Question:

Shanghai– A fishing-village-turned metropolis, Shanghai offers one of the best examples where the east meets the west, the Chinese meets the foreign, and the traditional meets the modern. The city equals many of the world’s metropolises in terms of the pace of life and the speed of change. A Los Angeles Times report in Sept.2001 says that, attracted by Shanghai’s glitz, more than 300,000 Taiwanese, mostly businesspeople, have settled down in the city in recent years. Chongqing– The Red Star Pavilion in the Pipasha Park, the Kansheng Pavilion in the Eling Park, and a place called Yikeshu on the Nanshan Mountain are vintage points for observing the nocturnal scenes of the mountain city of Chongqing. At night the entire city is inundated in an ocean of lights, which form a colorful three-dimensional painting, with waves of the Yangtze and Jialing rivers glistening against the moonlit, star spangled sky. Wuhan– Wuhan is described as the "Homeland of White Clouds and Yellow Crane" The Yangtze River and the Han River join here,dividing the city into three towns:Hankou, Hanyang and Wuchang. Wuhan has many scenic spots and historical sites. Among them are the 2,400 years old Zenghouyi Chime Bells known as one of the world wonders; the 1,700 yearsold Yellow Crane Tower, one of the three famous towers in South China: the East Lake whose natural beauty rivals that of the West Lake in Hangzhou;the TY Tower on Tortois Hill known as the highest mast of Asia; the ancient Guiyuan Temple, and the modern International Amusement Park. Day 1. SHANGHAI to CHONGQING Fly to Chongqing. Greeted by tour guide at the airport. Leisure time, then transfer to Regal China Cruises. Overnight at the Cruises Day 2. CHONGQING to FENGDU (B. L. D.) Departs Chongqing 8:00am. Shore excursion at Fengdu. Overnight at the Cruises Day 3. BADONG to SANDOUPING (B. L. D.) Pass through the magnificent Qutang Gorge and beautiful Wu Gorge. Transfer to a small sampan to cruise the Shennong Stream. Overnight at the Cruises Day 4. SANDOUPING (B. L. D.) Visit the Three Gorges Dam. Sail through Xiling Gorge and pass Gezhouba Dam Ship lock. Overnight at the Cruises Day 5. WUHAN to SHANGHAI (B. L.) Morning continue to sail along the Yangtze River. Arrives Wuhan 12:00N. Visit Yellow Crane Pagoda, proceed to transfer to airport and fly back to Shanghai. [Remark]: 1. Please make reservation for Spring Tour one week at least prior to the departure! 2. Tour cost for Child (below 12): 90% and 75% of the normal cost separately for occupying bed and no bed. 3. Tour cost fluctuates according to the season. TOUR COST (Per Person) $450   Single Supplement $200 DEPARTURES Sorry! There are no available tour packages for you now. Please inform us of your demands! We’ll do our best to arrange the tour package only for you

Response:

REGAL THREE GORGES PACKAGE—-DOWNSTREAM Shanghai– A fishing-village-turned metropolis, Shanghai offers one of the best examples where the east meets the west, the Chinese meets the foreign, and the traditional meets the modern. The city equals many of the world’s metropolises in terms of the pace of life and the speed of change. A Los Angeles Times report in Sept.2001 says that, attracted by Shanghai’s glitz, more than 300,000 Taiwanese, mostly businesspeople, have settled down in the city in recent years. Chongqing– The Red Star Pavilion in the Pipasha Park, the Kansheng Pavilion in the Eling Park, and a place called Yikeshu on the Nanshan Mountain are vintage points for observing the nocturnal scenes of the mountain city of Chongqing. At night the entire city is inundated in an ocean of lights, which form a colorful three-dimensional painting, with waves of the Yangtze and Jialing rivers glistening against the moonlit, star spangled sky. Wuhan– Wuhan is described as the "Homeland of White Clouds and Yellow Crane" The Yangtze River and the Han River join here,dividing the city into three towns:Hankou, Hanyang and Wuchang. Wuhan has many scenic spots and historical sites. Among them are the 2,400 years old Zenghouyi Chime Bells known as one of the world wonders; the 1,700 yearsold Yellow Crane Tower, one of the three famous towers in South China: the East Lake whose natural beauty rivals that of the West Lake in Hangzhou;the TY Tower on Tortois Hill known as the highest mast of Asia; the ancient Guiyuan Temple, and the modern International Amusement Park. Day 1. SHANGHAI to CHONGQING Fly to Chongqing. Greeted by tour guide at the airport. Leisure time, then transfer to Regal China Cruises. Overnight at the Cruises Day 2. CHONGQING to FENGDU (B. L. D.) Departs Chongqing 8:00am. Shore excursion at Fengdu. Overnight at the Cruises Day 3. BADONG to SANDOUPING (B. L. D.) Pass through the magnificent Qutang Gorge and beautiful Wu Gorge. Transfer to a small sampan to cruise the Shennong Stream. Overnight at the Cruises Day 4. SANDOUPING (B. L. D.) Visit the Three Gorges Dam. Sail through Xiling Gorge and pass Gezhouba Dam Ship lock. Overnight at the Cruises Day 5. WUHAN to SHANGHAI (B. L.) Morning continue to sail along the Yangtze River. Arrives Wuhan 12:00N. Visit Yellow Crane Pagoda, proceed to transfer to airport and fly back to Shanghai. [Remark]: 1. Please make reservation for Spring Tour one week at least prior to the departure! 2. Tour cost for Child (below 12): 90% and 75% of the normal cost separately for occupying bed and no bed. 3. Tour cost fluctuates according to the season.

Response:

Question:

   Good fortune, Oh yes.  Now , I know that you and your friend are just checking to see what kind of answers you get here, but I offer this anyway.  Looking around at the following should get you going.    I now buy almost everything from Clemens Tackle, (610) 395 5119, www.clemenstackle.com   Dick French there is extremely knowledgable.  They list other rod wrappers than the Pacific Bay rod wrapper in their catalog and they have good quality in everything needed.  Get their catalog and ask about the RodCrafter’s Journal.  They also have some books you’ll want and video tapes maybe you’ll want later.    Both of the above have run seminars around the country each year but I don’t know anything about that.      Cabela’s "Tackle Craft" catalog  lists the Flex Coat line which looks good too.  Also a list of books and videos.    The best way and the fastest way to get a look at rod building is to go to www.flyanglersonline.com  click on rodbuilding and view the excellent twelve chapter on-line book on rod building.  It really gave me a jump start and I still refer to it.    Fishing with a rod that I built is extremely satisfying.  Almost as satisfying as fishing with my kids and grandkids using rods into which I put all the extra care that is not in a production rod.  Right now I’m thinking about a couple of new rods…  No it is not an addiction…  I could quit any time…  besides I have to build that spinning rod for my daughter-in-law, too.   —

A few days ago I mentioned to a friend (who used to own a fly shop) that I was planning to build some flyrods this winter. He asked me if I had the equipment I needed. I didn’t. He graciously gave me several pieces of useful looking equipment and some materials, including a number of cork grips and a very nice reel seat. I have only a dim notion of what some of this equipment is for. You can see a photo of the stuff at: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/stuff-web.jpg The long device with the aluminum base is obviously meant for wrapping and drying rods. It has two settings: a constant, slow speed labeled "dry", and a variable speed controlled by a foot pedal labeled "wrap". The large motor on the right is for shaping cork grips. The long things standing up in the background are specialized rattail files for reaming grips, I suppose. I don’t really know what the two devices in the middle (above the grips) and the clamp in the back of the photo are for, but I’ll figure it out. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Mark, if you happen to be reading this. I guess I’ll actually have to build those rods now. No excuses. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Steve,    The thing on the lower left is the foot pedal/reostat. Next to it, above the grips, is a conventional rod wrapper (learn to use it, it’s the most useful devise in the picture). Next to it is a thread holder accessory to the power wrapper. It  has the capacity to hold multiple thread spools, for fancy-shmancy wrapping. The lathe like device is a power wrapper, best used for production (sloppy looking) rod building. The only thing I’d use it for is drying, on the low speed setting. The big thing in the lower right corner is used to shape cork grips, after they’ve been glued up on the devise that’s leaning against the wall on the left. The things leaning against the wall on the right are tapered reamers, for enlarging the ID of the finished cork grip.   Hope this helps. E-mail me if you need instructions on how to use any of this junk.             Charlie

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If anyone could give me some information about how to use this thing I’d appreciate it. The guy who gave it to me can’t find the manual, if there ever was one. The manufacturer is Pacific Bay, Inc., Placentia, CA. The current PacBay catalog lists their address as:         Pacific Bay International, Inc.         165 Business Park Loop         Sequim, WA 98382         (360) 683 – 2080         (360) 683 – 2234 (Fax) They are pretty nice folks at PacBay, I’m sure they can find an instruction book for you.  The list price on that thing is $338, if you were wondering.

Thanks for the information, Kevin. This rod wrapper had so much dust on it that it must have been in my friend’s garage for many years. I despaired of finding a manual. I’ll call PacBay on Monday. Kevin If you can’t figure out how to use it, just box it all up and ship it to me.

I’m afraid you’ll have to come here to use it. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

could the black thing be a thread holder for the rod wrapper? does it attach to the wrapper somewhere?

Bingo. The black thread holder has three rollers (with ball bearings) that butt up against the rod wrapper in such a way that the thread is in exactly the right position. There’s also a metal bar with three machine screws, and I have absolutely no idea what it’s for. It doesn’t seem to fit anything on the rod wrapper or the thread holder. I’ve put three more photos on the web:         http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/p1.jpg         http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/p2.jpg         http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/p3.jpg The first one shows the motor, the chuck in the open position, the thread holder in position, two of the three roller mechanisms, and the mysterious metal plate. The second photo is a little closer up. The third photo shows the rollers that are under the thread holder, and the rod wrapper chuck in the closed position. If anyone could give me some information about how to use this thing I’d appreciate it. The guy who gave it to me can’t find the manual, if there ever was one. The manufacturer is Pacific Bay, Inc., Placentia, CA. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

not that I’ve ever used such fancy equipment but……. in http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/stuff-web.jpg The thing against the back wall with the wood pieces joined by threaded rod is for pressing together individual cork rings that have been put on the rod (or a dowel if you are making the grip separately) while the glue dries. The large motor on the right, I believe, is for turning the rod or the dowel with the cork rings so you can shape them.  It can also be used as a lathe to shape a wood insert for a reel seat.   I have no idea what the metal bar with three machine screws is used for. http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/p1.jpg You got your hands on some nice equipment. Want to make me a custom rod? Willi

Response:

Bingo. The black thread holder has three rollers (with ball bearings) that butt up against the rod wrapper in such a way that the thread is in exactly the right position. There’s also a metal bar with three machine screws, and I have absolutely no idea what it’s for. It doesn’t seem to fit anything on the rod wrapper or the thread holder.

I think it is a thread tensioning bar.  Can you add a pic of what I suspect is a wooden wrapping fixture, and a close-up of the bar, and particularly, its fittings/screws – are they "pulley wheels" or just nuts and bolts? If anyone could give me some information about how to use this thing I’d appreciate it.

How do you mean "how to use it?"  Do you mean rod-finishing in general, or the specifics of this set-up?  If you mean the particulars of this set-up, it doesn’t appear to be anything tricky or "non-standard," but if you mean rod-finishing in general, that’s quite a bit of info.  Anything in particular? TC, R – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -The guy who gave it to me can’t find the manual, if there ever was one. The manufacturer is Pacific Bay, Inc., Placentia, CA.

Response:

There’s also a metal bar with three machine screws, and I have absolutely no idea what it’s for. It doesn’t seem to fit anything on the rod wrapper or the thread holder.

Sort of a PS – It appears there are three holes of similar spacing near the edge of the wooden fixture.  Do these actually line up with the bar? R

Response:

If anyone could give me some information about how to use this thing I’d appreciate it. The guy who gave it to me can’t find the manual, if there ever was one. The manufacturer is Pacific Bay, Inc., Placentia, CA.

The current PacBay catalog lists their address as:         Pacific Bay International, Inc.         165 Business Park Loop         Sequim, WA 98382         (360) 683 – 2080         (360) 683 – 2234 (Fax) They are pretty nice folks at PacBay, I’m sure they can find an instruction book for you.  The list price on that thing is $338, if you were wondering. Kevin If you can’t figure out how to use it, just box it all up and ship it to me.

Response:

A few days ago I mentioned to a friend (who used to own a fly shop) that I was planning to build some flyrods this winter. He asked me if I had the equipment I needed. I didn’t. He graciously gave me several pieces of useful looking equipment and some materials, including a number of cork grips and a very nice reel seat.

Wow, you are lucky.  That’s top notch stuff.  Sorry I can’t help – I’ve never actually used that stuff  (What I mean you gear whores, of course, is that I don’t make enough rods to go to the trouble of buying that stuff. Affordability is not the issue when you are at one with the industry – when you are content in your consumerism – when you… well, you know.)

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A few days ago I mentioned to a friend (who used to own a fly shop) that I was planning to build some flyrods this winter. He asked me if I had the equipment I needed. I didn’t. He graciously gave me several pieces of useful looking equipment and some materials, including a number of cork grips and a very nice reel seat. I have only a dim notion of what some of this equipment is for. You can see a photo of the stuff at:    http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/stuff-web.jpg The long device with the aluminum base is obviously meant for wrapping and drying rods. It has two settings: a constant, slow speed labeled "dry", and a variable speed controlled by a foot pedal labeled "wrap". The large motor on the right is for shaping cork grips. The long things standing up in the background are specialized rattail files for reaming grips, I suppose. I don’t really know what the two devices in the middle (above the grips) and the clamp in the back of the photo are for, but I’ll figure it out. Any help would be appreciated.

Steve, I suspect the long, threaded rods and blocks (there are two blocks, no?) is a cork clamp, and the two things in the middle are thread holders/wrapping jigs/parts.  From what I can see, I’d guess the black one is a holder for use on the larger jig/dryer, and the wooden looking one is a stand-alone wrapping jig, but ???.  Can you post close-ups of them? TC, R

Response:

could the black thing be a thread holder for the rod wrapper? does it attach to the wrapper somewhere? . .Walter .

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A few days ago I mentioned to a friend (who used to own a fly shop) that I was planning to build some flyrods this winter. He asked me if I had the equipment I needed. I didn’t. He graciously gave me several pieces of useful looking equipment and some materials, including a number of cork grips and a very nice reel seat. I have only a dim notion of what some of this equipment is for. You can see a photo of the stuff at: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/stuff-web.jpg The long device with the aluminum base is obviously meant for wrapping and drying rods. It has two settings: a constant, slow speed labeled "dry", and a variable speed controlled by a foot pedal labeled "wrap". The large motor on the right is for shaping cork grips. The long things standing up in the background are specialized rattail files for reaming grips, I suppose. I don’t really know what the two devices in the middle (above the grips) and the clamp in the back of the photo are for, but I’ll figure it out. Any help would be appreciated. Steve, I suspect the long, threaded rods and blocks (there are two blocks, no?) is a cork clamp, and the two things in the middle are thread holders/wrapping jigs/parts.  From what I can see, I’d guess the black one is a holder for use on the larger jig/dryer, and the wooden looking one is a stand-alone wrapping jig, but ???.  Can you post close-ups of them? TC, R

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Response:

A few days ago I mentioned to a friend (who used to own a fly shop) that I was planning to build some flyrods this winter. He asked me if I had the equipment I needed. I didn’t. He graciously gave me several pieces of useful looking equipment and some materials, including a number of cork grips and a very nice reel seat. I have only a dim notion of what some of this equipment is for. You can see a photo of the stuff at:         http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/stuff-web.jpg The long device with the aluminum base is obviously meant for wrapping and drying rods. It has two settings: a constant, slow speed labeled "dry", and a variable speed controlled by a foot pedal labeled "wrap". The large motor on the right is for shaping cork grips. The long things standing up in the background are specialized rattail files for reaming grips, I suppose. I don’t really know what the two devices in the middle (above the grips) and the clamp in the back of the photo are for, but I’ll figure it out. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Mark, if you happen to be reading this. I guess I’ll actually have to build those rods now. No excuses. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Boy you certainly did luck out.  That is some professional level equipment he gave you. Its hard to really tell from the picture, but the real seat and the handles also seem to be of very high quality. You’ve correctly identified most of the equipment.  The two devices in the middle (above the grips) and the clamp in the back of the photo are for gluing together cork rings for building your own handles. Have fun. Using a rod you put together yourself gives much of the same satisfaction one gets from fooling tough trout with flies you tied yourself. Bob Weinberger

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A few days ago I mentioned to a friend (who used to own a fly shop) that I was planning to build some flyrods this winter. He asked me if I had the equipment I needed. I didn’t. He graciously gave me several pieces of useful looking equipment and some materials, including a number of cork grips and a very nice reel seat. I have only a dim notion of what some of this equipment is for. You can see a photo of the stuff at: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/stuff-web.jpg The long device with the aluminum base is obviously meant for wrapping and drying rods. It has two settings: a constant, slow speed labeled "dry", and a variable speed controlled by a foot pedal labeled "wrap". The large motor on the right is for shaping cork grips. The long things standing up in the background are specialized rattail files for reaming grips, I suppose. I don’t really know what the two devices in the middle (above the grips) and the clamp in the back of the photo are for, but I’ll figure it out. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Mark, if you happen to be reading this. I guess I’ll actually have to build those rods now. No excuses. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Question:

But Tiger had to shoot 2 under (or so it seemed) for 4 holes on Friday to get paid for the week.  Guess who got it done.  The same guy who can’t find a fairway, can’t hit a wedge the right distance, can’t sink an 8 footer, and still gets it around the course under par for the week.  He’s not a winner this week but Tiger is the most determined SOB the sport has seen since Ben Hogan. Your logic is astounding.  Are you a democrat, by any chance? Greg

What has THAT got to do with anything? I’m about as Republican as you can get, and I’ll echo Joseph: Tiger is the most determined SOB the sport has seen since Ben Hogan. Most Republicans are smart enough to realize that Joseph’s point was this: that, despite the fact that Tiger had nowhere near his "A game" this week, he really gritted it out. When it was crunch time late in Friday’s round and he was in danger of missing the cut, he found a way to get the job done. Say, you’re not a Perotista, are you, Greg?  :-) Ray Pezzi

Response:

Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. Does he come up short or does he make it? I’d like to have seen Tiger on the last green – unfortuantely for him, Phil was 13 strokes better The point was that when Tiger has a chance to win, he usually converts. Winners find a way to win. Losers find a way to lose.

Yse, but first you have to have a chance to win.  My point is that Phil outplayed Tiger and yet somehow Phil is a loser.  Yes, Tiger has had big wins in the past, but this weekend he wasn’t even close to Phil.  Is Tiger a loser for the way he played this weekend or does he get special dispensation due to past victories?  People will say that Lowery played great golf and that Katayama played great golf but that a guy who was better than either of them played crappy golf, is a loser, etc.  Why is it superior to finish at -10 than at -14? They were not good enough to get that close to Toms so therefore they aren’t chokers – they are fine golfers. Let me get this straight – Phil Mickelson is a much better golfer than anybody else and whenever he loses it is because he chokes.  He could have kicked Tiger’s butt in the Masters but he choked.  Tiger is not capable of  outplaying Mickelson, its just that Mickelson cannot summon up his superior talent because he doesn’t have the killer instinct.  Is this what we are supposed to believe? Tiger missed a short put on the back nine in the Masters.  Question:  was that a choke?  Toms missed two short put on Sunday – were they chokes?  Nobody is willing to say it at the time it is made.  Once the tournament is over it is obvious – no, they weren’t chokes because the guy who missed the put won the tournament.  Had he lost, they might then have said that it was a choke.  Lovely standard – let’s wait for the final score and then we will look back at each mishap and refer to it as a choke if it happened to the loser and an obstacle from which the winner battled back heroically.  Phil has 19 victories but everybody harps about the lack of a major.  How does he keep from choking in those tournaments?  I know, they aren’t majors and so they don’t count.  Even if he beats many of the same golfers (including Tiger) he still sucks.  Let’s face it – if Phil had shot a 59 and Toms shot a 60 people would still call Phil a choker because he didn’t win. Maybe he and Monty will get in a playoff in a major then someone will have to win and no matter what happens the loser will be called a choker. (don’t laugh – the Oakland Raiders and the Minnesota Vikings went to a Super Bowl with both of them having the reputation of not being able to win the big one).

Response:

In that case, given Woods’ current level of play, I believe that Woods would have missed the putt. If Woods was playing up to his best level, he may have made the putt. However, we’ll never know, will we? You are probably asking whether it is Tiger or Phil who has more of a killer instinct. If that’s the case, then why don’t you simply find the right words? There is no need to be sarcastic towards me. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – No, my question was what would’ve happened had Tiger been there in Phil’s place.  The fact that Tiger wasn’t there is obvious and irrelevant. If I ask you if you think you could make a 2-foot putt to win The Masters, it makes no sense to answer, "But I’d never have a 2-foot putt to win The Masters." Look up "hypothetical."

Response:

Tiger would have hit the ball closer to the hole from the fairway. That’s the difference between the guy who’s won every major and the guy who hasn’t won one yet but still doesn’t want to be hitting 4 from the other side of the water.  The fact that Phil didn’t hit his approach 6 feet from the hole is the best evidence yet that his mindset has started to change.  Unfortunately he needed the old Phil for that one last full swing today.   -joseph – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. Does he come up short or does he make it? Neither – goes long, but makes the 4 footer coming back.

Response:

But Tiger had to shoot 2 under (or so it seemed) for 4 holes on Friday to get paid for the week.  Guess who got it done.  The same guy who can’t find a fairway, can’t hit a wedge the right distance, can’t sink an 8 footer, and still gets it around the course under par for the week.  He’s not a winner this week but Tiger is the most determined SOB the sport has seen since Ben Hogan.

Your logic is astounding.  Are you a democrat, by any chance? Greg

Response:

Tiger would have put his second shot to within 3 feet. He then would have missed the bird as is his current norm. Before being dumped by women twice in succession he woulda had a better shot.

Response:

I tell ya, it’s in the eyes.  It’s in the mind.  When Tiger is in position to win, and he needs that 30 footer to win, you can see it in his eyes.  You wouldn’t bet against him.  He *knows* its going in.  Call it focus.  Call it determination.  Call it "brining it up a level".  It’s when its all on the line – he *has* no doubts.  *If* he fails, he’s pissed – at himself, at the golf gods.  It would never enter his mind that he might end up in 2nd place. Not that hang-dog defeated "not again" look. Tiger hasn’t had that look in his eyes this year.  The fact that he’s one of the best golfers to ever live has allowed him to win a few, even a major – without that in-the-zone focus for 4 days.  Maybe it’s burn out from last year, or the media hype, or distraction from his million dollar other interests, or fly fishing with Mark.  Or maybe its his plan to just play bad enough to undo the hype for a while… who knows.  But *that* Tiger, the one who stares it down, hasn’t been on the course much. Phil on the other hand, always has that "please God" look when he’s up against it.  I know that look.  I live that look on the course (of course without the raw talent that Phil *does* have). – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. Does he come up short or does he make it? I’d like to have seen Tiger on the last green – unfortuantely for him, Phil was 13 strokes better The point was that when Tiger has a chance to win, he usually converts. Winners find a way to win. Losers find a way to lose.

Response:

Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. Does he come up short or does he make it? Tiger would’ve made the put on 16 so he would never have gotten in the situation, but saying he didn’t… nothing but the bottom of the cup.

He sure the hell wouldn’t have left that 7-iron 45 feet short on 16 !! And if he had, he wouldn’t have listened to some drunken idiots telling him it was slow coming up the slope….. Annika, was that you ???

Response:

The point was that when Tiger has a chance to win, he usually converts.

Three 3-putts on the first day of a PGA tourney and you find it hard to have any chance to be around on the weekend.  From what I saw of him on Thursday, you could have putted better than Tiger. Also remember that Tiger is quite tough on one-to-one battles when he gets in position.  Remember those USGA titles and last year’s PGA. Winners find a way to win. Losers find a way to lose.

Looks like Phil beat a long list of guys and lost to one.  To me the bottom line is that Duval (and I expect Phil) thought that 16 under would win.  Phil left two strokes out on the course he got the other days – perhaps the course harden up a little. Cheers, Mike

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I agree that visually, Tiger seems to have  more "killer instinct" compared to Phil (and I’d bet money that this is true). However, it’s hard to believe that Phil really thinks in the manner you describe below (but I understand what you are saying based on his facial expressions). I doubt that Phil would not have gotten as far as he has w/o a very strong desire to win. That said, what do I or anyone of us here know. Only Mickelson knows. No matter what we think about this subject, the best arbiter will be the test of time. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I tell ya, it’s in the eyes.  It’s in the mind.  When Tiger is in position to win, and he needs that 30 footer to win, you can see it in his eyes. You wouldn’t bet against him.  He *knows* its going in.  Call it focus.  Call it determination.  Call it "brining it up a level".  It’s when its all on the line – he *has* no doubts.  *If* he fails, he’s pissed – at himself, at the golf gods.  It would never enter his mind that he might end up in 2nd place. Not that hang-dog defeated "not again" look. Tiger hasn’t had that look in his eyes this year.  The fact that he’s one of the best golfers to ever live has allowed him to win a few, even a major – without that in-the-zone focus for 4 days.  Maybe it’s burn out from last year, or the media hype, or distraction from his million dollar other interests, or fly fishing with Mark.  Or maybe its his plan to just play bad enough to undo the hype for a while… who knows.  But *that* Tiger, the one who stares it down, hasn’t been on the course much. Phil on the other hand, always has that "please God" look when he’s up against it.  I know that look.  I live that look on the course (of course without the raw talent that Phil *does* have).

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By your definition, Tiger is a loser? I disagree. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Winners find a way to win. Losers find a way to lose.

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But Tiger had to shoot 2 under (or so it seemed) for 4 holes on Friday to get paid for the week.  Guess who got it done.  The same guy who can’t find a fairway, can’t hit a wedge the right distance, can’t sink an 8 footer, and still gets it around the course under par for the week.  He’s not a winner this week but Tiger is the most determined SOB the sport has seen since Ben Hogan.   -joseph – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. Does he come up short or does he make it? But Tiger WASN’T in his place.

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Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. Does he come up short or does he make it?

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Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. Does he come up short or does he make it?

But Tiger WASN’T in his place.

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Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. Does he come up short or does he make it?

Tiger would’ve made the put on 16 so he would never have gotten in the situation, but saying he didn’t… nothing but the bottom of the cup.

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Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. Does he come up short or does he make it?

I’d like to have seen Tiger on the last green – unfortuantely for him, Phil was 13 strokes better

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Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. Does he come up short or does he make it?

Or put a putting machine in either of their places and let it make the putt once.  Don’t change anything and see if it goes in again. Joseph

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Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. Does he come up short or does he make it? But Tiger WASN’T in his place.

No shit.

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Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. Does he come up short or does he make it? I’d like to have seen Tiger on the last green – unfortuantely for him, Phil was 13 strokes better

The point was that when Tiger has a chance to win, he usually converts. Winners find a way to win. Losers find a way to lose.

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Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. Does he come up short or does he make it?

Neither – goes long, but makes the 4 footer coming back.

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: Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. : Does he come up short or does he make it? He comes up short, probably, from there. The difference is that Tiger would have snuggled that approach closer. cb

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The way Tiger has played lately…….he misses too, but gets an angry look on his face like it was his caddies fault that he missed it. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. : Does he come up short or does he make it? He comes up short, probably, from there. The difference is that Tiger would have snuggled that approach closer. cb

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Put Tiger on the last green in Phil’s place. Does he come up short or does he make it? I’d like to have seen Tiger on the last green – unfortuantely for him, Phil was 13 strokes better The point was that when Tiger has a chance to win, he usually converts. Winners find a way to win. Losers find a way to lose.

Winners find a way to be playing at the last hole when they CAN win.  Losers watch on TV.

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But Tiger WASN’T in his place. No sh**. "Annika", you’ve answered your own question.

No, my question was what would’ve happened had Tiger been there in Phil’s place.  The fact that Tiger wasn’t there is obvious and irrelevant. If I ask you if you think you could make a 2-foot putt to win The Masters, it makes no sense to answer, "But I’d never have a 2-foot putt to win The Masters." Look up "hypothetical."

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"Annika", you’ve answered your own question. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – But Tiger WASN’T in his place. No sh**.

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Question:

Go take a look at the Isuzu Trooper.  A good buddy of mine bought one about a year ago and we use it for both scuba diving and fishing.  He’s in love with it and I think a Trooper will be my next vehicle. At $21,000, it seems to me to be one of the best values for the buck on the market. Standard, it comes with power "everything" AM/FM/Cassette, nice seats, etc. and *so far* it just WILL NOT get stuck.  ’Worth a look for you at least.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Its time to bite the bullet and purchase a new vehicle.  My wife and I are discussing what to purchase to replace our aging fleet of rusty junk and decided we wanted the perfect fly fishing vehicle.  It will have to tow a small drift boat (16 1/2 ft long).  Hold two float tubes, be able to get in to moderately difficult destinations via dirt (read mud) roads. With the wealth of experience out their in Roffian land…how about some input?  As the wise African Tribal Chief once said, "Tis better to get the advice of 10 fools than one wise man "  Were could I go to seek better advice than from fellow fly fishing addicts.  By the way, its just my wife and I these days, so a pickup is an acceptable alternative…we have no brand loyalty and no prejudice in place. Our credit union gave us a $25K line for this vehicle… — Padishar Creel "I don’t want to achieve immortality through my work…I want to achieve it through not dying."  – Woody Allen

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I agree it’s a great rig but 25k won’t get you in the door New anyway Ford F350 diesel crew cab 4×4 w/off-road package. white.

         Harry Mason     www.Troutflies.com               *** "Quality Flies for a Trout’s Eyes"

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Its time to bite the bullet and purchase a new vehicle.  My wife and I are discussing what to purchase to replace our aging fleet of rusty junk and decided we wanted the perfect fly fishing vehicle.  It will have to tow a small drift boat (16 1/2 ft long).  Hold two float tubes, be able to get in to moderately difficult destinations via dirt (read mud) roads.

If it must be a newish truck/SUV, my vote would be to find a gently-used Ford PU (in whatever cab/bed choice you prefer) with the PowerStroke diesel engine.  Even a crew-cab, 1-ton, long bed, 4×4 gets over 20 MPG on the highway, even pulling a loaded cattle/horse trailer.  I’ve seen them with 200k of hard use and still going strong. If you don’t mind older, I’d recommend a late-80’s Jeep Grand Wagoneer.  We have them, and they can’t be beat as a real "off road" "off-the-rack" SUV.  I’ve pulled out stuck Landcruiser/Lexus SUVs, Rovers, PUs, etc.  Another big plus now is the fact it is they have actually become desirable again, and the prices are actually increasing in areas I’m familiar with – buy lower now, and it might actually increase in value.  You can get a damn near perfect low mileage one for well under 10K, even as low as 4-5k.  If you turn your own wrenches, you can work on anything on or in it easily – I can do damn near anything on one with a socket set and a couple of screwdrivers.  If you don’t, just about any halfway competent mechanic can, and without "specialty" tools. The only real drawback is gas mileage – 16-18 MPG or so is about it. If it can be a car, IMO, a Nissan Maxima wins hands-down, no question. We just replaced a 1996 with a 2001, and the only reason we did is because my mother needed a "new" car and we gave her the ‘96.  A friend, who had previously killed Mercedes, 2 pickups, a Volvo, and a BMW got one new in ‘94 and managed 200k on it, which was about equal to 500k for most.  In fact, the only reason he got rid of it was a rock hit the oil pan just right and blocked the pump, resulting in a locked motor.  He was going to replace the motor, but it just didn’t make economic sense. Whatever you choose, enjoy it, and have a Happy New Year! TC, R

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Our credit union gave us a $25K line for this vehicle…

My advice is not to take advice, but since you asked… I suggest a Ford Expediiton. I have a ‘97 4WD that I tow around the Grady w/. If you’re thinking about the 150, it’s essentially the same vehicle, only there’s more inside  it. One nice feature to consider is that w/ a cheap web rod holder system on the headliner, you can carry rigged 9 ft. flyrods inside. It’s a great tow vehicle and general hauler too. Best of luck. Capt. Gary S. Colecchio West Palm Beach Behold the Fisherman! He Riseth Up Early in the Morning, and Disturbeth the Whole Household. Mighty are His Preparations. He Goeth Forth Full of Hope. And When the Day is Spent, He Returneth, Smelling of Strong Drink. And the Truth is not with Him!

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Ford F350 diesel crew cab 4×4 w/off-road package. white. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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Ford F350 diesel crew cab 4×4 w/off-road package. white.

no, the perfect flyfishing vehicle must be grey <G cb

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Go take a look at the Isuzu Trooper.  A good buddy of mine bought one about a year ago and we use it for both scuba diving and fishing.  He’s in love with it and I think a Trooper will be my next vehicle. At $21,000, it seems to me to be one of the best values for the buck on the market. Standard, it comes with power "everything" AM/FM/Cassette, nice seats, etc. and *so far* it just WILL NOT get stuck.  ’Worth a look for you at least. Plus it rolls over quite nicely when changing lanes at freeway speeds. –Steve

And you can’t drive it across lakes like this convertible vehicle. http://4wd.sofcom.com/Mil/GAZ/46.html All you need to do is add a GPS, fishfinder, and a swivel chair to the bow. You will be the envy of all the bass fishermen.  :) Happy New Year! Dave

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Go take a look at the Isuzu Plus it rolls over quite nicely when changing lanes at freeway speeds. –Steve

Steve,   I think you may be right about the Isuzus.  I travelled to the Gillette, WY airport to work on an airplane over a 2 year period.  They had a car rental (Avis, I think) there and, in this 2 year period, I saw  3 or 4 wrecked Isuzu’s in the lot.  Each one looked like it had been rolled.  There wasn’t a straight piece of sheet metal on the whole rig.   Bob — —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

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I’ve been checkiing out Toyota’s new RAV4.  The rear seats fold up or come right out, the back floor is low and flat

That’s where the sub-woofer goes… <g — Charlie…

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For an extra 5 grand you might even get them to put an Orvis Edition decal on it. Frank Church – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve been checkiing out Toyota’s new RAV4.  The rear seats fold up or come right out, the back floor is low and flat and best of all, you can sit down at the back to put your waders on.  It has a 2 litre four so the gas mileage is good, comes with full time 4X4 and best of all, it’s a Toyota.  $25K should put you into a top of the line model including leather seats, with no trade-in. BTW, got the flies finally.  Thanks for hosting the swap and the nice fly box.  There are some great patterns in this one. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at

http://members.home.net/pcharles/streamers/index.html

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I’ve been checkiing out Toyota’s new RAV4.  The rear seats fold up or come right out, the back floor is low and flat and best of all, you can sit down at the back to put your waders on.  It has a 2 litre four so the gas mileage is good, comes with full time 4X4 and best of all, it’s a Toyota.  $25K should put you into a top of the line model including leather seats, with no trade-in. BTW, got the flies finally.  Thanks for hosting the swap and the nice fly box.  There are some great patterns in this one. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://members.home.net/pcharles/streamers/index.html

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Go take a look at the Isuzu Trooper.  A good buddy of mine bought one about a year ago and we use it for both scuba diving and fishing.  He’s in love with it and I think a Trooper will be my next vehicle. At $21,000, it seems to me to be one of the best values for the buck on the market. Standard, it comes with power "everything" AM/FM/Cassette, nice seats, etc. and *so far* it just WILL NOT get stuck.  ’Worth a look for you at least.

Plus it rolls over quite nicely when changing lanes at freeway speeds. –Steve

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Padishar Creel writes: Our credit union gave us a $25K line for this vehicle…

Pick-up truck.  Think Japanese.  Toyota or Nissan. Dave LaCourse Pirate and Bottom Dweller

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Gotta go with Dave on this one…my little Toy riceburner (2WD) is fast approaching 500 thousand miles (we’ll see that before 2001 is out)  My 3rd Toyota, and looking to buy another if this damn thing ever wears out.  Like another poster said, I just turn up the radio so as not to hear the strange noises coming from under the hood. Frank (road warrior) Church

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Padishar Creel writes: Our credit union gave us a $25K line for this vehicle… Pick-up truck.  Think Japanese.  Toyota or Nissan. Dave LaCourse Pirate and Bottom Dweller

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and I these days, so a pickup is an acceptable alternative…we have no brand loyalty and no prejudice in place.

I like my Ford F150. The milage sucks, but anything smaller seems cramped the first time you start a trip with a thousand mile day. Big Dale

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Before the wall between East and West Germany fell, the East Germans had only very limited possibilities with regard to cars. The most widespread model was a "Trabant", a two stroke engine mounted on a steel chassis, and a body of fibre glass. These were not renowned for either their speed or reliability, and were a virtual death-trap in a fire. Their maximum speed varied somewhat according to the ingenuity of the owner, but was usually about 110Kmh. However this may be, an East German visiting west Berlin pushed his broken down Trabant into a garage, and asked the duty mechanic for help.  The mechanic looked under the bonnet, gave the motor a cursory glance, and then shook his head slowly, saying "No chance I

Question:

[deleted] Don’t get too hung up on graphite specs.

Good call Dan !. *Much* better to buy based on more *useful* information such as: MVR (Maximum Vibration Technology) <g — TimW – Halfordian Golfer Guilt replaced the creel…

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writes: Good call Dan !. *Much* better to buy based on more *useful* information such as: MVR (Maximum Vibration Technology) <g

Hi Tim, The point I was trying to make was that yes, there is a lot of different technology out there (including Orvis’ Maximum Vibration Reduction), but the whole point of the tech is to make a rod that works well and feels good to the individual.    It doesn’t matter what the technology is behind it if it doesn’t feel good (or make a difference) to the person buying it.  Got to keep that horse in front of the cart.<g                              Good Fishing,                                     Dan Dan Gracia Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools Mt. Shasta Fly Fishing Schools http://www.thegrid.net/flyfish

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I’ve heard the designation IM6 used when describing rods. It seems as though this is some "grade" of graphite. Can someone enlighten me as to what it means? Thanks, Scott Wilkinson

Hi Scott, There are four generations of graphite compositions that rod makers use today. The original or first generation called graphite #1 is ~30 million modulus The second generation called graphite #2 or IM6 is ~40 million modulus The third generation called graphite #3 is ~ 50 million modulus The fourth generation called graphite #4 is ~ 64 million modulus The later generations are usually lighter and more efficient, but I am really more concerned about how they cast. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY www.kiene.com

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Snip, snip….Don’t get too hung up on graphite specs.  Try out the rod and

see how it worksfor your needs.  Just because a rod says it is IM6 does not necessarily mean it is a better rod than one made out of the older graphite, or a worse rod than a rod made out of a newer graphite formula.  It allows the rod designer more design options than the old graphite and not as many options as the newestgraphite.  The result depends a lot on the skill of the rod designer and how he utilises those capabilities. Hope this helps,

I didn’t raise the question, but that’s about as good an answer as anybody could ask for. Cleared things up for me, anyway. Thanks. From the minute we’re born we all start dying;some of us just take longer than others. Me? I’ve been dragging my feet, but it doesn’t seem to help much.

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I’ve heard the designation IM6 used when describing rods. It seems as though this is some "grade" of graphite. Can someone enlighten me as to what it means?

It stands for "Intermediate Modulus 600" and is a graphite specification that is used to make fly rods.  It is typically known as second generation graphite and was pretty much the standard for many rod companies prior to the higher modulus graphites (third and fourth generation) currently used.  Lots of good fly rods were/are made from this material although it is no longer the standard of the industry. I believe  Winston still makes all of their rods out of this material and they make some very nice (and expensive) fly rods from it. Don’t get too hung up on graphite specs.  Try out the rod and see how it works for your needs.  Just because a rod says it is IM6 does not necessarily mean it is a better rod than one made out of the older graphite, or a worse rod than a rod made out of a newer graphite formula.  It allows the rod designer more design options than the old graphite and not as many options as the newest graphite.  The result depends a lot on the skill of the rod designer and how he utilises those capabilities.                     Hope this helps,                           Dan Dan Gracia Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools Mt. Shasta Fly Fishing Schools http://www.thegrid.net/flyfish

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I’ve heard the designation IM6 used when describing rods. It seems as though this is some "grade" of graphite. Can someone enlighten me as to what it means? Thanks, Scott Wilkinson

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there was an excellent posting on all the types of graphite a couple of months back. I suggest you search Dejanews if you want the straight goods as I am sure I have muddled it up in my memory a tad; graphite as a raw material is available from a number of manufacturers. The original graphite had a modulus of 33 million or so ( 33 million what?) About 10 years ago "2nd generation" graphite appeared with a modulus of 42 million: IM6 and Sage’s graphite II were part of this crowd. 3rd generation followed (ie Graphite III), modulus of maybe 50 million etc etc. So IM6 refers to a 2nd generation graphite fibre from a particular manufacturer. It’s been used a long while, it’s proven, rod designers know it’s qualities and a lot of people like rods made from it. Ralph H note spurious hyperbole, insults and ‘personal attacks’ made by the author are meant to honour "the Soul of Cicero" and are not intended as personal slights. Please don’t take offense as none is intended. remove "(take_this_out)" for email reply.

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Question:

you might visit http://www.troutangler.com they wont be too far out of your way. — happy trails, Mike Foate Polo Ponies, Ranch Vacation, Web Site Design http://www.rockinghorseranch.com

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Starting from Yosemite, crossing Nevada, Utah, Colorado and back to San Francisco. In early June (12 days). Where are the best places for flyfishing???? (catch & release, too) Accomodation suggestions?? Thanks in advance. Giovanni from Italy.

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Starting from Yosemite, crossing Nevada, Utah, Colorado and back to San Francisco. In early June (12 days). Where are the best places for flyfishing????

That is not enough time!   20 Lakes Basin east of Yosemite. Walker River, north on Hwy. 395 Truckee River north of there. Across Nevada and Utah, hit the all of the larger streams/rivers in CO.   —  markb – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Giovanni from Italy.

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Starting from Yosemite, crossing Nevada, Utah, Colorado and back to San Francisco. In early June (12 days). Where are the best places for flyfishing???? (catch & release, too) Accomodation suggestions?? Thanks in advance. Giovanni from Italy.

Giovanni: The period you will be fishing is pretty much dead in the middle of the "normal" spring runoff here in the Rockies.  With that in mind, you may find yourself sticking to tailwater streams below artificial lakes.  Another possibility is some of the lakes themselves. Here in Utah, three of the better-known tailwaters are the Green River below Flaming Gorge Reservoir, the Provo River below Jordanelle and Deer Creek Reservoirs, and Currant Creek below Currant Creek Reservoir.  All have extremely good fishing at times although the Provo and the Green tend to get a *lot* or pressure so the fish are fairly educated.  You can wade fish all of those streams, but you would probably have more luck on the Green if you hire a guide for a float trip – it’s a *big* river. I don’t know what your opinion of lake fishing with flies is, but there can be some very good fishing that time of year in some of the lakes in Utah. Strawberry Reservoir (about 1.5 hours south and east of Salt Lake City) is the premier lake in Utah, but there are many others that offer good fishing if you have a float tube or other type of boat.. Up in Wyoming, the New Fork River near Pinedale has the reputation as fishing the best early in the season, but there is very little public water.  You can, however, do float trips with a number of guide operations. I’ve never fished it, but the Ham’s Fork River outside Kemmerer is supposed to be very good.  Most of the other streams are fairly likely to be very high from runoff that time of year. A possible thought would be lake fishing on private water.  Western Rivers Flyfishing shop in Salt Lake City offers day trips on a number of lakes at a private ranch called L C Ranch.  Supposed to be VERY good fishing and they provide everything you might need. Good luck.  Accomodations are pretty easy that time of year here in Utah. Email me direct if you have any other questions. Bob

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone out there know where the native trout are?  I mean, where in the continental US can a person fish for trout that are native to the watershed they’re in presently, and have been there since before Man?  I know up in the Sierra’s you can still catch Volcano creek and Kern river Goldens in what I think are their ancestral (sp?) waters, but where else?  Are there still some Apache trout swimming where they always have, without the assistance of Man?  Greenbacks?  Lahontans?  Are the Cutts in Yellowstone completely pure?  Or have they been augmented by Man at any time?  I’d really love to know.  Is there a good book on this topic? JE

Try the south fork of the Flathead river. Only has native west slope cutthroats and dolly varden. both are thriving, and are natives.   little hard to reach though…. in the bob Marshall Wilderness…. which is why they are still natives.

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I’m on the other side of the mountains, but there are a few little small streams coming down out of the mountains near my house have have native brookies.  And 8 incher is a lunker, but they’re gorgeous.

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Apache trout are still found in decent numbers in one watershed on the eastern Sierra, but no fishing is allowed and it is patrolled by a back country ranger whose only territory is that particular watershed.

OOOOOOPPPPS!! This was supposed to say Piute Cutthroat, not Apache trout.                                       Sorry ’bout that,                                               Dan Dan Gracia Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone out there know where the native trout are?  I mean, where in the continental US can a person fish for trout that are native to the watershed they’re in presently, and have been there since before Man? Jon, I don’t know a lot about many places, but wild native Brook Trout are still to be found in a few of the spring creek headwaters in the Appalachians (North Georgia, N.C.) but they are having a real tough time surviving the ever encroaching effects of man. As I’m sure you’re aware, the Brookie needs colder, clearer water than most freshwater species, and this presents a problem as the streams warm due to the activities on or near the various watershed.  Also, they cannot fend for themselves when pitted against Browns and Rainbows for a limited food supply. Sadly, another problem that the little brookies have is that they have a reputation of being too easy, and too small (we’re not talking Labrador here) so they don’t get a lot of attention.

Here in the eastern  part of Tn we still have some native brookies. It looks like they are coming back. I recently caught and released a  10 inch brook trout and caught many more of lesser caliber. Hans

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Fereira) writes: Do you know if the "Eagle Lake" rainbow is considered "native"?

Yes, it is native to Eagle Lake in Northern CA but has also been transplanted to lots of otherwise dead waters or to places where water is too alkaline for other types of trout including more common strains of rainbows .  This particular strain can tolerate higher alkalinity than normal trout.  They also get REAL BIG!                                   Good Fishing,                                        Dan Dan Gracia Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools

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Yep! Terry Weir is right. Every fish I catch is a native, wild fish! Love that salt water biodiversity too! Wayne Marshall

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I think the brookies in Shenandoah NP are native. — Charlie… You weren’t supposed to tell

OOPs<g. They are so pretty though and hard enough to catch that I hope I didn’t do any harm. I can remember hiking back in a couple of miles, suprising a bear or two, and crawling up behind a boulder to make a cast into a pool that couldn’t have been much bigger than the inside of my rental car. What a lot of fun! — Charlie…

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Anyone out there know where the native trout are?  I mean, where in the continental US can a person fish for trout that are native to the watershed they’re in presently, and have been there since before Man?  I know up in the Sierra’s you can still catch Volcano creek and Kern river Goldens in what I think are their ancestral (sp?) waters, but where else?  Are there still some Apache trout swimming where they always have, without the assistance of Man?  Greenbacks?  Lahontans?  Are the Cutts in Yellowstone completely pure?  Or have they been augmented by Man at any time?  I’d really love to know.  Is there a good book on this topic? JE

I think the brookies in Shenandoah NP are native. — Charlie…

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I think the brookies in Shenandoah NP are native. — Charlie…

You weren’t supposed to tell

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone out there know where the native trout are?  I mean, where in the continental US can a person fish for trout that are native to the watershed they’re in presently, and have been there since before Man? JE <snip you would like the book "Native Trout of North America" by Robert H. Smith published by Amato Publications.  this book is a search for native, pure strain fish.  lots of searching of the high desert, tiny streams, etc.  pretty good reading too.  he goes after the fish with a fly rod. I second the recommendation for Robert H. Smiths book.  It’s been my resourse for any question that have come up in the group over the past few years.   John Fereira

  Yes; also for a strictly scientific approach to this interesting subject, try Robert J. Behnke’s monograph of western trouts: _Native Trout of Western North America_ pub. by: American Fisheries Society 5410 Grosvenor Lane, Suite 110 Bethesda, MD  20814   Cheers, and tight Lines! – Mark

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: Anyone out there know where the native trout are?  I mean, where in the : continental US can a person fish for trout that are native to the [snip] : Man at any time?  I’d really love to know.  Is there a good book on this : topic? Read Lewis and Clark’s Journal.  The same fish are still here in this part of the world. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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Otherwise thank all your angler fellows introducing brook trout, rainbows, and – even worse- brown trout (of course with WD) into rivers where they outcompete the natives.

[deleted] Then the hypocritical irony of calling these the ‘wild fish’ and not wanting to eat ‘em because they are beautiful wild fish. TimW

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ry the Atlantic ocean. Native Stripers and Blues up to 30 lbs or more on a fly. That’s fishin!                                 Terry Weir         Right on Terry.  I grew up on Long Island sound and looked forward to every autum for a shot at those really BIG Blues.           I was speaking specifically of trout in the post though.  By the way, how is the Bluefish run shaping up this year?  It’s been a long time…… JE

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone out there know where the native trout are?  I mean, where in the continental US can a person fish for trout that are native to the watershed they’re in presently, and have been there since before Man?  I know up in the Sierra’s you can still catch Volcano creek and Kern river Goldens in what I think are their ancestral (sp?) waters, but where else?  Are there still some Apache trout swimming where they always have, without the assistance of Man?  Greenbacks?  Lahontans?  Are the Cutts in Yellowstone completely pure?  Or have they been augmented by Man at any time?  I’d really love to know.  Is there a good book on this topic? California is loaded with native rainbows.  They are indiginous to the west slope of the sierra and are wide spread with many identifiable strains.

Do you know if the "Eagle Lake" rainbow is considered "native"? The giant Lahontan Cutthroat is gone for good, but some "almost" pure strain can still be found in the Eastern Sierra and in Pyramid Lake in Nevada.  The population in Pyramid Lake is artificially spawned each year by the Indians who control the Lake.  The original strain was wiped out with Bureau of Land Management project #1 which was the Darby Dam on the Truckee River.  

The Piute cutthroat can still be found in it’s native waters in an area a bit further south. Ralph Cutter has some great info on these trout in his book "Sierra Trout Guide".

Agreed. Robert Behnke has a good book out on Native Trout of North America (think that’s the title) but it is hard to find and expensive.

Actually Behnke’s book is called "Native Trout of Western North America".   Robert Smiths book is called "Native Trout of North America".                                  Hope this helps,                                          Dan Dan Gracia Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools

John Fereira Stop Unsolicited Commercial Email – Join CAUCE (http://www.cauce.org) Support HR 1748, the anti-spam bill.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone out there know where the native trout are?  I mean, where in the continental US can a person fish for trout that are native to the watershed they’re in presently, and have been there since before Man?  I know up in the Sierra’s you can still catch Volcano creek and Kern river Goldens in what I think are their ancestral (sp?) waters, but where else?  Are there still some Apache trout swimming where they always have, without the assistance of Man?  Greenbacks?  Lahontans?  Are the Cutts in Yellowstone completely pure?  Or have they been augmented by Man at any time?  I’d really love to know.  Is there a good book on this topic? JE you would like the book "Native Trout of North America" by Robert H. Smith published by Amato Publications.  this book is a search for native, pure strain fish.  lots of searching of the high desert, tiny streams, etc.  pretty good reading too.  he goes after the fish with a fly rod.

I second the recommendation for Robert H. Smiths book.  It’s been my resourse for any question that have come up in the group over the past few years.   John Fereira Stop Unsolicited Commercial Email – Join CAUCE (http://www.cauce.org) Support HR 1748, the anti-spam bill.

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Try the Atlantic ocean. Native Stripers and Blues up to 30 lbs or more on a fly. That’s fishin!                                 Terry Weir

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Anyone out there know where the native trout are?  I mean, where in the continental US can a person fish for trout that are native to the watershed they’re in presently, and have been there since before Man?  I know up in the Sierra’s you can still catch Volcano creek and Kern river Goldens in what I think are their ancestral (sp?) waters, but where else?  Are there still some Apache trout swimming where they always have, without the assistance of Man?  Greenbacks?  Lahontans?  Are the Cutts in Yellowstone completely pure?  Or have they been augmented by Man at any time?  I’d really love to know.  Is there a good book on this topic?

California is loaded with native rainbows.  They are indiginous to the west slope of the sierra and are wide spread with many identifiable strains.  The Shasta rainbow is one strain that is found throughout northern CA, and the McCloud rainbow is still found in its native waters of the McCloud river in CA.  Strange thing, McCloud has the Shasta Rainbow and the McCloud (subspecies) in the same water along with the non-native brown trout (two strains of that one also).  Pure strain McCloud rainbows are easily discerned by their tangerine orange stripe and cheeks along with orange cuts under the chin.  Not often caught, but spectacular fish. There is not a question what it is when you catch one. Specific strains of Steelhead have been all but wiped out in many areas, But some native runs survive.  Skamania Strain (Washington state strain from Skamania River) hatchery replacements were introduced in many of the rivers to mitigate the destruction (and continued destruction) of their habitat.  Poor attempt at a solution. Apache trout are still found in decent numbers in one watershed on the eastern Sierra, but no fishing is allowed and it is patrolled by a back country ranger whose only territory is that particular watershed. Numerous fly fishing clubs have helped with stream reconstruction projects ther to help repair damage from grazing cattle. The giant Lahontan Cutthroat is gone for good, but some "almost" pure strain can still be found in the Eastern Sierra and in Pyramid Lake in Nevada.  The population in Pyramid Lake is artificially spawned each year by the Indians who control the Lake.  The original strain was wiped out with Bureau of Land Management project #1 which was the Darby Dam on the Truckee River.   Although they thought they provided for it, the dam wiped out all of the spawning area and within a few years, the 40 lb. + Lahontan Cutthroat were gone.  Used to be a cannery at the mouth of the Lake that netted fish, canned them, and shipped them throughout the world in the 1800’s.  Was a booming industry until the dam.  They did find some pockets of the Lahontan Cutthroat in some lakes on the east slope of the Sierra and that is what is currently in Pyramid Lake.  There is some controversy as to whether they are pure strain or not, but they don’t grow nearly as large as the native strain that was in Pyramid Lake.  Still catch 8 to 15 lb. Cutthroat there, but not much chance of breaking that 40 lb. record. Goldens can still be found in the Kern drainage (native waters), but few are pure strain as there were hatchery plants again in the 1800’s when rainbow hatcheries were thought to be the best thing since sliced bread. There are some pure strain fish still in there that were geologically isolated from the drainage they dumped the rainbow plants in.  Ralph Cutter has some great info on these trout in his book "Sierra Trout Guide". We also have lots of native squaw fish but they are not much of a gamefish and they predate on salmonids. Robert Behnke has a good book out on Native Trout of North America (think that’s the title) but it is hard to find and expensive.                                   Hope this helps,                                           Dan Dan Gracia Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools

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Anyone out there know where the native trout are?  I mean, where in the continental US can a person fish for trout that are native to the watershed they’re in presently, and have been there since before Man?   snip< JE

 Try Maine, Jon.  There are still places producing  fairly good size native brook trout.   And, the landlock salmon fishing ain’t too shabby either.  However, I believe the landlocks were stocked as fingerlings years ago.  Of course you may have trouble finding *exactly* where to go. ;0) Dave L.

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Anyone out there know where the native trout are?  I mean, where in the continental US can a person fish for trout that are native to the watershed they’re in presently, and have been there since before Man?  I know up in the Sierra’s you can still catch Volcano creek and Kern river Goldens in what I think are their ancestral (sp?) waters, but where else?  Are there still some Apache trout swimming where they always have, without the assistance of Man?  Greenbacks?  Lahontans?  Are the Cutts in Yellowstone completely pure?  Or have they been augmented by Man at any time?  I’d really love to know.  Is there a good book on this topic? JE

Take a look at Ralph Cutters book about the Sierra Nevada. Otherwise thank all your angler fellows introducing brook trout, rainbows, and – even worse- brown trout (of course with WD) into rivers where they outcompete the natives. Look at recent discussions about the reintroduction of native grayling into Yellowstone National Park and all the counterarguments of these f****** stupid fisherman who only want to catch lots of big fish without caring about ecological interconnections. The general agreement of environmental destruction (what else is the deminishing of species variety in a given biotop?) is responsible that you can

Question:

Any suggestions on reasonably accessible locations on the east side of RMNP?  I have a recollection of being on horseback and seeing a fly fisherman near a bridge that would have been the Bear Lake road crossing a small stream that runs up from YMCA of the Rockies into Moraine Park. This was before FFing for me so I wasn’t actively spotting sites.  Any help will be appreciated so the time my 12yo and I can pry away from rest of family can be spent on fishing, not looking for sites.

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Steve, check out lilly lake, it is south of Estes Park on Peak to Peak highway. It was sold to the park about 4 years ago and was stocked with greenbacks,  last fall we were pulling 15-21inchers out….try an olive damsel fly, or a small olive midge just under the surface, Its a kick in the pants!   Also, at the end of horshoe park there is a small lake on the east side of fall river road, it doesn’t look like much, but it is packed with small brookies! a renegade will be all you need! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any suggestions on reasonably accessible locations on the east side of RMNP?  I have a recollection of being on horseback and seeing a fly fisherman near a bridge that would have been the Bear Lake road crossing a small stream that runs up from YMCA of the Rockies into Moraine Park. This was before FFing for me so I wasn’t actively spotting sites.  Any help will be appreciated so the time my 12yo and I can pry away from rest of family can be spent on fishing, not looking for sites.

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Question:

Anybody know of good flyfishing waters in or near Steamboat CO??? Pointers to the best flyshop in the area are also welcome…. Thanks, Lee Butler

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Anybody know of good flyfishing waters in or near Steamboat CO??? Pointers to the best flyshop in the area are also welcome…. Thanks, Lee Butler

all of ‘em. TimW

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Question:

The best advice for the Beartooth is to be prepared for EVERYTHING and know where you are going.  It can and will snow up there at any time and will likely get down to the 40s at night (if not lower).  There are a couple of good sporting good stores in Red Lodge who will answer questions. P.S. If you ski — bring them as it is year round if you don’t mind hiking back up.  Have fun.

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Hello my name is Michael mitchell I currently attend Michigan State University and work in Yellowstone Nat. Park.  Some of the best Fishing for cutts can be found in the North east portion of the park.  just 15 min. from cook city Montana Ps. good food at Beartooth Cafe. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m doing a hike into the Bear Tooth range in Montana to do some fishing this august.. I’ve always wanted to hike into the high country and fish some of the alpine lakes.. i’ve heard this region is great.. I would appreciate any advice or talk on the area.. I don’t know what to expect for weather.. I was told that the region we’re going to is void of insect life except crickets.. keg

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