Question:

In light of the recent tension, caused by so-called "ignorance," I began thinking about words and symbols that either have more than one meaning or are bastardized in one way or another. http://www.ccnet.com/~suntzu75/news_archives/pc970001.htm — Op

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In light of the recent tension, caused by so-called "ignorance," I began thinking about words and symbols that either have more than one meaning or are bastardized in one way or another. http://www.ccnet.com/~suntzu75/news_archives/pc970001.htm — Op

______  My advice for any Jewish fly fisherman is to that a Swastika Acres resident fly fishing and make friends.  Do any of the condo’s there look like bunkers? — — George Gehrke http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html   affordable bamboo flyrods & blanks

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______  My advice for any Jewish fly fisherman is to that a Swastika Acres resident fly fishing and make friends.  Do any of the condo’s there look like bunkers? —

        george, you need to clear out.  your posts are beginning to make a soup sandwich look like the rock of gibralter. wayno

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______  My advice for any Jewish fly fisherman is to take a Swastika Acres resident fly fishing and make friends.  Do any of the condo’s there look like bunkers? —         george, you need to clear out.  your posts are beginning to make a soup sandwich look like the rock of gibralter. wayno

Clearing the cache right now Wayne! — — George Gehrke http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html   affordable bamboo flyrods & blanks

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Question:

I need some help finding information on spin fishing in Wyoming (Yellowstone area).  All the books and sites that I visit are for fly fishing.  If anyone has some information on this subject I would appreciate it.

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Don’t be intimidated.  Tiny 1/8 to 1/16 ounce spoons in brass, silver, and copper will take all trout in all rivers (and all but the biggest lakes) in Wyoming.   Check the regulations, however.  Sometimes, when it says "…single hook artificial only…" you think it means fly fishing only.  If tiey mean fly only, they will say so. Try to use bait anywhere, and you will probably be shot, burried, and your car pushed into a canyon. Fishing in the park isn’t much good, and the crowds are horrible.  Try the Shoshone River just west of Cody, or the Green, north of Pinedale.  Few tourists fish either place. good luck oz

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I lived in West Yellowstone( west enterance to Yellowstone. There are several rivers west of the park that are great for spin fishing. Also there is a lake naned Quake lake that has BIG trout. Henry’s lake is also great.  There are lots of beaver ponds. the choises are there.

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View Wyoming’s new lure for trout at http://www.fishcatchwy.qpg.com

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Question:

I have a question on how you guys react when someone sees you walking along with a flyrod and with that nasty grin on their face they ask "Catch anything?"

"really hammered ‘em"  covers all situations.  (keep walking) Schuhfly

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John – How timely to see your post. Late yesterday afternoon (around 4:30) I ventured out to a local municiple lake.  I have learned to prepare myself for the stares I get when I take my rod out of the tube.  Heck, most of the guys around here have never seen a rod tube except in a Cabela’s catalog. Anyway, the area I usually fish had a few baitcasters chunking plastic worms and being the social type, I climbed right in with them. They ususally give me plenty of clearance when they see my backcast. Anyway, the worm chunkers were bombing a grassline and turning up nothing.  I gave them there space and when they moved down the shoreline a bit, I came in behind them with a black #12 wooly worm and picked up the little 2 and 3 lb bass they left behind.  The looks on their faces were priceless. So you see, even us – no catching wiggle rodders – have our day in the sun. Tight lines. Gary

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Howdy Rowdies, I have a question on how you guys react when someone sees you walking along with a flyrod and with that nasty grin on their face they ask "Catch anything?"  Now what I’d like to say is yea, I had a great day, the sky was blue, the birds were singing, I cast to a few trout, one took my fly, we had a great fight, and I gently released him back to his stream to fight another day. However, you know what they are thinking is "Ha you loser…you got skunked…can’t catch fish at all…ha ha ha". What do you guys do about this situation?  Should I lie and always say "Yea, I stacked ‘em like cordwood", or should I try and explain to these bait slinging fish killers how I feel? -John —

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What do you guys do about this situation?  

On those occasions when I don’t want to stop & chat, standard response, "Oh yeah, one er two". It’s not impolite, gives no additional information and is said in a way that invites no further conversation. should I try and explain to these bait slinging fish killers how I feel?

Given your pretentious predilections, I would advise against it. — Ken Fortenberry

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What do you guys do about this situation?  

If I have had a great day, I like to park my butt in a hole within eyesight of the bastards and pound fish like crazy, careful of course to emphasize the catch and release aspect.  Even better is catching a fish right under their nose or out of the back pocket of their waders. If I have had a poor day, a simple, "What a day!" followed by a grin leaves em guessing and keeps the honesty in check. Of course if I got skunked and the bait huckers are pulling fish out like crazy I find that a large rock hurled from the trail into their hole helps ease my frustrations.  I must mention that this form of therapy is saved for the times when the Jeep is in sight and I have a big head start.   Mike Wilson Fishing!! What else is there?

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Howdy Rowdies, I have a question on how you guys react when someone sees you walking along with a flyrod and with that nasty grin on their face they ask "Catch anything?"

I usually reply to all and sundry with a ambiguous "…not much" and leave it at that. Majority of times it’s true – when it’s not I don’t want to advertise. I don’t care if someone else thinks I’m an idiot. Ralph H – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – —

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What do you guys do about this situation

My standard reply is: "Got a couple on midges" George Adams

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ROFL! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My standard reply is: "Got a couple on midges" George Adams

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The idea of a fisherman telling the truth when asked about his fishing should not be considered.

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Tell them you got a couple on worms and watch the look on their faces.

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situation?  Should I lie and always say "Yea, I stacked ‘em like cordwood", or should I try and explain to these bait slinging fish killers how I feel? -John — Of course if I got skunked and the bait huckers are pulling fish out like

crazy I find that a large rock hurled from the trail into their hole helps ease my frustrations.  I must mention that this form of therapy is saved for the times when the Jeep is in sight and I have a big head start. Mike Wilson Geez, I’d reply to these trolls, but I feel like I’d be stepping on T-Bone’s toes.             Jim

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Tell them you got a couple on worms and watch the look on their faces.

Quizzical, confused, look comes over my face. …wrigglers or baby nighties ? — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

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Howdy Rowdies, I have a question on how you guys react when someone sees you walking along with a flyrod and with that nasty grin on their face they ask "Catch anything?" However, you know what they are thinking is "Ha you loser…you got skunked…can’t catch fish at all…ha ha ha".

I’m not sure if bait chuckers think that way in my neck of the woods. Most of the time they see flyfishers catching more fish than they do. You also see a lot of spin fishers use a water bubble and fly on lakes here. A number of times they have sheepishly asked if it was hard to learn to fly fish. THEN- you lay it on them. Big Al

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red wigglers, baby nighties, or, most likely, San Juan. aaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrggggggghhhhhhh.

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[deleted] What do you guys do about this situation?  Should I lie and always say "Yea, I stacked ‘em like cordwood", or should I try and explain to these bait slinging fish killers how I feel?

[deleted] Is there any doubt that guilt replaced the creel ? — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

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Howdy Rowdies, I have a question on how you guys react when someone sees you walking along with a flyrod and with that nasty grin on their face they ask "Catch anything?"

    I think if the flyrod is accompanied with nice looking neoprenes and a vest with pockets buldging and gadgets dangling you’ll tend to get this greeting.  My appearence on stream far from suggests the stereotypical "fly fisherman".  The only give away is the rod.  I always have it rigged in the car before I leave the driveway.  I guess I just tend to blend in.  That is until I start fishing. Of course, I can’t remember the last time I didn’t fish circles around everyone in sight. Sorry, couldn’t help myself, but it’s true!! JE

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Howdy Rowdies, I have a question on how you guys react when someone sees you walking along with a flyrod and with that nasty grin on their face they ask "Catch anything?"  Now what I’d like to say is yea, I had a great day, the sky was blue, the birds were singing, I cast to a few trout, one took my fly, we had a great fight, and I gently released him back to his stream to fight another day. However, you know what they are thinking is "Ha you loser…you got skunked…can’t catch fish at all…ha ha ha". What do you guys do about this situation?  Should I lie and always say "Yea, I stacked ‘em like cordwood", or should I try and explain to these bait slinging fish killers how I feel? -John —

Simple, I beat them to the punch and ask them first. Peter Email address hacked. Remove -delete-this- to email a reply.

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Of course, I can’t remember the last time I didn’t fish circles around everyone in sight. Sorry, couldn’t help myself, but it’s true!!

Speaking of which…how did the smoked whitefish turn out ? — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

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Speaking of which…how did the smoked whitefish turn out ?

    Not quite as good as the trout I brought up, but still darn good.  I wonder if it was the wood.  I used apple on the whitefish and hickory on the trout.  Either way, I need another load! JE – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Howdy Rowdies, I have a question on how you guys react when someone sees you walking along with a flyrod and with that nasty grin on their face they ask "Catch anything?"  Now what I’d like to say is yea, I had a great day, the sky was blue, the birds were singing, I cast to a few trout, one took my fly, we had a great fight, and I gently released him back to his stream to fight another day. However, you know what they are thinking is "Ha you loser…you got skunked…can’t catch fish at all…ha ha ha". What do you guys do about this situation?  Should I lie and always say "Yea, I stacked ‘em like cordwood", or should I try and explain to these bait slinging fish killers how I feel? -John —

Hi John, This is a great subject. I know what you are talking about. I guess you could tell them that you don’t keep the fish because they are full of chemicals? You could say that you are allergic to fish? You could say that you freezer is full? You could tell them that this stretch is catch and release? You could say that you had to let the big ones go because you have a bad back? You could say that you were getting tired of catching so many fish with bait, that you decided to try fly fishing? You could say that you were just shooting a Toyota commercial? You could say that you were just practicing casting? You could say that you are actually an undercover game warden? You could say I had a great day, the sky was blue, the birds were singing, I cast to a few trout, one took myfly, we had a great fight, and I gently released him back to his stream to fight another day. Thanks. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop www.kiene.com

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My standard answer to this question is always: "Yup" "47" e

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Howdy Rowdies, I have a question on how you guys react when someone sees you walking along with a flyrod and with that nasty grin on their face they ask "Catch anything?" -John

Maybe its a regional thing, but I’m more often asked, "Any luck?" My standard answer if I’ve been skunked is, "Well, I didn’t fall in." If not, "Yeah, I did OK." For another fly fisherman, I usually tell ‘em everything. Joe

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—–BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE—– While in non-compliance with local decency ordinances the world over, I guess you could tell them that you don’t keep the fish because they are full of chemicals?

That’s very depressing when it’s true. I like to fish the Kansas River as much as anyone, but the fish are unfit to eat to the extent that there are any eating fish anyway. A century ago, there was a significant commercial fishery for Blue and Flathead catfish on the Kaw, and fish weighing more than 80 pounds actually were caught on a semi-regular basis. Now, there’s a fat lot of nothing aside from cyprinids, a few small sturgeons, and some unhealthy-looking striped bass. You could say that you are actually an undercover game warden?

Bad news. In most US states, the wardens are peace officers. It’s illegal to claim to be one if you’re not. OTOH, if you are…:-) —–BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE—– Version: 2.6.2 iQEVAwUBNt8/h5diUzdLFqlpAQGBrgf/RzbTAlaM74FFvMIO9exqnq3U5pgVDFMk Q0Ufdy4Grf373dWTDbrhwzxfmdLsaxUJYeSQuQACZ/TKxjqUVpP9qBYjhKtIA9Nd Lg/pXpdle1/eR3uJ3fpVXqL7fk9HCisA9Q/7Y9XQiCOCfqvxAjk9gWmsEHNM2wrY TbB9VeQ+8aMa81+8qUJig/1kNPJvyUjdbRwQcE2GzBnSqgX8llm/HXsA31qf4JJo mEH7/AKrrh5JyDkf83AndiaASynBHMGPcTA0SMu/8xSjf1i8K/ZB3HucCkNVG7PG 8rU02rpJttF+hajJMkUgXw97/ASpoaXAljo1×7kd6wHbIL7X5a4OeA== =Manp —–END PGP SIGNATURE—– Mike S. Medintz, http://www.grapevine.net/~medintz Some people say that fishing is better than sex. That proves that they ain’t doing either one right. -Mike S. Medintz, 1998

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Question:

I very much doubt you could break an 8lb tippet with a 5wt rod without either seriously damaging the rod or pointing the rod straight at the fish. The secret of all fishing is to use balanced tackle, that way you can use your tackle to it’s maximum without running the risk of damaging it. — Regards Peter Kay (Remove "nospam" to email)  :The guy is full of unmitigated bull hooie.  The tippet is the defining :element.  If you can break the tippet with the rod, and the tippet is

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How tightly do you set your drag?  If you point your rod tip towards the fish and set the drag higher than when fishing with a 4 lb tippet then sure you will definitely apply more pressure.  Your drag setting and how you hold the rod while fighting fish will determine the answer to your question.  My guess is that you’ve got the drag setting at less than 4 lbs (would you dare jiggle a 1/2 gallon carton of milk from the end of your 6 wt rod?).  So the guy at the shop is probably right.

Sorry Mu, You’re wrong, and so is the guy in the shop. Drag has nothing to do with it, the breaking strength of the tippet and how much pressure you can put to the fish as a result of that breaking strength is the question here The size of the rod only matters in regards to the weight of the line when casting and in your desire to keep that rod intact when playing a fish. If you are using 4 lb. tippet on an 8 wt. rod there is no way you can apply as much pressure on the fish than you can with an equivalent length rod in 6 wt. and 8 lb. tippet. The only reason that it would be better for the fish to use a 4 lb. tippet is that the fish will probably break off sooner and recover faster. Any steelhead worth half his salt would destroy a 4 lb. tippet in seconds. If the angler was very skilled he would be able to baby that fish in eventually, but at what price? The fish will be mortally exhausted from a half hour struggle to the beach. Chances of recovery of this fish is poor. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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I thought a conundrum was what you wore for safe sex!!

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<< I thought a conundrum was what you wore for safe sex!! Nope, that’s a carborundrum.  A conundrum is is a kind of Arabian boss.

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You are thinking of a condominium. — Ernie Harrison Remove NOSPAM to send E-mail GO TO http://users.ccnet.com/~emh FOR TRAVEL TIE BOX PLANS – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I thought a conundrum was what you wore for safe sex!!

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  The rod wt does make a difference. If you are fighting a 2lb trout with say 6x tippet you are more likely to land the fish with a 4wt rod then a 6wt rod. The 4wt is more giving at any given drag setting and will absorb the shock of the fishes fight. The more severe the struggle the more a lighter rod helps. I’ve seen newby fishermen (or bass fishermen new to flyfishing) loose lots of fish with a 6wt rod. I give them my 4 wt and they land the fish. So the shock absorption is for both ends of the rod (fish and fisherman’s action.)  So you have to set the drag down for a stiffer rod given the same fish and tippet. Few fish are lost just due to a slow steady pull of a fish where the drag setting only is the consideration, but rather to a fish jerking the line and adding to the pull. I guess said in another way a 2 lb weight is less likely to break a tippet then a 2 lb fish since one is a dynamic force that exceeds a 2lb pull. Sorry Mu, You’re wrong, and so is the guy in the shop. Drag has nothing to do with it, the breaking strength of the tippet and how much pressure you can put to the fish as a result of that breaking strength is the question here The size of the rod only matters in regards to the weight of the line when casting and in your desire to keep that rod intact when playing a fish. If you are using 4 lb. tippet on an 8 wt. rod there is no way you can apply as much pressure on the fish than you can with an equivalent length rod in 6 wt. and 8 lb. tippet. The only reason that it would be better for the fish to use a 4 lb. tippet is that the fish will probably break off sooner and recover faster. Any steelhead worth half his salt would destroy a 4 lb. tippet in seconds. If the angler was very skilled he would be able to baby that fish in eventually, but at what price? The fish will be mortally exhausted from a half hour struggle to the beach. Chances of recovery of this fish is poor.

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I think anyone who actually believes that an 8-weight rod can’t put more pressure on a fish than a 6-weight rod has never caught fish big enough to show them the difference. Take the two rods out striper fishing this spring with a ten-pound tippet on each and you’ll be immediately enlightened.   I can’t believe this thread has gone on so long. Bob Scott

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To some extent it doesn’t matter, although it depends how good a fisherman you are. The best way to put max pressure on a fish is to point the rod directly at the fish; but then it doesn’t matter what the rod weight is! To put the least pressure on a fish, you hold the rod vertical, at which angle a 15 foot 10 weight only puts about two pound pull on a fish. You can demonstrate this with a spring balance, although this will give a higher reading than expected – remember that the fish can’t exactly dig its heels in. Any angle below 45 degrees begins to put a fish under pressure, and the stiffness of the rod and the efficiency of the reel drag will begin to count. However, if the fish is a long way out, and a deal of line is drowned, then other factors are in play which alter your ability to exert pressure. I have seen a guide stop a bonefish in its tracks using an eight pound tippet simply by pointing the rod directly at the fish. I have seen the same done with a chinook. Mind, it is dull compared to playing them… Andrew Andrew N. Herd Associate Editor, Waterlog Magazine http://www.demon.co.uk/medlarpress/ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, I have a question for all of you. I was in the local flyshop and was chastized for using a six weight for steelhed. I was told thet I shold be using at least an 8 wt, the reason being that you can put more pressure on the fish. My question is this, if I use a 6wt with 8lb tippet and this other guy uses an 8wt with 4 lb tippet, who puts on more pressure? I said me, becauseI have a stronger tippet that I can really put the coals on with. He said no, he could apply more pressure because of the heavier rod. This make absolutly no sense to me. Casting, flies, wind considerations aside, is the above statment on his part true? Andrew

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pressure on a fish than a 6-weight rod has never caught fish big enough to show them the difference.

is a 20 pound sleelhead big enough? or how about a thirty pound plus chinook? Take the two rods out striper fishing this spring with a ten-pound tippet on each and you’ll be immediately enlightened.

Ten pound tippet is ten pounds breaking strength, with a 6 or an 8 it is still ten pounds. If I put enough pressure on a tippet to break the tippet that is ten pounds, be it with a six or eight that is irrelevant. The big difference is that it is easier to cast the big flies a longer distance. I can’t believe this thread has gone on so long.

That’s an invitation to a flame war Bob Scott

Andrew McFarland

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The way that I look at this is that, like Andrew said, ten puonds is ten pounds. One could land a 1500 pound marlin on a 4 wt (heavy leader, naturally) if he had around 2000 yards of backing. Any fish can be landed on any wieght. Just with one rod, the fish might be exhausted and another rod would make the fight last 15 seconds. A six weight is fine. Bryce

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  I think anyone who actually believes that an 8-weight rod can’t put more   pressure on a fish than a 6-weight rod has never caught fish big enough to   show them the difference.   <SNIP   Bob Scott

YES!  And why the hell one would confuse the issue by forcing the stronger rod to have lighter tippet is beyond me.  Apples to apples.   8wt is stiffer than 6wt.  8wt allows the possibility of putting more pressure on a fish than 6wt.  It is that simple. -tgades — Tony Gades. Seattle, WA.  USA http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades/Fishing/fish_page.html email: replace the "this_address_is_wrong" with "tgades"

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Ten pound tippet is ten pounds breaking strength, with a 6 or an 8 it is still ten pounds. If I put enough pressure on a tippet to break the tippet that is ten pounds, be it with a six or eight that is irrelevant. I can’t believe this thread has gone on so long. That’s an invitation to a flame war Andrew McFarland

Not an invitation to a flame war at all.   Here’s the deal: naturally, the tippet strength is the limiting factor of the TOTAL AMOUNT of pressure you can put on the fish, regardless of rod weight rating.  But it’s not that simple.   The rod is applying pressure to the fish anytime it is flexed against him, whether the fish is moving away or not.  The pressure varies with the amount of flex put in the rod, angle the rod is held, etc.  This pressure comes from the rod’s desire to maintain its original, straight shape.  Since it takes more pressure to bend a similar-length 8-weight rod than a 6-weight rod, to the same arc, the heavier rod exerts more pressure on the fish as it tries to straighten… even when the fish isn’t moving, and regardless of the tippet strength or drag setting.  Follow me?     You’ve got to try it for yourself.   Like I said, take the two sized rods, set the drags the same with a scale, and fight a few big fish.  The heavier rod will whip them quicker.   The relentless pull of a flexed rod really tires the fish.  When the fish runs, the drag pressure dogs him.  But when he’s not running away, the pressure of the rod trying to straighten is what is pulling on him.  A heavier rod pulls harder. Bob Scott

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I think anyone who actually believes that an 8-weight rod can’t put more pressure on a fish than a 6-weight rod has never caught fish big enough to show them the difference. Take the two rods out striper fishing this spring with a ten-pound tippet on each and you’ll be immediately enlightened.   I can’t believe this thread has gone on so long. Bob Scott    This is sooo true. The fish has to work much harder against an     8 wt rod.   –tony

You all want to pass some of that stuff yer smokin’?  I’ve caught plenty of fish in the size range to be able to tell the difference – Silvers, steelhead, chums.  My six weight Sage can break a fish off on undamaged climax 2x tippet (about 10lb test), if held right on a strong enough fish. My 8 wgt can break heavier tippet, so what.  With 2x tippet, it simply cannot pull harder than the six weight, since both are capable of breaking the line.   This is explained by an obscure branch of science known as physics.   What you all are saying is the equivalent of saying that a pickup can tow more than a bicycle, even though they are both connected to the trailer by 8 lb test.  Replace the connection with a log chain, and you’re correct.  However, log chain is fairly poor in it’s energy transference to the fly.  Tough to tie a clinch knot, as well. In the range of tippets that the fellow is talking about, with the rods he is talking about,  the six weight is fine for steelhead. I had ample opportunity to experiment in this area two years ago when I broke my 8 weight on a salmon, and had to finish the trip catching salmon with the six weight.  After the trip, came back and was fishing sea run cutts.  Hooked a big one, and still had the Alaska strike instinct (rear back hard, pull hard with the line hand).  Popped the fly in one of the biggest cutthroats I’ve ever seen, who entertained me and my buddy with three jumps down stream, fly still in his jaw. 3x tippet, good knots, 6 wgt.  I know whereof I speak… — Andrew Brunette

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The 6wt rod I am referring to is a Sage 690 sp+ that is a  stiff rod, I can put LOTS of pressure on a fish. I have yet to meet a steelie that the rod couldn’t handle, I keep a short line and fight the fish using angles. In other words, I keep the rod in opposite to the direction of movement of the fish, to the side. I find that after watching the other guys up here use their 8wts for steelies they don’t put anywhere near the amount of pressure that I do. they mostly use 6lb tippet, some times going down to 4lb, I never use anything less than 8lb. If that prevents me from catching fish so be it, but if it makes the difference between me catching fish and then over playing them then I will not do that. I have out fished guys using 8wts with 4 lb and even float fishermen. I feel that I can put the coals on just as much with those guys. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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 My six weight Sage can break a fish off on undamaged climax 2x tippet (about 10lb test), if held right on a strong enough fish. My 8 wgt can break heavier tippet, so what.  With 2x tippet, it simply cannot pull harder than the six weight, since both are capable of breaking the line.   This is explained by an obscure branch of science known as physics.

…that you obviously have no grasp of. You didn’t read or comprehend my post. And, by the way,  my two-weight can break an undamaged 10lb. tippet, too, if "held right."   You are not breaking that tippet with rod pressure. If your six weight can lift ten pounds, I’ll eat my eight and nine weight rods.  Like the other guy said, go ahead and put a ten-pound weight on the floor, put some heavy tippet on your miracle six-weight, get out your warranty card, and try to lift it up.  I know you won’t try it.   An eight-weight will lift more weight (still not ten pounds!) — apply more pressure — than a six-weight.  Period. Why do you think people use 12-weights to fight big tarpon?  Because they need a 12-weight to cast a lightly-dressed 3/0 fly?   Not. Dan Gracia, why don’t you jump in on this one?  You have a great way of explaining things. Bob Scott

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If your six weight can lift ten pounds, I’ll eat my eight and nine weight rods.  Like the other guy said, go ahead and put a ten-pound weight on the floor, put some heavy tippet on your miracle six-weight, get out your warranty card, and try to lift it up.  I know you won’t try it.   An eight-weight will lift more weight (still not ten pounds!) — apply more pressure — than a six-weight.  Period. Why do you think people use 12-weights to fight big tarpon?  Because they need a 12-weight to cast a lightly-dressed 3/0 fly?   Not.

I think you have all forgotten the original "conondrum" , whether a 6 wt with 8 lb test can apply  an equal amt of pressure as 8wt with 4lb tippet. to compare these two factors we apply logic and search for least common denominator between the two. For our purposes we will settle on the 4lb tippet. While on an equal basis, an 8wt rod will be able to apply more pressure than a 6wt, in this situation, the most amt of pressure the 8wt rod will be able to apply is 4lbs before the leader breaks. Likewise, the 6wt rod with 4lb leader will max out at 4lbs of pressure before the leader breaks.( hopefully we can all agree that a 6wt is capable of breaking 4lb tippet even though it may not be capable of breaking anything higher.) Since the 8wt is limited to 4 lb test, the real question becomes whether or not a 6 wt can apply more than 4lbs of pressure given the chance by using a stronger tippet, say 8lbs. whether it can or not doesn’t matter. the "conondrum" has been answered. Both rods will be able to apply at least 4 lbs of pressure, so in this exact situation, it doesn’t make a difference which setup you use, as both will be able to apply at least the same amt of pressure, so using a 6wt doesn’t put you at any diadvantage compared to the 8wt. Unaccounted factors: 1)No one ever uses their full tippet breaking strength. Applying 4 lbs of pressure to a 4 lb tippet is inviting disaster. 2lbs would be more like it, but we won’t take this into consideration as it will bring up more "conundrums". 2) Whether you can lift a weight with your rod is not a realistic comparison of breaking strength.it doesn’t take into account the speed of the pressure application and water tension which equally apply in real situations.                    

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I was in the local flyshop and was chastized for using a six weight for steelhed. I was told thet I shold be using at least an 8 wt, the reason being that you can put more pressure on the fish. My question is this, if I use a 6wt with 8lb tippet and this other guy uses an 8wt with 4 lb tippet, who puts on more pressure?

The 6wt with 8lb tippet can put on more pressure. Ligther, more flexable rods protect tippets better. A lighter rod will flex more in the butt but you can still put pressure on the fish. The only reason people say you can’t put pressure on is fear of breaking the rod so size of fish is the question. How big are the steelhead you’re after? If they’re in the 4-10lb range then use the 6wt. If they are in the 15-20lb range, use an 8-9wt. The person using a stiffer, heavier rod with light tippet is putting more risk on the fish. Cheers, Jack

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a question for all of you. I was in the local flyshop and was chastised for using a six weight for steelhed. I was told that I should be using at least an 8 wt, the reason being that you can put more pressure on the fish. My question is this, if I use a 6wt with 8lb tippet and this other guy uses an 8wt with 4 lb tippet, who puts on more pressure? I said me, because have a stronger tippet that I can really put the coals on with. He said no, he could apply more pressure because of the heavier rod. This make absolutely no sense to me. Casting, flies, wind considerations aside, is the above statement on his part true?

Andrew, Another point is this discussion is that anyone who would chastise another as to one’s method of fishing, bothers me. Fred Halford and others includes…. As long as it is legal, reasonably sporting, and respects property rights and the rights of others near you, you ought to be able to fish with what works for you……  With a steady pull, one cannot exert 8 pounds of pressure on a tippet with a 9 foot rod….  So I think the way you apply pressure and way you avoid letting the fish rest between runs and pulls has a lot to do with how quickly one can land a fish… For example a fish hooked in the upper lip can be made to raise its head while fighting a very quickly tired…. as compared to one hooked in the rear lower edge of the mandible.  If you have ever accidently hooked a fish in tail, you will know the outter limit of this difference…  Keeping the fish upstream of you will also result in a quicker finish…..  And in very clear water, that is not too fast, and not too deep, and 8 pound tippet may provide many fewer hook-ups…  Lots of side to this issue…. but for someone to say….. only fish the way I advocate…. well, I would chalk that up and move on.. Alan E. Hoover       to quote one of my favorite authors: "Fly fishing is such great fun, it really ought to be done in bed"  John Voelker, aka Robert Traver

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, I have a question for all of you. I was in the local flyshop and was chastized for using a six weight for steelhed. I was told thet I shold be using at least an 8 wt, the reason being that you can put more pressure on the fish. My question is this, if I use a 6wt with 8lb tippet and this other guy uses an 8wt with 4 lb tippet, who puts on more pressure? I said me, becauseI have a stronger tippet that I can really put the coals on with. He said no, he could apply more pressure because of the heavier rod. This make absolutly no sense to me.

The guy is full of unmitigated bull hooie.  The tippet is the defining element.  If you can break the tippet with the rod, and the tippet is strong enough to be appropriate for the fish, the rod is fine.  And 3x tippet, from a reputable manufacturer, is strong enough for the average steelhead.  If you were expecting to catch 20 lb fish all day, I might sing a different story, but the 8 to 12 lb fish I run into can be brought to the beach in 5 minutes with 8lb test leader, and that seems to let them swim away safely.   I have caught 15 lb steelhead with my six weight, using 3x (=8lb) tippet, and been able to whip the steelhead quickly.  I use 8lb leader for gear fishing with a meat stick, with the same, sporting, results.   I think the average fisherman does not realize how much pressure can be put on a fish with today’s tippet material.   — Andrew Brunette

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How tightly do you set your drag?  If you point your rod tip towards the fish and set the drag higher than when fishing with a 4 lb tippet then sure you will definitely apply more pressure.  Your drag setting and how you hold the rod while fighting fish will determine the answer to your question.  My guess is that you’ve got the drag setting at less than 4 lbs (would you dare jiggle a 1/2 gallon carton of milk from the end of your 6 wt rod?).  So the guy at the shop is probably right.  Mu Young Lee         Ann Arbor, MI  o             oooo                          o   o   o o   o o o  o – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, I have a question for all of you. I was in the local flyshop and was chastized for using a six weight for steelhed. I was told thet I shold be using at least an 8 wt, the reason being that you can put more pressure on the fish. My question is this, if I use a 6wt with 8lb tippet and this other guy uses an 8wt with 4 lb tippet, who puts on more pressure? I said me, becauseI have a stronger tippet that I can really put the coals on with. He said no, he could apply more pressure because of the heavier rod. This make absolutly no sense to me. Casting, flies, wind considerations aside, is the above statment on his part true? Andrew

Response:

Hi All, I have a question for all of you. I was in the local flyshop and was chastised for using a six weight for steelhed. I was told that I should be using at least an 8 wt, the reason being that you can put more pressure on the fish. My question is this, if I use a 6wt with 8lb tippet and this other guy uses an 8wt with 4 lb tippet, who puts on more pressure? I said me, because have a stronger tippet that I can really put the coals on with. He said no, he could apply more pressure because of the heavier rod. This make absolutely no sense to me. Casting, flies, wind considerations aside, is the above statement on his part true? Andrew

Response:

Hi All, I have a question for all of you. I was in the local flyshop and was chastized for using a six weight for steelhed. I was told thet I shold be using at least an 8 wt, the reason being that you can put more pressure on the fish. My question is this, if I use a 6wt with 8lb tippet and this other guy uses an 8wt with 4 lb tippet, who puts on more pressure? I said me, becauseI have a stronger tippet that I can really put the coals on with. He said no, he could apply more pressure because of the heavier rod. This make absolutly no sense to me. Casting, flies, wind considerations aside, is the above statment on his part true? Andrew

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a question for all of you. I was in the local flyshop and was chastised for using a six weight for steelhed. I was told that I should be using at least an 8 wt, the reason being that you can put more pressure on the fish. My question is this, if I use a 6wt with 8lb tippet and this other guy uses an 8wt with 4 lb tippet, who puts on more pressure? I said me, because have a stronger tippet that I can really put the coals on with. He said no, he could apply more pressure because of the heavier rod. This make absolutely no sense to me. Casting, flies, wind considerations aside, is the above statement on his part true?

Hi Andrew, Like many answers, this one is "it all depends".   Obvoiusly 4 pound test line (presuming it is rated accurately) will break before 8 lb test.  But the question is, "how much of that 8lb. test capacity are you really using?" The answer is "not nearly as much as you think your are." If you hook up your 6 wt. to a Chatillon scale and start bending the heck out of it, you will find it very hard to exert more than 5 lbs. of steady pressure (don’t break your rod trying to get that little bit more!).  Quick jerks will exceed it but not steady pressure which is what you’re using when you’re fighting fish.  An 8 wt. rod is much more capable of exerting that amount of steady pressure, though 8lbs of steady pressure will bend most 8 wt rods well into the butt.  If you both used 8 lb. tippet then I’d say the 8wt. would be able to apply more of the tippet’s capacity more consistently than the 6wt. So, depending on how you fight the fish, the 8wt. would certainly be more capable of applying constant pressure at 4 lbs. than the 6 wt.  An 8wt will however break 4lb. test pretty consistently so it requires a very good touch. If the comparison had been a 6wt. with 8lb. test vs an 8wt. with 6 lb. test, then I’d say the 8 wt would do the better job because it would be able to constantly use more of the tippets capacity than the 6wt. By changing the rod angle, you can change the amount of pressure on the fish. if you keep your rod tip up and the butt of the rod between 45 and 60 degrees, you get a maximum amount of shock absorption and comparatively little pressure on the fish. However, if you wind or strip in line until your rod angle is more like 30 degrees, anchor the line against the handle or reel, and then pull up and off to the side, you exert easily two to three times as much pressure.  You are takin the tip of the rod out of the fight by doing this and using the butt of the rod to supply the lifting power. This is a good technique to use once you’ve got a fish beaten.  It can break you off quickly if the fish is too fresh. Try this with a friend sometime.  One hold the rod and the other hold the end of the line.  Pull with both methods.  The one bending the rod will think he is exerting huge amounts of pressure when he is not.  As soon as the rod tip drops and then pulls, the difference is obvious.                    Hope this helps,                            Dan Dan Gracia Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools Mt. Shasta Fly Fishing Schools http://www.thegrid.net/flyfish

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You might want to contact the real experts at a place called G. Loomis.   They have the tech. knowledge to give you the facts. try http://www.gloomis.com  Regards,  Capt. Jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, I have a question for all of you. I was in the local flyshop and was chastized for using a six weight for steelhed. I was told thet I shold be using at least an 8 wt, the reason being that you can put more pressure on the fish. My question is this, if I use a 6wt with 8lb tippet and this other guy uses an 8wt with 4 lb tippet, who puts on more pressure? I said me, becauseI have a stronger tippet that I can really put the coals on with. He said no, he could apply more pressure because of the heavier rod. This make absolutly no sense to me. Casting, flies, wind considerations aside, is the above statment on his part true? Andrew

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, I have a question for all of you. I was in the local flyshop and was chastised for using a six weight for steelhed. I was told that I should be using at least an 8 wt, the reason being that you can put more pressure on the fish. My question is this, if I use a 6wt with 8lb tippet and this other guy uses an 8wt with 4 lb tippet, who puts on more pressure? I said me, because have a stronger tippet that I can really put the coals on with. He said no, he could apply more pressure because of the heavier rod. This make absolutely no sense to me. Casting, flies, wind considerations aside, is the above statement on his part true? Andrew

I agree with you with your specific example, I think you can put more pressure on a fish with a 6 wgt using an 8 lb tippet than you could with an 8 wgt using a 4 lb tippet.  However, with a 6 or 8 weight rod both using for example an eight pound tippet, you could put more pressure on a fish with an 8 weight as a rule.  Rod lengthn also figures in on this.  You can put more pressure on a fish with a longer rod in the same line class.  Action also plays into this.  A fast rod can provide more pressure, but a softer rod is more forgiving and break offs are less likely.  Obviously an angler’s skill is another factor. I think you use what works well for you just as long as the fish you catch (assuming you are releasing them) are landed in a short enough time that the fish will survive releasing.  If you follow the reasoning of the guy in the shop, a 10 weight would be better, a 12 better still.  Bet he doesn’t fish a 12. Willi

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Question:

In rec.outdoors.fishing.fly Yeah Mark, In a recent "Fly Fisherman" there was an article on Conejos. I’m not sure which month though as I can’t find it now. Anyway, look around. It was very recent.

Great  I guess I can kiss one of my favorite secrets goodbye. I’ve fished the Conejos since I was a little tike with my grandfather.

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Can anyone tell me about from recent experience? Thanks, Mark Wiebelhaus Yeah Mark, In a recent "Fly Fisherman" there was an article on Conejos. I’m not sure which month though as I can’t find it now. Anyway, look around. It was very recent. Cliff

July Issue

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – In rec.outdoors.fishing.fly Yeah Mark, In a recent "Fly Fisherman" there was an article on Conejos. I’m not sure which month though as I can’t find it now. Anyway, look around. It was very recent. Great  I guess I can kiss one of my favorite secrets goodbye. I’ve fished the Conejos since I was a little tike with my grandfather. It’s not that bad.  The Conejos has lots of fishable water, and there are better fishing spots in the higher streams, anyway.  I doubt that people will flock to Conejos County anyway, as it is not on the way to anywhere, and pretty far from a major metropolitan area.

Like the  uh, San Juan ? or the uh, Green ? or the uh, North Platte ? or the uh, Bighorn ? I think your favorite secret is safe for the time being.

No it’s not. It is under attack. TimW

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Sure.  I did it last month and had a blast! You can read a more extended description at the following URL:

I enjoyed reading your story.  We used to stay at Magote Meadows too. Grandpa had a travel trailer and we stayed in the RV park there.  My grandfather fished that river every summer from the early 70s until he died 2 years ago, and he was preparing to go back even then.  I have some of the best memories of my life up there. Bruce Wedding

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Mark: for the latest fishing conditions on the Conejos check www.thereellife.com/reellife/ Manuel Monasterio The Reel Life

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Can anyone tell me about from recent experience?                                 Thanks, Mark Wiebelhaus

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Can anyone tell me about from recent experience?                             Thanks, Mark Wiebelhaus

Yeah Mark, In a recent "Fly Fisherman" there was an article on Conejos. I’m not sure which month though as I can’t find it now. Anyway, look around. It was very recent. Cliff

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Question:

Anyone have any info on how the fishing has been on the St. Mary’s Rapids in Sault Ste. Marie  as of late ?  Never been there before – any advice ?

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Anyone have any info on how the fishing has been on the St. Mary’s

Rapids in Sault Ste. Marie as of late ?  Never been there before – any advice ? See the Linsenman/Nevala book Great Lakes Steelhead: a Guided Tour for Fly Anglers (Backcountry Pubs. 1995) which suggests SSM trout are practically a year-round fishery and mentions a local guide, Karl Vogel IIRR. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

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Question:

I am looking for info on the splayed hair tying method on a comparadun. I have an idea of how it’s done but I’m not quite getting the right effect. Thanks ahead of time. Patrick

One of the keys of getting the the "splayed" hair of the comparadun wing is to to make sure that you begin tying the hair in at about mid-shank with loose wraps,then move toward the front with wraps that are progressivly tighter until the wings flare to about 180 degrees.  After trimming the butts make several wraps in front of the wing to strengthen the base. A great reference is "Tying Flies with Jack Dennis and Friends". Good Luck Rob Warren

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I am looking for info on the splayed hair tying method on a comparadun. I have an idea of how it’s done but I’m not quite getting the right effect. Thanks ahead of time. Patrick

In other responses I haven’t seen what myself and friends in the midwest and out west believe to be one of the most important aspects of this neat little fly. When the wing is tied in, hold the tips up with your left hand, and wrap back in front several times to get the wing to stand up straight. Almost over compensate and get that wing up and back slightly. (kinda like you are finishing a head) Don’t rely on dubbing to hold up that wing. You might drop a touch of head cement or 2 on the wind in front of the wing. After it dries, finish dubbing and whip the head. Nothing worse than getting on the stream and pulling out a comparadun or sparkle dun and seeing all the hair leaning forward over the eye. Kevin Williams

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I am looking for info on the splayed hair tying method on a comparadun. I have an idea of how it’s done but I’m not quite getting the right effect. Thanks ahead of time. Patrick

Hi Patrick, I’m not sure who perfected this technique, I’ve met three people who claim it. I share it with you to use as needed. With the wing hair fibers tied on the hook (tips pointed forward), start at the back side of the wing clump. Pull about 1/4 of the wing fibers up straight and take a tight wrap of thread between the small portion you’ve pulled up and the rest the wing clump of hair. Pull up another 1/4 and repeat the process. Keep repeating this process until your thread is hanging in front of the wing fibers. The last step is to wrap several turns of thread directly in front of the wing clump – these last wraps force the last portion of hair fibers to remain standing. An easy way to split the tail fibers is to use a six inch scrap of thread. Slip the scrap thread around the bend of the hook, grab the ends of the thread and pull straight back from the bend. Next pull the thread straight up and thru the tail fibers effectively dividing them in half. Tie the thread to the hook shank and apply dubbing to the hook. The last thing you do after apply the dubbing is to fan the wing fibers so they form almost a 180 degree arc – not a compete 180 but almost. The techniques used here have work well for me over the last 15 years. If my records are accurate I’ve tied about 1500 dozen Compara Duns during that time. Sorry this post got so long. It just got away from me. Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (96 catalog)

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Sorry this post got so long. It just got away from me. Tight Lines Al Beatty

Al, You’re posts are always informative and interesting- let ‘em ramble! Jack Jack Wheeler

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am looking for info on the splayed hair tying method on a comparadun. I have an idea of how it’s done but I’m not quite getting the right effect. Thanks ahead of time. Patrick Hi Patrick, I’m not sure who perfected this technique, I’ve met three people who claim it. I share it with you to use as needed. With the wing hair fibers tied on the hook (tips pointed forward), start at the back side of the wing clump. Pull about 1/4 of the wing fibers up straight and take a tight wrap of thread between the small portion you’ve pulled up and the rest the wing clump of hair. Pull up another 1/4 and repeat the process. Keep repeating this process until your thread is hanging in front of the wing fibers. The last step is to wrap several turns of thread directly in front of the wing clump – these last wraps force the last portion of hair fibers to remain standing. An easy way to split the tail fibers is to use a six inch scrap of thread. Slip the scrap thread around the bend of the hook, grab the ends of the thread and pull straight back from the bend. Next pull the thread straight up and thru the tail fibers effectively dividing them in half. Tie the thread to the hook shank and apply dubbing to the hook. The last thing you do after apply the dubbing is to fan the wing fibers so they form almost a 180 degree arc – not a compete 180 but almost. The techniques used here have work well for me over the last 15 years. If my records are accurate I’ve tied about 1500 dozen Compara Duns during that time. Sorry this post got so long. It just got away from me. Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (96 catalog)Al,

Like your technique. When applying the dubbing at the wing, I force the wing back with my fingers & wrap several turns of dubbing tight against the wing to force it up & back. The effect is to have the wing look concave when view from the rear of the fly. Your tailing technique sounds good, I’m going to try it after I quit this surfing stuff. Leo Rouillard

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An alternative to the hair wing is a wing of poly yarn.  These wings are much easier to tie in and arrange, for me anyway, and they will float forever.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am looking for info on the splayed hair tying method on a comparadun. I have an idea of how it’s done but I’m not quite getting the right effect. Thanks ahead of time. Patrick I tie what many would argue to be a variation of the Comparadun called "Haystack".  The difference seems to be mostly one of finesse. First I dress the hook shank.  Then I tie in the tail.  This is usually a clump of deer hair with the tips evened up in a hair stacker.  Then I trim the butts and advance the thread. Near the middle of the hook I take another larger clump of deer hair.  The tips pointing over the eye of the hook, I pinch the clump down with my left thumb nail on top of the hook.  Then I take one complete wrap of thread around the hair and hook, not too tight to avoid spinning the hair.  I slowly tighten this wrap while taking a second turn, then a third. Now I release nmy thumb a bit and wrap down on the butt ends of this hair, keeping the clump on top of the hook.  When it’ll stay by itself, I trim off the butts in between the wing and the tail.  Now I advance the thread in front of the wing clump. Hold the wing up, and lay down a lot of thread right up against the base of the wing to hold it upright.  When it’s about ready to stand up by itself, fan the wing out, with your fingers.  In the traditional style, the fan should extend about 180 degrees. (Once described as waterline-to-waterline.)  Lay down a few more turns, and work the thread back to the tail.  Now you just dub the body from the tail, around the wing and up to the head.  Finish off with a whip finish and some head cement. Hope this helps: Bob Lundy IWFFC Mississauga, ON http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rlundy/Using good quality coastal deer hair makes a big difference with flies

14 and smaller.

Response:

I am looking for info on the splayed hair tying method on a comparadun. I have an idea of how it’s done but I’m not quite getting the right effect. Thanks ahead of time. Patrick

Response:

I am looking for info on the splayed hair tying method on a comparadun. I have an idea of how it’s done but I’m not quite getting the right

What’s the problem?  You tie on the wing first, and arrange it to suit. When you add dubbed body fore and aft of the wing, those winds lock it in place. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

Response:

I am looking for info on the splayed hair tying method on a comparadun. I have an idea of how it’s done but I’m not quite getting the right effect. Thanks ahead of time. Patrick

I tie what many would argue to be a variation of the Comparadun called "Haystack".  The difference seems to be mostly one of finesse. First I dress the hook shank.  Then I tie in the tail.  This is usually a clump of deer hair with the tips evened up in a hair stacker.  Then I trim the butts and advance the thread.   Near the middle of the hook I take another larger clump of deer hair.  The tips pointing over the eye of the hook, I pinch the clump down with my left thumb nail on top of the hook.  Then I take one complete wrap of thread around the hair and hook, not too tight to avoid spinning the hair.  I slowly tighten this wrap while taking a second turn, then a third.   Now I release nmy thumb a bit and wrap down on the butt ends of this hair, keeping the clump on top of the hook.  When it’ll stay by itself, I trim off the butts in between the wing and the tail.  Now I advance the thread in front of the wing clump. Hold the wing up, and lay down a lot of thread right up against the base of the wing to hold it upright.  When it’s about ready to stand up by itself, fan the wing out, with your fingers.  In the traditional style, the fan should extend about 180 degrees. (Once described as waterline-to-waterline.)  Lay down a few more turns, and work the thread back to the tail.  Now you just dub the body from the tail, around the wing and up to the head.  Finish off with a whip finish and some head cement. Hope this helps: Bob Lundy IWFFC Mississauga, ON http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rlundy/

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Question:

I will be in Estes July 7 and 8 and expect to have some time to wet a line. I’d appreciate any suggestions on streams to try. I fear the Big Thompson is overcrowded and fished out, and in any event I’d prefer smaller streams, especialy as this trip is a break in this Easterner’s   3 week visit to some of Montana’s bigger rivers. Thanks.   Phil Holt

All of the streams in Colorado are running VERY high.  Your best bet would be lake fishing or perhaps higher in Rocky Mountain National Park.  Check with Estes Anglers (I don’t have the phone handy) for any other spots.  It is going to be a disappointing weekend in Colorado, we have more rain last night and today.  Snow closed Trail Ridge Road (south of Estes Park) last night.  Some of the passes I am used to traversing this time of year are still closed due to snow. Bob McDuffee Network Services Manager, WICHE Office:303.541.0299 Fax:303.541.0291

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You’re in for a real treat! I vacationed in Rocky Mountain Nat’l Park last summer and fished some of the smaller streams there with a guide, Todd, from the Estes Angler.   Todd showed me some secluded spots on the Big Thompson (above the lake, where the stream is anything but big) and Glacier Creek.  I also fished on my own on the North Branch of the St. Vrain River.   The fish aren’t real big, but they sure are beautiful — and fun to catch.   In 3 1/2 days of fishing I managed the "grand slam" — rainbow, brown, brook and cutthroat.   The concern this year, of course, is the runoff situation.  It was the opposite last year when the rivers were running low. If you go, take short, light rods with you.  These aren’t big western rivers; they are small mountain streams.  A lot of time you will be fising with nothing but your fly and leader on the water. Have a great trip!

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Ok, you said you like smaller streams… I fished cow creek when I was in Estes this same time last summer. You have to walk about 1 mile from the parking area, the stream is very small (you can jump across it in places), and it is thick with brush along the banks.  That is, until you get to the beaver ponds!.  They are clear, clear, clear and the little brookies in there are spooky but willing. They are small fish (6-8" so I mean small).  But, I used very light tackle and if I did a reasonable job of not making myself too obvious, they rose willingly to dries.  The ponds are not deep, and you can site many fish to cast to. Stealth, delicate casting, and fish! Anyway, if that is the type of fishing you like, check out cow creek.  

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I will be in Estes July 7 and 8 and expect to have some time to wet a line. I’d appreciate any suggestions on streams to try. I fear the Big Thompson is overcrowded and fished out, and in any event I’d prefer smaller streams, especialy as this trip is a break in this Easterner’s   3 week visit to some of Montana’s bigger rivers. Thanks.   Phil Holt

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Question:

: I seem to recall reading that he owned property in Montana where he liked to go : and fish.  I read this some time ago, so I don’t remember the details.  Anyone : else have additional info? Heh – looks like he’ll have lots of time to use it this year — 3798 Woodland Drive     voice: (604) 368-9315 Trail, BC               data:  (604) 368-9341

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Did anyone catch Coach Phil Jackson’s outfit during the postgame press conference after Sunday’s win over the Magic?  He had his suit coat off, and I noticed his suspenders were decorated with fly patterns!  And you thought the biggest news in Chicago was Number 23’s return! So, what’s the deal, Bulls fans?  Is this guy just a smart dresser, or does he REALLY know what to do in the off season? Regards, Bill Uyeki

I know they say he spends his off season in Montana.

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Did anyone catch Coach Phil Jackson’s outfit during the postgame press conference after Sunday’s win over the Magic?  He had his suit coat off, and I noticed his suspenders were decorated with fly patterns!  And you thought the biggest news in Chicago was Number 23’s return! So, what’s the deal, Bulls fans?  Is this guy just a smart dresser, or does he REALLY know what to do in the off season?

I seem to recall reading that he owned property in Montana where he liked to go and fish.  I read this some time ago, so I don’t remember the details.  Anyone else have additional info?

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Path: interramp.com!psinntp!psinntp!uunet!news.cloud9.net!news.sprintlink.net!gat ech!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!news.netins.net!bj.palmer.edu!SCHMIDT_K Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly Organization: Palmer Chiropractic University Lines: 12 NNTP-Posting-Host: bj.palmer.edu Did anyone catch Coach Phil Jackson’s outfit during the postgame press conference after Sunday’s win over the Magic?  He had his suit coat off, and I noticed his suspenders were decorated with fly patterns!  And you thought the biggest news in Chicago was Number 23’s return! So, what’s the deal, Bulls fans?  Is this guy just a smart dresser, or does he REALLY know what to do in the off season? I seem to recall reading that he owned property in Montana where he liked to go and fish.  I read this some time ago, so I don’t remember the details.   Anyone else have additional info?

The Coach actually has a home just outside of Kalispell Montana, near Lakeside. (has two basketball courts too! nice place) and he also helped start a physical fitness gym there called ’second wind’ right up on the hill in Kalispell. So, I imagine he fishes when he gets home.

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Did anyone catch Coach Phil Jackson’s outfit during the postgame press conference after Sunday’s win over the Magic?  He had his suit coat off, and I noticed his suspenders were decorated with fly patterns!  And you thought the biggest news in Chicago was Number 23’s return! So, what’s the deal, Bulls fans?  Is this guy just a smart dresser, or does he REALLY know what to do in the off season? Regards, Bill Uyeki

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Question:

I am wanting some suggestions for good trout fly fishing in the mountains of western north carolina.  I am new to this art and any help would be appreciated. — Michael Ebbs Center for Communications and Signal Processing North Carolina State University

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<< am lookin for information on the western half of North Carolina… In the Ashville area, the fly shop of choice for info is Hunter Banks. I like to fish the Pisgah National Forest, specifically the Davidson River but there are many other near by from GA to Va. If you want your trout easy & big the Cherokee reservation has some tribal stocked waters which they will sell you daily permits. The national park has an abundance of streams.   Also suggest the rivers in the Joyce Kilmer nat forest, as well as the French Broad around Ashville. There is also  fly shop in Cashiers and near Blowing Rock (different shop) for additional info, but the guys at Hunter Banks will give you so much info, you’ll not be able to digest it all at once. Good Luck Wayne Knight — Wayne Knight CSERVE, 71151, 2762

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Just got back from a visit to my folks in Waynesville.  Took a tour of the eastern edge of the Great Smokies.  The Catalooche, and Big Creek in that area are both good although the fish apparently can be a little picky on the Catalooche.  Both streams are gorgeous and as a rule not crowded due to relatively limited road access.

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