Question:

Today I took the day off work and decided to head out to Loch Lomond in Santa Cruz California to get in some flyfishing. Loch Lomond is a beautiful lake for being so close to an urban center. It’s a reservoir in a mountain valley… and if you squint just a little and ignore all of the picnic tables and hiking paths, you would swear you’re at a lake in the high sierra. It has resident populations of bass, catfish, panfish, and is planted in the spring with rainbows.  Of course, the trout is my fish of choice. Since the lake doesn’t allow wading or float tubes, your only choice is to bring or rent a boat if you want to flyfish… renting is cheap, and they rent only rowboats, so I get a free workout thrown in. I didn’t get on the lake until 11am (had to drop my daughter off at school, etc), so I did get a late start.  Thanks to the fog, though, conditions were cool and the fish were still near the surface.  One after one, I try all the dries in my flybox.. but they’re not hitting. Strange, because they are ocassionally rising (though not very often)… to what?  That’s the big question, and one I still don’t know the answer to.  Maybe there are emergers, but I can’t see any. I also try nymphing a little bit… but no luck there either. Of course, I notice the trollers and the bait dunkers at the shore aren’t having any better luck.  A couple people had good luck earlier, before I arrived, but nobody is catching. Anyway, it was a GREAT day, even if I didn’t catch a damn thing.  I was off the water by 2pm, just when the fog burned off and the air started to heat up a little.  I WILL go back soon, it was great! Now, here’s the request for knowledge section of this post: HOW does one fish nymphs in a lake?  I’ve fished dries in high sierra lakes, and dries and nymphs in rivers, but never nymphs in lakes.  Do they need movement?  The current is moving a little in the lake.  Any advise you can give me? Also, what do you think they were rising for?  Yea, I know you weren’t there, but if you had to guess…. Thanks for the help…

Response:

HOW does one fish nymphs in a lake?  

Buy and read Gary LaFontaine’s Fishing the High Mountain Lakes. You might try dangling a small brassie (chironomid imitation) below an indicator, especially if there’s a little ripple on the surface. Works for me. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

<SNIP Also, what do you think they were rising for?  Yea, I know you weren’t there, but if you had to guess….

Chironomids. ( Midge pupa). Have a look here; http://www.bcadventure.com/adventure/angling/protalk/chan/confession…. The rest of the site is worth a good look as well. TL MC

Response:

Try this one as well; http://www.fishbc.com/adventure/angling/flies/chironomid/pupa.phtml TL MC

Response:

Thanks! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – HOW does one fish nymphs in a lake? Buy and read Gary LaFontaine’s Fishing the High Mountain Lakes. You might try dangling a small brassie (chironomid imitation) below an indicator, especially if there’s a little ripple on the surface. Works for me. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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Thanks and thanks! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Have a look here; http://www.bcadventure.com/adventure/angling/protalk/chan/confession…. The rest of the site is worth a good look as well. TL MC

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 Chironomids, all various colors coming off lakes or any other hatch you can identify are difficult to fish on lakes.  The trout are many times large and they are cruisers.  The difficulty in fishing for cruising trout feeding on emerging Chironomids is timing.  Timing is everything. Pick a fish out that you see break the surface one, two, cast, three!  The fish are taking Chironomids just under the surface, not on top of it.  They cruise about a foot or two under looking up.  They come up and take the food in an arch, their backs breaking the water.  This means you may have to try dangling about six to eight inches of tippet "under the water" and float the rest of the tippet and leader on top.  Lead the fish, and then twitch about an inch or two.  Dress the first few inches of leader with Xink and that includes the nymph or Chironomid pattern of your choice.  Float the rest of your leader and fly line. "The Take," is one of perpetual motion and a cruiser will hook themselves for obvious reasons.  The initial response is one of surprise.  Make sure you lower your rod tip level and sideways to the first run because it will be a duzzie! Hope this helps.  You WILL catch fish. George Gehrke "Chironomids are Cillers"

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Question:

Back legs extended, front claws out – Back Scratcher. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply. Another cat person – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – On its back legs up … magazine rack that doesn’t scuff the covers. Steve (Actually a cat person … especially Abyssinians)

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well, evidently Mr. Reid did, though it bears mentioning that Mr. Reid implies (at least) that he has no memory or knowledge of having said anything that would indicate that he did.  On the other hand, Mr. Reid would, we hope, certainly deny that he made any such denial, especially in light of the documentary record plainly demonstrating the utter absence of any such denial.  Meanwhile, Mr. Reid, having recently returned to the fold, is up to his old tricks vis a vis objectors objecting to objections, while simultaneously and vehemently objecting to the notion that he ever left in the first place.  The careful reader will, of course, not be fooled by any of the foregoing as it clear, plain, and uncategorically inarguable that that couldn’t possibly have happened given the time constraints and the relative implausibility of Mr. Reid’s simultaneous cohabitation in more than roughly three planes at any given moment.  Hope this clears things up. Hum? Wolfgang

Cool, I know drugs kicked in ’cause I totally grokked that.  BTW, am I in New Zealand or Maryland today? — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply.

Response:

[gross humour snipped] Which begs the question, was it a case of mistaken identity or … Steve

Response:

[gross humour snipped] Which begs the question, was it a case of mistaken identity or … Steve

Being too drunk, high, stoned etc. to know what you were doing . . . Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Well, evidently Mr. Reid did, though it bears mentioning that Mr. Reid implies (at least) that he has no memory or knowledge of having said anything that would indicate that he did.  On the other hand, Mr. Reid would, we hope, certainly deny that he made any such denial, especially in light of the documentary record plainly demonstrating the utter absence of any such denial.  Meanwhile, Mr. Reid, having recently returned to the fold, is up to his old tricks vis a vis objectors objecting to objections, while simultaneously and vehemently objecting to the notion that he ever left in the first place.  The careful reader will, of course, not be fooled by any of the foregoing as it clear, plain, and uncategorically inarguable that that couldn’t possibly have happened given the time constraints and the relative implausibility of Mr. Reid’s simultaneous cohabitation in more than roughly three planes at any given moment.  Hope this clears things up.  Hum? Wolfgang who, becoming hopelessly confused anent who is likely to do how much damage to whom under which circumstances and when, is giving serious consideration to kicking his own ass this weekend and being done with it!    :(

You planning on any ice skating judging in the next little while? Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

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Hey Op, I’m in for c-note.  Does this mean YOU are coming to the Penn’s clave? Gonna make it to the presentation? john

Whether I make it to the Penn’s ‘Clave is a matter to be determined.  Still waitin’ to hear from Mr. Fortenberry.  ’Course he may never have seen my post on the subject, as he has me blocked and all, and in that case if I don’t hear back from him within two weeks of the ‘clave I will attend, come hell of high water. I will attend the presentation, as long as it doesn’t involve you and an out door shower! Op

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A LIAR AND THOSE WHO MAKE THREATS CANNOT BE TRUSTED: You are known for your lies and that you cannot be trusted.  Even this message of yours must be reported to the authorities Mike Connor and all of this is of your doing. It is time Klaus does something positive about you because his trust in you has been violated as you have indeed violated Roff and many of its’ members. You must be stopped before you do something very, very stupid. It is time to post every negative thought, every negative deed, every name calling post you send to Roff.  Until you stop your insane conduct, every abuse you bestow upon the American Fly Fishing Scene will be reported until you stop. Do you understand this Mike Connor? George Gehrke "it’s time to police your pathetic conduct Connor"

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I pledge $100.00 to Mike’s trip across the water, but only if he will spend his time at a ‘clave over here.  Any ‘clave will do, but wouldn’t it be nice if he made an appearance at the Penn’s ‘Clave! Mike, please don’t waste your time and energy on confronting an obviously deranged individual.  I honestly don’t think George can help himself.  I have no doubt that the rest of the folks pledging funds would rather see you in the flesh fishin’, than see you on the back pages of some local paper’s arrest report.  Do you realize how much satisfaction George would get from you being hauled off to an *American* jail, before you ever got to lay a finger on him? Anyway, hope to meet ya some day, at a ‘clave! Op  –eternal optimist– Well Op, that is very kind of you, and I appreciate the sentiment, but I don

Question:

I’ve taken some time off to work finish my thesis (obviously not working on it right now) and I took a few minutes to watch the steelhead at Grindstone Creek.  This stretch of water is a fish sanctuary and it provides a superb view for migrating steelies.

Being able to find an area like this where you can easilly observe the fish’s behavior is very interesting and valuable, at least to me. Like you reported, it teaches you things about the fish that you wouldn’t have discovered. Willi

Response:

I’ve taken some time off to work finish my thesis

heard that one before, fishing or thesis? fishing or… thesis? fishing … or … fishing?  fishing?  Fishing! BTW, the local fly shop recently decided to sell off all their fishng videos for $3 a piece so I picked up the SciAng Jim Teeny Steelhead video. There is one pool shown in that video where 20 fish are milling about all pointed in various directions.  The surface is flat and Teeny is pitching a nymph at the end of a 5ft sink tip with a long leader. Mu

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I’ve taken some time off to work finish my thesis heard that one before, fishing or thesis? fishing or… thesis? fishing … or … fishing?  fishing?  Fishing! BTW, the local fly shop recently decided to sell off all their fishng videos for $3 a piece so I picked up the SciAng Jim Teeny Steelhead video. There is one pool shown in that video where 20 fish are milling about all pointed in various directions……

Weird, wasn’t it?  When I saw it, I wondered just how many rocks he’d tossed in at that point. JR

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve taken some time off to work finish my thesis heard that one before, fishing or thesis? fishing or… thesis? fishing … or … fishing?  fishing?  Fishing! BTW, the local fly shop recently decided to sell off all their fishng videos for $3 a piece so I picked up the SciAng Jim Teeny Steelhead video. There is one pool shown in that video where 20 fish are milling about all pointed in various directions…… Weird, wasn’t it?  When I saw it, I wondered just how many rocks he’d tossed in at that point.

I have that video. The rock tossing works, BTW. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

I have that video. The rock tossing works, BTW.

You fish molester. But seriously, I think if I tried that rock trick on any of the streams that I used to fish in michigan, the fish would have headed about 100 yards downstream. Mu

Response:

I’ve taken some time off to work finish my thesis (obviously not working on it right now)

  Me either What’s your field? interesting obs. snipped.

Thats the beauty of putting up the stick for awhile, and having an optic.  As a more general comment on trouty lies, some of the angles fish lie at in front of,  behind and under structure are quite surprising.   In some of the little streams we find fish sitting at right angles to the current fairly regularly, we even have some pet rocks that seem to attract this sort of behaviour. There is a horse, that sits in behind a log in tailout.  The log is probably 45 degrees to the current and immediatley below is a 2-3 foot waterfall. The bank is a mere 3 feet away and a good deal of the current is forced between the log and the bank.  Depending on the the flow, the fish will be found more or less hard up to the log – but never straight up and down stream.   With the angle he lies at and the height above downstream water he can see any movement on the banks both up and down stream, has a bit of a funnel feeding him food and a relatively good oxygen supply. The force is strong with that one … Steve

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I’ve taken some time off to work finish my thesis (obviously not working on it right now)  Me either What’s your field?

MA, Cultural Anthropology – specialty – development NGOs interesting obs. snipped. Thats the beauty of putting up the stick for awhile, and having an optic.  

I should do more of this – I just get to the water too horny to spend the time. There is a horse, that sits in behind a log in tailout.  The log is probably 45 degrees to the current and immediatley below is a 2-3 foot waterfall. The bank is a mere 3 feet away and a good deal of the current is forced between the log and the bank.  Depending on the the flow, the fish will be found more or less hard up to the log – but never straight up and down stream.  

That’s why she’s a horse, eh?  My son fished to one like that in PA. the fish had put herself in an almost perfect spot.  He got in a lucky cast, the fish took and then broke him off in a twinkle. With the angle he lies at and the height above downstream water he can see any movement on the banks both up and down stream, has a bit of a funnel feeding him food and a relatively good oxygen supply. The force is strong with that one … Steve

Those are the ones that keep us coming back. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

MA, Cultural Anthropology – specialty – development NGOs

Cripes – a mouthful, that will look impressive on your business cards. NGO – Non-Government Org? Hope the writeup goes as well as it can … I’m almost there with mine, another month or 6 (shudder). I should do more of this – I just get to the water too horny to spend the time.

  Had that happen the other day, left home 2.5 hours late – primary destination was a mess – warm water algae low flows – poor fish. Arrived at secondary at least 3 hours later than usual – fished the first hour like a complete maniac i.e. badly … trouble with trees, leader stopper failing, companion was (seemingly) in my pocket – bad.  After about the 10th spooked fish I realised what the hell was going on slowed down, and started to enjoy myself … it began with a little stalking of fish for my companion.  We still did that usually 6 hour fish/walk, in three and a half hours – time enoguh left for some new water to be explored but that first section was ‘orrible. That’s why she’s a horse, eh?  My son fished to one like that in PA. the fish had put herself in an almost perfect spot.  He got in a lucky cast, the fish took and then broke him off in a twinkle.

  My nymph came unhitched from the horse almost immediately … Those are the ones that keep us coming back.

Oh yeah. Though now summer has set in fully I expect the lie will change as the water is getting uncomfortably warm. Steve (back to my Contusion)

Response:

Steve (back to my Contusion)

you neglected to add, "Which one." – now that I’ve admitted to my feeble attempt to added to academic trivia – it’s your turn. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

Steve (back to my Contusion) you neglected to add, "Which one." – now that I’ve admitted to my feeble attempt to added to academic trivia – it’s your turn.

  If your academic research is half as good as your fishing research appears to be you’ll knock the socks off …anyway its the journey … the journey …that matters …  8^) Heading for PhD in Computer Science (or a complete NBD) – topic last I looked was Synthetic Images in particular mucking about with morphing. I know one thing … I took up flyfishing a year or two before starting the undergrad thing … it has definately kept me more or less sane over the intervening 9 years.  Fishing, thinking about it, recollections, and even the scribblings here from the more sentient beings that inhabit roff all help. Though I look forward to finishing, my mid-week forays into the forests of "Nophishe Valley" and "Watchemecrawlalong ck" will be severely curtailed by a return to full-time work … back to the evening rise and weekend fishing (which I haven’t done for probably 3-4 years!)  On the other hand I will have more shekels for trips and gear Steve

Response:

Weird, wasn’t it?  When I saw it, I wondered just how many rocks he’d tossed in at that point. I have that video. The rock tossing works, BTW.

Yes it does.  Teeny gets a lot of flack from a lot of folks, but he’s a hell of a steelhead fisherman.  I rarely sight fish to steelhead in the rivers around here, but if I were unable to move a fish I could see and cast well to, I’d probably toss a rock or two myself. JR

Response:

I’ve taken some time off to work finish my thesis (obviously not working on it right now) and I took a few minutes to watch the steelhead at Grindstone Creek.  This stretch of water is a fish sanctuary and it provides a superb view for migrating steelies. There is a small plunge pool downstream from a small rock face/chute of about 3′ high.  The water rushes through the chute into the pool, creating a white water plume about 20′ long and 5′ wide.  Unlike most days, the water was gin clear and afford an unobstructed view of the fish. Surprise No.1 – the holding fish were lying approximately 90 to 120 degrees off the current, under the plume.  Obviously, the plume creates eddies along the bottom and these fish had their heads pointed into the eddy current direction.  Most of the fish were angled slightly downstream.  One pair were snuggled up to the base of the rock wall, holding side-by-side, perpendicular to the rushing plume above their heads. Surprise No. 2 – well not really a surprise, just a confirmation – many of the fish were madly dashing about chasing each other at high speed.  Obviously not the slow metabolism, frozen fish syndrome we keep hearing about.  A fast presentation would have probably been effective on these fish. One other observation, some of the fish held just outside of the plume but none would venture very far from its cover.  Now this could be attributed to my presence but as I approached, I could see the fish clearly and the closest didn’t spook until I got very close.  I stood very still and within a minute or two, the fish ignored me and went back to their previous positions.  None of the fish were holding more than 3′ from the plume and even when they dash about, they rarely left its cover. These observations will certainly influence my next steelhead trip as I don’t think I’ll look at this type of water the same way again.  I had always been told that steelhead won’t hold in back eddies but these fish put the lie to that theory.  From now one, I’ll try to visualize the fish pointing in different directions depending on the current and not just the head-upstream we always assume. One effective nymphing presentation, anywhere eddies rotate from the rear of the plume to the front, would be to cast a nymph into the tailout and allow the nymph to be brought into the head of the plume by the eddie, plunge down the plume, then repeat.  I’ve caught carp here using this method when the regs permitted but never thought to use it for steelhead – that thing about steelies not holding pointing downstream.  Next time . . . No reason this wouldn’t be true for residents either. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

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Question:

Ha! Made you look, cracker!

Response:

Ha! Made you look, cracker!

What does this have to do with skating?

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Blacks are the foremost perpetrators of "hate crimes". 30,000 White women are raped by black males every year. Over 5,000 Whites are assaulted. 1,800 Whites are murdered by blacks every year in America. Read "The Color of Crime" http://www.amren.com/colrcrim.html                           ||__||           |    Please do   |                          /   O O      |        NOT       |                         /                |     feed the    |                        /                |   the niggers  |                      /    |____        ||                     /     | | | |____/      ||                    /       |_|_|/   |    __ ||                   /  /              |____| ||                  /   |   | /|        |      –  |                  |   |   |//         |____           * _    |  |_|_|_|          |     -/        *– _– _     //           |          /  _     \ _ //   |        /        *  /   _ /- | –     |       |

What does this sick stuff have to do with skating?

Response:

Dear Julia.. You are one sick puppy! Woman sentenced in racist e-mail hoax trash snipped

What does this have to do with skating?

Response:

What does this sick stuff have to do with skating?

It is related to Ice Skating in the exact same manner it is related to CD Recorders, GI-Joe toys, Fly Fishing, and Outdoor Travel (cross posted newsgroups).  There is no correlation, it is just some AWM (anger white male) venting their frustrations and showing their ignorance.  It is 2001, even red necks can get on the internet now

Response:

Blacks are the foremost perpetrators of "hate crimes". 30,000 White women are raped by black males every year. Over 5,000 Whites are assaulted. 1,800 Whites are murdered by blacks every year in America. Read "The Color of Crime" http://www.amren.com/colrcrim.html                           ||__||           |    Please do   |                          /   O O      |        NOT       |                         /                |     feed the    |                        /                |   the niggers  |                      /    |____        ||                     /     | | | |____/      ||                    /       |_|_|/   |    __ ||                   /  /              |____| ||                  /   |   | /|        |      –  |                  |   |   |//         |____           * _    |  |_|_|_|          |     -/        *– _– _     //           |          /  _     \ _ //   |        /        *  /   _ /- | –     |       |

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Woman sentenced in racist e-mail hoax BY JENNIFER FEEHAN BLADE STAFF WRITER BOWLING GREEN – A black woman who admitted sending racist e-mail messages to herself was placed on probation yesterday for two years and ordered to write a letter of apology to Bowling Green State University students. Omobonike Odegbami, 27, of Toledo, Ohio pleaded guilty Oct. 27 to tampering with evidence, a third-degree felony. Investigators said she reported to BGSU police in April that she had received threatening, racially charged e-mail from an unknown source. A graduate student at the time, she relayed her story to the campus newspaper, which published a front-page story about the case. Campus police enlisted the aid of the FBI, soon zeroing in on classmates and instructors in Odegbami’s small graduate program. She eventually confessed. Odegbami, appearing yesterday in Wood County Common Pleas Court, apologized before Judge Reeve Kelsey but offered no explanation for her actions. She declined to comment after the sentencing. James Wiegand, director of public safety at BGSU, told Judge Kelsey that university officials are "both disappointed and certainly relieved" at the outcome of the case. He said it is disappointing that a student would go to such lengths to get attention, but a relief that the messages were bogus. Wood County Prosecutor Alan Mayberry said he agreed not to seek a prison sentence as part of a plea deal with Odegbami. However, he said he wants her to obtain counseling and apologize in a letter published in the campus newspaper. Odegbami’s attorney, Stanley Garrett, told the judge his client has no prior criminal record, that she accepts responsibility for what she did, and that she is attending the University of Toledo. Judge Kelsey said Odegbami must perform 200 hours of community service during her two years of community control, continue to undergo mental health counseling at her own expense, and pay all court costs. He warned that if she violates those conditions, she could receive more restrictive sanctions, go to jail for up to six months, or to prison for three years. — Blacks are the foremost perpetrators of "hate crimes". 30,000 White women are raped by black males every year. Over 5,000 Whites are assaulted. 1,800 Whites are murdered by blacks every year in America. Read "The Color of Crime" http://www.amren.com/colrcrim.html

Response:

Woman sentenced in racist e-mail hoax

But have they been fishin’? Can they send us a TR? Chris

Response:

Dear Julia.. You are one sick puppy! Woman sentenced in racist e-mail hoax

trash snipped — On my retirement adventure from the rolling hills of the Southern Tier in New York State…..    Traveling in my 1999 Dodge 2500 6-spd diesel, 1999 Sunnybrook 27RKFS 5th-wheel

Response:

Soltys Says Victims Tried to ‘Poison’ Him  By KPIX – Ann Notarangelo  Investigators say mass murder suspect Nikolay Soltys claims the family members he’s accused of killing were trying to "poison"  him.  However, language difficulties are making it hard for police to determine if that means Soltys believed his family was trying to  murder him, or simply ruin his reputation.  Police do say that the 27-year-old Ukrainian immigrant is cooperating with the investigation. But they won’t comment on reports  that Soltys has already confessed to the crimes, saying that revealing too many details could damage their case in court.  Soltys is now in protective custody in the county jail, to protect him from other inmates and himself. He was arrested Thursday,  outside his mother’s home in a Sacramento suburb.  Soltys is suspected of killing his wife, son, and four other family members, but police say there’s no evidence he went to his  mother’s house to hurt anyone. Instead, investigators thought the Soltys may have been trying to reach out to his mother. It was  that possibility that inspired police to quietly watch the home since the family chose to leave protective custody earlier this week.  Police also gave Soltys’ mother a panic button to use if her son appeared.  "It’s designed to be a one-button-push call to the 911 operator," said Sgt. Jamie Lewis with the Sacramento County Sheriff’s  Department. "Ultimately, they decided not to use this device, because they wanted to put some distance between them and the  suspect."  But police say that decision backfired. When the family tried to call 911 on the cell phone authorities had also given them, they  mistakenly dialed 119. A store clerk eventually helped them make the call.

Response:

Question:

Hi Does anyone know if there is any saltwater flyfishing to be had in these countries

My friend’s father was a weapons salseman for Raytheon based in the UAE. He told me the whole area was teeming with fish.  Showed me a picture of him holding up a sailfish.  He himself wasn’t into fishing but was surprised at how good the fishing was.  This was about 10 years ago. Sorry, don’t have any more specific info. Mu

Response:

Last question first, no, I do not live there but have been in that area too many times to count – maybe a hundred – often for a couple of months per-visit.

I was brought up there and just in the process of moving back There are (were) a couple of hotels in Oman that promoted fishing as part of a tourism package, but FF-ing is seldom seen in the Gulf.

of effect or awareness ? With a British passport, you have a greater degree of freedom in areas where the Crown formerly held sway (still does).

I knew it was useful for something ……   The Emirates are safer than most US or UK territories,

One of the reasons I want to move back out there  but not Pakistan.  There are lots of fish-bearing fresh water rivers and streams in Pakistan, particularly in the mountainous areas, but those are mostly in/near the disputed zones and, ignoring the cross-border risks, there are banditos who have absolutely no regard to who you are or where you came from, as long as someone will pay for your return.  If you’re captured and nobody seems interested in paying, you become fertilizer and the next "guest" comes into view.

Yet again politics get in the way enough said on this one ……oh well some day … Be careful.

or just sensible and not go rgds JF

Response:

I have hear the ‘Sailfish Mecca’ comment from a few people ….. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Does anyone know if there is any saltwater flyfishing to be had in these countries My friend’s father was a weapons salseman for Raytheon based in the UAE. He told me the whole area was teeming with fish.  Showed me a picture of him holding up a sailfish.  He himself wasn’t into fishing but was surprised at how good the fishing was.  This was about 10 years ago. Sorry, don’t have any more specific info. Mu

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During one trip to the Gulf, a local English language newspaper had an article (with photo), about a large black marlin that was caught in the Indian Ocean, just below the Straits of Hormuz (Oman).  I believe that an Australian or Kiwi had begun a charter fishing business in Muscat for the purpose of catching the "big fish". Generally, the Gulf waters are shallow, excepting specific "lanes" that are regularly dredged from the northern end of the straits to the oil terminals off Saudi and Mina al-Ahmadi off Kuwait to support the deep draft tankers.  Most of the "big fish" talk that I’ve heard was specific to the deeper waters in the northern Indian Ocean along the southern coast of OMAN.  Keep in mind that the distances are short between these places and with a Brit passport, you can move freely between any of those countries without the necessity for visas or NOC’s. The whole area is a fascinating place with vestiges of history traceable back over a long span of time (human time).  Fishing is only one recreational aspect. Tom – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have hear the ‘Sailfish Mecca’ comment from a few people ….. Hi Does anyone know if there is any saltwater flyfishing to be had in these countries My friend’s father was a weapons salseman for Raytheon based in the UAE. He told me the whole area was teeming with fish.  Showed me a picture of him holding up a sailfish.  He himself wasn’t into fishing but was surprised at how good the fishing was.  This was about 10 years ago. Sorry, don’t have any more specific info. Mu

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Hi Does anyone know if there is any saltwater flyfishing to be had in these countries or freshwater in Pakistan thanks

Hi, My brother spent time in the Persian Gulf. He always talked about stripping streamers there with a very large rod. To see a picture of my brother in the Persian Gulf (although he’s not fishing at the moment), go to http://www.montana.com/dno/brian.htm . Scroll toward the bottom and you’ll see Marcus Nelson in the Persian Gulf but be prepared for a large K download. There’s lots of photos. Other than that, thats as close as I can come. — Tight Lines! Brian D. Nelson Diamond N Outfitters, Missoula, Montana http://www.montana.com/dno 406-626-4022

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thanks Brian – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Does anyone know if there is any saltwater flyfishing to be had in these countries or freshwater in Pakistan thanks Hi, My brother spent time in the Persian Gulf. He always talked about stripping streamers there with a very large rod. To see a picture of my brother in the Persian Gulf (although he’s not fishing at the moment), go to http://www.montana.com/dno/brian.htm . Scroll toward the bottom and you’ll see Marcus Nelson in the Persian Gulf but be prepared for a large K download. There’s lots of photos. Other than that, thats as close as I can come. — Tight Lines! Brian D. Nelson Diamond N Outfitters, Missoula, Montana http://www.montana.com/dno 406-626-4022

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Hi Tom thanks for the quick response Yes, but it’s not popular.  I have flyfished along the Northern coast of the Emirates (West of the cement factory at the Omani border) a few times, but most fishing is with bait.  Of interest, there are BIG tarpon in those warm waters.

Is this due to results ….or simply that fly is not promoted locally ? One of the most nervous moments of my life occurred in about 1989 about 5 miles off the coast of Ras al-Khaimah, while fishing on a Friday. Around midday, we were bottom-fishing over a big rock pile and pretty oblivious to our surroundings when I noticed an Iranian gunboat about a half mile away and closing.  Note that we were clearly in UAE waters, but there was no way to know what the Irani crew had in mind.  I was prepared to eat my US passport, when a US Navy helicopter rose above the horizon and began to prosecute the gunboat.  There was no offensive action by either and the gunboat retreated toward his territorial waters while we began thinking about getting out of that area.

I have heard of the Navy prtecting fisheries ….but that is dramatic ….. We did catch a few Cobia which we enjoyed that night, cooked over charcoal and brushed with lemon butter.

Sounds marvelous As for freshwater fishing in Pakistan, DO NOT plan on venturing anywhere in the bush unless you’re in the immediate company of an armed band. Check with the US Embassy in Islamabad or the Consulate in Karachi before you make any plans.

I am British so will liase with my Embassy there …..is it worth it is there any fishing to be had ? Did you live in the Emirates ? thanks again James

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Last question first, no, I do not live there but have been in that area too many times to count – maybe a hundred – often for a couple of months per-visit. There are (were) a couple of hotels in Oman that promoted fishing as part of a tourism package, but FF-ing is seldom seen in the Gulf. With a British passport, you have a greater degree of freedom in areas where the Crown formerly held sway (still does).  The Emirates are safer than most US or UK territories, but not Pakistan.  There are lots of fish-bearing fresh water rivers and streams in Pakistan, particularly in the mountainous areas, but those are mostly in/near the disputed zones and, ignoring the cross-border risks, there are banditos who have absolutely no regard to who you are or where you came from, as long as someone will pay for your return.  If you’re captured and nobody seems interested in paying, you become fertilizer and the next "guest" comes into view. Be careful. Tom – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Tom thanks for the quick response Yes, but it’s not popular.  I have flyfished along the Northern coast of the Emirates (West of the cement factory at the Omani border) a few times, but most fishing is with bait.  Of interest, there are BIG tarpon in those warm waters. Is this due to results ….or simply that fly is not promoted locally ? One of the most nervous moments of my life occurred in about 1989 about 5 miles off the coast of Ras al-Khaimah, while fishing on a Friday. Around midday, we were bottom-fishing over a big rock pile and pretty oblivious to our surroundings when I noticed an Iranian gunboat about a half mile away and closing.  Note that we were clearly in UAE waters, but there was no way to know what the Irani crew had in mind.  I was prepared to eat my US passport, when a US Navy helicopter rose above the horizon and began to prosecute the gunboat.  There was no offensive action by either and the gunboat retreated toward his territorial waters while we began thinking about getting out of that area. I have heard of the Navy prtecting fisheries ….but that is dramatic ….. We did catch a few Cobia which we enjoyed that night, cooked over charcoal and brushed with lemon butter. Sounds marvelous As for freshwater fishing in Pakistan, DO NOT plan on venturing anywhere in the bush unless you’re in the immediate company of an armed band. Check with the US Embassy in Islamabad or the Consulate in Karachi before you make any plans. I am British so will liase with my Embassy there …..is it worth it is there any fishing to be had ? Did you live in the Emirates ? thanks again James

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Hi Does anyone know if there is any saltwater flyfishing to be had in these countries or freshwater in Pakistan thanks

Response:

Yes, but it’s not popular.  I have flyfished along the Northern coast of the Emirates (West of the cement factory at the Omani border) a few times, but most fishing is with bait.  Of interest, there are BIG tarpon in those warm waters. One of the most nervous moments of my life occurred in about 1989 about 5 miles off the coast of Ras al-Khaimah, while fishing on a Friday. Around midday, we were bottom-fishing over a big rock pile and pretty oblivious to our surroundings when I noticed an Iranian gunboat about a half mile away and closing.  Note that we were clearly in UAE waters, but there was no way to know what the Irani crew had in mind.  I was prepared to eat my US passport, when a US Navy helicopter rose above the horizon and began to prosecute the gunboat.  There was no offensive action by either and the gunboat retreated toward his territorial waters while we began thinking about getting out of that area. We did catch a few Cobia which we enjoyed that night, cooked over charcoal and brushed with lemon butter. As for freshwater fishing in Pakistan, DO NOT plan on venturing anywhere in the bush unless you’re in the immediate company of an armed band. Check with the US Embassy in Islamabad or the Consulate in Karachi before you make any plans. Tom Hi Does anyone know if there is any saltwater flyfishing to be had in these countries or freshwater in Pakistan thanks

– Tom Brown The Signal Group Wake Forest, NC If Lee had listened to Longstreet and flanked Meade at Gettysburg instead of sending Pickett up the middle, you’d be paying taxes to Richmond instead of Washington.                                              anonymous

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Question:

Congratulations, Darin. You will have a lot of fun with your new fishing buddy! Tim Lysyk – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them. Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son? Darin the proud new father

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Congratulations Life as you knew is over. Fortunately the best is yet to come. BJ Conner

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Congratulations from the Left Coast! Merry Christmas and I know you’ll all have a Happy New Year! John – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them. Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son? Darin the proud new father

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A hearty Congrats to you and the Missus! — "Of what service would militia be to you, when most probably you will not have a single musket in the State; for as arms are to be provided by Congress, they may or may not furnish them?" -Patrick Henry,  5 June 1788

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Thank you all. May you all have a wonderfull Christmas. Mines already been perfect. Darin still the proud new father

And I must remind you to bring a big box of cigars to the next Clave.  :-) Joe F.

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Now, remember to be a nice Dad and make her birthdays special.  Two of my sons, and my wife have birthdays within 2 weeks of Christmas, and every year at least one of them reminds me that they feel like they are being overlooked because of the holidays. Congrats, and good health to you and your family, Darin! –Stan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That’s exactly what we were thinkin’. She was due Jan. 2, but due to a few circumstances she was induced 2 weeks early. Darin

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Congratulations, and best wishes to you all. Does he have a name yet?  ("Lefty" is nice <g) JR – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them. Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son? Darin the proud new father

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Way to go Darin Dave

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Thank you all. May you all have a wonderfull Christmas. Mines already been perfect. Darin still the proud new father

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Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them. Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son? Darin the proud new father

Congrats Darin!  What a fine way to ring in the holiday season.  Best of luck and health to you and your family. Cheers. Natty

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Hey hey ! Congratulations, old man. And just in time for that nice tax deduction too. — Ken Fortenberry

That’s exactly what we were thinkin’. She was due Jan. 2, but due to a few circumstances she was induced 2 weeks early. Darin

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Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them. Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son? Darin the proud new father

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Congratulations. I guess if you have to give up fishing for a few years the SJ clave was a good way to end. Paul

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them. Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son? Darin the proud new father

Response:

"Darin Minor" wrote Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son?

    Congratulations, and I hope mother and son are doing fine. Send "Uncle Charlie" your shipping address by e-mail, I think I may have what the boy needs.

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Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them.

Congratulations.   ‘Tis a fine thing. Joe F

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Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them. Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son? Darin the proud new father

Hey hey ! Congratulations, old man. And just in time for that nice tax deduction too. — Ken Fortenberry

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Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them. Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son? Darin the proud new father

Congratulations, and best to all. Happy Holidays, R

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Congratulations to you and your wife Darin, you’ll make an awesome dad. bruce h — bare your soul let your spirit burn out along the road to no return – r.e. keen

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Congrats!! I have a couple of fly rods that have been "accidentally modified" if you’d like a short rod! <g Congratulate the happy mother for us too.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them. Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son? Darin the proud new father

Response:

Darin Minor writes: Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them. Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son? Darin the proud new father

Congrats, Darin.  My best to the mom.  Actually a 1 weight, 2 if he’s big, would be better. Dave LaCourse, ROFian Grandpa

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Congrats Darin!!! Willi – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them. Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son? Darin the proud new father

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Congratulations to you and your wife, Darin! –Walt Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them. Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son? Darin the proud new father

– Ezflyfish.com: http://www.ezflyfish.com Blue Ridge Book Gallery: http://users.boone.net/wgw/brbg.html

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Congratulations Darin. TL MC — "Where fishing is concerned, most anglers are basically manic excessives" http://www.mikeconnor.de – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them. Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son? Darin the proud new father

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Congratulations!  Outstanding. Bruce Thomsen

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Congratulations from all over the pond! Herman Those of you who met me at the Western Clave knew that my wife was pregnant, well that is no longer the case. My son was born at 8:12pm last night. Mother and child are doing great and I couldn’t be happier. I will try and post pics on the web when I can and post the address for those of you who would like to see them. Anybody know where to get a 4 or 5′ rod for my new son? Darin the proud new father

–         Cheers, Herman         Herman Nijland         Daytime webmaster         Lifetime flyfisher

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Question:

______  RW?  I want to talk to you at: — http://www.gink.com/chat If you are up.  I’m going there now. George

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Ernie, I’ve seen these but have never had the guts to use them.  Do they stay in the flyline when you hook a big fish?  They look like they would slip out.

Vern; This topic comes up every few weeks here.  If you do a Deja News search you can find quite a bit of discussion of it over the past year or so.  It seems that Ernie and I are the biggest fans of leader links.  I’ve used them for over fifteen years, as have a number of my friends.  I know of no case in which they have failed, except when they are so old that repeated dragging over rocks etc., has abraded them badly.  Of course, any knot used to attach a leader to the fly line would have fared just as badly. Like anything else, a leader link has a finite useable life.  But bearing that in mind they are very reliable, cheap, and easy to use, and should be more than adequate for anything less demanding than large salt water species.  I’ve personally caught quite a few steelhead and salmon while rigged with leader links and never had a problem. Someone else recently suggested knotting the ends of the leader and line together before reinserting them into the leader link.  This is unnecessary for most applications but can’t hurt if you can actually tie a knot small enough.

Response:

Vern,    They are surprisingly strong.  The only thing to watch out for is to tie a figure 8 knot or double overhand when attaching leader butt’s with diameters of .017 or less to make a larger knot.  You should check the line where it enters the Leader Link vocationally to see that it hasn’t cracked. They seem to last forever, I have worn out lines and moved the Leader Link to a new line.  Changing leaders is so easy that I replace the whole leader rather than tie on a new tippet while I am fishing.  I save the leaders and rebuild them when I am not fishing. Ernie Harrison – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ernie, I’ve seen these but have never had the guts to use them. Do they stay in the flyline when you hook a big fish? They look like they would slip out. Vern Don,    Try using the Leader Link from Eagle Claw. Eagle Claw Country Store Phone 1-800-628-0108 4245 East 46th Avenue Denver Colorado 80216 Leader Link For tapered lines (LL1) For level lines     (LL2) There are 3 links per package and cost $2.83 per pack.

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Are you guys differentiating between the kind that slip over and the kind that poke through (with barbs) the end of your flyline?……john – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Vern,   They are surprisingly strong.  The only thing to watch out for is to tie a figure 8 knot or double overhand when attaching leader butt’s with diameters of .017 or less to make a larger knot.  You should check the line where it enters the Leader Link vocationally to see that it hasn’t cracked. They seem to last forever, I have worn out lines and moved the Leader Link to a new line.  Changing leaders is so easy that I replace the whole leader rather than tie on a new tippet while I am fishing.  I save the leaders and rebuild them when I am not fishing. Ernie Harrison Ernie, I’ve seen these but have never had the guts to use them. Do they stay in the flyline when you hook a big fish? They look like they would slip out. Vern Don,    Try using the Leader Link from Eagle Claw. Eagle Claw Country Store Phone 1-800-628-0108 4245 East 46th Avenue Denver Colorado 80216 Leader Link For tapered lines (LL1) For level lines     (LL2) There are 3 links per package and cost $2.83 per pack.

Response:

John,    A Leader Link looks like a large grain of rice with a hole drilled through the center lengthwise and with the sides cut out in the middle. Your line slides into the hole in one end and out the hole in the side,  You tie an overhand knot in it, trim off the excess and pull it back through the hole in the side.  Then you do the same with your leader in the hole in the other end. Ernie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Are you guys differentiating between the kind that slip over and the kind that poke through (with barbs) the end of your flyline?……john

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ahhhh….those rascals……thanks….john

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -John,   A Leader Link looks like a large grain of rice with a hole drilled through the center lengthwise and with the sides cut out in the middle. Your line slides into the hole in one end and out the hole in the side, You tie an overhand knot in it, trim off the excess and pull it back through the hole in the side.  Then you do the same with your leader in the hole in the other end. Ernie Are you guys differentiating between the kind that slip over and the kind that poke through (with barbs) the end of your flyline?……john

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I’ve been experimenting with different connections between my fly line and leader.  My local flyshop has a habit of tying a perfection loop into a line and then using a loop-to-loop connection but if I’m going to get a wind knot that’s where it will happen 90% of the time.  I’ve taken recently to tying a short section (18") of butt directly to the end of the line using a nail knot, then tying in a tapered leader, then tying in a tippet.  I end up clipping off a 1/2" of line anytime I have to change out that butt section which is more often than I’d like. Any other suggestions? TIA, Don — Don Anderson

Response:

going to get a wind knot that’s where it will happen 90% of the time.  I’ve taken recently to tying a short section (18") of butt directly to the end of the line using a nail knot, then tying in a tapered leader, then tying in a tippet.  I end up clipping off a 1/2" of line anytime I have to change out that butt

Don, I wonder how many posts you are going to get like this one. You know, where your question is addressed but no advice given? Myself, I use the perfection not on both the butt section and the leader.  I like the way it forms the loop to loop as far as turn over goes.  Less likelihood of the ‘hinging effect.’ I do recall this question coming up a long time ago and I saved the question and all of the answers….course I lost a whole big file of stuff while learning some of the various functions of my computer.  And I don’t remember what the answer was….I think it had something to do with casting…in order to avoid the knots. I must have retained something on a subconscious level because it moved the knots down into the tippet section. All I know is that it’s a real pickle trying to flyfish with a short term

Response:

Hi Don, I like to first needle nail knot a new tapered knotless monofilament leader directly to the end of my flyline. I am actually ’snelling’ on the leader. Then after I have used up all the taper by adding tippet material, I cut the leader at about 12 to 18 inches from the flyline and then attach another tapered leader. This gives me the same diameter and the same constancy of monofilament. You can shorten the new leader by cutting 12 to 18 inches from the butt before tying it on. This is not ‘thee way to do it’, but just another way to do it. — Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop http://www.kiene.com – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve been experimenting with different connections between my fly line and leader.  My local flyshop has a habit of tying a perfection loop into a line and then using a loop-to-loop connection but if I’m going to get a wind knot that’s where it will happen 90% of the time.  I’ve taken recently to tying a short section (18") of butt directly to the end of the line using a nail knot, then tying in a tapered leader, then tying in a tippet.  I end up clipping off a 1/2" of line anytime I have to change out that butt section which is more often than I’d like. Any other suggestions? TIA, Don — Don Anderson

Response:

Don,    Try using the Leader Link from Eagle Claw. Eagle Claw Country Store Phone 1-800-628-0108 4245 East 46th Avenue Denver Colorado 80216 Leader Link For tapered lines (LL1) For level lines     (LL2) There are 3 links per package and cost $2.83 per pack. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’ve been experimenting with different connections between my fly line and leader.  My local flyshop has a habit of tying a perfection loop into a line and then using a loop-to-loop connection but if I’m going to get a wind knot that’s where it will happen 90% of the time.  I’ve taken recently to tying a short section (18") of butt directly to the end of the line using a nail knot, then tying in a tapered leader, then tying in a tippet.  I end up clipping off a 1/2" of line anytime I have to change out that butt section which is more often than I’d like. Any other suggestions? TIA, Don — Don Anderson

Response:

I use a nail knot to tie a butt to the leader and then I put a surgeons loop at the end of that.I use a loop to loop connection to attach the leader.I don’t like to use a loop connection to my tippet because I believe it will affect the ability of the leader to lay out straight.Art Lee recommends never using a loop anywhhere on your leader but using a uni-knot to connect which is easier to tie than a nail knot and serves the same function.I have switched to this knot and I haven’t had any problems.

Response:

Don,    Try using the Leader Link from Eagle Claw. Eagle Claw Country Store Phone 1-800-628-0108 4245 East 46th Avenue Denver Colorado 80216 Leader Link For tapered lines (LL1) For level lines     (LL2) There are 3 links per package and cost $2.83 per pack.

Hear, Hear!  I’ve been using Leader Links for 20 years now, and wouldn’t waste my time trying anything else.  They work great, but I hardly know anybody else that uses them.  They don’t look as though they would be all that strong, but they are a hell of a lot stronger than the tippet of your leader (unless maybe you are fishing for blue marlin or something), which is all that you need. Kevin

Response:

Hear, Hear!  I’ve been using Leader Links for 20 years now, and wouldn’t waste my time trying anything else.  They work great, but I hardly know anybody else that uses them.  They don’t look as though they would be all that strong, but they are a hell of a lot stronger than the tippet of your leader (unless maybe you are fishing for blue marlin or something), which is all that you need.

When I recommended leader links to a friend of mine in Idaho he turned up his nose at them. Said he was a "purist". I pointed out that he was using a graphite rod, a nylon leader, and a synthetic flyline. It turned out that the guy didn’t even know how to tie a nail knot or a needle knot. He had it done at the tackle shop. Sheesh! — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

Response:

Ernie, I’ve seen these but have never had the guts to use them.

Question:

     Seems like we’ve finally accomplished something?  :-)

and what would that "something" be?         -tgades — Tony Gades. Seattle, WA.  USA http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades/Fishing/fish_page.html email: replace the "this_address_is_wrong" with "tgades"

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 It seems to me that fly casting is using the weight of the line to carry the lure or (fly) to the fish. I’m attracted to this definition…..

At the age of 46, I’d be inclined to agree.  But here’s a story from my youth you may find amusing.  Back in ‘63, I was in Sequoia camping with a ‘Y’ group of youths my age.  We were there for fishing and hiking. ‘Fishing’ was the operative word, since no one had ‘caught’ anything.  At that time, FF wasn’t nearly the designer sport it is today.  I had only seen a couple people doing it and I was a fair distance away:  totally naive to the special gear required for the graceful casts. Taking my self quite seriously, I started whipping a spoon around using my 6′ ft, fiberglass, $12 Thrifty spinning rod and reel.  There I was, whippin that thing back and forth and every once in a while lettin the spoon drag through the pool.  On one of my "backcasts" I literally yanked a little 8 incher right out of the water, totally surprising both of us.  (This was the only trout caught by anyone on the trip!).  Subsequent flailing, for an hour or so produced no more fish.  Go figure.  I guess I put ‘em all down. (The most amazing part of this story is that I still have both of my eyes).  Now you can easily convince this 46 year old that aint flyfishin, but don’t try to convince that 12 year old kid.   Now we’re getting somewhere. Fly fishing is the use of a fly rod to propel anything so light it needs the weight of the line to get anywhere. The use of lightweight bobbers and multiple flies can still be called "fly fishing".

I guess this pretty well rules out spin casting a clear bubble attached above a 6′ leader having a dry fly attached.  Personally, this works for me because the result is to drift flies with a presentation that fools the fish in the same way your defined technique does.  (I don’t do this anymore, but it certainly wouldn’t chap my hide if I say someone plying ff only waters in this fashion, especially if it was a young’un)

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   Seems like we’ve finally accomplished something?  :-)

(hee hee) What is flyfishing ? If you have to ask or try and define it, you’ll never understand it. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

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        Seems like we’ve finally accomplished something?  :-) and what would that "something" be?

the first internet gigabyte waste of bandwith for "1997 Useless Threads" category…… — TimW Halfordian Golfer

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  It seems to me that fly casting is using the weight of the line to carry the lure or (fly) to the fish. I’m attracted to this definition…..  Now we’re getting somewhere. Fly fishing is the use of a fly rod to propel anything so light it needs the weight of the line to get anywhere. The use of lightweight bobbers and multiple flies can still be called "fly fishing". RALPH may or may not want an amemdment to exclude the use of lightweight spoons or wigglers. Note: that doesn’t mean we can’t fish with bass poppers….It just puts a tight limit on how we categorize them.   Seems like we’ve finally accomplished something?  :-)

Maybe it could be simpler, fly fishing is fishing with a fly line. — Charlie…

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 It seems to me that fly casting is using the weight of the line to carry the lure or (fly) to the fish. I’m attracted to this definition…..

  Now we’re getting somewhere. Fly fishing is the use of a fly rod to propel anything so light it needs the weight of the line to get anywhere. The use of lightweight bobbers and multiple flies can still be called "fly fishing". RALPH may or may not want an amemdment to exclude the use of lightweight spoons or wigglers. Note: that doesn’t mean we can’t fish with bass poppers….It just puts a tight limit on how we categorize them.    Seems like we’ve finally accomplished something?  :-)

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m going to make one post about the definition of ff and then say no more.  It seems to me that fly casting is using the weight of the line to carry the lure or (fly) to the fish. As long as the lure is so light as to require a line to carry it to the fish it seems you are fly casting. As for what is fly fishing, you now have many different lures or (flies) that fit into the definition above. These lures or flies range from #32 up to 8" long or longer. I maintain you are fly fishing as long as you NEED the weight of the line to carry the fly to the fish. I don’t see how the use of boats or strike indicators, or anything else enters into the definition. Certainly, some types of fly fishing are more difficult than others. It doesn’t mean the others aren’t fly fishing. I think we should encourage all kinds of fly fishing. The young person we help now, with his poppers for largemouth, may someday be a #32 hook in-the-film emerger fisherman. That’s all brothers. Hope you all have a great summer of fly fishing. Jim

I’m attracted to this definition having posted something similar some time back. It concentrates on one major factor that makes flyfishing different; the cast. It also seems more consistent with the more ‘catholic’ outlook most flyfishers have these days (includes me) – adopt what works within rather broad confines. I do think though we have to exclude obvious ‘lures’ (spoons spinners etc) but don’t know what to do about "flys" that act like lures –  spoons flies tullis wigglers, plastic bills on bass poppers etc. So many of these things are constructed the same way we tie flies so though I’m tend to be not convinced they are flies I use them rather than condemn them. Ralph H replace "spamsucks" with direct for email reply.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m going to make one post about the definition of ff and then say no more.  It seems to me that fly casting is using the weight of the line to carry the lure or (fly) to the fish. As long as the lure is so light as to require a line to carry it to the fish it seems you are fly casting. As for what is fly fishing, you now have many different lures or (flies) that fit into the definition above. These lures or flies range from #32 up to 8" long or longer. I maintain you are fly fishing as long as you NEED the weight of the line to carry the fly to the fish. I don’t see how the use of boats or strike indicators, or anything else enters into the definition. Certainly, some types of fly fishing are more difficult than others. It doesn’t mean the others aren’t fly fishing. I think we should encourage all kinds of fly fishing. The young person we help now, with his poppers for largemouth, may someday be a #32 hook in-the-film emerger fisherman. That’s all brothers. Hope you all have a great summer of fly fishing. Jim

Hi Jim Good point. I agree it’s a lot more important to help a kid get started than to argue about what fly fishing is. You also have a good summer. Take care & … — Tight Lines ….. Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Catalog,Tips & Tricks, Fishing Reports, & NeverSink at: http://www.btsflyfishing.com

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I’m going to make one post about the definition of ff and then say no more.  It seems to me that fly casting is using the weight of the line to carry the lure or (fly) to the fish. As long as the lure is so light as to require a line to carry it to the fish it seems you are fly casting. As for what is fly fishing, you now have many different lures or (flies) that fit into the definition above. These lures or flies range from #32 up to 8" long or longer. I maintain you are fly fishing as long as you NEED the weight of the line to carry the fly to the fish. I don’t see how the use of boats or strike indicators, or anything else enters into the definition. Certainly, some types of fly fishing are more difficult than others. It doesn’t mean the others aren’t fly fishing. I think we should encourage all kinds of fly fishing. The young person we help now, with his poppers for largemouth, may someday be a #32 hook in-the-film emerger fisherman. That’s all brothers. Hope you all have a great summer of fly fishing. Jim

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Question:

about flyfishing, I learned as a bait fisherman. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

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about flyfishing, I learned as a bait fisherman. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

     Puleeeze, Tim! You sound as pompous as us fly-fisher-persons.      From one who learned from her father in 1938 how to sling a worm.                                   Louise Scharrenberg

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about flyfishing, I learned as a bait fisherman. — TimW Halfordian Golfer      Puleeeze, Tim! You sound as pompous as us fly-fisher-persons.      From one who learned from her father in 1938 how to sling a worm.                                   Louise Scharrenberg

Interesting twist on my post to be sure… — TimW Halfordian Golfer

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Question:

Anyone use cat fur for dubbing.Seems like it should work fine. I have a grey cat and a black and white cat that I brush. I tied a few flies with good results but haven’t fished them yet. Any experience with this.

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: Anyone use cat fur for dubbing.Seems like it should work fine. I have a : grey cat and a black and white cat that I brush. I tied a few flies with : good results but haven’t fished them yet. Any experience with this.  Ummmm…..Yes. But just don’t tell those PETA people about it. It would only make them madder at fishermen!  ;)   My experience with cat fur as dubbing has been that cat fur is rather course to work with. Try mixing in some rabbit of the same color to make the dubbing hold together better. A rabbit and alley cat blend is what Polly Rosborough like to use to make his Stone fly nymph. How do you get dubbing from a cat?  Very carefully….. Here, kitty, kitty, kitty… Jon Porter

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Anyone use cat fur for dubbing.Seems like it should work fine. I have a grey cat and a black and white cat that I brush. I tied a few flies with good results but haven’t fished them yet. Any experience with this.

Mike…. My girlfriend has a long hair white cat.  I have used the fur for dubbing and have found that it works fine.  Because the fur is so long, I have found the best use is on streamers and nymphs where you want an action like Marabou.  I tried it on a dry but it didn’t work too well. I had to keep applying floatant as it absorbed A LOT of water. Good luck, Steve Hering

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Your getting to involvoled,lighten up! A year ago I was scourering the roads for roadkill before I realized my family was worried and on the verge of suggesting psychiatric help. I enjoy fishing to much to give them the satisfaction of having a qauck tell me I need to quit. Keep your actions private and you shouldn’t have any trouble.

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Now there’s a twist, the fish eating the cat!

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I HAVE OR I SHOULD REALLY SAY MY WIFE HAS A CAT, ITS A CALICO. AND I CUT I WAD OF FUR OFF HER AND USE IT AS DUBBING. IT WORKS GREAT ON NYMPHS , WITH AMAZING RESULTS. IT IS VERY SPIKEY AND DUBS  REAL FINE. THE CALICO DOESN’T SEEM TO MIND WHEN I CUT SOME HAIR OFF HER ( IT ALWAYS GROWS BACK ) MY WIFE BITCHES ABOUT IT THOUGH.GOOD LUCK WITH THIS RENEWABLE DUBBING.

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Your getting to involvoled,lighten up! A year ago I was scourering the roads for roadkill before I realized my family was worried and on the verge of suggesting psychiatric help. I enjoy fishing to much to give them the satisfaction of having a qauck tell me I need to quit. Keep your actions private and you shouldn’t have any trouble.

What’s the best way to keep the hair from slipping once you get the skin off?    J. Rice

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I have a grey, long haired cat that has just about any shade of grey you could want. Doesn’t float too well, though…… Best Regards,                         Sourcing  Laser Diodes, Optics, Motors, Electronics, Timothy M. Beahan,              Photodiodes and such for Laser products used in the Purchasing Agent,                 Construction industry, such as aligning water pipe, Laser Alignment, Inc.             land leveling and contouring, and interior construction. 6330 28th St. SE                      Serving the world wide marketplace. Grand Rapids, MI 49546 Ph (616)942-4610 Fax (616)940-8609

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Anyone use cat fur for dubbing.Seems like it should work fine. I have a grey cat and a black and white cat that I brush. I tied a few flies with good results but haven’t fished them yet. Any experience with this.

Yes, I have a little bit of cat fur that was given to me to tie a pattern called "The Kittie Caddis".  Great shade of gray with some brown mixed in and it works great.  Story goes that my friend’s room mate used to brush his mother’s gray & brown cat to get some of the fur for fly tying without raising his mothers ire.  His mother was heartsick when the cat died and her son offered to bury the cat for her.  He shaved the fur off before he buried the cat.  Cat didn’t care, he was dead and mom never knew.  Fish like it just fine.                                               Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

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