Question:

yep look at the forests in Alabama and you will see the great management of OUR forests that has robbed us and paid the timber industry. Pine trees

The majority of americans support being thinner, and yet the majority of americans are fatter than they should be.  That says something about the majority of americans.

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Musty Ass has spoken.

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\More like a ten year old, with no friends, and a ghetto blaster.\  I have had the pleasure of fishing with Muskie on several occasions, twice on the San Juan and once on the Kootenai.

I could not care less about his girlfriend or his fly-rods. The only thing I care about, is the fact that he costs me money with his constant Usenet abuse. The problem is solved for me at least. I have unsubscribed from rec.outdoors.fishing.fly  as it is simply too expensive to download all the rubbish. I will occasionally have a look in, using Google ( where I don

Question:

In reference to a thread by this title a week or so back….went over to the local stream yesterday(Weds) afternoon. Decent hatch of Grannoms, size 14 or 16, and a later hatch of pale green caddis in a size 16 or 18.  Streambred trout took wets or surface emerger types for a couple of us who were fly fishing amongst a few bait fishers. Every small hole seemed to hold a brown. Fish landed ranged from 7 to 13 inches. The locals claim no big hatch of Quill Gordons(the local spring mayfly hatch) yet, which is odd, as they generally precede the little green caddis. These guys I spoke with live on the creek and are as trustworthy as anglers can be<g. On other PA streams, I would expect some Blue Quills, Hendricksons and sometimes Black Quills.  All over the state, bright yellow craneflies are out in droves, and sometimes, the fish key on them exclusively. Use a sulfur in a pinch, about a size 16 or smaller.  Better still is a parachute style, with large, sparse hackle.                                                              Tom L

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Tom Littleton’s <Tulpehocken TR snipped On other PA streams, I would expect some Blue Quills, Hendricksons and sometimes Black Quills.  All over the state, bright yellow craneflies are out in droves, and sometimes, the fish key on them exclusively. Use a sulfur in a pinch, about a size 16 or smaller.  Better still is a parachute style, with large, sparse hackle.                                                              Tom L

Tom, I can confirm that the bright yellow craneflies are out in force in Central PA, yesterday and today. Fished the ‘newly’ public water (Espy Farm’s ~1.25 miles) on the Little Juniata River yesterday (Friday)… tan caddis and bright yellow craneflies between 9am-3pm.  The ‘Espy Farm" outfitter is charging $100 per person/day to fish, unguided, this small stretch ($295 guided).  It is NOW freely accessible if you enter the river either above/below their property and traverse upon the river bed during your travels in the Espy Farm area.   Spring Creek is in pretty good shape and fishing well – midges and bright yellow craneflies.  The Little Lehigh Creek’s regulars captured a Sulphur dun today (Saturday), an early hatch? take care Dave

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Dave,   Thanks for the update……Will you be going to Penn’s/Lil J area around Memorial Day??                              Tom

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Tom – Thanks.  On Thursday the locals on the Brodhead said the Hendricksons had been coming for a week and that the Quill Gordons had gone by.  No bugs flying in the rain that day. Glenn << In reference to a thread by this title a week or so back….went over to the local stream yesterday(Weds) afternoon. Decent hatch of Grannoms, size 14 or 16, and a later hatch of pale green caddis in a size 16 or 18.  Streambred trout took wets or surface emerger types for a couple of us who were fly fishing amongst a few bait fishers. Every small hole seemed to hold a brown. Fish landed ranged from 7 to 13 inches. The locals claim no big hatch of Quill Gordons(the local spring mayfly hatch) yet, which is odd, as they generallyprecede the little green caddis. These guys I spoke with live on the creek and are as trustworthy as anglers can be<g. On other PA streams, I would expect some Blue Quills, Hendricksons and sometimes Black Quills.  All over the state, bright yellow craneflies are out in droves, and sometimes, the fish key on them exclusively. Use a sulfur in a pinch, about a size 16 or smaller.  Better still is a parachute style, with large, sparse hackle.                                                              Tom L GKT

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Dave,   Thanks for the update……Will you be going to Penn’s/Lil J area around Memorial Day??                              Tom

Tom, I am planning on fishing Penns the weekend after Memorial Day.  Its a Green Drake thing.  Sort of like a fly fisherman’s Woodstock thingey. take care Dave

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Dave,   Thanks for the update……Will you be going to Penn’s/Lil J area around Memorial Day??                              Tom Tom, I am planning on fishing Penns the weekend after Memorial Day.  Its a Green Drake thing.  Sort of like a fly fisherman’s Woodstock thingey.

I’ve never had the chance to fish a heavy, large Mayfly hatch. I’ve read that the fish get pretty satiated after a couple days and are no longer feeding very heavilly on the Duns. Is this true? Willi

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I’ve never had the chance to fish a heavy, large Mayfly hatch. I’ve read that the fish get pretty satiated after a couple days and are no longer feeding very heavilly on the Duns. Is this true?

My experience has been just the opposite, that is, the first few days of the hatch will see sparse feeding on the surface, but as the hatch progresses, the fish will rise to the duns more freely. Yesterday, I fished a massive Hendrickson hatch on the Farmington river….a hatch that was actually too good because of the overwhelming number of naturals. The trout rose steadily for two hours, but few fish were caught during that period, most being taken at the beginning and end when fewer bugs were on the water. I wound up landing nine trout from  11 to 16 inches, but the only fish I caught at the hieght of the hatch were a few salmon smolts. As a point of reference, the Hendricksons started hatching on April 15, and the fish are still avidly feeding on them. George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

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Willi writes: I’ve never had the chance to fish a heavy, large Mayfly hatch. I’ve read that the fish get pretty satiated after a couple days and are no longer feeding very heavilly on the Duns.

In my experience, the fish continue to take advantage of nutrients and thus, feed through a hatch to the end. They may tend to become wary of surface items due to angling pressure as a hatch goes on. Also, feeding on duns varies with air temps and humidity, with fish rising more readily to duns when they have difficulty getting off water surface. The drake hatch, as a specific example on Penn’s, tends to be great fishing on Duns and emergers for the first couple days in any area, with wary fish by the end(6th or 7th day) of the hatch. Many times, it proves easier to take fish during the Drake hatch with other surface items, like sulfurs, caddis and spinners of Grey Foxes and March Browns.                               Tom

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Question:

Lots of good fishing on Bushkill Creek, but Ressica Falls is extra-special.  Actually, there are a lot of Big and Little Bushkill Creeks in Pennsylvania; Ressica Falls is near 611 & 402. Ressica Falls is owned by the Liberty Council of the Boy Scouts of America, and a permit is required to fish there.  Way worth it. The stream is as pretty as any you’ll find, the water as suited for trout as you could like, and the water is so well-stocked with nice trout that first time visitors are likely to be flabbergasted.  Hatches are common in spring and summer, and can be quite abundant.  Imagine standing in hemlock lined pool, fishing a riffle, with ten trout rising noisily all around you.  Now imagine miles of stream just like that.  Now imagine you’ve just hooked a 14" brown, and boy is he pissed.  That’s Ressica Falls. Wednesday evening was quite warm.  Once again, forgot to check the water temp, but was comfy while wading wet, until my pipe started rattling in my teeth, and I started shaking violently as soon as I stepped out to go home.  ’Bout 55 degrees? Quill Gordon duns and spinners, as well as grannoms were out and about.  a tan-colored fly was also laying eggs on the water, but I wasn’t able to get a good look.  The trout were taking small brown imitations, quill gordens, henrysville, etc.  As it got dark and I was forced to switch to lighter colored flies, hits became tougher to get. Also out in profusion were buffalo gnats.  These are like the no-see-ums of the North, except that you can see them.  In fact, you can rope ‘em and ride ‘em.  You usually won’t get bitten by one; you’ll get bitten by 5 or 6.  As a repellent, I recommend a burly pipe tobacco, as they are quite aggressive. The stream bed is rocky, with numerous pools and riffles, and it’s full of brookies, browns , and rainbows.  Careful wading is important.  The scenery is beautiful, and the entire experience is more than worth the modest permit fee. Two words of caution: first, pesky bears.  Bothersome bears occasionally hassle folks in this area.  Just don’t be afraid of them. Bears can smell fear, you know.  Don’t poke them with a stick either; they really don’t like that, take my word for it. Chiggers – very common here.  Any exposed skin can become home to those cuddly little burrowing mites, and I’ve got a red dot on the side of my knee to prove it. Jeez, I feel bad that I forgot to get the water temp for you.  I’ll go back up this evening & do it right this time.  That is, if I don’t forgot again, what with the trout rising all around me, bitey gnats nipping at my ears, tobacco fog all around my head, snarly bears trying to get my attention, minimites digging holes through me like a swiss cheese, and me with the wrong fly all tangled up around the tip of my rod. Timothy Juvenal In sleep every dog dreams of food, and I, a fisherman, dream of fish.     -Theocritus

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Lots of good fishing on Bushkill Creek, but Ressica Falls is extra-special.  Actually, there are a lot of Big and Little Bushkill Creeks in Pennsylvania; Ressica Falls is near 611 & 402. Ressica Falls is owned by the Liberty Council of the Boy Scouts of America, and a permit is required to fish there.  Way worth it.

Timothy, Your posts, which are quite pleasant to read, would be even more so if you would kindly set your line length to 70-75 or so. JR — To reply, remove the Qs from the address above

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"JR" wrote …  kindly set your line length to 70-75 or so.

Oops.  Thanks for the tip. Timothy Juvenal

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Question:

Oh please Oh please they beseech, that man we just have to impeach, they ought to go fishing, instead of just wishing, besides,  they

Question:

I need some advice about a second flyrod.  I have used four rods for the past 22 years and all have been for 8 wt. line.  The majority of my fishing is for Largemouth.  I think I would like a 4 piece 8.5 to 9 foot in size 4, 5 or 6.  I would use it for small pond bass, bluegill, carp and small river smallmouth.  I would be tossing smaller (size 4 and down) muddlers, clousers and topwaters.  I want something fun that can cast a decent distance and with enough backbone to get a decent size fish in.  Since I have been in an 8 wt. rut all my life and don’t have any experience with these other weights I really appreciate your help.  One additional thing. I will likely purchase an Orvis (no flaming please) Silver Label and need to decide on tip, mid, or full flex also. Jay Kidwell

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I need some advice about a second flyrod.  I have used four rods for the past 22 years and all have been for 8 wt. line.  The majority of my fishing is for Largemouth.  I think I would like a 4 piece 8.5 to 9 foot in size 4, 5 or 6.  I would use it for small pond bass, bluegill, carp and small river smallmouth.  I would be tossing smaller (size 4 and down) muddlers, clousers and topwaters.  I want something fun that can cast a decent distance and with enough backbone to get a decent size fish in.  Since I have been in an 8 wt. rut all my life and don’t have any experience with these other weights I really appreciate your help.  One additional thing. I will likely purchase an Orvis (no flaming please) Silver Label and need to decide on tip, mid, or full flex also. Jay Kidwell

Hi Jay, You will notice a large difference with a #6 outfit as it will be 2 sizes smaller than you have been using. You can go to a #5 if you think it would be better, but a #4 sounds a bit light. Three or four piece rods are really catching on in northern California. The 9 foot length would be nice for deep wading or float tubing. I would hope that you could cast some rods before purchasing one, if possible. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY

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I need some advice about a second flyrod.  I have used four rods for the past 22 years and all have been for 8 wt. line.  The majority of my fishing is for Largemouth.  I think I would like a 4 piece 8.5 to 9 foot in size 4, 5 or 6.  I would use it for small pond bass, bluegill, carp and small river smallmouth.  I would be tossing smaller (size 4 and down) muddlers, clousers and topwaters.  I want something fun that can cast a decent distance and with enough backbone to get a decent size fish in.  Since I have been in an 8 wt. rut all my life and don’t have any experience with these other weights I really appreciate your help.  One additional thing. I will likely purchase an Orvis (no flaming please) Silver Label and need to decide on tip, mid, or full flex also.

Hi Jay, I’d recommend a 6 wt. for the type of fishing you’ll be doing.  This will be much lighter than the 8 wt. you’ve been using, yet will still have the necessary power to cast the flies needed for smallmouth and still have a good time when you get them on the line.  The 4 and 5 weight lines are better trout rods & more typically used for size 10 flies and smaller.  The 5 wt. works fine for tossing the occasional larger streamer (size 8 or 6),but is not the best choice for a steady diet of them.  The 4 wt. doesn’t throw them well at all. Whether to buy a tip-flex, mid-flex, or full-flex rod depends a lot on your casting style and the type of fishing you’ll be doing.   The tip flex rods throw tighter loops more easily (most accurate and they cast well into the wind), but you really need to use a "fore-arm" casting style to use them easily and effectively.  If you use your fore-arm as the primary lever in your casting stroke you will cast this type of rod easily and you will get the most performance for the least effort.  Keep in mind this action is the least forgiving when playing the fish. If you use mostly wrist in your casting stroke, you’ll probably prefer a mid-flex or full-flex rod that loads more easily using your wrist as the primary lever.  Wrist casters have a very tough time even getting the tip-flex rods to bend because they are using a very short lever (the wrist), and the forearm muscles used to move the lever are not nearly as strong as the biceps and triceps which are used when making a fore-arm stroke.  Wrist casters typically prefer the full-flex rods because they load so easily with such little effort.  Many casters, regardless of casting style, like this type of rod for fishing light lines (4 wt. and lighter) in close conditions where short casts and roll casts are the norm and range of arm motion is restricted.  Full flex rods are the most forgiving of mistakes when fighting fish. Mid-flex rods tend to throw loops that are not as consistently tight as tip-flex rods and are often preferred by those who use more wrist in their cast, but still use the forearm to initiate the stroke.  Wider loops (within reason) are often preferred when casting larger, heavier flies, or nymph and indicator rigs.  They don’t tangle as often from rapidly dropping flies. Mid-flex rods still load fairly easily even with a fair amount of wrist in the casting stroke.  This type of rod is also more forgiving of mistakes than the tip-flex while playing fish. What it all comes down to is what feels good to you.  You need to cast these different rods to see which you like.  If you were new to fly fishing, I’d recommend you learn to use the forearm stroke in your casting and get the tip-flex rod for the best effort/preformance ratio afforded by them.  However, if a person has been fishing for years, they are not likely to change their casting stroke and the best choice is to get a rod that works well with your casting style. I’d recommend you look at the Orvis Silver Label PM-10 906 ($250, 9 ft. 6 wt.) for a tip flex rod, the Silver Label HLS Cutthroat ($250, 9ft. 6wt.) for a mid-flex rod, and the Silver Label Limestone special ($235, 8 1/2 ft. 6wt.) for a full flex rod.  All of these Silver Label rods offer the same performance as their more expensive premium versions but use less expensive cosmetics.   The PM-10 Silver and HLS Silver rods will also cast a 7 wt. line if you need it for larger flies and windier conditions.  The Limestone Special will wallow around if you try to overline it. ;^)                                            Hope this helps,                                                       Dan Dan Gracia Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools

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Question:

I must have missed the post describing how to vote.  This is not hard to do in an area as cluttered as this one. I want to vote YES.  How do I do it? Thanks, Jack Jack from Taxacola (formerly Pensacola), Florida

Jack: Like you, I missed the first CFV. The new (and final) CFV was posted one or two days ago (it is now 2-12). Just find & read it, and it will tell you how to cast your ballot. I did just that when I first found it. If you vote, then your vote will cancel mine. Fair is fair. Actually, that depends on your definition of the word "fair". Because it takes a 2/3 vote to create the new group, your vote counts half as much as mine. Regards (and good gardening); Bill — Center for Room Temperature Confusion

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I must have missed the post describing how to vote.  This is not hard to do in an area as cluttered as this one. I want to vote YES.  How do I do it? Thanks, Jack Jack from Taxacola (formerly Pensacola), Florida I vote YES on rec.gardens.edible

While I think this was done in innocence, let me please remind everyone that voting should be done from the original CFV ballot, not by writing a line someone tells you to. You can find a CFV in DejaNews, or request one by email from the votetaker. Ginger

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I am grabbing this message as an example.  Ginger is entirely correct in her message.  THE ONLY WAY TO VOTE IS TO REPLY TO THE CFV.  I am not trying to yell, but I want that line to grab your attention if nothing else does. The voting on CFV rec.gardens.edible has indeed started.  You should see or have seen a message entitled CFV: rec.gardens.edible (Jani Patokallio) This is the OFFICIAL call for votes message.  If you missed it, it will appear again as 2nd CFV:rec.gardens.edible (Jani Patokallio) sometime soon.  You should only reply once (unless you change your mind) to EITHER message.  You don’t need to vote twice.   Read the CFV or 2nd CFV very closely.  It details how to vote. You should not vote by "just sending email to Jani with I vote __" because someone tells you it is the right way.  Your vote MAY not be counted. (Example: Calling the election committee to vote for Bob Dole) You should not vote by replying to a CFV that was emailed to you by a friend.  This could also cause your vote to be disallowed.   (Example: filling out Bob Dole on the ballot Newt sent you, even if it is word for word the same) You should not vote by replying to any other message besides the OFFICIAL CFV.  If you replied to one of the above threads(Vote Yes or Vote No) with a "me too" and THOUGHT you were voting, you were not. (Example: Calling Newt and telling him Dole has your vote) Your vote is important to the future of rec.gardens.edible irrespective of which way you vote.  I would prefer that you make your vote count.  That way we get a true representation of the internet gardening community. (Example: You driving your own car to your local elementary school and pulling a lever) Again, if you have any questions, please respond via post to this message.  No email to me please. Scott proponent rec.gardens.edible

I must have missed the post describing how to vote.  This is not hard to do in an area as cluttered as this one. I want to vote YES.  How do I do it? Thanks, Jack Jack from Taxacola (formerly Pensacola), Florida I vote YES on rec.gardens.edible While I think this was done in innocence, let me please remind everyone that voting should be done from the original CFV ballot, not by writing a line someone tells you to. You can find a CFV in DejaNews, or request one by email from the votetaker. Ginger                  Scott D. Jung http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/2392 http://www.netcom.com/~jung Remove the FIX-ME to send email.

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I must have missed the post describing how to vote.  This is not hard to do in an area as cluttered as this one. I want to vote YES.  How do I do it? Thanks, Jack Jack from Taxacola (formerly Pensacola), Florida

I vote YES on rec.gardens.edible

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I must have missed the post describing how to vote.  This is not hard to do in an area as cluttered as this one. I want to vote YES.  How do I do it? Thanks, Jack Jack from Taxacola (formerly Pensacola), Florida

   There was an RFV (Request for Vote) with a detailed proposal posted on Jan 31 to all of the garden related newsgroups.  It was the first call for votes and will be officially posted again before the voting is closed. You might be able to find it by looking in a group with less traffic (It’s still on my server in triangle.gardens for example) and setting the entire set of messages to unread.    I’m not sure if reposting it is acceptable, but I’ll ask one of the originators if they will do it again since it seems to have been widely missed.  I only saw it on triangle.gardens. — Lloyd Fortney http://www.phy.duke.edu/~fortney/ has links to my garden, flower, flyfishing, and travel JPEG images as well as teaching, research, and stuff like that

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I must have missed the post describing how to vote.  This is not hard to do in an area as cluttered as this one. I want to vote YES.  How do I do it?

The CFV would also be available in news.announce.newgroups.  It will also be posted once more before the end of the voting period. Note that because of fraudulent campaigning on other votes in the past by some individuals, providing someone with instructions on how to vote with anything other than the full, uneditted CFV is considered a big no-no.  If someone out there still has the CFV on their machine, reposting it is okay, but just posting the bare instructions is not. — Mary Conner

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I must have missed the post describing how to vote.  This is not hard to do in an area as cluttered as this one. I want to vote YES.  How do I do it? Thanks, Jack Jack from Taxacola (formerly Pensacola), Florida

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Question:

I’m Interested in buying a boat for shallow water fishing in Bays and Rivers (Chesapeake Bay) Can anyone give me thier opinion on the Carolina Skiffs. I’ll be flyfishing from this boat. Preferably would like to hear from skiff owners or dealers. Thanks Nick DelleDonne "The Evening Rise Fly Angler’s Shop"

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I’m Interested in buying a boat for shallow water fishing in Bays and Rivers (Chesapeake Bay) Can anyone give me thier opinion on the Carolina Skiffs. I’ll be flyfishing from this boat. Preferably would like to hear from skiff owners or dealers. Thanks Nick DelleDonne "The Evening Rise Fly Angler’s Shop"

Hi Nick: I own a Southern Skimmer,(pretty much the same boat) I love it, you don’t need much water to run in or that much power to push it. I use mine on the great south bay on long island(NY) and it gets a little bouncy when its rough but on a river or lake where it’s a little calmer it should be great. J Branca

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Question:

Here’s a really stupid question: do you wear sockes when fishing? Do you wear socks inside your waders (full size, and/or stocking)?  When you wet wade, do you wear socks?  What kind?  When you go steelheading, do you wear several pairs? I have NOT been wearing socks, and my wife complains that my feet smell worse than any fish would…so I might as well bring some bodies home.  It smells like there are dead bodies in my waders. Incidentally, suppose your waders leak (like mine).  Do you still wear socks? What color? — Laboratory for Applied Logic    Dept. of Computer Science University of Idaho             www: http://www.cs.uidaho.edu/~foster —–BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK—– Version: 2.6.2 mQCNAzDtvLEAAAEEAKAC21G2Be0K0DMgjLpxrwLmsYfCz8rWcfgyABjr3Ryfk1dO nV7fFFpUF3xohR7die+/B2V9oqRQzTLeSF2ECKlsTY/yUyw2kn+P2ju1umh4Fwzd cVTvc+H69q1+Ft3kmw/PE0Pan+g0PUGGJ43stw3q4OgBHdixbRd/f9giJFDxAAUR tCZKYW1lcyBBLiBGb3N0ZXIgPGZvc3RlckBjcy51aWRhaG8uZWR1PokAlQMFEDD8 ReEXf3/YIiRQ8QEBFrAD/2AFuRWcD/3MENC3qJMC/Or1qxknjkK7Uv+TDf2LHPOY GHBbG9PyWuXQ8of0Dd+JYwf/tzlO9Yk1s1zTdikfriak21FW0bCokxDIhA3myppZ IZDWVA9CyvDYHuP5Ii1NkBvocab813JzDLZA+0iVN5sebGb9zSXR4Za47hlriHeP =RDHK —–END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK—–

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Here’s a really stupid question: do you wear sockes when fishing? Do you wear socks inside your waders (full size, and/or stocking)?  When you wet wade, do you wear socks?  What kind?  When you go steelheading, do you wear several pairs?

Of course, how else do you keep your pants from riding up when you put your waders on?

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Polar Fleece type socks in stockingfoot waders are the best I have found so far. Ken..

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Here’s a really stupid question: do you wear sockes when fishing?

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James Foster writes: Here’s a really stupid question: do you wear sockes when fishing?

..Yes, Do you wear socks inside your waders (full size, and/or stocking)?

…Yes When you wet wade, do you wear socks?

..Starting to sound like you have a sock fetish..  When you go steelheading, do you wear several pairs?

..No, just one THICK pair..I only wear several pairs of socks, when I play "strip poker".. I have NOT been wearing socks, and my wife complains that my feet

smell worse than any fish would…so I might as well bring some bodies home.  It smells like there are dead bodies in my waders. …[CENSORED!!!] Incidentally, suppose your waders leak (like mine).  Do you still wear socks?

..No, I usually get off my lazy ass and patch my waders…and keep my feet dry!!! What color?

…Black fish net…the real fine mesh..for catch and release only!

Response:

Here’s a really stupid question: do you wear sockes when fishing?

You’re absolutely correct: that is a *really* stupid question! ;^) Do you wear socks inside your waders (full size, and/or stocking)?

Of course – if for no other reason that getting my feet into neoprene waders would be even tougher without socks… When you  wet wade, do you wear socks?  What kind?  

Depends on where I’m wet wading: if I’m rock hopping I’ll wear felt-soled boots with socks. If I’m wading off a beach, sneakers and no socks… When you go steelheading, do you wear several pairs?

Well, it’s been about 23 years since I did any serious steelheading (I moved away from the Olympic Penninsula and we don’t have steel head in New England) but if you’re referring to cold water fishing, you bet I wear socks in my neoprene waders! I have NOT been wearing socks, and my wife complains that my feet smell worse than any fish would…so I might as well bring some bodies home.  It smells like there are dead bodies in my waders.

Ugh! Sounds disgustin’ to me! Your wife has my deepest pity! Incidentally, suppose your waders leak (like mine).  Do you still wear socks?

I fix the leaks, of course! What color?

Moving from *really* stupid to sublime, eh? <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< < Digital Equipment Corp.     Alpha Server Engineering < < Parker Street Campus          Maynard, Massachusetts   < <       Charter Member of Curmudgeons Unlimited        < <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Response:

Here’s a really stupid question: do you wear sockes when fishing?

I always take a single rogue sock along in my vest and put it on my hand as a puppet when I have a flyfishing dillema or need someone too talk to. "Hi Mr. Hand, What should I tie on…?" "Put me back in your pocket you idiot". TimW

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -(James Foster) writes: Here’s a really stupid question: do you wear sockes when fishing? Do you wear socks inside your waders (full size, and/or stocking)?  When you wet wade, do you wear socks?  What kind?  When you go steelheading, do you wear several pairs? I have NOT been wearing socks, and my wife complains that my feet smell worse than any fish would…so I might as well bring some bodies home.  It smells like there are dead bodies in my waders. Incidentally, suppose your waders leak (like mine).  Do you still wear socks? What color?

It’s a good idea to wear socks inside of waders to keep comfortable.  I usually use either wool or wool/polypro blend.  The wool keeps the sock from compacting and give a bit of cushioning, plus it still keeps your feet warm when it gets wet.  Even if your waders don’t leak, any water you get it your waders will end up in your feet. For instance from a slip or poor depth perception.  The only other socks I know of that will perform similarly are made from polartech.  Stay away from cotton socks as they will hold the water and get clammy and cold. Be careful not to put so much bulk around your feet that they constrict the blood flow, or your feet will freeze.   You should always be able to move your toes a little inside of your socks, waders, and boots.  Get larger boots if needed. I also use socks when wet wading mostly because my wading boots would fall off my feet if I didn’t. Also it’s a lot easier to wash the socks than it is to wash the waders and with the socks you shouldn’t get that ugly smell in your waders.                                  Good fishing,                                       Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

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I think it was Haig-Brown in "A River Never Sleeps" that gave some sage advice for socks and wading when you have hiked to your fishing. 1) wear wool socks and take a dry pair 2) if you fall in and ship water, wring out the socks and dump the water out of your boots, but put the wet socks back on 3) at the end of the day, put the dry socks on and hike out reasoning being that it is impossible to get all the water out of the boots and you’d only end up getting your spare socks wet. And of course, you have those puppets. TimW

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Here’s a really stupid question: do you wear sockes when fishing? I always take a single rogue sock along in my vest and put it on my hand as a puppet when I have a flyfishing dillema or need someone too talk to. "Hi Mr. Hand, What should I tie on…?" "Put me back in your pocket you idiot".

Last summer I went out fishing on one of the hottest days of the year.  I was heading over to another section of the stream when I saw steam coming from under the hood of my car.  I had blown a radiator hose.  I coasted down the hill to the stream.  I didn’t have and duct tape in the car so I removed one of my socks and wrapped up the hose with it then filled the radiator from the stream.  I was able to limp about five miles to the nearest gas station where I bought some radiator hose tape.   — John Fereira Isis Distributed Systems – Ithaca, NY

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Here’s a really stupid question: do you wear sockes when fishing? I always take a single rogue sock along in my vest and put it on my hand as a puppet when I have a flyfishing dillema or need someone too talk to. "Hi Mr. Hand, What should I tie on…?" "Put me back in your pocket you idiot". Tim

Of all the entries I’ve read from you, this is the one I believe most…

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Here’s a really stupid question: do you wear sockes when fishing? I always take a single rogue sock along in my vest and put it on my hand as a puppet when I have a flyfishing dillema or need someone too talk to. "Hi Mr. Hand, What should I tie on…?" "Put me back in your pocket you idiot". Tim Of all the entries I’ve read from you, this is the one I believe most…

Thanks, but I didn’t post it. Mr. Hand did.   TimW

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Here’s a really stupid question: do you wear sockes when fishing? I always take a single rogue sock along in my vest and put it on my hand as a puppet when I have a flyfishing dillema or need someone too talk to. "Hi Mr. Hand, What should I tie on…?" "Put me back in your pocket you idiot". Last summer I went out fishing on one of the hottest days of the year.  I was heading over to another section of the stream when I saw steam coming from under the hood of my car.  I had blown a radiator hose.  I coasted down the hill to the stream.  I didn’t have and duct tape in the car so I removed one of my socks and wrapped up the hose with it then filled the radiator from the stream.  I was able to limp about five miles to the nearest gas station where I bought some radiator hose tape.

,and put the sock back on. ouch. TimW

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My Simms KBS waders kept migrating into my boots, pulling the crotch to my knees and stretching the suspenders to the breaking point.   Watching me step over logs in this configuration left fishing partners incapacitated with laughter.  I switched from wool socks to polyester fleece (Polartech, Polar Fleece, etc.) because they wash and dry easier, and doggoned if those waders didn’t stay put!  Apparently the wool offers a lot more friction when walking than the fleece.   Whatever the reason I don’t do much knee-walking anymore… –Buddy

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Do they stink so bad that, on a slow day, you could dip your feet directly in the water to stun a few fish to the surface (assuming you’re a meat fisherman). This could be as effective as explosives and not nearly as noisy! Tom BTW, if this was a serious inquiry seeking a serious answer: I always wear two pairs of socks. A thin inner liner to draw moisture away from the skin (like Capilene from Patagoina) and then an insulating sock whose thickness is determined by water temperature. To get rid of the stink in your waders, turn them inside out and brush on a diluted bleach/water solution. This should kill whatever has taken up residence there (provided they aren’t so old as to be dissolved by the bleach!) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Here’s a really stupid question: do you wear sockes when fishing? Do you wear socks inside your waders (full size, and/or stocking)?  When you wet wade, do you wear socks?  What kind?  When you go steelheading, do you wear several pairs? I have NOT been wearing socks, and my wife complains that my feet smell worse than any fish would…so I might as well bring some bodies home.  It smells like there are dead bodies in my waders. Incidentally, suppose your waders leak (like mine).  Do you still wear socks? What color?

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Question:

   Does anyone know Bill Hunter’s address or phone number. He no longer owns Hunter’s Angling but sells some stuff out of his house I need. Thanks in advance.    Ralph —

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   Does anyone know Bill Hunter’s address or phone number. He no longer owns Hunter’s Angling but sells some stuff out of his house I need. Thanks in advance.    Ralph —

Last I heard he was in New Boston NH. There is a listing in the Select Phone CD. Bill Hunter, 223 S Hill Rd, New Boston NH 03070, 603-487-3844 Don’t know if that is the same Bill you’re looking for but it’s worth a shot. I haven’t been to his shop in years & wasn’t even aware he had sold it. Tight Lines. Byard

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Question:

Ron To get the best traction on a wet surface (a boat ramp) look for an all season tire with a high volume of tread surfaces.  This type of tire will have a lot of tiny cuts in the tread design.  When the tire is stressed pulling a load, this type of tread will flex and the edges of these cuts will grip the road surface.  Do Not consider the course off road tread design!  It has the worst hard surface traction. You should also be very light on the gas pedal.  A posi traction differential is also a big help if it is kept maintained and the clutches adjusted. Would you believe I pull a 3800 lb boat up steep boat ramps with a chev s-10 with no problems? Good Luck Wayne

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The next time this happens, try letting some air out of the rear tires – enough to increase the footprint somewhat. Be sure to air up again at the first opportunity. (Longrigger) writes: | Have your buddies jump in the back of the truck to give it wieght. | I have stuck the floor mats in front of the tires once when I was alone | and got stuck, but sand would be alot better. | | Longrigger

    Try pulling up the anchor on the boat…  (I couldn’t resist!)     No, really…  Tire pressure helps a ton, and the start of the pull is the most important part.  Once underway, roll into the throttle, but maintain traction…  (I think that all of the answers I have read here would help.)     …Sam

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Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower. Question: what kind of tire tread design would provide the *most* friction? Knobby, off-road type, or a smoother "pavement" type? Remember, by the way, that this is extremely low-speed operation, just barely turning, in fact, so concepts like "hydroplaning" probably wouldn’t apply here. We’re talking about pulling a load up a wet concrete surface. How about it, you guys? I need to buy new tires for my truck in

Well iv been towing several different boats for many years and with different car’s here’s my $.01 worth. My last boat is a 3500 -4000 lbs boat and trailer, and iv towed it with my four cylinder turbo 5 speed (not many times) it did well no spinning. But now it has posi and very good traction tires on the rear. I now use a 87 jeep cherokee with a posi and BF comp TA’s works very well. Also on thing to remember is your toung weight. My toung weight is over 250+ lbs , thats why I went to the jeep. At first the jeep was a standard rear end and there was some slipping but since the posi the only time it skips is if I jump on the gas to hard. Does any one out there remember the rule of thumb on toung weight? It’s some % of your total weight should be your toung weight. And this also helps if you have to slow your boat down real fast on the hwy. bye

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Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower.

. . . . Ron Morgan

Since you have more than enough horsepower – if one rear wheel starts to spin, hold the parking brake release open and apply the parking brake.  If you apply hard enough, both wheels will receive power. You can also try stabbing at the parking brake if the engine does not have enough power. Not a sure fire thing.  But it is another trick to but in your bag. Terry Dobie 83 CJ7 Hailey, ID

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I use my Jeep Grand Cherokee to haul my boat.  I learned the hard way that you have to ease into the pull.  I use an awefull ramp in East Falmouth Cape Cod that is always covered in a thin layer of scum.  On one occasion, I was sort of hurried by other boaters waiting to get out of the water and I pulled to fast.  Before I knew it, my tires were spinning and I was moving backward.  OOOOPS!  Thank god I stopped on time.   I now make sure that my air pressure is a little lower (more surface space), and that I ease into the pull.  At this one particular ramp, I often throw handfulls of sand onto the algae to create a little traction.  I read a lot of others posts where sand is the enemy, but in this scenerio, it works well. Good luck David

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower. Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off other boats that were just pulled out. My truck can just BARELY pull the boat up the ramp under these conditions. If it’s dry, no problem, but when the ramp is wet, the tires slip and spin, sometimes even smoking. It’s a very, very marginal situation. Last night, I came very close to being stranded at a deserted ramp after dark; I could *not* get that boat up that ramp, and finally made it up after creeping about an inch at a time, before the tires would slip. God only knows what kind of wear this produced on my transmission. Question: what kind of tire tread design would provide the *most* friction? Knobby, off-road type, or a smoother "pavement" type? Remember, by the way, that this is extremely low-speed operation, just barely turning, in fact, so concepts like "hydroplaning" probably wouldn’t apply here. We’re talking about pulling a load up a wet concrete surface. How about it, you guys? I need to buy new tires for my truck in another couple of months, and I’d appreciate some input. In addition, I think it’d make an interesting discussion topic, as well. Ron Morgan

Ron, I have a Full size Dodge Van and have never had a problem pulling the boat up the ramp, except for one occasion. It was a really long and very wet ramp. I was having problems with wheel spin, I remember reading somthing about turning your front tires, (somthing about changing the pull ratio) and also applying the parking brake a bit. Boat pulled right out with out any wheel spin what-so-ever. Good luck. Michael

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*snip* months, and I’d appreciate some input. In addition, I think it’d make an interesting discussion topic, as well. Ron Morgan Ron, I have a Full size Dodge Van and have never had a problem pulling the boat up the ramp, except for one occasion. It was a really long and very wet ramp. I was having problems with wheel spin, I remember reading somthing about turning your front tires, (somthing about changing the pull ratio) and also applying the parking brake a bit.

    You must have a non-posi rear end on your van…  The emergency brake trick worked on my ‘91 Dakota when semi-stuck in sand (I had a non-posi rearend).   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Boat pulled right out with out any wheel spin what-so-ever. Good luck. Michael

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Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower. Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off other boats that were just pulled out.

After many years of enjoying the entertainment of watching people pull boats out at a wide variety of ramps throughout the western US, I know this: The initial pull to get a boat up out of the water is substantial, if you think of how hard it is to pull a small water skier up out of the water, imaging something with 30 times the weight and surface tension and bad hydrodynamics (the trailer…not the boat!) Many people think the best approach is to try to accelerate quickly to "get the damn thing going!", so they give their rig too much throttle. Once you break adhesion on a slick surface, you cannot pull a load equivalent to before you spun the wheels.  So if it spins, let off the throttle and let the wheels catch traction.  Then, try again with less acceleration.  Don’t think that spinning your wheels faster will get you up the ramp, ’cause it will only make it harder to get out. As other posts have said, lowering your tire pressure a little will help a lot.  But I have found on most ramps I can get my boat out by just driving a little more gently and not starting the spinning.  I find an auto trans works better, since you can accelerate from a standstill very slowly without having to dump the clutch.  But I have had several trucks with 4 speeds and a couple of 5 speeds.  You just gotta take it easy, and don’t try to pull the boat out fast.

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I thought friction was normal force times coefficient of friction.  Nowhere mentioning pressure or area.  Deflation is for soft surfaces where pressure does need to be reduced? …        Grasping another opportunity to be wrong!

seems you caught this opportunity nicely That’s the description you find in physics 101, but it doesn’t work well in this case.  It works for flat surfaces in contact (with a few other assumptions).  When you add rough surfaces, compressible and deformable surfaces, and weak surface features (like sand on the ramp) that can withstand only a (smallish) maximum force before breaking away, then surface area and tread play an important role.

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I thought friction was normal force times coefficient of friction.  Nowhere mentioning pressure or area.  Deflation is for soft surfaces where pressure does need to be reduced? pqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpqpq        Grasping another opportunity to be wrong! [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]

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Man, sand on concrete can REALLY cause you to slip!

This isn’t sand on concrete (like a building site) but sand on a concrete boat ramp. All the ramps I’ve seen have been pretty slippery with weed and green gunk. If I used the same ramp every day, I’d scrub the thing clean and use Jeyes fluid or caustic soda on it occasionally to keep the gunk off. I know little about boat ramps, but I do know about silage clamps and slurry lagoons  (bleurgh !) – even for these noxious devices it’s worth doing a bit of scrubbing & hosing occasionally. Failing that, get as big a contact patch as you can. Soft rubber in small tread blocks (not great mud-plugger tread bars) and a low enough pressure to let the tyre flatten as much as is practical. — alt.flame – Making the world a safer place for postal workers.

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How about it, you guys? I need to buy new tires for my truck in another couple of months, and I’d appreciate some input. In addition, I think it’d make an interesting discussion topic, as well.

        Er, does that imply that your current tires are rather bald?         If so, ‘nuf said.         Relative weight of vehicle and tow is important. (If the wheels         on your trailer are bigger than the wheels on your tow vehicle,         you’re in trouble. Saw a Chicago flatlander trying to tow a large         boat with his Beamer. Didn’t make it.)         In your case, the truck should have enough towing weight, but         the question is about weight on the rear wheels.         o The angle of the ramp tends to transfer more weight to the           rear wheels.         o Tounge weight of the trailer is important.         I am hauling a smaller  14′ runabout (40 horse motor) with a         Ranger pickup in a similar situation. I have no problems.         o I have a stick, so can control things better.         o When I was towing with a station wagon and automatic, I would:            o Put the transmission in second            o Step on the brake            o Give it some gas.            o Use the break as a clutch, slowly easing up so that there              was no jerk in the initial pull. Frank R. Borger – Physicist     ___      "I think medical research would show Michael Reese – U of Chicago   |___       that being a Cubs fan lengthens Center for Radiation Therapy   | |_) _    your life. Or maybe it just _seems_ ph: 312-791-8075 fa: 791-2517       |_)

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Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower. Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off other boats that were just pulled out.

[...]         have you tried deflating the rear tyres a bit?  you’d get a larger         contact area.         andrew —            work phone/fax: 0131 668 8356, office: 0131 668 8357     institute for astronomy, royal observatory, blackford hill, edinburgh                      http://www.roe.ac.uk/ajcwww

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Question: what kind of tire tread design would provide the *most* friction? Knobby, off-road type, or a smoother "pavement" type? Remember, by the way, that this is extremely low-speed operation, just barely turning, in fact, so concepts like "hydroplaning" probably wouldn’t apply here. We’re talking about pulling a load up a wet concrete surface. How about it, you guys? I need to buy new tires for my truck in another couple of months, and I’d appreciate some input. In addition, I think it’d make an interesting discussion topic, as well.

There’s a lot coming into play. I find all terrains are significantly better than road tires.  I would assume mudders are even better.  My guess would be that the deep tread actually allows some of the edges of the tread to grip the ramp, cause there’s certainly lower area in contact.  Course that also means greater psi. Another factor is the softness of the rubber.  I would suspect that given two identical tires, the one with the lower tread life would be better. You could also get a bit wider tires.  I’ve also seen people with a bucket of sand they toss out to get a better grip.  No-one really complains about sand at a launch ramp. kevin

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Well, since you’re having trouble on boat ramps with your pickup you need more weight on the wheels.  If you can’t get buddies or bystanders to sit in the bed to get more weight on the rear wheels, try some of that water in 5 gallon pails (like paint pails).  If you’re in salt water you’ll want lids to keep the water out of the bed; in fresh water that’s not a problem.  10 x 5 gal x 8 lbs/gal is 400 lbs, enough to help quite a bit.  Nice thing about this is you don’t need to drag the extra weight around afterwards, and it’s likely to be available wherever you launch your boat .   — Bart Smaalders                  Solaris Performance     SunSoft http://playground.sun.com/~barts                    2550 Garcia Ave                                                         Mt View, CA 94043-1100

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he one with the lower tread life would be better. You could also get a bit wider tires.  I’ve also seen people with a bucket of sand they toss out to get a better grip.

Man, sand on concrete can REALLY cause you to slip! Sand on ICE is ok but no sand is better on non-frozen concrete. George Bonser

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How about it, you guys? I need to buy new tires for my truck in another couple of months, and I’d appreciate some input. In addition, I think it’d make an interesting discussion topic, as well. Ron Morgan

Wide, sticky tires in my opinion. Though they spread the weight out more, there is more surface for gripping. It will reduce fuel economy somewhat though.  Also, I would worry more about hydroplaning on FRONT wheels where you could loose steering control. You might try putting some weight over that axle or letting 5lb of air out if you get stranded. George Bonser

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Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off other boats that were just pulled out. Ron Morgan

I stuck my truck in Galveston Bay this way.  My solution was to buy an old CJ5.  Now I drop into 4 wheel drive in low range.  And no problem. A cheaper alternative is to mount a trailer ball on the front which keeps those rear wheels way up out of the water. cfly — Charlie and Dorothy Fly Non-Trivial Solutions 2951 Marina Bay Dr. Suite 130-349 League City, TX  77573-2733

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Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off other boats that were just pulled out. Ron Morgan

Ron – When you buy your tires, make sure you get a better traction rating.  Talk to the tire dealer about traction ratings and wet pavement.  He may help you out tremendously. (Softer tires may wear quicker.) Other solutions to consider can make a big difference :         1. Put a couple hundred pounds of sand bags or blocks in the                 very back of the truck.  Spinning can be caused by not                 enough weight on the rear wheels.         2. Adjust your boat on the trailer to increase the tongue weight                 of the trailer (not to an extreme).  With the boat further                 on the trailer, you will get more weight on the truck tires.         3. Next truck, get limited slip differential to use both back wheels instead of one. Good luck and may all your ramps be dry ones, Joe

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Have your buddies jump in the back of the truck to give it wieght. I have stuck the floor mats in front of the tires once when I was alone and got stuck, but sand would be alot better. Longrigger

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Almost everybody I know has had the same problem with some combination of boats, ramps and tow vehicles. I have better traction on my jeep since I moved up on tire size. The tires are all weather radials. I can still spin all 4 tires if the ramp is mucky enough. Just having new tires will make a difference because the rubber will be softer and the thicker tread will be more compliant than on the older tires. My neighbor mounted a hitch ball on the front bumper of his 2WD truck which let him keep his rear tires high and dry. This can be particularly important at low tide, especially on ramps in estuaries that tend to silt up and/or grow moss. I carried a 20 foot heavy duty tow rope for several years untill the size of my tow vehicle caught up with my boat. I have also seen tongue extensions used for the same purpose. Many sailboaters use these because a keelboat has to be sent WAY back before it will float off the trailer. They either telescope out of the trailer tongue or are carried along side. Some of them even have their own wheels on them that will take much more abuse than a standard trailer jack wheel. My jeep has mushy rear springs and a short wheelbase, so I don’t run with much tongue weight. You can usually run much more tongue weight on a real truck like yours. 300 or 400 lbs of tongue weight, if you are not already running that much, could do a lot for your traction problems. Check with the truck manufacturer to see what they recommend.                                                 vaaler

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& Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 & pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The & boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, & of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower. & Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off & other boats that were just pulled out. & My truck can just BARELY pull the boat up the ramp under these & conditions. If it’s dry, no problem, but when the ramp is wet, & the tires slip and spin, sometimes even smoking. It’s a very, & very marginal situation. Last night, I came very close to being & stranded at a deserted ramp after dark; I could *not* get that & boat up that ramp, and finally made it up after creeping about an & inch at a time, before the tires would slip. God only knows what & kind of wear this produced on my transmission. You don’t say what the truck is, but does it have a limited slip differential (pozi-trac, sure-grip, etc)?  If not that would get you double the traction.  They can be added to many of the trucks out there. Hewlett Packard              (707) 794-4848 fax      (707) 538-3693 home 1212 Valley House Drive      http://web.sr.hp.com/~frankb/ Rohnert Park CA 94928-4999   KC6WUG, AMA, DoD #7566, NMLRA, I’m the NRA. U.S.A.              Dodge V8 Dakota, Yamaha IT175 XT350 YZF600R Seca 750

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower. Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off other boats that were just pulled out. My truck can just BARELY pull the boat up the ramp under these conditions. If it’s dry, no problem, but when the ramp is wet, the tires slip and spin, sometimes even smoking. It’s a very, very marginal situation. Last night, I came very close to being stranded at a deserted ramp after dark; I could *not* get that boat up that ramp, and finally made it up after creeping about an inch at a time, before the tires would slip. God only knows what kind of wear this produced on my transmission. Question: what kind of tire tread design would provide the *most* friction? Knobby, off-road type, or a smoother "pavement" type? Remember, by the way, that this is extremely low-speed operation, just barely turning, in fact, so concepts like "hydroplaning" probably wouldn’t apply here. We’re talking about pulling a load up a wet concrete surface. How about it, you guys? I need to buy new tires for my truck in another couple of months, and I’d appreciate some input. In addition, I think it’d make an interesting discussion topic, as well. Ron Morgan

    Ron I had the same ‘problem’ with my old truck (‘91 Dakota with limited slip).  I would put up a slippery ramp and one tire would spin (no posi!)…  I helped the situation by putting all of the crap in the back of the truck that was in the boat, to put more weight over the rear tires (Coolers, skis, gas cans, clothes, etc.)  This made a difference.  I don’t know what type of truck you have, or if it has posi, but with my NEW ‘95 Dakota w/posi + 5 speed I am able to pull that same boat, with all of the crap still in the boat, with no problem out of the same ramp.  I do run a lower tire pressure, as this tends to put more rubber onto the ground, giving more traction.  You might try that too…(it wouldn’t hurt).       BTW  If you didn’t already know this, when pulling out of a boat ramp with a automatic trans, and you work pretty hard to pull that boat up (any pull should be considered) the ramp, make sure you don’t pull up to the staging area and shut off your truck while securing you boat. All of the heat generated by the pull will not leave the transmission (as it didn’t get cooled yet by the transmission cooler)…and can cause a lot of wear/tear/damage to your transmission.  My bone-head friend went through 2 transmissions over 2 seasons going to the Colorado river with his boat.  Every time he got it out of the water he would shut down, secure the boat, then take off…with an air temp of about 110 F. that truck would almost boil the transmission fluid!!!  He learned.     I got a 5 speed ( no cooler needed!), and it works a lot better than a automatic (at least for me it does).     My $.02     ..Sam

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Conditions: a standard half-ton truck, attempting to pull a 3,000 pound fishing boat up a fairly steep concrete launch ramp. The boat is on a 4-wheel trailer in good condition. The truck is, of course, rear-wheel drive, and has more than enough horsepower. Special consideration: the ramp is *wet*, due to water dripping off other boats that were just pulled out. My truck can just BARELY pull the boat up the ramp under these conditions. If it’s dry, no problem, but when the ramp is wet, the tires slip and spin, sometimes even smoking. It’s a very, very marginal situation. Last night, I came very close to being stranded at a deserted ramp after dark; I could *not* get that boat up that ramp, and finally made it up after creeping about an inch at a time, before the tires would slip. God only knows what kind of wear this produced on my transmission. Question: what kind of tire tread design would provide the *most* friction? Knobby, off-road type, or a smoother "pavement" type? Remember, by the way, that this is extremely low-speed operation, just barely turning, in fact, so concepts like "hydroplaning" probably wouldn’t apply here. We’re talking about pulling a load up a wet concrete surface. How about it, you guys? I need to buy new tires for my truck in another couple of months, and I’d appreciate some input. In addition, I think it’d make an interesting discussion topic, as well. Ron Morgan

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