Question:

Now imagine that trip with some *real* streamers in your arsenal.  <g (we may have the beginnings of a convert) Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

I fish streamers often.  I had small Mickey Finns and white/peacock Deceivers with me.  But, knowing there were very large fish in the pool, and never having taken one there, I tried the largest fly I had.  And it took the largest trout I’ve ever caught. Glenn GKT

Response:

. 15" and 18" browns.  Not something to write in a diary, but it worked. Any trout of that size I take on a fly rod will get written in a diary. Pete Collin

Well, me too; I was way too casual in that description.  Probably in comparison to the 11 trout someone else caught the day before.   For the record, the previous largest trout of my life was a 21" brown on a #16 Goddard Caddis from a pool on this creek.  But there are a fair number of long-term holdover trout in the 15" plus range there.   Glenn   GKT

Response:

Not something to write in a diary, but it worked. Fairly sure I would write that in my diary! TL MC

Well, I did.  I apologize for being way too casual.  I belittled it in comparison to the 11 fish someone else caught the day before. Glenn GKT

Response:

If I saw a trout big enough to eat a 4" clouser I would write about it.    hell, i would leap from the water, terrified. your friend in the old north state wayno where a 4 inch clouser would be damn close to a record.

I did warm my waders when I saw the fish. GKT

Response:

. 15" and 18" browns.  Not something to write in a diary, but it worked. Any trout of that size I take on a fly rod will get written in a diary. Pete Collin

Could you improve that remark by just saying "Any?" GG

Response:

After an hour or so of good intentions, I switched to the inevitable Wooly Bugger.  Black marabou, peacock herl and silver wire body, black saddle hackle palmer, silver barbell eyes.  With the cover of rain, I got next to the dark green channels and high sticked the Bugger through the runs. 15" and 18" browns.  Not something to write in a diary, but it worked.

Fairly sure I would write that in my diary! TL MC

Response:

Fairly sure I would write that in my diary! TL MC

If I saw a trout big enough to eat a 4" clouser I would write about it. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply.

Response:

Fairly sure I would write that in my diary! TL MC If I saw a trout big enough to eat a 4" clouser I would write about it.

    hell, i would leap from the water, terrified. your friend in the old north state wayno where a 4 inch clouser would be damn close to a record.

Response:

Thursday 4/25 Paradise Creek off the Brodhead 9:30 to 2:30.  Light to moderate rain with an air temperature of 43 to 46 degrees. The day before, someone had taken 11 browns up to 18" on Hendrickson spinners. To quote Dizzy Dean, it ain’t bragging if you can do it. Thursday the creek was up but fairly clear.  Rings on every pool but they were made by drips from the hemlocks and sycamores.  An occasional microcaddis in the air, but no concentration of bugs in the trees.  I checked the streamside and bridge spiderwebs for evidence of hatches but they were generally empty. No shucks on the rocks, though the rising creek might have covered earlier stonefly activity. My fishing partner stuck with a Prince nymph most of the day.  It had worked the previous week, so he went over a lot of water giving it another chance. Moderately stubborn type. I changed flys with that fine desperation and lack of intuition which characterizes my approach to tough conditions.  If I had thought to bring midge pupa imitations with me they might have been a better bet.  I was also trying to avoid retreating to Wooly Buggers. After an hour or so of good intentions, I switched to the inevitable Wooly Bugger.  Black marabou, peacock herl and silver wire body, black saddle hackle palmer, silver barbell eyes.  With the cover of rain, I got next to the dark green channels and high sticked the Bugger through the runs. 15" and 18" browns.  Not something to write in a diary, but it worked. To close out the day, we went to the toughest stretch, Harold’s Pool.  My friend went up through all the riffles with the Prince.  I drew a very large flash to the Wooly Bugger, but the big fish in that pool see a lot of Wooly Buggers from desperate anglers.  I put on a 4" 1/0 chartreuse and white Clouser (barbless) and flogged the depths of the pool.  No fun casting with a 3 wt. But the second cast, letting the Clouser swing below me, a trout nailed the fly (ok, it might as well be a jig).  And it made the day light up.  I horsed it as best I could with the 3 wt. and a 2X flourocarbon leader.  And it fought upstream, probably surprised as hell that it couldn’t snap the leader instantly.  So in a few minutes I brought a brilliantly colored brown to my feet, popped the Clouser out of the corner of its mouth, and set it free. We took our shivering old bodies to the car, put away our rods, signed out, and headed home with the heater cranked to max.  No bugs but not a bad day. GKT

Response:

[snip] We took our shivering old bodies to the car, put away our rods, signed out, and headed home with the heater cranked to max.  No bugs but not a bad day. GKT

Now imagine that trip with some *real* streamers in your arsenal.  <g (we may have the beginnings of a convert) Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

. 15" and 18" browns.  Not something to write in a diary, but it worked.

Any trout of that size I take on a fly rod will get written in a diary. Pete Collin

Response:

Nice story Arn.  It’s hard to maintain the discipline between being a fly fisherman and lures.  It’s like walking the fine line between genius and insanity. Fly fishing has driven many advocates mad. Yes, its a mad, mad, mad world! George Gehrke "Mr. Cool"

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thursday 4/25 Paradise Creek off the Brodhead 9:30 to 2:30.  Light to moderate rain with an air temperature of 43 to 46 degrees. The day before, someone had taken 11 browns up to 18" on Hendrickson spinners. To quote Dizzy Dean, it ain’t bragging if you can do it. Thursday the creek was up but fairly clear.  Rings on every pool but they were made by drips from the hemlocks and sycamores.  An occasional microcaddis in the air, but no concentration of bugs in the trees.  I checked the streamside and bridge spiderwebs for evidence of hatches but they were generally empty. No shucks on the rocks, though the rising creek might have covered earlier stonefly activity. My fishing partner stuck with a Prince nymph most of the day.  It had worked the previous week, so he went over a lot of water giving it another chance. Moderately stubborn type. I changed flys with that fine desperation and lack of intuition which characterizes my approach to tough conditions.  If I had thought to bring midge pupa imitations with me they might have been a better bet.  I was also trying to avoid retreating to Wooly Buggers. After an hour or so of good intentions, I switched to the inevitable Wooly Bugger.  Black marabou, peacock herl and silver wire body, black saddle hackle palmer, silver barbell eyes.  With the cover of rain, I got next to the dark green channels and high sticked the Bugger through the runs. 15" and 18" browns.  Not something to write in a diary, but it worked. To close out the day, we went to the toughest stretch, Harold’s Pool.  My friend went up through all the riffles with the Prince.  I drew a very large flash to the Wooly Bugger, but the big fish in that pool see a lot of Wooly Buggers from desperate anglers.  I put on a 4" 1/0 chartreuse and white Clouser (barbless) and flogged the depths of the pool.  No fun casting with a 3 wt. But the second cast, letting the Clouser swing below me, a trout nailed the fly (ok, it might as well be a jig).  And it made the day light up.  I horsed it as best I could with the 3 wt. and a 2X flourocarbon leader.  And it fought upstream, probably surprised as hell that it couldn’t snap the leader instantly.  So in a few minutes I brought a brilliantly colored brown to my feet, popped the Clouser out of the corner of its mouth, and set it free. We took our shivering old bodies to the car, put away our rods, signed out, and headed home with the heater cranked to max.  No bugs but not a bad day. GKT

Response:

STREAMERS is a very good idea.  I would have fished a muddler minnow darting along the bottom with a sink tip. George Gehrke "guessing is better than doing nothing" Now imagine that trip with some *real* streamers in your arsenal.  <g (we may have the beginnings of a convert) Peter Visit The Streamer Page at

http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

Question:

I’ll see what I can do, PSU tickets between the 20s are hard to find. I’d love to go to any PSU home game this year, and if I can get tickets I’ll contact you.  How much prior notice do you require?

I’m workin’ on a ticket in the visitors section from this end as well. Unfortunately, I’m well down the pecking order of Illini alums and probably won’t get one. If I do, I’d be very grateful and appreciative of the opportunity to have you show me some of those great PA streams around the ballgame. If we can pull this off, we’ll need to hijack Mark Faulkner and force him to fish with us. As far as prior notice, … hell, I don’t know, depends on what’s happening at the time. Don’t go to any expense on my account, the game will be on the tube anyway. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

This has the makings of an miniclave in central PA.  Let’s work on some tickets and see what happens.  After the so-called "Fighting Illini" get sent back to the playpen by the Nittany Lions – led by the quarterback now proudly known as the "defendant" – we can get to some serious fishing. Mark Faulkner – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m workin’ on a ticket in the visitors section from this end as well. Unfortunately, I’m well down the pecking order of Illini alums and probably won’t get one. If I do, I’d be very grateful and appreciative of the opportunity to have you show me some of those great PA streams around the ballgame. If we can pull this off, we’ll need to hijack Mark Faulkner and force him to fish with us.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ll see what I can do, PSU tickets between the 20s are hard to find.  I’d love to go to any PSU home game this year, and if I can get tickets I’ll contact you.  How much prior notice do you require? I’m workin’ on a ticket in the visitors section from this end as well. Unfortunately, I’m well down the pecking order of Illini alums and probably won’t get one. If I do, I’d be very grateful and appreciative of the opportunity to have you show me some of those great PA streams around the ballgame. If we can pull this off, we’ll need to hijack Mark Faulkner and force him to fish with us. As far as prior notice, … hell, I don’t know, depends on what’s happening at the time. Don’t go to any expense on my account, the game will be on the tube anyway. — Ken Fortenberry

Well, I had been looking for PSU tickets for any home game already.  If I can get them, I’m sure that I will be able to find somebody around here that would want to go with me if you are unavailable.  The most available tickets are always in the student section (of course) which is at the wrong end of the field for an Illini fan…  Usually you can find tickets in the newspaper or on eBay in the week or two immediately prior to the game.  Nothing personal, but a game vs. Illinios isn’t like a game against Michigan or OSU so finding tickets may not be impossible. Tom perhaps we should be looking for the Big Ten newsgroup? Before you buy.

Response:

So I’m hoping that one of you ROFFians can help me…  Or maybe you just know somebody who might.  Anybody who fishes in the Centre/Clinton/Lycoming county region who would be willing to throw away a few hours of their time giving me a few pointers would be a blessing.  Hell, I’ll bring the food AND the beer. Thanks, Tom Before you buy.

Tom It just so happens that I will spending Labor Day weekend at my cabin along Slate Run in Lycoming County. I will arriving on Thur the 31st and departing Mon morning Sep 4. Slate Run is a beautiful wild trout stream in a remote wilderness setting as are Cedar Run and Young Womens Creek all near by. Maybe we could hookup sometime over the weekend for a little dry fly fishing. I probaby dry fly fish 95% of the time so maybe I could help you out a little there. Drop me a email message if you are interested. We would have to pick a time and place to meet before hand as there is no phone in the cabin. John Mimnall Before you buy.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ll see what I can do, PSU tickets between the 20s are hard to find. I’d love to go to any PSU home game this year, and if I can get tickets I’ll contact you.  How much prior notice do you require? I’m workin’ on a ticket in the visitors section from this end as well. Unfortunately, I’m well down the pecking order of Illini alums and probably won’t get one. If I do, I’d be very grateful and appreciative of the opportunity to have you show me some of those great PA streams around the ballgame. If we can pull this off, we’ll need to hijack Mark Faulkner and force him to fish with us. — Ken Fortenberry

Hell Ken you could probaby be on the stream by halftime as the soon to be convict PSU quarterback will probaby run circles around the Illini defense and there would be no question as to the outcome of the game by that time. Before you buy.

Response:

Nothing personal, but a game vs. Illinios isn’t

like a game against Michigan or OSU so finding tickets may not be impossible.< Going at cut rate prices, one would assume. <g

Response:

It just so happens that I will spending Labor Day weekend at my cabin along Slate Run in Lycoming County… Slate Run is a beautiful wild trout stream in a remote wilderness setting as are Cedar Run and Young Womens Creek all near by.

John, John, John. I’m afraid you might have just inadvertently invited one Anthony Wayne Harrison, Esquire to be a permanent house guest at your cabin. Tell me–how far exactly is it to Young Womens from your cabin? –Steve

Response:

 Nothing personal, but a game vs. Illinios isn’t like a game against Michigan or OSU

    bwaaaaahaaaa!     truth always rings clear, even though the sound might be painful to certain ears. wayno

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It just so happens that I will spending Labor Day weekend at my cabin along Slate Run in Lycoming County… Slate Run is a beautiful wild trout stream in a remote wilderness setting as are Cedar Run and Young Womens Creek all near by. John, John, John. I’m afraid you might have just inadvertently invited one Anthony Wayne Harrison, Esquire to be a permanent house guest at your cabin. Tell me–how far exactly is it to Young Womens from your cabin? –Steve

No need for Mr. Harrison’s help as I already saw to it that all the young women along the creek are ‘changed’ and only have eye’s for me. Actually I think the creek was named after a young indian girl that was lost along it. Before you buy.

Response:

Nothing personal, but a game vs. Illinios isn’t like a game against Michigan or OSU so finding tickets may not be impossible. Going at cut rate prices, one would assume. <g     bwaaaaahaaaa!     truth always rings clear, even though the sound might be painful to certain ears.

All this Illini razzing is music to my ears, especially from the Buckeye and Tarheel contingent who happened to be THE major source of college football Laphroaig last season. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

No need for Mr. Harrison’s help as I already saw to it that all the young women along the creek are ‘changed’ and only have eye’s for me.

        pretty work.  so many creeks; so little time. wayno

Response:

All this Illini razzing is music to my ears, especially from the

Buckeye and Tarheel contingent who happened to be THE major source of college football Laphroaig last season. < Hey, Wayne.  Did you reseal your bottle the way I advised?  Gives Laphroaig a decent flavor.  0

Response:

All this Illini razzing is music to my ears, especially from the Buckeye and Tarheel contingent who happened to be THE major source of college football Laphroaig last season. —

"college football Laphroaig"??? isn’t that a team in texas?  no wait that’s the horned phroaigs…  oh hell, can we at least have a better quality bet this year fellas??  with Laphroaig as the trophy, it’s no wonder the heels lost and wayno paid up…who’d want that cadaver juice?  ’cept ken, of course… <G jeff

Response:

"college football Laphroaig"??? isn’t that a team in texas?  no wait that’s the horned phroaigs…  

Maybe you’re thinking of a different Forty, the north Dallas one perhaps? <g — Charlie…

Response:

"college football Laphroaig"??? isn’t that a team in texas?  no wait that’s the horned phroaigs…  oh hell, can we at least have a better quality bet this year fellas??  with Laphroaig as the trophy, it’s no wonder the heels lost and wayno paid up…who’d want that cadaver juice?  ’cept ken, of course… <G

The Laphroaig is my winnings. If the Tarheels ever put together a football squad, I’d owe Wayno some horribly expensive chardonnay. If the Buckeyes were to get real lucky I’d have to get Harry a bottle of Cardhu. In the spirit of "you can never have too much Laphroaig" I should find a sucker^H^H^H^H^H^H  football fan of the Nittany Lion persuasion to swindle^H^H^H^H^H^H^H  bet with this year. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

Does anyone know what happened to my Barnoculars? Lost them sometime in college in California early 80’s… absolute necessity for college football where they frisk you as you enter… as a Democrat who encourages diversity, I’d put single malt in one half, bourbon in the other…

Response:

I am, I guess, a newbie in many respects. I’ve owned a fly rod since 1990 or so, but

Hell, I’ll bring the food AND the beer. Tom

 Hell, if you bring the food and beer…….well, I’ll be there. I live a few hours away from Happy Valley  but try to get out that way as often as time allows. My last trip was probably a month ago so I’m due for another any weekend. Around Oct 9 I have five days free and plan on fishing/drinking my time away. Depending on my $$$ flow, I will be floating the Deleware, trying my luck at Striper fishing, searching for Salmon or camping at Hemlock Acres, which is in your neck of the woods. I’d be more than happy to give you a few pointers if I’m out that way. Have you tried Flyfishers Paradise? There’s a spot there I call the trough. Its the channel of water that flows out of the hatchery ponds. There are *big* fish there year round sipping on midges. The day before Christmas I was there- 24 degrees out and they were feeding! I’ve taught several of my friends how to midge fish there. My friend Phil caught his first fish on a fly there- a 17 inch bow on a sz. 26 midge. Its a good place to learn because the fish are immune to human presence. You can cast to them all day and they dont move. The key is to use small flies. Sz. 22 or smaller. And as long as I’m there to teach someone else, I don’t feel guilty about hooking a few myself  If I head that way, I’ll drop you a line. Tight Lines… Matt M.

Response:

I am, I guess, a newbie in many respects. I’ve owned a fly rod since 1990 or so, but have only begun fly fishing (almost) exclusively this summer.  I grew up here in central PA (Clinton Co.) fishing with spinners and salmon eggs.  I can usually catch trout quite successfully in PA streams with a Panther Martin spinner…  This is my first summer fly fishing in PA. I am woefully inept with dry flies, 95% of my fly fishing experience being in Alaska, where the notorious ‘egg hatch’ is the only hatch worth worrying about.  Of the remaining 5%, 4% is pond fishing with small poppers for bass/crappie/bream in NC and 1% has been this summer here in central PA.  Due to this experience my casting is awful (I can roll cast REAL GOOD) and I have no idea which flies to use when. So far, my luck with dry flies has been not so great.  I caught two chubs a couple of weeks ago, and I’ve gone through several leaders and plenty of tippet material trying to catch a trout.  I was surprised by the chubs–I never even considered the possibility of catching a chub on a dry fly.  Or catching chubs at all, for that matter. I only know two people that fly fish, and neither of them very seriously.  One, my aunt’s husband, probably hasn’t fished in 5 years or more.  He may have been fairly adept at it at one time but he no longer seems to have any interest.  The other, the husband of a friend of the same aunt, hasn’t been fly fishing for very long and he is strictly a nymph fisherman. So I’m hoping that one of you ROFFians can help me…  Or maybe you just know somebody who might.  Anybody who fishes in the Centre/Clinton/Lycoming county region who would be willing to throw away a few hours of their time giving me a few pointers would be a blessing.  Hell, I’ll bring the food AND the beer. Just to keep you from digging up my ‘ROFFians: who the hell are these folks?’ post, I am: 33 years old. White. Male. 5′11". 240lbs. (I carry it well, ha ha) Married. (with child, a 15 month old girl) Employed. (Systems Consultant, i.e. glorified computer sales guy) Homeowner. (100-year old Victorian house that requires a LOT of time) I can listen to almost anything, music-wise, but prefer rock-n-roll. I don’t have the most flexible schedule (see above), but I am available practically every weekend.  Saturday or Sunday–no preference here. Penn’s Creek, Spring Creek, Fishing Creek, Kettle Creek, Pine Creek, wherever.  Let’s go fishing! Thanks, Tom Before you buy.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …  Hell, I’ll bring the food AND the beer. FREE beer ?! Just to fish with you ? Don’t know which of us will get there first, me or Waldo. If it turns out to be Waldo, FER THE LUV OF GAWD, HIDE THE BEER ! If you let Waldo have the beer BEFORE fishing, you gotta drag him around by his groaty old waders all day. He’s a MUCH better fishing partner if you make him wait til the end of the day to start chugging beers. Hmmmmm, my calendar shows that the Illini are scheduled to whup the snot out of the Nittany Lions on Oct 21. If you were to fix me up with a decent seat, say between the 20’s, on Saturday, I would gladly teach you more than a few bad dry fly fishing habits on Sunday. — Ken Fortenberry

I’ll see what I can do, PSU tickets between the 20s are hard to find. I’d love to go to any PSU home game this year, and if I can get tickets I’ll contact you.  How much prior notice do you require? Tom Before you buy.

Response:

…  Hell, I’ll bring the food AND the beer.

FREE beer ?! Just to fish with you ? Don’t know which of us will get there first, me or Waldo. If it turns out to be Waldo, FER THE LUV OF GAWD, HIDE THE BEER ! If you let Waldo have the beer BEFORE fishing, you gotta drag him around by his groaty old waders all day. He’s a MUCH better fishing partner if you make him wait til the end of the day to start chugging beers. Hmmmmm, my calendar shows that the Illini are scheduled to whup the snot out of the Nittany Lions on Oct 21. If you were to fix me up with a decent seat, say between the 20’s, on Saturday, I would gladly teach you more than a few bad dry fly fishing habits on Sunday.   — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

If you let Waldo have the beer BEFORE fishing, you gotta drag him around by his groaty old waders all day.

I always wondered how you spell "groaty". Regards, Jeff

Response:

If you let Waldo have the beer BEFORE fishing, you gotta drag him around by his groaty old waders all day. I always wondered how you spell "groaty".

G  R  O  A  T  Y Groady, on the other hand, is spelled with a d. Wolfgang W  O  L  F  G  A  N  G

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am, I guess, a newbie in many respects. I’ve owned a fly rod since 1990 or so, but have only begun fly fishing (almost) exclusively this summer.  I grew up here in central PA (Clinton Co.) fishing with spinners and salmon eggs.  I can usually catch trout quite successfully in PA streams with a Panther Martin spinner…  This is my first summer fly fishing in PA. I am woefully inept with dry flies, 95% of my fly fishing experience being in Alaska, where the notorious ‘egg hatch’ is the only hatch worth worrying about.  Of the remaining 5%, 4% is pond fishing with small poppers for bass/crappie/bream in NC and 1% has been this summer here in central PA.  Due to this experience my casting is awful (I can roll cast REAL GOOD) and I have no idea which flies to use when. So far, my luck with dry flies has been not so great.  I caught two chubs a couple of weeks ago, and I’ve gone through several leaders and plenty of tippet material trying to catch a trout.  I was surprised by the chubs–I never even considered the possibility of catching a chub on a dry fly.  Or catching chubs at all, for that matter. I only know two people that fly fish, and neither of them very seriously.  One, my aunt’s husband, probably hasn’t fished in 5 years or more.  He may have been fairly adept at it at one time but he no longer seems to have any interest.  The other, the husband of a friend of the same aunt, hasn’t been fly fishing for very long and he is strictly a nymph fisherman. So I’m hoping that one of you ROFFians can help me…  Or maybe you just know somebody who might.  Anybody who fishes in the Centre/Clinton/Lycoming county region who would be willing to throw away a few hours of their time giving me a few pointers would be a blessing.  Hell, I’ll bring the food AND the beer. Just to keep you from digging up my ‘ROFFians: who the hell are these folks?’ post, I am: 33 years old. White. Male. 5′11". 240lbs. (I carry it well, ha ha) Married. (with child, a 15 month old girl) Employed. (Systems Consultant, i.e. glorified computer sales guy) Homeowner. (100-year old Victorian house that requires a LOT of time) I can listen to almost anything, music-wise, but prefer rock-n-roll. I don’t have the most flexible schedule (see above), but I am available practically every weekend.  Saturday or Sunday–no preference here. Penn’s Creek, Spring Creek, Fishing Creek, Kettle Creek, Pine Creek, wherever.  Let’s go fishing! Thanks, Tom Before you buy.

Response:

I am, I guess, a newbie in many respects. I’ve owned a fly rod since 1990 or so, but have only begun fly fishing (almost) exclusively this summer.  I grew up here in central PA (Clinton Co.) fishing with spinners and salmon eggs.  I can usually catch trout quite successfully in PA streams with a Panther Martin spinner…  This is my first summer fly fishing in PA.

(woes and travails of the flyfisher snipped) Tom – Contact me be email and I’ll see if I can help.  A bit limited in my activities these days – at least for the short term – but let’s see. Mark Faulkner

Response:

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – % % % % % I don’t know, but if this guy % is for real……he scares me!!!! % % This is the strait scoop.  Theres % nothing to be scared of unless your a % smartmouth like that stooge guy Moe. % % % Me, too!  Strangely, I’m reminded % of the thread from late % Summer/early Fall that dealt % with stories of sabotage, flattened % tires and other acts against fisher % people…  hmmmmmmmmmmmmm! % % I dont know nothin about that % stuff.  I just started posting % here.   I know % about guys who got their tires % slashed when they fished here in NY on them % Indian reservations.   You gotta % watch out for some of them jamokes when %they % go on the warpath.  I could tell % you stories but I dont got the time now. %The % little lady is already bitchin % cause Im running the computer instead of %helping % with her dishes. % % MEOW!!!! % % Tony G. % % % -tran % Oakland, CA % % % % % % % % THIS POSTED IN ALT.FAN.KARL-MALDEN.NOSE, %ALT.ALIEN.VAMPIRE.FLONK.FLONK.FLONK, % REC.OUTDOORS.FISHING.FLY  REC.OUTDOORS % FISHING.BASS, ALT.FISHING % % BOYCOTT THE COLEMAN STORE FOR CENSHORSHIP % www.rochesterweb.com/colemans % a.f.k-m.n.n (newbie)number of 2. % THIS POSTED IN ALT.FAN.KARL-MALDEN.NOSE, %ALT.ALIEN.VAMPIRE.FLONK.FLONK.FLONK, % REC.OUTDOORS.FISHING.FLY % REC.OUTDOORS FISHING.BASS, ALT.FISHING % % BOYCOTT THE COLEMAN STORE FOR CENSHORSHIP % www.rochesterweb.com/colemans % a.f.k-m.n.n (newbie)number of 2. % %PROBLEM THE FIRST: Adding "Subject" %to the subject header %is stupid and redundant and %fucks up the way that many %newsreaders, including Mozilla %and Agent, display threads. % %PROBLEM THE SECOND: You did not %x-post this to AFKMN, or %for that matter anywhere else, %and especially not any of %the groups that you list. In %fact, all of the people you %replied too will likely never %see your posts for this %reason. (You will note that %this has been corrected, %and I even added alt.flame %to the headers, because I %felt like flaming a newbie %anyway. You’re welcome.) % %PROBLEM THE THIRD: We (TINW) %do not issue "newbie %numbers". I don’t know who %told you that, and whoever %it is is probably going to be %really pissed that I ruined %the joke, but that’s the truth. % %PROBLEM THE FOURTH: Your grammar sucks. % %PROBLEM THE FIFTH: You make no %attempt at making anything %even vaguely resembling UPA. %This of course makes me %wonder why you are here in %the first place, unless of %course you are one of those %stupid newbie me-tooers that %have been plaguing us recently. %Which is in fact very %likely. % %PROBLEM THE SIXTH: You posted %your sig twice. Way to %go, dipshit. % %PROBLEM THE SEVENTH: You suck. % %CONCLUSION: I’d plonk you, but %I’m actually vaguely %interested as to how you react to this. % %– %mhm37×4                   crisis at quackquack dot com % %"They call them ‘bouncing %baby boys’, but they don’t really %bounce. They just sort of go ‘plop’." % %      -Bruce McCulloch % %Mr. Crisis; % %I dont got a lot of time to post %this morning.  I got up late and I gotta open %the shop up for the boys in a few minutes. % %I wrote Mr. Crisis cause I dont know %if your a guy or a girl from your name but %Im guessing your a guy.   If Im wrong %I figger you’ll let me know. % %I know Im a newbie and I figger %like most places this is some kind of %initation.  Im cool with that.  So %Im not gonna get insulting back at you %because that probably wouldnt be %the Meow way and Im trying to be a good Meower %now.  I hope I pass the initation. % %Ive been reading the Nose for weeks %now and I dont remeber seeing too much from %you before.  Your probably one of %them lower rankin Meowers that they use for %the initations.  Your not one of the %big time Meowers like Medcial Catastrophy. % Thats ok because you still rank higher %than me.  Its like us guys at the %volunteer fire dept all got different ranks. % %It dont always got anything to do %with how long you been somewhere neither.   I %been with the fire dept for 12 years %now but I take orders from the guy whose %Captain even though hes only been there %6 years and Im bigger than he is and I %could kick his behind if I wanted to. %   I figger its somethin like that. % %Im doing good as a mewoer so far. %Ive got all kinds of guys pissed off in all %them fishin groups and there talking %about ratting on me to compuserv and me %losing my account with compuserv. %Dont you people call that netpolice?  They %dont want me posting there because %they dont want to here nothing bad about the %fishing and the guys lifting and %snaggin the fish all the tiem. % %Before I go I wanted to talk about %some of them problems you mentioned.  Thanks %for posting to all those groups all %at once for me.   With this compuserv crap %I cant crosspost nothin.   The reason %for stuff being in my posts twice is %because Ive been copying and then %pasting all these posts to new posts and then %posting to each group individually. %It sure takes a lot of time and thats why %I dont have a lot of time to respond today. % %As far as them newbie numbers I got. %I got 3133T from Medical Catastrophy and %the other one I got from Scott Johnson. %I dont know what the Meow policy is on %them numbers but I figger that Medical % Catastrophy knows what hes talkin about. % Youll have to take it up with him. %Hes like your boss right? % %PS  Whats UPA?   I cant talk intelligent %about it if I dont know what it is. % %PPS   I know my writing sucks but %its better than it used to be.  Im trying but %its hard.  Its always been hard.   The %penguins were always making me stay %after school as a kid at the Catholic %school there.  I want to be a writer %though so I can write good stuff %about the storys my dad used to tell me about %WW2 and Toe Joe and Hero Hito. % %Ill see ya.  Thanks again. % %MEOW!!!!! % %Tony G.  3133T This troll.  It is simply too obvious. I will not respond to it. hey toneyg im liek teh lowest rankeing dued here next to loerd corkscrewbutt so yuo can litsen to me but be suer not to copey anytheing i do or respeong to me or yuoll be immeddieatetly gieven a vrey low mewo rank henvieng said thet i hace to respecteufleley disagree weth teh

Question:

I’m wondering if any of you know what kind of paint is used on pastic baits and where would  you purchse some if you wanted to paint your own.

Response:

Are you holding out on me, Jim? I didn’t know you were using Pastic Baits!!!!!!! Is that a new sponsor?

Response:

Try Jann’s Netcraft or Lurecraft on the net. — The RodMaker http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Gorge/2865

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m wondering if any of you know what kind of paint is used on pastic baits and where would  you purchse some if you wanted to paint your own.

Response:

I use airplane model paint  for my bass poppers (the ones with plastic bodies) which I fly fish with. Works well on plastic. Probably would work on metal. So cheap it is probably worth a try unless you get a better suggestion. Regards from Montreal John Brkich

Response:

I use Tester Model Paint it seems to work pretty well FISH-ON FISH-HARD

Response:

Question:

Does anyone know who puts on equipment/demonstration shows for flyfishing in alrge cities? I would like to go to one next year but can’t seem to find out how/where they are scheduled.

Huh, loaded kind of question….What  large area are you near? The fly fishing magazines often put out a list of the winter shows….also check websites www.flyshop.com,www.flyfish.com,www.flyfishing.com,www.flyrodreel.com, etc…; you local sporting goods stores or fly shops or the local clubs, ie TU, FFF chapters. All will have the low down. Wayne Knight (remove nospam to respond via mail) Expert in the creation of  wind knots and tailing loops.

Response:

Does anyone know who puts on equipment/demonstration shows for flyfishing in alrge cities? I would like to go to one next year but can’t seem to find out how/where they are scheduled. Thanks

Response:

Does anyone know who puts on equipment/demonstration shows for flyfishing in alrge cities? I would like to go to one next year but can’t seem to find out how/where they are scheduled. Thanks

Check the following URL’s.     www.sportshow.com     www.flyfishingshow.com

Response:

Question:

Assuming that you didn’t set the rod in a corner or leave it in its aluminum tube in your car, I’d say that it sounds like insufficient heat-treating of the bamboo.  (Is the rod a "blonde" bamboo or darker?)  I’d say you should contact the manufacturer. George

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I recently purchased a fairly expensive 7′  3wt.custom bamboo rod.  After a few careful fishing excursions I noticed a slight curve has developed between the tip of the rod and the second eye from the top.  Is this a normal characteristic of bamboo or a quality or workmanship issue. Any advice greatly appreciated Tom Bogdan

Response:

I recently purchased a fairly expensive 7′  3wt.custom bamboo rod.  After a few careful fishing excursions I noticed a slight curve has developed between the tip of the rod and the second eye from the top.  Is this a normal characteristic of bamboo or a quality or workmanship issue. Any advice greatly appreciated Tom Bogdan

Response:

It is completly normal and is called a "fishing set" or just a "set". Ways to avoid them is to occasionally turn the rod over when fighting a fish and make sure the rod is dry before putting it back in the tube. If you want to correct it you can heat the section with a hair dryer and hold the section straight until it cools or go fishing and catch a few fish playing them with the rod turned 180 degrees. Paul

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I recently purchased a fairly expensive 7′  3wt.custom bamboo rod.  After a few careful fishing excursions I noticed a slight curve has developed between the tip of the rod and the second eye from the top.  Is this a normal characteristic of bamboo or a quality or workmanship issue. Any advice greatly appreciated Tom Bogdan

Response:

I recently purchased a fairly expensive 7′  3wt.custom bamboo rod.  After a few careful fishing excursions I noticed a slight curve has developed between the tip of the rod and the second eye from the top.  Is this a normal characteristic of bamboo or a quality or workmanship issue.

The first couple of rods I built have both shown a proclivity towards a tip set. I think it was a combination of three things (1) poor workmanship (i.e. insufficient heat treating), (2) excessively long sections–both rods were 5 feet long with no ferrule, and (3) improper storage–I live in a very humid climate and I did not take steps to make sure the rods were kept dry. Since then I’ve built several rods with improvements in all three of the above shortcomings. So far none of those rods is any less straight today that it was when it was new (which is to say in some cases that they didn’t start out arrow straight to begin with–but that’s another topic . Assuming you haven’t horsed fish in (and it sounds like you’ve been careful), I would see if the builder would be willing to restraighten the rod for you at his expense. It might not stay straight, but the builder’s reaction will tell you a lot. As Paul mentioned in a different reply, you can do it yourself using a hair dryer and gentle pressure in the opposite direction of the set. The bottom line: if I were one day to start making rods professionaly, I would consider a tip set after only a couple of careful uses (assuming the rod is being stored correctly) to be a shortcoming in my heat-treating technique. –Steve

Response:

It’s a quality and workmanship issue, return it! Vern – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I recently purchased a fairly expensive 7′  3wt.custom bamboo rod.  After a few careful fishing excursions I noticed a slight curve has developed between the tip of the rod and the second eye from the top.  Is this a normal characteristic of bamboo or a quality or workmanship issue. Any advice greatly appreciated Tom Bogdan

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s a quality and workmanship issue, return it! Vern I recently purchased a fairly expensive 7′  3wt.custom bamboo rod.  After a few careful fishing excursions I noticed a slight curve has developed between the tip of the rod and the second eye from the top.  Is this a normal characteristic of bamboo or a quality or workmanship issue. Any advice greatly appreciated Tom Bogdan

_______  You may be too hasty here.  This is what you need to do.  Look at the tip closely and make sure it has a good varnish finish on it, protecting the rod from getting wet inside. Sets in bamboo fly rods can be caused the same way as with graphite. Setting it in an upright position leaning against a corner or wall or having a bend in the tip over a long period of time.  Heat in the summer, beating down on any fly rod can cause tips or rods to take a set. With bamboo Tom, if you’re satisfied the finish is well done and the fly rod is not wet inside,  you can do this.  Set a hair dryer up to blow hot air.  Heat that section of the fly rod gently until the rod gets not warm, but hot.  Yet, not hot enough to burn it.  Hot enough to make it pliable.  Simply remove from heat and torque the bend or set out into opposite direction and hold it there until rod cools.  All bamboo fly rods are straightened like this Tom.  A master fly rod maker can’t pick up a fly rod without tweaking it time and again until it is finally finished and ready for delivery.   The heat will soften the glue enough so it will move molecularly.  It makes no difference it your have a $7,000 Bamboo Fly Rod or a Production Line fly rod – they all will take sets sooner or later. Permit me to offer you some sage advice.  Store your tip tops of your tips to the top of your tube next to the cork handle.  Regarding the bag with a cord to wrap them with?  DON’T use them.  Simply insert the rod with sock loosely into the tube.  Always try and keep your bamboo fly rods laying flat or straight and apart over long periods of time.  If you make a mental error regarding your tips and you get a set because they got too hot in the sun when under car glass, etc.  You can now fix the problem yourself. If you are not sure, send it too me and I will fix it for you for nothing.  What brand fly rod  it is, isn’t important. — George Gehrke/American Sportsman http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html http://www.gink.com/rod_facts/bastardjun00.html  LATEST BAMBOO FACTS "the saga continues"

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I have an Uncle who recently showed me a fly rod that he has had for 20 yrs. I have never heard of the name of the maker and I was hoping that someone out there could maybe help me find out what its worth and where it came from. I have searched the internet and haven’t found anything. Here is a list of what the rod says on it: Made by T. C. Ivens "The Ivens Farstrike" Made in London 9′ 4"     6# That is all the markings that are on the rod. Any help would be GREATLY appreciated. Please email me with any responses as I do not have a chance to check this newsgroup very often. Thanks for any help. Mark Blanks

Contact this web sit.  They may be able to answer your bamboo question.    http://www.gorp.com/bamboo.htm Good luck. Joel Axelrad Joel Axelrad

Response:

Made by T. C. Ivens "The Ivens Farstrike" Made in London 9′ 4"     6#

Tom Ivens was not really a rod manufacturer but a well-known English angling writer (born 1922, author of Still Water Fly Fishing etc.)  Rods with his name are probably discussed in British magazines of the 1960s e.g. Trout and Salmon. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

Response:

I have an Uncle who recently showed me a fly rod that he has had for 20 yrs. I have never heard of the name of the maker and I was hoping that someone out there could maybe help me find out what its worth and where it came from. I have searched the internet and haven’t found anything. Here is a list of what the rod says on it: Made by T. C. Ivens "The Ivens Farstrike" Made in London 9′ 4"     6# That is all the markings that are on the rod. Any help would be GREATLY appreciated. Please email me with any responses as I do not have a chance to check this newsgroup very often. Thanks for any help. Mark Blanks

Response:

While picking the brain of a more experienced fly fisherman today I was puzzled by a remark he made about bamboo rods.  He said the reason for two tips was to permit a tip to "rest".  According to him bamboo begins to lose power in the tip section after several hours of fishing and must be "rested" for a time. I find this improbable but would like to hear about the behavior of bamboo as a fly-rod material and any special care required. Wayne To fish is human…to release devine.

Response:

Wayne wrote While picking the brain of a more experienced fly fisherman today I was puzzled by a remark he made about bamboo rods.  He said the reason for two tips was to permit a tip to "rest".  According to him bamboo begins to lose power in the tip section after several hours of fishing and must be "rested" for a time. I find this improbable but would like to hear about the behavior of bamboo as a fly-rod material and any special care required. Wayne To fish is human…to release devine.

The tip section gets what is known as a "set" a curve downward.  Especially if you catch a lot of big fish or have the rod overlined.  This curve (set) remains in the tip and would have to be straightened by a rod builder or person who is expert in the process.  If you have a twin tip rod it’s best to rotate the tips.  Resting them will not straighten them! Joel Axelrad

Response:

The tip section gets what is known as a "set" a curve downward.  Especially if you catch a lot of big fish or have the rod overlined.  This curve (set) remains in the tip and would have to be straightened by a rod builder or person who is expert in the process.  If you have a twin tip rod it’s best to rotate the tips.  Resting them will not straighten them! Joel Axelrad

As well, one should consciously (and conscientiously) avoid applying prolonged unidirectional pressure on the tip section of your favorite cane rod, and rotate the rod about its long axis while playing in your catch (ie: half the time the reel should be below the rod, the other half it should be above). Awkward for certain, but every little bit will help keep your cane healthy and avoid the dreaded set. /dave

Response:

Wayne wrote While picking the brain of a more experienced fly fisherman today I was puzzled by a remark he made about bamboo rods.  He said the reason for two tips was to permit a tip to "rest".  According to him bamboo begins to lose power in the tip section after several hours of fishing and must be "rested" for a time. I find this improbable but would like to hear about the behavior of bamboo as a fly-rod material and any special care required.

A set can happen for a lot of reasons, playing big fish or overlining the rod are but two fo them.  Leaning the rod in a corner, hanging it like a rifle, even the way the rod was made and the glue used could cause the tips or any section of the rod to take a set, especially if there was a weak flat in the section. As for two tips so that you can rotate them, well, that is partly true, but it very much depends on the rod.  A great many of the older, and even some newer rods are made with two tips to do various things.  Some had a Wet Fly action tip and a Dry Fly action tip.  Some were and are even produced to handle different line weights – say a 5 and a 7. As for bamboo losing power after a time, that happens after many years of fishing.  There is no need to rest a tip after a day of fishing. One other point about two tips comes up often, and that is that the second tip is an insurance policy against breakage.  Nice to have a spare tip when you are at a remote camp for a few days. Lastly, should a rod take a set, you can have it removed.  But chances are that the set will reapear in time.

Response:

While picking the brain of a more experienced fly fisherman today I was puzzled by a remark he made about bamboo rods.  He said the reason for two tips was to permit a tip to "rest".  According to him bamboo begins to lose power in the tip section after several hours of fishing and must be "rested" for a time. I find this improbable but would like to hear about the behavior of bamboo as a fly-rod material and any special care required.

Hi Wayne, Bamboo is an organic material which does soften up and wear out over time with hard use, but a few hours of casting is a bit of a stretch.  Also, because the material is no longer alive, It can’t repair itself or get stronger form resting.   The two tips were supplied because the tip  flexes the most and wears out the quickest. If you alternate the tips everytime you go out fishing it will typically take 50 years of hard fishing to soften them up to the point that you need to use a lighter line than the rod originally cast.  If you use the same tip all the time, it takes ~25 years of hard fishing to reach this point. this is a slow process and happens so gradually that the fly fisher rarely realizes it’s happened. It’s possible for the butt section to also soften up, but there is so much more material in the butt section, it is rare. Most people who used bamboo rods in their heyday, didn’t alternate the tips every time they went out.  They used one until they broke it (typically in a door of some kind)  and then used the other tip. If the rod was used a lot and fished with the same tip, using the other tip on makes the rod cast entirely differently.   When you look at such a rod, it’s usually pretty easy to determine which tip was used the most. Dependant upon what type of glue was used to make the rod, you can also put a set (or permanent bend) in the rod by fighting particulalry large fish for extended periods of time.  To counteract this, many who use bamboo rods will turn the rod over during the fight, and fight the fish with the reel above the rod instead of below it.  The idea was to even out the stress on the tip and keep it straight.  Still others will point to the set in their rod as a battle scar and saythings like, "You should have seen the fish that put that set in my rod — monster!!".  Most old, well used,  bamboo rods have some evidence of a set in them.  If the set gets bad enough to inhibit casting, it can be taken out with the judicious use of dry heat, preferably done by an experienced bamboo rod builder.                                  Hope this helps,                                        Dan Dan Gracia Orvis

Response:

The answer to both of your questions is YES…..

Along with Larry’s good advice, in using cane pay attention to the varnish and other details. If there are nicks and problems moisture can get in and delaminate it so touch it up with spar varnish.  If you hear clicking from a ferrule take care of it before it works loose and causes a break. When playing a good sized fish turn the rod around so it’s not always bending the same direction, to prevent putting a permanent bend in it. And never ever put it away damp.  It is better for it to be out in the rain overnight than in a damp cloth sleeve in a closed tube. I am gradually switching to cane for most of my fishing. I enjoy the slower pace of casting. I enjoy the more substantial heft of the solid cane in the light rods compared to hollow rods that feel weightless. Solid cane is more rugged than hollow graphite when you step on it. You feel the line load the rod and the way the rod springs back to fling it.  Someone spent as much time to make the rods as I had to work to pay for them.  You can buy great cane rods that collectors shun for $100-200 because maybe someone broke an inch off the tip or rewrapped them without regard for color matching. Friday I used an old 8 wt. Granger on the North Umpqua and caught a 10 lb. wild steelhead. That rod might be too heavy to cast all day but I sit and watch a river half the time anyway, the best technique of all for success and enjoyment. My modern reel backlashed so I had to play it by hand and hold tight when it tried to run. I should have used a pflueger.  The rod had backbone to spare. The smile will last for months, regardless of how the Raiders play. I am more hoping we can get the Oakland A’s back in a few years. Mark Vinsel Oakland, CA www.vinsel.com

Response:

Sorry but I just have to comment on the Traitor Raiders. Don’t watch them anymore, don’t care. Let them move back to LA. When a team can fill the stands and the owner still moves them because of pure greed, that team should no longer be supported by those that care. Same thing should have happened to the Baltimore Colts when they moved. Although football teams are privately owned, they take on the name of the city where they play, it wasn’t the A. Davis Raiders, It was the Oakland Raiders, in using the name, they owe something to the city and fans that supported them so well Jerry in Lodi (close to Oakland) http://www.softcom.net/users/dorado — ——- Hope you always have time to go fishing, Jerry in Lodi      Al & Jerry’s Excellent Adventures           http://www.softcom.net/users/dorado     Member: Save Our Stripers          http://www.softcom.net/users/dorado/sos.htm

Response:

Yes, bamboo requires a much slower stroke than graphite. A good caster adjusts to the rod instead of finding a rod that he can cast. There are no more REAL Raiders.  It’s like the old saying "you can’t go home again".  Al Davis really stuck it to the taxpayers of Alameda County and we didn’t even get a chance to vote on the money we are paying for the pleasure of watching them loose.  It looks like they are going to repeat their loosing performance again this year. — Ernie Harrison Remove NOSPAM to send E-Mail Selling my Fly Fishing Books Go to: http://users.ccnet.com/~emh – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The answer to both of your questions is YES….. Naturally, you’ll need to carefully inspect the rods for splits between the cane sections, tight ferrules, no unraveling wraps on the eyes and a tight reel seat. You need to handle the rod carefully, not to load it too much, make some nice gentle casts, say up to 30′ with it at first and then lengthen the line…..you will likely be surprised how smooth it feels and how well you feel the line straighten out behind you as opposed to graphite. The REAL Raiders had a glorious existence in OAKLAND, CALIFORNIA until their bonehead owner decided to "fool with Mother Nature"…he wasn’t making enough money, made ridiculous demands on the city and county who owned th estadium the Raiders played and won super bowl championships from and move the team to Los Angeles….they went into the former LA Coliseum which had ben renovated for the 84 olympics, never could fill it and failed to have much success playing there…..a few years back, they lied to the former city and county in which they won lots of fans and games, convinced them to rebiuld the stadium, sell "seat licenses"

Response:

Well when you reach my age the first thing to go is your memory and I forgot what the second thing is. — Ernie Harrison Remove NOSPAM to send E-Mail Selling my Fly Fishing Books Go to: http://users.ccnet.com/~emh – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Errol Mann is my investment broker….he doesn’t fish I remember George Blanda,I don’t remember Don.

Response:

As a follow-up question to the group: Is it realistic to expect to use a 30 to 70 year old bamboo  rod for day to day fishing.  Even if in otherwise good condition would the moisture loss and case hardening of bamboo occur as in wood to reduce flexibility and increase internal friction damage? Thanks to the group for the excellent information about bamboo. Was there a football team called Raiders? Wayne To fish is human…to release devine.

Response:

The answer to both of your questions is YES….. Naturally, you’ll need to carefully inspect the rods for splits between the cane sections, tight ferrules, no unraveling wraps on the eyes and a tight reel seat. You need to handle the rod carefully, not to load it too much, make some nice gentle casts, say up to 30′ with it at first and then lengthen the line…..you will likely be surprised how smooth it feels and how well you feel the line straighten out behind you as opposed to graphite. The REAL Raiders had a glorious existence in OAKLAND, CALIFORNIA until their bonehead owner decided to "fool with Mother Nature"…he wasn’t making enough money, made ridiculous demands on the city and county who owned th estadium the Raiders played and won super bowl championships from and move the team to Los Angeles….they went into the former LA Coliseum which had ben renovated for the 84 olympics, never could fill it and failed to have much success playing there…..a few years back, they lied to the former city and county in which they won lots of fans and games, convinced them to rebiuld the stadium, sell "seat licenses"

Response:

I remember George Blanda,I don’t remember Don.

Response:

Errol Mann is my investment broker….he doesn’t fish – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I remember George Blanda,I don’t remember Don.

Response:

Larry, I remember Don Blanda, he used to fill in for Ken Stabler.  He was the oldest quarterback playing at that time, but normally was the Raiders place kicker.  Those were the good old days. — Ernie Harrison Remove NOSPAM to send E-Mail Selling my Fly Fishing Books Go to: http://users.ccnet.com/~emh – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The 3 canes I have, all having two tips at least at ONE time, have tips of differing composition…I mean one of them being of a stouter material. There is/was a marked difference in the performance of the rods dependent on the tip used…I had always thought of it as a "nymphing tip" and a "dry fly tip", that’s how different the action of the rods were. I still take one cane out each trip, and get it maybe a half hour of action, but then they go back to rest, with a brandy and a cigar…..=8^) I refer to them as my "Blanda Rods" for those of you with remembrances of Raiders football in the late 60s – early 70s. Larry #:)#

Response:

The 3 canes I have, all having two tips at least at ONE time, have tips of differing composition…I mean one of them being of a stouter material. There is/was a marked difference in the performance of the rods dependent on the tip used…I had always thought of it as a "nymphing tip" and a "dry fly tip", that’s how different the action of the rods were. I still take one cane out each trip, and get it maybe a half hour of action, but then they go back to rest, with a brandy and a cigar…..=8^) I refer to them as my "Blanda Rods" for those of you with remembrances of Raiders football in the late 60s – early 70s. Larry #:)#

Response:

I always thought the idea of two tips was that the tip is the most likely the section to get  broken. — Ernie Harrison Remove NOSPAM to send E-Mail Selling my Fly Fishing Books Go to: http://users.ccnet.com/~emh – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – While picking the brain of a more experienced fly fisherman today I was puzzled by a remark he made about bamboo rods.  He said the reason for two tips was to permit a tip to "rest".  According to him bamboo begins to lose power in the tip section after several hours of fishing and must be "rested" for a time. I find this improbable but would like to hear about the behavior of bamboo as a fly-rod material and any special care required. Wayne To fish is human…to release devine.

Response:

While picking the brain of a more experienced fly fisherman today I was puzzled by a remark he made about bamboo rods.  He said the reason for two tips was to permit a tip to "rest".  According to him bamboo begins to lose power in the tip section after several hours of fishing and must be "rested" for a time.

I can’t speak as to bamboo rods (mine having only one tip each, but not normally used continuously for more than a couple of hours) — but fibreglass rods seemed to become "fatigued" after a day’s continuous use.  I first noticed this in cold weather (air temp 30 to 40 deg. F.) fishing for Great Lakes steelhead with a Fenwick fibreglass rod about 1970.  It seemed important enough that when I got a second state-of-the-art glass rod I used to swap after 3 or 4 hours. This fatigue phenomenon has not been observed in graphite rods (Loomis and no-brand IM6.)  But then I have not for 20 years flogged the water continuously all day long when fishing for fall steelhead, being physically weaker and more experienced . . . . — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

Response:

Question:

I think it’s about time that somewhere some fisheries managers bite the big one and introduce regulations that restrict all anglers in trout fisheries (or bass etc) to a minimum number of fish killed per year ( as Jon suggests) and a minimum number of fish landed per day.

I’m all for this.  I was on a streak last spring– caught one fish on every outing for three weeks.  But, usually I don’t catch anything. It’d be great to have a regulation that guarantees me a minimum number of fish landed per day! — Tight Threads,         Charley Renn         Corvallis, OR

Response:

Its Catch and Cook. I practice it regularly. What is the point if spending hundreds of dollars in tackle and not eating a fish that you catch? I am not saying only fly fishing. I eat reds and specks that I catch on an Abu Garcia 6500 as much as I do a 16 inch trout caught on a 18 Adams. It is a simple thing and would be common if it wern’t for the Bunny Huggers. Am I the only one that eats fish here? If you get a fish that is as good as a trout as table fair, you should make it table fair. i know I’ll get hell from everyone about this but I accept that. BryceC

– Brice, Wake up! Where is the next fish you cook comming from? This is not a bunny hug, a tree hug, a rock hug or any other "Environmental issue." Say you own a pond with 100 fish in it, if you want to fish the pond every day, you will soon realize that catch and release is the only way you can sustain your sport. Or, of course, you could open a hatchery . . . . / o          /                                    |   __ /        /         Douglas Easton             |                                /                                      |                                                     *

Response:

Well I will not judge you for your way of life, but don’t come up to Montana and try to catch and cook in any of the prime trout areas, because you will be arrested if I see it…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Its Catch and Cook. I practice it regularly. What is the point if spending hundreds of dollars in tackle and not eating a fish that you catch? I am not saying only fly fishing. I eat reds and specks that I catch on an Abu Garcia 6500 as much as I do a 16 inch trout caught on a 18 Adams. It is a simple thing and would be common if it wern’t for the Bunny Huggers. Am I the only one that eats fish here? If you get a fish that is as good as a trout as table fair, you should make it table fair. i know I’ll get hell from everyone about this but I accept that. BryceC Ain’t nothing wrong with keeping.  Depends on why you fish.  Frankly, I like the total experience and an satisfied with the challenge, the "art" of flyfishing, the environment, etc.  I don’t need to harvest the fish to be satisfied and therefore I fish entirely catch and release. however, I certainly do not blame anyone for harvesting what can be used appropriately.

Response:

fish, then it is theoretically possible for a larger % of the population to be decimated by C&R methods than by C&K

It’s a nice theory but empirical evidence just doesn’t bear it out. In fact empirical evidence disproves it.  Go fish both the C&R and C&K section of the San Juan River for instance.  The two areas are adjacent. In a day of fishing the former you’ll typically catch about 30 fat healthy fish running 12-24 inches; in the latter you’ll catch a handful of scrawny 10-inch stockers.  Which is decimated? Even what I’ve said above is overly simplistic.

No actually, it’s too complicated.  The facts are clear, simple, and undeniable.   — -Wayne Trzyna

Response:

: Hopefully, we’re not : carrying fin tags or punch cards anytime soon. Why? Just curious… JonCook.

Since what was proposed was essentially an honor system, what’s the point of punch cards? I either follow the rules or I don’t. The paperwork is a potential bureaucratic nightmare. It just makes fishing more expensive for everyone. For the record, I have killed one fish on the Platte in 16 years of fishing it. The fin tags would be of no use to me unless someone could convince me that killing fish there improved the fishery. (Colorado has a great bag limit foroverpopulated pond brookies under 8" that more than satisfies my appetite for fresh trout and HELPS the population.) However the 40 caught per season is interesting. As tough as the Platte can be some days, therehave been numerous days where the seasonal limit would have been filled. I only get to fish there 1 to 10 or 12 days a year while I’m visiting family in the Springs. What about the guys who fish there much more than that? How would they feel? Or is the real issue here limiting the number of fishing days to improve the fisherman’s aesthetic experience as opposed to protecting a fishery? Could it be this is just a stalking horse for another round of yuppie bashing?  Not saying I know the answer, but it’s an interesting question. I fish the Platte during the week at off times of the year, often with snow on the ground, because I want to see fewer people. I guess with punch cards and fin tags I could go whenever I wanted and see fewer people, but I’ve come to love the Canyon more the times that I go than any other. Probably wouldn’t change a thing. BP

Response:

wayne trzyna  wrote in article I think it’s about time that somewhere some fisheries managers bite the big one and introduce regulations that restrict all anglers in trout fisheries (or bass etc) to a minimum number of fish killed per year ( as Jon suggests) and a minimum number of fish landed per day. Ideally it would require a punch card or tag system and the max catch per day (regardless if they are all released) would have to operate fairly much on an honour system – but I think most fishers would do so. This is unnecessary.  If a person is catching dozens of fish that fact implies there are plenty of fish to catch.  It seems silly to regulate "number of fish landed" in this scenario.

This may be a naive assumption.  (Before you react.  Note that I said ‘may’.)  I have no facts on this issue (and certainly would appreciate it if anyone could contribute some), but it stands to reason that C&R could have it’s own pitfalls.  If it is true that a certain percentage of returned fish die as a result of having been caught and handled, and it is true that there are many fishermen who are successful at catching many fish, then it is theoretically possible for a larger % of the population to be decimated by C&R methods than by C&K (where fishers keep all they catch, must stop fishing when the limit is reached,  and compliance to these regs is high….i.e. an ‘ideal’ C&K fishery). Even what I’ve said above is overly simplistic.  We all know that there are a variety of factors that uniquely effect each fishery, and to some degree, I think the jury is still out as to what works best where.  There is no magic bullet that is going to cure the underlying problem…overpopulation of fishers.  (I sure aint gonna stop fishing, are you?).  Unfortunately, we have found all too often that well meant resource management techniques, even though they look good on paper, fail to measure up to our expectations.  I suspect that this may be true of C&R, at least on some fisheries, but again I have no specific facts. Does anyone know of any scholarly investigations of the long term impacts of C&R fishing?

Response:

A friend of mine (bait fisher) had an excellent idea.  On the South Platte around Deckers there is a 2 fish over 16" slot limit.   as a result you won’t find a lot of fish over 16".  This is a wrong approach. switch to 2, or4 fish under 12", and let the big ones go. How’s that? </c

Response:

Sounds nice but what happens when all the bigs ones die of old age and here ain’t any little ones around to grow big because they’ve all been C & C’s (or whatever the latest inane acroynm or synthetic politically correct terminology is) Ralph H – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -A friend of mine (bait fisher) had an excellent idea.  On the South Platte around Deckers there is a 2 fish over 16" slot limit.   as a result you won’t find a lot of fish over 16".  This is a wrong approach. switch to 2, or4 fish under 12", and let the big ones go. How’s that? </c

Response:

Chaz, given the pressure on the SP, Ralph’s probably right. So, how about: Define some section of the SP, say Cheesman to Oxyoke (that right?), then, each angler can keep 4 fish per year, any size, and (this is the key) can only catch a total of 40 fish per year. With that, the SP would be a truely great fishery, and those 2-10 days you fished it per year would be much more memorable than the 50 you do now (you being anyone who fishes it that much now, not neccessarily Chaz). JonCook.

: : Sounds nice but what happens when all the bigs ones die of : old age and here ain’t any little ones around to grow big : because they’ve all been C & C’s (or whatever the latest inane : acroynm or synthetic politically correct terminology is) : Ralph H : A friend of mine (bait fisher) had an excellent idea.  On the South : Platte around Deckers there is a 2 fish over 16" slot limit.   as a : result you won’t find a lot of fish over 16".  This is a wrong approach. : switch to 2, or4 fish under 12", and let the big ones go. : : How’s that? : : </c

Response:

Its Catch and Cook. I practice it regularly. What is the point if spending hundreds of dollars in tackle and not eating a fish that you catch? I am not saying only fly fishing. I eat reds and specks that I catch on an Abu Garcia 6500 as much as I do a 16 inch trout caught on a 18 Adams. It is a simple thing and would be common if it wern’t for the Bunny Huggers. Am I the only one that eats fish here? If you get a fish that is as good as a trout as table fair, you should make it table fair. i know I’ll get hell from everyone about this but I accept that. BryceC

Ain’t nothing wrong with keeping.  Depends on why you fish.  Frankly, I like the total experience and an satisfied with the challenge, the "art" of flyfishing, the environment, etc.  I don’t need to harvest the fish to be satisfied and therefore I fish entirely catch and release. however, I certainly do not blame anyone for harvesting what can be used appropriately.

Response:

Sounds nice but what happens when all the bigs ones die of old age and here ain’t any little ones around to grow big because they’ve all been C & C’s (or whatever the latest inane acroynm or synthetic politically correct terminology is)

Yes, that is the fly in the ointment.  You could expect more stocks because larger fish produce more eggs, etc. – but remember only a few small ones would be kept. But you’re right.  The number of small fish would decline, especially on the SP – I doubt there is a great deal of natural reproduction and they won’t stock it, so……. </c – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ralph H

Response:

Chaz, given the pressure on the SP, Ralph’s probably right. So, how about: Define some section of the SP, say Cheesman to Oxyoke (that right?), then, each angler can keep 4 fish per year, any size, and (this is the key) can only catch a total of 40 fish per year.

For anglers who keep some/most/all of thier legal catch, a 40 fish/year limit would be totally unenforceable.  Unless, of course, you gave them "tear-away tags"  as part of their liscense and made them tag the fins of thier fish.   Hey, what a great way to limit exclusive Catch and Kill fishing.  Make killing a bunch of fish more trouble than it’s worth! Jason B

Response:

Chaz, given the pressure on the SP, Ralph’s probably right. So, how about: Define some section of the SP, say Cheesman to Oxyoke (that right?), then, each angler can keep 4 fish per year, any size, and (this is the key) can only catch a total of 40 fish per year. With that, the SP would be a truely great fishery, and those 2-10 days you fished it per year would be much more memorable than the 50 you do now (you being anyone who fishes it that much now, not neccessarily Chaz). JonCook.

I think it’s about time that somewhere some fisheries managers bite the big one and introduce regulations that restrict all anglers in trout fisheries (or bass etc) to a minimum number of fish killed per year ( as Jon suggests) and a minimum number of fish landed per day. Ideally it would require a punch card or tag system and the max catch per day (regardless if they are all released) would have to operate fairly much on an honour system – but I think most fishers would do so. I don’t know much about the South Platte other than I recognize the name but it seems to me if you have a reg that allows killing only fish of 16" or over and fish that size are rare then something isn’t working (providing the river is able to grow good numbers of fish to that size). you’ve got to wonder if a limit of 4 smaller fish will help either if the kill so seriously affects the larger fish. I think that most of us want our waters managed so there is a more or less normal distribution of all age classes. Wiping out one class to protect the other doesn’t make sense and will likely lead to an imbalance in the long run! Ralph H – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : : Sounds nice but what happens when all the bigs ones die of : old age and here ain’t any little ones around to grow big : A friend of mine (bait fisher) had an excellent idea.  On the South : Platte around Deckers there is a 2 fish over 16" slot limit.   as a : result you won’t find a lot of fish over 16".  This is a wrong approach. : switch to 2, or4 fish under 12", and let the big ones go. : : How’s that? : : </c

Response:

Sounds nice but what happens when all the bigs ones die of old age and here ain’t any little ones around to grow big because they’ve all been C & C’s (or whatever the latest inane acroynm or synthetic politically correct terminology is) Ralph H

I let the hatcheries replenish the stock. I also don’t get very many chances to trout fish so I make the best of the ones that I catch. BryceC

Response:

        <<Killing a fish and eating it is not a dishonorable thing to do. The angler should use a little discretion, though. Where they are scarce, it’s foolish to kill them. On the other hand, if the trout are plentiful I may keep one or two per trip.         You are right, Bryce, when you admit that you are likely to catch some flak over this issue. But, where legal, it is your RIGHT to do that if you wish. People can holler all they want, but it’s their problem not yours. Just use good judgment, and don’t overcook those beauties. Enjoy! (Try poaching them in wine and garlic.) I fish the Tellico so there are plenty of fish around there. The Tellico Hatchery Stocks weekly. I also fish the West Prong Pigeon, the Little and the Elk. All have lots of fish. If I were fishing Abrahms creek or Rabbit Creek that would be a different story. I’m glad someone agrees with me. BryceC

Response:

Jason, the reason game laws work is because most people observe them voluntarily. There is simply not enough DFG (or DNR, depending on where you’re from) money to enforce these laws.   Laws that are "more trouble than they are worth"  are the ones least likely to be honored by the requisite number of fishermen.                                                            -dnc- Jason Beary wrote – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – [snip]  Unless, of course, you gave them "tear-away tags"  as part of their liscense and made them tag the fins of thier fish.   Hey, what a great way to limit exclusive Catch and Kill fishing.  Make killing a bunch of fish more trouble than it’s worth! Jason B

Response:

So if I get skunked, your going to fine me?  (No need to reply.  I know what you meant.  Just couldn’t resist) —                                                            -dnc- I think it’s about time that somewhere some fisheries managers bite the big one and introduce regulations that restrict all anglers in trout fisheries (or bass etc) to a …[snip]…. a minimum number of fish

landed per day.

Response:

I think it’s about time that somewhere some fisheries managers bite the big one and introduce regulations that restrict all anglers in trout fisheries (or bass etc) to a minimum number of fish killed per year ( as Jon suggests) and a minimum number of fish landed per day. Ideally it would require a punch card or tag system and the max catch per day (regardless if they are all released) would have to operate fairly much on an honour system – but I think most fishers would do so.

This is unnecessary.  If a person is catching dozens of fish that fact implies there are plenty of fish to catch.  It seems silly to regulate "number of fish landed" in this scenario. I don’t know much about the South Platte other than I recognize the name but it seems to me if you have a reg that allows killing only fish of 16" or over and fish that size are rare then something isn’t working (providing the river is able to grow good numbers of fish to that size).

There are a bunch of dubious assumptions underlying this thread.  The fact that one is not catching bigger fish does not mean that there are no big fish to be caught.  We all understand this more than we’d care to admit. But I agree that slot limits that allow killing only big fish are counterproductive. — -Wayne Trzyna

Response:

-Wayne Trzyna

<snip I don’t know much about the South Platte other than I recognize the name but it seems to me if you have a reg that allows killing only fish of 16" or over and fish that size are rare then something isn’t working (providing the river is able to grow good numbers of fish to that size). There are a bunch of dubious assumptions underlying this thread.  The fact that one is not catching bigger fish does not mean that there are no big fish to be caught.  We all understand this more than we’d care to admit.

If the 16" fish is rare then you will fish somewhere else right? If the 16" fish is rare, you will change the regs to protect them right? Seems there are an awful lot of people on this group going out of their way to poor mouth the Platte. I suspect Wayne knows that Cheeseman Canyon(Pure C&R) has plenty of 16"+ fish and has for years. Maybe its not like the eighties when there were many days when almost all the fish I caught were above 16", but… I must admit however that I have never caught as many larger fish below the canyon (kill one over 16" stretch), even in the better days. Numbers of total fish caught were somewhat similar though. Only 3 real differences between the areas: Better Habitat (Canyon), C&R vs. C&R&K(1 over 16"), Much easier access (below the canyon). Differences are probably attributable to a complex blend of  all three. The solution for the whole fishery should be derived deliberately. Hopefully, we’re not carrying fin tags or punch cards anytime soon. BP

Response:

Its Catch and Cook. I practice it regularly. What is the point if spending hundreds of dollars in tackle and not eating a fish that you catch? I am not saying only fly fishing. I eat reds and specks that I catch on an Abu Garcia 6500 as much as I do a 16 inch trout caught on a 18 Adams. It is a simple thing and would be common if it wern’t for the Bunny Huggers. Am I the only one that eats fish here? If you get a fish that is as good as a trout as table fair, you should make it table fair. i know I’ll get hell from everyone about this but I accept that. BryceC

Response:

Its Catch and Cook. I practice it regularly. What is the point if spending hundreds of dollars in tackle and not eating a fish that you catch? I am not saying only fly fishing.

While that’s nice (and perhaps you’d like to trade some recipes): Somewhere some nincompoop(s) cooked this whole issue into a one or the other kind of argument. What was supposed to an idea of applying common sense for the good of fishing for the future has been perverted into a sort of quasi religion and had a concommittent religious backlash. That there are those who say you should never kill a fish and to kill a fish bespeakes a blatant disregard for the sport and the environment versus those who say there should always be a kill and a meal regardless or close a fishery down ( like you having to justify the cost of your sport with a meal on the table as if being on the water and hooking a fish or two can’t be enough) just proves to me there are people who don’t really want to think about an issue and then ironically decide they have all the answers. One eminent poster here once eluded to Ecclesiates and said there is a time to kill (as in your fishery has an undeniable surplus available) and a time to release (such as is the case for virtually all wild steelhead) where you can’t really be certain of a sufficient number of fish being available for the future of the stocks to be assured. It may be a matter of convention (like on the Dean) where the body of anglers fishing there agree releasing is the best thing to do or boil down to personal preference. But why not accept it as a fact sometimes it is best to let it live. For those that don’t like those sorts of fisheries they can go someplace else. It’s a big free wide world. Ralph H replace "spamsucks" with direct for email reply.

Response:

Its Catch and Cook. I practice it regularly. What is the point if spending hundreds of dollars in tackle and not eating a fish that you catch? I am not saying only fly fishing.  Am I the only one that eats fish here? BryceC

Bryce; The point is that many (most) FFermen prefer the opportunity to catch lots of quality fish all year.  If I and all other FFermen kept a good % of the trout we caught, there would really be very little reason to continue the sport.  Here in PA, wild trout would not exist in the numbers that they do were it not for voluntary C&R.  We have way more fishermen than fish to support the sport.  If people keep the fish they catch, it will not ever be able to be caught by other fishermen or yourself, guaranteed.  Here in the East, we would very quickly run out of the good populations of wild fish that already struggle to survive in the shadow of Man.  All Catch and Cook would do is deplete the resource to the point of destruction.  (But, then again, that IS the american way, isn’t it? Fuck it all to hell and let someone else pay for the baby.) Jason Beary

Response:

        Killing a fish and eating it is not a dishonorable thing to do. The angler should use a little discretion, though. Where they are scarce, it’s foolish to kill them. On the other hand, if the trout are plentiful I may keep one or two per trip.         You are right, Bryce, when you admit that you are likely to catch some flak over this issue. But, where legal, it is your RIGHT to do that if you wish. People can holler all they want, but it’s their problem not yours. Just use good judgment, and don’t overcook those beauties. Enjoy! (Try poaching them in wine and garlic.)

Response:

Jason makes a good point, but it is true that there is nothing wrong with keeping fish where it is legal to do so.  If you care about the resource (which you should if you want to continue to C&C) then I strongly recommend supporting a mixed management program in your area that protects some waters with C&R, some with limited C&K.  If eating trout is your real pleasure, try searching out the put-n-take waters in your area (if they exist).  Living in San Diego, as I do, means travelling long distances for abundant trout streams, but the winter fishing in local lakes for put-n-take trout is pretty good.  And believe it or not, the private hatchery that provides the fish feeds them on something that makes ‘em taste really good.  Maybe you can find something like this in your area.   —                                                            -dnc- – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Its Catch and Cook. I practice it regularly. What is the point if spending hundreds of dollars in tackle and not eating a fish that you catch? I am not saying only fly fishing.  Am I the only one that eats fish here? BryceC Bryce; The point is that many (most) FFermen prefer the opportunity to catch lots of quality fish all year.  If I and all other FFermen kept a good % of the trout we caught, there would really be very little reason to continue the sport.  

Response:

Question:

If you fish, boat, camp, hunt or anything to do with the great

outdoors and have friends that do the same, why not start your  OWN business with little or know cost to you? < The IRS does make a distinction between a hobby business and a real business. You may be asked to demonstrate that it is a real business and not just supporting your hobby. Just because you have the legal paperwork that shows it to be a "business" doesn’t mean that the IRS has to accept it. The small tax savings will be more than offset by the cost of an audit. You are just making yourself a target.

Response:

My name in Norm Larsen and I’d like to tell you a fishing story!! A couple of week ago a friend of mine came to me and asked me if I fished, I said sure I fish, why? Well he said: " if I could show you how you can deduct your fishing, camping, boating and hunting expenses from your income tax AND earn an income would you like to here about it? That was a no-brainer  for me, so I asked him to show it to me. He proceeded to show me of the most  interesting companies I had ever seen, The companies called Champion Fishing    Co.  based out of  Texas. They have a 197 page catalog that is full of outdoor  equipment. All name brand gear like Mitchell, Fenwick, Remmington etc. By October of this year they’ll have golfing, mountain bike and organized sporting equipment too!! I thought it made since to buy my gear from myself than from someone else! They have the simplest compensation plans I have ever seen too! There’s no start-up fees, no inventory, no quota’s , no organizational  tracking and no weekend deliveries!! Everything is shipped direct to the buyer. The recreational fishing industry is a $69.4 BILLION dollar a year business with 60 million people. That doesn’t include the Pro- Fishing industry, boating, camping or hunting!! Champion Fishing Co. has been growing at a fantastic rate. The number of reps has tripled since last October. Some states only have a few reps so were talking ground floor, "once in a life time opportunity"! If you fish, boat, camp, hunt or anything to do with the great outdoors and have friends that do the same, why not start your  OWN business with little or know cost to you? If would like more info on this program, please contact me by return email with your address and I’ll send you some info. If you give me your phone number I’ll call you a week or so after I send to answer any questions you may have. Sincerely, Norm Larsen

Response:

Question:

Anyone fished this lake? Any good? I’ll be in SF mid-April.

Response:

Anyone fished this lake? Any good? I’ll be in SF mid-April.

There are fish there I guess. I use to see some people around the edges with poles. I never saw a fish and I doubt if flies wil be of any use.. Regards — Michael Paine Mit der Dummheit kampfen Gotter selbst vergebens.

Response:

Anyone fished this lake? Any good? I’ll be in SF mid-April.

  To say that Merced is a lake is a bit of a stretch.There are some large marshmellow eater’s in that pond (s). The flat "concrete"  noses of the fish are truly nice:-).  Fish the surf  (salt) , which is less than a mile away.    Harry

Response:

There are some huge trout in that lake…..there is a upper and lower portion tho. Not sure which one is better. I believe that the upper lake needs a  boat more than the other one. I agree with that one post regarding flies. I havent seen fish rising out there and bait dunkers catch the most fish. But for bait fisherman Merced has some lunkers. Kurtz-

Response:

snip But for bait fisherman Merced has some lunkers.

Primarily retired brood stock from hatcheries around the state. Ross Wilson

Response:

 writes:

: :Anyone fished this lake? Any good? I’ll be in SF mid-April. This is a put and take lake that is not known for fly fishing. That said, there are some big fish planted, (and maybe some holovers.) I have lived in the area for 18 years and have thought about what a wooly bugger might do. Just never got around to trying. There are boat rentals available. So give it a try. George Berns Trout Live in Beautiful Places

Response:

Question:

I just got back from a two week vacation to the Bighorn & the Henry’s Fork.  The fishing was great! The Bighorn: Running at twice the volume that I’ve ever fished it before.  My objective was to put my girls into large rainbows and browns.  With the high water there places for them to wade on the right side looking downstream were extremely difficult.   BTW the volume flow was 6500 cfs.  I took the girls out with Frank Johnson from the Bighorn Trout Shop the first day.  The girls both caught Brown’s to 18 inches.  The long line releases ran about 5:1, but they did great under difficult conditions.  The nice gravel bars I expected them to be able to put them on were either four feet under water or completely washed out.  Many of my favorite dry fly areas (side channels and backwaters were completely washed out, never to be seen again).  Lets hear it for the DWR.  Frank feels that in ten to twenty years of the current mismanagement the bighorn will be a nice smooth irrigation ditch with no character. The next two days I took the oars and really enjoyed myself.  My twelve year old took a twenty-one inch rainbow male on the second day.  The fishing was good but not what I really like (too much lead). Henry’s Fork (July 3 thru July 9):  The weather turned cold and wet.  Sleet, hail and snow at higher elevations.  The only warm weather was on Thursday my last day. July 3: Fished the Fire Hole in wet cold weather.  Lots of PMD’s comming off, but not profusely.  Lot’s of small fish raising all over on the PMD’s. A few big fish were porposing regularily.  Looking closer I noticed Baetis were hatching and the big guys were keyed into the size 18 & 20’s.  I fished downstream with dry baetis emerger and had a ball with fish to 16 inches. Everyone else in my area was using the larger PMD’s and catching dinks. The rest of the trip I fished the Fork, concentrating on the Ranch.  Great hatches and great dry fly fishing.  At on point below the Osborn bridge there were five insect hatches in progress (micro caddis, evening caddis – size 18, large Caddis with speckled wings, PMD’s and Flav’s).  The fish keyed into different hatches as the light conditions changed. I’ll get on my soap box for a second.  The Fork is still a mighty sick river.  Lot’s of silt and Brown Drakes in the Millionaires Pool area where I remember only gravel.  Also a lot of the fish in the river a lake fish from the Res. that was drained last year.  You know immediately when you have a river fish, they jump 3 or 4 times and take you into your backing immediately.  The trout from the lake are much less robust.  The increase in trout numbers is great for the outfitters, but I miss the quality.  I missed having my clock cleaned by big trout on the Ranch, ripping line and rubbing me off in a weed bed.  The trout have to win sometimes to make it interesting. My only regret was that I had to leave without a spinner fall.   It was just too cold in the evenings, except for last Thursday.  I spent a beautiful evening on the ranch waiting for spinners and had to settle for a Brown Drake hatch.  The big trout were up for about thirty minutes before the White fish moved in and the trout were gone. It’s always fun  to spend the evening in Church (The Ranch)! If you want some great guides for the Ranch I’d recommend  Mate (The last name escapes me, if I ever knew it), who guides for Mike Lawson’s Henry’s Fork Anglers at last chance.

Response:

I forgot to mention that the area from the end of the Box to the Ranch was fishing great on drys (Caddis, PMD’s and Flav.’s).   Fish to raisers, don’t just cover water.  

Response: