Question:

Right on. Al

Response:

Right on. Al

Fly" while slicing  your sandwich in two with your fillet knife. —

Question:

To: All Oregon Fly Fishers This is an invitation to *all* who are interested in fly fishing in Oregon to join the Oregon Council Federation of Fly Fishers’ new e-mail listserv. The purpose of the listserv is to create a forum focused on fly fishing in Oregon.  Since snail mail and newsletters to the Oregon Council’s 2,200 members will take some time, I encourage you to forward this notice to anyone interested. To subscribe, send e-mail as follows:      subscribe orcfff-l Note that the subject line if left blank, and the command "subscribe orcfff-l" is placed all alone on the first line of the message body. Soon thereafter you will receive a "confirmation" number which you must return to complete the subscription (it prevents malicious people from signing you on and off the list without your consent). To obtain more information before subscribing, send e-mail:      info orcfff-l In addition to the open "general" list, there is a closed "conservation" list for those deeply dedicated to fish and habitat conservation matters. I will screen applicants to those who actively engage private, state and federal entities in fish conservation matters (e.g. ODFW basin plans, ODF Forest Practices Act, Option 9, ESA, stream gravel removal). The conservation list is "orcfff-cons-l". Thomas Gilg VP Conservation, Oregon Council of the Federation of Fly Fishers Chair, Mid-Willamette Fly Fishers

Response:

: subscribe orcfff-l :

If you’re having problems subscribing, note the following:    - The last character in "orcfff-l" is a lower case "L",      not the number "1" (one).  If your mailer is like mine,      the font is exactly the same    - Unlike many mail lists, the orcfff lists add an      extra step in the subscription process (see *):            with a line in it that looks something like         4) Your subscription should be complete. If you still can’t get through, please let me know. Thomas Gilg

Response:

Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I actually saw and held a size 32 Royal Coachman tied by Lee Wulff…quite a few years ago, asit happens. They did exist at some point. Herters Professional Fly Tying book stated that the small fly was tied by Miss Helene Shaw on Jan 21, 1939. It was tied on a specially made English hook size forty. The was pattern was a Royal Coachman. I don’t know if you can believe this source. Herter’s books are very interesting to read. There is alot of good information in them but you really have to sift through them. According to him, he originated almost every fly pattern & designed most everything used for tying & fly fishing. Fun books from a real character! Willi

My original queries on seeing the request for where to buy these was "What length are these hooks, what gape are they, are they up eyed down eyed or straight eyed? I don’t believe they are any more than a renumbered small hook given the number to massage the egos of fly tiers.  A bit like American dress sizes are given smaller numbers than they get in England. richard

Response:

I actually saw and held a size 32 Royal Coachman tied by Lee Wulff…quite a few years ago, asit happens. They did exist at some point.

Any major compromises in construction details ?…I mean… that band of peacock/floss/peacock alone would be wider than the shank length, wouldn’t it ? Curious…thanks… — TimW Halfordian Golfer

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I actually saw and held a size 32 Royal Coachman tied by Lee Wulff…quite a few years ago, asit happens. They did exist at some point. Just checking if anyone out there can help me find some size 32 hooks. Size 32 hooks are a figment of your imagination, as are any fish you might hook with one.  The eye would be bigger than the hook. Anglerboy

And what material was used for the leader and how many fish did he catch with these flies? richard

Response:

I actually saw and held a size 32 Royal Coachman tied by Lee Wulff…quite a few years ago, asit happens. They did exist at some point.

Herters Professional Fly Tying book stated that the small fly was tied by Miss Helene Shaw on Jan 21, 1939. It was tied on a specially made English hook size forty. The was pattern was a Royal Coachman. I don’t know if you can believe this source. Herter’s books are very interesting to read. There is alot of good information in them but you really have to sift through them. According to him, he originated almost every fly pattern & designed most everything used for tying & fly fishing. Fun books from a real character! Willi

Response:

I actually saw and held a size 32 Royal Coachman tied by Lee Wulff…quite a few years ago, asit happens. They did exist at some point. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just checking if anyone out there can help me find some size 32 hooks. Size 32 hooks are a figment of your imagination, as are any fish you might hook with one.  The eye would be bigger than the hook. Anglerboy

Response:

Just checking if anyone out there can help me find some size 32 hooks. Size 32 hooks are a figment of your imagination, as are any fish you might hook with one.  The eye would be bigger than the hook. Anglerboy — Trout fear me, Women want me.

FWIW. Some years ago I read in the "Guiness book of records", the smallest fly ever tyed on a hook was a dry "Royal Coachman" size 30+ something back in the thirties by a lady. ( Don’t recall her name)  Jocke

Response:

I have some size #32 hooks (sorry, personal inventory only). I can not locate my source but they are labeled: Mustad M277. Mustad’s web site may be of further assistance. Good luck all! Mike.

Response:

Somewhere down from #20 you have to tie a snell because there is no eye, just a little nub.

I just returned from a old tackle shop, and while I was there making my purchase of flies, I checked out the hooks.  The smallest I could find there was a size #28, it had a eye too.  I was talking to a dealer at a shop  few weeks ago, and he claimed there is a size #32 still around and this does not have a eye, just a little "nub" as you have stated…. –Randy Junk e-mail, solicitation, sales, products and services gladly accepted at $500.00 per mailing and billed directly to your ISP.

Response:

And I’ve seen ‘em, too. Some rodbuilders now use them to lay into the epoxy coat on the guide wraps. Very decorative, but can’t imagine the size tippet you’d need to put through the eye.

Ahh now I understand.  These hooks are made by Letraset….! richard

Response:

Somewhere down from #20 you have to tie a snell because there is no eye, just a little nub. And I’ve seen ‘em, too. Some rodbuilders now use them to lay into the epoxy coat on the guide wraps. Very decorative, but can’t imagine the size tippet you’d need to put through the eye.

 The initial question is…why so small a HOOK?  Once you get to the level of stability with 8x…#22_hook?, why don’t you just tie the smaller pattern on the #22?  Once you get to #22..the hooking % will probably drop…..? steve

Response:

And I’ve seen ‘em, too. Some rodbuilders now use them to lay into the epoxy coat on the guide wraps. Very decorative, but can’t imagine the size tippet you’d need to put through the eye.

Response:

Somewhere down from #20 you have to tie a snell because there is no eye, just a little nub. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – And I’ve seen ‘em, too. Some rodbuilders now use them to lay into the epoxy coat on the guide wraps. Very decorative, but can’t imagine the size tippet you’d need to put through the eye.

Response:

Go on then tell us what is a size #32 hook when it’s at home? What length is it or a size #30 for that matter? What gape? Is there an eye? Is it ringed straight?  Or turned up or down?

Some European hooks for coarse fishing are as small as a 30 or 32 on Mustad scale.  They are usually made with a spade end, to be whipped directly to nylon.  These seem different from the gold up-eyed hooks for fly tyers sold briefly in N.America as size 30 or 32 in the 1970s. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

Response:

I watched two fellows tie #30s by lanternlight just a couple of weekends ago beside the West Branch of the Ausable in NY. Mind you, I didn’t see anyone actually _fish_ with ‘em!

Go on then tell us what is a size #32 hook when it’s at home? What length is it or a size #30 for that matter? What gape? Is there an eye? Is it ringed straight?  Or turned up or down? Or are these hooks numbered in a reverse of the practice used in describing dress sizes in America?  A size 12 dress in America would be called a size 18 in England to flatter the buyer. Is there a fawning practice here of certain crafty hook suppliers to massage the egos of fly tyers and thus ensure some extra sales? richard

Response:

0]

: Just checking if anyone out there can help me find some size 32 hooks. : Size 32 hooks are a figment of your imagination, as are any fish you : might hook with one.  The eye would be bigger than the hook. : Anglerboy : — : Trout fear me, : Women want me. Aren’t they controlled by the EPA these days as suspected carcinogens as are other fine dusts like asbestos and silica? Mike — Michael McGuire                     Hewlett Packard Laboratories Phone: (415)-857-5491               Palo Alto, CA 94303-0971

Response:

Just checking if anyone out there can help me find some size 32 hooks. Size 32 hooks are a figment of your imagination, as are any fish you might hook with one.  The eye would be bigger than the hook. The smallest hook I ever seen was a #28, and I cannot imagine something smaller. Personnally I will not fish with something smaller than 18 or 20.

I watched two fellows tie #30s by lanternlight just a couple of weekends ago beside the West Branch of the Ausable in NY. Mind you, I didn’t see anyone actually _fish_ with ‘em! — Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Disclaimer: Over 30 and born in Fredericton, NB

Response:

   From my experiences, there are some differences between companies as to sizes of hooks. I have seen no. 20 hooks from Veniard that compared to no 18 hooks from Partridge.

This is true; the standards vary.  Regarding #32’s, I think there is a photograph in Robert Traver’s _Anatomy of a Fisherman_ which shows the #32 hooks which John Voelker/Robert Traver used. Woods Hole, MA   USA

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just checking if anyone out there can help me find some size 32 hooks. Size 32 hooks are a figment of your imagination, as are any fish you might hook with one.  The eye would be bigger than the hook. Anglerboy The smallest hook I ever seen was a #28, and I cannot imagine something smaller. Personnally I will not fish with something smaller than 18 or 20. By the way, does anyone know what unit of measure these hook numbers use? Sounds like a fraction of something, as the greater the number, the smaller the hook, but not being familiar with UK/US units of measure, I’m missing the starting point. We adopted the same numbers in France.

        From my experiences, there are some differences between companies as to sizes of hooks. I have seen no. 20 hooks from Veniard that compared to no 18 hooks from Partridge.

Response:

Size 32 hooks are a figment of your imagination, as are any fish you

might hook with one.  The eye would be bigger than the hook. Anglerboy — Trout fear me, Women want me. what do you do when the fish are only selectively rising to #32 bugs? why you quit, sit and watch the fish rise, or just enjoy being outside, or you could drink a few beers. chris

Response:

Size 32 hooks are a figment of your imagination, as are any fish you might hook with one.  The eye would be bigger than the hook.

A friend of mine gave a box of 100 size 32 hooks to me around 1973.  Since I have only a dozen or so left and not in the original box I cannot pass along any additional manufacturer info other than to discrbe them as gold with up-turned eyes.  I tied extremely small midges which worked quite well at producing takes on the Monocacy and Little Lehigh in eastern PA. However, as suggested, hooking fish was tough. I have never seen commercially advertized hooks smaller than 28 aside from these which were available only for a year or two back in the mid 1970s.  ..No, the few I have left are not for sale. Dennis

Response:

Size 32 hooks are a figment of your imagination, as are any fish you might hook with one.  The eye would be bigger than the hook.

Size 32 hooks are sold in Europe.  They are made with spade ends, for you to whip on to a tippet, or sold snelled. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

Response:

Just checking if anyone out there can help me find some size 32 hooks. Size 32 hooks are a figment of your imagination, as are any fish you might hook with one.  The eye would be bigger than the hook. Anglerboy

The smallest hook I ever seen was a #28, and I cannot imagine something smaller. Personnally I will not fish with something smaller than 18 or 20. By the way, does anyone know what unit of measure these hook numbers use? Sounds like a fraction of something, as the greater the number, the smaller the hook, but not being familiar with UK/US units of measure, I’m missing the starting point. We adopted the same numbers in France.

Response:

Just checking if anyone out there can help me find some size 32 hooks.

Size 32 hooks are a figment of your imagination, as are any fish you might hook with one.  The eye would be bigger than the hook. Anglerboy — Trout fear me, Women want me.

Response:

Size 32 hooks are a figment of your imagination, as are any fish you might hook with one.  The eye would be bigger than the hook.

Darn tootin’. I have mustad 94842 hollow points down to a size 28 and with my aging eyesight I can barely see the eye (let alone thread anything through it). The hole appears to be smaller than the diameter of a human hair and you can only just see light through it. David E. Malone All opinions expressed are my own.

Response:

Just checking if anyone out there can help me find some size 32 hooks. Will be glad to pay or trade for any amount.  Gunner

Response:

Question:

I have a question concerning nymphing…I learned that one should dead drift a nymph (holding the rod high) through riffles, pocket-water, along seams, etc.. I was on the DePuys outside of Livingston.

True, generally that’s a good idea (dead drifting).  Some times I find it effective to impart a slight twich every couple of seconds as the fly drifts. But that depends on the pattern I am fishing (e.g., ameletus immitation). life…these generally don’t have the capability to swim in the current,

Not so, there are swimmers such as the ameletus, which swims as fast as a minnow.  But anyway, even the nonswimming crawlers get dislodged in riffles while moving from one place to another, maybe foraging.  Some types of nymphs, e.g. the stonefly, crawl to shore to hatch and may be dislodged by fast currents and drift in the current. How does this impact presentation?? Favorite patterns: B-H squirrel tail, B-H telico, B-H Hare’s ear…all 10-16

These are caddis and mayfly imitations and a dead drift is fine.  They rise to the surface and hatch, or hatch while rising to the surface. -Burton — L. Burton Hawley           2330 NW Hummingbird Corvallis, OR

Response:

Not so, there are swimmers such as the ameletus, which swims as fast as a Hello Burton, I’m not familiar with the ameletus. Can you tell me a little about it?

Glad to Fred!  Ameletus (Genus) belongs to the Family Siphlonuridae.  It seems to be a distinctly western genus of mayflies.  Sixteen species are recorded from the West, and only four from the rest of the country.  They have been know to emerge in both the opening and closing weeks of the trout season, and often in between.  This is probably because of the large number of species.  They are a reddish-brown color (nymph and dun, I use a Hendrickson shade of dubbing to tie), and the nymph has short antennae small single, oval gills on abdominal segments 1-7 and the leading edges of the gills have a dark sclerotized band.  Three tails fringed with interlocking hairs and have one to several dark bands accross them near the tip (very distinctive, I use golden pheasant tippet for my imitation).  The have a broad head with large eyes on the side.  Size varies 6-14 mm(1/4-1/2 in.).   On specimens I have collected one or more of the abdominal segments on the underside is white. Their distribution is quite wide throughout the west, but some of the best populations are found in high mtn. streams of the Rockies where they have been collected at altitudes up to 11,000 ft.  They are commonly found in small, rapid streams, near but not *in* fast water.  They rrest on clean stones, vegetation, or debris.  They have been found all the way from small coastal streams to large desert rivers (not found in lakes).  They often inhabit deep undercut banks, away from the main current, the same places inhabited by large trout. Which is probably why it took us so long to discover them on a streach of river we knew held fish but couldn’t figure out what they fed on.  As a last resort we swept out a handfull of vegetation and debris from under the bank. The little critters were flying all over the place.  As I mentioned before, they swim with minnow-like speed.   Disturbances as I mentioned, send them scurring for better cover.  Their active swimming behavoir makes them readily available to trout. Ameletus have a one-year life cycle and the nymphs feed on algae or other plant material.  When mature they select a quiet area near the water’s edge to emerge.  The nymphs crawl from the water on plant stems, twigs, rocks or logs, like their sister genus Siphlorurus.  It may take fifteen minutes for the dun to free itself from the nymphal shuck.  Since they emerge above water the duns are seldom available to fish.  Spinner flights have never been recorded in any literature and mating may take place far from the water or high above it. It’s an interesting bug, and well worth looking for.  We have taken some nice fish on the nymph imitations.  When shown a picture of the bug by Dave McNeese, Polly Rosborough thought it was his Isonychia bicolor.  The color is similar and because of this it may have been misidentified or largely ignored by fly fishing writers. Well, there’s more than you ever wanted to know about Ameletus. Tight Lines, -Burton — L. Burton Hawley           2330 NW Hummingbird Corvallis, OR

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a question concerning nymphing…I learned that one should dead drift a nymph (holding the rod high) through riffles, pocket-water, along seams, etc.. I was on the DePuys outside of Livingston. <snip lots of great stuff        The guiding principle of when to use which technique is to understand which insect one is trying to imitate… In unfamiliar water with unfamiliar insects, the technique you described is often the best place to start…  If it doesn’t produce and you know there are fish there, do a bit of stream bottom research and change accordingly. Alan,

Nice summary on nymphing technique.  I really didn’t address technique.  If John wants to learn more about technique I suggest he try to obtain a copy of Charles E. Brooks excellent book "Nymph Fishing For Larger Trout" (ISBN 0-8329-0330-2) in which he discusses all aspects of nymph fishing (10 methods even). Tight Lines, -Burton — L. Burton Hawley Corvallis, OR          "Those children that you spit on           as they try to change their world,           are immune to your consultations,           and are quite aware of what they are                    going through."      "Changes"      David Bowie

Response:

Hey folks, I have a question concerning nymphing…I learned that one should dead drift a nymph (holding the rod high) through riffles, pocket-water, along seams, etc.. I was on the DePuys outside of Livingston. I see a number of FFers fishing nymphs downstream…I assume that some are using streamers…but I was under the impression that a nymph pattern was immitating (obviously??) nymphal stages of insect life…these generally don’t have the capability to swim in the current, right? So wouldn’t fishing downstream cause them to swing across the current or drag through the water creating non-natural movement of the nymph? I mostly fish the Chattahoochee or rivers/streams in the North Georgia Moutains…much faster than the slower spring creeks out West…the Hooch can be fairly deep in some places( 10ft) but I tend to wade the 2-4ft areas and most of the streams in N. GA that I fish are around 2-3ft with pools about 4-5ft in depth.   How does this impact presentation?? Favorite patterns: B-H squirrel tail, B-H telico, B-H Hare’s ear…all 10-16 Any and all techniques appreciated. Thanks, -John *       John Carney        * * Fly Fisher & Parrot Head *

Response:

Not so, there are swimmers such as the ameletus, which swims as fast as a minnow.  But anyway, even the nonswimming crawlers get dislodged in riffles while moving from one place to another, maybe foraging.  Some types of nymphs, e.g. the stonefly, crawl to shore to hatch and may be dislodged by fast currents and drift in the current.

Hello Burton, I’m not familiar with the ameletus. Can you tell me a little about it? Thanks,

Response:

I have a question concerning nymphing…I learned that one should dead drift a nymph (holding the rod high) through riffles, pocket-water, along seams, etc.. I was on the DePuys outside of Livingston.

<snip John,      I spent a very long time trying to catch trout with nymphs before I ever got a single hit…..then a kind gentleman, Chuck Davidison showed me how to do the normal "dead drift"….. but since have learned how and now prefer when there is no surface activity to use nymphs…. as it is very deadly..         Clearly dead drift is one of the best techniques for nymphing…..  with the line so slack you do not impart artificial movement or underwater drag to the fly… but with the line so taut that you can instantly sense any pick up…… *but* there are many other good presentations…. One I love in deep quiet pools is the "Bergman" crawl…. described in Ray Bergman’s "Trout"…. letting a nymph settle all the way to the bottom of a pool and then slowly with the fingers of the left hand (for right handed l….) sllllloooooooowwwwly winding in the fly line to crawl the nymph over the bottom….. has the advantage of imparting a realistic move, yet allowing instant telegraph of a pick-up.        Another effective technique a few days before the white miller hatch in July in Pa. is to use a perfectly white nymph with a bit of a tail.  Make very fast 12 inch jerks or strips of the fly line while there is a down and across drift.   space the strips a few seconds apart and make sure the nymph is within an inch of the bottom… You may need to dip you rod tip underwater….  this nymph is a swimmer and a fast swimmer and is quite active the few days before the duns appear at dusk… the best time to use this technique.        Another is the Leisenring lift named for Jim Leisenring noting that many nymphs rise to the surface *immediately* prior to the dun-on-the-water phase in a manner of completing an arc from the bottom and moving to the surface faster near the end of the rise… this is simulated by dead drifting and then as the fly swings past the fisherperson, allowing the line to tighten then smoothly lifting the rod to do the Leisenring lift…. The trout will take the fly about 5 inches below the surface.        The guiding principle of when to use which technique is to understand which insect one is trying to imitate… In unfamiliar water with unfamiliar insects, the technique you described is often the best place to start…  If it doesn’t produce and you know there are fish there, do a bit of stream bottom research and change accordingly. Tightlines, Alan E. Hoover Anglers’ Rest Powhatan, Va        *the trout teach many, lessons*

Response:

John, Please take the following with my usual caveat: I don’t consider myself or my opinions expert. Re: fishing nymphs downstream…while I have been on a near 10-year dry fly love-fest, I can remember a few things from my previous fishing life. I was weaned on multiple wet-flys and have caught hundreds of trout using the old down-and-across. It has been my observation that as the fly swings across the current it is popped upward just like a nymph heading for the surface. With practice, one can time this "emergence" to occur in likely trout lies. Same applies to downstream nymphing, but you must exercise much more restraint in setting the hook (hooking angle is terrible…too quick, and you pull it right out his mouth), while the "swing" is often a self-hooking affair. Since my wonderful (seriously) wife found me a good straight bamboo at an auction this summer, I am planning a return to my "three-at-a-time-swing", for old time’s sake if nothing else. As far as specific techniques…that will come if you pay attention to what’s happening. One word of advice that has really helped me: If you can’t spit in his eye, you’re casting too far. Good luck. — Jim Marple "He went fishing…call back at dark thirty."

snip I see a number of FFers fishing nymphs downstream…I assume that some are using streamers…but I was under the impression that a nymph pattern was immitating (obviously??) nymphal stages of insect life…these generally don’t have the capability to swim in the current, right? So wouldn’t fishing downstream cause them to swing across the current or drag through the water creating non-natural movement of the nymph?

snip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – *       John Carney        * * Fly Fisher & Parrot Head *

Response:

John: When the water is clear and the trout can see all, you sometimes have to present the nymph on a downstream cast.  The angler should then release line thru the rod guides to give the nymph a drag free float before it swings to the side of the stream. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey folks, I have a question concerning nymphing…I learned that one should dead drift a nymph (holding the rod high) through riffles, pocket-water, along seams, etc.. I was on the DePuys outside of Livingston. I see a number of FFers fishing nymphs downstream…I assume that some are using streamers…but I was under the impression that a nymph pattern was immitating (obviously??) nymphal stages of insect life…these generally don’t have the capability to swim in the current, right? So wouldn’t fishing downstream cause them to swing across the current or drag through the water creating non-natural movement of the nymph? I mostly fish the Chattahoochee or rivers/streams in the North Georgia Moutains…much faster than the slower spring creeks out West…the Hooch can be fairly deep in some places( 10ft) but I tend to wade the 2-4ft areas and most of the streams in N. GA that I fish are around 2-3ft with pools about 4-5ft in depth.   How does this impact presentation?? Favorite patterns: B-H squirrel tail, B-H telico, B-H Hare’s ear…all 10-16 Any and all techniques appreciated. Thanks, -John *       John Carney        * * Fly Fisher & Parrot Head *

Response:

some really excellent info clipped < Alan E. Hoover Anglers’ Rest Powhatan, Va        *the trout teach many, lessons*

Alan (et. al.), Thanks for the info folks…today the weather is bright, clear and 70 degrees! I’m hoping that the Hooch won’t look like YooHoo by this weekend….we have a lot of construction north of Atlanta and the runoff from the red clay really gets bad… However, there are other places…a few more days of this weather and the hatch will be on!  Gosh, I feel an illness coming on…;-D –John *       John Carney        * * Fly Fisher & Parrot Head *

Response:

Question:

I find myself going on a cruise this January with stops at Jamaica, Santo Domingo, Tortola, Ponce, and St. Croix. If anyone knows of any flats fishing that can be done on any of these islands, I’d love to hear about it. The more details the better, to decide if I should take my fly rod. thanks, Bob Vorel

Response:

If the cruise ship stops on the north coast of jamaica, I am happy to report there are tarpon in Montego bay and very nice looking flats intermittenly between there and Negril to the West and Ocho Rios to the west. You can "hire" a glass bottom boat which might serve as a casting platform, but the local captain will have no idea what you’re doing or what you want. The flats are reachable right from the coast road which runs mostly next to the sea. Saw BIG fins of either tarpon or cuda  nearer to Ocho Rios, where I just happended to stop and wade out a bit. I posted for information a couple of times to the news group before I went and got practically no responses. This is VIRGIN territory. By the way DO try the Pork Pit in Montego bay for jerk!!!. Its genuine and fantastic (and very clean). let me know how you do, Clair

Response:

Question:

Last week while driving home after a great day of fishing the CaneyFork River in Tn. I laid my reddington fly rod in the back of my pick up truck , and while taking a corner my coleman cooler wiped out my custombuilt rod. Reddington is going to replace the blank , but I would like to get the struble reelseat off the broke rod , any helpful hints ? I would be so

the only way I know is to heat with a heat gun until the epoxy goes soft and pull it off…this works with most of the 5 minute epoxies… TimW

Response:

Last week while driving home after a great day of fishing the CaneyFork River in Tn. I laid my reddington fly rod in the back of my pick up truck , and while taking a corner my coleman cooler wiped out my custombuilt rod. Reddington is going to replace the blank , but I would like to get the struble reelseat off the broke rod , any helpful hints ? I would be so                                                thank you                                                              Kent K. Anderson                                                              Nashville,Tn

Kent, Your Struble Reel Seat may be fine piece, but heating it to a temperature sufficient to loosen the epoxy can ruin the wood finish (speaking from experience here). I know of no way to protect the finish from the heat. You might also consider trying a drill press equipped with a bit the size of the seat’s original bore. Mitch Mulhall

Response:

I’d like to take the time to thank all of you , that took the time to suggest the best way to remove a reel seat .The reel seat is off ! After cussing and breaking the blank again . I first laid it out in the 97 degree sun , while I mowed the yard. I then took the Mrs. . hairdryer and heated that mother up . Then , I pulled the cork grip and the reel seat apart . The corkgrip was the one that came off . To make a long story short  , I drilled it out using a 3/8th drill bit and held the vise in my hand , it just ate away the graphite . Once again thank you.                                                         Kent K .Anderson

Response:

A friend of mine who builds rods tells me that he has done this procedure countless times.  You simply wrap the reel seat in ducy tape (lots of duct tape) and heat it all up with a torch.  The tape protects the wood while still getting the core hot enough to melt the epoxy.  I have not tried it myself. Hope this helps, gp

: Last week while driving home after a great day of fishing the CaneyFork : River in Tn. I laid my reddington fly rod in the back of my pick up truck : , and while taking a corner my coleman cooler wiped out my custombuilt : rod. Reddington is going to replace the blank , but I would like to get : the struble reelseat off the broke rod , any helpful hints ? I would be so :                                                thank you :                                                              Kent K. : Anderson :                                                              Nashville,Tn — gp

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   Last week while driving home after a great day of fishing the CaneyFork   River in Tn. I laid my reddington fly rod in the back of my pick up truck   , and while taking a corner my coleman cooler wiped out my custombuilt   rod. Reddington is going to replace the blank , but I would like to get   the struble reelseat off the broke rod , any helpful hints ? I would be so                                                  thank you                                                                Kent K.   Anderson                                                                Nashville,Tn  Kent,  Your Struble Reel Seat may be fine piece, but heating it to a temperature  sufficient to loosen the epoxy can ruin the wood finish (speaking from  experience here). I know of no way to protect the finish from the heat. You  might also consider trying a drill press equipped with a bit the size of the  seat’s original bore.  Mitch Mulhall

I agree with Mitch, having used this technique a few times, only without the drill press.  I use a hand held drill while holding the reel seat in a workmate (wrap the reel seat in a piece of old carpet).  What you’ll find is that the cutting point will displace the graphite, while the sides of the bit will generally not carve into the wood unless you create a severe angle.  Don’t try to cut to the bottom of the reel seat in one cut.  Instead, drill one quarter of the depth at a time, and pour the graphite out of the reel seat between quarters.  Good Luck Jeff Shafer

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Last week while driving home after a great day of fishing the CaneyFork River in Tn. I laid my reddington fly rod in the back of my pick up truck , and while taking a corner my coleman cooler wiped out my custombuilt rod. Reddington is going to replace the blank , but I would like to get the struble reelseat off the broke rod , any helpful hints ? I would be so                                                thank you                                                              Kent K. Anderson                                                              Nashville,Tn

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Question:

I will be in Anchorage 1 – 4 Aug 96.  I have two choices. First choice is floating down Lake Creek and fishing for Silvers.  Second choice is fishing the Keni. I am the only flyfisher in the bunch and my partners have no idea what type of fly I should be tying.  I need to start tying now so any suggestions on patterns and sizes would be apprecitated.   Thanks,         John

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I will be in Anchorage 1 – 4 Aug 96.  I have two choices. First choice is floating down Lake Creek and fishing for Silvers.  Second choice is fishing the Keni. I am the only flyfisher in the bunch and my partners have no idea what type of fly I should be tying.  I need to start tying now so any suggestions on patterns and sizes would be apprecitated.   Thanks,        John

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxx John…. I have been up in Anchorage several time at an area called Bulchitna. It is a lake and stream  on a tributary (sp) of Lake creek.  August may be just a little ealy for silvers, but if you want some good fishing and if the silvers are up, I would go to Bulchitna.  You can get a cabin on the lake (rustic cabin), with the stream 50 yards behind the cabin.  Lots of Pinks, rainbows, grayling, and silver (when running), and pike in the lake.  Call Craig Ketchum of Ketchum Air Service.  I don’t have the number with me right now, but they have an 800 number which you can get from the 800 operator.  Just as for Ketchum Air Service in Anchorage. Ketchum has lots of places they will fly you out to.  You can fish from 5:30am til 10:30pm.  I know that for a fact.  Who eats when you can fish! Contact me for more info. Russ….

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I will be in Anchorage 1 – 4 Aug 96.  I have two choices. First choice is floating down Lake Creek and fishing for Silvers.  Second choice is fishing the Keni. I am the only flyfisher in the bunch and my partners have no idea what type of fly I should be tying.  I need to start tying now so any suggestions on patterns and sizes would be apprecitated.   Thanks,         John

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I will be in Anchorage 1 – 4 Aug 96.  I have two choices. First choice is floating down Lake Creek and fishing for Silvers.  Second choice is fishing the Keni. I am the only flyfisher in the bunch and my partners have no idea what type of fly I should be tying.  I need to start tying now so any suggestions on patterns and sizes would be apprecitated.   Thanks,        John

I’d tie wooly buggers, egg-sucking leeches, large egg patterns, and flashy streamers on 1/0 to #4 hooks.  The best all-around fly in Alaska is probably the egg sucking leech in purple/Iliamna pinky.   BTW you didn’t ask but: Lake Creek float trip = nice wilderness experience, some mild whitewater, (WW1 – WW3) and good fishing.  There will be some , grayling, RBTs and some tired Kings.  It might be a bit early for Silvers in the upper river but you should run into them in the lower part. Kenai = lots of people, (although the King Salmon crowds are gone) and Aug. 1 – 4 is too early for Kenai Silvers.  They hit their stride in early September.  May be some late run Reds around in the upper drainages, (albeit a bit tired.) R. Wood in Alaska

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Question:

My wife and I are driving our camper to Alaska this summer (with part of the trip on the Alaska ferry).  Along with the sightseeing and flyfishing, I do need to keep in touch with my office (unfortunate, but true) because I will be gone for an extended period.  Does anyone have any experience with cellular phones in southeast or southcentral Alaska?  When you get away from Anchorage or Fairbanks, is there any reasonable service?  Thanks for any information.  Please E-mail me in

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: My wife and I are driving our camper to Alaska this summer (with part : of the trip on the Alaska ferry).  Along with the sightseeing and : flyfishing, I do need to keep in touch with my office (unfortunate, : but true) because I will be gone for an extended period.  Does anyone : have any experience with cellular phones in southeast or southcentral : Alaska?  When you get away from Anchorage or Fairbanks, is there any : reasonable service?  Thanks for any information.  Please E-mail me in I recommend that you ignore all answers to this question.  Just go.  If the cell phone doesn’t work, shrug your shoulders, put it in the glove compartment, and tell the office that at least you tried…when you get back. You’ll be oh-so-much more productive for having taken a real vacation, after all. — Laboratory for Applied Logic    Dept. of Computer Science University of Idaho             www: http://www.cs.uidaho.edu/~foster —–BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK—– Version: 2.6.2 mQCNAzDtvLEAAAEEAKAC21G2Be0K0DMgjLpxrwLmsYfCz8rWcfgyABjr3Ryfk1dO nV7fFFpUF3xohR7die+/B2V9oqRQzTLeSF2ECKlsTY/yUyw2kn+P2ju1umh4Fwzd cVTvc+H69q1+Ft3kmw/PE0Pan+g0PUGGJ43stw3q4OgBHdixbRd/f9giJFDxAAUR tCZKYW1lcyBBLiBGb3N0ZXIgPGZvc3RlckBjcy51aWRhaG8uZWR1PokAlQMFEDD8 ReEXf3/YIiRQ8QEBFrAD/2AFuRWcD/3MENC3qJMC/Or1qxknjkK7Uv+TDf2LHPOY GHBbG9PyWuXQ8of0Dd+JYwf/tzlO9Yk1s1zTdikfriak21FW0bCokxDIhA3myppZ IZDWVA9CyvDYHuP5Ii1NkBvocab813JzDLZA+0iVN5sebGb9zSXR4Za47hlriHeP =RDHK —–END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK—–

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: My wife and I are driving our camper to Alaska this summer (with part : of the trip on the Alaska ferry).  Along with the sightseeing and : flyfishing, I do need to keep in touch with my office (unfortunate, : but true) because I will be gone for an extended period.  Does anyone : have any experience with cellular phones in southeast or southcentral : Alaska?  When you get away from Anchorage or Fairbanks, is there any : reasonable service?  Thanks for any information.  Please E-mail me in Get serious. It’s time you learned what the word "rural" means.  And you better expect about three days without that precious phone in Canada.  What am I saying…might as well switch it off when you get to Montana. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Assistant professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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Question:

The original remark may be humorous to a man, but not to many of the women who may be exploring fly fishing on the internet. This type of attitude and mind set on the stream or anywhere else is not always comfortable to everyone.

I dont’s intend to speak for everyone nor to make everyone comfortable.  All I know is that I only read one response (yours) that took offense at my little joke.  I know that there are quite a few women that read this group and none of them seemed to take offense at it either.  I did, however, see at least one response from a woman that takes offense that the industry seems intent on selling equipment "designed" specifically for women.  I contend that trying to turn flyfishing into a non-gender neutral sport is more damaging then my little joke could ever be.  I’d also like to believe that a sense of humor is a gender neutral attribute as well. — John Fereira Isis Distributed Systems – Ithaca, NY

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The original remark may be humorous to a man, but not to many of the women who may be exploring fly fishing on the internet. This type of attitude and mind set on the stream or anywhere else is not always comfortable to everyone.

Uh Oh, someone’s going to save us all from the evils of politically incorrectness.  Lighten up. Jerry Cobb Nashville, TN

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Lighten up?…NO I DON’T THINK SO….saying something like tits on the grips is not funny, it’s not mature, and it doesn’t belong here.

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Seems to be any rod that can be taken apart has a male AND a female end!

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 guess some women just, want to be "Fashion Barbie"…

I’d like to point out that women have been less than pleased with the manufacturers who have tried to make them into "Fashion Barbie."   It has to be the most negative comments I’ve hear at women’s flyfishing club meeting.  Most, being conservationists, are into greens and browns and wouldn’t be caught dead in pink or purple on a stream.

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You ought to see what has happened to the diving equipment industry. All these wild colors for wet suits, fins, masks, snorkles, tanks, regulators, knives, gauges, bc’s. You’re supposed to be color co- ordinated for the fish! An then you go down…..guess what happens to all those colors at 80 feet? Yup, unless you have a strobe flash on all that fancy equipment, it all looks the same.  :) What you are seeing in ffing equipment is the same thing except it doesn’t go away when it goes into the woods. Bees and yellow- jackets do like yellow and pink, though. :OOO– Bill Fashion plate of leftover GI olive drab equipment…..

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The original remark may be humorous to a man, but not to many of the women who may be exploring fly fishing on the internet. This type of attitude and mind set on the stream or anywhere else is not always comfortable to everyone.

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Your remark regarding women’s rods possibly having breasts is rather ignorant…one would like to believe that even you would see that there is no place for that sort of comment in the fly fishing community. Good grief, are you suggesting that the "fly fishing community" is humorless? You know, now that I consider a good protion of the posts

Sexism, bigotry, and general boorishness is NOT considered humor in a public place.  This is a public forum, not the locker room.  Some humor will always be appropriate in the locker room and nowhere else.  It might serve some of you well to learn when and where such humor is appropriate. —— Mike Tucker-  The Virtual Flyshop Web: http://www.flyshop.com Phone: 970/225-6445

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The largest diameter grip I ever made on a fly rod was for a woman. The lady in question had tendonitus (sp?) in her hand and the small diameter grips on her factory made rods made it much worse. After using the rod I built her, she came back and had me replace the grips on all of her rods. Trying to generalize by gender is, IMNSHO, Bullsh*t. — Phil Koenig Manhattan Custom Tackle Ltd. http://fishdoc.com./ "I’m the boss,so WHATEVER I say is OK"

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Your remark regarding women’s rods possibly having breasts is rather ignorant…one would like to believe that even you would see that there is no place for that sort of comment in the fly fishing community.

Oh give me a break.  It was a joke, actually one I stole from George Carlin from his observation in describing a brand of womens cigarettes. I agree with the other person that mentioned that creating a flyrod for women is just a bit insulting.  Flyfishing is as a gender neutral sport as you can get and I don’t understand why people are trying to turn it into something otherwise.  Actually, I do.  Equipment manufacturers are just trying to sell more merchandise.  Women step into their waders the same way I do and can fart around on the stream as well as the next guy. — John Fereira Isis Distributed Systems – Ithaca, NY

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sounds like hype to me…a little sand paper will make the grip smaller…I can almost live with the mauve vest, and the burgandy waders, but this idea that fishing has to be *marketed* to women seems like an insult to women to me.  When Orvis says "here you go women, a flyrod just for you", they sound as if they are saying all our other rods are for men and not for you. It’s a nothing but an insulting gimmick in my mind DAMN RIGHT, Craig.. All Orvis did was put on a smaller grip..Like ALL women have little hands (like Frenchmen;)). I don’t think so!!!! If I can handle a SAGE 9′8Wt .. and 7+" of real man;).. like most REAL outdoors women can.. and have done for years…It is down right insulting! It’s like Walker says,"A cash flow runs through it". By the way, I have brown waders and a green vest, I look like a cute little tree on the stream,(stealth…it’s an Art!); not like "Barney". I guess some women just, want to be "Fashion Barbie"…

Who knows.  Maybe there will be a market for "Catskill Barbie" and "Catskill Ken". I personally want to catch fish..that’s why it’s called fishing….that’s why I’m out there, and none of my equipment has a cute little white "O" on it!! ….and NO,John F. the rods don’t have little breasts on them..the grips are still the basic "penis" shape, they have always been… Tickles, &"Bear "hugs for Charley

And as someone pointed out awhile back,  "queer" flyfishers like to hold the rod with the other hand because it feels like someone else is holding it. In flyfishing size doesn’t matter. — John Fereira Isis Distributed Systems – Ithaca, NY

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Your remark regarding women’s rods possibly having breasts is rather ignorant…one would like to believe that even you would see that there is no place for that sort of comment in the fly fishing community.

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Sounds like hype to me…a little sand paper will make the grip smaller…I can almost live with the mauve vest, and the burgandy waders, but this idea that fishing has to be *marketed* to women seems like an insult to women to me.  When Orvis says "here you go women, a flyrod just for you", they sound as if they are saying all our other rods are for men and not for you. It’s a nothing but an insulting gimmick in my mind

Response:

Your remark regarding women’s rods possibly having breasts is rather ignorant…one would like to believe that even you would see that there is no place for that sort of comment in the fly fishing community.

Good grief, are you suggesting that the "fly fishing community" is humorless? You know, now that I consider a good protion of the posts to this group you may be right. It seems that the computerized fly fisherman spending time on this group are endowed with an excess of selfimportance and no fun whatsoever. How about we all take a giant step back and a look at the big picture. We are really just a small, insignificant piece of that picture.  Just enjoy you days astream and not make it into more than it is – fishing.

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Sounds like hype to me…a little sand paper will make the grip smaller…I can almost live with the mauve vest, and the burgandy waders, but this idea that fishing has to be *marketed* to women seems like an insult to women to me.  When Orvis says "here you go women, a flyrod just for you", they sound as if they are saying all our other rods are for men and not for you. It’s a nothing but an insulting gimmick in my mind

DAMN RIGHT, Craig.. All Orvis did was put on a smaller grip..Like ALL women have little hands (like Frenchmen;)). I don’t think so!!!! If I can handle a SAGE 9′8Wt .. and 7+" of real man;).. like most REAL outdoors women can.. and have done for years…It is down right insulting! It’s like Walker says,"A cash flow runs through it". By the way, I have brown waders and a green vest, I look like a cute little tree on the stream,(stealth…it’s an Art!); not like "Barney". I guess some women just, want to be "Fashion Barbie"…I personally want to catch fish..that’s why it’s called fishing….that’s why I’m out there, and none of my equipment has a cute little white "O" on it!! ….and NO,John F. the rods don’t have little breasts on them..the grips are still the basic "penis" shape, they have always been… Tickles, &"Bear "hugs for Charley …..N.

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.Your remark regarding women’s rods possibly having breasts is rather ignorant…one would like to believe that even you would see that there is no place for that sort of comment in the fly fishing community.

First Day being a P.C. Cop in Owl Creek…Huh? Honey, if you think John’s comment was ignorant..maybe you should haul your ass over to R.O.F.F.PC ONLY!!! or R.O.F.F.H. (humorless);…  (Tim, these weren’t on your list…please add.) Some of us aren’t PC on the P.C., but don’t worry, after we die, we will burn in Hell….Remember, life’s a bitch, and 7X tippet breaks….. Tickles;) …N.  

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(PWullenweb) writes: A few brands offer a women’s version (e.g. Orvis’ Mary Orvis Marbury), but I’m not sure if there is a significant or logical reason to go with those other than the lighter weight.

Th only difference between the Orvis "MOM" rod and the Orvis "Trout" rod is the handle.  Both are 8 ft. 6 wt. fullflex rods made out of the same blank.  The MOM rod has a handle that has been turned down for smaller hands.   You would be best served by casting the appropriate rods for the conditions you will fish until you find one you like, and if you want a smaller handle on it, any custom rod maker can turn the handle smaller for just a few $.  Size and weight is not a problem. All three of my kids started with 8 1/2 to 9  foot rods when they were between 9 and 11 years old.                                                            Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

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Hi Pluck, The ‘womens rod’ is a silly idea. I don’t believe that a rods purpose or application changes with gender. The rods purpose is to cast a line and play a fish. Seems as silly as a ’soft periwinkle’ fishing vest. My ideas on rods are governed by the fact that I build bamboo but for trout a 7 1/2 ft 4 or 5 in a fast action is a good place to start. For smallmouth bass I woul choose an 8ft parabolic action rod for a  5/6 weight. Good fishing, A.J. Thramer

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I’m new to fly fishing and am looking to buy a rod.  A few brands offer a women’s version (e.g. Orvis’ Mary Orvis Marbury), but I’m not sure if there is a significant or logical reason to go with those other than the lighter weight.  I’d like to make this rod somewhat of an "all arounder", at least for the present.  Most of the time I’ll be on a small upstate NY lake, fishing from shore or in a boat for panfish, trout, as well as smallmouth and largemouth bass.  I’d like though to be able to take this rod to fish in some nearby streams.  Info on length, line weight and/or model would be appreciated.  Thanks in advance. Puck Wullenweber Ithaca, NY

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Pluck, Women can fly fish better then men and its not the rod!! I suggest a week vacation in July, Aug. or Sept at the Hawley MT. Ranch, where you can Fly Fish, ride horese,hike or just read a book, Its just 25 miles north of Yellowstone Park.   We do a lot of things other than fishing. Just ask!!! BBlewett

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I’m new to fly fishing and am looking to buy a rod.  A few brands offer a women’s version (e.g. Orvis’ Mary Orvis Marbury), but I’m not sure if there is a significant or logical reason to go with those other than the lighter weight.  I’d like to make this rod somewhat of an "all arounder", at least for the present.  Most of the time I’ll be on a small upstate NY lake, fishing from shore or in a boat for panfish, trout, as well as smallmouth and largemouth bass.  I’d like though to be able to take this rod to fish in some nearby streams.  Info on length, line weight and/or model would be appreciated.  Thanks in advance. Puck Wullenweber Ithaca, NY

I think lighter weight is one critical factor, the other being the size of the grip. Rods not designed for women may have grips that are larger than you are comfortable with (depending of course on whether you have large hands.) If you can find a comfortable grip you can use it – most quality rods are pretty light anyways.

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The possible difference with woman’s rods would be in the grip.  Possibly smaller than normal.  I would suspect that it is generally hype and marketing.  Try both and let me know.   For suggestions for a rod, I would suggest a 5 or 6 weight.  You are asking a lot for a rod to do all you want it to do and still be fun.   I lean towards the 5wt for the fun factor with trout and panfish.  You would have to use small poppers & deerhair bugs with the 5 wt due to the wind resistance.  Also, make sure the rod is 9′. If your starting out you’ll ask for 1 rod to do it all.  After a few years thought, you’ll own about 4 rods (trust me, I’ve been there)!

Response:

I’m new to fly fishing and am looking to buy a rod.  A few brands offer a women’s version (e.g. Orvis’ Mary Orvis Marbury), but I’m not sure if there is a significant or logical reason to go with those other than the lighter weight.

<snip Hi, My recommendation would be for you to locate a reputable local dealer and cast as many rods as possible in your price range. The rod that ends up working the best for you may or may not be a women’s version. I think it’s much more important how the fly rod works than what it says on the label. I hope this helps,   Alan.   Alan Barnard   Kiene’s Fly Shop   Sacramento, California   WWW Fly Tyer   http://www.ns.net/~barnard

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Pluck, Women can fly fish better then men and its not the rod!! I suggest a week vacation in July, Aug. or Sept at the Hawley MT. Ranch, where you can Fly Fish, ride horese,hike or just read a book, Its just 25 miles north of Yellowstone Park.   We do a lot of things other than fishing. Just ask!!!

Womens fly rods?  What, do they have little breasts on them or something? Just to clarify a couple of things.  The name was "Puck", not "Pluck". Since I also live in Ithaca I know that we can flyfish (a five minute walk for me to the nearest stream from my front door), ride horses (there’s a B&B place about 1000′ down the road of me that is a horse ranch), hike (across my driveway and 100′ in the other direction from the B&B are trailheads which go into a wildlife reserve, and I can read a book just about anywhere.  I’ll let you sleep on my couch for half of what your ranch charges. — John Fereira Isis Distributed Systems – Ithaca, NY

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Question:

I just thought that i would tell the world that my son got his first salmon last week a six pound hummpy. What a thrill for him.

Response:

I just thought that i would tell the world that my son got his first salmon last week a six pound hummpy. What a thrill for him.

Wow! That kid must have some arm casting a six pound humpy.  (does there really exist a humpy salmon?)

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 I just thought that i would tell the world that my son got his first  salmon last week a six pound hummpy. What a thrill for him.  Wow! That kid must have some arm casting a six pound humpy.  (does there  really exist a humpy salmon?)

    Yes.  It’s another name for a Pink Salmon.

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writes: (does there really exist a humpy salmon?)

In Alaska they call them "Humpies from Hell".  They come in every other year and take flies well.  Unfortunately they come in about the same time the silvers do and take the fly before it gets down to the larger silvers.  Great light tackle fish (6 or 7 wt.). Not as much fun on the 8 or 9 wt. you’d use for silvers (at least in Alaska).                                                      Dan

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