Question:

I am a beginner at fly fishing (Boy, what fun??). Among the many questions that I have is about a creel. How is it used, do you just put a freshly caught fish in the creel, or what?

Response:

A creel is simply a basket to hold freshly caught fish, instead of putting them on a stringer. I’ll assume you’re talking about wicker creels (the weaved wooden kind.)  If you’re going to use a creel, it’s a good idea to put a layer of damp moss in it, to keep the fish cool and to keep it from drying out. I’ve read before that people even stick a layer of moss between each fish, to keep them fresh. you can either wear the creel with the help of a shoulder strap, or leave it on the bank until you need it (the latter would be easier on your shoulder, but it would mean slogging back to the bank when you wanted to keep a fish. I don’t think there’s too many guys still carrying a creel as an every-day piece of tackle, as many fly fishers have adopted the habit of catch & release fishing, only keeping fish every once in a while to eat. Again, to answer your question tho, the creel is just a basket to keep your fish in, instead of using a stringer. I’ve read that fish kept in a creel are usually better eating (better flavor) than those kept on a stringer. Creel is also a bit more convenient to carry than a stringer when you’re packing the fish out, as the creel is worn much like a ladie’s purse (or duffel bag, if you really need a macho example) instead of carrying it out in your hand. Hope this info is some help to you. PS…you don’t sound very enthused about taking up flyfishing, is there anything you’re confused about or need help with?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am a beginner at fly fishing (Boy, what fun??). Among the many questions that I have is about a creel. How is it used, do you just put a freshly caught fish in the creel, or what?

Response:

A creel is simply a basket to hold freshly caught fish,

        a very wise man once said that "guilt replaced the creel"… wayno

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        a very wise man once said that "guilt replaced the creel"… wayno

No, I’m pretty sure that it was Tbone… Kevin

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          a very wise man once said that "guilt replaced the creel"… wayno No, I’m pretty sure that it was Tbone…

Yes, it was TBone.  The wise man was the one who said "guilt debased the meal" <g — Warren Findley Remove (nospamZZ) to respond via email http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt/

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   a very wise man once said that "guilt replaced the creel"…

I thought it was a "quilt" that replaced the creel? Don’t tell me I was reading that wrong, it makes even *less* sense your way. <g — Charlie…

Response:

I am a beginner at fly fishing (Boy, what fun??). Among the many questions that I have is about a creel. How is it used, do you just put a freshly caught fish in the creel, or what?

Reed: Having come up with the "Old Men" who were still of a mind set that it was OK, even expected to "keep" the fish you caught I have a lot of experience with the wicker creel. Commonly it was lined with cedar fronds that were first wet in the river in which you were fishing thus keeping your catch cool. A fresh set of fronds was added as the creel recieved "layers" of fish. The fish was ALWAYS gutted and gilled first. The old guys commonly cut open their first fish (yep even if undersized) to examine stomach contents. Over the years my wickers were replaced with canvas. Then the canvas was left behind as fish became scarcer and privacy on the river became almost non-existant. Now the only fish I keep from the river are usually too badly injured to release with good survival chances. There is the infrequent meal when Fish are abundant. These then fit in my pouch nicely. My wickers now serve as traveling tackle boxes while spin fishing. For that they work freaking great! Especially while wading. The shoulder strap when used, goes (if wearing the creel on the right side) over the right shoulder, and then the body strap circles the torso and holds the shoulder strap in proper position. In general though creels went out of style and use just about the time when I finally figured out how to make one.  Figures! Mostly they are just a romantic and nostalgic accessory that sees little use these days. Buy some other piece of equipment instead. Something like a nice streamer wallet (also somewhat out of style but very classy), a couple of good braided butt leaders, or perhaps a nice tippet caddy. I would buy a nice streamside light for those times (everytime I am out) when you fish in the dusky dusk. These would see more use and provide more enjoyment. You could even buy some tying materials and REALLY get the bug. Tight Lines M. Wm.

Response:

I am a beginner at fly fishing (Boy, what fun??). Among the many questions that I have is about a creel. How is it used, do you just put a freshly caught fish in the creel, or what?

He must know all there is to know about creels…

Response:

        a very wise man once said that "guilt replaced the creel"… wayno No, I’m pretty sure that it was Tbone…

LMAO!

Response:

          a very wise man once said that "guilt replaced the creel"… wayno No, I’m pretty sure that it was Tbone… Yes, it was TBone.  The wise man was the one who said "guilt debased the meal" <g

First, I’m articulate, and now THIS!  I’m starting to worry about you Warren.     Wolfgang who is beginning to feel embarrassed by the actions of the thiasus

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Thanks for the replies. I have been fishing for bluegills and other panfish. I do beleive in catch and release, but there are times that I want to keep a few for supper.

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First, I’m articulate, and now THIS!  I’m starting to worry about you Warren.    

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I thought it was a "quilt" that replaced the creel? Don’t tell me I was reading that wrong, it makes even *less* sense your way. <g

Quilts can be bulky, and a wet quilt can weigh a ton. OTOH, a forked stick can do a pretty good job. Seriously, creels are nice to have. I feel naked without one. The wicker jobs are classic, but the canvas ones are more practical and less prone to damage. If you’re keeping a fish, kill it and field dress it ASAP, and put in in the creel. As it says, keep well soaked while in use. this will keep your catch cool and fresh. Now the sermon: Don’t keep a fish unless the stream can handle some harvest, and you intend to actually eat the fish, rather than letting it slowly rot in the fridge. Even when I don’t intend to keep anything, I’ll often use it as a streamside beer cooler. The looks you get on C&R water with a dripping, laden Polar Creel can be priceless. — Rusty Hook Laramie, Wyoming

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Question:

I’m relatively new to Colorado — but I’ve been flyfishing for some 16 years now (finally getting decent . I’m interested in finding some fishing partners and/or perhaps getting an informal fishing club going? I know about TU, but I’m looking more for a small group that would like to get together once or twice a month and swap fish tales and organize outings…… any interest? Or any groups like this out there?

–

Response:

check out the FEderation of Flyfisher’s website.  They have links to local clubs you can check into.  Click the link for FFF clubs and look under "by state" for Colorado. http://www.fedflyfishers.org Best of luck – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m relatively new to Colorado — but I’ve been flyfishing for some 16 years now (finally getting decent . I’m interested in finding some fishing partners and/or perhaps getting an informal fishing club going? I know about TU, but I’m looking more for a small group that would like to get together once or twice a month and swap fish tales and organize outings…… any interest? Or any groups like this out there? —

Response:

Sorry there was a typo in my instructions.  It should be by region, not by state. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – check out the FEderation of Flyfisher’s website.  They have links to local clubs you can check into.  Click the link for FFF clubs and look under "by state" for Colorado. http://www.fedflyfishers.org Best of luck I’m relatively new to Colorado — but I’ve been flyfishing for some 16 years now (finally getting decent . I’m interested in finding some fishing partners and/or perhaps getting an informal fishing club going? I know about TU, but I’m looking more for a small group that would like to get together once or twice a month and swap fish tales and organize outings…… any interest? Or any groups like this out there? —

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Question:

I am going to try my hand at some Salmon fishing this year.  A friend of mine recommended that I get some running line for my reel.  He says that you can split in in half and make two running lines.  Questions:  1) Is this true?  2) What are the properties of a running line and what makes it different than other conventional fly lines? 3) Reputable brands?  Thank you in advance.

Response:

I am going to try my hand at some Salmon fishing this year.  A friend of mine recommended that I get some running line for my reel.  He says that you can split in in half and make two running lines.  Questions:  1) Is this true?  2) What are the properties of a running line and what makes it different than other conventional fly lines? 3) Reputable brands?  Thank you

Your friend may have meant to recommend backing, e.g. 30 lb. test braided dacron, to fill up the fly reel under the fly line.  This is needed for strong fish like salmon which may take out more line than the 30-35 yards of the fly line. "Running line" used to be sold by Scientific Anglers (perhaps still is) and was a thin level fly line (0.029 inches diameter) used by people who liked to splice their own tapers, e.g. with a shooting head.  (British reservoir anglers used to use heavy mono for both backing and running line.  Perhaps 20 years ago British mono curled less than American.) — |        Carlsbad Springs, Ottawa, Canada        |

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Question:

I am looking for some new leader formulas for dry fly fishing. I want a 16-18 ft overall leader with tippit ( I use a long tippet, about 31/2 to 4 ft). I am fishing a 3 wt and 4 wt line at the present. Any suggestions? George

Response:

http://globalflyfisher.com/fishbetter/leadercalc/index.html It might take awhile to digest, but there is an interesting leader formula program in there. Regards, Jeff

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Question:

Its not a fishing pole case its ROD ARMOR Sleek, Small, custom crafted to size to perfectly match your favorite gear. 30 % lighter than PVC yet way stronger, The armor has a 3% deflection under a 4,000 pound load.You can drive over it with your truck without damaging your rods.  Now equipt with our ISP ( Inflatable Stabilization System ) and optional SMART CHIP (micro chip ) Recovery System Your rods aresafe from the hazards of life  in the armor , Protect your Gear. See it & buy it at www.rod-armor.com

Response:

Its not a fishing pole case its ROD ARMOR Sleek, Small, custom crafted to size to perfectly match your favorite gear. 30 % lighter than PVC yet way stronger, The armor has a 3% deflection under a 4,000 pound load.You can drive over it with your truck without damaging your rods. Now equipt with our ISP ( Inflatable Stabilization System ) and optional SMART CHIP (micro chip ) Recovery System Your rods aresafe from the hazards of life  in the armor , Protect your Gear. See it & buy it at www.rod-armor.com

OK, this seems pretty decent, but why the Smart Chip stuff?  If it has a label and all, why a microchip?

Response:

"David Kirk" wrote Your rods aresafe from the hazards of life  in the armor , Protect your Gear. See it & buy it at www.rod-armor.com

Yes, those are impressive rod tubes. And the irony of the fact that the tube is nicer than any fly rod I own isn’t lost on me either. –Steve

Response:

OK, this seems pretty decent, but why the Smart Chip stuff?  If it has a label and all, why a microchip?

Same reason Hillary and her Social Democrats want V-chips in TV and implanted in our children; THEY WANT TO CONTROL FLY FISHING!!!! — Wayne To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

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(greedy snivle snipped) BTW David, a one time post of a site announcement of material offered in the commercial vein will not draw much criticism. This description was ALMOST too lengthy to dis-qualify as SPAM.  Just a friendly heads- up to prevent some overzealous individual refering to you as SOME GODDAMN SPAMMING ASSHOLE trying to SPAM a discussion group with UN- SOLICITED ADVERTISING aka. SPAM! — Wayne (sitting next to TEAM SPAM while watching "The Patriot") To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

Response:

Its not a fishing pole case its ROD ARMOR Sleek, Small, custom crafted to size to perfectly match your favorite gear. 30 % lighter than PVC yet way stronger, The armor has a 3% deflection under a 4,000 pound load.You can drive over it with your truck without damaging your rods. Now equipt with our ISP (Inflatable Stabilization System) and optional SMART CHIP (micro chip ) Recovery System your rods are safe from the hazards of life  in the armor , Protect your Gear. See it & buy it at www.rod-armor.com

SPAM.  Definitely SPAM. Will it protect me from Canadian Black Bears, too? Tom happy with the aluminum rod tube that doubles as a walking stick and occassional brush beater Before you buy.

Response:

OK, this seems pretty decent, but why the Smart Chip stuff?  If it has a label and all, why a microchip? Same reason Hillary and her Social Democrats want V-chips in TV and implanted in our children; THEY WANT TO CONTROL FLY FISHING!!!!

Well that’s just charming…what’s next with these people?  10-fly books and boxes?  No hook keepers?  Background checks on backpack rods? Maybe if we toss ‘em Gerkoff and those FisherFin-thing people ala S and W, it will hold ‘em off a while. <G R – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Wayne To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

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Question:

>From: Gidget >urf wrote: >> Speaking and acting with love in one’s heart for others is an ideal that I >> would follow to the extent that I am able to. >I wouldn’t go that far.  The love in my heart is reserved for those who’ve >earned it for whatever reason.  But speaking and acting with compassion and >respect for others is, to me, a very reasonable ideal.

Ditto.  This goes back to the thread on what we need.  I think that when others are treated respectfully, it is not necessarily coming from a place of love…moreso from a place of caring. No bird soars too high, if he soars with his own wings. -William Blake

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>Minus 10 points for political correctness…

You butt. ) No bird soars too high, if he soars with his own wings. -William Blake

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Speaking and acting with love in one’s heart for others is an ideal that I would follow to the extent that I am able to. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Oceanmomma wrote in message <19990309112015.28004.00000…@ng134.aol.com>… >>From: urf <nos…@erols.com> >>Judgment is unavoidable. People have opinions and should be able to >>express them. There should be no "political correctness" here. No one >>should say anything they don’t mean to gain favor. The one thing I >>have trouble with is condemnation. >>But I’m not condemning anyone for that. >I agree that people should be able to express their opinion.  If they choose to >do it disrespectfully, or judgmentally, that speaks loudly of who they are. >There is a difference between being politically correct and just showing some >plain old respect.  Why not speak to members of this group as lovingly as one >would speak to their spouse?  Doesn’t all personkind deserve respect?  Or does >it only apply at home? >No bird soars too high, if he soars with his own wings. >-William Blake

Response:

Semantics again. The people with whom I disagree are "judgmental". The people with whom I agree are "insightful". Or so it seems to me. — Sourdough sez: "We would worry a lot less about what other people think of us, if we realized how seldom they do." Oceanmomma wrote in message

<19990308203922.14376.00003…@ng18.aol.com>… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>From: urf <nos…@erols.com> >>I agree, Gidget. One should be free to say anything without fear here. >I agree Urf.  It would be really nice if there were an atmosphere of >non-judgement.  However, the reality is that there is plenty of judgement in >here. >And please let’s not get started on what reality is  Pretty please???? >No bird soars too high, if he soars with his own wings. >-William Blake

Response:

urf wrote: > Speaking and acting with love in one’s heart for others is an ideal that I > would follow to the extent that I am able to.

I wouldn’t go that far.  The love in my heart is reserved for those who’ve earned it for whatever reason.  But speaking and acting with compassion and respect for others is, to me, a very reasonable ideal.

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Nobody wrote: > Gidget, I agree 100%.  I think its a troll, but the guy sounds like > he’s into power games.  I also would guess that his wife is mildly > interested in the power games as well, seeing that she responded > with the "Yes, Master" he wanted to hear instead of, "Shove it, > you fool."  There are a lot more people into the power game thing > than you might think.

Not only that, but I have a hard time believing that this guy all of a sudden woke up one day and decided he wanted his wife to go w/o underwear or play kinky sex games. This kind of thing, if the person is interested, would be kind of difficult to conceal for 29 years of marriage.

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Gidget, Then what does it make them? I’m curious as to how you would characterize them. Arnie In article <36E3BE68.9EF8…@hotmail.com>, Gidget – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -<gidgetoli…@hotmail.com> wrote: > He does sound trollish, but the truth is… a husband that wants his wife to go > without underwear or wants to be called "Master", is not all that bizarre.  Lots > of people have some kind of fetish that they like to indulge in, and while their > practices may seem "weird" to you and me, it hardly makes them "sick > motherfuckers."

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Arnie wrote: > Gidget, > Then what does it make them? I’m curious as to how you would characterize them.

Assuming the original poster is not just a foolish troll… I would characterize him as a person with a fetish (the desire for his mate to go w/o underwear) and a taste for "alternative" sexual practices (the dominance/submission games).

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In article <36E3BE68.9EF8…@hotmail.com>,   Gidget <gidgetoli…@hotmail.com> wrote: > Lots of people have some kind of fetish that they like to indulge in, and > while their practices may seem "weird" to you and me, it hardly makes them >"sick motherfuckers."

If an individual had an Oedipus complex and they followed through on their feeling then I think that they would qualify.  Dont you Gidget? garyz We cannot direct the wind but we can adjust the sails. ———–== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==———- http://www.dejanews.com/       Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own    

Response:

ga…@my-dejanews.com wrote: > If an individual had an Oedipus complex and they followed through on their > feeling then I think that they would qualify.  Dont you Gidget?

Obviously… so would a pedophile.

Response:

C’mon, now!  What goes on between ‘consenting adults’ is none of our business! Really, I’m kidding. Amused – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -ga…@my-dejanews.com wrote in message <7c1cs5$nj…@nnrp1.dejanews.com>… >In article <36E3BE68.9EF8…@hotmail.com>, >  Gidget <gidgetoli…@hotmail.com> wrote: >> Lots of people have some kind of fetish that they like to indulge in, and >> while their practices may seem "weird" to you and me, it hardly makes them >>"sick motherfuckers." >If an individual had an Oedipus complex and they followed through on their >feeling then I think that they would qualify.  Dont you Gidget? >garyz >We cannot direct the wind but we can adjust the sails. >———–== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==———- >http://www.dejanews.com/       Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own

Response:

I agree, Gidget. One should be free to say anything without fear here. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Gidget wrote: > Gail Warnings wrote: > > I really hope this is a troll, not just some sick motherfucker who likes to > > do weird things to some woman who is probably 60 years old.  This reminds me > > of the rape guy– and not in a good way. > He does sound trollish, but the truth is… a husband that wants his wife to go > without underwear or wants to be called "Master", is not all that bizarre.  Lots > of people have some kind of fetish that they like to indulge in, and while their > practices may seem "weird" to you and me, it hardly makes them "sick > motherfuckers."

Response:

Judgment is unavoidable. People have opinions and should be able to express them. There should be no "political correctness" here. No one should say anything they don’t mean to gain favor. The one thing I have trouble with is condemnation. But I’m not condemning anyone for that. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Oceanmomma wrote: > >From: urf <nos…@erols.com> > >I agree, Gidget. One should be free to say anything without fear here. > I agree Urf.  It would be really nice if there were an atmosphere of > non-judgement.  However, the reality is that there is plenty of judgement in > here. > And please let’s not get started on what reality is  Pretty please???? > No bird soars too high, if he soars with his own wings. > -William Blake

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Minus 10 points for political correctness… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Oceanmomma wrote in message <19990309112015.28004.00000…@ng134.aol.com>… >Doesn’t all personkind deserve respect

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>From: urf <nos…@erols.com> >Judgment is unavoidable. People have opinions and should be able to >express them. There should be no "political correctness" here. No one >should say anything they don’t mean to gain favor. The one thing I >have trouble with is condemnation. >But I’m not condemning anyone for that.

I agree that people should be able to express their opinion.  If they choose to do it disrespectfully, or judgmentally, that speaks loudly of who they are. There is a difference between being politically correct and just showing some plain old respect.  Why not speak to members of this group as lovingly as one would speak to their spouse?  Doesn’t all personkind deserve respect?  Or does it only apply at home? No bird soars too high, if he soars with his own wings. -William Blake

Response:

Did he also have a diamond in his belly button? lol – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Amused wrote: > I saw him last week living under a bridge, eating Billy-goats and fly > fishing. > Amused > Gail Warnings wrote in message <7buhgj$o6…@camel18.mindspring.com>… > >Richard Terry wrote in message <7bu94a$6i…@ash.prod.itd.earthlink.net>… > >.  I want my wife to stop wearing > >>underwear.  I positively had bras and for a time hid all her bras and made > >>her wear bralettes, which provide minimum support and maximum view. > >>I’ve told her that when our youngest son (a senior in high school) goes to > >>college I want her to go around the house without clothes.  .  It turns me > >on to think of > >>inflicting mild pain on my wife.  I have wrist restraints that I just > >bought > >>that I would like to use and a riding crop that I bought in hopes of tying > >>her up after a few weeks post op rest as well as nipple clamps.  I don’t > >>really want to hurt her, it just turns me on for her to be submissive. > >I really hope this is a troll, not just some sick motherfucker who likes to > >do weird things to some woman who is probably 60 years old.  This reminds > me > >of the rape guy– and not in a good way. > >Gail

Response:

>From: urf <nos…@erols.com> >I agree, Gidget. One should be free to say anything without fear here.

I agree Urf.  It would be really nice if there were an atmosphere of non-judgement.  However, the reality is that there is plenty of judgement in here. And please let’s not get started on what reality is  Pretty please???? No bird soars too high, if he soars with his own wings. -William Blake

Response:

Call Dr. Popoola.  He helped you before according to your other posting in alt.support.obesity. _____________________________________________________________________ Rich here.  10 months ago I weighed 300 pounds, today 3/1/99 I weight 207. After years of trying to diet I finally realized that my weight problem did not have to do with lack of will power, but a genetic problem passed down from generation to generation. Dr. Dapo Popoola, of the Surgilite Medical Group of North Hollywood, CA. performed a Vertical Ring Gastric Bypass on me and since that day my entire life has changed.  I was diabetic, I am no longer diabetic.  While I am still hypertensive I have cut my medications in half.  I am healther than I have ever been running up to 18 miles a week and doing a full body work out 3 days a week.  If you’re interested in knowing more, I have created a website for Surgilite at surgilite.hypermart.net and you can find out whatever your need to know by visiting that site.  Goodluck. ______________________________________________________ garyz Never mistake motion for action. –Ernest Hemingway ———–== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==———- http://www.dejanews.com/       Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own    

Response:

"Richard Terry" <rwte…@earthlink.net> wrote: >Short of going to a psychiatrist I am looking for some help.  Perhpas this >is the place.  Please bear with me as I explain.

Richard, It sounds like you’re going to need that psychiatrist.  It doesn’t sound like your wife is into these sex games you are playing.  If she isn’t,  you need help and plenty of it.

Response:

Gail Warnings wrote: > I really hope this is a troll, not just some sick motherfucker who likes to > do weird things to some woman who is probably 60 years old.  This reminds me > of the rape guy– and not in a good way.

He does sound trollish, but the truth is… a husband that wants his wife to go without underwear or wants to be called "Master", is not all that bizarre.  Lots of people have some kind of fetish that they like to indulge in, and while their practices may seem "weird" to you and me, it hardly makes them "sick motherfuckers."

Response:

Richard Terry wrote in message <7bu94a$6i…@ash.prod.itd.earthlink.net>…

.  I want my wife to stop wearing >underwear.  I positively had bras and for a time hid all her bras and made >her wear bralettes, which provide minimum support and maximum view. >I’ve told her that when our youngest son (a senior in high school) goes to >college I want her to go around the house without clothes.  .  It turns me on to think of >inflicting mild pain on my wife.  I have wrist restraints that I just bought >that I would like to use and a riding crop that I bought in hopes of tying >her up after a few weeks post op rest as well as nipple clamps.  I don’t >really want to hurt her, it just turns me on for her to be submissive.

I really hope this is a troll, not just some sick motherfucker who likes to do weird things to some woman who is probably 60 years old.  This reminds me of the rape guy– and not in a good way. Gail

Response:

I saw him last week living under a bridge, eating Billy-goats and fly fishing. Amused – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Gail Warnings wrote in message <7buhgj$o6…@camel18.mindspring.com>… >Richard Terry wrote in message <7bu94a$6i…@ash.prod.itd.earthlink.net>… >.  I want my wife to stop wearing >>underwear.  I positively had bras and for a time hid all her bras and made >>her wear bralettes, which provide minimum support and maximum view. >>I’ve told her that when our youngest son (a senior in high school) goes to >>college I want her to go around the house without clothes.  .  It turns me >on to think of >>inflicting mild pain on my wife.  I have wrist restraints that I just >bought >>that I would like to use and a riding crop that I bought in hopes of tying >>her up after a few weeks post op rest as well as nipple clamps.  I don’t >>really want to hurt her, it just turns me on for her to be submissive. >I really hope this is a troll, not just some sick motherfucker who likes to >do weird things to some woman who is probably 60 years old.  This reminds me >of the rape guy– and not in a good way. >Gail

Response:

Gidget wrote: > He does sound trollish, but the truth is… a husband that wants his wife to go > without underwear or wants to be called "Master", is not all that bizarre.  Lots > of people have some kind of fetish that they like to indulge in, and while their > practices may seem "weird" to you and me, it hardly makes them "sick > motherfuckers."

Gidget, I agree 100%.  I think its a troll, but the guy sounds like he’s into power games.  I also would guess that his wife is mildly interested in the power games as well, seeing that she responded with the "Yes, Master" he wanted to hear instead of, "Shove it, you fool."  There are a lot more people into the power game thing than you might think. Drew

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Short of going to a psychiatrist I am looking for some help.  Perhpas this is the place.  Please bear with me as I explain. I have been married to the same woman for 29 years.  I love her beyond words, but for 29 years we have struggled with a problem that seems to be getting worse and I need some objective input for disinterested third parties.  So here goes. As I said I love my wife, but I have a desire to control her, Oh, not in the conventional way.  I want her to have her own live, but I want to control what she wears under her clothes.  My wife says I just want to control her, if so, after you read this tell me so.  I want my wife to stop wearing underwear.  I positively had bras and for a time hid all her bras and made her wear bralettes, which provide minimum support and maximum view.  She is getting read to have a hysterectomy and after the surgery I do not want her to wear panties any more.  It turns me on to think of my wife, out in public, without underwear.  I’ve never asked her to do anything that she would consider immoral, only that she not wear underwear. On occasions she has gone without a bra, and several yeas ago, on one of our anniverseries, she went without bra and panties and I can’t describe how it made me feel.  I have a strong sex drive, but she does not.  I want sex every night, she wants it every week or month (I’m no exaggerating).  I dream about her every night. I dream about her being naked in front of other men and women and being ordered to allow the men to make love to her to for her to provide oral sex to the women. I’ve told her that when our youngest son (a senior in high school) goes to college I want her to go around the house without clothes.  I don’t want sex 24/7 I just like to look at my wife’s beautiful body. I do have one other "hang up" if you please.  It turns me on to think of inflicting mild pain on my wife.  I have wrist restraints that I just bought that I would like to use and a riding crop that I bought in hopes of tying her up after a few weeks post op rest as well as nipple clamps.  I don’t really want to hurt her, it just turns me on for her to be submissive. Last night we had a fight, afterwards I ordered her to remove all her clothes and as I made love to her I told her that she was to address me, at all times with "Yes, Sir" and when it was just she and I she was to address me as "Master".  I can’t begin to tell you how it turned me on when I asked "Do you understand what I’m saying" and she replied "Yes master." I love my wife and want help. After love making I feel so guilty.  I don’t want to hurt her, but at the same time I get so turned on by her submissiveness.  Does anyone have any suggestions that might help me to control my passions and range.   Please reply to me privately and not on this list because I need to hear from you as soon as possible. thanx for listening, I hope you can help. RWT mailto:rwte…@earthlink.net

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Question:

Anybody know of a lure resembling a Cicada (cyclical locust)?  Is there a company that might be able to custom-make such a device? — Ellard Douglas Imagine if time was logarithmic, and we were just living an exponential existence!                   Timothy D. Kuehn Comments made by Ellard Douglas do not represent the policies of CMS. By US Code Title 47, Sec.227(a)(2)(B), a computer/modem/printer meet the definition of a telephone fax machine.  By Sec.227(b)(1)(C), it is unlawful to send any unsolicited advertisement to such equipment, punishable by action to recover actual monetary loss, or $500, whichever is greater, for each violation.

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There is a lure called a Cicada made by Reef Runner Lure Co. It works quite well ! Look fer it in  Bass Pro Shops or Cabela’s catalogs.

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If you are into fly fishing, try a big muddler minnow & add floatant. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There is a lure called a Cicada made by Reef Runner Lure Co. It works quite well ! Look fer it in  Bass Pro Shops or Cabela’s catalogs.

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Question:

The Beaverkill is in need of urgent help from those who Love to Fly Fish. I went last year and the fishing was lousy but I can see why it is the most notorious fishery in the world. The Orvis company and the National Fish and Wildlife Foundation will match your donation to the Local Trout Unlimited for this effort. IT IS A 2 TO 1 MATCH If you donate $10.00 dollars they make it $30.00 Not Bad Make all checks  Payable to: Trout Unlimited/Beaverkill Restoration Project Mail to Orvis Route 7A Manchester, VT 05254 Department RS Thanks for the support of our waterways Bob Burbage

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The Beaverkill is in need of urgent help from those who Love to Fly Fish. I went last year and the fishing was lousy but I can see why it is the most notorious fishery in the world.

A lot of this had to do with the damage done from the big freeze-thaw last January.  That was merely nature doing it’s work and it’s likely that nature will take it’s course and the fishery will improve. The Orvis company and the National Fish and Wildlife Foundation will match your donation to the Local Trout Unlimited for this effort.

Details snipped.  Since I consider the Beaverkill one of my near home waters this article had some interest. However, before sending in a check I’d like to know exactly how this money is going to be spent.  

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I wish it was merely nature doing it’s work last January. However, after the flood, the NY DEC indiscriminately handed out hundreds of permits to landowners for "stream improvements" to "correct" the flood damage to many streams in the Catskills, including many that feed the Beaverkill and both branches of the Delaware River. These ignorant people bulldozed many of these important feeders and did infinitely more damage than the flood. The DEC was totally negligent in not monitoring much of this destruction. Nature will take it’s course, but I’m not convinced that the fishery will improve for many years to come. For more info on this, see the latest issue of Trout Unlimited’s Trout magazine. That article is enough to make a grown man cry.  

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Question:

There is a fly tying cd (perhaps 2) available in both Mac and PC-compatible format (but not necessarily the same cd). Anyway, has anyone know of or have seen a reputable mail order firm that offers these at a discount? — dept of math/cs ut martin

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There is a fly tying cd (perhaps 2) available in both Mac and PC-compatible format (but not necessarily the same cd). Anyway, has anyone know of or have seen a reputable mail order firm that offers these at a discount?

Hi Jim I think the CD you are looking for is Tying Flies for Trout by Dick Stewart and Farrow Allen.  It’s available through Bob Mariotts at 800-535-6633 (orders) or 800-367-2299 (fax orders).  Also get his catalog, it’s the most incredible catalog/information source you’ll ever see. Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (96 catalog)

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Question:

Recent posts on this and other locations have brought out some of the worst of those in our sport who have senselessly criticised equipment of particular brands and the anglers who use whatever happens to be on the "hit list." Two recent posts from another location provide a nice response, and I repeat them here: #1 Never feel that you have to apologize to anyone for the equipment you use. Most of the howlers are cheapskates who wouldn’t know a good rod if someone beat them over the head with it anyway, and they certainly don’t recognize that a good expensive rod is an investment in a lifetime (with reasonable care) of pleasure on the stream." #2 "If some people don’t like Orvis–so what? Think for yourself and do your own thing.  Owning Orvis products has about as much to do with being a yuppie as owning Scott or Winston.  Besides, who the hell really cares if someone *does* label you or me or Joe Blow a yuppie. Small-minded people need to fixate on simple-minded, non-issues–just look at our gov’mint!" Lyman Hughes                                               Dallas, TX                                               Ennis, MT

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Recent posts on this and other locations have brought out some of the worst of those in our sport who have senselessly criticised equipment of particular brands and the anglers who use whatever happens to be on the "hit list." Two recent posts from another location provide a nice response, and I repeat them here: #1 Never feel that you have to apologize to anyone for the equipment you use. Most of the howlers are cheapskates who wouldn’t know

a good rod if someone beat them over the head with it anyway, and they certainly don’t recognize that a good expensive rod is an investment in a lifetime (with reasonable care) of pleasure on the stream." #2 "If some people don’t like Orvis–so what? Think for yourself and do your own thing.  Owning Orvis products has about as much to do with being a yuppie as owning Scott or Winston.  Besides, who the hell really cares if someone*does* label you or me or Joe Blow a yuppie. Small-minded people

need to fixate on simple-minded, non-issues–just look at our gov’mint!" Bravo! JL 8-Wt Editor

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To me, it does not matter whether you use an Orvis rod or a Diawa, all that really matters is whether you can catch "and release" fish!  Too many people get too esoteric about having the best equipment but why do you have to spend your all your money on equipment because Lefty Kreh has endorsed it?  I have some expensive equipment and I have cheap equipment and to tell you the truth, sometimes I can’t tell the difference. Remember, "A bad day of fishing is still better than a good day at work!" Tight Lines! Mark

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Re: whether you own an Orvis, etc…I’d be willing to bet a day’s pay that those "toy snobs" can’t cast their expensive trinkets worth a damned. And I bet they don’t fish more than 1 or 2 times a year, then only in perfectly calm, clear days.       In my past days as a professional photographer, I would listen to the same B.S. concerning cameras. You know, it’s not What you use, but HOW you use it that counts!    A cheap rod and cheap line fished properly will catch just as  many fish as the expensive stuff. It is technique and presentation that counts. The fish don’t give a damned if they are caught on a Winston or a Sears "special!"

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Most people use the best equipment they can afford, since it is almost always more enjoyable to use than something cheaper.  Why don’t most serious flyfishers by cheap rods and/or lines?  There is a difference, and you know it, so why be so negative? BTW, what kind of rod and line do you use, and what kind of camera did you use professionally? — Jim Benenson                 Los Alamos, New Mexico, USA "The commonplace is only the self-constructed wall that separates us from the marvelous"  Tom Brown, Jr.

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Begin Message—– snipped The fish don’t give a damned if they are caught on a Winston or a Sears "special!" snipped End Message ——- As I look through all of my spring fishing catalogs (Bean, Dan Bailey, Cabelas, Bass Pro, etc.)  I have to ask myself why a bait casting rod made out of IM6 graphite or any other new generation graphites costs 50% less than a fly rod made out of the same material.  I do not believe that the manufacturting processes are that disimilar. Some people might argue something about mandrels and tapers (I always thought that a mandrel was a baboon like primate).  But I really think that the prices are  high for fly rods simply because the market can bear it. BTW, Bass Pro has a good deal on some IM6 rods with a SA 2L reel for $179.00. I priced the reel elsewhere at $125.00. So its like getting an IM6 rod for $54.00.  I bought one last year when the combo sold for $169.00 and the rod is pretty nice casting (minor cosmetic imperfections in the varnishing and wrapping) My $0.02 Daern C. Valentine

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Begin Message—– snipped The fish don’t give a damned if they are caught on a Winston or a Sears "special!" snipped End Message ——- As I look through all of my spring fishing catalogs (Bean, Dan Bailey, Cabelas, Bass Pro, etc.)  I have to ask myself why a bait casting rod made out of IM6 graphite or any other new generation graphites costs 50% less than a fly rod made out of the same material.  I do not believe that the manufacturting processes are that disimilar. Some people might argue something about mandrels and tapers (I always thought that a mandrel was a baboon like primate).  But I really think that the prices are  high for fly rods simply because the market can bear it.

An experienced and honest angler will have to admit that a high-end rod, e.g., Scott, Sage, Winston, etc., just casts and "feels" better than an economy rod, e.g., Cabela’s, St. Croix, etc.  The latter rods can be great bargains, and there is no doubt that an accomplished fisher with a Cortland in hand will do better than a novice casting a T&T.  Clearly, technique is MUCH more important than equipment.  However, once you’ve reached a certain level of casting skill, you appreciate a well-made rod and it makes for a better fishing experience.  In addition, high-end rods just look nicer: There is more attention to design and they are finished better (as you point out, the rod you bought had "minor cosmetic imperfections").  For some people, like myself, this matters; for others, it may be totally irrelevant. There is no doubt that the markup on high-end rods is high.  But you have to consider that the production of many of these rods is extremely labor intensive.  Consider Scott, for example.  Scott matches tip sections to butt sections by hand, testing each butt with a variety of tips until the appropriate and desired  taper and flex pattern is achieved.  This is done for each rod individually. Many high-end rod companies (e.g., Sage) also put a lot of money into R&D trying to figure out what lengths, tapers, diameters, scrims, etc., are appropriate for various types of graphite and various line weights. All that said, it is certainly true that these rod companies know their market and are not shy about pricing their products. Comparing fly rods to spinning rods is unfair.  Don’t think that any two blanks made from IM6 (which, BTW, is second generation graphite and is about 5-6 years old now) are of equivalent quality and should be priced the same.  The quality of a spinning rod is much less important to casting than is the quality of a fly rod, and rod makers know this.  You can get away with many more imperfections in the blank on a spinning rod.  In addition, they are shorter.  Cost goes up nonlinearly with length because it is just a lot harder to make a straight 9 ft. blank that tapers from say, 1 cm to 2 mm, than to make an almost straight 7 ft. blank that tapers from 2 cm (or more on some of Cabela’s rods, e.g.) to 2 mm.  Put it this way:  You could do pretty well spin casting with your reel tied to a broom handle, but unless you are Lefty Kreh, you’d have a hell of a time getting more than a few feet of line out fly casting with such a rig. Finally, I’ll gladly take up "FlyFish887" on his casting bet for a day’s pay:  Just name the time and the place . . . TPM

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writes: Re: whether you own an Orvis, etc…I’d be willing to bet a day’s pay that those "toy snobs" can’t cast their expensive trinkets worth a damned. And I bet they don’t fish more than 1 or 2 times a year, then only in perfectly calm, clear days.  In my past days as a professional photographer, I would listen to the same B.S. concerning cameras. You know, it’s not What you use, but HOW you use it that counts!    A cheap rod and cheap line fished properly will catch just as  many fish as the expensive stuff. It is technique and presentation that counts. The fish don’t give a damned if they are caught on a Winston or a Sears "special!"

I’ll take that bet. What do you consider "worth a damned"?  Distance?   Accuracy? I have a 9ft 7wt I can cast a standard flyline so far the backing is hanging out of the tiptop. Or how about picking up a bass bug at about 45 feet and with one false cast hit within 12 inches of a target at 65 feet. In my present days as a professional photo lab technician I also know that any _professional_ photographer is going to use top of the line equipment because it is dependable, rugged and has quality optics. People use Canons, Nikons, Hasselbads, not Ricoh, Pentax and Mamiya-Sekor.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Comparing fly rods to spinning rods is unfair.  Don’t think that any two blanks made from IM6 (which, BTW, is second generation graphite and is about 5-6 years old now) are of equivalent quality and should be priced the same.  The quality of a spinning rod is much less important to casting than is the quality of a fly rod, and rod makers know this.  You can get away with many more imperfections in the blank on a spinning rod.   This is all very nice but it’s not reflected in reality.  Take a close look   at blank vs finished rod prices in the Loomis catalogs, for instance, and   what comes through is that the majority of the differences in price between   spinning/casting and fly rods is in the rods and not the blanks themselves.     For example, look at several 9′ blanks and what happens to the final price   (these are GLoomis two-piece IMX rods):    Length      "Rating"    Blank price   Finished rod price      9′      6-10 lb line     $207            $330      9′      8-12 lb line     $214            $335      9′        6 weight       $171            $375      9′        7 weight       $182            $380   I think that the original poster was correct: there is a substantial premium   inherent in fly rod prices and it is not clear that there is a materials or   labor cost that warrants it.

These are interesting and useful data, but they cut both ways.  Your argument assumes that the blank prices are accurate reflections of production costs but that the finished rod prices are not.  If we assume that all costs reflect production costs plus a constant percentage markup (constant across rod types), the prices above indicate that spinning rods cost more to make (for a given length) but that fly rods cost more to finish.  If you are willing to question the increment from blank to finished rod for fly rods, why not also question the prices on blanks themselves.  Perhaps the markup is higher for spinning blanks than for fly rod blanks.  The real problem is that no one outside the company really knows what the production costs are and how items are priced for a given market. I’ll stick with my previous argument that the quality of the blank is much less important to spin fishing than to fly fishing, and hence, that comparing prices between spinning rods and fly rods is unfair.  However, I also strongly suspect that we fly fishers are not getting any bargains on premium rods. TPM

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