Question:

Now imagine that trip with some *real* streamers in your arsenal.  <g (we may have the beginnings of a convert) Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

I fish streamers often.  I had small Mickey Finns and white/peacock Deceivers with me.  But, knowing there were very large fish in the pool, and never having taken one there, I tried the largest fly I had.  And it took the largest trout I’ve ever caught. Glenn GKT

Response:

. 15" and 18" browns.  Not something to write in a diary, but it worked. Any trout of that size I take on a fly rod will get written in a diary. Pete Collin

Well, me too; I was way too casual in that description.  Probably in comparison to the 11 trout someone else caught the day before.   For the record, the previous largest trout of my life was a 21" brown on a #16 Goddard Caddis from a pool on this creek.  But there are a fair number of long-term holdover trout in the 15" plus range there.   Glenn   GKT

Response:

Not something to write in a diary, but it worked. Fairly sure I would write that in my diary! TL MC

Well, I did.  I apologize for being way too casual.  I belittled it in comparison to the 11 fish someone else caught the day before. Glenn GKT

Response:

If I saw a trout big enough to eat a 4" clouser I would write about it.    hell, i would leap from the water, terrified. your friend in the old north state wayno where a 4 inch clouser would be damn close to a record.

I did warm my waders when I saw the fish. GKT

Response:

. 15" and 18" browns.  Not something to write in a diary, but it worked. Any trout of that size I take on a fly rod will get written in a diary. Pete Collin

Could you improve that remark by just saying "Any?" GG

Response:

After an hour or so of good intentions, I switched to the inevitable Wooly Bugger.  Black marabou, peacock herl and silver wire body, black saddle hackle palmer, silver barbell eyes.  With the cover of rain, I got next to the dark green channels and high sticked the Bugger through the runs. 15" and 18" browns.  Not something to write in a diary, but it worked.

Fairly sure I would write that in my diary! TL MC

Response:

Fairly sure I would write that in my diary! TL MC

If I saw a trout big enough to eat a 4" clouser I would write about it. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply.

Response:

Fairly sure I would write that in my diary! TL MC If I saw a trout big enough to eat a 4" clouser I would write about it.

    hell, i would leap from the water, terrified. your friend in the old north state wayno where a 4 inch clouser would be damn close to a record.

Response:

Thursday 4/25 Paradise Creek off the Brodhead 9:30 to 2:30.  Light to moderate rain with an air temperature of 43 to 46 degrees. The day before, someone had taken 11 browns up to 18" on Hendrickson spinners. To quote Dizzy Dean, it ain’t bragging if you can do it. Thursday the creek was up but fairly clear.  Rings on every pool but they were made by drips from the hemlocks and sycamores.  An occasional microcaddis in the air, but no concentration of bugs in the trees.  I checked the streamside and bridge spiderwebs for evidence of hatches but they were generally empty. No shucks on the rocks, though the rising creek might have covered earlier stonefly activity. My fishing partner stuck with a Prince nymph most of the day.  It had worked the previous week, so he went over a lot of water giving it another chance. Moderately stubborn type. I changed flys with that fine desperation and lack of intuition which characterizes my approach to tough conditions.  If I had thought to bring midge pupa imitations with me they might have been a better bet.  I was also trying to avoid retreating to Wooly Buggers. After an hour or so of good intentions, I switched to the inevitable Wooly Bugger.  Black marabou, peacock herl and silver wire body, black saddle hackle palmer, silver barbell eyes.  With the cover of rain, I got next to the dark green channels and high sticked the Bugger through the runs. 15" and 18" browns.  Not something to write in a diary, but it worked. To close out the day, we went to the toughest stretch, Harold’s Pool.  My friend went up through all the riffles with the Prince.  I drew a very large flash to the Wooly Bugger, but the big fish in that pool see a lot of Wooly Buggers from desperate anglers.  I put on a 4" 1/0 chartreuse and white Clouser (barbless) and flogged the depths of the pool.  No fun casting with a 3 wt. But the second cast, letting the Clouser swing below me, a trout nailed the fly (ok, it might as well be a jig).  And it made the day light up.  I horsed it as best I could with the 3 wt. and a 2X flourocarbon leader.  And it fought upstream, probably surprised as hell that it couldn’t snap the leader instantly.  So in a few minutes I brought a brilliantly colored brown to my feet, popped the Clouser out of the corner of its mouth, and set it free. We took our shivering old bodies to the car, put away our rods, signed out, and headed home with the heater cranked to max.  No bugs but not a bad day. GKT

Response:

[snip] We took our shivering old bodies to the car, put away our rods, signed out, and headed home with the heater cranked to max.  No bugs but not a bad day. GKT

Now imagine that trip with some *real* streamers in your arsenal.  <g (we may have the beginnings of a convert) Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

. 15" and 18" browns.  Not something to write in a diary, but it worked.

Any trout of that size I take on a fly rod will get written in a diary. Pete Collin

Response:

Nice story Arn.  It’s hard to maintain the discipline between being a fly fisherman and lures.  It’s like walking the fine line between genius and insanity. Fly fishing has driven many advocates mad. Yes, its a mad, mad, mad world! George Gehrke "Mr. Cool"

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thursday 4/25 Paradise Creek off the Brodhead 9:30 to 2:30.  Light to moderate rain with an air temperature of 43 to 46 degrees. The day before, someone had taken 11 browns up to 18" on Hendrickson spinners. To quote Dizzy Dean, it ain’t bragging if you can do it. Thursday the creek was up but fairly clear.  Rings on every pool but they were made by drips from the hemlocks and sycamores.  An occasional microcaddis in the air, but no concentration of bugs in the trees.  I checked the streamside and bridge spiderwebs for evidence of hatches but they were generally empty. No shucks on the rocks, though the rising creek might have covered earlier stonefly activity. My fishing partner stuck with a Prince nymph most of the day.  It had worked the previous week, so he went over a lot of water giving it another chance. Moderately stubborn type. I changed flys with that fine desperation and lack of intuition which characterizes my approach to tough conditions.  If I had thought to bring midge pupa imitations with me they might have been a better bet.  I was also trying to avoid retreating to Wooly Buggers. After an hour or so of good intentions, I switched to the inevitable Wooly Bugger.  Black marabou, peacock herl and silver wire body, black saddle hackle palmer, silver barbell eyes.  With the cover of rain, I got next to the dark green channels and high sticked the Bugger through the runs. 15" and 18" browns.  Not something to write in a diary, but it worked. To close out the day, we went to the toughest stretch, Harold’s Pool.  My friend went up through all the riffles with the Prince.  I drew a very large flash to the Wooly Bugger, but the big fish in that pool see a lot of Wooly Buggers from desperate anglers.  I put on a 4" 1/0 chartreuse and white Clouser (barbless) and flogged the depths of the pool.  No fun casting with a 3 wt. But the second cast, letting the Clouser swing below me, a trout nailed the fly (ok, it might as well be a jig).  And it made the day light up.  I horsed it as best I could with the 3 wt. and a 2X flourocarbon leader.  And it fought upstream, probably surprised as hell that it couldn’t snap the leader instantly.  So in a few minutes I brought a brilliantly colored brown to my feet, popped the Clouser out of the corner of its mouth, and set it free. We took our shivering old bodies to the car, put away our rods, signed out, and headed home with the heater cranked to max.  No bugs but not a bad day. GKT

Response:

STREAMERS is a very good idea.  I would have fished a muddler minnow darting along the bottom with a sink tip. George Gehrke "guessing is better than doing nothing" Now imagine that trip with some *real* streamers in your arsenal.  <g (we may have the beginnings of a convert) Peter Visit The Streamer Page at

http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

Question:

Do not learn to cast. Very bad. Too much like work. Learn to draw pretty pictures. ….take a deep breath, assume the lotus position and let your mind begin to wander and then to wonder…if necessary, use the ancient relics and the secret blend of herbs to attain a sated state of complete relaxation… While sitting…grasp the rod. Hold it. Feel it. Become one with it. …. Learn how to gently coax line from the tip. Learn to move the line to different places. Use as little motion as possible in order to not molest or in any way raise your pulse rate. Your breathing should become deeper and slower as you bond with your rod. Start off with small strokes. Gently teasing and calling….calling…. Learn, seek the way to keep the line in the air…..slowly….how to keep it in the air with the least energy expenditure…..can you make it straight.? Can you, with a flick of the wrist, a flex of your forearm, make the line go straight out in front of you?  Can you make it then go straight out in back of you? Can you keep the ess curves out of your line? Can you keep the line flat and straight, curving only to change from forwards to backwards?  Can you feel the line so softly and tenderly tugging and pulling – yearning to be free of the rod and thus of it’s master? repeat……this is my rod. There are many like it, but this one is mine…… john

Response:

asadi wrote… repeat……this is my rod. There are many like it, but this one is mine……

My rod is my best friend, it is my life.  I must master it as I must master my life.  Without me my rod is useless, without my rod I am useless.  I must cast my rod true.  I must cast better than my friend who is trying to outfish me.  I must catch fish before he outfishes me.  I will.   Before God I swear this creed.  My rod and myself are defenders of our rivers.  We are the masters of the trout.  We are the saviors of fish.   So be it.  Until there are no fishless days but catching.   Amen. — Warren (amazed at how memories from 10+ years ago can flood your mind as fresh as if the events just happened….) PS – This is my rod and this is my gun.  This is for fishing, this is for fun….. Henry’s Fork Clave info and Bozeman, MT fishing info www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt

Response:

Do not learn to cast. Very bad. Too much like work. Learn to draw pretty pictures. …

        (etherial wisdom snipped) john

        i knew it would only be a matter of time before you got these techhies on the right path, john.         it must be tough being the only bodhisattva on roff. your friend in the old north state wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

… the secret blend of herbs to attain a sated state of complete relaxation…

Yeah, that’s the part I like about fishing with you, John. I just gotta remember to tie on the fly BEFORE I toke the secret herb. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

Hello asadi – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Do not learn to cast. Very bad. Too much like work. Learn to draw pretty pictures. ….take a deep breath, assume the lotus position and let your mind begin to wander and then to wonder…if necessary, use the ancient relics and the secret blend of herbs to attain a sated state of complete relaxation… While sitting…grasp the rod. Hold it. Feel it. Become one with it. …. Learn how to gently coax line from the tip. Learn to move the line to different places. Use as little motion as possible in order to not molest or in any way raise your pulse rate. Your breathing should become deeper and slower as you bond with your rod. Start off with small strokes. Gently teasing and calling….calling…. Learn, seek the way to keep the line in the air…..slowly….how to keep it in the air with the least energy expenditure…..can you make it straight.? Can you, with a flick of the wrist, a flex of your forearm, make the line go straight out in front of you?  Can you make it then go straight out in back of you? Can you keep the ess curves out of your line? Can you keep the line flat and straight, curving only to change from forwards to backwards?  Can you feel the line so softly and tenderly tugging and pulling – yearning to be free of the rod and thus of it’s master? repeat……this is my rod. There are many like it, but this one is mine…… john

Never had a dirty phone call and this is my first erotic newsgroup post……or did I just read it wrong <G May your Yin and Yang be in harmony always, and your Ch’i flow freely. — Don’t Worry, Be Happy! IRC Sandyb in #Rabble uk3.arcnet.vapor.com port:6667 Sandy (http://www.ftscotland.co.uk)   (Replace noway with sandy to email)

Response:

asadi [held it in a *real* long time then] posted…. Learn, seek the way to keep the line in the air

yes…young grasshooker …..slowly….how to keep it in the air with the least energy

expenditure….. yes…i can see it now…master bong lit can you make it straight.?

yes…ho wang…but for the fleeting flap of a single gnats nad… Can you, with a flick of the wrist, a flex of your forearm, make the line go straight out in front of you?

yes…huk lo…but then it will stay there forever (sometimes even with a mighty samurai pull) Can you make it then go straight out in back of you?

yes…far flung…I think I am ready…can I try to snatch the splitshot from your palm ? Can you keep the ess curves out of your line?

yes…but I can’t keep the fuk ng knots from my 5x… — The Halfordian Golfer

Response:

 Very bad. Too much like work. Some days it does feel that way.  Feel it. Become one with it. …. When I bring to mind my favorite places, most of them are places that for some reason or another, are more likely to give me one of those special days. On these days, "you" can get lost in the experience and all is right with the world. I’ve only had these sort of days when I was fishing alone. When I bring other people to these places, the trips are often disappointing because their "specialness" isn’t because of exceptional fish catching. Willi PS Before I once again get accused of not having a sense of humor, I DID see the humor in John’s post.

Response:

Question:

central PA. Third week of July. Need guide and/or boat rental info,

http://www.billsguideservice.com/ RichZ

Question:

Not to knock them, but they have a lower apeal after so many of them.

A real fish for once!   One day you too, will come to love those "Unreal Fish"  What a great morning to be alive!  Bruce Congratulations jim

Response:

<snip a great story The second cast found the blues scattering violently as a dork figure surged from under the moss toward the cricket.

This is just begging for a joke. Nice story Qwezy.

Response:

Finally got the bugger landed….my very first smallmouth bass (I think!) on a fly.  

It had to be a Largemouth. Well done. I’m far from a bass expert, but if I were you I’d try some poppers and other surface lures that are large enough that the bluegill can’t take them. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

Response:

as a dork figure surged from under the moss toward the cricket. This is just begging for a joke.

Well, hell…..that explains all the trouble with my casting today!  If I would Bruce

Response:

Nice story QwezyR.  Thanks for providing the imagery that my day lacked and my mind desperately needed. Had to remember the posts about pulling back too hard on the line and/or pole…only an inch needed to anchor the hook

  One suggestion though, try using a fly rod instead of a pole when fly fishing.  You can cast a lot better with a fly rod than a pole.  HTH? Warren X#-[

Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

Response:

Finally got the bugger landed….my very first smallmouth bass (I think!) on a fly.  

Congrats— But it was a largemouth…….As far as I know there are no smallmouths in the Orlando area, and unless there are some in the panhandle I don’t know about, none in Florida! Lloyd Heilbrunn Palm Beach Gardens, FL.

Response:

I’ve been learning this fly fishing craft for about a year now…with little chance to catch anything other than bluegill.  Not to knock them, but they have a lower apeal after so many of them.  That all changed today for me.  Picture, A stereotypical lazy, dark, Oak/Spanish moss covered central Florida stream…black water, moss on the banks, other aquatic vegitation here and there, black, still waters.  My newfound favorite hole for the time being. Been stalking whatever may be in there for a couple weks now.  Even learned the value of not stepping on the resident gator’s favorite hole.  On my K-mart trip this week for diapers, I got the urge to pick up some new flies.  A nice box of terrestrials looked enticing. Armed with my newfound cricket, I approached a shallow cove in the stream, dark waters broken slightly by shafts of light through the oaks.  The first cast across the stream to the opposite bank of moss with the cricket drew some attention of the bluegills….no bite.  The second cast found the blues scattering violently as a dork figure surged from under the moss toward the cricket.  This is it, I thought….the moment for which I’ve been lurking in this news group…all the lessons and thoughts of others culminating in this one dark fugure heading to my fly.  BAM!!!!!!  Much harder strike than any bluegill I ever had on the line!  Had to remember the posts about pulling back too hard on the line and/or pole…only an inch needed to anchor the hook.  And off on a fun ride we went!  THIS is what it’s all about, I thought for the couple minutes I played the fish, hoping I don’t lose my first real one. Finally got the bugger landed….my very first smallmouth bass (I think!) on a fly.  About 10-12 inches long (I have no idea how much that size would weigh) God, how exhilerating.  A real fish for once!  I remembered my vow to keep and grill the first real fish I ever caught on that rod…and thought again, "No…I’ll meet you again, little fishy!  Maybe next time, but thanks for the fun today!" What a great morning to be alive! Bruce

Response:

Question:

/daytripper (*feeling* Over 80 but actually much younger)

Much?  Oh Lordy!  Let’s go for another walk on Upper!    :)

Response:

How about magazines for the younger folks here?

It took me a minute to get that one  There are some great articles in there: – Easy access ramps on wilderness rivers near you! – Geritol makes a great leader greaser – Clip-on flies: do they spook fish? – The "granny" knot – new research shows it’s not as weak as you thought – The new generation automatic reels – are they strong enough to reel in fish over 12" for you? — Regards, Jeff Before you buy.

Response:

Over 80 Fly Fishing Magazines on ebay at: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=331586733

How about magazines for the younger folks here? /daytripper (*feeling* Over 80 but actually much younger)

Response:

Over 80 Fly Fishing Magazines on ebay at: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=331586733

Response:

OK, got my bid in….one of the photos showed a walker with built in rod holder…..hot damn!! Frank (crip) Church – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Over 80 Fly Fishing Magazines on ebay at: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=331586733 How about magazines for the younger folks here? /daytripper (*feeling* Over 80 but actually much younger)

Response:

Question:

Ok, we are two couples that want to rent a houseboat next May for our vacation.  No kids, 4 careers, all we want to do is a little fishing and a lot of relaxing.  We would like to keep the cost under $1500 for the week. Where’s the best place to go?  Currently we are in Ark and TX but 2 of us commute to NC and Europe.  What’s the best lake to go "houseboating"?   One says Lake of the Woods, one says Lake Mead.  I can’t find but a few web sites.  If you’ve done anything like this or have a recommendation please let me know.

Response:

There are quite a few "houseboating lakes" throughout North America.  It depends on where you want to go.  Some of the top lakes are (in no particular order): Lake Cumberland – KY Lake Powell-AZ Lake of the Ozarks-MO In your area, there is: Lake Ouchita – AR Lake Travis – TX I am sure I am leaving many out, so you can check out this link to find more "houseboating lakes" http://www.houseboatingworld.com/lake2.htm Thanks, Tim Gottschalk http://www.houseboatingworld.com

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ok, we are two couples that want to rent a houseboat next May for our vacation.  No kids, 4 careers, all we want to do is a little fishing and a lot of relaxing.  We would like to keep the cost under $1500 for the week. Where’s the best place to go?  Currently we are in Ark and TX but 2 of us commute to NC and Europe.  What’s the best lake to go "houseboating"? One says Lake of the Woods, one says Lake Mead.  I can’t find but a few web sites.  If you’ve done anything like this or have a recommendation please let me know.

Response:

I’ve been going to Cumberland Lake in Kentucky for last several years with 10-12 other guys for 4 days and 3 nights. This year took the wives (5 couples) and had best time of all. We rented a 64′ houseboat (they have several different models) and paid $1350 total including the fuel and another $100/couple for food &fuel for 3 speed/ski boats. For about $400/ couple you couldn’t do anything else so much fun and relaxing. Almost no houses in sight, just mountain sides all way around with over 1250 miles of natural shorline. Just so happens I have the brochure here in front of me on my  desk to get one reserved for 2000.  You might want to check them out at http://www.statedock.com  Jerry

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ok, we are two couples that want to rent a houseboat next May for our vacation.  No kids, 4 careers, all we want to do is a little fishing and a lot of relaxing.  We would like to keep the cost under $1500 for the week. Where’s the best place to go?  Currently we are in Ark and TX but 2 of us commute to NC and Europe.  What’s the best lake to go "houseboating"? One says Lake of the Woods, one says Lake Mead.  I can’t find but a few web sites.  If you’ve done anything like this or have a recommendation please let me know.

Response:

Ok, we are two couples that want to rent a houseboat next May for our vacation.  No kids, 4 careers, all we want to do is a little fishing and a lot of relaxing.  We would like to keep the cost under $1500 for the week. Where’s the best place to go?  Currently we are in Ark and TX but 2 of us commute to NC and Europe.  What’s the best lake to go "houseboating"?   One says Lake of the Woods, one says Lake Mead.  I can’t find but a few web sites.  If you’ve done anything like this or have a recommendation please let me know.

Probably one of the premier houseboat rental vacations in the U.S. can be had at Lake Powell.  You mention Lake Mead as a possibility.  Mead is nice, but I would have to give a significant edge to Powell for its overwhelming scenery and top-flight houseboat rental operation.  From your location, you would drive past Lake Powell to get to Mead.  If you intend to fly to your destination, Powell has a nearby airport in Page, but airfare is somewhat expensive, like it is to most small towns. Unfortunately, summer rental rates start May 1.  Heavily discounted rates can be had prior to that date, but $1,536 will rent a 36 footer for 6 days at on-season rates.  The water will be quite chilly in May, but the ambient temperatures will be beautiful and the crowds will not have shown up yet. Go to www.visitlakepowell for an introduction and complete information on the houseboats, including rates. Russ

Response:

Ok, we are two couples that want to rent a houseboat next May for our vacation.  No kids, 4 careers, all we want to do is a little fishing and a lot of relaxing.  We would like to keep the cost under $1500 for the week. Where’s the best place to go?  Currently we are in Ark and TX but 2 of us commute to NC and Europe.  What’s the best lake to go "houseboating"?   One says Lake of the Woods, one says Lake Mead.  I can’t find but a few web sites.  If you’ve done anything like this or have a recommendation please let me know.

Check out State Dock at Lake Cumberland 1-800-234-DOCK.  We went with three couples with kids and had a blast. I know they have a web site, but I don’t remember what it is. A search will do it. — Alan Fishwick

Response:

Do you go to 76 Falls? Not really a place for kids thou.  We go a couple times a year just to be at the Falls. Going to be their again for Memorial Day weekend. Beautiful lake and surroundings. I tell the wife I want to pull up roots and move to Kentucky just to be closer to the lakes. Jerry

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Check out State Dock at Lake Cumberland 1-800-234-DOCK.  We went with three couples with kids and had a blast. I know they have a web site, but I don’t remember what it is. A search will do it. — Alan Fishwick

Response:

All good choices, but no one has mentioned Ireland.  We have cruised the Shannon and the Shannon-Erne waterways (two trips), and enjoyed it very much.  Emerald Star Line is one of the best companies (we rented from them the second time).  We were using kind of "cabin cruiser" type boats, rather than the kind of house boats that would be found on Lake Powell. Of course, cruising the canals and rivers of France is also popular; we know people who have done that several times.  I believe that there are many waterways in Europe suitable for various kind of houseboats, including the long, skinny, and low canal boats. Richard – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ok, we are two couples that want to rent a houseboat next May for our vacation.  No kids, 4 careers, all we want to do is a little fishing and a lot of relaxing.  We would like to keep the cost under $1500 for the week. Where’s the best place to go?  Currently we are in Ark and TX but 2 of us commute to NC and Europe.  What’s the best lake to go "houseboating"?   One says Lake of the Woods, one says Lake Mead.  I can’t find but a few web sites.  If you’ve done anything like this or have a recommendation please let me know.

Response:

I along with 7 others also go to Lake Cumberland fishing for 8 days every year. We go in Oct. NOBODY around. Check out Grider Hill instead of State Dock, really great people, FINE houseboats! * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response:

We always stop in at Grider to get gas and watch the other boats. Seen the pic they have with a canoe going over 76 Falls? Jerry

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I along with 7 others also go to Lake Cumberland fishing for 8 days every year. We go in Oct. NOBODY around. Check out Grider Hill instead of State Dock, really great people, FINE houseboats! * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response:

Ok, we are two couples that want to rent a houseboat next May for our vacation.  No kids, 4 careers, all we want to do is a little fishing and a lot of relaxing.  We would like to keep the cost under $1500 for the week. Where’s the best place to go?  Currently we are in Ark and TX but 2 of us commute to NC and Europe.  What’s the best lake to go "houseboating"? One says Lake of the Woods, one says Lake Mead.  I can’t find but a few web sites.  If you’ve done anything like this or have a recommendation please let me know.

I’m located on Lake of the Woods and it is a beautiful fresh water lake about 65 miles long and 35 at it’s widest point. There are several houseboat rental outfits on our Lake. I would be reluctant to recommend a houseboat rental in May on L.O.W for the simple reason that it is too early in the season. The water is very cold . We frequently still have ice on the lake around the 1st week of May. Depending on what part of May you are looking at you may find that fishing season is not open due to spawning. Temps. in the day may be nice however the evenings are still quite cold. Nope, if I was you I would stick to Lake Powell. Now if you can come up our way later in June you would have excellent fishing and warmer weather although the water temps are still quite cold. I have been on Lake of the Woods all my life. Feel free to e-mail me if your interested in any further info. on L.O.W. Rick

Response:

I have been on Lake of the Woods all my life. Feel free to e-mail me if your interested in any further info. on L.O.W.

Last time I was up there, the (what you guys call a) road going to the lake was sooo bad that I had to abandon my pop-up camper trailer along the side and come back for it later.  Beautiful area though… Steve — / / / / / /

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I have been on Lake of the Woods all my life. Feel free to e-mail me if your interested in any further info. on L.O.W. Last time I was up there, the (what you guys call a) road going to the lake was sooo bad that I had to abandon my pop-up camper trailer along the side and come back for it later.  Beautiful area though… Steve — / / /

Seems like road construction, especially on Hwy 17 (International Fall MN to Kenora Ontario) is always under construction . You make a good point though for anyone towing a boat in this area. It is not unusual to have to travel miles and miles on what used to be a paved Highway and is now gravel while under going resurfacing. Rick – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – / / /

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Oh, yes, I’ve seen the pic!! When we go, in Oct. the lake is down so that when we put our bass boats in, the RAMP is a quarter mile long!! I really like Grider Hill, very pretty place, the guy that runs it is very nice, and helpful. * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

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Question:

Thinking of Belize next Feb/March primarily for diving. Anyone got any information good/bad

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I was there a number of years ago and plan to go back. Inaddition to the usual dive cites, Check out Placentia on the coast. — Dennis Gibbons CN35-207 S/V Dark Lady

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thinking of Belize next Feb/March primarily for diving. Anyone got any information good/bad

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The diving’s great, as there is a barrier reef off the coast (I think I read that it’s the second largest in the world after Australia).  We saw intense coral formations, lots of beautiful fish, whale sharks, rays, etc. Where we were in Placencia, there was NO diving off of the beach. typically the dive boats took us out to one of the cayes. Callen – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thinking of Belize next Feb/March primarily for diving. Anyone got any information good/bad

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Thinking of Belize next Feb/March primarily for diving. Anyone got any information good/bad

There are tons of terrific Web sites on Belize.  I believe that Belize has more Web sites than any other country its size in the world.  Beisides our own Web edition, I especially like the Belize by Natural Light sites and the AmbergrisCaye.com site. I edit and publish a magazine on Belize — e-mail us if you have questions, and we’ll try to answer them. –Lan Sluder Lan Sluder Editor & Publisher BELIZE FIRST MAGAZINE Free Web edition (600 + pages of ad-free information) at http://www.turq.com/belizefirst/

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Hi We went to Belize in February ‘97 and had an amazing time. Stayed in Belize City and did some day trips, then San Pedro for a couple of days. The snorkelling was incredible, so I imagine the diving is even better. Macy’s in Belize City is great place to eat. Scott – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thinking of Belize next Feb/March primarily for diving. Anyone got any information good/bad

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Thinking of Belize next Feb/March primarily for diving. Anyone got any information good/bad

Hi Bernie, Belize is great because they have not ruined it yet. It is still pretty untouched. Get a Belize guide book by Moon Publications. Most divers stay out on Ambergris Cay in or near the town of San Pedro.  You are in a nice little town on an island of the coast from Belize City. You can also stay out at one of the remote dive lodges on one of the three atolls off the coast past the reef in the Blue Water. On Turneffe Atoll, you can stay at Black Bird Resort, Turneffe Flats Lodge or Turneffe Island Lodge. On Lighthouse Atoll, you can stay at Lighthouse Reef Resort where they have the famous Blue Hole. On Glover’s Atoll, you can stay at Manta Reef Resort. This is one of the most remote palces in Belize. On South Water Cay, you can stay at the Blue Marlin Lodge right of the barrier reef. All these places have web sites now. I go to Belize to fly fish for bonefish, tarpon, permit and snook. I can help you there if you need any. I like Placencia too.  www.placencia.com Look at the Belize First site.

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Question:

Tara: I am also a fly tyer. What sort of info are you looking for? I believe we have an unfair advantage against the non-stitching tyers — we have so much more in the way of dexterity. Females’ fingers are also so much smaller than males’, so the small hooks and feathers are easier for us to manipulate. We also have experience in handling fibers, in coordinating colors, and combining textures. I’ve been tying for about 15 years now; been stitching for about 25. JulieAnn – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all, I’m curious if any stitchers know anything about fly tying?  I’ve been interested in this for years, and lo and behold, my SO is an avid fisherman. I am also lurking in the rec.outdoors.fishing.fly.tying, but it seems so male dominated, and you are all so friendly. Plus if any of you have tried it, you could give me the heads up in terms I understand. TIA Tara

Opinions expressed herein are my own and may not represent those of my employer.

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Tara: I’ve tried fly tying, and it was fun, but I never took it up as a hobby. I’m sure SO is thrilled when you express interest in fly tying. My SO’s fisherman roommates were deeply impressed to find out that I had tried fly tying, but they were even more impressed when I told them that one of my female friends from high school had taken it up as a hobby at the behest of her fisherman husband. I saw one of the guys giving his fianc

Question:

I would advise against wrapping any guide that’s bigger than you.  -AR

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If you use no color preserver, you take away the option of ever replacing a guide if you need to.  There is no way to remove the wrap without destroying the blank.

Bad advice here!  It is actually quite easy to remove a guide wrapped with non-NCP thread.  Done correctly, there will be no damage to the blank.  Simply cut through the wrap and epoxy with a single edge razor.  Slice along the guide foot to help avoid nicking the blank. Once you get started, simply slip your fingernail under the wrap and it will peel off.  No problem. I think your mass production types are more interested in eliminating a step from the manufacturing process (properly applied and allowed to dry, color preserver would add about 24 hours) than blending the color of the thread into the blank.

Actually, I think most manufacturers use non-NCP because most buyers prefer the look. You are correct however that the wrap will be stronger when the epoxy finish is applied without color preserver.  OTOH, I’ve been told that when properly done, the wrap alone should provide all the strength required to hold the guide on the rod and you should not rely on the finish to make up for a loose wrap.

It is true that you should never rely on the finish to make up for a loose wrap, but then you would always use a finish, so whether the thread wrap alone would be strong enough over time to hold the guide is academic.  Go for the strongest wrap you can and use non-NCP thread except for trim rings. Lyman Lyman G. Hughes Dallas, TX Ennis, MT

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Bad advice here!  It is actually quite easy to remove a guide wrapped with non-NCP thread.  Done correctly, there will be no damage to the blank.  Simply cut through the wrap and epoxy with a single edge razor.  Slice along the guide foot to help avoid nicking the blank. Once you get started, simply slip your fingernail under the wrap and it will peel off.  No problem. Actually, I think most manufacturers use non-NCP because most buyers prefer the look. It is true that you should never rely on the finish to make up for a loose wrap, but then you would always use a finish, so whether the thread wrap alone would be strong enough over time to hold the guide is academic.  Go for the strongest wrap you can and use non-NCP thread except for trim rings.

Great post, Lyman. My 15 years of building custom fly rods for myself, others, and commercially confirm everything you’ve said. In my rod repairs, I have never encountered a situation where blank damage has occurred when removing a guide, even on rods that had been wrapped 25 years ago. It just takes care and patience. I use standard thread with no color preservers on 90% of the rods I build. The bottom line is this technique is the best way to obtain a wrap that closely matches the color of the blank. This "stealthiness" has invaded the fly rod industry. Just take a look at Sage’s new SP line or Winston’s IM6 rods and you’ll see why the process looks so good. Ryan

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If you use no color preserver, you take away the option of ever replacing a guide if you need to.  There is no way to remove the wrap without destroying the blank. Bad advice here!  It is actually quite easy to remove a guide wrapped with non-NCP thread.  Done correctly, there will be no damage to the blank.  Simply cut through the wrap and epoxy with a single edge razor.  Slice along the guide foot to help avoid nicking the blank. Once you get started, simply slip your fingernail under the wrap and it will peel off.  No problem.

Are you kidding?  What kind of "epoxy" are you using?  When applied without color preserver the finish soaks through the thread and comes into direct contact with the blank.  I have encountered no epoxy that will "peel off" of anything. Every time I’ve tried what you mention, the thread/finish combination has turned into a solid mass.  I’ve tried exactly what you describe and cut along the guide foot with a razor.  When I pulled off the guide (with much effort) the rest of the wrap/finish stayed right where it was and left a nice solid wrap with a trench gug out where the guide foot had been.

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I used straight epoxy with no color preserve and had my rod spinner break down during the night. I woke up wih big bellies in all my wraps. I just cut them off fairly easily with a rasor and re-wrapped the whole rod. It wasn’t a big project to remove the old wrappings.

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Quoting "DavidC.Benjamin"<dcb from a message in rec.outdoors.fishing.fly    <I am seeking advice on the use of non-NCP thread for    <guide wrapping on a rod I am building.  Up to this point    <I have used only NCP threads and have been very satisfied    <with the results when finished. David – If you use non-NCP thread withoput applying color preserver it will become somewhat transparent when you apply the rod finish.  How transparent will depend on the color thread used.  If you look at some  factory rods its easy to see which brands do not use color preserver as the guidefeet show thru the wraps.  If you use color preserver the non-NCP thread will have a sparkley coloring as opposed to the flatter colors of the NCP thread.  It’s really personal preference which you prefer more. Jim Carlisle

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I am seeking advice on the use of non-NCP thread for guide wrapping on a rod I am building.  Up to this point I have used only NCP threads and have been very satisfied with the results when finished.   Recently, I bought a Thomas & Thomas Horizon blank and it is a dark blue in color.  I plan to wrap it using a dark blue colored thread (Navy Blue) with light blue and gold highlights.  However, when ordering the threads I found that the Navy Blue (Guderod #066) does not come in NCP.  I am worried that when coated it will become transparent — which I definitely do not want.  Skip Morris’s book says that if you do a trial wrap and soak it with water, you can see what it will look like when coated.  I did so and it was not transparent and I am satisfied with the way it looks and hopefully will look when coated. Question: has anyone out there had any experience with this "problem" and will it really remain non-transparent when finished?  I hope to wrap the rod within the next few days, finish it this weekend and fish it on the 27th or 28th. As you can imagine I hope to get feedback "very" soon. Thanks in advance! Keep your fly dry, David p.s. Lyman, are you out there?

I think many of the major fly rod manufacturers use non-NCP thread with no color preserver. This is not the way they finish those cool convetional salt water sticks. You will get a transparent result with no color preserver on standard thread. This gives them a clean look with the thread blending with the blank and also allows the epoxy to penetrate the thread better to bond with the blank. I have been selling rod building supplies for over 30 years and have heard almost every story imaginable. If someone has better info I will not be shocked as I have been wrong before. William Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am seeking advice on the use of non-NCP thread for guide wrapping on a rod I am building.  Up to this point I have used only NCP threads and have been very satisfied with the results when finished.   Recently, I bought a Thomas & Thomas Horizon blank and it is a dark blue in color.  I plan to wrap it using a dark blue colored thread (Navy Blue) with light blue and gold highlights.  However, when ordering the threads I found that the Navy Blue (Guderod #066) does not come in NCP.  I am worried that when coated it will become transparent — which I definitely do not want.  Skip Morris’s book says that if you do a trial wrap and soak it with water, you can see what it will look like when coated.  I did so and it was not transparent and I am satisfied with the way it looks and hopefully will look when coated. Question: has anyone out there had any experience with this "problem" and will it really remain non-transparent when finished?  I hope to wrap the rod within the next few days, finish it this weekend and fish it on the 27th or 28th. As you can imagine I hope to get feedback "very" soon. Thanks in advance! Keep your fly dry, David p.s. Lyman, are you out there? I think many of the major fly rod manufacturers use non-NCP thread with no color preserver. This is not the way they finish those cool convetional salt water sticks. You will get a transparent result with no color preserver on standard thread. This gives them a clean look with the thread blending with the blank and also allows the epoxy to penetrate the thread better to bond with the blank. I have been selling rod building supplies for over 30 years and have heard almost every story imaginable. If someone has better info I will not be shocked as I have been wrong before. William Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA

But… If you use no color preserver, you take away the option of ever replacing a guide if you need to.  There is no way to remove the wrap without destroying the blank. I think your mass production types are more interested in eliminating a step from the manufacturing process (properly applied and allowed to dry, color preserver would add about 24 hours) than blending the color of the thread into the blank. You are correct however that the wrap will be stronger when the epoxy finish is applied without color preserver.  OTOH, I’ve been told that when properly done, the wrap alone should provide all the strength required to hold the guide on the rod and you should not rely on the finish to make up for a loose wrap.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am seeking advice on the use of non-NCP thread for guide wrapping on a rod I am building.  Up to this point I have used only NCP threads and have been very satisfied with the results when finished.   Recently, I bought a Thomas & Thomas Horizon blank and it is a dark blue in color.  I plan to wrap it using a dark blue colored thread (Navy Blue) with light blue and gold highlights.  However, when ordering the threads I found that the Navy Blue (Guderod #066) does not come in NCP.  I am worried that when coated it will become transparent — which I definitely do not want.  Skip Morris’s book says that if you do a trial wrap and soak it with water, you can see what it will look like when coated.  I did so and it was not transparent and I am satisfied with the way it looks and hopefully will look when coated. Question: has anyone out there had any experience with this "problem" and will it really remain non-transparent when finished?  I hope to wrap the rod within the next few days, finish it this weekend and fish it on the 27th or 28th. As you can imagine I hope to get feedback "very" soon. Thanks in advance! Keep your fly dry, David p.s. Lyman, are you out there? I think many of the major fly rod manufacturers use non-NCP thread with no color preserver. This is not the way they finish those cool convetional salt water sticks. You will get a transparent result with no color preserver on standard thread. This gives them a clean look with the thread blending with the blank and also allows the epoxy to penetrate the thread better to bond with the blank. I have been selling rod building supplies for over 30 years and have heard almost every story imaginable. If someone has better info I will not be shocked as I have been wrong before. William Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA

I always use color preservative to provide the ability to replace the guide (it WILL happen) and to seal the underwrap/blank wrap. In addition I find that the application of epoxy is easier (resulting in a much better finish) since I don’t have to hunt for gaps in the thread (the preserver fills it in). Of course as you say there are a million stroies and a million ways …. "The true angler is always content to fish alone" Brian Di Carlo

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Using that dark thread on a similarly-colored blank, you shouldn’t have any trouble.  I build a lot of salt-water "standup" tuna rods on black Seeker blanks, and use medium blue non-NCP A thread for base wraps.  It works fine–as does the even lighter grey "gunmetal" thread I’m now using on a pair of Shakespeare Ugly Sticks.  Just be careful to use enough coats of color preserver, and soak all of the wrap.  I usually use 3 coats half-strength and 2 coats full strength (Clemens "Brilliance" brand) before applying the epoxy coats.  If you see "bleed-through" with the color preserver that doesn’t disappear when the preserver dries, you have a problem.  Redo that wrap.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I am seeking advice on the use of non-NCP thread for guide wrapping on a rod I am building.  Up to this point I have used only NCP threads and have been very satisfied with the results when finished.   Recently, I bought a Thomas & Thomas Horizon blank and it is a dark blue in color.  I plan to wrap it using a dark blue colored thread (Navy Blue) with light blue and gold highlights.  However, when ordering the threads I found that the Navy Blue (Guderod #066) does not come in NCP.  I am worried that when coated it will become transparent — which I definitely do not want.  Skip Morris’s book says that if you do a trial wrap and soak it with water, you can see what it will look like when coated.  I did so and it was not transparent and I am satisfied with the way it looks and hopefully will look when coated. Question: has anyone out there had any experience with this "problem" and will it really remain non-transparent when finished?  I hope to wrap the rod within the next few days, finish it this weekend and fish it on the 27th or 28th. As you can imagine I hope to get feedback "very" soon. Thanks in advance! Keep your fly dry, David p.s. Lyman, are you out there?

There is a very good chance that the thread will become somewhat transparent when you apply epoxy.  The way to solve this problem is to use colour preserver.  One of the best brands available in my opinion is U40 Color Lock.   I think you will be pleased with regular thread over NCP thread.  This type of thread has stronger highlights when used with color preserver, and I think looks much better than NCP.  As well, an added bonus is that Regular thread is a little stronger than NCP as well it is not as porous, therefore, you will not have the same bubble problems that may occur with NCP. Ian Scott Wishbone Custom Rods http://www.headwaters.com/wishbone

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I am seeking advice on the use of non-NCP thread for guide wrapping on a rod I am building.  Up to this point I have used only NCP threads and have been very satisfied with the results when finished.   Recently, I bought a Thomas & Thomas Horizon blank and it is a dark blue in color.  I plan to wrap it using a dark blue colored thread (Navy Blue) with light blue and gold highlights.  However, when ordering the threads I found that the Navy Blue (Guderod #066) does not come in NCP.  I am worried that when coated it will become transparent — which I definitely do not want.  Skip Morris’s book says that if you do a trial wrap and soak it with water, you can see what it will look like when coated.  I did so and it was not transparent and I am satisfied with the way it looks and hopefully will look when coated. Question: has anyone out there had any experience with this "problem" and will it really remain non-transparent when finished?  I hope to wrap the rod within the next few days, finish it this weekend and fish it on the 27th or 28th. As you can imagine I hope to get feedback "very" soon. Thanks in advance! Keep your fly dry, David p.s. Lyman, are you out there?

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Question:

Regarding the Upper Sac…. Last year I fished it with lures not flies due to the fact I didnt know how to fly fish:) I caught some beautiful McCloud Redbands around the Sim’s Campground area. Nice place to stay and good trails to walk the river up and down for a couple miles or so along the train tracks. Kurtz-

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If anybody could tell me what the first hatch of the year in the Upper Sac.  I would appreciate it.  My tying is slow, and I need to get as many as I can.  Any spots or stories are always welcome too.

Hello, The first hatch of the year on the Upper Sac is the famous Bead Head Prince Nymph hatch.  :-)  Sorry. Ok, actually it’s probably the Baetis, but the stoneflies get more attention. Both  salmonflies and golden stones will hatch, though it seems the numbers are down since the spill. Besides the standard stonefly imitations (Sofa Pillow, Stimulator, etc.) definitely try the Orange Humpy – for some reason it’s always a good searching pattern on the Sac (Pteronarcys, October Caddis?). Don’t forget to keep a few Green Drakes in your box. Last year I happened to be fortunate enough to be there when they came off and it was "stupid" fishing. Don’t let anybody fool ya’, the Sac is *still* a great river. Good fishing,    Alan.   Alan Barnard   Kiene’s Fly Shop   Sacramento, California   WWW Fly Tyer   http://www.ns.net/~barnard

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If anybody could tell me what the first hatch of the year in the Upper Sac.  I would appreciate it.  My tying is slow, and I need to get as many as I can.  Any spots or stories are always welcome too.

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In article If anybody could tell me what the first hatch of the year in the Upper Sac.  I would appreciate it.  My tying is slow, and I need to get as many as I can.  Any spots or stories are always welcome too.

I am sure there are caddis coming off already but it’s not open season there until April 27th.  As the water will be very high when it does open, you should tie up plenty of bead head nymphs – I find light green and regular hare’s ears do well there.  Dry fly fishing will be worthwhile on the side eddies and pockets with caddis emergers and dries, especially in the evenings, but you’ll get more action throughout the day with a two-nymph rig in the pockets as long as the current is down enough for the pockets to exist.  If not cast them right into the white water and hold the rod high and follow them down, what they call high-sticking.  Be careful wading as this river can be slippery. If you have an appreciation for flyfishing oldtimers, be sure to visit the Ted Fay Fly Shop located on the main street on the north end of Dunsmuir. You’ll want some black bombers like Ted Fay fly shop sells – lead wire under black yarn fat body with bit of grizzly hackle and optional splayed grizzly hackle tips for wings. If you are a home brewer fill a carboy at any of the fountains in Dunsmuir – this "best water on earth" makes for the best homebrew too. Here’s some reminiscing: I used to fish the area around Pollard Flat close to lake Shasta when I was a student and had no money.  I would take the Greyhound bus and have the driver drop me off there on I5, set up camp and fish a day or two then hike or hitchhike up to Dunsmuir to take the bus home. Back before about 1984 there was a free forest service campground a short walk from the all night truck diner there at Pollard Flat. I could fish all day up the river and hike back along the tracks in the dark, then instead of cooking in the dark enjoy a cheap cheeseburger and a lettuce salad and read a Field and Stream and even see a little TV.   They had Anchor Steam beer for 75 cents a bottle which was cheaper than buying sixpacks in SF.   This lower section usually had less fish but a high proportion of them were big.  There was one bend that always had a giant trout surface feeding that I could never approach without putting down, year after year. Joe Kinsey at the Ted Fay Fly Shop showed me their crude-looking flies which looked pretty much exactly like the smaller than normal black stonefles they had in vials in the shop, and told me some good places right there in Dunsmuir.  One time I caught ten good trout in one spot and after the third fish the fly was just a ragged blob of black yarn but it kept working better and better.  From this I learned that those pretty and delicate looking flies aren’t what you want. Later when I had an income I tried to take two friends up there. The campground was closed and overgrown, the diner had been sold and had born again reactionary hate messages posted on the walls inside and they had no beer at any price. From this I learned to enjoy things while you can. The weekend before it was wiped out in the pesticide spill I stopped enroute from the Klamath are caught a rainbow that took me into the backing but turned out to only be about 12 inches long – this must be some kind of record.   Have a good time – it is still a beautiful river and getting better all the time. Mark Vinsel http://www.lanminds.com/local/vinnie/gallery.html

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