Question:

traffic is awful (they closed down the interstate because of loose cows), it is really hard to breathe (because of smog), and it would take me half a day to get to any reasonable trout water. Have a great day!!!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hamilton, Montana: 15 Oct 02 (Trip Report Begins) We are camped on the Bitterroot River at The Angler’s Roost. The weather is gorgeous, the Montana sky blue.  Fly fishing now finds one standing in a river tunnel of golden laced Aspen and Maple trees.  The fires of fused fall colors dazzles in the sun as large, fall caddis’, dance on wiffs of warm air currents.  A light breeze brushes against your face with all the sweet fregrances of fall smells, and warming pines. . . gives pause.  One cannot but help smile as the blue tuxedoed king fisher flips along in staggered flight to the other side of the river with a wiggling minnow in its mouth. The oozel also fishes along with you not that far away, and off to the left, a cutthroat trout sups upon midges. It’s going to be a good day. George Gehrke http://www.gink.com/GG-Products-Rod-BastardBambooRodKits.html

Response:

traffic is awful (they closed down the interstate because of loose cows), it is really hard to breathe (because of smog), and it would take me half a day to get to any reasonable trout water.

    i believe you could be laying out line in the nantahala river, southwestern north carolina, in less than four hours from where you live. and charlie choc can put you on some great little streams in north by god georgia.     give the lady a hand, duc! your friend in the old north state wayno

Response:

traffic is awful (they closed down the interstate because of loose cows), it is really hard to breathe (because of smog), and it would take me half a day to get to any reasonable trout water. Have a great day!!!

Suzanna You might want to check out Jimmy Jacobs.  He has published a couple books on streams in the southeast.  The fishing here doesn’t compare to that in the west but there are some streams within a couple hours drive from the metro Atlanta area.

Response:

Where is this Charlie Choc????

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – traffic is awful (they closed down the interstate because of loose cows), it is really hard to breathe (because of smog), and it would take me half a day to get to any reasonable trout water.     i believe you could be laying out line in the nantahala river, southwestern north carolina, in less than four hours from where you live. and charlie choc can put you on some great little streams in north by god georgia.     give the lady a hand, duc! your friend in the old north state wayno

Response:

Where is this Charlie Choc????

Right here. <g I live in the Atlanta area and fish mostly Noontootla Creek these days, which isn’t that far – about an hour and a half for me, and doesn’t get blown out easily by rain. There is some nice water around Robbinsville NC (Snowbird and Santeetlah), where some of the NC contingent is gathering next week which is around a 3 hour drive, as is Tellico if you like bigger fish and more crowded fishing. Have you ever checked out the site: http://www.georgia-outdoors.com/ngto/ ? It has a lot of good information about streams in north Georgia. — Charlie…

Response:

Hamilton, Montana: 15 Oct 02 (Trip Report Begins) We are camped on the Bitterroot River at The Angler’s Roost. The weather is gorgeous, the Montana sky blue.  Fly fishing now finds one standing in a river tunnel of golden laced Aspen and Maple trees.  The fires of fused fall colors dazzles in the sun as large, fall caddis’, dance on wiffs of warm air currents.  A light breeze brushes against your face with all the sweet fregrances of fall smells, and warming pines. . . gives pause.  One cannot but help smile as the blue tuxedoed king fisher flips along in staggered flight to the other side of the river with a wiggling minnow in its mouth. The oozel also fishes along with you not that far away, and off to the left, a cutthroat trout sups upon midges. It’s going to be a good day. George Gehrke http://www.gink.com/GG-Products-Rod-BastardBambooRodKits.html

Response:

oh yea…sounds like a real good day … up there… enjoy….

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hamilton, Montana: 15 Oct 02 (Trip Report Begins) We are camped on the Bitterroot River at The Angler’s Roost. The weather is gorgeous, the Montana sky blue.  Fly fishing now finds one standing in a river tunnel of golden laced Aspen and Maple trees.  The fires of fused fall colors dazzles in the sun as large, fall caddis’, dance on wiffs of warm air currents.  A light breeze brushes against your face with all the sweet fregrances of fall smells, and warming pines. . . gives pause.  One cannot but help smile as the blue tuxedoed king fisher flips along in staggered flight to the other side of the river with a wiggling minnow in its mouth. The oozel also fishes along with you not that far away, and off to the left, a cutthroat trout sups upon midges. It’s going to be a good day. George Gehrke http://www.gink.com/GG-Products-Rod-BastardBambooRodKits.html

Response:

Question:

In other words, if you’ve made the moral decision to use a nymph, you might as well use all the weight you need to get it where it needs to be.

"the moral decision to use a nymph"??? I always considered it a tactical decision. What is the morality involved here?  Should we get Dr. Laura involved? George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

Response:

"the moral decision to use a nymph"??? I always considered it a tactical decision. What is the morality involved here?  Should we get Dr. Laura involved?

Hold on, Forty should be here momentarily… Kevin

Response:

In other words, if you’ve made the moral decision to use a nymph, you might as well use all the weight you need to get it where it needs to be. "the moral decision to use a nymph"??? I always considered it a tactical decision. What is the morality involved here?  Should we get Dr. Laura involved?

Oh fer cryin’ out loud George, why don’t you tip your nymph with a piece of corn while you’re at it?

Response:

… So the question is: do you or don’t you tie/use weighted nymphs? I’d just as soon toss in a stick of dynamite or a gallon of Clorox as to use a fucking nymph, weighted or unweighted.

That is a red herring.  Is the dynamite weighted or unweighted?

Response:

If it were me Danl, the answer is no.  You will catch fish if you weight your nymphs but what will you use, lead?  Not necessary.  You can use Zinc or copper if you want but there is a downside.  Your nymphs won’t flow along with the current drag free.  This is where 99% of all nymph fishermen mess up.  Trout are selective under water just as much as they are when coming to dry flies.  Drag free drifts is paramount if you’re going to be a savvy and serious nymph fisherman.  It’s difficult enough as it is and those who need to use bobbers while fly fishing is testimony to that fact.   Lead in a size #22 nymph isn’t going to do you any more good than weight inside a size 14 nymph or wet fly.  What you want to always maintain is a natural drift without lead and use nymphs as sparsely dressed as possible.  This is one of the reasons I make my own hand tied leaders because I would rather have weight on the knots above the main tippet and I use as much as is necessary to get the knot where the tippet is attached to the taper section, not the nymph itself.  I use a minimum of 24 inches of nymphing tippet material between the fly and the first knot.  If the weight (I use soft copper wire or zinc) for weight, if needed) and I use Xink on all my nymphs which will put my nymphs right along the same level as my tippet will be.  If your nymph is tumbling and turning and flowing along as naturally as possible, the amount of takes you’re going to get will triple compared to anyone who uses weight dragging nymphs. There is a zone of a foot or less right on the bottom of all rivers that is current free.  This is where resting fish lay as they watch food go drifting by.  As a dry fly rising fish will rise out of the current to take a fly on the surface, nymphing fish often rise from the very bottom to take a nymph passing by in the current.  You do not want your nymph ticking along the bottom as most profess you should be doing.  You want only the first weighted knot to be ticking along the bottom (every once in a while) and not the hook.  The fish that are caught with weighted nymphs are mostly force fed.  What I mean by this is the angler happens to be lucky enough to hit the fish almost right in the face.   I want to catch trout that are actively feeding on nymphs flowing along with the current because these are the fish that will swing left or right a foot or two.  There are feeding stations under water just as there are on the surface for dry fly fishermen. There is a lot more to this than what I have time to write here now, but to answer your question, you don’t need weighted flies as much as you do need more "Drag Free" drifts. George Gehrke Nymphomaniac Fly Fisherman – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Owing to the fact the I lost most of my collection of PT nymphs (to a group of rapscallionous willows, aided and abetted by an army of cattails on steroids and a navy of submerged logs) a couple of weeks ago on the Owens, I need to replenish my supply. At least that’s my excuse for spending hours at the tying bench, busily not doing other chores. So the question is: do you or don’t you tie/use weighted nymphs? Danl That’s the best straight line I can serve up tonight…….

Response:

I generally use weighted nymphs, but I prefer to use bead-heads, when practical, to weight them. Bead-head pheasnat tail nymphs are one of my most productive flies.

Mostly because of the "Apex Flash" on the round globe of the bead, not because of the extra weight which is mostly mute in its ability to influence a fishes’ attention Tim. George Gehrke Nymph maniac Fly Fisherman

Response:

I’d just as soon toss in a stick of dynamite or a gallon of Clorox as to use a fucking nymph, weighted or unweighted. — Ken Fortenberry

Okay?!  So why do you say and feel like this about nymph fishing Ken?   George Gehrke "interested"

Response:

… So the question is: do you or don’t you tie/use weighted nymphs? I’d just as soon toss in a stick of dynamite or a gallon of Clorox as to use a fucking nymph, weighted or unweighted. That is a red herring.  Is the dynamite weighted or unweighted?

that, will you please? jesus! my sides hurt . . .

Response:

Seems to me that it really depends on the water you’re fishing. Clearly, an unweighted nymph casts better and makes more elegant presentations,  and a heavy nymph is pretty ugly in the air, but if the water is fast and deep it’s hard to get an unweighted fly down near the bottom. I suppose one solution would be to use a sinking line, but in the small streams that I usually fish I’ve never been able to see much value in using it. And I don’t like having to carry a floating line for dries and a sinking line for nymphs. In other words, if you’ve made the moral decision to use a nymph, you might as well use all the weight you need to get it where it needs to be. — Bob Patton

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Owing to the fact the I lost most of my collection of PT nymphs (to a group of rapscallionous willows, aided and abetted by an army of cattails on steroids and a navy of submerged logs) a couple of weeks ago on the Owens, I need to replenish my supply. At least that’s my excuse for spending hours at the tying bench, busily not doing other chores. So the question is: do you or don’t you tie/use weighted nymphs? Danl That’s the best straight line I can serve up tonight…….

Response:

… So the question is: do you or don’t you tie/use weighted nymphs? I’d just as soon toss in a stick of dynamite or a gallon of Clorox as to use a fucking nymph, weighted or unweighted.

personally, i like fucking nymphs…… but what the hell ken, whatever floats yer boat <g –waldo

Response:

I like to use a heavily weighted Copper John along with an unweighted nymph, or maybe two. The Copper John takes the place of splitshot, but has fish-catching capability. I still haven’t figured out whether it’s better to put the weighted fly on the top or the bottom. Any opinions on that? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

personally, i like fucking nymphs…… but what the hell ken, whatever floats yer boat <g

Past tense, right Walt ? — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

… So the question is: do you or don’t you tie/use weighted nymphs? I’d just as soon toss in a stick of dynamite or a gallon of Clorox as to use a fucking nymph, weighted or unweighted. personally, i like fucking nymphs……

Weighted or unweighted?

Response:

Ken Fortenberry wrote… I’d just as soon toss in a stick of dynamite or a gallon of Clorox as to use a fucking nymph, weighted or unweighted.

Oh you dry fly snob! Joel Axelrad **DFD**

Response:

well, if there is really nothing doing on dries, and I can’t spark some action with soft-hackles, sure, I have some weighted nymphs in my boxes. Mostly I’ll go with bead-heads or in some places weighted stone-fly nymphs. I don’t much like casting heavy flies, nor flies with split-shot, but I’ll do what it takes.  I tend to fish places where I can get by just fine without resorting to heavy stuff. Eugene – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Owing to the fact the I lost most of my collection of PT nymphs (to a group of rapscallionous willows, aided and abetted by an army of cattails on steroids and a navy of submerged logs) a couple of weeks ago on the Owens, I need to replenish my supply. At least that’s my excuse for spending hours at the tying bench, busily not doing other chores. So the question is: do you or don’t you tie/use weighted nymphs? I seldom weight nymphs and I just don’t like the way beadheads look. (I know they catch fish but……) I prefer weight on the leader to weight on the fly in most situations. The only nymphs that I consistant tie with weight are large stoneflies. Willi

Response:

I still haven’t figured out whether it’s better to put the weighted fly on the top or the bottom. Any opinions on that?

I think the unweighted fly "swims" better, more naturally, if it’s on the bottom.  The weighted fly serves the same function as a split shot, but lets the other fly drift more or less freely. JR

Response:

I still haven’t figured out whether it’s better to put the weighted fly on the top or the bottom. Any opinions on that?

I put the weighted fly on top with the unweighted fly on the bottom (point). Just seems to be a logical arrangement, and I have had  success using it. George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

Response:

Owing to the fact the I lost most of my collection of PT nymphs (to a group of rapscallionous willows, aided and abetted by an army of cattails on steroids and a navy of submerged logs) a couple of weeks ago on the Owens, I need to replenish my supply. At least that’s my excuse for spending hours at the tying bench, busily not doing other chores. So the question is: do you or don’t you tie/use weighted nymphs?

I seldom weight nymphs and I just don’t like the way beadheads look. (I know they catch fish but……) I prefer weight on the leader to weight on the fly in most situations. The only nymphs that I consistant tie with weight are large stoneflies. Willi

Response:

… So the question is: do you or don’t you tie/use weighted nymphs? I’d just as soon toss in a stick of dynamite or a gallon of Clorox as to use a fucking nymph, weighted or unweighted.

I would certainly prefer to use dries all the time, but western tailwaters generally require small(sz 20-26) midge larva patterns.  Over the past few years I would guess that I use nymphs nearly 85% of the time.  This includes dropping a nymph from a dry or using a two nymph rig.     Regarding the use of weighed nymphs.  I have started to stay away from weighted nymphs.  I prefer to use weight directly on the tippet, generally 12 to 18 inches above the point fly.  A tailwater guide in Colorado recently pointed out how weighted nymphs simply don’t float naturally through the water column and he always uses unweighted nymphs.   He also pointed out how BH patterns generally don’t look realistic and more often than not many BH(bead heads) are too big for the hook size.   Especially when dealing with sz 24 midge patterns! For weight, I use that green coated stuff from England.  Can’t think of the name right now…. — remove all x’s for reply email. To worry is folly so let us be jolly.

Response:

    I do indeed tie weighted nymphs.  I use a red thread head on my weighted ones to indicate the difference from non-weighted.  I find arsenic-core lead solder to be a good weighting material as I don’t even have to use a priest, not that I ever would.  I do like the feel of those apache or golden trout flopping around in the creel, so some times I use the unweighted flies with the black-thread or beadheads.     By the way, for all those folk looking for a replacement for Gink, got an old transformer sitting out in the back yard and the liquid in that is great.  Keeps a fly floating forever.  I can ship a quart or two to anyone that needs it.  Might not want to hold your floatant bottle in your teeth, though.     Oh, by the way, for all you pissy C&R folks, I do practice it.  I got a latch on the bottom of the creel that lets me empty that sucker real quick if I see a ranger.  All he’ll find in there is a digital camera and an invite to the Elks Club Fly Tie. Danl,    I’ve gotten away from lead wire sinking nymphs and have found the ease of use of bead heads.  If I need to sink a nymph without a bead, I have found that the split-shot works great. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply.

Response:

… So the question is: do you or don’t you tie/use weighted nymphs?

I’d just as soon toss in a stick of dynamite or a gallon of Clorox as to use a fucking nymph, weighted or unweighted. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

So the question is: do you or don’t you tie/use weighted nymphs? That’s the best straight line I can serve up tonight…….

Keeps the ball rolling anyway. The only weight I’ll add to a PT is a copper beadhead,  a small one (3/32" for #14, 5/64" for #16, nothing on smaller sizes).  I like a slim silhouette on PTs and think wrapping weight on the shank ruins that.   The flies I most often weight (other than winter steelhead flies) are woolly buggers.  I’ll also weight Prince and stonefly nymphs, which I frequently fish together with a smaller unweighted fly on a dropper. JR

Response:

8< . So the question is: do you or don’t you tie/use weighted nymphs?

yes. –waldo

Response:

I generally use weighted nymphs, but I prefer to use bead-heads, when practical, to weight them. Bead-head pheasnat tail nymphs are one of my most productive flies. Tim Lysyk

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Owing to the fact the I lost most of my collection of PT nymphs (to a group of rapscallionous willows, aided and abetted by an army of cattails on steroids and a navy of submerged logs) a couple of weeks ago on the Owens, I need to replenish my supply. At least that’s my excuse for spending hours at the tying bench, busily not doing other chores. So the question is: do you or don’t you tie/use weighted nymphs? Danl That’s the best straight line I can serve up tonight…….

Response:

Owing to the fact the I lost most of my collection of PT nymphs (to a group of rapscallionous willows, aided and abetted by an army of cattails on steroids and a navy of submerged logs) a couple of weeks ago on the Owens, I need to replenish my supply. At least that’s my excuse for spending hours at the tying bench, busily not doing other chores. So the question is: do you or don’t you tie/use weighted nymphs? Danl That’s the best straight line I can serve up tonight…….

Response:

Question:

A lot of people want to vote for Nader and help the Green Party, but they don’t want Bush to win. It’s possible that votes for Nader in swing states will throw the election to Bush. There are two websites that help:         http://www.nadertrader.org         http://www.voteswap2000.com The idea is that a Gore supporter will vote for Nader in a state that is safe for Bush (like Texas) if a Nader supporter will vote for Gore in a swing state. That way, the Green Party gets the same popular vote, but Bush (it is hoped) is denied a victory. This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A lot of people want to vote for Nader and help the Green Party, but they don’t want Bush to win. It’s possible that votes for Nader in swing states will throw the election to Bush. There are two websites that help:    http://www.nadertrader.org    http://www.voteswap2000.com The idea is that a Gore supporter will vote for Nader in a state that is safe for Bush (like Texas) if a Nader supporter will vote for Gore in a swing state. That way, the Green Party gets the same popular vote, but Bush (it is hoped) is denied a victory. This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ <

Why don’t you fucking people stop the fucking election bull shit, left or right, and get back to fly fishing. Joel Axelrad

Response:

Hey Jaxfly. Now, now.. relax.. it’s almost over.  Just keep repeating, it’s almost over. Instead of bitching, perhaps you might go fishing for a while, chill, and not read the political postings? now then, back to your regularly scheduled political ad….

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A lot of people want to vote for Nader and help the Green Party, but they don’t want Bush to win. It’s possible that votes for Nader in swing states will throw the election to Bush. There are two websites that help: http://www.nadertrader.org http://www.voteswap2000.com The idea is that a Gore supporter will vote for Nader in a state that is safe for Bush (like Texas) if a Nader supporter will vote for Gore in a swing state. That way, the Green Party gets the same popular vote, but Bush (it is hoped) is denied a victory. This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ < Why don’t you fucking people stop the fucking election bull shit, left or right, and get back to fly fishing. Joel Axelrad

Response:

Joel, a fellow Illini, includes rw’s whole damn post, then bitches: A lot of people want to vote for Nader … Why don’t you fucking people stop the fucking election bull shit, left or right, and get back to fly fishing.

— Ken Fortenberry- vote for Nader willya, Joel, won’t matter, Illinois is solid Gore.

Response:

Why don’t you fucking people stop the fucking election bull shit, left or right, and get back to fly fishing.

I take it you aren’t interested in trading a Gore vote for a Nader vote? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Instead of bitching, perhaps you might go fishing for a while, chill,

Anyone who went fishing in the Northeast this weekend definitely chilled. Brrrrr! George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A lot of people want to vote for Nader and help the Green Party, but they don’t want Bush to win. It’s possible that votes for Nader in swing states will throw the election to Bush. There are two websites that help:    http://www.nadertrader.org    http://www.voteswap2000.com The idea is that a Gore supporter will vote for Nader in a state that is safe for Bush (like Texas) if a Nader supporter will vote for Gore in a swing state. That way, the Green Party gets the same popular vote, but Bush (it is hoped) is denied a victory. This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on.

Here’s what the Nader people have to say about this From CNET: [That move drew criticism Saturday from Public Citizen, the umbrella group for consumer causes founded by Nader. It said the ads would mark "a new low" in the presidential campaign and "is designed to mislead voters." ] Interesting how the ultimate consumer/public advocate thinks this is something to mislead people.  I’ll borrow a favorite phrase of Al Gore’s and simply call it…"a risky scheme". Natty (one who knows a vast LEFT wing conspiracy when he sees one) Before you buy.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A lot of people want to vote for Nader and help the Green Party, but they don’t want Bush to win. It’s possible that votes for Nader in swing states will throw the election to Bush. There are two websites that help:    http://www.nadertrader.org    http://www.voteswap2000.com The idea is that a Gore supporter will vote for Nader in a state that is safe for Bush (like Texas) if a Nader supporter will vote for Gore in a swing state. That way, the Green Party gets the same popular vote, but Bush (it is hoped) is denied a victory. This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on.

Why? The greasy weasels in the RNC are running *pro Nader* ads in many of the swing states – kinda puts them in a bind if they try to make any noise about trading votes… /daytripper

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A lot of people want to vote for Nader and help the Green Party, but they don’t want Bush to win. It’s possible that votes for Nader in swing states will throw the election to Bush. There are two websites that help:       http://www.nadertrader.org       http://www.voteswap2000.com The idea is that a Gore supporter will vote for Nader in a state that is safe for Bush (like Texas) if a Nader supporter will vote for Gore in a swing state. That way, the Green Party gets the same popular vote, but Bush (it is hoped) is denied a victory. This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on. Here’s what the Nader people have to say about this From CNET: [That move drew criticism Saturday from Public Citizen, the umbrella group for consumer causes founded by Nader. It said the ads would mark "a new low" in the presidential campaign and "is designed to mislead voters." ] Interesting how the ultimate consumer/public advocate thinks this is something to mislead people.  I’ll borrow a favorite phrase of Al Gore’s and simply call it…"a risky scheme".

I’m afraid you’re wrong about this, Hawkeye. The criticism from Public Citizen was directed at the Bush campaign for using footage of Nader attacking Gore in their ads, in an obvious attempt to swing Gore support to Nader. I think this is actually a pretty low-down trick, but it’s probably legal. It may backfire. The websites I posted are actually being created and promoted by pro-Nader people (who don’t want Bush to win). I don’t know what the Nader ccampaign’s official position is. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Instead of bitching, perhaps you might go fishing for a while, chill, Anyone who went fishing in the Northeast this weekend definitely chilled. Brrrrr! George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

I had to clean the snow off my truck before I went to the store!                                  Mike

Response:

This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on. Why? The greasy weasels in the RNC are running *pro Nader* ads in many of the swing states – kinda puts them in a bind if they try to make any noise about trading votes…

C’mon, Tripper. Get real. Since when has hypocrisy prevented the Republicans from complaining about something? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

____  I smoked the fish but I didn’t inhale. — George G. Bastard Bamboo Fly Rods http://www.gink.com/ http://www.gink.com/chat

Response:

I’m afraid you’re wrong about this, Hawkeye. The criticism from Public Citizen was directed at the Bush campaign for using footage of Nader attacking Gore in their ads, in an obvious attempt to swing Gore support to Nader. I think this is actually a pretty low-down trick, but it’s probably legal. It may backfire. The websites I posted are actually being created and promoted by pro-Nader people (who don’t want Bush to win). I don’t know what the Nader ccampaign’s official position is.

When I’m wrong, I admit it…I’m wrong and you are right RW.  Shame on me for employing a "speed read" on the cnet article.  After giving it a second read I see the reference to the Bush /Nader ads. I agree it is a strategy that could very well backfire on GW.  As for it’s legality, I would think the vote swapping thing, if it’s highly organized would have a much better chance at raising some legal eyebrows than simply running ads for another candidate. I really can’t wait until this election is over.  Between fuzzy math, Tammy Fae Baker makeup, ice-tea drinking at Budhist temples, the whole American political process is a freak show.  Besides, I’m a man without a candidate. Natty (looking to pull the lever for the Libertarian candidate….for once) Before you buy.

Response:

Why don’t you fucking people stop the fucking election bull shit, left or right, and get back to fly fishing. Joel Axelrad

Good idea Joel. You start. Haven’t seen any posts from you lately, fishing or otherwise. Willi

Response:

Since when has hypocrisy prevented the Republicans from complaining about something?

Seems to me the dems are guilty of some hypocrisy as well.  Al Gore goes campaigning in the south talking about how he grew and harvested tobacco, then gets on the bandwagon to put the tobacco companies out of business.  Bill Clinton said "I pledge to run the most ethical administration in this nations history"….well, I don’t think I have to expand on that one.  And of course, Bill didn’t inhale which makes him either really stupid or just a liar….you decide. My point is that they are all hypocrits.  If you’re lucky enough to identify with one or two key issues shared with a candidate then cast your vote and hope they don’t pull a fast one on you. For me, I could never vote for Gore, a man who thinks the answer to any issue is a government program or handout.  A man who would re-write the 2nd amendment to read "..the right of the people to keep and bear a hunting rifle as long as said rifle is single shot, non-scoped, government approved and stored at the local law enforcement agency".  No, I don’t believe what dems try to spin to us….that republicans want to poison the air and water, throw our seniors into the streets and starve all the schoolchildren. It’s fuzzy politics (a little GW lingo there). Am I crazy about GW?  No way.  But if I had to choose between Al Gore and GW, I’ll take GW.  I recall a speech given by a democrat who said "…ask not what your country can do for you….". I think the democratic party has gotten away from where he was trying to take it. Just my .02 and I can almost feel the flames coming already. Natty (enjoying my access to the Al Gore created internet) Before you buy.

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\ Why don’t you fucking people stop the fucking election bull shit, left or right, and get back to fly fishing. \

Because trout are more sensitive to environmental changes than bullhead or carp are. -Muskie

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 If in doubt, vote for the brighter man. That would be Al Gore. -Muskie

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Since when has hypocrisy prevented the Republicans from complaining about something? Seems to me the dems are guilty of some hypocrisy as well.  

Hypocrisy is endemic to politics. I have no doubt that Democratic politicians are often guilty of hypocrisy. The thing is, though, that the Republicans have raised it to an art form in recent years. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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Seems to me the dems are guilty of some hypocrisy as well.  Al Gore goes campaigning in the south talking about how he grew and harvested tobacco, then gets on the bandwagon to put the tobacco companies out of business.

<balanced snipped for brevity Excellent post, Natty…..My feelings exactly. George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A lot of people want to vote for Nader and help the Green Party, but they don’t want Bush to win. It’s possible that votes for Nader in swing states will throw the election to Bush. There are two websites that help: http://www.nadertrader.org http://www.voteswap2000.com The idea is that a Gore supporter will vote for Nader in a state that is safe for Bush (like Texas) if a Nader supporter will vote for Gore in a swing state. That way, the Green Party gets the same popular vote, but Bush (it is hoped) is denied a victory. This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Is not bartering a form of sale? Is it not illegal to sell your vote? Besides I expect all those dead people in Miami to vote again like in 62. I expect if GW wins, the lights in Washington will dim from the overload caused by massive paper shredder use.

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Is not bartering a form of sale? Is it not illegal to sell your vote?

There’s no barter involved. No one is selling a vote. It’s purely voluntary arrangement, based on trust, — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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 The thing is, though, that the Republicans have raised it to an art form in recent years. —

 Well hell yes ,why not ? they’ve had Bill Clinton to study and learn from for eight years. Bob-reluctantly Republican Before you buy.

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Seems to me the dems are guilty of some hypocrisy as well.  Al Gore goes campaigning in the south talking about how he grew and harvested tobacco, then gets on the bandwagon to put the tobacco companies out of business.

How is that hypocrisy? When Gore was young the dangers of tobacco were not known and growing tobacco was a perfectly honorable way to make a living. Things are different now. There are plenty of examples of hypocrisy on both sides but this is not one of them. Peter G. Aitken

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How is that hypocrisy? When Gore was young the dangers of tobacco were not known and growing tobacco was a perfectly honorable way to make a living.

The Surgeon General’s report on the dangers of smoking was released in 1964. Gore would have been in his teens. George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Seems to me the dems are guilty of some hypocrisy as well.  Al Gore goes campaigning in the south talking about how he grew and harvested tobacco, then gets on the bandwagon to put the tobacco companies out of business. How is that hypocrisy? When Gore was young the dangers of tobacco were not known and growing tobacco was a perfectly honorable way to make a living. Things are different now. There are plenty of examples of hypocrisy on both sides but this is not one of them. Peter G. Aitken

Gore was bragging to tobacco farmers in his home state when he was running for office that he " planted it, weeded it, picked it, cured it and sold it just like the rest of ya ", while at the same time his own sister was dying from smoking related cancer. Of coures after his sister died he saw a GREAT opportunity to use her death for political gain so after he was safely elected to the senate and running for president (1988) he gave his " sitting at my sisters death bed I vowed to fight against the tobacco industry with ever fiber of my being " speech. Just a few VERY SHORT years after his " I’m a PROUD tobacco farmer". Of course when he was running for office in Tennessee he was pro life, pro gun and pro tobacco. That’s what he needed to be to get elected. When he began running for the White House he became what he thought he needed to be to win, pro abortion, anti gun and anti tobacco. The guy is a bigger snake than Bill Clinton ever dreamed of being. I don’t know what kind of president G.W.B will make, you never know till they actually land the job. But I do know what kind of pres. Gore would be and I don’t want four years of him in the White House. Clintons main concern was his dick and looking for a legacy. Gore is a "crusader" with alot of bad ideas. He scares me "big time". Bob Before you buy.

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Question:

Yeah right… somebody’s in my way, so kill him. Land of the free, hey?

Well to be serious for a moment, I do not carry a handgun. I do, however, carry a size 6 weighted wooly bugger and I would feel no remorse whatsoever if I ripped some GDA’s nose off with it. I have not done this to date, but not for lack of trying. You all Europeans can become one with universe, hum mantras and tsk, tsk at the uncivilized North Americans if you wish, but <assume John Wayne accent sometimes a man’s gotta do what a man’s gotta do. — Ken Fortenberry

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 Hollow points tend not to pass through and kill an innocent bystander. Especially if you are using subsonic rounds. —  Don Thompson  Zoomie(BushBug)  ACA#3460  TLCB#335  Any Time, Any Place  Pull the chocks, lets get this kite in the air.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I try to hold my temper and sense of proportion in check. But necessary or overkill?

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You have no idea how impressive a size 6/0 pikestreamer can be when adequately stripped.. Ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm <ad infinitum Herman – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yeah right… somebody’s in my way, so kill him. Land of the free, hey? Well to be serious for a moment, I do not carry a handgun. I do, however, carry a size 6 weighted wooly bugger and I would feel no remorse whatsoever if I ripped some GDA’s nose off with it. I have not done this to date, but not for lack of trying. You all Europeans can become one with universe, hum mantras and tsk, tsk at the uncivilized North Americans if you wish, but <assume John Wayne accent sometimes a man’s gotta do what a man’s gotta do. — Ken Fortenberry

– Cheers, Herman Herman Nijland Daytime webmaster Lifetime flyfisher

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It was not malicious.  I must admit that I prefer to know the correct names of the people with whom I am communicating, and see no particularly good reasons for aliases here normally .  But it is like many things, purely a matter of personal choice. I never for a moment thought it was malicious.  As for the name..I’ve been using it for about 7 years now and use it for everything online. Just what I started with  so it’s a habit.

Using an alias online is an excellent idea that I recommend to everyone. I’m speaking from a truly harrowing personal experience that I’ve related in this newsgroup. I don’t mind most people knowing my real name, which is Stephen Barnard, but I don’t want it continually plastered all over Usenet. So I compromise. I use an alias, but I reveal my name occasionally so at least the regulars know whom they’re talking to. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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Mike Connor  AKA Upstream Spider

How do we know that your name is really Mike Connor? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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snip their own sense of etiquette. Bad temper, and bad manners can end up in a feedback loop that only makes things worse. And it seems more likely the more of us there are sharing the water. I try to hold my temper and sense of proportion in check. But or overkill?

My math isn’t very good but I come up with: more fishermen * same streams = more fishermen per stream (and most of them pissed off) The only variable I see there is the fishermen. They must change in either attitude or numbers. Nothing else will. Please advise where, when & if you plan to thin the standing crop of anglers. Thanks Kiyu

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My math isn’t very good but I come up with: more fishermen * same streams = more fishermen per stream (and most of them pissed off) Kiyu

You’re right, it isn’t.  That should be Fisherman / streams = fishermen per stream Kevin  

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – snip their own sense of etiquette. Bad temper, and bad manners can end up in a feedback loop that only makes things worse. And it seems more likely the more of us there are sharing the water. I try to hold my temper and sense of proportion in check. But or overkill? My math isn’t very good but I come up with: more fishermen * same streams = more fishermen per stream (and most of them pissed off) The only variable I see there is the fishermen. They must change in either attitude or numbers. Nothing else will. Please advise where, when & if you plan to thin the standing crop of anglers.

The situation is actually somewhat more complicated than what you describe.  In nearly fifty years on this planet I have met thousands of divorced persons, male and female.  Surprisingly, and in apparent defiance of immutable natural laws, in each case I have met the aggrieved party; NEVER the asshole.  The same sort of peculiarity marks my contacts with fishermen.  I never meet (in a social setting) the ill bred yuppie prick or the inbred bubba dipshit; only the well mannered and considerate gentlemen.  Anyone who doubts the possibility of something like this occurring need only read these pages for a few weeks.  All any of us asks is that we be allowed unlimited time in our favorite fishing spots unencumbered by the presence of any other human being within 12,000 miles or so.  What could be more reasonable and selfless?  Now, since we are ALL entirely void of the deplorable characteristics displayed by the lummoxen of whom we complain, it stands to reason that fishing assholes, like divorced assholes, are the residents of a parallel universe who somehow manage to cross over at odd intervals just to wreak havoc on our own blameless lives.  And since we have no reason to believe that the laws of nature behave differently in parallel universes it follows that simply shooting the bastards will never solve the problem because there are in all likelihood just as many of them as there are of us and from what I here they breed like rats anyway.  As well attack the tides with wooden lance! Wolfgang Oh WHY can’t everyone just be more like me?!

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snip one brookie but it was loads of fun on that lovely little rod.  Definitely a keeper.

I wouldn’t sell your stock in Sage just yet. I haven’t tossed a line with an RPL+ but from what I have read here they are nice rods and it is good to switch back and forth from time to time to appreciate what each rod can do for your fishing as your fishing & casting style will change over time. On another note and to revisit the GD I just will never get used to dealing with such incredibly inconsiderate, self consumed jerks.

As our streams become more crowded we will encounter and endure more "self consumed jerks" ….. and beginners who get mistaken for them. Sure streamside courtesy needs to be understood by all but I would doubt that hostile displays do much more than make the other angler think the messenger is a jerk.<G Beginners are usually (if they attended a class) taught in flocks and their early streamside habits often reflect this. Time & observation usually cures their crowding tendencies. A lot of seemingly inconsiderate behavior by experienced fishermen is because different streams develop their own codes of behavior and this gets carried over from stream to stream. I can almost guarantee that someone who regularly fishes a no-holds-barred, fight-for-your-space stream will seem to be a real jerk on a stream that has plenty of angling space and a different stream culture until he gets in sync with his surroundings. I have been on both ends of this. Most people don’t want to interfere with another’s fishing. If I feel someone has encroached upon what I deem to be my fishing space and I want to make a statement about it I quickly reel in without a word & leave for another spot. It is an obvious gesture, is very clear and often gets an apology (unless the person actually is a jerk in which case he will probably not understand any gesture except the single fingered one – and that could get dangerous for all parites). As well, I have sought out anglers to apologize to who have responded similarly to my own chowderheaded but inadvertent encroachments. Works for me – may not work for you. Kiyu

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yeah right… somebody’s in my way, so kill him. Land of the free, hey? Herman Ah, well, there is something to be said about etiquette. … Within 5 minutes, here he is, right in front of me. So I move downstream. This little game goes on for the next hour.  … Well, nobody owns the stream, we must learn to cope with whomever else shares it with us. Phooey, this is why god invented handguns. — Ken Fortenberry — Cheers, Herman Herman Nijland Daytime webmaster Lifetime flyfisher

sharing at all.  One doesn’t share reverie or tranquility.  It is a selfish thing we all need.  Some people need to  get away from even looking or seeing another human being.  Fly fishing is one place where that is possible.  Disturbing a man’s reverie is about the biggest sin anyone can do to another fly fisherman.  Reverie is so precious to some that to disturb it is to replace it with rage, which is reverie’s opposite.   Normally, there are other humans about fishing but it then comes down to a zone of several hundred yards or just a hundred yards but no less than that. It can mean, don’t dog my trail and don’t follow me around. Fly fishing is more a state of mind as anything else.  It doesnot need to be catching anything at all.  It can just be a place not to be shared or seen by others.  It can be just the knowledge that someone walks well around and away who is smart enough not to even say "hello."  One doesn’t go fly fishing to hear ‘hello’ from others, believe it or not.  All this sounds cruel, but ’some individuals’ need a piece of heaven on earth that is undisturbed.  This is a feature in the outdoors that is becoming rarer as each year goes by. As Mel Levin said one time, "Don’t say hello to that guy!  Before you know it, you’ll be exchanging flies, business cards and when you get home you will either get a telephone call or a love letter!  NEVER, say hello astream!" Finally, there is that burning question we all get, or at least the ones that are catching trout.  Suddenly!  From behind comes this rude invasion of privacy.  "What fly are you using?" I always answer, "The one found in "Matching the Hatch!"  Why do you ask? — Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

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"Ken Fortenberry" wrote…  … Well, nobody owns the stream, we must learn to cope with whomever else shares it with us. Phooey, this is why god invented handguns.

Ok, I’m relatively new to the sport of fly fishing. I mean, I’ve fished about 100 days in the last year, but almost always by myself on a private pond. So although I try to be a good sport and show etiquette, I can envision that somebody might infringe on someone else out of naivete rather than ill-will. I hope that if I were to–out of a lack of knowledge–infringe on what someone else considered to be their fishing "space" that the other party would be willing correct me politely and only shoot if I did it a second time. I’m assuming as well that we’re talking about infringement by strangers and not necessarily situations where you’re fishing with someone you know, right? –Steve (so call me an idiot, at least I’m trying to learn)

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Last year, I was fishing Mt. Vernon creek, a small popular spot not too far from Madison, WI. My buddy and I were treated to a streamside invective (a litany, really) directed by a fellow fisherman at the injustice of having arrived to find the stream full of other fisherman when he had been fishing that water for 20 years. Didn’t get a lot of sympathy from me, as I’ve been fishing it a good 5 years longer. But I *could* understand the frustration he must have felt as he watched the crowds grow over the years. For ourselves, we had already begun to leave work early in order to beat others to the stream. I suspect this guy has learned the same trick, or begun driving further. I wonder if some of the increased inconsiderate behavior we’ve had to bear over the years resulted from bad tempers caused by other, usually thoughtful people who had experienced boorishness just one too many times, and lost their own sense of etiquette. Bad temper, and bad manners can end up in a feedback loop that only makes things worse. And it seems more likely the more of us there are sharing the water. I try to hold my temper and sense of proportion in check. But or overkill?

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Yeah right… somebody’s in my way, so kill him. Land of the free, hey? Herman – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ah, well, there is something to be said about etiquette. … Within 5 minutes, here he is, right in front of me. So I move downstream. This little game goes on for the next hour.  … Well, nobody owns the stream, we must learn to cope with whomever else shares it with us. Phooey, this is why god invented handguns. — Ken Fortenberry

– Cheers, Herman Herman Nijland Daytime webmaster Lifetime flyfisher

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Set out this morning in a fine, misty rain eager to fish a new 2 wt. I picked up yesterday afternoon (Orvis, Silver Label 792) to determine if it was a keeper or not.  Suffice is to say, I love the new rod.  I had used a Sage RPL+ in the past and didn’t like it at all…..it was very fast, felt like a darn pool cue.  After 15 minutes or so getting used to casting the full flex action rod it was turning over a size 18 furry black ant beautifully, laying it down on the water as though it had fallen from an overhanging tree limb (actually did manage to snag a tree).  Unfortunately, the weather took a turn for the worse and the light mist turned into a steady rain within the hour.  During that time I managed only one brookie but it was loads of fun on that lovely little rod.  Definitely a keeper. On another note and to revisit the GD Ahole thread…….I had been on the stream for about 30 minutes and was working my way upstream when this jerk comes tromping into the water about 20 yards upstream from me and begins dead drifting some sort of wet fly downstream in my direction all the while chatting with his buddy who was sitting up on the bank, obviously perturbed that I had the nerve to get there before them!  Good thing I didn’t have a gun, I may have just been pissed enough to use it . Anyway, I fished (more like just spent the time false casting the new 2 wt as close to him as I could) a little while longer and since the weather wasn’t great I just tromped and splashed as loudly and clumsily as I could upstream, right past him  and exited about 30 yards past the two interlopers. I just will never get used to dealing with such incredibly inconsiderate, self consumed jerks.  My 4 year old son has the brains and common sense consideration to know better than to do what they did.  When I was leaving I noticed their truck had out of state tags…I guess they figured since they traveled to get there they weren’t going to let anything stop them from wetting a line. Natty

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My 4 year old son has the brains and common sense consideration to know better than to do what they did.

Well that’s probably because your son has a better father than those 2 guys. Don’t get angry with them – feel sorry for them. Regards, Jeff

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Two wrongs don

Question:

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Question:

Happy New Year to all my fellow Fisher-people. This light spinning tackle inshore salt water fisherman is ready to learn how to fish with a fly rod. I am looking for a 9ft 8wt fly rod that will be my learning rod. My question then is… How good are Cabela’s saltwater Fly rod blanks? How Bout the SL or FT blanks? How would these compare to the GLoomis GL3 blanks? Or is there a better route to take, maybe a fly rod combo set-up for saltwater. What do I need to look for when picking out a fly reel? Is there one type/model/construction/drag that would be advantageous over another? Thanks, Jay

Jay I can’t talk about Cabela’s, I don’t use their stuff, but I have used a Loomis GL3 8/9 weight 9 foot megataper saltwater rod for the past two years.  Unlike other salties, it has a soft tip that makes it useful for salmon, steelhead, bass, pike etc. (my type of fishing.) The usual salty is a broomstick, designed to put a lot of leverage on a fish.  Generally, they are brute force canons capable of great distances but pathetic to cast with any finesse.  They don’t really begin to load until you’ve got 30-40 foot of line beyond the tiptop. The GL3 8/9 is an exception, capable of delicate short casts, yet can match distance with any of them. Good diameter butt section for strength.  Very light, which is very important at the end of a long day.  At 3.85 ounces, there are 6 and 7 weights that weigh more. I was recently fishing for steelhead with another fishermen who was using an Orvis Trident salty.  He fishes salt frequently, and he made the same comments to me, as we compared rods.  I found his rod difficult to cast well, probably would be very difficult for a beginner.  On the other hand, my GL3 8/9 feels like a nice trout 6 weight, very easy to cast. A good reel match for the GL3 8/9 is the Lamson 3.5.  Tough reel, good drag, balances out the GL3 8/9 beautifully, tons of room for backing. Peter

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Happy New Year to all my fellow Fisher-people. This light spinning tackle inshore salt water fisherman is ready to learn how to fish with a fly rod. I am looking for a 9ft 8wt fly rod that will be my learning rod. My question then is… How good are Cabela’s saltwater Fly rod blanks? How Bout the SL or FT blanks? How would these compare to the GLoomis GL3 blanks? Or is there a better route to take, maybe a fly rod combo set-up for saltwater. What do I need to look for when picking out a fly reel? Is there one type/model/construction/drag that would be advantageous over another? Thanks, Jay

I know I’ll eat some flames for this but I would recommend getting one of the Orvis Clearwater combos.  I think the 8wt goes for about $180.00 and it is ready to fish.  I own one and it casts nice, and can double as a steelhead/salmon rod when you are in the mood. -John —        My Policy is to ALWAYS Blame the Computer

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Anything Cabela’s sells is usually very good and they give you a 100% satisfaction guaranty.   Joel Axelrad

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Happy New Year to all my fellow Fisher-people.  This light spinning tackle inshore salt water fisherman is ready to learn how to fish with a fly rod. I am looking for a 9ft 8wt fly rod that will be my learning rod. My question then is… How good are Cabela’s saltwater Fly rod blanks? How Bout the SL or FT blanks? How would these compare to the GLoomis GL3 blanks? Or is there a better route to take, maybe a fly rod combo set-up for saltwater. What do I need to look for when picking out a fly reel? Is there one type/model/construction/drag that would be advantageous over another? Thanks, Jay

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Question:

There is a darkness rooted in me and I’m afraid my angling is entangled in this darkness. I began this journey with a ten dollar fiberglass rod and a level line, dreaming of something. How I got this jaded I don’t know, for the life of me. An angling friend recently told me that I have become "too dark and competitive" to fish with. I’ve been lurking around like a werewolf, scaring people, aching and horrified. It’s time for me to stop, not for

You have many brothers and they have many faces. The whole C&R issue breeds this type of mentality. Just think for a minute if you had to work real hard just to catch one fish, rather than become jaded by the fact that you catch many and play into the sickness. The other fact is the "O" company portrays the one stop, "Fly Fisherman in a Can" mentality that everyone despises just because of its marketing and distribution. Not real great stuff all the time, just under one roof. What about all the guides that jumped upon train to sell themselves? This issue is becoming inbred. Hey, fishing is the second known profession. Then there’s the asshole that can ruin everybody’s day by one simple deed. Sometimes they don’t even know what their doing or why. Learn to be nice when you are astream and people will respond in kind, try it, it does work. We fly fisher people do tend to be stuffy at times. We’re no different from the other folks, just to cheap to buy bait. . — Doug Knight                           metalfab<atefaxinc.com Junk e-mail, solicitation, sales, products and services gladly accepted at $500.00 per mailing and billed directly to your ISP.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There is a darkness rooted in me and I’m afraid my angling is entangled in this darkness. I began this journey with a ten dollar fiberglass rod and a level line, dreaming of something. How I got this jaded I don’t know, for the life of me. An angling friend recently told me that I have become "too dark and competitive" to fish with. I’ve been lurking around like a werewolf, scaring people, aching and horrified. It’s time for me to stop, not for You have many brothers and they have many faces. The whole C&R issue breeds this type of mentality.

You know I feel much for Spinolio having experienced many of my own dark nights and a sequence of grey years. Flyfishing for me was reason to keep going. It gave me something to look forward to and to dream about. What ticks me off is the posters who take advantage of this to climb on a soap box on one side or the other and blame the whole thing on one aspect of the sport or on one tackle supplier. This applies equally to the fellow who complained that killing a fish that could grow larger is selfish and that most who kill fish don’t eat them (then what prey tell are we doing with them if you know so much!) My best to Spinolio I hope you work this out. Don’t be afraid to ask for help if the darkness widens or seems it can never end. Some journeys are not meant to traversed alone. Ralph H "…      the sabbath rang slowly      in the pebbles of the holy streams!" Dylan Thomas, "Fern Hill"

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: Rick, : I’ve got this paragraph taped to my monitor at work. I regret I don’t : have access to the rest of that post, which to my way of thinking was : one of the classic posts on this ng. OK, can we just occasionally pass along the comment "Speak English or Die" without explanation as a salute that Spinolio once passed this way? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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Mitch, could you repost the entire thing you saw? I’m serious.  Thanks.

Rick, I’ve got this paragraph taped to my monitor at work. I regret I don’t have access to the rest of that post, which to my way of thinking was one of the classic posts on this ng. Mitch

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: Rick, : I’ve got this paragraph taped to my monitor at work. I regret I don’t : have access to the rest of that post, which to my way of thinking was : one of the classic posts on this ng. OK, can we just occasionally pass along the comment "Speak English or Die" without explanation as a salute that Spinolio once passed this way?

I’ll second that, except perhaps we should use… "Brian Keith on steroids" as a better visual. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

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: Suddenly, from out of nowhere, cam George Gehrke, big as life and twice as conservative, carrying a fistfull of Gehrke’s Gink bottles and a rolled up copy of the "American Spectator". He looked like Brian Kieth on steroids, : all red flannel, denim and muscle. A tattoo on his forehead read "Speak : English or die." Damn… I didn’t get to see this part in the post that came my way.  Looks like classic Spinolio stuff.  What else did I miss?  Mitch, could you repost the entire thing you saw? I’m serious.  Thanks.

Search www.dejanews.com on "george gehrke red conservative"… etc in the old usenet database and you will find it. Charlie…

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: Search www.dejanews.com on "george gehrke red conservative"… etc in : the old usenet database and you will find it. Thanks for that reminder.  It’s important to search the"old" list rather than the new. I’ve decided Spinolio is really out fishing rather than reading and writing.  I’m looking forward to doing the same when the season opens here.  Of course, it will be tougher for me, since I don’t have Spinolio’s resources.  I’m sure he is raking in the bucks from his copyrighted works. A fine example is below: ("Fine Fettle" is a copyrited term of Spinolio Enterprises, 1992. All rights reserved.) As in "Tim and Ralph are in fine fettle today."  (Note the quotes after the period.) So… do I owe Steve money? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

Response:

  Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly   I think that we all fish for the enjoyment of spending time in the   outdoors, away from the stress of work and in some cases the HOUSE !   and what resides there-in. The mindless killing of fish that stand a   chance to grow into Trophy sized fish is only selfish.  How many   people actualy eat the fish that they keep ! ….. ?

I certainly understand what you are saying about stress, work etc…, but I don’t get what you are asserting with respect to killing fish etc. I eat ALL the fish that I keep (except for the bits I give to others to eat) – down to usually making stock out of the frames.  Why would you keep a fish if you weren’t going to eat it? It seems to me that if the only reason you toss fish back is so you can catch them when they are bigger – _that_ is probably selfish in many respects as well. -tgades — Tony Gades. Seattle, WA.  USA http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades/Fishing/fish_page.html NOTICE: DO NOT ADD MY NAME TO _ANY_ MAILING LISTS.  

Response:

It seems to me that if the only reason you toss fish back is so you can catch them when they are bigger – _that_ is probably selfish in many respects as well.

There is a glimmer of hope in this statement.  Thanks Tony.   Nothing selfish about eating, that’s for damned sure. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

Response:

We’re no different from the other folks, just to cheap to buy bait.

If we were southern bass fishermen we’d be chucking ‘fly baits’.   [Referring, of course, to spinner baits, crank baits, etc.] — TimW Halfordian Golfer

Response:

: Suddenly, from out of nowhere, cam George Gehrke, big as life and twice as conservative, carrying a fistfull of Gehrke’s Gink bottles and a rolled up copy of the "American Spectator". He looked like Brian Kieth on steroids, : all red flannel, denim and muscle. A tattoo on his forehead read "Speak : English or die." Damn… I didn’t get to see this part in the post that came my way.  Looks like classic Spinolio stuff.  What else did I miss?  Mitch, could you repost the entire thing you saw? I’m serious.  Thanks.

I agree.   Steve is one of the most naturally gifted writers I have ever read. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

Response:

I think that we all fish for the enjoyment of spending time in the outdoors , away from the stress of work and in some cases the HOUSE ! and what resides there-in . The mindless killing of fish that stand a chance to grow into Trophy sized fish is only selfish  . How many people actualy eat the fish that they keep ! ….. ?

Don’t frikken’ push me pal… How many people actually eat the fish they keep ?   I don’t know how many people exactly, but I can honestly say that all fishermen do. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

Response:

   Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly     It seems to me that if the only reason you toss fish back is so you     can catch them when they are bigger – _that_ is probably selfish in     many respects as well.    There is a glimmer of hope in this statement.  Thanks Tony.      Nothing selfish about eating, that’s for damned sure.    –    TimW These are (and always have been) just my opinions on the matter. Don’t thank me for having an opinion!  There is a time to kill and a time to release.   With apologies to grisham. -tgades — Tony Gades. Seattle, WA.  USA http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades/Fishing/fish_page.html NOTICE: DO NOT ADD MY NAME TO _ANY_ MAILING LISTS.  

Response:

Steve… Are you the devil ?   If so, I’ve been looking for you.  Why are you so hard to find ? Hey…what’s the going rate to fish and hunt everyday for the next 50 years ?  The rest of eternity in hell, you say, you keep my soul ?   …. Let me think about it a bit, eh ?  Do you have a FAX ? …you know where I am too, the river is in incredible shape. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

Response:

Suddenly, from out of nowhere, cam George Gehrke, big as life and twice as conservative, carrying a fistfull of Gehrke’s Gink bottles and a rolled up copy of the "American Spectator". He looked like Brian Kieth on steroids, all red flannel, denim and muscle. A tattoo on his forehead read "Speak English or die." There is a darkness rooted in me and I’m afraid my angling is entangled in this darkness…

The classic chicken & egg question. Good move though. Rid yourself of all the trappings and look at each piece for its merits. Mitch

Response:

Someone once asked me"If you like to fish so much , howcum you don’t fish in them tournaments?" I answered "Because I like to fish so much." Blank stare. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A quick note to anyone who’s still reading (and I can’t imagine there are many of you)… Starting immediately I’m putting myself into self-imposed exile from this newsgroup. I won’t be posting to ROFF again for at least a year (today is April 17th I believe), perhaps never. A year might not be enough.   Recent arguments between myself and other frequent contributors have caused me to reevaluate my own contributions. Things have been ugly, and much of the blame is mine to bear. I truly owe Tony Gades an apology. There is a darkness rooted in me and I’m afraid my angling is entangled in this darkness. I began this journey with a ten dollar fiberglass rod and a level line, dreaming of something. How I got this jaded I don’t know, for the life of me. An angling friend recently told me that I have become "too dark and competitive" to fish with. I’ve been lurking around like a werewolf, scaring people, aching and horrified. It’s time for me to stop, not for your sake, but my own. You know where I am, Spinolio

– Flyfish NC http://planet-nc.com/flyfishnc/ Striped Bass on the Roanoke River, Hybrids on Jordan Lake, Largemouths on surface.  Pickup and dropoff in Research Triangle Park

Response:

I think that we all fish for the enjoyment of spending time in the outdoors , away from the stress of work and in some cases the HOUSE ! and what resides there-in . The mindless killing of fish that stand a chance to grow into Trophy sized fish is only selfish  . How many people actualy eat the fish that they keep ! ….. ? Someone once asked me"If you like to fish so much , howcum you don’t fish in them tournaments?" I answered "Because I like to fish so much." Blank stare. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A quick note to anyone who’s still reading (and I can’t imagine there are many of you)… Starting immediately I’m putting myself into self-imposed exile from this newsgroup. I won’t be posting to ROFF again for at least a year (today is April 17th I believe), perhaps never. A year might not be enough.   Recent arguments between myself and other frequent contributors have caused me to reevaluate my own contributions. Things have been ugly, and much of the blame is mine to bear. I truly owe Tony Gades an apology. There is a darkness rooted in me and I’m afraid my angling is entangled in this darkness. I began this journey with a ten dollar fiberglass rod and a level line, dreaming of something. How I got this jaded I don’t know, for the life of me. An angling friend recently told me that I have become "too dark and competitive" to fish with. I’ve been lurking around like a werewolf, scaring people, aching and horrified. It’s time for me to stop, not for your sake, but my own. You know where I am, Spinolio

– Flyfish NC http://planet-nc.com/flyfishnc/ Striped Bass on the Roanoke River, Hybrids on Jordan Lake, Largemouths on surface.  Pickup and dropoff in Research Triangle Park

Response:

: Suddenly, from out of nowhere, cam George Gehrke, big as life and twice as conservative, carrying a fistfull of Gehrke’s Gink bottles and a rolled up copy of the "American Spectator". He looked like Brian Kieth on steroids, : all red flannel, denim and muscle. A tattoo on his forehead read "Speak : English or die." Damn… I didn’t get to see this part in the post that came my way.  Looks like classic Spinolio stuff.  What else did I miss?  Mitch, could you repost the entire thing you saw? I’m serious.  Thanks. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

Response:

A quick note to anyone who’s still reading (and I can’t imagine there are many of you)… Starting immediately I’m putting myself into self-imposed exile from this newsgroup. I won’t be posting to ROFF again for at least a year (today is April 17th I believe), perhaps never. A year might not be enough.   Recent arguments between myself and other frequent contributors have caused me to reevaluate my own contributions. Things have been ugly, and much of the blame is mine to bear. I truly owe Tony Gades an apology. There is a darkness rooted in me and I’m afraid my angling is entangled in this darkness. I began this journey with a ten dollar fiberglass rod and a level line, dreaming of something. How I got this jaded I don’t know, for the life of me. An angling friend recently told me that I have become "too dark and competitive" to fish with. I’ve been lurking around like a werewolf, scaring people, aching and horrified. It’s time for me to stop, not for your sake, but my own. You know where I am, Spinolio

Response:

We’re no different from the other folks, just to cheap to buy bait. If we were southern bass fishermen we’d be chucking ‘fly baits’. [Referring, of course, to spinner baits, crank baits, etc.] — TimW Halfordian Golfer

Fly baits hard to cast with a baitcasting reel! -Burton — L. Burton Hawley         2330 NW Hummingbird Corvallis, OR

Response:

My best to Spinolio I hope you work this out. Don’t be afraid to ask for help if the darkness widens or seems it can never end. Some journeys are not meant to traversed alone.

Indeed!  However, I feel the act of discovery is the real beginning of the solution. -Burton — L. Burton Hawley         2330 NW Hummingbird Corvallis, OR

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A quick note to anyone who’s still reading (and I can’t imagine there are many of you)… Starting immediately I’m putting myself into self-imposed exile from this newsgroup. I won’t be posting to ROFF again for at least a year (today is April 17th I believe), perhaps never. A year might not be enough. Recent arguments between myself and other frequent contributors have caused me to reevaluate my own contributions. Things have been ugly, and much of the blame is mine to bear. I truly owe Tony Gades an apology. There is a darkness rooted in me and I’m afraid my angling is entangled in this darkness. I began this journey with a ten dollar fiberglass rod and a level line, dreaming of something. How I got this jaded I don’t know, for the life of me. An angling friend recently told me that I have become "too dark and competitive" to fish with. I’ve been lurking around like a werewolf, scaring people, aching and horrified. It’s time for me to stop, not for your sake, but my own. You know where I am, Spinolio

Spinolio, Perhaps it is time to get that ten dollar rod back out and spend an afternoon fishing for bream with a 5 year old?   I too once went through the troubling competetive problem. I tuna fished and my type A "Hobby" ended up becoming like another job for me.  I put too much into it and got little in return, with the exception of actually looking forward to relaxing at work on Monday.  I gave up the 29′ boat and haven’t particularly missed it.  Now I fly fish and the solitude has helped make me calmer and easier to deal with, although I’m a little distressed that my girlfriend commented on how the captain on one of this mornings fishing shows wasn’t yelling at the girl who fouled the rod tip.  I guess I have a ways to go, but between you and me, my blood pressure is down considerably. Take heart, when fishing becomes too serious, it may be time to take up golf. Rediscover the sport.  It has a lot to offer. — Mark N. Cahill For E-mail remove the _Remove_This from the reply to address. http://www.geocities.com/Baja/3297

Response:

Take heart, when fishing becomes too serious, it may be time to take up golf. Rediscover the sport.  It has a lot to offer.

Mark’s right.  Well not about the golf part… but there is always a way to be that beginner with the fiberglass rod and level line.  For me it’s bass.  I’ve been learning for about a year now and am still very much a beginner with bass.  "When your full sinking line starts sinking faster or slows down" is just begining to make the sense that "when your leader behaves differently strike" on a trout stream does.  When you start to feel ownership of a stretch of water (i.e. "some yahoo was in my favorite pool and he was F-ing it up!"), or a whole rivers for that matter, is when the darkness takes over.  Become the Yahoo and it’s an adventure in discovery again.  The newsgroup of course is absolutely useless and should be abandoned immediately   Phil

Response:

Spinolio, We all have a darkside! When the competition becomes the primary motivation it is time to stop and "smell the roses." Mark is right about taking a child fishing. Their excitement is in the experience of fishing. After you take a  child fishing take a handicapped person fishing. Someone who has never fished and needs help in even holding the rod. Watch their face when you catch a three inch sunny! It will make you remember your first fish, the good feeling you had and the darkside will brighten. There is much more to fly fishing and life than the competitive part. The older I get the more I enjoy the simple things in life, like sunrise while sitting on the bank of my favorite stream. Have a good day, Dennis   — Dennis C. Aron Independent Representative #13921 Champion Fishing Co., Ltd e-mail for business opportunity – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A quick note to anyone who’s still reading (and I can’t imagine there are many of you)… Starting immediately I’m putting myself into self-imposed exile from this newsgroup. I won’t be posting to ROFF again for at least a year (today is April 17th I believe), perhaps never. A year might not be enough.   Recent arguments between myself and other frequent contributors have caused me to reevaluate my own contributions. Things have been ugly, and much of the blame is mine to bear. I truly owe Tony Gades an apology. There is a darkness rooted in me and I’m afraid my angling is entangled in this darkness. I began this journey with a ten dollar fiberglass rod and a level line, dreaming of something. How I got this jaded I don’t know, for the life of me. An angling friend recently told me that I have become "too dark and competitive" to fish with. I’ve been lurking around like a werewolf, scaring people, aching and horrified. It’s time for me to stop, not for your sake, but my own. You know where I am, Spinolio

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A quick note to anyone who’s still reading (and I can’t imagine there are many of you)… Starting immediately I’m putting myself into self-imposed exile from this newsgroup. I won’t be posting to ROFF again for at least a year (today is April 17th I believe), perhaps never. A year might not be enough.   Recent arguments between myself and other frequent contributors have caused me to reevaluate my own contributions. Things have been ugly, and much of the blame is mine to bear. I truly owe Tony Gades an apology. There is a darkness rooted in me and I’m afraid my angling is entangled in this darkness. I began this journey with a ten dollar fiberglass rod and a level line, dreaming of something. How I got this jaded I don’t know, for the life of me. An angling friend recently told me that I have become "too dark and competitive" to fish with. I’ve been lurking around like a werewolf, scaring people, aching and horrified. It’s time for me to stop, not for your sake, but my own. You know where I am, Spinolio

  Spinolio   I would forget golf, just put the pipe down for a while.    harry

Response:

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : : a good definition of the term bifluorescence : I’m not an entomologist, but I do make my living observing : fluorescence.  I : don’t believe I’ve ever heard the term… is it specific to insects? : I would be interested in knowing about fish perception … : Are trout more sensitive to UV, vis or IR radiation? : What exactly, do fish "see?" : As one might guess based on the fact that Rick hasn’t heard of this, it is : indeed a highly obscure term.  I ran it by a few of my colleagues who use : fluorescent tags in their work and some others who work on vision. : Several of : us could loosely be referred to as entomologists.  None were familiar : with it, : although we did manage to dig up a few recent references that use the : adjective : bifluorescent, in each case referring to things (not insects or any other : kind : of fish food) that fluoresce at two different wavelengths.  This may not be : very satisfying, but it does make sense. Could be, but everything fluoresces at multiple wavelengths except the very expensive lasers or the much less expensive diode lasers.  I thinbk you refer to organism or compounds that fluoresce with two discernible *peak* intensities.  In any case, another thread indicates the original poster meant "biofluorescence".  But lets ignore that for now and talk about the rest of your post. : Of perhaps more significance is the skepticism with which the vision types : greeted the possibility that fluorescence could be significant with : regard to : surface feeding.  There’s so much ambient light that fluorescence would : not be : likely to be important.  In contrast, at depths where light becomes more : monochromatic, fluorescence could indeed become significant. Excellent point, and rephrased, it is simialr to the fact that stars in the sky cannot be seen at night even though they are there.  Only when ambient light levels drop at night can the stars be seen against the background.  A fish looking up at the sky will see high amounts of ambient UV. I know that water begins to absorb light strongly near 200 nanometers. The UV is usually defined as wavelengths shorter than 400 nanometers or so.  This leaves a window from approximately 220 nm – 400 nm of UV open for transmission through water. : As for what fish see, there was a decent article in Fly Fisherman (?) a few : years back on how trout see.  As I recall, it dealt mostly with the : windows of : visibility and visual acuity, but there was also some stuff about color : vision. :  I don’t have the info on spectral sensitivity for trout specifically, : but many : fish are known to be sensitive to UV. Specifics are always good. : As an aside, for what it’s worth, I’ve never paid much attention to the : information on trout spectral sensitivities.  While I know that there are : many : who swear by exacting attention to colors, it’s been my experience that color : isn’t all that important.  I’m not quite ready for the "Adams for everything" : approach (although I know it works well for some, at least), but light, : medium : and dark has usually worked just fine. I would say that specific colors, like green or orange, will work well on specific days.  BTW, I would guess that most of the synthetic materials fluoresce in around 250 nm. :  My experience, which may not be : typical, has likely been colored by my propensity for fishing small : dries, but : I had a little chuckle when a colleague who works on vision suggested : that most : likely all the fish usually see is a silhouette. Especially the ones down deep.  Scattering would be a real hindrance to correct color perception for fish that are deep.  (Except of course on Idaho streams, where the water is so clear one must get out of the rivers to pee in their waders.) : Bummer, Rick.  Maybe it would look better under UV. Bring out the black lights… it’s time to party! — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

Who said that?

Response:

: : a good definition of the term bifluorescence : I’m not an entomologist, but I do make my living observing : fluorescence.  I : don’t believe I’ve ever heard the term… is it specific to insects? : I would be interested in knowing about fish perception … : Are trout more sensitive to UV, vis or IR radiation? : What exactly, do fish "see?" : As one might guess based on the fact that Rick hasn’t heard of this, it is : indeed a highly obscure term.  I ran it by a few of my colleagues who use : fluorescent tags in their work and some others who work on vision.   : Several of : us could loosely be referred to as entomologists.  None were familiar : with it, : although we did manage to dig up a few recent references that use the : adjective : bifluorescent, in each case referring to things (not insects or any other : kind : of fish food) that fluoresce at two different wavelengths.  This may not be : very satisfying, but it does make sense. Could be, but everything fluoresces at multiple wavelengths except the very expensive lasers or the much less expensive diode lasers.  I thinbk you refer to organism or compounds that fluoresce with two discernible *peak* intensities.  In any case, another thread indicates the original poster meant "biofluorescence".  But lets ignore that for now and talk about the rest of your post.   : Of perhaps more significance is the skepticism with which the vision types : greeted the possibility that fluorescence could be significant with : regard to : surface feeding.  There’s so much ambient light that fluorescence would : not be : likely to be important.  In contrast, at depths where light becomes more : monochromatic, fluorescence could indeed become significant. Excellent point, and rephrased, it is simialr to the fact that stars in the sky cannot be seen at night even though they are there.  Only when ambient light levels drop at night can the stars be seen against the background.  A fish looking up at the sky will see high amounts of ambient UV. I know that water begins to absorb light strongly near 200 nanometers. The UV is usually defined as wavelengths shorter than 400 nanometers or so.  This leaves a window from approximately 220 nm – 400 nm of UV open for transmission through water. : As for what fish see, there was a decent article in Fly Fisherman (?) a few : years back on how trout see.  As I recall, it dealt mostly with the : windows of : visibility and visual acuity, but there was also some stuff about color : vision. :  I don’t have the info on spectral sensitivity for trout specifically, : but many : fish are known to be sensitive to UV. Specifics are always good. : As an aside, for what it’s worth, I’ve never paid much attention to the : information on trout spectral sensitivities.  While I know that there are : many : who swear by exacting attention to colors, it’s been my experience that color : isn’t all that important.  I’m not quite ready for the "Adams for everything" : approach (although I know it works well for some, at least), but light, : medium : and dark has usually worked just fine.   I would say that specific colors, like green or orange, will work well on specific days.  BTW, I would guess that most of the synthetic materials fluoresce in around 250 nm. :  My experience, which may not be : typical, has likely been colored by my propensity for fishing small : dries, but : I had a little chuckle when a colleague who works on vision suggested : that most : likely all the fish usually see is a silhouette. Especially the ones down deep.  Scattering would be a real hindrance to correct color perception for fish that are deep.  (Except of course on Idaho streams, where the water is so clear one must get out of the rivers to pee in their waders.) : Bummer, Rick.  Maybe it would look better under UV. Bring out the black lights… it’s time to party! — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

Response:

: a good definition of the term bifluorescence I’m not an entomologist, but I do make my living observing fluorescence.  I

don’t believe I’ve ever heard the term… is it specific to insects? I would be interested in knowing about fish perception … Are trout more sensitive to UV, vis or IR radiation? What exactly, do fish "see?"

As one might guess based on the fact that Rick hasn’t heard of this, it is indeed a highly obscure term.  I ran it by a few of my colleagues who use fluorescent tags in their work and some others who work on vision.   Several of us could loosely be referred to as entomologists.  None were familiar with it, although we did manage to dig up a few recent references that use the adjective bifluorescent, in each case referring to things (not insects or any other kind of fish food) that fluoresce at two different wavelengths.  This may not be very satisfying, but it does make sense. Of perhaps more significance is the skepticism with which the vision types greeted the possibility that fluorescence could be significant with regard to surface feeding.  There’s so much ambient light that fluorescence would not be likely to be important.  In contrast, at depths where light becomes more monochromatic, fluorescence could indeed become significant. As for what fish see, there was a decent article in Fly Fisherman (?) a few years back on how trout see.  As I recall, it dealt mostly with the windows of visibility and visual acuity, but there was also some stuff about color vision.  I don’t have the info on spectral sensitivity for trout specifically, but many fish are known to be sensitive to UV. As an aside, for what it’s worth, I’ve never paid much attention to the information on trout spectral sensitivities.  While I know that there are many who swear by exacting attention to colors, it’s been my experience that color isn’t all that important.  I’m not quite ready for the "Adams for everything" approach (although I know it works well for some, at least), but light, medium and dark has usually worked just fine.  My experience, which may not be typical, has likely been colored by my propensity for fishing small dries, but I had a little chuckle when a colleague who works on vision suggested that most likely all the fish usually see is a silhouette. I just painted my living room and it turned out pink!!

Bummer, Rick.  Maybe it would look better under UV. Bill S.

Response:

Question:

I’m canoing the Bowron Lake circuit next week and I don’t know what kind of fish I will find – trout, walleye, or northern pike?  Somebody please give me some advice on what to bring and what I’ll find.  Thanks…

Trout. — Isaac Lake President – Recreational Canoeing Association of British Columbia Master Instructor

Response:

Mountain House and Alpenlite are the lures most likely to supply a decent meal on the Bowron Lakes.   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m canoing the Bowron Lake circuit next week and I don’t know what kind of fish I will find – trout, walleye, or northern pike?  Somebody please The fishing is particularly good in June, in fact.  Mostly trout, including big lake trout down deep and some amazing rainbows.  Also a few whitefish.  Try paddling slow with  a white apex spoon about 3 inches long, down deep with about 2 ounces of weight. Fly fishing also works in close to shores. The guy who said to try freeze dried because its a park doesn’t know what he’s talking about.  Just make sure to get a fresh water licence from any sporting goods store and follow the regulations they give you.  Basically, 12 inch minimum. Dan Burnett Vancouver, B.C., Canada Tel: 604-691-7506  Fax:604-688-2827

Response:

I’m canoing the Bowron Lake circuit next week and I don’t know what kind of fish I will find – trout, walleye, or northern pike?  Somebody please

The fishing is particularly good in June, in fact.  Mostly trout, including big lake trout down deep and some amazing rainbows.  Also a few whitefish.  Try paddling slow with  a white apex spoon about 3 inches long, down deep with about 2 ounces of weight. Fly fishing also works in close to shores. The guy who said to try freeze dried because its a park doesn’t know what he’s talking about.  Just make sure to get a fresh water licence from any sporting goods store and follow the regulations they give you.  Basically, 12 inch minimum. Dan Burnett Vancouver, B.C., Canada Tel: 604-691-7506  Fax:604-688-2827

Response:

I’m canoing the Bowron Lake circuit next week and I don’t know what kind of fish I will find – trout, walleye, or northern pike?  Somebody please give me some advice on what to bring and what I’ll find.  Thanks…

Response:

I’m canoing the Bowron Lake circuit next week and I don’t know what kind of fish I will find – trout, walleye, or northern pike?  Somebody please

Bring freeze dried- it’s a park. ian iGIVE ME Some advice on what to bring and what I’ll find.  Thanks…

Response:

Question:

| Can anyone suggest the name/number of a good guide in that area.  If | you don’t know of a guide, can someone send me the name of a tackle | shop in Williamsport (information does not have a yellow page | look-up). I don’t personally know guides in Williamsport, but I know of two fly shops: The Pennsylvania Outdoor Warehouse, and E. Hille Angling Supplies. I’m sure one/both of them would be able to help, Fred P.S. Almost forgot; Barry and Cathy Beck have "Beckies Angling Supplies"      in nearby Benton, PA. on the banks of Fishing Creek. They’re both      world-renouned anglers, and I believe they provide a guide service      thru the shop. Yes, they would definitely be the folks to contact      in the Williamsport area… —         Fred L. Templin

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I am going to Williamsport, PA on 4/29 – 5/1 to work.  My wife is coming along and wants to do some fly fishing on Sat (4/30).  As it’s her birthday, I want to get her a guided trip. Can anyone suggest the name/number of a good guide in that area.  If you don’t know of a guide, can someone send me the name of a tackle shop in Williamsport (information does not have a yellow page look-up).  I would call my contact for the job, except he lives too far from Williamsport. Thanks for any assistance.   Jim Impara ps We are going to the Keys (Marathon — staying at Rainbow Bend Resort) next week.  Also connected with a work trip.  We have booked the boat Pursuit (Capt Frank Waters) for a 1/2 day trip.  Hope the Mahi Mahi are in.  We will do some close in fishing (around bridges and such) during the rest of the week.  If we have a good catch, I’ll post a note.

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