Question:

I love you man! Op

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Given normal variation in preferences and style no one need ever know what your flies, whatever you decide to call them, are supposed to look like.  In this swap, only one person, besides yourself, will ever know whether or not any two copies of your pattern bear a familial resemblance to one another and I give you my personal guarantee that he’ll never talk. Wolfgang who knows where his masseuse lives ….but I can be bought. <seg  Well Op, you have nothing to worry about when it comes to me judging your tying efforts. Given my ratty-assed flies, there is no way I’d have the cojones to rate yours or anyone elses flies. You’re safe my friend. Frank Five Thumbs Church

Response:

You’re not helpin’ matters Eugene!  Now I’m in tears and have flushed all my previous ties. Op  –headin’ to Wally’s shop to buy 41 decently tied flyz–

ya want me set aside 41 different flies <g op, i plan on being there saturday am to do some paperwork and such. why doncha swing by with your stuff and we’ll see if we can fix ‘em up good fer ya. i’ll be leaving about noonish to go pick marie up from her folks house…… i might be able to fish sunday…. –walt

Response:

….well, let me knock you outa that preen boy… you tie a better fly than rachel and she’ll eviscerate you worse than any deer you never killed and gutted… we’re counting on you. jeff (you other fellas might take note as well) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Op  –findin’ encouragement, and the courage to tie in every post–

Response:

Given normal variation in preferences and style no one need ever know what your flies, whatever you decide to call them, are supposed to look like.  In this swap, only one person, besides yourself, will ever know whether or not any two copies of your pattern bear a familial resemblance to one another and I give you my personal guarantee that he’ll never talk. Wolfgang who knows where his masseuse lives

….but I can be bought. <seg  Well Op, you have nothing to worry about when it comes to me judging your tying efforts. Given my ratty-assed flies, there is no way I’d have the cojones to rate yours or anyone elses flies. You’re safe my friend. Frank Five Thumbs Church

Response:

op, thursday eve…. 6-6:30…… tommy’s fly tying class starts.

Snippage of good advice… Thanks for the heads-up Wally, but I think I will have to wait for the next session of classes.  If I work long and hard enough, I believe that I will be able to tie some decent flyz.  Once I complete this task, maybe we can go fishin’ like reel men do? Op

Response:

in the for what it is worth department, for some time, my elk hair caddis’s, no matter what technique I used to tie the hair on with, would always slip and not "lie straight" on the hook. though i put a few in the box anyway,I would never use them. One day on the hiwassee, during a massive caddis hatch, I changed flies from the emerger to the ehc, wasn’t not paying attention and tied on one of my crooked hair flies. really didn’t notice it until my fly landed admist the real ones. muttered an expletive and started to bring it in when a fish took it. then another, and another and so on. later i tried the same tie on another stream and caugh fish with it. A friend theorized that the fly looked like a cripple and therefore easier feeding for the trout. the moral if you want one is to emphasize the old saying, pretty flies are sometimes tied to catch fishermen and not fish. hang in there bubba.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have been paying, what seemed to be, outrageous prices for fake bugs! Once I finally settled on a pattern that I *thought* I could tie–tried numerous others first–I have a grand total of ten flyz tied:  three that I wouldn’t be ashamed to send off, two that I would send if push came to shove, and five that I wouldn’t give to my worst enemy

Response:

hmmm, that may be true but the opposite is also true….look at a group of flies that are more or less the same and you might say, hey those flies are not bad…but if you get the one which is on the crappy side of good, you might say these flies suck since you only see one crappy one and not the group. Eugene K.

sometimes, flies become more effective as they fall apart…why not tie them that way from the start…heehee Eugene K.

Response:

…..but if you get the one which is on the crappy side of good, you might say these flies suck since you only see one crappy one and not the group.

So remember, all of you:  only the one YOU got was crappy, dammit. JR (feeling less pressured about the whole business)

Response:

…….if you get the one which is on the crappy side of good, you might say these flies suck since you only see one crappy one and not the group.

look like? Wolfgang

Response:

So remember, all of you:  only the one YOU got was crappy, dammit. JR (feeling less pressured about the whole business)

OK, well maybe the one you and the one your buddy got were crappy, but the rest were fabulous, honest. Eugene K.

Response:

op, thursday eve…. 6-6:30…… tommy’s fly tying class starts. it runs for 6 weeks and is good…. tommy is a natural and can sure tie some flies. scenario: walt: damn, broke another herl. tommy: here, lemme show ya wally. waldo: ok tommy: see? waldo: yeah… way cool…. just 16 more tommy, just 16 more! –waldo, countin’ down the swap flies <g ps…. frank, could you please send me via e-mail your address so that i can get tomm…. err, my swap flies sent off to ya. pss: big dale, thankee!!!!!!! the yellahammas are beautiful, i’d like to send you some also, please e-mail addie….. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks for the offer Wally, but if I come to the shop, I will have to take on a second and third job!  Somethin’ about flyfishin’ goodies that I can’t resist.  It’s a drug I tell ya. Op op, come on by the shop and we’ll fix what needs fixin’…. –walt I have been paying, what seemed to be, outrageous prices for fake bugs! Once I finally settled on a pattern that I *thought* I could tie–tried numerous others first–I have a grand total of ten flyz tied:  three that I wouldn’t be ashamed to send off, two that I would send if push came to shove, and five that I wouldn’t give to my worst enemy–no not you God, sorry. Unfortunately, the five I wouldn’t wish on Osama weren’t the first five that I tied.  I guess this means that I am not necessarily gettin’ any better, but may just be lucky every third or so tie.  I bought a tyin’ tape, and have numerous books on the subject, but my hands don’t seem to comprehend what I have seen and read.  The elk and deer hair don’t do like it is supposed to, according to A.K. Best, anyway.  Yeah, he stopped by for a good laugh, but left in tears.  My bad. I figure if I tie 5 flyz a night and 20 or 30 on the weekends, I will have tied around 250 flyz by the deadline.  Hopefully, I will have at least 41 decent flyz by that time, otherwise I promise to buy Fortenberry a Cabela’s "Stowaway" and never call him God again!  Fortunately, him, my word is better than my likelihood of goin’ postal. Op  –never again– — Tight Lines, –Walt Fly Fishing NC & more… http://www.ezflyfish.com http://www.wilsoncreekoutfitters.com

– Tight Lines, –Walt Fly Fishing NC & more… http://www.ezflyfish.com http://www.wilsoncreekoutfitters.com

Response:

You ain’t just whistlin’ Dixie!  However, I only want women like I fish–catch and release.  I think Rod Stewart said it best, "don’t be here in the mornin’, when I wake up." Or somethin’ to that affect.

And just how long have you had this problem with fly-tying women who won’t go away? Poor baby.  ;^P Sandy — "…the sport and game of angling is the true means and cause that brings a man into a merry spirit, which…makes a flowering age and a long one." ~~ Dame Juliana Berners 1496

Response:

And just how long have you had this problem with fly-tying women who won’t go away? Poor baby.  ;^P Sandy —

Never had a problem of women shunnin’ me Sandy, fly-tiers or not.  I ain’t the most compromisin’ sort-o-fella, so I tend to do poorly in long term relations.  I figure my best bet is to meet a nice inflatable doll, and carry on a passionate but brief affair.  Ya know any good inflatable models? Op  –asexual in Lenoir–

Response:

It’s not the variation in each fly I worry about Wolfie.  It’s the look of any particular fly.  While I’m not able to tie a magnificent specimen, of any sort, I do know a beautifully tied fly when I see one and I suspect that others do as well. My flyz tend to be over-threaded, over-feathered, over-furred, well just plain over-all heavily tied.  I suspect that I try to tie them so that they won’t come apart, but they just end up fat and funny lookin’.  Given time, I believe that I will work this out.  I have already begun to pare down on the hackles and fur a bit.  Now I just need to work on wrappin’ each piece fewer times. I’ll get through this, yet, with a little help from my friends. Op  –takin’ the day off to buy new glasses, (maybe this will help?)–

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …..I’m tryin’ to tie flyz worthy of this most prestigious swap….. Given normal variation in preferences and style no one need ever know what your flies, whatever you decide to call them, are supposed to look like.  In this swap, only one person, besides yourself, will ever know whether or not any two copies of your pattern bear a familial resemblance to one another and I give you my personal guarantee that he’ll never talk. Wolfgang who knows where his masseuse lives

Response:

You’re not helpin’ matters Eugene!  Now I’m in tears and have flushed all my previous ties. Op  –headin’ to Wally’s shop to buy 41 decently tied flyz– – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – In this swap, only one person, besides yourself, will ever know whether or not any two copies of your pattern bear a familial resemblance to one another and I give you my personal guarantee that he’ll never talk. Wolfgang who knows where his masseuse lives hmmm, that may be true but the opposite is also true….look at a group of flies that are more or less the same and you might say, hey those flies are not bad…but if you get the one which is on the crappy side of good, you might say these flies suck since you only see one crappy one and not the group. Eugene K.

Response:

You’re right Wayne.  I have yet to tie a fly that didn’t catch at least one trout, even my infamous "Golden Fuzzy Butt."  Yet, I can’t help but want to tie a decent lookin’ presentation for youz guyz.  I’ll try not to belabor the matter any longer. Op  –findin’ encouragement, and the courage to tie in every post–

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – in the for what it is worth department, for some time, my elk hair caddis’s, no matter what technique I used to tie the hair on with, would always slip and not "lie straight" on the hook. though i put a few in the box anyway,I would never use them. One day on the hiwassee, during a massive caddis hatch, I changed flies from the emerger to the ehc, wasn’t not paying attention and tied on one of my crooked hair flies. really didn’t notice it until my fly landed admist the real ones. muttered an expletive and started to bring it in when a fish took it. then another, and another and so on. later i tried the same tie on another stream and caugh fish with it. A friend theorized that the fly looked like a cripple and therefore easier feeding for the trout. the moral if you want one is to emphasize the old saying, pretty flies are sometimes tied to catch fishermen and not fish. hang in there bubba. I have been paying, what seemed to be, outrageous prices for fake bugs! Once I finally settled on a pattern that I *thought* I could tie–tried numerous others first–I have a grand total of ten flyz tied:  three that I wouldn’t be ashamed to send off, two that I would send if push came to shove, and five that I wouldn’t give to my worst enemy

Response:

Thanks for the offer Wally, but if I come to the shop, I will have to take on a second and third job!  Somethin’ about flyfishin’ goodies that I can’t resist.  It’s a drug I tell ya. Op

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – op, come on by the shop and we’ll fix what needs fixin’…. –walt I have been paying, what seemed to be, outrageous prices for fake bugs! Once I finally settled on a pattern that I *thought* I could tie–tried numerous others first–I have a grand total of ten flyz tied:  three that I wouldn’t be ashamed to send off, two that I would send if push came to shove, and five that I wouldn’t give to my worst enemy–no not you God, sorry. Unfortunately, the five I wouldn’t wish on Osama weren’t the first five that I tied.  I guess this means that I am not necessarily gettin’ any better, but may just be lucky every third or so tie.  I bought a tyin’ tape, and have numerous books on the subject, but my hands don’t seem to comprehend what I have seen and read.  The elk and deer hair don’t do like it is supposed to, according to A.K. Best, anyway.  Yeah, he stopped by for a good laugh, but left in tears.  My bad. I figure if I tie 5 flyz a night and 20 or 30 on the weekends, I will have tied around 250 flyz by the deadline.  Hopefully, I will have at least 41 decent flyz by that time, otherwise I promise to buy Fortenberry a Cabela’s "Stowaway" and never call him God again!  Fortunately, him, my word is better than my likelihood of goin’ postal. Op  –never again– — Tight Lines, –Walt Fly Fishing NC & more… http://www.ezflyfish.com http://www.wilsoncreekoutfitters.com

Response:

…..I’m tryin’ to tie flyz worthy of this most prestigious swap…..

Given normal variation in preferences and style no one need ever know what your flies, whatever you decide to call them, are supposed to look like.  In this swap, only one person, besides yourself, will ever know whether or not any two copies of your pattern bear a familial resemblance to one another and I give you my personal guarantee that he’ll never talk. Wolfgang who knows where his masseuse lives

Response:

In this swap, only one person, besides yourself, will ever know whether or not any two copies of your pattern bear a familial resemblance to one another and I give you my personal guarantee that he’ll never talk. Wolfgang who knows where his masseuse lives

hmmm, that may be true but the opposite is also true….look at a group of flies that are more or less the same and you might say, hey those flies are not bad…but if you get the one which is on the crappy side of good, you might say these flies suck since you only see one crappy one and not the group. Eugene K.

Response:

You ain’t just whistlin’ Dixie!  However, I only want women like I fish–catch and release.  I think Rod Stewart said it best, "don’t be here in the mornin’, when I wake up." Or somethin’ to that affect. Good luck with you flyz, I know I will appreciate them! Op

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …here’s a hint op…women.  …you need to find you a couple, be nice to em, tell em about the "art" of flytying, how you just know they are artistic souls, etc…  get my drift?  course you’re way ahead of us, er…rachel… we have completed 2 mutants, but seem to be increasing speed of the ties…i’m sure quality will creep in a few times before we’re (she’s) finished…. jeff (mutant master) I have been paying, what seemed to be, outrageous prices for fake bugs! Once I finally settled on a pattern that I *thought* I could tie–tried numerous others first–I have a grand total of ten flyz tied:  three that I wouldn’t be ashamed to send off, two that I would send if push came to shove, and five that I wouldn’t give to my worst enemy–no not you God, sorry. Unfortunately, the five I wouldn’t wish on Osama weren’t the first five that I tied.  I guess this means that I am not necessarily gettin’ any better, but may just be lucky every third or so tie.  I bought a tyin’ tape, and have numerous books on the subject, but my hands don’t seem to comprehend what I have seen and read.  The elk and deer hair don’t do like it is supposed to, according to A.K. Best, anyway.  Yeah, he stopped by for a good laugh, but left in tears.  My bad. I figure if I tie 5 flyz a night and 20 or 30 on the weekends, I will have tied around 250 flyz by the deadline.  Hopefully, I will have at least 41 decent flyz by that time, otherwise I promise to buy Fortenberry a Cabela’s "Stowaway" and never call him God again!  Fortunately, him, my word is better than my likelihood of goin’ postal. Op  –never again–

Response:

I have been paying, what seemed to be, outrageous prices for fake bugs! Once I finally settled on a pattern that I *thought* I could tie–tried numerous others first–I have a grand total of ten flyz tied:  three that I wouldn’t be ashamed to send off, two that I would send if push came to shove, and five that I wouldn’t give to my worst enemy–no not you God, sorry. Unfortunately, the five I wouldn’t wish on Osama weren’t the first five that I tied.  I guess this means that I am not necessarily gettin’ any better, but may just be lucky every third or so tie.  I bought a tyin’ tape, and have numerous books on the subject, but my hands don’t seem to comprehend what I have seen and read.  The elk and deer hair don’t do like it is supposed to, according to A.K. Best, anyway.  Yeah, he stopped by for a good laugh, but left in tears.  My bad. I figure if I tie 5 flyz a night and 20 or 30 on the weekends, I will have tied around 250 flyz by the deadline.  Hopefully, I will have at least 41 decent flyz by that time, otherwise I promise to buy Fortenberry a Cabela’s "Stowaway" and never call him God again!  Fortunately, him, my word is better than my likelihood of goin’ postal. Op  –never again–

Response:

op, come on by the shop and we’ll fix what needs fixin’…. –walt – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have been paying, what seemed to be, outrageous prices for fake bugs! Once I finally settled on a pattern that I *thought* I could tie–tried numerous others first–I have a grand total of ten flyz tied:  three that I wouldn’t be ashamed to send off, two that I would send if push came to shove, and five that I wouldn’t give to my worst enemy–no not you God, sorry. Unfortunately, the five I wouldn’t wish on Osama weren’t the first five that I tied.  I guess this means that I am not necessarily gettin’ any better, but may just be lucky every third or so tie.  I bought a tyin’ tape, and have numerous books on the subject, but my hands don’t seem to comprehend what I have seen and read.  The elk and deer hair don’t do like it is supposed to, according to A.K. Best, anyway.  Yeah, he stopped by for a good laugh, but left in tears.  My bad. I figure if I tie 5 flyz a night and 20 or 30 on the weekends, I will have tied around 250 flyz by the deadline.  Hopefully, I will have at least 41 decent flyz by that time, otherwise I promise to buy Fortenberry a Cabela’s "Stowaway" and never call him God again!  Fortunately, him, my word is better than my likelihood of goin’ postal. Op  –never again–

– Tight Lines, –Walt Fly Fishing NC & more… http://www.ezflyfish.com http://www.wilsoncreekoutfitters.com

Response:

…here’s a hint op…women.  …you need to find you a couple, be nice to em, tell em about the "art" of flytying, how you just know they are artistic souls, etc…  get my drift?  course you’re way ahead of us, er…rachel… we have completed 2 mutants, but seem to be increasing speed of the ties…i’m sure quality will creep in a few times before we’re (she’s) finished…. jeff (mutant master) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have been paying, what seemed to be, outrageous prices for fake bugs! Once I finally settled on a pattern that I *thought* I could tie–tried numerous others first–I have a grand total of ten flyz tied:  three that I wouldn’t be ashamed to send off, two that I would send if push came to shove, and five that I wouldn’t give to my worst enemy–no not you God, sorry. Unfortunately, the five I wouldn’t wish on Osama weren’t the first five that I tied.  I guess this means that I am not necessarily gettin’ any better, but may just be lucky every third or so tie.  I bought a tyin’ tape, and have numerous books on the subject, but my hands don’t seem to comprehend what I have seen and read.  The elk and deer hair don’t do like it is supposed to, according to A.K. Best, anyway.  Yeah, he stopped by for a good laugh, but left in tears.  My bad. I figure if I tie 5 flyz a night and 20 or 30 on the weekends, I will have tied around 250 flyz by the deadline.  Hopefully, I will have at least 41 decent flyz by that time, otherwise I promise to buy Fortenberry a Cabela’s "Stowaway" and never call him God again!  Fortunately, him, my word is better than my likelihood of goin’ postal. Op  –never again–

Response:

I have been paying, what seemed to be, outrageous prices for fake bugs! Once I finally settled on a pattern that I *thought* I could tie–tried numerous others first–I have a grand total of ten flyz tied:  three that I wouldn’t be ashamed to send off, two that I would send if push came to shove, and five that I wouldn’t give to my worst enemy–no not you God, sorry.

If the trout down your way are like the ones up here in the Great White North, they will gobble down your five worst as good as, if not better than, the ones that appeal to you. G.Cleveland

Response:

Thanks for your encouragement George, but I ain’t tryin to impress the trout at this point, I’m tryin’ to tie flyz worthy of this most prestigious swap. I know there are goin’ to be some expert fly tiers represented in this affair, and I don’t want to send out trash flyz. I tied a nymph pattern a couple a years back–Opie’s Ugly– and it catches trout with the best of them, but I was too ashamed of the looks of it to pass it on to others.  Surprisingly, I purchased a book at Uncle Wally’s shop last Sat. and lo and behold I found a fly that looked so much like my Ugly that one would think I had copied the pattern without actually using the same materials, of course.  The pattern is the Hatching Caddis, tied by David Wotten, and pictured in "Flys For Trout" by Dick Stewart and Farrow Allen. I will continue to work on my skills/lack of skill, and send out the best that I can.  I’m glad I decided to join this swap, as I have been wanting to force myself to tie for some time, but I’m just not disciplined enough to work at it with out some kind of pressure exerted upon myself.  Having spent a small fortune–to a lowly electrician–on materials and tools, I now think I can find the incentive to actually tie more often.  If I am successful in my endeavor to persever, Wally will lose business at one end and gain on the other end. Thanks again! Op

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have been paying, what seemed to be, outrageous prices for fake bugs! Once I finally settled on a pattern that I *thought* I could tie–tried numerous others first–I have a grand total of ten flyz tied:  three that I wouldn’t be ashamed to send off, two that I would send if push came to shove, and five that I wouldn’t give to my worst enemy–no not you God, sorry. If the trout down your way are like the ones up here in the Great White North, they will gobble down your five worst as good as, if not better than, the ones that appeal to you. G.Cleveland

Response:

Question:

Item from this evening’s Capital Times (Madison, WI): FISHERMAN’S BRAWL LEAVES 1 MAN DEAD A man was killed Sunday in a brawl among six anglers vying for the same fishing spot. Craig Alan Buckley, 35, died on the Matanzas Bridge on Florida’s east coast. The cause of death was pending results of an autopsy, St. Johns County Sheriff’s officials said. Three men were arrested, including Buckley’s brother, David Todd Buckley, 37, of Peoria, Ill., who was charged with aggravated assault. Kenneth Eubanks, 39, of Tallahassee, and James Robert Nelson, 36, of Palatka, were charged with manslaughter. Nelson also was charged with aggravated assault. Must’ve been a helluva hatch…..

Response:

that’s why i gave up fishing for migratory species and started chasing resident trout in little streams…once you get past the need to catch the biggest trout in the world, everything opens up and you can start to have some fun…wahoo! Eugene

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Item from this evening’s Capital Times (Madison, WI): FISHERMAN’S BRAWL LEAVES 1 MAN DEAD A man was killed Sunday in a brawl among six anglers vying for the same fishing spot. Craig Alan Buckley, 35, died on the Matanzas Bridge on Florida’s east coast. The cause of death was pending results of an autopsy, St. Johns County Sheriff’s officials said. Three men were arrested, including Buckley’s brother, David Todd Buckley, 37, of Peoria, Ill., who was charged with aggravated assault. Kenneth Eubanks, 39, of Tallahassee, and James Robert Nelson, 36, of Palatka, were charged with manslaughter. Nelson also was charged with aggravated assault. Must’ve been a helluva hatch…..

Response:

Wonder how this ended up in a wis newspaper but I think a little geography lesson is called for. The Matanzas bridge is part of A1A, it spans the Matanzas inlet near St.Augestine. The inlet is a link between the Atlantic and the Intercoastal waterway. When conditions are right it is one of the most productive fisheries in the country, with actively feeding fish of every south eastern variety. Unfortunately the bridge is also wall to wall with fishermen from all over usually jockeying for position over the channel and tempers do flair. So it may have been a case of justifiable homicide. — John Popp in Sanford Fl.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Item from this evening’s Capital Times (Madison, WI): FISHERMAN’S BRAWL LEAVES 1 MAN DEAD A man was killed Sunday in a brawl among six anglers vying for the same fishing spot. Craig Alan Buckley, 35, died on the Matanzas Bridge on Florida’s east coast. The cause of death was pending results of an autopsy, St. Johns County Sheriff’s officials said. Three men were arrested, including Buckley’s brother, David Todd Buckley, 37, of Peoria, Ill., who was charged with aggravated assault. Kenneth Eubanks, 39, of Tallahassee, and James Robert Nelson, 36, of Palatka, were charged with manslaughter. Nelson also was charged with aggravated assault. Must’ve been a helluva hatch…..

Response:

Wonder how this ended up in a wis newspaper

I read it this morning in the SF Chronicle.

Response:

John, Good to see ya back. Did ya git any big bucketmouths in the Johns this year? Was it the Bridge of Lions where the homicide occured? I don’t recall catwalks on that bridge…… I always liked fishing down stream from there….. by the old fort on the south end below crescent…. jesus, i’m getting old, can’t ‘member the name. I’m coming down to Jax for xmas….. hope to wet a line somewhere…. most likely Palm Coast area. tight lines ya old salty dog, walt

Response:

NO, the bridge at matanzas inlet by all accounts, when the tide changes there every thing from massive tarpon to sea trout go into a feeding frenzy on bait fish from the intercoastal. I like to fly fish for flounder from the sand flats there. You might try it when you come down, it’s a blast. a good minnow on a floating line and slow retrieve work well. Minimum gear is 7wt with 5lb tippit. — John Popp in Sanford Fl.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – John, Good to see ya back. Did ya git any big bucketmouths in the Johns this year? Was it the Bridge of Lions where the homicide occured? I don’t recall catwalks on that bridge…… I always liked fishing down stream from there….. by the old fort on the south end below crescent…. jesus, i’m getting old, can’t ‘member the name. I’m coming down to Jax for xmas….. hope to wet a line somewhere…. most likely Palm Coast area. tight lines ya old salty dog, walt

Response:

Yes, but it’s unethical… Chas – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is it still legal to report Florida news outside of the state? <g — Charlie…

Response:

Jim Rome (sp) did a very funny take this morning on the topic. Willi

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Wonder how this ended up in a wis newspaper I read it this morning in the SF Chronicle. My wife saw it in the Buffalo News (Buffalo, NY). Is it still legal to report Florida news outside of the state? <g — Charlie…

The reason I wondered is. Why the interest in one Fl. dead guy ? Guess there are no killings in those states, Hell I wouldn’t wear a new pair of sneakers in most parts of Detroit and I bypassed NY city on my way to Vermont. On those trips I also removed NRA decals to keep from being ILLEGALLY stopped and searched in N.J. John Popp

Response:

On those trips I also removed NRA decals to keep from being ILLEGALLY stopped and searched in N.J.

You kiddin me?   You’ll arm with guns yourself to support your 2nd Amendment right but are too panty-waisted to leave stickers in your window to stand up for the First & Fourth?   <vbg Joe F.

Response:

I usually travel armed. the NJ highway patrol had made an official announcement that dispite the law or courts, "anyone carrying guns into the state would be arrested and guns confiscated". I felt it prudent to not try the system with my meager income. I did place my NRA hats on the dash and back shelf while transversing other states. By the way they were better seen and I got a lot of honks and did a lot of friendly waving. — John Popp in Sanford Fl.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – On those trips I also removed NRA decals to keep from being ILLEGALLY stopped and searched in N.J. You kiddin me?   You’ll arm with guns yourself to support your 2nd Amendment right but are too panty-waisted to leave stickers in your window to stand up for the First & Fourth?   <vbg Joe F.

Response:

Question:

<Good report snipped What, no whitefish to report about Jeff? Darin

Response:

Jeff C writes:

(snip for brev) – Jeff Miller’s week: up at 5:30 to fish before breakfast.  Sometimes pack a lunch to fish straight through.  At dinner, eat everything he ordered plus half of Dene’s order,

You mean to tell me that scurrilous lawyer from the great North State was also eating Dene’s food?  Helll, when he sat opposite me I had to build a defensive wall consisting of wine bottles, water glasses, etc. to keep my food from ending up in his plate.  Somewhere there is a picture of Jeffy, ala the picture of Dorian Gray, growing fatter and fatter and fatter, while our beloved yet scurrilous friend remains lean and mean. As far as Benee goes —- well, if I didn’t have to take a leak so badly, we’d *still* be in the 2nd current catching big brookies and salmon.  I enjoyed meeting her, Jeff, and hope the both of you can come back. Dave LaCourse, Bottom Dweller

Response:

Helll, when [Jeffy] sat opposite me I had to build a defensive wall consisting of wine bottles, water glasses, etc. to keep my food from ending up in his plate.

That’s good …hope the both of you can come back.

Yes, that would be good. Regards, Jeff

Response:

What, no whitefish to report about Jeff?

I forgot!  No whitefish!  One nice thing about the fishing there is that when you hook something it’s either a salmon or brook trout (although there were rumours of some browns being in the water, which was made more confusing because apparently some salmon had red spots.)  And you know immediately which one it is by the direction the fish streaks – north or south Regards, Jeff

Response:

Jeff C writes: What, no whitefish to report about Jeff? I forgot!  No whitefish!  One nice thing about the fishing there is that when you hook something it’s either a salmon or brook trout (although there were rumours of some browns being in the water, which was made more confusing because apparently some salmon had red spots.)  And you know immediately which one it is by the direction the fish streaks – north or south Regards, Jeff

There are both chubs (large shiner-like fish) and suckers in the Rapid.  The chubs will hit a streamer and the suckers regularly take a nymph.  In fact, on Monday I took a slucker out of 1st current.  Peter was at the tail of the current and couldn’t see it — he thought it was a big brookie.  There are also yellow perch and supposedly small mouth bass.  I’ve caught a yellow perch, but never a bass. Dave LaCourse

Response:

There are also yellow perch and supposedly small mouth bass.

I remember now I saw a sign on the riverside that said smallmouth had been illegally "stocked" in the river.  It encouraged fishermen to keep any smallmouth that were caught, since they are "very aggressive" (in taking over trout habitat.)  I have to admit I would have been shocked to catch a perch Regards, Jeff

Response:

- Benee and I really enjoyed our trip to Lakewood.  Ever since I dropped in on this group and mentioned to Benee the sort of names I’ve been called, she really had no interest in reading or posting.  She’s not a big internet surfer in any case.  But slowly I was able to convince her she’d enjoy a clave like the one in Maine.  I think one of the things that intrigued her was some of the handles of ROFF posters: Indian Joe, Pamlico Jim, Daytripper, Fishworship, Flyfish, Big Dale, Bruiser, Wayno, and now I guess Zimbo??, etc.  She says she will invent her own handle and post a trip report herself, and she also has pics to contribute. – First I’d like to say that one of my primary goals was to see Benee catch her first trout on a fly.  Now, as many of you know, teaching fly fishing to your significant other ranks right up there with showing them how to golf. According to Peter Charles, it is second to hanging wallpaper together.  So I’m very thankful to Dave LaCourse who not only provided a pleasant guiding experience to Benee, but actually helped her catch her first fish.  There was one tag team effort between Dave and Benee on a brookie of about 17", and after that Benee caught a salmon on her own that appeared somewhere around 14-16". Mission accomplished!! – My dream fish for the trip was an 18" native brook trout.  I never caught that fish, but I was pleasantly surprised by the salmon, which went ballistic when hooked, as Zimbo said. – I cannot claim the biggest fish, the most fish, the largest fish on a little hook, or any other meaningful accomplishment, but I do claim the toughest river crossing – *below* lower dam.  I made it, but not recommended. – I wasn’t able to stay long enough for the raffle, but look forward to whatever I might have gotten.  Also sorry I missed the bonfire.  On the way out Wednesday morning, I ran into Dave Tatosian, Paul Goodwin, and Dave (Bottom ? flyfish).  Glad I was able to at least say hi to Dave again but sorry we again didn’t get a chance to fish. – Dave LaCourse drives an Audi.  When Dave asked Benee what she did, Benee said she was an audiologist.  Dave asked Benee if she could look at his car. – One thing that’s fun about fishing with a newbie is a fresh look at some of the lingo we take for granted.  When you or I might say "Had a few splashy refusals", Benee would say "I think I had a nibble.  Didn’t pan out though." – From the sound of things, the better fishing seems to have been in the second half of the week.  Oh well!  That’s the kind of thing that keeps you coming back. – The accomodations were exactly my style.  On Sunday I only had half a day to fish, so I took a lunch with me to the river.  There wasn’t anything unique or special in the lunch bag, yet the lunch out on the river, under absolutely beautiful skies and perfect temperature, *was* special and it tasted damn good.  Hard to say why, but you know what I mean. – Jeff Miller’s week: up at 5:30 to fish before breakfast.  Sometimes pack a lunch to fish straight through.  At dinner, eat everything he ordered plus half of Dene’s order, and start drinking wine.  After dinner, sit in a rocking chair and start drinking heavier stuff.  At some point while listening to the "party", drift off to sleep.  Repeat. – It turns out Indian Joe and Dene stayed at the same bed and breakfast that Benee and I did in Portland Thursday night.  The contrast between the brochure and the actual accomodations was a joke!  Luckily we had good company to share the laugh with. – Well, Dave did a great job with the organization, thank you. Regards, Jeff

Response:

Question:

Can anyone suggest a good web site for info/maps/reviews on fly fishing within a short drive of the Northern VA area? Thanks. Phil Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

Can anyone suggest a good web site for info/maps/reviews on fly fishing within a short drive of the Northern VA area? Thanks. Phil

www.murraysflyshop.com — Wayne To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

Response:

Phil asks: Can anyone suggest a good web site for info/maps/reviews on fly

fishing within a short drive of the Northern VA area?< http://www.murraysflyshop.com/

Response:

You should get a copy of the January issue of Virginia Wildlife, which contains a comprehensive list (and maps) of wild and stocked trout streams throughout Virginia.  Much of this information, including stocking schedules, is also available at:  http://www.dgif.state.va.us Accotink creek, near Springfield/Burke (accessible from Wakefield Park off Braddock Road–very close to the Braddock Rd S/W exit from 495) is a delayed harvest stream in the Northern Virginia area, but aside from a large pool near the south end of the park, there isn’t much action here, and the water is usually pretty low (though I’ve rarely fished this and would defer to other peoples’ experiences). Your best bet is to head west, towards Shenandoah National Park.  From the beltway, you can be in the Rose or the Hughes in a little over an hour, though this time of year the stocked sections of the stream are pretty well fished out and you’ll have to hike up into the park for the natives.  You may also want to descend from Skyline drive on the top–the Hughes river near Corbin Cabin can be a particularly fine spot.  But be warned–fishing in Virginia during the summer months can be rough going.  That’s not to say that you won’t enjoy some beautiful wilderness, and may wade miles of stream without seeing another fisherman (even on a weekend), but the water is often quite low in the summer, and although you’ll find large groups of native locked into pools at various points, you have to be at the top of your game to hook one in July or August. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Can anyone suggest a good web site for info/maps/reviews on fly fishing within a short drive of the Northern VA area? Thanks. Phil Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

 but the water is often quite low in the summer, and although you’ll find large groups of native locked into pools at various points, you have to be at the top of your game to hook one in July or August.

Be careful fishing pools like that during low water, you can kill a lot of fish that took years to grow. Better slide on down to the South Fork (of the Shenandoah) and fish for smallmouth. Lotsa smallies and they bite good. The commute is not any longer, so it is worth a try. Just my two cents worth. John still in the Shenandoah Valley

Response:

Question:

If you fish lakes for trout and other species, this is for you. Whether a pro or a beginner the articles will be welcomed. Fly patterns techniques, how-to and all the pitfalls when selecting equipment and where to use it and when. Best of all it’s FREE!

Response:

Ok it’s free, but where the heck is the site? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If you fish lakes for trout and other species, this is for you. Whether a pro or a beginner the articles will be welcomed. Fly patterns techniques, how-to and all the pitfalls when selecting equipment and where to use it and when. Best of all it’s FREE!

Response:

Ok it’s free, but where the heck is the site?

I can’t help you with the URL for the original poster’s magazine (can’t find it myself), but there is a decent on line magazine at http://www.fishandfly.co.uk , if you’re interested. Brian Cass

Response:

Ok it’s free, but where the heck is the site? If you fish lakes for trout and other species, this is for you. Whether a pro or a beginner the articles will be welcomed. Fly patterns techniques, how-to and all the pitfalls when selecting equipment and where to use it and when. Best of all it’s FREE!

Try http://www.rural.escape.ca/angling_north/ and click on "fly fishing".

Response:

Try http://www.rural.escape.ca/angling_north/ and click on "fly fishing".

And it will be well worth your time — set aside an evening for it. Bob Sheedy knows more about flyfishing for trout in lakes than all the rest of us put together, and I suspect he catches more 20+ inch trout before lunch on the average weekend than I have caught in my life. Be sure to get a towel to wipe the drool off your keyboard when you see the pictures of the trout he catches.  Bob, if you’re listening, you want to set up a Prairie Clave sometime? Kevin

Response:

What’s the address dude?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If you fish lakes for trout and other species, this is for you. Whether a pro or a beginner the articles will be welcomed. Fly patterns techniques, how-to and all the pitfalls when selecting equipment and where to use it and when. Best of all it’s FREE!

Response:

Question:

my partner and i are planning a trip to missoula this summer to see an old friend. unfortunately, he doesn’t fish, so there’s no immediate info on runnoff, snowpack, etc. we’re two wisconsin steelhead anglers who’ve soured on the notion of stampede fishing. we’d like to come to montana to escape the crowds. what’s that mean? we’re looking for a bit of info on runoff so we can avoid the crowds while still hitting a few nice dry-fly days. and we’re not necessarily looking for that "true" montana big water experience either. just a good trip, some challenges but more relaxing and just a general time to ease out. in our minds, brook trout caught in uncrowded waters are sometimes bigger than a brown in a crowd. hope this provides some info on what sort of trip we’re looking for a small glimpse on the sort of guys we are. *as a note, we’re interested in a few guided days, so any guides are encouraged to respond by email. thanks, jason

Response:

my partner and i are planning a trip to missoula

I’m not sure what exactly you’re looking for, or when you’re trip is planned.  I live outside Missoula.  I can tell you we have about average snowpack this year, so we’ll probably have an average run-off, which means forget all of May and most of June.  The last week or two of June might be all right.  But when run-off is running off, everything’s pretty blown out.  The nice thing is, different rivers go at different times.  Often Rock Creek will blow and clear while the Clark Fork is blowing.  The Blackfoot is usually a little later than the others.  That said, of course, depnding on how everything comes off, you could catch an amazing days or two on Rock Creek with the salmonfly hatch.  You’ll want a guide for that, and for my money the best guides are out of the Kingfisher fly shop, which I don’t have a phone number for, but they’re in information and they’re right off the interstate, first Missoula exit if you’re coming from the east.  Those guys hands down, no question, beyond a doubt have the best guides in town. From the last week in June through July and August you should have excellent fishing.  I would suggest hitting some of the Idaho panhandle streams (which I don’t want to post the names of, but ask around when you get here).  I’d also try the North Fork of the Blackfoot, way, way up, hike-in style, just because it’s a fantastic experience, and also often full of cutts and sometimes bull trout (which are endangered species so catching them is a no-no).  Upper upper Rock Creek can be nice, but the problem there is going to be crowds.  The Bitterroot is, well, see this month’s Fly Rod & Reel magazine.  The Clark Fork above Rock Creek is a waste of time, but from Rock Creek down all the way to St. Regis there’s very good water.  You’re going to find most of your fish up against the banks.  Depending on the time ofyear you’re here you could catch golden stonefly hatches, pmd hatches, really steady evening caddis blizzards, among other things (baetis, etc).    Missoula has very good fishing, very close, but it’s often overlooked for the more famous fisheries over by Bozeman.  I think you should hang around the Kingfisher, and call me if you want.  You should be in for some real treats.

Response:

Question:

Hi Jess, I  couldnt agree more, I grew up in England a long time after the depression, but I can appreciate your sentiments entirely. I enjoyed your article as well ! Keep up the good work ! Mike – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

With the prices of new, state-of-the-art graphites approaching $600, I would say that we are entering a period of reverse bamboo snobbery! For $600 you can get a hell of deal on a used, 7 1/2-8 ft bamboo of good lineage.  You just have to pay attention to the used tackle lists. –Rich

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hello, The fishing news groups are quite new to me.  As I browse and read the messages, I find that some feelings exist against flyfishing and flyfishers, and more particularly against the users of bamboo as being somehow snobbish or elite.  I don’t want to offend anybody, but would it be okay if I say something about this?  If you don’t want to read it, please just skip it now. I’m an old guy who grew up poor, without complaint then or now, during the depression.  I had a paper route, did odd jobs, shoveled snow, mowed lawns. In 1940, when I was 14, my first fly rod cost me $1.67 at a Coast to Coast hardware store, and with it I bought some cheap gut leaders.  Nothing snobbish about that or the way we fished.  After Navy duty in WWII, I first tied flies with supplies bought by mail from old George Leonard Herter.   Nothing snobbish about George Leonard.  Not no way, not no how.  In 1947, with blank sections bought from old George, I made up a bamboo rod, to save a buck and have some fun.   For me, yet, at 71, to go out with a bamboo rod makes me feel a bit like the kid with a stick, off to try to catch a fish.  I don’t even mind (please forgive) if somebody calls a bamboo rod a "fishpole."  "Let’s get our poles and go fishing."  "When?"  "Now!"  Nothing snobbish about that. Bamboo.  It’s fun to say.  Like "greenheart," another word that’s fun to say.  Unlike, to me,  "fibreglas"  or "graphite."  Further, it’s fun to fiddle with bamboo, with thread,  guides, tiptops.  Fun, even, to scrape off old varnish.  Yes, and to put it all together and wave it around and get the feel of that stick.   It is, after all, just a bunch of sticks glued together into one stick, isn’t it? Certainly, much science and technology goes into the making of a fibreglas or graphite rod.  Largely it’s a mystery to me, maybe to most of us.  On the other hand, I can somewhat understand the making of a bamboo rod, and I admire and respect the handwork, the craftsmanship that goes into its initial construction.  Not many people do much with their hands any more. Maybe it’s just a feeling for tradition.   Probably because of that feeling, I admire the warmth of wood, of bamboo. Admire it, maybe even, to……caress it.  I haven’t yet caressed a fibreglas or graphite rod.   Well, I have a pretty good Browning graphite (60 bucks) and a (wow) 80+ dollar IMG with a beautiful reel seat, made in Taiwan, and I’ve almost caressed it, but…..not like bamboo.  I recognize that a kid or teenager today, first used to graphite, may well have the same affection for his or her "new pole."   Moreover I realize that a fibreglas or graphite rod delivers more "power.’ It will not rot or come unglued or take a set.  You can’t slam the car door or close the trunk lid on it, but it will stand some abuse.  You have to give more care to bamboo.   But that was for me a good learning process.  You can’t treat bamboo like the horse that was "rode hard and put away wet."  You must wipe it off, dry it, keep it dry.  You don’t stand it in a corner or against the wall or bang it around.  You nurse it, gentle it, dare I say, respect it?  But that’s a good lesson to apply not only to a flyrod (or to any kind of fishing equipment), but to bicyles, clothes, cars, even…..to people. With this background, it never dawned on me that flyfishing or bamboo had anything snobbish about it, or that it was for any kind of elite.  If I had felt that, I would have known that I didn’t belong.  So it does bother me somewhat that in recent years flyfishing has given the impression to some that it has gone "high class" or Hollywood-ish, and that is has probably in fact drawn some snobs, or that some feel snobbish about their place in it. At the same time, I don’t begrudge those who can pay for expensive lessons, hire guides, buy thousands of dollars worth of equipment.  A couple years ago, at a shop in Livingston, the owner’s son told me that they had just sold a $1,600 Ovis rod over the phone, to mail out.  I can only blink at such goings on. Not to go off into rapture or anything like it, but to me one of the beautiful things about flycasting lies in the curve that a flyline makes when you throw it.  Have you seen Winslow Homer’s painting of the guy in the canoe, moving his flyline through the air?  Nature, if this is correct, has no straight lines, and the graceful flow of a flyline seems somehow alive.  Actually, I’d say the same thing about any kind of line flowing from any kind of rod or reel, for it’s not restricted to fly casting, and I do enjoy all kinds of fishing.   Like water that’s too high and gone off color, some things still rile me. But then too, as you grow older, you generally grow more respectful of the way others go about things.  So it seems to me that the world has room for the kid with a stick, for the guy in between who just wants to get off somewhere and fish a bit, and for snobs as well.  Who knows but what any of us might be a snob, if we just had the money. I hope with this bit that I haven’t touched anybody off.  If so, please ignore it.  It’ll pass quickly.  And you could have just skipped it.   Jess Thompson

Hi Jess, You have not missed anything. In fact you got to fish when it was still wild in America. Today much of the wild feeling is gone. Streams are crowded and stocked with hatchery fish. You were lucky to have been born when you were.  You really appreciate what you have and the good memories. I have memories of my youth that are good also ever though I was born in 1945. I have a bunch of old fish buddies that are now 70 to 80 years old. They have told me lots of great tales of the fishing when you and they were young. I feel that the youth of today are missing out on the simple fun that once was. Even though you remember the depression, you were born at the best time in America for a good life. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – = Hello, The fishing news groups are quite new to me.  As I browse and read the messages, I find that some feelings exist against flyfishing and flyfishers, and more particularly against the users of bamboo as being somehow snobbish or elite.  I don’t want to offend anybody, but would i= t be okay if I say something about this?  If you don’t want to read it, plea= se just skip it now. = I’m an old guy who grew up poor, without complaint then or now, during = the depression.  I had a paper route, did odd jobs, shoveled snow, mowed la= wns.  In 1940, when I was 14, my first fly rod cost me $1.67 at a Coast to C= oast hardware store, and with it I bought some cheap gut leaders.  Nothing snobbish about that or the way we fished.  After Navy duty in WWII, I f= irst tied flies with supplies bought by mail from old George Leonard Herter.= Nothing snobbish about George Leonard.  Not no way, not no how.  In 194= 7, with blank sections bought from old George, I made up a bamboo rod, to = save a buck and have some fun. = For me, yet, at 71, to go out with a bamboo rod makes me feel a bit lik= e the kid with a stick, off to try to catch a fish.  I don’t even mind (please forgive) if somebody calls a bamboo rod a "fishpole."  "Let’s g= et our poles and go fishing."  "When?"  "Now!"  Nothing snobbish about tha= t. = Bamboo.  It’s fun to say.  Like "greenheart," another word that’s fun t= o say.  Unlike, to me,  "fibreglas"  or "graphite."  Further, it’s fun to= fiddle with bamboo, with thread,  guides, tiptops.  Fun, even, to scrap= e off old varnish.  Yes, and to put it all together and wave it around an= d get the feel of that stick.   It is, after all, just a bunch of sticks glued together into one stick, isn’t it? = Certainly, much science and technology goes into the making of a fibreg= las or graphite rod.  Largely it’s a mystery to me, maybe to most of us.  O= n the other hand, I can somewhat understand the making of a bamboo rod, a= nd I admire and respect the handwork, the craftsmanship that goes into its initial construction.  Not many people do much with their hands any mor= e. Maybe it’s just a feeling for tradition. = Probably because of that feeling, I admire the warmth of wood, of bambo= o. Admire it, maybe even, to……caress it.  I haven’t yet caressed a fibreglas or graphite rod.   Well, I have a pretty good Browning graphi= te (60 bucks) and a (wow) 80+ dollar IMG with a beautiful reel seat, made = in Taiwan, and I’ve almost caressed it, but…..not like bamboo.  I recogn= ize that a kid or teenager today, first used to graphite, may well have the= same affection for his or her "new pole." = Moreover I realize that a fibreglas or graphite rod delivers more "powe= r.’ It will not rot or come unglued or take a set.  You can’t slam the car = door or close the trunk lid on it, but it will stand some abuse.  You have t= o give more care to bamboo. = But that was for me a good learning process.  You can’t treat bamboo li= ke the horse that was "rode hard and put away wet."  You must wipe it off,= dry it, keep it dry.  You don’t stand it in a corner or against the wall or= bang it around.  You nurse

(remainder of good stuff snipped) Jesse:  I really enjoyed your little essay.  Thoughtful and correct (and I obviously agree with it! Mark Faulkner

Response:

You might want to rethink that statement and read up on the genetic research on telemeres that has been reported in the last week.  You may have enough time left to PAY OFF a bamboo rod!!!  ;^) George – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Jessie, Every thing old will become new again except of course you and I Jessie. — Remove NOSPAM to send E-mail Ernie Harrison

Response:

Jesse One of my personal disappoints is that I came to flyfishing late, about nine years ago, when bamboo rod prices had already begun heading for the stratosphere.  In the early sixties, a good friend of mine had a bamboo spinning rod that his dad had handed down to him.  We would ride our bikes down to the canal to dunk worms for sunfish or throw spoons for pike.  He could always out cast me, especially considering the broomstick I was using. I had a paper route and I saved my coin to buy a Shakespeare Wonderod and a Mitchell 300 after my old rod broke.  I just knew that I would be able to outcast him once I got it.  Well, you guessed it, he could still throw a red devil 20′ further than I could.  We switched rods, and the bamboo still out cast the newfangled fibreglass. Having never owned a bamboo rod, I still lust for them.  Whenever I go into an old fishing shop, I always look around for an old bamboo that may be hiding in a corner.  Haven’t seen one yet, but I’m still hoping.  Funny enough, I still have the Wonderod and the Mitchell.  I hope to have a few grandkids in the next few years and I’ll be needing a good worm dunking rod. That was a very nice post, and considering some of the uninformed vitriol that is tossed around here, it’s a very pleasant change. Peter

Response:

Hello, The fishing news groups are quite new to me.  As I browse and read the messages, I find that some feelings exist against flyfishing and flyfishers, and more particularly again

Jesse, Wowwww waht can I say. All that I wanted to say about Bamboo but was to ignorent to do so. I have been fishing with Bamboo for the better part of 35 years now, and I would not change my rods for anything. I do not own glass, graphite or any other type of rods, just Bamboo and like you said, I caress them and yes I do respect them. They have serve me well over the years.  Please post more of your insight in fly fishing, I really enjoyed your post. Michel Lajoie http:www.titan.qc.ca/moucheux

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, The fishing news groups are quite new to me.  As I browse and read the messages, I find that some feelings exist against flyfishing and flyfishers, and more particularly against the users of bamboo as being somehow snobbish or elite.  I don’t want to offend anybody, but would it be okay if I say something about this?  If you don’t want to read it, please just skip it now. I’m an old guy who grew up poor, without complaint then or now, during the depression.  I had a paper route, did odd jobs, shoveled snow, mowed lawns.  In 1940, when I was 14, my first fly rod cost me $1.67 at a Coast to Coast hardware store, and with it I bought some cheap gut leaders.  Nothing snobbish about that or the way we fished.  After Navy duty in WWII, I first tied flies with supplies bought by mail from old George Leonard Herter. Nothing snobbish about George Leonard.  Not no way, not no how.  In 1947, with blank sections bought from old George, I made up a bamboo rod, to save a buck and have some fun. For me, yet, at 71, to go out with a bamboo rod makes me feel a bit like the kid with a stick, off to try to catch a fish.  I don’t even mind (please forgive) if somebody calls a bamboo rod a "fishpole."  "Let’s get our poles and go fishing."  "When?"  "Now!"  Nothing snobbish about that. Bamboo.  It’s fun to say.  Like "greenheart," another word that’s fun to say.  Unlike, to me,  "fibreglas"  or "graphite."  Further, it’s fun to fiddle with bamboo, with thread,  guides, tiptops.  Fun, even, to scrape off old varnish.  Yes, and to put it all together and wave it around and get the feel of that stick.   It is, after all, just a bunch of sticks glued together into one stick, isn’t it? Certainly, much science and technology goes into the making of a fibreglas or graphite rod.  Largely it’s a mystery to me, maybe to most of us.  On the other hand, I can somewhat understand the making of a bamboo rod, and I admire and respect the handwork, the craftsmanship that goes into its initial construction.  Not many people do much with their hands any more. Maybe it’s just a feeling for tradition. Probably because of that feeling, I admire the warmth of wood, of bamboo. Admire it, maybe even, to……caress it.  I haven’t yet caressed a fibreglas or graphite rod.   Well, I have a pretty good Browning graphite (60 bucks) and a (wow) 80+ dollar IMG with a beautiful reel seat, made in Taiwan, and I’ve almost caressed it, but…..not like bamboo.  I recognize that a kid or teenager today, first used to graphite, may well have the same affection for his or her "new pole." Moreover I realize that a fibreglas or graphite rod delivers more "power.’ It will not rot or come unglued or take a set.  You can’t slam the car door or close the trunk lid on it, but it will stand some abuse.  You have to give more care to bamboo. But that was for me a good learning process.  You can’t treat bamboo like the horse that was "rode hard and put away wet."  You must wipe it off, dry it, keep it dry.  You don’t stand it in a corner or against the wall or bang it around.  You nurse it, gentle it, dare I say, respect it?  But that’s a good lesson to apply not only to a flyrod (or to any kind of fishing equipment), but to bicyles, clothes, cars, even…..to people. With this background, it never dawned on me that flyfishing or bamboo had anything snobbish about it, or that it was for any kind of elite.  If I had felt that, I would have known that I didn’t belong.  So it does bother me somewhat that in recent years flyfishing has given the impression to some that it has gone "high class" or Hollywood-ish, and that is has probably in fact drawn some snobs, or that some feel snobbish about their place in it. At the same time, I don’t begrudge those who can pay for expensive lessons, hire guides, buy thousands of dollars worth of equipment.  A couple years ago, at a shop in Livingston, the owner’s son told me that they had just sold a $1,600 Ovis rod over the phone, to mail out.  I can only blink at such goings on. Not to go off into rapture or anything like it, but to me one of the beautiful things about flycasting lies in the curve that a flyline makes when you throw it.  Have you seen Winslow Homer’s painting of the guy in the canoe, moving his flyline through the air?  Nature, if this is correct, has no straight lines, and the graceful flow of a flyline seems somehow alive.  Actually, I’d say the same thing about any kind of line flowing from any kind of rod or reel, for it’s not restricted to fly casting, and I do enjoy all kinds of fishing. Like water that’s too high and gone off color, some things still rile me. But then too, as you grow older, you generally grow more respectful of the way others go about things.  So it seems to me that the world has room for the kid with a stick, for the guy in between who just wants to get off somewhere and fish a bit, and for snobs as well.  Who knows but what any of us might be a snob, if we just had the money. I hope with this bit that I haven’t touched anybody off.  If so, please ignore it.  It’ll pass quickly.  And you could have just skipped it. Jess Thompson

Hi Jess, I really like what you wrote above. One friends of mine, an old carpenter, he has made cane or bamboo rods from bar stock and ..well whatever you would call it. One of his biggest dissapointments getting older is not being able to make them anymore let alone casting. I do like those rods and have some of my own. My first memory actually was from an American friend of my fathers when I was 6 years old. He had a cane rod, brownish with lovely action. He is in one of my very short stories I once wrote about the grayling, lady of the stream, in my home river. Also one of my cherished memories are from Finland and Lapland there I for some nights during one summer had my 7 footer. Had anyone seen me grinning like I did, rollcasting and catching white fish, one after another, they would have thought me somewhat funny I think….<*)(((<( Cheers and thanks again for your nice piece. Harry Salmgren http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/6392/ http://www.savsjo.se/Forening/Hemsida/Sfkhugget/ ps tried your email also, but didn

Question:

Ron To get the best traction on a wet surface (a boat ramp) look for an all season tire with a high volume of tread surfaces.  This type of tire will have a lot of tiny cuts in the tread design.  When the tire is stressed pulling a load, this type of tread will flex and the edges of these cuts will grip the road surface.  Do Not consider the course off road tread design!  It has the worst hard surface traction. You should also be very light on the gas pedal.  A posi traction differential is also a big help if it is kept maintained and the clutches adjusted. Would you believe I pull a 3800 lb boat up steep boat ramps with a chev s-10 with no problems? Good Luck Wayne

Response:

The next time this happens, try letting some air out of the rear tires – enough to increase the footprint somewhat. Be sure to air up again at the first opportunity. (Longrigger) writes: | Have your buddies jump in the back of the truck to give it wieght. | I have stuck the floor mats in front of the tires once when I was alone | and got stuck, but sand would be alot better. | | Longrigger

    Try pulling up the anchor on the boat…  (I couldn’t resist!)     No, really…  Tire pressure helps a ton, and the start of the pull is the most important part.  Once underway, roll into the throttle, but maintain traction…  (I think that all of the answers I have read here would help.)     …Sam

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Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower. Question: what kind of tire tread design would provide the *most* friction? Knobby, off-road type, or a smoother "pavement" type? Remember, by the way, that this is extremely low-speed operation, just barely turning, in fact, so concepts like "hydroplaning" probably wouldn’t apply here. We’re talking about pulling a load up a wet concrete surface. How about it, you guys? I need to buy new tires for my truck in

Well iv been towing several different boats for many years and with different car’s here’s my $.01 worth. My last boat is a 3500 -4000 lbs boat and trailer, and iv towed it with my four cylinder turbo 5 speed (not many times) it did well no spinning. But now it has posi and very good traction tires on the rear. I now use a 87 jeep cherokee with a posi and BF comp TA’s works very well. Also on thing to remember is your toung weight. My toung weight is over 250+ lbs , thats why I went to the jeep. At first the jeep was a standard rear end and there was some slipping but since the posi the only time it skips is if I jump on the gas to hard. Does any one out there remember the rule of thumb on toung weight? It’s some % of your total weight should be your toung weight. And this also helps if you have to slow your boat down real fast on the hwy. bye

Response:

Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower.

. . . . Ron Morgan

Since you have more than enough horsepower – if one rear wheel starts to spin, hold the parking brake release open and apply the parking brake.  If you apply hard enough, both wheels will receive power. You can also try stabbing at the parking brake if the engine does not have enough power. Not a sure fire thing.  But it is another trick to but in your bag. Terry Dobie 83 CJ7 Hailey, ID

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I use my Jeep Grand Cherokee to haul my boat.  I learned the hard way that you have to ease into the pull.  I use an awefull ramp in East Falmouth Cape Cod that is always covered in a thin layer of scum.  On one occasion, I was sort of hurried by other boaters waiting to get out of the water and I pulled to fast.  Before I knew it, my tires were spinning and I was moving backward.  OOOOPS!  Thank god I stopped on time.   I now make sure that my air pressure is a little lower (more surface space), and that I ease into the pull.  At this one particular ramp, I often throw handfulls of sand onto the algae to create a little traction.  I read a lot of others posts where sand is the enemy, but in this scenerio, it works well. Good luck David

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower. Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off other boats that were just pulled out. My truck can just BARELY pull the boat up the ramp under these conditions. If it’s dry, no problem, but when the ramp is wet, the tires slip and spin, sometimes even smoking. It’s a very, very marginal situation. Last night, I came very close to being stranded at a deserted ramp after dark; I could *not* get that boat up that ramp, and finally made it up after creeping about an inch at a time, before the tires would slip. God only knows what kind of wear this produced on my transmission. Question: what kind of tire tread design would provide the *most* friction? Knobby, off-road type, or a smoother "pavement" type? Remember, by the way, that this is extremely low-speed operation, just barely turning, in fact, so concepts like "hydroplaning" probably wouldn’t apply here. We’re talking about pulling a load up a wet concrete surface. How about it, you guys? I need to buy new tires for my truck in another couple of months, and I’d appreciate some input. In addition, I think it’d make an interesting discussion topic, as well. Ron Morgan

Ron, I have a Full size Dodge Van and have never had a problem pulling the boat up the ramp, except for one occasion. It was a really long and very wet ramp. I was having problems with wheel spin, I remember reading somthing about turning your front tires, (somthing about changing the pull ratio) and also applying the parking brake a bit. Boat pulled right out with out any wheel spin what-so-ever. Good luck. Michael

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*snip* months, and I’d appreciate some input. In addition, I think it’d make an interesting discussion topic, as well. Ron Morgan Ron, I have a Full size Dodge Van and have never had a problem pulling the boat up the ramp, except for one occasion. It was a really long and very wet ramp. I was having problems with wheel spin, I remember reading somthing about turning your front tires, (somthing about changing the pull ratio) and also applying the parking brake a bit.

    You must have a non-posi rear end on your van…  The emergency brake trick worked on my ‘91 Dakota when semi-stuck in sand (I had a non-posi rearend).   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Boat pulled right out with out any wheel spin what-so-ever. Good luck. Michael

Response:

Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower. Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off other boats that were just pulled out.

After many years of enjoying the entertainment of watching people pull boats out at a wide variety of ramps throughout the western US, I know this: The initial pull to get a boat up out of the water is substantial, if you think of how hard it is to pull a small water skier up out of the water, imaging something with 30 times the weight and surface tension and bad hydrodynamics (the trailer…not the boat!) Many people think the best approach is to try to accelerate quickly to "get the damn thing going!", so they give their rig too much throttle. Once you break adhesion on a slick surface, you cannot pull a load equivalent to before you spun the wheels.  So if it spins, let off the throttle and let the wheels catch traction.  Then, try again with less acceleration.  Don’t think that spinning your wheels faster will get you up the ramp, ’cause it will only make it harder to get out. As other posts have said, lowering your tire pressure a little will help a lot.  But I have found on most ramps I can get my boat out by just driving a little more gently and not starting the spinning.  I find an auto trans works better, since you can accelerate from a standstill very slowly without having to dump the clutch.  But I have had several trucks with 4 speeds and a couple of 5 speeds.  You just gotta take it easy, and don’t try to pull the boat out fast.

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I thought friction was normal force times coefficient of friction.  Nowhere mentioning pressure or area.  Deflation is for soft surfaces where pressure does need to be reduced? …        Grasping another opportunity to be wrong!

seems you caught this opportunity nicely That’s the description you find in physics 101, but it doesn’t work well in this case.  It works for flat surfaces in contact (with a few other assumptions).  When you add rough surfaces, compressible and deformable surfaces, and weak surface features (like sand on the ramp) that can withstand only a (smallish) maximum force before breaking away, then surface area and tread play an important role.

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I thought friction was normal force times coefficient of friction.  Nowhere mentioning pressure or area.  Deflation is for soft surfaces where pressure does need to be reduced? pqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpq        Grasping another opportunity to be wrong! [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]

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Man, sand on concrete can REALLY cause you to slip!

This isn’t sand on concrete (like a building site) but sand on a concrete boat ramp. All the ramps I’ve seen have been pretty slippery with weed and green gunk. If I used the same ramp every day, I’d scrub the thing clean and use Jeyes fluid or caustic soda on it occasionally to keep the gunk off. I know little about boat ramps, but I do know about silage clamps and slurry lagoons  (bleurgh !) – even for these noxious devices it’s worth doing a bit of scrubbing & hosing occasionally. Failing that, get as big a contact patch as you can. Soft rubber in small tread blocks (not great mud-plugger tread bars) and a low enough pressure to let the tyre flatten as much as is practical. — alt.flame – Making the world a safer place for postal workers.

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How about it, you guys? I need to buy new tires for my truck in another couple of months, and I’d appreciate some input. In addition, I think it’d make an interesting discussion topic, as well.

        Er, does that imply that your current tires are rather bald?         If so, ‘nuf said.         Relative weight of vehicle and tow is important. (If the wheels         on your trailer are bigger than the wheels on your tow vehicle,         you’re in trouble. Saw a Chicago flatlander trying to tow a large         boat with his Beamer. Didn’t make it.)         In your case, the truck should have enough towing weight, but         the question is about weight on the rear wheels.         o The angle of the ramp tends to transfer more weight to the           rear wheels.         o Tounge weight of the trailer is important.         I am hauling a smaller  14′ runabout (40 horse motor) with a         Ranger pickup in a similar situation. I have no problems.         o I have a stick, so can control things better.         o When I was towing with a station wagon and automatic, I would:            o Put the transmission in second            o Step on the brake            o Give it some gas.            o Use the break as a clutch, slowly easing up so that there              was no jerk in the initial pull. Frank R. Borger – Physicist     ___      "I think medical research would show Michael Reese – U of Chicago   |___       that being a Cubs fan lengthens Center for Radiation Therapy   | |_) _    your life. Or maybe it just _seems_ ph: 312-791-8075 fa: 791-2517       |_)

Response:

Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower. Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off other boats that were just pulled out.

[...]         have you tried deflating the rear tyres a bit?  you’d get a larger         contact area.         andrew —            work phone/fax: 0131 668 8356, office: 0131 668 8357     institute for astronomy, royal observatory, blackford hill, edinburgh                      http://www.roe.ac.uk/ajcwww

Response:

Question: what kind of tire tread design would provide the *most* friction? Knobby, off-road type, or a smoother "pavement" type? Remember, by the way, that this is extremely low-speed operation, just barely turning, in fact, so concepts like "hydroplaning" probably wouldn’t apply here. We’re talking about pulling a load up a wet concrete surface. How about it, you guys? I need to buy new tires for my truck in another couple of months, and I’d appreciate some input. In addition, I think it’d make an interesting discussion topic, as well.

There’s a lot coming into play. I find all terrains are significantly better than road tires.  I would assume mudders are even better.  My guess would be that the deep tread actually allows some of the edges of the tread to grip the ramp, cause there’s certainly lower area in contact.  Course that also means greater psi. Another factor is the softness of the rubber.  I would suspect that given two identical tires, the one with the lower tread life would be better. You could also get a bit wider tires.  I’ve also seen people with a bucket of sand they toss out to get a better grip.  No-one really complains about sand at a launch ramp. kevin

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Well, since you’re having trouble on boat ramps with your pickup you need more weight on the wheels.  If you can’t get buddies or bystanders to sit in the bed to get more weight on the rear wheels, try some of that water in 5 gallon pails (like paint pails).  If you’re in salt water you’ll want lids to keep the water out of the bed; in fresh water that’s not a problem.  10 x 5 gal x 8 lbs/gal is 400 lbs, enough to help quite a bit.  Nice thing about this is you don’t need to drag the extra weight around afterwards, and it’s likely to be available wherever you launch your boat .   — Bart Smaalders                  Solaris Performance     SunSoft http://playground.sun.com/~barts                    2550 Garcia Ave                                                         Mt View, CA 94043-1100

Response:

he one with the lower tread life would be better. You could also get a bit wider tires.  I’ve also seen people with a bucket of sand they toss out to get a better grip.

Man, sand on concrete can REALLY cause you to slip! Sand on ICE is ok but no sand is better on non-frozen concrete. George Bonser

Response:

How about it, you guys? I need to buy new tires for my truck in another couple of months, and I’d appreciate some input. In addition, I think it’d make an interesting discussion topic, as well. Ron Morgan

Wide, sticky tires in my opinion. Though they spread the weight out more, there is more surface for gripping. It will reduce fuel economy somewhat though.  Also, I would worry more about hydroplaning on FRONT wheels where you could loose steering control. You might try putting some weight over that axle or letting 5lb of air out if you get stranded. George Bonser

Response:

Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off other boats that were just pulled out. Ron Morgan

I stuck my truck in Galveston Bay this way.  My solution was to buy an old CJ5.  Now I drop into 4 wheel drive in low range.  And no problem. A cheaper alternative is to mount a trailer ball on the front which keeps those rear wheels way up out of the water. cfly — Charlie and Dorothy Fly Non-Trivial Solutions 2951 Marina Bay Dr. Suite 130-349 League City, TX  77573-2733

Response:

Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off other boats that were just pulled out. Ron Morgan

Ron – When you buy your tires, make sure you get a better traction rating.  Talk to the tire dealer about traction ratings and wet pavement.  He may help you out tremendously. (Softer tires may wear quicker.) Other solutions to consider can make a big difference :         1. Put a couple hundred pounds of sand bags or blocks in the                 very back of the truck.  Spinning can be caused by not                 enough weight on the rear wheels.         2. Adjust your boat on the trailer to increase the tongue weight                 of the trailer (not to an extreme).  With the boat further                 on the trailer, you will get more weight on the truck tires.         3. Next truck, get limited slip differential to use both back wheels instead of one. Good luck and may all your ramps be dry ones, Joe

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Have your buddies jump in the back of the truck to give it wieght. I have stuck the floor mats in front of the tires once when I was alone and got stuck, but sand would be alot better. Longrigger

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Almost everybody I know has had the same problem with some combination of boats, ramps and tow vehicles. I have better traction on my jeep since I moved up on tire size. The tires are all weather radials. I can still spin all 4 tires if the ramp is mucky enough. Just having new tires will make a difference because the rubber will be softer and the thicker tread will be more compliant than on the older tires. My neighbor mounted a hitch ball on the front bumper of his 2WD truck which let him keep his rear tires high and dry. This can be particularly important at low tide, especially on ramps in estuaries that tend to silt up and/or grow moss. I carried a 20 foot heavy duty tow rope for several years untill the size of my tow vehicle caught up with my boat. I have also seen tongue extensions used for the same purpose. Many sailboaters use these because a keelboat has to be sent WAY back before it will float off the trailer. They either telescope out of the trailer tongue or are carried along side. Some of them even have their own wheels on them that will take much more abuse than a standard trailer jack wheel. My jeep has mushy rear springs and a short wheelbase, so I don’t run with much tongue weight. You can usually run much more tongue weight on a real truck like yours. 300 or 400 lbs of tongue weight, if you are not already running that much, could do a lot for your traction problems. Check with the truck manufacturer to see what they recommend.                                                 vaaler

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& Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 & pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The & boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, & of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower. & Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off & other boats that were just pulled out. & My truck can just BARELY pull the boat up the ramp under these & conditions. If it’s dry, no problem, but when the ramp is wet, & the tires slip and spin, sometimes even smoking. It’s a very, & very marginal situation. Last night, I came very close to being & stranded at a deserted ramp after dark; I could *not* get that & boat up that ramp, and finally made it up after creeping about an & inch at a time, before the tires would slip. God only knows what & kind of wear this produced on my transmission. You don’t say what the truck is, but does it have a limited slip differential (pozi-trac, sure-grip, etc)?  If not that would get you double the traction.  They can be added to many of the trucks out there. Hewlett Packard              (707) 794-4848 fax      (707) 538-3693 home 1212 Valley House Drive      http://web.sr.hp.com/~frankb/ Rohnert Park CA 94928-4999   KC6WUG, AMA, DoD #7566, NMLRA, I’m the NRA. U.S.A.              Dodge V8 Dakota, Yamaha IT175 XT350 YZF600R Seca 750

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower. Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off other boats that were just pulled out. My truck can just BARELY pull the boat up the ramp under these conditions. If it’s dry, no problem, but when the ramp is wet, the tires slip and spin, sometimes even smoking. It’s a very, very marginal situation. Last night, I came very close to being stranded at a deserted ramp after dark; I could *not* get that boat up that ramp, and finally made it up after creeping about an inch at a time, before the tires would slip. God only knows what kind of wear this produced on my transmission. Question: what kind of tire tread design would provide the *most* friction? Knobby, off-road type, or a smoother "pavement" type? Remember, by the way, that this is extremely low-speed operation, just barely turning, in fact, so concepts like "hydroplaning" probably wouldn’t apply here. We’re talking about pulling a load up a wet concrete surface. How about it, you guys? I need to buy new tires for my truck in another couple of months, and I’d appreciate some input. In addition, I think it’d make an interesting discussion topic, as well. Ron Morgan

    Ron I had the same ‘problem’ with my old truck (‘91 Dakota with limited slip).  I would put up a slippery ramp and one tire would spin (no posi!)…  I helped the situation by putting all of the crap in the back of the truck that was in the boat, to put more weight over the rear tires (Coolers, skis, gas cans, clothes, etc.)  This made a difference.  I don’t know what type of truck you have, or if it has posi, but with my NEW ‘95 Dakota w/posi + 5 speed I am able to pull that same boat, with all of the crap still in the boat, with no problem out of the same ramp.  I do run a lower tire pressure, as this tends to put more rubber onto the ground, giving more traction.  You might try that too…(it wouldn’t hurt).       BTW  If you didn’t already know this, when pulling out of a boat ramp with a automatic trans, and you work pretty hard to pull that boat up (any pull should be considered) the ramp, make sure you don’t pull up to the staging area and shut off your truck while securing you boat. All of the heat generated by the pull will not leave the transmission (as it didn’t get cooled yet by the transmission cooler)…and can cause a lot of wear/tear/damage to your transmission.  My bone-head friend went through 2 transmissions over 2 seasons going to the Colorado river with his boat.  Every time he got it out of the water he would shut down, secure the boat, then take off…with an air temp of about 110 F. that truck would almost boil the transmission fluid!!!  He learned.     I got a 5 speed ( no cooler needed!), and it works a lot better than a automatic (at least for me it does).     My $.02     ..Sam

Response:

Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower. Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off other boats that were just pulled out. My truck can just BARELY pull the boat up the ramp under these conditions. If it’s dry, no problem, but when the ramp is wet, the tires slip and spin, sometimes even smoking. It’s a very, very marginal situation. Last night, I came very close to being stranded at a deserted ramp after dark; I could *not* get that boat up that ramp, and finally made it up after creeping about an inch at a time, before the tires would slip. God only knows what kind of wear this produced on my transmission. Question: what kind of tire tread design would provide the *most* friction? Knobby, off-road type, or a smoother "pavement" type? Remember, by the way, that this is extremely low-speed operation, just barely turning, in fact, so concepts like "hydroplaning" probably wouldn’t apply here. We’re talking about pulling a load up a wet concrete surface. How about it, you guys? I need to buy new tires for my truck in another couple of months, and I’d appreciate some input. In addition, I think it’d make an interesting discussion topic, as well. Ron Morgan

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Question:

I would appreciate finding out where there is private water open to the public for flyfishing at a fee.  What would be a reasonable cost per day for either American plan (with meals) or European plan (without plans)? Catch and release fishing would be just fine.  It is getting more and more difficult to find places to fish. I usually have to fish by myself because no one in my family is interested and it is vey difficult to match schedules with friends.  Moreover, many of my friends think that fishing should be free. William Buchman

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I would appreciate finding out where there is private water open to the public for flyfishing at a fee.  What would be a reasonable cost per day for either American plan (with meals) or European plan (without plans)? Catch and release fishing would be just fine.  It is getting more and more difficult to find places to fish. I usually have to fish by myself because no one in my family is interested and it is vey difficult to match schedules with friends.  Moreover, many of my friends think that fishing should be free.

William: Would it help if you narrowed the criteria to a continent or two? (or perhaps a region or two, even)? Otherwise, I’m sure you’ll troll up responses from Russia to New Zealand, Alaska to Argentina… Just wondering… /dave <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< < Digital Equipment Corp.    Alpha Server Engineering  < <           "Read this and nobody gets hurt"           < <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

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Would it help if you narrowed the criteria to a continent or two? (or perhaps a region or two, even)? Otherwise, I’m sure you’ll troll up responses from Russia to New Zealand, Alaska to Argentina… You are right of course.  There are other parts to the world than the area I live in which is Los Angeles. I am particularly interested in the Western United States but willing to be tempted toward more distant horizons. William Buchman

Response:

you might try marble canyon arizona ,colorado river just below glen canyon dam. i have been there three times and the fly fishing is exelent.

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Question:

(Fournier Thomas A.J.) writes: Am having trouble casting more than 15 feet without knots in line.

I’m sure you can cast further than that, but I get the point. Usually, excessive knotting is the result of overpowering the cast, thus allowing tailing loops to form. Spend an hour in an open space–not fishing. Watch your cast as you gradually work out line to different distances. I’ll bet you’ll find two things. First, your backcast is breaking down, causing the line to describe something more like a figure-8 than a pair of balanced loops. The remedy is to add a little more power at the start of the backcast and to move your forearm in an upwards direction as it sweeps past you. Second, I’ll bet your loops are *real* tight right now, even with the breakdown. Slow down and open the loop a bit. The line will accept more power (speed) and travel further with less effort. If your loops stand one foot tall or less, that’s too tight and wind knots are inevitable. Try the graduated target method for an afternoon. E-mail me if you need any info on how to set that up. Good luck! JL 8-Wt Editor

Response:

(Fournier Thomas A.J.) writes: Am having trouble casting more than 15 feet without knots in line. Best advice I’ve received — don’t cast with your wrist.  Your wrist stays locked, and tight (almost touching) the pole, and your arm does the casting.  This forces you to move your arm quickly, from 10 o’clock to 2 o’clock and back, to achieve the desired result.  If you do this, you’re casting with the strength of your arm and back and not just with your wrist — you get less tired and the line shoots farther and straighter. Ben

Ben is giving you excellent advice here. My local guru gave me a little casting clinic a few weeks ago and got me to break the bad habit of cocking my wrist on the backcast by tying my forearm to the reel seat – he used a peice of monofilament, but a heavy rubber band would work even better.  I can now lay out sixty or seventy-foot casts with a DT 3-wt., where before I couldn’t do much better than forty or fifty feet.  I found that not cock- ing my wrist has also kept the fly off the water (or in the bushes) on the backcast.  I’m convinced this helps in not spooking a pool.  So get a heavy rubber band or one of those spool keepers and practice a while fishing for lawn trout.  I hope it helps you as much as it has me!  Also, if you’re knotting your line it may because you’re starting your forecast too soon. Try laying off until the rod is "loaded", i.e., ’til you feel the weight of the backcast really pull on the rod tip. Cheers,

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(Fournier Thomas A.J.) writes: Am having trouble casting more than 15 feet without knots in line.

MISATTRIBUTION!!! I can cast 15 feet.  Honest.  No, really. Best advice I’ve received — don’t cast with your wrist.  Your wrist stays locked, and tight (almost touching) the pole, and your arm does the casting.  This forces you to move your arm quickly, from 10 o’clock to 2 o’clock and back, to achieve the desired result.  If you do this, you’re casting with the strength of your arm and back and not just with your wrist — you get less tired and the line shoots farther and straighter. Ben

Good advice. Keep your stick on the ice. Thos.

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I have a Sage fishing pole and the line seems to be sticking in the bottom loop by the handle.  Is this unusual?

Not sure if you mean the little loop just above the handle cork/foam (which is parallel to the rod instead of perpendicular), but if your line is strung through it, that might be the problem. That bottom loop is just there to hook a fly to while you’re not fishing, to keep the fly from snagging on trees, shrubs, and ears of friends. Not sure if this was what you meant by bottom loop, but I thought I’d pipe up just in case. — Scott Ferguson                          My views are mine; what’s mine is mine Cray Computer Corporation       http://www.craycos.com/~ferguson/ferguson.html

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  I’ve been having some problems casting and I wondered if anyone could give me some advice.  I’m kinda new to fly fishing so any advice would greatly be appreciated. I’ve been having trouble casting more than about fifteen feet without getting knots around my fly or tiring myself out. I don’t understand what I am doing wrong. I’ve followed all the directions they gave me at the fishing school I went to .  I’m afraid it might be my fishing pole that might be the trouble.  I have a Sage fishing pole and the line seems to be sticking in the bottom loop by the handle.  Is this unusual? Does anyone else have this problem?  Is my

Ref. "bottom loop":  someone else has already pointed out fly line should be strung from reel to tip only through fly rod guides, not the hook keeper attached just above the handle. Ref. "fifteen feet": modern fly rods are rated to flex under the weight of the first 30 feet of a particular line.  If less line than 30 feet extends beyond the rod tip, it’s that much harder to get the rod to flex OK.  I.e. it’s (usually) harder to cast a fly 20 feet than 40 feet. Unmentioned common casting error is failure to hold the line in the left hand so that it does not move relative to the stripper guide.  While the rod is moving (false casting) the line length beyond the tip should be held constant by left-hand control.  If the line is travelling up and down the guides, i.e. getting longer and shorter, energy is being lost rather than being transferred from hand to rod to line beyond tip. —  |          Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Rd., Carlsbad         |  |        Springs, Ont., Canada K0A 1K0; tel: (613) 822-0734       |  |  "What I’ve always liked about science is its independence from |  |  authority"–Ontario Science Centre (name on file) 10 July 1981 |

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – writes: Am having trouble casting more than 15 feet without knots in line. Best advice I’ve received — don’t cast with your wrist.  Your wrist stays  locked, and tight (almost touching) the pole, and your arm does the  casting.   This forces you to move your arm quickly, from 10 o’clock to 2  o’clock and back, to achieve the desired result.  If you do this, you’re  casting with the strength of your arm and back and not just with your   wrist — you get less tired and the line shoots farther and straighter. Ben

I would also suggest reading Mel Krieger’s book, "The Essence of Fly Casting" and watching his videos. Gary W. Godden

Response:

(Fournier Thomas A.J.) writes: Am having trouble casting more than 15 feet without knots in line.

Best advice I’ve received — don’t cast with your wrist.  Your wrist stays locked, and tight (almost touching) the pole, and your arm does the casting.  This forces you to move your arm quickly, from 10 o’clock to 2 o’clock and back, to achieve the desired result.  If you do this, you’re casting with the strength of your arm and back and not just with your wrist — you get less tired and the line shoots farther and straighter. Ben

Response:

  I’ve been having some problems casting and I wondered if anyone could give me some advice.  I’m kinda new to fly fishing so any advice would greatly be appreciated. I’ve been having trouble casting more than about fifteen feet without getting knots around my fly or tiring myself out.

Try cleaning your fly line.  I find that if I practice on a lawn (especially a new mown lawn) gunk accumulates that impedes the smooth flow of the line through the guides.  When the line is sticky I have to work harder to shoot line.  When I work hard my timing goes off, I "punch" the line out, and I get wind knots. Keep your stick on the ice. Thos.

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  I’ve been having some problems casting and I wondered if anyone could give me some advice.  I’m kinda new to fly fishing so any advice would greatly be appreciated. I’ve been having trouble casting more than about fifteen feet without getting knots around my fly or tiring myself out. Unmentioned common casting error is failure to hold the line in the left hand so that it does not move relative to the stripper guide.  While the rod is moving (false casting) the line length beyond the tip should be held constant by left-hand control.  If the line is travelling up and down the guides, i.e. getting longer and shorter, energy is being lost rather than being transferred from hand to rod to line beyond tip.

FWIW: I had real problems keeping the energy going as well, until a kindly passer-by pointed out this last to me, and also taught me to "load the rod", as he called it. Just a little yank (4-6") on the line with my left hand just as I begin to go forward on the cast really helps me a lot. Also, I was not waiting long enough on the backcast for the line to go all the way out. I still count "one-mississippi-two", but as my .sig shows, I mostly plug & chug, so I don’t get a whole lotta practice. Anyway, without that guy I probably woulda chucked the whole thing, so thanks guy if you’re out there. (Course, I didn’t have a Sage, either)         /   V  V  V  V  V  V  V  /      King’s Computer Management, Inc.        <   0  0  0  0  0  0  0  (o   1633 NE Hwy 10      VVV              Y                 612-784-8042 (voice)                      VVV Heddon Lucky 13 leopard: the lure doesn’t catch fish, fish catch the lure. Opinions? I’m married. I am not allowed to have opinions.

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* Le 09-25-94, JENNIFER LEIGH BOUGHNER exprimait . ALL le propos suivant: JL   I’ve been having some problems casting and I wondered if anyone could JLgive me some advice.   <deleted stuff JLmight be my fishing pole that might be the trouble.  I have a Sage JLfishing pole and the line seems to be sticking in the bottom loop by the <deleted stuff JLfat part be hanging up?  We used orvis poles at my school and we didn’t JLhave any trouble at all. One thing you might want to verify is the flexibility of your Sage pole compare to the Orvis. If you have a soft pole (or slow action) compare to a stiff pole (or fast action) there might be the source of your problem. You have to wait more before changing direction in your cast, to give the line the time to extend completely and the pole to charge (whip action) to the max. If you do not wait enough, than your doing all the work and not the pole. Furthermore, I noticed myself that when I’m not doing it right there are nots in my line. I hope this help. Au plaisir de vous lire, Denis Lamy Trois-Rivieres (Quebec, Canada) ~~~ * VbReader 2.2 #67 * La pensee n’est helas souvent qu’un eclair dans la nuit.

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   I’ve been having some problems casting and I wondered if anyone could give me some advice.  I’m kinda new to fly fishing so any advice would greatly be appreciated. I’ve been having trouble casting more than about fifteen feet without getting knots around my fly or tiring myself out. I don’t understand what I am doing wrong. I’ve followed all the directions they gave me at the fishing school I went to .  I’m afraid it might be my fishing pole that might be the trouble.  I have a Sage fishing pole and the line seems to be sticking in the bottom loop by the handle.  Is this unusual? Does anyone else have this problem?  Is my line too big? I have the line with the triangle in the front. Could the fat part be hanging up?  We used orvis poles at my school and we didn’t have any trouble at all. Thanks for your help, Jennifer    " In our family there wasn’t a clear line between religion and fly fishing.."                 …Norman Mclean

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I’ve been having some problems casting and I wondered if anyone could give me some advice.

It sounds like you’re trying to cast too fast. One of the main reasons for "wind knots" is too quick a motion through the cast. The loop gets too tight, resulting in tailing loops, wind knots and no distance. A very helpful exercise, particularly when getting used to a new rod, is to set out a couple of markers at ten-foot intervals. Start with the ten-foot mark and lay down just enough line to reach it. Pull the line off the reel and manually lay it on the ground between you and the mar if you have to. Then, without pulling any line back through the guides, simply pick the line up with the rod, swing it behind you and lay it back down onto the ten-foot mark as gently as possible. Do this as many times as it takes until you’re comfortable and consistent. Then do the same with the 20-foot mark. You should be able to pick up 25 to 30 feet of line off grass without having to do more than swing the rod back and forth. This exercise will teach you the rythm of your rod and your own body. Once you’ve found those, casting further should be easy. Personally, I floundered around for months before I tried this exercise. Once I did, casting problems get much less severe. It’s no panacea, but I’ve tried it with other novices and all have found that it helped. Good luck! JL 8-Wt Editor LPM Editor

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