Question:

This past week I received in the mail a new book from Mark Jeffrey Volk, I believe it was his fourth book "Pages from a Mountain Journal" previously he had written three books known as the Winding Ridge Trilogy. His first, The Upland Way, hooked, if you will, me hard. He writes of the people, fish, and birds  found in Appalachians of PA, WV, and MD in a way that sometimes reminds me of Harry Middleton’s love of the Smokys.

Wayne — Just the other day I was told that the books "Homesick" which I guess is the third book of the Winding Ridge Trilogy and  "Pages from a Mountain Journal"  both include Smallmouth Bass.  I was wondering if the first two books in the Trilogy also included something on Smallmouth? Clyde Drury Books of the Black Bass. http://members.aol.com/BassBks/index.html

Response:

Most of the *regulars* know that I ‘ve gone from Atlanta to Chicago to now Dodge City Kansas since I first logged on to ROFF. What I thought was going to be a short term stint is now past two years and no real hope of moving on anytime soon. Work has been a pain due to changes and I’ve had to cancel two trips to the Juan. When i can find time to drive the 5 hours to Colorado, if only to fish a heavily pounded tailwater for the day, the weather turns to crap as it did this past weekend. I read of the gatherings I missed and long to hit some water, at some point soon, I will probably get up and drive the 350 miles just to fish for an hour or two and drive back here to the Sunflower State. "Home" is really Louisiana, but I’ve come to call the waters of the Appalachians my home. There you will find the most beautiful of nature’s creations, the Brookie. I long to fish for them again, but for now I must be content to read. Since January I’ve read books by Tapply, Leeson, Fulmer, Gaines, and re-read some favorites by Middleton, Lyons, Haig-Brown, Babb and Voelker (aka Traver). Enjoyed a couple of compilations and imagined the rivers as they fished them. This past week I received in the mail a new book from Mark Jeffrey Volk, I believe it was his fourth book "Pages from a Mountain Journal" previously he had written three books known as the Winding Ridge Trilogy. His first, The Upland Way, hooked, if you will, me hard. He writes of the people, fish, and birds  found in Appalachians of PA, WV, and MD in a way that sometimes reminds me of Harry Middleton’s love of the Smokys. This quote from the 1st chapter of "Pages" really hits home to what I miss, I just wanted to share it. "I love wild brookies; those incomparable, true originals in every sense in these Appalachian mountains. They’re an icon of the way things should be, rather than how they are, and remain a symbol of a mountain’s purity and grace. The next time you catch one, hold him in the water for just a moment longer before releasing him. There’s a masterpiece cradled in your hand; feel his flawless form and his wild strength, his instinctive struggle to return to that frigid world he is an inseparable part of."     quoted ver batim, by mark volk. Wayne

Response:

… This quote from the 1st chapter of "Pages" really hits home to what I miss, I just wanted to share it. "I love wild brookies; those incomparable, true originals in every sense in these Appalachian mountains. …

Sheesh. Sounds like that guy’s one of those "creationists" about whom Choc was cracking wise. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

Oh bite me you cynical SOB

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – … This quote from the 1st chapter of "Pages" really hits home to what I miss, I just wanted to share it. "I love wild brookies; those incomparable, true originals in every sense in these Appalachian mountains. … Sheesh. Sounds like that guy’s one of those "creationists" about whom Choc was cracking wise. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

"I love wild brookies; those incomparable, true originals in every sense in these Appalachian mountains. They’re an icon of the way things should be, rather than how they are, and remain a symbol of a mountain’s purity and grace. The next time you catch one, hold him in the water for just a moment longer before releasing him. There’s a masterpiece cradled in your hand; feel his flawless form and his wild strength, his instinctive struggle to return to that frigid world he is an inseparable part of."    quoted ver batim, by mark volk. Wayne

        well, that’s pretty to read, in my view.  and all of us know that to get to where they live requires more than a little energy, sacrifice, and love.         your friend in the old north state         wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

Wayne Knight wrote… good stuff snipped.

God Wayne you’re making me cry. Joel Axelrad **DFD**

Response:

Wayne, ’nuff bs. you name the time buddy, stay at the house here, we’ll go chasin’ some of them jewels you love so much. –walt – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Most of the *regulars* know that I ‘ve gone from Atlanta to Chicago to now Dodge City Kansas since I first logged on to ROFF. What I thought was going to be a short term stint is now past two years and no real hope of moving on anytime soon. Work has been a pain due to changes and I’ve had to cancel two trips to the Juan. When i can find time to drive the 5 hours to Colorado, if only to fish a heavily pounded tailwater for the day, the weather turns to crap as it did this past weekend. I read of the gatherings I missed and long to hit some water, at some point soon, I will probably get up and drive the 350 miles just to fish for an hour or two and drive back here to the Sunflower State. "Home" is really Louisiana, but I’ve come to call the waters of the Appalachians my home. There you will find the most beautiful of nature’s creations, the Brookie. I long to fish for them again, but for now I must be content to read. Since January I’ve read books by Tapply, Leeson, Fulmer, Gaines, and re-read some favorites by Middleton, Lyons, Haig-Brown, Babb and Voelker (aka Traver). Enjoyed a couple of compilations and imagined the rivers as they fished them. This past week I received in the mail a new book from Mark Jeffrey Volk, I believe it was his fourth book "Pages from a Mountain Journal" previously he had written three books known as the Winding Ridge Trilogy. His first, The Upland Way, hooked, if you will, me hard. He writes of the people, fish, and birds  found in Appalachians of PA, WV, and MD in a way that sometimes reminds me of Harry Middleton’s love of the Smokys. This quote from the 1st chapter of "Pages" really hits home to what I miss, I just wanted to share it. "I love wild brookies; those incomparable, true originals in every sense in these Appalachian mountains. They’re an icon of the way things should be, rather than how they are, and remain a symbol of a mountain’s purity and grace. The next time you catch one, hold him in the water for just a moment longer before releasing him. There’s a masterpiece cradled in your hand; feel his flawless form and his wild strength, his instinctive struggle to return to that frigid world he is an inseparable part of."     quoted ver batim, by mark volk. Wayne

– Tight Lines, –Walt Fly Fishing NC & more… http://www.ezflyfish.com http://www.wilsoncreekoutfitters.com

Response:

Question:

Craig, My club does have two different awards at the end of the year – one for the most weight and one for the highest number of fish.  Each participant receives 1 bonus pound per day for participation in the tournament.  Occasionally, different individuals will win the two awards but one person wins both the majority of the time.  We also have a different award for the largest single fish during the year. This system seems to work fine for us.  The winners are usually determined at the last tournament of the year but we occasionally have someone run away with the competition.   Lamar Middleton Winter Haven, FL http://www.LMbassguideFL.com

Response:

I have been reading the Bass Club Point scoring Advice string with interest over hear in England. Why do you not have two competitions. One for the largest fish caught. One for the most fish caught. This would give recognition for the skill of catching prize fish and for consistency and skill at catch the most amount of fish regularly. — Have a great day. Go fly fishing! <  <  <  < <  < <

  <   <   <  <  <  < Craig Moore The English Fly Fishing Shop www.flyfishing-flies.com

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Question:

Does anybody know of any good fishing books to read. I’m lookin for a book about the pleasures of fishin in a philisophical sense. Not the fly fishing type of book….A book about fishing/guiding/travelling & fishing etc Al Have fishing rod…will travel. Prospective accomplice in fishing

Response:

Know lots of great fishing books but not to many that fill your requirement. Only 2 I can think of were Shaw Grigsby’s book, and Jimmy Huston’s, "Caught me a Big ‘Un". There are a lot more from the fly fishing side of the sport. I am a lot better on the educational stuff. dan

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anybody know of any good fishing books to read. I’m lookin for a book about the pleasures of fishin in a philisophical sense. Not the fly fishing type of book….A book about fishing/guiding/travelling & fishing etc Al Have fishing rod…will travel. Prospective accomplice in fishing

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Know lots of great fishing books but not to many that fill your requirement. Only 2 I can think of were Shaw Grigsby’s book, and Jimmy Huston’s, "Caught me a Big ‘Un". There are a lot more from the fly fishing side of the sport. I am a lot better on the educational stuff. dan

Thanks Dan i am aware of those 2 books. I picked up a book today by Richard Louv. He travels through America…meeting other fisherman.I like it because it is a thick book (475 pages) and a cheapo price $5.99. Al Have fishing rod…will travel. Prospective accomplice in fishing

Response:

Darwin’s Bass & Pavlov’s Trout — both by Paul Quinnett. It’s been a while since I read them, but I found them both very enjoyable reads for ‘non-how-to’ type books. RichZ

Question:

Any ideas???? Terry

gherke invented it of course, just ask him <G cb

Response:

Amazing what one may learn on here, I never realised that the expression "dickhead" had such historical connotations ! TL MC — "Where fishing is concerned, most anglers are basically manic excessives" http://www.mikeconnor.de <SNIP LLBeanian – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – the shockingly crude preserved penile adornment which was, one can only surmise, worn as a headdress by the leaders. The hypothesis that <SNIP –waldo submitted with all due respect, literary license of published article (http://www.med.abaco-mac.it/issue001/articles/doc/006.htm) used.

Response:

LaPlacian industry is a myth. There is no supporting archaeological evidence whatsoever that the pugilistic LaPlac sloth were ever industrious during the upper paleolithic period of Orvian neandertal times. Even the more conservative estimate carries the significant implication that many opportunities for acculturation must have occurred through contact between groups living on each side of the frontier. [snipped, regrettably]

Enjoying another cold beverage tonight, eh my friend? –Steve (looks like next Thursday’s the day. Really… No, I mean it

Response:

There have been tantalizing recent finds at the Orvis site in Portugal. Dated reliably at 33,000 years old, this is among the most recent Homo neandertal sites in the world. Extremely small hooks made of tempered bone have been found. These finds are associated with fossilized mites, specific to certain avian and mammal hosts, and with fossilized pollen specific to fibrous plant material of the type used for making thread. Archeologists have discovered elaborate burial sites, in which the body (presumably of the chief or head man) was decorated with literally hundreds of these hooks (ranging from about #18 to #10.). Also associated with the burial sites are the fossilized bones of remarkably large pisciverous specimens…..

It should come as no surprise to anyone here that there ARE different interpretations of these findings.  The plenitude of so-called "venus" figurines at paleolithic sites throughout Europe has been taken to suggest that the patriarchal religious cults so prevalent today were once the exception rather than the rule.  Many archeologists and paleontologists today believe that goddess worship was the norm for the time; a theory bolstered by the large role played by goddesses in many "primitive" societies throughout recorded history.  The currently popular "sleeps with the fishes" school holds that the hooks found on the Orvis remains suggest a rather more sinister scenario than that posited by adherents to the "sport" theory.  The presumed perforation of the deceased by hundreds of sharp implements, so the theory goes, may be seen as a metaphor, and retribution, for the collective domination and penetration, not only of the women of the tribe, but also of the mother goddess Earth herself.  Needless to say, much work remains to be done at this and other similar sites. Wolfgang Chairman, Revision Committee

Response:

My theory is they starved to death after embracing C+R. JonCook.

That is a reasonable hypothesis, Jonathan, but it doesn’t explain the sudden ascendance of Homo sapiens. Another peculiar fact about these Orvis people that I didn’t mention, however, but that supports your hypothesis, is that despite the compelling fossil evidence for elaborate fishing rituals, there is no evidence whatsoever that they actually consumed fish. Indeed, all the evidence points to a "totem fish culture," which elevated fish to god-like status. Perhaps the leading hypothesis about the dimise of the Orvis neandertals is that they increasingly diverted their resources to opulent displays of wealth, symbolized by the fish hooks in their elaborate burial ceremonies, rather like the ancient Egyptians and Aztecs of historical times. The "conspicuous consumption" of wasting the hooks [*], so this theory goes, established a corrupt, aristocratic class structure that was ripe for the picking by Homo sapiens, which had recently migrated from northern Africa (where there is no fishing to speak of, and never has been). Quite by coincidence, supporting evidence for this hypothesis comes from the recently re-opened, contemporaneous LaPlac site in the Loire Valley of France. It seems that thse LaPlac neandertals copied the Orvis fishing toolkit literally, even slavishly. There is some evidence that Orvis technology was even exported to the LaPlac site. [*] Reconstructions of the manufacture of these hooks, some of which are elaborately carved despite their small size, yields an estimate of 40 man hours required to make each hook, which is in stark contrast to the approximately 4 man hours required to produce a functionally equivalent, and even superior hook without useless ornamentation. [**] As I mentioned previously, the proponents of the "hybridization" hypothesis point to the modern flyfishing compulsion of Homo sapiens, with its elaborate, conspicuous display of wealth and "insider knowledge", to support their theory. The opposing "takeover and eat" school replies that this is merely a case of convergent evolution. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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SPLOOORRRKK!!!!! Danl – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any ideas???? Terry gherke invented it of course, just ask him <G cb

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Was this prehistoric Gink? JR – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – yep, the first flies were pieces of intestine and feces smeared on a hook… they hadn’t become no-scent purists yet.

Response:

Any ideas???? Terry

Response:

Any ideas???? Terry

The Brits tied bits of fur to hooks and flung them about underwater. The Germans were hijacked as mercenaries and brought their floating feather bugs with them to the States.  Both used long, stiff sticks to wildly flail the water.  The Americans, watching from the bushes, thought there was a buck to be made.  They immediately incorporated both methods into an intricate pattern of air-born manipulations using a limber bamboo pole.  Some bamboo pole users used worms and became known as bait slingers.  Some bamboo pole users continued with the bits of fur and feather and became known as fly fishermen.  This all occurred in Virginia, just outside the Hessian POW camp at Charlottsville. — Wayne To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

Response:

This history begins with the first recorded description of fishing with a fly (in Macedonia), written by Aelian around 200 AD.  It’s likely that someone may have attached fur or feather to a hook well before that, but I don’t know of the existence of any convincing archeological evidence. There have been tantalizing recent finds at the Orvis site in Portugal. Dated reliably at 33,000 years old…

Wow, Orvis has been around longer than I had realized.  :-)      - Ken — "A wedding is just like a funeral except that you get to smell  your own flowers." – Grace Hansen

Response:

lol steve…. i’d say yer ’bout primed for the juan. happy hunti…uhmm, fishin’… –walt – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This history begins with the first recorded description of fishing with a fly (in Macedonia), written by Aelian around 200 AD.  It’s likely that someone may have attached fur or feather to a hook well before that, but I don’t know of the existence of any convincing archeological evidence. There have been tantalizing recent finds at the Orvis site in Portugal. Dated reliably at 33,000 years old, this is among the most recent Homo neandertal sites in the world. Extremely small hooks made of tempered bone have been found. These finds are associated with fossilized mites, specific to certain avian and mammal hosts, and with fossilized pollen specific to fibrous plant material of the type used for making thread. Archeologists have discovered elaborate burial sites, in which the body (presumably of the chief or head man) was decorated with literally hundreds of these hooks (ranging from about #18 to #10.). Also associated with the burial sites are the fossilized bones of remarkably large pisciverous specimens. As a side note, it is especially curious that these hooks lack barbs, Alas, after 33,000 BP (before present), all traces of Homo neandertalis disappear from the Orvis site, aside from a thin layer of charred bones. They are replaced in the higher, more recent stata by Homo sapiens. A scientific controversy rages over whether the invaders exterminated (and apparently ate) neandertalis, or whether they interbred and hybridized with them. Supporters of the hybridization hypothesis point to the obseesion with flyfishing in modern Homo sapiens as evidence that we have, indeed, inherited neandertalis genes. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

– Ezflyfish.com: http://www.ezflyfish.com Blue Ridge Book Gallery: http://users.boone.net/wgw/brbg.html

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This history begins with the first recorded description of fishing with a fly (in Macedonia), written by Aelian around 200 AD.  It’s likely that someone may have attached fur or feather to a hook well before that, but I don’t know of the existence of any convincing archeological evidence. There have been tantalizing recent finds at the Orvis site in Portugal. Dated reliably at 33,000 years old, this is among the most recent Homo neandertal sites in the world. Extremely small hooks made of tempered bone have been found. These finds are associated with fossilized mites, specific to certain avian and mammal hosts, and with fossilized pollen specific to fibrous plant material of the type used for making thread. Archeologists have discovered elaborate burial sites, in which the body (presumably of the chief or head man) was decorated with literally hundreds of these hooks (ranging from about #18 to #10.). Also associated with the burial sites are the fossilized bones of remarkably large pisciverous specimens. As a side note, it is especially curious that these hooks lack barbs, Alas, after 33,000 BP (before present), all traces of Homo neandertalis disappear from the Orvis site, aside from a thin layer of charred bones. They are replaced in the higher, more recent stata by Homo sapiens. A scientific controversy rages over whether the invaders exterminated (and apparently ate) neandertalis, or whether they interbred and hybridized with them. Supporters of the hybridization hypothesis point to the obseesion with flyfishing in modern Homo sapiens as evidence that we have, indeed, inherited neandertalis genes.

Actually RW,  I saw a TV program about the transition between Neanthertal and sapiens; there was a distinct argument that they hybridised.  Mmm, could it be,  that we here fly anglers are descended from union between sapiens and neandertal.  Mmm,  that 4 foot haul…..

Response:

Seems Orvis has been at it for longer than I thought !  Did they find any fossilised dog baskets ? TL MC — "Where fishing is concerned, most anglers are basically manic excessives" http://www.mikeconnor.de

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: large pisciverous specimens. As a side note, it is especially curious : that these hooks lack barbs, : Alas, after 33,000 BP (before present), all traces of Homo neandertalis : disappear from the Orvis site, aside from a thin layer of charred bones. My theory is they starved to death after embracing C+R. JonCook. — Are you a r.o.f.f. newbie? Then see http://www.cs.nmsu.edu/~jcook/ROFF/

Response:

Seems Orvis has been at it for longer than I thought !  Did they find any fossilised dog baskets ?

No but I heard that they did find some fossilized Orvis firewood in the communal fire pit. Jon

Response:

My theory is they starved to death after embracing C+R.

Or inadvertently following Timbo’s trail.  

Response:

My theory is they starved to death after embracing C+R. JonCook. That is a reasonable hypothesis, Jonathan, but it doesn’t explain the sudden ascendance of Homo sapiens. Another peculiar fact about these Orvis people that I didn’t mention, however, but that supports your hypothesis, is that despite the compelling fossil evidence for elaborate fishing rituals, there is no evidence whatsoever that they actually consumed fish. Indeed, all the evidence points to a "totem fish culture," which elevated fish to god-like status.

possible support of what you say rw is at this link: http://www.trollart.com/FSHWRSHP.html 8< Quite by coincidence, supporting evidence for this hypothesis comes fromthe recently re-opened, contemporaneous LaPlac site in the Loire Valleyof France. It seems that thse LaPlac neandertals copied the Orvisfishing toolkit literally, even slavishly. There is some evidence that Orvis technology was even exported to the LaPlac site.

LaPlacian industry is a myth. There is no supporting archaeological evidence whatsoever that the pugilistic LaPlac sloth were ever industrious during the upper paleolithic period of Orvian neandertal times. Even the more conservative estimate carries the significant implication that many opportunities for acculturation must have occurred through contact between groups living on each side of the frontier. In spite of this, LaPlacian Neandertals south of the mountains never became Upper Paleolithic and retained traditional Middle Paleolithic technologies and primitive LLBeanian tool-kits until the end: blade debitage is unknown in the late Orvian of the area, as are bone tools and personal adornments, with exception of course, the shockingly crude preserved penile adornment which was, one can only surmise, worn as a headdress by the leaders. The hypothesis that acculturation of LaPlacian neandertals would inevitably follow from contact with moderns and is the only possible explanation for the Fortenberrian and similar cultural phenomena must be, therefore, the object of serious inquiry. –waldo submitted with all due respect, literary license of published article (http://www.med.abaco-mac.it/issue001/articles/doc/006.htm) used.

Response:

Terry,   I have read that fishing with a feathered lure was done in Egypt long before it was done in England.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any ideas???? Terry

Response:

Terry,   I have read that fishing with a feathered lure was done in Egypt long before it was done in England.

Fish hooks go back to prehistory. It’s hard to believe that someone, somewhere in the stone age didn’t try an artificial lure made of fur or feathers. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Fish hooks go back to prehistory. It’s hard to believe that someone, somewhere in the stone age didn’t try an artificial lure made of fur

or feathers. Stone "toggle hooks" are common finds in pre-histoic Native American sites along Virginia’s estuaries.  Seems like I recall early explorer accounts of the natives using feathers as part of "fish lures". Fishing line was deer sinew. — Wayne To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

Response:

Terry, You can find a short on-line history of fly-fishing at: http://www.flyfishinghistory.com/contents.htm This history begins with the first recorded description of fishing with a fly (in Macedonia), written by Aelian around 200 AD.  It’s likely that someone may have attached fur or feather to a hook well before that, but I don’t know of the existence of any convincing archeological evidence. JR – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any ideas????

Response:

Fish hooks go back to prehistory. It’s hard to believe that someone, somewhere in the stone age didn’t try an artificial lure made of fur or feathers. Stone "toggle hooks" are common finds in pre-histoic Native American sites along Virginia’s estuaries.  Seems like I recall early explorer accounts of the natives using feathers as part of "fish lures". Fishing line was deer sinew. —

I forget what the bone was called, but deer also provided a "hook" from each hoove. –walt

Response:

This history begins with the first recorded description of fishing with a fly (in Macedonia), written by Aelian around 200 AD.  It’s likely that someone may have attached fur or feather to a hook well before that, but I don’t know of the existence of any convincing archeological evidence.

There have been tantalizing recent finds at the Orvis site in Portugal. Dated reliably at 33,000 years old, this is among the most recent Homo neandertal sites in the world. Extremely small hooks made of tempered bone have been found. These finds are associated with fossilized mites, specific to certain avian and mammal hosts, and with fossilized pollen specific to fibrous plant material of the type used for making thread. Archeologists have discovered elaborate burial sites, in which the body (presumably of the chief or head man) was decorated with literally hundreds of these hooks (ranging from about #18 to #10.). Also associated with the burial sites are the fossilized bones of remarkably large pisciverous specimens. As a side note, it is especially curious that these hooks lack barbs, Alas, after 33,000 BP (before present), all traces of Homo neandertalis disappear from the Orvis site, aside from a thin layer of charred bones. They are replaced in the higher, more recent stata by Homo sapiens. A scientific controversy rages over whether the invaders exterminated (and apparently ate) neandertalis, or whether they interbred and hybridized with them. Supporters of the hybridization hypothesis point to the obseesion with flyfishing in modern Homo sapiens as evidence that we have, indeed, inherited neandertalis genes. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Tempered bones.  LOL. JR – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There have been tantalizing recent finds at the Orvis site in Portugal. ……etc.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This history begins with the first recorded description of fishing with a fly (in Macedonia), written by Aelian around 200 AD.  It’s likely that someone may have attached fur or feather to a hook well before that, but I don’t know of the existence of any convincing archeological evidence. There have been tantalizing recent finds at the Orvis site in Portugal. Dated reliably at 33,000 years old, this is among the most recent Homo neandertal sites in the world. Extremely small hooks made of tempered bone have been found. These finds are associated with fossilized mites, specific to certain avian and mammal hosts, and with fossilized pollen specific to fibrous plant material of the type used for making thread. Archeologists have discovered elaborate burial sites, in which the body (presumably of the chief or head man) was decorated with literally hundreds of these hooks (ranging from about #18 to #10.). Also associated with the burial sites are the fossilized bones of remarkably large pisciverous specimens. As a side note, it is especially curious that these hooks lack barbs,

Mmm,  catch and release too. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Alas, after 33,000 BP (before present), all traces of Homo neandertalis disappear from the Orvis site, aside from a thin layer of charred bones. They are replaced in the higher, more recent stata by Homo sapiens. A scientific controversy rages over whether the invaders exterminated (and apparently ate) neandertalis, or whether they interbred and hybridized with them. Supporters of the hybridization hypothesis point to the obseesion with flyfishing in modern Homo sapiens as evidence that we have, indeed, inherited neandertalis genes. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Question:

I’m heading to see my brother for a few days and will be in the Boulder area.  Can anyone recommend some areas/ types of flyfishing.  My preference is drys but just want to enjoy some great scenery.  Wild fish preferred! thanks much! Bruce

Response:

<snipped Bruce, I know Mike Medintz lives up in that area.  I went up there a month ago and fished the Big Thompson with moderate success.  I was using a black midge with a red bead head and got some good action.  We started fishing just below the dam at Estes(?) Park in the early morning, then drove down about 4 miles and fished a really good stretch with a lot of big boulders breaking up the water.  Nice area. bc. — Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. -Benjamin Franklin

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Question:

my week-long sabbatical in the blue ridge ends today, but i leave with more experience in the streams i love and having developed a better friendship with Walt Winter of ezflyfish.com..

Appreciate the reports, Jeff.  I think Tom Brown was up that way this weekend as well.  Fond memories of the Great North State……. Mark Faulkner

Response:

Appreciate the reports, Jeff.  I think Tom Brown was up that way this weekend as well.  Fond memories of the Great North State……. Mark Faulkner

I wanted to go this weekend, but couldn’t get a dog sitter.  Probably just as well, there would have been more witnesses.  NEXT weekend – now that’s a different story.  I’m heading over on Friday and, if I make it back home, I’ll post an unambiguous, unfettered, true report of the ensuing activities (depending on circumstances and to the extent that my attorney allows). Tom — Tom Brown The Signal Group Wake Forest, NC HEATHEN, n. A benighted creature who has the folly to worship something that he can see and feel.                – Ambrose Bierce: The Devil’s Dictionary

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        my week-long sabbatical in the blue ridge ends today, but i leave with more experience in the streams i love and having developed a better friendship with Walt Winter of ezflyfish.com…walt martyred himself to fishing with me during these last 3 days, braving the wrath of his lovely spouse Marie and delaying the demands of his business until the late evening hours.           The first 3 days, i fished my usual spots.           one stream i consider "my" stream because of its closeness to my cabin, because i fish it every time i’m in the area hoping to get to know its entire length eventually, and because it always yields me a fish or two or several. it holds only wild browns and is overlooked by many of the fishing population (spinning and fly) because of its location and lower elevation (1400 feet). still, it has all of the characteristics of streams i love to hike and fish…wildlife (turkey, deer, grouse, snakes)can be seen on occasions, wildflowers blooming from spring through late fall, and a nice combination of deep pools, pocket water, and riffles with some small waterfalls and large boulders or rock formations.  there is a small trail for about 4 miles running beside the stream, which allows access to various points and gives an ability to avoid other fishermen/women or to share a nice day with a group of friends by staggering entries. the browns in the stream are as beautiful, "spooky", and feisty as any i’ve caught in any of the wild trout waters of the state.  On this trip, i deceived several nice brownies with a dave’s hopper, parachute adams, hare’s ear, and prince nymph.  the largest was 10 1/2 inches…above average for me in this stream…with the others in the 6 – 9 inch range, which is the size of fish generally caught in non-hatchery waters. on one trip, i caught an 8 inch brown out of the tail of a deep pool, and a big brown of at least 15-18 inches chased after it as i was bringing it in, so there are larger fish waiting to be taken with skillful and patient persistence…that big brown provides an enduring optimism and goal for future pursuits on "my" stream… jeff

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Question:

<<A number of well-written soliloquies.  Could you not excise the few items that belong in a separate category, due to the unfortunate occurences of offennsive language?    Those gutter language quotes could have easily been excised. In fact, it took effort to include them.    They weren’t excluded and their presence show us something of the internal contradictions within Cubic Dog. -Ray

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Like I said, I like it.  Shows you something about the internal contradiction in the Moth. Those gutter language quotes could have easily been excised. In fact, it took effort to include them   They weren’t excluded and their presence show us something of the internal contradictions within Cubic Dog.

- Mothra  (aka Kathy Streletzky)    "Whan that Aprill with his shoures soote                                   The droughte of March hath perced to the roote, . . . Thanne longen folk to goon on pilgrimages."  - Geoffrey Chaucer

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<<A number of well-written soliloquies.  Could you not excise the few items that belong in a separate category, due to the unfortunate occurences of offennsive language?    Those gutter language quotes could have easily been excised. In fact, it took effort to include them.    They weren’t excluded and their presence show us something of the internal contradictions within Cubic Dog. -Ray

Well, this may have something to it, Then again, I think their presence also may intend to show something of the *external* contratictions and conflicts within the sport, in fact, I think that was the point. chipper

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I find your post(and Ray’s) much more offensive than the original poetry that was originally posted. Too bad the both of you are so uptight so as not to see the real meanings behind those words.                    shallow is the depth of some souls                    the hull is inevitibly worn thin                    from years of misuse                                                                       William Davis

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<<I find your post(and Ray’s) much more offensive than the original poetry that was originally posted. Too bad the both of you are so uptight so as not to see the real meanings behind those words.    theknuckle   Badbilly – how many handles do you have in this newsgroup? -Ray

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Badbilly – how many handles do you have in this newsgroup?

Evidently one for each of his personalities:-) I like theKnuckle the best!  How bout you? – Mothra  (aka Kathy Streletzky)    "Whan that Aprill with his shoures soote                                   The droughte of March hath perced to the roote, . . . Thanne longen folk to goon on pilgrimages."  - Geoffrey Chaucer

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The cold monk burns the image of the buddah, reads about the sacred cows and murmors — oh shit it sure is cold.

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Well, little moth girl, "the knuckle" is a type of motor that was made by harley-davidson motorcycles from 1932 to 1947. It is a highly coveted motorcycle. I do have multiple personalities, unlike a lot of people on r.p.b. Work…paddle….work…paddle. I know…some of you are saying, "well, what else is there to do?" The answer is…Plenty! I many past times that I enjoy. From skateboarding, flyfishing, playing nine ball(billiards), and riding and building harley-davidson motorcycles, not to mention scads of other things. enthusiasts. But surely you must know that I always put RPB in my "favorite places" folder so that I can check on all you paddlepeople whenever I want. So, now you know. Paddler…Biker….Fisherman…Pool Shark…Thrillseeker…Bad Billy. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Badbilly – how many handles do you have in this newsgroup? Evidently one for each of his personalities:-) I like theKnuckle the best!  How bout you? – Mothra  (aka Kathy Streletzky)   "Whan that Aprill with his shoures soote                                   The droughte of March hath perced to the roote, . . . Thanne longen folk to goon on pilgrimages."  - Geoffrey Chaucer </PRE</HTML

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A number of well-written soliloquies.  Could you not excise the few items that belong in a separate category, due to the unfortunate occurences of offennsive language?

I don’t think so, Robin, re-read it – the "offensive" sections are part of a whole.  Nice-writing, Cubic Dog. – Mothra  (aka Kathy Streletzky)    "Whan that Aprill with his shoures soote                                   The droughte of March hath perced to the roote, . . . Thanne longen folk to goon on pilgrimages."  - Geoffrey Chaucer

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A number of well-written soliloquies.  Could you not excise the few items that belong in a separate category, due to the unfortunate occurences of offennsive language?

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I like it! shimmering the warriors small boat vanishes on the eddy line his soul intact

- Mothra  (aka Kathy Streletzky)    "Whan that Aprill with his shoures soote                                   The droughte of March hath perced to the roote, . . . Thanne longen folk to goon on pilgrimages."  - Geoffrey Chaucer

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"Fool!" "The Paddle is the soul,

snip… Very Nice…

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"Rules and laws are always the result of loss of respect and courtesy and are themselves therefore the seeds of failure see to your soul first if you seek mastery"

Well Said Brother

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Awesome poetic commentary!

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "Fool!" "The Paddle is the soul, see to your soul first or there will be no mastery." The warrior smiles as his children play. These new ones come, I had seen their forebearers come to the crags when I was young, We the clueless clutched and groped our way skyward, tenous pro, lead out on clean placements. They with white scars of chalk showing all the moves, drove bolts and clipped in, stretching out the ladders to touch the heart of fear, climbed glass while we spat on the ground in disgust. They breezed our standards and buried the soul. He had an old land rover, and we pulled the grill off and brought it with us to throw it over the fire to grill some steaks we bought in town the other day. Our canoes were safely ashore high above the water and tied off just in case. It was raining. "Kore wa burauni desu. Chairo no chyokoreeto no keeki desu. Doozo." I took the offered brownie cake, it tasted strongly of herbs. The warrior told me of important things, sex, death, flyfishing, , I watched the stars melt. Years passed and quiet bass fishermen with stealthy trolling motors drift jerkbaits through the camp. The dam is a success. Ten thousand years ago, the warrior walked away from the field at the end of the day his hide intact, only by the grace of God. His seed sees the whole world No field, no lance thrust to parry we pierce ourselves No spoils no freedom dashed at the slavers block we forge our own chains No tribe no belonging ritual to earn we ink and needle our limbs "Fuck You, Bitch" we say in conversation, without meaning or feeling or care The warrior muses on the antinym of competition "Rules and laws are always the result of loss of respect and courtesy and are themselves therefore the seeds of failure see to your soul first if you seek mastery" Fuck you! I can throw ends till you puke watching me I got the flatspin down and I can kick yer butt at rodeo class IV? you call that class IV? I fell asleep That creek roks, I kicked its ass though shimmering the warriors small boat vanishes on the eddy line his soul intact the mystery is fun :wq

The best post to this group in days!

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"Fool!" "The Paddle is the soul, see to your soul first or there will be no mastery." The warrior smiles as his children play. These new ones come, I had seen their forebearers come to the crags when I was young, We the clueless clutched and groped our way skyward, tenous pro, lead out on clean placements. They with white scars of chalk showing all the moves, drove bolts and clipped in, stretching out the ladders to touch the heart of fear, climbed glass while we spat on the ground in disgust. They breezed our standards and buried the soul. He had an old land rover, and we pulled the grill off and brought it with us to throw it over the fire to grill some steaks we bought in town the other day. Our canoes were safely ashore high above the water and tied off just in case. It was raining. "Kore wa burauni desu. Chairo no chyokoreeto no keeki desu. Doozo." I took the offered brownie cake, it tasted strongly of herbs. The warrior told me of important things, sex, death, flyfishing, , I watched the stars melt. Years passed and quiet bass fishermen with stealthy trolling motors drift jerkbaits through the camp. The dam is a success. Ten thousand years ago, the warrior walked away from the field at the end of the day his hide intact, only by the grace of God. His seed sees the whole world No field, no lance thrust to parry we pierce ourselves No spoils no freedom dashed at the slavers block we forge our own chains No tribe no belonging ritual to earn we ink and needle our limbs "Fuck You, Bitch" we say in conversation, without meaning or feeling or care The warrior muses on the antinym of competition "Rules and laws are always the result of loss of respect and courtesy and are themselves therefore the seeds of failure see to your soul first if you seek mastery" Fuck you! I can throw ends till you puke watching me I got the flatspin down and I can kick yer butt at rodeo class IV? you call that class IV? I fell asleep That creek roks, I kicked its ass though shimmering the warriors small boat vanishes on the eddy line his soul intact the mystery is fun :wq

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Question:

I am trying to make my own float tube this winter. If anyone has any plans or knows where to get plans to make one any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Joe

Response:

I am trying to make my own float tube this winter. If anyone has any plans or knows where to get plans to make one any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Joe

Got a little free time on your hands this winter Joe?

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I am trying to make my own float tube this winter. If anyone has any plans or knows where to get plans to make one any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Joe

Make your own float tube? Hell, I’m making my own spring creek this winter! Really though, it’s not so much the plans I’d wonder about as the materials. It has often been the case, when I got a notion to make something, that I discovered it would be cheaper to buy it after I factored in the costs of material. Unfortunately, one guy doesn’t get the economies of scale a large mfg. does. This is not to say I don’t understand the appeal of do-it-yourself. That’s why I tie flies. I don’t tie enough of any particular pattern at one time to produce flies for $.10/per. Then I go buy more materials to learn a new pattern. I’m probably still losing money on the deal, but I’m gaining something else. I just wonder where the line is and if perhaps making your own float tube doesn’t cross that line. Roger

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am trying to make my own float tube this winter. If anyone has any plans or knows where to get plans to make one any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Joe Make your own float tube? Hell, I’m making my own spring creek this winter! Really though, it’s not so much the plans I’d wonder about as the materials. It has often been the case, when I got a notion to make something, that I discovered it would be cheaper to buy it after I factored in the costs of material. Unfortunately, one guy doesn’t get the economies of scale a large mfg. does. This is not to say I don’t understand the appeal of do-it-yourself. That’s why I tie flies. I don’t tie enough of any particular pattern at one time to produce flies for $.10/per. Then I go buy more materials to learn a new pattern. I’m probably still losing money on the deal, but I’m gaining something else. I just wonder where the line is and if perhaps making your own float tube doesn’t cross that line. Roger

YOU are talking about a very dangerous thing to do.  Something that can kill you.  If the stitching isn’t correct, the material wrong, etc. Whatever you do, please, please wear a life vest when trying it out. There is more engineering involved than meets the eye.  Understand this. Mr. G. — MZ

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This is not to say I don’t understand the appeal of do-it-yourself. That’s why I tie flies. I don’t tie enough of any particular pattern at one time to produce flies for $.10/per. Then I go buy more materials to learn a new pattern. I’m probably still losing money on the deal, but I’m gaining something else. I just wonder where the line is and if perhaps making your own float tube doesn’t cross that line. Roger

Roger,         Of course it crosses the line!  Didn’t you know we’re ALL over the line. Tight Line Crossings, Charley

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This is not to say I don’t understand the appeal of do-it-yourself. That’s why I tie flies. I don’t tie enough of any particular pattern at one time to produce flies for $.10/per. Then I go buy more materials to learn a new pattern. I’m probably still losing money on the deal, but I’m gaining something else. I just wonder where the line is and if perhaps making your own float tube doesn’t cross that line. Roger Roger,         Of course it crosses the line!  Didn’t you know we’re ALL over the line. Tight Line Crossings, Charley

DEAR CHARLIE:  The real profit is in the high quality improvements you obtain by tying your own flies.  Better success equates into lower overhead in the time it takes to get into your next fish. etc. — George Gehrke/President Gehrke’s World’s Best Fly Fishing Products Asotin, WA 99402 509-243-4100  FAX 4644

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Question:

Wait a minute!  The Deschutes River is NOT near Portland, Oregon.   It’s gotta be a 3-4 hour drive, at least.  And it’s not that easy to fish from shore.  What about smaller streams on the slopes of Mt Hood or an hour or so west of Portland near Vernonia/Mist or down in Yamhill County (seem to remember some creeks in there near McMinnville – Yamhill River?)?  Anyway, if you consider total travel time, a 3-hour drive is fairly long way to go for an hour or two of fishing.  Where do busy Portlanders REALLY go?

I can make it from McMinnville to Maupin in less than three hours, less from portland. IMHO it is worth the drive, but it does make it a long day. There are some nice small streams out here in Yamhill County. They hold mostly small wild cutthroat and hatchery rainbow. They also get very low in summer and I usually stop fishing them by mid June. I would stay away from the main Yamhill River, unless you are into warmwater fish and don’t mind raw sewage. The upper forks of the Yamhill have small cutthroat and can be fun but nothing great. Tight Lines, Jay Whitworth

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Wait a minute!  The Deschutes River is NOT near Portland, Oregon. It’s gotta be a 3-4 hour drive, at least.  And it’s not that easy to fish from shore.  What about smaller streams on the slopes of Mt Hood or an hour or so west of Portland near Vernonia/Mist or down in Yamhill County (seem to remember some creeks in there near McMinnville – Yamhill River?)?  Anyway, if you consider total travel time, a 3-hour drive is fairly long way to go for an hour or two of fishing.  Where do busy Portlanders REALLY go? — Ken Brown Satis elequontiae, sapientiae parum.

Seriously, people.  Hit the coastal streams.  The searun cutthroat are in and many streams have summer steelhead as a bonus.  But seriously, my son and I target the cutthroat.  They are the best fly rising fish in the state–yes we fish on top–and it is not a 3 hour drive.   And if the fish are not cooperating–there is the beach, maybe the jetties, and a whole smorgasbord of good cafes and restaurants. Paul

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The Deschutes is not 3 hours from Portland. It usually takes me less than two hours to get to Maupin where there is aproximately 25-30 miles of outstanding bank fishing for steelhead and Trout. (And plenty of whitefish if you are nymphing.)

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Wait a minute!  The Deschutes River is NOT near Portland, Oregon. It’s gotta be a 3-4 hour drive, at least.  And it’s not that easy to fish from shore.  What about smaller streams on the slopes of Mt Hood or an hour or so west of Portland near Vernonia/Mist or down in Yamhill County (seem to remember some creeks in there near McMinnville – Yamhill River?)?  Anyway, if you consider total travel time, a 3-hour drive is fairly long way to go for an hour or two of fishing.  Where do busy Portlanders REALLY go? — Ken Brown Satis elequontiae, sapientiae parum.

Busy Portlanders aren’t real fisherpeople.  Real fisherpeople go to the …… Mike in PDX "When the trout are lost, smash the state."                           Tom McGuane

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: Busy Portlanders aren’t real fisherpeople.  Real fisherpeople go to …. Anywhere in Idaho? (Except Leitheiser… he bailed out.  Don’t really blame him, it’s tough to come back to Oregon waters after getting spoiled by all those big Cutts.) — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

Response:

I’ll be in the Portland, OR area the end of June – beginnig of July.  I’d appreciate suggestions on places to fish for 2 days (Sat and Sun).  I’ll have a car and don’t have to return to Portland Sat nite.. Thanks in advance for your help. Martin

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I’ll be in the Portland, OR area the end of June – beginnig of July.  I’d appreciate suggestions on places to fish for 2 days (Sat and Sun).  I’ll have a car and don’t have to return to Portland Sat nite.. Thanks in advance for your help. Martin You may want to try the coastal streams–a lot closer than the Deschutes

and the searun cutthroats are the most wonderful fly rod fish you can find.  A friend of mine is a guide.  If you want to, call Glenn Young at (503) 642-4570. A secret–these fish are active surface takers!!!!! Let me know if you go and how you do. Paul

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The Deschutes River – where else.  Call Kaufmann’s Streamborn in Portland for information on the Deschutes and guides (if you want or need one).

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Wait a minute!  The Deschutes River is NOT near Portland, Oregon.   It’s gotta be a 3-4 hour drive, at least.  And it’s not that easy to fish from shore.  What about smaller streams on the slopes of Mt Hood or an hour or so west of Portland near Vernonia/Mist or down in Yamhill County (seem to remember some creeks in there near McMinnville – Yamhill River?)?  Anyway, if you consider total travel time, a 3-hour drive is fairly long way to go for an hour or two of fishing.  Where do busy Portlanders REALLY go? — Ken Brown Satis elequontiae, sapientiae parum.

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writes: Wait a minute!  The Deschutes River is NOT near Portland, Oregon.   It’s gotta be a 3-4 hour drive, at least.  And it’s not that easy to fish from shore.

Whoa!  The Deschutes is about 100 miles from Portland via very good freeways.  This makes it about an hour and a half to an hour and three quarters travel time.  As for fishing from shore, you can’t legally fish from a boat unless you are disabled amd have the proper permits.  I’ll agree that you do have to wade it to flyfish, but that’s true of most any stream!

Response:

Question:

Ayone have directions to Deep Creek in Southern California?  I’m told it’s near Lake Arrowhead.  Any info would be appreciated including recommended areas to fish. Thanks in advance, Richard

Response:

Ayone have directions to Deep Creek in Southern California?  I’m told it’s near Lake Arrowhead.  Any info would be appreciated including recommended areas to fish. Thanks in advance,

Richard, I haven’t fly-fished Deep Creek but I used to have a house at Lake Arrowhead and still go up there occasionally to visit friends.  You can get to Deep Creek from the east end of Arrowhead; take the road across the street from the Marina.  There is a trailhead with a sign.  It’s a nice 3 mile or so hike down – I haven’t hiked all the way to the creek.  Friends that have fished the creek like it; the fish are small, it’s catch and release, barbless hooks.  Compared to a lot of places you can fish, it’s not great but there is very little fly-fishing in SOCAL so you take what you can get.  Remember, you have to hike out at the end!  I think there are other approaches to the creek but I don’t know them.  Good luck. Dave Hurwitz

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