Question:

Dave, when you get the details all worked out. Post a thread outlining same so everybody won’t respond to such a length that I read them all and get confused. And I hope you recoup your investment first……

Response:

Asadi writes: Dave, when you get the details all worked out. Post a thread outlining same so everybody won’t respond to such a length that I read them all and get confused. And I hope you recoup your investment first……

Will do that, John.  The participation has slowed – 37 tickets right now.  BTW, I ain’t doin’ this to regain any investment.  Remember when I bought it from Vern that several kind folks sent me money which I sent to a teacher in Maine who teaches his 9th graders fly fishing. Dave

Response:

Question:

Have the white flies started to hatch on the upper Potomac yet?

Response:

Yes.  Best time is after seven p.m.  I’ve been using a "green weenie" pattern, but using white chenille vice chartreuse. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply.

Response:

Yes.  Best time is after seven p.m.  I’ve been using a "green weenie" pattern, but using white chenille vice chartreuse. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply.

Frank, it strikes me that Doc Saylor might be somebody you ought to hook up with (no pun intended) Given your propensity to do face plants and other wild gyrations while fishing, you need to make him your fishin’ buddy. Just tryin’ to keep you alive and his business flourishing. Frank Sr. who is due for two more cortisone shots in the heels. YIKES!!!

Response:

Frank, it strikes me that Doc Saylor might be somebody you ought to hook up with (no pun intended) Given your propensity to do face plants and other wild gyrations while fishing, you need to make him your fishin’ buddy. Just tryin’ to keep you alive and his business flourishing. Frank Sr. who is due for two more cortisone shots in the heels. YIKES!!!

Actually, looking for the Air Force Pararescue type. Need someone who can scale a cliff or a fish, shoot an attacking grizzly or a class V rapid to drag my ass out, repair a float tube or repair to the extraction point.  Must be qualified in white water, avalanche, and deep submersible rescue.  Should be world renown fly tyer and brewer. Now thats a fishing buddy.                  Frank (Just had cortisone next to my spine)

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Frank, it strikes me that Doc Saylor might be somebody you ought to hook up with (no pun intended) Given your propensity to do face plants and other wild gyrations while fishing, you need to make him your fishin’ buddy. Just tryin’ to keep you alive and his business flourishing. Frank Sr. who is due for two more cortisone shots in the heels. YIKES!!! Actually, looking for the Air Force Pararescue type. Need someone who can scale a cliff or a fish, shoot an attacking grizzly or a class V rapid to drag my ass out, repair a float tube or repair to the extraction point.  Must be qualified in white water, avalanche, and deep submersible rescue.  Should be world renown fly tyer and brewer. Now thats a fishing buddy.

You need a dog. — TL, Tim (well, not for the fly tying and brewing but, hey, nobody’s perfect.)

Response:

You need a dog. — TL, Tim

Well, I have a dog.  I shall refer to him as "blond dog."  He is a master brewer, as a matter of fact, his output rivals Budweiser in quantity and quality.  He is afraid of bugs, terrified of the treadmill (well, thats not a bad thing), feet moving under a blanket on the bed will send him into a barking fit for two hours, often forgets to put his feet back down when jumping off of a step, gets beaten up by the cat, has more psychosis than ROFF (you must pretend that you are trying to eat his food or he will go 4-5 days without eating), his daddy was a long-haired miniture dachshund and mommy was a maltese.  So he is either a dachtese or a malhund.  I don’t need another. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply.

Response:

Well, I was in the Navy so I could probably call in an aircraft carrier to save you on occasion.  I’m also due to brew my sixth batch of pale ale or porter soon. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You need a dog. — TL, Tim Well, I have a dog.  I shall refer to him as "blond dog."  He is a master brewer, as a matter of fact, his output rivals Budweiser in quantity and quality.  He is afraid of bugs, terrified of the treadmill (well, thats not a bad thing), feet moving under a blanket on the bed will send him into a barking fit for two hours, often forgets to put his feet back down when jumping off of a step, gets beaten up by the cat, has more psychosis than ROFF (you must pretend that you are trying to eat his food or he will go 4-5 days without eating), his daddy was a long-haired miniture dachshund and mommy was a maltese.  So he is either a dachtese or a malhund.  I don’t need another. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply.

Response:

Okay, think we gotta hook up.  I do know of a couple of good spots within ten miles of Harpers Ferry.  My daughter is coming back this weekend after a month away so will stay home, but mayhaps next?  I’ll even leave off the squiddly jokes. — Frank Reid (USAF Retired) Reverse email to reply.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You need a dog. — TL, Tim Well, I have a dog.  I shall refer to him as "blond dog."  He is a master brewer, as a matter of fact, his output rivals Budweiser in quantity and quality.  He is afraid of bugs, terrified of the treadmill (well, thats not a bad thing), feet moving under a blanket on the bed will send him into a barking fit for two hours, often forgets to put his feet back down when jumping off of a step, gets beaten up by the cat, has more psychosis than ROFF (you must pretend that you are trying to eat his food or he will go 4-5 days without eating), his daddy was a long-haired miniture dachshund and mommy was a maltese.  So he is either a dachtese or a malhund.  I don’t need another.

Thanks.  Best laugh I’ve had in a week.  Nice to know someone has at least one pet crazier than most I’ve had. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless remove invalid or hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

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Question:

Would anyone like to give a history of Roff. When it started,who are the longest posters Etc.

Response:

I and several others helped kick off alt.fishing in the late 1980’s, and the Associated Press and several well known magazines interviewed us and ran articles on the new forum for fishers. Until the early 1990’s, I posted stats on who the top posters were per year.  Readership was about 20,000-40,000 in the early years Several years later, Brian Dixon (then in Colorado, ironically now working for HP a few buildings away from me) successfully led an effort to get the rec.outdoors.fishing.* hierarchy started. Certainly many of us older posters don’t post as much due to other activities. I remain very impressed with the quality and value of the fishing forums, and thank many of you for keeping things going. Thomas Gilg – President, Mid-Willamette Fly Fishers, Corvallis Oregon – VP Conservation, Oregon Council of the Federation of Fly Fishers – Oregon [Fish] Restoration and Enhancement Board, Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife    (i.e. I and 6 others get to decide how to spend the several-dollar surcharge on every    angling license sold in Oregon to improve fisheries and fishing opportunities) – lots of other fishing conservation and education stuff

Response:

Would anyone like to give a history of Roff. When it started,who are the longest posters Etc.

I’m not sure who started ROFF or how long ago it was, but I’ll bet HWMNBN was the one who introduced him to USENET as they developed new fly patterns in a foxhole in the Korean War. –Steve (hey, someone’s gotta namedrop, even during a Clave)

Response:

, I posted stats on who the top posters were per year.  Readership was about 20,000-40,000 in the early years    thomas, is there any way that you or some other tekkie could roughly determine the number of posters/lurkers on roff at the present? wayno

There’s no way to count pure lurkers, without having server logs for every access point on the net – world wide. Most of us are already booked for other more worthy endeavors, but I invite my good friend from The Old North State to have at it with his usual gusto ;^) Otherwise, you could scoop a contributing authors list through one of the news archivers for as far back as they go. I figure that roughly 500 authors have contributed (positively or otherwise) since Opening Day. /daytripper (who’s heading for the Cape of Cod for the week. Buh Bye! ;^)

Response:

thomas, is there any way that you or some other tekkie could roughly determine the number of posters/lurkers on roff at the present?

Well, number of posters would be fairly easy. However, if there’s someone out there who can tell how many lurkers there are, please let me know. I have a few questions to ask about my future. –Steve

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Tom;   From a self professed computer geek and fly fishing fanatic, thank you.          Frank Reid Before you buy.

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, I posted stats on who the top posters were per year.  Readership was about 20,000-40,000 in the early years

        thomas, is there any way that you or some other tekkie could roughly determine the number of posters/lurkers on roff at the present? wayno

Response:

Amen! Well done Tom. This ng and ROFFT are the major reasons I enjoy my online time. — Jamie http://clik.to/flyfish

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Tom;   From a self professed computer geek and fly fishing fanatic, thank you.          Frank Reid Before you buy.

Response:

Wayne Harrison: … is there any way that you or some other tekkie could roughly determine the number of posters/lurkers on roff at the present?

Someone somehow used to post USENET readership statistics in one of the news.* newsgroups.  I think they derived actual readership numbers from some NNTP servers, and then did some reasonable math to come up with total readership.  They would also list top posters for the top lists. Someone with time on their hands might cruise the news.* groups to see if they still post such results. Thomas Gilg

Response:

Someone with time on their hands might cruise the news.* groups to see if they still post such results.

I found: http://metalab.unc.edu/usenetb-bin/to-group.pl?rec.outdoors.fishing.fly Not that I have time on my hands you understand<g. — Charlie…

Response:

Remarq.com, which I use as a free newsreader (hence the stupid phone ad at the bottom of my posts) lists ROFF as having 1958 Threads and 2241 posters. Don’t know how far back that goes nor how many of those posters are various "G" alias’ Cheers, Allen Epps Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

Wayne Harrison: … is there any way that you or some other tekkie could roughly determine the number of posters/lurkers on roff at the present? Someone somehow used to post USENET readership statistics in one of the news.* newsgroups.  I think they derived actual readership numbers from some NNTP servers, and then did some reasonable math to come up with total readership.  They would also list top posters for the top lists.

You could make REALLY crude guesstimates, but it would be nearly impossible to get real numbers short of asking every ISP newsprovider to track each of their users and report back. They probably did something like, there are x news providers, with y average users a piece, z% of their users read usenet and then look at the posting amounts of each newsgroup to get some idea of the popularity of various group’s readers. It’s probably a good estimate +-40-50%.      - Ken —     "I was gratified to be able to answer promptly,       and I did.  I said I didn’t know."     — Mark Twain

Response:

Someone with time on their hands might cruise the news.* groups to see if they still post such results. I found: http://metalab.unc.edu/usenetb-bin/to-group.pl?rec.outdoors.fishing.fly

Thanks.  On that site I found their explanation on how the readership is estimated… "Readers      Estimated total number of people who read this group, worldwide      There are two sources of error in this number. The number is      computed by multiplying the number of people in the sample who      actually read the group by the ratio of estimated network size to      sample size. The estimated total can therefore be biased by errors in      the network size estimate (see above) and also by errors in the      determination of whether or not someone reads a group. Assuming that      "reading a group" is roughly the same as "thumbing through a      magazine", in that you don’t necessarily have to read anything, but      you have to browse through it and see what is there, then the      measurement error will come primarily from inability to locate .newsrc      files, which can either be protected or moved out of root directories.      There is no way of measuring the effect on the measurements from      unlocated .newsrc files, but it is not likely to be more than a few      percent of the total news readers. "      - Ken —     "I was gratified to be able to answer promptly,       and I did.  I said I didn’t know."     — Mark Twain

Response:

Someone with time on their hands might cruise the news.* groups to see if they still post such results. I found: http://metalab.unc.edu/usenetb-bin/to-group.pl?rec.outdoors.fishing.fly Not that I have time on my hands you understand<g. — Charlie…

    chocolat, you da king uh da world!  and the source is located in a unc.edu file–unfreaking impeachable! wayno

Response:

Question:

Hi, I was wondering if anyone has any experience with the Cabela’s FT flyrods. I was thinking of the 9′ 9 weight for casting big pike flies and for salmon etc. I’d just like to know who the manufacturer is and whether they are really a fast action rod like they claim and what a comparable name brand would be. They claim to save you as much as $200 because they don’t sell their name. Does that mean that the $230 FT 9′ 9 weight is as good as a $430 name brand rod? Thanks James

Response:

Hi, I was wondering if anyone has any experience with the Cabela’s FT flyrods. I was thinking of the 9′ 9 weight for casting big pike flies and for salmon etc. I’d just like to know who the manufacturer is and whether they are really a fast action rod like they claim and what a comparable name brand would be. They claim to save you as much as $200 because they don’t sell their name. Does that mean that the $230 FT 9′ 9 weight is as good as a $430 name brand rod?

Cabelas has a great return policy so I suggest buying one and trying it. Maybe you can do a side by side comparison with a pricier rod. Remember, a rod needs to suit you. Peter G. Aitken

Response:

Does that mean that the $230 FT 9′ 9 weight is as good as a $430 name brand rod?

Lefty Kreh says any rod over $200 casts better than almost everyone buying it. Is it "as good as"?  Depends on what you mean.  For all practical purposes, if the action of the rod suits your style, it could be as good as or better than a $430 rod.  More money buys you a label, usually better fit and finish but not always, and better resale value. Regards, Jeff

Response:

More money buys you a label, usually better fit and finish but not always, and better resale value.

Amem brother, last weekend I was looking at some pricy Orvis stuff and noticed the tip sections were all a bit warped and twisted. No way I’d pay that price for a rod that wasn’t straight and true, even if I can’t cast good enough to do the rod justice. Flyfish

Response:

Does that mean that the $230 FT 9′ 9 weight is as good as a $430 name brand rod? Lefty Kreh says any rod over $200 casts better than almost everyone buying it. Is it "as good as"?  Depends on what you mean.  For all practical purposes, if the action of the rod suits your style, it could be as good as or better than a $430 rod.  More money buys you a label, usually better fit and finish but not always, and better resale value. Regards, Jeff

Lefty actually says any rod over $100! Peter G. Aitken

Response:

More money buys you a label, usually better fit and finish but not always, and better resale value. Amem brother, last weekend I was looking at some pricy Orvis stuff and noticed the tip sections were all a bit warped and twisted. No way I’d pay that price for a rod that wasn’t straight and true, even if I can’t cast good enough to do the rod justice.

One thing to consider is that some rods come with a guarantee against breakage regardless of the cause. I have heard for example that if you break an L.L.Bean rod and call them, then if FedEx can find you, you will have a replacement the next day. This is a practical reason to pay a bit more for a rod, particularly if you are a klutz like me. Peter G. Aitken

Response:

One thing to consider is that some rods come with a guarantee against breakage regardless of the cause. I have heard for example that if you break an L.L.Bean rod and call them, then if FedEx can find you, you will have a replacement the next day. This is a practical reason to pay a bit more for a rod, particularly if you are a klutz like me.

Yeah you’re right, I left that out.  That’s an important point.  A lot of the "top dollar" rods offer that and it’s nothing to sneeze at! Regards, Jeff

Response:

The only guarantee I would ever pay extra money for, is if they guarantee that I will live a hundred years to fish with it. TL MC — "In order to achieve what is possible, one must constantly attempt the impossible" http://www.mikeconnor.de

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Lefty actually says any rod over $100!

Now that you hold me to it, I can’t remember where I read it.  What book is that from?  Thanks, Jeff Regards, Jeff

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The only guarantee I would ever pay extra money for, is if they guarantee that I will live a hundred years to fish with it.

Sure, I’ll give you that guarantee. If you die you can sue me! Peter Aitken

Response:

It is in Advanced Fly Fishing Techniques – a terrific book, by the way, for those who have not read it. Peter Aitken

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Lefty actually says any rod over $100! Now that you hold me to it, I can’t remember where I read it.  What book is that from?  Thanks, Jeff Regards, Jeff

Response:

I think Cabela’s uses Loomis blanks for their higher priced rods. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, I was wondering if anyone has any experience with the Cabela’s FT flyrods. I was thinking of the 9′ 9 weight for casting big pike flies and for salmon etc. I’d just like to know who the manufacturer is and whether they are really a fast action rod like they claim and what a comparable name brand would be. They claim to save you as much as $200 because they don’t sell their name. Does that mean that the $230 FT 9′ 9 weight is as good as a $430 name brand rod? Thanks James

Response:

Cabela’s FT flyrods. I’d just like to know who the manufacturer is

Call Cabela’s and ask them!  That’s what I did.  I bought a nice 7 1/2 ft 4 wt several years ago that was made by Loomis. Sig Chicago

Response:

Cabela’s FT flyrods. I’d just like to know who the manufacturer is Call Cabela’s and ask them!  That’s what I did.  I bought a nice 7 1/2 ft 4 wt several years ago that was made by Loomis. Sig Chicago

Some time back I did ask them.  They refused to say.  A while back they were selling a very excellent fly reel that I thought was probably made by Ross.  They wouldn’t say on that one either.  Even though I was looking for parts they couldn’t supply.

Response:

Question:

I got hooked on it this summer and I recommend that you check out www.kayakfishing.com  Spike is really knowledgeable and I know that you will find what advice you need there.  I got a Malibu 2 (Ocean Kayak) and love it all the way.  i have boated some very large fish from this thing and am now really confident that the sit-on-tops are the way to go. Fish-on I spent quite a bit of time fishing from a canoe, but think I’d like to try a kayak, particularly for carrying in relatively short distances to lakes without boat ramps.  I think I’d prefer an open cockpit, or sit-on type.  Someone suggested I look into the "Pungo".  Does anyone have any experience with the Pungo, or ideas about other types I should be considering?  Thanks much. chuck

– MZ

Response:

I saw someone fly fishing from a kayak this past weekend.  It was quite the site!  I think they were in a Perception Carolina? My Old Town Heron has a large cockpit area but its heavy (50lbs or so) so its not easy to carry long distances.  You ought to look at Dagger’s Atlantis, its a large cockpit and its a pretty light boat. — http://www.ncseakayak.com North Carolina’s Headquarters for Sea Kayakers! Before you buy.

Response:

Ifly fish about 4 days a week, from my kayak’s mostly. I’ve migrated to dagger’s delta & bayou models. Their stable & stealth I can park them anywhere with low profile they get little wind drift. I use a 2 ft. hand paddle to position boat  from place to place as i fish. my wife claims I’ve become obsesed,I think i’ve finialy discovered the ultimate fly fishing vehicle.  good luck& enjoy

Response:

I spent quite a bit of time fishing from a canoe, but think I’d like to try a kayak, particularly for carrying in relatively short distances to lakes without boat ramps.  I think I’d prefer an open cockpit, or sit-on type.  Someone suggested I look into the "Pungo".  Does anyone have any experience with the Pungo, or ideas about other types I should be considering?  Thanks much. chuck

Response:

I spent quite a bit of time fishing from a canoe, but think I’d like to try a kayak, particularly for carrying in relatively short distances to lakes without boat ramps.  I think I’d prefer an open cockpit, or sit-on type.  Someone suggested I look into the "Pungo".  Does anyone have any experience with the Pungo, or ideas about other types I should be considering?  Thanks much.

The Pungo seems to be a big seller in the Atlanta area, but I like my Ride (also by Wilderness Systems). The Ride is a sit-on-top as opposed to an open cockpit, and if keeping your butt dry is important it’s probably not for you<g. The Ride is also probably more awkward to carry than the Pungo, I got a set of wheels that slip on the back of a kayak or canoe to use on mine. — Charlie…

Response:

Chuck, I use to fish from a small boat I owned and sometimes from canoes I rented. I sold the boat and didn’t fish for many years. This past summer I decided to fish again and thought to buy a canoe but ended up buying a kayak. I’ll share the details – maybe it will be of help in some way. – canoes were more expensive than I thought and the   idea of using a kayak came to mind. I had no idea what kayaks cost – thought they might be cheaper. I had never heard of anyone fishing from a kayak but thought maybe it would work. – I wanted something small enough to store in my garage.  I did some research online. I was surprised at how long and how expensive some kayaks are. I identified the major companies and the smaller, less expensive models. I narrowed my search to about 3 kayaks. Only one of them had a distributer close by (20 miles away). They had a website and I got the basic info from that. I called and made arrangements to come look at the model of interest – an Old Town – Otter – they had to bring it in from their warehouse several miles away. They had a ‘Loon’ – a more expensive and longer model in stock that was nice but I bought the Otter for just over $300. – the otter is 9′ 6" long and fits just perfect on top of my car, it has a large open cockpit easy to enter/exit, it is not built to ‘roll’ – which having never ridden in a kayak I didn’t know how to do, and I’m not sure ‘rolling’ and fishing go together anyway! It fits nicely in my garage. It weighs 39 pounds – about as light as I could find- and is easy to carry. – I knew nothing about tracking, speed, compounds etc when I bought it but I think all that turned out ok with what I got and the casual fishing I’m doing. – I didn’t know if there would be enough room to fish comfortably from a kayak but it turned out there is – for me. All my ‘gear’ goes in my small backpack – the other items are a paddle and a ‘life jacket’ and one fishing rod. I have a bow line and a stern line tied to the kayak – they are used to tie the kayak to the car. When I launch – I tie the bow line to my paddle and the stern line to my pack – in case I ever flip. I rest my legs on the pack – it’s right in front of me with easy access to my lures etc. I’ve learned to rest the paddle across the kayak when not in use and to ‘fish around it’. I’ve never had a problem  landing a fish because the paddle got in the way. – I don’t know if other styles of kayaks such as those you ’sit on top’ would work better or not – I’ve never tried one. I have made trips of up to 3-4 hrs without getting out of the kayak – I can shift my seating position a little and that helps- but you can’t move around much. -kayak fishing isn’t for everyone, but I like it. I’m small (5′ 8"), a good swimmer (also scuba certified), very comfortable in and around the water, comfortable in confined spaces (use to do some cave exploring). I like being low on the water while I fish – and the way I’m able to move the kayak into places larger craft don’t go – in and around the bank / stumps etc – and it’s so peaceful and quiet – I can come up on fish very quietly – some even swim over to check me out. I think I enjoyed my past canoe trips because it ‘put me close to nature’ – and with the kayak I feel even closer. – the places I fish have boat ramps, but once I went where there was no ramp. I had to carry the kayak down a hill about 50 feet. It was not a problem – but it did take more effort than I thought it would. I wouldn’t want to carry it a hundred yards! – as for negatives, the kayak tips over relatively easy – (that hasn’t been a problem for me), it’s sensitive to the wind – this can be a challenge while trying to fish – sometimes I can take advantage by drifting, depending on shoreline location or even doing some trolling. – I’ll be happy to share other info or answer questions. -larry

Response:

You should look into the Old Towne Loon series.  They have a large open cockpit and are very stable. Bill Bernhardt

Response:

Does anyone have any experience with the Pungo, or ideas about other types I should be considering?

The Pungo would be a great choice – stable, roomy, relatively fast for its size, not too heavy to cart around.

Response:

Here are two sites to try: http://www.waldenkayak.com/models.html ( scroll down to the Walden Scout ) and http://www.otccanoe.com/loon138.html check out the Old Town Loon 138

Response:

Hey Chuck, I do alot of fishing from a sit on top out here in the Pacific ocean. I have an ocean kayak scupper classic. This is a popular boat out here for fishing from. It is about 14 feet long, fairly stable, and has two big hatches so you can store gear inside the kayak. It doesn’t roll, you will fall off before you roll it…but the best thing that I have found is to sit sideways, with your feet in the water when fishing. This makes the boat very stable, I have never even come close to feeling like I was going to tip, when sitting sideways. Its also really comfortable that way. Necky also makes some nice models for fishing and so does Perception. Our company makes some wheels which use the drain holes on many sit on tops as mounting points,(that way the cart can’t slip off the back of the kayak when going over curbs, rocks, roots, etc.) they collapse so you can fit them inside the hatches on the kayak. This is really handy, because once you get to the water, you just disassemble the wheels and take them with you instead of having to take them back to the car. You can make some pole holders out of pvc pipe, or mount some of the holders available at tackle stores to the deck of the kayak, which is really handy. We put sonar on our kayaks too, once you outfit the kayak you have a great fishing machine…This might be more info than you asked for, but what can I say, Im enthusiastic about the sport. Good luck E Scary Sports http://www.scarysports.com

Response:

I spent quite a bit of time fishing from a canoe, but think I’d like to try a kayak, particularly for carrying in relatively short distances to lakes without boat ramps.  I think I’d prefer an open cockpit, or sit-on type. Someone suggested I look into the "Pungo".  Does anyone have any experience with the Pungo, or ideas about other types I should be considering?  Thanks much. chuck

Chuck, look at this site before you do anything: http://www.kayakfishing.com/ Also, make sure you look at all the different boats that might suit your purpose (lake, river, or ocean fishing). In recent years, there have been many innovations, especially in plastic sitontop boats, so give them a try before settling for a more "traditional" solution. For example, Ocean Kayaks, Perception, and Cobra all have models that come with decks molded to accept small coolers, SCUBA tanks, dry bags, caught fish, etc., that are instantly accessible from the seat. Some have hatches that open into compartments that can be used as live bait or fish wells, and can even be equipped with areators. These kayaks can also be outfitted with small anchors or sea drogues to help with drifting, clips to hold spare paddles and rods, rod holders, etc. Perception sells "outback" models of a couple of its boats that are fully geared up for the "outdoorsman," with many of the options I mentioned above. Have fun! Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

Get the Pungo.  It’s a GREAT fishing kayak!! Courtney Rapid Adventures

Response:

I spent quite a bit of time fishing from a canoe, but think I’d like to try a kayak,

The Perception Axess comes in two styles, one style is specificly designed and outfitted for fishing. The boat is a "closed" cockpit type but can easily be paddled without a skirt on flat water and the front of the cockpit area is equipped with little tackle trays and such goodies. It is a very stable boat and a lot of thought went into the bow hull design to reduce the "slapping" of the water that spooks fish. The fishing version of this boat comes in subdued colors, and as far as I know, it is the only boat of its kind anywhere at any price. The whitewater variant is a full-on creek boat and the only real differences are in color, cockpit design and outfitting. The fishing axess has a pretty cool rod holder built in as well. Its a nice nice boat, and yes, I have paddled it. take care have fun go fishing :wq Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

Question:

Hi there!  With flyfishing season coming up, I’m looking for a #4 weight rod no more than 9 feet long.  A good quality rod such as Fenwick,Sage, Scientific angler would do.  Willing to pay up to $200 cdn Let me know if you have one to sell thanks! Mike

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  Hi, I just bought a nice little 4wt loomis GL2, 7.5ft. Beautifull rod, well finished with a nice med action. The best part was it only set me back $140 cdn. Great rod at a great price!

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Piragis, the Boundary Waters Catalog people, offer a fishing rod holder that clamps to the gunwale.  I’ve used it for spinning and baitcasting rigs and I think it’ll hold a flyrod.  You can call them at 1-800-223-6565.  They also have a web site: http://www.piragis.com/ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any ideas on where to get or how to make fly rod holders for a canoe? — Paul Bunchuk Ft. Lauderdale, Fl

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Anyone have any ideas on where to get or how to make fly rod holders for a canoe? — Paul Bunchuk Ft. Lauderdale, Fl

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An interesting experience with Atlantics!  I didn’t know they were on the West Coast. The sparse Chum you mentioned, is this something new, or have you noticed it coming on.  Our populations of Chum here in Oregon have been sadly declining for several years now.  In fact there are few left.  And they are one of my favorite quarry with a fly. Burton

Well I don’t think that they’re declining.  There was a supposed poor return last year supposedly due to environmental considerations or something.  I think that they were just a little late this year.  A friend fished the same river last week and said that they were plenty of fresh chum in the lower part of the river.  I do enjoy fishing for them when they’re in a taking mood, but I have yet to uncover any sort of consistent success with them.  I would really like to find a beach with some silver chums  on it and try for them in the salt.  Haven’t been able to figure that one out yet either.

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An interesting experience with Atlantics!  I didn’t know they were on the West Coast. The sparse Chum you mentioned, is this something new, or have you noticed it coming on.  Our populations of Chum here in Oregon have been sadly declining for several years now.  In fact there are few left.  And they are one of my favorite quarry with a fly. Burton – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -just spent an interesting trip out on a local river where the Chum salmon were rather sparse.  I was swinging an egg sucking leech over the

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s too bad these farm escaped fish are moving in on our rivers.  It felt weird to cold heartedly slay what I’m sure is a noble fish in its own territory. Oh well, if you’re planning a trip after Atlantics, you might want to consider Vancouver ISland, B.C.   Martin There have been a few caught down here as well.  Someone was telling me that they are sterile, in which case, seems like they’ll do no harm. They hit a dry fly and fight well, they’re welcome to hang around where I fish. I have heard that due to the cramped quarters that these aqua cultured fish are kept in, that bacterial and fungal outbreaks are common on these fish. They may not be as harmless as you think if they introduce disease into the resident natural population. Food for thought. mike

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It’s too bad these farm escaped fish are moving in on our rivers.  It felt weird to cold heartedly slay what I’m sure is a noble fish in its own territory. Oh well, if you’re planning a trip after Atlantics, you might want to consider Vancouver ISland, B.C.   Martin There have been a few caught down here as well.  Someone was telling me that they are sterile, in which case, seems like they’ll do no harm. They hit a dry fly and fight well, they’re welcome to hang around where I fish.

Down here ? William Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA

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It’s too bad these farm escaped fish are moving in on our rivers.  It felt weird to cold heartedly slay what I’m sure is a noble fish in its own territory. Oh well, if you’re planning a trip after Atlantics, you might want to consider Vancouver ISland, B.C.   Martin

They are also in the Skagit River, having escaped from a pen in Puget Sound. Pat Hayden Sedro-Woolley

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It’s too bad these farm escaped fish are moving in on our rivers.  It felt weird to cold heartedly slay what I’m sure is a noble fish in its own territory. Oh well, if you’re planning a trip after Atlantics, you might want to consider Vancouver ISland, B.C.   Martin

There have been a few caught down here as well.  Someone was telling me that they are sterile, in which case, seems like they’ll do no harm. They hit a dry fly and fight well, they’re welcome to hang around where I fish.

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It’s too bad these farm escaped fish are moving in on our rivers.  It felt weird to cold heartedly slay what I’m sure is a noble fish in its own territory. Oh well, if you’re planning a trip after Atlantics, you might want to consider Vancouver ISland, B.C.   Martin There have been a few caught down here as well.  Someone was telling me that they are sterile, in which case, seems like they’ll do no harm. They hit a dry fly and fight well, they’re welcome to hang around where I fish.

I have heard that due to the cramped quarters that these aqua cultured fish are kept in, that bacterial and fungal outbreaks are common on these fish. They may not be as harmless as you think if they introduce disease into the resident natural population. Food for thought. mike

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I just spent an interesting trip out on a local river where the Chum salmon were rather sparse.  I was swinging an egg sucking leech over the few fish I could find when I had a take.  I set the hoook and the fish took a little upstream run.  I saw the medium sized fish was a dark color and not the green and purple typical of chum.  I was thinking I’d been lucky enough to hook a coho and put some pressure on the fish.  It jumped and then moved close to me where I noticed a bronze color with blue and red spots!  An Atlantic Salmon! I put extra pressure on the fish to capture this nasty unwanted invader.  One big sweep of the two handed rod and the fish was beached.  I clobbered it over the head and it’s now in the freezer waiting for the authorities to haul it away for dissection. It’s too bad these farm escaped fish are moving in on our rivers.  It felt weird to cold heartedly slay what I’m sure is a noble fish in its own territory. Oh well, if you’re planning a trip after Atlantics, you might want to consider Vancouver ISland, B.C.   Martin

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I need info on getting info (flyfishing for trout) in northern Washington, Idaho and Montana states. Thanx Bish

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I need info on getting info (flyfishing for trout) in northern Washington, Idaho and Montana states.

Hi Bish Your request is fairly broad.  In Washington I recommend you contact the Blue Dun Fly Shop in Wenatchee (509-664-2416) and in Idaho check with the Cast a Way Fly Shop in Coeur d’Alene (208-765-3313). In Montana the Yellowstone River is fishing good, most of the waters in the Park are also fishing well.  The Clarks Fork is high but starting to turn on.  The Madison is good AM & PM and slow through the day.  The Gallatin is Fishing good through the day and into the evening (caddis).   Hoppers, caddis, woolly buggers, and bead heads are the flies of choice.  Also Wulffs, Trudes, etc. are alway a good choice. Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (96 catalog)

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The following are acouple of places that may be able to answer questions about fly fishing in Montana http://www.cyberport.net/ecs/troutski/troutski.html http://www.cyberport.net/ecs/wwater/gnwwater.html — Electronic Cottage Services http://www.cyberport.net/ecs/lakeco/business/ecs/ecshome.html PO Box 81 Polson, MT 59860 406-887-2899

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The following are acouple of places that may be able to answer questions about fly fishing in Montana

OR NOT!!!

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Path: news.micron.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-stk-11.sprintlink.net!cs.utexas.ed u!swrinde!news-res.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!hunter.premier.net!news.cais.net!nn tp04.primenet.com!news.shkoo.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.fibr.net!news.inter netMCI.com!news-admin Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly Organization: InternetMCI Lines: 7 NNTP-Posting-Host: dialup535.bloomington.mci.net The following are acouple of places that may be able to answer questions about fly fishing in Montana OR NOT!!!

Try calling the Idaho Outfitters and Guides Association or visit the Idaho home page.

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writes: Fished at Salmon River 9/27,9/28 for Spposed to be Greatest Chinook Salmon run.

Your experience sent chills down my spine.  At first I felt sorry for those Chinook Salmon that had been transplanted to such an unfriendly location. Then I felt sorry for you, trying to give these magnificent fish a decent sporting chance and being thwarted by uncaring fishermen.  And then I felt sorry for myself, because I wondered how long it would be before that type of fishing would become standard practice everywhere.  I prey that the new fishermen entering the sport give some respect to their surroundings and their fellow fishermen. Ernie Harrison

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Hi Goh, Looks like the SR really got to you. Maybe you should give SW a try! Give me a call  or send Email and we’ll work something out. Maybe join "Salty" Fly rodders-Good bunch of guys with similar interest(and they don’t like to kill fish) We meet 1st Monday of the month at Queens Botanical Garden in Flushing. On Main street just North of LIE.

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Fished at Salmon River 9/27,9/28 for Spposed to be Greatest Chinook Salmon run. Hooked a  fish in every morning and run after fish up stream and down stream  was great sport. but no more fish come through. everybody have to wait for a single  fish to come up. The run was very spars and too many fishermen. (I can’t imagine what  weekend will be!!) They are totally different crowds than any others I have seen. They are just like Bear with rod and reel!! Chasing fish after fish and present Ugliest fly you can imagine to their nose and hook them any where on their body and hold the rod still . partner or their  guide will run after hooked fish and net fish. The Warden will  run to them and check if they foul or fair. if it’s fair they will  kill the fish. If not, release him and chase the same fish again until hook him near the mouth. arguing about who’s fish,who cuts in middle etc…..endless. Ugliest fishing I have ever saw. I had enough watching theses Bears and went down stream to explore other stretch of river. where no body around. happen to be good holding pool. as my fly reached to productive area Spin fishermen with huge spoon from no where splashed in front of my fly. I said to my self enough is enough. clipped off my fly and  practice Spey casting  for rest of the day. I should Foul hook those Bears with #4/0 Dbl hook with Droper It could be great fight!! It was  clear and beautiful autumn day (not good for fishing) PS. At the Fly fishing section is worse. they foul hook one single fish with 20lb tippet from both side of the bank  and yell each other. They don’t care at all beacuse it’s catch and  release water anyway. There is no respect to sports or to the fish. This is The Ugliest Fly fishing in world. If someone knows Uglier Fly fishing than this,I don’t mind trying them. it’s all Bullsxxt!! Goh

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Camping is available but I don’t camp there. I recommend the Portly Angler (about 17-23$ a night depending on the # of people). There really isn’t a back country so camping parks are your best bet (i.e. KOA or such). Licences are about $20 for limited time period?? and 35-40 a year. Chuck Abbott

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Hi there is a web page set up exclusively for the Salmon River. It’s pretty informative! http://www.maine.com/fish-ny/

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Hi During Steelhead season in November at Fly Fishing section. I saw many Fishermen using long leader and Hevey Weight AND!! Size 3/0 or larger hook with little bity piece of some hair or feather. Very nice low-water parttern!? drifting on holding pool and snaging one after another. Hope the DEC will check these Fly fishermen !? very closely also. I think Salmon River is very pretty if you go upper section. Especialy the end of Season (March and April) With less crowd, you will have whole section by your self.

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Hi During Steelhead season in November at Fly Fishing section. I saw many Fishermen using long leader and Hevey Weight AND!! Size 3/0 or larger hook with little bity piece of some hair or feather. Very nice low-water parttern!? drifting on holding pool and snaging one after another. Hope the DEC will check these Fly fishermen !? very closely also. I think Salmon River is very pretty if you go upper section. Especialy the end of Season (March and April) With less crowd, you will have whole section by your self.

"Fly fishermen"???? I hope they get checked too, as the legal hook gap is 1/2 inch, or roughly a size 2. Chances are, there leaders were illegal as well. This is the type of fishing that gives the river such a bad reputation. Bob Petti Endwell, NY

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I admint that the river is crowded and that fishing can be a hectic because of the crowds, but IMHO there is large supply of fly fishers. The fly fishing section has been expanded in include a new areas (more on the way) and still the places can be filled with fly fishers. Snagging to the best of my knowledege has been banned on the Salmon but is still being contested to some degree. Salmon absolutely will take a fly in places other than the body. They need to be teased a bit but they will attack/eat/absently swallow a fly on a regular basis. This may require several casts to a fish. Attractor patterns and glow bugs take many Salmon. In fact, spin fishers sometimes tie on a fly to their rig and do quite well as the key is "be on the bottom" where the fish are. Dry fly fishing is rare to non-existent. I heard a tale that Ted Williams fished the river and caught serveral steelhead and salmon on the surface; but this was Mr. Williams and not you or I. Try hitting the Salmon on a wednesday-friday before a weekend and you’ll be suprised how few people there are and how mush more cooperative the fish are when they are not pounded by the crowds. Don’t give up yet…. Chuck Abbott

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  Well, speaking as a average flyfisherman who has never been there, the Salmon River has a tarnished reputation in my view.

Yes, it has a bad rep among fly fishers. I think that’s going to change over the next few years.   All the stories of crowds of neanderthals with grappling hooks and corn, and a puny 1 mile of flyfishing-only have taken me from the "I’ve gotta get up there" stage to the "I think I’ll go out west" stage.

Snagging is illegal this year. I saw people hauled off the river last year by DEC officials when the snagging was outlawed for awhile. The DEC is taking this seriously. Those "in the know" realize that sportsman will bring more money into the area than "neanderthals".   Perhaps this is good news to those who fish the Salmon.

Not really. If you accept beforehand that you’re not going to be fishing in solitude, and bring a good attitude with you, it really can be fun. Granted, it’s different, but is that necessarily bad? C’mon up and have some fun!   Mysteriously, the folks who promote the Salmon (like Fran Verdoliva, for example) don’t seem to address the issues I mentioned above.   Instead, in her online information she waxes enthusiastic about flyfishing on the Salmon, when in fact from what I’ve heard it ain’t so swift.

Fran’s a guy. The flyfishing is outstanding. Most people get disappointed if they don’t hook up there first few times out. It takes awhile to learn the river, the fish, and the techniques, just like anywhere else. It’s *NOT* a western river. The effective techniques and flies are different.   I’m not being cynical;  I just want some knowledge-backed reassurances that if I go up there, I’ll catch one fish and not get hooked in the ear by someone 10 feet from me!   — Scott

I wouldn’t guarantee anyone’s ear. I also wouldn’t guarantee someone a fish on any body of water their first time out. However, if you put your time in and learn the water and techniques, you can begin to hook fish quite regularly up there in all sorts of weather an water conditions. Just ask Fran! Bob Petti Endwell, NY

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   Well, speaking as a average flyfisherman who has never been there, the Salmon River has a tarnished reputation in my view.    All the stories of crowds of neanderthals with grappling hooks and corn, and a puny 1 mile of flyfishing-only have taken me from the "I’ve gotta get up there" stage to the "I think I’ll go out west" stage.    Perhaps this is good news to those who fish the Salmon.    Mysteriously, the folks who promote the Salmon (like Fran Verdoliva, for example) don’t seem to address the issues I mentioned above.   Instead, in her online information she waxes enthusiastic about flyfishing on the Salmon, when in fact from what I’ve heard it ain’t so swift.    I’m not being cynical;  I just want some knowledge-backed reassurances that if I go up there, I’ll catch one fish and not get hooked in the ear by someone 10 feet from me!    — Scott

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I’ve had two fishing trips to the area.   And I think it will be some time before I return. If you really want to go, I strongly recommend hiring a guide. And not all guides pratice what you might consider ‘ethical’ or at least standard flyfishing techniques. There are three I recommend without reserve: Fran Verdolovia    315 963 3905 Peter Basta        315 963 3905 or 802 867 4103 Greg Lui            (see Fran’;s number)

My experiences with the Salmon River during the salmon run are quite varied. Last year, with the on-again off-again snagging, flyfishers were out of their element (I’m being polite) downstream from the C&R areas. However, fishing in the two C&R areas was actually quite fun. It may be crowded, but it’s a different kind of crowd. I really enjoyed it, and the fishing action is usually outstanding. IMHO, the Salmon River comes into its own during the winter steelhead season. There are still quite a few fisherman out, but a flyfisherman can fish most of the river without "being in danger". And when the weather is bad, you can have large sections of the river all to yourself.

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Can anyone offer any information about Sept/Oct on the Salmon River such as the average cost of lisence and guides and whether or not back country camping is available?  Any good spots or guides. Thanks

I’ve had two fishing trips to the area.   And I think it will be some time before I return. If you really want to go, I strongly recommend hiring a guide. And not all guides pratice what you might consider ‘ethical’ or at least standard flyfishing techniques. There are three I recommend without reserve: Fran Verdolovia    315 963 3905 Peter Basta        315 963 3905 or 802 867 4103 Greg Lui            (see Fran’;s number)

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If you have an internet www browser, point it here: http://w3.maine.com/fish-ny/welcome.htm It’s a home page devoted to Salmon River

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Can anyone offer any information about Sept/Oct on the Salmon River such as the average cost of lisence and guides and whether or not back country camping is available?  Any good spots or guides.

There now are several reliable stores in Pulaski.  I’ve not been there for years but fancy the most popular FF store is at a truck stop just east of the freeway at the Pulaski exit, i.e. the side away from the town. —  |          Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Rd., Carlsbad         |  |        Springs, Ont., Canada K0A 1K0; tel: (613) 822-0734       |  |  "What I’ve always liked about science is its independence from |  |  authority"–Ontario Science Centre (name on file) 10 July 1981 |

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The salmon stop eating once they enter the river from lake Ontario.

So… the technique used to catch them is called "lifting"… a legal word for snagging/foul hooking.<<<< LIFTING IS NOT "LEGAL" IT IS IMMORAL AND PRACTICED BY IDIOTS WHO THINK THAT SALMON CANNOT BY CAUGHT AFTER THEY ENTER THE RIVER.  For some stupid reason people think that when you have thousands of fish in a river that you should be able to get a fish on every cast. The salmon will most certainly hit a fly out of aggression and reflex if it is presented the correct way,, in fact I  and large number of other anglers can consistently  hook into salmon as long as they have not had the crap spooked out of them by jerks wadding thru pools trying to move the salmon out into shallower water so they can rip a single pointed hook into the head region of the fish (this is what "lifting" is). In fact it is now a state law as of September 1 that no one may snag, lift or foul hook a salmonid  in any body of water in New York State. Anyone who is caught keeping a foul hooked fish is subject to arrest and fines. The NY DEC will be beafing up patrols on the salmon river this year in order to enforce the law. Mark Arrigo

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Check out the following Home Page.  It will answer all your questions http://www.maine.com:80/fish-ny/ Bill A.

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I fished the river a few times in late Sept/early Oct for the salmon run that occurs that time of year.  There are a few nice browns (hooked jaw & spawning colors) in there too. The salmon stop eating once they enter the river from lake Ontario.  So… the technique used to catch them is called "lifting"… a legal word for snagging/foul hooking.  There was (and still may be) a legal snagging section where you throw a heavily weighted trebble hook (sorta looks like the grapling hook that James Bond uses to climb walls) and rip it through the water in hopes of snagging a dorsal fin or tail or eye or ???  Sounds like fun huh???  Add to that the total lack of elbow room (you often have to synchronize your cast with all your neighbors to avoid tangles) and you have the ultimate fishing experience.  By the way, if your still headed there after reading this, don’t go without korkers.  Wading can get a little tough (lotsa rocks and some pushy water). There is a fee for fishing section that some senator owns.  It’s west of Pulaski and is considerably less crowded.  The fish are also much fresher since this section is closer to the lake.  It is heavily patrolled by fish & game wardens in plain clothes for snagging violators.  I believe the fee was $15 but that was in ‘93. Water levels can vary greatly due to a damn upriver.  900-933-FISH was a river report number at one time. There are very few fly-fisherpeople on most of the river.  There is a ff only section the last mile just below the hatchery.  Any fish that have managed to make it past the 33 bazillion guys downstream are pretty worn out and "near the end". I don’t know about wilderness camping or guides (never used one) but there is a campground that we stayed at on route 13 called the Pineville Campground (315-298-2325).  Most of the sites are pretty open but a few are tucked into corners giving you some semblance of privacy. I guess I sound pretty sour on the place but that’s ’cause it’s not my kind of fishing.  I suppose I became too much of a purist.  I scratched it from my list in ‘94.  There’s some nice looking water in a nice setting. You might have a better experience than I did.  Good Luck (seriously, not sarchasm). Karl Bass

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Can anyone offer any information about Sept/Oct on the Salmon River such as the average cost of lisence and guides and whether or not back country camping is available?  Any good spots or guides. Thanks

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