Question:

Has anyone tried 9X tippet material?  Is it really more beneficial than 8X (or even 7X)?  Or is it just a ploy to get us to buy more spools? —

Response:

Has anyone tried 9X tippet material?  Is it really more beneficial than 8X (or even 7X)?  Or is it just a ploy to get us to buy more spools?

Well, it’s thinner and more flexible, all else being the same.  But manufacturers fudge the numbers, so one company’s 5x is another’s 6x. Personally I use 11x – you know, for the sporting aspect of it.

Response:

Has anyone tried 9X tippet material?  Is it really more beneficial than 8X (or even 7X)?  Or is it just a ploy to get us to buy more spools?

I use 9X leaders the following way: 1) cut off leader at butt 2) tie on 2X, 4X, and 6X to create taper 3) tie on fly Research shows I break off far fewer fish on 9X tippet this way.  :) — HTH, Tim

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   Has anyone tried 9X tippet material?  Is it really more beneficial than 8X  (or even 7X)?  Or is it just a ploy to get us to buy more spools?       I use 9X leaders the following way:   1) cut off leader at butt   2) tie on 2X, 4X, and 6X to create taper   3) tie on fly     Research shows I break off far fewer fish on 9X tippet this way.  :) What are you fishing for that you feel you need 9X tippet? Willi

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  Has anyone tried 9X tippet material?  Is it really more beneficial than 8X  (or even 7X)?  Or is it just a ploy to get us to buy more spools?   I use 9X leaders the following way:   1) cut off leader at butt   2) tie on 2X, 4X, and 6X to create taper   3) tie on fly   Research shows I break off far fewer fish on 9X tippet this way.  :) What are you fishing for that you feel you need 9X tippet?

I don’t. That was the point of my reply. I use mainly 6X, but sometimes 7X for more calm, clear water presentation. Most of the flies I use are #20 or larger so the finer tippet isn’t normally needed. — TL, Tim

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Personally I use 11x – you know, for the sporting aspect of it.

Certainly eliminates any drag, but you lose a lot of fish. — Rusty Hook Laramie, Wyoming

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That’s the gist of the question.  Why do you need it and when would you use it?  I break off enough fish using 7X.  I’m still debating the use of 8X and now they come out with 9X and … get this…. 10X!  I saw it on a web site recently. — | |

|   |  Has anyone tried 9X tippet material?  Is it really more beneficial | than 8X |  (or even 7X)?  Or is it just a ploy to get us to buy more spools? |   |   |   I use 9X leaders the following way: |   1) cut off leader at butt |   2) tie on 2X, 4X, and 6X to create taper |   3) tie on fly |   |   Research shows I break off far fewer fish on 9X tippet this way.  :) | | | What are you fishing for that you feel you need 9X tippet? | | Willi |

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I’m still debating the use of 8X and now they come out with 9X and … get this…. 10X!  I saw it on a web site recently.

I’d be curious to know the diameter of 10X or 11X. I did measure some 9x once, and it measured .0027, which is exactly .0003 less than 8x.  Hardly a significant difference. I’ll bet that 10X and 11X would measure somewhere around .0024/.0025. Using the standard X designations, 9X would measure .002, 10X .001, and 11X at a very stealthy .000. George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

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Personally I use 11x – you know, for the sporting aspect of it. Certainly eliminates any drag, but you lose a lot of fish.

Never lost one yet!  ’course, haven’t hooked any either.

Response:

Looks like you got some thin 9X.  The Classic and Custom flyshop web page has 9X and 10 X Varivas Tippet at 0.0028 and 0.0026, respectively.  The same chart rates them at 1.5 lb and 1.2 lb test.  For comparison, their 8 X is 0.003 at 1.8 lb test. —

| I’m still debating the use of 8X and | now they come out with 9X and … get this…. 10X!  I saw it on a web site | recently. | | I’d be curious to know the diameter of 10X or 11X. I did measure some 9x once, | and it measured .0027, which is exactly .0003 less than 8x.  Hardly a | significant difference. I’ll bet that 10X and 11X would measure somewhere | around .0024/.0025. Using the standard X designations, 9X would measure .002, | 10X .001, and 11X at a very stealthy .000. | | | George Adams | | "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was | worth the comin’ down." | ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

Response:

Looks like you got some thin 9X.  The Classic and Custom flyshop web page has 9X and 10 X Varivas Tippet at 0.0028 and 0.0026, respectively.  The same chart rates them at 1.5 lb and 1.2 lb test.  For comparison, their 8 X is 0.003 at 1.8 lb test.

So the spread from 8X to 10X is a whopping .0004. That’s probably outside of their normal manufacturing tolance. I have seen a lot of tippet material in the 4X/5X range that deviates from nominal by .0005. George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

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9x ! I can’t convince myself to 6x (well, maybe once in a while if I’m fooling with the 2 wt) jh

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Looks like you got some thin 9X.  The Classic and Custom flyshop web page has 9X and 10 X Varivas Tippet at 0.0028 and 0.0026, respectively.  The same chart rates them at 1.5 lb and 1.2 lb test.  For comparison, their 8 X is 0.003 at 1.8 lb test. So the spread from 8X to 10X is a whopping .0004. That’s probably outside of their normal manufacturing tolance. I have seen a lot of tippet material in the 4X/5X range that deviates from nominal by .0005. George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

Response:

What are you fishing for that you feel you need 9X tippet?

    Neon tetras. Not just any neon tetras though, he’s getting his name in the record book.

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What are you fishing for that you feel you need 9X tippet?

You’ve never heard of The 69 Club ? 6# fish on 9X tippet and when you’re done the fish is licked. Your pal, TBone

Response:

What are you fishing for that you feel you need 9X tippet?

The Great North American Smart-Assed Reply… TC, R – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Willi

Response:

     Looks like you got some thin 9X.  The Classic and Custom flyshop web page  has 9X and 10 X Varivas Tippet at 0.0028 and 0.0026, respectively. The same  chart rates them at 1.5 lb and 1.2 lb test.  For comparison, their 8 X is  0.003 at 1.8 lb test.       So the spread from 8X to 10X is a whopping .0004. That’s probably outside of   their normal manufacturing tolance. I have seen a lot of tippet material in the   4X/5X range that deviates from nominal by .0005. Sounds like a gimmick to me. All other X designations from X4 down to 8X    vary progressively by .001. Their 9X should be 8.2X and their 10X – 8.4X. Willi

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<Splork Clark (Who always prefered 68,…. "You go for it and I’ll owe you 1)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What are you fishing for that you feel you need 9X tippet? You’ve never heard of The 69 Club ? 6# fish on 9X tippet and when you’re done the fish is licked. Your pal, TBone

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Sounds like a gimmick to me. All other X designations from X4 down to 8X   vary progressively by .001. Their 9X should be 8.2X and their 10X – 8.4X.

Exactly……basically it sounds like all repackaged 8X. George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

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What are you fishing for that you feel you need 9X tippet? The Great North American Smart-Assed Reply…

A measured judgement from the master of the genre. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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aspect of it.  Only 11x? Outhere in Kansas we take the big bass on 15x tied to an old Hogan Apex 4 iron with a piece of popcorn as a indicator with a Velvetta dropper. Best Wishes -Jeff

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sporting aspect of it.  Only 11x? Outhere in Kansas we take the big bass on 15x tied to an old Hogan Apex 4 iron with a piece of popcorn as a indicator with a Velvetta dropper. Best Wishes -Jeff

We’ve invented a 20X tippet material but can’t market it.  The reason is, after we spool it up with a thousand yards worth, the customer can’t find the end of it. Is this over-engineering? George Gehrke

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I have 20 spools of 30X for sale. Due to cutbacks we have been unable to obtain suitable packaging so these spools may just "appear" to be empty 4X and 5X spools. Anyone interested in purchasing can do so by contacting me. Each spool holds 50 meters of 30X flurocarbon and they are available as a bulk lot for only $50. Make checks payable to me please. Clark

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I’m still debating the use of 8X and now they come out with 9X and … get this…. 10X!  I saw it on a web site recently. I’d be curious to know the diameter of 10X or 11X. I did measure some 9x once, and it measured .0027, which is exactly .0003 less than 8x.

Yeah, but the 8x from the same company was probably .0036.

Response:

Looks like you got some thin 9X.  The Classic and Custom flyshop web page has 9X and 10 X Varivas Tippet at 0.0028 and 0.0026, respectively.

How silly.

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sporting aspect of it.  Only 11x? Outhere in Kansas we take the big bass on 15x tied to an old Hogan Apex 4 iron with a piece of popcorn as a indicator with a Velvetta dropper. Best Wishes -Jeff

Since you’re using forged blades, I assume your line is silk.  I’m sure Hogan would approve, since "The feel of a [fish on silk line], travels up the [rod], into your hands and into your heart."

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Question:

Hello!  Has anyone hiked in Lake Superior Provincial Park, Ontario, Canada? I’ll be heading up there in June and I’m looking to spend a couple nights in the backcountry and flyfish.  I’d like to hike in, camp and fish, hike to a second location, and camp for the second night/fish.  Any route suggestions? TIA!

Response:

Haven’t been to that particular park, but anywhere in N.Ontario is bad for bugs at that time of year. Be prepared for blackflies and mosquitoes, i.e. bring bug jackets and bug dope (DEET).

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello!  Has anyone hiked in Lake Superior Provincial Park, Ontario, Canada? I’ll be heading up there in June and I’m looking to spend a couple nights in the backcountry and flyfish.  I’d like to hike in, camp and fish, hike to a second location, and camp for the second night/fish.  Any route suggestions? TIA!

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Hello!  Has anyone hiked in Lake Superior Provincial Park, Ontario, Canada? I’ll be heading up there in June and I’m looking to spend a couple nights in the backcountry and flyfish.  I’d like to hike in, camp and fish, hike to a second location, and camp for the second night/fish.  Any route suggestions? TIA!

Don’t know about fly fishing, but the Gargantua Harbour / Warp Bay area is excellent to hike and explore for several days. Orphan Lake Trail will get you down to the coast where there are several sites to pitch a tent. Peter

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Question:

Reading G’s nicely written posts about a tough caddis hatch and RW’s response (which I happen to agree with), got me thinking about a very versatile and simple tie I use alot during lower water conditions. I don’t like to change flies. I feel that, most of the time, if you present the right sized fly IN THE WAY THE FISH WANT IT, you will have more success. More success than using the "right" fly presented slightly wrong. This is a debate that has gone on as long as people have been fly fishing and I’m just stating my take on it. I’d rather use my time making changes in presentation than in changing flies. The tie is as simple as can be and is nothing special.  It is very drab to look at and, for this reason, will never be popular. Its strength is its versatility. The tie has a scraggly body of dubbing. I often use an antron mix but I’m not sure this is important. The wing consists of sparsely tied, somewhat short Elk hair. I usually use a light color because it is easier to see. No hackle is used and the head is just the thread from wrapping down the ends of the Elk hair. That’s it. In the low water conditions, when I generally use it, I mainly fish a size 18 but also use it in a 20 and a 16. The fly can be effective during a variety of hatches.  I used a size 18 successfully while I fished for about an hour this AM during a Trico spinner fall. A 20 usually works during midge hatches. The 18 covers a variety of the smaller early and late season Mays and Caddis. Fishing the fly: I usually go through the following sequence in trying to determine how to best fish the fly. Upstream drag free float with the fly on the surface Upstream drag free drift with the fly in the film Upstream "drag free" drift with the saturated fly drifting along in mid to bottom current keeping very light contact with the fly by following the fly with the rod tip and removing all slack as the fly drifts down Dry off the fly Up and across stream, rod tip kept high doing some skittering across the current. The heavier the current the more skittering.   Up and across stream, pull the fly under and retrieve the fly across the current Up and across stream, pull the fly under and do a "traditional" wet   fly drift, mending to allow the fly to sink and allowing the fly        the hang in the current at the end of the drift. Then the fly is    lifted and skittered across the surface The skittering techniques often results in missed strikes or refusals. However, it tells you where a feeding fish is and you can usually take it with one of the other type of drifts.   The above routine works best for actively feeding fish. In water from inches to about three foot deep (depending on current speed), the water can be covered from top to bottom with no terminal tackle changes. Willi

Response:

Dry off the fly

What do you do here – blow on it, use some drying pad, shake it in dessicant….? Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

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Dry off the fly What do you do here – blow on it, use some drying pad, shake it in dessicant….?

Whatever.  I usually just use my shirt. Willi

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Jeffnc I usually false cast it two or three times, then blow on it and shake it in desiccant powder and re coat it with floatant.  If that doesn’t work I replace it. Ernie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dry off the fly What do you do here – blow on it, use some drying pad, shake it in dessicant….? Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

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I printed this post and will study it.  I’ve always read willi’s posts, but now that i have fished with the guy….  i’ll memorize them. That post really can help speed up the learning curve.  Great Stuff Willi. The western clavesters don’t call him the Troutmaster for nothing, and he’s a very modest and super friendly person to boot. Hmmmm…. changing presentations.  I was the guy in montana constantly changing flies and lead, now i’ll deliberately try different presentations beforehand. bruiser Before you buy.

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Willi: I am trying to visualize this fly. Is it like an elk-hair caddis, with the wing tied trude style, no hackle?? Tim Lysyk – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – its versatility. The tie has a scraggly body of dubbing. I often use an antron mix but I’m not sure this is important. The wing consists of sparsely tied, somewhat short Elk hair. I usually use a light color because it is easier to see. No hackle is used and the head is just the

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Question:

As the proud single parent of the Virtual Flybox I was so excited to learn that the very successful, publically traded corporation, About.Com thought highly enough of my humble web offering to write a feature article touting it’s accomplishments. If you have a spare minute or two please visit…  http://flyfishing.about.com/sports/fishhunt/flyfishing/mcurrent.htm …and ponder the praises…and you of course are always welcome to stop by the VFB. Thanks everyone…it wouldn’t have happened without you! keep tyin’…byard * * * * * * * * *   V I R T U A L    F L Y B O X    * * * * * * * * *    Fly Tyers Worldwide * Hundreds of Patterns * Tying Instructions                     http://www.VirtualFlybox.com * * * *   F E A T U R I N G   *  9 6 2  *   P A T T E R N S   * * * *

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Congratulations on your recent mention in About.com   I took a look at your link, are you on your way to commercial success? Making a web site is tough, even more so when you do it for fun… Have a great day!

Hi Adam… Thanks for the visit and the congrats! The Virtual Flybox was never or will ever be a commercial project. It was never my intent to profit from this venture. On the other hand, due to the mega-hours involved with the production of this website, some form of compensation had to be considered. So the institution of an advertising program was necessary as well as an appeal for financial support from the viewership. In the last year the VFB has served up over 1 million pages of information to flyfisherman worldwide. The hours involved in keeping abreast with this demand exceed 50 per week. My need for nutrition is the same as anyone elses…hence, what you may consider commercialism. BTW…you are doing a wonderful job with your Small Streams site…it has always been one of my favorites. keep tyin’…byard * * * * * * * * *   V I R T U A L    F L Y B O X    * * * * * * * * *    Fly Tyers Worldwide * Hundreds of Patterns * Tying Instructions                     http://www.VirtualFlybox.com * * * *   F E A T U R I N G   *  9 8 0  *   P A T T E R N S   * * * *

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Question:

Hi gang,   I’m fishing this area while on vacation next week. I’d be glad to hear any advice from people who know the area. I’m looking to catch trout, not planning to keep any, and hope to get some photos of some nice ones. Jerry

Response:

Check out the thread "Michigan Flyfishing Spots For Vacation" George Adams

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Try http://www.troutbums.com/.

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Question:

I`m going for a week to Nahville Tenn. and Want to Know of any Flyfishing for central Tenn. L.J.`s Eastrn web site is great but its 3 hours from where I will be based.  Any help would be welcome…Tight Lines…Trouter1

Response:

I`m going for a week to Nahville Tenn. and Want to Know of any Flyfishing for central Tenn. L.J.`s Eastrn web site is great but its 3 hours from where I will be based.  Any help would be welcome…Tight Lines…Trouter1

Wasn’t last years TU annual meeting in Nashville?  I think there are some great tailwater opportunities in the area… — Chris Schmelzer, NREMT-P Duluth, Minnesota

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Question:

This is probably more information than most people would like to see, but its part of what I do for a living, and I’ve waded thru the physics of braided leaders, so here goes Current regulations regarding Country of Origin require all imported items to be marked with the country of origin.  This means that at it basic form, an article, described in the terms of the Harmonised Tariff Code Nomenclature, must delclare the country in which it first meets that definition as its origin. In order to change the origin must undergo "substantial transformation" which results in a new article with a new HTN classification.   For example, Steel exported from Canada to Taiwan is Canadian; ball bearings made from that steel are Taiwanese, and when shipped to England and used in the manufacture of a Hardy fly reel, they become part of the reel and now are a product of the UK.   Apparel and textile rules are different, and somewhat more complex.  The percentage of content rules generally apply to Lesser Developed Countries (LDC’s) in which a transformation is deeemed to have taken place if 35% of the value was added in the LDC. NAFTA for Canada and Mexico, rules are slighly different, but generally   the "substantial transformation" principle applies. and as always there are exceptions. jg

Response:

Current regulations regarding Country of Origin require all imported items to be marked with the country of origin.  This means that at it basic form, an article, described in the terms of the Harmonised Tariff Code Nomenclature, must delclare the country in which it first meets that definition as its origin.

Hi J.J. It’s kind of like tying a woolly bugger on a Japanese hook, using Italian thread, American chenille and Chinese hackle/marabou. Thanks for the information. I sure didn’t think the post was too long. — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (97 materials catalog) http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

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Question:

No man can lose what he never had.           Chap. v. The Compleate Angler – Izaak Walton. 1593-1683. I guess that’s why its called fishing and not catching Tight lines Julian

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Bad news….16 inches isn’t a monster.  It’s a nice fish, but not worth  crying over.  Hope this makes you feel better.

I beg to differ…it was probably a speck (brook trout), in which case 16 inches is DEFINITELY worth crying over. The biggest brookie I’ve caught so far was only 10 inches. "Oh, once in a while you’ll tie into a big one, say seven or eight inches long, but you’ll need to use live bait and Ford Fenders for one of those." – Jeff Ohman, Fear of Fly fishing. My condolences, Pierre…but look on the bright side…you saw it, you felt it. You may run into it again, in which case say hello from me. — K.G. (Kat) Cruickshank – fish enthusiast – Toronto, Ontario, Canada see my illustrations at http://www.mackerel.com/fish/home.html

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16" may be a big brookie on some small stream, but on large lakes and rivers in northern Ontario, and especially Quebec, a 16" brookie doesn’t even entitle you to braggin rights.  IMHO.  Tight lines.  

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Yesterday, I was fishing near my home in Quebec with my girlfriend’s father I was using a little green Muddler. After I had caught 10 trouts, some have 11 inches long, I saw this MONSTER at the end of my line. It was at least 16 inches. But I just can’t bring it on the ground I had no net and I lost it. Since yesterday I can’t stop tinking about this fish. Help me

Congratulate yourself on effecting a humane and brilliantly executed long distance release, tie another muddler and get on with your life.

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Yesterday, I was fishing near my home in Quebec with my girlfriend’s father I was using a little green Muddler. After I had caught 10 trouts, some have 11 inches long, I saw this MONSTER at the end of my line. It was at least 16 inches. But I just can’t bring it on the ground I had no net and I lost it. Since yesterday I can’t stop tinking about this fish. Help me

it was the spirits of 10 fishies haunting you.   you must cleanse yourself by UPS’ing me all of your fishing stuff. it is the only way. TimW

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Yesterday, I was fishing near my home in Quebec with my girlfriend’s father I was using a little green Muddler. After I had caught 10 trouts, some have 11 inches long, I saw this MONSTER at the end of my line. It was at least 16 inches. But I just can’t bring it on the ground I had no net and I lost it. Since yesterday I can’t stop tinking about this fish. Help me

Pierre,  Congratulations!! You haven’t "lost" your monster trout, you have successfully completed one of the most difficult type of humane releases a Catch and Release Fly Fisher can accomplish — The Long Distance – No Hands Release. What you experienced is not a failure but a magnificent success. Non, mon ami you don’t need therapy —  YOU NEED A NET!!!!!! jg

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You need more than a net.  You need to re-define "big" trout. A big trout is 5 lbs or better IMHO. 16" trout are a dime a dozen.  Great fighters at that size, though.

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Bad news….16 inches isn’t a monster.  It’s a nice fish, but not worth crying over.  Hope this makes you feel better.

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IMHO, the size of a "great" trout depends on the river or watershed and your experience catching and releasing that fish.  In a number of fisheries a 16" fish may represent the best that that ecosystem is capable of producing and sustaining. Dave Donahue

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Since yesterday I can’t stop tinking about this fish. Help me

Pierre, this is a malady that effects us all.  The demons of the deep (sometimes shallow) will continue to haunt us all for as long as we fish and then some.  I myself have a similiar re-occuring nightmare where I lost a 28in, 6-6 1/2 lb brown on a size 22 nymph when the knot came loose.  I have dreamed about that fish at least once a month for the last two years.  But a wise man once said, "It is better to have fished and lost than never to have fished before!"  Keep on trying and remember "Love ‘em and Leave ‘em."

Response:

Yesterday, I was fishing near my home in Quebec with my girlfriend’s father I was using a little green Muddler. After I had caught 10 trouts, some have 11 inches long, I saw this MONSTER at the end of my line. It was at least 16 inches. But I just can’t bring it on the ground I had no net and I lost it. Since yesterday I can’t stop tinking about this fish. Help me

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Question:

Why not deal with a local fly shop. That way you get personal service and help the local economy. You never know what the loss of a local shop means until you lose one that has been undercut on prices by one of the large mail order chains. I dont own a shop but our area recently lost one and now every one realises what we had but have now lost. Jack

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This is gonna sound like a minor problem, given everything else we have to deal with. But ya know how a little something, if left to it’s own accord, tends to grow and gnaw at you, just bugging the crap out of you until you have to bitch to somebody. Last year around this time, I called L.L. Bean’s 800 number and asked for their fly fishing catalog. They said they would send it when it was done. Couple months later, nothing, so I called again. "Oh sure, send it right out." Few more months…nothing. So I filled out a form from a magazine. Nothing. Month later, sent my own postcard requesting the catalog. Month or so, nothing. Called again. "Gee, don’t know what the problem is. We’ll get one right out to you." Needless to say it’s one year on, and I’ve received every stinking catalog those people put out except for the one I want. At this point I’m disinclined to buy from them, I just want the catalog to chalk up a moral victory, and add it to my growing collection. Have I done something wrong? Am I not the L.L. Bean type and they know it? Have they checked my credit rating before sending the catalog? Has anyone else had this problem? Does anyone know anybody at L.L. Bean with some weight? Thanks for letting me waste bandwidth. I do feel much better Roger Backlar

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Question:

I am in need of some fly-fishing spots.  I live in the Chicago area . . .

I, too, live near Chicago and have been looking for places to go that are nearby.  So far as I can tell, there’s not one bloody trout stream anywhere in the state.  The good news is that just a short hop away, in SW Wisconsin (I’m told) there are some fairly decent trout streams, some of which are designated no-kill streams.  I’ve also heard of various streams in Michigan that might be decent, but don’t know any specifics. I got this information from the Trout & Grouse store, which is located in Northfield (right off the Edens expressway).  I took a fly-fishing course there just recently (I’m just beginning), and they apparently have guides that know these WI and MI streams really well.  Sorry, I don’t have their phone or address handy, though I’m sure they’re in the directory if you want to give them a call. Hope this helps.  Keith — Keith Ludwig, Odesta Systems Corporation,

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Being a displaced Coloradoan here in the land of Lincoln, I am in need of some fly-fishing spots.  I live in the Chicago area . . . does anyone have any suggestions or secret spots they might care to divulge.  I will throw a fly at anything but catfish or carp Thanks, Kevin

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