Question:

I will be in Mitchell SD for opening day of phesant season next week. Does anyone know of any good areas near Mitchell that I could do a little fishing?

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4 hours drive to the black hills.  Some trout in the missouri river below the dam (damn?) near Pierre (2 hour drive).  Bass in Lake Mitchell. steve haun sioux falls, sd

I will be in Mitchell SD for opening day of phesant season next week. Does anyone know of any good areas near Mitchell that I could do a little

fishing?

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Just outside of Rapid City are two lovely streams that hold good fish and have excellent hatches.  Spring Creek and Rapid Creek. They are really worth fishing.

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Question:

So, I’ve been lurking around for a while and am still new to this newsgroup stuff, but i can’t help asking for help. Im just starting to FF for Steelhead and would apprec. any advice on the best places to FF for steelhead within a day trip from Portland, (any othr hint on tackle or tech. would also be much appreciated!) I’ve been fishing this area all my life about the last 20 FF mostly for trout and drift FF for steelies and salmon (only once have i caught any Chinook but what a thrill!) So I’m not a beginner but would like to maximize my chances for a hook up without running afoul of the rest of the regular fisherfolk. P.S. I’ve had problems with my postings going out multiple times so I’ll try to watch it. please advise if problem persists Russ Weitz "Reality is an escape for people who don’t fish" "Reality is an escape for people who don’t fish" – Unknown

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So, I’ve been lurking around for a while and am still new to this newsgroup stuff, but i can’t help asking for help. Im just starting to FF for Steelhead and would apprec. any advice on the best places to FF for steelhead within a day trip from Portland, (any othr hint on tackle or tech. would also be much appreciated!) I’ve been fishing this area all my life about the last 20 FF mostly for trout and drift FF for steelies and salmon (only once have i caught any Chinook but what a thrill!) So I’m not a beginner but would like to maximize my chances for a hook up without running afoul of the rest of the regular fisherfolk.

The Sandy/Salmon river to the east is only maybe 45 minutes away depending on what part of Portland you are coming from. The Trask and Wilson rivers to the west are probably about the same also depending on which side you live on. Add 30 minutes time if you are coming from Beaverton/Hillsboro going east or Gresham going west. Good Luck, I hear the rivers are finally starting to drop after a very wet November/December.      - Ken

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You might also want to check out the links under United States then Oregon at http://www.davisbrown.com/ffgeo.htm  There are plenty of places with fishing reports and fly shop assistance. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So, I’ve been lurking around for a while and am still new to this newsgroup stuff, but i can’t help asking for help. Im just starting to FF for Steelhead and would apprec. any advice on the best places to FF for steelhead within a day trip from Portland, (any othr hint on tackle or tech. would also be much appreciated!) I’ve been fishing this area all my life about the last 20 FF mostly for trout and drift FF for steelies and salmon (only once have i caught any Chinook but what a thrill!) So I’m not a beginner but would like to maximize my chances for a hook up without running afoul of the rest of the regular fisherfolk. P.S. I’ve had problems with my postings going out multiple times so I’ll try to watch it. please advise if problem persists Russ Weitz "Reality is an escape for people who don’t fish" "Reality is an escape for people who don’t fish" – Unknown

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Question:

I’ve heard the same thing and don’t get it. I’ve fished the Nissitissit and Squannacook six times and never seen a fish, never seen a fly and never seen anyone catch anything with corn, worms or flies. I bought the TU book ages ago and Kaplan’s Middlesex County Rivers book last year, called the local shops and even changed my local TU chapter to the Squan-A-Tissit hoping to at least see a rising fish. I’ve decided it’s a scam supported by the local outfitters. They’re only an hour from my house but a waste of time when an extra hour will get me to the Deerfield, Farmington or N.H. Doug – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi I went to fish the Nissitissit this saturday.  I would appreciate any tips people night have.  I have been told that this one of the best trout streams near boston.  But it seemed ‘dead’ to me, still tannic water. I tried the prescott bridge area which seemed in better shape and also the Henry Columbo area.  Does the stream die off in the later summer? How is the fall/winter fishing?

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I’ve heard the same thing and don’t get it. I’ve fished the Nissitissit and Squannacook six times and never seen a fish, never seen a fly and never [snip] While living in Boston, the Niss was a regular stop for me in the fall.  Caught

several large Brownies and saw more than I landed. What takes away from the river is that it warms up badly in the summer, and poaching. Poaching is a major problem in the FFO section.  The last time I was there, in the fall of 95′, a hunter told me that two guys and a can of worms took something like 60 fish out. We have similar problems in W. Pa.  Its a shame, because E. Ma has few opportunities for stream fishing for trout, and the Niss is perhaps one of the best.          good luck,          brad shuster

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Question:

Hi, is anyone here in this group who can give me informations for flyfishing posibilities in Italy south of the alps? Thanks Hans-Peter Weigel D-28213 Bremen

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – says… Hi, is anyone here in this group who can give me informations for flyfishing posibilities in Italy south of the alps? Thanks Hans-Peter Weigel D-28213 Bremen All the Italians come to Slovenia to fish – Italy sucks. Mike

In order to avoid another politicly or culturely motivated bout of mud slinging, I think you should clarify whether you meant that the fishing in Italy sucks  :-(  or whether you meant that Italy as a country sucks. ) Not Italian, but more sensitive to the feelings of nationalism than ever. Mike Uetz

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says… Hi, is anyone here in this group who can give me informations for flyfishing posibilities in Italy south of the alps? Thanks Hans-Peter Weigel D-28213 Bremen

All the Italians come to Slovenia to fish – Italy sucks. Mike

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In order to avoid another politicly or culturely motivated bout of mud slinging, I think you should clarify whether you meant that the fishing in Italy sucks  :-(  or whether you meant that Italy as a country sucks. ) Not Italian, but more sensitive to the feelings of nationalism than ever. Mike Uetz

Of course I’m refering to the fishing – this is rec.outdoors.fishing.fly NOT italy.as.a.country.sucks Mike

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Question:

Boca Paila and Casa Blanca have great permit, some Tarpon and  lotsa bones.  The bones are on the smallish side but you should get more chances a permit than in the Bahamas or Florida.  I’ve fished Boca Paila twice. Good folks.  Casa Blanca is just to the South of Boca Paila. Best day — 13 bones before lunch.   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Can anyone tell me where is the best lodge to goto for BIG Permit & Bonefish? Robert Wong                        1993 Honda Civic Si Hatchback                                          Advanced Timing Visit My New & Improved Homepage  http://www.gate.net/~foxer           Atkid – 48 days – down 20

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A great, and less expensive alternative to fishing at Asencion Bay is the CUZAN GUEST HOUSE at $1450 per week, double occupancy. Contact me for more info.    Gene Kelly

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writes: Can anyone tell me where is the best lodge to goto for BIG Permit &

Bonefish? If you want really big permit, the biggest are found in Ascension Bay on the Yucatan Penninsula of Mexico (Carribean side).  There is currently a world record pending from the area.   I fished there in June and stayed at the Ascension Bay Bonefish Club (great place for small parties – no more than a max of 6).  Joe Sugura is an excellent host.  Did a lot of looking and almost no casting to permit (one cast 5 feet behind a permit as he left the area).  One of the guys that week took 5 permit the biggest being around 26 lbs.  On the last day my fishing partner got off about a dozen casts to two permit that were over 30 lbs ( if only I’d been on the other side of the boat!). Kaufmann’s book is way off in its description of permit fishing in the area.  They have a great picture in the lodge of a triple on Permit (this is real unusual). Bonefish are plentiful there, but not nearly so big as the singles and doubles you’ll find in florida.   They make up for it by traveling in schools.  Some beautiful flats fishing. Food was great by the way. You can contact them through Fishing International (1-800-950-4242).                                        Good Fishing,                                               Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

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Can anyone tell me where is the best lodge to goto for BIG Permit & Bonefish? Robert Wong                        1993 Honda Civic Si Hatchback                                          Advanced Timing Visit My New & Improved Homepage  http://www.gate.net/~foxer           Atkid – 48 days – down 20

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Can anyone tell me where is the best lodge to goto for BIG Permit & Bonefish? Robert Wong                        1993 Honda Civic Si Hatchback                                         Advanced Timing Visit My New & Improved Homepage http://www.gate.net/~foxer           Atkid – 48 days – down 20

I think the biggest permit are caught in southern Florida. They catch pretty nice ones in Ascension Bay, Yucatan, Mexico. I think the biggest average size for bones is in southern Florida and the Bahamas. They are both very difficult on a fly and I would recommend working your way up the ladder by fishing for more plentiful, smaller fish that are much easier to catch. Personally, that is what I have been doing for the past fifteen years. Call us and we can tell you about many flats destinations. 800/4000FLY William Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA

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Question:

Many rivers still high, but they are dropping as fast as they went up.   Extremely hot weather melted a lot of snow(still a lot to melt, though).   Big Hole is dropping 10-15% per day.  2′ viz at Melrose yesterday, and salmon flies are showing up down near the "Notch".  River is fishing fairly well with nymphs.  Madison is beginning to drop, too, and traditionally the Montana Power Company drops the Madison flows around the 3rd week of June and begins to fill Hebgen Lake.  Gallatin and Yellowstone are still a mess.  Yellowstone has done some serious damage to  DePuy’s and Armstrong’s Spring Creeks, but NOONE knows for sure how much until the river goes done.  I guess I am the eternal optimist, and I figure this flood is like the YNP fires of 1988.  It will be temporarily inconvenient for us humans, but I expect this event will be beneficial.   Talked to Bob Auger, DePuy’s riverkeeper, yesterday, and he is poised to begin work to rebuild the dam as quickly as the water comes down.  I hope there will be fishing in DePuy’s again by mid-July(will take small bets on this!).  Beaverhead and Big Horn are very good.  Smith River is excellent.  Firehole and Henry’s  Fork are good, too.  Firehole has caddis and PMD’s and the Henry’s Fork is getting ready for green and brown drakes.  High water as this time of year is normal.  Remember, we have been in a decade long drought cycle here, and the recollections of many fishermen are of LOW water years.  Things will look fairly good by first week of July.   Dave Kumlien, Montana Troutfitters,Bozeman html

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Hi Dave, Thanks for the Montana report.  It’s obvious to me you spend a lot of time on it (and for our benefit) and I wanted you to know it’s appreciated. Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (96 catalog)

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Al Beatty writes: Hi Dave, Thanks for the Montana report.  It’s obvious to me you spend a lot of time on it (and for our benefit) and I wanted you to know it’s appreciated.

I second that. -Ande Rychter

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David, Thanks for the information.  It sure is helpful for those of us who live in the city (ie, Dallas, TX) who plan on traveling to Montana in the near term. I was wondering, do you not receive info on the North Blackfoot (from around North Fork down to either Scotty Browns bridge or Clear Creek), as well as Rock Creek? If you or anyone else could provide info on these areas (such as water conditions, hatch & pattern info, whether I should consider wading or floating, etc.) and what I might expect from around July 10 through July 14, I would appreciate it. Thanks again! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Many rivers still high, but they are dropping as fast as they went up.   Extremely hot weather melted a lot of snow(still a lot to melt, though).   Big Hole is dropping 10-15% per day.  2′ viz at Melrose yesterday, and salmon flies are showing up down near the "Notch".  River is fishing fairly well with nymphs.  Madison is beginning to drop, too, and traditionally the Montana Power Company drops the Madison flows around the 3rd week of June and begins to fill Hebgen Lake.  Gallatin and Yellowstone are still a mess.  Yellowstone has done some serious damage to  DePuy’s and Armstrong’s Spring Creeks, but NOONE knows for sure how much until the river goes done.  I guess I am the eternal optimist, and I figure this flood is like the YNP fires of 1988.  It will be temporarily inconvenient for us humans, but I expect this event will be beneficial.   Talked to Bob Auger, DePuy’s riverkeeper, yesterday, and he is poised to begin work to rebuild the dam as quickly as the water comes down.  I hope there will be fishing in DePuy’s again by mid-July(will take small bets on this!).  Beaverhead and Big Horn are very good.  Smith River is excellent.  Firehole and Henry’s  Fork are good, too.  Firehole has caddis and PMD’s and the Henry’s Fork is getting ready for green and brown drakes.  High water as this time of year is normal.  Remember, we have been in a decade long drought cycle here, and the recollections of many fishermen are of LOW water years.  Things will look fairly good by first week of July.   Dave Kumlien, Montana Troutfitters,Bozeman html

Steve Ginn 2nd VP – Consulting Group

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Question:

I NEED INDIVID’S WILLING TO USE THEIR TALENTS TO REFURBISH THE THE LATE                                           1) THE POOL IS COLLAPSED ON ONE SIDE—–NEED AN ENGIE TYPE WILLING TO SWAP FISHING FOR HIS OPINION.                                                        2) THE CESTE FOR FRESH WATER IS IN NEED OF MAJOR REPAIR.                                                       JOIN MAJOR SALTWATER FLYFISHING LEGENDS FOR A WEEKEND OF YOUR CHOICE AND HELP US RE-ESTABLISH THE BANG-BANG CLUB AS THE BEST BONEFISHING DESTINATION IN THE                                       PEACE,   CAPT. RAHE                                                          305-293-8088

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I NEED INDIVID’S WILLING TO USE THEIR TALENTS TO REFURBISH THE THE LATE                                           1) THE POOL IS COLLAPSED ON ONE SIDE—–NEED AN ENGIE TYPE WILLING TO SWAP FISHING FOR HIS OPINION.                                                        2) THE CESTE FOR FRESH WATER IS IN NEED OF MAJOR REPAIR.                                                       JOIN MAJOR SALTWATER FLYFISHING LEGENDS FOR A WEEKEND OF YOUR CHOICE AND HELP US RE-ESTABLISH THE BANG-BANG CLUB AS THE BEST BONEFISHING DESTINATION IN THE

Hey, "Capt." Rahe, Your previous two posts show you to be an a–hole (not surprising considering the aol address) and furthermore, see that little key labeled "caps lock" over to the left on your keyboard? TURN IT OFF!!! David B.

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Question:

I am interested in learning more about flyfishing for stripers in fresh water.  I live in the San Francisco Bay Area and would like any information that pertains to fishing the SF bay delta area as well.   I would like to know of good books to read and local quides to contact Thanks Stu Booth

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Good places for stripers in the SF area are Franks Tract in the Delta; you will need a boat, and the O’Neill Forebay of San Luis Reservoir which is accessible by canoe, float tube or boat.  The O’Neill is right at the intersection of Rte. 152 and I-5 near Los Banos jsut as you come down out of the Pacheco Pass into the Central Valley.  Although I haven’t caught one yet, there are reported to be a nice population of big stripers in this small lake. There are also stripers to be found in the main reservoir too, but it is a much more formidable piece of water. Pick up a copy of California Fly Fisher.  There are always ads for guides for striper fishing the bay and Franks tract in the back. Good luck–Crashjibe

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Question:

: Just started fly fishing this past fall ( mostly Greate Lakes Steelhead ). : This Saturday is the opening day of trout season here in NY. : I was hoping someone could recommend some patterns that may work this : early in the season on hatchery type ‘put and take’ type rainbows : ( we don’t practice the ‘take part’ ). —PCR         For stockers some of the classics flies are the best:  Gold Ribbed Hare’s Ear’s, Adams, Wulff dries, Wooly Worms, and Wooley Buggers.  For the nymphs and the dries, you want to fish big, like size 12 and 14.  You can also use stonefly nymphs or hellagrammites in sizes 6-10.  Stocked fish often just like something they can see.  Glo bugs should work alright on the stockers.

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Early season flies that work great in the Syracuse area are pheasant tail, both bead headed & traditional, picket pin, wooly bugger (various colors), and G.R. Hares ear. P.S. on Sunday, I saw some Quill Gordon duns flirting about on Limestone Creek here in Syracuse. G.R. Hares Ear should work, sizes 16, 18. PH – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just started fly fishing this past fall ( mostly Greate Lakes Steelhead ). This Saturday is the opening day of trout season here in NY. I was hoping someone could recommend some patterns that may work this early in the season on hatchery type ‘put and take’ type rainbows ( we don’t practice the ‘take part’ ). Have been having alot of success using glo-bugs and frammus patterns on 3 – 10 pound Rainbows but aren’t sure what to use on the smaller (10 – 12 inch ) stockers.   Thanks in advance PCR

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just started fly fishing this past fall ( mostly Greate Lakes Steelhead ). This Saturday is the opening day of trout season here in NY. I was hoping someone could recommend some patterns that may work this early in the season on hatchery type ‘put and take’ type rainbows ( we don’t practice the ‘take part’ ). Have been having alot of success using glo-bugs and frammus patterns on 3 – 10 pound Rainbows but aren’t sure what to use on the smaller (10 – 12 inch ) stockers.   Thanks in advance PCR

On the 10 -12 inch stockers , you should use PELLET FLIES!!!!!!                Greg

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Woolly Buggers are killers for the stockers.  Black, Olive and "Grizzly" colors are great.  Purple & Black have worked great, too. And, if you really want to catch a stocker out of a put &take stream, tip your wooly bugger with a berkley power grub (eek, did he say "BAIT"?) Yep.  If you want to catch fish. Jim Elias Blue Grass IA H.Y.M.R.

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Just started fly fishing this past fall ( mostly Greate Lakes Steelhead ). This Saturday is the opening day of trout season here in NY. I was hoping someone could recommend some patterns that may work this early in the season on hatchery type ‘put and take’ type rainbows ( we don’t practice the ‘take part’ ). Have been having alot of success using glo-bugs and frammus patterns on 3 – 10 pound Rainbows but aren’t sure what to use on the smaller (10 – 12 inch ) stockers.   Thanks in advance PCR

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Question:

This subject is getting a lot of press with the identification of the disease in the Madison, so there is (finally) some information out there. The disease has been in Colorado for some time now and is getting worse. The culprit is almost certainly illegal stocking or (apparently in the case of Colorado) knowingly stocking with diseased fish.  There is evidence that the disease can be spread to other rivers via boots and other fishing equipment, but (at least according to Dick Vincent at the Montana Fish, Wildlife and Parks Department) it is not spread by wildfowl. Brook trout and salmon are also affected. I suspect now that a river as important as the Madison has been affected, we will see a lot more about this and other threatening diseases.

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I would be interested in seeing the Washington Post article and the article mentioned in December from the Bozeman Gazette.  The posts I have been reading here about Whirling disease have really been upsetting.  My fishing buddies and I are trying to figure out what the best course of action for us would be.  Certainly no good plans have come from the "experts" as of yet (this would seem to be especially true in Colorado). Why hasn’t there been much yet in the fly fishing ‘literature’?  I haven’t read a thing in FR&R or Flyfisherman.  It would seem that research into why Browns and other unaffected species are immune would be the way to get this disease out of fish populations.  Does anyone involved in Fisheries Management or Biology at Montana State or at CU know anything about any research into the molecular biology/pathogenesis of this disease?  Please post!

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If this thing is protozoan and can potentially be spread by our wading boots, does anyone have any suggestions or know what we should be doing with our waders after fishing any of the potentially affected waters?  How long can the protozoa live out of water?  I often fish the Madison for a day or two, then go to the spring creeks in the Paradise Valley.  I would hate to be contributing to the spread of this disease into those waters, or any other for that matter!

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:   What about cutthroats? From what I have heard–in both Montana : and Colorado (and perhaps the Truckee too)–the brown trout are OK! : Does anybody know anything about Whirling disease and cutthroats? The Washington Post article mentioned that cutts are susceptible to the disease. Rick — T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher Assistant professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    |  These University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    |  opinions Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. |  are mine.  

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as u have pointed out whirling disease has made its way inot the wild population and indeed this is bad news.  as i have had it described to me this disease effects the delicate bone structure in juvinelle fish so when frightened/starteled they swim in small fast concentric circles instead of going for cover.  in addition, i have also heard that it is usually the result of the close confines of hatcherys that spread it, as u may also have heard the state of colorado fish & game department is releasing hatchery fish with this disease into some of their blue ribbon water, for what reason god alone knows and god aint speakin on this subject.  anyway i hope that the local TU chapters get involed in this an can help Mr. Vincent out.  from all reports he is a pretty good guy and knows a thing or two about how to maintain a wild trout population.  any news on this unhappy event is most welcome

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disease has been discovered in the wild rainbow populations of Montana’s upper Madison. None of us here knows anything more than that just yet. But it continues to look bad. The outfitters haven’t really caught on, because the spring/winter fishing is good at this very moment. But whirling disease, apparently, only effects the tiddlers. In a few more seasons, once the current crop of bigger rainbows has died off from old age, there may be no more little fish to replace them. I wish I knew more about what’s going on. I’ve heard that Whirling disease made its way into wild rainbow populations in Colorado some time ago. Who down there in Colorado knows something about this? Which Colorado river systems are effected? How long has this been going on, etc?  Is the Colorado problem stable in any way, or is it getting worse? —

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: some time ago. Who down there in Colorado knows something about this? : Which Colorado river systems are effected? How long has this been RE: Whirling Disease I met with some guides here in the shop over Christmas and this was the issue at hand. It looks very grim and much worse then originally speculated.  The guides are accusing the Colorado DOW of a MAJOR cover up.  They have SCREWED up big time and since fishing is such a huge economical thing…noone will come straight.  The local guides are going to try to take matters into their own hands and we are in the process of recommending a wierd but hopefully effective idea to the DOW for the 96-98 regs…the idea is to close off feeder streams to all fishing during the rainbow spawn. The idea is to try to get some of these genetically farked up fish to produce (naturally) fish that are genetically immune to the disease.  It is a long shot, but better then no shot.   Apparently noone is talking but the rumour is that all year classes are missing in some of the major drainages (i.e. NO/0/nada/zip baby fishes) and that the spore (?) is present throughtout the state and that it originated in a hatchery in Utah. All colorado fishermen should pressure anybody and everybody they know for more information ans to support this closed rainbow spawning fishing season in the feeders… Tim Walker

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RE: Whirling Disease Apparently noone is talking but the rumour is that all year classes are missing in some of the major drainages (i.e. NO/0/nada/zip baby fishes) and that the spore (?) is present throughtout the state and that it originated in a hatchery in Utah. Tim Walker

  What about cutthroats? From what I have heard–in both Montana and Colorado (and perhaps the Truckee too)–the brown trout are OK! Does anybody know anything about Whirling disease and cutthroats? —

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I understand that there was an article in the Washington Post today (1/4) on the whirling disease in the Madison.  I have not seen it, but would like to get a copy if anyone has one.

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:   What about cutthroats? From what I have heard–in both Montana : and Colorado (and perhaps the Truckee too)–the brown trout are OK! : Does anybody know anything about Whirling disease and cutthroats? My understanding is that the cutts aren’t affected, allthough I haven’t conducted too many fry surveys and the misinformation in general does scare me.   Damned hatcheries indeed.  If only the folkes could to see fit to spend their tax monies on stream improvements and accept a greatly reduced general catch limit while the wild stocks rebound… Population estimates for colorado are around 5 million by the year 2000.  The state is just too fragile for this many people.  No, I don’t begrudge folkes for wanting to live here. Nor do I have any answers.   It frightens me to the core. Tim Walker

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: Hey, I may be stupid, but can anyone explain what Whirling disease is? It is a disease that affects the spine of rainbow trout fry that first showed up in the state hatcheries.  Now the dept of wildlife has introduced it into the waters and it is affecting the wild stock.   It is very, very serious and some think we are on the brink of a disaster of major proportions.  I really hope that some biologist in the know (Bob Golder…what’re you up to today) would really fill in the blanks. Tim Walker

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Hey, I may be stupid, but can anyone explain what Whirling disease is? Paul

Whirling disease is caused by a protozoan parasite that invades the cartilage of the skull, gill arches and spine.  It affects only trout and salmon.  Rainbow trout are the most seriously affected, browns (which probably coevolved with the parasite in Europe) are somewhat, but not totally resistant. The parasite goes through a complex life cycle which involves spores which may persist in the bottom sediments for many years, hence it is here to stay in the Madison. It may make infected fish swim in a circle  (whirling) or die, but more frequently cause deformities or make the fish more susceptible to predation or environmental episodes. It was discovered in Colorado in the late ’80s, Utah in ‘91 and now in Montana. Utah initiated a strong program to try to eradicate it when it was first discovered.  Later findings showed it had been spread, perhaps intentionally, to other parts of the state.  Current efforts are directed to try to protect wild native cutthroat from the disease.  Montana has a good program and  has been trying to prevent it from coming into the state.

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Hey, I may be stupid, but can anyone explain what Whirling disease is? Paul

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Whirling disease…..not good.  Up to 90% of the rainbows have died.  I got this from a guy at Lakestream Fly Shop in Whitefish last week.  It doesn’t seem to be affecting the brown trout population that badly.  Yet…another distrubing note.  They are not sure how the disease is spreading.  I am going to ask a fishery pathologist i know, on what he knows what is going on.  I will post the info that evening.  I will try to do it on Monday. If anyone around here knows what is going on…he will.  Yet the info coming my way on the impact of the disease is NOT GOOD!.  Just pray I guess. Peter

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Last night’s Bozeman Daily Chronicle ran the headline "Madison River Rainbows Diseased," or something like that. The story identified Whirling disease as the culprit, and quoted Montana Fish and Game Biologist Dick Vincent, who said upper Madison rainbow populations had plummeted from 3300 to 300 fish/mile in a single season. Brown trout, so far, seem unafected.    Whirling disease has traditionally been associated with hatchery fish in the past. How this disease has made its way into a wild population remains a mystery. But Dick Vincent did mention scattered reports of hatchery rainbows mysteriously appearing in the upper Madison in late 1980’s. What this means is anyone’s guess. Montana hasn’t stocked rainbows in the Madison for decades.    What happens next? There are rumors. But nothing definite yet. I wouldn’t be surprised to see a complete fishing closure on the upper Madison for a few years. It’s not clear that a slimy Elk Hair Caddis–heavily used Monday evening on the Madison–couldn’t transmit Whirling disease to Big Hole or Yellowstone rainbows on Tuesday morning. It would be a real tragedy if the lower Yellowstone’s (now) recovering native Cutthroat populations were to become effected (decimated?) too. This could be really bad news. —

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Last night’s Bozeman Daily Chronicle ran the headline "Madison River Rainbows Diseased," or something like that. The story identified Whirling disease as the culprit, and quoted Montana Fish and Game Biologist Dick Vincent, who said upper Madison rainbow populations had plummeted from 3300 to 300 fish/mile in a single season. Brown trout, so far, seem unafected. <snip   What happens next? There are rumors. But nothing definite yet. I wouldn’t be surprised to see a complete fishing closure on the upper Madison for a few years. It’s not clear that a slimy Elk <snip again

There are a lot of rumors bouncing around Bozeman today. The main one that I have heard is that FW&P will attempt a total rainbow kill on the Upper Madison, although how they would do this without taking out the browns is anyone’s guess.  Suggestions that I have heard include changing the regs to require people fishing to kill all rainbows and release all browns.  I can’t believe that this would get all of the rainbows – we just don’t fish that well. Another problem will be what to do if they can take out the rainbows completely.  Options would presumably include (a) leaving this stretch of river as a trophy wild brown river, (b) restocking the rainbows from hatchery fish, which would really degrade the fishery for several years, and (c) relocating wild rainbows from other parts of the river. On the less bad news side, it is my understanding that this is limited to the river between Quake lake and Ennis dam.  I never thought that I would be grateful for that stupid dam.  I.e., unless they lose it there is no immediate danger of this getting into the lower Madison and hence into the Missouri, Gallatin, etc.  At the other end, the Madison in Yellowstone National Park, and hence the Gibbon and Firehole, are not currently in danger. Unfortunately I haven’t heard that this will kill off the whitefish. The stretch of river affected by this disease is often claimed to be the best piece of wild trout water in the continental US, so this is already a disaster, and if the disease does get into the browns as well it will probably be 10-20 years before they can fully restore the fishery.  Not a good Christmas present for the people who read this group. Denbigh http://www.cs.montana.edu/~starkey http://www.cs.montana.edu/~starkey/fishing.html 406-994-4780 (work), 406-586-7614 (home)

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