Question:

The 2IC wandered into my office yesterday and noted that the 1IC was detained and wouldn’t be in for the rest of the day … I looked at my duffle bag (which contains accoutrements for annoying fish) looked back at the 2IC and said "I might make it to 3:30 this afternoon …" I didn’t – at 2:50 I teed up the pick-up and we were well on our way by 3:30.  How is it that roadwork crews unfailingly select peak hour to rip up roadways? Does it take them all day to find the road to be ripped up?  Is it their way of making sure the maximum number of rate payers "notice" them? If so, they do a mighty fine job of it. Bugger ‘em. I’d scoped out a pool and glide a few weeks ago that provided some terrific dry-fly fishing mid-morning and that’s where we were heading. It was a bit warm waiting to get through the council induced traffic snarl but the air-con worked well as always – we just opened the windows wider.  Actually the weather looked a bit stormy before we hit the Divide and the cool mountain air. A few spots of rain as we geared up was all the inclemency suffered and the clouds gradually dissipated as the afternoon wore on. As I said, I scoped this stream a few weeks ago, and you guessed it: nary a fish in places I found them previously.  We fished, peeked, snuck, and skulked around and through through some nice looking water only picking up the odd fish.  We weren’t moving fast enough for me though – I really wanted to see that pool and its tailout. Bugger – a couple of fish in side channels. We did our best … he to catch them, me to get a wriggle on.   Columns of midges a metre in diameter and some 3-5 metres high  were evident over some of the backwaters – how many insects in those columns?   They twisted and gyrated like huge schools of baitfish being rounded up by predators.  A combination of the fluky breeze and the midges’ urges drove the column to writhe, twist and seemingly eject adults at the base of the column. There lay a single predator waiting and sipping the evicted with unhurried confidence.  Those that escaped that vortex trickled out of the backwater and down stream past us and into a drop pool.  You have to get your rocks off quick if you’re a midge. At last! The pool. They rose. All of them.  They rose and we cast, and we cast and we cast.  Then the takes started – one, two, three – six or more  missed.  Bigger fly same pattern – its getting dark. _Somebody_ was fairing a little better and had one, the bounder was using a swing I noticed on his second.  Not an unreasonable tactic considering the number of caddis about.  Same dry fly, cast to the same fish, cast across and drawn as it approached a fishes position bought good solid takes and hook-ups.   Certainly my imaginings about the pool had more than been matched by the reality at least on this occasion. A  pleasant surprise and a lovely place to put a bend in a new rod. As for Caddis: to dead-drift or not: that is the question: Whether ’tis nobler to suffer the rings and splashes of short takes, or to take arms against a battery of upstream dry-fly men and, by opposing, offend?  Yet by a swing we end the heart-ache and catch. Steve (humblest apologies to Bill … and any who got this far

Response:

…….(humblest apologies to Bill … and any who got this far

Yeah, well, billy’s on his own.  Besides, he understood the groundlings.  Nice stuff, Steve. Not sure exactly where you’re at.  I was almost enticed into a backpacking trip in the Blue Mountains a couple of years ago.  Any fish there? Wolfgang

Response:

Not sure exactly where you’re at.  I was almost enticed into a backpacking trip in the Blue Mountains a couple of years ago.  Any fish there?

It’s not my neck of the woods, but yes there are.  Small stream’s that you’d be used to, with populations of small browns and rainbows. The Cox’s River is rather larger and had (I haven’t heard much of it in the last few years) a significant rainbow run each winter (at least I think its winter).   Steve

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Not sure exactly where you’re at.  I was almost enticed into a backpacking trip in the Blue Mountains a couple of years ago.  Any fish there? It’s not my neck of the woods, but yes there are.  Small stream’s that you’d be used to, with populations of small browns and rainbows. The Cox’s River is rather larger and had (I haven’t heard much of it in the last few years) a significant rainbow run each winter (at least I think its winter). Steve

Hm…….interesting.  One last questions then.  Ya’ll got any REAL beer down there?      :) Wolfgang

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Hm…….interesting.  One last questions then.  Ya’ll got any REAL beer down there?      :)

Yep, you can also get Bud if you want it.   Steve

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Question:

You’re actually going to fish with them. I usually make copies and save the original. Who knows, someday a full set of the great fly swap flies may be worth a small fortune. Paul

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I see the fly swap packages are starting to show up and most seem happy with the goodies contained therein, and that’s a good thing. Off to Houston, TX. in a few minutes so I won’t be here to answer complaints or other comments until Sat AM most likely.  You girls play nice while I’m gone, on the road slaving over a hot steering wheel. Frank Church recently deposed SwapDictator Thanks to all the tyers and to you Frankie baby…… great collection of flies. I can’t wait to try ‘em! –waldo

Response:

You’re actually going to fish with them.

yup! hell, i can’t tie anywhere as nice as you guys….. hell, they’re meant to catch fish! I usually make copies and save the original. Who knows, someday a full set of the great fly swap flies may be worth a small fortune.

well, your (and others) have gone up in value, as there will soon be one less set on the market. –waldo – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Paul I see the fly swap packages are starting to show up and most seem happy with the goodies contained therein, and that’s a good thing. Off to Houston, TX. in a few minutes so I won’t be here to answer complaints or other comments until Sat AM most likely.  You girls play nice while I’m gone, on the road slaving over a hot steering wheel. Frank Church recently deposed SwapDictator Thanks to all the tyers and to you Frankie baby…… great collection of flies. I can’t wait to try ‘em! –waldo

– Tight Lines, –Walt Fly Fishing NC & more… http://www.ezflyfish.com http://www.wilsoncreekoutfitters.com

Response:

I see the fly swap packages are starting to show up and most seem happy with the goodies contained therein, and that’s a good thing. Off to Houston, TX. in a few minutes so I won’t be here to answer complaints or other comments until Sat AM most likely.  You girls play nice while I’m gone, on the road slaving over a hot steering wheel. Frank Church recently deposed SwapDictator

Thanks fro everything Frank!  Draive safely. Op

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<<  "Frank Church"   << I see the fly swap packages are starting to show up and most seem happy with the goodies contained therein, and that’s a good thing. Off to Houston, TX. in a few minutes so I won’t be here to answer complaints or other comments until Sat AM most likely.  You girls play nice while I’m gone, on the road slaving over a hot steering wheel. Frank Church recently deposed SwapDictator   Thank you so much. Glenn Tippy GKT

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God it’s got to be the first clave ever!!  See Wayno on the right.  Go to www.csse.monsah.edu.au/~steve/clave.jpg

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I see the fly swap packages are starting to show up and most seem happy with the goodies contained therein, and that’s a good thing. Off to Houston, TX. in a few minutes so I won’t be here to answer complaints or other comments until Sat AM most likely.  You girls play nice while I’m gone, on the road slaving over a hot steering wheel. Frank Church recently deposed SwapDictator

Response:

I see the fly swap packages are starting to show up and most seem happy with the goodies contained therein, and that’s a good thing. Off to Houston, TX. in a few minutes so I won’t be here to answer complaints or other comments until Sat AM most likely.  You girls play nice while I’m gone, on the road slaving over a hot steering wheel. Frank Church recently deposed SwapDictator

Thanks to all the tyers and to you Frankie baby…… great collection of flies. I can’t wait to try ‘em! –waldo

Response:

Question:

I know ‘zackly what you mean, Charlie. I spend too much time there also. The guy you referred to is "Mac" who is famous for ruining production rods and then listing them as "restored". His latest kick is plaid signature wraps. But then, there ARE still a few deals showing up daily. I snagged a Courtney Ryley Cooper SB/Doublebuilt for $71 last week and a good friend made off with an unidentified Ray Bergman/Dickerson for the ridiculous sum of $36 + shipping. Vigilance pays off sometimes.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –     As an unapologetic gear whore, I spend way too much time (and money) on e-bay. I’ve been burned more than once by bamboo swindlers, lately the crooks seem to outnumber the honest dealers. I just noticed a Heddon#17 that opened at $75.00 more than it is worth, the first (and only) bidder made an opening bid of $150.00 more than the opening price.I recently read about some guys who were indicted for bidding up their own items (utilizing other user names) to create a false sense of interest, and I suspect that is what’s happening with the Heddon. A lot of this crap still goes on, beware of it. When you see so many low end Montagues selling for $85.00 with 4 or 5 total bids, beware of the short tipped Sunbeam that has been bid up to $175.00 by fifteen bidders. Don’t be fooled into thinking something is valuable, just because there appears to be a lot of interest in the item.    Always insist on a return privilege after you’ve won a bid. I’ve been burned three times this year by swindlers who blatantly lied about the product, the worst case being the guy who’s 8′ Redwing arrived as a no-name Japanese rod, worth $35.00.    There are several guys who sell a lot of counterfeit rods on e-bay. One guy out of central Oregon is pretty good, and it takes an expert’s eye to detect some of the working class rods he’s turned into high dollar collectibles. There’s another guy here in Colorado who takes crappy rods, changes the reel seat, and slaps on a coat of glossy varnish. This guy is also in the habit of turning 9′ buggy whips into 7 1/2′ "highly collectibles, rods like this sell for over $1000.00". Do you have any idea what it does to a rod’s castability (a cheap rod that wasn’t good to start with) when you cut 6" out of each section? It pains me just to look at some of his images, which usually depict a way too small ferrule crammed onto a crudely whittled-down section.    With that said, there are some occasional deals to be had. I often skip over the ads that don’t even mention the maker’s name in the header, 99% of them are junkers. Last fall, I bought a mint Edwards salmon rod, the seller didn’t know what it was, and I wasn’t sure until it arrived; I paid less than $200.00 for it. I had no use for a bamboo salmon rod, so I recently swapped it for a 7 1/2′ Granger. So, with a little bit of luck, I’ve come out about even on e-bay.

Response:

I feel for you and have noticed the same thing in the local equivilent, lots of cheap gear with unrealistic prices on them. On the other hand I recently put a scsi card up for auction at half its used value.I was abused for putting a "high" price on it. Damned if I was going to put a $4000 scsi controller (still in shrink wrap) on auction for 30 bucks. There are a hell of a lot of unscrupulous dealers out there and many people the law in the states regarding false claims when selling something. There must be something around to stop them.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –     As an unapologetic gear whore, I spend way too much time (and money) on e-bay. I’ve been burned more than once by bamboo swindlers, lately the crooks seem to outnumber the honest dealers. I just noticed a Heddon#17 that opened at $75.00 more than it is worth, the first (and only) bidder made an opening bid of $150.00 more than the opening price.I recently read about some guys who were indicted for bidding up their own items (utilizing other user names) to create a false sense of interest, and I suspect that is what’s happening with the Heddon. A lot of this crap still goes on, beware of it. When you see so many low end Montagues selling for $85.00 with 4 or 5 total bids, beware of the short tipped Sunbeam that has been bid up to $175.00 by fifteen bidders. Don’t be fooled into thinking something is valuable, just because there appears to be a lot of interest in the item.    Always insist on a return privilege after you’ve won a bid. I’ve been burned three times this year by swindlers who blatantly lied about the product, the worst case being the guy who’s 8′ Redwing arrived as a no-name Japanese rod, worth $35.00.    There are several guys who sell a lot of counterfeit rods on e-bay. One guy out of central Oregon is pretty good, and it takes an expert’s eye to detect some of the working class rods he’s turned into high dollar collectibles. There’s another guy here in Colorado who takes crappy rods, changes the reel seat, and slaps on a coat of glossy varnish. This guy is also in the habit of turning 9′ buggy whips into 7 1/2′ "highly collectibles, rods like this sell for over $1000.00". Do you have any idea what it does to a rod’s castability (a cheap rod that wasn’t good to start with) when you cut 6" out of each section? It pains me just to look at some of his images, which usually depict a way too small ferrule crammed onto a crudely whittled-down section.    With that said, there are some occasional deals to be had. I often skip over the ads that don’t even mention the maker’s name in the header, 99% of them are junkers. Last fall, I bought a mint Edwards salmon rod, the seller didn’t know what it was, and I wasn’t sure until it arrived; I paid less than $200.00 for it. I had no use for a bamboo salmon rod, so I recently swapped it for a 7 1/2′ Granger. So, with a little bit of luck, I’ve come out about even on e-bay.

Response:

 I haven’t worked for any sellers and I don’t think  I’m stupid (tho I did take up flyfishing after a fashion  this last year, so may that’s questionable…).  But I  don’t have any interest in planning my life around  eBay pumpkin times to buy Yet Another Thing  that I do not really need.  Whatever this thing that I  can’t live without is, it will inevitably pop up again,  either on eBay or somewhere else.

     Good advise, generally. I let a lot of desirable things go, just because I couldn’t be near the computer at the time of their closing (a man has to fish, you know). The point I tried to make is, if you bid twenty dollars with ten hours till closing, somebody is more likely to come along and outbid you, whereas the same bid right at closing is more likely to get the item. I don’t buy *anything* unless I get a good deal on it, and I’m not the only puter user in the world who recognizes a good deal.      I picked up an item last week that I really wanted, but I couldn’t be around the computer at the time of closing. The item (I’d never seen one like it before) had gone six days without a bid, but I figured other sharks (like me) were circling in the waters. With ten hours to go, I bid twice the opening price (and a third the real value) and left for the day, allowing the proxy bid to do it’s thing. I returned that evening to find I’d won the item for a price just fifty cents under my max. A review of the bid history revealed a bidding war had erupted in the final six minutes of the auction, and I was literally saved by the bell. If I hadn’t won it wouldn’t have mattered anyway, because it’s only stuff.

Response:

 That’s the best advice re eBay.  Further, I would  make that "max you’re willing to pay" at least 20  to 25 percent less than I would be willing to pay  through another venue.  If you get the item and it is  what was advertised, you’ve done well.  If you don’t  get it it’s no big deal, invariably another one will  come along.

Right.  There is a little more risk involved because the people aren’t established businesses.  98% of mine have been fine.  If you use common sense and check for bad feedback, it helps.  Paying with PayPal or other credit card service also helps protect you.  If you’re not buying something pretty rare, and you’re not in a big rush, you can get respectable deals.

Response:

 "Jeff Connelly" Right.  There is a little more risk involved because the people aren’t established businesses.  98% of mine have been fine.  That’s in the same ballpark as my experiences:  I’ve had 2 not very good transactions out of a  total of about 70.

    I have been burned three times out of 100+ transactions. All three of the bad deals were bamboo fly rods; I’ve never gotten a bum deal on other types of merchandise.

Response:

It’s a numbers game.  Play enough and you will get burned.  I wuz 3 out of 100 + and no bamboo rods! John – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "Jeff Connelly" Right.  There is a little more risk involved because the people aren’t established businesses.  98% of mine have been fine.  That’s in the same ballpark as my experiences:  I’ve had 2 not very good transactions out of a  total of about 70.    I have been burned three times out of 100+ transactions. All three of the bad deals were bamboo fly rods; I’ve never gotten a bum deal on other types of merchandise.

Response:

Good idea and good advice, but not always permitted under eBays rules.  If a seller refuses your return privilege request/demand after you’ve won, he can legitimately post negative feedback about you and eBay would stand behind the seller every time.

Oh, one more thing regarding feedback.  Feedback is only slightly useful because it’s 2-way feedback, and after a number of years I’ve come to the conclusion feedback should be sent to the seller only.  Otherwise, it’s just a game where people know they will usually get negative feedback in retaliation for giving negative feedback.  Therefore, I believe most people don’t give negative feedback ever.  Many sellers have much less negative feedback than they deserve.  One way feedback, such as on Amazon, seems to work much better.  Moral of the story: if an eBay seller has much negative feedback, you should avoid him.  If he doesn’t – well, you really don’t know much.

Response:

    As an unapologetic gear whore, I spend way too much time (and money) on e-bay. I’ve been burned more than once by bamboo swindlers, lately the crooks seem to outnumber the honest dealers. I just noticed a Heddon#17 that opened at $75.00 more than it is worth, the first (and only) bidder made an opening bid of $150.00 more than the opening price.I recently read about some guys who were indicted for bidding up their own items (utilizing other user names) to create a false sense of interest, and I suspect that is what’s happening with the Heddon. A lot of this crap still goes on, beware of it. When you see so many low end Montagues selling for $85.00 with 4 or 5 total bids, beware of the short tipped Sunbeam that has been bid up to $175.00 by fifteen bidders. Don’t be fooled into thinking something is valuable, just because there appears to be a lot of interest in the item.    Always insist on a return privilege after you’ve won a bid. I’ve been burned three times this year by swindlers who blatantly lied about the product, the worst case being the guy who’s 8′ Redwing arrived as a no-name Japanese rod, worth $35.00.    There are several guys who sell a lot of counterfeit rods on e-bay. One guy out of central Oregon is pretty good, and it takes an expert’s eye to detect some of the working class rods he’s turned into high dollar collectibles. There’s another guy here in Colorado who takes crappy rods, changes the reel seat, and slaps on a coat of glossy varnish. This guy is also in the habit of turning 9′ buggy whips into 7 1/2′ "highly collectibles, rods like this sell for over $1000.00". Do you have any idea what it does to a rod’s castability (a cheap rod that wasn’t good to start with) when you cut 6" out of each section? It pains me just to look at some of his images, which usually depict a way too small ferrule crammed onto a crudely whittled-down section.    With that said, there are some occasional deals to be had. I often skip over the ads that don’t even mention the maker’s name in the header, 99% of them are junkers. Last fall, I bought a mint Edwards salmon rod, the seller didn’t know what it was, and I wasn’t sure until it arrived; I paid less than $200.00 for it. I had no use for a bamboo salmon rod, so I recently swapped it for a 7 1/2′ Granger. So, with a little bit of luck, I’ve come out about even on e-bay.

Response:

I just noticed a Heddon#17 that opened at $75.00 more than it is worth, the first (and only) bidder made an opening bid of $150.00 more than the opening price.

   Sorry to add to my own thread, but I just noticed this Heddon has a short tip, so it’s opening price was about $200.00 more than it is worth. It has now been "bid up" to approximately 3X what it’s really worth.    And fwiw, last week I purchased a higher grade Heddon, in better shape. I paid $200.00 + shipping to a reputable dealer from Michigan.

Response:

    As an unapologetic gear whore, I spend way too much time (and money) on e-bay.

As long as you sell (almost) as much as you buy, you’ll be alright What’s that?  You end up buying a lot more than you sell??  :-) I recently read about some guys who were indicted for bidding up their own items (utilizing other user names) to create a false sense of interest, and I suspect that is what’s happening with the Heddon.

Between me and especially my brother we’ve seen a lot of eBay action, and this and much more does go on.  It’s virtually unstoppable in the long run. There’s really only one way around it for the buyer, and it’s quite simple… Don’t be fooled into thinking something is valuable, just because there appears to be a lot of interest in the item.

…know what the value of the item you want to buy.  This is obviously true no matter what you buy – it’s not an eBay thing.  Well, maybe I oversimplified, because in some cases where an item is very rare, it’s the other bids that help you determine its value.  eBay is a good value-meter for things that are not unique, and that a good number of transactions occur for.  For the life of me though, I can’t understand people that bitch and moan because they got outbid "at the last second".  They complain about "poachers", who wait until the auction is a minute from ending, and swoop in with their "guerilla bid".  So freakin’ what?  Proxy bid the max that you’re willing to pay.  There is one thing that sellers can get away with though that’s unethical.  Use a fake name to raise the bid if you think a buyer has proxy-bidded higher than his actual bid.  If you go over it by mistake, just retract the bid.  That way you have a way of knowing how high a person will go, and make him go there.  I don’t think eBay would let you get away with it more than a few times though.    There are several guys who sell a lot of counterfeit rods on e-bay.

The best defense I’ve found against counterfeits, unethical dealers, etc. is a good credit card company.  If you have a good one, they’ll back you up when you refuse payment on an item.  One of the problems with eBay transactions is that there tends to be too many places to lay blame, so everyone points somewhere else.  eBay points to the seller or to a mediator (which is not free), the seller of course won’t help, the payment company (PayPal or whoever) points to the FBI, the FBI isn’t going to take it seriously, or the payment company points to your credit card company.  If your credit card company is good, the buck stops there and you’re covered. I think internet buying and selling is the greatest thing since the electric guitar, but buying rare or unique items without seeing them in person is tough.

Response:

There was one about a month back that I got a kick out of. One of the ebay regulars that refinishes rods with glossy new varnish had a Granger rod – I think. He said it was a Granger rod, however, He replaced the grip with one that didn’t match the original, replaced the reeelseat with an antique aluminum one, replaced the ferrules and guides. He even removed the granger stamp from the rod and wrote Granger on it. Sounds just a little suspicious to me. Paul

    As an unapologetic gear whore, I spend way too much time (and money) on e-bay.

[snip] – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

For the life of me though, I can’t understand

people that bitch and moan because they got outbid "at the last second".  They complain about "poachers", who wait until the auction is a minute from ending, and swoop in with their "guerilla bid".  So freakin’ what?<   I was watching a flyrod on Ebay.  Someone put a bid in with less than a minute to go, only to be aced out by another bidder who got in with 9 seconds left.  Talk about "the last second."  I imagine that next to the last bidder was pissed.

Response:

I was watching a flyrod on Ebay.  Someone put a bid in with less than a minute to go, only to be aced out by another bidder who got in with 9 seconds left.  Talk about "the last second."  I imagine that next to the last bidder was pissed.

In the few instances I’ve been a participant in these last second bids, it’s been fun to watch.   For my part, I’ve never really regretted being beat at the last second.   I bid what I’m willing to pay.   If somebody’s willing to pay more, good for them.   I’ve never felt bad about losing one that way. Joe F.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was watching a flyrod on Ebay.  Someone put a bid in with less than a minute to go, only to be aced out by another bidder who got in with 9 seconds left.  Talk about "the last second."  I imagine that next to the last bidder was pissed. In the few instances I’ve been a participant in these last second bids, it’s been fun to watch.   For my part, I’ve never really regretted being beat at the last second.   I bid what I’m willing to pay.   If somebody’s willing to pay more, good for them.   I’ve never felt bad about losing one that way. Joe F.

joe, the animosity generated plum evades me. back in my golden years when i travelled to quite a few thousand auctions buying antiques, libraries, estates and such, i set my limit….. and since i was pretty much a foolish bidder, if some fool outbid me…. well, congrats, nicely done. all i can say is i never regretted winning and i never regretted nor angered over losing. i take that back…. my only regret is that i didn’t go to 27k on a full bronze figurine at an auction outside of daytona beach one evening….  i believe the fool that out-bid me would have dropped out and i would today be enjoying the finest deco sculpture i’ve ever seen… enjoying daily cuz i never would have sold her…. course, marie probably would have divorced my silly ass. ah well…that’s life…. you win some and you lose some. anyway…. the point being…. at auction, and at ebay, thars a hammer. when it slams down… the *last* bidder wins….tain’t much use losing sleep over it…imho. –walt

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For the life of me though, I can’t understand people that bitch and moan because they got outbid "at the last second".  They complain about "poachers", who wait until the auction is a minute from ending, and swoop in with their "guerilla bid.

     Groundless bitching it is. The earlier a bidding war gets started, the higher the price inevitably goes. You gotta play by the home court rules, and use all the legal tactics. When I see something I *really* want, I get involved in the last couple of minutes. Anybody who hasn’t figured this out doesn’t deserve to win the bid. And anybody who actively bids an item with days to go is either stupid or working for the seller. I think internet buying and selling is the greatest thing since the electric guitar, but buying rare or unique items without seeing them in person is tough.

    Agree

Response:

He said it was a Granger rod, however, He replaced the grip with one that didn’t match the original, replaced the reeelseat with an antique aluminum one, replaced the ferrules and guides. He even removed the granger stamp from the rod and wrote Granger on it. Sounds just a little suspicious to me.

Did it have a number on it, by any chance? {;-) George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

Response:

<snip    Always insist on a return privilege after you’ve won a bid. I’ve been burned three times this year by swindlers who blatantly lied about the product, the worst case being the guy who’s 8′ Redwing arrived as a no-name Japanese rod, worth $35.00.

Good idea and good advice, but not always permitted under eBays rules.  If a seller refuses your return privilege request/demand after you’ve won, he can legitimately post negative feedback about you and eBay would stand behind the seller every time.  If you want a return privilege, send the seller an e-mail BEFORE you bid, unless there is some sort of return policy/guarantee in the items description and/or auction terms.  It doesn’t take much negative feedback to get people really turned off about dealing with you.    There are several guys who sell a lot of counterfeit rods on e-bay. One guy out of central Oregon is pretty good, and it takes an expert’s eye to detect some of the working class rods he’s turned into high dollar collectibles. There’s another guy here in Colorado who takes crappy rods, changes the reel seat, and slaps on a coat of glossy varnish. This guy is also in the habit of turning 9′ buggy whips into 7 1/2′ "highly collectibles, rods like this sell for over $1000.00". Do you have any idea what it does to a rod’s castability (a cheap rod that wasn’t good to start with) when you cut 6" out of each section? It pains me just to look at some of his images, which usually depict a way too small ferrule crammed onto a crudely whittled-down section.

Wow.  I haven’t been shopping for bamboo rods, but what you describe here is downright amazing.  Good deal for the seller, I guess.    With that said, there are some occasional deals to be had. I often skip over the ads that don’t even mention the maker’s name in the header, 99% of them are junkers. Last fall, I bought a mint Edwards salmon rod, the seller didn’t know what it was, and I wasn’t sure until it arrived; I paid less than $200.00 for it. I had no use for a bamboo salmon rod, so I recently swapped it for a 7 1/2′ Granger. So, with a little bit of luck, I’ve come out about even on e-bay.

I’ve done more selling than buying on eBay, and none of it fishing-related. As a seller, I can honestly state that I have never ripped anybody off.  One guy did buy an old clone PC from me and he paid more for shipping than he did for the PC.  He may have been a fool, but I didn’t rip him off. As a buyer, my experience is much more limited.  Initially, I wasn’t playing like an eBay vulture–so I always got outbid.  More recently I bought some books and got a tremendous deal.  Six hardback novels from the 70s for less than $20, shipping and all, all in excellent condition. With any sort of ‘collectible’ item, or anything of significant value–say over $100–I’d be careful.  There are LOTS of eBay scam artists out there, and plenty of them never get caught.  A slight misrepresentation can result in a practically valueless item being bid up as if it were the real thing. Caveat Emptor never rang more true than the day eBay arrived. Tom G eBay vulture

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Question:

Hi,   We’re planning a trip to Vermont for a few days in mid-August following a visit to Boston to attend a wedding (we’re in California). We’d like to find a nice B&B or inn where we can get in some hiking and ff. Any recommendations? Thanks, Gary

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We’re planning a trip to Vermont for a few days in mid-August following a visit to Boston to attend a wedding (we’re in California). We’d like to find a nice B&B or inn where we can get in some hiking and ff. Any recommendations? Thanks, Gary

Gary, Check out By The Old Mill Stream … if you cannot find them on the web, drop me an email, and I will get it for you.  The owner, Steve, is a real nice guy and a fly fisher himself. All the best, Jame

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The reluctant panther in manchester village is wonderful and is 50 feet from the fly fishing museum, 150 feet from the original site of Orvis, 7.5 minute walk from Orvis headquaters, accross the street from glen eagles golf course and virtually next door to the Equinox Hotel (get directions to their pond..located up the mountai behind the hotel..very nice lake bows). The restaurant is wonderful in the inn.  you’ll love it!! I. Clair

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a ‘94 short-shart Gamefisher (Force?) that’s been running great since I picked it up at the beginning of tge year. However, the last time I was out,I get a "clack, clack, clack" as I was pulling on the starter rope.  I pushed the trans lever back and forth a couple of times, and it started right up with no"clack" at all. I motored to my fishing spot, cut the motor, making sure I was in neutral, then fished.  When I was ready to pull up, I once again went to start the motor and got the "clack" again.  I was once again able to get rid of the clack by moving the trans lever in and out of gear. Does anyone recognize my problem? Do I have a problem? Will I soon have a problem. Thanks…

There is a safety device system to prevent starting the motor in gear located on the flywheel. As the motor gets older parts get worn and these devices don’t quite work as they use to. The clack clack is a little plastic lever thats connected to the gear shift thats half connecting with the fly wheel. Moving the gear lever as you do helps to put it in the right position. I sugest that you take the cover off the engine and observe how this mechnisium works. Its located on the top of the motor at the back (spark plug end) work the gear lever and you will see the lever and how it works. There is another reason you should know about this is because sometimes the mechinisum jams and you can not pull the cord. If this occurs you take the cover off and manually move the lever out from the flywheel. These safety devices usually fail after a few years (regardless of make). If you are really keen you could set about adjusting it. You will find however that there is a spot on he gear lever where the lever is in the out position. Once you know the spot its just a matter of remembering to put it there before starting the motor. Best of luck Silver fox

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I have a ‘94 short-shart Gamefisher (Force?) that’s been running great since I picked it up at the beginning of tge year. However, the last time I was out,I get a "clack, clack, clack" as I was pulling on the starter rope.  I pushed the trans lever back and forth a couple of times, and it started right up with no"clack" at all. I motored to my fishing spot, cut the motor, making sure I was in neutral, then fished.  When I was ready to pull up, I once again went to start the motor and got the "clack" again.  I was once again able to get rid of the clack by moving the trans lever in and out of gear. Does anyone recognize my problem? Do I have a problem? Will I soon have a problem. Thanks…

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Question:

The Fly Fisherman is a true FF shop they can accomidate you for fresh and saltwater, they also have a store in Titusville (you can FF for redfish in the indian river and mosquito lagoon area). Dominic Pruitt Cary, NC (Relatives in Orlando area)

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Dear Joseph                 There are two excellent fishing shops Jumbo Sports and The Fly Fisherman, they are both in the yellow pages. I visitedthem while i was on holiday. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have received a very interesting job offer in the Orlando area (zip 32750)… but I’m trying to check some things out before I commit myself. I know the fishing is good down there… but what’s the flt-fishing presence like? Any good shops in the area? Any tying supplies for freshwater? I may be headed down for an interview shortly… any place I should scope out while I’m there? Thanks! — Joe Ellis         o/~ The Synthetic Filker o/~ |   TesserAct Studios  ()X  Darwin (;        Now on the Web at      |  Cincinnati, OH 45240  //~~~LL~~~~LL~  http://shell.idt.net/~ellis69 | New Dimensions In Filk!   If you race a train to the crossing and the train gets there first,      the train wins. If you get there first, the train STILL wins.

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I have received a very interesting job offer in the Orlando area (zip 32750)… but I’m trying to check some things out before I commit myself. I know the fishing is good down there… but what’s the flt-fishing presence like? Any good shops in the area? Any tying supplies for freshwater? I may be headed down for an interview shortly… any place I should scope out while I’m there? Thanks! — Joe Ellis         o/~ The Synthetic Filker o/~ |   TesserAct Studios  ()X  Darwin (;        Now on the Web at      |  Cincinnati, OH 45240  //~~~LL~~~~LL~  http://shell.idt.net/~ellis69 | New Dimensions In Filk!   If you race a train to the crossing and the train gets there first,      the train wins. If you get there first, the train STILL wins.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have received a very interesting job offer in the Orlando area (zip 32750)… but I’m trying to check some things out before I commit myself. I know the fishing is good down there… but what’s the flt-fishing presence like? Any good shops in the area? Any tying supplies for freshwater? I may be headed down for an interview shortly… any place I should scope out while I’m there? Thanks! — Joe Ellis         o/~ The Synthetic Filker o/~ |   TesserAct Studios  ()X  Darwin (;        Now on the Web at      |  Cincinnati, OH 45240  //~~~LL~~~~LL~  http://shell.idt.net/~ellis69 | New Dimensions In Filk!   If you race a train to the crossing and the train gets there first,      the train wins. If you get there first, the train STILL wins.

       One thing you’ll learn is that Orlado is just one area, there are many cities in the area and all are back to back so to speak. Check the phone book and don’t be put off by the city names. There is an Orvis shop in Winter Park, 2 Bitters shops, all kinds of mall shops, KMart sells fly fishing poppers, flys and some low level gear as does WallMart. Fern Park, Altamonte Springs, Winter Park are some of the towns heading north on either I-4 or 17/92 all really close together. There are numerous bait and tackle shops all over the place and Titusville, Cape Canaveral is also close. as to bait and tackle "The big Bass hole is about 6 blocks from my house in Sanford. It’s on lake Monrow (the St.John’s runs through it.) What you’ll need is an 8wt at least for bass and small saltwater possibly a 3wt for bream and a short 5wt for general streamside among trees etc. There are so many shops and sporting goods stores that I can’t begin to tell you about all of them.                                                             John Popp                                                          in Sanford Fl.

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Question:

Anyone have any current information on the streams of PA. If you do please let me know! What I am look for is cool water and maybe some trout. I know it is tough this time of year. Thank in advance Roger Grant

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If it doesn’t rain soon we’re not going to have ANY water in PA, cold or otherwise.  But for stream conditions and hatch advice in southeast PA, especially Cumberland County (Yellow Breeches, Letort, etc), I suggest you call Cold Spring Anglers at 717 245-2646. They’re very good and run a first rate shop.

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How small a stream are you comfortable on??  E-mail me.. Despite the pontifications of the westerners here, not all the wild trout are west of the Mississippi…:)

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Anyone have any current information on the streams of PA. If you do please let me know! What I am look for is cool water and maybe some trout. I know it is tough this time of year. Thank in advance Roger Grant

Roger: As others may note, all waters are low and warm – we need some of Hurricane Danny’s rain.  What part of the state will you be in? Mark Faulkner

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any current information on the streams of PA. If you do please let me know! What I am look for is cool water and maybe some trout. I know it is tough this time of year. Thank in advance Roger Grant Roger: As others may note, all waters are low and warm – we need some of Hurricane Danny’s rain.  What part of the state will you be in?

Hi Mark; I am from Ohio and travel is a consideration but not always. Roger

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How small of a stream are you comfortable on.. This makes a difference as well…:)

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Anyone have any current information on the streams of PA.

If you do please let me know! What I am look for is cool water and maybe some trout. I

know it is tough this time of year. Thank in advance Roger Grant

My Brother in Law says there’s been NO rain for weeks and streams flows are VERY low. He’s been mountain biking instead. Fishing’s great here in Slovenia! Mike

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It depends on what part of PA you’re interested in but, for the southeast, especially Cumberland county (Yellow Breeches, Letort, etc), I suggest you call Cold Spring Anglers at 717 245-2646.  They have the latest stream and hatch information and run a very nice shop as well.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any current information on the streams of PA. If you do please let me know! What I am look for is cool water and maybe some trout. I know it is tough this time of year. Thank in advance Roger Grant Roger: As others may note, all waters are low and warm – we need some of Hurricane Danny’s rain.  What part of the state will you be in? Hi Mark; I am from Ohio and travel is a consideration but not always. Roger

Central Pa still has some good fishing in its Limestoners dispite the lack of rain.  Spring Cr. Big Fishing Cr,  Spruce Cr., all are still fishing good and producing some nice fish.  I guide on these streams and have been doing quite well.  If you have any questions feel free to e-mail me and I do what I can to help.  Pete (Serene Fly-Fishing Adventures)  <’{{{,<

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If it doesn’t rain soon we’re not going to have ANY water in PA, cold or otherwise.  But for stream conditions and hatch advice in southeast PA, especially Cumberland County (Yellow Breeches, Letort, etc), I suggest

I suggest calling Bill or Dusty at Yellow Breeches Outfitters for this area – They are right on the Yellow Breeches in Boiling Springs.  The Breeches can still be productive early morning and I suspect these recent rains will extend time on stream (planning on going this evening).  Yellow Breeches Outfitters # is 717-258-6752

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Question:

For your free brochure featuring the funniest in t-shirts,  E-mail the shirtguy for info.  Guaranteed to help you look better catching that whopper!!  Good Fishing.

Response:

For your free brochure featuring the funniest in t-shirts,  E-mail the shirtguy for info.  Guaranteed to help you look better catching that whopper!!  Good Fishing.

This is not posted by the intelekchualy advanced, flyfishing supremo, humorous South African Bruce which you have all come to know and admire. (I realy crack myself up sometimes). I would never attempt to sell t-shirts via roff. Hell hath no fury as a flyfisherman spammed. Cheers Bruce….

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Question:

I fish in the Chattahoochee River around Atlanta,GA.  Its fairly large and has some deep holes so some sort of float tube is very useful. I have had no problems with the donut style.  Though I can see the advantages of the U-boat, they do tend to be larger than the donut. I’m not a particulary large person (5′7′, 160 lbs) so I have not really seen the need for the U-boat.  Also part of this is that I do not do a lot true floating.  It serves more as a safety device and a way to float over to a mid-stream rock. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve been tubing for about 12 years here in Michigan and like my good old ‘donut’ boat. The only thing I don’t like about it is getting in and out, and while flippin’ through thin, weedy and silty shorelines. I found the U-Boats to not support my legs underwater. I was always forcing my legs into the water where the donuts rest across the top of your legs. Others I’ve spoken to don’t feel as secure in the U-boats. I prefer a U-Boat. I don’t have either of the probs you mentioned. The U-Boat is much easier to get in and out of and I find ‘em generally more comfortable (then again I’m a pretty large mammal 6′4" ~230 . I can’t think of any reason to recommend a donut over a U for full sized adults. I have one made by the Creek Company. Quality is excellent. In general though, I’d say float tubes are just an awesome fishing tool and will enhance your experience no matter what type you decide to go with.

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have three doughnut tubes….all of which go unused since my purchase of a quality U boat.  Granted, mine was custom built for me….but my wife has a stock U boat and loves her as much as I love mine.  Neither of us would ever consider going back to a round tube.

Hi All float tubers, The U or V type boats have taken over here in Northern California. If you like to float tube lakes, then go look at a new Outcast ‘Super Fat Cat’ in person. Get it on the floor and really look at it. They have the same raised front end as a ‘Zodiac’ type boat has, so the water runs under the boat causing way less drag. This is the hottest thing to happen to the belly boat market in years. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY www.kiene.com

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  By the way, the "stock model Stealth Riders ("V" boats from Wood River) are great.  I purchased one for my wife and she’s been really happy with it. Barry

I have to second this in a big way.  I have used a round tube for about ten years, and still cannot believe how much I like the wood river boats.   Probably the best part is how much easier they are to launch and land.   — Andrew Brunette

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Some valve types require you to push and hold something for them to deflate. Tire-type valves fall into this category.  This means while your buddies watch their tubes deflate while sipping apprez-fishing drinks, you’ll be on the ground holding the valve and squeezing the air out. My old JW Outfitters has a Roberts valve like this but I think new ones are improved.

Just wanted to let you know that tire tube valves can be removes using a special wrench.  I have valve covers on mine that have the wrench built it.   Take the cover off, turn it over, take out the valve, go have a drink, and your tube will be deflated.  The wrenches/caps should be available at all car parts stores.  I think they’re under $2.  Make sure you get extra stems too as you’ll probably lose atleast a couple in a lifetime. Matthew           Matthew W Kaphan    http://home.sprintmail.com/~mwk            Silverdale, WA

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As long as we’re on this thread, perhaps some folks would be willing to weigh in on the question — U-tube versus standard (doughnut)  float tube. I’m in the market, and trying to decide which way to go. I’ve used a standard tube, the U tube would be something new to me. David Shaffer Minneapolis, MN

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Some time ago, Pete Ross (Wood River Products), was seeking feedback on various tube designs and options.  Because I had used tubes for so many years, he sent prototypes to me to try out and make suggestions.  During this process, I found out what was best for me and had Pete build two of them….one for me and one for my father (who is 80 yrs old and still is an active float tuber).  By the way, the "stock model Stealth Riders ("V" boats from Wood River) are great.  I purchased one for my wife and she’s been really happy with it.

I’ve yakked some with Pete and his brother Greg myself. Nice guys – killer product. It’s neat you were part of the field test program. I have a couple of JW Outfitter pontoon boats,  plus their "Ultimate" model belly boat. Of the three, I prefer the old donut. Pontoons are a pain as far as I’m concerned- big, awkward, totally uncontrollable in wind. I’m unloading both of them for Wood River V-boats. For the kind of stillwater fishing I like to do  (small, high lakes) – Pete’s boats are the best: They’re fast, maneuverable, lightweight and comfortable. And of course, they’re a heck of a lot easier to get in and out of than the old donut. Thanks for the info, Dennis

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have three doughnut tubes….all of which go unused since my purchase of a quality U boat.  Granted, mine was custom built for me….but my wife has a stock U boat and loves her as much as I love mine.  Neither of us would ever consider going back to a round tube. Barry, how do you go about getting a float tube custom-built? Are you friends with the manufacturer? – or is this something anyone can have done? I’m really curious. Regards, Dennsi

Some time ago, Pete Ross (Wood River Products), was seeking feedback on various tube designs and options.  Because I had used tubes for so many years, he sent prototypes to me to try out and make suggestions.  During this process, I found out what was best for me and had Pete build two of them….one for me and one for my father (who is 80 yrs old and still is an active float tuber).  By the way, the "stock model Stealth Riders ("V" boats from Wood River) are great.  I purchased one for my wife and she’s been really happy with it. Barry

Response:

I’ve been tubing for about 12 years here in Michigan and like my good old ‘donut’ boat. The only thing I don’t like about it is getting in and out, and while flippin’ through thin, weedy and silty shorelines. I found the U-Boats to not support my legs underwater. I was always forcing my legs into the water where the donuts rest across the top of your legs. Others I’ve spoken to don’t feel as secure in the U-boats.

(snip) Perhaps you’re not using the right U Boat or the one you tried was not the right size for you.  I’ve fished with float tubes for 40 yrs and have three doughnut tubes….all of which go unused since my purchase of a quality U boat.  Granted, mine was custom built for me….but my wife has a stock U boat and loves her as much as I love mine.  Neither of us would ever consider going back to a round tube. Different strokes for different folks, I guess. Barry

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writes: Perhaps you’re not using the right U Boat or the one you tried was not the right size for you.  I’ve fished with float tubes for 40 yrs and have three doughnut tubes….all of which go unused since my purchase of a quality U boat.  Granted, mine was custom built for me….but my wife has a stock U boat and loves her as much as I love mine.  Neither of us would ever consider going back to a round tube. Different strokes for different folks, I guess. Barry

I was out last week with a buddy and a "newbie" we brought along.  My buddy had a spare tube and was going through the rigamarole of getting the newcomer situated with fins, etc and telling him to be careful walking with the fins while he waddled towards the water.  I chuckled, grabbed my U-tube, fins and rod, walked into the thigh deep water, sat down, pulled on the fins and paddled away. I too, would never go back to a round tube. Brent

Response:

As long as we’re on this thread, perhaps some folks would be willing to weigh in on the question — U-tube versus standard (doughnut)  float tube. I’m in the market, and trying to decide which way to go. I’ve used a standard tube, the U tube would be something new to me.

Take a long hard look at the "V" boats too. Wood River, in particular, has a hell of a product, and the Ross brothers are good people. Pete Ross invented the original U-boat, then "re-invented it in the form of the V-boat – only this time he patented the design before somebody else beat him to the punch. Check it out before you write your check.

Response:

I’ve been tubing for about 12 years here in Michigan and like my good old ‘donut’ boat. The only thing I don’t like about it is getting in and out, and while flippin’ through thin, weedy and silty shorelines. I found the U-Boats to not support my legs underwater. I was always forcing my legs into the water where the donuts rest across the top of your legs. Others I’ve spoken to don’t feel as secure in the U-boats. The only time I would consider a pontoon (despite considerable pressure from those who sell them) is if I planned on fishing a lot of heavier running water. On lakes and ponds you have little directional stability without dropping your rod and paddling, and you are very much at the mercy of the wind. I ask a buddy on one of the pontoons where he was going as he paddled away, he said he was paddling up-wind so by the time he drifted (sailed!) back to our fishing area he would have a new fly tied on. With a float-tube you can fin like a fish, holding your direction while fishing or tying. You can chomp on a sandwich while finning to as new location or otherwise keep your feet busy while your hand do something else. That, to me, is the #1 drawback of pontoons. (the others being windage, cost, bulk, weight and complication. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – After wrestling my canoe around today, I’ve decided that a float tube or pontoon outfit looks like a pretty good idea.  Funny.  I couldn’t handle the canoe on & off the vehicle as well as I did 20 years ago and, without an anchor to use when it’s windy, a canoe is a real handfull. I’ve watched fly fishermen on various lakes around here with both the tubes and pontoons.  I get the idea from visiting with various fishermen that the pontoons work a bit better.  But, it seems they’d be harder to haul.  I have a Jeep Grand Cherokee and a pontoon would kind of fill it up.   I would appreciate any ideas from those of you who have experience with either tubes or pontoons.   As always, please respond by e-mail as well as to the group.  I’d hate to miss any info because of my unreliable server.   Thanks, To reply, remove one "bs" from E-mail address

  I have a tube and will have a pontoon soon.  (also have a canoe, drift boat, and jet boat). The other posts are on the money on the relative merits of each.  I have demo’ed some pontoons and like the speed,  and warmth during the winter,  but they just aren’t as good of "fishing" platform.  They are not stealthy, require a lot of handling, won’t stay oriented so that you can pay attention to where the fish are.  I use a power boat to get to the general area where the fish are and then launch the tube for a more stealthy approach.  I think this is best on large waters.  On ponds and small lakes you might need the mobility of the pontoon, and of course on creeks and small rivers a pontoon is the only choice. Why choose?  Buy both.  Life if too short to have to live with only one or two "boats"

Response:

 As always, please respond by e-mail as well as to the group.  I’d hate to miss any info because of my unreliable server.  Thanks,

Bob,         I’ve had a Browning Predator float tube for years and years, and really love it.  The only disadvantage I can find with the float tube is its inability to cover long distances quickly.  Otherwise, they are made for fly fishing!  It’s so nice being able to move, manuever,  WHILE  using both hands to fish.  I used to get so frustrated trying to pick up/put down paddles and anchor lines while trying to cast, retrieve, set the hook, etc., when fishing from my canoe.  It seems if you had to set down the paddle for a minute, the wind would spin you around in the most awkward direction, or blow you away from where you had to be.  Not so with the float tube. Bob Scott

Response:

Tubes are better: 1. In high wind because they don’t have lots of area. Really important out west in Wyoming 2. Are cheaper 3. Easier to move, backpack 4. More stealthy during fishing. The fish are concerned about whats above them out of the water but seamingly unconcerned about your legs and flippers under the water. Pontoons are better 1. Can use oars and can move you around faster 2. More comfortable and keeps your butt out of cold water 3. Easier to cast from (your higher up) 4. Only way to go on a river 5. Can move you into shallower water since your body isn’t under the bladers I have a friend who owns a small Hobby hardside pontoon craft that he lashes down with four straps to his Grand Cherokee’s roof rack. Its much quicker then any belly boat. It also works well in the wind since it only sits about 4 inches above the water when he is in it. Perfect for lakes but it would be terribly dangerous on a river. I have both but put the pontoon boat (8 ft with large inflatable bladders) in rivers only. It killed me on Wyoming lakes. The wind pushed me so hard that the day turned into rowing exercise and not fishing. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – After wrestling my canoe around today, I’ve decided that a float tube or pontoon outfit looks like a pretty good idea.  Funny.  I couldn’t handle the canoe on & off the vehicle as well as I did 20 years ago and, without an anchor to use when it’s windy, a canoe is a real handfull. I’ve watched fly fishermen on various lakes around here with both the tubes and pontoons.  I get the idea from visiting with various fishermen that the pontoons work a bit better.  But, it seems they’d be harder to haul.  I have a Jeep Grand Cherokee and a pontoon would kind of fill it up.   I would appreciate any ideas from those of you who have experience with either tubes or pontoons.   As always, please respond by e-mail as well as to the group.  I’d hate to miss any info because of my unreliable server.   Thanks, To reply, remove one "bs" from E-mail address

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Bob, I have tried a few kinds so I’ll give some opinion on pros and cons. About the shapes, the advantages are also drawbacks; as in any boat design you have to decide what you want and compromise. A boat that can be easily propelled will help you get where you want, but will be harder to hold still in the wind to fish accurately. Float tube success with dries, nymphs, and leeches often depends on your staying as still as possible to present your fly as intended. All tubes are pretty good at this compared to a canoe fished solo. Anchors are a great equalizer but are objectionable for pulling up and leaving a mess of weeds.  All tube types are also great for trolling very slowly which will catch you a lot of fish. No matter what kind you pick, the type of valve is very important. It is a little bit of effort but you can blow up most non-donut types by mouth tight enough to fish. Someday this will make the difference between your tubing or not because pumps break or get forgotten. Tire type valves used in donut tubes I have seen cannot be blown up by mouth (please tell me different anyone who knows a way).  In my opinion the best valves are a large grey plastic thing with a spring button release, as used on whitewater rafts. The opening is very wide so you can blow them up by pump or mouth quickly, then you attach a fitting for a pump to bring it to very tight pressure. The spring release lets it deflate very quickly too.  I have seen these on SuperCat and Wood river tubes, and expect they are on many other models now.  Some valve types require you to push and hold something for them to deflate. Tire-type valves fall into this category.  This means while your buddies watch their tubes deflate while sipping apprez-fishing drinks, you’ll be on the ground holding the valve and squeezing the air out. My old JW Outfitters has a Roberts valve like this but I think new ones are improved.  Here are ones I have tried and the pros and cons: JW Outfitters – Osprey (their original model pontoon). Seat sits 4"+ from water, but sags and is slowed down if tubes and straps are not tight. You can just barely blow it up by mouth tight enough for good performance. Sitting so high is great for fishing, great in winter, this boat can be kicked pretty fast, but paddling it causes more surface commotion that you would if sitting deeper. It gets blown around in the wind as there is very little underwater resistance. But I can troll a half mile across a lake. The metal frame breaks down and it packs pretty small for travel, but not something you’d fit in a pack. Price was around $300 in 1994. Bucks Colt – this is a small stubby pontoon boat. The valves can be blown up by mouth but it is a contortion getting your mouth to them but it can be done. The seat is molded plastic and sits right at the surface, so your butt is colder and you miss the catamaran speed advantage of the real pontoon boats. The rigid seat makes this not the best for traveling.  Price was around $190 in 1996. Wood River V Boat – Faster than a donut tube but slower than a pontoon. Seat down in the water.  Very light and compact, about five pounds for the basic model with no pockets; this is the best tube I could find for backpacking. I think the V or U boat best for windy lakes as they have some of the directional stability of a pontoon with enough of you underwater to help hold in place. Needs to be pumped very tight for best performance because this one has no crossbar. Prices range from $180 to $250. Sevylor donut polyvinyl-$10-20 -the diaper tube. One last tip – to really get a tube tight by mouth only, blow it up in the cold night, or at elevation two to three thousand feet below where you will fish, and let temperature or elevation do the work for you. Are we tubers yet? Mark Vinsel www.vinsel.com   I would appreciate any ideas from those of you who have experience with either tubes or pontoons.   As always, please respond by e-mail as well as to the group.  I’d hate to miss any info because of my unreliable server.   Thanks, To reply, remove one "bs" from E-mail address

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After wrestling my canoe around today, I’ve decided that a float tube or pontoon outfit looks like a pretty good idea.  Funny.  I couldn’t handle the canoe on & off the vehicle as well as I did 20 years ago and, without an anchor to use when it’s windy, a canoe is a real handfull.   I’ve watched fly fishermen on various lakes around here with both the tubes and pontoons.  I get the idea from visiting with various fishermen that the pontoons work a bit better.  But, it seems they’d be harder to haul.  I have a Jeep Grand Cherokee and a pontoon would kind of fill it up.   I would appreciate any ideas from those of you who have experience with either tubes or pontoons.   As always, please respond by e-mail as well as to the group.  I’d hate to miss any info because of my unreliable server.   Thanks, To reply, remove one "bs" from E-mail address

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Bob, My preference is the tube. I feel I can maneuver a tube a little bit better than I can the pontoon. Although on long floats I always take the pontoon. Sitting in the water all day, especially in the winter, can be sort of a pain. Keep in mind that I’m float in rivers mostly. I think if I fished in lakes I would go with the pontoon. J.W. Outfitters has a pontoon called the "Scout" that weighs about 20lbs. The step up weighs 42lbs. but has a few more features, like the load capacity is greater. Hope this helps. Kevin – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – After wrestling my canoe around today, I’ve decided that a float tube or pontoon outfit looks like a pretty good idea.  Funny.  I couldn’t handle the canoe on & off the vehicle as well as I did 20 years ago and, without an anchor to use when it’s windy, a canoe is a real handfull. I’ve watched fly fishermen on various lakes around here with both the tubes and pontoons.  I get the idea from visiting with various fishermen that the pontoons work a bit better.  But, it seems they’d be harder to haul.  I have a Jeep Grand Cherokee and a pontoon would kind of fill it up.   I would appreciate any ideas from those of you who have experience with either tubes or pontoons.   As always, please respond by e-mail as well as to the group.  I’d hate to miss any info because of my unreliable server.   Thanks, To reply, remove one "bs" from E-mail address

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I am considering purchasing a float tube.  Any suggestions or comments as to brand or model?

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I am considering purchasing a float tube.  Any suggestions or comments as to brand or model?

I’ve used a Buck’s Bag model "Hi & Dri" for four years now and am very happy with it.  I’ve avoided "buying up" to the more expensive (and cumbersome) u-tubes, pontoons, etc.  I haven’t seen anyone mention it yet but I find the front of the donut shaped tube acts as a good fulcrum to brace your knee against when paddling. For fins I’d recommend the Caddis version that you lace on.  They’re a lot less expensive than the Force Fins and just as efficient (and they float).  I own both types and never use the Force Fins anymore. I use Cabella’s 3 mm waders.  They are relatively inexpensive, durable and comfortable.  I’d also recommend getting a pair of Glacier Boots to save wear on the waders. Good Luck – float tubing’s great fun. Mike

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I am considering purchasing a float tube.  Any suggestions or comments as to brand or model?

I own a Buck’s Bag and am happy with it.  However, many ff’ers are starting to go with kick boats instead of float tubes.  They are much safer in whitewater but are tougher to carry to a remote lake.

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I am going to get one.  I have a friend that wants to sell his or I might spend a little more on a "V" shape one. — Vern My ROFF page: http://msnhomepages.talkcity.com/ResortRd/v_deloy/ROFFintro.html Before you buy.

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I saw 2 float tubes in sportsmans guide, one was a pontoon style, 70 bucks, and the other was a traditional style, 50 bucks? something in that range… www.sportsmansguide.com     i think

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I am going to get one.  I have a friend that wants to sell his or I might spend a little more on a "V" shape one. –

Vern, Have you tried his tube out? Just wondered since you describe yourself as vertically challenged and I find in my tube that I like the crotch strap as tight as possible so I sit up as high as possible in the tube. That way my elbows don’t have to be raised up to cast over the tube which is more tiring. I’m 6′4". Now this is likely a peculiarity of my own since I am above average height but if you are below average you might not enjoy being down inside the tube donut- just in general.  It might be that you would enjoy the V type more since they provide better flotation and you aren’t as enclosed. Just a thought. Cheers. Jon

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Thanks for the info. — Vern My ROFF page: http://msnhomepages.talkcity.com/ResortRd/v_deloy/ROFFintro.html Before you buy.

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choc…hot dog??  i got the vienna sausage lecture. jeff   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was at a place in the tropics that liked to feed hot dogs to a moray eel by the reef. They cautioned people not to point their finger at it and, of course, recommended that the males leave their trunks on. — Charlie…

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Vern –         I’ve always had really good luck with my Buck’s Bags float tubes.  I own a Hi&Dry Giant and a Top Gun, and both have proven to be real workhorses.   I use them primarily on small warmwater lakes and ponds, and other than a Cottonmouth trying to climb in with me once, I haven’t had any problems with the quality or workmanship. There’s a downside to float tubes, though, and it may be a bigger issue for you than some others.   You’ve been quite open about your size, and while I’m not trying to offend, you might have a few problems with a traditional float tube as a result.   I’m 5-10, and I have problems launching one.   I have a much bigger problem in that if you do manage to lose a fin, or get discarded monofilament wrapped around your legs, or something similar,  it can be a total bitch to deal with unless you have long arms.   The tube itself is VERY difficult to reach around, and trying to reach down through it doesn’t work well either.         I saw a couple of very nice designs out on Ebay recently, and both are designed around the concept of "pontoon" craft.  Caddis has one that is similar to a traditional belly boat, but rather than having a donut-shaped tube, it has a pontoon down either side. There’s also one out there that is made by the Creek Company, which has a fairly common "U-Boat" design but uses pontoons that are several feet long,  This unit actually looks to give you a seat about 5" above the water, which can make a lot of difference if you’re fishing cold-water lakes for trout.   I haven’t fished out of one, but it looks quite good.         No matter which boat you get, you’ll love it.  Once you get used to controlling the boat with your feet, it’s like having the ultimate mind-reading guide to put the boat "just exactly" where you want it at all times.  I use mine a lot, and wouldn’t give them up.                                 Michael – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’m in the search of my first float tube.  So, all this information is very nice.  What I wanted to say was, I saw a man using a small trolling motor.  Another man that I saw was using a depth gauge/fish finder.  What are the problems using either of these to items in a float tube?

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_____  Nice read Mike.  Thank you. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Vern –         I’ve always had really good luck with my Buck’s Bags float tubes.  I own a Hi&Dry Giant and a Top Gun, and both have proven to be real workhorses.   I use them primarily on small warmwater lakes and ponds, and other than a Cottonmouth trying to climb in with me once, I haven’t had any problems with the quality or workmanship. There’s a downside to float tubes, though, and it may be a bigger issue for you than some others.   You’ve been quite open about your size, and while I’m not trying to offend, you might have a few problems with a traditional float tube as a result.   I’m 5-10, and I have problems launching one.   I have a much bigger problem in that if you do manage to lose a fin, or get discarded monofilament wrapped around your legs, or something similar,  it can be a total bitch to deal with unless you have long arms.   The tube itself is VERY difficult to reach around, and trying to reach down through it doesn’t work well either.         I saw a couple of very nice designs out on Ebay recently, and both are designed around the concept of "pontoon" craft.  Caddis has one that is similar to a traditional belly boat, but rather than having a donut-shaped tube, it has a pontoon down either side. There’s also one out there that is made by the Creek Company, which has a fairly common "U-Boat" design but uses pontoons that are several feet long,  This unit actually looks to give you a seat about 5" above the water, which can make a lot of difference if you’re fishing cold-water lakes for trout.   I haven’t fished out of one, but it looks quite good.         No matter which boat you get, you’ll love it.  Once you get used to controlling the boat with your feet, it’s like having the ultimate mind-reading guide to put the boat "just exactly" where you want it at all times.  I use mine a lot, and wouldn’t give them up.                                 Michael I’m in the search of my first float tube.  So, all this information is very nice.  What I wanted to say was, I saw a man using a small trolling motor.  Another man that I saw was using a depth gauge/fish finder.  What are the problems using either of these to items in a float tube?

– Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

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Wolfgang wrote;snip  I have, on three separate occasions been bitten on the nipple by blue gills while wading at beaches in different parts of the country.

I have no nipple patterns, but I think you can see why I believe that if there were 10 pound bluegills no one would swim in the lakes. Big Dale

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In a related note, has anyone used those tubes which seem to be a composite between the pontoon boats and the float tubes? They are more or less like pontoon boats but have no frame, are lighter and generally smaller and cheaper. Any good? Jon

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Might I recommend instead that you simply wear a shirt next time. I’d hate to think what would have happened had you not been wearing any shorts.

I was at a place in the tropics that liked to feed hot dogs to a moray eel by the reef. They cautioned people not to point their finger at it and, of course, recommended that the males leave their trunks on. — Charlie…

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<< Fred, interesting you mention this.   I have found that the fish ignore my presence when in a float tube.   I have noticed the same thing.  One of the lakes I fish is a high pressure C&R lake.  While pondering the meaning of life, where my beer was and when I was going to stop for lunch one day, I had a 20+ rainbow come up and sip a midge not more then a foot away from my tube.  The water was relatively shallow here too. One of the great pleasure of float tubing has been the ability to observe fish cruising and feeding. You miss most of this while in a boat. Mike

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Fred, interesting you mention this.   I have found that the fish ignore my presence when in a float tube.  The lakes that I fish are pretty clear and I have had fish swim under me several times.  A couple have even stayed under me.

Warren, I agree that fish can and do ignore us, including me standing still in my boat, on occasion, but not when rowing or, I suspect, you come along kicking those big, black, cormorant-like fins.  But I have also seen a person kicking in a tube just move the school along at a constant distance until the fish disperse.  I fish a shallow lake, Davis (Oregon) at 8-9 ft mostly, and the fish that my boat do not spook are the smaller ones.  If I want to sneak up on something 5-6+ lbs, I have to get down on my knees and just paddle with an oar over the side.  And I can just about guarantee you that tubers never, or very rarely, get into a really large fish unless they are well into their backing on a slow troll. Fred

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…I have found that the fish ignore my presence when in a float tube….

And it seems that the deeper you are in the water, the less likely fish are to be disturbed by your presence.  I have, on three separate occasions been bitten on the nipple by blue gills while wading at beaches in different parts of the country.

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And it seems that the deeper you are in the water, the less likely fish are to be disturbed by your presence.  I have, on three separate occasions been bitten on the nipple by blue gills while wading at beaches in different parts of the country.

Might I recommend instead that you simply wear a shirt next time. I’d hate to think what would have happened had you not been wearing any shorts. –Steve | Support project KILLFILE for the chance to win | a new bamboo flyrod! Remove meniscus from my | email address to contact me regarding the project.

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    Hi, Am new to the newsgroup and have not seen anything about float tubing.

Some folks like to carry an onion sack and fill it with rocks for an anchor.  I reserve the float tube for warm calm days in the summer when I can sit around in the tube wearing shorts and t-shirt.

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very nice.  What I wanted to say was, I saw a man using a small trolling motor.  Another man that I saw was using a depth gauge/fish finder.  What are the problems using either of these to items in a float tube?

Personally, it seems like too much of a hassle.  I like the float tube because of its simplicity.  I leave it partly inflated in the garage. Throw it in the back of the truck with a pair of snorkel fins and I’m ready to fish.  I typically borrow a canoe if I need to cover more water. As far as the sonar device is concerned, most of the ponds I fish are small enough that I can ususally figure out after a few trips what the underwater topology is like.   Mu

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Just one suggestion.  Since you will probably not learn to cast (that’s OK, just a fact), don’t ever try and troll close to a school of rising fish, surrounded by folks standing in boats casting maybe 50-70 feet to those fish. Don’t ever believe that since you are close to the water the fish can’t see you, as all you will do is either put the feeding off, or just move the fish out of range of the casters, and the language can then make a mess of a beautiful day.  Have fun, and put ‘em back when you are through playing with them. Fred. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –     Hi, Am new to the newsgroup and have not seen anything about float tubing.Went out for the first time and spent whole time finning to stay correctly to the wind. Must do more of it. You’re right down there with the fish close to the water and peace abounds. Any oldtimers with tube experience please respond/  Hugh

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Don’t ever believe that since you are close to the water the fish can’t see you, as all you will do is either put the feeding off, or just move the fish out of range of the casters, and the language can then make a mess of a beautiful day.

Fred, interesting you mention this.   I have found that the fish ignore my presence when in a float tube.  The lakes that I fish are pretty clear and I have had fish swim under me several times.  A couple have even stayed under me.  I ended up jigging for them and caught one.  My friend and I are always amazed when we see the cutts and grayling swim underneath us.  We tend to be able to spot the fish we would most like to catch and kind of keep track of them and the rest of the pod. As a matter of fact, one time I was out of woolly buggers except for the one I had on and got hung up on a log.  I ended up finning my way into position so I could retrieve my bugger and went right over the pod of fish.  When I was done I went to another position, not wanting to tempt fate twice, and proceeded to catch fish who were still in the same position. Maybe in waters where the fish are constantly being buzzed by boats and such things are different.  The lakes I tube require hiking and have no boat launches so maybe are unaccustomed to floating objects. If nothing else, my experience shows the other end of the spectrum I guess. But I do agree with the part about getting too close to rising fish surrounded by people and just rising fish in general.   Warren Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

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I’m in the search of my first float tube.  So, all this information is very nice.  What I wanted to say was, I saw a man using a small trolling motor.  Another man that I saw was using a depth gauge/fish finder.  What are the problems using either of these to items in a float tube? — Vern My ROFF page: http://msnhomepages.talkcity.com/ResortRd/v_deloy/ROFFintro.html Before you buy.

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_______  You ask some very interesting innocent questions Vern. I happen to own one of those electric trolling driven float tube motorized systems.  There are some who are physically incapable or who need help to get around a pond or lake because of leg problems, heart problems, or whatever.  The gauge/fish finder is a bit much regarding using too much technology in a sport that requires we use our wits, we experiment and we suffer the slings and arrows in order to be successful.  Those who use fish finders in float tube are basically fishing for the wrong reasons but in my opinion, sae-la-vie!  To each his own.  (I imagine I spelled that wrong and I will hear about it?) Did I say . . . "slings and arrows?"   Duck!  Here they come Vern! LOL! Mr. G. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m in the search of my first float tube.  So, all this information is very nice.  What I wanted to say was, I saw a man using a small trolling motor.  Another man that I saw was using a depth gauge/fish finder.  What are the problems using either of these to items in a float tube? — Vern My ROFF page: http://msnhomepages.talkcity.com/ResortRd/v_deloy/ROFFintro.html Before you buy.

– Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

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Hi Vern, I have used a Buck’s Bag belly boat for some 15 odd yrs now and find it a relaxing way to fish.  A lower back problem has plagued me for 20 yrs or more (too many hrs on the road!) but after 1 or 2 hrs in the float tube all the pain or discomfort are magically gone.  My first Buck’s Bag was stolen out of my hatchback Toyota while I was at work one day, and it was immediately replaced. (I couldn’t be without it) The only damage ever suffered was one day I left it in my Toyota inflated (in Florida, no less) and came back 8 hrs later to find the denier outer-covering split wide open by the heat-expanded truck inner tube. A quick trip to an awning shop had it sewn up and good as new. Living in LV could produce the same results if you store your tube fully inflated in the sun. I still have and use my Buck’s Bag, the denier outer covering is sun-faded, but all the zippers still work and the stitching is still in place.  As a safety precaution, replace the inner tube at least once every 2 yrs or so, and never store it completely deflated (the creases in the tube will eventually start to show small cracks) and that ain’t good. I don’t have a problem with mounting "gadgets", ie: trolling motor or depth finder, but that is just something else for your flyline to catch on when casting. BTW, the depth finder *is* sort of a "fish finder" as it’s primary use is to let you see bottom structure, thus in an obtuse way, is a "fish finder." I’ve always had the notion of mounting a depth finder, but just can’t bring myself to add stuff to a "clean" platform. Cabela’s sells 1 and 3 pound anchors just for float tubes and/or pontoon boats, a good investment IMO. Just one other caveat, buy flippers that are designed for float tubes, not something meant for scuba diving. The droopy tips on the scuba fins will trip you up in fine style on your first attempt to get in the tube.  Be sure to draw a crowd and sell tickets if you use the wrong fins, because you will surely put on a fine comic act in just getting in your tube!  Get one Vern, you won’t regret it. Frank Church Elkhart, IN USAF RETIRED I’m in the search of my first float tube.  So, all this information is very nice.  What I wanted to say was, I saw a man using a small trolling motor.  Another man that I saw was using a depth gauge/fish finder.  What are the problems using either of these to items in a float tube? — Vern My ROFF page: http://msnhomepages.talkcity.com/ResortRd/v_deloy/ROFFintro.html

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Excellent thread started by Hugh: Snipped some to save space: The final step is choosing where you want to fish.  Look for structure areas like points, bays and rock slides.  Weed beds are also a great place to fish over and around.  I usually put on a wooly bugger and fish deep as I paddle towards my destination (forgive me George, I know you consider this trolling but I find it highly effective!).  This lets me search the water and experiment with patterns as I move around.  Once you find your hot spot you can cast into and work the bank with either line. If you have any more questions feel free to email me. Mike, Spokane, WA

______  Mike, you reminded me of another thing I do sometimes and that is to carry a compass with me when tubing in a lake or large pond. Paddling backwards, sometimes can be difficult because one may have to keep turning around to keep on coarse. I will make this example simple.  If I want to paddle backwards 360 degrees we know we only have to look down at the compass and keep the needle on 180 degrees or the reciprocal of the heading you want.  Its not often we need to do this, but there are times getting around an area is made easy by simply having one.  No big deal, but I usually have one in one of my storage bags . . . just in case Hugh, and Mike. Nuff said. — Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

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<<   Hi, Am new to the newsgroup and have not seen anything about float tubing.Went out for the first time and spent whole time finning to stay correctly to the wind. Must do more of it. You’re right down there with the fish close to the water and peace abounds. Any oldtimers with tube experience please respond/  Hugh Hugh, welcome to one of the most relaxing ways to fish.  I float tube extensively during the warm months and sometimes during the not so warm months. George pretty much covered the how to’s of using a tube.  The only thing I might add is that take a bit of time before you launch to determine where you want to go and observe what is happening. It is a lot like fishing a river. Turn over a few rocks in the shallows to see what insects are living there. Like George mentioned, scuds are often quite abundent.  Are the chironimids hatching or is there a mayfly hatch occuring.  If you figure that out you can form your strategy. Having an idea how you want to fish really comes in handy in choosing a floating vs. sinking line.  If little to no surface action then I go with a sinking line and a wooly bugger or scud imitation.  Lots of chironimids or other surface action then I go ontop.  I prefer to carry a second rod in my rod holder strung up with a floating line and use a sinking line on my primary rod.  Changing lines in a float tube is a drag!! The final step is choosing where you want to fish.  Look for structure areas like points, bays and rock slides.  Weed beds are also a great place to fish over and around.  I usually put on a wooly bugger and fish deep as I paddle towards my destination (forgive me George, I know you consider this trolling but I find it highly effective!).  This lets me search the water and experiment with patterns as I move around.  Once you find your hot spot you can cast into and work the bank with either line. If you have any more questions feel free to email me. Mike, Spokane, WA

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    Hi, Am new to the newsgroup and have not seen anything about float tubing.Went out for the first time and spent whole time finning to stay correctly to the wind. Must do more of it. You’re right down there with the fish close to the water and peace abounds. Any oldtimers with tube experience please respond/  Hugh

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    Hi, Am new to the newsgroup and have not seen anything about float tubing.Went out for the first time and spent whole time finning to stay correctly to the wind. Must do more of it. You’re right down there with the fish close to the water and peace abounds. Any oldtimers with tube experience please respond/  Hugh

Tubing has had many books written about the subject and I suppose I could write a few chapter here and now myself for you. The primary secret to float tubing is staying warm.  If the tube is moving, you’re trolling.  If your still in the water and casting, you’re fly fishing.  You have to think in patterns that imitate lake and pond life.  Leaches and minnow patterns and thinking more like a lake rather than a river will assist you into that direction.  Look into having and/or tying fairy shrimp and Crawdads patterns.  The flesh of the fish you’re catching will tell you what they are usually eating.  If the flesh is pink, their primary diet are crustaceans which contain predominantly aquatic arthropods such as crabs, shrimps and shelled exoskeleton forms of life.  These have high protein value.  The fact that few tubers tie flies to imitate snails amuses me. You may wish to carry a light anchor and if you know the wind, and the lake is large, you may want to think about using two vehicles, the second is the one the wind will eventually carry you two which could be two three miles away. You will use a lot of calories to stay warm.  As warm as the water will feel, any time it is below your ambient body temperature, body heat is slowly being sucked out of your body.  You will need to pack carbohydrates such as bread sandwiches to keep your calorie count up. Getting cold is the one thing that can ruin tubing.  Another thing is always wear a life vest and always carry a RAZOR SHARP knife on your person.   Make sure you can get out of a damaged tube and that may not be as easy as you think.  Until you are highly experienced, stay close together and fish in a buddy system.  Your fishing buddy should never be more than a minute paddling from you. Another thing is you will do best with a long fly rod like a 9.5′er for a 5 WT.  You really don’t need a long rod but to have a casting advantage because your butt is setting in the water, a longer fly rod is a big help.  Also, you have fighting leverage. Remember, you can tie into a huge fish with a tube then you may know and sooner than you think. Look at your tube design and make sure you have straps you can pull to set you free if necessary.  If the design isn’t safe to get in and out of, consider other designs. Also, while fishing, you may want to make sure you can change fly lines from floating, to sink tip to full sinking.  The STH cassette design may be just the ticket for you to look at next time you go to your pro shop.  The STH is an excellent float tube design reel.  You have all your spools in storage and its a simple matter to change them while in the middle of a lake or pond.  Always safety your fly rod somehow so that if you drop it in the water you have a thither on it somewhere, somehow.   I’m just rambling here as I think of things for you to know and maybe this will get others to add onto the thread what I cannot possibly recall in one setting. I don’t know what the latest books are, but ordering from Barnes or Amazon a couple of them might be wise.  I’m sure other fly fishermen will be more up to date in that area than I. Hope this is enough to get you kick started, but I think you should ask for some good fly patterns for ponds and lakes in ROFFT.  You will need a good dragon fly and damsel fly pattern including the nymphs.  The subject is endless. Good luck to both of you.  You sound like my kind of people.  If I can help in any other way, please feel free to contact me via E-Mail.  Don’t forget to take pictures and don’t forget to buy a water proof camera and don’t forget to get real close to each other when you take that picture.  Count one,two,three – lift the fish, snap the picture with water still streaming off it, and bingo!  You’ve got it! — Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

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Does anyone out ther have any idea where I can find a set of plans to make my own float tube? The truck inner tube is no problem but I need help in getting the covering material to the right shape so it covers the shape of the tube without kinks and folds. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Joe

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: Does anyone out ther have any idea where I can find a set of plans to : make my own float tube? : The truck inner tube is no problem but I need help in getting the : covering material to the right shape so it covers the shape of the : tube without kinks and folds. For all the bother it would take, I think that it would be better and almost no extra cost to just buy one. Prices start at about $100 for a decent tube with two air chambers. — Jon Porter

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Question:

Have only fished state parks one of which is Montauk which is the beginning of the current river, also have fished outside the park in the current without much success for the limited time involved.  Look into Crane Creek.

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Where is the 160 acre lake near Montauk Park?

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There are a couple of great spots along the Meremac River.  The first one is just down river from the Meremac Springs State Park to the Dry Fork. The water is clear and cold as a result to the spring.  I caught the nicest brown trout last fall (18").  Caught it on a 4 weight rod with 6x tippet.  The next section is a little further down river at an access point called Cardiac Hill.  You will understand why it is named that when you spend a day on the river and try and make your way back up to the car.  You need to get a map from the conservation department.  It is very difficult to find but well worth it.  Another good spot south of St. James from I-44 is a place called "Windrush".  Privately owned and stocked.  You can pay a flat rate and release or pay by the pound.  The owners limit the stream to 15 or so a day. You need to make a reservation before you show up.  Enjoy fishing and let me know other spots you come across.

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 Any Missouri flyrod fishermen here?  I would like to talk with fly fishers who frequent the Meramec,Current,or any other small Missouri streams in search of trout, smallmouth, or largemouth.                                          Thank you

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Path:

monsanto.com!newspump.wustl.edu!news.starnet.net!wupost!travel!don.wortmann Distribution: world Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly Organization: TRAVEL ONLINE / ST. LOUIS ONLINE – (314) 561-4956 Lines: 4  Any Missouri flyrod fishermen here?  I would like to talk with fly fishers who frequent the Meramec,Current,or any other small Missouri streams in search of trout, smallmouth, or largemouth.                                          Thank you

One of the things I like about Missouri is the quality hunting AND fishing.  I like to go to the trophy area downstream of Montauk State Park as well as the pay-as-you-go fly only areas within the park.  Drifting jigs & wooly worms seems to one of the tickets to success.  Still kinda new at fly fishing but I should get more practice at the 160 ac. lake nearby!  Where do you go in MO? Denis Boyle

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