Question:

seems to be such a co-incidence it cracks up when they put their new home page up Rob sig always 99p bargains going here nike , next , m+s , leather jacket 99p http://cgi6.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewSellersOtherItems&userid=…

EBay’s PayPal Hit by Glitches in Online Payments Mon Oct 11, 8:30 PM ET   Technology – Internet Report By Lisa Baertlein

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20041012/wr_nm/tech_ebay_… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) – EBay Inc.’s online payment service PayPal has suffered intermittent glitches since late last week, locking some users out of their accounts for long stretches and making it difficult for some online sellers to complete deals, the company and users said on Monday. The online payment problem came at the start of eBay’s (Nasdaq:EBAY – news) seasonally biggest quarter for revenues and roughly four months after the company apologized for a run of billing and search snafus that disrupted some of the auction site’s most dedicated sellers. EBay on Monday said it was working to fix the recent PayPal problems, which have affected payments, log-ins and account creation. "We are working furiously. … We have all resources dedicated to getting it fixed as soon as possible," PayPal spokeswoman Amanda Pires told Reuters. "We haven’t found the ultimate cause," said Pires, who added that the problem appeared to be related to a coding update late on Thursday. It was not immediately clear how widespread the problems were, although eBay’s message boards were filled with postings about the PayPal glitches. Michael Bokan, of West Charlton, New York, told Reuters PayPal usually processes 5 to 10 payments a day on orders from his fly-fishing equipment Web site FlyShack.com. Bokan, who said he can see payment requests being sent to PayPal, said no payments came through on Friday, less than half than normal were processed over the weekend and just one was processed on Monday. "It’s messing things up," said one San Francisco-based PayPal user who spoke on condition he not be named. He said payments were "trickling in" to his account, although confirmation e-mails from PayPal were not. Users also complained they were unable to withdraw money from their PayPal accounts or to use their PayPal debit cards. "I can’t get paid, can’t ship and can’t get to my own money," a PayPal user wrote in a posting on eBay’s message boards. EBay has been integrating PayPal tightly into its site since it purchased the company in 2002. For example, the company added a feature to its popular "Buy It Now" function that allows sellers to accept immediate payment only through PayPal. PayPal boasted 50.4 million accounts at the end of the second quarter, during which it processed $4.4 billion in payments. Shares in eBay closed $1.14 higher at $93.73 on Monday on the Nasdaq stock exchange.

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| seems to be such a co-incidence it cracks up when they put their new home | page up That shouldn’t have changed much but apparently they changed the back end at the same time and screwed everything up. Bloody idiots. GW

In all fairness, I would love to know of any programmer out there that could make even the slightest change to a system the size of eBay’s or PayPal’s, serving over 100 million pages per day, without some glitches. My hat is off to both eBay and PayPal. They did a fantastic job. SB

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| seems to be such a co-incidence it cracks up when they put their new home | page up That shouldn’t have changed much but apparently they changed the back end at the same time and screwed everything up. Bloody idiots. GW

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – | seems to be such a co-incidence it cracks up when they put their new home | page up That shouldn’t have changed much but apparently they changed the back end at the same time and screwed everything up. Bloody idiots. GW probably got some bodger in with a pirate copy of dreamweaver.

Of course not a PIRATE copy. A HONG KONG copy…bought on eBay of course =)

Response:

Question:

We, Stichting Neptune Association, want to have a pair of blisters. Complete or large parts of it, whatever al will do. Even parts will do. We are able to remake the missing ones. So please help us, look in your backyard for parts. Mail us at the website http://www.neptune-association.nl. We don’t held it for possible that we can’t fly our grand old lady without this. With Kind regards, Peter Boel The Netherlands

Response:

Try HARS at: http://www.notebookpub.com/hars/hars1.html They have two Neptunes, one flying. Cheers John

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We, Stichting Neptune Association, want to have a pair of blisters. Complete or large parts of it, whatever al will do. Even parts will do. We are able to remake the missing ones. So please help us, look in your backyard for parts. Mail us at the website http://www.neptune-association.nl. We don’t held it for possible that we can’t fly our grand old lady without this. With Kind regards, Peter Boel The Netherlands

Response:

We, Stichting Neptune Association, want to have a pair of blisters. Complete or large parts of it, whatever al will do. Even parts will do. We are able to remake the missing ones. So please help us, look in your backyard for parts. Mail us at the website http://www.neptune-association.nl. We don’t held it for possible that we can’t fly our grand old lady without this. With Kind regards, Peter Boel The Netherlands

good heavens is that all that stops you. stop looking at them as PBY blisters and look at them as sorta RV4 canopies. the manufacturing process is just perspex blowing. lots of homebuilders around that can help you with that. Stealth Pilot Australia.

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JV, Don’t speak too soon!! I believe the second Neppy is due to fly in to Albion Park (YWOL) very soon and hopefully the C-47 won’t be too much longer either!!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Try HARS at: http://www.notebookpub.com/hars/hars1.html They have two Neptunes, one flying. Cheers John We, Stichting Neptune Association, want to have a pair of blisters. Complete or large parts of it, whatever al will do. Even parts will do. We are able to remake the missing ones. So please help us, look in your backyard for parts. Mail us at the website http://www.neptune-association.nl. We don’t held it for possible that we can’t fly our grand old lady without this. With Kind regards, Peter Boel The Netherlands

— Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

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Good to hear! Cheers John – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – JV, Don’t speak too soon!! I believe the second Neppy is due to fly in to Albion Park (YWOL) very soon and hopefully the C-47 won’t be too much longer either!! Try HARS at: http://www.notebookpub.com/hars/hars1.html They have two Neptunes, one flying. Cheers John We, Stichting Neptune Association, want to have a pair of blisters. Complete or large parts of it, whatever al will do. Even parts will do. We are able to remake the missing ones. So please help us, look in your backyard for parts. Mail us at the website http://www.neptune-association.nl. We don’t held it for possible that we can’t fly our grand old lady without this. With Kind regards, Peter Boel The Netherlands — Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

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bloody certification systems eh. the death of common sense aviation. I think this was the sort of thing someone else had in mind a few weeks ago when he asked where to find the fun. Cheers.

the secret is in the way you approach it. if you tie the boat and trailer on the back of the car and go fishing. typically you do it sensibly and within the law. the fact that you are operating in     laws on vehicle licensing     laws on driving on the road     laws on boatramps     laws on marine safety     laws on fishing limitations     laws on parking just never enters your mind. you operate in accordance with the intent of those laws and rarely worry about the specifics of the statutes. when I’m flying I never ever think of CASA. most of the requirements are just sensible practise enshrined in law. fly sensibly and it is automatically covered. why treat flying any differently than fly fishing? Stealth Pilot.

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bloody certification systems eh. the death of common sense aviation.

I think this was the sort of thing someone else had in mind a few weeks ago when he asked where to find the fun. Cheers.

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Our JAR-145 company won’t accept this type, thanks for the idea. Peter

eh? what I was getting at was that it should be possible to just blow new ones which were clones of the original. surely they accept locally manufactured spares of identical spec to the originals? bloody certification systems eh. the death of common sense aviation. I wish you the best in wading through it. Stealth Pilot

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Our JAR-145 company won’t accept this type, thanks for the idea. Peter

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We, Stichting Neptune Association, want to have a pair of blisters. Complete or large parts of it, whatever al will do. Even parts will do. We are able to remake the missing ones. So please help us, look in your backyard for parts. Mail us at the website http://www.neptune-association.nl. We don’t held it for possible that we can’t fly our grand old lady without this. With Kind regards, Peter Boel The Netherlands good heavens is that all that stops you. stop looking at them as PBY blisters and look at them as sorta RV4 canopies. the manufacturing process is just perspex blowing. lots of homebuilders around that can help you with that. Stealth Pilot Australia.

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Question:

well willi…with our fly-swap tie, you’ll get all the discomfort but none of that nasty fish catchin problem, i’m sure… <g jeff n rachel, mutant tyers – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …but then again the whole chernobl mutant series of flies catches fish too, so you go figure I find it discomforting that those things work. Willi

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well willi…with our fly-swap tie, you’ll get all the discomfort but none of that nasty fish catchin problem, i’m sure… <g

I once had the opportunity to do a float on the South Fork, and not only were the damn Chernobl flies by far the best flies we had, some of them were clearly better than other…the next best fly was maybe the Tarantula. Mind you the South Fork was a pretty big river for this boy to even begin to comprehend.   Eugene K.

Response:

… the whole chernobl mutant series of flies I find it discomforting that those things work.

Well, you can take comfort in that they don’t work for very long. "Gimmick" patterns come and go, eventually the fish aren’t fooled by them anymore. The "gimmick-of-the-year" in Greater Yellowstone this past year was the Chernobyl Cricket, next year it will have to be something else. — Ken Fortenberry

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 You can sometimes soak an – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -unweighted Muddler in floatant and use it as a hopper as well, I’m told. Never been steelheading, so I couldn’t tell you anything about that. TL! – — Linux: Because I like it when my computer actually works —–BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE—– Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE8Sq/JkciOs8eNXDMRAiHQAJ9fNO17S4LwnmMkm26bT3SlhaxBygCdHmu4 A2XEfZ7l0nnUEsqglT6jLDk= =KTc9 —–END PGP SIGNATURE—–

I’ve fished muddlers on the surface in a pinch and they work just fine…but then again the whole chernobl mutant series of flies catches fish too, so you go figure Eugene K.

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…but then again the whole chernobl mutant series of flies catches fish too, so you go figure

I find it discomforting that those things work. Willi

Response:

<< Craig Moore   << I have been sent a woolhead sculpin. This is not a fly we use in Europe very much. I am interested to know what is a sculpin and where do you find them or is sculpin the name of the designer? Shows how little I know <grin What colors and hook sizes do you prefer? The one I have is brown wool head and olive body and tail. Do you use them mainly for steelhead? Thanks Craig   Ken Fortenberry’s response describes the scientific identification.  I know them as a large trout fly for darkness and deep water.  One North American variety is known as the Miller’s Thumb and an imitative tie has huge pectoral fins which push a lot of water when the fly is retrieved. GKT

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—–BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE—– Hash: SHA1 I have been sent a woolhead sculpin. This is not a fly we use in Europe very much. I am interested to know what is a sculpin and where do you find them or is sculpin the name of the designer?

Sculpin is the name of a baitfish of the order Scorpaeniformes, at least in the US. I don’t know what fishes of that order are present in Europe, if any. What colors and hook sizes do you prefer? The one I have is brown wool head and olive body and tail. Do you use them mainly for steelhead?

There’s a streamer called the Muddler Minnow which was originally tied to imitate sculpins. I use them as streamers when I want an imitator. I usually use them in #4 or #8 for bass or trout. You can sometimes soak an unweighted Muddler in floatant and use it as a hopper as well, I’m told. Never been steelheading, so I couldn’t tell you anything about that. TL! – — Linux: Because I like it when my computer actually works —–BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE—– Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE8Sq/JkciOs8eNXDMRAiHQAJ9fNO17S4LwnmMkm26bT3SlhaxBygCdHmu4 A2XEfZ7l0nnUEsqglT6jLDk= =KTc9 —–END PGP SIGNATURE—–

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The famous and much disliked (on ROFF) Muddler Minnow was originally tied to be a Sculpin imitation. Joel Axelrad **DFD**

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I have been sent a woolhead sculpin. This is not a fly we use in Europe very much. I am interested to know what is a sculpin and where do you find them or is sculpin the name of the designer? Shows how little I know <grin What colors and hook sizes do you prefer? The one I have is brown wool head and olive body and tail. Do you use them mainly for steelhead?

There is a designer named Stalcup, but it’s not related.  A sculpin is a little ugly fish that hangs out on the bottom of rocky rivers.  So, you fish it like a streamer, except that most people seem to bottom-bounce it.  I haven’t heard of using it for steelhead, but I don’t fish for steelhead. It’s in all the modern books here in the US as a rainbow and especially brown trout lure.  The colors you mention are right.

Response:

I have been sent a woolhead sculpin. This is not a fly we use in Europe very much. I am interested to know what is a sculpin and where do you find them or is sculpin the name of the designer? Shows how little I know <grin What colors and hook sizes do you prefer? The one I have is brown wool head and olive body and tail. Do you use them mainly for steelhead? Thanks Craig

Response:

I have been sent a woolhead sculpin. This is not a fly we use in Europe very much. I am interested to know what is a sculpin and where do you find them … What colors and hook sizes do you prefer?

Sculpins, family COTTIDAE, are a bottom-dwelling species, often found under or between rocks. You should match the color and size of the naturals wherevever you’re fishing and fish them "rightdownonthebottom". Sculpins are a very important fly to have in your box for fishing the Norfork in Arkansas, other than that I don’t use them. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

Question:

    Does anyone have any info/experience in SWFF in Greece?  I am a reasonably experienced So Florida FF, but am going to Greece in May on my honeymoon, (and will miss some of the Tarpon season).  I’ll be traveling throughout the Aegean Islands (Patmos, Simi, etc), and am looking for info on types of fish, flies, rod weights, line types, etc. Any direction will be greatly appreciated. Thanking the community in advance CHRIS

Response:

    Does anyone have any info/experience in SWFF in Greece?  I am a reasonably experienced So Florida FF, but am going to Greece in May on my honeymoon…

        On your honeymoon?         Chris, you’re either a brave man or a very lucky one!

Response:

   Does anyone have any info/experience in SWFF in Greece?  I am a reasonably experienced So Florida FF, but am going to Greece in May on my honeymoon, (and will miss some of the Tarpon season).  I’ll be traveling throughout the Aegean Islands (Patmos, Simi, etc), and am looking for info on types of fish, flies, rod weights, line types, etc. Any direction will be greatly appreciated. Thanking the community in advance CHRIS

Chris – Sorry, buddy, but Greece is a little beyond my FF experience.  But I sure would appreciate it if you would fill us in when you get back.       Gene

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Does anyone have any information on flyfishing in Greece?  I’m interested in area North of Athens.  Haven’t been able to find much so far.

Response:

Does anyone have any information on flyfishing in Greece?  I’m interested in area North of Athens.  Haven’t been able to find much so far.

Back in october, about 150 miles north of athens, dave lacourse was doing some serious fishing in grease. it’s dangerous, dang near kilt jeff miller. so if you’re gonna fish in grease, be careful….. waldo — Ezflyfish.com:  http://www.ezflyfish.com http://auctions.yahoo.com/booth/ezflyfish_com Used, Rare, & Out-of-Print Books: http://users.boone.net/wgw/brbg.html

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Does anyone have any information on fly fishing in Greece?  I’m interested in the area from Athens to the North.  Thanks for any help anyone can give.   I tried to post this a couple hours ago but it apparently didn’t work.

Response:

Let me guess, that would be Athens, Georgia.                         Frank Reid

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone have any information on flyfishing in Greece?  I’m interested in area North of Athens.  Haven’t been able to find much so far. Back in october, about 150 miles north of athens, dave lacourse was doing some serious fishing in grease. it’s dangerous, dang near kilt jeff miller. so if you’re gonna fish in grease, be careful….. waldo — Ezflyfish.com:  http://www.ezflyfish.com http://auctions.yahoo.com/booth/ezflyfish_com Used, Rare, & Out-of-Print Books: http://users.boone.net/wgw/brbg.html

Response:

Let me guess, that would be Athens, Georgia.

Correct, and the grease was the by-product of Louie’s alleged ‘cooking’.<g — Charlie…

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Thanks guys, didn’t realize I would be opening the door for you to poke such fun!  Don’t slip too far.

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Two weeks holiday in Crete what’s the fishing like.

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Two weeks holiday in Crete what’s the fishing like.

Well, damn…I thought this was another Gink/Xink thread… TC, R

Response:

Question:

I’ve never been very good at following instructions.  I tried putting a tag on each of the flies I tied for the swap but it got to be an unholy mess with all those itty bitty pieces of paper, especially since I used barbless hooks.  So, I decided that I would simply identify my contribution here for all those due to receive one. Pass Lake: Fine black chenille body on a size 14 standard dry fly hook.  The tail is mallard flank clipped short just behind the bend.  Three turns of brown hackle.  White calf tail wing tied trude style.  I can’t imagine anyone having any difficulty identifying the pass lake based on this description…….it doesn’t even vaguely resemble anything else I have ever seen.  I would be much surprised if it could be confused with anyone else’s contribution.  Besides, it should be the only one you get without a tag on it.    :) This is allegedly a dry fly, but with the chenille body it tends to absorb water readily.  In fact, it floats or sinks pretty much at its own discretion.  However, it has proven very effective for me whether floating high and dry, floundering in the meniscus, or completely submerged.  Not only does it not resemble any other fly I have ever seen, but the same can be said for its affinity to anything that has ever lived in a lake or stream.  Nevertheless, both trout and bluegills (and all their kin) take it readily.  Dead drifting, skittering across the surface, slow retrieve or twitching below the surface, and simply hanging in the current have all worked at various time under a variety of conditions. Any experienced tier should have no trouble figuring out how to put this one together.  One important note though:  calf tail is very slippery; don’t try to make a small neat head on this one.  I make the heads relatively long and thick in order to get a lot of thread holding the wing in place.  Be very liberal in this regard or you will find the calf tail falling out.  Newbies feel free to email me for specific instructions. Sorry Frank, I tried to be good!

Response:

 Incidentally, I have caught many fish on the Pass Lake by just letting it hang in the current downstream while watching a partner fish.  Any similar experience with the Rio Grande King?

Especially when caddis are hatching, once the fly begins to drag I submerge it, give it slack and fish it like a downstream wet.  Get lots of fish during the swing and even hanging directly downstream.  These are usually smaller fish.  The better fish I’ve caught on the pattern have been fish tight against the bank that hit the fly when partially submerged. Willi

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You might be right Warren, I’ve called in the FBI to have the box and all those little buggers checked for fingerprints…but if the miscreant who removed those tags wuz wearin’ expensive Italian shoes and blood-soaked gloves, we’ll never get a conviction! Frank (coppin’ out) Church

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That’s OK Warren, the old tired grey swapmeister will tag ‘em for ya both, I love helping out those less fortunate than me. )….."and barbless hooks don’t help anything either"….shoulda been one of these there  :-) (I gotta take longer naps) Thanks Frank.  I will keep investigating to see who it was that didn’t tag their flies.  It wasn’t me, because I had mine all tagged.  I spent a lot of time tagging those damn things so if they arrived without tags it must have been the postal service and their latest anti-terrorism technology that made them disappear. Of course the flies were probably damaged too during the process, so keep that in mind.<g Warren X#-[ Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

Response:

You might be right Warren, I’ve called in the FBI to have the box and all those little buggers checked for fingerprints…but if the miscreant who removed those tags wuz wearin’ expensive Italian shoes and blood-soaked gloves, we’ll never get a conviction!

Or what if it was Richard Jewel?  They’ll never prove Bubba did it! <g Warren X#-[

Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

Response:

That’s OK Warren, the old tired grey swapmeister will tag ‘em for ya both, I love helping out those less fortunate than me. )….."and barbless hooks don’t help anything either"….shoulda been one of these there  :-) (I gotta take longer naps)

Thanks Frank.  I will keep investigating to see who it was that didn’t tag their flies.  It wasn’t me, because I had mine all tagged.  I spent a lot of time tagging those damn things so if they arrived without tags it must have been the postal service and their latest anti-terrorism technology that made them disappear. Of course the flies were probably damaged too during the process, so keep that in mind.<g Warren X#-[

Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

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Well, OK Wolfie..I’ll forgive you just this once, but all you really needed to do was put yer moniker and the name of the fly on the tag.  I can see why the tag would be the size of a legal paper with all that recipe on it. And barbless hooks don’t help anything either.

Well Wolfie, you aren’t the only one that bagged them without taggin’ them.  I know there was another dirty, rotten s.o.b. out there that didn’t do it either.  For the life of me I can’t remember his name or what he tied, but I know he is out there <g Warren X#-[

Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

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That’s OK Warren, the old tired grey swapmeister will tag ‘em for ya both, I love helping out those less fortunate than me. )….."and barbless hooks don’t help anything either"….shoulda been one of these there  :-) (I gotta take longer naps) OTGS

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well, OK Wolfie..I’ll forgive you just this once, but all you really needed to do was put yer moniker and the name of the fly on the tag.  I can see why the tag would be the size of a legal paper with all that recipe on it. And barbless hooks don’t help anything either. Well Wolfie, you aren’t the only one that bagged them without taggin’ them. I know there was another dirty, rotten s.o.b. out there that didn’t do it either. For the life of me I can’t remember his name or what he tied, but I know he is out there <g Warren X#-[ Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

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Actually the fly is very similar to a Rio Grande King or Rio Grande Trude….

Thank you Willi.  And now that you have made everyone aware of the distinctions between the Rio Grande King and my own humble offering NOBODY has any excuse to confuse it with anything else that arrives in their goody boxes!  Incidentally, I have caught many fish on the Pass Lake by just letting it hang in the current downstream while watching a partner fish.  Any similar experience with the Rio Grande King? Wolfgang who is hoping oh so fervently that he will be able to put his fly swap rejects to work this weekend!

Response:

Good idea posting the recipe Wolfgang.  BTW – I made my tags stay on by coating the paper front and back with scotch(tm) tape. Here is the recipe for the Teco Bug (or Teko Bug – I’ve seen it spelled both ways). The Teco Bug was originated about 40 years by Dick Blair and some other guys long who fish the Westfield River here in Western Massachusetts.  The lower stretches of the river have lots of dragonfly nymphs and we think this fly imitates those and probably stonefly nymphs and the Isonychia.  Dick ties these in sizes 4 through 8, usually unweighted and never with a bead.  Most other people I know will either add lead or a bead head.  The ones I tied are on a size 8 Mustad 3906B nymph hook.  I also tie mine sparser and smaller than Dick.  He does two layers of the underfur before adding the guard hairs – he makes really fat buggy nymphs and has been very successful with those for lots of years.  I don’t fish the main stem of the Westfield, preferring the smaller feeder branches, and I think the sparser version does better up there and also in the ponds I fish.  Fish the Teco as a nymph (up and across, dead drift, and use an indicator if you want).  We also fish these like a streamer, down and across with short strips at the end of the swing, especially when fishing the Isonychia drift in August.  The name Teco (Teko) comes from Tekoa Mountain, a big rocky hill overlooking the Westfield River where Dick likes to fish. Bead Head Teco Bug No tail Thread: Danville 6/0 waxed, color to match fur Hook: Mustad 3906B or similar, size 4 through 12 (I usually use size Bead: cyclops eye (size to fit hook, 1/8" is good on a size Underbody: snowshoe hare body fur underfur Overbody: snowshoe hare guard hair (see description below) Wing: mallard flank feather Method: We tie these in silver (silver bead, gray fur, natural mallard), brown (silver or brass bead, brown fur, mallard dyed wood duck, or real wood duck if you have them) and olive (olive dyed rabbit, brass bead, olive dyed mallard). Put the bead on the hook.  You probably need to pinch down the barb. Coat shank well with thread back to the hook bend.  You can lock in the bead with thread, but I usually just build up a ball of dubbing.  For the sparse version, bring the thread up to the head.  For the fat version, bring the thread back to the hook bend. Cut off several bunches of fur (six is about right for a size and separate the underfur from the guard hairs.  This is critical to the fly – using blended dubbing and picking out guard hairs does not give a buggy enough appearance.  Swap hands so you are pinching the fur at the cut end and pinch the guardhairs with the thumb and forefinger of the other hand. Pull out the guard hairs and stack in neat piles for later use.  Tease out the piles of underfur and mix. Dub the underfur mixture and wrap a fairly cylindrical body.  The fat version does two layers of dubbing.  Both versions should end with the thread at the hook bend. The guard hairs are applied either by waxing the thread and dabbing the hairs on loosely, or by using a dubbing loop.  I prefer using a little wax and just sticking on the hairs.  If you’re using pre-waxed thread and you have the right touch, no additional wax is necessary.  Don’t spin them tight.  Wrap the guard hair dubbing up to the eye.  The idea is to apply all six bunches fairly evenly.  You should have lots of spiky hair sticking out in all directions.  If necessary, brush out more hairs with a piece of velcro. The mallard flank wing should use a symmetrical rounded feather.  Pick a decent feather and strip off the fluffy section.  The feather should extend about 1/2 hook shank length past the bend.  Wet your fingers and stroke the barbules to compact them.  Dick Blair just puts the feather in his mouth to wet it and pulls it through his lips to compact it – use your own judgement. Take two or three loose wraps of thread over the feather and position the feather, then pull the stem to bring the barbules under the wraps.  This further compacts the feather.  When it looks right, take a few tighter wraps to secure the feather. Make a wing case by taking the thread back about 1/4" under the feather and taking two loose wraps.  Then bring the thread back to the head and tie off. –Stan

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve never been very good at following instructions.  I tried putting a tag on each of the flies I tied for the swap but it got to be an unholy mess with all those itty bitty pieces of paper, especially since I used barbless hooks.  So, I decided that I would simply identify my contribution here for all those due to receive one. Pass Lake:

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<snip Apparently my spell checker doesn’t care about obviously stupid headers or it is deliberately out to get me.

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Well, OK Wolfie..I’ll forgive you just this once, but all you really needed to do was put yer moniker and the name of the fly on the tag.  I can see why the tag would be the size of a legal paper with all that recipe on it. And barbless hooks don’t help anything either. YOT&GS – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve never been very good at following instructions.  I tried putting a tag on each of the flies I tied for the swap but it got to be an unholy mess with all those itty bitty pieces of paper, especially since I used barbless hooks.  So, I decided that I would simply identify my contribution here for all those due to receive one. Sorry Frank, I tried to be good!

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Actually the fly is very similar to a Rio Grande King or Rio Grande Trude, a fly that was very popular about 25 years ago in Colorado and Wyoming. The Rio Grande traditionally has a golden tinsel tag and the tail is made of golden pheasant tippets, but there were many variations. I tie mine very similar to your Pass Creek, but use brown hackle for the tail (one less material to get out) and I often tie it on a 2X long hook. I also like the versatility of this fly.  Like you stated, it can be fished dry, damp or wet and can be fished dead drift or with various amount of action. Locally it has seemed to have fallen out of favor. It is one of several "old" patterns that I use that have been replaced by more modern, but not necessarily better, patterns. These "old" patterns, aside from being good flies in their own right, can sometimes turn the trick on fish that have seen alot of flies. Willi – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve never been very good at following instructions.  I tried putting a tag on each of the flies I tied for the swap but it got to be an unholy mess with all those itty bitty pieces of paper, especially since I used barbless hooks.  So, I decided that I would simply identify my contribution here for all those due to receive one. Pass Lake: Fine black chenille body on a size 14 standard dry fly hook.  The tail is mallard flank clipped short just behind the bend.  Three turns of brown hackle.  White calf tail wing tied trude style.  I can’t imagine anyone having any difficulty identifying the pass lake based on this description…….it doesn’t even vaguely resemble anything else I have ever seen.  I would be much surprised if it could be confused with anyone else’s contribution.  Besides, it should be the only one you get without a tag on it.    :) This is allegedly a dry fly, but with the chenille body it tends to absorb water readily.  In fact, it floats or sinks pretty much at its own discretion.  However, it has proven very effective for me whether floating high and dry, floundering in the meniscus, or completely submerged.  Not only does it not resemble any other fly I have ever seen, but the same can be said for its affinity to anything that has ever lived in a lake or stream.  Nevertheless, both trout and bluegills (and all their kin) take it readily.  Dead drifting, skittering across the surface, slow retrieve or twitching below the surface, and simply hanging in the current have all worked at various time under a variety of conditions. Any experienced tier should have no trouble figuring out how to put this one together.  One important note though:  calf tail is very slippery; don’t try to make a small neat head on this one.  I make the heads relatively long and thick in order to get a lot of thread holding the wing in place.  Be very liberal in this regard or you will find the calf tail falling out.  Newbies feel free to email me for specific instructions. Sorry Frank, I tried to be good!

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Well that’s not terribly expensive – I would recommend the 4 pc rod over the 2 pc. The higher resale valve will make up for the additional cost and it’s so much easier if you get a chance to do some traveling. The casting action on the 4 pc VPS is virtually the same on the 2 and 4 pc. The DS series is considerably slower action that the RPL / VPS series – I have cast both. Also the resale valve is considerably lower percent wise. Most everyone I know that purchased a DS outgrow it within a year or so. FYI: I normally fish RPLX rods (8wt & up) , to me the RPL/VPS is slower, but still very castable and able to shoot line, where the DS is too slow and unable to shoot line.

I’m not sure about the 5, seems light if you do much smallmouth fishing so my 2 bits: go for a 6. On the VSP –  I have a 690-4 RPL – I was told that the VSP is the exact same rod by sage.  It’s a nice rod, and  can cast a pretty good sized popper or streamer.  Most of my buddies that have cast it like it also. What is the cost of the VPS combo?

They want a little over $400 for a combo.  They give you a nice reel setup with backing and WF-F fly line, usually higher quality.   But then for the same action I was checking into the DS series rods, looks line the same rod action of med-fast, but at about $290 for the combo.  I am leaning towards the Sage more and more. One good thing (if you need the money), I start working 7 days a week in two weeks, so after I work two or three of them, I’ll have the money to buy either one if I want and still be able to feed the family. –Randy

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… I will also be casting  all of these rods before I make my finial decision, but I’d like input on these rods.

Why ? — Ken Fortenberry

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Okay, I’m thinking about a new rod.  I stopped at my local shop today and checked out a few rods.  I’ve determined after talking with the guy there, I want a 5 weight for the different fishing I do, mainly smallmouth and trout. I have narrowed down to the following: a Sage DSL series , a Scott (whatever series), a step up to a Sage VSP series, or going to a different shop and getting a Orvis Silver label series rod.  I am not in a hurry since I will only start working 7 days a week in a few weeks (I’ll have the money after one or two weeks of this).     I am leaning towards the Sage VSP Combo right now, but this can change. I will also be casting  all of these rods before I make my finial decision, but I’d like input on these rods. –Randy

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   I am leaning towards the Sage VSP Combo right now, but this can change. I will also be casting  all of these rods before I make my finial decision, but I’d like input on these rods.

Sage has a pretty hefty markup on their rods, IMO.  But, it seems to me the VSP is one of the best "values" (this term might be hotly debated by Mike Connor  Their rep was telling me how just a few years ago it was a top-of-the-line rod (used to be the RPL I think?)  Technology marches on and the price goes down.  Is it all of a sudden not such a good rod?  Of course not.  I preferred that rod’s action over the SP, but that’s just personal preference, and reasonable as far as Sage goes.  BTW, if you’re deciding on finials, go with something in iron rather than wood – more gothic looking * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

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… I will also be casting  all of these rods before I make my finial decision, but I’d like input on these rods. Why ?

Exactly. No one can tell what you like. You have to try them and decide what you want, and then post your opinion and your reasons if you like. It’s not like buying a used car. I’m sure any of those rods would do the job. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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I will also be casting  all of these rods before I make my finial decision, BTW, if you’re deciding on finials, go with something in iron rather than wood – more gothic looking BTW, I’m not old enough to start playing golf yet…though If I could find a ‘gothic’ looking rod, I just might be able to interest my oldest daughter in fly fishing, I don’t think I seen black waders yet.

Randy, the keyword here is finial. I don’t think anybody is being so crude that they would suggest that you’re a golfer.     Jim * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –    I am leaning towards the Sage VSP Combo right now, but this can change. I will also be casting  all of these rods before I make my finial decision, but I’d like input on these rods. Sage has a pretty hefty markup on their rods, IMO.  But, it seems to me the VSP is one of the best "values" (this term might be hotly debated by Mike Connor  Their rep was telling me how just a few years ago it was a top-of-the-line rod (used to be the RPL I think?)  Technology marches on and the price goes down.  Is it all of a sudden not such a good rod?  Of course not.  I preferred that rod’s action over the SP, but that’s just personal preference, and reasonable as far as Sage goes.  BTW, if you’re deciding on finials, go with something in iron rather than wood – more gothic looking

Maybe I should just get another ultra-light spinning outfit and one of those fly fishing shooting head attachments… ROFLOL BTW, I’m not old enough to start playing golf yet…though If I could find a ‘gothic’ looking rod, I just might be able to interest my oldest daughter in fly fishing, I don’t think I seen black waders yet. –Randy — Under  40……yet!

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… I will also be casting  all of these rods before I make my finial decision, but I’d like input on these rods. Why ? — Ken Fortenberry

        oh, the profundity! wayno

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BTW, I’m not old enough to start playing golf yet..

        well, randy, the truth is you are too damn old to start playing golf, if you are past 30. wayno, just keeping the record straight

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BTW, I’m not old enough to start playing golf yet.. well, randy, the truth is you are too damn old to start playing golf, if you are past 30.

wayno, does miniature golf count? –Randy – the crowd goes crazy, as he sinks a hole in one as the ball goes over the bridge at the water fall, then under the prop of the wind mill into the pipe on the left and comes out into the cup…..

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Wayno writes: well, randy, the truth is you are too damn old to start playing golf, if you are past 30.

As is often the case, Wayne is correct here, Randy. Golf is a game best learned before the teens, abandoned in one’s early twenties as a sport for old farts. When one achieves the latter status, one can resume the sport. This oncoming of old fart status can,however, occur at various ages, thus it is that some never give the game up at all.                       all in good fun,                           Tom Littleton

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I’m not sure about the 5, seems light if you do much smallmouth fishing so my 2 bits: go for a 6. On the VSP –  I have a 690-4 RPL – I was told that the VSP is the exact same rod by sage.  It’s a nice rod, and  can cast a pretty good sized popper or streamer.  Most of my buddies that have cast it like it also. What is the cost of the VPS combo?

Okay, I’m thinking about a new rod.  I stopped at my local shop today and checked out a few rods.  I’ve determined after talking with the guy there, I want a 5 weight for the different fishing I do, mainly smallmouth and trout. I have narrowed down to the following: a Sage DSL series , a Scott (whatever series), a step up to a Sage VSP series, or going to a different shop and getting a Orvis Silver label series rod.  I am not in a hurry since I will only start working 7 days a week in a few weeks (I’ll have the money after one or two weeks of this).     I am leaning towards the Sage VSP Combo right now, but this can change. I will also be casting  all of these rods before I make my finial decision, but I’d like input on these rods. –Randy

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I’m not sure about the 5, seems light if you do much smallmouth fishing so my 2 bits: go for a 6. On the VSP –  I have a 690-4 RPL – I was told that the VSP is the exact same rod by sage.  It’s a nice rod, and  can cast a pretty good sized popper or streamer.  Most of my buddies that have cast it like it also. What is the cost of the VPS combo?

They want a little over $400 for a combo.  They give you a nice reel setup with backing and WF-F fly line, usually higher quality.   But then for the same action I was checking into the DS series rods, looks line the same rod action of med-fast, but at about $290 for the combo.  I am leaning towards the Sage more and more. One good thing (if you need the money), I start working 7 days a week in two weeks, so after I work two or three of them, I’ll have the money to buy either one if I want and still be able to feed the family. –Randy

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Question:

FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE FOR SALE    FOR SALE Several Sage 7 foot 9 inch, 6 weight 2 piece rods. These rods are brand new. The price includes shipping anywhere in the continental U.S. The rods do not have rod tubes or socks. These are brand new, unused rods. Must sell as soon as possible. The price in only $100, cash, check (held until cleared) or money order. Donna

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Several Sage 7 foot 9 inch, 6 weight 2 piece rods. These rods are brand

new.  The price in only $100, cash, check (held until cleared) or money order. Donna

I hate to sound cynical, but….Why would anyone sell new $400-$500 rods for $100.? What’s the story behind these rods????  A cynic would think this is either a scam or they are a little warm to the touch.  Just wondering. Wes

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Wes writes:  "I hate to sound cynical, but….Why would anyone sell new

$400-$500 rods for $100.?  What’s the story behind these rods????  A cynic would think this is either a scam or they are a little warm to the touch.  Just wondering. Wes" Wes, if I recall correctly from a previous post, these rods are the Sage Youth Rods that have been discontinued.  The rod is of Graphite One construction 6 weight.  I bought one for my son from my local fly shop several years ago for $165 and that included the bag, rod case, reel and a cheap line. While these are great beginner rods, they should not be confused with the other Sage rods.  There is a huge difference in power and presentation.   Mike

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These rods are indeed brand new. The are not seconds. These rods are no longer made. They were called "Youth" rods because of their small diamter grips and length. Trust me, they are Sage, marked Sage, the the RPL style flex and design. I believe these rods were originally $200. Ken Please send your inquiries about purchasing these rods to Donna – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Several Sage 7 foot 9 inch, 6 weight 2 piece rods. These rods are brand new. The price in only $100, cash, check (held until cleared) or money order. Donna I hate to sound cynical, but….Why would anyone sell new $400-$500 rods for $100.? What’s the story behind these rods????  A cynic would think this is either a scam or they are a little warm to the touch.  Just wondering. Wes

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Several Sage 7 foot 9 inch, 6 weight 2 piece rods. These rods are brand new. The price in only $100, cash, check (held until cleared) or money order. I hate to sound cynical, but….Why would anyone sell new $400-$500 rods for $100.? What’s the story behind these rods????  A cynic would think this is either a scam or they are a little warm to the touch.  Just wondering.

Good questions – though you don’t have to be a cynic to feel that a 7′9" 6wt must be one heck of a club. IMHO $100 for such a rod (Sage or otherwise) is just about right… /dave

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE    FOR SALE FOR SALE    FOR SALE Several Sage 7 foot 9 inch, 6 weight 2 piece rods. These rods are brand new. The price includes shipping anywhere in the continental U.S. The rods do not have rod tubes or socks. These are brand new, unused rods. Must sell as soon as possible. The price in only $100, cash, check (held until cleared) or money order. Donna

Hi All, Those are Sage Youth Rods that were discontinued. I think they sold for about $135. They are really a 7′9" #5 rod that Sage labeled as a #6 for kids. At a $100 they would be a great rod for small water dry fly fishing for anyone. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY www.kiene.com

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iI would like to thank all who responded to my request for books on "fly patterns". I now have a realy good list to choose from. I’m sure it will keep me busy all winter. Thanks Again

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Hi Gerald Happy to help, that’s what this newsgroup is all about. — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (97 catalog) http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

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Question:

I live in Illinois—not exactly the fly fishing capital of the world—and I’m planning a trip out west  (Yellowstone, Grand Tetons, Black Hills) in August.  I’ve never been fly fishing, but I’m determined to give it a try.   I’m getting a basic Orvis Clearwater rod and reel, but I have no idea how to use it.   Does anyone know if there is a video that teaches basic fly fishing techniques, basic info about the types of flies you should use in what conditions, etc.?  Any information about where I might find such a video would Dan Simeone                   (PHONE) 217-333-0850 Station Manager               (FAX) 217-333-7151 University of Illinois

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Try Orvis’ "Fly Fishing School".  It’s an eighty minute video for about $20.00 and covers just about all you would need to know.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hi, I am 10 years old have been fly fishing for 2 1/2 years. I would like to hear from other kids who are interested in fly fishing. Matt- North Carolina

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I am advisor to a fly fishing club at our middle school here in Bozeman.   I had our first meeting yesterday, and we had 18 students!  I did this the last two years and average 6-8 students.  I’d be interested to know if anyone else is doing anything like I am trying.  Would be interested in sharing information.  Dave Kumlien, Bozeman, MT

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(David Kumlien) writes: I am advisor to a fly fishing club at our middle school here in Bozeman. I had our first meeting yesterday, and we had 18 students!  I did this the last two years and average 6-8 students.  I’d be interested to know if anyone else is doing anything like I am trying.  Would be interested in sharing information.  Dave Kumlien, Bozeman, MT

What a great idea, Dave.  I, for one, would really like to hear of your experiences, and I may have a thought or two to throw in now and then.  By all means, keep posting! Kurt Steinbock

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Hi, I am 10 years old have been fly fishing for 2 1/2 years. I would like to hear from other kids who are interested in fly fishing. Matt- North Carolina

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