Question:

Hello Anglers, Will be in Yosemite for a few days and was wondering about fishing the lakes off Hwy 120 going east thru Tioga pass. Is fishing not allowed? Is it OK with barbless/artificial only? Is it catch & release? Do they plant any of these lakes with stupid DFG trout? What species of fish are in these lakes? Etc., etc. Appreciate any and all info. CP Note: I realize the Pass is closed due to rockslide! I also realize I could find this info somewhere if I really looked. But I’m looking for some first-hand knowledge/experience info.

Response:

Tuolumne Meadows has a lake near it, and the fishing can be good with worms and the white wood worms.  Most of the lakes up near Tioga pass are sterile. Bill – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Anglers, Will be in Yosemite for a few days and was wondering about fishing the lakes off Hwy 120 going east thru Tioga pass. Is fishing not allowed? Is it OK with barbless/artificial only? Is it catch & release? Do they plant any of these lakes with stupid DFG trout? What species of fish are in these lakes? Etc., etc. Appreciate any and all info. CP Note: I realize the Pass is closed due to rockslide! I also realize I could find this info somewhere if I really looked. But I’m looking for some first-hand knowledge/experience info.

Response:

Just got back from a ten day trip with my 9 year old son. Stopped off at saddlebag lake, 2 miles in from the Yosemite gate at Tioga pass. We took he boat in ,its a long and skinny lake, and planned to camp for the night. My son caught his first trout, a 14 inch rainbow, using a lure. At night, we used a fly and bubble on 4 pound test. Caught more fish than we could handle. When the boat came back the next morning to take us out, we decided to spend another night .Had another good day, nobody else camped there. Saw a few other hikers in the day but had the lake to ourselves all night. Saw no bears and had a wonderful time. Great place. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Anglers, Will be in Yosemite for a few days and was wondering about fishing the lakes off Hwy 120 going east thru Tioga pass. Is fishing not allowed? Is it OK with barbless/artificial only? Is it catch & release? Do they plant any of these lakes with stupid DFG trout? What species of fish are in these lakes? Etc., etc. Appreciate any and all info. CP Note: I realize the Pass is closed due to rockslide! I also realize I could find this info somewhere if I really looked. But I’m looking for some first-hand knowledge/experience info.

Response:

Question:

What should the flyfishing be like around Hungry Horse, the first two weeks of July? What kind of patterns would be best to have and size?? Doesn’t anyone fish in Montona, or just no one wanting to answer a honest question?????

Wait a week, drive 5 hours to Ennis, and you’ll meet a whole bunch of guys from here who can help you! (see, the "more than you asked for" is starting already…) Regards, Jeff

Response:

Actually, you mean wait a ‘month’ (or two). Clave starts in late July. — Tight Lines! Brian D. Nelson Diamond N Outfitters, Missoula, Montana http://www.montana.com/dno/dno.htm 406-626-4022

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What should the flyfishing be like around Hungry Horse, the first two weeks of July? What kind of patterns would be best to have and size?? Doesn’t anyone fish in Montona, or just no one wanting to answer a honest question????? Wait a week, drive 5 hours to Ennis, and you’ll meet a whole bunch of guys from here who can help you! (see, the "more than you asked for" is starting already…) Regards, Jeff

Response:

Actually, you mean wait a ‘month’ (or two). Clave starts in late July. What should the flyfishing be like around Hungry Horse, the first two weeks of July? What kind of patterns would be best to have and

size?? Geez, I hate it when I don’t read the original post! Do think on fishing the South Fork of the Flathead. My advice would be to take the drive south around Hungry Horse reservoir all the way to the trailhead at Spotted Bear. Hike upstream and start fishing! Attractor patterns work well on the cutts. — Tight Lines! Brian D. Nelson Diamond N Outfitters, Missoula, Montana http://www.montana.com/dno/dno.htm 406-626-4022

Response:

Wait a week, drive 5 hours to Ennis, and you’ll meet a whole bunch of guys from here who can help you!

If the clave in Ennis is next week I wish I would have told everyone that instead of Jul 21-31 Warren X#-[

Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

Response:

He said he’d be there the first couple weeks in July.  I meant if he waited a week from then…. Wait a week, drive 5 hours to Ennis, and you’ll meet a whole bunch of guys from here who can help you! If the clave in Ennis is next week I wish I would have told everyone that instead of Jul 21-31 Warren

Regards, Jeff

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What should the flyfishing be like around Hungry Horse, the first two weeks of July? What kind of patterns would be best to have and size?? Doesn’t anyone fish in Montona, or just no one wanting to answer a honest question????? Wait a week, drive 5 hours to Ennis, and you’ll meet a whole bunch of guys from here who can help you! (see, the "more than you asked for" is starting already…) Regards, Jeff

Wish I could, but vacation is planned and we are taking some of grandkids

Response:

What should the flyfishing be like around Hungry Horse, the first two weeks of July? What kind of patterns would be best to have and size?? Doesn’t anyone fish in Montona, or just no one wanting to answer a honest question?????

well, i don’t know how runoff will be during your time frame… but i’ve heard great things about the s. fork flathead for native cutthroats.  i believe there’s a flyshop in whitefish or kalispell… i’m sure they’d be happy to give you some ideas on what will be best during that time frame.  good luck, it’s beautiful country there.  i wish i had spent more time fishing there, but i usually stop short of that area and fish some of the smaller rivers in nw montana. chris chris

Response:

What should the flyfishing be like around Hungry Horse, the first two weeks of July? What kind of patterns would be best to have and size??

Response:

For hungry horses, try a "haystack".   Very large pattern is probably best. Sorry, couldn

Question:

Hello. I’m Art Daudelin, a writer on assignment for "Physicians Financial News." I’m doing a piece on Fly Fishing and would like to speak with someone who can give me an overview and philosophy of the sport, as well as some tips, travel spots, etc. An M.D. would make a great subject for an interview, as the magazine is targeted to physicians, but any good insight would be welcome. E-mail me if you are interested… thanks in advance, art daudelin

Response:

If I didn’t fish whenever possible, I’d strangle every911 callin, terminally unemployable slob who gets on teh medic…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello. I’m Art Daudelin, a writer on assignment for "Physicians Financial News." I’m doing a piece on Fly Fishing and would like to speak with someone who can give me an overview and philosophy of the sport, as well as some tips, travel spots, etc. An M.D. would make a great subject for an interview, as the magazine is targeted to physicians, but any good insight would be welcome. E-mail me if you are interested… thanks in advance, art daudelin

Response:

Question:

: :Is it really possible-as our friend with his first boat seems to think it :is-for  any  GPS to "steer" a boat running WOT around all these hazards?   no, the accuracy is only good to 50ft or so under ideal conditions. — george jefferson

Response:

| Now, the question: | | Is it really possible-as our friend with his first boat seems to think it | is-for  any  GPS to "steer" a boat running WOT around all these hazards?   | Seems to me it would take a complete map of the bottom and more waypoints | than any  device could handle. | | Peggie Hall/Peal Products | Specializing in marine toilet systems since 1987 | (And should prob’ly stick to giving plumbing advice only!) | | Peggie, If your boating friends make such wide-sweeping assumptions that you do, then I can understand why they would run aground in the middle of a channel! Actually, many ocean-going boats have much more advanced guidance and navigation systems than most of the lake-trailers that you see on Lake Lanier. Auto-pilots and GPS combined are used by many fishing and scuba outfits to drop almost dead-on a target with minimal search. I’ve seen it done many times. Please read what I have written again. If I was looking for a target, why would I run WOT? However, if I was heading for a fishing spot on, say, Lake Hiwassee, and I knew the GPS co-ordinates, then why do you fail to see the value in inland lake GPS? Actually, there are GPS maps of many lakes available, with features pre-programmed. Plug and play, as it were. I doubt that any electronics, whether it be GPS or marine radios, can replace the instrument between your ears. Now, you want to talk useless. With a toilet at every ramp, who needs a marine toilet?

Response:

I doubt that any electronics, whether it be GPS or marine radios, can replace the instrument between your ears.

Absolutely true. You mentioned going fast, night running, unfamiliarity with powerboats, unfamiliarity with the lake (which has a nasty habit of changing week to week)…and spoke of using a GPS to do your navigating. But from your above comments, it’s obvious I misread your intent to use it to navigate going fast at night…Sorry!  However,  when you’ve heard as many stories as I have about some of the ideas new boat owners have, it’s understandable.  The best one recently was a dealer who told me about a first time buyer who wanted GPS and an autopilot on his new houseboat so it could take him back to his slip at night if he was too drunk to do it himself! I see bass boats hauling all over the lake at night at WOT (more often than not with no lights showing BTW)… occasionally hear of  tragic consequences….I just don’t want you to be  one of  ’em. Now, you want to talk useless. With a toilet at every ramp, who needs a marine toilet?

Anyone who has a boat with enough privacy for one who doesn’t  want to go find a toilet on land every time his wife has to pee! <gg Bring that shiny new toy up my way one of these days and I’ll buy you a beer…it’s the least I can do after insulting your intelligence! Peggie Hall/Peal Products Specializing in marine toilet systems since 1987

Response:

WARNING – This post will have little content. I picked up my first bass boat on Saturday and I am gleaming from ear to ear.

Welcome to boating!  I plan to add a Bimini top, fishfinder(s), bilge pump (not included!), and a tachometer, once the checkbook balances out. I even have to add tie-down cleats! I put in another 6 gallon tank.

Welcome to the reality of owning (and dumping money into) a boat . . .

Response:

For one thing, you’ll learn that GPS isn’t a speedometer…it stands for Global Positioning System…it’s a computerized satellite navigation system that tells you where you are and what course to steer in latitude/longitude terms. Since you can always see the shore on all sides, you don’t need one to find your way home on Lanier!

Gee, my GPS displays current course and speed. (In knots, statute miles per hour, or km per hour) If you go over the the sci… groups, you can debate whether the speed is calculated based on delta-t / delta-d or doppler shift. Lee Lindquist     lindquist ‘at’ ibm.net "Only 2 more years until people stop telling me when the millenium REALLY ends."

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For one thing, you’ll learn that GPS isn’t a speedometer…it stands for Global Positioning System…it’s a computerized satellite navigation system that tells you where you are and what course to steer in latitude/longitude terms. Since you can always see the shore on all sides, you don’t need one to find your way home on Lanier! Gee, my GPS displays current course and speed. (In knots, statute miles per hour, or km per hour) If you go over the the sci… groups, you can debate whether the speed is calculated based on delta-t / delta-d or doppler shift.

So I’ve heard from a dozen people via e-mail!  Since there’s no real practical use for ‘em on an inland lake, the only ones I’ve seen were on friends’ sailboats on the Chesapeake Bay….and those only showed course and position. The owners  all have separate knotmeters. How ’bout expanding  my learning curve a bit more…first, the lake conditions: Lanier is a river in the foothills of the Smokies that was dammed and spread out over hills & valleys…around 260′ deep at the dam, but as little as 15′ deep up "creeks" out of the main channel. The water level fluctuates as much as 13′…what’s  6′ below the surface-and no problem–at full pool can "rise" to 2′ below it in a  matter of a week or two,  much of  it in the middle of  channels.  And the shoreline "moves" as a result.  In fact, the shoreline is "expanding" and islands  are shrinking–some have disappeared –due primarily to wake…Lanier is the most-used Corps of Engineers lake in the country. While the areas that are always shallow, many of which are passable when the lake is at full pool, but not when it’s down as little as 2′,  are marked,  it’s impossible to mark the ones that appear and disappear with fluctuating water levels as fast as often happens …and markers get knocked down. "Local knowledge" of the reefs and shoal waters is  essential…prop and outdrive repair accounts for a major percentage of the marine repair  business around the lake…even seasoned boaters who’ve been on the lake for more than a decade fall victim, proceeding VERY cautiously even in the daytime, and especially at night. Just last fall a friend who’s had a houseboat on the lake for more than 20 years lost an outdrive on an unmarked shoal in the main  channel of the lake, more than 100 yds from the shore…running at about  1200 rpms, but not paying enough attention to his course. Now, the question: Is it really possible-as our friend with his first boat seems to think it is-for  any  GPS to "steer" a boat running WOT around all these hazards?   Seems to me it would take a complete map of the bottom and more waypoints than any  device could handle. Peggie Hall/Peal Products Specializing in marine toilet systems since 1987 (And should prob’ly stick to giving plumbing advice only!)

Response:

| Congratulations!  You’re about to find out why B.O.A.T. stands for Break | Out Another Thousand! <gg | | However…. | | I am new to powered boats, but have driven friend’s boats. This boat | will fly! I am not sure how fast, though – no GPS, yet. I plan to add… | | But first do the rest of us on Lanier–and yourself–a HUGE favor: take | a Coast Guard Auxiliary or US Power Squadron boating safety course! | | For one thing, you’ll learn that GPS isn’t a speedometer…it stands for | Global Positioning System…it’s a computerized satellite navigation | system that tells you where you are and what course to steer in | latitude/longitude terms. Since you can always see the shore on all | sides, you don’t need one to find your way home on Lanier! | | You DO need a VHF radio, however…so you can call for help when you run | out of gas. <GG | | A boating safety course costs nothing but the time to do it. You’ll | learn the rules of the road, correct VHF procedure, how to read a chart, | how to recognize when weather is building and get to shelter before the | storm hits (I’ve been on Lanier in sudden squalls packing 45 knot | winds–NOT where someone in a 17′ open boat wants to be!)…safety gear | and how to use it–what’s required…a whole BUNCH of information that | could save your life–or mine. <g | | Have fun and be safe!  When you get the radio (and learn how to use it), | call SOLITAIRE…I’d love to see your boat. | | Peggie Hall/Peal Products | Specializing in marine toilet systems since 1987 | | Peggie | Thanks Peggy, I am reading a boating safety manual right now, which is probably more than most boaters do as a minimum. It is not my first time on the water, just my first power boat. I’ve have four other boats under the deck. Thanks, too, for the info on the GPS. I was trying to head off the corrective comments about speedometers not being accurate. GPS is a lot more useful than just finding your way back to the dock, in my estimation. It can be a safety device in tough boating conditions such as inclement weather or just being in the dark. Shorelines can be tricky to read in the dark, and one might not want to run next to waterway markers if there is a boat anchored nearby. Last, but not least, GPS can be used to re-locate positions, whether it be underwater cover, building foundations (my wife and I are divers, as well), and submerged islands, particularly on the distant lakes where I plan to trailer my boat. Not too sure I need a VHF radio, though. I’ve got twelve gallons of gas and I am an awful cautious. I switch over a tank leaving enough to get back on in the empty. I prefer to have a HONKIN’ bilge pump with a redundant back-up to buy me enough time to get to safety or shore. I have been in a thirteen foot Ghenoe on a river when it was raining so hard and the boat was filling with water so fast that I couldn’t stop bailing long enough to set the gear out of the boat on the bank! I’ve also paddled the Ocoee river in my kayak a few of times and gotten chewed up by Double Trouble and Diamond Splitter, as well as Hell Hole and Double Suck, but I’ll say this…it wasn’t as thrilling as cruising the lake in MY BASS BOAT!!! See you on the water.

Response:

Congratulations!  You’re about to find out why B.O.A.T. stands for Break Out Another Thousand! <gg However…. I am new to powered boats, but have driven friend’s boats. This boat will fly! I am not sure how fast, though – no GPS, yet. I plan to add…

But first do the rest of us on Lanier–and yourself–a HUGE favor: take a Coast Guard Auxiliary or US Power Squadron boating safety course! For one thing, you’ll learn that GPS isn’t a speedometer…it stands for Global Positioning System…it’s a computerized satellite navigation system that tells you where you are and what course to steer in latitude/longitude terms. Since you can always see the shore on all sides, you don’t need one to find your way home on Lanier! You DO need a VHF radio, however…so you can call for help when you run out of gas. <GG A boating safety course costs nothing but the time to do it. You’ll learn the rules of the road, correct VHF procedure, how to read a chart, how to recognize when weather is building and get to shelter before the storm hits (I’ve been on Lanier in sudden squalls packing 45 knot winds–NOT where someone in a 17′ open boat wants to be!)…safety gear and how to use it–what’s required…a whole BUNCH of information that could save your life–or mine. <g Have fun and be safe!  When you get the radio (and learn how to use it), call SOLITAIRE…I’d love to see your boat. Peggie Hall/Peal Products Specializing in marine toilet systems since 1987 Peggie

Response:

I think its great that you got you’re first boat. I bought my first boat as well last week. Its an old boat a ‘72 Starcraft with a small motor (35 HP). We took it out Sunday and ran around a local lake. Sonce i was a kid I’ve wanted a boat. Someday, I’ll upgrade, but I’m just in heaven from this boat. I did not catch any fish my first time out, but I did not really try. Have fun and be safe. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – WARNING – This post will have little content. I picked up my first bass boat on Saturday and I am gleaming from ear to ear. I bought a 17ft Grumman with console steering with a 50HP Johnson with pwr trim/ tilt. Two casting decks, aerated livewell, and a Johnson foot-operated trolling motor. My wife and I went out both Saturday and Sunday on Lake Lanier (north of Atlanta) and just had a blast. I caught a small spotted bass (about 1-1/4#) and she made me bring him home and clean him, since it was the inaugural bass, in the first 15 minutes of fishing! I am new to powered boats, but have driven friend’s boats. This boat will fly! I am not sure how fast, though – no GPS, yet. I plan to add a Bimini top, fishfinder(s), bilge pump (not included!), and a tachometer, once the checkbook balances out. I even have to add tie-down cleats! I put in another 6 gallon tank. This boat sips fuel, though. My wife loves it and the dogs were great for their first trip out. Got to get that bimini top on, though, for everyone’s sake. There was hardly anybody on the lake, especially yesterday. Although, it was partly sunny, we saw only a dozen boats. Great time for us to try out our new baby. The name of our new boat? Well, I guess we’re getting silly as we age, but we call our new Ford truck the "Golden Boy" (after the "Seinfeld" episode), so our aluminum boat is called the "Silver Queen", after the corn we love to pick out of our teeth. See you on the water…

Response:

This is what it is all ABOUT!!! Tear it up Tom & family…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – WARNING – This post will have little content. I picked up my first bass boat on Saturday and I am gleaming from ear to ear. I bought a 17ft Grumman with console steering with a 50HP Johnson with pwr trim/ tilt. Two casting decks, aerated livewell, and a Johnson foot-operated trolling motor. My wife and I went out both Saturday and Sunday on Lake Lanier (north of Atlanta) and just had a blast. I caught a small spotted bass (about 1-1/4#) and she made me bring him home and clean him, since it was the inaugural bass, in the first 15 minutes of fishing! I am new to powered boats, but have driven friend’s boats. This boat will fly! I am not sure how fast, though – no GPS, yet. I plan to add a Bimini top, fishfinder(s), bilge pump (not included!), and a tachometer, once the checkbook balances out. I even have to add tie-down cleats! I put in another 6 gallon tank. This boat sips fuel, though. My wife loves it and the dogs were great for their first trip out. Got to get that bimini top on, though, for everyone’s sake. There was hardly anybody on the lake, especially yesterday. Although, it was partly sunny, we saw only a dozen boats. Great time for us to try out our new baby. The name of our new boat? Well, I guess we’re getting silly as we age, but we call our new Ford truck the "Golden Boy" (after the "Seinfeld" episode), so our aluminum boat is called the "Silver Queen", after the corn we love to pick out of our teeth. See you on the water…

Response:

WARNING – This post will have little content. I picked up my first bass boat on Saturday and I am gleaming from ear to ear. I bought a 17ft Grumman with console steering with a 50HP Johnson with pwr trim/ tilt. Two casting decks, aerated livewell, and a Johnson foot-operated trolling motor. My wife and I went out both Saturday and Sunday on Lake Lanier (north of Atlanta) and just had a blast. I caught a small spotted bass (about 1-1/4#) and she made me bring him home and clean him, since it was the inaugural bass, in the first 15 minutes of fishing! I am new to powered boats, but have driven friend’s boats. This boat will fly! I am not sure how fast, though – no GPS, yet. I plan to add a Bimini top, fishfinder(s), bilge pump (not included!), and a tachometer, once the checkbook balances out. I even have to add tie-down cleats! I put in another 6 gallon tank. This boat sips fuel, though. My wife loves it and the dogs were great for their first trip out. Got to get that bimini top on, though, for everyone’s sake. There was hardly anybody on the lake, especially yesterday. Although, it was partly sunny, we saw only a dozen boats. Great time for us to try out our new baby. The name of our new boat? Well, I guess we’re getting silly as we age, but we call our new Ford truck the "Golden Boy" (after the "Seinfeld" episode), so our aluminum boat is called the "Silver Queen", after the corn we love to pick out of our teeth. See you on the water…

Response:

Question:

Bill–thank you for the clearest, most succinct piece of fishing advice I’ve seen recently in this group. I’m also going to the Bahamas for the first time next week and your advice was timely and valuable.

Response:

I am planning my first bonefish trip to Abaco in April. Does anyone have a list of what to pack (stuff like sunscreen,etc.) to fish this area. I have never traveled to the Bahamas and would appreciate any suggestions. Also, any recommendations on clothing and fly patterns would be great. Thanks.

Jim, As of yet I have to wet a line in the southern salt.  However I attended a lefty Kreh seminar last year with a few good general tips, as follows: Find out what colour the bottom is where you are going.  Tie light coloured flies for a light bottom..  A dark bait would seem out of place in "nature" A few good flies in different sizes and colours are better than a vest of mix and match.. FInd out if the fish are being caught on a high or low tide and fish accordingly… Suncreen, suncreen and more suncreen… Ian

Response:

I am planning my first bonefish trip to Abaco in April. Does anyone have a list of what to pack (stuff like sunscreen,etc.) to fish this area. I have never traveled to the Bahamas and would appreciate any suggestions. Also, any recommendations on clothing and fly patterns would be great. Thanks.

Start with a good hat that has a bill that is dark on the underside and has a chin strap for wind. Next, Polarized glasses that are not to dark and are in brown to yellow tones with a neck strap and side shields. Good sun screen is a must. I like very light weight long sleeve shirts and long pants for sun protection in light colors. Orvis, Streamline, Simms and Bare make about the same neoprene, thick soled flats booties that are the standard foot wear today. Most anglers are using #7, 8 and 9 weight outfits for bonefish depending on the wind, fly size and weight. We like leaders that a either hand tied or knotless that are ~ 9′ and clear with a stiff/hard consistency. If the wind is not blowing and the fish are spooky, I just add 3 to 5 feet of tippet and go down a size in flies. I recommend Cortland or SA saltwater lines for the hotter weather. In the Bahamas they use light colored Nasty Charlies that were developed there by Bob Nauheim of Santa Rosa ( Fishing International). The McVay Gotcha is very popular and Lefty Kreh really promotes the chartruese/white Clouser minnows. You might bring some small light colored crabs?  We use smaller/lighter flies in shallow water ( #6/8), medium weight/size flies(#4/6) for average depths(12 to 18") and larger/heavier flies( #2) with lead eyes for deeper water or current drift from tide movement. Take something to clean the salt spray from you glasses. I use a fanny pack if we are going for a long walk on the flats. Bring a small water resistant camera, batteries and film. I use a big stainless steel combo forcepts/cutter that will pinch the barbs, cut leader/tippet and remove deeply hooked flies. I hope that all anglers could have one nice day on the flats with the bonefish. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY

Response:

I am planning my first bonefish trip to Abaco in April. Does anyone have a list of what to pack (stuff like sunscreen,etc.) to fish this area. I have never traveled to the Bahamas and would appreciate any suggestions. Also, any recommendations on clothing and fly patterns would be great. Thanks.

Response:

Question:

Steve, It sounds an awful lot like a trermocline to me. Did your friend  try to look below this light line? Whenever I have seen the thermocline I am always able to see bottom also and im sure he to should have been able to see bottom.  I guess you will have to ask him but to answer your question yes sonar does pick up thermoclines,but remember not every lake will develope one every year! It just depends on the conditions Good Luck Weedjig

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Can anybody clear up an issue.  A friend fished a couple of fly-in Canadian lakes last year and said that the edges sloped off fairly steeply, lots of rocks, etc., but that at about 20-25 feet the bottom became uniformly flat across the basin, with a weak echo return.  He assumed that this indicated an old lake bottom that had silted in, so there was just a featureless expanse of mud. These weren’t tiny lakes and I have some difficulty imagining that kind of siltation.  I seem to recall reading something about sonar echoes being intercepted and bounced back by the thermocline (epilimnion or hypolimnion, I’m not sure) when a lake has stratified (In-Fisherman, I think).  This was the beginning of July and the weather had been hot and dry.  The water was warm enough to swim in. Could this be a cuase of the aforementioned sonar readings?  We are going up again this year and I would really like to know if this might be the case? Thanks loads.

With a paper graph (Eagle or Lowrance X-16) it is very easy to adjust the unit to see the thermocline and the bottom at the same time.  To support your theory, 20 to 25 feet deep seems to be a realistic depth for a thermo- cline in mid summer that far north. Easiest way to test — use a hand line with depth markings or mark your fishing line with a permanent marker ko

Response:

The flat ‘bottom’ reading could certainly be the thermocline.  It is very rare for any lake to have a uniformly flat bottom, especially Canadian shield lakes. Try adjusting the sensitivity up and down (mostly down in this case) to filter out unwanted signal and returns.  Also, be sure and turn the fish ID feature off if your unit has one.  Fish ID is not reliable for recognizing fish signals.  Any return not close to the bottom will show up a a "fish", and it may not be.  Some units also loose much detail in the displayed signal when the fish ID is on. Enjoy your Canadian trip!  I have to skip my Canada trip this summer and will be going through severe withdrawl!  I guess I’ll just have to fish more at home instead CHPeil!

Response:

Can anybody clear up an issue.  A friend fished a couple of fly-in Canadian lakes last year and said that the edges sloped off fairly steeply, lots of rocks, etc., but that at about 20-25 feet the bottom became uniformly flat across the basin, with a weak echo return.  He assumed that this indicated an old lake bottom that had silted in, so there was just a featureless expanse of mud. These weren’t tiny lakes and I have some difficulty imagining that kind of siltation.  I seem to recall reading something about sonar echoes being intercepted and bounced back by the thermocline (epilimnion or hypolimnion, I’m not sure) when a lake has stratified (In-Fisherman, I think).  This was the beginning of July and the weather had been hot and dry.  The water was warm enough to swim in. Could this be a cuase of the aforementioned sonar readings?  We are going up again this year and I would really like to know if this might be the case? Thanks loads.  

Response:

Question:

[...] BTW, my fly vest contains about a half-bottle each of "Gink" and "Xink". They’ll be the last I’ll buy. Anyone else want to join this boycott?

Yes, I’d be MORE than happy to. Besides, I picked up a huge container of Albolene during my stay in the US anyway… — | Environmental Toxicology Section | phone: +31 30 535338              | | Utrecht University               | fax:   +31 30 535077              | | the Netherlands                  |                                   |

Response:

[...] I thought it was pretty damn entertaining. I mean, here are all these flyfishers wandering into this newsgroup looking for tips on tying humpies, or instructions on how to fix the zippers on their gravel guards and what do they find: George Gehrke, beloved creator of Gehrke’s Gink, going completely freakin’ batshit in a tirade that would have made Adolph Coors blush. It was great! Bring him back here! He’s got balls the size of church bells, and this newsgroup (indeed, perhaps even the world of angling as we know it) needs more like him!

I don’t think this is entertaining at all. Out of curiosity I sometimes wander into rec.outdoors.fishing.fly (which I abandoned way before there even was a rec.outdoors.fishing.fly, just rec.outdoors.fishing), and time and again fall right into a similar raving, name-calling, rabid flamefest. Enough to make me realize why I switched r.o.f.f. for the And George Gehrke might have balls the size of church bells, but he certainly has a brain the size of the brain of our beloved quarry — or as we more commonly say: the size of a pea. And I will buy no more of his products and will actively pursue that more Europeans act likewise… — | Environmental Toxicology Section | phone: +31 30 535338              | | Utrecht University               | fax:   +31 30 535077              | | the Netherlands                  |                                   |

Response:

The..(lot’s of shortwave radioesque editorial snipped)..Arrrrgh!!! A.J.Thramer

Y’know A.J., it’s not so much your opinion that bugs me, it’s your absolute view that only you, and those who share your views, are right and good.  Also, your narrow minded definition of those who DO something for a living is a load of crap (IMHO, of course). Ross

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – [massive snip] I really think I’m wasting my time here. Color me gone. [snip again] I’ve about had enough of this net business anyhow.  My time is better used elsewhere. Color me gone. George Gehrke/Mr. Gink Yikes! I think we’ve just witnessed a self proclaimed "Professional Sportsman" go completely postal on the internet… That was the all time worst display of "professionalism" I’ve read in a long while, completely devoid of "sportsmanship". It was, in fact, simply a rant. Confronted with simple truth, he blew his brains out into the ether (not a pretty sight at all)…

I thought it was pretty damn entertaining. I mean, here are all these flyfishers wandering into this newsgroup looking for tips on tying humpies, or instructions on how to fix the zippers on their gravel guards and what do they find: George Gehrke, beloved creator of Gehrke’s Gink, going completely freakin’ batshit in a tirade that would have made Adolph Coors blush. It was great! Bring him back here! He’s got balls the size of church bells, and this newsgroup (indeed, perhaps even the world of angling as we know it) needs more like him!   George, if you’re still out there, switch to decaf, stop sniffing the Gink, turn off the Rush Limbo show, and get a grip…There’s room for you here…

Right on, but skip the "grip" part. And the decaf. Spinolio

Response:

I’d support a tax hike if Billy would use it to get the end of his nose fixed so that it did not look so much like a penis. TimW

Response:

Norm…those six occasions you mention wouldn’t have had any "pork" attached for the democrats agenda by any chance would they ? I believe there may have been a little more to those "occasions" than a vote on the environment. If not I would really like to know, pure speculation on my part but any details would be nice.

Response:

I wouldn’t support anything Clinton proposes but I do agree his nose looks like a penis. I can’t imagine what his penis looks like!

Response:

I wouldn’t support anything Clinton proposes but I do agree his nose looks like a penis. I can’t imagine what his penis looks like!

So this explains why you support Dole: you want a President who lacks any sign of a working penis. Steve

Response:

The second ammendment has absolutelyNOTHING to do with hunting and/or sporting arms. It has everything to do with the right of the people to self protection, whether from the local burgler or the an overactive government that has lost its contact with the people. A flock of killer ducks was not what the framers had in mind.   Does anyone really think that the excise money is 100% apropriated back to sporting causes? If there is even ONE person who believes that I can get you a hot deal on a bridge…..  As an example look up the figures on aircraft use taxes, gasoline road taxes and I am quite sure a list of examples ad nauseum.   Mr Gherke was perhaps a bit vehement in his rhetoric but his facts have been well documented and I for one agree with his message if not exactly his tone. This is turning into a society of citizens who want to ‘feel’ good. Damn the facts and full speed ahead on the good ship lollipop. Sometimes the facts are unpleasant or painful. Bubbas reputation is one of a terrible joke among the international community. Hi duck hunting episode last year made me gag.   IMHO Gherkes right, an opinion shared by most people who make,repair,sell,build or in short DO something to earn a living. Go ahead FEEL good and send the country down a payh that will lead to a place where everyone is a victim and no one can afford to make a living.   I use his products because they are the best available and will happily continue to purchase same!    Election by sound bite!!! Arrrrgh!!! A.J.Thramer

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : ——DEFEAT THE DOPE SMOKING, DRAFT DODGING, GUN HATING, COCAIN : SNIFFING, MENA VISITOR (Fly In Site for his Coke Habit In Oklahoma) TWO Well, I’m not certain how this fits into the discussion on the taxation of outdoor equipment Those with short memories and/or brain damage (Mr. Gehrke, perhaps?) sould be reminded that all hunting and fishing gear sold in the US has, for years, been subject to special excise taxes (generally referred to as "Pitman-Robertson" and "Dingell-Johnson", after the legislative sponsors). These taxes have been a notable success, mainly because they are "earmarked" for specific purposes, and don’t go into general revenue. Thus, a proposal for extending the base for these taxes *should* be discussed rationally, not by referring to ‘two-faced lying whore hoppers’. As for "draft dodging", Mr. Gehrke is just out of touch. The Vietnam era was indeed controversial. Those of draft age at that time could fall into four basic categories: 1. agreed with the war, and went – gotta respect these guys 2. harboured major doubts that the war was right, but went anyway – can appreciate the dilemma that these guys faced, gotta respect them too 3. believed the war was wrong, and didn’t go – obviously a group Mr. Gehrke despises, but making a decision of that nature involved significant personal sacrifice for many (living just 6 miles north of the US border, I know how many of my neighbours are US expats) 4. believed that the war was a great thing, provided someone else went; "preserve my ass, but ship out the farm boys and ghetto rats" ; these pond scum include Dan Quayle (whose daddy bought him a postion in the Guard) and Rush Limbaugh (whose family hired a specialist to come up with a medical problem that the army doc couldn’t find); no way anyone should respect these turds I’d respect Mr. Gehrke’s disgust with the folks in group 3 if I didn’t suspect he was kissing the asses of the sleazeballs in group 4. : VOTE DOLE IF YOU WANT TO SAVE YOUR GUNS AND YOUR HERITAGE. Of course, in the event that the Republicans are too successful (i.e. Dole in the White House, with the Newtzies still running the House), the question becomes academic – yes, you’ll be able to own as many guns as you want, but there will be nothing to hunt (and nowhere to go to hunt). And, if the water’s unsafe to drink, there ain’t gonna be a lot of fishing around either. This isn’t a Democrat/ Republican issue (respect a lot of folks on both sides) or a liberal/conservative issue (as above), but a *sane/insane* issue. Now, I guess the next major question is : I’ve read more posts from Mr. Gehrke than I really want to, given that his style (rabid) and his orientation (screw the environment, I wanna go fishing) are so extreme. Why does Mr. Gehrke, who owes his livelihood to the existence of a healthy environment, take such anti-environmental stands? BTW, my fly vest contains about a half-bottle each of "Gink" and "Xink". They’ll be the last I’ll buy. Anyone else want to join this boycott? 3798 Woodland Drive     voice: (604) 368-9315 Trail, BC               data:  (604) 368-9341   My, My, How mean-spirted we are today, hows the clear cutting going in B.C. ? Did the republicans get into Canada also ?   Just asking..   Harry

I think the original post by Mr. Gehrke was much more "mean spirited" than Tom’s, and at least Tom took some time to flesh out his thoughts instead of posting the all-caps, right-wing bumper sticker that George threw out. Just because you disagree with Tom’s reply, Harry, doesn’t make his message "mean spirited". Still, I’m very glad that Mr. Gehrke came out and stated his political beliefs so bluntly so that those like myself who flatly disagree can now avoid his products. Spinolio

Response:

Henk Verhaar writes:

I don’t think this is entertaining at all. Out of curiosity I sometimes wander into rec.outdoors.fishing.fly (which I abandoned way before there even was a rec.outdoors.fishing.fly, just rec.outdoors.fishing), and time and again fall right into a similar raving, name-calling, rabid flamefest. Enough to make me realize why I switched r.o.f.f. for the And George Gehrke might have balls the size of church bells, but he certainly has a brain the size of the brain of our beloved quarry — or as we more commonly say: the size of a pea. And I will buy no more of his products and will actively pursue that more Europeans act likewise… the size of a pea…don’t really correspond to flaming anyone you……really we don’t

Response:

I wouldn’t support anything Clinton proposes but I do agree his nose looks like a penis. I can’t imagine what his penis looks like! So this explains why you support Dole: you want a President who lacks any sign of a working penis. Steve

   Or law suits associated with the unbridled use of said unit. Where is  L  Bobbit  when you need her !   Harry  " If this is the Bridge to the 21st Century, I hope to God  Kennedy is not driving "

Response:

I wouldn’t support anything Clinton proposes but I do agree his nose looks like a penis. I can’t imagine what his penis looks like! So this explains why you support Dole: you want a President who lacks any sign of a working penis.

they’re both lying. TimW

Response:

Actually the final Senate count was all 50 Republican senators, because after the Ted Williams’ "Dirty Dozen"  article in Fly Rod and Reel went to press, the one Democrat, Sen. Shelby,  showed his true unenvironmental colors and switched to the Republican party. Should we read anything into this? Should this voting record be a factor in how we vote on election day? For me, it will be a major factor.

Response:

[massive snip] I really think I’m wasting my time here. Color me gone.

[snip again] I’ve about had enough of this net business anyhow.  My time is better used elsewhere. Color me gone. George Gehrke/Mr. Gink

Yikes! I think we’ve just witnessed a self proclaimed "Professional Sportsman" go completely postal on the internet… That was the all time worst display of "professionalism" I’ve read in a long while, completely devoid of "sportsmanship". It was, in fact, simply a rant. Confronted with simple truth, he blew his brains out into the ether (not a pretty sight at all)… George, if you’re still out there, switch to decaf, stop sniffing the Gink, turn off the Rush Limbo show, and get a grip…There’s room for you here… Cheers! /dave <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< < Digital Equipment Corp.     Alpha Server Engineering < < Parker Street Campus            Maynard, Massachusetts < <      Charter Member of "Curmudgeons Unlimited"       < <<<<<<<<<<<< AMA 548313 <<<<<<<<<<< Disclaimer: Opinions expressed herein may not be shared by             my employer, etc…

Response:

I wasn’t aware that the rabid and absurd Mr. Gherke in this group was the same who makes fly floatant.  If this is true (and I’d like confirmation of same), then I second the boycott motion.  This guy is hell-bent on destroying our resources for his own gain; something I don’t want to support.  Instead, I’ll use the environmentally friendly products made by Loon.

Response:

: ——DEFEAT THE DOPE SMOKING, DRAFT DODGING, GUN HATING, COCAIN : SNIFFING, MENA VISITOR (Fly In Site for his Coke Habit In Oklahoma) TWO Mr. Gherke: I read with dismay your response to our neighbor from the North.  My disappointment is not with your political views; you are entitled to express those as you wish.  Rather, I take issue with the discourteous and disrespectful way in which you have attacked the President of the United States in this international forum.  You behavior undermines the integrity and honor of our nation.  I shudder to think that the international community regards behavior such as yours as the norm for all Americans. Recently in the fly tying newgroup, you wrote about loyalty to U.S. manufacturers and their products.  You stated, "If Americans will not support Americans, then who will?"  Your conduct in this forum reveals your hypocricy.  No matter what you think of his policies or performance in office, you owe it to your nation and your fellow citizens to accord President Clinton the respect he and his office deserve.  If you dislike his policies or personal conduct, I urge you to exercise your right to vote against him and campaign for his political opponent in a constructive way. But personal attacks that disparage not just the man but the office have no place in civilized political discourse. I do not mean to imply that those who hold views similar to yours have a monopoly on discourtesy.  The legions who attacked President Nixon during his tenure were guilty of the same lack of honor.  More recently, arch-conservatives such as Rush Limbaugh and Bob Grant have helped institutionalize disrespect.  It is not an issue of politics, it is a matter of manners, pure and simple.  Hysterical and personal invective, whether liberal or conservative, sways no one’s opinion.  It simply tells others that Americans are a bunch of boors.  To say nothing of what we are teaching our children! Indeed, I believe that Americans have become fed up with negativism and discourtesy in the political process.  IMO, the best messages to come from the presidential debate held last night in Hartford were the expressions of professional respect and personal amity that each candidate holds for the other.  If you respect Mr. Dole, your chosen candidate, at all, then I suggest you follow his example of courteous and honorable conduct. I also urge you to retract your statements and apologize for the poor behavior you have exhibited in front of thousands of people.  While you are entitled to your policitcal views, you are not entitled to disparage America at the same time that you ask for the loyalty of Americans.  It is for this reason that I intend to join the boycott of your products. Respectfully, Michael Zuch

Response:

Tom, Good post! I won’t buy any Gink or Xink either. An interesting article appeared in the April 1996 issue of Fly Rod & Reel entitled "Out of Touch" by Ted Williams. Information in the article was collated by the National Wildlife Foundation. The article makes for interesting reading, but a portion lists the "dirty dozens" …."those listed are the dirtiest of the dirty; to make this compliation, they had to enter an anti-enviornmental vote on at least five of six occasions."(page 40) The Senate list had 49 Republicans and 1 Democrat. The House had 176 republicans and 13 Democrats. Mr.Dole made the list with five out of a possible of six anti-enviornmental votes. Norm

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Tom, Good post! I won’t buy any Gink or Xink either. An interesting article appeared in the April 1996 issue of Fly Rod & Reel entitled "Out of Touch" by Ted Williams. Information in the article was collated by the National Wildlife Foundation. The article makes for interesting reading, but a portion lists the "dirty dozens" …."those listed are the dirtiest of the dirty; to make this compliation, they had to enter an anti-enviornmental vote on at least five of six occasions."(page 40) The Senate list had 49 Republicans and 1 Democrat. The House had 176 republicans and 13 Democrats. Mr.Dole made the list with five out of a possible of six anti-enviornmental votes. Norm

  As Spinolio has rightly pointed out, the tone of George’s post was none too sweet. I am not condoning how he stated his feelings.  I also think he passed the point of "good taste".   What I do find amusing is the flight by some, on angelic wings, too some self-ordanined "higher ground". It is patently bullfeathers. Your above quoted article was printed on paper from trees, yes folks, trees that most likely where the result of clear cutting, are we all going to cancel our subscription ??  .  Mr Williams myopic views are well known and his cutting down of trees to get them printed is no less " anti-enviromental" than the people he  harpoons editorially.  How much tool oil went down some river to get your reels made?  Did your return the reel ?  How many Dams provide power so you can run your computer ? Do you shut your power off in protest?  The hypocrisy is knee deep here     The very idea that this "Holy" sport is a "non-impact", environmentally PC way of entertainment, is absolute crap on the face of it, and if you think that by partaking in this "hobby" you are somehow an environmentalist, you had better look again.  It is a blood sport that requires one to use, yes use , natural resources to partake. This is a contact sport folks, we impact the river, lake, creek environs  hard and to think we do not is teaching what to our children ?.    I don’t mean to point toward you per say Norm , it is just that there is an aroma about this that makes me gag. George is not the only one who may want to apologize "internationally", what ever that means.   It’s Monday…   Harry

Response:

Fact is Mr. Clinton has been in office for 4 years and some very tough gun regulating laws have been passed…as far as I know no sportsman has had his or her hunting rifle confiscated….second fact…there is no question which Presidential candidate will better protect our natural resources…third fact, the Vietnam war was nothing like WW1 or WW2…to use that war as a litimus test of ones patriotism is absurd…55,000 American men and women died to satisfy the hard ons of politicians and big business…fourth fact..Mr Gehreke is intitled to think what he wants of Bill Clinton, but he should check into the reality a bit more before openning his mouth.  Thanks for your time and bandwidth.

Response:

Snip, snip, snip, snip, snip… I gotta say that I find this ad-hominem, mouth-foaming, pissing-contest sort of post really nauseating on this newsgroup, which I thought was for people who enjoy the __peace and quiet__ that goes along with fly-fishing. Sure, let’s fight for what we hold dear; but calling people filthy names just because they wrote out a carefully considered opinion that doesn’t agree with you, is offputting and embarrassing to see in a newsgroup like this. Just my $.02 CDN. — K.G. (Kat) Cruickshank, ichthyophile. Toronto, Ontario, Canada. see my illustrations at http://www.mackerel.com/fish/home.html

Response:

: ——DEFEAT THE DOPE SMOKING, DRAFT DODGING, GUN HATING, COCAIN : SNIFFING, MENA VISITOR (Fly In Site for his Coke Habit In Oklahoma) TWO Well, I’m not certain how this fits into the discussion on the taxation of outdoor equipment Those with short memories and/or brain damage (Mr. Gehrke, perhaps?) sould be reminded that all hunting and fishing gear sold in the US has, for years, been subject to special excise taxes (generally referred to as "Pitman-Robertson" and "Dingell-Johnson", after the legislative sponsors). These taxes have been a notable success, mainly because they are "earmarked" for specific purposes, and don’t go into general revenue. Thus, a proposal for extending the base for these taxes *should* be discussed rationally, not by referring to ‘two-faced lying whore hoppers’. As for "draft dodging", Mr. Gehrke is just out of touch. The Vietnam era was indeed controversial. Those of draft age at that time could fall into four basic categories: 1. agreed with the war, and went – gotta respect these guys 2. harboured major doubts that the war was right, but went anyway – can appreciate the dilemma that these guys faced, gotta respect them too 3. believed the war was wrong, and didn’t go – obviously a group Mr. Gehrke despises, but making a decision of that nature involved significant personal sacrifice for many (living just 6 miles north of the US border, I know how many of my neighbours are US expats) 4. believed that the war was a great thing, provided someone else went; "preserve my ass, but ship out the farm boys and ghetto rats" ; these pond scum include Dan Quayle (whose daddy bought him a postion in the Guard) and Rush Limbaugh (whose family hired a specialist to come up with a medical problem that the army doc couldn’t find); no way anyone should respect these turds I’d respect Mr. Gehrke’s disgust with the folks in group 3 if I didn’t suspect he was kissing the asses of the sleazeballs in group 4. : VOTE DOLE IF YOU WANT TO SAVE YOUR GUNS AND YOUR HERITAGE. Of course, in the event that the Republicans are too successful (i.e. Dole in the White House, with the Newtzies still running the House), the question becomes academic – yes, you’ll be able to own as many guns as you want, but there will be nothing to hunt (and nowhere to go to hunt). And, if the water’s unsafe to drink, there ain’t gonna be a lot of fishing around either. This isn’t a Democrat/ Republican issue (respect a lot of folks on both sides) or a liberal/conservative issue (as above), but a *sane/insane* issue. Now, I guess the next major question is : I’ve read more posts from Mr. Gehrke than I really want to, given that his style (rabid) and his orientation (screw the environment, I wanna go fishing) are so extreme. Why does Mr. Gehrke, who owes his livelihood to the existence of a healthy environment, take such anti-environmental stands? BTW, my fly vest contains about a half-bottle each of "Gink" and "Xink". They’ll be the last I’ll buy. Anyone else want to join this boycott? 3798 Woodland Drive     voice: (604) 368-9315 Trail, BC               data:  (604) 368-9341

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : ——DEFEAT THE DOPE SMOKING, DRAFT DODGING, GUN HATING, COCAIN : SNIFFING, MENA VISITOR (Fly In Site for his Coke Habit In Oklahoma) TWO Well, I’m not certain how this fits into the discussion on the taxation of outdoor equipment Those with short memories and/or brain damage (Mr. Gehrke, perhaps?) sould be reminded that all hunting and fishing gear sold in the US has, for years, been subject to special excise taxes (generally referred to as "Pitman-Robertson" and "Dingell-Johnson", after the legislative sponsors). These taxes have been a notable success, mainly because they are "earmarked" for specific purposes, and don’t go into general revenue. Thus, a proposal for extending the base for these taxes *should* be discussed rationally, not by referring to ‘two-faced lying whore hoppers’. As for "draft dodging", Mr. Gehrke is just out of touch. The Vietnam era was indeed controversial. Those of draft age at that time could fall into four basic categories: 1. agreed with the war, and went – gotta respect these guys 2. harboured major doubts that the war was right, but went anyway – can appreciate the dilemma that these guys faced, gotta respect them too 3. believed the war was wrong, and didn’t go – obviously a group Mr. Gehrke despises, but making a decision of that nature involved significant personal sacrifice for many (living just 6 miles north of the US border, I know how many of my neighbours are US expats) 4. believed that the war was a great thing, provided someone else went; "preserve my ass, but ship out the farm boys and ghetto rats" ; these pond scum include Dan Quayle (whose daddy bought him a postion in the Guard) and Rush Limbaugh (whose family hired a specialist to come up with a medical problem that the army doc couldn’t find); no way anyone should respect these turds I’d respect Mr. Gehrke’s disgust with the folks in group 3 if I didn’t suspect he was kissing the asses of the sleazeballs in group 4. : VOTE DOLE IF YOU WANT TO SAVE YOUR GUNS AND YOUR HERITAGE. Of course, in the event that the Republicans are too successful (i.e. Dole in the White House, with the Newtzies still running the House), the question becomes academic – yes, you’ll be able to own as many guns as you want, but there will be nothing to hunt (and nowhere to go to hunt). And, if the water’s unsafe to drink, there ain’t gonna be a lot of fishing around either. This isn’t a Democrat/ Republican issue (respect a lot of folks on both sides) or a liberal/conservative issue (as above), but a *sane/insane* issue. Now, I guess the next major question is : I’ve read more posts from Mr. Gehrke than I really want to, given that his style (rabid) and his orientation (screw the environment, I wanna go fishing) are so extreme. Why does Mr. Gehrke, who owes his livelihood to the existence of a healthy environment, take such anti-environmental stands? BTW, my fly vest contains about a half-bottle each of "Gink" and "Xink". They’ll be the last I’ll buy. Anyone else want to join this boycott? 3798 Woodland Drive     voice: (604) 368-9315 Trail, BC               data:  (604) 368-9341

  My, My, How mean-spirted we are today, hows the clear cutting going in B.C. ? Did the republicans get into Canada also ?   Just asking..   Harry

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : ——DEFEAT THE DOPE SMOKING, DRAFT DODGING, GUN HATING, COCAIN : SNIFFING, MENA VISITOR (Fly In Site for his Coke Habit In Oklahoma) TWO Well, I’m not certain how this fits into the discussion on the taxation of outdoor equipment Those with short memories and/or brain damage (Mr. Gehrke, perhaps?) sould be reminded that all hunting and fishing gear sold in the US has, for years, been subject to special excise taxes (generally referred to as "Pitman-Robertson" and "Dingell-Johnson", after the legislative sponsors). These taxes have been a notable success, mainly because they are "earmarked" for specific purposes, and don’t go into general revenue. Thus, a proposal for extending the base for these taxes *should* be discussed rationally, not by referring to ‘two-faced lying whore hoppers’. As for "draft dodging", Mr. Gehrke is just out of touch. The Vietnam era was indeed controversial. Those of draft age at that time could fall into four basic categories: 1. agreed with the war, and went – gotta respect these guys 2. harboured major doubts that the war was right, but went anyway – can appreciate the dilemma that these guys faced, gotta respect them too 3. believed the war was wrong, and didn’t go – obviously a group Mr. Gehrke despises, but making a decision of that nature involved significant personal sacrifice for many (living just 6 miles north of the US border, I know how many of my neighbours are US expats) 4. believed that the war was a great thing, provided someone else went; "preserve my ass, but ship out the farm boys and ghetto rats" ; these pond scum include Dan Quayle (whose daddy bought him a postion in the Guard) and Rush Limbaugh (whose family hired a specialist to come up with a medical problem that the army doc couldn’t find); no way anyone should respect these turds I’d respect Mr. Gehrke’s disgust with the folks in group 3 if I didn’t suspect he was kissing the asses of the sleazeballs in group 4. : VOTE DOLE IF YOU WANT TO SAVE YOUR GUNS AND YOUR HERITAGE. Of course, in the event that the Republicans are too successful (i.e. Dole in the White House, with the Newtzies still running the House), the question becomes academic – yes, you’ll be able to own as many guns as you want, but there will be nothing to hunt (and nowhere to go to hunt). And, if the water’s unsafe to drink, there ain’t gonna be a lot of fishing around either. This isn’t a Democrat/ Republican issue (respect a lot of folks on both sides) or a liberal/conservative issue (as above), but a *sane/insane* issue. Now, I guess the next major question is : I’ve read more posts from Mr. Gehrke than I really want to, given that his style (rabid) and his orientation (screw the environment, I wanna go fishing) are so extreme. Why does Mr. Gehrke, who owes his livelihood to the existence of a healthy environment, take such anti-environmental stands? BTW, my fly vest contains about a half-bottle each of "Gink" and "Xink". They’ll be the last I’ll buy. Anyone else want to join this boycott? 3798 Woodland Drive     voice: (604) 368-9315 Trail, BC               data:  (604) 368-9341

It is evident that a Canadian, who may have harbored the idea of draft dodgers isn’t anyone I care to do business with anyways. That a Canadian has the reasons to justify why Americans should be draft dodgers, such as Slick Willie Clinton as opposed to the WWII Combat Soldier that is now running against  him, Bob Dole, I regard as a vacilating mind that is concerned about his own best interests and not that of his neighbors who were willing to die for his views, as wrong as they are. So, if you want to start a boycott, be my guest.  But don’t go around saying that I’m against good environmental stands and taxing, taxing, taxing is NOT the solution.  Not being responsible in defending the general public AGAINST POLITICAL TAXING IDEAS SUCH AS YOURS, would be criminal.  Not fighting the U.S. Forest Service with their sick plans to destroy our last remaining National Virgin Forests, is pure laziness and apathy.  My passion is against people who hold opposite points of view to these premises.  My record regarding my life long fight to uphold and prevent the special interests from destroying what remains for our childrens tomorrows is well documented.  I take special offense to your stupid, shallow, and outright filthy lies and acquisations to the contrary.  It is my company and my dollars and my staff and our persistant efforts over decades of work that have fought the good fight. Where the hell do you get off telling everybody that I have anti-environmental stands?  I spend thousands of dollars of Gink money every years supporting Trout Clubs, Many Chapers of T.U. the Federation of Fly Fishermen, Political candiates who care about your outdoor inventories . . . and because I don’t want the slick politicians taxing bikers, camping gear . . . you assume the worse?  You’re a very ill-informed, close-minded, selfish sonofabitch! In a lifetime of blood, sweat and tears, of writing letters, of digging in and putting my money where my mouth is, where were you in America? I’ll tell you where.  No where!  Never, in tens of thousands of dollars of donations to preserving, protecting and defending the enviornment has anyone . . . ANYONE . . . ever even said, "thank you". Well, I don’t want anyone’s thanks.  I haven’t given my entire life to the great American Outdoors to solicite anyones ‘thanks’.  I don’t need it.  Don’t want it. But you sir.  Are a pompous, ignorant person who knows NOTHING of what he is talking about. So, had you not snipped or had the full benefit of the entire thread of where our original distain for Slick Willie Clinton had started, you would have realized the justification for calling this liar of a President down for what he is.  Dishonest, unhonorable, and a yuppie who has not served this country, who is now a President that has not stopped the clear cutting timber barons, nor the dam builders, nor any of the rape that continues in outdoor America by special interests, even as I speak and you listen. I really think I’m wasting my time here. Color me gone. Do with my products what you want.  They still are the world’s best that you can buy.  If you want to go second class, that is your choice.  We have always appreciated our supporters business.  But if you think you can black-mail me . . . think again. At least you didn’t do business with a compromiser.  They will say anything to fall in line with such as yourself. I won’t. Tight lines always in the fond memories my products have given you. That, to me is the main satisfaction I’ve had on your life.  I’ve given you the best that is in me.  You can never that away.  Its too late. You want to take prisoners.  I don’t want any. I’ve about had enough of this net business anyhow.  My time is better used elsewhere. Color me gone. George Gehrke/Mr. Gink

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…looks like it has great potential as a fly fishing stream.  Do you know where it is? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Assistant professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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Nice cuts and one can actually walk away from the roads. Moose, Elk, Deer and an occasional bear (grizzly) pask

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I need to speak at the funeral of a friend who loved to fly fish.  I’d like to read a poem about flyfishing.  Any suggestions.

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I have two suggestions.  One suggestion is a lovely poem by Elizabeth Bishop entitled "The Fish," found in "North & South" and "The Complete Poems: 1927-1979."  My other suggestion is any one of several contemplative poems by Raymond Carver with a flyfishing setting in his collection "Ultramarine."  Bishop’s "The Complete Poems" is available in paperback from The Noonday Press; Carver’s "Ultramarine" is available in paperback from Vintage Books.

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Question:

Has anyone had any experience with the Scientific Angelers fly fishing package that you see in the stores?

They are nice little outfits. I honestly don’t know how they can afford to sell the things so cheaply.  St. Croix makes the rod and it is similar to their Imperial XL series.  Good value for the money.  I think they are trying to get someone up to usable quality who might otherwise end up with the $75 KMart special.  Note:  New ones are the 9′ 6wts which features a redesigned rod, last years was an 8′ 6" 6 wt.  Since everyone knows us West Coast folk won’t fish anything that starts w/ 8′, you can tell my bias. . .  :-) –Jim in Northern CA

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Has anyone had any experience with the Scientific Angelers fly fishing package that you see in the stores? I have a friend who may be interested in buying one to see if he likes fly fishing. Richard Warren Raleigh, NC

i’ve tried the 8wt.. The reel is good.. but the rod is not.. in my opinion they could have chosen from a hundred other better rods for less money.. if you get a chance.. take the rod out of the package and put it together and take a couple false casts on it.. it’s a real power house near the butt section but the tip section is slow.. keg

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Has anyone had any experience with the Scientific Angelers fly fishing package that you see in the stores? I have a friend who may be interested in buying one to see if he likes fly fishing. Richard Warren Raleigh, NC

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