Question:

[snip] All in all, it was a pretty typical outing, tho shorter than most.

Somehow, I missed this TR but it has a familiar ring to it.  :) Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

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Darn sight safer than coming out of the Air & Space Museum at 11:30 and the car won’t start or hitting a pothole on 295 and blowing two tires!  Now THAT will crease your seat! — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  Thanks.  I assume that you fished there after dark.  Did you  feel reasonably safe doing that ? After dark is best on stripers with an in-running tide.  Try a black Clouser with yellow eyes and a touch of Crystal Flash. —

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I too caught a channel cat in the Potomac many years ago, almost in the same spot that you did.  Judging by my very limited sample, there must be a lot of them in  there.  I caught a good-sized one above the Chain Bridge last  year.  I was sure that I had a nice largemouth on until I saw it.  I did a good amount of heavy-duty rowing for that one.

I foul-hooked a couple of cats this spring.  Lots of fun until it is time to take them off the hook… The first time I fished there this year, I was on the VA side below Chain Bridge.  I wasn’t having much luck, but a Good Old Boy was reeling in catfish after catfish after catfish.  After a while, he shouted across from me, bragging about his catching and my not.  When I complemented him on doing so well, he told me that last week was better.  He took home 57 catfish after a day’s fishing.  Ate them in one sitting.  Fed his entire family.  The DC license states, in big letters, not to eat catfish, carp, or eels because they are full of PCBs.  I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt.  I don’t think he had a DC license to read. JR

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 Ok.  I asked because when I was at Fletcher’s one evening,  the owner there was anxious to close up to avoid taking a  chance on being held up.

On the evening of my encounter with the GOB, I walked back up to the parking area on the VA side of Chain Bridge to find the extended cab window on the passenger side broken.  Lost a book of CDs.  Does that count? John

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 that well and the travel rod I was using wasn’t ideal for a heavy  Teeny/clouser combo.   I’d get the line out 45-50 feet, which meant  that the fly reached bottom just as it was passing the boat, and  was rising back up no more than 10 feet later.

I used to have a hell of a time throwing sinking lines with my soft St. Croix Pro Graphite until I learned to make an underhand backcast.  I too caught a channel cat in the Potomac many years ago, almost in the same spot that you did. Mu

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After dark is best on stripers with an in-running tide.  Try a black Clouser with yellow eyes and a touch of Crystal Flash. — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  Just upstream from downtown DC, the Potomac flows  through a heavily wooded gorge alongside the Chesapeake  and Ohio Canal.   Up a ways, but still within DC limits,  is Fletcher’s Boat House, a family business of some 100  years of renting rowboats and canoes.  Also at this time of  the year there are striped bass in the river, and I hadn’t  had a chance to fish for those since late last summer.  According to the boat house web site reports, early morning  was the best time for the stripers.  That aligned neatly with  a late start for meetings on Sunday.  I grabbed a cab from  my hotel and was at the boat house at a quarter to six.  The  boat house was still closed, but one of the owners was down  on the dock getting ready to fish.  He offered to let me take a  rowboat on a promise to do the paperwork and payment when  I got back.  The boat house sits on a shallow inlet.  On the outer edge  of the inlet on the upstream side is a shoal marked by a buoy.  I rowed for that spot, intending to fish the seam between  the river and the inlet just below the shoal.  Since the river  moves at a good clip in the main channel and the water is at  least 10 feet deep, I decided to use my Teeny 300 line.  By now it was 6 AM.  None of the usual weekday noises – from  cars, planes, helicopters –  were in the air, and I could imagine  myself back three hundred years, with nothing downstream  but water and woods, and herring surfacing all over.  I tried a #1 hook clouser first, since I figured that I had the best  chance of getting close to the bottom with it on the fast side of  the seam.  I had some problems with that, since I don’t cast all  that well and the travel rod I was using wasn’t ideal for a heavy Teeny/clouser combo.   I’d get the line out 45-50 feet, which meant  that the fly reached bottom just as it was passing the boat, and  was rising back up no more than 10 feet later.  After a bit of this, casting on both sides of the seam, I decided to  try a white deceiver, tied on a 1/0 hook, partly because it came  closest to looking like the herring that were all over the river.   I  concentrated on the slow side of the seam, letting out some  additional line and letting it dangle, twitching it a bit, when it  was fully downstream from me.  The third time down, something  clobbered the deceiver and I had my first striper on !   Well, a  little striper.  Well, maybe something else.  Well, how about a  modest-sized channel cat ?  Things continued to go downhill after that: I lost the deceiver  on the following cast, then several clousers.  The Fletcher  Boat House guy was fishing upstream from me a ways, and  seemed to have a fish on his line every time I looked up.  I told  myself that he was just bait-fishing, but I didn’t *really* know  that for sure.  Then I snagged bottom again.  Deciding I had lost  one fly too many,  I pulled anchor determined to recover my fly and  then try a slow-moving chute between two large boulders about 100 feet away.  With the anchor up the boat begin to drift quickly  with the current.  Grabbing the oars, while holding on to the rod, I  tried to manipulate three ungainly objects with two hands and in one  of those series of moves –    the very complicated ones which the  great athletes make look easy –  I snapped the fly rod in two.  I rowed back to shore, docked, and watched two deer graze within  40 feet of me before they sauntered off into the woods.  I walked up  to the boat house, now open, with my busted weapon in hand.  Owner #2 gave me some coffee in consolation and then offered to  lend me one of his spinning rods.  I told him that he didn’t *really*  want to do that.  He assured me that he broke as many rods as I did.  I assured him that he didn’t.  All in all, it was a pretty typical outing, tho shorter than most.

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Question:

It’s Christmas time again….. Therefore, here is my Christmas greeting card for you, as you will find at the following address since posting binaries to non-binary newsgroups isn’t allowed: http://home.online.no/~stigbye/christmas_cards/rec_outdoors_fishing_f… PS.  For those who may remember my old Christmas greeting card that I      have used before on this newsgroup, just forget it! Cheers, Stig Arne Bye

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It’s Christmas time again….. Therefore, here is my Christmas greeting card for you, as you will find at the following address since posting binaries to non-binary newsgroups isn’t allowed: http://home.online.no/~stigbye/christmas_cards/rec_outdoors_fishing_f… PS.  For those who may remember my old Christmas greeting card that I      have used before on this newsgroup, just forget it!

Stunning photo. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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nice card…thanks, and best of the season to you too. jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s Christmas time again….. http://home.online.no/~stigbye/christmas_cards/rec_outdoors_fishing_f…

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Question:

A lot of people want to vote for Nader and help the Green Party, but they don’t want Bush to win. It’s possible that votes for Nader in swing states will throw the election to Bush. There are two websites that help:         http://www.nadertrader.org         http://www.voteswap2000.com The idea is that a Gore supporter will vote for Nader in a state that is safe for Bush (like Texas) if a Nader supporter will vote for Gore in a swing state. That way, the Green Party gets the same popular vote, but Bush (it is hoped) is denied a victory. This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A lot of people want to vote for Nader and help the Green Party, but they don’t want Bush to win. It’s possible that votes for Nader in swing states will throw the election to Bush. There are two websites that help:    http://www.nadertrader.org    http://www.voteswap2000.com The idea is that a Gore supporter will vote for Nader in a state that is safe for Bush (like Texas) if a Nader supporter will vote for Gore in a swing state. That way, the Green Party gets the same popular vote, but Bush (it is hoped) is denied a victory. This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ <

Why don’t you fucking people stop the fucking election bull shit, left or right, and get back to fly fishing. Joel Axelrad

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Hey Jaxfly. Now, now.. relax.. it’s almost over.  Just keep repeating, it’s almost over. Instead of bitching, perhaps you might go fishing for a while, chill, and not read the political postings? now then, back to your regularly scheduled political ad….

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A lot of people want to vote for Nader and help the Green Party, but they don’t want Bush to win. It’s possible that votes for Nader in swing states will throw the election to Bush. There are two websites that help: http://www.nadertrader.org http://www.voteswap2000.com The idea is that a Gore supporter will vote for Nader in a state that is safe for Bush (like Texas) if a Nader supporter will vote for Gore in a swing state. That way, the Green Party gets the same popular vote, but Bush (it is hoped) is denied a victory. This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ < Why don’t you fucking people stop the fucking election bull shit, left or right, and get back to fly fishing. Joel Axelrad

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Joel, a fellow Illini, includes rw’s whole damn post, then bitches: A lot of people want to vote for Nader … Why don’t you fucking people stop the fucking election bull shit, left or right, and get back to fly fishing.

— Ken Fortenberry- vote for Nader willya, Joel, won’t matter, Illinois is solid Gore.

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Why don’t you fucking people stop the fucking election bull shit, left or right, and get back to fly fishing.

I take it you aren’t interested in trading a Gore vote for a Nader vote? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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Instead of bitching, perhaps you might go fishing for a while, chill,

Anyone who went fishing in the Northeast this weekend definitely chilled. Brrrrr! George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A lot of people want to vote for Nader and help the Green Party, but they don’t want Bush to win. It’s possible that votes for Nader in swing states will throw the election to Bush. There are two websites that help:    http://www.nadertrader.org    http://www.voteswap2000.com The idea is that a Gore supporter will vote for Nader in a state that is safe for Bush (like Texas) if a Nader supporter will vote for Gore in a swing state. That way, the Green Party gets the same popular vote, but Bush (it is hoped) is denied a victory. This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on.

Here’s what the Nader people have to say about this From CNET: [That move drew criticism Saturday from Public Citizen, the umbrella group for consumer causes founded by Nader. It said the ads would mark "a new low" in the presidential campaign and "is designed to mislead voters." ] Interesting how the ultimate consumer/public advocate thinks this is something to mislead people.  I’ll borrow a favorite phrase of Al Gore’s and simply call it…"a risky scheme". Natty (one who knows a vast LEFT wing conspiracy when he sees one) Before you buy.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A lot of people want to vote for Nader and help the Green Party, but they don’t want Bush to win. It’s possible that votes for Nader in swing states will throw the election to Bush. There are two websites that help:    http://www.nadertrader.org    http://www.voteswap2000.com The idea is that a Gore supporter will vote for Nader in a state that is safe for Bush (like Texas) if a Nader supporter will vote for Gore in a swing state. That way, the Green Party gets the same popular vote, but Bush (it is hoped) is denied a victory. This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on.

Why? The greasy weasels in the RNC are running *pro Nader* ads in many of the swing states – kinda puts them in a bind if they try to make any noise about trading votes… /daytripper

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A lot of people want to vote for Nader and help the Green Party, but they don’t want Bush to win. It’s possible that votes for Nader in swing states will throw the election to Bush. There are two websites that help:       http://www.nadertrader.org       http://www.voteswap2000.com The idea is that a Gore supporter will vote for Nader in a state that is safe for Bush (like Texas) if a Nader supporter will vote for Gore in a swing state. That way, the Green Party gets the same popular vote, but Bush (it is hoped) is denied a victory. This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on. Here’s what the Nader people have to say about this From CNET: [That move drew criticism Saturday from Public Citizen, the umbrella group for consumer causes founded by Nader. It said the ads would mark "a new low" in the presidential campaign and "is designed to mislead voters." ] Interesting how the ultimate consumer/public advocate thinks this is something to mislead people.  I’ll borrow a favorite phrase of Al Gore’s and simply call it…"a risky scheme".

I’m afraid you’re wrong about this, Hawkeye. The criticism from Public Citizen was directed at the Bush campaign for using footage of Nader attacking Gore in their ads, in an obvious attempt to swing Gore support to Nader. I think this is actually a pretty low-down trick, but it’s probably legal. It may backfire. The websites I posted are actually being created and promoted by pro-Nader people (who don’t want Bush to win). I don’t know what the Nader ccampaign’s official position is. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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Instead of bitching, perhaps you might go fishing for a while, chill, Anyone who went fishing in the Northeast this weekend definitely chilled. Brrrrr! George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

I had to clean the snow off my truck before I went to the store!                                  Mike

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This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on. Why? The greasy weasels in the RNC are running *pro Nader* ads in many of the swing states – kinda puts them in a bind if they try to make any noise about trading votes…

C’mon, Tripper. Get real. Since when has hypocrisy prevented the Republicans from complaining about something? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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____  I smoked the fish but I didn’t inhale. — George G. Bastard Bamboo Fly Rods http://www.gink.com/ http://www.gink.com/chat

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I’m afraid you’re wrong about this, Hawkeye. The criticism from Public Citizen was directed at the Bush campaign for using footage of Nader attacking Gore in their ads, in an obvious attempt to swing Gore support to Nader. I think this is actually a pretty low-down trick, but it’s probably legal. It may backfire. The websites I posted are actually being created and promoted by pro-Nader people (who don’t want Bush to win). I don’t know what the Nader ccampaign’s official position is.

When I’m wrong, I admit it…I’m wrong and you are right RW.  Shame on me for employing a "speed read" on the cnet article.  After giving it a second read I see the reference to the Bush /Nader ads. I agree it is a strategy that could very well backfire on GW.  As for it’s legality, I would think the vote swapping thing, if it’s highly organized would have a much better chance at raising some legal eyebrows than simply running ads for another candidate. I really can’t wait until this election is over.  Between fuzzy math, Tammy Fae Baker makeup, ice-tea drinking at Budhist temples, the whole American political process is a freak show.  Besides, I’m a man without a candidate. Natty (looking to pull the lever for the Libertarian candidate….for once) Before you buy.

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Why don’t you fucking people stop the fucking election bull shit, left or right, and get back to fly fishing. Joel Axelrad

Good idea Joel. You start. Haven’t seen any posts from you lately, fishing or otherwise. Willi

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Since when has hypocrisy prevented the Republicans from complaining about something?

Seems to me the dems are guilty of some hypocrisy as well.  Al Gore goes campaigning in the south talking about how he grew and harvested tobacco, then gets on the bandwagon to put the tobacco companies out of business.  Bill Clinton said "I pledge to run the most ethical administration in this nations history"….well, I don’t think I have to expand on that one.  And of course, Bill didn’t inhale which makes him either really stupid or just a liar….you decide. My point is that they are all hypocrits.  If you’re lucky enough to identify with one or two key issues shared with a candidate then cast your vote and hope they don’t pull a fast one on you. For me, I could never vote for Gore, a man who thinks the answer to any issue is a government program or handout.  A man who would re-write the 2nd amendment to read "..the right of the people to keep and bear a hunting rifle as long as said rifle is single shot, non-scoped, government approved and stored at the local law enforcement agency".  No, I don’t believe what dems try to spin to us….that republicans want to poison the air and water, throw our seniors into the streets and starve all the schoolchildren. It’s fuzzy politics (a little GW lingo there). Am I crazy about GW?  No way.  But if I had to choose between Al Gore and GW, I’ll take GW.  I recall a speech given by a democrat who said "…ask not what your country can do for you….". I think the democratic party has gotten away from where he was trying to take it. Just my .02 and I can almost feel the flames coming already. Natty (enjoying my access to the Al Gore created internet) Before you buy.

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\ Why don’t you fucking people stop the fucking election bull shit, left or right, and get back to fly fishing. \

Because trout are more sensitive to environmental changes than bullhead or carp are. -Muskie

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 If in doubt, vote for the brighter man. That would be Al Gore. -Muskie

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Since when has hypocrisy prevented the Republicans from complaining about something? Seems to me the dems are guilty of some hypocrisy as well.  

Hypocrisy is endemic to politics. I have no doubt that Democratic politicians are often guilty of hypocrisy. The thing is, though, that the Republicans have raised it to an art form in recent years. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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Seems to me the dems are guilty of some hypocrisy as well.  Al Gore goes campaigning in the south talking about how he grew and harvested tobacco, then gets on the bandwagon to put the tobacco companies out of business.

<balanced snipped for brevity Excellent post, Natty…..My feelings exactly. George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A lot of people want to vote for Nader and help the Green Party, but they don’t want Bush to win. It’s possible that votes for Nader in swing states will throw the election to Bush. There are two websites that help: http://www.nadertrader.org http://www.voteswap2000.com The idea is that a Gore supporter will vote for Nader in a state that is safe for Bush (like Texas) if a Nader supporter will vote for Gore in a swing state. That way, the Green Party gets the same popular vote, but Bush (it is hoped) is denied a victory. This is going to get very interesting. I’ll bet the Bush campaign is going to go ballistic over this if it catches on. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Is not bartering a form of sale? Is it not illegal to sell your vote? Besides I expect all those dead people in Miami to vote again like in 62. I expect if GW wins, the lights in Washington will dim from the overload caused by massive paper shredder use.

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Is not bartering a form of sale? Is it not illegal to sell your vote?

There’s no barter involved. No one is selling a vote. It’s purely voluntary arrangement, based on trust, — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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 The thing is, though, that the Republicans have raised it to an art form in recent years. —

 Well hell yes ,why not ? they’ve had Bill Clinton to study and learn from for eight years. Bob-reluctantly Republican Before you buy.

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Seems to me the dems are guilty of some hypocrisy as well.  Al Gore goes campaigning in the south talking about how he grew and harvested tobacco, then gets on the bandwagon to put the tobacco companies out of business.

How is that hypocrisy? When Gore was young the dangers of tobacco were not known and growing tobacco was a perfectly honorable way to make a living. Things are different now. There are plenty of examples of hypocrisy on both sides but this is not one of them. Peter G. Aitken

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How is that hypocrisy? When Gore was young the dangers of tobacco were not known and growing tobacco was a perfectly honorable way to make a living.

The Surgeon General’s report on the dangers of smoking was released in 1964. Gore would have been in his teens. George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Seems to me the dems are guilty of some hypocrisy as well.  Al Gore goes campaigning in the south talking about how he grew and harvested tobacco, then gets on the bandwagon to put the tobacco companies out of business. How is that hypocrisy? When Gore was young the dangers of tobacco were not known and growing tobacco was a perfectly honorable way to make a living. Things are different now. There are plenty of examples of hypocrisy on both sides but this is not one of them. Peter G. Aitken

Gore was bragging to tobacco farmers in his home state when he was running for office that he " planted it, weeded it, picked it, cured it and sold it just like the rest of ya ", while at the same time his own sister was dying from smoking related cancer. Of coures after his sister died he saw a GREAT opportunity to use her death for political gain so after he was safely elected to the senate and running for president (1988) he gave his " sitting at my sisters death bed I vowed to fight against the tobacco industry with ever fiber of my being " speech. Just a few VERY SHORT years after his " I’m a PROUD tobacco farmer". Of course when he was running for office in Tennessee he was pro life, pro gun and pro tobacco. That’s what he needed to be to get elected. When he began running for the White House he became what he thought he needed to be to win, pro abortion, anti gun and anti tobacco. The guy is a bigger snake than Bill Clinton ever dreamed of being. I don’t know what kind of president G.W.B will make, you never know till they actually land the job. But I do know what kind of pres. Gore would be and I don’t want four years of him in the White House. Clintons main concern was his dick and looking for a legacy. Gore is a "crusader" with alot of bad ideas. He scares me "big time". Bob Before you buy.

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Question:

Added note, from an email:       Hall of the Mountain King:      Howard Snyder       White Winds:                    Joe Wilcox If you have problems, I first read Snyder in

the 70s from a library loan and now I own both just because of this group, try Chessler in CO. Panel 7 issue. Every one should go out this weekend.  NO posting. You guys are all too tired to be here.  You

guys are snapping at each other too much. I love it, Eugene!  You are absolutely right!

I’m reading this on Friday the 11th and did go out last weekend and had a

lovely time hiking on a beautiful trail with absolutely no other hikers

on it.  Eat your hearts out, guys! I’m outta here. Marcy should be the only one posting here over the weekend. hey there fellow hikers.. I just moved to LA

from oregon and it was a total shock.. My Nature life completely disappeared or so i thought.. for the first couple of months here i couldn’t find any trails to hike and was about to leave due to mountain separation anxiety…i went into a 7- Eleven to get a coke and saw the coolest free Magazine ever.. its called StreetZebra.. All about sports and they even have a section dedicated solely to my love.. HIKING.. they also said there was a web site so i checked it out and sure enough they gave trail suggestions and locations…. it changed my whole outlook on living in this over populated city..if you are in the same situation i strongly suggest checking it out.. www.streetzebra.com Before you buy.

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Every one should go out this weekend.  NO posting. You guys are all too tired to be here.  You guys are snapping at each other too much. I love it, Eugene!  You are absolutely right!  I’m reading this on Friday the 11th and did go out last weekend and had a lovely time hiking on a beautiful trail with absolutely no other hikers on it.  Eat your hearts out, guys!

It needs to be repeated. I think I posted that on Aug. 4.  It’s now Aug. 18. Some people take this group, too seriously. Like it’s rec.scouting.usa or something. I’m outta here.

I’m outta here.

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hey there fellow hikers.. I just moved to LA from oregon and it was a total shock.. My Nature life completely disappeared or so i thought.. for the first couple of months here i couldn’t find

Months?! any trails to hike and was about to leave due to mountain separation anxiety…i went into a 7- Eleven to get a coke and saw the coolest free Magazine ever…

There’s tons of outdoor activities around Portland. The only thing lacking is easy to moderate granite and maybe a slight excess of mold.  And a lack of powder. Study maps people! 8^)

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My Nature life completely disappeared or so i thought.. for the first couple of months here i couldn’t find Months?!

‘Twas in another lifetime, one of toil and blood When blackness was a virtue and the road was full of mud I came in from the wilderness, a creature void of form. And if I pass this way again, you can rest assured I’ll always do my best for her, on that I give my word In a world of steel-eyed death, and men who are fighting to be warm. Not a word was spoke between us, there was little risk involved Everything up to that point had been left unresolved. Try imagining a place where it’s always safe and warm. I was burned out from exhaustion, buried in the hail, Poisoned in the bushes an’ blown out on the trail, Hunted like a crocodile, ravaged in the corn. Suddenly I turned around and she was standin’ there With silver bracelets on her wrists and flowers in her hair. She walked up to me so gracefully and took my crown of thorns. Now there’s a wall between us, somethin’ there’s been lost I took too much for granted, got my signals crossed. Just to think that it all began on a long-forgotten morn. Well, the deputy walks on hard nails and the preacher rides a mount But nothing really matters much, it’s doom alone that counts And the one-eyed undertaker, he blows a futile horn. I’ve heard newborn babies wailin’ like a mournin’ dove And old men with broken teeth stranded without love. Do I understand your question, man, is it hopeless and forlorn? In a little hilltop village, they gambled for my clothes I bargained for salvation an’ they gave me a lethal dose. I offered up my innocence and got repaid with scorn. Well, I’m livin’ in a foreign country but I’m bound to cross the line Beauty walks a razor’s edge, someday I’ll make it mine. If I could only turn back the clock to when God and her were born. "Come in," she said, "I’ll give you shelter from the storm."

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If I could only turn back the clock to when God and her were born. "Come in," she said, "I’ll give you shelter from the storm."

Yeah, but I like standing in storms.

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Study maps people! 8^)

   The best trips I have ever had were ones planned using maps, books and a desire to explore on my own. They haven’t come from someone telling me about a certain area.    If I would’ve had someone hold my hand, it would have taken all the fun out of it.    The summit of the highest peak in WY took us two tries with each being a week long vacation. I didn’t feel that the first failure to summit was a waste of a vacation and when we finally did make it, it was that much more rewarding.    Sometimes I wish there were no maps, books or trails.    Ed Huesers    http://www.grandshelters.com

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  The best trips I have ever had were ones planned using maps, books and a desire to explore on my own. They haven’t come from someone telling me about a certain area.

I am hoping that my trip to the Alps in December will be my next "best" trip.  Unless I get called to the Ross ice sheet again as an alternate. I had a great trip once, coming back from Lake Tahoe I looked across the Center Valley and saw snowy Coastal Range Peaks.  Not bold great peaks, but interesting unrated mountains.  The trip was some months after that first sight, but it was the sight that set the trip in motion.   If I would’ve had someone hold my hand, it would have taken all the fun out of it.

Find the book         Mountains w/o Hand Rails         by Joe Sax (UCB’s law school) There’s a lot of novices who unfortunately for themselves fool themselves into thinking they have fun.  They would argue that fun is a diversity of experience: this is a gross generalization and only somewhat true.  I had a couple of guys who were roommates like this. My friend and editor Martha who used to post in this group thinks she is like this, but I really think Martha is at heart an outdoor person (only I’m not in Portland to take her out every weekend on trips). I thought of a 3rd friend (F) who is a poser.  These guys kind of think its some sort of status thing, and it’s not unless you rake in bucks for doing a trip (which as a guide is a nice thing).  The only business is repeat business.   The summit of the highest peak in WY took us two tries with each being a week long vacation. I didn’t feel that the first failure to summit was a waste of a vacation and when we finally did make it, it was that much more rewarding.

Yeah, I took two different trips to get up the v-notch, 3 trips to get up Charlotte dome, etc.  Gross, for instance, is very insistent upon summit success.  I’ve bailed on hard technical climbs, so I have less an investment threshold for bailing (failing).  I can come back or skip. I don’t tally lists.  I’m more interested in coming back alive.   Sometimes I wish there were no maps, books or trails.

Well, I’ve had training as a cartographer and a photogrammetrist. The issue isn’t maps or books.  And I think about wandering around alone on the Ross Ice sheet (I got to the state where I was allowed to travel alone (had to carry a radio), a reasonable state of trust). Ilana when she was with the group is now preparing to sail around the world in a small boat.  You can gain some of that in a small boat. Just head out into open ocean and jump into the water.  If that doesn’t scare you, you don’t know enough yet.  Another good one is looking at swells which tower over your boat.  Combine that with climbing and that’s how Chouinard’s days are spent. It’s your own attitude.  It’s what’s inside your head, and your collection of good buddies whom you trust on ski trips or flying the bush, or whatever.  When I think about some of my favorite trips and my best buddies and partners, I know I’m part of having a good time.

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Added note, from an email:    Hall of the Mountain King:      Howard Snyder    White Winds:                    Joe Wilcox If you have problems, I first read Snyder in the 70s from a library loan and now I own both just because of this group, try Chessler in CO. Panel 7 issue. Every one should go out this weekend.  NO posting. You guys are all too tired to be here.  You guys are snapping at each other too much.

I love it, Eugene!  You are absolutely right!  I’m reading this on Friday the 11th and did go out last weekend and had a lovely time hiking on a beautiful trail with absolutely no other hikers on it.  Eat your hearts out, guys! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’m outta here. Marcy should be the only one posting here over the weekend.

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Has anyone written an account of hiking the Pacific Crest trail?  

The High Adventure of Eric Ryback (quite controversial). water under the bridge. Consider The Thousand Mile Summer (1958, too) by Colin Fletcher and it’s NOT the Muir trail.  I’m not as nearly enthralled with Man Who Walked through Time.  Others like it.

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Added note, from an email:         Hall of the Mountain King:      Howard Snyder         White Winds:                    Joe Wilcox If you have problems, I first read Snyder in the 70s from a library loan and now I own both just because of this group, try Chessler in CO. Panel 7 issue. Every one should go out this weekend.  NO posting. You guys are all too tired to be here.  You guys are snapping at each other too much. I’m outta here. Marcy should be the only one posting here over the weekend.

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The High Adventure of Eric Ryback (quite controversial). water under the bridge.

What’s the controversy? It’s certainly ignored, I’ve noticed in subsequent books/articles. Like the trip never happened.

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I’m curious to hear what others thought about Bill Bryson’s book, "A Walk in the Woods."

It was entertaining.  I wouldn’t look too deeply into it to try to use it as an ethical, moral, or how-to hiking guide.  When you read "The Bronx Zoo" or "Ball Four" you really don’t expect to read about baseball fundamentals or how baseball teams should comport themselves. started off on the trail without much experience and then didn’t even complete (or come close to) what he set out to do.  

So completion is the criteria for compelling prose?  Don’t read anything from Shackleton. Sometimes the best way to illustrate the right way to do things is to embellish the wrong way to do them. Steve Silberberg Visit the Air Sickness Bag Museum http://www.airsicknessbags.com/ FACT:  Buff Babes Dig Cut Dudes!

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The most offensive part of the book was Bryson’s friend Katz

The book pretty much WAS Katz, or rather the interaction between Katz and the author. I laughed out loud a number of times (though I frequently had suspicions of gross fictionalization). Book wasn’t much about the AT, or backpacking, or the outdoors at all. But I thought Katz was a hoot.

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I could never finish "The Living," even though I really like Dillard’s books. It just seemed so depressing when the characters kept dying off — but I guess that was, to a point, the reality of life in the pioneer days… Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

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I’m curious to hear what others thought about Bill Bryson’s book, "A Walk in the Woods."

Has anyone written an account of hiking the Pacific Crest trail?   Not a guidebook, but something akin to "walk in the woods". Phil

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There are so many good books… Edward Abbey comes to mind, especially "Desert Solitaire". Nelson’s "The Island" is good, too. There are always classics, too, like "Wild Animals I Have Known" and "A Sand County Almanac". Annie Dillard’s "A Pilgrim at Tinker Creek" is an incredible book, but not exactly light reading. There is a series of books out with collections of essays/extracts from books with common themes. I have read one called "Wild" that is good, and would like to read the others, too. Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

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I am a newbie, but the best books I have read about outdoors,wildlife were by Helen Hoover–I got them thru the local library–Gift of the Deer was one–she had several-they took place in the northwoods of MN–awesome books      theo God is good–for sure!!!!!!

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"Endurance" the story of Shackleton’s "adventure" in the antarctic; just about any book by Farley Mowat. "A Walk in the Woods", Bryson’s story of "thru-hiking" the AT. Several mountaineering books, including "The White Spider", "Annapurna", "Touching the Void".

I’m curious to hear what others thought about Bill Bryson’s book, "A Walk in the Woods."  Personally, I found it very disappointing that he was given a publisher’s advance to write the book, went out and bought a lot of expensive equipment, started off on the trail without much experience and then didn’t even complete (or come close to) what he set out to do.  (And his book was still a best-seller).  The most offensive part of the book was Bryson’s friend Katz, who decided he didn’t want to carry so much weight and dumped out half the contents of his backpack along the AT.  Perhaps this was just part of Bryson’s style of humor, but since most of the people buying his book probably have not ever been in the backcountry, it certainly doesn’t set a good example! As for books set in the Pacific NW, "The Living", by Annie Dillard is a fictional account of the early settlers in NW Washington state (around Bellingham and the Nooksak River).  For me, it was a little tough to get through at times, but she really captures the feel of the landscape and the hardships the pioneers endured. Anita Vasavada

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Do you have any recommendations for good books about the outdoors?  Western settings preferred.  Pacific northwest settings best.

Oh, there. Well, you might want to look at Dee Molnaar’s (sp) books. Find The Mountaineers web site.  They publish a whole bunch. Contact Elliot Bay Books.  Fred Beckey has a few books, mostly guidebooks, but not all, which are useful.  I have not seen Fred in years. Books like Challenge of the North Cascades (DM), Prater has a snowshoeing book. Depends what you want to read: climbing, history, The Dharma Bums ends in the North Cascades.  Scan the REI book rack. I’m not really into fiction anymore.  Usually. Considering Alaska, I really liked -148F, that’s the title  Minus 148. By Art Davidson.  I read it one day in a sign huge push and it was as good as Endurance in many ways.  The crux is about dinner time (when they guys were pinned down in a snow cave for a week). Art’s 3rd book, In the Wake of the Exxon Valdez is also good. ‘And the oil companies rotated in their executives, and they had names like "Bubba" and "Skitter."’ Panel 28 topic. Oh, another two Denali books are In the Hall of the Mountain King and White Winds.  Give serious thought as to which to read first: chronological publication date, coin flip, or author alphabetic order. Same trip.

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"Endurance" the story of Shackleton’s "adventure" in the antarctic; just about any book by Farley Mowat.

Farley Mowat … hmmmn … just remember to treat it as fiction or altered non-fiction.

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"Endurance" the story of Shackleton’s "adventure" in the antarctic;

There’s also, "To the Pole in the Footsteps of Shackleton" or something like that.  It’s definitely not western US though. Steve Silberberg Visit the Air Sickness Bag Museum http://www.airsicknessbags.com/ FACT:  Buff Babes Dig Cut Dudes!

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"Endurance" the story of Shackleton’s "adventure" in the antarctic;

I can’t resist gushing over this book.  Everyone should read it.  Events stranger than any fiction are in this story.  Exceptional writing. Phil

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I’m a northwest native stranded out here in the prairie and chained to a desk working on my PhD.  Hence, I have no wilderness to go to and I relish good books about the outdoors.  Recently, I’ve enjoyed books by Richard Nelson, and Byron Ricks’ account of a trip down the inside passage. Do you have any recommendations for good books about the outdoors?  Western settings preferred.  Pacific northwest settings best.  Fiction and non-fiction recommendations welcome.

        Offhand can’t think about any/many with Western/PacNW settings, except perhaps for anything by John Gierach who writes about fly-fishing mostly in Colorado/Montana, etc. But as for other stuff "The Arctic Grail" by Pierre Berton is a wonderful book about the exploration of the Arctic. Kind of reminded me of "The White Nile" and "The Blue Nile" by Alan Moorhead from the 50’s or early 60’s which are drop-dead wonderful.         Also, ever hear of a guy named Redmond O’Hanlon? Writes (or at least used to write) the London Times’ column on nature. First book

Question:

Yo Dave, I’m with you. And I know this guy is probably going to beat me up for getting out of line here, but I couldn’t help imagining Pat’s voice as Eddie G Robinson’s." See, I use only braided line, see. You use that mono and the fish is going to rub you out, see. N’yeah" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "PAT" But I take it as an insult when you tell me I don’t have a clue. Look pards, I don’t know where you’re from, and don’t care really. ok lemme explain… i didnt mean to insult you i just thought it funny that you are telling a new jig man to forget the $150 curado he just bought and upgrade to 80 lb test.. he surely doesnt need that… you must agree that a new jig man who obviously isnt fishing for millions in prize money wouldnt need to go buy a $300 dollar set up with 80 lb test.. if he misses one fish a day who cares? Thats why its called fishing not catching! On to the next comment.. You misunderstood or misread what i wrote.. as it is quoted above i said that the name tuna should have been the first clue.. i said nothing about you being clueless.. yo might be a great fisherman but seems to me that you dispense tournament advice to an amatuer who is gettin interested in a type of fishing.. My last point.. the name "pards" might actually be taken as offensive.. i had nothing in my letter to you that was meant to be taken as a direct insult to you.. yet you reply to my email seems to not hold as much charecter!!! End of discussion. Dave

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Amen, AJH.  They should have to put labels about Jigs being addictive.  :-) After you start sticking those big beauties on the jig-n-chunk, your hooked for life.  I used to only use a jig for a short time at the end of the winter season, but then I learned to catch bass on the jig-n-pig (usually zoom super chunks).  Now I use them all year through.  Swimming them through shoreline weeds is almost as much fun as top water fishing. Bassman

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I fish a jig and pig just like a plastic worm. I use a 3/16 or 1/4 oz black and blue jig (Strike King Bitsy Bug) with a Zoom swimmin chunk Sapphire blue trailer. Right now I am using 14lb hi vis mono, I have ordered 30lb test Berkley Fireline in the hi vis green. I too feel it’s very important to watch the line when fishing jig and pig and worms. I am trying the Fireline in hope of improving my hook set and maybe it will allow me to feel the bass bite. Once you catch a few bass on the jig and pig you become obsessed with it. Anybody want to buy 1200 powerworms. Also I remove about half of the fibers in the weed guard, I think it allows a better hook set. I have caught at least 12 bass on the swimmin chunk I have on now and it still looks good so you can one advantage it has over the worm. Stick with it you will get hooked

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"PAT" But I take it as an insult when you tell me I don’t have a clue. Look pards, I don’t know where you’re from, and don’t care really.

ok lemme explain… i didnt mean to insult you i just thought it funny that you are telling a new jig man to forget the $150 curado he just bought and upgrade to 80 lb test.. he surely doesnt need that… you must agree that a new jig man who obviously isnt fishing for millions in prize money wouldnt need to go buy a $300 dollar set up with 80 lb test.. if he misses one fish a day who cares? Thats why its called fishing not catching!   On to the next comment.. You misunderstood or misread what i wrote.. as it is quoted above i said that the name tuna should have been the first clue.. i said nothing about you being clueless.. yo might be a great fisherman but seems to me that you dispense tournament advice to an amatuer who is gettin interested in a type of fishing.. My last point.. the name "pards" might actually be taken as offensive.. i had nothing in my letter to you that was meant to be taken as a direct insult to you.. yet you reply to my email seems to not hold as much charecter!!! End of discussion.

Dave

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Me too. — Why is it called ‘Tourist Season’ if we can’t shoot them ?     Shawn

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’d like to hear more. We routinely fish with 1oz. jigs in less than 3′ of water.   I’ll explain later if anyone’s interested. What your car says about you – Ford Crown Victoria – "I enjoy having people slow to 55mph and change lanes when I pull up behind them" — Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

holy smokes…..thanks for the input. Keep em’ comin’ I had luck w/ one fish so far. 3 pounder. As soon as the thing hit the water BOOM had a 4" green tube as a trailer. That was it for the rest of the day….I guess i’m gonna keep on fishin’ keeping a open mind. Brian

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"Dave" Adjusted his Orvis fly fishing cap, put on his topsiders, laid down his Harvard business journal and decided the world needed to hear this: The name , tuna blank, of your "Heavy" setup should have been the first clue that you are not correctly set-up for bassin’ Dave

Look pards, I don’t know where you’re from, and don’t care really. I fish for money.  I described my tournament setups.  Why?  Lemme s’plain. First off, you gotta realise, we’re not throwing that jig on some rocky bank.   Three scenarios that I’ll explain, and maybe you’ll understand. 20′ deep matted hydrilla.  Use a minimum of a 1oz. jig.  Usually a 11/2 oz. when it’s really thick.  When that fish hits, if he moves laterally two feet, he’s gone. Lost, never to be seen again.  You must get him off the bottom and up through the matted grass instantly.  It ain’t gonna happen with 12 pound mono.  Period. Falcon lake, pitching into flooded mesquite trees.  VERY large, very strong fish.  They will stay in the thickest, nastiest part of the cover.  We used to use 30#mono, but you’d still get two a day lost by sawing off in the cover.   Skipping a jig under boat houses and docks.  Nasty place, lot’s of things to rub mono off on.  The braid ended the problem. Look Skippy, everyone goes fishing for a different reason.  If you think it’s more "sporting" to use light line, hey that’s just fine.  I’ve caught 120lb. Tarpon on fifteen pound line too.  It’s a different deal.  In a bass tournament, one lost fish is worth thousands of dollars. Literally.  If I can eliminate that from ever happening, then that’s what I’m gonna do.  But I take it as an insult when you tell me I don’t have a clue.  You spend one day on the lake with me, and you use your 6lb. mono.  Then let’s compare sacks at the end of the day.   End of discussion. Pat Goff

Response:

Hi Brian: Brain: "This is what i understand to date. You try to get it in the water next to or right in the cover making the least amount of noise you can. right?" Reply: Yes & No.  When flipping or pitching, you try and get as close as you can to your target without spooking the fish.  Often this will depend on water clarity and depth.  Depending on how close you are to your target depends on if you are flipping (0-15ft.) or pitching (15-40ft.).  Flipping is easy. Pitching on the other hand requires a lot of skill and practice.  The longer the rod the easier it is to perform both of these techniques. Your 6′6" rod is the minimum length you want to use for this technique.  A 7′6" or 8′ flipping (heavy) is the best rod for this technique.  But with 6′6" you should be able to pitch up to 25′ comfortably and quietly. Brian: "Here’s a scenario of a river we fish often. The edges of the river have thick weeds and brush back about 25 feet all seeming to be in 1-3 feet of water. NOW do i throw the jig into the brush? how far back do i throw it? OR do I just try to work the edges?" Reply: When I am fishing a weedbed, I first flip or pitch to the shade side of weed points, cuts, and holes (1′ to 3′ in) along the edge.  I position the boat parallel to the weedbed but 15′ to 20′ off the weedbed itself and work the entire edge.  Then I would slowly and quietly move my boat so that it was just touch the weeds and then flip or pitch to the holes that are further in the weeds and thoroughly fish the weedbed out. Brian: "When should i use different colors or weights of jigs?" Reply: As for color you need to know what the fish are feeding on.  If the primary forage is crawfish, then I would use black, brown, pumpkin, or watermelon. If the primary forage is shad then I would use black, white, or black/white blend or gray/black/white blend.  Clear water (crawfish) I use brown/black (jig skirt/trailer), pumpkin/green or pumpkin/orange, watermelon/brown, pumpkin/brown, pumpkin/black.  Clear water (shad) white/black (jig skirt/trailer), black/white, white/white, black&gray/white. As far as weight, I use small 1/8, 3/16, 1/4 ounce jigs for smallmouth around rock and gravel bottom (0-8 ft of water)and #101 or #11 pork trailers, or 5/16 ounce for deeper water #11 trailer.  I use 5/16 & 3/8 ounce jigs for largemouth along weedbeds, brush piles, etc.  I use 1/2, 3/4, and 1 ounce jigs for thick weeds or fishing deep structures.  But I believe we can all learn from Woo’s Classic victory.  So you can count on me trying 3/16 & 1/4 jigs on 8 pound test with #11 trailers in deeper water. Brian: "Do you flip it in there, let it sit for a while? bounce it off the bottom? swim it? Or are there any rules at all? Does the same things apply here the same as in all other tackle? Or is it just a convoy mission to get in there, scare the crap out of the fish, so he’ll bite and then bring him on home?" Reply: Tough question.  I personally start with flipping or pitching a jig into the cover and let it settle to the bottom.  Then I hop it a couple of times in place (1" to 3"), then a couple more moving hops (6"-12") and then I swim it out.  Remember to stop it just before the jig gets to the top and let it drop a second and then pull it.  Once I get a strike or two, I know what they want and I drop the other movements. Brain: "If somebody could be kind enough to explain the point of Jig-n-a pig. It would make me(i bet a bunch of other people too!) understand it better." Reply: There are many types of jigs, all for different types of cover and presentations.  Jigs can represent many different types of forage.  A simple hair jig looks more like a fish or larvae.  A larger hair jig with a bigger pork trailer can represent a mouse or small animal.  While rubber skirted jigs look more like crawfish.  Silicone skirted jigs can represent both fish and crawfish depending on color.  Let’s start with "Hair" jigs.  These are the oldest type and are super effective in clear water or when there is little cover.  The hair moves with the water action (waves) and applied action looks more alive (in my opinion) then do silicone skirts.  They are excellent in colder water situations.  Rubber and silicone skirted jigs and all the possible colors can be customized to match the forage in your area. I always custom blend my skirts to closely match the crawfish or forage fish in the lake I am fishing.  Example.  The crawfish in my home lake are light brown and have black and light orange patches.  So I start with a pumpkin colored skirt and add a strain or two of black and orange.  Then I put on a brown or orange trailer.  On the orange trailer I use a black permanent marker and dye it so that it looks mostly black with orange spots. The jig can be presented in a lot of ways to match the conditions you are fishing.  A light jig (1/8, 3/16, 1/4 ounce) with a #101 can represent a small fish or crawfish.  On clam water this setup will have a medium fall rate (about 1 to 1.5 seconds per foot)  The same jig with a #11 pork trailer will fall much slower (1.5 to 2 second a foot), and look like a bigger fish or crawfish.  The same jig with a #1 trailer will fall real slow (2 to 3 seconds a foot) and an even larger fish and crawfish. Brian: When jig hits the water does it really matter if it’s quiet or not?" Reply: Most of the time you want to flip or pitch this type of lure into the water as quietly as possible.  But there are times when splashing the jig can be beneficial (like in muddy water or at night or when casting the jig on top of thick matted weeds). Hopes this helps. — Craig Baugher

Response:

I’d like to hear more. We routinely fish with 1oz. jigs in less than 3′ of water.   I’ll explain later if anyone’s interested.

What your car says about you – Ford Crown Victoria – "I enjoy having people slow to 55mph and change lanes when I pull up behind them" — Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

Mobees, also some ‘good’ reading on the subject here: http://www.bassdozer.com/articles.shtml What your car says about you – Ford Crown Victoria – "I enjoy having people slow to 55mph and change lanes when I pull up behind them" — Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

 My "light" duty setup is a Quantum flipping rod 7′6" with 50lb. Oldham’s braid.  My "heavy" setup is a Waterloo double wall tuna blank-8′ with 80lb. Oldham’s braid. 50lb. Oldham’s braid. 80lb. Oldham’s braid.

I have caught 100+ pound sharks..the meanest fighter pound for pound.. on 20 lb test around very sharp coral heads..much sharper than logs…I understand needing heavy equipment but heavy in the bass world is 20lb test… if you need 50 or 80 pound test for a 10 pound bass what would you use for a real fish? When i am land locked as i am now i use 6 or maybe 12 pound test and have done very well with bass.  It seems funny to me that you need heavier test than i have ever fished in the ocean with to catch bass… maybe you could email me and explain to me why the overly strong choice in test line?  The name , tuna blank, of your "Heavy" setup should have been the first clue that you are not correctly set-up for bassin’ Dave

Response:

I fish a jig and pig just like a plastic worm. I use a 3/16 or 1/4 oz black and blue jig (Strike King Bitsy Bug) with a Zoom swimmin chunk Sapphire blue trailer. Right now I am using 14lb hi vis mono, I have ordered 30lb test Berkley Fireline in the hi vis green. I too feel it’s very important to watch the line when fishing jig and pig and worms. I am trying the Fireline in hope of improving my hook set and maybe it will allow me to feel the bass bite. Once you catch a few bass on the jig and pig you become obsessed with it. Anybody want to buy 1200 powerworms. Also I remove about half of the fibers in the weed guard, I think it allows a better hook set. I have caught at least 12 bass on the swimmin chunk I have on now and it still looks good so you can one advantage it has over the worm. Stick with it you will get hooked

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Mobees drank two pots of coffee, kicked the dogs off the porch, ran the kids off on the yard, sat down and decided the world needed to hear: When should i use differnet colors or weights of jigs? do you flip it in there, let it sit for a while? bounce it off the bottom? swim it? Or are there any rules at all?

Ok, I’m going to get probably ripped for what I’m going to tell you, that’s fine, if they’ve caught half the fish we’ve caught on a jig, I’ll listen to ‘em. There are no "rules"  I’ll tell you that right now. The only rule is figure out what’s working right now. Don’t ever be afraid to experiment with colors, weight, trailers, and combinations. Ok, I’ll give you a few things I’ve learned, and discovered. 1. Use a heavier jig when the water’s hot.  When the water’s warm, the metabolism of the bass is way high, so you need to match the speed of you lure to the fish’s aggressiveness.  We routinely fish with 1oz. jigs in less than 3′ of water.   I’ll explain later if anyone’s interested. 2.  Cast it into the MIDDLE of the cover.  That’s where they live. 3.  Don’t be afraid to experiment.  We use solid white, purple, chartuese, and other goofy looking colors.  Try lot’s of different trailers.  We’ll use an entire 8" lizard on the back of a jig with much success.   4.  Don’t be afraid to vary your presentation.  Somedays they just aren’t on the bottom.  Someday’s they want it fast, someday’s slow, they’ll tell you when you figure it out. 5.  Be a sniper.  You need to learn to put that jig into places you wouldn’t send your rabbit hound.   6.  Upgrade your equipment.  This isn’t a slam on your new rod&reel pards, but that’s what I’d fish an open rock bank with.  My "light" duty setup is a Quantum flipping rod 7′6" with 50lb. Oldham’s braid.  My "heavy" setup is a Waterloo double wall tuna blank-8′ with 80lb. Oldham’s braid. 7. Upgrade your jigs.  Anything you buy with an American made hook is second rate.  Anyone who’s ever used one would agree the Oldham’s eye-max is the finest jig made.  512-847-9202   There is much more to fishing the most effective quality bass lure made, and we’ll continue this discussion if anyone’s interested. Pat Goff

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Brain, I will try to answer some of your questions, and I’m sure there are other here that can tell you more than I can.  You will find that certain presentations produce more bass than others.  It depends on the weather, water conditions, mood of the fish (which is affected by everything), and also on what you feel comfortable with. Often times bass will hit a jig/pig combo on the initial drop.  These are the blessed times when you can ease along a bank, pitching or flipping a jig to cover and set the hook as soon as the bait starts to fall.  But they don’t always do that.  Sometimes they will not touch it jig if you are moving it.  They prefer for it to just lay there wriggling on its own, then the move in a pick it up.  You just have to try it one way and if it doesn’t work change.  I have noticed that on high pressure days, or in extremely clear water, the bass seem to prefer that the lure remain motionless, at least as far as your input to the motion is concerned.  I have also done well in these conditions by using a heavy jig head and getting the reaction strikes as the bait rips past them on the way to the bottom.  In murky water or flowing water bass seem to like to hit the jig on the initial fall. But, as I mentioned before… sometimes it’s just trial and error. Some things that you should follow as basic rules will help you increase your catch on jig and pigs combos.  Always watch your line.  Try to allow your bait to fall straight down on a simi-tight line; not so tight that the lure can’t fall straight down, but tight enough to remain in contact with the lure as it falls.  Always watch your line.  Place the lure into the water as quietly as possible, especially in shallow or clear water conditions.  Always watch your line.  Put you lure as close to cover as possible.  The clearer the water or higher the barometric pressure, the closer and deeper in cover they tend to be.  Set the hook fast upon detecting a strike, whether by site or feel, don’t pause at all like you might do with soft plastic lures.  And, always watch your line. I don’t know if this gives you a detailed enough outline of how to fish the jig-n-pig, but just as with any other lure, it’s always up to the bass to dictate how they will bite, we just have to figure it out. Good luck and always watch your line, Bassman Duane Knight

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi everybody. I wanted to figure out how to fish jig n a pig style w/ 20 pound test on a heavier pole w/ a baitcasting reel. So i went out and bought a Shimano Curado and a lightning rod med/heavy 6′6" rod. thru on a 3/8 jig w/ a matching pork trailer…great. that’s the easy part….Now, I’m practicing how to flip it different ways etc…Okay…thats about as far as i got.    This is what i understand to date. You try to get it in the water next to or right in the cover making the least amount of noise you can. right? Sounds easy enough.     Here’s a scenario of a river we fish often. The edges of the river have thick weeds and brush back about 25 feet all seeming to be in 1-3 feet of water. NOW do i throw the jig into the brush? how far back do i throw it? OR do i just try to work the edges? I know i should just get out there and use it,use it and use it some more, but i like to understand things, before i go out and fish. When should i use differnet colors or weights of jigs? do you flip it in there, let it sit for a while? bounce it off the bottom? swim it? Or are there any rules at all? Does the same things apply here the same as in all other tackle? Or is it just a convoy mission to get in there, scare the crap out of the fish, so he’ll bite and then bring him on home??? I need help w/ this. If somebody could be kind enough to explain the point of Jig-n-a pig. It would make me(i bet a bunch of other people too!) understand it better. When jig hits the water does it really matter if it’s quiet or not? So many ?’s…..Anyway thanks in advance for any info you can provide me! Brian

Response:

Hi everybody. I wanted to figure out how to fish jig n a pig style w/ 20 pound test on a heavier pole w/ a baitcasting reel. So i went out and bought a Shimano Curado and a lightning rod med/heavy 6′6" rod. thru on a 3/8 jig w/ a matching pork trailer…great. that’s the easy part….Now, I’m practicing how to flip it different ways etc…Okay…thats about as far as i got.    This is what i understand to date. You try to get it in the water next to or right in the cover making the least amount of noise you can. right? Sounds easy enough.     Here’s a scenario of a river we fish often. The edges of the river have thick weeds and brush back about 25 feet all seeming to be in 1-3 feet of water. NOW do i throw the jig into the brush? how far back do i throw it? OR do i just try to work the edges? I know i should just get out there and use it,use it and use it some more, but i like to understand things, before i go out and fish. When should i use differnet colors or weights of jigs? do you flip it in there, let it sit for a while? bounce it off the bottom? swim it? Or are there any rules at all? Does the same things apply here the same as in all other tackle? Or is it just a convoy mission to get in there, scare the crap out of the fish, so he’ll bite and then bring him on home??? I need help w/ this. If somebody could be kind enough to explain the point of Jig-n-a pig. It would make me(i bet a bunch of other people too!) understand it better. When jig hits the water does it really matter if it’s quiet or not? So many ?’s…..Anyway thanks in advance for any info you can provide me! Brian

Response:

Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My home river has been alternating on a daily basis between running high and muddy and high and clear with an amber tinge. When it is running amber, the fishing is pretty good, but with the heavy flows, traditional dry techniques aren’t productive. In this heavy flowing, colored water, I’ve been having good success with a technique that was shown to me by an old rancher about twenty years ago. The technique is a fun one and is often productive when the trout are reluctant to come up for traditionally fished dries. It’s a technique geared for fishing fast, heavy water. I use it mainly in pocket water, but it also works on the streamside edges of heavy, deep water and in around any obstructions in deep strong runs. The flies I use are a high floating dry with a wet fly or soft hackle on a dropper of about 2 feet. I generally use a dry about two sizes bigger than I normally would and use a fly two sizes smaller than the dry as a dropper. The dropper is optional but will result in more hookups. I’ll describe the technique for a pocket water situation where I mainly use it. Casts can be short or long, but since you can approach fish closely in pocket water, often surprisingly close, and short casts give you much more control, I use casts of under fifteen feet 90% of the time. The only time I use longer casts is when the water is too deep or heavy to get to an area I want to fish. I try to fish an area thoroughly, even spots where there doesn’t appear to be any rocks that could break up the current, but I concentrate the casts to run through any visible areas where larger rocks provide calm water cushions. I generally a cast up and across stream and immediately raise the rod tip to lift all the fly line off the water and get direct contact with the fly.  I then begin dragging and skipping the fly across the current. I vary the action of the fly but the key is lots of action.  When the flies get in a position just below me, I begin maneuvering them through each small pocket I can find.  I skitter them upstream and down, back and forth through any pockets below. This technique will bring good fish to the surface that ignore more placid, traditional techniques. The quick moving flies result in strikes that are aggressive, vicious, slashing, fast, exciting etc. and you will get many more misses than hookups. Setting the hook at the strike usually results in pulling the fly away from the trout. Strikes need to be delayed but because of the tight line, the fish will usually hook themselves. Since there are a large percentage of missed fish with this technique, the feeding locations and holding areas that are revealed, need to be fished again. Since most of these missed strikes, refusals etc. are to the larger, more visible dry, the next thing I do is to try to maneuver the small dropper through the area trying to skip it across the surface. If this doesn’t work, I do a number of traditional drag free drifts through the area, paying close attention for hits on the dropper. This technique is definitely a kick when it’s working.  It elicits strikes from trout more akin to those of a bass or a pike to a popper than a typical sedate sip to a dry. I tend to ignore the technique when the fish are rising to more typical techniques but maybe I shouldn’t. Willi Interesting technique Willi.  I think most of us have used a similar

approach for pocket water, but not with a dropper, and not with a systematic plan.  For me its been an approach used out of necessity at times for fishing pocket water, especially casting over currents or boulders.  I’ll try it next opportunity. Pat K Before you buy.

Response:

My home river has been alternating on a daily basis between running high and muddy and high and clear with an amber tinge. When it is running amber, the fishing is pretty good, but with the heavy flows, traditional dry techniques aren’t productive. In this heavy flowing, colored water, I’ve been having good success with a technique that was shown to me by an old rancher about twenty years ago. The technique is a fun one and is often productive when the trout are reluctant to come up for traditionally fished dries. It’s a technique geared for fishing fast, heavy water. I use it mainly in pocket water, but it also works on the streamside edges of heavy, deep water and in around any obstructions in deep strong runs. The flies I use are a high floating dry with a wet fly or soft hackle on a dropper of about 2 feet. I generally use a dry about two sizes bigger than I normally would and use a fly two sizes smaller than the dry as a dropper. The dropper is optional but will result in more hookups. I’ll describe the technique for a pocket water situation where I mainly use it. Casts can be short or long, but since you can approach fish closely in pocket water, often surprisingly close, and short casts give you much more control, I use casts of under fifteen feet 90% of the time. The only time I use longer casts is when the water is too deep or heavy to get to an area I want to fish. I try to fish an area thoroughly, even spots where there doesn’t appear to be any rocks that could break up the current, but I concentrate the casts to run through any visible areas where larger rocks provide calm water cushions. I generally a cast up and across stream and immediately raise the rod tip to lift all the fly line off the water and get direct contact with the fly.  I then begin dragging and skipping the fly across the current. I vary the action of the fly but the key is lots of action.  When the flies get in a position just below me, I begin maneuvering them through each small pocket I can find.  I skitter them upstream and down, back and forth through any pockets below. This technique will bring good fish to the surface that ignore more placid, traditional techniques. The quick moving flies result in strikes that are aggressive, vicious, slashing, fast, exciting etc. and you will get many more misses than hookups. Setting the hook at the strike usually results in pulling the fly away from the trout. Strikes need to be delayed but because of the tight line, the fish will usually hook themselves. Since there are a large percentage of missed fish with this technique, the feeding locations and holding areas that are revealed, need to be fished again. Since most of these missed strikes, refusals etc. are to the larger, more visible dry, the next thing I do is to try to maneuver the small dropper through the area trying to skip it across the surface. If this doesn’t work, I do a number of traditional drag free drifts through the area, paying close attention for hits on the dropper. This technique is definitely a kick when it’s working.  It elicits strikes from trout more akin to those of a bass or a pike to a popper than a typical sedate sip to a dry. I tend to ignore the technique when the fish are rising to more typical techniques but maybe I shouldn’t. Willi

Response:

Question:

I am wondering what type of experiences people have had fishing smallmouth in the Quetico in early September.  We have a group who has gone on several spring trips thinking about a fall trip.  Several of us are fly fishermen, so in particular, I’m wondering if the fish use shallow areas this time of year or if they begin to go deep. Thanks Peter Jonas Iron Mountain, MI

Response:

I am wondering what type of experiences people have had fishing smallmouth in the Quetico in early September.  We have a group who has gone on several spring trips thinking about a fall trip.  Several of us are fly fishermen, so in particular, I’m wondering if the fish use shallow areas this time of year or if they begin to go deep.

        They are still deep in early Sept. Don’t forget they don’t care about the air temp., they care about the water temp. And by the end of Aug. the water is as warm there as it gets. Mornings and evenings might still be okay though. But otherwise think late Sept., early Oct. tgb

Response:

I’m wondering if the fish use shallow areas this time of year or if they begin to go deep.

We went in last September (early) into the northern part of the park and did fairly well on smallmouth catching quite a few in the 17-19" class.  Most of them were shallow to about 8′

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Question:

I don’t have ten favorite flies and I would be hard pressed to just to give you the names of 30 flies.  To me "favorite fly" means the one I like best, not 10 or 30.  My favorite dry fly is a modified Horner Deer Hair, which tells you nothing because you have no idea how I modify it.  Jack Horner is the inventor of the Humpy or Goofus Bug which is my next to my favorite dry fly.  My favorite wet fly is a Western Coachnan and my favorite streamer is one of Keith Fulshers flies from his book "Tying and Fishing the Thunder Creek Series". — Remove NOSPAM to send E-mail Ernie Harrison – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – PEOPLE! I didn’t want to know a 10 fly collection, I wanted to know your 10 favorite dries, your 10 favorite wets, your ten favorite nymphs, and your 10 favorite streamers. Bryce Carron Santa Fe, Texas

Response:

PEOPLE! I didn’t want to know a 10 fly collection, I wanted to know your 10 favorite dries, your 10 favorite wets, your ten favorite nymphs, and your 10 favorite streamers. Bryce Carron Santa Fe, Texas

PERSON !!   I do not want to tell you !   Harry

Response:

PEOPLE! I didn’t want to know a 10 fly collection, I wanted to know your 10 favorite dries, your 10 favorite wets, your ten favorite nymphs, and your 10 favorite streamers. Bryce Carron Santa Fe, Texas

Response:

PEOPLE! I didn’t want to know a 10 fly collection, I wanted to know your 10 favorite dries, your 10 favorite wets, your ten favorite nymphs, and your 10 favorite streamers.

Now you’re telling us the rules! My fly box isn’t that big, and I can’t remember all the names, just what works. 12 green ones, 16 black, 4 red, and 8 brown. Some are multi colored but who’s counting. — Doug Knight                           metalfab<atpacbell.net Junk e-mail, solicitation, sales, products and services gladly accepted at $500.00 per mailing and billed directly to your ISP.

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Question:

I am trying to find out where a good place to go fly fishing in the

early spring is.  It has to be running water and shallow enough to wade in and hopefully not tooooo many people.  Any tips will be greatly appreciated. Uhh….within an [n] mile radius of where ?  

  Money, travel no object ? If money & travel are no object, go to New Zealand.  It will be late summer – early fall there.  Bring hoppers! CQ

Response:

I am trying to find out where a good place to go fly fishing in the early spring is.  It has to be running water and shallow enough to wade in and hopefully not tooooo many people.  Any tips will be greatly appreciated.

Northwest Nevada is normally very good in the eary spring  However this year is a big question mark after the floods.  If cold weater sets in and reduces the runoff, and the fish have not been washed away, rivers like the East Fork of the Walker fish real well    

Response:

I am trying to find out where a good place to go fly fishing in the early spring is.  It has to be running water and shallow enough to wade in and hopefully not tooooo many people.  Any tips will be greatly appreciated.

Response:

I am trying to find out where a good place to go fly fishing in the early spring is.  It has to be running water and shallow enough to wade in and hopefully not tooooo many people.  Any tips will be greatly appreciated.

Uhh….within an [n] mile radius of where ?   Money, travel no object ? TimW

Response:

I am trying to find out where a good place to go fly fishing in the early spring is.  It has to be running water and shallow enough to wade in and hopefully not tooooo many people.  Any tips will be greatly appreciated.

Hi Montana has some great early spring fishing. When I say early I’m talking about March and April before spring run off. The Bighorn is often very productive at this time and does not have the crowds you can expect during the summer. — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (97 materials catalog) http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

Response:

Question:

Could someone post a primer on steelhead fishing on the Lake Ontario Tributaries?  Where, what flys, what other types of bait/rig are used (not that I would use anything but a fly, but I have an 8 year old who dreams of landing a big fish and he spins), how to work the fly and the stream.  I’ve read that they haven’t yet come in but we are waiting none too patiently.  Thanks in advance. — Jeffrey D. Morris Applied Math and Statistics Kodak Research Labs Rochester, NY 14650-2205

Response:

Could someone post a primer on steelhead fishing on the Lake Ontario Tributaries?  Where, what flys, what other types of bait/rig are used (not that I would use anything but a fly, but I have an 8 year old who dreams of landing a big fish and he spins), how to work the fly and the stream.  I’ve read that they haven’t yet come in but we are waiting none too patiently.  Thanks in advance. — Jeffrey D. Morris Applied Math and Statistics Kodak Research Labs Rochester, NY 14650-2205

        I believe most people use a roe sac with a bobber and just drift it downstream. Flyfishing is not something I would recommend if the fish are running. Any stream with a hint of movement is covered with anglers crowded almost shoulder to shoulder. If the fish are not in season and you are hoping to pick up stragglers you might be better off.  Most of the flyfishermen I have talked to in the area find that larger bucktails seem to work better than most. keep the hook sharp and the tip up

Response:

Lafleur) writes:

Extreme crowded conditions are the norm during the king salmon runs of September-October.  Steelhead enter the tribs from mid-Oct. all the way until April.  The Salmon River in Pulaski NY is often crowded but if you arrive on a weekday there are most certainly places to fish.  The lower few miles of the river is a private  pay to fish section ($10 weekdays, $15 weekends) and only a a certain number of people are allowed on this property each day.  Overall, the crowds are not bad after the salmon runs are over.  The best bait rig to use is a small salmon egg sac on a #6-10 egg hook dead drifted on bottom using very light line (2-8lb) and a long (9-12 foot) limber rod, called noodle rods around here.  The best fly patterns this time of year are anything that looks like a salmon egg in sizes #6-10 (ex. glow bugs, yarn flies, ect…).  The best colors are usually chartreuse, orange, and a combination of chart. and blue (yup I said blue). These should be fished on a 9-11 ft. rod (slow action preferred), and 2-5x tippets.  The Salmon River is deep and fast, several flyfishers in the area have developed a technique in which 2-4 weight floating lines are used in order to decrease drag caused by heavier lines.  I have not graduated to this level and still use 5-7 weight floating lines.  You will need lots of lead, especially if the waters up, I would suggest purchasing what are called slinky sinkers.  They dont snag on bottom nearly as much as regular split shot and will save you lots of time and money.  Casting with lots  of lead on your line ain’t easy, but it is the only way to get to the fish on some days (we call the casting technique the "chuck and duck"). Hope this was helpfull.                                   Mark Arrigo                                  SUNY College of Environmental Science and Forestry                                   Syracuse NY 13210

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