Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Kevin, You are going at the prime time. I would look at the Mangrove Outfitters Fly Shop web site and then email them some questions. I am sure that they could arrange a guide/boat for you now as good guides are very hard to get in the spring. I would bring any fly rods from #6 through #12 that you have. I like a 9′ #9, 3 or 4 piece rod for a basic salt water rod for bonefish, snook, small tarpon, redfish and sea trout. I would have a floating line and a slow sinking clear line. —– Original Message —– Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly Sent: 01 December 1999 08:20 Hi Kevin, You are going at the prime time. I would look at the Mangrove Outfitters Fly Shop web site and then email them some questions. I am sure that they could arrange a guide/boat for you now as good guides are very hard to get in the spring. I would bring any fly rods from #6 through #12 that you have. I like a 9′ #9, 3 or 4 piece rod for a basic salt water rod for bonefish, snook, small tarpon, redfish and sea trout. I would have a floating line and a slow sinking clear line. Thanks Bill, Your interest is much appreciated, We are bringing a couple of #6 and a #9 . Good news in your reply about the time of year to visit, I`m getting a twitchy right arm just thinking about going. We are from the UK and have never connected with any of the species that you mention. Did have a short trip to the Keys last Jan, but conditions were poor for fishing and the flats guides were beyond our pockets on that occasion, managed some permit wading a flat, plenty of barracuda and some small shark tho. I vowed to go back, and take my son with me. His head is full of dreams of tarpon!!! I am having trouble locating The Mangrove Outfitters Fly shop web site with the search engines, does anyone out there have a link we could share?

Response:

Try http://www.mangrove-outfitters.com/ This was the first hit on Google Chris – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <snip I am having trouble locating The Mangrove Outfitters Fly shop web site with the search engines, does anyone out there have a link we could share?

Response:

Can anyone help us out please? My 10 year old son and I intend to spend a couple of weeks in the Naples area this coming Easter and not having been there before we are looking for help, lots of it. For starters: What sort of saltwater fly fishing can we expect to find and where are the local hotspots, what species are around this area at the end of April, can we get by without a guide? Having said that recommendations for a good guide would be greatly appreciated although we are unlikely to be able to afford more than one trip with one. Advice on flies would be greatly appreciated so that we can get tying. Tips on suitable tackle warmly welcomed, My son is not a good caster with a fly rod so he is likely to want to spin and baitfish, spinning particularly. I will cross post to roft to widen the network. Thanks in anticipation, I have never posted on this group, asking for help, and not got it. Kevin and Ian Cumming

Response:

Hi Kevin, You are going at the prime time. I would look at the Mangrove Outfitters Fly Shop web site and then email them some questions. I am sure that they could arrange a guide/boat for you now as good guides are very hard to get in the spring. I would bring any fly rods from #6 through #12 that you have. I like a 9′ #9, 3 or 4 piece rod for a basic salt water rod for bonefish, snook, small tarpon, redfish and sea trout. I would have a floating line and a slow sinking clear line.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Can anyone help us out please? My 10 year old son and I intend to spend a couple of weeks in the Naples area this coming Easter and not having been there before we are looking for help, lots of it. For starters: What sort of saltwater fly fishing can we expect to find and where are the local hotspots, what species are around this area at the end of April, can we get by without a guide? Having said that recommendations for a good guide would be greatly appreciated although we are unlikely to be able to afford more than one trip with one. Advice on flies would be greatly appreciated so that we can get tying. Tips on suitable tackle warmly welcomed, My son is not a good caster with a fly rod so he is likely to want to spin and baitfish, spinning particularly. I will cross post to roft to widen the network. Thanks in anticipation, I have never posted on this group, asking for help, and not got it. Kevin and Ian Cumming

Response:

Question:

I was reading about the death of Payne Stewart and came across a list of sports figures who have lost their lives in plane crashes. One was Johnny Dieckman, world fly-casting champion who died in Chicago, March1, 1962. Was he well known among flyfisherman?

Response:

Allen He may have been but he doesn’t show up in the index or the biblio of Schullery’s Amer. Fly Fishing, A History. You might want to check with the museum Dave – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was reading about the death of Payne Stewart and came across a list of sports figures who have lost their lives in plane crashes. One was Johnny Dieckman, world fly-casting champion who died in Chicago, March1, 1962. Was he well known among flyfisherman?

Response:

I was reading about the death of Payne Stewart and came across a list of sports figures who have lost their lives in plane crashes. One was Johnny Dieckman, world fly-casting champion who died in Chicago, March1, 1962. Was he well known among flyfisherman?

Lee Wulff was killed when he pranged his plane a few years back.

Response:

I was reading about the death of Payne Stewart and came across a list of sports figures who have lost their lives in plane crashes. One was Johnny Dieckman, world fly-casting champion who died in Chicago, March1, 1962. Was he well known among flyfisherman?

Hi Allen, I heard his name years ago, maybe from my Cortland Line Company Rep, now retired, Joe Patterson. I would bet that the old timers like Lefty, Kurt Gowdy or Jack Samson would have known him.

Response:

Question:

If I only had one more day I could fish, I think I would want it to be the day I had Wednesday. I hadn’t been out for about 5 weeks. Too busy at work. This coming from the guy who’s motto is "The best time to go fishing is when you are too busy to go". I had to attend too many meetings, give too many talks, and write too many grants over the past little while. Finally, I had finished everything, and called my fishing buddy to go. I left the house Wednesday morning. It is about an hour’s drive to my friend’s place. I live in Lethbridge, Alberta, he lives in the Crowsnest Pass. This is nice drive, and gives me a lot of time for some quiet thoughts. You pass over the treeless prairie, watching the Rocky mountains in front of you getting closer, until finally, you are surrounded by them. I meet my buddy, and since it is real windy in Alberta, we decide to make the short drive across the divide into BC to go for cutthroats. When we hit the river, it is sunny, with  a light breeze. I began nymphing at the tail of a deep, fast run. The takes are real subtle, you can barely see the indicator move when the fish is on. It doesn’t matter, because I land my first fish about 10 – 15 minutes after I began, and they just seem to keep coming steadily. I work my way to the head of the run, walk back to the tail, and sit down and watch my friend across the river. It is getting kind of windy over here now, but by some luck, the wind is at my back. I decided to try some dry flies. This is October 20, in Western Canada, but what the heck. I put on a huge size 10 Chernobyl Ant, because they are supposed to work okay on the fish in this river, and I start working my way back up the same run.  Not two casts later, I see a large cutt come slowly from the bottom to the fly, and miss. I cast over the same spot, and he comes again, and slowly sucks the fly in. I set the hook, and land another one. This goes on for a while, probably about a half hour to an hour. These big cutts kept appearing from nowhere it seems, and kept taking the fly, almost in slow motion. I would see a large fish, he would pause, then take the fly, and I would set the hook. The fish are larger than the ones I was catching using the nymphs. These fish are slabs, and they are beautiful. My friend shows up. I ask him if he wants to fish this run for a while, he tells me no, he is heading farther upstream. I’ll meet him there in a while. Right after he leaves, I notice there a lot of these big cutts rising all over the run. Fins and snouts everywhere. They don’t seem to care too much about the big dry fly anymore, so I tie on a finer tippet and a size 18 comparadun, because it looks like we are either having a midge or a blue-winged olive hatch. I can’t see any bugs, just these rising fish. I cast the comparadun, and watch it drift. The water is fast, and accuracy doesn’t matter here. Just put the fly on the current, and a fish will come up for it. This keeps going on, just like before, only now I am catching them on a size 18 instead of a size 10. I look upstream, and I can’t see my friend anymore. I check my watch, and time has evaporated. I head upstream, and see him fishing a run. I cross the river, and sit on the bank behind him, watching him. We decide to leave at 4:30, and it now just a little after 4. He tells me some cutts are rising in a little run upstream, and probably feeding on small flies. He had got a few, so I went up to look. It was more of the same, I cast a small dry, watch it drift, see a little swirl and bulge in the water, set the hook, and a fish is on. I lose the compardun when the tippet breaks, the only fly I lose all day. I figure what the hell, let’s see how they like a small red foam ant. They do. My friend shows up at the side of the river upstream from me, and tells me he can see a fish rising. I can’t see it, but after a few casts, finally figure out where the little critter is likely to be. I drift the red foam ant over him, there’s the swirl and bulge, and I have my last fish for the day. We left right after that. The wind had died down, the walk back was pleasant. The leaves were yellow and coming off the trees.  Winter is on its way, and many of the streams will be closed soon. I will be out again this Wednesday, with a different fishing buddy, and a different stream. I don’t expect to have the same magical kind of day, but I really don’t care. It will be a different magic, but magic all the same. Tim Lysyk

Response:

Very nice report. Thanks. I just do not know what this group is coming too lately, I check in for my regular dose of slander, ranting, and general angry argument, and what do I find ? Nice interesting posts about fishing ! )) TL MC

Response:

If I only had one more day I could fish, I think I would want it to be the day I had Wednesday. [an Albertan's trip to British Columbia snipped]

I have never seen a cutthroat (trout, that is) but somehow your post did nearly make me think I had.   Also reminded me that I’d better visit the Canadian Rockies several times before I die. Mu Young Lee           Ann Arbor, MI  USA

Response:

Very nice report. Thanks. I just do not know what this group is coming too lately, I check in for my regular dose of slander, ranting, and general angry argument, and what do I find ? Nice interesting posts about fishing ! )) TL MC

        yes, indeed, agreed.  oh, canada!  just another day in paradise.  well done narrative, tim. wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

Mu: We have a short blurb on cutthroat on our web page at: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/cnangler/html/cutts.htm Tim Lysyk cutthroat (trout, that is) but somehow your post did – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – nearly make me think I had.   Also reminded me that I’d better visit the Canadian Rockies several times before I die. Mu Young Lee           Ann Arbor, MI  USA

Response:

In article <Pine.SOL.4.10.9910250317540.29864- I have never seen a cutthroat (trout, that is) but somehow your post did nearly make me think I had.   Also reminded me that I’d better visit the Canadian Rockies several times before I die. Mu Young Lee           Ann Arbor, MI  USA

Mu, Definitely visit my old stomping grounds then… The Kananaskis Lakes area are wonderful for that! I have had friends tell me of streams in Banff Natl. Park but I can’ recall now. When I lived in Alberta I got sick of catching trout. Matter of fact that was all we seemed to catch for the most part. I love the "trash fish" from this area. I am still rabid about catching bass and bluegills on my fly rod. Next I am going for the salt! Who hoo! — Michael Era

Question:

Well, Willi…..

This ROFF rant was well worth the price of admission if only to hear T-Bones lounge lizard act. — Ken Fortenberry- kicks shit out of little old lady litterers Illini 1 – Tar Heels 0

Response:

Nope… didn’t rant or rave or attack anyone personally, just attacked the bunch of "cyberbullies" that think everyone else wants to listen to their shit! Besides, I gave everyone a technique as to how they can avoid it…so, no harm- no foul- case in point….I deleted Fornicationberry’s response unread =) Larry #:)#

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I’m sure he’s distressed.<

Actually, I bet he’s pleased that someone actually relates the concept of fornication with his name.  <g

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It is true that I have never seen him engaged in sexual congress, but

he always seemed less obsessed with the concept than some of the others around at the time<g.< Still water runs deep.  <g

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Geeeeze.   I go fishing for a few days, come home and Fortenberry has his own thread and there is a thread about "off topic posts". Didn’t we go down these roads before?  And before that too? What’s left — another C&R/C&K thread, or maybe one about the effin’ Indians stealing from us white folk!  I betcha some dumb sumbitch is gonna ask what the best floatant is! Darwinnian my ass!  Dalwhinnie, maybe.  <g Louie (who is packin’ goin’ fishin’) Dave LaCourse

Response:

Larry,    The filter is a great tool.  There is only one person on this group who I have filtered out all of his posts, but there are many threads where people start in saying things that should be taken to e-mail.  When I see there will be nothing more of value on a thread I filter it.. Ernie Harrison See Ernie’s Fly-Fishing Stuff:   http://home.pacbell.net/ernie2 Well, Willi….. <snip Personally, I think anytime someone wants to rant-n-rave, it should be taken to private quarters and left out of the public arena, but the vast majority of these chest thumping testosterone laden hairy palmed individuals think that it’s quite important to make a public display of their idiocy and then look for others to come to their aid, grunting "UnNNNHHH- Me TOO….

<snip Larry #:)# – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

Larry While not agreeing completely with your characterization, I will at least own a part of it and back off on some of these threads which frankly get my dander up. Of late there have been too many in that set. To the extent that Ive not seen the humor in a selective charactiture of the US, and my reaction is seen as hatred, I apologize to Christian, Mike and Herman. I will note that the spirit of the Revolutionary Army singing Yankee Doodle Dandy at Yorktown was reportedly very high and even our Polish, German, Irish and French officers joined in. Humor gentleman, humor. As to the Native American thread, which relates directly to the laws and history of the US, I am honestly appalled at the degree of ignorance expressed on ROFF for which I find no excuse in a group of my countryman with such nominally high educational levels. Racial considerations have been an element in our history from the start. Im no saint in this regard. What I find particularly chilling is the "reasonableness" of expression of this ignorance by nominally good men. I also note that the Southerners among us and some of those from the older parts of the US seem in general a bit more perceptive of where such ignorance leads. So maybe the lessons of our history are not lost. In any case Im taking a time out from the more controversial threads, and going to stick to FFing for a bit. Hope that helps. Dave – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Nope… didn’t rant or rave or attack anyone personally, just attacked the bunch of "cyberbullies" that think everyone else wants to listen to their shit! Besides, I gave everyone a technique as to how they can avoid it…so, no harm- no foul- case in point….I deleted Fornicationberry’s response unread =) Larry #:)#

Response:

Nope… didn’t rant or rave or attack anyone personally, … ….I deleted Fornicationberry’s response unread =)

Well, I’ll take at face value your assertion that you didn’t attack anyone personally and conclude from your last line that you were just flexing your intellectual muscle. That’s so cute, and such a BIG word too, I sure am proud of you sweetheart. You keep working real hard and one of these days you’ll get out of fifth grade and be able to play with the big boys too. — Ken Fortenberry Illini 2 – Tar Heels 0

Response:

As to the Native American thread, which relates directly to the laws and history of the US, I am honestly appalled at the degree of ignorance expressed on ROFF for which I find no excuse in a group of my countryman with such nominally high educational levels. Racial considerations have been an element in our history from the start. Im no saint in this regard. What I find particularly chilling is the "reasonableness" of expression of this ignorance by nominally good men.

Well said. I too grow weary. I said in another thread that there were two almost equally distasteful options, ignore racist posts or set to with the racists. As it turns out most of the racists are good guys that just don’t know any better. I’ve drawn my line in the sand. Everyone here should know by now where I stand. This brouhaha has tipped the scale of "almost equally distasteful" back to where I think it better to ignore racist posts. I don’t know what posessed me to think it better to tilt at the other side of the scale other than frustration and an inflated sense of my own poor powers of persuasion. I do appreciate all the supportive email and the kind words from "lurkers" and Europeans alike. And a quick note to Harry Mason, we are in 100% agreement. Throwing out the race card IS an attempt to end the discussion. Sure as hell don’t work around here though. Native Americans are NOT the problem, but they sure make convenient scapegoats. — Ken Fortenberry Illini 2 – Tar Heels 0

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – As to the Native American thread, which relates directly to the laws and history of the US, I am honestly appalled at the degree of ignorance expressed on ROFF for which I find no excuse in a group of my countryman with such nominally high educational levels. Racial considerations have been an element in our history from the start. Im no saint in this regard. What I find particularly chilling is the "reasonableness" of expression of this ignorance by nominally good men. Well said. I too grow weary. I said in another thread that there were two almost equally distasteful options, ignore racist posts or set to with the racists. As it turns out most of the racists are good guys that just don’t know any better. I’ve drawn my line in the sand. Everyone here should know by now where I stand. This brouhaha has tipped the scale of "almost equally distasteful" back to where I think it better to ignore racist posts. I don’t know what posessed me to think it better to tilt at the other side of the scale other than frustration and an inflated sense of my own poor powers of persuasion. I do appreciate all the supportive email and the kind words from "lurkers" and Europeans alike. And a quick note to Harry Mason, we are in 100% agreement. Throwing out the race card IS an attempt to end the discussion. Sure as hell don’t work around here though. Native Americans are NOT the problem, but they sure make convenient scapegoats. — Ken Fortenberry Illini 2 – Tar Heels 0

Americans ARE the problem and killers of the extraordinary amount of America’s Wildlife they are plundering. What part of this is racist and what part of this problem don’t you understand Ken? This IS A REALITY CHECK. You understand – Check this line. You Don’t Understand – Check this line. — Mr. G.   http://www.gink.com/html  Fly Fisherman’s Chat Site   "Flyfisherman’s Camp Fires Burning" http://www.gink.com http://www.rodbuilding.com http://www.xink.com

Question:

Register now for: Fly tying classes, instructor Derek Tay,  beginning January 1999 Fly Casting classes beginning April 1999 Christmas gift certificates available Atlantic Fly Fishing School Brookfield, Nova Scotia www.flyschool.net

Response:

Register now for: Fly tying classes, instructor Derek Tay,  beginning January 1999 Fly Casting classes beginning April 1999 Christmas gift certificates available Atlantic Fly Fishing School Brookfield, Nova Scotia www.flyschool.net

____ Your http://www.flyschool.net  will show up blueif you add the http://  (I think!)  Why it didn’t light up as a web site, I don’t know.   Someone will tell me. Anyhow, I think teaching people "how" to use their hands tying flies is the primary goal before we teach them specific flies.  For example, how to use the hands to tie in tails, wings, tying knots, etc. When I go to Sports Shows with Fly Tiers, I will watch instructors on how they explain tying a fly, and FEW, if any ever cover what they are doing with their hands to properly divide the wings for that fly, for instance. "Sure, I know you use Calf Hair, but . . . " I will visit your site and see what you have. If you need to try some FLY-MAKER’S WAX or order some, let me know at: http://www.gink.com/ (Was I tactful enough with that fellahs?) no?  huh?

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Question:

I’m getting back into flyfishing after several years and i need a new rod/reel/line outfit.  I’ve seen several nice ones around but can’t really decide which weight i should go for.  I’m considering a #6 or #7 weight rod – but i haven’t ruled out a #5 or #8 weight either.  I fish mostly for trout and panfish, w/ a few occasional largemouth and smallmouth bass and small pickerel.  I would like an outfit w/ as much versitility as possible for small to medium-sized fish.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thanx.                                                -Zimmy

Response:

I’m primarily a warmwater ff and have always used an 8 wt.  Recently I picked up a 6 wt. fast action rod and have really enjoyed it for bass and panfish.  I think that the faster action allows it to cast larger flies well, yet, it is still fun with small 12" bass. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m getting back into flyfishing after several years and i need a new rod/reel/line outfit.  I’ve seen several nice ones around but can’t really decide which weight i should go for.  I’m considering a #6 or #7 weight rod – but i haven’t ruled out a #5 or #8 weight either.  I fish mostly for trout and panfish, w/ a few occasional largemouth and smallmouth bass and small pickerel. I would like an outfit w/ as much versitility as possible for small to medium-sized fish.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thanx.                                               -Zimmy

Response:

I’m getting back into flyfishing after several years and i need a new rod/reel/line outfit.  I’ve seen several nice ones around but can’t really decide which weight i should go for.  I’m considering a #6 or #7 weight rod – but i haven’t ruled out a #5 or #8 weight either.  I fish mostly for trout and panfish, w/ a few occasional largemouth and smallmouth bass and small pickerel.  I would like an outfit w/ as much versitility as possible for small to medium-sized fish.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thanx.

Be guided by fly size.  If your typical day was spent using only flies #16 and smaller you would want a 5 weight outfit (or 6 or 4).  If the typical day was spent casting one-inch poppers or streamers for bass you’d want a 7 weight or 8.  You can cast bigger flies on a lighter outfit, and you can cast smaller than #16s on a 7 weight or heavier outfit, but you would probably not enjoy it after an hour or so. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

Response:

I use a Sage 5wt overlined with 6wt line.  It is a tip-flex rod and it has a very fast action which does a good job casting flies as small as size 12 dries to 1/0 deer hair poppers.  It has enough backbone to fight big largemouths and is sensitive enough to make moderate sized panfish a blast to catch.  No, it’s not the perfect rod for every situation, but as an all-around warm-water rod, I couldn’t want for much more.  I still would like a 2 or 3wt for small panfish and a 9wt for saltwater. HTH, Clark – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m getting back into flyfishing after several years and i need a new rod/reel/line outfit.  I’ve seen several nice ones around but can’t really decide which weight i should go for.  I’m considering a #6 or #7 weight rod – but i haven’t ruled out a #5 or #8 weight either.  I fish mostly for trout and panfish, w/ a few occasional largemouth and smallmouth bass and small pickerel. I would like an outfit w/ as much versitility as possible for small to medium-sized fish.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thanx.                                               -Zimmy

Response:

(Donald Phillipson) writes:

*SNIP* I fish mostly for trout and panfish, w/ a few occasional largemouth and smallmouth bass and small pickerel.  I would like an outfit w/ as much versitility as possible for small to medium-sized fish.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thanx. Be guided by fly size.  If your typical day was spent using only flies #16 and smaller you would want a 5 weight outfit (or 6 or 4).  If the typical day was spent casting one-inch poppers or streamers for bass you’d want a 7 weight or 8.  You can cast bigger flies on a lighter outfit, and you can cast smaller than #16s on a 7 weight or heavier outfit, but you would probably not enjoy it after an hour or so.

Don’s advice is right on the money.  Presuming you use a forearm-based casting stroke, sounds like a fast action 6wt. (such as the Orvis TL 906 – Silver Label or Trident version) would do the trick.  If you expect to through lots of #2 deer hair bugs, go ahead and stick a 7wt. line on that fast action 6.  The rod will handle it just fine and the 7wt. line pulls big bugs through the air better than the 6.  If you didn’t need to throw the big bugs for largemouth bass, a 5 wt would do fine.  So, like Don says, let your fly size be your guide. I have a line-weight/fly size/quarry table (my personal opinions) set up on my web-site that you might want to glance at.  Go to "http://www.thegrid.net/flyfish/LineSpec.html" and click on the hyperlink to "Line Weight ‘Recommended Uses’ Chart".  You might find it useful in making your decision.                                        Good Fishing,                                             Dan Dan Gracia Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools Mt. Shasta Fly Fishing Schools http://www.thegrid.net/flyfish

Response:

I have a pfluger summit 6W and I use it for every kind of fish, from 15 inch trout to 20 pound red salmon on the keni river. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m getting back into flyfishing after several years and i need a new rod/reel/line outfit.  I’ve seen several nice ones around but can’t really decide which weight i should go for.  I’m considering a #6 or #7 weight rod – but i haven’t ruled out a #5 or #8 weight either.  I fish mostly for trout and panfish, w/ a few occasional largemouth and smallmouth bass and small pickerel.  I would like an outfit w/ as much versitility as possible for small to medium-sized fish.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thanx.                                                -Zimmy

Response:

If you are just getting back into flyfishing and you fished with lower modulus graphite or even fiberglass in the past, be very careful with the new tip flex type rods that some have recommended.  A 5 weight is a good all around rod, and as one wrote, 6 wt line will help the rod load better with larger flies.  I would consider a good mid flex or even a powerful full flex rod to get back in the swing of things.  Either way, make sure you cast it first.  Any good dealer will insist you cast it prior to buying it.  Good luck. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m getting back into flyfishing after several years and i need a new rod/reel/line outfit.  I’ve seen several nice ones around but can’t really decide which weight i should go for.  I’m considering a #6 or #7 weight rod – but i haven’t ruled out a #5 or #8 weight either.  I fish mostly for trout and panfish, w/ a few occasional largemouth and smallmouth bass and small pickerel. I would like an outfit w/ as much versitility as possible for small to medium-sized fish.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thanx.                                               -Zimmy

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Question:

  Does anyone have info on the Big Hole in July . I have to drop the Wife off in Salmon, ID. so I thought I would try fishing the Wisdom area. I have never been in that part of Montana and could use some help, where to stay , fish etc. We will be coming from  Ennis, Mt.    Thanks    Harry

Response:

  Does anyone have info on the Big Hole in July .

Harry: Call and book a trip with Dick Sharon at Fishing Headquarters in Dillon, MT.  You can get the number from information–I believe the area code is 406.  He’s a great guide, and you will love the Big Hole. dcook

Response:

 Does anyone have info on the Big Hole in July . I have to drop the Wife off in Salmon, ID. so I thought I would try fishing the Wisdom area. I have never been in that part of Montana and could use some help, where to stay , fish etc. We will be coming from  Ennis, Mt.   Thanks   Harry

Hi Harry, If you are coming through Ennis, don’t overlook the Madison River. I like the section below Ennis where it breaks into channels before it goes into Ennis Lake. Regarding the Big Hole: There are plenty of motels, etc in Wisdom, Wise River, and Melrose if that is your interest. If you plan on camping, you can do so at most (not all) Montana state fishing access points. Good Luck. Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (96 catalog)

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Question:

: What about Rain-X.  It is basically Silicon based with alcohol.  It works : on winshields and I have seen it use on film projectors for similar purposes : "slickening", etc.  It doesn’t hurt the estar of the films so it might not effect : the fly line.  Any thoughts? It’s your flyline. Go ahead and try it out!  I don’t think it would be a good idea for this product. There are just too many flyline dressings out there for a similar cost. Jon Porter

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Been there, done that, works fine, no guilt (what is 1 gram of Armor-All on my line going to hurt???) Multiply that * a couple of million fly fisherpersons..

OK.  2,000 kg of Armor All in 60 Trillion gallons of water = nothing. I’m not insenstive to the need for environmental responsibility, but like everything else, it can be taken to ridiculous extremes.       Gene

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Re: armor all. I have used it for ten years and it is terrific. It still is. I havent noticed any formula change. Its especially great because its so easy to appy, so you can do it streamside if your line starts to get water logged. GREAT STUFF, and 1/4 the price of commercial dressings, some of which are decidedly "armor all-like". Dale Owens

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Anyone ever tried using Armor-all as a flyline dressing? Seems like it would help reduce the friction of the line passing through the guides…

As I recall, Armor-all is petroleum based? Read the label. If you wouldn’t douse your fly line in gasoline to clean it, don’t use it. -David Buschhorn

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Multiply that * a couple of million fly fisherpersons.. OK.  2,000 kg of Armor All in 60 Trillion gallons of water = nothing. I’m not insenstive to the need for environmental responsibility, but like everything else, it can be taken to ridiculous extremes.

I agree Gene. I posted that I used Armorall a couple of days ago and got a couple flames from the eco-correct crowd. I suppose they all ride their bicycles to get to their fishing holes. And I’m sure none of them use lead split shot, right? Dale

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As I recall, Armor-all is petroleum based? Read the label. If you wouldn’t douse your fly line in gasoline to clean it, don’t use it.

Uh, gee, come to think of it, your fly line is "petroleum based" too. I don’t use armor-all on my fly line for the same reason I don’t use it on my car interior.  It makes it look great for a few days, after which it dries out and looks worse than it did in the first place. — -Wayne Trzyna

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Multiply that * a couple of million fly fisherpersons.. OK.  2,000 kg of Armor All in 60 Trillion gallons of water = nothing. I’m not insenstive to the need for environmental responsibility, but like everything else, it can be taken to ridiculous extremes. I agree Gene. I posted that I used Armorall a couple of days ago and got a couple flames from the eco-correct crowd. I suppose they all ride their bicycles to get to their fishing holes. And I’m sure none of them use lead split shot, right? Dale

        well, dale and gene, add the voice of this southern liberal to your chorus of amazement:  how can these people be real.  the  enemy is their republican congressman, not someone who uses amorall on their fly line, auto, hat, or ass.         a. wayne harrison

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Anyone ever tried using Armor-all as a flyline dressing? Seems like it would help reduce the friction of the line passing through the guides… (may not be too environmental-friendly though) — Lockheed Martin EIS Orlando, FL

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 Armor-all as a flyline dressing? No, Frank, not yet, but I use it on my rods.  It prevents  the ‘grabbing & dragging’ of mono in the rain and seems to improve casting accuracy. Grant

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: Anyone ever tried using Armor-all as a flyline dressing? Seems like it : would help reduce the friction of the line passing through the guides… This stuff is very effective as a flyline dressing. The product is a plasticizer, which is good a filling in minor cracks and scuffing on the line. It also does lube the line and make it very slippery. If you have never dressed the line before, you will see an increase in your casting distance. The line may float higher too. : (may not be too environmental-friendly though) The trick here is to buff off the excess with a clean, dry rag. When I apply the stuff to my lines, I use two coats for the first time. Let it dry, and then run it through a rag. This will remove the excess that you would otherwise see as an "oil slick" on the surface of the water. Jon Porter –If you are concerned about enviromentally friendly fishing, try products put out by Loon Outdoors. All their stuff is  earth friendly!

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Been there, done that, works fine, no guilt (what is 1 gram of Armor-All on my line going to hurt???)

Multiply that * a couple of million fly fisherpersons….. "What is 1 gram going to hurt ?" DuPont and Co. 1976 -Dan-

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Been there, done that, works fine, no guilt (what is 1 gram of Armor-All on my line going to hurt???) Multiply that * a couple of million fly fisherpersons….. -Dan-

Then divide it by 10 million miles of stream dispersing that product and factor it by the amount of gasoline you burn getting to your favorite fishing hole to see that theatrics are not a productive use of your time. Charley

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (Frank Hinson) writes: Anyone ever tried using Armor-all as a flyline dressing? Seems like it would help reduce the friction of the line passing through the guides… Used to be good for fly lines, but they changed their formula a number of years ago and you don’t want to use it on your lines now.  They will work great for a short while but will crack prematurely.  With the new coatings on the lines and the new formula for Armour-all, l the plasticisers (which keep the line supple) are prematurely released out of the pvc coating causing cracks and deteriation.  Leeches the life out of your lines. "303 Protectant" is a similar product that will keep your lines slippery longer by adding plasticisers to the coatings instead of leaching them out.  You can get it by the bottle at auto parts places or in single use pads from Orvis.                                                              Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools

What about Rain-X.  It is basically Silicon based with alcohol.  It works on winshields and I have seen it use on film projectors for similar purposes "slickening", etc.  It doesn’t hurt the estar of the films so it might not effect the fly line.  Any thoughts?

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(Frank Hinson) writes: Anyone ever tried using Armor-all as a flyline dressing? Seems like it would help reduce the friction of the line passing through the guides…

Used to be good for fly lines, but they changed their formula a number of years ago and you don’t want to use it on your lines now.  They will work great for a short while but will crack prematurely.  With the new coatings on the lines and the new formula for Armour-all, l the plasticisers (which keep the line supple) are prematurely released out of the pvc coating causing cracks and deteriation.  Leeches the life out of your lines. "303 Protectant" is a similar product that will keep your lines slippery longer by adding plasticisers to the coatings instead of leaching them out.  You can get it by the bottle at auto parts places or in single use pads from Orvis.                                                               Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone ever tried using Armor-all as a flyline dressing? Seems like it would help reduce the friction of the line passing through the guides… (may not be too environmental-friendly though) — Lockheed Martin EIS Orlando, FL I think the guides in Florida have been using Armor-all for over 20 years. I have never tried it. I understand that armour all used to be a very popular line cleaner and dressing, however, they have apparently changed their formulation and the new stuff cause fly lines to leach.  It is best if you od not use it. Ian Scott Wishbone Custom Rods http://credit.headwaters.com/wishbone

William Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA

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Anyone ever tried using Armor-all as a flyline dressing? Seems like it would help reduce the friction of the line passing through the guides… (may not be too environmental-friendly though)

Been there, done that, works fine, no guilt (what is 1 gram of Armor-All on my line going to hurt???)       Gene

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Anyone ever tried using Armor-all as a flyline dressing? Seems like it would help reduce the friction of the line passing through the guides… (may not be too environmental-friendly though) — Lockheed Martin EIS Orlando, FL

I understand that armour all used to be a very popular line cleaner and dressing, however, they have apparently changed their formulation and the new stuff cause fly lines to leach.  It is best if you od not use it. Ian Scott Wishbone Custom Rods http://credit.headwaters.com/wishbone

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Question:

Does anyone go fly fishing in Orance County at any of the local beaches?   (*particularly Huntington Beach)  I’d much rather drive 10 minutes to the beach rather than an hour to the nearest fresh water for trout. Jae

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The best salt water fly fishing nearest you, in my opinion, would be in Redondo Beach; King Harbour. Go to Daves Rocky Point at 6:30 am, rent a skiff ($40 for half day) and fish your brains out for Bonita in the harbour. Be sure to have a reel with a drag system and at least an 8-9 rod. Sinking line is considered best, but I have outfished my buddies with a floating line. A 10 lb tippet will do and the Bonita is considered the "Jack Dempsey" of the tuna family. Bonita on the fly is an amazing thing!! Up in the Ventura Co., there is also some great salt water fly fishing from shore. Be sure to have a line tray! the Spy on the Fly

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Question:

Does anyone know of any other fly fishing groups on the net?

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Does anyone know of any other fly fishing groups on the net?

There is the FLYFISH mailing list, as well as FLYSHOP-list (fly gear for sale) and EUR-FLYFISH (a European version of FLYFISH); all are e-mail based – FLYFISH will provide you with about 100+ messages a day. E-mail me privatley if you want to figure out how to join. There are also fishing forums on CompuServe and one other commercial service (believe Prodigy) — 3798 Woodland Drive     voice: (604) 368-9315 Trail, BC               data:  (604) 368-9341

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I am interested in any and all newsgroups about flyfishing. I would like a list of such groups. Norther California is an area of interest. Thanks for your help. Allen Allen

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Look into the NorCal Fishing group, I think it’s on USENET or one of those.  I access it through 24th St. Exhange BBS, here in Sacto.  I’ll bet your local TU or Caltrout clubs have hecka members online.

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