Question:

Does anyone know anything about flyfishing the east coast of the Yucatan, south of Cancun?  Supposedly there are snook and small tarpon (redfish?) in the bays and estuaries there.  I’m particularly interested in the areas around Akumal, Xel-Ha, and Boca Paila. Thanks, J

Response:

Check out www.rodreeladventures.com I can’t give any recommendation, because I haven’t used them at all. Good luck, Bill… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Does anyone know anything about flyfishing the east coast of the Yucatan, south of Cancun?  Supposedly there are snook and small tarpon (redfish?) in the bays and estuaries there.  I’m particularly interested in the areas around Akumal, Xel-Ha, and Boca Paila. Thanks, J

Response:

Question:

Hm…..it shows as 10:30 a.m., Tuesday on my server.  Truth to tell, I no longer remember when I actually sent that particular message and reference to any sort of clock would now appear to be of little help.      

We could be talking about different messages. It wouldn’t be the first time I expect. <g — Charlie…

Response:

My server says it came in at 8:43 a.m. on Tuesday; not quite two hours before I wrote the message to which he was responding. I must not see all the messages; what appears on my server to be the message he responded to shows being sent at 11:30 (EDT) on Monday.

Hm…..it shows as 10:30 a.m., Tuesday on my server.  Truth to tell, I no longer remember when I actually sent that particular message and reference to any sort of clock would now appear to be of little help.       Wolfgang who, according to the watch on his left wrist is hitting the send button at exactly 11:02 a.m. CDT on wednesday, 18 april, 2001.

Response:

My server says it came in at 8:43 a.m. on Tuesday; not quite two hours before I wrote the message to which he was responding.

I must not see all the messages; what appears on my server to be the message he responded to shows being sent at 11:30 (EDT) on Monday. — Charlie…

Response:

Moreover, as this latest missive seems to have arrived some two hours before the post to which you were responding, extra credit is being given for prescience.  I concede!        :) According to my server it was 22 hours after, not 2 hours before.

My server says it came in at 8:43 a.m. on Tuesday; not quite two hours before I wrote the message to which he was responding. Not-quite-parrallel universes?

Probably just a parallax error. Wolfgang

Response:

(bizarre exchange snipped) Man, I knew i was in for trouble as soon as I hit that send button. I must have gotten a bad bottle of merlot. With any luck, that post is buried so deep in such an old and uninteresting thread, that very few will see it. As for you others, I know I wrote bad things in bad style. I take responsibility. Bring down your ire! sean

No points will be deducted for style.  Moreover, as this latest missive seems to have arrived some two hours before the post to which you were responding, extra credit is being given for prescience.  I concede!        :) Wolfgang never wrestle with a fatidical

Response:

Moreover, as this latest missive seems to have arrived some two hours before the post to which you were responding, extra credit is being given for prescience.  I concede!        :)

According to my server it was 22 hours after, not 2 hours before. Not-quite-parrallel universes? — Charlie…

Response:

(bizarre exchange snipped) Man, I knew i was in for trouble as soon as I hit that send button. I must have gotten a bad bottle of merlot. With any luck, that post is buried so deep in such an old and uninteresting thread, that very few will see it. As for you others, I know I wrote bad things in bad style. I take responsibility. Bring down your ire! sean

Response:

Never again will I take seriously anyone here who wags their self-righteous finger at me or anyone else about wasting bandwidth about politics, weather, sex, or God for bide FF’ing or any other fucking thing.  The amount of BW pissed down the rat hole chasing Ginks crap all over cyberspace is stunning. You poor SOB’s are eating out of his dirty little paws and it’s rather sad. Harry Mason There is Sale going on,have a look    www.Troutflies.com

Response:

Never again will I take seriously anyone here who wags their self-righteous finger at me or anyone else about wasting bandwidth about politics, weather, sex, or God for bide FF’ing or any other fucking thing. The amount of BW pissed down the rat hole chasing Ginks crap all over cyberspace is stunning. You poor SOB’s are eating out of his dirty little paws and it’s rather sad. Harry Mason There is Sale going on,have a look   www.Troutflies.com

You’re absolutely right on target Harry, I succumbed to breaking a long standing rule I have of not responding to Gherke, no matter how outrageous his postings. Besides, I think Mike Connor is doing an excellent job of that. <g I will forthwith and henceforth sink back into silence. But sometimes it is hard to remain passive in the face of these onslaughts to intelligent discourse, so I can understand why others can’t resist in feeding his egocentric ramblings. Frank (tikalok) Church

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You poor SOB’s are eating out of his dirty little paws and it’s rather sad. Harry Mason It’s indeed sad; but the food is so good! I find myself wakening in the wee hours, sneaking out of bed and slinking downstairs for just one more bite of the dirty little nibblets! I hate them but I NEED them! ravenously yours, sean Good Lord man, have you ANY idea of what you have just done??!!  Do you have even the foggiest inkling of what a dangerous precedent you have just set?  I think NOT!  You have, if we may momentarily stoop the gauche convenience of lapsing into the vernacular, "let the cat out of the poke". You can look at it that way.

Thank you. BUT, should you afford me a little more credit,

Hm, I thought I WAS doing just that. you might be of the opinion I play the Devil’s advocate, mixing shoulds, coulds and hand-fed morsels into a polarized miasma of repulsion and attraction.

I might indeed but, based on the above exchange, it would appear that neither of us would know it if I was.  I like the "polarized miasma" thing though. I may be exposing on this forum

And you certainly wouldn’t be the first. for what it has become ( merely a glorified video game, a text adventure, a room full of Dungeons & Dragons geeks fullfilling their fantasies by living vicariously through the fictive lives they could never achieve in the true world ) only with the objective of raising the odius ante.

Never been very much interested in video games myself, and I’ve never tried text adventures or D&D at all.  Just an educated guess here, but I think most of the people in this group whom I have met thus far aren’t great fans either. Moreover, based on what little time I have spent with them, I don’t think most of them depend to any great extent on vicarious living.  Until someone else steps forward to make a claim, I am content to recognize you as the resident authority on these matters. Perhaps I know that the more surreal and absurdist a mileu appears, the more irrational, and reactionary its members will let themselves -or their ‘net personas- be.

Yes, perhaps you do. Further, I might realize that ROFF is NOT a place where e-concequences do not merge with the "real" world, where everyone is really anonymous, and every man has a 13" dick.

The list of things you might know is growing at an impressive rate.  Sadly though, I am at something of a loss in trying to determine just what the latest addition to that list refers to.  I might, perhaps, guess it has something to do with not being content with the distinction of being a recognized expert on role playing; that you also have a burning desire to be the resident authority on other men’s dicks as well.  If so, I for one, decline to challenge your ascendancy on this matter. Now, what we have, is a fly-fishing version of Doom (the vid game). We can wade through the muck and dredge mowing any threat down like the Columbine library… trolling and seting, one might say. Violent, bloody and quite enjoyable, but not real. However, there is a pretty good chance that someday on the river you’re going to run in to some guy named gg, or wolfgang, or sean, and you’ll press further and find out this same gg wolfgang sean is the same who wrote of you as a coward, or pussy, or loonie, or thief, or hack, or strike indicator user, or whatever on ROFF. And the monkeywrench Devil’s advocate cashes in as some angler floats down the river face-down.

Before today I never had occasion to take seriously any threat of physical violence proffered by anyone on this news group.  Even the rather explicit threats exchanged by a few regulars were probably not taken too seriously by most readers and, as subsequent events proved, their lack of concern was not as irresponsible as one might think.  Alas, for me at least, all that has changed now.  Of course, I can’t be certain of what others may think, but I suspect you may have  limited the number of potential fishing partners you are likely to find here.  Or, to put it more directly, every swingin dick who whines about what goes on in here laps it up like a junky with the three day shakes.  The only thing they need worse than a regular fix of this appalling degradation and squalor is an occasional opportunity to declaim their disgust over the whole wretched mess and their absolute disdain (ever so politely put, of course) for those who participate, Or, if you could afford, just a little bit MORE credit, you might condisder that no one really takes credit for playing Devil’s advocate if he really is playing Devil’s advocate. You can bet that one calling himself D’s A is really likening himself to some allegorical figure like Tar Baby, or Fritz the Cat,

Admirably convoluted…..gotta give you credit for that. in which case this so-called DA thinks he has some sort of lesson to teach.

Yes, don’t we all. Perhaps this DA wants to remind us what Jesus said of speaking (and by inference, typing): what exits the mouth is a reflection of the heart.

And what are we likely to see reflected in the heart of a monkeywrench DA as we float face down in the river? And by reminding us of this on the Holy day of Easter this DA hopes ROFF will see the truth in this… that every flame and squabble degrading the bandwidth of this forum is a testament to the bile and jealousy and pride and fear and self masturbation of every over-inflated ego and every rotten heart that takes part, justified or not.

with your Jesus of Nazareth there. MAYBE, this DA might go so far as to say "Go forth, and get ye upon that river, or lake, or ditch. Take in to thine hands a flexible staff of three cubit’s length whereupon a tether is attached with which ye shall attempt to fool fishes.

The defense might be getting weary of trying to divine what the DA might or might not think, do, or say.  We could just possibly wish he might just get on with it and say what he may have to say…..allegorically speaking, that is. And when enough fishes have been fooled, and enough rivers forged, ye shall ascend to a state of grace and truth which crucifies you unto the world and the world unto you."

? To the challenged, one might translate, "get a life."

Ah!  One may have hoped there might be a sort of pr

Question:

I just got an old willow creel from a friend. The willow look pretty dry and there is no varnish to protect it. Since i want to use it when i’m fly fishing should i put something on it , if so what should i use; Varnish, linseed oil…….or is there any special product i should know of? Thanks for your help! Before you buy.

Response:

I just got an old willow creel from a friend. The willow look pretty dry and there is no varnish to protect it. Since i want to use it when i’m fly fishing should i put something on it , if so what should i use; Varnish, linseed oil…….or is there any special product i should know of?

Yo Robert.   I’m heading down to the fly shop today.   You get the latest FFA yet? Joe F.

Response:

Willow creels require no maintenance apart from a wash now and again. Line the creel with damp grass before placing fish in it. You may also soak the creel in the stream before placing fish in it.  The evaporation which then ensues helps keep the fish cool.  The grass also prevents too much slime from soaking into the creel itself and producing the most horrendous stink. TL MC — "If you have tried everything you know, and nothing works, then perhaps it is time to accept that you don

Question:

Jeff, What I would do, and what I did, was take a friend or two that know how to row a boat.  This on-the-job training is invaluable.  It doesn’t take very long to learn the basic skills.  When you no longer work up a sweat or scare the hell out of yourself, you are getting proficient.  Always be alert and remember that safety comes before fishing.  If I can row a drift boat, anyone can learn.  Good luck. Jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’ve been drifting with a number of guides over the past few years and would like to purchase a drift boat of my own soon. The major problem is that I am totally ignorant of HOW to drift a river in a boat. I am certainly not going to just "launch and learn" with on the job training. How does one go about learning to do it safely? Is it a watch and listen thing or are there instructors, books, web sites? To all you drift boat experts out there: How did you learn to do it? Thanks for listening, Jeff Marso Vancouver, WA.

Response:

Try what I did last summer.  Let the guide fish and in return he should be very happy to show you the basics.  In a couple of hours, you should be able to handle easy water without a problem.

Response:

I’ve been drifting with a number of guides over the past few years and would like to purchase a drift boat of my own soon. The major problem is that I am totally ignorant of HOW to drift a river in a boat. I am certainly not going to just "launch and learn" with on the job training. How does one go about learning to do it safely? Is it a watch and listen thing or are there instructors, books, web sites? To all you drift boat experts out there: How did you learn to do it? Thanks for listening, Jeff Marso Vancouver, WA.

Rowing a drift boat in a river or moving stream isnt that hard.   If you can read water!   First thing to remember is that all your maneuvering will be done by rowing backwards.  As you approch a rapids look at the surface of the water and see where the main current is running.  By rowing upstream or backwards position the boat in the main current or on the edge of the main current.   Never push with the oars to try to get out of a bad situation in current, row backwards or try to row up stream when making a move.   Always keep your bow pointing down stream, never get sideways or you might catch a edge….if your going to hit something hit it head on.   Have the boat balanced out so your not rowing with one oar more than the other.  You don’t need to dip the whole oar into the water, the tip of the oar will have plenty of power to postion the boat. Have a extra oar in the boat, you never know when your going to break or lose one.  Be safe and walk the boat through any water your not confident about.  Stop and look at any rapids that look bad to you, Make a mental map of how to get through it. Sharp Hooks, Pat Holdzit Fishing Products Inc. http://www.holdzit.com Before you buy.

Response:

I’ve been drifting with a number of guides over the past few years and would like to purchase a drift boat of my own soon. The major problem is that I am totally ignorant of HOW to drift a river in a boat. I am certainly not going to just "launch and learn" with on the job training. How does one go about learning to do it safely? Is it a watch and listen thing or are there instructors, books, web sites? To all you drift boat experts out there: How did you learn to do it? Thanks for listening, Jeff Marso Vancouver, WA.

Response:

I’ve been drifting with a number of guides over the past few years and would like to purchase a drift boat of my own soon. The major problem is that I am totally ignorant of HOW to drift a river in a boat. I am certainly not going to just "launch and learn" with on the job training. How does one go about learning to do it safely? Is it a watch and listen thing or are there instructors, books, web sites? To all you drift boat experts out there: How did you learn to do it? Thanks for listening, Jeff Marso Vancouver, WA.

well, you can read some books or watch a video to get some idea about what the manuevers are, but imo the best way is to find some easy water to drift (no rapids, just some wide open riffles, like the skagit from rockport to concrete) and make some floats playing around maneuvering back and forth.  this will get you used to the power needed and get the feel for the oars. don’t know what river qualifies as that easy in and around vancouver, but the local flyshop would probably have a pretty good idea of some safe, easy water. good luck, chris

Response:

DRIFTBOAT AXIOM:   Where you don’t want to go is more important than where you do want to go. In a driftboat, you can push on the oars (when they’re dipped in the water) or pull. But you’ll find you have far more arm strength when you pull. But when you pull, you go backwards. So that’s what you do: to go somewhere, you pull on the oars (hands extended at first, then hands at chest), and go there rear end first. More important, if there is someplace you DO NOT want to go (like a log jamb, suck hole or shallow riffe) point the boat at the bad place and pull hard on the oars. That’s all you need to know! — /* Sandy Pittendrigh                  –oO0  * http://montana-riverboats.com  */

Response:

Jeffery I read your post about learning to row a drift boat and would suggest the following video  "How To Row A Drift Boat" it is produced and distributed by Hyde Drift Boats in Idaho Falls, Idaho. You can get a copy by visiting the web site http://www.hydeboats.com If you are serious about learning to row safely then I suggest a river skills course.  I do not know what part of the country you are in but you should be able to find someone who offers it in your area.  Hyde runs a course in the fall at their location in Idaho Falls  and I run a week long course here in Missoula, Montana.  No matter what you decide to do please be safe, a drift boat can be a great way to enhance your fishing but they can be very dangerous in unskilled hands. Ray Beaulieu Montana Waters flyfishing outfitters

Response:

Here’s the URL for the how-to video: http://www.flyshop.com/scripts/hyde/video.cfm Haven’t seen it myself, but with Hyde’s name on it, I’m sure it’s ok. Price is $24.95. Only thing I would add is the same advice I would give to any new owner of a small boat. Start out on lakes, then move on to slow rivers, and finally to the swifter ones. Get professional-level instruction if you can; an good alternative is to join a local paddlers club. Understand that while you can teach yourself, there is an increased level of danger in doing so, and you need to decide whether the added danger is acceptable to you. Finally, buy a set of lifejackets (3 for a mack boat) the same day you buy the boat. Wear yours anytime you’re aboard, so it will be there if/when you need it, and get your passengers to do the same. If you wear it all the time, you’ll get used to it, and the comfort factor will fade into the background; eventually, it will feel uncomfortable to be aboard *without* one. Almost forgot: The North Platte and the Upper Colorado should be fishing very well this summer. I prefer the bow seat. ;^) — Rusty Hook Laramie, Wyo Before you buy.

Response:

Try what I did last summer.  Let the guide fish and in return he should be very happy to show you the basics.  In a couple of hours, you should be able to handle easy water without a problem.

Yes, this is a great way to teach someone how to manouver a drift boat/raft stern seat (that’s back for those ‘naval-y challenged’). When drifting a river, practically all your main oar usage will be in the ‘pull’ mode instead of the ‘push’ mode. This slows down the boat on moving water (bow basically pointed downstream, of course) and,  besides allowing more time for an occupant(s) of the boat to present their fly to the offerings,  does allow you (the driver ) to manouver the boat around/through any dangers. With this in mind, if the Instructor Pilot is aft of the Student Pilot and the…. sorry, there goes that Marine Air training mindset again… What I meant was…. the guy in back (the instructor) can reach over the back/shoulders of the guy driving the boat (the student) and help him pull/ push/feather the oars for drifting that wonderful moving stream of water we call a trout river. Believe me when I say that to sit in the bow seat and ‘try’ to teach someone to oar a boat down a western river, unless it’s a big, slow, flat stretch of water, is a foolish thing. You can ‘tell’ someone how,  but from the front, you can’t ’show’ them how. — Tight Lines! Brian D. Nelson Diamond N Outfitters, Missoula, Montana http://www.montana.com/dno/dno.htm 406-626-4022

Response:

Question:

<SNIPPED.  They are always very good and very quick reponses.  Do you sit at your computer all day just waiting for ROFF posts?:) Tim

No, but I do log in about twice daily usually, and at times when most posters elsewhere have long since gone to bed, so it may appear that my responses are pretty quick.  I sometimes spend quite a while doing other work on the computer, and log in even more often though. TL MC

Response:

[snip] So give em a brake or just keep on driving that jeep util you find a suitable wall..

Metaphorically speaking, of course… /daytripper ("I Brake For Newbies")

Response:

Lighten up, have a cool one and relax a bit.  It is not about gear or ego’s fellas. Mike

Thanks Mom…..errrr Mike….I almost forgot what it was "all about"….now as soon as I get done doin’ the dishes, startin another load of clothes and takin out the garbage.. if I have your permission, I’ll suck down that cold one before I kick another cat down the driveway….. Jeez….I’m sure glad we have our Jiminy Cricket around today!! Larry #:)#

Response:

Tim Look Tim, if you don’t ask your learning curve will be slower, so ask. However Grumpy some of us are, if the truth be known most here really like to share what we think we know. And newbies are the future of our sport so you are valued. As to diplomacy, or what some might prefer to think of as courtesy, well that itself is a matter of debate. I for one have a bad attitude toward what I consider pussy footing around, and a fairly sharp tongue. However, I think I can assure you though that even the most ragged and long standing feuds here wash away in the field and when it comes down to support for wise use of our country’s natural resources. If its any comfort there is also a long standing tradition for cussidness among the flyfishing fraternity. I offer Sparse Grey Hackle’s story "the Lotus Eaters" in his book "Fishless Days, Angling Nights" as exhibit 1, wherein he describes the Fly Fishers Club of Brooklyn, ensconced on the Beaverkill after their move from the the Brodhead’s in the last century. As exhibit 2 and 3  I offer the personality of our patron saint, Theodore Gordon himself, and Hewitt, fairly opinionated buggers I think you will agree. Having survived your initial dunking you’ve earned the right to ask anything you please and you will mostly get reasonable responses. Presumptuous, but I remain your humble servant, Dave – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have to agree with you mike. I am very much a "rookie" at this FF game and admittedly don’t post much because I don’t feel I know enough about this wonderful sport to be of help to anybody. I have asked some "newbie" questions and pretty much have received very polite and helpful replies (other than my initial post about an experience I had at a club that had fish feeders installed along the stream, which caused quite a backlash, well deserved though in retrospect). However, I have noticed a decided souring of tempers as of late. I lurk, mainly because I can and have gained many useful tidbits just from reading the posts, but also because I don’t want to be a bother to the regulars by asking a ton of "newbie" questions. After reading some of the recent posts I probably will be even more hesitant in the future. Tim

Response:

The current heat wave must be getting to people.  Of the two posts I read by newbies looking for advice, one guy got his head bit off by somebody on their soapbox about quality vs. price and the other question deteriorated into a thread taking personal jabs at each other and contradicting the previous post. This is not a way to encourage new people to stick around. Lighten up, have a cool one and relax a bit.  It is not about gear or ego’s fellas. Mike

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -The current heat wave must be getting to people.  Of the two posts I read by newbies looking for advice, one guy got his head bit off by somebody on their soapbox about quality vs. price and the other question deteriorated into a thread taking personal jabs at each other and contradicting the previous post. This is not a way to encourage new people to stick around. Lighten up, have a cool one and relax a bit.  It is not about gear or ego’s fellas. Mike

I have to agree with you mike. I am very much a "rookie" at this FF game and admittedly don’t post much because I don’t feel I know enough about this wonderful sport to be of help to anybody. I have asked some "newbie" questions and pretty much have received very polite and helpful replies (other than my initial post about an experience I had at a club that had fish feeders installed along the stream, which caused quite a backlash, well deserved though in retrospect). However, I have noticed a decided souring of tempers as of late. I lurk, mainly because I can and have gained many useful tidbits just from reading the posts, but also because I don’t want to be a bother to the regulars by asking a ton of "newbie" questions. After reading some of the recent posts I probably will be even more hesitant in the future. Tim

Response:

<SNIPPED However, I have noticed a decided souring of tempers as of late. I lurk, mainly because I can and have gained many useful tidbits just from reading the posts, but also because I don’t want to be a bother to the regulars by asking a ton of "newbie" questions. After reading some of the recent posts I probably will be even more hesitant in the future. Tim

Hi Tim, that is extremely unfortunate and was not my intention with my post. I just got a bit ratty at somebody insulting a lot of people for no good reason.  As you  know by now, and indeed mentioned in your post,  just about all questions are answered promptly and politely otherwise, by quite a few people. It would be a shame if we frightened people off, but by the same token, some things are unfortunately worded, and beg all sorts of cutting replies, which are then inevitably forthcoming. Glad to see you hung around anyway. TL MC

Response:

Oh yeah? Well fuck you! My rod is bigger than your rod and costs more, too. Tongue firmly in cheek… WESH – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The current heat wave must be getting to people.  Of the two posts I read by newbies looking for advice, one guy got his head bit off by somebody on their soapbox about quality vs. price and the other question deteriorated into a thread taking personal jabs at each other and contradicting the previous post. This is not a way to encourage new people to stick around. Lighten up, have a cool one and relax a bit.  It is not about gear or ego’s fellas. Mike

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I have asked some "newbie" questions and pretty much have received very polite and helpful replies (other than my initial post about an experience I had at a club that had fish feeders installed along the stream, which caused quite a backlash, well deserved though in retrospect). However, I have noticed a decided souring of tempers as of late. I lurk, mainly because I can and have gained many useful tidbits just from reading the posts, but also because I don’t want to be a bother to the regulars by asking a ton of "newbie" questions. After reading some of the recent posts I probably will be even more hesitant in the future. Tim

Tim, I am a newbie to this NG so if the old timers are getting cranky you can ask me stuff.  I am not bothered by "newbie" questions and enjoy passing on what I know about fishin. Just don’t listen to anyone after I said my peace! Just jokin’.  There is a ton of resources here to use, don’t feel timid in asking questions.  If you still have questions that need to be answered and don’t want the backlash, feel free to email me.  I am available most of the time and will send you a reply just as soon as I can. Warren

Response:

No…not the heat…. (In the memory Sam Kinisson) "It’s not the heat, it’s the stupid fucking questions posted by stupid fucking newbies. What’s the best fucking floatant ? Who gives a flying fuck, how many kinds of fucking floatant are there ? Are these fucking idiots too fucking stupid just to go to the store and ask ‘em what the best fucking floatant is ? What’s next, what finger should I fucking use to put it on my fucking fly ? The heat ? The heat never wanted to make me drive my jeep into A FUCKING WALL". http://www.rodney.com/gallery/kinn.htm Your pal, — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

Response:

<equivocating post snipped Um……come on Tim, why don’t you just tell us how you really feel?

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hi Tim, that is extremely unfortunate and was not my intention with my post. I just got a bit ratty at somebody insulting a lot of people for no good reason.  As you  know by now, and indeed mentioned in your post,  just about all questions are answered promptly and politely otherwise, by quite a few people. It would be a shame if we frightened people off, but by the same token, some things are unfortunately worded, and beg all sorts of cutting replies, which are then inevitably forthcoming. Glad to see you hung around anyway. TL MC

Hi Mike: yea, I figure I’ll hang around…most of the posts by regulars are pretty comical, even if I don’t know what the hell they’re talking about with all the "inside jokes" around here. BTW, I do appreciate all of your helpful responses to my questions in the past.  They are always very good and very quick reponses.  Do you sit at your computer all day just waiting for ROFF posts?:) Tim

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Tim Look Tim, if you don’t ask your learning curve will be slower, so ask. However Grumpy some of us are, if the truth be known most here really like to share what we think we know. And newbies are the future of our sport so you are valued. As to diplomacy, or what some might prefer to think of as courtesy, well that itself is a matter of debate. I for one have a bad attitude toward what I consider pussy footing around, and a fairly sharp tongue. However, I think I can assure you though that even the most ragged and long standing feuds here wash away in the field and when it comes down to support for wise use of our country’s natural resources. If its any comfort there is also a long standing tradition for cussidness among the flyfishing fraternity. I offer Sparse Grey Hackle’s story "the Lotus Eaters" in his book "Fishless Days, Angling Nights" as exhibit 1, wherein he describes the Fly Fishers Club of Brooklyn, ensconced on the Beaverkill after their move from the the Brodhead’s in the last century. As exhibit 2 and 3  I offer the personality of our patron saint, Theodore Gordon himself, and Hewitt, fairly opinionated buggers I think you will agree. Having survived your initial dunking you’ve earned the right to ask anything you please and you will mostly get reasonable responses. Presumptuous, but I remain your humble servant, Dave

Thanks Dave, I already feel better about this NG! Now could you please tell me: What is the best floatant?  <Just Kidding Tim

Response:

It ain’t the heat — natural cussedness. Of course, heat and violent weather do tend to put the trout down, yielding more frustration. Watch it, or I’ll discorse on "Global Warming" again…. r.m.bies

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<equivocating post snipped Um……come on Tim, why don’t you just tell us how you really feel?

How can you possibly complain about such a linguistically sophisticated post ? TL MC

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Tim, I am a newbie to this NG so if the old timers are getting cranky you can ask me stuff.  I am not bothered by "newbie" questions and enjoy passing on what I know about fishin. Just don’t listen to anyone after I said my peace! Just jokin’.  There is a ton of resources here to use, don’t feel timid in asking questions.  If you still have questions that need to be answered and don’t want the backlash, feel free to email me.  I am available most of the time and will send you a reply just as soon as I can. Warren

Thanks for the generous offer Warren! Tim

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Oh, I suppose you have never had a stupid question.  I guess you were born knowing exactly what is the best floatant.  You know some people don’t have a flyfishing shop right next door and asking here is a great way for people to learn.  So give em a brake or just keep on driving that jeep util you find a suitable wall..

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Question:

I’m looking for a fresh water fly fishing buddy.  I live in Fairfax county.

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OK weevee66.  You wanna fish for trout and smallmouth or are shad, carp, largemouth, catfish and other trash fish your main quarry?  When were you born and what is your real name?  Many of us posted brief Bios awhile back. Care to do the same?  Send me a private e-mail with a detailed listing of all your best secret fishing holes and we will talk.  I’m just outside of Fredericksburg. Wayne To fish is human…to release divine. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m looking for a fresh water fly fishing buddy.  I live in Fairfax county.

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Question:

According to the Whittakers site, the release from the Beacon Hill Dam has been cut back to 2 gates.  This is still more water than can really be fished effectively with a fly rod without using running line and a very big slinky.  This is still more water than can be waded safely. If you do plan to fish it, look for seams along the edge and work them very quietly.  Steelhead will often hold well out of the flow of the river during periods of high water. Bob Davis

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Because of problems at the uppper reservoir, combined with the rainfall over the weekend, early on Tuesday morning, 11/4/97, Niagara Mohawk began releasing tremendous amounts of water into the lower Salmon River, rendering it currently unfishable.   For those of you who are familiar with the "gate system", the river is now running at 2 gates, plus an overflow spillway, plus the run-off from Trout and Orwell Brooks as the result of recent heavy rain.  Even with the heaviest slinky, it is almost impossible to get down to the fish, and the sudden change in water volume seems to have put them completely off of their feed. I drove up to the upper power plant and talked with some of the staff and found out that, due to repairs now underway, the water level will not be dropping before Friday 11/7/97.   Whittakers, probably the best of the fly fishing shops up there, has a web site at http://www.whitakers.com/, and they are the only one that seems to be giving the correct info about this problem.

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There are a bunch of web sites which claim to cover the Salmon River, and this recent change in the water level gives us a good opportunity to test out their reliability.   The Oswego County Chamber of Commerce has not said anything about the abnormally high water releases, and is still talking about Salmon on their redds, and stating that the ebst fishing is around the 2-A Bridge. Well, the truth is that any salmon that is still on its redd is swimming very fast…and if they are around 2-A they have tied themselves to the bottom <g.  Bad info here… Salmon River Sportfishing Reports is a really well done site with all of the Java that anyone would want…but it was last updated on 10/31/97, well before the high water began. Bad info here too… Whittakers, at http://www.whitakers.com/ updated its report at 5:00AM this morning and says "Water is under two gates.  The level was supposed to be dropped at midnight tonight. Will update as soon as we know." Sounds like good info here….a page worth bookmarking, and a shop worth visiting.  Whittakers is heavily oriented toward flyfishing, Jim Rusher who owns the place is very knowledgeable and "user-friendly", and Duke and Dick also know their stuff. They are also telling us that "The North and South Sandys had a run of Rainbows and Cohoes the last two days."  I know fairly reliably that Sandy Creek had not yet gotten any significant run of fish this fall, and it was expected that the recent rains would have brought them in. they were not there on Tuesday – I fished Sandy Creek below the falls, an area that I know well, and saw no sign of fish. But I would expect them to be moving in. Lots of deer and game birds though… Let me put in a plug for my own site – if you invest in undervalued small-cap stocks, take a look at http://www.napeague.com Bob Davis

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Here is my two cents. For walleye find structure such as rockpikes, reefs, humps and points. Wave action and boat traffic can produce currents and waves that seem to help the action. For example a shallow hump in deep water is a great spot when the water is moving right, but on a calm day it can be slow. Slip bobber and leechs are deadly. You can set your leech at a fixed depth and drift it over structure. Windblown points can be good spots. You probably might want to postion your boat  in a fixed spot somewhere off of the structure and cast to the structure. Ultralight equipment. For pike I like submergered weeds in shallower areas with access to deep cold water. Water temperature is important, the cooler the better. leechs work but I like Small Mepps like #3 or 4 in a simple configuration (silver, gold, white.. nothing fancy). Have had luck with sluggos and bigger rapalas. Of course a live sucker on a quick strike works but it is a passive approach and release of the fish isn’t always possible. Use wire leader. For smallies… current. I’m happy to get any advice on smallies. I want a big one, I’ve caught a 4 pounder but I really want to catch (and release) a nice smallie. Leechs work.  In fact you can catch anything on a leech and slip bobber. Alot depends on the time of year, the type of boat you have and your equipment. Good luck. I would be interested in getting any reports on the fishing in the BWCA. Thanks.

In the BWCA, the Boundary Waters CANOE Area, the type of boat will likely be a canoe.  And live bait, especially minnows, will be hard to come by.  Jigs and twister tails and various forms of Rapalas seem to be pretty reliable.  Mepps spinners will work also. Fishing has been pretty slow from what I heard due to very cold water.   But it has been warmer weather the past few days so it may be improving. Del Cecchi Rochester, MN

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I suppose certain areas of BWCA are for canoe access. There are also areas where access is available via 25 hp boats. These craft are used by support people who take people who CANOE. They are also used by people who are allowed to FISH in certain restricted areas under increasingly ridiculous restrictions. Of course people get emotional over these issues. I take the perspective of tolerance for both sides. Otherwise, maybe we’ll let Disney run  the BWCA instead of Greenpeace.

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Leeches for small mouth! Silver kastmaster spoons for lake trout, if your going to be near any! Vertical jigging for ‘em! Try Argo Lake for lake trout. I envy you going up there. Knock ‘em dead!

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In the BWCA, the Boundary Waters CANOE Area, the type of boat will likely be a canoe.  And live bait, especially minnows, will be hard to come by.  Jigs and twister tails and various forms of Rapalas seem to be pretty reliable.  Mepps spinners will work also. Fishing has been pretty slow from what I heard due to very cold water. But it has been warmer weather the past few days so it may be improving. Del Cecchi Rochester, MN

Del, In the Boundary Waters, the type of boat for fishing will be a 14′ or 16′ boat with up to a 25hp motor, OR a square stern canoe with a 5hp motor. Minnows are readily used, along with leeches and nightcrawlers, as the preferred bait.  At this time of year, fishing is mostly on the larger motorized lakes of the Boundary Waters.  There are 18 such lakes that allow motors.  Canoeists that have a problem with this should stay on the paddle-only lakes.

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Snipped my previous post Del, In the Boundary Waters, the type of boat for fishing will be a 14′ or 16′ boat with up to a 25hp motor, OR a square stern canoe with a 5hp motor. Minnows are readily used, along with leeches and nightcrawlers, as the preferred bait.  At this time of year, fishing is mostly on the larger motorized lakes of the Boundary Waters.  There are 18 such lakes that allow motors.  Canoeists that have a problem with this should stay on the paddle-only lakes.

Most of the American side of Lac Lacroix, all of Crooked, and much of Basswood is closed to motors.  Of course there are those that disregard the restriction, especially on Basswood.  Fortunately there are not too many scofflaws around.  Continuing on to the east, Knife has no motors and the border continues with no motors until Sag and Seagull.  In the southern part of the bwca, motors are allowed on Trout lake.   I don’t have any problem with people using motors in the motor zone.  I thought closing the portages was a sneaky backhanded way to reneg on a deal.  I have a boat an motor.  I was merely pointing out that to fish most of the bwca one must use a canoe without a motor, and that transporting minnows is difficult, especially in warm weather.  Leeches are a little easier. A small cooler with nightcrawlers will hold up for a few days.   Looks from your email address that you might be from North Eastern Minnesota.  I know that it has been a long and emotional winter trying to fend off the "Friends of the Boundary Waters" and their lawyers in the Wellstonian mediation hearings.  Hey most of you guys voted for him as I recall.  But don’t attack supporters or neutral parties.  Try not to be so paranoid.  Although just because you are paranoid doesn’t mean someone isn’t out to get you.   I guess I stand by my advice, but will note that there are relatively small portions of the BWCA where one is allowed to use motors butyou still must portage using human power.  Some portages have humans for rent, others you are on your own to attach wheels and go.  Wheels are only allowed in the motorized zones.  The dogs on Trout lake aren’t there this year.   Del Cecchi Rochester, MN

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I will be fishing in the Boundary Waters Canoe Area Wilderness this coming June.  I hope to catch smallmouth bass, walleye, and northern pike, in that order.  I would welcome any advice on what lures and jigs to use, presentation techniques, structure to look for, etc.   Thanks in advance, Todd —

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Here is my two cents. For walleye find structure such as rockpikes, reefs, humps and points. Wave action and boat traffic can produce currents and waves that seem to help the action. For example a shallow hump in deep water is a great spot when the water is moving right, but on a calm day it can be slow. Slip bobber and leechs are deadly. You can set your leech at a fixed depth and drift it over structure. Windblown points can be good spots. You probably might want to postion your boat  in a fixed spot somewhere off of the structure and cast to the structure. Ultralight equipment. For pike I like submergered weeds in shallower areas with access to deep cold water. Water temperature is important, the cooler the better. leechs work but I like Small Mepps like #3 or 4 in a simple configuration (silver, gold, white.. nothing fancy). Have had luck with sluggos and bigger rapalas. Of course a live sucker on a quick strike works but it is a passive approach and release of the fish isn’t always possible. Use wire leader. For smallies… current. I’m happy to get any advice on smallies. I want a big one, I’ve caught a 4 pounder but I really want to catch (and release) a nice smallie. Leechs work.  In fact you can catch anything on a leech and slip bobber. Alot depends on the time of year, the type of boat you have and your equipment. Good luck. I would be interested in getting any reports on the fishing in the BWCA. Thanks.

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Dear Todd, I have spent many years fishing in the Boundry  Water’s area and the Quitico Area and have found it to be exceptional fishing!!  One thing I suggest is a new product specifically designed for quick CATCH-MEASURE-RELEASE.  It is called the Big Fish Ruler and it is manufactured by Big Bass Inc.  I am sending you their web page.  Other baits and accessories will be Gold # 7&9 Rapalas(floating), slip bobber and 1/8 oz leadheads with ribbon leaches, black fly dope and other insect repellent that is water proof.  Skin so soft is not strong enough for a heavy fly infestation.  Remember to take along a water proof camera that can be thrown around and not damaged.  The one I suggest in a Kodak one time water proof camera.  It has 24 pictures and when you are finished you just drop off the camera with the film still inside.  Good fishing and get a couple of rulers.  You will need them!!  The fish are huge!!!

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Hey guys, motor or no motor the fishing is fine in eastern BWCA.  Just returned from a week near Gabbro/Bald Eagle and weather was warm and canoe worked just great for catching northerns, perch and walleye on rapalas and spinners mostly.  You just have to find the schools and drop in the line. So enjoy what you get, big or small.  Those waters still make ‘em tastier.

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Question:

Looking for any reports on the fishing buddy II to be used on a float tube.

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Looking for any reports on the fishing buddy II to be used on a float tube.

you can tell where your feet are

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I use one on my tube all the time. Works great for finding weed edgesdrop offs and other structures. Side finder is very good for marking fish and casting blind. I use mine for tracking  afish coming down a weededge to figure out which direcction he is going. Batteries last a long time and its great for both flyfishing and walleyes. Anything further try Email — *** Home of the Fishing Log ***

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Question:

Well, some of us need more stability than others.  Since I haven’t fallen into a stream (unlike some people I know) that aspect wouldn’t concern me.  

Actually, my balance may not be the best, but even though I fall in the stream once in a while, I can still catch fish (unlike some people I know) which is the point of it anyway.  I prefer to stay dry while I catch these fish, but I don’t mind being a little wet.  Hey, I rather be catching fish while a little wet, than being dry and SKUNKED. -Cousin *                       *    "To catch a river unguarded is less a        * * Paul "Cousin" Graham   *    matter of where to look than of when, and   * *                          *  I have a secret time."-Ted Leeson           *

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I also have a Sage four piece and find its action as good as any two piece in the same price range that I’ve had the opportunity to cast. I almost went with a two piece instead, working on the (previously stated by someone else) theory that the rod case makes a great hiking staff. But then I also mountain bike to a few favorite spots and that 4-5′ rod case can be a might unwieldy strapped to a bike frame…   Ben

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There have been several posts that have commented that there is no reason
to buy a travel rod because the two piece rods all fit in the overheads,
etc.  I generally agree, but would add one caveat.  If you are going to do
some backpacking or take horseback trips into more remote locations,
consider a travel rod (ie, a pack rod).                                               Dallas, TX
                                              Ennis, MT

Also on short business trips it’s nice to have a small rod that fits in your suitcase or straps to your briefcase. -Clyde         ..            ..   \   (  \  ~     //  )  //        Bay Networks, Inc. "What do you mean, ‘NOT TONIGHT’!?"  

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What red-blooded fly fisherman is satisfied with just ONE rod. I find my 4-piece  rod satisfactory, but not QUITE the same as my 2-piece rods.

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Can’t imagine having only 1 Fly rod, but I have found that my 3pc Sage Casts better than my 2pc Sage of the same series. I believe that Sage has designed the ferrule as an enhancement to the rod

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I have been fishing a Scott 5-pc 9′ #6, 4-pc 8′ 6" #4, and a 4-pc 10′ #8. I have used them for over five years.  The y are the easiest to carry, transport and fike with.  I have never experienced any problems, dead spots, or breakage.  This year, Scott has introduced a lifetime, unconditional guarantee.

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What red-blooded fly fisherman is satisfied with just ONE rod. I find my 4-piece  rod satisfactory, but not QUITE the same as my 2-piece rods.

I agree, fly rods are like golf clubs, you need a different one for every conceivable situation. John Carmichael

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I bought a Sage 590 LL 4 piece travel rod last year and I like the way it casts and it sure is easier to travel with then the 2 piece version. I can carry this one on the airplane (fits in overhead storage) and know that it will arrive at my destination.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – As for 4 piece rods, there is really no difference when it come to air travel, but I would recommend them if you ever backpack.  Backpacking even once, in IMHO, would be enough reason to purchase a 4 piece.  Backpacking with a 2 piece tube can be hell.  Unless of course you like getting snagged by every piece of greenery within 10 feet. — Well, IMHO, pack rods are great when you want to put them on your pack and get them out of the way, BUT two piece tubes can come in handy.  I coat the bottom (about a foot) with Shoe Goo or Plastic Dip.  Then I use the tube for a walking stick.  I had one of those babies save me from slipping on a rock in a stream with a FULL pack. Anyway, I think you should list the pros an cons of each, and then decide which one would best fit your needs. -Paul *                       *    "To catch a river unguarded is less a        * * Paul "Cousin" Graham   *    matter of where to look than of when, and   * *                          *  I have a secret time."-Ted Leeson           *

Well, some of us need more stability than others.  Since I haven’t fallen into a stream (unlike some people I know) that aspect wouldn’t concern me.   Later. —

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I am getting ready to by a rod, and don’t no if I should get a 2 piece, or a travel rod.  Any recommendations???                                         Brian

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I am getting ready to by a rod, and don’t no if I should get a 2 piece, or a travel rod.  Any recommendations???                                    Brian

Buy a rod that casts the best and meets all of your requirements for enjoyable fishing.  If that rod happens to be a 2-piece rod, then buy it.  If that rod happens to be a 4-piece rod then buy it.  It is possible to travel with a 2-piece rod. You can also fish close to home with a 4-piece rod. Brian, if you want to cast a bunch of rods and talk more about what you want in a rod, we can take this conversation off-line via RIT email.  I work for a local fly fishing outfitter part-time. Frank

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am getting ready to by a rod, and don’t no if I should get a 2 piece, or a travel rod.  Any recommendations???                                       Brian Buy a rod that casts the best and meets all of your requirements for enjoyable fishing.  If that rod happens to be a 2-piece rod, then buy it.  If that rod happens to be a 4-piece rod then buy it.  It is possible to travel with a 2-piece rod. You can also fish close to home with a 4-piece rod. Brian, if you want to cast a bunch of rods and talk more about what you want in a rod, we can take this conversation off-line via RIT email.  I work for a local fly fishing outfitter part-time. Frank

A time ago I had serious plans on buying a Thomas & Thomas Horizon travel rod. I had tried the 2 pc and wanted a 4 pc if it was as good as the 2 pc. The xtra money did not matter to me then. After trying the 4 pc I was very disappointed and bought the 2 pc, a T&T HS864. I think that if you can find a 4 pc rod you like a lot, buy it, but don’t buy a rod that you ‘almost’ want just because it is 4 pc. It’s worth the trouble carrying the 2 pc when you travel. Good luck. /Key | Key Hyckenberg                        |                       | | http://www.csd.uu.se/~m91key/         |                       | | University of Uppsala, Sweden         |                       | | Department of Mathematics             |         – L P Deutsch | |                                                               | | **** A bad day fishing is better than a good day at work **** | |                                                               |

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My recommendation is: By a travel rod!!!! with two piece rods. There are a huge selection of excellent three and four piece rods available on the market. Tight lines! Inge

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I agree with Andrew.  I have taken my two piece rods, an eight foot four weight and a ten foot seven weight, to alaska six times.  There has never been a problem.  It was not at all difficult.  The rod tubes will fit in the overhead compartments on most jets.  Traveling on commercial airlines is not a reason just to buy short or multi-piece rods. Just my $0.0212 (thats two cents plus 6% Michigan sales tax) worth. Steve

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There have been several posts that have commented that there is no reason to buy a travel rod because the two piece rods all fit in the overheads, etc.  I generally agree, but would add one caveat.  If you are going to do some backpacking or take horseback trips into more remote locations, consider a travel rod (ie, a pack rod).                                               Dallas, TX                                               Ennis, MT

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I agree w/ decision to buy travel rod. In the better rods. travel rods are almost indistuinguisable from 2 piece rods in performance. And the convenience is really well worth it. i was very skeptical when I bought my first, four piece {a sage}, but now I wonj’t buy anything else.

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I agree w/ decision to buy travel rod. In the better rods. travel rods are almost indistuinguisable from 2 piece rods in performance. And the convenience is really well worth it. i was very skeptical when I bought my first, four piece {a sage}, but now I wonj’t buy anything else.

As for 4 piece rods, there is really no difference when it come to air travel, but I would recommend them if you ever backpack.  Backpacking even once, in IMHO, would be enough reason to purchase a 4 piece.  Backpacking with a 2 piece tube can be hell.  Unless of course you like getting snagged by every piece of greenery within 10 feet. —

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As for 4 piece rods, there is really no difference when it come to air travel, but I would recommend them if you ever backpack.  Backpacking even once, in IMHO, would be enough reason to purchase a 4 piece.  Backpacking with a 2 piece tube can be hell.  Unless of course you like getting snagged by every piece of greenery within 10 feet. —

Well, IMHO, pack rods are great when you want to put them on your pack and get them out of the way, BUT two piece tubes can come in handy.  I coat the bottom (about a foot) with Shoe Goo or Plastic Dip.  Then I use the tube for a walking stick.  I had one of those babies save me from slipping on a rock in a stream with a FULL pack. Anyway, I think you should list the pros an cons of each, and then decide which one would best fit your needs. -Paul *                       *    "To catch a river unguarded is less a        * * Paul "Cousin" Graham   *    matter of where to look than of when, and   * *                          *  I have a secret time."-Ted Leeson           *

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