Question:

The principal of my elementary school was named Lyman Edward Angel. Had a daughter that was a little older than me that was friends with my sis, but I can’t remember her name. Small world. That’s my wife’s aunt. Drew

Hit me just now. Her name is Dawn. That the one? — Charles Davis    K4SWB <I’m The NRA

Response:

Seems like there are a lot of NC boys here. I’m in Lenoir which is pronounced:  "len-war"–like that fellas name that painted out of focus pictures, Renoir– at least  to us sofisticated folk. Actually grew-up and live in the Raleigh–name after the cigerette brand– area most my life, but don’t ever expect to move back.

Not as long as I live here, anyway.

Response:

charles, i reside in the sunny community of foscoe… –waldo Seems like there are a lot of NC boys here. If you feel like it, tell me where in NC you are. I’m in Reidsville. Just north of Greensboro. I’m gonna make me a list of who is here, and where each of you are, and thought I’d start out close to home. Thanks. — Charles Davis    K4SWB <I’m The NRA

– Tight Lines, –Walt Fly Fishing NC & more… http://www.ezflyfish.com http://www.wilsoncreekoutfitters.com

Response:

charles, i reside in the sunny community of foscoe… –waldo

That’s near Morganton, right? — Charles Davis    K4SWB <I’m The NRA

Response:

charles, i reside in the sunny community of foscoe… –waldo That’s near Morganton, right? —

actually, near boone. the store is in morganton. –walt

Response:

actually, near boone. the store is in morganton. –walt

Gotcha. — Charles Davis    K4SWB <I’m The NRA

Response:

Hit me just now. Her name is Dawn. That the one?

That’s the one. Drew

Response:

……I’m gonna make me a list of who is here, and where each of you are…..

Uh oh. Wolfgang somewhere in stanley.

Response:

greenville, with a plot of ground on england branch in graham county… jeff Noted. —

uh oh. Charles Davis    K4SWB <I’m The NRA

UH OH! Wolfgang

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – greenville, with a plot of ground on england branch in graham county… jeff Noted. — uh oh. Charles Davis   K4SWB <I’m The NRA UH OH! Wolfgang

Response:

Seems like there are a lot of NC boys here. If you feel like it, tell me where in NC you are.

I’m in Atlanta, but it’s the source of most of the folks fishing the Nantahala. <g — Charlie…

Response:

Seems like there are a lot of NC boys here.

I’m in Lenoir which is pronounced:  "len-war"–like that fellas name that painted out of focus pictures, Renoir– at least  to us sofisticated folk. Actually grew-up and live in the Raleigh–name after the cigerette brand– area most my life, but don’t ever expect to move back. Mark  –aka Opie, Op, asshole, shit-maggot–

Response:

The principal of my elementary school was named Lyman Edward Angel. Had a daughter that was a little older than me that was friends with my sis, but I can’t remember her name.

Small world. That’s my wife’s aunt. Drew

Response:

. I’m in Lenoir which is pronounced:  "len-war"–like that fellas name that painted out of focus pictures, Renoir– at least  to us sofisticated folk.

I’ve never heard it pronounced that way, but then I know few sofisticates. Actually grew-up and live in the Raleigh–name after the cigerette brand– area most my life, but don’t ever expect to move back.

I went there once, and that was enough. Mark  –aka Opie, Op, asshole, shit-maggot–

Sounds like we might be kin. — Charles Davis    K4SWB <I’m The NRA

Response:

greenville, with a plot of ground on england branch in graham county… jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Seems like there are a lot of NC boys here. If you feel like it, tell me where in NC you are. I’m in Reidsville. Just north of Greensboro. I’m gonna make me a list of who is here, and where each of you are, and thought I’d start out close to home. Thanks.

Response:

Seems like there are a lot of NC boys here. If you feel like it, tell me where in NC you are. I’m in Reidsville. Just north of Greensboro.

        sweet baby jesus–rockingham county.  where do you keep your trailer? I’m gonna make me a list of who is here, and where each of you are, and thought I’d start out close to home. Thanks.

        now charles, this here ain’t one of them 1984 big brother deals, is it?         just kiddin, of course.  some of my best friends live in rockingham county. wayno 1519 whilden place greensboro  27408

Response:

says… I’m in Charlotte. Grew up in Asheville with time spent in Watauga County. You familiar with any Angels or Trents up that way? Matter of fact I’ll be up there on the 9th for a wedding. Drew Patterson

The principal of my elementary school was named Lyman Edward Angel. Had a daughter that was a little older than me that was friends with my sis, but I can’t remember her name. Betty Sue Trent ran the record store, and I went to school with some Trents, but that was loooooong ago, and in another galaxy, it seems. Got some neighbors named Patterson. — Charles Davis    K4SWB <I’m The NRA

Response:

greenville, with a plot of ground on england branch in graham county… jeff

Noted. — Charles Davis    K4SWB <I’m The NRA

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says…    sweet baby jesus–rockingham county.  where do you keep your trailer?

I should be so lucky. Still living in the truck, ‘cept when Shirley needs it to get to work at the beauty saloon.    now charles, this here ain’t one of them 1984 big brother deals, is it?

Nah. Just curious. What started me thinking was that it seems that whenever you all have a clave, they make the NC boys get off by themselves.    just kiddin, of course.  some of my best friends live in rockingham county.

I stayed in G’boro for a while, till she tossed me out. — Charles Davis    K4SWB <I’m The NRA

Response:

On the assumption that displaced Tarheels count, I’m just outside St Louis. Born in Murphy (Cherokee county) and grew up in Henderson county. I figger Missouri appreciates the cultural benefit provided by North Carolinians so much that they just won’t let me go. Still go to Murphy several times a year and have to go to Charlotte occasionally. I do have an annual NC non-resident fishing license. Bob Patton

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Seems like there are a lot of NC boys here. If you feel like it, tell me where in NC you are. I’m in Reidsville. Just north of Greensboro. I’m gonna make me a list of who is here, and where each of you are, and thought I’d start out close to home. Thanks. — Charles Davis    K4SWB <I’m The NRA

Response:

says… On the assumption that displaced Tarheels count, I’m just outside St Louis. Born in Murphy (Cherokee county) and grew up in Henderson county. I figger Missouri appreciates the cultural benefit provided by North Carolinians so much that they just won’t let me go. Still go to Murphy several times a year and have to go to Charlotte occasionally. I do have an annual NC non-resident fishing license. Bob Patton

Everyone counts. I’ve just started a list so I can put people and places together. — Charles Davis    K4SWB <I’m The NRA

Response:

Seems like there are a lot of NC boys here. If you feel like it, tell me where in NC you are.

Rah-leigh.

Response:

Seems like there are a lot of NC boys here. If you feel like it, tell me where in NC you are. Rah-leigh.

Thankee. — Charles Davis    K4SWB <I’m The NRA

Response:

Seems like there are a lot of NC boys here. If you feel like it, tell me where in NC you are. I’m in Reidsville. Just north of Greensboro. I’m gonna make me a list of who is here, and where each of you are, and thought I’d start out close to home. Thanks. — Charles Davis    K4SWB <I’m The NRA

Response:

I’m in Charlotte. Grew up in Asheville with time spent in Watauga County. You familiar with any Angels or Trents up that way? Matter of fact I’ll be up there on the 9th for a wedding. Drew Patterson – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Seems like there are a lot of NC boys here. If you feel like it, tell me where in NC you are. I’m in Reidsville. Just north of Greensboro. I’m gonna make me a list of who is here, and where each of you are, and thought I’d start out close to home. Thanks. — Charles Davis    K4SWB <I’m The NRA

Response:

Question:

I noticed that the Boy Scouts have started a FF Merit Badge, and I see an opportunity for our TU Chapter to do a little community outreach. Before I start asking local BSA people about how we can help, I was hoping that maybe some ROFFers involved with the Boy Scouts can offer suggestions.   I was thinking about maybe a group outing.  Maybe there’s a Boy Scout Camp with some good water on it, or something. Scott

Response:

I noticed that the Boy Scouts have started a FF Merit Badge, and I see an opportunity for our TU Chapter to do a little community outreach. Before I start asking local BSA people about how we can help, I was hoping that maybe some ROFFers involved with the Boy Scouts can offer suggestions.   I was thinking about maybe a group outing.  Maybe there’s a Boy Scout Camp with some good water on it, or something. Scott

        why not just post all their pictures, with names, family member’s names, and school lunch schedule.  that ought to make *somebody* happy…. wayno

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I noticed that the Boy Scouts have started a FF Merit Badge, and I see an opportunity for our TU Chapter to do a little community outreach. Before I start asking local BSA people about how we can help, I was hoping that maybe some ROFFers involved with the Boy Scouts can offer suggestions.  I was thinking about maybe a group outing.  Maybe there’s a Boy Scout Camp with some good water on it, or something. Scott      why not just post all their pictures, with names, family member’s names, and school lunch schedule.  that ought to make *somebody* happy…. wayno

It’s a good thing my new Cabela’s clearance moleskin shirt sheds nasally- ejected coffee like water off a duck’s ass, or I would be really pissed right now   Scott

Response:

A group outing makes the most sense.  Contact your local Scout office and volunteer.  Definitely, if there’s a Scout camp nearby that would be an ideal opportunity because they are heavy on merit badges during camp.  On the off chance that they already offer the program at camp, remember that not all the boys can make it to camp, so it would be an excellent gesture to offer a separate program. You can get some good info here: http://www.bsaflyfishing.com/

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I noticed that the Boy Scouts have started a FF Merit Badge, and I see an opportunity for our TU Chapter to do a little community outreach. Before I start asking local BSA people about how we can help, I was hoping that maybe some ROFFers involved with the Boy Scouts can offer suggestions. I was thinking about maybe a group outing.  Maybe there’s a Boy Scout Camp with some good water on it, or something. Scott

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A group outing makes the most sense.  Contact your local Scout office and volunteer.  Definitely, if there’s a Scout camp nearby that would be an ideal opportunity because they are heavy on merit badges during camp.  On the off chance that they already offer the program at camp, remember that not all the boys can make it to camp, so it would be an excellent gesture to offer a separate program. You can get some good info here: http://www.bsaflyfishing.com/ I noticed that the Boy Scouts have started a FF Merit Badge, and I see an opportunity for our TU Chapter to do a little community outreach. Before I start asking local BSA people about how we can help, I was hoping that maybe some ROFFers involved with the Boy Scouts can offer suggestions. I was thinking about maybe a group outing.  Maybe there’s a Boy Scout Camp with some good water on it, or something. Scott

Thanks, Stan.  I’ll let you know what we come up with. Scott

Response:

I served my term as assistant scoutmaster and have helped do this before there was a flyfishing badge.  It was just a fishing badge at the time and three of us did it for the scouts in our sons troop and one other. Call the local counsel (there on the web) and get a list of the troops near you.  They will have the names and phone numbers of the troop Scoutmasters.  Call the troop leaders and tell them what you are willing to do.  They will be all over you.  They are always looking for and welcome help. The scouts have booklets that detail the steps for earning every merit badge.  The emphasis is to have the scouts do all the work; your role is to be teacher and advisor. You can run the program for the whole troop or for just a couple of boys, depends on how many are interested. It’s the boys who decide if they want to get the badge. If your names on the list as an advisor some boys will seek you out. Some of the things we did were:  1.) Gave hands on demos on fly tying at one of their regular meetings.  We started using a parachute cord and an 8/0 hook and then let them go with the six vices and various materials we brought. They all managed to tie a couple of flies.  2.) Depending on where they meet you can bring in some rods and give casting instructions. 3.) You can let them come to your house and work at your bench and tie a few flies. .  You have to have at least two boys there at a time, no one on one instruction is allowe.  Let them see you stuff, explain how it works and maybe cast some in your back yard.  This is the point where some of them become lifetime flyfishers.  4.) You take them on an outing.  This part may educate you as much as them.  Pick a spot that safe and has catchable fish.  I wouldn’t count on a lake at a Boy Scout Camp having any cacheable fish. This is where you will need more help.  Get more volunteers for the trip one on one instruction is a big help here.    Twenty wild kids on a river with fly rods, wading, throwing rocks, and just being boys. It’s a great experience.  I cannot recommend it enough. .     – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I noticed that the Boy Scouts have started a FF Merit Badge, and I see an opportunity for our TU Chapter to do a little community outreach. Before I start asking local BSA people about how we can help, I was hoping that maybe some ROFFers involved with the Boy Scouts can offer suggestions.   I was thinking about maybe a group outing.  Maybe there’s a Boy Scout Camp with some good water on it, or something. Scott

Response:

The scouts have booklets that detail the steps for earning every merit badge.

Apparently it will cost $15,000 to print up all the booklets and the scouts are currently seeking donations to defray that cost. Mu

Response:

I noticed that the Boy Scouts have started a FF Merit Badge, and I see an opportunity for our TU Chapter to do a little community outreach. Before I start asking local BSA people about how we can help, I was hoping that maybe some ROFFers involved with the Boy Scouts can offer suggestions. I was thinking about maybe a group outing.  Maybe there’s a Boy Scout Camp with some good water on it, or something.

There’s one on the White river in central WI.  Great hex hatch too.  Don’t know about a dozen or so scouts flailing the water in the dark though. Wolfgang

Response:

Don’t know about a dozen or so scouts flailing the water in the dark though.

A noble quest, but I don’t think I’d wanna be the responsible party that hands them a fish hook or anything else that could potentially put me on the defendent end of a PI suit when somebody sticks a hook in his eye.   Maybe a dozen pairs of cheap safety glasses would be a good investment. Call me paranoid, Joe F.

Response:

A noble quest, but I don’t think I’d wanna be the responsible party that hands them a fish hook or anything else that could potentially put me on the defendent end of a PI suit when somebody sticks a hook in his eye.   Maybe a dozen pairs of cheap safety glasses would be a good investment. Call me paranoid, Joe F.

Both TU and the Scouts have mechanisms to deal with insurance issues.   Safetly glasses should be mandatory.  I won’t cast without them.  I also walk around with a whistle in my vest, but I’m paranoid. Scott

Response:

Wiscoy Creek runs right through Camp Sam Wood right near Pike, NY.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I noticed that the Boy Scouts have started a FF Merit Badge, and I see an opportunity for our TU Chapter to do a little community outreach. Before I start asking local BSA people about how we can help, I was hoping that maybe some ROFFers involved with the Boy Scouts can offer suggestions. I was thinking about maybe a group outing.  Maybe there’s a Boy Scout Camp with some good water on it, or something. Scott

Response:

Both TU and the Scouts have mechanisms to deal with insurance issues. Safetly glasses should be mandatory.  I won’t cast without them.  I also walk around with a whistle in my vest, but I’m paranoid.

It’s been my limited experience that should anything unfortunate happen, TU, BSA, the rodmaker, the hook manufacturer, and you personally will get named in a suit.   Sure, you’d probably get out of any liability, but it’ll still cost a few shiny nickles in legal fees.   Lawsuits are a bitch for the innocent.   Didn’t mean to get so serious about it, but being married to a (former) property/casualty insurance agent will do that to you.  :-) Joe F.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Wiscoy Creek runs right through Camp Sam Wood right near Pike, NY. I noticed that the Boy Scouts have started a FF Merit Badge, and I see an opportunity for our TU Chapter to do a little community outreach. Before I start asking local BSA people about how we can help, I was hoping that maybe some ROFFers involved with the Boy Scouts can offer suggestions. I was thinking about maybe a group outing.  Maybe there’s a Boy Scout Camp with some good water on it, or something. Scott

Thanks.  There’s also a pretty nice campground right on the Eastkoy that might be suitable.  Not many tent spots, though.  Seems taken up by permanent RVs Scott

Response:

I noticed that the Boy Scouts have started a FF Merit Badge, and I see an opportunity for our TU Chapter to do a little community outreach. Before I start asking local BSA people about how we can help, I was hoping that maybe some ROFFers involved with the Boy Scouts can offer suggestions.   I was thinking about maybe a group outing.  Maybe there’s a Boy Scout Camp with some good water on it, or something. Scott

well, I don’t know about good water compared to other areas, but in NJ there’s the Big Flat Brook that goes through Stokes State Forest which has an adjacent Boy Scout Camp. The BFB is known for decent trout FFing. Rob

Response:

Question:

Tracey <rbranc…@mediaone.net> wrote in message

news:3A96A46C.45DF0E68@mediaone.net… > >of everyone I have ever met who was into that I can believe it > >would cause marital problems. > If *both* are involved (and are devoted to it), it doesn’t seem > like it’s a cause of problems. > — > Tracey

My mistake…I suppose there could be occasions where this would not cause problems.  (shudders) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Indigo: What sailors do when they see a bar >                      —Funky Winkerbean—

Response:

Jadelee111512 <jadelee111…@aol.com> wrote in message

news:20010223130358.05491.00000364@ng-co1.aol.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >From: "B and B" > >Aaaauuugggghhhh!!!!!!!!!! > >Stay away!  Stay away!!!! > >Oh, wait.  You were asking about being married to an amway distributor, not > >becoming one. > >Well…I don’t know what to tell you, but given the "borg sphere" mentality > >of everyone I have ever met who was into that I can believe it would cause > >marital problems. > >Kevin Stone <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote in message > >news:t9d626mr61ho47@corp.supernews.com… > >> Just a fishing question here. > >> Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does they way > >> of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? > >> Kevin > At the very least, this inquiry could bring up an intersting topic regarding > different professions and the effect they might have  on the marriage. Amway > is one of many that has the potential to create its own set of problems within > a relationship. > jadelee

Being a phone sex operator can grate on a marriage too.  And so can just about any occupation where a lot of travel is involved.

Response:

I do not know what Amway work is. Is it a fortune 500 club? momalot – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Jadelee111512 wrote: > >From: "B and B" > >Aaaauuugggghhhh!!!!!!!!!! > >Stay away!  Stay away!!!! > >Oh, wait.  You were asking about being married to an amway distributor, not > >becoming one. > >Well…I don’t know what to tell you, but given the "borg sphere" mentality > >of everyone I have ever met who was into that I can believe it would cause > >marital problems. > >Kevin Stone <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote in message > >news:t9d626mr61ho47@corp.supernews.com… > >> Just a fishing question here. > >> Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does they way > >> of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? > >> Kevin > At the very least, this inquiry could bring up an intersting topic regarding > different professions and the effect they might have  on the marriage.  Amway > is one of many that has the potential to create its own set of problems within > a relationship. > jadelee

Response:

Tracey wrote: > >of everyone I have ever met who was into that I can believe it > >would cause marital problems. > If *both* are involved (and are devoted to it), it doesn’t seem > like it’s a cause of problems.

That would be tres cool, if you think about it.  They could sell each other stuff ad nauseam and be filthy rich in no time, right? Ponzi 1, do you take Ponzi 2 to be your lawful wedded… Drew

Response:

> I do not know what Amway work is. Is it a fortune 500 club? > momalot

www.amway.com shepette  (who used to like momalot’s posts, too bad we’ve now lost her to the underworld of amway…)

Response:

Ahhh, I see what it is now. Thanks for the link, btw. In my area we have "Stanley" , I think it’s a lot like Amway. Not my cup a tea. momalot – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Shepette wrote: > > I do not know what Amway work is. Is it a fortune 500 club? > > momalot > www.amway.com > shepette  (who used to like momalot’s posts, too bad we’ve now lost her to > the underworld of amway…)

Response:

ROFLOL ISIS "momalot" <dadalotmoma…@hotmail.com> wrote in message

news:3A96B436.6E33A6DB@hotmail.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I do not know what Amway work is. Is it a fortune 500 club? > momalot > Jadelee111512 wrote: > > >From: "B and B" > > >Aaaauuugggghhhh!!!!!!!!!! > > >Stay away!  Stay away!!!! > > >Oh, wait.  You were asking about being married to an amway distributor, not > > >becoming one. > > >Well…I don’t know what to tell you, but given the "borg sphere" mentality > > >of everyone I have ever met who was into that I can believe it would cause > > >marital problems. > > >Kevin Stone <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote in message > > >news:t9d626mr61ho47@corp.supernews.com… > > >> Just a fishing question here. > > >> Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does they way > > >> of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? > > >> Kevin > > At the very least, this inquiry could bring up an intersting topic regarding > > different professions and the effect they might have  on the marriage. Amway > > is one of many that has the potential to create its own set of problems within > > a relationship. > > jadelee

Response:

Run fast and far. — JWB remove spamkiller to reply via e-mail "Kevin Stone" <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote in message

news:t9d626mr61ho47@corp.supernews.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Just a fishing question here. > Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does their way > of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? > Kevin

Response:

I agree with that, but Amway is in a class by itself. Amway’s just……… creepy — JWB remove spamkiller to reply via e-mail "Jadelee111512" <jadelee111…@aol.com> wrote in message

news:20010223130358.05491.00000364@ng-co1.aol.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >From: "B and B" > >Aaaauuugggghhhh!!!!!!!!!! > >Stay away!  Stay away!!!! > >Oh, wait.  You were asking about being married to an amway distributor, not > >becoming one. > >Well…I don’t know what to tell you, but given the "borg sphere" mentality > >of everyone I have ever met who was into that I can believe it would cause > >marital problems. > >Kevin Stone <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote in message > >news:t9d626mr61ho47@corp.supernews.com… > >> Just a fishing question here. > >> Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does they way > >> of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? > >> Kevin > At the very least, this inquiry could bring up an intersting topic regarding > different professions and the effect they might have  on the marriage. Amway > is one of many that has the potential to create its own set of problems within > a relationship. > jadelee

Response:

On Fri, 23 Feb 2001 12:11:14 -0500, "B and B" <baboonnliz…@prodigy.net> wrote: >Aaaauuugggghhhh!!!!!!!!!! >Stay away!  Stay away!!!! >Oh, wait.  You were asking about being married to an amway distributor, not >becoming one. >Well…I don’t know what to tell you, but given the "borg sphere" mentality >of everyone I have ever met who was into that I can believe it would cause >marital problems.

Nitpick Dept:  Most Borg vessels are cubes, not spheres.

Response:

>From: "B and B" >Being a phone sex operator can grate on a marriage too.  And so can just >about any occupation where a lot of travel is involved.

Those are examples of a few.  Any high stress job has a potential to effect a marriage. Too many to name.  We are not well prepared to handle the stressors of jobs and marriage. jadelee

Response:

"B and B" wrote: >Being a phone sex operator can grate on a marriage too.  And so can just >about any occupation where a lot of travel is involved.

I could see how a lot of travel could grate on a marriage. Mom, for example, got more than just a bit fed up being home alone with the kids while dad was always out on the road selling insurance. He finally had to give it up, trading it in for teaching highschool and regular home hours. On the other hand, a tiny bit of work travel can be good for a marriage. For example, I’m happy for the time I have with my wife, but for the three or four times a year she’s off to trade shows, I enjoy that solitude time as well. As well, there have also been at least a few of her work trips where I’ve come along, we’ve extended our stay, and made a vacation of the situation more economically than if we had to pay the full shot for travel ourselves. So to my own family experiences at least, a lot of occupational travel can add to marital stress, where as a bit of occupational travel can actually be more beneficial to a marital relationship than none at all. CJ

Response:

Our relationshio has various small problems ie… insistence on using only Amway products (even if I don,t like that particular product) Granted Amway has some good products, But as any Company does they also have some bad ones or just plain some too expensive ones. I love my wife with all my heart, sometimes tho it seems that the Amway brainwashing borders on the ridiculous. By the way I am a former Amway brainwashee so I do know the other side and underrstand how they think. I was pretty disturbed by the way the marketing was carried out and the type of person I was turning out to be when I was involved. Thanks for all the response, keep it coming Kevin – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text —— Original Message —– From: CupCaked <karensSP…@nac.net> Newsgroups: alt.support.marriage Sent: Friday, February 23, 2001 9:36 AM Subject: Re: Amway > "Kevin Stone" <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote: > >Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does their way > >of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? > That’s a VERY provocative question.  May I ask what brought it about? >    http://www.cupcaked.com/cupcaked >  (and leave off the "potatoes" CupCaked <karensSP…@nac.net> wrote in message news:3aa09f57.22892148@news.nac.net… > "Kevin Stone" <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote: > >Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does their way > >of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? > That’s a VERY provocative question.  May I ask what brought it about? >    http://www.cupcaked.com/cupcaked >  (and leave off the "potatoes" to e-mail)

Response:

I’ve always had the belief that Amway will ruin a relationship unless both partners are in it 100%. Let me guess – your wife makes next to nothing in real profit, but "will… someday" — JWB remove spamkiller to reply via e-mail "Kevin Stone" <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote in message

news:t9frefdafcame5@corp.supernews.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Our relationshio has various small problems ie… insistence on using only > Amway products (even if I don,t like that particular product) Granted Amway > has some good products, But as any Company does they also have some bad ones > or just plain some too expensive ones. I love my wife with all my heart, > sometimes tho it seems that the Amway brainwashing borders on the > ridiculous. By the way I am a former Amway brainwashee so I do know the > other side and underrstand how they think. I was pretty disturbed by the way > the marketing was carried out and the type of person I was turning out to be > when I was involved. > Thanks for all the response, keep it coming > Kevin > —– Original Message —– > From: CupCaked <karensSP…@nac.net> > Newsgroups: alt.support.marriage > Sent: Friday, February 23, 2001 9:36 AM > Subject: Re: Amway > > "Kevin Stone" <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote: > > >Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does their > way > > >of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? > > That’s a VERY provocative question.  May I ask what brought it about? > >    http://www.cupcaked.com/cupcaked > >  (and leave off the "potatoes" > CupCaked <karensSP…@nac.net> wrote in message > news:3aa09f57.22892148@news.nac.net… > > "Kevin Stone" <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote: > > >Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does their > way > > >of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? > > That’s a VERY provocative question.  May I ask what brought it about? > >    http://www.cupcaked.com/cupcaked > >  (and leave off the "potatoes" to e-mail)

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Hi Kevin, I’m not a distributor, but I do know a few.  A co-worker was married 16 years when "they" got started in "the business".  That was about 6 years ago.  Their divorce was final last summer.  W said he was never home and found someone to fill in the gap.  Another co-worker says it ruined her daughter’s first marriage for the same reason – one of the two of them was always chasing a sale or going off to one function or another.  Another couple  that I know make it work, but that’s because they literally do it side by side.  As I understand the way that it’s structured, it’s together….on NOT.  Figuratively and literally. I hope this is somewhat of an answer for you. — – First Light     @——-We are each of us angels with only one wing; and it’s when we embrace each other that we can fly.—-/—@ "Kevin Stone" <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote in message

news:t9d626mr61ho47@corp.supernews.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Just a fishing question here. > Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does their way > of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? > Kevin

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The company as a whole is successful. But the people in it, overwhelmingly, are not. They get you in for a year or two, the suckers buy *everything* they use/own through amway, then they realize they are making *zero* monry, and they drop out. They seem to recruit from the lower-middle / middle class mostly. The people easiest to sell "the good life" to, as those people will believe it. The poor usually won’t, and generally won’t have the ambition the follow through (and afford the initial "kit"). But the middle class will put the kit on the credit card, charge a few suits (for the weekly "pump me ups"), and generally feel proud for awhile that they have a "business". They get nice little business cards made, and listen to Zig-Zigler tell them how great life can be. Most of them are smiling on the outside and putting up a successful "front" (wearing clothing and taking trips they cannot afford, so they can "keep up"…. really. I had several friends in Amway. They would charge a new suit, and fly to Florida for a three hour meeting, and fly home the same day. stuff they could hardly afford to do – but Amway made them feel like they couldn’t afford NOT to – it’s a bizzare company). Anyway, I’ve rambled enough. I’ve seen this company close up, and see what it does to people. It’s sad. — JWB remove spamkiller to reply via e-mail "IgOr" <ignora…@NOSPAM.invalid> wrote in message

news:slrn99h3mt.4j4.ignoramus@nospam.invalid… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Kevin Stone <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote: > * Our relationshio has various small problems ie… insistence on using only > * Amway products (even if I don,t like that particular product) Granted Amway > * has some good products, But as any Company does they also have some bad ones > * or just plain some too expensive ones. I love my wife with all my heart, > * sometimes tho it seems that the Amway brainwashing borders on the > * ridiculous. By the way I am a former Amway brainwashee so I do know the > * other side and underrstand how they think. I was pretty disturbed by the way > * the marketing was carried out and the type of person I was turning out to be > * when I was involved. > That’s interesting. So, what kind of brainswashing do they do? What > kinds of people do they recruit? Why are they successful? > igor > * Thanks for all the response, keep it coming > * > * Kevin > * —– Original Message —– > * From: CupCaked <karensSP…@nac.net> > * Newsgroups: alt.support.marriage > * Sent: Friday, February 23, 2001 9:36 AM > * Subject: Re: Amway > * > * > * > "Kevin Stone" <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote: > * > > * > >Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does their > * way > * > >of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? > * > > * > That’s a VERY provocative question.  May I ask what brought it about? > * > > * > > * > > * >    http://www.cupcaked.com/cupcaked > * >  (and leave off the "potatoes" > * CupCaked <karensSP…@nac.net> wrote in message > * news:3aa09f57.22892148@news.nac.net… > * > "Kevin Stone" <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote: > * > > * > >Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does their > * way > * > >of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? > * > > * > That’s a VERY provocative question.  May I ask what brought it about? > * > > * > > * > > * >    http://www.cupcaked.com/cupcaked > * >  (and leave off the "potatoes" to e-mail) > * > * > — > Don’t sweat the petty things and don’t pet the sweaty things. – George

Carlin

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As I’ve seen it described here and as I’ve seen it out here in RL, Amway is a religion of sorts.  It’s things like this that make me jest the concept of religion. ISIS "IgOr" <ignora…@NOSPAM.invalid> wrote in message

news:slrn99j39n.jm9.ignoramus@nospam.invalid… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Dan Kegel <d…@alumni.caltech.edu> wrote: > * First Light wrote: > * > I’m not a distributor, but I do know a few.  A co-worker was married 16 > * > years when "they" got started in "the business".  That was about 6 years > * > ago.  Their divorce was final last summer.  W said he was never home and > * > found someone to fill in the gap.  Another co-worker says it ruined her > * > daughter’s first marriage for the same reason – one of the two of them was > * > always chasing a sale or going off to one function or another. Another > * > couple  that I know make it work, but that’s because they literally do it > * > side by side.  As I understand the way that it’s structured, it’s > * > together….[or] NOT.  Figuratively and literally. > * > * Yep.  Amway is a lot like a charismatic church… > * there are plenty of fine people in it, but they believe weird things > I have yet to see a "fine" person in MLM. Fine people tend to not like > lying constantly. > — > Don’t sweat the petty things and don’t pet the sweaty things. – George

Carlin

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Larry Kessler <l_k_e_s_s_l_e_r@w_t_._n_e_t> wrote in message

news:4cee9tksrq1jrfqniogd52t0emakba5sn3@4ax.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> On Fri, 23 Feb 2001 12:11:14 -0500, "B and B" > <baboonnliz…@prodigy.net> wrote: > >Aaaauuugggghhhh!!!!!!!!!! > >Stay away!  Stay away!!!! > >Oh, wait.  You were asking about being married to an amway distributor, not > >becoming one. > >Well…I don’t know what to tell you, but given the "borg sphere" mentality > >of everyone I have ever met who was into that I can believe it would cause > >marital problems. > Nitpick Dept:  Most Borg vessels are cubes, not spheres.

Depends on which star trek you are watching.

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"John Kendricks" <jd…@yahoo.com> wrote in message

news:3a99948c.245820765@news.cis.dfn.de… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Everything you have said is true.  Amway (also now known as Quixtar) > preys on people who cannot afford the things or the lifestyle they > want, and brainwashes them to believe that if they will attend > frequent seminars, spend all their time listening to brainwashing > tapes, buy exclusively from amway or quixtar, and pester their > friends, relatives, coworkers, aquaintances,  people in malls, etc. > nonstop, they will become fabulously wealthy. > Here are some good amway-info links: > http://www.awod.com/gallery/rwav/slarsen/amway.html > http://skepdic.com/amway.html > http://www.apollowebworks.com/amway/ > http://www.freedomofmind.com/groups/amway/amo_qmo.htm > If anyone reading this is planning on getting involved with amway or > quixtar, or is already involved with them, reading the above links > could be the single most important thing you ever do to save yourself > much suffering, misery and agony.

I’ve found that these people who are ‘Quixtar/Amway Critics’ have no credibility at all on the subject, they are usually the most screwed-up-broke-done-nothing-in-life people I’ve ever met. Why on earth would I want to fill my head with a bunch garbage from people who have no credibility in the area of success?  I seriously doubt that these people ‘got in’ then ‘quit’ (actually quit something they probably didn’t put hardly any effort toward) and then when on to be successfull fathers, husbands, entreprenuers, race car drivers or anything.  I bet the the only good things they end up being good at is: justification & rationalization of why they are where they are finanically, complaining, remote control operation and butt print formation (in couch cushions). I’ve seen all sorts of different levels of success in this business opportunity and I’ve seen it actually pull dozens (probably 100s) of marriages together, and these are indirect benefits from any kind of prosperity.  For postive results like these, it requires to a certain amount of effort just like any kind of  business opportunity, job, church, etc. and if a person is too busy (translates to lazy) to apply himself  and put forth effort than he is going to fail. This IS the best business opportunity I have ever seen it provides a level playing field for everyone.  It is structured to make money and the business plan works only if you work it.  Depending upon where you are personally, mentally and emotionally, you may need to learn and develop some personal and business skills that will enable you to build a successful business.  So in order to succeed learn how to learn from someone who has already done what you want to do.  The main goal of business is to make money and this opportunity is a great way to get the money obstacle hurdled in your life unlike most jobs out there.  Jobs are simply not structured to create any kind of wealth for the employee. It IS NOT a religion, if any body tries to enforce their beliefs on you concerning your faith in your creator, they are off base.  This applies to anywhere in life including your boss at your job. Good business is never built on deception and if someone is using any kind of deceptive tactics then you should address this issue directly don’t give up until you are satisfied.  I’ve found that the truly successfull people in this business are very direct, honest and trustworthy; the business is structured so that success is based upon success and it is in nobody’s interest to decieve anybody. If you’re checking out this business, remember to consider the credibility of the person who is providing the information. And make sure to check it out for yourself and don’t listen to broke people or negative attitudes. Good Luck to you in what ever you decide to do -but decide to do something!

Response:

First Light wrote: > I’m not a distributor, but I do know a few.  A co-worker was married 16 > years when "they" got started in "the business".  That was about 6 years > ago.  Their divorce was final last summer.  W said he was never home and > found someone to fill in the gap.  Another co-worker says it ruined her > daughter’s first marriage for the same reason – one of the two of them was > always chasing a sale or going off to one function or another.  Another > couple  that I know make it work, but that’s because they literally do it > side by side.  As I understand the way that it’s structured, it’s > together….[or] NOT.  Figuratively and literally.

Yep.  Amway is a lot like a charismatic church… there are plenty of fine people in it, but they believe weird things – Dan

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Everything you have said is true.  Amway (also now known as Quixtar) preys on people who cannot afford the things or the lifestyle they want, and brainwashes them to believe that if they will attend frequent seminars, spend all their time listening to brainwashing tapes, buy exclusively from amway or quixtar, and pester their friends, relatives, coworkers, aquaintances,  people in malls, etc. nonstop, they will become fabulously wealthy. Here are some good amway-info links: http://www.awod.com/gallery/rwav/slarsen/amway.html http://skepdic.com/amway.html http://www.apollowebworks.com/amway/ http://www.freedomofmind.com/groups/amway/amo_qmo.htm If anyone reading this is planning on getting involved with amway or quixtar, or is already involved with them, reading the above links could be the single most important thing you ever do to save yourself much suffering, misery and agony.

Response:

Just a fishing question here. Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does their way of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? Kevin

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Aaaauuugggghhhh!!!!!!!!!! Stay away!  Stay away!!!! Oh, wait.  You were asking about being married to an amway distributor, not becoming one. Well…I don’t know what to tell you, but given the "borg sphere" mentality of everyone I have ever met who was into that I can believe it would cause marital problems. Kevin Stone <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote in message

news:t9d626mr61ho47@corp.supernews.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Just a fishing question here. > Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does their way > of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? > Kevin

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>of everyone I have ever met who was into that I can believe it >would cause marital problems.

If *both* are involved (and are devoted to it), it doesn’t seem like it’s a cause of problems. — Tracey Indigo: What sailors do when they see a bar                      —Funky Winkerbean—

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->From: "B and B" >Aaaauuugggghhhh!!!!!!!!!! >Stay away!  Stay away!!!! >Oh, wait.  You were asking about being married to an amway distributor, not >becoming one. >Well…I don’t know what to tell you, but given the "borg sphere" mentality >of everyone I have ever met who was into that I can believe it would cause >marital problems. >Kevin Stone <kdstone…@vermontel.net> wrote in message >news:t9d626mr61ho47@corp.supernews.com… >> Just a fishing question here. >> Does anyone here have a spouse who is an Amway distributor? Does they way >> of doing business or actions cause problems in your marriage? >> Kevin

At the very least, this inquiry could bring up an intersting topic regarding different professions and the effect they might have  on the marriage.  Amway is one of many that has the potential to create its own set of problems within a relationship. jadelee

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Question:

Has anyone fished the San Juan river in mid October? How was it ? Was the weather good? Where did you stay and would you recommend it? Thanks in advance for any  information.

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I’ve been there a couple of times in October. I like to stay at Abe’s. The weather is unpredictable in October. One time it was in the 70’s and beautiful. The other time it rained two days and snowed the other two. Neither should keep you from fishing.

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Hey Tree Skier (great handle, just make sure you baseball cap is on backwards so you don’t hit any branches). October is one of the best months to fish the san juan.  There are a couple of other threads discussing our upcoming trip there in december. Hate to sound like a broken record, but go to http://www.ifly4trout.com and read everything.  it has basically everything you need to know. bruce h Before you buy.

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Question:

I fear you might have a problem riding the horse in the stream itself, if it shies for some reason you might be thrown.  

That’s always a possibility, even if I’m not fishing. If you have no intention of landing the fish, then you will at least have no problems with fish splashing about close, and possibly frightening the horse.   You might have problems with the noise the horse makes frightening the fish, or perhaps you can "muffle" the hooves in some way, without causing the horse to lose traction. Presumably the horse is shod?

Yes, he’s shod. Horses are actually very good at wading in freestone rivers — much better than people are. They’re tall, they have four long legs, they’re heavy, and their weight is high (not underwater, like much of ours when we wade). I cross streams frequently while mounted without problems. Does not sound much like "stealthy" fly-fishing either.  Up on a horse in the stream, in places where horses are not common, you are liable to frighten most fish long before you get within casting range, although this might not be the case.  

That’s true, but I’d also be up high where I could more easily spot fish. There’s so much noise in these freestone streams that you can wade with a fair amount of ruckus without spooking the fish. let us know how you get on.

Will do. The idea here isn’t really to catch fish, of course. It’s just to try this to be able to say I’ve done it. I’m looking for the right setup — early evening, sun and wind at my back, riffles with pocket water, and plenty of dumb fish. There’s a perfect spot just upstream from my pasture on the Salmon river. Unfortuanately, a highway goes right by there, so I might cause an sensation. This is just the sort of thing what would get people talking around here. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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Willi can attest to the fact that I did an incredible hopping/dancing routine in a slippery Madison riffle when a fish came straight at me and swam through my legs.  (Yeah, it was a whitefish… so?)  If you put tassles on your horse and braided its mane, I’d pay good money to see a horse do the same thing.

No tassles and braids, Jeff. This is Idaho. You don’t baby horses or take them to the hairdresser here. There’s a horse in my rented pasture (not mine) that had a serious case of ear mites, and probably other parasites as well. He was really suffering and was weak and listless. Since so one was doing anything about it I gave him a dose of Ivermectin (recommended by folks in rec.equestrian) just before I left for the Western Clave. When I returned about 10 days later the mites were gone and he was feeling and looking good. I took him on a long ride up to Sulpher Creek and he did just fine, except it’s like fighting the Devil to get the bridle over his ears. He’ll get over that. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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Don’t laugh. I’m serious. The next logical step is actually fishing FROM THE HORSE!         i’m really worried about wolfgang.  at this point, there have been a dozen responses to this post, and he remains silent.         could someone check the e.r.’s in milwaukee? wayno, always thinking of his friends.

Ahem….yes….sorry about the delay.  It’s been a rather busy week for me.  I’ve been engaged in monitoring ROFF’s collective blood pressure using my own patented remote telemetry device.  Oddly enough it appears that the numbers increase significantly in direct proportion to the frequency of my participation.  Still working on whether the relationship is causal or merely coincidental.  Will keep everyone posted on results. Have also been deeply engaged in an investigation of population genetics as manifested in boorish behavior on small mountain streams.  Fascinating study! As to the point under consideration in this thread, why anyone would consider doing anything on a horse’s back other than perhaps parking a bus, completely escapes me.  That said, if memory serves, I seem to recall seeing photos in some of the fishing rags a few years ago, when I still paid attention to them, of people doing exactly what Steve is contemplating.  I believe there were some ads for outfitters who take people out on fishing trips specifically to fish while mounted upon the backs of these ungainly and treacherous brutes.  Sorry I can’t give any more details but my memory of the references is rather dim as I was at that time deeply engrossed in the consideration of a plan to get nymphs to the bottom of deep pools without using hazardous lead weights by clasping the fly firmly in my teeth and diving headlong into the pools with a medium sized anvil tied securely to my neck.  Sadly, I must report that this plan never came to fruition as I was unable to devise a reliable method for retrieving the anvils which, as I’m sure everyone knows, are in short supply due to the distressing habit of "collectors" buying them up at auctions and yard sales to be used as lawn ornaments. However, now that I think about it, I suppose that a steel shod horse has from horse hair lines to using the entire beast…..waste not, want not, eh?  Or would that be considered bait casting? FWIW Wolfgang "Something’s happening here….."

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rw,   One of my wildest rides occurred when mounting a horse with a fishing rod in hand. Ernie

A mare no doubt. Peter

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  One of my wildest rides occurred when mounting a horse with a fishing rod in hand. Ernie A mare no doubt. Peter

Ernie "Stud" Harrison seems to take a little "different" view of dealing with animals.  I shudder to think of what would happen if Ernie took up Mike’s Camel suggestion.  Reminds me of a Foreign Legion story; there was a new officer assigned to a remote French Foreign Legion post…… — Wayne (saving the rest of the story for the Smallie Clave this weekend) To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

Response:

As to the point under consideration in this thread, why anyone would consider doing anything on a horse’s back other than perhaps parking a bus, completely escapes me.  

Why would anyone consider climbing up a waterfall while wearing wading boots and carrying a flyrod? That said, if memory serves, I seem to recall seeing photos in some of the fishing rags a few years ago, when I still paid attention to them, of people doing exactly what Steve is contemplating.  I believe there were some ads for outfitters who take people out on fishing trips specifically to fish while mounted upon the backs of these ungainly and treacherous brutes.

I’ve wanted to try this ever since I saw the movie "Jeremiah Johnson". Johnson (played by Robert Redford) was starving in the winter, and he was desperately trying to catch fish with his bare hands. As he was pathetically flopping around in the freezing creek he looked up to see a mounted Indian wading, carrying a full stringer of trout he’s shot with a bow and arrow. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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I’ve wanted to try this ever since I saw the movie "Jeremiah Johnson". Johnson (played by Robert Redford) was starving in the winter, and he was desperately trying to catch fish with his bare hands. As he was pathetically flopping around in the freezing creek he looked up to see a mounted Indian wading, carrying a full stringer of trout he’s shot with a bow and arrow.

Be careful when bowfishing.  When I was a kid I went bowfishing for carp with my father and uncle.  My uncle shot at a fish and the line wrapped around his finger as he shot.  His finger was essentially only held together by the fingernail.  We rushed him to the hospital and they sewed it all back together, but it wasn’t a pretty sight. I know I’ve never gone since then and I seriously doubt if either of them have.  Still makes me cringe 10-15 years later just thinking about it. Happy lunchtime reading,      - Ken —     "I was gratified to be able to answer promptly,       and I did.  I said I didn’t know."     — Mark Twain

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 There’s so much noise in these freestone streams that you can wade with a fair amount of ruckus without spooking the fish.

    with all due respect, steve, i will put you and that goddam horse at the mouth of hazel creek, give you your choice of equipment, and give you one hundred dollars for every fish you can catch from dawn to dark.  in return, you will pay me a thousand bucks if you fail to bring a fish to hand.  shit, the rainbows in hazel creek will spook a hundred yards in both directions if audrey hepburn’s ghost slips on an orange slider!     wayno, who is put in mind of the shotgunned killdeer of the tejas.

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The problem is what to do with the fish when I hook it. My plan is to cut the hook bends off of dry flies and just fish for rises. Does this sound totally crazy?

How about using a net with a 6′ handle? But if that’s too much work, you might just consider paying someone to fish for you–you can just watch from a distance on horseback and that way you’ll have at least one hand free to make calls on your satellite phone. –Steve

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How about using a net with a 6′ handle? But if that’s too much work, you might just consider paying someone to fish for you–you can just watch from a distance on horseback and that way you’ll have at least one hand free to make calls on your satellite phone.

If he’d hunt from it too, and wear a fur coat, PETA could just focus on him and leave everyone else alone (especially if he bought the Wienermobile to tow his horse trailer to the stream)<g. — Charlie…

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If he’d hunt from it too, and wear a fur coat, PETA could just focus on him and leave everyone else alone (especially if he bought the Wienermobile to tow his horse trailer to the stream)<g. — Charlie…

Arlo could trot behind fitted up with an antler tied to his head like the dog in Grinch Who Stole Christmas! — Wayne To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

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If he’d hunt from it too<

You know the old joke – "can I shoot off this horse?"  "Sure."  Guy comes back all beat up, wants his money back.  Seller reminds him, "I said you could shoot OFF him, not ON him!" <g

Response:

Don’t laugh. I’m serious. The next logical step is actually fishing FROM THE HORSE!

        i’m really worried about wolfgang.  at this point, there have been a dozen responses to this post, and he remains silent.         could someone check the e.r.’s in milwaukee? wayno, always thinking of his friends.

Response:

rw,    One of my wildest rides occurred when mounting a horse with a fishing rod in hand. Ernie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Don’t laugh. I’m serious. When I got my horse in June he was afraid of flyrods. Thought they were whips, I suppose. He’s over that now. I can mount and ride him with a flyrod. It’s really fun to ride from hole to hole, dismounting for a few casts, sticking around if there’s action, and moving on if there’s not. There’s lots of water around here where you can do that without disturbing anyone. The next logical step is actually fishing FROM THE HORSE! I want to eliminate this dismounting and tying up bullshit. I know places where I could wade upstream (mounted, of course) and cast to lots of riffles, pocket water, and shoreline, kind of like a drift boat in reverse. The problem is what to do with the fish when I hook it. My plan is to cut the hook bends off of dry flies and just fish for rises. Does this sound totally crazy? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ to something bogus to avoid spam)

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True….a rod in hand is definitely not very romantic…..john – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – rw,   One of my wildest rides occurred when mounting a horse with a fishing rod in hand. Ernie Don’t laugh. I’m serious. When I got my horse in June he was afraid of flyrods. Thought they were whips, I suppose. He’s over that now. I can mount and ride him with a flyrod. It’s really fun to ride from hole to hole, dismounting for a few casts, sticking around if there’s action, and moving on if there’s not. There’s lots of water around here where you can do that without disturbing anyone. The next logical step is actually fishing FROM THE HORSE! I want to eliminate this dismounting and tying up bullshit. I know places where I could wade upstream (mounted, of course) and cast to lots of riffles, pocket water, and shoreline, kind of like a drift boat in reverse. The problem is what to do with the fish when I hook it. My plan is to cut the hook bends off of dry flies and just fish for rises. Does this sound totally crazy? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ to something bogus to avoid spam)

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I hope someone is around with a camera<g. I wonder how the horse will like fish jumping and splashing next to it, not to mention the line tangled around its legs…

Willi can attest to the fact that I did an incredible hopping/dancing routine in a slippery Madison riffle when a fish came straight at me and swam through my legs.  (Yeah, it was a whitefish… so?)  If you put tassles on your horse and braided its mane, I’d pay good money to see a horse do the same thing. Regards, Jeff

Response:

can you image the affect of a bad sinktip cast whipping across its rump?

I believe the technical term is "yee haw"<g. — Charlie…

Response:

A camel might be a better idea. Puts a whole new perspective on fishing with humpys !:) TL MC — "If you have tried everything you know, and nothing works, then perhaps it is time to accept that you don

Question:

Try hitting a beef shank bone if you want to hear shear pins in action… /daytripper (in a winter wonder land)

Here in Wisconsin we generally come up on the cow from behind.  Once the auger makes contact with the tail the cow invariably moves off  the driveway, post haste.  No need to hit ‘em in the shanks! Wolfgang in lala land

Response:

Fortenberry writes: Oh holey moley, THIS is what passes for trash talk amongst the geriatric set. One-upmanship over snowblowers fer cryin’ out loud. I’m still shovelin’ and still castin’ that 9′ bamboo. — Ken Fortenberry- neener neener neener

Just took the new car with the 255/45 17inch performance tires to the super market.  It does not like snow!!!  d;0) Bought some strawberries and water melon. Have lots of martini fixins. Everything is copesetic. Dave L.

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Just took the new car with the 255/45 17inch performance tires to the super market.  It does not like snow!!!  d;0) Bought some strawberries and water melon. Have lots of martini fixins. Everything is copesetic. Dave L.

Wha’d ya buy?  (got check out what I’m likely gonna be chasin’) Peter

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Peter Charles: Wha’d ya buy?  (got check out what I’m likely gonna be chasin’)

A 2000 Audi A6 with the 300bhp 4.2L engine.  Goes like stink, but not in the snow with 255/40-17 Y rated tires.  It’s actually scarey out there.  Jo’s got the farm implement. Dave L.

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[a lot of snow whining snipped] The get a bit of snow and listen to the wusses. Nannook Peter Peter

Hey, now, don’t mistake my post for a complaint. Being snowbound gives me just the excuse I needed to work on the fly rod I’m building (since I’m not a fly tier, what else am I gonna do?). It is pretty amazing that we’ve had 17" of snowfall in the last 18 hours or so in Cary, NC. I grew up in Utah and can’t remember ever having that much snowfall in one day. Pass the back bacon, eh. –Steve

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A 2000 Audi A6 with the 300bhp 4.2L engine.  Goes like stink, but not in the snow with 255/40-17 Y rated tires.  It’s actually scarey out there.  Jo’s got the farm implement. Dave L.

AWESOME – you will be bringing that up here won’t you <GGGGGGGG Peter

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Just cleared six inches off the driveway.  My 15 year old Dukakus snowblower is still going strong. Hah! That’s a baby! My 30" 8hp Ariens was built in 1967. Bought it for $75 ten years ago, dropped all of $30 into it for a new carb, plug, and traction lock pin, and it starts first pull every time. They built this one to outlast a couple of owners ;^) Oh holey moley, THIS is what passes for trash talk amongst the geriatric set. One-upmanship over snowblowers fer cryin’ out loud.

Well, heck, what do you expect us geriatrics to be doing, anyway? We can’t even FIND open water under all this white stuff, never mind fish it! And actually, I thought that was one-downmanship, but what do I know. I was responding to someone who bought a $40000 accident-waiting-to-happen ;^) I’m still shovelin’ and still castin’ that 9′ bamboo.

If you put down the 9′ bamboo you’ll cast that shovel further ;^) /daytripper (snowblind in stow)

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Day Tripper: If you put down the 9′ bamboo you’ll cast that shovel further ;^) /daytripper (snowblind in stow)

Farther. Dave, duckin’ in the snow five miles south of Dave. Dave L.

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Day Tripper: If you put down the 9′ bamboo you’ll cast that shovel further ;^) /daytripper (snowblind in stow) Farther.

Oh well. I can spell just fine, but I need a context-checker! Dave, duckin’ in the snow five miles south of Dave.

I can still SEEEEEEE you! We didn’t get THAT much snow ;^) /daytripper (now comes the freezin’ rain…)

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Out here in the beautiful Western end of Massachusetts, I just finished clearing the first 6" and it’s now turning to sleet.  Oh joy. Hope it clears up before I drive down to Somerset, NJ Friday.  Picture on the front page of the local paper is a snow plow clearing snow off one of the local ponds – time for skating, not fishing.  A friend tells me he caught a good sized pickerel through the ice on a black wooly bugger Saturday… –Stan

You and me both Stan… I plan on coming out on Friday to view with out the crowds and then again on Saturday to meet with abunch of others on I’ll be driving back and forth though… It was sleeting today in So.Jersey but the main roads were in good shape. Plan on a long drive. Most of the speed limits are heavily reduced. — Michael Era

Question:

I am not sure about loading the boat solo.  Its not so much the weight but

I’ve just switched canoes from an Old Town to a handmade wooden one. The wooden one weighs at least 20 pounds less, but is too hard to handle completely well alone in getting it off the truck and back on the sawhorses, so I’ve been paddling for overnights in the tiny Otter, with stuff strapped on deck.  Otter fits in my truck bed on a diagonal.  The new canoe is 18 feet and the fore/aft wobble and so forth and need to try to keep the wood safe is just more work than the weight loss is worth.  I’ll probably be selling it next year. The Old Towns are wonderful.  You don’t have to worry about dents.  I used to take that thing off my car (lousy arm strength) by looking over to my right to be sure there was nothing pointy and tip/flipping it off.  As people would stare, I’d smile and say, "It’s a Old Town." and go get the rest of my gear out of my trunk.  I even used to be able to get it on top of my truck by doing the crawl under, lift bow, set bow on top of truck and shove until it was in the right position. I did that on a well used Old Town for 10 years and it was in about the same shape when I handed it on as it was when I bought it.  Faded more, though, and one long nasty scratch that has to be fixed by the new owner. So go for the Old Town, even a bit heavy, if you don’t mind some unconventional on and off vehicle moves.  I’m 5′4" and out of shape and if I could do it, darn near anyone can.  Oh, yeah, middlel-aged, too.  However, if I could find a 40 pound kevlar at a price I could afford, I’d be on it like a shot. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -the size could get tough.  I carry it myself but its helpful having my son guide the back as I load it on and off.  But that may just be me…your coleman seemed to be heavier. I’m now back in the market and looking for an all-purpose boat to cover the following usage: 65% fishing (with electric or tiny outboard) 30% flatwater paddling (maybe day trips or overnights) 5% "whitewater" (certainly ning more than a class 2+) ty. er) It seems to me that Old Town makes more general purpose boats than the other manufacturers, let me know if I am wrong. Woodbury, MN

—– I only answer my email every few months, on average.   Patience helps.   http://www.visi.com/~cyli

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If I bought a Discovery I’d buy the 169.  Its patterned on their "tripper" which is a great boat.  A friend has the 169 and it seems decent. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Old Town Discovery 160K Old Town Discovery 133K Old Town Discovery 147 (current front runner)

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Try before you buy…saying that… I had the same requirements you had except I also have a requirement of bringing my son along with me.  I went with the Mad River Revelation.  It does everything you want.  Its about 78 pounds, 17ft, and very stable also its expensive.  I fly fish out of it and its very comfortable to have my son in the front and me in the back.  It is amazingly comfortable to paddle over the lakes we fish.  It easily fits four for day trip though I have not tried camping out of it yet.  The electric motor is nice but because we enjoyed paddling it so much we use it only for trolling. I have not tried white water but have heard of others having no problems. I am not sure about loading the boat solo.  Its not so much the weight but the size could get tough.  I carry it myself but its helpful having my son guide the back as I load it on and off.  But that may just be me…your coleman seemed to be heavier. Good luck. John – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Back in the early 80’s I canoed quite a bit.  Yes, I was a teenager, broke and naive, and bought a 15′ Coleman.  (Yada, yada, yada).  I enjoyed that, fished the heck out of it, camped out of it some and ran a few rapids I probably shouldn’t have. I’m now back in the market and looking for an all-purpose boat to cover the following usage: 65% fishing (with electric or tiny outboard) 30% flatwater paddling (maybe day trips or overnights) 5% "whitewater" (certainly ning more than a class 2+) Now I certainly don’t expect to find something that shines at everything. I had originally decided to do something square-sterned but decided that a double-ended boat would be more versatile.  I want to favor fishing since that will be my heaviest usage.  Tracking well under power would be important so I’m assuming a flat or slightly rockeredboat would be appropriate.  I might also row when fishing solo.  I will fish out of it a lot solo so ease of car topping is also important ( I used to do my Coleman alone and I think the 15′ I had was about 85 lbs).  But I want the ability to hold two for fishing comfortably, or hold three on a day or overnight paddle.  I favor plastic boats for cost and durability. I’m hoping the experts here can help. What have I come up with?  My best guesses so far are: Old Town Discovery 160K Old Town Discovery 133K Old Town Discovery 147 (current front runner) It seems to me that Old Town makes more general purpose boats than the other manufacturers, let me know if I am wrong. Let me know what you think. Thanks a lot, Keith Hatfull Woodbury, MN

Response:

Back in the early 80’s I canoed quite a bit.  Yes, I was a teenager, broke and naive, and bought a 15′ Coleman.  (Yada, yada, yada).  I enjoyed that, fished the heck out of it, camped out of it some and ran a few rapids I probably shouldn’t have. I’m now back in the market and looking for an all-purpose boat to cover the following usage: 65% fishing (with electric or tiny outboard) 30% flatwater paddling (maybe day trips or overnights) 5% "whitewater" (certainly ning more than a class 2+) Now I certainly don’t expect to find something that shines at everything.  I had originally decided to do something square-sterned but decided that a double-ended boat would be more versatile.  I want to favor fishing since that will be my heaviest usage.  Tracking well under power would be important so I’m assuming a flat or slightly rockeredboat would be appropriate.  I might also row when fishing solo.  I will fish out of it a lot solo so ease of car topping is also important ( I used to do my Coleman alone and I think the 15′ I had was about 85 lbs).  But I want the ability to hold two for fishing comfortably, or hold three on a day or overnight paddle.  I favor plastic boats for cost and durability. I’m hoping the experts here can help. What have I come up with?  My best guesses so far are: Old Town Discovery 160K Old Town Discovery 133K Old Town Discovery 147 (current front runner) It seems to me that Old Town makes more general purpose boats than the other manufacturers, let me know if I am wrong. Let me know what you think. Thanks a lot, Keith Hatfull Woodbury, MN

Response:

Old Town is OK but consider a Mad River Explorer in Royalex.  They cost a bit more, but have more stability, and load carrying capacity.  They can handle any reasonable whitewater. (The first  open canoe down the Grand Canyon was Jim Shelander’s explorer. )

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If you can take the time paddle every boat that is recommended to you. I am totally biased but I don’t think you will find a better boat for your described purpose than a Dagger Sewannee. 15 feet, reasonably light, and paddles better than you will believe until you try it. Go with the three seat version and venture  into only very mild whitewater in any of this type of  boat. There should be a description at www.Dagger.com Steve Scarborough

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Question:

I do alot  of backpacking in NM. As in most of my trips I try to hit a lake, any lake small, big, it does not matter. Every time I go I see fish that are worth catching! I’m looking for gear that  is lite, compactable and tha does no take up room. Any ideas?

Drew,  3-6pc flyrods are a hot market….Scott, Sage, Winston..etc. I’ve probably left out a half-dozen brands… Nice rods out there…that CAN be packed small.       have fun, steve d.      

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 I do alot  of backpacking in NM. As in most of my trips I try to hit a lake, any lake small, big, it does not matter. Every time I go I see fish that are worth catching! I’m looking for gear that  is lite, compactable and tha does no take up room. Any ideas?

I just disassemble (2 pieces) my 5-foot Daiwa lightweight (8-10 lb test) rod, remove the reel (my favorite lucky Shimano Maglight baitcaster), stuff the 2 rod lengths in my tentpole bag, stored in a vertical pouch on the side of my Camp Trails Wilderness frame pack.  The reel goes in the pack along with a small Plano lurebox.  The pole lengths are about 8-10 inches longer than the tentpoles so they extend that much above the pack, though they’re protected along the back frame and behind whatever rolled gear (tent, bag, pad) is packed on top of the pack. Always ready to fish, Dave

Response:

Try a four piece "Pack Rod", they are most popular for flyfishing.  You can pack them in a 2 foot tube and strap it to your pack frame.  A reel and a few flies dont weigh much and take up very little space. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  I do alot  of backpacking in NM. As in most of my trips I try to hit a lake, any lake small, big, it does not matter. Every time I go I see fish that are worth catching! I’m looking for gear that  is lite, compactable and tha does no take up room. Any ideas? I do a lot of fishing from my kayak.  I have a collapsible telescoping pole…goes down to 14 inches long.  While i’d imagine this would break if i caught Walter (any fish over 4 LBS), i have landed a 2.5 LB German Brown. Has a spinning reel.  I also have two Plano plastic lure organizers.  One is for bass, while the other is for trout.  Though, i could easily compact them into one box if needed.  I keep everything in creel.  Though i could get along with the pole, reel, one lure box, and pliers.

Response:

 I do alot  of backpacking in NM. As in most of my trips I try to hit a lake, any lake small, big, it does not matter. Every time I go I see fish that are worth catching! I’m looking for gear that  is lite, compactable and tha does no take up room. Any ideas?

Response:

 I do alot  of backpacking in NM. As in most of my trips I try to hit a lake, any lake small, big, it does not matter. Every time I go I see fish that are worth catching! I’m looking for gear that  is lite, compactable and tha does no take up room. Any ideas?

I do a lot of fishing from my kayak.  I have a collapsible telescoping pole…goes down to 14 inches long.  While i’d imagine this would break if i caught Walter (any fish over 4 LBS), i have landed a 2.5 LB German Brown. Has a spinning reel.  I also have two Plano plastic lure organizers.  One is for bass, while the other is for trout.  Though, i could easily compact them into one box if needed.  I keep everything in creel.  Though i could get along with the pole, reel, one lure box, and pliers.

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Question:

I am fishing a small lake for brookies in Hawkes Bay in the next week. The only information that I have is that they are there, and in patches. No one seems to fish there much. Does anyone have any ideas that work in small lakes elsewhere in the world? Simon

Brookies attempt spawn in the fall.  Fish the shallows or if the lake has inlet stream at mouth.  Bright flies work well as well as black leaches. Don’t be afraid to try blood worm or chironomid larva imitations as the blood worm migrates from shallows to deeper water in the fall.  At Henry’s lake bright crystal buggers and sparce crystal bodied flies do great.  

Response:

My experience with brookies in lakes generally varies with lake location and time of year.   When fishing the Cypress Hills lakes in southeastern Alberta, I have the most luck fishing deep (right off the bottom) and slow using a black or very dark green nymph pattern.  I generally use a dragonfly pattern in a size 8 to 10 hook. I have often seen these insects in shallow water along the shore. From a belly boat, I can slowly troll my line from shallow to the deepest water. My luck increases if I regularly twitch the line with my fingers.  When I connect, the fish strike hard and put up an amazingly good fight.  Trout sizes generally range from 10 to sixteen inches in length. I generally have very poor luck trying to take the brookies off the surface of the lake with a dry fly. Hope this helps. — David J. Wormsbecker, Regina, Saskatchewan Ph/Fax: (306) 789-4024

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Question:

                                                                    The thing that got me was that i read Lyman Hugh’s response, when he stated that he was always disappointed to see them on the end of the line.  My question is, if the fish fight well (which they really do), and if they aren’t too ugly (which, in my book, they’re not), then why the disappointmentR?

A)…..white fish can’t jump! B)…..they fight hard for few moments, and then poop out, perhaps        because their mouths are so small, so they run out of oxygen        faster. C)…..they’re good smoked, a delicacy, in fact. Because of their        oily flesh, they take the smoke better. (But they’re hard to        keep lit). —

Response:

I’m pretty sure you are now talking about 2 different species of fish. The whitefish in Montana looks a lot like a grayling/sucker, relatively long and thin.  The Great Lakes whitefish, a delicacy, is a chunky, somewhat oily fish that is a high-priced restaurant meal, commercially netted.  I have caught them in the Boundary Waters Canoe Area, rising at dusk to the white may flies that come in August.  They are usually broiled with paprika, andthe fillets are delicious. Whitefish are sought after up here in Ontario. You guys don’t know what

you’re missing. They fillet great and are also stuffed/baked. They must be good ifthey are sold commeircially here but I get mine thru the ice on Simcoe andwould rank them behind crappie and walleye in terms of tastiness They – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -will also hit minnows and jigs. — Richard Park    

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Well, I ditched work for the afternoon yesterday and ventured out upon the local waters and managed to catch my first brown trout (2 of ‘em, actually — I’m a novice ffisherman).  I also caught a mountain whitefish.  I’ve caught a couple of whitefish now.  The fishing proclamation calls them gamefish here in Utah, but to my knowledge, most fishermen treat them as trash fish.

Jay, I’ve caught mountain whitefish and a couple of species of lake w’fish. They taste just fine. Despite the scales, they’re salmonids (as are grayling). The mountain species lives in substantially the same waters as trout, eats almost the same stuff, and fights quite respectably. Unfortunately, there is a perception on some waters that fish fall into one of two categories (trout & trash). Sad — 3798 Woodland Drive     voice: (604) 368-9315 Trail, BC               data:  (604) 368-9341

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inhis posting on whitefish, Jay stated The fishing proclamation calls them gamefish here in Utah, but to my knowledge, most fishermen treat them as trash fish. Does anyone know if whitefish are edible?  (Well, of *course* they’re edible, but does anybody purposely fish for them and take them home for supper?)

     Whitefish are excellent eating, and they are truly wonderful smoked, which is easy to do. There is a good article and recipe in the latest issue of Big Sky Journal. Whitefish are best eaten when caught in the colder weather months, i.e. November through April.       In addition, whitefish provide some pretty good sport to any Ffisher with an open mind. They take dry flies, love nymphs, and fight respectably. They are NOT a trash fish. The term Trash Fish usually conjures up images of fish species that take over sections of river that become either too warm or too polluted to sustain hte more desireable game fish.  Also, trash fish are often accused, either rightly or wrongly,  of having a negative impact on trout or other gamefish populations, which is certainly not the case with Whitefish.      Whitefish, require the same pristine river conditions that trout do. Chances are that a river that can no longer sustain breeding trout populations can’t sustain whitefish either. They too are an indicator species for water quality. Finally they are a member of the overall family of which trout are also members, like second or third cousins, so they cant be all bad!  I wish trout fishermen who catch them would stop throwing them on the banks to die needlessly, and either return them to the rivers or take them home and make use out of them Dale Owens

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Well, Me and my girlfriend caught a couple on accident while fishing for crappie.  We took it home, and filleted them.  We froze them and then took them out of the freezer to thaw.  The thawed for a while (we went somewhere that weekend), and when we came back, they were ruined.  They filleted real nicely and had a lot of boneless meat to them, so They would not be a problem to try them and see if they are any good.  I hear they are good smoked.  We hear about them all the time in our hunting and fishing news, they are active about the same time the other fishes are spawning (they eat eggs).  People catch them on whitefish flies (what are whitefish flies), and also with a maggot on the fly.  This did not answer the question, but had to say my piece.

Response:

Whitefish are sought after up here in Ontario. You guys don’t know what you’re missing. They fillet great and are also stuffed/baked. They must be good if they are sold commeircially here but I get mine thru the ice on Simcoe and would rank them behind crappie and walleye in terms of tastiness They will also hit minnows and jigs. — Richard Park    

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.. would not be a problem to try them and see if they are any good.  I hear they are good smoked. …

I really like them smoked (although a lot of bones, but I don’t mind) … Peter

Response:

Jay  Clibern writes:

"The fishing proclamation calls them gamefish here in Utah, but to my knowledge, most fishermen treat them as trash fish. Does anyone know if whitefish are edible?  (Well, of *course* they’re edible, but does anybody purposely fish for them and take them home for supper?)" Jay – As ugly as they are, they are edible – smoked is the only way that I know of.  I can’t say I am a big fan, but lots of folks like them.  If you fish around Ennis, MT on the Madison, you can take 4 or 5 (or fewer) whitefish into the Resvedts Meat market, give them a fish and a dollar for each fish, and they will give you an already smoked whitefish. A big surprise to me is the fact that the whitefish is part of the trout family.  Hard to believe.  I don’t like whitefish (could you tell?), and to me nothing is as frustration as thinking you ahve a big trout on the line only to see that slimey rubber lipped head appear.  But that’s ony one man’s opinion. Lyman Hughes Ennis, MT Dallas, TX                                               Dallas, TX                                               Ennis, MT

Response:

The round whitefish is another Great Lakes species. Locally they are called "Menominee." I catch them off Michigan piers in October to freeze up. In 1994 I fished as late as after Christmas. They bite on a single poached salmon egg on the bottom. They are timid biters and the real trick is to know when they are after the bait. My family considers them delicious. Incidently, nobody fishes for them on the Wisconsin side of the lake. Wisconsin comercial fishermen net them but I’ve never seen anyone fishing for them in the Michigan manner.

Response:

you are correct about the Lake witefishes.  But the mountain whitefish of the Rockies and the Truckee drainage in California/Nevada ( The answer to a trivia question about distribution of Western Salomids before coming of the european )  are a completely different case then the  whitefish of the Great Lakes.        The Mountain Whitefish, otherwise Known as Salmo ( as they are a salmonid )  Carpi, have been extending their range.  It seams that with all the "progress"  and the wonderful benefit that strip mining brings to the landscape and the stream.  That the Mountain Whitefish is able to withstand the rapid changes in its environment, better then the trout.

Response:

I think that all the answers to the original note follow pretty much what I have read and heard about Whitefish.  I have just one other thought.  I am a catch-and-releaser, mainly because I really don’t like trout that much.  But that’s another story.  I have caught a zillion whitefish in Montana and Wyoming and I can truly say that in most cases I didn’t know they were whitefish until I got them up close in the stream.  That says that they gave me the fight I was looking for and if you don’t keep the fish, what difference does it make if it isn’t a trout but gives you pleasure in catching it?  I’ll have to admit I’m always a little disappointed when I see it’s not a trout since I came to catch trout.  But – accept the fun of the catch and the fight and enjoy the experience. John B. in Mpls..

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Re: white fish-Not to rehash other wf remarks, but … they do fight well and taste great! Have caught them in Madison fried them for breakfast and grilled them. Meat is white and chunky. I caught 16 last year on dry files in about 30 minutes. Way to tell if guy down stream has a wf, the rod tip will jiggle up and down and trout have more steady bend. I got ‘em, turned away from crowd to release them, still in water and everyone thought I was catching trout!!! Was fun.

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