Question:

I’ve been lurking around these parts lately.  A while back I saw that ROFF was going to the San Juan.  That’s just over 3 hours from home, and I fish there pretty often, so I hooked up with Bruiser and made plans to be there for the Clave.  I fish lots of waters around northern New Mexico – some because of the fishing, others because of the beauty of the places. Off to the ‘Juan we went.  The SJ is a tailwater, behind a large earthen dam, flowing through a spectacular sandstone canyon in an exceptionally dry and arid region – it gets an average of 8" of precipitation each year.  It’s near the village of Navajo Dam, east of Farmington, at 6000′.  Willi’s pictures were great – but they still don’t capture the beauty of the area. I met Bob and Charlie, Willi, Bruce, and Dan’l when they arrived Friday night.  Chuck arrived in a little while.  We had dinner and a few beers, figured out where/when we’d meet the next morning, and turned in pretty early. We started fishing early Saturday morning.  Early enough to have ice in the guides and to break through ice in the sloughs next to the river. By the time I got my flies tied on, Willi had caught a couple of fish. I understand that’s pretty common.  Everyone caught fish on Saturday. Everyone but me, it seems.  I hooked up with a few, but not as many as I should have, and landing them was almost impossible.  I got tangled, I broke off, it was like I’d never done this before!  Of course, it was still fun, but here I am, on water I know pretty well, not catching much of anything. Sunday I slept in a bit.  I got down to the river at 9:30 or 10:00. Charlie and Bob are in the Kiddie Pool, and Bruiser shows up while I’m getting ready.  Things are going kind of slow, so I put my seine in the water to see what kind of bugs were around.  Lots of light-colored midges and midge larva showed up in the net, so we tied on light-colored patterns.  And fish were on!  I was catching my share, and everyone was having a good day.  We moved around the river, to the big holes, to the fast canyon water, to the flats – pretty much all over.  Fishing was good.  Chuck fished part of the day and went home.  He was replaced by Arni and Scott. One of the big thrills of fishing the SJ is catching large fish on tiny flies.  A 12" rainbow is a tiny fish there.  Most are 14-18".  Lots are bigger, with 20+" fish not uncommon.  And they take #20-#24 midge larva – basically thread on a hook.  We made the regular jokes about fishing a #76 paramecium.  But then we figured out that the fish really wanted egg patterns.  Midge eggs.  That’s about a #84 hook. Two exceptional things happened Sunday.  Fish at the SJ collect behind the fishermen.  They see so many fishermen every day that they don’t spook too easily.  They swim behind you, sifting through the junk that your feet stir up.  I’m fishing in the Texas Hole and a big fish starts tapping on my boot!  He’s bumping it with his head!!  We figured he was trying to tell me to move my feet some more, so I’d stir up some more food. The second thing was when a beautiful blue heron came to our pool in the evening and watched us fish.  He squawked at us for a while, then he just watched. One of the problems with fishing the SJ is the crowds.  It’s become really popular.  The normal rules of stream etiquette just don’t apply, and you’re always fishing in sight of someone, and in the popular spots, with people very close by.  Except between Thanksgiving and Christmas. Monday there wer 8 people on the top ~1.5 miles of the river, from Texas Hole up to the dam (not counting two duck hunters).  7 of them were us!   It was deserted.  But the fish seemed to want to ride the tilt-a-whirl, and with fewer anglers on the river, they viciously attacked our flies.  My flies, at least.  Monday was one of those days you hear about, but seldom have.  Fish after fish after fish.  Big fish.   No tangles.  No break-offs.  Spot a fish, get a good drift to him, and he’d take.  Toss your fly in the water as you waded to a new place, and they’d find it when you weren’t expecting it.  I caught what was probably the largest trout of my life – ask Dan’l how big it was.  We layed it up against my fly rod to measure it.  I measured the fly rod later – it was a 24-25" rainbow – a true denizen of the deep.  I caught at least 4 over 20" on Monday, and lots and lots of the "small" ones. That evening, I walked over to a hole we’d been fishing every evening. I was the only one there – I couldn’t even see anyone else.  By Monday we knew what would work in this particular hole – any midge larva with red in it.  Unable to understand how fish could find such tiny flies in the failing light, I tossed in a #22 Desert Storm and started catching fish.  Pretty soon the blue heron came over to watch me.  Just me, the heron, and the fish.  I caught 5 in ~30 minutes before I decided to call it quits and head for home. It was a great weekend.  Fishing was good to great.  The weather was spectacular – the storm that was predicted went to the south and we never saw it.  Everyone got along well, and there was plenty of comraderie When do we do it again?  I’d fish with these guys any time.  Thanks Bruce, for setting this up.         – Bryan

Response:

Bryan, After a great report like that, you will be in great demand around here. Everyone enjoyed meeting you and fishing with you.  Glad to hear you had a good time.  Once we heard the "everyothercast" echo down the river, we knew you were. And I’ve got some news for you:  next year you’re the co-host! bruce h

Response:

I’ve been lurking around these parts lately.  A while back I saw that ROFF was going to the San Juan.  That’s just over 3 hours from home, and I fish there pretty often, so I hooked up with Bruiser and made plans to be there for the Clave.

    thanks for a nifty report, bryan.     funny how much your experience reminds me of fishing up in the smokies….  :( yfitons wayno

Response:

Bryan, [snip] And I’ve got some news for you:  next year you’re the co-host!

You realize that almost guarantees snow for next year, right? Sure, I’ll help.  If we act early, we can reserve most of Rizuto’s!         – Bryan

Response:

Sure, I’ll help.  If we act early, we can reserve most of Rizuto’s!

  Rizuto’s wins out over Abe’s, don’t you think?  I asked Chuck if he’d give a discount if I could get all of the roffians at next year’s clave booked there and he said yes.  Something to remember.  I knew it was a bad sign when we pulled up to #52 at Abe’s and there was the plumber’s truck sitting in front. Still not fixed after a year:)   Another great clave.  Thanks, Bruiser.  Bryan, it was nice to meet and fish with you.  You fit right in.  (Scary, isn’t’ it?)   As others have given such nice trip reports, I don’t have much to add.  I did discover the joys of studded, felt waders.  Unbelievable traction.  Should have purchased them years ago. I also bought some of that high priced Rio Fluoroflex plus tippet.  5X with a 5 lb. test.  It worked very well and I didn’t break off as many fish.   The first two days were the best for me.  I don’t know when I’ve caught as many big fish.  You couldn’t beat the weather, either.  I had a lot of fun driving down with Willi and Charlie, again.  They weren’t much fun on the way back as I think they slept the whole way.  I only took short naps as I was driving:)  It was great to see my clave buddies again and I’ll see you next year. Snoop — —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

    The first two days were the best for me.  I don’t know when I’ve caught as   many big fish.  You couldn’t beat the weather, either.  I had a lot of fun   driving down with Willi and Charlie, again.  They weren’t much fun on the way   back as I think they slept the whole way.  I only took short naps as I was   driving:)  It was great to see my clave buddies again and I’ll see you next   year. Get those pictures developed and out to me, please. Willi

Response:

Get those pictures developed and out to me, please.

  They’re being processed as we speak.  Hopefully will have them Monday.  Send me your mailing address. Snoop — —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

  Rizuto’s wins out over Abe’s, don’t you think?

Abe’s is part of the "experience."  I’ve experienced the "experience." This was the first time I’ve stayed at Rizuto’s.  Definately nicer. Seeing all those picnic tables around, I think we’ll need to haul a BBQ grill up there and have a Clave Banquet in the parking lot!   Another great clave.  Thanks, Bruiser.  Bryan, it was nice to meet and fish with you.  You fit right in.  (Scary, isn’t’ it?)

Doesn’t that mean I should be flaming somebody?  Everybody? I left one thing out of my trip report.  There were these bait fishermen.  They were fishing below the quality waters, down by the campground.  But they were staying at Rizuto’s, in room #1. AND THEY BROUGHT THEIR OWN SATELLITE TV DISH! [for those who don't know much about northern NM - you only get one TV station in Navajo Dam, and the reception of that one is pretty poor]         – Bryan

Response:

AND THEY BROUGHT THEIR OWN SATELLITE TV DISH!

Sounds like a good idea to me, assuming you have the time to watch TV. The local NM stations are the absolute worst.

Response:

Question:

Today it is windy and rainy (way more than usual) and all the boats are at the docks.  40 kt winds at Diamond Shoals.  The past four days have seen albie fishing of the best kind.  The cold weather and northerly winds brought the fish in like they are supposed to be. Most people are able to find some fish to cast to about all day long. And in the morning the fish have been feasting on everything and anything that people can throw at them.  Little flies, big flies, doesn’t much matter.  They will eat it.  In the afternoon they get a little bit pickier and a little more spread out but the morning action has been quite memorable.  The fish are coming up shoulder to shoulder and I would think that if you dragged your toes in the water you might get nipped.  Now those are aggressive fish!!  Sorry to those folks who came down before this.  The warm weather delayed the arrival.  Should be good for a while now.  If you can get down here, now would be a good time. Capt Gordon Churchill http://www.flyfish-nc.com

Response:

Gordon, will the Albies stay in close all winter or will they head further South? So how about booking 4 fly fishermen on 2 half day trips.  All 4 ride out to the Cape via ferry, they fish until you get there around 9ish (since Christine might be keeping you up late).  Two jump on board with you and go joy riding.  The other two continue to fish.  Around 12:30 you return and swap out sports with the two ashore and off you go.  Around 4 – 4:30 you return, pick up the first two and take all 4 back to ferry central.  This is starting to sound like a PLAN!  All 4 get both Cape Lookout shore fishing at the "Hook" and Albie chasing with you! — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Today it is windy and rainy (way more than usual) and all the boats are at the docks.  40 kt winds at Diamond Shoals.  The past four days have seen albie fishing of the best kind.  The cold weather and northerly winds brought the fish in like they are supposed to be. Most people are able to find some fish to cast to about all day long. And in the morning the fish have been feasting on everything and anything that people can throw at them.  Little flies, big flies, doesn’t much matter.  They will eat it.  In the afternoon they get a little bit pickier and a little more spread out but the morning action has been quite memorable.  The fish are coming up shoulder to shoulder and I would think that if you dragged your toes in the water you might get nipped.  Now those are aggressive fish!!  Sorry to those folks who came down before this.  The warm weather delayed the arrival.  Should be good for a while now.  If you can get down here, now would be a good time. Capt Gordon Churchill http://www.flyfish-nc.com

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Question:

Question:

______ The prettiest Western Dry Fly in all the world.  I don’t know about Eastern opinions on this but  I suppose it would have to be the Light Cahill or Hendrickson?  I love them all, really.  I love dry flies, period. I wish some of you would start submitting your signature fly to our "Flies of the World" web site listed below.  See Mike Connor’s examples.  Don’t any of you eastern boys know how to tie a dry fly for christ sake?  You guys have only one good fly tier their, I think and his name is George Harvey.  I thought he taught fly tying out that way in Pennsylvania and about?  You DO know what a dry fly is in North Carolina now, don’t you boys?  They sure don’t, in Arkansas. ; ) George *twitch —

Question:

BULLSHIT.

 Really Cartman? (Great handle btw) that was profound.  Care to elaborate further?

Response:

There is also a program available called "Cookie Cruncher".  It is freeware. You can then allow cookies to be set (preventing cookies can be such a pain because of the constant messages from the browser) and delete them at the end of the session with CC. You can delete all of them or just specific ones.  Sometimes you may want to leave a cookie in place because it may contain your specific preferences about a website.  Not all cookies are bad. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How do I tell when I am being passed a "cookie" & how can I stop a site from accessing my hard drive? From what I hear they can come in and almost get your shorts size off your computer. <G Most browser have settings on whether or not to accept cookies, either with a warning or not at all. FWIW, most cookies store information about what *you* did or entered while visiting a site so you won’t have to do or enter it the next time, not the contents of your hard drive. — Charlie… Thanks. Found it on my browser & xed the box. Kiyu

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I’d like to know just what kind of invasion you think Loomis or any other site my make by using a cookie? So would I, just what kind of info are they looking for – and just who gives them the right to snoop in my computer anyway?

They don’t have the right to snoop  your HD.  And, most likely they are not.  They DO have the right to check on your activity on their site and keep track of it.  That’s what cookies do. Companies like loomis use them to keep track of their potential customers, and their activities in their web site Good point – which is why they did not get my information.  I have no intention of becoming a customer.  Let’s say you go into a fly shop and the clerk follows you around and whenever you go to look at a rod or reel or anything else he says, " before you can look at this item you have to tell me where else you have been shopping and any other information I want or you can’t look at it". Would you do business there?  If on the otherhand they ask me to fill out a survey and I have the time, I just might do that.

Shop owners keep track too.  If nobody seems interested in a particular product they won’t buy any more of it.  They may not follow you around the store, but they ARE paying attention – atleast they should be if they want to stay in business. What else would they want?  Are you keeping a pirated copy of one of their fly rods on your hard drive?  Are you distributing specs on their golf club shafts from home via the net? I am sure I have no idea what else they would want, but as long as they are not going to disclose what information they are seeking, I am not going to give them the opportunity to snoop around in my hard drive.  It’s a question of privacy.  If in order to view their products I have to open my computer up to them, I just simply am not going to look.

You don’t.  You simply accept what amounts to a text file that the site writes to every time you log in.  It beats having some poor schmuck watching logfiles on the server to see what you’re doing (another way to gather info). If Loomis really wanted to find out things about _you_ there are better ways to do it without building some devious little executable to sneak in as a cookie to scan your hard drive. Just knowing that that is possible is reason enough not to accept cookies.

Y’know, you probably don’t even realize it, but you hit sites every day, that check to see what browser you’re using and what plugins are available, and it redirects you to an appropriate file you can see.  Most sites use JavaScript to do this.  Some sites use server-side techniques to do this, but most use JavaScript.  You download it and it goes to work. Cookies aren’t a whole lot different. And hitting this newsgroup is a lot more dangerous to your system that any website.  All kinds of evil, nasty things can be spread by seemingly innocent usenet posts. And as a person who make a living from that same kind of technology, I can say that e-commerce on the web – a thing most of want to see – is almost impossible without cookies and similar technology. That is ridiculous.  I do a lot of business on the WWW, and  I do not accept cookies.  I have never had a problem with a legitimate company even if I did not accept their cookies, and I have never been locked out of a WWW business site for not accepting one before Loomis.  The only reason you want the "cookie" technology is so that you can direct your advertising dollars more wisely.  There is nothing wrong with that as long as the information given up is done so on a voluntary basis.  Most companies allow that choice.  Loomis does not.  Therefore I choose not to do business with them.  

People get, and take info about you all the time in every walk of life.   People who want to know, or need to know, can get scads of info about you without your ever knowing it. And the worst part of it is, you don’t really know what the Loomis cookie is doing, do you?  Chances are it’s only logging your activity on their site and nothing more.  What else could they possibly want to know?  What email program you use?  What good would that do them. My slant is they want to know what you’re doing so they can use it to improve their site or product line and nothing else. And if you’re son parnoid about the net, I would suggest you get off of it and try something a little more passive. </c

Response:

This post started as a fly-fishing post (Loomis website) but has turned into a computer debate. Decide what you want to do and do it. If you want to continue this post, please move it to rec.computer.people.with.too.much.idle.time.on.their.hands.      Thanks,       Bryce

Response:

BULLSHIT. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Before you go condemning G. Loomis, you should really make sure you really understand what cookies do.  Often times, they are simply used to track repeat visitors.  If you look at the kind of data stored in a cookie, you will see it isn’t really a big deal, and can actually be helpful… For example, the Amazon.com web site sends a cookie to its customers, and when I connect to the web site, it is able to read the cookie and know who I am, what my book and layout preferences are, and simplifies the ordering process… They really aren’t any all that dangerous to your privacy…

Response:

How do I tell when I am being passed a "cookie" & how can I stop a site from accessing my hard drive? From what I hear they can come in and almost get your shorts size off your computer. <G Most browser have settings on whether or not to accept cookies, either with a warning or not at all. FWIW, most cookies store information about what *you* did or entered while visiting a site so you won’t have to do or enter it the next time, not the contents of your hard drive. — Charlie…

Thanks. Found it on my browser & xed the box. Kiyu

Response:

Well, I agree that cookies aren’t very significant invasions of privacy

Question:

Stick with the hardwood patches for the planks.  Ignore the loose canvas unless it is peeling off.  (As long as it is well attached along the stems and gunwales.)  Sand lightly (wet or dry) being careful not to sand into the fabric.  Paint with marine grade paint: flat, semi, or gloss … your choice.  Classic Boatworks. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Howdy all!  I need some help here. I own a canvas-covered cedar ribbed canoe [Chestnut Prospector Fort Garry, circa 1970] in need of repairs and paint.  First, any books to recommend? I have borrowed Stelmok and Thurlow’s *The Wood & Canvas Canoe*.  Fine book and great for anybody wishing to restore a canvas canoe, but I would prefer not to "restore" the canoe.  Any other books? Specifically: Some of the planks are cracked.  My father in the past has placed small flat pieces of hard-wood over these cracks and held them in place with marine epoxy. Varnish then covers the works. It appears to have worked well over the years.  I might use small pieces of cedar instead.  I would prefer not to use sheet-metal and have to remove the ribs. The paint is cracked and peeled.  The canvas is a little loose in a couple of places.  Trail-Head in Ottawa painted the canoe for me in 1994 and frankly, I do not think they did a good job. I need to strip it all off and re-paint, I would assume.  How? Wet-and-dry sand paper?  Chemical?  If so, which chemical?  Should I remove the keel before removing the paint?  Use a semi-gloss finish as recommended by Stelmok and Thurlow? I do not believe that the canoe needs to re-canvased.  I use it presently to fly fish for kamloops trout in the Merritt/Kamloops area and it works fine. Cheers, Burnaby, BC

Response:

Check out the Wooden Canoe Heritage Association site and you’ll find all the help you can handle. Rich Briere – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Howdy all!  I need some help here. I own a canvas-covered cedar ribbed canoe [Chestnut Prospector Fort Garry, circa 1970] in need of repairs and paint.  First, any books to recommend? I have borrowed Stelmok and Thurlow’s *The Wood & Canvas Canoe*.  Fine book and great for anybody wishing to restore a canvas canoe, but I would prefer not to "restore" the canoe.  Any other books? Specifically: Some of the planks are cracked.  My father in the past has placed small flat pieces of hard-wood over these cracks and held them in place with marine epoxy. Varnish then covers the works. It appears to have worked well over the years.  I might use small pieces of cedar instead.  I would prefer not to use sheet-metal and have to remove the ribs. The paint is cracked and peeled.  The canvas is a little loose in a couple of places.  Trail-Head in Ottawa painted the canoe for me in 1994 and frankly, I do not think they did a good job. I need to strip it all off and re-paint, I would assume.  How? Wet-and-dry sand paper?  Chemical?  If so, which chemical?  Should I remove the keel before removing the paint?  Use a semi-gloss finish as recommended by Stelmok and Thurlow? I do not believe that the canoe needs to re-canvased.  I use it presently to fly fish for kamloops trout in the Merritt/Kamloops area and it works fine. Cheers, Burnaby, BC

Response:

Howdy all!  I need some help here. I own a canvas-covered cedar ribbed canoe [Chestnut Prospector Fort Garry, circa 1970] in need of repairs and paint.  First, any books to recommend? I have borrowed Stelmok and Thurlow’s *The Wood & Canvas Canoe*.  Fine book and great for anybody wishing to restore a canvas canoe, but I would prefer not to "restore" the canoe.  Any other books?

This book is the "bible" of wood canvas canoe repair and restoration, so don’t be afraid of it. You don’t have to be doing a major restoration to appreciate the techniques and advice that the book has to offer. As for other books, there are books and articles available from and on the WCHA website that might be of some help to you. Specifically: Some of the planks are cracked.  My father in the past has placed small flat pieces of hard-wood over these cracks and held them in place with marine epoxy. Varnish then covers the works. It appears to have worked well over the years.  I might use small pieces of cedar instead.  I would prefer not to use sheet-metal and have to remove the ribs.

Don’t use metal. It’s ugly and not necessary. You can glue/screw on patches over cracked ribs as long as you don’t have too many in a row that are broken. Stain them the color of the wood and varnish over the whole area. It will work out fine.  If you decide to recanvas you may want to try a backside rib repair. This is detailed in a Wooden Canoe back issue available at the WCHA website. The paint is cracked and peeled.  The canvas is a little loose in a couple of places.  Trail-Head in Ottawa painted the canoe for me in 1994 and frankly, I do not think they did a good job.

If the canoe leaks, remember that painting will not help much. Leaks are caused by cracked filler, not cracked paint. The paint protects the filler and if this is cracked, your options are more limited. You can try to fill the cracks with bondo or something similar, but I generally take this as an indication that the canoe needs to be recanvassed. I need to strip it all off and re-paint, I would assume.  How? Wet-and-dry sand paper?  Chemical?  If so, which chemical?  Should I remove the keel before removing the paint?  Use a semi-gloss finish as recommended by Stelmok and Thurlow?

Chemical strippers may eat right through the filler, depending on the formula used. Sanding down to the filler is fine, but be sure not to sand too deeply and expose canvas weave or it’ll leak for sure.  Paint is your choice, but I use marine enamel. Semi-gloss tends to not show imperfections in the filler as gloss does, but many people use gloss paint to advantage. I do not believe that the canoe needs to re-canvased.  I use it presently to fly fish for kamloops trout in the Merritt/Kamloops area and it works fine.

Good, although canvassing is not all that tough. There are a couple of articles and back issues of Wooden Canoe that talk about it. Jerry and Rollin’s book also details it well. You can do it yourself for about $150 in materials and an afternoon’s worth of time. Enjoy your canoe. They make great friends. -Tim — Tim Hewitt – Webmaster Wooden Canoe Heritage Association, Ltd http://www.wcha.org

Response:

Howdy all!  I need some help here. I own a canvas-covered cedar ribbed canoe [Chestnut Prospector Fort Garry, circa 1970] in need of repairs and paint.  First, any books to recommend? I have borrowed Stelmok and Thurlow’s *The Wood & Canvas Canoe*.  Fine book and great for anybody wishing to restore a canvas canoe, but I would prefer not to "restore" the canoe.  Any other books? Specifically: Some of the planks are cracked.  My father in the past has placed small flat pieces of hard-wood over these cracks and held them in place with marine epoxy. Varnish then covers the works. It appears to have worked well over the years.  I might use small pieces of cedar instead.  I would prefer not to use sheet-metal and have to remove the ribs. The paint is cracked and peeled.  The canvas is a little loose in a couple of places.  Trail-Head in Ottawa painted the canoe for me in 1994 and frankly, I do not think they did a good job. I need to strip it all off and re-paint, I would assume.  How? Wet-and-dry sand paper?  Chemical?  If so, which chemical?  Should I remove the keel before removing the paint?  Use a semi-gloss finish as recommended by Stelmok and Thurlow? I do not believe that the canoe needs to re-canvased.  I use it presently to fly fish for kamloops trout in the Merritt/Kamloops area and it works fine. Cheers, Burnaby, BC

Response:

Question:

Currently seeking flyfishing photos and stories for publication and CD Rom Database, and for use in Calanders. Some selection will be used for pen and ink drawings. Paying $5.00 to $500.00 For guidelines and terms send $1.00 P&H to Down-n-The Holler Press 207 W. Sugarloaf Heber Springs, Ar. 72543

Response:

Currently seeking flyfishing photos and stories for publication and CD Rom Database, and for use in Calanders. Some selection will be used for pen and ink drawings. Paying $5.00 to $500.00 For guidelines and terms send $1.00 P&H to Down-n-The Holler Press 207 W. Sugarloaf Heber Springs, Ar. 72543

You expect me to send you a dollar for your guidelines? Not too much chance of that happening. I can understand the need to cover expenses if snail mail was the only way, but what’s wrong with e-mail? If you send ME a dollar I will send you a copy of my terms and conditions for use of my photographs!:-) — Mike Robinson

Response:

Currently seeking flyfishing photos and stories for publication and CD Rom Database, and for use in Calanders. Some selection will be used for pen and ink drawings. Paying $5.00 to $500.00 For guidelines and terms send $1.00 P&H to Down-n-The Holler Press 207 W. Sugarloaf Heber Springs, Ar. 72543

The last time I heard of an offer like this was when someone called me to tell me I’d just won a "fabulous prize".  All I had to do to claim said prize was to give him my credit card number.  <click!  End of conversation. If you’re guaranteeing payment of a minimum of $5.00 for each submission received I’ll be happy to pay you a buck for your guidelines and terms, *plus* I can guarantee a whole flood of stuff will soon arrive upon your doorstep.  If you’ll just guarantee *that* in writing my dollar bill will soon be winging its way to you.  :-) However, since I doubt you’re guaranteeing payment for any and all submissions I think that asking people to pay for your editorial guidelines and payment rate schedule is unlikely to produce much in the way of useful material.  In my dealings with publishers I’ve never had anyone ask for payment for their guidelines.  Perhaps you should reexamine your policy. — Bob Jarvis Mail addresses hacked to foil automailers! Remove ‘_spamless’ from reply address

Response:

what a crock!!!

Response:

Question:

I am planning a trip to Montana in mid to late September and could use some advice on fly selection. My  girfriend will be fishing the Yellowstone, Madison, and in the park. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!!!

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I am planning a trip to Montana in mid to late September and could use some advice on fly selection. My girlfriend and I will be fishing the Yellowstone, Madison, and some in Yellowstone Park. I would like to tie as many flies as possible before the trip. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!!!

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I am planning a trip to Montana in mid to late September and could use some advice on fly selection. My girlfriend and I will be fishing the Yellowstone, Madison, and some in Yellowstone Park. I would like to tie as many flies as possible before the trip. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!!!

Hi Tim, In September, in particular, the browns are quite active preparing to spawn. Preparing for this results in two activities: gorging lots of food to build up necessary fat deposits for spawning, and protecting their spawning lies from predators. Both activities result in excellent streamer fishing from September to November. Be prepared with a selection of Muddlers, Woolly Buggers, Matuka and Woolhead Sculpins, and Zonker patterns, to name a few of the more locally popular flies. September is also a fine time here for insects. Hydropsyche caddis are still emerging heavily on all the rivers (size 14-16, pale green & tan), as well as the late emergence of Rhyacophila (the "Bright Green Caddis Larva," size #14-16, olive adult). Baetis become the dominant mayfly (olive, size #18-22 with smaller sizes more typical of the fall emergence), with Mahogany duns (brown, size 14) providing late season action for the larger mayflies, especially on the Gallatin River. There are lesser hatches which are also "locally" important on some rivers, including Tricos (Madison), Attenella (upper Yellowstone), etc. I’d also suggest that you contact local fly shops for the area you’ll be visiting, including Jacklin’s in West Yellowstone and Montana Troutfitters or The River’s Edge in Bozeman. They can provide you with locally effective "hot" patterns and up-to-date fishing reports. Good Luck, Ryan Jordan J&J Flies (Bozeman)

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I had good luck using a PMD nymph at Buffalo Ford last Sept. Not much else was working at the time. Frank Cada

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I am planning a trip to Montana in mid to late September and could use some advice on fly selection. My girlfriend and I will be fishing the Yellowstone, Madison, and some in Yellowstone Park. I would like to tie as many flies as possible before the trip. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!!!

Hi Tim You will need a series of Bead Head nymphs and Hare’s Ear Nymphs #10 – #16, assorted Wulffs #12 – #18, Parachute Adams #16 – #20, assorted Compara Duns #14 – #22, Elk Hair Caddis #12 – #20 both light and dark,   Real important for that time of years is #8 Grass Hoppers — my favorite is a Whit’s Hopper or something similar.  By the time September rolls around the fish will have seen many different Hopper patterns and the more realistic the better.  This is especially true in the Park.  The fish on Slough Creek as an example will often "nudge" a hopper patterns several times before taking it.  It’s important that you not strike when they nudge the fly but wait for them to take it.  It can be a real nerve racking experience but a lot of fun as well. Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (96 catalog)

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It matters a GREAT deal WHERE on the Yellowstone you’ll be fishing.  The Yellowstone, as you know, is a very large river that can be broken down into several sections.  If you can be more specific as to the area you’ll be fishing, I’ll tell you the information you want to know.

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I am planning a trip to Montana in mid to late September and could use some advice on fly selection. My girlfriend and I will be fishing the Yellowstone, Madison, and some in Yellowstone Park. I would like to tie as many flies as possible before the trip. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!!!

Have some hoppers for warm days. Wooly buggers in whatever fancies you. I like black with a touch of flash and the Bakers hole special which is yellow and brown with a touch of flash. Bead head Hares ears in a variety of sizes and bead head Prince seems to work on the Madison. Definitely have some size 18-22 pmd type emergers in pale yellow. Last year this was our most effective fly on the madison the first week of October. (I still after all these years can’t figure out how those trout see those flies in all that rough water!) Fished them with a small strike indicator on the nymphs and like a dry for the emergers. I personally still used the strike indicator on th emergers cause I sure can’t see the fly. I would also still have the basics in a variety of sizes like Wulfs Adams, Caddis and sparkle duns, but the nymphs were most productive for us. The Wooly Buggers were the most productive on the Yellowstone above Le Hardy Rapids. Kevin Williams

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I am planning a trip to Montana in mid to late September and could use some advice on fly selection. My girlfriend and I will be fishing the Yellowstone, Madison, and some in Yellowstone Park. I would like to tie as many flies as possible before the trip. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!!!

I suggest calling Madison River Outfitters in West Yellowstone.  (I don’t feel comfortable publishing phone numbers, but I’m sure you can call information.)

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Hi Group– Well there’s now a pro and a con posted re: clipping hackle.  As a beginner in both tying them and fishing them, I’d like to see more on this subject from more experienced fishers–what does Issac Walton think about it?  Not being able to justify 50 bucks "for a bunch of feathers" to my dubious spouse, I don’t have many Metz primo capes, so I’m always snipping away at my creations.  (The height of my success as a tyer so far came when she swatted a fly I had in my vice–I call it a size 14 Blue-Green Bent Hook Flathead Roadkill). Anyway, should I add clipped hackle to my list of tying blunders?

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Yes, it is kind of a hassle to tie both wieghted and unweighted flies and keep them separated in your fly boxes.  Using both has allowed me to catch fish when the traditional nymph patterns would not produce.

No hassle of they are colour-coded by tying thread.  My weighted nymphs are all tied with red thread, easy to see;  if I were a closer imitationist I could choose between black, tan and olive. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

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No hassle of they are colour-coded by tying thread.  My weighted nymphs are all tied with red thread, easy to see;  if I were a closer imitationist I could choose between black, tan and olive. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

Don, I do the same color coding with one small difference. I lead all my hooks first and use the color coded thread which I wrap down the bend of the hook a little. So, when I look in the flybox all I have to do is look under their little tails to see how I weighted them…   I know someone will come up with a good joke about looking under their tails (:^ Frank

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Don, I do the same color coding with one small difference. I lead all my hooks first and use the color coded thread which I wrap down the bend of the hook a little. So, when I look in the flybox all I have to do is look under their little tails to see how I weighted them… I know someone will come up with a good joke about looking under their tails (:^ Frank

Oh, I get it, Frank.  Sort of a variation on a lead-ass!  My father used to always call me that.  Now I know what he was talking about– the color of my underpants, which must have stuck out above my pants.  :^) (Sorry, best I could do under pressure.) :^( Charley

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        For slow to medium water, I’ve clipped a ^ into the bottom of the hackle for years. When I’m doing so, I deliberately use a hackle which is too long so that when trimmed will be the proper length.         The benefits of doing this are twofold. It sits very well on the water and has a terrific footprint on the water. A mayfly at rest on the water has long legs out to the side – not underneath it. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well there’s now a pro and a con posted re: clipping hackle. When I started tying we had only Chinese and Idia necks.  We would have killed for a Metz #3 rooster neck.  Today they are around $30 and some shops split them in half or you might split one with a buddy. If you keep it away from bugs or you house pets they usually work to be a good long term investment with dries around $1.75 per each.  The most popular color is natural brown and then Grizzly.  Get some Pantone pens for coloring your Grizzly or Creme hackle in a pinch.  I haven’t clipped any hackle before, at least not on purpose, but I done think it would sit up like the natural ends.  Bill Kiene  Kiene’s Fly Shop  Sacramento, Ca.

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Well there’s now a pro and a con posted re: clipping hackle.

When I started tying we had only Chinese and Idia necks.  We would have killed for a Metz #3 rooster neck.  Today they are around $30 and some shops split them in half or you might split one with a buddy. If you keep it away from bugs or you house pets they usually work to be a good long term investment with dries around $1.75 per each.  The most popular color is natural brown and then Grizzly.  Get some Pantone pens for coloring your Grizzly or Creme hackle in a pinch.  I haven’t clipped any hackle before, at least not on purpose, but I done think it would sit up like the natural ends.  Bill Kiene  Kiene’s Fly Shop  Sacramento, Ca.

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Well can anyone out there give me a rule of thumb for weighting nymphs? My method in the past has been to first not weight the nymph itself so that it tumbled in the water more naturally.  I added weight (lead shot) about 8 inches up the tipet until JUST before my indicator would studder as the weight and nymph would drag the bottom.  I have always caught fish that way.  So I am fishing with this rookie who fished his nymph with no weight under an indicator.  I thought his nymph would never get anywhere near the bottom.  He started hooking fish and I was dry, both of us using the same PTs I had tied!.  Should I rething my nymphing strategy?  Can a nymph  act and be fished as an emerger with no modifications?  I’m thinking that these fish were wanting emergers and that my method for weighting is still very sound.  Opinions appreciated.  And please!  "No sticking to dry flys" cracks.

My experience in nymphing is that you should be prepared to offer both weighted and unweighted nymphs to actively feeding fish.  There are occasions when fish key on rising/hatching nymphs,  and virtually ignore bottom dwelling creatures even though they are plentiful. I try to tie my nymph flies to cover the full life cycle of the insect.  Something as simple as adding an emerging wing to a nymph can dramatically increase the effectiveness of a particular fly when nymphs are in transitional stage. As a rule of thumb for small nymphs (#14-#22) I add only enough weight to sink the fly a few inches.  I can always add or remove split shot to achieve the desired sink rate. Yes, it is kind of a hassle to tie both wieghted and unweighted flies and keep them separated in your fly boxes.  Using both has allowed me to catch fish when the traditional nymph patterns would not produce. I hope this helps. Bryan Bonds White River Anglers htttp://www.ipa.net/~bbonds Fayetteville, Ar

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:  (The height of my success as a tyer : so far came when she swatted a fly I had in my vice–I call it a size : 14 Blue-Green Bent Hook Flathead Roadkill).   Congratulations, Lee! Not often that the average joe can come up with a new pattern! You may want to publish it.  ;-  Anyway, should I add clipped hackle to my list of tying blunders?  My opinion, yes. It changes the appearnce of the fly. The fine tips of a natural feather make a difference in the silhoette and the floatabily. You may want to consider cheaper necks for now. The expensive one _are_ cheaper in the long run. More feathers per buck and fewer "bad" feathers per neck. The price is high to start though. Jon Porter

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Well can anyone out there give me a rule of thumb for weighting nymphs? My method in the past has been to first not weight the nymph itself so that it tumbled in the water more naturally.  I added weight (lead shot) about 8 inches up the tipet until JUST before my indicator would studder as the weight and nymph would drag the bottom.  I have always caught fish

[deleted] personally, i do not use my indicators like bobbers, constantly adjusting the weight until the perfect balance is acheived.  i much prefer using 3 to 5 tiny blobs of flourescent plastic indicator material (the sheet peel off types, not the big honking round versions of these…), Cortlands cut in 1/4ths or 1/6ths.  One right at the butt section/line connection and then spaced at 6-10 inch intervals.  this allows me to gauge… 1) depth of bug 2) directionality of leader 3) speed of drift 4) directionality of drift So you add some shot to get down and drown one or two of the indicators, so what …you can still see them under the water and see what attitude your your line is in relative to all the other variables. When you see a trout charge one of your sunken blobs of indicator you can switch to some kind of emerger and sagely pretend that you figured it out. Good fishing, Tim Walker

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Oh, was that hate mail? I thought it was just another ‘96 fund-raising blurb from the Republican National Committee.

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Unless someone changes the name of this conference to rec.woodworking.politics keep those comments to yourself or take them elsewhere.

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Now that the Republicans control Congress, and will control the White House  after the next election – I’m sure that hate mail was from Democrats! Let’s keep this kind  of nonsense off this board. Name: O.C. Garza Time: 13:46:39 Eat…Breath…Good Cigars…Fly Fishing…Die!

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