Question:

If you think that is weird, check out this; Abraham Lincoln was elected to Congress in 1846. John F. Kennedy was elected to Congress in 1946. Abraham Lincoln was elected President in 1860. John F. Kennedy was elected President in 1960. The names Lincoln and Kennedy each contain seven letters. Both were particularly concerned with civil rights. Both wives lost their children while living in the White House. Both Presidents were shot on a Friday. Both were shot in the head. Lincoln’s secretary, Kennedy, warned him not to go to the theatre. Kennedy’s secretary, Lincoln, warned him not to go to Dallas. Both were assassinated by Southerners. Both were succeeded by Southerners. Both successors were named Johnson. Andrew Johnson, who succeeded Lincoln, was born in 1808. Lyndon Johnson, who succeeded Kennedy, was born in 1908. John Wilkes Booth was born in 1839. Lee Harvey Oswald was born in 1939. Both assassins were known by their three names. Both names are comprised of fifteen letters Booth ran from the theater and was caught in a warehouse. Oswald ran from a warehouse and was caught in a theater. Booth and Oswald were assassinated before their trials. Coincidence? Hardly… Your Bug – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …and I`m not leaving. Your Bug Whatever.  Don’t get fixated on it and it will go away. Snookered again Collier, you whacko. Simple google search "nolio collier" points me to this page: http://www.cdkitchen.com/rfr/data/915228089.shtml There, the following is posted Newsgroups: rec.food.recipes If you’ve ever been to the Italian pizza restaurant Bertucci’s and dared to try one of their more unusual pizzas, you may be familar with this pizza which contains no tomato sauce…. Bertucci’s Nolio Pizza 1 medium yellow onion 1 tsp white pepper 1 cup heavy cream 1/2 lemon 1 – 1 1/2 cup shredded prosciutto 1 1/2 cup shredded mozzarella cheese 1 package Pilsbury pizza dough (or home made). Olive oil. Preheat oven to 400 F. Boil heavy cream until thickened. Add white pepper and the juice from a half of a lemon.   Slice onion very thin so that you are left with rings. Saute onion rings in olive oil until they are starting to get brown. Assemble pizza as follows: Unroll pizza dough onto a non-stick pizza pan. Add cheese, then prosciutto. (I like to add some pepperoni slices too).  Add the cream mixture at a time to the pizza, a tablespoon at a time, forming little puddles spread around the pizza. Drain the onions and put them on last. They will continue to carmelize as the pizza bakes.   Bake 8-10 minutes. Don’t over bake. You don’t want to "dry out" the pizza. You are sick, Collier.  Your need to be accepted is pitiful.  Print out these threads of the last couple of weeks, and take them to your shrink.   Tell him/her that you seek acceptance on ROFF because your frat brothers never accepted you, and beg him for help. Save your pride, and don’t take this as a challenge to come up with an alias that an idiot like me couldn’t bust.  You are a pitiful excuse for a human being, and getting more so rapidly. Also, what kind of idiot would poison a perfectly good pizza with heavy cream?

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Thanks, Wayne, Frank, Dave.   She’s out of danger now, just getting meds adjusted and the doctors popping in with contradictory opinions on when she can go home.  I think some want to keep her until they can track down the cause, rather than just letting her go when she seems okay.   It’s just wearing when everything to do with my kids or pets is always emergencies (okay, myself, too.).   When even the cats wait to get sick until the regular vet is closed, you know you’ve got a pattern going.  Although the dog never required a vet ER and my husband never even sees a regular doctor.  I have now seen the ERs of 5 different hospitals (not counting the ones I worked for in the long ago.) for actual emergencies.  Some of them more than once.   She sympathized with me about camping and fishing.  Said if she were in my spot, she’d want to go, too.  Heck, even though she hates camping and has never fished, she’d probably rather be doing that then trying to con the nurses in to taking her out for a cigarette. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless Hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

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cyli writes: BTW, I do cook; sometimes very oddly, though.  

You and I would get along very well.  Hope your daughter is better. Dave

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You can’t imagine how much more I’d rather be camping and fishing than visiting a hospital.  Or listening to a getting well cranky adult around the house.  Okay, maybe you can.  20 randy old guys would be a breeze. BTW, I do cook; sometimes very oddly, though. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless

My best to you and yours.  Hope all is better soonest. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply

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Mom and daughter both, HANG IN THERE!  Remember Nancy’s web site I sent you? Go there and drop her a note to let her know what’s going on with your daughter trial’s and tribulations.  I think you’ll find her a great person to "talk" to.  Her insights can be most enlightening. — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks, but my next week promises to be almost as nasty as last, except it seems my daughter _is_ likely to live.  But the only day off she’s giving me from visiting her in the hospital is tomorrow (today? Sunday, anyway.).   What are the odds an apparently healthy 30 year old woman would suddenly come down with clots all over her body? Doctors are going nuts (always a good sign, means they’re working hard at discovering the cause.).  They thought she’d be coming home on about Monday or Tuesday, but complications have ensued. You can’t imagine how much more I’d rather be camping and fishing than visiting a hospital.  Or listening to a getting well cranky adult around the house.  Okay, maybe you can.  20 randy old guys would be a breeze. BTW, I do cook; sometimes very oddly, though. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless Hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

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Say, the guy who was supposed to go down to Cape Lookout with me this coming weekend has to fly to Europe instead.  Lots of False Albacore and camping on the beach.  If you can get to Richmond by Thursday evening and bring your basic camping stuff, I have an extra Albacore rig and room in the car.  Just think! 20 randy old guys out on a spit of sand in the Atlantic and ONE woman!! (do you cook?)   BTW, The invitation is for reel!

Thanks, but my next week promises to be almost as nasty as last, except it seems my daughter _is_ likely to live.  But the only day off she’s giving me from visiting her in the hospital is tomorrow (today? Sunday, anyway.).   What are the odds an apparently healthy 30 year old woman would suddenly come down with clots all over her body? Doctors are going nuts (always a good sign, means they’re working hard at discovering the cause.).  They thought she’d be coming home on about Monday or Tuesday, but complications have ensued. You can’t imagine how much more I’d rather be camping and fishing than visiting a hospital.  Or listening to a getting well cranky adult around the house.  Okay, maybe you can.  20 randy old guys would be a breeze.   BTW, I do cook; sometimes very oddly, though.   — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless Hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

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Say, the guy who was supposed to go down to Cape Lookout with me this coming weekend has to fly to Europe instead.  Lots of False Albacore and camping on the beach.  If you can get to Richmond by Thursday evening and bring your basic camping stuff, I have an extra Albacore rig and room in the car.  Just think! 20 randy old guys out on a spit of sand in the Atlantic and ONE woman!! (do you cook?)   BTW, The invitation is for reel! — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Who cares? You came on with all the same errors he did, so whether or not you’re him is immaterial to those of us who are or are studying to be assholes. Maybe you were twins separated at birth? …and I`m not leaving. Okay. Your Bug Not mine.  It can take years of good posts and good manners to make me mellow out.   For my first 5 years or so of electronic communications I was regarded as kindly and forgiving.  I got over it.  For the next 5 years or so, I only took out after the occasional user who reminded me of a horde of black flies.  I got over that, too.  Now I can take offense at mere gnats, if their timing is right and their promise is of growth. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless Hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

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Rest Your case! Without further checking of the accuracy of your facts, this obviously proves that the asassinations were planned and performed by the same "Firm", maybe they should be a bit more inventious in their planning… There is a lawyer in the house, what do You say?? Coincidence #2: John Kennedy (Toole) wrote of a confederacy of dunces, You wrote of a confederacy against John (F) Kennedy… Weird world this! Stefan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If you think that is weird, check out this; Abraham Lincoln was elected to Congress in 1846. John F. Kennedy was elected to Congress in 1946. Abraham Lincoln was elected President in 1860. John F. Kennedy was elected President in 1960. The names Lincoln and Kennedy each contain seven letters. Both were particularly concerned with civil rights. Both wives lost their children while living in the White House. Both Presidents were shot on a Friday. Both were shot in the head. Lincoln’s secretary, Kennedy, warned him not to go to the theatre. Kennedy’s secretary, Lincoln, warned him not to go to Dallas. Both were assassinated by Southerners. Both were succeeded by Southerners. Both successors were named Johnson. Andrew Johnson, who succeeded Lincoln, was born in 1808. Lyndon Johnson, who succeeded Kennedy, was born in 1908. John Wilkes Booth was born in 1839. Lee Harvey Oswald was born in 1939. Both assassins were known by their three names. Both names are comprised of fifteen letters Booth ran from the theater and was caught in a warehouse. Oswald ran from a warehouse and was caught in a theater. Booth and Oswald were assassinated before their trials. Coincidence? Hardly… Your Bug

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …and I`m not leaving. Your Bug Whatever.  Don’t get fixated on it and it will go away. Snookered again Collier, you whacko. Simple google search "nolio collier" points me to this page: http://www.cdkitchen.com/rfr/data/915228089.shtml There, the following is posted Newsgroups: rec.food.recipes If you’ve ever been to the Italian pizza restaurant Bertucci’s and dared to try one of their more unusual pizzas, you may be familar with this pizza which contains no tomato sauce…. Bertucci’s Nolio Pizza 1 medium yellow onion 1 tsp white pepper 1 cup heavy cream 1/2 lemon 1 – 1 1/2 cup shredded prosciutto 1 1/2 cup shredded mozzarella cheese 1 package Pilsbury pizza dough (or home made). Olive oil. Preheat oven to 400 F. Boil heavy cream until thickened. Add white pepper and the juice from a half of a lemon.   Slice onion very thin so that you are left with rings. Saute onion rings in olive oil until they are starting to get brown. Assemble pizza as follows: Unroll pizza dough onto a non-stick pizza pan. Add cheese, then prosciutto. (I like to add some pepperoni slices too).  Add the cream mixture at a time to the pizza, a tablespoon at a time, forming little puddles spread around the pizza. Drain the onions and put them on last. They will continue to carmelize as the pizza bakes.   Bake 8-10 minutes. Don’t over bake. You don’t want to "dry out" the pizza. You are sick, Collier.  Your need to be accepted is pitiful.  Print out these threads of the last couple of weeks, and take them to your shrink. Tell him/her that you seek acceptance on ROFF because your frat brothers never accepted you, and beg him for help. Save your pride, and don’t take this as a challenge to come up with an alias that an idiot like me couldn’t bust.  You are a pitiful excuse for a human being, and getting more so rapidly. Also, what kind of idiot would poison a perfectly good pizza with heavy cream?

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Who cares?   You came on with all the same errors he did, so whether or not you’re him is immaterial to those of us who are or are studying to be assholes. Maybe you were twins separated at birth?   …and I`m not leaving.

Okay. Your Bug

Not mine.  It can take years of good posts and good manners to make me mellow out.   For my first 5 years or so of electronic communications I was regarded as kindly and forgiving.  I got over it.  For the next 5 years or so, I only took out after the occasional user who reminded me of a horde of black flies.  I got over that, too.  Now I can take offense at mere gnats, if their timing is right and their promise is of growth. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless Hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

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…and I`m not leaving.

Wow, are you pathetic.  You even went to the trouble of locating the incorrect apostrophe on your keyboard.  Really sad.

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Nicely done. Though, in truth, you needn’t have bothered, as with the possible exception of Citizen Luser himself, everyone here knew he and "nolio" were one and the same pathetic moron f*ckwit… /daytripper (On him from the jump.)

It’s kind of like a sore festering under a bandage.  You know it’s ugly, but you just have to lift the bandage to look anyway. — Scott Reverse first field of address to reply

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find other posts from this gentleman. He lives in Iowa. However, he did make a purchase on eBay… In fact, do a search on Michael Collier, and see how common that name is. Admittedly, the coincidence is stunning. Very sloppy investigative work, though. You did not complete your research. You would get torn apart on cross-examination. Anyway, good luck, Bug. We will see how long you can withstand the constant affronts to your common sense. This is one weird place. — Citizen Fisherman I promote Waterloo rods www.waterloorods.com

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Snookered again Collier, you whacko.

I’ve come across some pathetic losers on Usenet, but Collier takes the prize.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …and I`m not leaving. Your Bug Whatever.  Don’t get fixated on it and it will go away. Snookered again Collier, you whacko. Simple google search "nolio collier" points me to this page: http://www.cdkitchen.com/rfr/data/915228089.shtml There, the following is posted Newsgroups: rec.food.recipes If you’ve ever been to the Italian pizza restaurant Bertucci’s and dared to try one of their more unusual pizzas, you may be familar with this pizza which contains no tomato sauce…. Bertucci’s Nolio Pizza 1 medium yellow onion 1 tsp white pepper 1 cup heavy cream 1/2 lemon 1 – 1 1/2 cup shredded prosciutto 1 1/2 cup shredded mozzarella cheese 1 package Pilsbury pizza dough (or home made). Olive oil. Preheat oven to 400 F. Boil heavy cream until thickened. Add white pepper and the juice from a half of a lemon.   Slice onion very thin so that you are left with rings. Saute onion rings in olive oil until they are starting to get brown. Assemble pizza as follows: Unroll pizza dough onto a non-stick pizza pan. Add cheese, then prosciutto. (I like to add some pepperoni slices too).  Add the cream mixture at a time to the pizza, a tablespoon at a time, forming little puddles spread around the pizza. Drain the onions and put them on last. They will continue to carmelize as the pizza bakes.   Bake 8-10 minutes. Don’t over bake. You don’t want to "dry out" the pizza. You are sick, Collier.  Your need to be accepted is pitiful.  Print out these threads of the last couple of weeks, and take them to your shrink.   Tell him/her that you seek acceptance on ROFF because your frat brothers never accepted you, and beg him for help. Save your pride, and don’t take this as a challenge to come up with an alias that an idiot like me couldn’t bust.  You are a pitiful excuse for a human being, and getting more so rapidly.

Nicely done. Though, in truth, you needn’t have bothered, as with the possible exception of Citizen Luser himself, everyone here knew he and "nolio" were one and the same pathetic moron f*ckwit… /daytripper (On him from the jump.)

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…and I`m not leaving. Your Bug

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…and I`m not leaving. Your Bug

Whatever.  Don’t get fixated on it and it will go away.

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…and I`m not leaving.

Your stuff is much more interesting than the cross posted environmental drivel.

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…and I`m not leaving. Your Bug Whatever.  Don’t get fixated on it and it will go away.

Snookered again Collier, you whacko. Simple google search "nolio collier" points me to this page: http://www.cdkitchen.com/rfr/data/915228089.shtml There, the following is posted Newsgroups: rec.food.recipes If you’ve ever been to the Italian pizza restaurant Bertucci’s and dared to try one of their more unusual pizzas, you may be familar with this pizza which contains no tomato sauce…. Bertucci’s Nolio Pizza 1 medium yellow onion 1 tsp white pepper 1 cup heavy cream 1/2 lemon 1 – 1 1/2 cup shredded prosciutto 1 1/2 cup shredded mozzarella cheese 1 package Pilsbury pizza dough (or home made). Olive oil. Preheat oven to 400 F. Boil heavy cream until thickened. Add white pepper and the juice from a half of a lemon.   Slice onion very thin so that you are left with rings. Saute onion rings in olive oil until they are starting to get brown. Assemble pizza as follows: Unroll pizza dough onto a non-stick pizza pan. Add cheese, then prosciutto. (I like to add some pepperoni slices too).  Add the cream mixture at a time to the pizza, a tablespoon at a time, forming little puddles spread around the pizza. Drain the onions and put them on last. They will continue to carmelize as the pizza bakes.   Bake 8-10 minutes. Don’t over bake. You don’t want to "dry out" the pizza. You are sick, Collier.  Your need to be accepted is pitiful.  Print out these threads of the last couple of weeks, and take them to your shrink.   Tell him/her that you seek acceptance on ROFF because your frat brothers never accepted you, and beg him for help. Save your pride, and don’t take this as a challenge to come up with an alias that an idiot like me couldn’t bust.  You are a pitiful excuse for a human being, and getting more so rapidly. Also, what kind of idiot would poison a perfectly good pizza with heavy cream? — Scott Reverse first field of address to reply

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Also, what kind of idiot would poison a perfectly good pizza with heavy cream?

It’s pretty popular actually.  Not something you would want to eat all the time, but it can be pretty tasty!

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Question:

Here’s a few shots of the river. http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/nith-1.jpg http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/nith-2.jpg http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/nith-3.jpg

Nice shrubbery!

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Here’s a few shots of the river. http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/nith-1.jpg http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/nith-2.jpg http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/nith-3.jpg Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

Very pretty.  There are a couple of stretches like that that I’ve fished, but this looks as if the whole river might be open and mellow. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless remove invalid or hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

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Here’s a few shots of the river. http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/nith-1.jpg http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/nith-2.jpg http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/nith-3.jpg

Looks like easy wading at least…

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Very pretty.  There are a couple of stretches like that that I’ve fished, but this looks as if the whole river might be open and mellow.

that is a good description of it but the flow rate is down quite a bit.  I figure it’s about 6" to 12" below normal levels so the big fish bunch up in a few holes, making them easy pickings for the bucket brigade.  These long glides look like perfect trout water, even the temps are not bad, yet I’ve not encountered a single young steelhead. The shallows contain the most amazing amount and variety of minnow life, I’ve ever seen.  What is really encouraging, among them are hordes of young smallies.  This river has neat "hatches" – minnows jumping out of the water all over the place, fleeing the omnipresent smallie. BTW, went out yesterday and fished some of the same water.  I didn’t do nearly as well as though I did lose a clouser to a thumping smash from a northern.  It’s fall fair time and they have helicopter rides. Guess who was the star attraction on the River Nith?  "Look folks! There’s a guy fly fishing.  Let’s take a closer look and see if he’s catching anything."  After somewhere between 30 and 40 passes, what I wouldn’t have done for an AK-47.  A chopper thumping up the river valley doesn’t do much for the catch rate.  On one pass, he dropped down below the height of the riverside trees, coming straight at me. He would’ve looked real good in a ring sight.  Oh, and there was plenty of fresh worm sign too.  No wonder things were a little slower than Friday. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

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Here’s a few shots of the river. http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/nith-1.jpg http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/nith-2.jpg http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/nith-3.jpg Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

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40 min from the house…?…nice spot…

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The Nith River was a real treat.  Thanks to low water and other abuses, a lot of the rivers around here don’t look so good but the Nith shows every sign of being very healthy.  The alewives were all fat and spunky, literally hundreds of them in every shallow riffle, and the smallies!  Each deep pool had an ordering of smallies. the little baby ones were scampering about the shallows, their older siblings hung along the edges of the pools while the big old buggers camped out in the deep middle.  A fly drawn in close would have a trail of ten or more little guys all taking turns nipping the tail. I’m used to seeing a smallie here and there, I can’t remember literally seeing dozens and dozens in one small area.  I was also pleased to see the obvious health of all of the age classes – there didn’t appear to be gaps – seeing 3" fish and catching everything from 6" to 14" plus hooking even larger.  All of this only a 100 yards from the access point.  If the GRCA website can be believed, it also has some browns and now I’m damn sure that I had a very large brown on yesterday.  I had it on for over a minute though I didn’t get it close enough to see it, the fish fought so different from the other large smallies it had to be a large trout.  The river also has pike and walleye but the take wasn’t pike-like at all and it fought too well for a walleye (unless it was a friggin’ huge walleye.) At this access point, the Nith is still a decent sized river, about as wide as Penns in some places but without the flow rates.  It’s a spate river, winding through agricultural land but a healthy riparian strip has been maintained long much of its length so the water quality is better than average for rivers in this part of the world.  The bottom is mostly gravel and cobble, providing for easy wading and access doesn’t require mountain goat DNA (and no rhodos either).  It has multiple access points, a minimum of postings, plus it’s not far from Whiteman’s Creek either.  It could easily support a group of anglers along this section without crowding, and though there are signs that some people come to fish it, It doesn’t show the evidence of pressure. This is a standard regulations river, so normal seasons, limits, and all tackle and baits in the regulations are legal. All of this only 40 minutes from the house. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at

http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/streamers/index.html – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

The Nith River was a real treat.  Thanks to low water and other abuses, a lot of the rivers around here don’t look so good but the Nith shows every sign of being very healthy.  The alewives were all fat and spunky, literally hundreds of them in every shallow riffle, and the smallies!  Each deep pool had an ordering of smallies. the little baby ones were scampering about the shallows, their older siblings hung along the edges of the pools while the big old buggers camped out in the deep middle.  A fly drawn in close would have a trail of ten or more little guys all taking turns nipping the tail. I’m used to seeing a smallie here and there, I can’t remember literally seeing dozens and dozens in one small area.  I was also pleased to see the obvious health of all of the age classes – there didn’t appear to be gaps – seeing 3" fish and catching everything from 6" to 14" plus hooking even larger.  All of this only a 100 yards from the access point.  If the GRCA website can be believed, it also has some browns and now I’m damn sure that I had a very large brown on yesterday.  I had it on for over a minute though I didn’t get it close enough to see it, the fish fought so different from the other large smallies it had to be a large trout.  The river also has pike and walleye but the take wasn’t pike-like at all and it fought too well for a walleye (unless it was a friggin’ huge walleye.) At this access point, the Nith is still a decent sized river, about as wide as Penns in some places but without the flow rates.  It’s a spate river, winding through agricultural land but a healthy riparian strip has been maintained long much of its length so the water quality is better than average for rivers in this part of the world.  The bottom is mostly gravel and cobble, providing for easy wading and access doesn’t require mountain goat DNA (and no rhodos either).  It has multiple access points, a minimum of postings, plus it’s not far from Whiteman’s Creek either.  It could easily support a group of anglers along this section without crowding, and though there are signs that some people come to fish it, It doesn’t show the evidence of pressure. This is a standard regulations river, so normal seasons, limits, and all tackle and baits in the regulations are legal. All of this only 40 minutes from the house. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

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Question:

    No, I’m not referring to the excellent book of the same name. I just got this cut and paste in an e-mail from my uncle. There is no indication that the guy was fishing with flies, but I thought the article would be of interest to the group. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Journal) about the truth on the shark attack here on Pensacola Beach, the truth is coming out!  There is a reason that the "hero" of the attack that wrestled that 7 foot shark to shore is not giving any interviews, and is hard to find.  There is a reason that this 7 foot shark was in 2 feet of water, and there is a reason that the family is "acting funny" about taking money from those that want to help….here it is…..hard truth…Sit down…. THE UNCLE THAT WRESTLED THE SHARK ASHORE WAS FISHING FOR SHARKS, HAD IT ON A LINE AND HAD BEEN FIGHTING IT FOR TWO HOURS PLUS. The unidentified stranger that helped him also helped him fight the fish to shore.  When the shark got into two feet of water, the kids all ran into the water in jubilation and the shark lunged from off the ground and hit Jessie Arbogast twice, took his arm off and bit into his leg.  !!!!!!! The man had CHUM in the water, and heavy tackle built to fish for sharks. His nephew got bit because the entire family went into the water trying to wrestle the fish to land.  There is big money on a shark that size. THIS IS THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH The press has suppressed the real truth, because they are afraid that it will effect the contributions for Jessie and the uncle is so filled with guilt, he has tried to commit suicide once already….Now it all makes sense.  NO MAN is going to wrestle a shark that large to shore in two feet of water, that is one powerful animal, and they had cut the cable, and hid the rods by the time the Medic’s got there.  The ranger that shot the shark testified that the shark still had the hook in his mouth and "put up a big fight because his mouth was all bloody and torn up"….(that is why the shark had blood all over it’s mouth in the TV photo’s, it was it’s own blood !!) I am not lessening the horror of the event.  Jessie did get an arm bit off and is going to recover, but I am tired of Pensacola Beach taking it in the shorts because of the "whole truth not being told"….The money, in my opinion would still come in, and the uncle will have to accept that it was a tragic accident and a mistake.

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No, I’m not referring to the excellent book of the same name. I just got this cut and paste in an e-mail from my uncle. There is no indication that the guy was fishing with flies, but I thought the article would be of interest to the group.

Saw this in the Urban Legends web page-they said not true.  Hope not, anyway….

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THE UNCLE THAT WRESTLED THE SHARK ASHORE WAS FISHING FOR SHARKS, HAD IT ON A LINE AND HAD BEEN FIGHTING IT FOR TWO HOURS PLUS.

Not sure about the veracity of that report but at least one network news program did present a brief story about tourists in that area chumming sharks, not necessarily to fish for them but to gawk at them. Mu

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Question:

…so walt, that explains why you were so easily hooked, eh??

doncha be callin’ me a fish, jeff. genetically-impaired….no problemo, but fish, no way. well, walt, some of us need a bit of a challenge ya know…those tight loops and free casts you throw are just way too easy…and, anybody can tie a knot with their hands (btw, that was a surgeon’s loop you witnessed me create in the air) …i need me some trees, rocks, and fishin buddies to carom my flies off… seems only sportin. how to explain it???  karma, man, pure karma… jeff (applying the billiards zen theory to ff)

as rene (georgie’s honey-bun from rap) once said here at roff… "oh, it’s a zen thingy". on a more serious note….i hope you guy’s aren’t getting pounded with rain again. waldo

Response:

hate to hear you’ve lost the knack, so…out of pure, gawldang southern empathy, anytime you can make yer way to north carolina i’d be honored to help you re-instill the fine art of tree catchin…i excel in the skill… i can personally vouch for jeff’s innate ability to catch anything but the occasional genetically-impaired fish….

…so walt, that explains why you were so easily hooked, eh?? he actually caught a fish after yanking the fly out of a tree….put the darndest "wind" knot in the line i’ve ever seen. the fly landed on the water…hookset, and wallah… biggest fish of the day. i’m not gonna even try and explain it…i wouldn’t even know how.

well, walt, some of us need a bit of a challenge ya know…those tight loops and free casts you throw are just way too easy…and, anybody can tie a knot with their hands (btw, that was a surgeon’s loop you witnessed me create in the air) …i need me some trees, rocks, and fishin buddies to carom my flies off… seems only sportin. how to explain it???  karma, man, pure karma… jeff (applying the billiards zen theory to ff) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – waldo — Ezflyfish.com http://www.ezflyfish.com BRBG http://www.abebooks.com/home/BLUEBOOKS P.O. Box 5112  Banner Elk, NC 28604 (828)963-5001

Response:

hate to hear you’ve lost the knack, so…out of pure, gawldang southern empathy, anytime you can make yer way to north carolina i’d be honored to help you re-instill the fine art of tree catchin…i excel in the skill… jeff (holder of the state record for leaf-fish)

i can personally vouch for jeff’s innate ability to catch anything but the occasional genetically-impaired fish….hell, he even hooked my arm and i thought i was safe behind that boulder. damndest thing…he actually caught a fish after yanking the fly out of a tree….put the darndest "wind" knot in the line i’ve ever seen. the fly landed on the water…hookset, and wallah… biggest fish of the day. i’m not gonna even try and explain it…i wouldn’t even know how. waldo — Ezflyfish.com http://www.ezflyfish.com BRBG http://www.abebooks.com/home/BLUEBOOKS P.O. Box 5112  Banner Elk, NC 28604 (828)963-5001

Response:

,,,<snipped some stuff… I was a really expert tree catcher in those days -lost the knack a bit since. Thanks again Tight Lines, Tony Deacon

hate to hear you’ve lost the knack, so…out of pure, gawldang southern empathy, anytime you can make yer way to north carolina i’d be honored to help you re-instill the fine art of tree catchin…i excel in the skill… jeff (holder of the state record for leaf-fish)

Response:

Tony, I tied a few of Andre Puyans Loop Wing’s and they seemed to hold up just fine.  I didn’t notice any improvement in catching fish Ernie Harrison See Ernie’s Fly-Fishing Stuff:   http://home.pacbell.net/ernie2.

<snip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I remember reading an article by John Veniard on the Andre Puyans Loop Wing Dun in ‘Trout & Salmon’ back in the early 70s. The piece was reproduced in ‘Modern Fly-Tying Techniques’, by John Veniard and Donald Downs. At the time, I never had the confidence that those loop wings would hold up for any distance with me: I was a really expert tree catcher in those days -lost the knack a bit since. Tony Deacon

Response:

Not knockin’ your knowledge of the G&H Sedge Tony, but truth be known, it was ACTUALLY a threesome that developed this fly. The pattern was thought up as a collaboration by three tyers and fishermen, one who didn’t want any credit for his part in developing the fly, a guy named Andre Puyans…

(interesting history snipped) I’m indebted to you Larry. I didn’t know that Andre Puyans had a hand in the G&H. Credit where it’s due! I have at least a nodding acquaintance with John Goddard. He was very good about providing me with articles, at short notice sometimes, when I edited the quarterly magazine of the Fly Dressers’ Guild a few years back. He has probably forgotten more about angling than most of us will every know. Very dry sense of humour. Now, if only Andy can get full credit for his Loop Wing Dun and his line of AP Nymphs, among other flies he’s developed over the years…

I remember reading an article by John Veniard on the Andre Puyans Loop Wing Dun in ‘Trout & Salmon’ back in the early 70s. The piece was reproduced in ‘Modern Fly-Tying Techniques’, by John Veniard and Donald Downs. At the time, I never had the confidence that those loop wings would hold up for any distance with me: I was a really expert tree catcher in those days -lost the knack a bit since. Thanks again Tight Lines, Tony Deacon

Response:

it thick, the thicker the better

CarefulDave.I am not one of them, but you should see how one of the members of The Roadkill Roundtable packs deer hair…If I had not watched Bruce pack it I could have sworn it was balsa wood. Big Dale  

Response:

Darin Minor writes:

<<I’ve been looking for the pattern for this fly for some time. Could somebody please post it for me? Thanks in advance, Hook:  Dry fly Thread:  Gray or black Body:  Natural deer hair, spun and trimmed into the whap of a           wing adult caddisfly Antennae:  Two stems of a brown hack with the barbs stripped. Hackle:  Brown. The original recipe called for a small piece of bright green fur (or dubbing) spun in at the back as a first step and then pulled forward and tied off as a final step.  However, I have never seen one tied with this option. If you hate to spin deer hair, this ain’t the pattern for you.  Pack it thick, the thicker the better. Dave LaCourse

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Darin Minor writes: <<I’ve been looking for the pattern for this fly for some time. Could somebody please post it for me? Thanks in advance, Hook:  Dry fly Thread:  Gray or black Body:  Natural deer hair, spun and trimmed into the whap of a           wing adult caddisfly Antennae:  Two stems of a brown hack with the barbs stripped. Hackle:  Brown. The original recipe called for a small piece of bright green fur (or dubbing) spun in at the back as a first step and then pulled forward and tied off as a final step.  However, I have never seen one tied with this option. If you hate to spin deer hair, this ain’t the pattern for you.  Pack it thick, the thicker the better. Dave LaCourse

Thanks for posting the pattern Dave. Darin

Response:

Tony Deacon writes:

(snip for brevity) <<May I make the plea that Cliff Henry is remembered and given the credit he is due by using the original name: the ‘G&H Sedge’? Thank you for the history lesson, Tony.  I am a great afcionado of the Goddard Caddis.  I fish it almost exclusively on some rivers.  I tie is down to a size 18, but 16s and 14s are used most.  Because of its bouyancy, it is a great fly to skitter.  It will be tough to call it the G&H Sedge, but I will give it a try.  <g  And, of course, when folks question me I will have to give *them* a history lesson. Dave LaCourse

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The pattern popularly known as the ‘Goddard Caddis’ was originally called the ‘G&H Sedge’ and was a collaboration between John Goddard and the late Cliff Henry. I share the belief with many that the G&H is one of the truly great dry fly designs of all time. Because it is positively buoyant, even without proofing, one can fish it on a pitch black night with absolute confidence that it is still on the surface. It has caught me literally hundreds of brown and rainbow trout and many dozens of sea trout, fished as a ‘wake’ fly on the blackest of nights. May I make the plea that Cliff Henry is remembered and given the credit he is due by using the original name: the ‘G&H Sedge’? Tight Lines, Tony Deacon

I’ve been looking for the pattern for this fly for some time. Could somebody please post it for me? Thanks in advance, Darin

Response:

Not knockin’ your knowledge of the G&H Sedge Tony, but truth be known, it was ACTUALLY a threesome that developed this fly. The pattern was thought up as a collaboration by three tyers and fishermen, one who didn’t want any credit for his part in developing the fly, a guy named Andre Puyans.  Andy was sitting with John and Cliff one of the nights they were developing this fly and actually came up with the idea of the spun and clipped hair.  Story is by the time they had the "final product" tied, they were all in quite a drunken stupor and were quite pleased with their efforts, but didn’t really know what they came up with until the next morning when they were sober!! One of the features of the patten that has seemed to vanish into the dust is the spun fur dubbing strip of green hare (or originally seal) that was left hanging from the rear of the hook until the fly was completed, then pulled forward under the belly before tying in the antennae and hackling the fly. Another tip I shared with someone earlier today was to make the fly have a more "mottled" appearance like sedges naturally do, blend caribou and antelope along with deer to get the "blotchy" colors that are seen in a sedge’s wings.  The antennae are optional, but sure look nice on the finished fly….stripped coachman brown hackle quills are my favorite, but moose looks nice too.  Tie in the hackle quills just forward of the finished and trimmed body by the butts, leaving the tips on the hackles, then trim them after hackling the fly. Andy ties this patten at demos he does at some shows and tells the story, giving FULL CREDIT to both John Goddard and Cliff Henry when he does…and he says "It’s known now as the Goddard Caddis, but the TRUE name of the fly is the G&H Sedge" Larry #:)# Now, if only Andy can get full credit for his Loop Wing Dun and his line of AP Nymphs, among other flies he’s developed over the years…

Response:

The pattern popularly known as the ‘Goddard Caddis’ was originally called the ‘G&H Sedge’ and was a collaboration between John Goddard and the late Cliff Henry. I share the belief with many that the G&H is one of the truly great dry fly designs of all time. Because it is positively buoyant, even without proofing, one can fish it on a pitch black night with absolute confidence that it is still on the surface. It has caught me literally hundreds of brown and rainbow trout and many dozens of sea trout, fished as a ‘wake’ fly on the blackest of nights. May I make the plea that Cliff Henry is remembered and given the credit he is due by using the original name: the ‘G&H Sedge’? Tight Lines, Tony Deacon

Response:

Question:

Hello there, I’m scheduled to spend a couple of weeks near London on work assignment. I’m very interested in any advice you may have for fly fishing in this area. Any and all suggestions are welcome!! Thanks, John Erskine

Response:

I’m scheduled to spend a couple of weeks near London on work assignment. I’m very interested in any advice you may have for fly fishing in this area. Any and all suggestions are welcome!!

Surprisingly good fishing is available near London, as many of the classic chalk streams (Test, Itchen, Bourne, Lambourne, etc.) are within a 90 minute drive west-southwest of the city in Hampshire. Isaak Walton, for example, is buried in Winchester cathedral.  There’s a small chapel where he lies, with stained glass scenes of the apostles fishing, intermixed with scenes of the master himself.  If you hit my website, address below, you can read an account of my trip last year. The problem, of course, is that virtually all of the water is private, controlled either by private land-owners or clubs.  You’ll have to at least pay a rod fee, and probably need to hire a guide, at least to begin. My fishing was arranged by: William Daniel, some of the best water in the area. Michael — www.geocities.com/yosemite/falls/3363 Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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Question:

[...] The only unquestionably true, authentic, genuine trout is the brown, _salmo trutta_.

Not quite true.  There is also Salmo salar, the atlantic salmon which is actually a trout (at least the last time I looked – it may have been reclassified since…) Regards, John — Dr. John Hardie Indiana University Cyclotron Facility

Response:

  <snip a lake trout. I was under the impression that the tell-tale sign of their chardom is the white band on the bottom of their bottom fins,   <snip

I have caught and also seen photographs of brown trout having white (or at least cream-colored) leading edges on some of their fins.  I don’t recall seeing this on the pectoral fins. August K. Watercolor Fish Art http://www.eskimo.com/~augustk

Response:

Brook trout are charr, not trout — James R. Babb – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –    Excuse my ignorance, but a friend of mine is convinced, and tried to convince me, that Brook Trout aren’t actually trout. Does anyone have an opinion on this?                    thanks.

Response:

[...] The only unquestionably true, authentic, genuine trout is the brown, _salmo trutta_. Not quite true.  There is also Salmo salar, the atlantic salmon which is actually a trout (at least the last time I looked – it may have been reclassified since…) Regards, John — Dr. John Hardie Indiana University Cyclotron Facility

To every one who is watching this thread: Do you think the fish know this?  I hope the brookie’s ego doesn’t get bruised.  So let me get this: some trout and  salmon are really char, but there is a salmon that is really a trout.  White wine from red grapes is called blush, Tomatoes are fruit, but ketchup is a vegetable,  peanuts aren’t nuts or peas.  We park in a driveway and drive on a parkway. Class dismissed! all kidding aside, thanks for the info, this is why NG’s are here so we can learn something and have some fun at it.  

Response:

I note Robert that you are from Maine and commented on brook trout. I am an outdoors columnist in Canada, and am curious about two subspecies of rare trout. One I believe exists in Maine. Do you have any info. on this? I ask because I am interested in trout and enjoy catching (primarily release most) unusual or rare strains.

Is it safe to presume that you’re referring to Blueback trout? Actuaally another artic char subspecies – and a rare if not endangered one, for sure. Or perhaps the Sunapee Golden trout (actually Yet Another Rare Artic Char – Salvilinus alpinus oquassa)? btw: Being a neighbor to our north, are you familiar with the Red Trout – which is native to Quebec – and another member of the Salvilinus alpinus group? I believe all three of these fish are described as "relics" today… Cheers! /dave <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< < Digital Equipment Corp.       Alpha Server Engineering < < Parker Street Campus            Maynard, Massachusetts   < <        Charter Member of "Curmudgeons Unlimited"       < <<<<<<<<<<<< AMA 548313 <<<<<<<<<<<< Disclaimer: Opinion and content is mine alone, and unlikely             to be shared by my employer, etc…

Response:

Thanks, John, for starting such an interesting thread on the truth about Brookies… I’d like to suggest that everyone interested in the origins, history, genetic makeup of our favorite fish, read a new book by ichthyologist Nick Karas entitled, appropriately,  BROOK TROUT. It is being published by Lyons & Burford and should be in stores in late March/early April. Email me if you have any questions…  Krista

Response:

If Brookies aren’t trout, they’re doing a damn fine imitation. Anglerboy

Response:

The bull trout and Dolly Varden, which are char, also have the white tipped fins.

So do some strains of rainbows. Though not the hatchery trout I see. John Nesselrode Shawnee, KS

Response:

   Excuse my ignorance, but a friend of mine is convinced, and tried to convince me, that Brook Trout aren’t actually trout. Does anyone have an opinion on this?                    thanks.

Brookies aren’t trout … they’re char.

Response:

their chardom is the white band on the bottom of their bottom fins, though I don’t know if other char have this too; would be interested in hearing. The bull trout and Dolly Varden, which are char, also have the white tipped fins. -Burton

In Scotland our native Arctic Char have the beautiful white outline too. Just Pete Marrow   work:  http://www.gsrg.nmh.ac.uk/   play:  http://www.gorp.com/gorp/activity/scottish_ff_faq.htm

Response:

In article    Excuse my ignorance, but a friend of mine is convinced, and tried to convince me, that Brook Trout aren’t actually trout. Does anyone have an opinion on this?

Systematic taxonomists classify the fish we know as "brook trout" as belonging to the genus _Salvelinus_ (the chars) and not _Salmo_ (the trouts).  The "lake trout" is also a char, but for some reason the popular name of the "Arctic char" (_Salvelinus alpinus_) recognizes that this fish is indeed a char.  There are minor differences between chars and trouts, which are usually of interest only to fisheries scientists.  The clearest visible difference between chars and trouts is that char have lighter-colored spots on a darker-background body, while trout have dark spots on a lighter body.  Scientific names and classifications shift and change; you probably know that the rainbow trout, long considered a true trout (_Salmo_) was reclassified several years ago and placed among the Pacific salmon (_Oncorhyncus_).  But this reclassification didn’t cause rainbow trout to immediately die after spawning, like all their brethren in _Oncorhynchus_.  A wild, native brook trout is a wonderful creature, no matter what name we give it. Woods Hole, MA   USA

Response:

Brook trout are not true trouts! They are a member of the char family so they are actually the small cousins of lake trout, artic char and dolly varden.   But enough of genetic, they’re great pan fried!                                      Leif da Lucky

Response:

I note Robert that you are from Maine and commented on brook trout. I am an outdoors columnist in Canada, and am curious about two subspecies of rare trout. One I believe exists in Maine. Do you have any info. on this? I ask because I am interested in trout and enjoy catching (primarily release most) unusual or rare strains. Tight Lines Don Stokes Outdoors Columnist

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – In article       Excuse my ignorance, but a friend of mine is convinced, and tried to convince me, that Brook Trout aren’t actually trout. Does anyone have an opinion on this? Systematic taxonomists classify the fish we know as "brook trout" as belonging to the genus _Salvelinus_ (the chars) and not _Salmo_ (the trouts).  The "lake trout" is also a char, but for some reason the popular name of the "Arctic char" (_Salvelinus alpinus_) recognizes that this fish is indeed a char.  There are minor differences between chars and trouts, which are usually of interest only to fisheries scientists.  The clearest visible difference between chars and trouts is that char have lighter-colored spots on a darker-background body, while trout have dark spots on a lighter body.  Scientific names and classifications shift and change; you probably know that the rainbow trout, long considered a true trout (_Salmo_) was reclassified several years ago and placed among the Pacific salmon (_Oncorhyncus_).  But this reclassification didn’t cause rainbow trout to immediately die after spawning, like all their brethren in _Oncorhynchus_.  A wild, native brook trout is a wonderful creature, no matter what name we give it. Woods Hole, MA   USA

Hi Bob Great bit of information. I hope you don’t mind if I save it for future reference. Good Tying &…. — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

Response:

: :         Excuse my ignorance, but a friend of mine is convinced, and tried : to convince me, that Brook Trout aren’t actually trout. Does anyone have : an opinion on this? : :                         thanks. : We tend to generically treat them as trout, however they are char.  Char are : distinguished by the white at the tips of their fins. I believe they real difference is in the dentition.  Char have teeth on their tongues and true trout (salmo) don’t.  At least I believe thats where the teeth differ. — Isaac(Ike) B. Wilder That’s my story and I’m sticking to it.

Response:

: John, : Best to concede early on this one.  Brook trout are not truly trout, but : rather char.  All fall under the family heading of salmonid and then brook : trout fall in the salvelinus genus, rainbows in the oncorhynchus genus and When did rainbows get reclassified?   I would find placing them in the oncorhyncus genus very difficult.  Their physiology is very differnt as well as physical characteristics.  Was this done based on molecular genetics? : browns in the salmo genus. The practical distinction is that char have : light spots on a dark background.  There are skull structure differences. : Char scales are especially tiny in comparison as well.  Hope this helps. : James Ehlers : Uncle Jammer’s Guide Service : Underhill, VT — Isaac(Ike) B. Wilder That’s my story and I’m sticking to it.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : :         Excuse my ignorance, but a friend of mine is convinced, and tried : to convince me, that Brook Trout aren’t actually trout.  Does anyone have : an opinion on this? : :                         thanks. : We tend to generically treat them as trout, however they are char.  Char are : distinguished by the white at the tips of their fins. I believe they real difference is in the dentition.  Char have teeth on their tongues and true trout (salmo) don’t.  At least I believe that’s where the teeth differ.

Colour is more visible, but teeth are more reliable.  Char (or equally correctly charr) have only a few teeth on the front of the vomer (broadly speaking the palate), and trout have a full set of vomerine teeth. Generally, charr have light spots, and trout have dark spots. I owe these tidbits to Calabi’s "The Illustrated Encyclopedia of Fly-Fishing."

Response:

In article    Excuse my ignorance, but a friend of mine is convinced, and tried to convince me, that Brook Trout aren’t actually trout. Does anyone have an opinion on this?

Technically, your friend is right.  The brook trout is a char, genus -salvelinus- .  The other members of this genus are the lake trout, dolly varden, bull trout, arctic char, and European char.  The whole issue of what’s a true trout has recently been stirred up by biologists who have reclassified the rainbow, cutthroat, and golden trout into the genus _oncorrhyncus_ with the Pacific salmon (chinook, coho, chum, et al).  The only unquestionably true, authentic, genuine trout is the brown, _salmo trutta_.      On the other hand, who cares?  The members of the genera salvelinus, salmo, and oncorrhyncus resemble each other closely in general morphology.  If common usage makes brookies, lakers, dollies, bulls, ‘bows, cutts, and brownies all trout, that’s fine with me.  –Roger

Response:

*  The only unquestionably true, authentic, genuine trout is the brown, _salmo trutta_.      Actually, the Atlantic salmon, Salmo salar, also belongs to the same genus as the brown trout.  Just thought I’d add a little more confusion to everyone’s day. el coyotero

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –         Excuse my ignorance, but a friend of mine is convinced, and tried to convince me, that Brook Trout aren’t actually trout. Does anyone have an opinion on this? John: Don’t think it’s a matter of opinon, as the other more technical minded responder wrote, they are a char. So, if my recollection is correct, is a lake trout. I was under the impression that the tell-tale sign of their chardom is the white band on the bottom of their bottom fins, though I don’t know if other char have this too; would be interested in hearing. Cheers TB

//snip TGB, you’re right regarding Brook trout and lake trout belonging to the char family (salvelinus). Other north american char are bull trout, dolly varden, sunapee, siscowet and – arctic char. All char species have light spots and light bands on their bottom fins; the coloration is more or less pronounced and varies from white (e.g. arctic char) to pale pink  (e.g. dolly varden) and yellowish (e.g. lake trout), depending on the species. /Tord

Response:

        Excuse my ignorance, but a friend of mine is convinced, and tried to convince me, that Brook Trout aren’t actually trout. Does anyone have an opinion on this?

John: Don’t think it’s a matter of opinon, as the other more technical minded responder wrote, they are a char. So, if my recollection is correct, is a lake trout. I was under the impression that the tell-tale sign of their chardom is the white band on the bottom of their bottom fins, though I don’t know if other char have this too; would be interested in hearing. Cheers TB The workings of great institutions is mainly the result of a vast mass of routine, petty malice, self-interest, carelessness, and sheer mistake. Only a residual fraction is thought." Santayana

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –         Excuse my ignorance, but a friend of mine is convinced, and tried to convince me, that Brook Trout aren’t actually trout. Does anyone have an opinion on this? John: Don’t think it’s a matter of opinon, as the other more technical minded responder wrote, they are a char. So, if my recollection is correct, is a lake trout. I was under the impression that the tell-tale sign of their chardom is the white band on the bottom of their bottom fins, though I don’t know if other char have this too; would be interested in hearing.

The bull trout and Dolly Varden, which are char, also have the white tipped fins. -Burton

Response:

        Excuse my ignorance, but a friend of mine is convinced, and tried to convince me, that Brook Trout aren’t actually trout. Does anyone have an opinion on this?                         thanks.

We tend to generically treat them as trout, however they are char.  Char are distinguished by the white at the tips of their fins. -Burton

Response:

        Excuse my ignorance, but a friend of mine is convinced, and tried to convince me, that Brook Trout aren’t actually trout. Does anyone have an opinion on this?                         thanks.

Response:

John, Best to concede early on this one.  Brook trout are not truly trout, but rather char.  All fall under the family heading of salmonid and then brook trout fall in the salvelinus genus, rainbows in the oncorhynchus genus and browns in the salmo genus. The practical distinction is that char have light spots on a dark background.  There are skull structure differences. Char scales are especially tiny in comparison as well.  Hope this helps. James Ehlers Uncle Jammer’s Guide Service Underhill, VT

Response:

Question:

I am spending a week in the Jackson Tenn. area.  Anyone know of any good flyfishing to be had within an hours drive? Thanks for your reply.   Dee

Response:

I don’t really know of anything near Jackson, however if you are willing to drive about 6 hours you can fish some of the finest fly fishing waters in the world in NorthEast Tennessee.   The tailwaters of the S. Holston has been rated in the top ten trout streams in the nation, and if you are looking for the mountain stream experience the Doe Creek which runs through Roan Mountain State Park is great.  Also Laurel Fork, etc.  There are also some great spots in the Smoky’s, but I have never fished them. If you want to come up here, I can guide you or I can recommend a guide. Joe Byrd – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am spending a week in the Jackson Tenn. area.  Anyone know of any good flyfishing to be had within an hours drive? Thanks for your reply.   Dee

Response:

You are closer to the White River area of Arkansas than East Tenessee. Call Gaston’s near Mountain Home Ark. or Ozark Anglers in Heber Springs, Ark.If you want to fish for small mouth try Buffalo River near Flatwoods Tn. Its about 1 hour southeast of Jackson. Try and find a book, Home Waters, written by the Mid -South Flyfishers of Memphis, Tn. It gives you good advice about the Ark. area and also about Buffalo River in Tn. Best wishes. Jack.

Response:

One hour east of Nashville is the Caney Fork River.  It has fished excellent this year.  The Caney is a tailwater.  One to two hours south of Nashville are the Elk and the Duck rivers.  They are both excellent tailwaters.  Closer to you is the Little Buffallo River.  It has a section of trout water, but I have not fished it.  Lots of smallmouth and largemouth water all over middle Tennessee.   Some of the colder smallmouth streams are stocked with trout in the spring.  Maybe some summer survivors. Maybe this will help. If you decide on a tailwater in Tennessee, please-please, call the TVA generation schedule for that particular dam.  1-800-238-2264 and follow their instructions.  The generation schedules have been pretty good for the three tailwaters I listed.  Sometimes. Michael

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Question:

writes: I landed a 3 pound carp (now I surely will go on the list ’sh_t list) on an 8x tippet today at lunch.

   Not hardly, at least for me.  I fished (bait) for carp as a kid, and know them to be wary and strong.  Carp are vegetarians, not scavengers; they don’t like polluted water, but can survive in conditions that would kill other fish; they are exotics and often a nuisance, but they did not ask to be brought here.  My hat is off to anyone who can bring one to a fly.  What pattern did you use?  Broccoli comparadun? Roger (ffer and goldfish keeper)

Response:

Call Cabella’s (800-237-4444).  They are a huge mail order company in the Midwest and they have some very good deals that they will guarantee 100%. Let me know what you do and good luck. Jeff

Response:

: I just won $100 in the instant lottery and I was able to talk my lovely : spouse into letting me buy a new fly rod (the money being a windfall and all)! Reddington Redspot, 5-6 wt, $100.  I’ve got a few rods, but I’ve used this new one more than any other this year.  It’s a fast rod, and that suits me fine.  Your style might be different.  Whether or not it works for you, I am really impressed by the value of the redspot. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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I just won $100 in the instant lottery and I was able to talk my lovely spouse into letting me buy a new fly rod (the money being a windfall and all)!<Snip..

I bought a Martin flyrod recently, and I think it is an american brand, so you should be able to find it somewhere. It is a 8′6", 5-6 wt, handles well and casts like a dream. The price was about 110 USD (in Holland), which is definitely value for money. They also have a 9 foot travelrod (4-piece) in the same weightclass. Good luck and tight lines, Herman —  Herman Nijland        |   Daytime   system manager                        |   Lifetime  flyfisher STOAS  APH             | Vlijmenseweg 50a       |   Tel.  : +31 (0)73-6214745 5223 GW Den Bosch      |   Fax   : +31 (0)73-6220235 Netherlands            |   E-mail: Check out our WWW site! URL:  http://www.stoas.nl Or my own page at:            http://www.stoas.nl/user/hny

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direct or I may miss it. Back in the March ‘96 issue of FlyRod &Reel magazine, there was an article on "affordable rods".  They gave a very good review to a "HT" (HiTech) manufactured rod in a couple of variations.  I ordered a 7′6" Executive Premier in a 5 wt. with the cork handle (comes in EVA also) from a mail order dealer up in the Milwaukee area for less than $40.  Picked up a little Shakespear reel at the local sports super store (SportMart) for around $15, some Scientific Anglers Concept WF5F line for $13 and shazam! A complete setup for less than $70 including tax and shipping. I’ve used it 4 times now and it ain’t bad.  In fact, it’s downright a pleasure to fish with.  I know that in confessing this transgression against the very precept of spending small (maybe not so small) fortunes for a FF outfit that I am setting myself up to be banished from this list for the rest of my life. It works quite well also, I landed a 3 pound carp (now I surely will go on the list ’sh_t list) on an 8x tippet today at lunch.   I’m not saying that it will replace my Orvis bamboo but then it’s many hundreds less in cost too.  Any questions, please address direct (my wife occassionally reads the list and I don’t want her knowing that gear can cost this little). Hope this helps…Jerry

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I just won $100 in the instant lottery and I was able to talk my lovely spouse into letting me buy a new fly rod (the money being a windfall and all)! Now herw is my quandry.  I have been using a cheep, heavy, stiff 7 wt rod for about 3 yrs now. I fish mosty bass and bluegill (no elephant gun comments please ;-p).  I would like to buy a 5wt rod and I need to keep the price as close to my lucky $100 as possible.  As I said, I am used to a heavy, stiff clunker of a rod, so weight is of little consideration. I suppose as I get older I will regret that opinion. I have heard good and bad about St. Croix. I also know that there are used rods out there for bargin prices. Any advice would be helpfull as I don’t want to blow this decision and end up with a $100 dud.

     You might look in the LL Bean Flyfishing Catalog.  They have a good beginner’s outfit they use in their school, with reel, backing, the works, for $99.00.  I did not buy it, because they said the action was a bit faster than is good for a true beginner learning on their own.  However, since you already have experience, that should not be any problem.  They sell them in a range of rod weights, so you should be able to get what you are looking for.  I DID buy their  next level of rod, and I have been having a ball!  The casting action is good for my skill level, and I did not go into deep debt for my new-found passion.  Hope this helps you.                                 Dan Johnson

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I just won $100 in the instant lottery and I was able to talk my lovely spouse into letting me buy a new fly rod (the money being a windfall and all)! Now herw is my quandry.  I have been using a cheep, heavy, stiff 7 wt rod for about 3 yrs now. I fish mosty bass and bluegill (no elephant gun comments please ;-p).  I would like to buy a 5wt rod and I need to keep the price as close to my lucky $100 as possible.  As I said, I am used to a heavy, stiff clunker of a rod, so weight is of little consideration. I suppose as I get older I will regret that opinion. I have heard good and bad about St. Croix. I also know that there are used rods out there for bargin prices. Any advice would be helpfull as I don’t want to blow this decision and end up with a $100 dud. P.S. if you are in the Columbus area and are trying to sell your wonderfull, whippy, high-end, casts like a dream, bought it for $300 and now I just don’t get out like I would like to, rod — I would be delighted to give it a new home. Email me. — | P. Erik Jaros                 | "I was a fine idea at the time. | |                               |          Elvis Costello         |

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I suspect the dye you used was a problem – too many salts or something else.  Try a pure acid dye, and after dying, make sure to rinse the heck out of the hide. Thomas Gilg

It was RIT DYE….

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writes: Rit dye gives fairly good results but tough colors like black Rit is not very good for fur or feathers. Of course there may be someone on the group who has good luck with Rit, my hats off to them

To get a good black with rit dye you need to add some brown dye to it. Now if I could only remember how much!                                                    Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

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   January 10 I will be taking a trip to Western Georgia, Raven Gap to be precise.  I have never fished this area and was wondering if anyone could supply me with information regarding waters in this region.  I could use any help you can offer: names and locations of streams and rivers, possible patterns, weather conditions, or perhaps the name and/or number of tackle shops in the area. Thanks in advance, Peter Johnson

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(Matthew H. Hsu) writes:

<<January 10 I will be taking a trip to Western Georgia, Raven Gap to be precise. <<…. Could use any help you can offer, …. Unfortunately, most of Georgia’s trout water will be unavailable to you due to season being closed. Also the western part of the state is not "known" for its trout waters. The Toccoa Rivers & Chattooga Rivers are open year round. as well as a few other smaller streams in the area. Anyway, I use general attracter patterns such as Royal Wulffs for dries and usually have success with small BWO’s. Streamers (buggers & muddler minnows, as well as terrestial imitations are usually good). I don’t do nymphs so can’t help there. Fly shops, the only thing close to a fly shop I know of in north western GA is the Bargain Barn in Jasper GA. There are three shops in Atlanta (Atlanta Fly Fishing Outfitters, The Classic Angler, and The Fish Hawk). The Bargain Barn will probably do a better job of directing you to the year-round water. Anyway, if you are close enough to TN or NC, suggest try and fish there since those state’s essentially have a year round season (some exceptions in NC). Check with the Choo-Choo fly shop in Chattanooga TN for more current info. E-mail me if you need more specific information. Wayne Knight Atlanta, GA

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: Anyway, I use general attracter patterns such as Royal Wulffs for dries : and usually have success with small BWO’s. Streamers (buggers & muddler : minnows, as well as terrestial imitations are usually good). I don’t do : nymphs so can’t help there. I’d suggest a hare’s ear.  my favorite for northern GA.   Steve

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