Question:
Lately, the outside of my left elbow is sore to the core. (I’m right handed) I was told by some golfers that I may have ‘tennis elbow’. Has anyone experienced this and what did you do for it? I’m sure I’ll have to see the Doc, if it doesn’t go away. Will it go away?? Thanks in advance!
Response:
Lately, the outside of my left elbow is sore to the core. (I’m right handed) I was told by some golfers that I may have ‘tennis elbow’. Has anyone experienced this and what did you do for it? I’m sure I’ll have to see the Doc, if it doesn’t go away. Will it go away??
Do a web search on "lateral epicondylitis". It’s not fun, that’s for sure.
Response:
Lately, the outside of my left elbow is sore to the core. (I’m right handed) I was told by some golfers that I may have ‘tennis elbow’. Has anyone experienced this and what did you do for it? I’m sure I’ll have to see the Doc, if it doesn’t go away. Will it go away??
A couple of years ago I got tennis elbow in my right (racquet) arm by digging up trees in my yard. I stupidly didn’t take much time off of tennis, and also didn’t get any treatment. It took a long time to go away, but I eventually recovered completely. I think I helped the healing by careful weightlifting that didn’t aggravate it. One guy I used to play tennis with got it pretty bad. He’s had physical therapy and cortisone shots, and is still trying to recover. I’ve had pain in my left arm for the last couple of months that I can only attribute to golf. It sounds like what you have. During the summer I was hitting a lot of balls each week, and also doing some cross-training to maintain strength and flexibility and ward off injury. I may have overdone the practice regimen a bit. I have one more tournament to play on 10/20, then I’m planning on rest and rehab over the winter to get rid of the pain. – cja
Response:
Lately, the outside of my left elbow is sore to the core. (I’m right handed) I was told by some golfers that I may have ‘tennis elbow’. Has anyone experienced this and what did you do for it? I’m sure I’ll have to see the Doc, if it doesn’t go away. Will it go away?? Do a web search on "lateral epicondylitis". It’s not fun, that’s for sure.
And if that happens to be your problem, ask your pharmacist for the type of "armband" (some look like a U-shaped clamp) that redirects vibration away from your elbow. It won’t cure you (only rest will do that) but at least will alleviate further pain.
Response:
I am currently suffering from a (left) tennis elbow as a result of a too strong grip while playing in the rain. I am getting physiotherapy but have been told that it may take anywhere between 3 months and 2 years to heal. Rest seems to do the trick. Certainly no more golf for the foreseeable future… 
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Lately, the outside of my left elbow is sore to the core. (I’m right handed) I was told by some golfers that I may have ‘tennis elbow’. Has anyone experienced this and what did you do for it? I’m sure I’ll have to see the Doc, if it doesn’t go away. Will it go away?? Thanks in advance!
Response:
This is bad news. I’ve worked through this in both elbows. Definitely take measures now, or it can get a lot worse. The things I have done, that are finally getting me fixed, after a year, are: 1) Ice the elbow thoroughly after golf or other activities which make it sore. 2) Stretch the tendons before. There are web sites out there which can give you the stretches. 3) Weight training of the forearm. I use 12 lb dumbells now, had to start with 2 lb. You want to lay your arm across your knee, palm down, and flex the hand backwards towards your elbow. Do 15 reps with what ever weight you can. Then turn the hand over, palm up, and curl your wrist with the same weight. Do three or four times a week. 4) I had to give up golf and fly fishing for two months. I gave it up for three weeks and then went back, and really made things worse. 5) Ibuprofen 6) Get a tennis elbow support strap. Your local drug store should have one. Wear this while golfing or when doing other things that subject the elbow to impact. You wear it just below the elbow, on the fat part of your forearm. It distributes stress to the muscle lower in your arm. Hope that helps. Don’t ignore this, or it can become chronic. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Lately, the outside of my left elbow is sore to the core. (I’m right handed) I was told by some golfers that I may have ‘tennis elbow’. Has anyone experienced this and what did you do for it? I’m sure I’ll have to see the Doc, if it doesn’t go away. Will it go away?? Thanks in advance!
Response:
In addition to the excellent list of options below, I would taking Glucoseamaine Sulphate, which cured a very bad case of Tennis Elbow I had several years ago. would seem to take 60 days for benefits to appear. Cortisone shots help, but are not recommended until other treatments fail. — Bill Cochrane 416-284-8462
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This is bad news. I’ve worked through this in both elbows. Definitely take measures now, or it can get a lot worse. The things I have done, that are finally getting me fixed, after a year, are: 1) Ice the elbow thoroughly after golf or other activities which make it sore. 2) Stretch the tendons before. There are web sites out there which can give you the stretches. 3) Weight training of the forearm. I use 12 lb dumbells now, had to start with 2 lb. You want to lay your arm across your knee, palm down, and flex the hand backwards towards your elbow. Do 15 reps with what ever weight you can. Then turn the hand over, palm up, and curl your wrist with the same weight. Do three or four times a week. 4) I had to give up golf and fly fishing for two months. I gave it up for three weeks and then went back, and really made things worse. 5) Ibuprofen 6) Get a tennis elbow support strap. Your local drug store should have one. Wear this while golfing or when doing other things that subject the elbow to impact. You wear it just below the elbow, on the fat part of your forearm. It distributes stress to the muscle lower in your arm. Hope that helps. Don’t ignore this, or it can become chronic. Lately, the outside of my left elbow is sore to the core. (I’m right handed) I was told by some golfers that I may have ‘tennis elbow’. Has anyone experienced this and what did you do for it? I’m sure I’ll have to see the Doc, if it doesn’t go away. Will it go away?? Thanks in advance!
Response:
Question:
Have you done this walk up Hazel as an overnighter? It has been my experience that what is a six hour walk with a fly rod is a whole different critter than hiking in with a backpack, tent, etc. At any rate, I’m in if the sceduling can be worked out. Any idea what the actual mileage is?
never done it…they wouldn’t let you fish up there FOR 25 YEARS! why would i walk that far *not* to fish… now that it’s open to fishing, i’m yearning to take a look at the water. i’m thinking it’s 8-10 miles up to the walkers creek, proctor creek area based on my map. the cascade is about 13 miles… but maybe someone who’s a hiker and been in there can tell us – and…the trail is a flat road, much easier walking than snowbird. there are carts with big wheels… can’t we do 8 miles in 6 hours? btw…i’m still wet-wading in october… neoprenes seem a bit much for carolina fall fishing. I agree about the neoprenes but my one experience fishing with you in October suggests that wading wet could be a bit iffy……
yeah, but that’s why we’ll be carryin the lightweight goretex <g. it’s when you’re done fishin that the wetness and the evening chill gets you… the days are great, unless it rains. it’s o.k. if you’re naturally numb from the waist down
i can’t help it if you’re easily numbed… those of us with sturdy scrotum and "turtle" reflex find it invigorating… but for those of us who are of the neck up persuasion
…hmm, thought ee cummings described them as boston women… it would come down to a choice between walking on our hands or perhaps wearing lightweights. :)
damn…if only i’d known what might have occurred if i’d gotten the lightweights instead of the socks… jeff (makin a note) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Have you done this walk up Hazel as an overnighter? It has been my experience that what is a six hour walk with a fly rod is a whole different critter than hiking in with a backpack, tent, etc. At any rate, I’m in if the sceduling can be worked out. Any idea what the actual mileage is? never done it…they wouldn’t let you fish up there FOR 25 YEARS! why would i walk that far *not* to fish… now that it’s open to fishing, i’m yearning to take a look at the water. i’m thinking it’s 8-10 miles up to the walkers creek, proctor creek area based on my map. the cascade is about 13 miles… but maybe someone who’s a hiker and been in there can tell us – and…the trail is a flat road, much easier walking than snowbird. there are carts with big wheels… can’t we do 8 miles in 6 hours?
"Got Speed Bumps?"
Response:
no speed bumps so far…but i’ve only been up about 3 miles. i’ve been told wayno’s had the park rangers drive him up the road, so maybe he can describe upper hazel. i believe you could do it no problem. didn’t you go up a ways when wayno hit his big rainbow? jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "Got Speed Bumps?"
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Have you done this walk up Hazel as an overnighter? It has been my experience that what is a six hour walk with a fly rod is a whole different critter than hiking in with a backpack, tent, etc. At any rate, I’m in if the sceduling can be worked out. Any idea what the actual mileage is? never done it…they wouldn’t let you fish up there FOR 25 YEARS! why would i walk that far *not* to fish… now that it’s open to fishing, i’m yearning to take a look at the water. i’m thinking it’s 8-10 miles up to the walkers creek, proctor creek area based on my map. the cascade is about 13 miles… but maybe someone who’s a hiker and been in there can tell us – and…the trail is a flat road, much easier walking than snowbird. there are carts with big wheels… can’t we do 8 miles in 6 hours?
Shit, Tripper can do eight miles in six hours on a flat road in a big wheel cart……um……well, if Petah is pushing it. btw…i’m still wet-wading in october… neoprenes seem a bit much for carolina fall fishing. I agree about the neoprenes but my one experience fishing with you in October suggests that wading wet could be a bit iffy…… yeah, but that’s why we’ll be carryin the lightweight goretex <g. it’s when you’re done fishin that the wetness and the evening chill gets you… the days are great, unless it rains.
I LOVE rain…..it’s warmer than the creek! it’s o.k. if you’re naturally numb from the waist down i can’t help it if you’re easily numbed… those of us with sturdy scrotum and "turtle" reflex find it invigorating…
Uh…….remind me not to watch you bathe up there…..o.k.? :( but for those of us who are of the neck up persuasion …hmm, thought ee cummings described them as boston women…
I’ll have to defer to mr. harrison vis mr. cummings…..they speak the same language. it would come down to a choice between walking on our hands or perhaps wearing lightweights. :) damn…if only i’d known what might have occurred if i’d gotten the lightweights instead of the socks…
Oh yeah, they’re indispensable, as Mr. Tup so eloquently put it. jeff (makin a note)
Uh huh, about a fourth register E if mine ear doth not deceive me. Wolfgang who would recommend a good geographer to explain the nice distinction between flat and level. :)
Response:
On my topo map this looks to be a pretty ambitous trip. Approximately 13.5 miles and 2000 feet of elevation. Early in May my son and I walked up to the campsite at the confluence of Hazel and Sugar Fork. It’s about 5.6 miles by the trail and 425 feet vertically from the lake. Had a full pack with pasta and dehydrated meals for two days, tent, sleeping bag, thermarest, primus stove, waders, wading boots, rod, vest, etc. And one can of St. Louis’ best beer. I figure the pack weighed at least 30 lbs. It seemed much heavier. The fishing apparatus added more weight (total = 40?) and hassle. Furthermore, I was pretty sadly out of shape. Having listed all those excuses, it took between four and five hours to make the trip. That included several stops along the way to admire the creek. You all have been on the trail before – it’s a gentle grade and fairly easy walk if you don’t try to take your entire net worth in equipment. But a 13 or 14 mile walk with full pack and fishing gear is a fairly major undertaking. Wet wading in Smoky mountain streams in October takes more fortitude than I have. I’m numb enough from the waist down already, and it gets worse every year. Bob
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …well, this appears to be the beginnings of yet another fine idea. i suggest you take charge of it, establish some proposed dates, and we’ll set up a new thread to see what develops. if zimbo is still hereabouts, perhaps he’ll post the dates of his gathering – i’m gonna be in the smokies the week of oct 19-26th with rachel – the 21st is her birthday. i can probably manage a 3-day camping trip either before that week or at the latter part of that week, or i can take a 4 day weekend thursday-sunday at another time. the park service provides some carts we can use to roll supplies up the trail if anyone wants or needs to bring some special stuff. Have you done this walk up Hazel as an overnighter? It has been my experience that what is a six hour walk with a fly rod is a whole different critter than hiking in with a backpack, tent, etc. At any rate, I’m in if the sceduling can be worked out. Any idea what the actual mileage is? btw…i’m still wet-wading in october… neoprenes seem a bit much for carolina fall fishing. I agree about the neoprenes but my one experience fishing with you in October suggests that wading wet could be a bit iffy……it’s o.k. if you’re naturally numb from the waist down but for those of us who are of the neck up persuasion it would come down to a choice between walking on our hands or perhaps wearing lightweights. :) Wolfgang
Response:
"Got Speed Bumps?" no speed bumps so far…but i’ve only been up about 3 miles. i’ve been told wayno’s had the park rangers drive him up the road, so maybe he can describe upper hazel. i believe you could do it no problem. didn’t you go up a ways when wayno hit his big rainbow?
I know we went past the "town", maybe a mile or two up the road from there. It wasn’t a hard hike up to wherever we ended up. otoh, we nearly had to have a certain Boy Lawyer airlifted out of there after he caught a WAY-too-big-for-Hazel-Creek rainbow… /daytripper (You think he had the Rangers "salt" the creek for ‘im, too? 
Response:
…nothing like a week in graham county to confirm i’ve wasted the better part of my life down here in the crowded flatlands of coastal nc… a situation i hope to correct in the next year or two. anyway, it was an incredible week of fiSSSSHing 5 of my favorite streams in nc, S[******], S[nowbird], S[assafrass], S[anteetlah], and H[azel], briefly recounted as follows: Saturday – rachel and i arrived at the snowbird house, bought some groceries, and settled in… well, sorta. i was busy getting the fishing stuff settled on the table, rachel did the practical stuff – unpacked clothes and groceries. just before dark (it didn’t get dark until after 9), i walked the 10 feet to the stream out back and fished the two runs that always yield a fish or two – yup, still happenin! two rainbows on an ehc…one was the typical 8 incher caught in the deeper cut of the main current where wolfgang snapped a picture or two of me in an evening stupor last october; the other was a nice 12 inches or more, caught by "bowling" the fly downstream about 50 feet around the bend of a deeper, quiet pool. satisfied the week was properly started, i ambled outta the stream, back up the gentle bank to a well-prepared spaghetti dinner and a chilly beer. thus began my week’s adventure of solitary fishing in some of the best streams in the smokies … SUNDAY – fished S.[******], the stream that yielded those 3 big rainbows last october. arrived around 9 am, parked in the same place as last year. the road was a bit worse, but manageable. this was my day of paying proper devotion and respect – so, after humbly thanking all the spirits and deities, and making a silent oath not to break that commandment about the lord’s name, a kinder, gentler, easier-goin jeff set out up the road to the spot wally and i stopped in our october frenzy, the soul-filling gift of zimbo’s 6′ bamboo rod & the abandoned socks of wolfgang at the ready for a full day in the stream. didn’t see or hear another person the entire day. S[******]is at about 3000 feet elevation at this point, and it’s headwaters are near a bald which is above 5000 feet. getting to it requires a drive up a steep, narrow grade of dirt and rocks for a mile or so until the road becomes unmanageable with a vehicle… the upper stretch is a rutted, rocky path only 4-wheelers can traverse safely. from the point i entered the stream, until the pool i quit, with the exception of one pocket, i either caught a fish or had one rise to the fly. except for several brookies, all were rainbows of the usual size with a few approaching or just at ten inches. size 14 and 16 ehc and parachute adams never failed to attract a fish. after a while, i started playing around with various dry flies just to see what would happen – color didn’t matter, but the size did. though they’d come up and look at the #12 stimulator, i guess it just looked a bit too big to tangle with, or it was easier to distinguish as a phony bug…i don’t know. but switch off to a smaller fly and no problem. THE HIGHLIGHT – near the close of the day, once the leader had gotten cut back from all the fly changing, as a lark i tied on a flashy green and black bugger i had acquired from a mail order outfit in england a few years ago. i was at one of the deeper pools with a nice froth of white water formed by the stream falling from the pool above. casually tossed the bugger into the froth, let it sink a bit, twitched it back towards me and, damn…what’s this…quite a different feel… jeezusfuckingchri…(ok, i confess… i never was too good at keeping that particular commandment)… it was an honest 12" brookie (spec)- the biggest wild nc brook trout i’ve ever caught! fat, heavy, and healthy looking. what a day! fellas, seeing a 12" spec in nc is an experience akin to seein pj in a tuxedo dancin a waltz at the terpsichorean ball in raleigh. … unique, if ya get my drift. …i continued up a few more pools with the bugger, catching rainbows, until i pulled out around 5 pm, then walked up the road for 30 minutes or so just exploring a bit…yup, there’s still a lot of water left for the next trip. [cont.]
Response:
Marvelous TR, Jeff. Hope you don’t keep us waiting too long for the next installment in the series! I’m sitting here in sultry Missouri reading your TR and listening to a segment on CBS Sunday Morning about the rhododendrons blooming in the appalachians. In fact, they juxtaposed that segment with a segment about subway musicians in New York. My GPS tells me that it’s 430 miles to my favorite spot on Snowbird. But my bank account tells me the office is a hell of a lot closer. Congratulations on having a wife who puts up with your fishing!! Bob
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …nothing like a week in graham county to confirm i’ve wasted the better part of my life down here in the crowded flatlands of coastal nc… a situation i hope to correct in the next year or two. anyway, it was an incredible week of fiSSSSHing 5 of my favorite streams in nc, S[******], S[nowbird], S[assafrass], S[anteetlah], and H[azel], briefly recounted as follows: Saturday – rachel and i arrived at the snowbird house, bought some groceries, and settled in… well, sorta. i was busy getting the fishing stuff settled on the table, rachel did the practical stuff – unpacked clothes and groceries. just before dark (it didn’t get dark until after 9), i walked the 10 feet to the stream out back and fished the two runs that always yield a fish or two – yup, still happenin! two rainbows on an ehc…one was the typical 8 incher caught in the deeper cut of the main current where wolfgang snapped a picture or two of me in an evening stupor last october; the other was a nice 12 inches or more, caught by "bowling" the fly downstream about 50 feet around the bend of a deeper, quiet pool. satisfied the week was properly started, i ambled outta the stream, back up the gentle bank to a well-prepared spaghetti dinner and a chilly beer. thus began my week’s adventure of solitary fishing in some of the best streams in the smokies … SUNDAY – fished S.[******], the stream that yielded those 3 big rainbows last october. arrived around 9 am, parked in the same place as last year. the road was a bit worse, but manageable. this was my day of paying proper devotion and respect – so, after humbly thanking all the spirits and deities, and making a silent oath not to break that commandment about the lord’s name, a kinder, gentler, easier-goin jeff set out up the road to the spot wally and i stopped in our october frenzy, the soul-filling gift of zimbo’s 6′ bamboo rod & the abandoned socks of wolfgang at the ready for a full day in the stream. didn’t see or hear another person the entire day. S[******]is at about 3000 feet elevation at this point, and it’s headwaters are near a bald which is above 5000 feet. getting to it requires a drive up a steep, narrow grade of dirt and rocks for a mile or so until the road becomes unmanageable with a vehicle… the upper stretch is a rutted, rocky path only 4-wheelers can traverse safely. from the point i entered the stream, until the pool i quit, with the exception of one pocket, i either caught a fish or had one rise to the fly. except for several brookies, all were rainbows of the usual size with a few approaching or just at ten inches. size 14 and 16 ehc and parachute adams never failed to attract a fish. after a while, i started playing around with various dry flies just to see what would happen – color didn’t matter, but the size did. though they’d come up and look at the #12 stimulator, i guess it just looked a bit too big to tangle with, or it was easier to distinguish as a phony bug…i don’t know. but switch off to a smaller fly and no problem. THE HIGHLIGHT – near the close of the day, once the leader had gotten cut back from all the fly changing, as a lark i tied on a flashy green and black bugger i had acquired from a mail order outfit in england a few years ago. i was at one of the deeper pools with a nice froth of white water formed by the stream falling from the pool above. casually tossed the bugger into the froth, let it sink a bit, twitched it back towards me and, damn…what’s this…quite a different feel… jeezusfuckingchri…(ok, i confess… i never was too good at keeping that particular commandment)… it was an honest 12" brookie (spec)- the biggest wild nc brook trout i’ve ever caught! fat, heavy, and healthy looking. what a day! fellas, seeing a 12" spec in nc is an experience akin to seein pj in a tuxedo dancin a waltz at the terpsichorean ball in raleigh. … unique, if ya get my drift. …i continued up a few more pools with the bugger, catching rainbows, until i pulled out around 5 pm, then walked up the road for 30 minutes or so just exploring a bit…yup, there’s still a lot of water left for the next trip. [cont.]
Response:
… it was an honest 12" brookie (spec)- the biggest wild nc brook trout i’ve ever caught! fat, heavy, and healthy looking. what a day!
Not too shabby at all 
Response:
…well, this appears to be the beginnings of yet another fine idea. i suggest you take charge of it, establish some proposed dates, and we’ll set up a new thread to see what develops. if zimbo is still hereabouts, perhaps he’ll post the dates of his gathering – i’m gonna be in the smokies the week of oct 19-26th with rachel – the 21st is her birthday. i can probably manage a 3-day camping trip either before that week or at the latter part of that week, or i can take a 4 day weekend thursday-sunday at another time. the park service provides some carts we can use to roll supplies up the trail if anyone wants or needs to bring some special stuff.
Have you done this walk up Hazel as an overnighter? It has been my experience that what is a six hour walk with a fly rod is a whole different critter than hiking in with a backpack, tent, etc. At any rate, I’m in if the sceduling can be worked out. Any idea what the actual mileage is? btw…i’m still wet-wading in october… neoprenes seem a bit much for carolina fall fishing.
I agree about the neoprenes but my one experience fishing with you in October suggests that wading wet could be a bit iffy……it’s o.k. if you’re naturally numb from the waist down but for those of us who are of the neck up persuasion it would come down to a choice between walking on our hands or perhaps wearing lightweights. :) Wolfgang
Response:
Naw – that coven is down close to Stecoah. Sometimes it meets in Bryson City depending on which politician is in town. This is way the hell too far in the boondocks.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested? i hear tell that there’s a unsavory rattlersnake worshippin’ coven up in those parts…. –waldo d;^)
Response:
Naw – that coven is down close to Stecoah. Sometimes it meets in Bryson City depending on which politician is in town. This is way the hell too far in the boondocks.
naaaahh bob, yer thinkin’ ufduh dolly parton mandolin strummin’ coppahead group that meets at tooties every udduh toosday. weird group, dancin widda coppaheads to 9-5… weird stuff but well worth da show if ya can drop in on toosday evenins…. whatever da hell ya do…. don’t go into the kitchen….bad, really bad mojo. duh group way up on hazel, well, bone creek pickahs. days banjo and jug tootin’ fellahs…… meanest dirty rotten sob’s you’d ever wanna come across….. hell, ask wayno, he’ll tell ya d;^) –waldo, workin’ way too late….
Response:
Hell, Waldo, I don’t know if you’re thinking of the last Snowbird ROFF clave in the second case, or a stockholders meeting here, in the first case, both of which I missed but both of which sound familiar based on reports from observers . . .
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Naw – that coven is down close to Stecoah. Sometimes it meets in Bryson City depending on which politician is in town. This is way the hell too far in the boondocks. naaaahh bob, yer thinkin’ ufduh dolly parton mandolin strummin’ coppahead group that meets at tooties every udduh toosday. weird group, dancin widda coppaheads to 9-5… weird stuff but well worth da show if ya can drop in on toosday evenins…. whatever da hell ya do…. don’t go into the kitchen….bad, really bad mojo. duh group way up on hazel, well, bone creek pickahs. days banjo and jug tootin’ fellahs…… meanest dirty rotten sob’s you’d ever wanna come across….. hell, ask wayno, he’ll tell ya d;^) –waldo, workin’ way too late….
Response:
Never one to flinch from doing my duty for God and Country. October would be a fine time – even late October. If we could tie it in with Zimbo’s soiree that would be great. I feel like I made a three-day trip up Hazel in 2 days early in May. A six-hour walk up and a five-hour walk down didn’t leave much fishing time in two days. I’d agree three days is the minimum unless you really groove on walking. Also, if one has to walk five miles while wearing neoprenes, it’s more comfortable in October than in May. And by late October the bears should be doing their final snacking before settling in for the winter! Bob
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – as you’ve probably heard, they’ve opened portions of hazel that have been closed to all fishing for 25 years – as an experiment to see if the fisherman actually affects the brook trout population in any meaningful way. i believe it is our duty to participate in this grand experiment … but, it will require at least 3 days. the hike in will be 6 hours at least… if there’s any interest, it’s time to start planning. i don’t know who is going where in october – zimbo floated a blue ridge gathering, i’ll be in the smokies with rachel the week of oct. 20. anyway, let me know if you’ve got a preference as far as dates and we’ll see what develops. jeff Jeff – I’d like to join up on such an expedition if it was planned well in advance. It’s an all-day drive for me, like it probably is for you. I would make a several-day trip of it and combine two or three days on Hazel with some other fishing – maybe on the Tellico river downhill from McDaniel Bald or on one of the creeks in the Snowbird/Santeetlah area. Bob //snip// i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested? jeff
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…well, this appears to be the beginnings of yet another fine idea. i suggest you take charge of it, establish some proposed dates, and we’ll set up a new thread to see what develops. if zimbo is still hereabouts, perhaps he’ll post the dates of his gathering – i’m gonna be in the smokies the week of oct 19-26th with rachel – the 21st is her birthday. i can probably manage a 3-day camping trip either before that week or at the latter part of that week, or i can take a 4 day weekend thursday-sunday at another time. the park service provides some carts we can use to roll supplies up the trail if anyone wants or needs to bring some special stuff. btw…i’m still wet-wading in october… neoprenes seem a bit much for carolina fall fishing. jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Never one to flinch from doing my duty for God and Country. October would be a fine time – even late October. If we could tie it in with Zimbo’s soiree that would be great. I feel like I made a three-day trip up Hazel in 2 days early in May. A six-hour walk up and a five-hour walk down didn’t leave much fishing time in two days. I’d agree three days is the minimum unless you really groove on walking. Also, if one has to walk five miles while wearing neoprenes, it’s more comfortable in October than in May. And by late October the bears should be doing their final snacking before settling in for the winter! Bob as you’ve probably heard, they’ve opened portions of hazel that have been closed to all fishing for 25 years – as an experiment to see if the fisherman actually affects the brook trout population in any meaningful way. i believe it is our duty to participate in this grand experiment … but, it will require at least 3 days. the hike in will be 6 hours at least… if there’s any interest, it’s time to start planning. i don’t know who is going where in october – zimbo floated a blue ridge gathering, i’ll be in the smokies with rachel the week of oct. 20. anyway, let me know if you’ve got a preference as far as dates and we’ll see what develops. jeff Jeff – I’d like to join up on such an expedition if it was planned well in advance. It’s an all-day drive for me, like it probably is for you. I would make a several-day trip of it and combine two or three days on Hazel with some other fishing – maybe on the Tellico river downhill from McDaniel Bald or on one of the creeks in the Snowbird/Santeetlah area. Bob //snip// i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested? jeff
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Good stuff Jeff. That certain Southern Style creeps in to all your writing. When you return from the HF you’ll be changed slightly bruce h
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Good stuff Jeff. That certain Southern Style creeps in to all your writing. When you return from the HF you’ll be changed slightly
Yep, before you know it, you will be wearing big hats and cowboy boots, and have a three inch circle worn into your ass pocket by the Cope tin. You will be driving a full- size American pickup truck with a gun rack and a Labrador retriever (or two) in back, and you won’t even unhitch the boat trailer to go to the grocery store. Where, btw, you will be buying Rainier beer and beef, not chardonnay and green vegetables. Your favorite rod will be a nine foot six or seven weight graphite, not the 6 foot bamboo. Your fly vest will contain as many Woolly Buggers as anything else, and you will wear your waders into even the best restaurants. You will bitch about how the out-of-staters are ruining everything, even though you were one recently. You will have NRA stickers on your truck, and will vote Republican religiously, even if the GOP candidate is a drooling idiot. The trout you catch will average 18 inches no matter how big they really were. You will start conversations with "Cold enough for you?" "Hot enough for you?" "Seen any salmonflies yet?" or "Got your elk yet?" depending on the season. I could keep this up all day. Just remember to get some 130 gr. bullets for your .270, and eat the parsley, because it’s the only vegetable you’re getting. Kevin, part-time Montanan
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Great, well written report Jeff damn…what’s this…quite a different feel… jeezusfuckingchri…(ok, i confess… i never was too good at keeping that particular commandment)… it was an honest 12" brookie (spec)- the biggest wild nc brook trout i’ve ever caught! fat, heavy, and healthy looking. what a day! fellas, seeing a 12" spec in nc is an experience
Congrats, beautiful fish! It may be the best Brookie you ever catch in NC! Willi
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When you return from the HF you’ll be changed slightly bruce h
… um…, uh oh. … not sure i catch yer drift there, pardner. trust that ain’t wayno-speak…unless, of course, "bruiser" is the descriptive pseudonym for a henry’s fork working lady, in which case, i bruise quite easily. <g however, just from looking at rw’s photos and some of the web sites for hf, i’m feeling a metamorphosis coming on already. looking forward to it all… jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
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Congrats, beautiful fish! It may be the best Brookie you ever catch in NC!
thanks…easily the "best" so far, although the ones wolfgang and i made acquaintance with up at the middle falls pool last october were pretty spec-tacular. … still, i plan to keep hunting for that next best one as long as i’m upright and forward moving. i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested? jeff
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Kevin wrote.Yep, before you know it. snip. Priceless…Thanks Kevin. Big Dale
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Congrats, beautiful fish! It may be the best Brookie you ever catch in NC! thanks…easily the "best" so far, although the ones wolfgang and i made acquaintance with up at the middle falls pool last october were pretty spec-tacular. … still, i plan to keep hunting for that next best one as long as i’m upright and forward moving. i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested? jeff
Does sound like a beautiful fish alright – I bet there’ll be a few more buggers and streamers in your future. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html
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Jeff – I’d like to join up on such an expedition if it was planned well in advance. It’s an all-day drive for me, like it probably is for you. I would make a several-day trip of it and combine two or three days on Hazel with some other fishing – maybe on the Tellico river downhill from McDaniel Bald or on one of the creeks in the Snowbird/Santeetlah area. Bob
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – //snip// i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested? jeff
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i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested?
i hear tell that there’s a unsavory rattlersnake worshippin’ coven up in those parts…. –waldo d;^)
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as you’ve probably heard, they’ve opened portions of hazel that have been closed to all fishing for 25 years – as an experiment to see if the fisherman actually affects the brook trout population in any meaningful way. i believe it is our duty to participate in this grand experiment … but, it will require at least 3 days. the hike in will be 6 hours at least… if there’s any interest, it’s time to start planning. i don’t know who is going where in october – zimbo floated a blue ridge gathering, i’ll be in the smokies with rachel the week of oct. 20. anyway, let me know if you’ve got a preference as far as dates and we’ll see what develops. jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Jeff – I’d like to join up on such an expedition if it was planned well in advance. It’s an all-day drive for me, like it probably is for you. I would make a several-day trip of it and combine two or three days on Hazel with some other fishing – maybe on the Tellico river downhill from McDaniel Bald or on one of the creeks in the Snowbird/Santeetlah area. Bob //snip// i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested? jeff
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Question:
I would like to find a canoe that will work as a boat to flyfish out of (small lake fishing). This means I HAVE TO be able to stand up in it. I also have to be able to carry it on top of my Jeep Wrangler. The canoe that has caught my eye is the Old Town Discovery 133k. I understand that this canoe has been around for some time so I should be able to pick up a used one for a reasonable price. I also want it to be able to be fit with oar locks. What price should I pay for this canoe used? new? What other canoes might suit my purpose better? I am also considering building some type of outriggers for it for added stability and a platform to fish/cast from. Any advice on this? Thank you, Paul P.S. Besided the classifieds, which I’m watching closely, does anyone have an idea of a good place to find a used canoe. I live about 2 hours north of Seattle.
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I would like to find a canoe that will work as a boat to flyfish out of (small lake fishing). This means I HAVE TO be able to stand up in it. snip< Thank you, Paul
Dear Paul; I don’t mean to pick, no not at all, but to be fair to you and to the potential craft, I would recommend that if you need< to stand up to cast, you should work on your casting technique. I won’t go into it here, but you really should be able to cast sitting down, yeah, you can’t cast as far< sitting down, but you can sure cast safer.
luv chipper
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I would like to find a canoe that will work as a boat to flyfish out of (small lake fishing). This means I HAVE TO be able to stand up in it. snip< Thank you, Paul
Paul, I think it’s Mad River, but they used to make several boats ( the winooski comes ito my foggy mind here) that were "really wide as hell". I think they had a 15 foot boat that was like 60" wide at midship. It was really stable. But then again, it was really interesting to paddle. I sat in the middle, and leaned it over like Mason would have done, and it spun on a dime, but with 4 feet of boat sticking up in the air, it really caught the wind too. You know, this might actually be an application for one of those rigs that have an extended thwart that sticks out either side of your boat, and has a flotation bag on each end. Like a Hawaiian boat, only you have two. You could dance a jig on one of those things. Still, If I can stand up in a dragonfly and fish, you can stand up in one of those things. I stand up sometimes in my Blue hole when fishing, and with a ton of gear in the thing, it’s really stable. I dunno, shouldn’t be a problem whatever you decide to do. Good Luck. Dale http://www.inlink.com/~dailu/ http://www.inlink.com/~dailu/intergear.html
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would like to find a canoe that will work as a boat to flyfish out of (small lake fishing). This means I HAVE TO be able to stand up in it. snip< Thank you, Paul Dear Paul; I don’t mean to pick, no not at all, but to be fair to you and to the potential craft, I would recommend that if you need< to stand up to cast, you should work on your casting technique. I won’t go into it here, but you really should be able to cast sitting down, yeah, you can’t cast as far< sitting down, but you can sure cast safer. chipper
Thank you for being helpful and posting a follow up to my question, however I am still looking for an answer. I know that my post is only a day old, but I don’t want Chipper’s interjection to be viewed as a conclussion to my question. Please refer to the original post and present your answers according to it. In case the original post wasn’t clear I’m interested in a canoe that is stable enough so I can stand up in it while flycasting. This is the main requirement for the canoe. Meanwhile I will ponder Chipper’s recommendation. Thank you Paul
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Standing in a canoe is something that only takes practice and is not particularly dangerous – in spite of what the Red Cross canoeing course has said for many years. I’ll be teaching some local scouts the skill later this summer, and hope to have canoe poling officially recognised by the BSA in the next few years. Here in Maine, standing and poling a canoe is common practice. The rivers get pretty low late in the year, and it’s just plain fun. I don’t have any specific canoe recommendation, because any shallow arch, flat bottom or shallow V hull will work. I have stood in and fly casted in dozens of canoes, including Discovery’s 169 and 174, Grummans, Old Town 15-20 foot wood canvas canoes in many models, EM White Guide, Miller (from NB, Canada), Chestnut Prospector, Jerry Stelmok’s Willow (a tender 13 foot W/C canoe) and more. It’s a wonderful way to reduce the glare off the water and with practice is not at all dangerous. What you might consider is getting into a canoe with a setting pole (12 foot or so) and just pushing yourself around off the bottom for a while. If you can get some poling instruction (there’s a class in Maine in June) that’s even better. The trick is to feel comfortable standing in the canoe, even if the canoe moves around under you. Once you have this down – you can walk around in many canoes and be perfectly safe. My 20 foot Old Town Guide has been named "The Enterprise" by my wife, because she’s as big and stable as an aircraft carrier (not my wife, teh canoe). My kids regularly change ends by standing up and walking one end to the other – stepping or crawling over the gear pile in the middle. -Tim — Tim Hewitt – Webmaster Wooden Canoe Heritage Association, Ltd http://www.wcha.org
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I would like to find a canoe that will work as a boat to flyfish out of (small lake fishing). This means I HAVE TO be able to stand up in it.
Mike: I too flyfish out of my canoe quite a bit and like to stand a little. Can’t afford a strictly FF boat though so I just settle for my Mad River Explorer. I think you should be aware that at least some canoe manufacturers (such as Mad River) are honest and don’t try to pretend that every boat they make is suitable for every activity under the sun, but then use differing pictures or euphemisms to hint to you what it’s best use is. Thus, Mad River talks in terms of boats with good "initial stability" and those with good "secondary" stability. Get one of their catalogs and 802-496-3127). I believe this distinction is a valid one. It seems to me there are two different styles canoe bottoms come in: flattish and deep vee. Of course there are all degrees of in-between. What you find in those towards the flattish end of the scale is that they feel very stable initially; i.e. you put some weight towards one side and the boat does not rock that way very much. The problem with these boats is that they are not very good for traveling far; they paddle like tubs, are susceptible to wind, etc., AND (a very important AND you will quickly grasp once in one), while they have such good "initial" stability once you put just a little too much weight towards one side, when they start to flip THEY REALLY GO. Suddenly. With little warning. Ass over elbows. On the other end of the spectrum the boats with deep vees tend to "feel" less stable. A little shift to the side and you feel it right away. BUT: you can continue putting weight towards the side and its a far more gradual thing than the flatter-bottomed boats. This is "secondary" stability. If you truly are willing to buy a boat that has just one use such as FF, you can go quite far to one end of the spectrum and feel very happy. I know that the Mad River "Winooski" is a very flat-bottomed, wide boat. Other mfg.s undoubtedly have models that are similar in approach. Mad River doubtlessly also has other boats that tend toward the flat-bottomed end of the spectrum. Again, their catalog is excellent in describing these things generally and specifically for each of the boats they sell. Hope this helps; please know that I am not shilling for Mad River here and have no interest in the company other than as a consumer. (Though I do think they are a great company; they have treated me fantastically as a consumer.) I just bought an Old Town "Pack" model canoe. A little solo 12 footer, for portaging into little trout lakes to fish up in Canada. If I had really wanted what you want I would have gone with the Winooski but I liked the weight of the Pack model (33 lbs.) and the price. Don’t know yet if its stable enough for your needs, and, of course, if you intend on fishing with more than one person in the thing the Pack is not the way to go. I would say this, while you may be strongly drawn to a very flat bottomed boat and may have the luxury of needing/wanting nothing with more versatility you might want to go to a retailer on a lake/stream and at least try out
