Question:

The 2IC wandered into my office yesterday and noted that the 1IC was detained and wouldn’t be in for the rest of the day … I looked at my duffle bag (which contains accoutrements for annoying fish) looked back at the 2IC and said "I might make it to 3:30 this afternoon …" I didn’t – at 2:50 I teed up the pick-up and we were well on our way by 3:30.  How is it that roadwork crews unfailingly select peak hour to rip up roadways? Does it take them all day to find the road to be ripped up?  Is it their way of making sure the maximum number of rate payers "notice" them? If so, they do a mighty fine job of it. Bugger ‘em. I’d scoped out a pool and glide a few weeks ago that provided some terrific dry-fly fishing mid-morning and that’s where we were heading. It was a bit warm waiting to get through the council induced traffic snarl but the air-con worked well as always – we just opened the windows wider.  Actually the weather looked a bit stormy before we hit the Divide and the cool mountain air. A few spots of rain as we geared up was all the inclemency suffered and the clouds gradually dissipated as the afternoon wore on. As I said, I scoped this stream a few weeks ago, and you guessed it: nary a fish in places I found them previously.  We fished, peeked, snuck, and skulked around and through through some nice looking water only picking up the odd fish.  We weren’t moving fast enough for me though – I really wanted to see that pool and its tailout. Bugger – a couple of fish in side channels. We did our best … he to catch them, me to get a wriggle on.   Columns of midges a metre in diameter and some 3-5 metres high  were evident over some of the backwaters – how many insects in those columns?   They twisted and gyrated like huge schools of baitfish being rounded up by predators.  A combination of the fluky breeze and the midges’ urges drove the column to writhe, twist and seemingly eject adults at the base of the column. There lay a single predator waiting and sipping the evicted with unhurried confidence.  Those that escaped that vortex trickled out of the backwater and down stream past us and into a drop pool.  You have to get your rocks off quick if you’re a midge. At last! The pool. They rose. All of them.  They rose and we cast, and we cast and we cast.  Then the takes started – one, two, three – six or more  missed.  Bigger fly same pattern – its getting dark. _Somebody_ was fairing a little better and had one, the bounder was using a swing I noticed on his second.  Not an unreasonable tactic considering the number of caddis about.  Same dry fly, cast to the same fish, cast across and drawn as it approached a fishes position bought good solid takes and hook-ups.   Certainly my imaginings about the pool had more than been matched by the reality at least on this occasion. A  pleasant surprise and a lovely place to put a bend in a new rod. As for Caddis: to dead-drift or not: that is the question: Whether ’tis nobler to suffer the rings and splashes of short takes, or to take arms against a battery of upstream dry-fly men and, by opposing, offend?  Yet by a swing we end the heart-ache and catch. Steve (humblest apologies to Bill … and any who got this far

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…….(humblest apologies to Bill … and any who got this far

Yeah, well, billy’s on his own.  Besides, he understood the groundlings.  Nice stuff, Steve. Not sure exactly where you’re at.  I was almost enticed into a backpacking trip in the Blue Mountains a couple of years ago.  Any fish there? Wolfgang

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Not sure exactly where you’re at.  I was almost enticed into a backpacking trip in the Blue Mountains a couple of years ago.  Any fish there?

It’s not my neck of the woods, but yes there are.  Small stream’s that you’d be used to, with populations of small browns and rainbows. The Cox’s River is rather larger and had (I haven’t heard much of it in the last few years) a significant rainbow run each winter (at least I think its winter).   Steve

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Not sure exactly where you’re at.  I was almost enticed into a backpacking trip in the Blue Mountains a couple of years ago.  Any fish there? It’s not my neck of the woods, but yes there are.  Small stream’s that you’d be used to, with populations of small browns and rainbows. The Cox’s River is rather larger and had (I haven’t heard much of it in the last few years) a significant rainbow run each winter (at least I think its winter). Steve

Hm…….interesting.  One last questions then.  Ya’ll got any REAL beer down there?      :) Wolfgang

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Hm…….interesting.  One last questions then.  Ya’ll got any REAL beer down there?      :)

Yep, you can also get Bud if you want it.   Steve

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Question:

It was good to meet you and great to fish with you. Hope you continue to post. Next year maybe a Colorado/New Mexico Clave? Willi

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Next year maybe a Colorado/New Mexico Clave? Willi

Now that that cat is out of the bag, I’ll tell you that I’ve started a list of potential locations for a CO/NM western clave 2001. A friend in the office showed me some pictures today, and after some coaxing i got the locations from him….  beautiful cutthroats…. lots of other nearby fishing….. WESTERN CLAVE 2001  in a secret town somewhere in southern colorado. bruiser Before you buy.

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Education & employment: Went to college in Lubbock, Tx at Texas Tech University.  Received a BBA in MIS/Finance and MBA with a concentration in MIS.  

Welcome to another Red Raider. As far as I know we are the only two on ROFF. Big Dale, Class of ‘77

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colorado. bruiser

Count me in. Any excuse to get to the mountains in the summertime. Big Dale

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Count me in!!! But whats this "next year" stuff?? Ain’t there fishin yet to be done this year, or do you suppose there’s so many claves going already there might be conflicts? (Conflicts??? on ROFF??? Tell me ain’t so !!!) Danl – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Next year maybe a Colorado/New Mexico Clave? Willi Now that that cat is out of the bag, I’ll tell you that I’ve started a list of potential locations for a CO/NM western clave 2001. A friend in the office showed me some pictures today, and after some coaxing i got the locations from him….  beautiful cutthroats…. lots of other nearby fishing….. WESTERN CLAVE 2001  in a secret town somewhere in southern colorado. bruiser Before you buy.

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With Big Dale and Dan’l, it’s a CLAVE already. We want time to plan, and time for everyone to restock their travel $ and hall passes.  Probably July 2001. Big Dale, we all missed you at the W Clave, although we know you’d have liked to go. We’ll get Jon Cook and Kelly roped into it also i’m sure.  Correct me if i’m wrong, jon, but it seems like you know your way around NM and CO pretty well. Before you buy.

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BIO name:  Kelly Rogers but I answer to a lot of things, depending upon the who’s yellin’ at me

<snipped a damn impressive BIO ’bout damn time there Kelly! <g  Enjoyed reading your 3 part post and look forward to reading mroe from you.  I was beginning to think you were going to wuss out. So did you do any fishin’ after the clave?  Feel free to email me the secret locations. I never did get a chance to stop in there and check on that girly, but I am planning on going for a weekend very soon and will no doubt have some free time. — Warren Findley Member of the Clavemeister Club Before you buy.

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rivers. Big Dale All we need is a clavemeister, Big Dale. I know at least one guy will show up.

It won’t be me. I have spent my whole life trying to stay out of west Texas and the decade I spent there was the worst flyfishing in my life. Big Dale

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I’m also thinking of a trip to southern Colorado/northern New Mexico sometime this September to check out some possible areas. Anyone interested in getting together?

   I’m up for that Willi, let’s synchonize our daytimers.    I’d been giving some thought to doing a clave in the North Park area, maybe even volunteering to be clavemeister. Wherever it is held, the bossman will need to be somebody with good knowledge of the local waters; me and Willi and probably a few others can find our way around North Park. Just an idea.

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   I’d been giving some thought to doing a clave in the North Park area, maybe even volunteering to be clavemeister. Wherever it is held, the bossman will need to be somebody with good knowledge of the local waters; me and Willi and probably a few others can find our way around North Park. Just an idea.

Dude, what about South Park?!?  Oh my god!  You killed Vern!  You bastard!!!! <g — Warren Findley Member of the Clavemeister Club Before you buy.

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It ain’t a hell of a lot of fun flyfishing in the land of dusty rivers. Big Dale

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It ain’t a hell of a lot of fun flyfishing in the land of dusty rivers. Big Dale All we need is a clavemeister, Big Dale. I know at least one guy will show up.

I don’t know.  Maybe a Vegas Clave with each member bringing a big roll of 20s.  Maybe Vern can give us some casting lessons and show us where the honey holes are <g — Warren Findley Member of the Clavemeister Club Before you buy.

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It ain’t a hell of a lot of fun flyfishing in the land of dusty rivers. Big Dale

All we need is a clavemeister, Big Dale. I know at least one guy will show up. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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I do have a question though.  What are the possiblities of having more than one Western Clave for 2001?  Maybe another in Montana, Idaho or Wyoming as well as the CO/NM clave.  Thoughts, ideas, suggestions anyone?

How about West Texas? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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(awesome plan clipped) WHAT HE SAID!!! bruiser Before you buy.

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Willi, September’s great i agree.  I’m into a remodeling job on a dump i just bought but maybe a day or two here and there… I am psyched now for next september. bruiser Before you buy.

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Willi, September’s great i agree.  I’m into a remodeling job on a dump i just bought but maybe a day or two here and there… I am psyched now for next september. bruiser

Bruiser, you know to just count me in.  How the hell could I say no after reading over half of this book in one night (p 104 of 142 btw)?!?! I do have a question though.  What are the possiblities of having more than one Western Clave for 2001?  Maybe another in Montana, Idaho or Wyoming as well as the CO/NM clave.  Thoughts, ideas, suggestions anyone? — Warren Findley Member of the Clavemeister Club Before you buy.

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I do have a question though.  What are the possiblities of having more than one Western Clave for 2001?  Maybe another in Montana, Idaho or Wyoming as well as the CO/NM clave.  Thoughts, ideas, suggestions anyone?

I like Willi’s idea for a September CO/NM ‘Clave. I’ve been mulling over the idea of a summer ‘Clave in the Park. If we got on it early enough we could rent cabins at Roosevelt and be a short drive from a wide variety of fishing. From the geezer accessible Lamar and Soda Butte to the real challenge of Hellroaring Creek and the canyon of the Yellowstone. Steve’s horses are welcome in the Park and of course there’s campgrounds for those that prefer to camp. Just a thought. — Ken Fortenberry

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I’m game if I can work out the time schedule. When do you have in mind? Danl

July 2001. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I vote for fall. Fishing is always good in September. Weather is usually great, tourists are gone etc. July fishing depends on snow pack and the tourists are out in force. I’m also thinking of a trip to southern Colorado/northern New Mexico sometime this September to check out some possible areas. Anyone interested in getting together? Willi

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restock their travel $ and hall passes.  Probably July 2001.

This sounds good, but a little naive. I don’t see my travel $ ever being restocked what with some talking of a meeting in The Big Easy ( I always spend WAY TOO MUCH in the big easy). I have never fishing in Penn and have always wanted to see a game in Happy Valley. I have always enjoyed fishing Northern New Mexico and Colorado. One area I go to as often as I can is around Gunnison, cause it has lots of different types of water. I happen to enjoy those little brookies and cutthroats in the high mountain meadows…they are small but the area is beautiful. The more I think about it I am tempted to load the truck and leave right now. Big Dale.

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With Big Dale and Dan’l, it’s a CLAVE already. We want time to plan, and time for everyone to restock their travel $ and hall passes.  Probably July 2001.

I vote for fall. Fishing is always good in September. Weather is usually great, tourists are gone etc. July fishing depends on snow pack and the tourists are out in force. Big Dale, we all missed you at the W Clave, although we know you’d have liked to go. We’ll get Jon Cook and Kelly roped into it also i’m sure.  Correct me if i’m wrong, jon, but it seems like you know your way around NM and CO pretty well.

I’m also thinking of a trip to southern Colorado/northern New Mexico sometime this September to check out some possible areas. Anyone interested in getting together? Willi

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BIO name:  Kelly Rogers but I answer to a lot of things, depending upon the who’s yellin’ at me vitals: 6′4", as recent as a couple of months ago 226 lbs but currently hoverin’ around 208 lbs. (who says lite beer diet doesn’t work) , 35 yrs old the early years:  Born in Irving, TX but moved to Big Spring, TX in 1972 when my Grand Pa  past away.  Moved there to take over the family cotton farm along with a small time (and I do mean small time, 25-30 head) cattle operation that was thrown in for good measure.  Had a great up bringing of hard work on the farm, chasing gals in the big city of Big Spring, and drinking beer (not necessarily in that order). Education & employment: Went to college in Lubbock, Tx at Texas Tech University.  Received a BBA in MIS/Finance and MBA with a concentration in MIS.  Went to work at Sandia National Labs in 1992 and currently still employed there which is my first and only job outside of the farm. marital stats:  Married 10 years in June but that will probably be done in about a month. fishin’ stats:  Started fishing early on mostly on lakes and stock ponds around the house.  Not much to choose from in west Texas.  In 1992, a co-worker introduced me to flyfishing and have looked back since. Other interest: bird hunting and up until 1992-93, competitive trapshooting. Started shooting in 1979 through 4-H.  Shot skeet for about 1 1/2 years before a friend invited me over to the trap range one Saturday.  Shot three rounds that day and the friend told my Dad that if he didn’t take me to San Angelo the next day to shoot in the Zone II shoot that he would.  Dad took me that next day where I won runner up in the handicap championship.  Used the prize money to buy my own BT-99 and finished out that year shooting only singles and handicap.  The next year I started shooting doubles in order to try and make the All-American team.  Made the junior team that year and the next.  After the second year on the team, the ATA sent me to the US Nationals for Olympic style shooting where I won the US Nationals. Over the next 3 years, I won the Nationals one more time and 3rd twice.  As a junior, I shot in two World Championships in 1983 (Canada) and 1985 (Italy).  Won 2nd in ‘83 and 4th in ‘85.  I quit Olympic style after ‘85 and went back to shooting ATA.  Shot for the next 6 years with my best year coming in the 91′ season where I ended up high-overall and doubles (at the time, my average was 8th highest on record but they’ve since kicked the livin’ snot outta that) average leader for the year.  Over the years, I shot a Browning BT-99, Gamba combo, Perazzi, Beretta (they made a matched set of combo’s for me when I was there in 85), and finally a Kreighoff K-80 from ‘89 on.  In ‘93, I was hitting pretty hard on the burnout factor when I suffered a 2.5-degree separation of my right shoulder playing softball.  Combine those two things with my new love of flyfishing, I decided to hang’em up.  I’m also an avid hacker, and I do mean hacker, of the golf ball. Jeez, pretty simple life I guess but that’s about it. Kelly

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Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well that’s the case for me Terry. It takes around 3 days for a dose change of only 2 units to be "noticed" and another 3 days for things to settle again. It took me close on two weeks to change successfully from 28 units per day to 24 units and back up slightly to 26 units, when I was finding my best basal dose. As you probably know, I use beef Lente, but when I was using Novo’s Ultratard, the same thing applied. I had to accept that any changes needed a week to be fully "absorbed" Beav Thanks. So what I’ve been doing is eating like crazy. The last last weekend away I had to eat so much my gut was full and could hardly process all the food.

Can’t you reduce the Humalog during a strenuous weekend and eat "slightly" more than usual? That’s what I have to do VERY regularly as no two weeks are alike with me. It was a real problem. So I’ve been thinking of 2 other approaches. I could drink a sugar filled soft drink like Coke as needed -easier to digest.OR go on the pump.

Pumping isn’t high on the list of "wantables" for me, but the odd Coke does the trick if I’ve cut back on my Humalog. If all you use in a pump is say Humalog, you could adjust very easily.

I would imagine so. Of course starting on the pump is a big undertaking and I would need to consider other factors. But I need to know my options because I need to keep up my habit of Salt Water Fly Fishing!

Sorry Terry, I have no experience of either. I don’t even know what a salt water fly LOOKS like Thoughts?

Only the "less Humalog" and a good supply of instant sugar. I prefer Mars Bars myself for those heavy days coz they give a pretty quick lift and I don’t "crash and burn" too soon after. Beav

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Well that’s the case for me Terry. It takes around 3 days for a dose change of only 2 units to be "noticed" and another 3 days for things to settle again. It took me close on two weeks to change successfully from 28 units per day to 24 units and back up slightly to 26 units, when I was finding my best basal dose. As you probably know, I use beef Lente, but when I was using Novo’s Ultratard, the same thing applied. I had to accept that any changes needed a week to be fully "absorbed" Beav

Thanks. So what I’ve been doing is eating like crazy. The last last weekend away I had to eat so much my gut was full and could hardly process all the food. It was a real problem. So I’ve been thinking of 2 other approaches. I could drink a sugar filled soft drink like Coke as needed -easier to digest.OR go on the pump. If all you use in a pump is say Humalog, you could adjust very easily. Of course starting on the pump is a big undertaking and I would need to consider other factors. But I need to know my options because I need to keep up my habit of Salt Water Fly Fishing! Thoughts?

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I am a type 1 and take Humalog and Ultralente 3 years. As I look back on this summer I see I made some good improvements on dealing with camping trips, fishing trips, hiking and other strenuous activity. I’m really trying to get a better hold on how to deal with strenuous weekends as it relates to my long acting Ultalente.  Currently what happens is I will go away for a weekend that involves lots of excercise and fresh air in the outdoors. I tend to go in the low BG direction the 1st day and start eating like crazy. Yes I cut back on my Humalog for sure as I do when ever I excercise. But it’s not enough. I think the long acting insulins start to dominate. I tried once this last fall on a weekend sporting trip to cut back my U but was not sure. Isn’t it true that the long acting insulins develop some sort of momentum in your system? And if so,  just reducing your U  level 10-20 hours before hand will NOT have an effect? — Terence Weir

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writes – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I am a type 1 and take Humalog and Ultralente 3 years. As I look back on this summer I see I made some good improvements on dealing with camping trips, fishing trips, hiking and other strenuous activity. I’m really trying to get a better hold on how to deal with strenuous weekends as it relates to my long acting Ultalente.  Currently what happens is I will go away for a weekend that involves lots of excercise and fresh air in the outdoors. I tend to go in the low BG direction the 1st day and start eating like crazy. Yes I cut back on my Humalog for sure as I do when ever I excercise. But it’s not enough. I think the long acting insulins start to dominate. I tried once this last fall on a weekend sporting trip to cut back my U but was not sure. Isn’t it true that the long acting insulins develop some sort of momentum in your system? And if so,  just reducing your U  level 10-20 hours before hand will NOT have an effect?

Well that’s the case for me Terry. It takes around 3 days for a dose change of only 2 units to be "noticed" and another 3 days for things to settle again. It took me close on two weeks to change successfully from 28 units per day to 24 units and back up slightly to 26 units, when I was finding my best basal dose. As you probably know, I use beef Lente, but when I was using Novo’s Ultratard, the same thing applied. I had to accept that any changes needed a week to be fully "absorbed" Beav

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Question:

We have set up a free site where flyfishermen can find other flyfishermen who have services to offer (Financial Planners, Business Consultants, Landscapers, etc.). We also offer links to sites we like as well as reviews of products or destinations we enjoy. Fly Shops can list free if they offer discounts to our viewers. We will accept products or invitations to destinations but will only offer reviews if we like them. Stop by and take a look. http://www.outofchaos.com/flyfishing.html Tight Lines, Dave Fischbach Charlie Levin

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Where is the best place on the net to get fishing magazine subscriptions?

Try: http://nbaf.com/USsubscriptions.html They cover most topics and have all the popular stuff. Tim

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Question:

planning a four day trip over Bishop Pass with the object of climbing Mt. Sill. I haven’t done it yet, but am planning to by next year. I was planning on five days… day 1 to Dusy Basin, day 2 to Glacier Creek, summit on day 3, back to Dusy Basin on day 4, out on day 5. You might consider this, it makes more sense to me. If you do it in four, I’d love to hear about how it went! Cheers, Kevin

You should be able to do it in three.  South Lake to Barrett Lakes. Sill on day two and back out over Thunderbolt pass and Bishop Pass day three.

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Greetings all, We three not-so-young-but-in-very-good-shape guys with good backpacking experience but no climbing experience are planning a four day trip over Bishop Pass with the object of climbing Mt. Sill. I’ve done some research on this and have found out the SW chutes up Mt. Sill are rated at only class 2 (maybe some avoidable class 3 bits). We like the sound of that. We’ve got a couple questions, though, if anyone has been up that way and has wise words for us. 1) Should we try to camp in the Palisade Basin or go all the way to the Glacier Creek area? We’re not sure how difficult Potluck Pass would be with our packs. As I said, we’re in good shape, but we’re not real mountaineers. 2) Is there fishing in either the Barrett Lakes or in the lake at the head of Glacier Creek? My dad, who’s coming, is a big fly fisherman (though he’s not above using bait if he’s hungry enough and the fishing is really bad). This could influence our decision on where to camp. Mmmmm, trout. 3) Does anyone have any advice on the climb of Sill, other than to make for the Polemonium Glacier and turn NE up the chutes to the top of Sill? We figure we can do this in a long roundtrip with only day packs. We’re right about that, aren’t we? We’re not interested at this time in getting killed or rescued (I suppose we’d take the latter over the former, but the embarassment factor would be awfully high). Thanks so much for any information that might make this a better trip. We’re very excited and look forward to that beautiful late Summer Sierra weather. (We actually attempted this trip three years ago and got snowed out at the trailhead. We ended up driving South and climbing Mt. Whitney instead. That was lucky. So we know we are being a bit risky.) Again, thanks for any tips and I’ll post a trip report when we’re back. Franz —         But now almost finished dissertating in Los Angeles  N.B.: Disguised address; please remove "delete-this." if replying.

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Question:

I would like to know if there is any good flyfishing in NewEngland Jan,Feb,March.

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Matty Boy, I response to your query, I may only speak for Vermont.  The fishing for steelhead and browns can be good but it is unpredictable.  Lewis Creek, the Lamoille and Upper Connecticut are all options when a cold snap is followed by a warm-up.  Your timing has to be right on for it to be productive in terms of fish caught.  Otherwise it could be thought of as being productive in a character-building sense alone. James Ehlers Underhill, VT

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I would like to know if there is any good flyfishing in NewEngland Jan,Feb,March.

As I’m sure others will comment, the swift river in central Mass is a very popular winter fishing site.  The fishing is directly below the Quabbin Reservoir just outside of Belchertown.  If the weather isn’t arctic (i.e. reasonably calm and 25 Degrees or more) there will likely be a midge hatch going on.  The key to matching the hatch is size 24 midge patterns with a dark green thread body.  Lots of big fish, very hard to hook and harder to land.   Stay Warm and keep the ice off of your line! Randy

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  Rainbows and cutts will interbreed in the wild, but it’s a little more complicated than that.  For example, they won’t interbreed where they evolved together in the same river because they occupy different niches and spawn differently (West slope cutts and redband rainbow exist together in several rivers).  However, if you introduce rainbow into waters where cutthroats are native and rainbow are not, such as the Madison, they will interbreed.  Such is the danger of stocking. I don’t normally like to see stocking in rivers that support wild trout, but if the rainbows (non-native planted in the 30’s) are done for in the Madison, and they want to re-introduce the native west slope cutthroat from pure strain stocks (which they believe they have), it would be nice to have the native fish back in the Madison.  

Hi Dan, Glad to see you back on the group. The Montana fish and game people I’ve talked with also advised that the cutthroat spawn in the tributaries where there is not whirling disease and stay there for a couple of years before returning to the main river. In that time their skeletal structure grows from grissle to bone — their skeleton is supposed to be only effected by the disease when it is in the grissle state. Rainbows on the others hand spawn in the tributaries and return to the main river soon after while their skeletal structure is still grissle. Have a great 1997. — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (97 materials catalog) http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

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 Rainbows and cutts will interbreed in the wild, but it’s a little more complicated than that.  For example, they won’t interbreed where they evolved together in the same river because they occupy different niches and spawn differently (West slope cutts and redband rainbow exist together in several rivers).  However, if you introduce rainbow into waters where cutthroats are native and rainbow are not, such as the Madison, they will interbreed.  Such is the danger of stocking.

The Montana DFW page ( http://fwp.mt.gov/ ) has some great info on the project.   The impression I get is that even though cutts and bows will cross breed when stocked together, they don’t expect much in the way of cross breeding because there are so few rainbows left in the Madison. I don’t normally like to see stocking in rivers that support wild trout, but if the rainbows (non-native planted in the 30’s) are done for in the Madison, and they want to re-introduce the native west slope cutthroat from pure strain stocks (which they believe they have), it would be nice to have the native fish back in the Madison.  the areas they are talking about re-stocking with Cutts is being checked for the prescence of tubifex worms (carriers of whirling disease) and thought to have low quantities of both tubifex worms and infected rainbows. The question then becomes how much stocking is enough, and how long will it take to develop wild natives from the hatchery natives.   Of course, they could just leave it alone and let the brown trout take over, but then they aren’t as easy to catch as the cutts.                                          Hmmmmm,                                               Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

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Al, Thanks for sharing this information with us.  This is indeed very interesting.  Here in Oregon we have a lot of native cutthroat and they are great to fish.  They will attack a fly like it’s the last morsel on earth.  The hatcheries like to stock them (they are hardier) as well as a cross they produce with rainbow they call a cutbow.  I wonder if the cutts and rainbow would cross in the Madison.  I don’t know if they will cross in the wild.  we have streams that contain both.  If they did where would the young grow?

  Rainbows and cutts will interbreed in the wild, but it’s a little more complicated than that.  For example, they won’t interbreed where they evolved together in the same river because they occupy different niches and spawn differently (West slope cutts and redband rainbow exist together in several rivers).  However, if you introduce rainbow into waters where cutthroats are native and rainbow are not, such as the Madison, they will interbreed.  Such is the danger of stocking. Rob Gregoire                                                        | Pocatello, Id              

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  There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . Visit     http"//fwp.mt.gov/    and take a look. Sounds good so far … any thoughts ? if so, CC to   Dave Hagengruber   Harry

Hi Harry I know there will be those against the plan but after a long conversation with a Montana fish biologist I’m supporting the plan.  What he shared with me was very encouraging based on a whole lot of information I can not put in here but basically this is it in a very boiled down version: Cutthroat trout spawn in small tributaries and REMAIN there for a couple of years (while their bones turn from grissle to real bone). Rainbows spawn in the tributaries and return to the main river while their bones are still grissle rather than bone. Supposedly whirling disease attacks the fish while their skeletal structure is still grissle. This is a short version of a several hour discussion with the folks that seem to know a heck of a lot more than I do. Will it work? I have no ideas but the stuff they shared with me sounded good at least. — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (97 materials catalog) http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

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  There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . Visit     http"//fwp.mt.gov/    and take a look. Sounds good so far … any thoughts ? if so, CC to   Dave Hagengruber I’ll take cutt’s in montana over bows, browns and brookies any day of the week.  They belong there, right ? TimW

I agree, they where there years back, just like the Grayling. I do not know if the plan will work but I like the idea of "something" being done to try and combat WD.   Hm  

Response:

  There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . Visit     http"//fwp.mt.gov/    and take a look. Sounds good so far … any thoughts ? if so, CC to   Dave Hagengruber   Harry

Response:

 There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . Visit     http"//fwp.mt.gov/    and take a look. Sounds good so far … any thoughts ? if so, CC to   Dave Hagengruber  Harry

   Sorry, fat fingers, the URL is    http://fwp.mt.gov/      Harry  ( Nice page in any event g< )

Response:

  There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . Visit     http"//fwp.mt.gov/    and take a look. Sounds good so far … any thoughts ? if so, CC to   Dave Hagengruber

I’ll take cutt’s in montana over bows, browns and brookies any day of the week.  They belong there, right ? TimW

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . Visit     http"//fwp.mt.gov/    and take a look. Sounds good so far … any thoughts ? if so, CC to   Dave Hagengruber I’ll take cutt’s in montana over bows, browns and brookies any day of the week.  They belong there, right ? TimW I agree, they where there years back, just like the Grayling. I do not know if the plan will work but I like the idea of "something" being done to try and combat WD.  Hm  

Ain’t WHIRLING DISEASE somethin them square dancer get when they dance too long? DJones

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While stocking always sounds like a good idea, fact is that it was stocking hatchery fish that brought whirling disease into existing populations. There is also the matter of genetic intergression if one stocks fish from another watershed into another where a native stock already exists.  If the Madison is completely devoid of cutts, intergression would not be a problem; however if any native fish remain, their genes will be lost when the new stock takes over. — Don Jordan POB 2357 Chiefland, FL 32644 http://ripserv.com/indyjones

Its my understanding that the rainbow below Quake Lake were restocked after the earthquake because of fisk kill resulting from the landslide at Quake Lake.  Can some of you Montanans with long memories shed any light on this? Jim

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While stocking always sounds like a good idea, fact is that it was stocking hatchery fish that brought whirling disease into existing populations. There is also the matter of genetic intergression if one stocks fish from another watershed into another where a native stock already exists.  If the Madison is completely devoid of cutts, intergression would not be a problem; however if any native fish remain, their genes will be lost when the new stock takes over. — Don Jordan POB 2357 Chiefland, FL 32644 http://ripserv.com/indyjones

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While stocking always sounds like a good idea, fact is that it was stocking hatchery fish that brought whirling disease into existing populations.

No, Don.    What brought whirling disease into existing populations was stocking SICK hatchery fish.  Stocking per se is not the problem. that is not to say, however, tht it is the solution either.  I think that it is not. But, although I am generally opposed to stocking hatchery fish in rivers where there are wild populations, I have become convinced this idea withthe cutts may be worth a try.  I had most of my reservations addressed by the excellent coverage of the project on the Montana FW&P web page.  You really ought to check it out.  I can’t give you the exact address, but you should be able to get to it.  Let me know if you cannot, and I will get it for you. There is also the matter of genetic intergression if one stocks fish from another watershed into another where a native stock already exists.  If the Madison is completely devoid of cutts, intergression would not be a problem; however if any native fish remain, their genes will be lost when the new stock takes over.

I am not a biologist, but I do not believe this will be a problem. Take a look at the discussion I just cited.  As I stated, I generally am not a supporter of stocking in wild trout waters, an even stronger opponent is Dick Vincent whose 1970’s study led to the cessation of stocking in Montana rivers.  He is in favor of the proposed project with the cutts.  That says a lot to me. Lyman Lyman G. Hughes Dallas, TX Ennis, MT

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snip   I had most of my reservations addressed by the excellent coverage of the project on the Montana FW&P web page.  You really ought to check it out.  I can’t give you the exact address, but you should be able to get to it.   Lyman G. Hughes snip

Montana’s web page addres is:  http://www.fwp.mt.gov/ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dallas, TX Ennis, MT

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  There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . I’ll take cutt’s in montana over bows, browns and brookies any day of the week.  They belong there, right ? TimW

I think you are right.  The cutthroat are always native it seems in our most inaccessible waters in the west.  So they surely belong.  A damn great fighter too. -Burton

Response:

  There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . Cutthroat trout spawn in small tributaries and REMAIN there for a couple of years (while their bones turn from grissle to real bone). Rainbows spawn in the tributaries and return to the main river while their bones are still grissle rather than bone. Supposedly whirling disease attacks the fish while their skeletal structure is still grissle. This is a short

Al, Thanks for sharing this information with us.  This is indeed very interesting.  Here in Oregon we have a lot of native cutthroat and they are great to fish.  They will attack a fly like it’s the last morsel on earth.  The hatcheries like to stock them (they are hardier) as well as a cross they produce with rainbow they call a cutbow.  I wonder if the cutts and rainbow would cross in the Madison.  I don’t know if they will cross in the wild.  we have streams that contain both.  If they did where would the young grow? -Burton

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Its my understanding that the rainbow below Quake Lake were restocked after the earthquake because of fisk kill resulting from the landslide at Quake Lake.  Can some of you Montanans with long memories shed any light on this? Jim

Good question.  I don’t know the answer specifically, but stocking was fairly common in the Madison until Dick Vincent’s study showed that stocking actually was detrimental to the wild trout fishery.  I believe that study was in the early 70’s.   The quake was in ‘59, so what you suggest is possible. Lyman Lyman G. Hughes Dallas, TX Ennis, MT

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . I’ll take cutt’s in montana over bows, browns and brookies any day of the week.  They belong there, right ? TimW I think you are right.  The cutthroat are always native it seems in our most inaccessible waters in the west.  So they surely belong.  A damn great fighter too. -Burton

Burton    "point your browser to"         http://fwp.mt.gov/      Nice page, good info   HM

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – cross they produce with rainbow they call a cutbow.  I wonder if the cutts and rainbow would cross in the Madison.  I don’t know if they cross in the wild.  we have streams that contain both.  If they Rainbows and cutts will interbreed in the wild, but it’s a little more complicated than that.  For example, they won’t interbreed where they evolved together in the same river because they occupy different niches and spawn differently (West slope cutts and redband rainbow exist together in several rivers).  However, if you introduce rainbow into waters where cutthroats are native and rainbow are not, such as the Madison, they will interbreed.  Such is the danger of stocking. Rob Gregoire

Ah so, that’s what I suspected.  Thanks for the response Rob.  I know the McKenzie River had redsides and cutthroat both, but the cutts are only found in the lower reaches of the river.  There are rainbows in the lower part of the river, but I have never caught a cutt in the upper rainbow rich region. Merry Christmas to all and Happy New Year, -Burton

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Question:

        Will be fishing in the Smokey Mountian park week of Nov. 10th . Any information on good patterens or methods would be of great help.

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   Will be fishing in the Smokey Mountian park week of Nov. 10th . Any information on good patterens or methods would be of great help.

Check out LJ Decuir’s page at : http://funnelweb.utcc.utk.edu/~ldecuir/default.html Won’t be much in the way of hatches.  Stick to large weighted nymphs. –Rich

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Question:

I will be going to Kenya on business  next month,  for about 3 weeks. I understand fly fishing is great there. Does anyone know what fish and what patterns are popular there? For  that matter, does anyone know what AREAS and RIVERS? Thanks in advance. Mike

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I will be going to Kenya on business  next month,  for about 3 weeks. I understand fly fishing is great there. Does anyone know what fish and what patterns are popular there? For  that matter, does anyone know what AREAS and RIVERS?

Aberdare Highlands (formerly "white highlands") north and west of Nairobi.  Be warned (by Canadian papers) law and order may have vanished in some parts of Kenya these days. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

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Question:

I will be travelling in Europe this Spring and have thought to do a little fly fishing.  If there is anyone out there with knowlede of freshwater fishing in Norway or Spain/Portugal (Pyrenes) I would be greatful.  Please post publicaly so others might benefit.  Thanks Grant C. Hughes Portland, OR  (Home of the Deschutes Red Side)

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I will be travelling in Europe this Spring and have thought to do a little fly fishing.  If there is anyone out there with knowlede of freshwater fishing in Norway or Spain/Portugal (Pyrenes) I would be greatful.  Please post publicaly so others might benefit.  Thanks Grant C. Hughes Portland, OR  (Home of the Deschutes Red Side)

Grant! Being a norwegian….I’ll be more than happy to give you some advice and info., but I do need a little more details from you…..especially when you are planning to go, where in Norway (if you are on business) and how much time you got to spend. Spring is a pretty broad term, especially in a country like Norway where we can have spring down south when they still got 6 weeks of winter left further north. In general, I can say that trout season would start sometime in April (a littel dependant where you are) while the salmon season starts mid-May in some rivers and June 1 in most. There is little guided fishing for trout, although opportunities are plenty. Guided salmon fishing is available on most of the bigger rivers (if you can afford the cost). Although I’ve been to Spain and Portugal on a few occasions, I’ve never flyfished and can’t offer any help, but maybe someone else can. Tight lines! Inge Solberg Houston, TX

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