along the road to no return – r.e. keen Before you buy.

Response:

Bruiser writes: i’ll be packing 0x thru 10x nanocarbon and fishing dave’s new midge patterns, so i’m not too worried bruce h

*My* new midge patterns!  I thought I was gonna use *your* new midge patterns. <g   Dave LaCourse

Response:

Ditto.

I will get mine out Monday A.M. Ain’t postal service priority one a great service. Big Dale

Response:

In today’s mail… jal

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If I do *not* receive 30 sets of flies from 30 folks, what do I do with the rest of the flies?  If only 20 folks actually participate, would I send out 20 flies each, leaving over 200 flies?  Can we use them for a raffle, or should I just divvy up the extra’s among the fly swap participants?  Sell them on Ebay for my house payment, or what? <g Also, I purchased 30 surprises for the swap members, maybe we could use those for a raffle or something if less than 30 folks show up, as well? Advice from past Swapmeister’s would be appreciated, but will not be remunerated. <g — Padishar Creel "I don’t want to achieve immortality through my work…I want to achieve it through not dying."  – Woody Allen

Response:

Walt, Got the reel from you yesterday. It’s replacing a Cortland Rimfly that I wore out. It seems to be MUCH better quality. The rod Steve made for me also came. To try and say thanks, I’m going to tie up a shitload of flies for him. I know you fish with him frequently.  Steve just posted a number of his favorite flies, so I have a good start. If you think of some other patterns and sizes that are good for the places he fishes, I’d appreciate it. Willi

Response:

Sorry this was supposed to be an email!! Willi – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Walt, Got the reel from you yesterday. It’s replacing a Cortland Rimfly that I wore out. It seems to be MUCH better quality. The rod Steve made for me also came. To try and say thanks, I’m going to tie up a shitload of flies for him. I know you fish with him frequently.  Steve just posted a number of his favorite flies, so I have a good start. If you think of some other patterns and sizes that are good for the places he fishes, I’d appreciate it. Willi

Response:

Walt, Got the reel from you yesterday. It’s replacing a Cortland Rimfly that I wore out. It seems to be MUCH better quality. The rod Steve made for me also came. To try and say thanks, I’m going to tie up a shitload of flies for him. I know you fish with him frequently.  Steve just posted a number of his favorite flies, so I have a good start. If you think of some other patterns and sizes that are good for the places he fishes, I’d appreciate it. Willi

Willi, I’m glad you like the reel…. I use mine quite a bit. Yesterday, on the banks of Steve’s new home water, the Watauga River, he mentioned that he had sent you a cane…. if you ask me, he has a heart of gold. The best fly for Steve’s holding place on the Watauga, a big ‘ole granite boulder he likes to perch on, is, well, a round brown fly, possibly size 16. I can best say that it would imitate a…. uhmmm, well a purina trout chow pellet <g Seriously, do you remember those real small emergers you sent me a while back? THOSE WORK GREAT!!!  I have, by my own admission, been reluctant to share those with anyone being the drsob that I am. However, considering that it is the Holiday Season, a time for sharing, I’ll confess that those durn little buggers are terrific! Have fun on the juan….. Walt

Response:

If I do *not* receive 30 sets of flies from 30 folks, what do I do with the rest of the flies?  If only 20 folks actually participate, would I send out 20 flies each, leaving over 200 flies?  Can we use them for a raffle, or should I just divvy up the extra’s among the fly swap participants?  Sell them on Ebay for my house payment, or what? <g Also, I purchased 30 surprises for the swap members, maybe we could use those for a raffle or something if less than 30 folks show up, as well? Advice from past Swapmeister’s would be appreciated, but will not be remunerated. <g — Padishar Creel "I don’t want to achieve immortality through my work…I want to achieve it through not dying."  – Woody Allen

Response:

Pad, You will receive my flies.. I tmay be right at the deadline, but you’ll get em. edwin

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If I do *not* receive 30 sets of flies from 30 folks, what do I do with the rest of the flies?  If only 20 folks actually participate, would I send out 20 flies each, leaving over 200 flies?  Can we use them for a raffle, or should I just divvy up the extra’s among the fly swap participants?  Sell them on Ebay for my house payment, or what? <g Also, I purchased 30 surprises for the swap members, maybe we could use those for a raffle or something if less than 30 folks show up, as well? Advice from past Swapmeister’s would be appreciated, but will not be remunerated. <g — Padishar Creel "I don’t want to achieve immortality through my work…I want to achieve it through not dying."  – Woody Allen

Response:

If I do *not* receive 30 sets of flies from 30 folks, what do I do with the rest of the flies?

Raffle ‘em off. Whomever correctly guesses which roffians weaseled out wins. /daytripper (Got mah suspicions at the ready, already ;^)

Response:

If I do *not* receive 30 sets of flies from 30 folks, what do I do with the rest of the flies?

     I say you keep them. I just got back from shipping mine, sorry I waited until the last minute.

Response:

If I do *not* receive 30 sets of flies from 30 folks, what do I do with the rest of the flies?      I say you keep them. I just got back from shipping mine, sorry I waited until the last minute.

I second that.  It’s a pain sorting and shipping them all out. If you feel guilty you could pack up half for a Clave raffle and keep the rest. Willi

Response:

I agree…this should be one of the benefits for being a swap miester Ed B – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If I do *not* receive 30 sets of flies from 30 folks, what do I do with the rest of the flies?      I say you keep them. I just got back from shipping mine, sorry I waited until the last minute. I second that.  It’s a pain sorting and shipping them all out. If you feel guilty you could pack up half for a Clave raffle and keep the rest. Willi

Response:

: If I do *not* receive 30 sets of flies from 30 folks, what do I do with the : rest of the flies?   Send ‘em to me! For that, I’d gladly put up with being proclaimed the "ROFF moocher of the year" Of course, LaPlac’s already gonna call me that once I meet him on the Juan…you bringin’ flourocarbon, Dave? (No, I didn’t bail out — I never signed up, but would gladly be the beneficiary of y’all’s hard work tying all those flies…) JonCook. — Are you a r.o.f.f. newbie? Then see http://www.cs.nmsu.edu/~jcook/ROFF/

Response:

PC, Ditto, Mine will leave Mon. AM HT – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Same here. Rather tight schedule at the moment, but Saturday evening is set aside for the swap flies. TL MC — "Where fishing is concerned, most anglers are basically manic excessives" http://www.mikeconnor.de Pad, You will receive my flies.. I tmay be right at the deadline, but you’ll get em. edwin If I do *not* receive 30 sets of flies from 30 folks, what do I do with the rest of the flies?  If only 20 folks actually participate, would I send out 20 flies each, leaving over 200 flies?  Can we use them for a raffle, or should I just divvy up the extra’s among the fly swap participants? Sell them on Ebay for my house payment, or what? <g Also, I purchased 30 surprises for the swap members, maybe we could use those for a raffle or something if less than 30 folks show up, as well? Advice from past Swapmeister’s would be appreciated, but will not be remunerated. <g — Padishar Creel "I don’t want to achieve immortality through my work…I want to achieve it through not dying."  – Woody Allen

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If I do *not* receive 30 sets of flies from 30 folks, what do I do with the rest of the flies?     I say you keep them. I just got back from shipping mine, sorry I waited until the last minute. keep ‘em – you did all the work. Peter

ditto for me also…. keep the extras Chris. walt — Ezflyfish.com: http://www.ezflyfish.com Blue Ridge Book Gallery: http://users.boone.net/wgw/brbg.html

Response:

Jon Cook writes: Send ‘em to me! For that, I’d gladly put up with being proclaimed the "ROFF moocher of the year" Of course, LaPlac’s already gonna call me that once I meet him on the Juan…you bringin’ flourocarbon, Dave?

Orvis. 3x, 4x, 5x, 6x, 7x.  Wouldn’t leave home without it.  Got some flies too, ones that will work and probably ain’t never been seen by those Juanian fishies.  20s, 22s, 24s.  <g  Got some surprises for Bruiser, too.  And, I’ll be packin industrial strength Zantac (150mG tablets) – you could eat in T-town with them.   Dave L.

Response:

Same here. Rather tight schedule at the moment, but Saturday evening is set aside for the swap flies. TL MC — "Where fishing is concerned, most anglers are basically manic excessives" http://www.mikeconnor.de – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Pad, You will receive my flies.. I tmay be right at the deadline, but you’ll get em. edwin If I do *not* receive 30 sets of flies from 30 folks, what do I do with the rest of the flies?  If only 20 folks actually participate, would I send out 20 flies each, leaving over 200 flies?  Can we use them for a raffle, or should I just divvy up the extra’s among the fly swap participants? Sell them on Ebay for my house payment, or what? <g Also, I purchased 30 surprises for the swap members, maybe we could use those for a raffle or something if less than 30 folks show up, as well? Advice from past Swapmeister’s would be appreciated, but will not be remunerated. <g — Padishar Creel "I don’t want to achieve immortality through my work…I want to achieve it through not dying."  – Woody Allen

Response:

Any bets on how many times he gets hooks himself sorting all those flies?

None. Willi

Response:

Thirded.  Keep some and donate some either to a ‘clave or give them to your local TU or FFF chapter for fundraising.  If that doesn’t work, just send them to me<g.  I’ll share with the other Massachusetts ROFFians, honest I will<g. –Stan (glad I don’t have to sort 900 flies next week)

Any bets on how many times he gets hooks himself sorting all those flies? Paul

Response:

Thirded.  Keep some and donate some either to a ‘clave or give them to your local TU or FFF chapter for fundraising.  If that doesn’t work, just send them to me<g.  I’ll share with the other Massachusetts ROFFians, honest I will<g. –Stan (glad I don’t have to sort 900 flies next week) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I agree…this should be one of the benefits for being a swap miester Ed B If I do *not* receive 30 sets of flies from 30 folks, what do I do with the rest of the flies?      I say you keep them. I just got back from shipping mine, sorry I waited until the last minute. I second that.  It’s a pain sorting and shipping them all out. If you feel guilty you could pack up half for a Clave raffle and keep the rest. Willi

Response:

Pad, You will receive my flies.. I tmay be right at the deadline, but you’ll get em. edwin

Ditto. Wolfgang

Response:

Chris, It has been crazy here.  I will be sending out my flies Monday. bc. — Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. -Benjamin Franklin

Response:

If I do *not* receive 30 sets of flies from 30 folks, what do I do with the rest of the flies?     I say you keep them. I just got back from shipping mine, sorry I waited until the last minute.

keep ‘em – you did all the work.   Peter

Response:

Question:

Just read an article in my local paper about the NY DEC stocker trucks dumping their annual loads of browns and bows into the local rivers. 8" one year olds and up to 16" two year olds. i welcome a discussion on this program. i’ve heard a lot of pros and cons on this issue. one point is that is provides a lot of fun (if you like to catch dumb stockers), and that fishing pressure neccesitates the stocking program. the counterpoint (which i agree with), is that the inferior stocker fish dilute the gene pool and compete with wild fish for food. the solution seems to be more no kill zones on rivers so the population is not deleted in a single season. i’ve seen this work on rivers in the west where i used to live, and the result was a healthy population of wild fish that were a little harder to catch, but worth the result. in the state of washington where i used to live, the state’s policy is put and take, and they spend millions of dollars and employ thousands of state workers to dump gujillions of fish into the state’s waters. in more enlightened states (MT for example), its been shown that reasonable management of wild fish can result in a plentiful and healthy population. personally i’m not crazy about catching trout with raw noses from living in such tight quarters in the breeding tanks. the wild fish are much healthier and prettier. comments and complaints please. stephen in ny

Response:

As a fellow New Yorker, I pretty much concur with Stephen.  With the vast financial resources of NY State, I think the fishery can do a much better job. While I’m strongly in favor of better stream/river management–a la "no kill/artificial only" to help build healthier and more ‘wild’ trout bases, I also believe that keeping some ‘Put and Take’ spots is critical.  NY should continue to heavily stock parts of streams/rivers near significant population bases where young kids can still have an opportunity to catch fish with worms and bring ‘em home for dinner.   This is what gets kids interested in the outdoors.  Sooner or later they appreciate the ’sport’ of fly fishing, just like the rest of us did, and don’t have a need to keep everything.   For example, I live in the Albany area.  There’s a ton of chatter about state of the Battenkill.  I think the DEC should stock the stream with healthy browns, and then restrict the ENTIRE river in NY to catch and release/artificial only.  Over the next few years, assuming people don’t keep anything, this river ought to bounce back.  Most of the Battenkill winds through very rural areas, so there isn’t a huge population base thats really affected by the change in policy. At the same time, the DED should continue stocking the Kaydeross and Geyser Creeks, understanding that ninety percent of those fish are going to be fried for dinner. The Battenkill becomes the classic trout tream it once was, and the Kaydeross is the stream we all grew up with… My two cents, but NY, has large opportunities for improvement. Pete

Response:

Question:

I hear ya Wayno Buddy…loud and clear. Ever drop a lit match on your whacker ? — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…" B.M.P.I.A.

        sure.  why the hell you think i stopped smoking? wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

   sure.  why the hell you think i stopped smoking?

Couldn’t work the child proof lighters? — Charlie…

Response:

Gentle FFers, Is there a FAQ, that I could look at before I ask any more FAQ? John

Response:

John Not that I know of. Actually fly fishing questions are very welcome and greeted generally with pretty full answers as they break the monotony of biting one another over and over. Dave – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Gentle FFers, Is there a FAQ, that I could look at before I ask any more FAQ? John

Response:

Gentle FFers, Is there a FAQ, that I could look at before I ask any more FAQ? John

Yes there is.  Check out these sites: http://www.cs.nmsu.edu/~jcook/ROFF/ http://www.roff.org/ — Levi Always do sober what you said you’d do drunk. That will teach you to keep your mouth shut. –Ernest Hemingway

Response:

John Not that I know of.  [deleted]

It is a *requirement* of this newsgroup that you read the FAQ prior to posting. — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…" B.M.P.I.A.

Response:

John Not that I know of.  [deleted] It is a *requirement* of this newsgroup that you read the FAQ prior to posting.

Bullshit.      - Ken — "Everyone must believe in something. I believe I’ll go canoeing."                   — H.D. Thoreau

Response:

[deleted] Bullshit. – Ken

As much as I see poetry in this itself…. From the FAQ: "This FAQ list has been compiled by members to address questions and issues that freequently appear. Review it. " It does not say, "please review it" or "you should review it". http://www.rdc.com.au/Netiquette.html "When you join a list, monitor the messages for a few days to get a feel for what common questions are asked, and what topics are deemed off-limits. This is commonly referred to as lurking. When you feel comfortable with the group, then start posting. See if there is a FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) for a group that you are interested in joining. Veteran members get annoyed when they see the same questions every few weeks, or at the start of each semester." Again it doesn’t ask you to "please see if there is a FAQ.." it says "See if there is a FAQ". Pretty common Usenet stuff Ken.  If there is a FAQ then it is required reading… (define ‘require’). — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…" B.M.P.I.A.

Response:

 I could have sent in my version of a FAQ requiring the reading of ROFF in the nude.  While I’m sure that’s how most of us do indeed read ROFF, just because it is written does not make it a requirement. sweet baby jesus, janik, show some concern for your fellow man!  having attended more than one clave, the images suggested by your reckless ramblings force one’s imagination control to levels of sheer panic.  even the first amendment has its limits!

I hear ya Wayno Buddy…loud and clear. Ever drop a lit match on your whacker ? — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…" B.M.P.I.A.

Response:

  I could have sent in my version of a FAQ requiring the reading of ROFF in the nude.  While I’m sure that’s how most of us do indeed read ROFF, just because it is written does not make it a requirement.

        sweet baby jesus, janik, show some concern for your fellow man!  having attended more than one clave, the images suggested by your reckless ramblings force one’s imagination control to levels of sheer panic.  even the first amendment has its limits! wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

[deleted] Bullshit. – Ken As much as I see poetry in this itself…. From the FAQ: "This FAQ list has been compiled by members to address questions and issues that freequently appear. Review it. " It does not say, "please review it" or "you should review it".

The FAQ at Jon’s site is merely a collection of thoughts from various members, it is in no way an "official" charter.  I could have sent in my version of a FAQ requiring the reading of ROFF in the nude.  While I’m sure that’s how most of us do indeed read ROFF, just because it is written does not make it a requirement. http://www.rdc.com.au/Netiquette.html "When you join a list, monitor the messages for a few days to get a feel for what common questions are asked, and what topics are deemed off-limits. This is commonly referred to as lurking. When you feel comfortable with the group, then start posting. See if there is a FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) for a group that you are interested in joining. Veteran members get annoyed when they see the same questions every few weeks, or at the start of each semester." Again it doesn’t ask you to "please see if there is a FAQ.." it says "See if there is a FAQ". Pretty common Usenet stuff Ken.  If there is a FAQ then it is required reading…

The site you cite is titled "Net User Guidelines and Netiquette" and is from one particular University.  You even selectively took sentences from various sections.  In the Usenet section, it does not even mention FAQs. It is CERTAINLY a good idea to read the FAQ, it’s probably even a nice thing to do, but it is in no way required. Later,      - Ken — "Everyone must believe in something. I believe I’ll go canoeing."                   — H.D. Thoreau

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Question:

I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies. I have tried a light coating of Scotchguard, which does not seem to do too much. I am wondering if soaking flies in Scotchguard would work better, or if there are other products that could to the trick. Please note the following: -my attractor patterns tend to float forever, especially when they are ignored by     the fish, I am more concerned with less heavily  dressed flies, especially     those that ride low on the water, or hackless patterns such as poly spinners     etc. etc. – IMHO, false casting is a good way of further spooking already spooky fish,     and not the best fly floatant, as I have seen mentioned from time to time.     Also, what if you do not have space for a backcast and you are forced to     rollcast your dries ? – a better floatant could be a solution, however what I currently use seems     to do the trick. Since it is a paste, it is hard to apply to details of small flies,     and this is the reason why I would like something that I apply once, that will     prevent the bodies of the flies from soaking up too much water Thanks -Vittorio

Response:

I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies. I have tried a light coating of Scotchguard, which does not seem to do too much. I am wondering if soaking flies in Scotchguard would work better, or if there are other products that could to the trick.

I hear Orvis has a GREAT floatant, you should try that. [Ducking],      - Ken — "Time is but the stream I go a-fishin in. I drink at it, but while I drink I see the sandy bottom and detect how shallow it is. It’s thin current slides away, but eternity remains."   – H.D. Thoreau

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Other than Scotch Guard, the way you dress you pattern helps, meaning your hackle density, etc.  Variants of patterns such as a parachute or irresistable instead of a standard adams; CDC & Elk Hair vs a regular Elk hair caddis, etc..  Dress your flies to suit the water you will be fishing. A good dessicant can help, which is what I use when I can’t false cast. There is a brand of dessicant in a green translucent bottle called "Dry Shake" that dries off a fly quickly.  If you use that, and then hit it with your flotant of choice, its as good as starting with a fresh fly. I am going to mention it anyhow Vittorio, GG’s flotant really is good stuff. I used to use paste before switching.  It is worth the small investment of giving it a try.   Liquid floatants are better at getting into the details, which is the main reason I tried liquids, the liquids I tried didn’t work well enough until I used GG’s brand of flotant, no kidding. Good luck, let us know how your Scotch Guard soaking works.  I have found just spraying SG to be relatively useless. — Matt Blickensderfer * Piscaro itaque dicet mendacium *

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies. I have tried a light coating of Scotchguard, which does not seem to do too much. I am wondering if soaking flies in Scotchguard would work better, or if there are other products that could to the trick. Please note the following: -my attractor patterns tend to float forever, especially when they are ignored by    the fish, I am more concerned with less heavily  dressed flies, especially    those that ride low on the water, or hackless patterns such as poly spinners    etc. etc. – IMHO, false casting is a good way of further spooking already spooky fish,    and not the best fly floatant, as I have seen mentioned from time to time.    Also, what if you do not have space for a backcast and you are forced to    rollcast your dries ? – a better floatant could be a solution, however what I currently use seems    to do the trick. Since it is a paste, it is hard to apply to details of small flies,    and this is the reason why I would like something that I apply once, that will    prevent the bodies of the flies from soaking up too much water Thanks -Vittorio

Response:

Michael, I have tried the soaking in ScotchGuard trick. I found very little improvement on floatability. I soaked several flies in a container of Scotchguard for about a half hour then let them dry on a paper towel. I then took them and some flies I had not treated with Scotchguard fishing.  The flies soaked in Scotchguard floated only slightly longer than non-treated flies. To me it did not seem to be worth the extra effort and mess of soaking the flies in Scotchguard for what little extra floatability I got.The fliesI fished with floatant(Gink) floated just fine. I was experimenting with a parachute Adams. bruce – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -0] : : I have seen people claim that soaking in ScotchGuard works, although I : haven’t tried it. They said to spray some in a 35mm film cannister and : shake the flies in there, as I recall. : — : Charlie… I have tried that and come to the conclusion that Scotchgaurd  has no noticable effecton the flotation or soakability of my dry flies. I currently use old GG’s product at streamside and find that it works as advertised. Mike — Michael McGuire                     Hewlett Packard Laboratories (remove x’s from email if not      Palo Alto, CA 94303-0971  a spammer) Phone: (650)-857-5491

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vittorio asked for advise on fly floatants. Anyone who tries Scotchguard might be tempted to try Rain-X. Please don’t that crap stunk up the garage for about a week. Big Dale

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Other than Scotch Guard, the way you dress you pattern helps, meaning your hackle density, etc.  Variants of patterns such as a parachute or irresistable instead of a standard adams; CDC & Elk Hair vs a regular Elk hair caddis, etc..  Dress your flies to suit the water you will be fishing. A good dessicant can help, which is what I use when I can’t false cast. There is a brand of dessicant in a green translucent bottle called "Dry Shake" that dries off a fly quickly.  If you use that, and then hit it with your flotant of choice, its as good as starting with a fresh fly. I am going to mention it anyhow Vittorio, GG’s flotant really is good stuff. I used to use paste before switching.  It is worth the small investment of giving it a try.   Liquid floatants are better at getting into the details, which is the main reason I tried liquids, the liquids I tried didn’t work well enough until I used GG’s brand of flotant, no kidding. Good luck, let us know how your Scotch Guard soaking works.  I have found just spraying SG to be relatively useless. — Matt Blickensderfer * Piscaro itaque dicet mendacium * I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies. I have tried a light coating of Scotchguard, which does not seem to do too much. I am wondering if soaking flies in Scotchguard would work better, or if there are other products that could to the trick. Please note the following: -my attractor patterns tend to float forever, especially when they are ignored by    the fish, I am more concerned with less heavily  dressed flies, especially    those that ride low on the water, or hackless patterns such as poly spinners    etc. etc. – IMHO, false casting is a good way of further spooking already spooky fish,    and not the best fly floatant, as I have seen mentioned from time to time.    Also, what if you do not have space for a backcast and you are forced to    rollcast your dries ? – a better floatant could be a solution, however what I currently use seems    to do the trick. Since it is a paste, it is hard to apply to details of small flies,    and this is the reason why I would like something that I apply once, that will    prevent the bodies of the flies from soaking up too much water Thanks -Vittorio

3M marketed a floatant years ago (20 yrs, maybe) and from what I heard it was scotchguard – I think the trick is to spray flies 24 hrs b4 there use and then apply a floatant, Daves bug float or whatever. The post b4 mine from Mr Matt Blickensderfer about dressing flies is probably most important.  http://www.newsfeeds.com/       The Largest Usenet Servers in the World!

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tried gink? — Nicholas J. Slodki http://trampled.net/Nikolai0/

:I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies. :I have tried a light coating of Scotchguard, which does not seem to do :too much. :I am wondering if soaking flies in Scotchguard would work better, or if :there are other products that could to the trick. : lease note the following: : :-my attractor patterns tend to float forever, especially when they are :ignored by :    the fish, I am more concerned with less heavily  dressed flies, :especially :    those that ride low on the water, or hackless patterns such as poly :spinners :    etc. etc. :- IMHO, false casting is a good way of further spooking already spooky :fish, :    and not the best fly floatant, as I have seen mentioned from time to :time. :    Also, what if you do not have space for a backcast and you are :forced to :    rollcast your dries ? :- a better floatant could be a solution, however what I currently use :seems :    to do the trick. Since it is a paste, it is hard to apply to details f small flies, :    and this is the reason why I would like something that I apply once, :that will :    prevent the bodies of the flies from soaking up too much water : :Thanks : :-Vittorio : : :

Response:

I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies.

        in my twentysomething years of fishing for trout, i have found nothing that is as long lasting as gink. wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Thanks -Vittorio

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(Frogspritz) writes: Someone gave me the bottle to try.  Haven’t tried it yet, however, so who knows? Unfortunately, I don’t know where it could be for sale.

The stuff works, it really works if you follow the instructions. And it is becoming available in many fly shops. Wayne Knight Geneva IL                            

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0]

: I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies. : I have tried a light coating of Scotchguard, which does not seem to do : too much. : I am wondering if soaking flies in Scotchguard would work better, or if : there are other products that could to the trick. : : I have seen people claim that soaking in ScotchGuard works, although I : haven’t tried it. They said to spray some in a 35mm film cannister and : shake the flies in there, as I recall. : — : Charlie… I have tried that and come to the conclusion that Scotchgaurd  has no noticable effecton the flotation or soakability of my dry flies. I currently use old GG’s product at streamside and find that it works as advertised. Mike — Michael McGuire                     Hewlett Packard Laboratories  (remove x’s from email if not      Palo Alto, CA 94303-0971   a spammer) Phone: (650)-857-5491              

Response:

I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies.         in my twentysomething years of fishing for trout, i have found nothing that is as long lasting as gink.

Speaking of Gink, you’re suposed to put it on a dry fly (I mean on a fly that’s not wet). No doudt that’s best, but I sometimes slather it on a soaked fly and it still seems to work pretty well. I’ll dry the fly out as well as I can with a few false casts, but the fly is still pretty damp. — something bogus to avoid spam)

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<<I hear Orvis has a GREAT floatant, you should try that. And, Orvis sells a neat tub of dessicant (drying crystals).  Simply put you fly in the tub, close the lid, and shake a couple of times. Works wonderfully.  Then you wouldn’t need any of that sissy floatant stuff. Dave pushing Ken aside and also ducking.

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I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies.

I have before me a little bottle of stuff called "Water Shed", which is called "permanent waterproofing liquid".  Instructions call for a drop to be added to the fly at least one day before the fly touches the water for the first time. "It will not effect color, softness and is odorless after 24 hour cure period" says the label. Someone gave me the bottle to try.  Haven’t tried it yet, however, so who knows? Unfortunately, I don’t know where it could be for sale. Mark Faulkner

Response:

I am looking for advice on how to improve the floatability of flies. I have tried a light coating of Scotchguard, which does not seem to do too much. I am wondering if soaking flies in Scotchguard would work better, or if there are other products that could to the trick.

"Watershed" permanent waterproofing liquid is recommended by and available from Feather-Craft Fly Fishing of St.Louis. http://www.flyfishamerica.com/Ads/National/FeatherCraft98JF.html I have no connection with Feather_Craft other than satisfied customer. — Ken Fortenberry

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Question:

I would appreciate info as to whether there is bonefishing (and/or flyfishing for other species) on Jamaica. Thanks in advance. Brad Hall

Response:

"they" say there is no fly fishing in jamaica. The truth is is that there are small flats all over the place with lots of good potential. Montego bay itself has lots of tarpon. E.G. The road from Montego bay to Ocho Rios runs along the north shore and you can stop just about anywhere and see narrow flats bordered from the ocean by low reef that are easy and accesible. Don’t be adfraid to stop at the roadside jerk stands or bars. They look like shacks, but the people are great , the food is good and the fishing is right there. Take your stuff and look around. I. Clair

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Question:

I am planning on fishing Milton and Martis Lakes (Truckee area, CA) this weekend (3 -4 May).  I was wondering if anyone fished them opening weekend and could supply me with a report? Fish on,         John Kinyon

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I am curious as to how it went at these lakes. In exchange, I offer this report from Indian Creek Reservoir, near Markleeville south of lake Tahoe. Elevation ~5,000 ft.   Weekends of 4/26 & 5/3. Fishing is slow. Water is still very clear.  Very few callibaetis or damsels showing yet, and no visible surface action morning or evening. Dedicated fishers willing to fish through the wind are getting 5-10 hookups per day, on full sink lines fished near the bottom. Most fish in the 12-14 inch range.  Try olive leeches, rubberlip hares ears, and green scuds. Winds generally blowing from the south towards the dam. Most fish were caught in the northern half of lake with few fish taken in the shallows at the southern end. More fish were being caught by trollers with flashers than tubers with flies. It does not seem that there are as many fish here as in years past, but a damsel or callibaetis hatch may bring them to the surface and prove that wrong. -Mark Vinsel I am planning on fishing Milton and Martis Lakes (Truckee area, CA) this weekend (3 -4 May).  I was wondering if anyone fished them opening weekend and could supply me with a report? Fish on,         John Kinyon

– http://www.lanminds.com/local/vinnie/gallery.html

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I am curious as to how it went at these lakes.

I heard Martis was not bad, but you could not get into Milton. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY

Response:

I am curious as to how it went at these lakes. I heard Martis was not bad, but you could not get into Milton. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY

Bill & Mark—-Martis has been fishing well in the new "flats" on the south side, at the inlet.  Check-out my website and click on "update" for more detailed info on Martis:                  http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/CyberFly Frank R. Pisciotta

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Question:

My step-dad and I are going to Weaverville on Saturday for some steelhead fishing.  Any advice from recent visitors?  Lures, places, approaches? Thanks in advance.  Dave in Anderson, CA

Response:

This is probably late advice, but I’d stay home.   The river is muddy and fishing is slow. Instead of the Trinity, I’d go over to Lewiston Lake and flyfish that area.  Or…take a drive over to the Smith River as it’s still clear enough to fish and, I understand, that the salmon and steelhead are being cooperative.  Four good updated info on the Trinity, I’d call the Eureka Fly Shop at 444-2000 or the Redding Fly Shop (I don’t have their number). Barry Brown – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My step-dad and I are going to Weaverville on Saturday for some steelhead fishing.  Any advice from recent visitors?  Lures, places, approaches? Thanks in advance.  Dave in Anderson, CA

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Question:

   I was fly fishing on the North Fork of the Yuba above Downeyville California one fall when a couple of gold miners dredging for gold called me over and showed me a Brown trout that was 36" long.  It was beautiful, and I belive it was female because the bottom of the tail fin was worn away from years of spawning.  Perhaps she had just spawned, because she was lean and did not look like she was carrying eggs.    They wanted to know if it would be ok to eat it, they said it was acting very sluggish and they had caught it with their hands.  I told them I didn’t know why the trout had acted as it did.    I have often wondered why they were able to catch that trout so easily, was she dying?  Was she weak from spawning?   Does anyone have any ideas? Ernie Harrison  

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   I was fly fishing on the North Fork of the Yuba above Downeyville California one fall when a couple of gold miners dredging for gold called me over and showed me a Brown trout that was 36" long.  It was beautiful, and I belive it was female because the bottom of the tail fin was worn away from years of spawning.  Perhaps she had just spawned, because she was lean and did not look like she was carrying eggs.   They wanted to know if it would be ok to eat it, they said it was acting very sluggish and they had caught it with their hands.  I told them I didn’t know why the trout had acted as it did.   I have often wondered why they were able to catch that trout so easily, was she dying?  Was she weak from spawning?   Does anyone have any ideas? Ernie Harrison  

It sounds like you’re right on the money. I would suspect the fish had just finished spawning. Typically a spawned out fish, females in particular, will be pretty sluggish after this event. There immune systems aren’t working very well, and most of there energy has gone into building the redd and depositing the eggs. Fish in this condition are not worth eating and it seems a little heartless to harrass them.I would guess that this was a pretty old fish, possibly 8 to 10 years old. At fish hatcheries, I’ve known of fish that lived over 10 years. This would be pretty rare in the wild, but not impossible. Hope this helps. Tim

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