Question:

If grasshoppers had machine-guns, the birds wouldn’t fuck with them and neither would I for that matter.  <BSEG — Opie  –Planning for the Past–

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If grasshoppers are bopping about then, you can’t beat them.

Response:

I spend the summer there.  If you want to float with a guide, I would suggest the Yellowstone.  It seems the guides will be favoring either the Yellowstone or the Upper Madison, both about a 60 minute ride from Bozeman.  To wade/walk the Gallatin is just outside of Bozeman and flows south to north from Yellowstone National Park.  The other poster is right you’ve got many miles of water (go south, though, not north).  The lower Madison is too warm that time of year to spend time with if you’ve just a few days (it can produce early in the day).  July is caddis time.  The key for next summer will be water flows since the snowpack is only 50% of normal.  If you have time go to West Yellowstone (60 miles south), hire a guide and fish the Park.  The two biggest fly shops in town have websites, The Rivers Edge and Montana Troutfitters. Good Luck

Response:

I have a friend who lives in Livingston, 26 miles east of Bozeman. You have good access to the Madison, Gallatin, and Yellowstone rivers. The Madison is absolutely beautiful, the Gallatin is nice, but the Yellowstone has been the most consistent producer of nice fish for both of us. South of Livinston is Daily Lake, which has nice fish. If grasshoppers are bopping about then, you can’t beat them. In article – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Heading to Bozeman this summer in July.  Can anybody offer suggestions on streams/rivers to check while I am there and what to expect while I am doing it?  Anything would be appreciated.  A bit of a break from what I normally do is always welcome and I am really looking forward to it. Thanks.

Response:

Heading to Bozeman this summer in July.  Can anybody offer suggestions on streams/rivers to check while I am there and what to expect while I am doing it?  Anything would be appreciated.  A bit of a break from what I normally do is always welcome and I am really looking forward to it. Thanks. — Capt Gordon Churchill http://www.flyfish-nc.com Guided flyfishing on the Roanoke River and the Crystal Coast of NC out of Atlantic Beach/Morhead City/Beaufort.

Response:

Heading to Bozeman this summer in July.  Can anybody offer suggestions on streams/rivers to check while I am there and what to expect while I am doing it?  Anything would be appreciated.  A bit of a break from what I normally do is always welcome and I am really looking forward to it. Thanks. — Capt Gordon Churchill http://www.flyfish-nc.com Guided flyfishing on the Roanoke River and the Crystal Coast of NC out of Atlantic Beach/Morhead City/Beaufort.

Head north man and you have the Gallitin for 50 miles or more. Joel Axelrad

Response:

Question:

Here is a sight that claims to list the "Deadly Dozen" http://www.islandroots.com/finecast/products.htm I posted the same q a while back and told all I was going to take a poll. Let me have a day to dig up those results. Jamie http://clik.to/flyfish – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What are your favorite flies for fly fishing brookies?  I’ve had quite a bit of luck at times with muddler minows and a few other flies, but I’m really not an expert fly fisherman. What works best for you?  Which flies, and what type of presentation? — Richard Jackson Before you buy.

Response:

I always try to match the hatch. Watch what is in the air over the water or kneel down and grab some rocks to see what is there. Presentation: if you are trying to duplicate what is in the air use dry flies, in the water use wet flies – latter category almost always nymphs. WLM – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What are your favorite flies for fly fishing brookies?  I’ve had quite a bit of luck at times with muddler minows and a few other flies, but I’m really not an expert fly fisherman. What works best for you?  Which flies, and what type of presentation? — Richard Jackson Before you buy.

Response:

What are your favorite flies for fly fishing brookies?  I’ve had quite a bit of luck at times with muddler minows and a few other flies, but I’m really not an expert fly fisherman. What works best for you?  Which flies, and what type of presentation? — Richard Jackson Before you buy.

Response:

What are your favorite flies for fly fishing brookies?  I’ve had quite a bit of luck at times with muddler minows and a few other flies, but I’m really not an expert fly fisherman. What works best for you?  Which flies, and what type of presentation?

I try to "match the hatch" whenever possible.  If I am fishing for dinner, I will open up the first one that I catch and see what it has been feeding on.  I usually start out with a stonefly or a Royal Coachman.  As you probably know, Brookies can be extremely frustrating to catch at times.  If you get one to follow or even take a swipe at your bait/fly/lure and he doesn’t take it, leave him alone and come back later and try again.  If a brookie has found a nice spot in the stream, he may stay within a few yards of that spot for months. — "Our eyes and hands and feet will give us the same assistance in doing mischief as in doing good; but it would not therefore be better for the world, that all mankind were blind and lame.  Arms are not to be laid aside by honest men, because carried by assassins and ruffians; they are to be used the rather for this very reason." -George Campbell (1719-1796)

Response:

Question:

I want information about flyfishing on the seychelles.

Response:

Three of us have booked a trip to the Seychelles next March through Indian Ocean Angling Adventures.  We need 2 or 3 more to join us or we will have to cancel as its too much $$ for three.  If you might be interested e-mail me at different groups who have gone there and they all said the same thing …way better than XMAS Island. Steve

Response:

I want information about flyfishing on the seychelles.

You can get all the info you want from us – Anna and martin lewis.  Fax us on (248) 344266 or We discovered and developed flyfishing in the seychelles – been in the business now for 10 years. Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

I want information about flyfishing on the seychelles. Dear Lasse,

We have been running a fishing operation in the Seychelles for 10 years.  For the past two years we have concentrated on saltwater flyfishing specifically for bone fish and trevally. We have been very successful over the past two years and now have four world records pending ratification. If you wish to visit our website – it will soon be changed – you will gain an idea of what we do.  Go to altavista and type in seychelles + flyfishing.  Tam Tam should come up. Look forward to hearing from you. Regards Martin and Anna Lewis Tam Tam Tel +248 344266 Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

Question:

Thank you Azure. I hope you are well, spike – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Noen; You are welcome. A) I’m scared of Alan. B) He is nice to the new ppl like you. C) He is nice to the ca girls. D) Or It’s because he has been here about 3 years longer that you. I have seen extraordinary acts of kindness from him, and has earned certain rights, that as a boundary i don’t allow all ppl to have. In short he is pretty fly for a white guy. He has that punk ethos happening, i respect that. With love, spike But really the number one reason, is the way he flames ppl that ask stupid questions or when a new person thinks they have things all figured out, and they get a post from Alan. (uproarious giggles) Spike, you have a hilarious way of hitting the nail right on the head. azure drop ‘trou’ to reply — For more information about this posting service, contact: If you want an anonymous account, visit our sign-up page: http://asarian-host.org/emailform.html

Response:

Hi Colin; Yikes beats me. Maybe your news reader doesn’t like doing it. For some reason, it doesn’t work with the new icq proper either. Try it with a word app, like notepad, if it does, it’s that agent warez, you are using. It’s the right-hand number pad you are using right? I’m good, thank you, it’s nice you are back. How is life? You are building now? Roofing and framing? Hey if you need a garage door(s) i’ll tell you how it get it very cheap, and if the fishing is as good as i hear, in that area, i’ll hang it for free. Are your finger nails that pretty purple color, framers always have? Take care and use a level and square, spike – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – 0233=

Question:

As long as he doesn’t lie under oath I’ll vote for him.  :-)< How about if he *lays* under oath?

If he wants to do something with potato chips, that’s OK too.  :-) — Bob Jarvis Mail address hacked to foil spammers!

Response:

As long as he doesn’t lie under

oath I’ll vote for him.  :-)< How about if he *lays* under oath?

Response:

Sounds like we need to get the independent council to take a look at

this… Hey, what this guy does on his own time is OK by me. He  can commit unusual acts with a salmon on his tying bench for all I care – not my business, don’t want to know.  He can rent out the upstairs bedroom if he likes, it’s OK by me.  As long as he doesn’t lie under oath I’ll vote for him.  :-) — Bob Jarvis Mail address hacked to foil spammers!

Response:

Sounds like we need to get the independent council to take a look at this…< Why?  Is sex involved?

Well, I guess it is.  Judging from the original post, somebody got it where the sun don’t shine. Peter

Response:

: Sounds like we need to get the independent council to take a look at this…< : Why?  Is sex involved? It will be, if the Independent Counsel gets involved. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – He took our deposit $$$. and never showed. He refuses to send a refund Let everyone know Tell him and them where you heard it. Olympic Peninsula scum Bob " the pig" Pigott Ph      360 327 3554          208344 Highway 101          Port Angeles Wa 98363

Hi Fred, I think I would let it go because you are giving Bob too much attention. I heard his was already so busy that he couldn’t really handle much more exposures, good or bad. I guess we all make mistakes. Bob made his and now you are making yours. I was mean to someone on this news group and after thinking about it, I apologized to everyone for being so nasty. Don’t let this ruin the sport for you. I think if you made up to Bob he would give you your money back? Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY www.kiene.com

Response:

When I was living in Idaho, I fished with a guy that guided out of Forks for about 15 years.  He knew Bob and recommended him to me as a source of information prior to my trip to the peninsula last year.  From everything that my friend told me, Mr. Pigot is an extremely knowledgeable and ethical guide.  I would be very interested to hear his perspective, because I know from my own guiding experiences that often miscommunication and differences in expectations can cause severe problems between parties.  I know that Bob has an e-mail address but I have misplaced it–but I have sent a couple messages to other guides in the area and the chamber of commerce in Forks to see if he could join in this discussion. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Good idea Paul, if he doesn’t have a computer you could post the message for him. —

Response:

Sounds like we need to get the independent council to take a look at this… — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "Guilt replaced the creel…"

Response:

Sounds like we need to get the independent council to take a look at this… — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "Guilt replaced the creel…"

I hear he’s fresh out of a job and looking for opportunities! Ralph H

Response:

Sounds like we need to get the independent council to take a look at this…<

Why?  Is sex involved?

Response:

Hello All, I am from Port Angeles, and I know Mr. Pigott and his family.  I have fished with him multiple times and found him to be quite helpful and very professional.  I would be interested in hearing Mr. Pigotts side of the story. Paul J.

        aha! the game is afoot!  it just might be that the evil pigott has a position of his own, which differs from the angry fred.  all of which goes to show that there are two sides to every story.  and when you choose to make your position public, you should be prepared to have your adversary do the same.         a. wayne harrison – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : : In January,  this year I sent a deposit of $280 to Bob Pigott for two : days fishing on Tues Aug 25  and Wed Aug 26. [...an story oft-repeated...] 1 complaint post    == a service to the community 2 complaint posts   == you want to make sure no one missed the first. ok. 3-4 complaint posts == you are not dealing with your anger 5+ complaint posts  == I hope you don’t own a gun Seriously Fred, you have got to let this go. Anger only destroys you and your life, it does nothing positive. So Bob took $280 from you. That’s nothing in the scheme of things. He’s got to deal with his own conscience. Report it to the BBB and the Chamber of Commerce, and to ROFF, but then move on…dwelling on it only hurts you. Go out fishing, look at the beauty of nature around you, and say, "Man, I am blessed to be healthy and able to come out here and enjoy nature, to walk the stream, to see the beauty around me, to hear the beauty, even to smell it. Life is great!" Take care, JonCook.

Here here Jon!!!!   LET IT GO MAN LET …. IT …. GO!!!! — #  D. Stew McLeod … working at The Boeing Company .. in Renton, WA. #"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; # an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." #    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

Response:

Good idea Paul, if he doesn’t have a computer you could post the message for him. — Ernie Harrison Remove NOSPAM to send E-Mail Selling my Fly Fishing Books Go to: http://users.ccnet.com/~emh – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello All, I am from Port Angeles, and I know Mr. Pigott and his family.  I have fished with him multiple times and found him to be quite helpful and very professional.  I would be interested in hearing Mr. Pigotts side of the story. Paul J.

Response:

They will not let me post my story All their readers should know about a crooked guide Monday, September 21, 1998…

Fred I think most of us wouldn’t want to be treated as you report. No matter what you may have said to this person I don’t think they have a right to keep your money, particularly if you have proof you notified him of the change in dates. Unfortunately you are not the only person this happens to. The VFS likley can’t publish the stories of everyone who suffers the same treatment. They probably have legal problems with it as well, they could be liable for any factual errors they publish – such statements are very damaging to someones reputation. That’s not their Business (dollar wise) You should contact whatever boards and associations in Washington State who would be interested; does the state licence it’s guides –  report his to them. Report it to any guide associations – particurly if this particular guide is a member – perhaps they will arbitrate a settlement. Contact the local Better Business Bureau and Chamber of Commerce. Ask for their help and follow up. Find out what they’ve done with your complaint. However you won’t solve the problem by continually venting it here. It’s time to move on. Ralph H

Response:

Fred, I am sympathetic to your story but I am beginning to mumble the name Bob Pigott in my sleep.  Your frequent posting to this group with the same story is getting old.  Turn the guy into the state guides association, sue him or find a new hobby! <grin  Better yet, go fishing and forget the bastard!

Response:

I too am tired of your spam.  try doing one posting every 3 months, and makeing it more exciting. Schuhfly

Response:

Hello All, I am from Port Angeles, and I know Mr. Pigott and his family.  I have fished with him multiple times and found him to be quite helpful and very professional.  I would be interested in hearing Mr. Pigotts side of the story. Paul J.

Response:

They will not let me post my story All their readers should know about a crooked guide Monday, September 21, 1998 In January,  this year I sent a deposit of $280 to Bob Pigott for two days fishing on Tues Aug 25  and Wed Aug 26. A month later I called and changed the dates to Sun Aug 30 and Mon 31 I remember that I wanted to change to Sun 8/30 and Tues 9/1 but he wanted two days straight and steered me back to Sun 8/30 and MON 8/31 I remember clearly because I was a little disappointed in that I wanted a day in between  to expore w my friend – both the town (I am looking at a major move in my life -relocating my family west)  and the fishing. However I did not push the issue and we left it at 8/30 and 8/31. When we agreed to these dates and I hung up I had a feeling – you know-  when someone is rushed or partially blowing you off, or partially listening. So – I reconfirmed twice more. One week before the trip my friend from Canada called, reconfirmed and was told to call when we arrived in town. I’m a pretty thorough person. I arranged the whole trip w airlines, rental cars, my friend, 2 real estate brokers in P.A.and Port Townsend. It all revolved around a trade show that I had in Vancouver on 8/29. Each day was set. My friend flew in from Ontario and we drove down from Vancouver on 8/29. I called Bob Pigott 5 or 6 times from my cellular phone and 3 or 4 more times fron the Doubletree hoitel in PA. No return calls. I could not believe it. I had used guides with advance deposits before. I called numerous times on Sunday 8/30. When I finally got his wife at 4AM on 8/31 she told me that she would send a check to me. She told me that she had me down for Tues and Wed. Which showsd me that this simpleton never paid attention when I initially made the changes and confirmed the changes. I will not pay for his stupidity. I must admit that after 10 calls my messages were pretty enraged and outraged , although I mean all of what I said. Two weeks later on 9/15 I called and got Mr Pigott. His words to me were "no check". – and that I owed him an apology for my messages. If I had gotten my $280 back I probably would have chalked it up to a bad experience with an idiot and put my energy elsewhere – I have many other more important venues – family (infant grandaughter, my guitar,or maybe even business) So: This is my best recourse Is it worth it to me to go to small claims court? I should sue the bastard for airfare for 2, hotels etc I may. But I want the world to know that there is slime in this business. I would like to put this pig out of business. I want everyone to know Pigott gives guides a black eye I have used guides many times but from now on I will think twice. I think i may even quit using guides. I will certainly never send $$ in advance again. He took our deposit $$$. and never showed. He refuses to send a refund Let everyone know Tell him and them where you heard it. Olympic Peninsula scum Bob " the pig" Pigott Ph      360 327 3554           208344 Highway 101           Port Angeles Wa 98363 Fred Lebow http://www.flebow.com http://www.bluesbank.org — Fred Lebow http://www.flebow.com

Response:

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve read about a trouts field of view and its ability to sense vibration/disturbance through its lateral line. Does anyone know how well a trout can distinguish one object from another? Where I fish there are a lot of boulders and laurel. If I’m wearing subdued clothing and not splashing around, can a trout pick me out from the surrounding terrain? Find a copy of "In the Ring of the Rise" (Vincent Marinaro). More than you’ll ever want to know about trout vision… Cheers! /dave

Hi Dave I sure agree, V.Marinaro explains things very well. I especially remember him explaining about "one" hackle fiber on a pattern making the difference on catching or not catching fish. As I remember the hackle fiber was misplaced and extended over the eye of the hook or some-such. Good tying &… — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

Response:

I’ve read about a trouts field of view and its ability to sense vibration/disturbance through its lateral line. Does anyone know how well a trout can distinguish one object from another? Where I fish there are a lot of boulders and laurel. If I’m wearing subdued clothing and not splashing around, can a trout pick me out from the surrounding terrain?

Find a copy of "In the Ring of the Rise" (Vincent Marinaro). More than you’ll ever want to know about trout vision… Cheers! /dave <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< < Digital Equipment Corp.       Alpha Server Engineering < < Parker Street Campus            Maynard, Massachusetts   < <        Charter Member of "Curmudgeons Unlimited"       < <<<<<<<<<<<< AMA 548313 <<<<<<<<<<<< Disclaimer: Opinion and content is mine alone, and unlikely             to be shared by my employer, etc…

Response:

I am of the belief that if I can see a fish, the actual fish spots ‘n all, not shadows or riseforms, then they can definately see me. The problem then becomes one of threatening behaviour ie moving

I think you’ve got it about right there, Steve. Andrew

Response:

How well can trout REALLY see?

Too damn well! -AR

Response:

How well can trout REALLY see? Too damn well! -AR

After 15+ years of testing how well wild brown trout see…here are some basic conclusions IMHO: 1) they react to objects no farther than 45 feet left, right, and front in ideal visibility conditions 2) they react to objects (birds) as high as 80 ft. overhead in ideal visibility conditions 3) their optimum eyesight is about 8X that of a human’s from 4 ft. to 1 inch. BobE.

Response:

92 degree window of vision….the deeper they are, the bigger this window gets. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How well can trout REALLY see? Too damn well! -AR

Response:

I’ll tell you what…I’m planning on taking a dark brown magic marker to those damned white letters on the waders I got for christmas. TimW

Response:

Re: How well can trout REALLY see? How well can trout REALLY see? Too damn well! -AR

After 15+ years of testing how well wild brown trout see…here are some basic conclusions IMHO: 1) they react to objects no farther than 45 feet left, right, and front in ideal visibility conditions 2) they react to objects (birds) as high as 80 ft. overhead in ideal visibility conditions 3) their optimum eyesight is about 8X that of a human’s from 4 ft. to 1 inch. BobE. <<<<<<<< How do you define "8X that of a humans?".  What experiments did you actually perform?  Have you published in a peer review journal? William Buchman

Response:

TimW — Ha! Ha! Just stay downstream…no need to worry. Seriously, I’d like to apologise to those who read my previous post about 8x vision…while I truly believe that *wild* browns (at least in my home waters) have this effective vision, the techniques I used to "prove" this to myself are not based on the kind of scientific procedure that I’d be willing to defend in public. I have done many of my own tests over the last 15 years to satisfy myself that the 8x figure is the accurate *effective* vision of a wild brown in certain (if not, most) feeding conditions…the theory has served me well, because using this principle my catch rate dramatically improved when I was actively fishing browns from 1982-1990, especially in spring creek and clear water habitates. It’s a long and complicated story that many flyfishers more knowledgeable than me (especially Dr. Bachman, TimW, Mr. Zink, Al Beatty, and a whole bunch more) could shoot a lot of holes thru. (Even I can shoot holes thru it.) When all is said and done, I don’t know for certain what and how well brown trout see. I just use the 8x as a rule of thumb to gage the quality of all brown trout flies I tie. Simply stated, I believe that if all tyers considered the 8x as a standard measurement to gage the quality of their flies they would catch a lot more trout …but only Seth Green knows this for sure. And, all of us have stories about the biggest trout we ever caught hitting a ragged and torn fly that looked terrible. From now on, I’ll be a little more cautious about spewing me theories. Thanks for your understanding. BobE. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ll tell you what…I’m planning on taking a dark brown magic marker to those damned white letters on the waders I got for christmas. TimW

Response:

I’ll tell you what…I’m planning on taking a dark brown magic marker to those damned white letters on the waders I got for christmas. TimW

No Tim,  Those white letters are called Christmas cards.  All you need do is unstick them from your waders. If you have any further problems I am sure that there is a club nearby who hold beginners evenings and would be willing to help. Cheers Bruce….<g

Response:

How well can trout REALLY see?

Really well, but not nearly as acutely as human’s.  There is evidence that trout see farther into the ultraviolet and infrared at least while fingerlings and again during spawning.  If Ralph Cutter happens to read this, he could probably give you the specifics of the color spectrum studies.  No one can really tell you exactly what they see though, because no one has ever come back from being a fish – at least not with any memory of it.   However, based on the biological make-up of their eyes  we have some good guesses.   On the human eye, the fovea (sp?)  is a small indentation "" on the back of the retina that is covered with cone cells (color receptors).  They are in a very high concentration in this spot with very few rod cells (black and white or low-light receptors) in evidence.  The lens of the human eye focuses light on this fovea and that’s what gives us the visual acuity (sharp & clear vision) we enjoy – at least for a while.  In low light the rod cells expand allowing us to see in black & white.  Because there are few rod cells in the fovea,  you will often see an object more clearly in low light if you look slightly off to the side of it.  This puts more light on the surrounding rod cells and allows you to see the target better even if it is with your peripheral vision. Trout’s eyes have both rod cells and cone cells on the retina of their eye.  During normal light conditions the cone cells are expanded – during low light, the cone cells recede and the rod cells expand allowing them to see by starlight.  The retina does not however have a fovea, nor does the lens of the eye focus the light on any one small spot on the retina.  Best guess is that although trout can see color all around and can judge distances well within a 30 degree cone in front of them (binocular vision) everything is still blurry even from 2" away.  Acuity is somewhat lacking. This is perhaps one of the reasons why they take a fly that has an otherwise obvious hook hanging from it.  Also helps explain why impressionist or imitative flies usually work much better than "realistic flies" which may match the natural perfectly.                                  Hope this helps,                                             Dan Dan Gracia Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools

Response:

, I know that I’ve seen trout streak 8-10 feet, from deep down, to take a small dry fly in moving water.  I’ve also seen one rise to a cigarette butt.  And I’ve scattered them from just far enough away for a good cast.  Suffice to say, that a trout’s vision in water is analogous to your vision in air–they’ve adapted to survive and flourish, as have we (assuming I’m a human and not a fish).  I can’t tell you if trout have 20/20 vision, what we think they see is just the best guess, only the trout know for sure.  I don’t pay much attention to what I wear under my vest, but I am careful about moving slowly and casting shadows. Anglerboy

And don’t forget they can see behind underwater objects like rocks and tree branches by using the reflective mirror of the surface film outside the ‘window’, where they see through the surface. Avoid heavy footfalls on the river bank or when wading as their lateral line vibration sense is acute. I think that may be how seatrout (anadromous browns) can detect my size 14 black pennel on a pitch black night…. Pete Marrow   work:  http://www.gsrg.nmh.ac.uk/   play:  http://www.gorp.com/gorp/activity/scottish_ff_faq.htm

Response:

There have been a number of recent posts presuming to know how well trout see.  My guess is that they are all WRONG!  Who can tell us about *experiments* that increase the liklihood of any of these assertions to be true. There are optical effects produced by a small flies that may attract trout even if they cannot see the fly clearly.  Certainly, even small dry flies dimple the surface of water causing light to refract in strange ways and cast fairly large shadows.  Glints off of peacock and various reflective materials may also attract attention.  A selective fish does not have to see the fly clearly.  It can wait until it gets close before making an eat or flee response. I make no assertions about how trout see or process information. William Buchman

Response:

Well put – no one really knows (and hence the vendors can sell us anything…). However, I DO know that a golf ball has eyes and a brain.  Having tried to play golf I do know that balls that I find in the woods while looking for my ball soon will return there.  It would seem that these "wild" balls differ in their genetic makeup from the store-bought put-n-putt cousins… but I digress….. — Tim Wohlford, DO NOT SEND JUNK E-MAIL: "By US Code Title 47, Sec.227(a)(2)(B), a computer/modem/printer meets the definition of a telephone fax machine.  By Sec.227(b)(1)(C), it is unlawful to send any unsolicited advertisement to such equipment.  By Sec.227(b)(3)(C), a violation of the aforementioned Section is punishable by action to recover actual monetary loss, or $500, whichever is greater, for each violation." – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There have been a number of recent posts presuming to know how well trout see.  My guess is that they are all WRONG!  Who can tell us about *experiments* that increase the liklihood of any of these assertions to be true. There are optical effects produced by a small flies that may attract trout even if they cannot see the fly clearly.  Certainly, even small dry flies dimple the surface of water causing light to refract in strange ways and cast fairly large shadows.  Glints off of peacock and various reflective materials may also attract attention.  A selective fish does not have to see the fly clearly.  It can wait until it gets close before making an eat or flee response. I make no assertions about how trout see or process information. William Buchman

Response:

I’ve read about a trouts field of view and its ability to sense vibration/disturbance through its lateral line. Does anyone know how well a trout can distinguish one object from another? Where I fish there are a lot of boulders and laurel. If I’m wearing subdued clothing and not splashing around, can a trout pick me out from the surrounding terrain?

Though clothing is definetely a big consideration, I wouldn’t worry too much. You see, apparently even today’s most advanced trout can’t see well enough to detect the bend, point and barb of a hook. It’s amazing how these cunning, fabled creatures we pursue -which can supposedly detect the most microscopic details in color and size of the insects they are feeding on- somehow, time and time again, fail to notice the large, metallic-brown, bent, nasty-looking organ that is protruding from the crotch of every artificial fly that has ever been created. Fly fishing or lock-picking… Spinolio

Response:

: I’ve read about a trouts field of view and its ability to sense : vibration/disturbance through its lateral line. Does anyone know how : well a trout can distinguish one object from another? Where I fish there : are a lot of boulders and laurel. If I’m wearing subdued clothing and : not splashing around, can a trout pick me out from the surrounding : terrain? : : Thanks in advance. Yes, no and maybe All the following occurred in bright sunny conditions about mid-day: Anecodote 1: at least 40 feet downstream of a fish tailing in 12" water … waved a fly away from my face, bow wave … one annoyed fish. Anecdote 2: next to, standing, a fish picking tasty morsels off a submerged log for 5 minutes.  Approached from downstream *verrrry* slowly with the sun behind and casting shadows away from the fish, probably could have tailed it if I’d been that way inclined, moved my rod arm something caught his eye … gone. Anecdote 3: fish hard against a bank in a riffly run, I’m within a rod length, a birds shadow made it change position then return after a minute or so.  Watching it feed, yup taking nymphs, scratched my nose … Gone. All three have a common thread, sudden or unexpected movement.   I am of the belief that if I can see a fish, the actual fish spots ‘n all, not shadows or riseforms, then they can definately see me. The problem then becomes one of threatening behaviour ie moving Steve Still in Melbourne, Australia.

Response:

I’ve read about a trouts field of view and its ability to sense vibration/disturbance through its lateral line. Does anyone know how well a trout can distinguish one object from another? Where I fish there are a lot of boulders and laurel. If I’m wearing subdued clothing and not splashing around, can a trout pick me out from the surrounding terrain? Thanks in advance.

Response:

 Does anyone know how well a trout can distinguish one object from another?

G & A, I know that I’ve seen trout streak 8-10 feet, from deep down, to take a small dry fly in moving water.  I’ve also seen one rise to a cigarette butt.  And I’ve scattered them from just far enough away for a good cast.  Suffice to say, that a trout’s vision in water is analogous to your vision in air–they’ve adapted to survive and flourish, as have we (assuming I’m a human and not a fish).  I can’t tell you if trout have 20/20 vision, what we think they see is just the best guess, only the trout know for sure.  I don’t pay much attention to what I wear under my vest, but I am careful about moving slowly and casting shadows. Anglerboy

Response:

     Trout have excellent vision, especially character recognition.  I’ve found that they usually read the fishing regulations before the season opens, and on opening day take an extended vacation to parts unknown. el coyotero was here

Response:

writes: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  Does anyone know how well a trout can distinguish one object from another? G & A, I know that I’ve seen trout streak 8-10 feet, from deep down, to take a small dry fly in moving water.  I’ve also seen one rise to a cigarette butt.  And I’ve scattered them from just far enough away for a good cast.  Suffice to say, that a trout’s vision in water is analogous to your vision in air–they’ve adapted to survive and flourish, as have we (assuming I’m a human and not a fish).  I can’t tell you if trout have 20/20 vision, what we think they see is just the best guess, only the trout know for sure.  I don’t pay much attention to what I wear under my vest, but I am careful about moving slowly and casting shadows. Anglerboy

They can see better in smooth water vs. rippled water so you are more likely to spook trout in pools. Their eyes are placed on the sides of their heads so they have a wider angle of vision than we do. They can pick out a size #28 nymph without any problems. My best guess is that they see movement much better than we do. Their natural enemies (birds etc.) strike from above and food is also often found on the surface so they’re tuned into motion from above. Also they hear very well with a band of "ears" along their sides and can easily hear you stomping around on the banks long before they can see you in some cases. Good thing their brain is only the size of a pea. <G Don Burns

Response:

Question:

I’ve got the good luck to have 4-days near Evergreen CO in early August and am looking for suggestions on streams to stalk, catch and release. Don’t mind walking in a bit and I don’t need big name water or 18" fish to have fun – although 18" fish are… Anything within a reasonable 2-hour drive?  Thanks and let me know how to reciprocate for Wisconsin, if I can.

Response:

The local fly shop in Evergreen is the Blue Quill Angler.  Same folks that run the Orvis Colorado Fly Fishing school, Rick Rishell runs it and his number 800-235-9763.  They would give you a very good idea as to what is going on there.  Bear Creek right in town was aggressively cleaned up and improved by the local TU chapter.  Behind the Amoco gas station a few years ago I caught a 18" rainbow.  Clear Creek along I-70 is pretty good too at Georgetown, that’s just up the road a few miles.  Those are great after work areas.  The South Platte river at Deckers is close to for a serious session of lots of fish.  Stop in at the fly shop in Deckers (Motel, gas pump, cafe/bar and fly shop setup, it is the town) and get the info on the current flies.  You can go North to Hot Sulphur Springs and hit the Colorado, great time of year for the Colorado.  Evergreen is a great place to get to lots of the famous gold medal water but the little streams right around town are really fun.  LOTS of water this year. — Ken Rupkalvis, THE Republic of Texas

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve got the good luck to have 4-days near Evergreen CO in early August and am looking for suggestions on streams to stalk, catch and release. Don’t mind walking in a bit and I don’t need big name water or 18" fish to have fun – although 18" fish are… Anything within a reasonable 2-hour drive?  Thanks and let me know how to reciprocate for Wisconsin, if I can.

Response:

Question:

Don’t listen to what other people say , get new line if it is knicked.If you can find these colors they work good. 1.Trout-green;blue 2.Salmon-orange;yellow 3.Pike-gray;brown 4.Bass-dark green;mud                                                     Fellow Fisherman,                                                        Mr.Oralando

Response:

Don’t listen to what other people say , get new line if it is knicked.If you can find these colors they work good. 1.Trout-green;blue 2.Salmon-orange;yellow 3.Pike-gray;brown 4.Bass-dark green;mud                        Fellow Fisherman,                            Mr.Oralando

Um…Er…Uh…Aw, never mind….(sigh) /dave (To KF or Not To KF: That is the Question ;^) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< < Digital Equipment Corp.    Alpha Server Engineering  < <         "Read this and nobody gets hurt ;^)"         < <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Response:

Don’t listen to what other people say , get new line if it is knicked.If you can find these colors they work good. 1.Trout-green;blue 2.Salmon-orange;yellow 3.Pike-gray;brown 4.Bass-dark green;mud

I started to respond to this,  but got so confused by the above message I forgot what I was going to say. Ernie Harrison

Response:

: 1.Trout-green;blue : 2.Salmon-orange;yellow : 3.Pike-gray;brown : 4.Bass-dark green;mud :                        Fellow Fisherman, :                            Mr.Oralando : /dave (To KF or Not To KF: That is the Question ;^) Now, now.  Be nice. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Assistant professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    |  These University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    |  opinions Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. |  are mine.

Response:

Would appreciate info on flyfishing opportunities in Nevada and Southwestern Utah.  Best times, fly types, locations, etc. Thanks to all.

Response:

Would appreciate info on flyfishing opportunities in Nevada and Southwestern Utah.  Best times, fly types, locations, etc. Thanks to all.

William Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA

Response:

Hi,    There is some excellent fishing up in the northeastern part of Nevada. While most of the flyfishing is floattube reservoir oriented, there are some stream fisheries.   The season is year around, techniques and locations change with the seasons. Winter means ice on most of the stillwaters, and that severely limits flyfishing. The tailwater fisheries below Wildhorse Reservoir and South Fork Reservoir stay open water in all but the coldest temperatures. The Collection Ditch at the Ruby Marshes also stays open and provides some good winter nymphing.   Early spring is the best fishing, and it is winding down at this time. Big rainbows head up the South Fork of the Humboldt above the reservoir starting at ice off and they can be caught on nymphs or midges. Near the inlets on all the reservoirs will show some fish on these techniques. The Collection Ditch at the Marshes and some of the Marsh areas produce big trout at this time (the Ditch collects the springs and routes the water to the various units–it is really a big spring creek)  Big runnoff time, which we are into now, generally means muddy water and the small waters and the Marsh are the best as they don’t get as muddy.  Post runoff finds the streams dropping and you can get into some of the areas like the Bruneau and Jarbidge river systems and these have good dry fly fishing for trout. The bass action starts to improve and three pound smallmouths on a flyrod will almost make you forget about trout.   Summer and warming water shifts the good fishing to the early mornings or after sunset–you can fish this area on almost all waters as long as the casinos stay open…   Fall fishing is excellent. The browns start spawning about the time the first frosts cut the bug populations. Most of the anglers have given up for the season, but the fishing is great.   That’s the year in a nutshell. There’s 1100 miles of streams and about 50 lake and reservoirs in the county, so it would take a book for specifics. Tight Lines, Jim, Nevada Jim’s Outdoor Sports, Elko, NV

Response:

Question:

Previous posts on breathable waders have mentioned their durability and some problems that have developed. I wondered if there was more personal experience out there on this topic. How durable have the different breathable wader brands been in your experience (Simms microfibers, Hodgmann wadelite, LL Bean Gore-Tex, Orvis Gore-Tex and any others you know of)?

Response:

Previous posts on breathable waders have mentioned their durability and some problems that have developed. I wondered if there was more personal experience out there on this topic. How durable have the different breathable wader brands been in your experience (Simms microfibers, Hodgmann wadelite, LL Bean Gore-Tex, Orvis Gore-Tex and any others you know of)?

Hi Jonathan, I guided 83 trips and several personal trips as well in my Simms and they worked very well. I developed one pin hole leak after charging through some wild roses but the leak was very easy to repair. Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (96 catalog)

Response:

Question:

Any suggestions for where to find flyfishing sites on the worldwide web? Is this in a fishing FAQ?  If so where is it?                  /                 /                                            John Woodling              o/                                             Sacramento, CA              /                                                                <     <

Response:

Any suggestions for where to find flyfishing sites on the worldwide web? Is this in a fishing FAQ?  If so where is it?

I keep a fly fishing web page mostly dedicated to the state of Arizona, but also with some more general information, including a long list of links to other pages.  I hope this helps. John Shannon Fly Fishing in Arizona http://www.indirect.com/user/jshannon

Response:

Any suggestions for where to find flyfishing sites on the worldwide

web? For starters, try  http://www.geo.mtu.edu/~jsuchosk/fish/fishpage This has a lot of hypertext leads to other places.  It’ll keep you surfing until the green drakes hatch.                                           Catch and release,                                                              Phil Holt

Response:

: Any suggestions for where to find flyfishing sites on the worldwide web? : Is this in a fishing FAQ?  If so where is it? :     Hi- FAQ URL: http://www.geo.mtu.edu:80/~jsuchosk/fish/all-faqs.html List of flyfishing web sites (and fishing sites in general): http://www.gorp.com/gorp/activity/fishing.htm Hope this helps, Diane

Response: