Question:

I was looking at those before everyone suggested that stocking foot was the way to go.. Any second thoughts from you guys?

Only one. For the coldest conditions (winter tailwater fishing, goose hunting in a blizzard, etc.) you can’t beat the warmth of a pair of 5 mm neoprene bootfoot waders. But for anything else, I’d go with a pair of stocking foot waders with a good pair of wading boots. How cold is it where/when you plan to use them? — Rusty Hook Laramie, Wyoming

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Lou, Like somebody else mentioned, it all depends on where you plan to fish. As for myself, fishing on freestone creeks and doing a good bit of walking, I am a big fan of stockingfoot waders and good wading boots. Reducing the risk of a sprained ankle far outweighs the extra five minutes or so it takes to put them on. Bob

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Greg I was looking at those before everyone suggested that stocking foot was the way to go.. Any second thoughts from you guys? Lou FWIW: Cabelas has a lace up bootfoot model this year too.   I see that they’re a heck of a lot cheaper,  and the boots (from the small photo) look  like they might provide better ankle support.

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Wayne & Others Wet wading, even in late summer is not much of a option here in Michigan’s Western UP. The streams and rivers run cold. The trout seem to like it but a guy can freeze his ass off in these waters…..

Granted, it may not be for everyone, but I’ve often waded wet in the various branches of the Ontonagon, Cook’s Run, Big and Little Carps, the Paint, the Fence, both Brules, the Firesteel, several of the Irons, the Sturgeon, and a host of others in the western UP. You get used to it after a while.     Wolfgang numb nu…….well, never mind.

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Wolfgang You R tougher than me.   I’ve tried fishing the SalmonTrout river in nylon windpants and  rubber sandals. Goddddd that water is cold. I need waders! BTW,,you were less than an hour from my home so if you wander this way again send me a E mail first. If you do I’ll buy you a beer and maybe we could consider fishing together. Lou

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Wayne & Others Wet wading, even in late summer is not much of a option here in Michigan’s Western UP. The streams and rivers run cold. The trout seem to like it but a guy can freeze his ass off in these waters….. Granted, it may not be for everyone, but I’ve often waded wet in the various branches of the Ontonagon, Cook’s Run, Big and Little Carps, the Paint, the Fence, both Brules, the Firesteel, several of the Irons, the Sturgeon, and a host of others in the western UP. You get used to it after a while.     Wolfgang numb nu…….well, never mind.

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Greg Over the past year I often loaded  Cabelas Dry Plus bought waders, a chest pack, change of cloths, and some pop into a mid size pack. I’d catty a old wicker creel over one shoulder and carry my rod in a case. I don’t think the whole thing weighted 30 pounds and was no big deal to hike in with. I want to thank everyone here for their advice but I noticed that Cabelas had my old Dry Plus Breathable bought on sale for $100. I probably went fishing 100 + times last year and sure got my money’s worth and liked my old waders. I guess habit/ low price over comes good sense so I bought another pair today.. Lou

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was looking at those before everyone suggested that stocking foot was the way to go.. Any second thoughts from you guys?  I spend at least half of my fishing time in water  under 50 degrees or on beaches.   The laced  bootfoots have worked out quite well for that.  They are also easier to deal with: one piece  instead of the 3-5 (counting guards) that I would  be sure to forget one or more of.  The max distance that I have hiked in one day  is probably no more than 4-5 miles.  If I were  going to do some serious off-road hiking to get  to fishing water, I’m pretty sure that I would opt  to carry the waders in, since it would be inevitable  that I would destroy them otherwise (but first I  would have to have some serious work done on  one knee…).  The one disadvantage I  have in using bootfoots is  that I can’t switch between felt and studded soles.  So I used corkers for a while, which I couldn’t stand.  More recently I bought a pair of what looks like old-  fashioned galoshes with studs and a drawstring that  I slip on over the bootfeet (I think that Dan Bailey  distributes them).   They’re much more comfortable  and easy to slog through water in than corkers, but  I don’t believe that they work as well – too much metal  on the bottom so weight isn’t concentrated as well –  and the metal is quite soft, so it is abrading rather  quickly.  I’m pretty sure that I am going to buy another pair  of laced bootfoot waders soon and outfit one pair  with studs.

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HIYA guys I’ve always used bootfoot waders but I wonder if I’d be better off with stockingfoot. What do you folks use and why? Lou

Response:

HIYA guys I’ve always used bootfoot waders but I wonder if I’d be better off with stockingfoot. What do you folks use and why?

Stockingfoot allows you to wear a custom boot that has the best fit (including laces), and also to change boots.

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HIYA guys I’ve always used bootfoot waders but I wonder if I’d be better off with stockingfoot. What do you folks use and why? Lou

Stocking foot are best all around for convenience and comfort.Boot foot are best for cold water winter fishing and for fishing the beach.Why choose, it’s best to have both. Regards,  Flypaint(Shawn)

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Hi Lou, I have sold/fitted waders to anglers and hunters for 37 years now, but we specialize in waders for fly fishers now. Today in California we sell 100% stocking foot chest high breathable waders for fly fishing. A few years ago we sold only stocking foot neoprene waders and light weight non-breathable stocking foot waders. Boot foot waders are faster and easier to put on, but you don’t get the ankle support that you get with a lace up boot on a stocking foot wader  for walking long distances in trout streams. Also, it is hard to really fit people well with boot foot waders because you need to get the chest/body size right first, then the right inseam length and then the right boot size. We use to sell neoprene boot foot waders a little, but had them "custom" fitted. If you could order boot foot waders with your body size, inseam length and then a good boot fit, they are great for those fast situation where you don’ walk a lot. The story on hip boots is that everyone I know that has fished with me over the years has gone in over the top during a day of fly fishing in Northern California. It is either chest high stocking foot breathable waders or wade wet in northern California in the summer. We sell a few waist high waders a year now but with the onset of breathables it is not as necessary as it was with non-breathables. — Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento, CA, USA www.kiene.com

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – HIYA guys I’ve always used bootfoot waders but I wonder if I’d be better off with stockingfoot. What do you folks use and why? Lou

Response:

HIYA guys I’ve always used bootfoot waders but I wonder if I’d be better off with stockingfoot. What do you folks use and why? Lou

        stockingfoot.  because we wade wet down here after mid april, and thus need protection from the ankle up very infrequently.  if you ever hiked up to the middle falls on snowbird in late july, in even "breathable" chest high waders, you’d fully understand. wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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HIYA guys I’ve always used bootfoot waders but I wonder if I’d be better off with stockingfoot. What do you folks use and why? Lou stockingfoot.  because we wade wet down here after mid april, and thus need protection from the ankle up very infrequently.  if you ever hiked up to the middle falls on snowbird in late july, in even "breathable" chest high waders, you’d fully understand.

Quick word of caution…walking in shorts through briars and scrub that scratch the legs…then standing in biota rich pond water is a recipe for some interesting rash and infection…the notion of keeping alcohol pads back at the truck is a good one. — TBone Walker The Halfordian Golfer

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Guys Thanks to all of you who offered advice. I trust  the wisdom of this NG and will invest in some stocking foot waders and boots. BTW..I live in the Michigan’s Upper Peninsula, my old 5mm cold weather/ ice in the  river  waders are still in good shape but my summer ones are shot. I very often pack in my gear including waders on my back and them get organized streamside. Thanks again.. Lou

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – HIYA guys I’ve always used bootfoot waders but I wonder if I’d be better off with stockingfoot. What do you folks use and why? Lou stockingfoot.  because we wade wet down here after mid april, and thus need protection from the ankle up very infrequently.  if you ever hiked up to the middle falls on snowbird in late july, in even "breathable" chest high waders, you’d fully understand. Quick word of caution…walking in shorts through briars and scrub that scratch the legs…then standing in biota rich pond water is a recipe for some interesting rash and infection…the notion of keeping alcohol pads back at the truck is a good one. — TBone Walker The Halfordian Golfer

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Quick word of caution…walking in shorts through briars and scrub that scratch the legs…then standing in biota rich pond water is a recipe for some interesting rash and infection…the notion of keeping alcohol pads back at the truck is a good one. — TBone Walker The Halfordian Golfer

Taking a bottle of alcohol along to the stream has proved more popular it seems. TL MC

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Quick word of caution…walking in shorts through briars and scrub that scratch the legs…then standing in biota rich pond water is a recipe for some interesting rash and infection…the notion of keeping alcohol pads back at the truck is a good one. — TBone Walker The Halfordian Golfer Taking a bottle of alcohol along to the stream has proved more popular it seems.

I was refering to the ‘optional’ variety. — TBone Walker The Halfordian Golfer

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FWIW: Cabelas has a lace up bootfoot model this year too.

I was looking at those before everyone suggested that stocking foot was the way to go.. Any second thoughts from you guys?

I don’t have a second thought – I still prefer stocking foot.  For all the reasons previously mentioned, plus the EEEE show size I need<g. –Stan

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For what it is worth, the latest cabela’s catalog has laceup boot foots as well. Chris Richer – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Wet wading, even in late summer is not much of a option here in Michigan’s Western UP. The streams and rivers run cold.  Same in western NY and Ontario. The trout seem to like it but a guy can freeze his ass off in these waters. Going to take all the good advice and set up with stocking foot + boots.  Before you do you might want to take a quick look  at Orvis’s breathables with lace-up boot foots.

– Chris Richer chrisratnostormspamdotca

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Greg I was looking at those before everyone suggested that stocking foot was the way to go.. Any second thoughts from you guys? Lou

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – FWIW: Cabelas has a lace up bootfoot model this year too.   I see that they’re a heck of a lot cheaper,  and the boots (from the small photo) look  like they might provide better ankle support.

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Why Lou!  That’s for your annual bonefish trip to the Keys! Wayne to fish is human….to release Divine!! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Wayne & Others Wet wading, even in late summer is not much of a option here in Michigan’s Western UP. The streams and rivers run cold. The trout seem to like it but a guy can freeze his ass off in these waters. Going to take all the good advice and set up with stocking foot + boots. Lou

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 Before you do you might want to take a quick look  at Orvis’s breathables with lace-up boot foots.

FWIW: Cabelas has a lace up bootfoot model this year too.

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Wayne & Others Wet wading, even in late summer is not much of a option here in Michigan’s Western UP. The streams and rivers run cold. The trout seem to like it but a guy can freeze his ass off in these waters. Going to take all the good advice and set up with stocking foot + boots. Lou

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For may of the reasons already stated, go stocking foot.  Besides being able to change boot types and properly fit the boot, you can wet wade sans waders with a good boot in hot climes; maximum versatility.  As Bill recommended; go with breathables. Considere neoprene socks when wet wading with boots and keep in mind, some boots like Chota Brookies have removable insoles for use with and without waders. — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine! HIYA guys I’ve always used bootfoot waders but I wonder if I’d be better off with stockingfoot. What do you folks use and why? Lou

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… they are composed of poly-cotton with layers of codura on the knees and ass.  that’s because if you aren’t on the former when you fish, you aint gonna catch any of the latter, in hazel creek.

I fished all day on Hazel Creek, was on my knees most of the time and I STILL didn’t catch any ass. Need another lesson from the master, I guess. — Ken Fortenberry

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For may of the reasons already stated, go stocking foot.  Besides being able to change boot types and properly fit the boot, you can wet wade sans waders with a good boot in hot climes; maximum versatility.  As Bill recommended; go with breathables. Considere neoprene socks when wet wading with boots and keep in mind, some boots like Chota Brookies have removable insoles for use with and without waders. — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – HIYA guys I’ve always used bootfoot waders but I wonder if I’d be better off with stockingfoot. What do you folks use and why? Lou

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No reason you can’t use quick-dry long pants.  They even make ones that have zip-off bottoms (i.e. convertible to shorts.)

        actually, my "fishing pants" are what were originally designed as warm weather bird hunting pants:  they are composed of poly-cotton with layers of codura on the knees and ass.  that’s because if you aren’t on the former when you fish, you aint gonna catch any of the latter, in hazel creek.         what the hell, it’s after 6, and it’s been a long day. wayno

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Quick word of caution…walking in shorts through briars and scrub that scratch the legs…then standing in biota rich pond water is a recipe for some interesting rash and infection…the notion of keeping alcohol pads back at the truck is a good one.

No reason you can’t use quick-dry long pants.  They even make ones that have zip-off bottoms (i.e. convertible to shorts.)

Response:

stockingfoot.  because we wade wet down here after mid april, and thus need protection from the ankle up very infrequently.  if you ever hiked up to the middle falls on snowbird in late july, in even "breathable" chest high waders, you’d fully understand.

Good point.  I have used my wading boots without waders on quite a few occasions.

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Question:

Tuesday morning found only RW, Bruce and me in camp.  At breakfast, we met Kerry Evans a roffer from Colorado.  We headed back to the Texas Hole to fish the riffles in front of the first handicap ramp.  I started fishing without Bruce directing me — caught nothing.  When he came down, he placed me at the side of the main current.  On my first cast I was into a nice fish and managed to land a 20 inch bow, again with beautiful colors.  After awhile, Bruce moved us upstream to Big Rock Hole and the main current of the river.  RW, Bruce and I took some beautiful fish here.  We also lost two for every one we landed — the current was quite strong and with iddybiddy hooks it was difficult to land these big fish.  One brought me downstream about 50 yards.  As I stumbled/waded over the slippery rocks, RW hollered, "Hey, bring us back some chips and salsa and a couple of beers!"  I managed to finally net this giant football and in my excitement  reviving the fish, my net floated away!   I broke for lunch, but the two river maniacs stayed and continued to catch fish.  I met them in the flats above the KP after lunch and couldn’t believe that I was catching 20 inch fish in 16 inch deep water!   I moved back to the Texas Hole after awhile, and rigged up for some dry fly fishing.  I tied on a size 22 Adams parachute (Forty’s SJ fly) and cast to rising fish.  I managed to hook a few, but never landed one.  RW and Bruce collected me just before dark and we made our way back.  I left them at the parking lot and went back to the former Clave Central.  It was a lonely dinner and evening with no roffians about.  I fell asleep at 7:30 and awoke at 5:30. Apparently I was tired.  Happy, but very tired. Dave LaCourse Dave LaCourse

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(snip great report) Apparently I was tired.  Happy, but very tired. Dave LaCourse

Now THAT is the way to finish out a road trip!  :-) — Wayne To fish is human….To release Divine!

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Dave, i couldn’t imagine a better day than tuesday.  you caught more fish than i ever did in my first few days on that river.  it is fun in that current by the big rock – we lost several more each than we landed.  steve’s side is real tough because the fish are there, but you’ve only got about ten feet square of reasonable water around you and if the fish leaves the area, your chances are slim.  nice also that we all tended to pop out of the fish rather than break off, although our pockets were picked a few times each.  the flies are so small, louie thought he broke off the entire rig in a pig once, only to say "wait, i’ve still got one fly… no, maybe i’ve got both… yep, i’ve bruce h — bare your soul let your spirit burn out along the road to no return – r.e. keen

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Nice report Dave, thanks.  I share your feelings about catching beat up hatchery trout, even though they may be large ones taking tiny flies.  That’s what happens when a place becomes popular.  Keep all your honey holes a secret or they may turn out to be like the kiddy pool.  There is no substitute for wild trout. Ernie

Tuesday morning found only RW, Bruce and me in camp.  At breakfast, we met Kerry Evans a roffer from Colorado.

<great trip report snipped – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dave LaCourse

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[deleted] There is no substitute for wild trout.

The last week of November found me in a tourist town at the gates of a National Park near where I live.  There was a pond and a parking lot. In the parking lot was a large lit sign on a pole which read "Catch Wild Trout". And so I am left to conclude agreement with you on your sentiment Ernie. The one possible exception being the imagination. Your pal, — TimW Halfordian Golfer & Urban Forager It is impossible to catch and release a wild trout. A cash flow runs through it.

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Question:

My favorite river appears to have a hatch of what somebody told me was Crane Flys.  The insects torso hangs below the wings and the bottom of the torso comes around and looks like it connects with the thorax.  Imagine a flying J with wings on the top part of the J and you have the insect I am talking about. Does anybody have any information on these insects and if so, what patterns best imitate them. Thanks! Mike Wilson Fishing!! What else is there?

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FlyFis4fun: <<Does anybody have any information on these insects and if so, what patterns best imitate them. Patterns are in "Fly Patterns of Umpqua Feather Merchants", and Stewrt/Allen’s "Flies for trout".  Both adult and larva patterns are listed.  I can not imagine the crane fly as a major hatch, but if you say so…… Dave LaCourse

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My favorite river appears to have a hatch of what somebody told me was Crane Flys.  The insects torso hangs below the wings and the bottom of the torso comes around and looks like it connects with the thorax.  Imagine a flying J with wings on the top part of the J and you have the insect I am talking about.

If they are indeed crane flies, also know as "daddy long legs" they belong to the family tipulidae, and are terrestrials which often fall on the water in considerable numbers, especially when it is windy,  being very clumsy fliers.  They are often imitated using long trailing knotted pheasant tail or nylon legs, body, hackle, and hackle tip spent wings to match the colour, usually from light tan to dark brown, but olive and yellow variations are also common.  An excellent pattern may be made using detached buoyant mayfly bodies. TL MC

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Thanks for the information gentleman but it appears that the insect that I am seeing is something other then the Crane Fly.   The insect in question, as afore mentioned, is a pale tan to whiteish tan and flys with its torso bent around to connect near its thorax.  It hatches in fair numbers though I must admit, I have never seen any of them actually land on the water.  The primary food on this river is Stone Flys so this is more of a question exploration then anything else. Thanks for the help so far. Mike

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks for the information gentleman but it appears that the insect that I am seeing is something other then the Crane Fly. The insect in question, as afore mentioned, is a pale tan to whiteish tan and flys with its torso bent around to connect near its thorax.  It hatches in fair numbers though I must admit, I have never seen any of them actually land on the water.  The primary food on this river is Stone Flys so this is more of a question exploration then anything else. Thanks for the help so far. Mike

Hi Mike, how big is this insect ?  Does it hatch from the water, or does it just appear on the water ? TL MC

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Many Crane Fly species are terrestial, living in damp soil.  Aquatic species are usually found in streams with bottoms of fine gravel silt or sand.  Pupation usually takes place in damp soil along stream margins and is therefore of little account to the flyfisherperson. The larvae are simple and tube like and usually not available to fish as they burrow rather deeply and have no swimming abilities.  They are available during spates and may be represented by wooly worms.  The "Muskrat", an old Polly Rosborough pattern is another Crane Fly larva imitation.  Adults seem to be more available during light summer rains and may be represented by any appropriately sized and colored dry fly. As I write this I am watching a hiuge cranefly llumbering around the room….here in the Northwest there is a species that frequents lawns(well watered) and in climax years actually causes quite a bit of damage to the turf. Thanks for the information gentleman but it appears that the insect that I am seeing is something other then the Crane Fly.   The insect in question, as afore mentioned, is a pale tan to whiteish tan and flys with its torso bent around to connect near its thorax.  It hatches in fair numbers though I must admit, I have never seen any of them actually land on the water.  The primary food on this river is Stone Flys so this is more of a question exploration then anything else. Thanks for the help so far. Mike

– Mike in PDX "When the trout are lost, smash the state."                          Tom McGuane

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The insect in question, as afore mentioned, is a pale tan to whiteish tan and flys with its torso bent around to connect near its thorax.  It hatches in fair numbers though I must admit, I have never seen any of them actually land on the water.  The primary food on this river is Stone Flys so this is more of a question exploration then anything else. Thanks for the help so far. Mike

Hello Mike, I sometimes fish a limestone stream in Eastern Pennsylvania  where Orange Craneflys (orange head) gather in clusters all along the stream banks and edge of water.  The locals have an easy to tie pattern for the orange cranefly that is very effective..  Basically, your going to tie a dry fly without a tail or wings — just body, legs, & head.   Very lightly dubbed muskrat body with Dun colored hackle, use orange thread and build a small head.  I hope this helps. Dave

Response:

My favorite river appears to have a hatch of what somebody told me was Crane Flys.  The insects torso hangs below the wings and the bottom of the torso comes around and looks like it connects with the thorax.  Imagine a flying J with wings on the top part of the J and you have the insect I am talking about. If they are indeed crane flies, also know as "daddy long legs"

I don’t know about where you live, Mike, but in the US Crane Flies and Daddy Long Legs are not at all the same thing. Crane Flies actually have wings and fly. They look like gigantic mosquitoes, but they don’t bite. Daddy Long Legs look like large spiders (but they aren’t spiders). They don’t have wings.

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Crane Flies:   When I was in Ireland a few summers ago, the gillie taught me how to "dibble" for salmon: He put a relatively heavy wet fly at the end of my leader, and then a bushy dry fly on a dropper, about 6′ up from the tippet.   The idea was to use the wet fly as an anchor, and then bob the rod tip, so the dry fly danced on the surface of the water…on the surface one second, then suddenly 6" above, like a big bug jumping up and down on the water.   So I haven’t tried this over hear yet, frankly, but talking about it did lead to some interesting new information. I told this story to George Anderson,   and he said  "Sure, the guys over in Dillon (MT) have been fishing the crane fly hatch on the Beaverhead that way for years!" — /* Sandy Pittendrigh                  –oO0  * http://www.nervana.montana.edu/~sandy  */

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They look like giant mosquitoes…so how about a size 2 mosquito??? George

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Fish the larvae The trout eat them Lots easier to tie too… a Beaver leech — Free Lake Fly Fishing On-Line Magazine Lake Fly Fishing CD’s, Videos, Books http://www.rural.escape.ca/angling_north/fishing/organz.htm

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Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello All,     I must first say that have been reading ROFF rather religiously the past couple weeks and have found it to be extremely beneficial to my fly fishing. Many of my own queries have been addressed here.  Thank you.     Anyway, now to my question.  I have been fishing a particular stream with nice smallmouth in it for years now.  I have exclusively used ultra-light takle for this stream and have been extremely successful.  Now that I am more into flyfishing, I now want move on and try out some flys on this stream, but being as I have mainly flyfished for the rainbows of East Tennessee, I am somewhat at a loss for what types of flys to use.     I was wondering if anyone would have some suggestions for what are some good, general, "ol’ trusty" flys for catching smallmouth out of streams? Any bit of information will be greatly appreciated!                                                                 Thanks *BOB*

Hi Bob, I prefer to take them on top if I can. I would try something about one inch long like a hopper or dry muddler.  A friend that was working back East for a few years found out they liked the steelhead dry fly called the ‘Bomber’. It is spun and clipped grey deer hair body with a grizzly palmered hackle in about a size #6 or 8. I also used a light colored medium sized hard bodied popper on the lower umpqua River in Oregon. Early morning and late evening is best on top. Under water I would try a Whitlock Near-nuff Crayfish, weighted brown Wolly Bugger, Clouser Minnow or Big brown Rubberleg Nymph. Something weighted that is big, buggy and black or brown? I have also heard that they can be caught on most trout patterns at times.

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   I must first say that have been reading ROFF rather religiously the past couple weeks and have found it to be extremely beneficial to my fly fishing.

LOL! We must be slipping! [snipped]    I was wondering if anyone would have some suggestions for what are some good, general, "ol’ trusty" flys for catching smallmouth out of streams? Any bit of information will be greatly appreciated!

My experience with stream smallies (eg: Housatonic, Contoocook) has been that whatever I’m using for trout will generally work with the small mouths (in fact when I’m aiming for the trout the smallies seem to get to my fly first). If I’m aiming to hook up with small mouths, big flies (especially soggy ones) seem to work best. Woolly Buggers/Bombers, Deceivers, Matukas, Muddlers (my favorite), Wool-head Sculpins, etc. For dry flies, terrestrials (hoppers, beetles, flying ants, etc) have worked for me, along with the more "trouty" patterns. hth! /daytripper

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    Anyway, now to my question.  I have been fishing a particular stream with nice smallmouth in it for years now.  I have exclusively used ultra-light takle for this stream and have been extremely successful.

What did you use that was so sucessful?  Try imitating it.  Crayfish? Try a crayfish pattern (complicated to tie) or just a weighted woolybugger fished slowly in  crayfish colors.  Appropriately colored (weighted if necessary) wooly buggers can also imitate hellgramites or leeches. Floating Rapalas? A streamer in the colors of your most sucessful plugs might do the trick- a generic baitfish imitation will have a light underside and dark back, maybe some flashabou or a tinsel wrapped hooked or mylar body.  I find that smallmouths will eagerly strike dries and nymphs if drifting nearby, but are more likely to chase larger flies over some distance.  A floating muddler minnow, slightly waking the surface at the end of the downstream swing sometimes works really well.  In general I’ve had the best experiences with down-n-across presentations.  Since you have been an ultralight fisherman, you should be familiar with a "color" available in soft plastics called "pumpkinseed".  Some folks really like chartreuse but I typically stick to earth tones.  Was that too vague?  My best wooly bugger this year: #8 2x streamer hook.  Light olive, medium sized chenille body.  Very light olive (almost appears yellow in the water) marabou tail with (soft) red palmered hackle. Mu Young Lee             Ann Arbor, MI   USA

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Try size 8-4 clousers in brown orange and Chartreuse and white. Also, Woolly Buggers in brown, black, and olive in sizes 10-6 are good. And you can’t go wrong with deer hair bugs DAYGLOW York Team DBE

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Hello All,     I must first say that have been reading ROFF rather religiously the past couple weeks and have found it to be extremely beneficial to my fly fishing. Many of my own queries have been addressed here.  Thank you.     Anyway, now to my question.  I have been fishing a particular stream with nice smallmouth in it for years now.  I have exclusively used ultra-light takle for this stream and have been extremely successful.  Now that I am more into flyfishing, I now want move on and try out some flys on this stream, but being as I have mainly flyfished for the rainbows of East Tennessee, I am somewhat at a loss for what types of flys to use.     I was wondering if anyone would have some suggestions for what are some good, general, "ol’ trusty" flys for catching smallmouth out of streams? Any bit of information will be greatly appreciated!                                                                 Thanks *BOB*

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I’ve had luck with such flies as Bitch Creek, Wooly Buggers, and streamers. I kinda concoct my own fly that is basically a bunch of dubbing wrapped aound the shank of the hook with a maribou tail, usually in black, size 4-6. You can weight them for deeper waters if needed. Minnow patterns usually work good, I’ll make that same fly and add some flashabou to it as an attractor. Hope that helps. Chris – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello All,     I must first say that have been reading ROFF rather religiously the past couple weeks and have found it to be extremely beneficial to my fly fishing. Many of my own queries have been addressed here.  Thank you.     Anyway, now to my question.  I have been fishing a particular stream with nice smallmouth in it for years now.  I have exclusively used ultra-light takle for this stream and have been extremely successful.  Now that I am more into flyfishing, I now want move on and try out some flys on this stream, but being as I have mainly flyfished for the rainbows of East Tennessee, I am somewhat at a loss for what types of flys to use.     I was wondering if anyone would have some suggestions for what are some good, general, "ol’ trusty" flys for catching smallmouth out of streams? Any bit of information will be greatly appreciated!                                                                 Thanks *BOB*

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download headers until you get to the thread posted by Todd Arnold on July 15….folks responded pretty goo to that one and it contains a variety of tips… and then look for a book titled, "Smallmouth strategies for the

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Question:

Hello RBPers! I read this post just the other day, especially the part regarding Old Towns being heavier than announced, and decided to check for myself. So I weighed my 17′ Penobscot, advertised at 65 lbs, and whaddaya know? It weighed 65 pounds! So, at least in this particular instance (and assuming the scale was accurate, etc.) Old Town’s number appears to be correct. Of course, as they say, your mileage may vary, but I’ve been very happy with the Penobscot.  It is my family’s first canoe, and we have had a lot of fun with it. And that, to me, is what it is all about.

Well, Our 16 ft Penobscot is a heavy dog.  I weighed it and it came to almost 75 lbs. It’s advertised at 63 lbs. The only additions are flotation and knee pads. I’m still trying figure out why its such a lump of lead! Eric L. Nilson Remove {Remove-to-mail} for email

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Thanks for your reply and comments, Andrew! I just didn’t want new folks (not unlike myself) to dismiss a manufacturer out-of-hand based upon one model or experience. I used RBP as one of my sources in selecting the Penobscot, so I truly believe people’s experiences here are valuable. Regarding materials, I think I would have liked to have been able to justify the Kevlar, but two to three times the price was just too much. I don’t know much about Kevlar’s real-life durability, but the weight reduction would have been nice. Maybe one of these days… Anyway, thanks again and let’s hope for an early spring! Carl Seals – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello RBPers! I read this post just the other day, especially the part regarding Old Towns being heavier than announced, and decided to check for myself. So I weighed my 17′ Penobscot, advertised at 65 lbs, and whaddaya know? It weighed 65 pounds! So, at least in this particular instance (and assuming the scale was accurate, etc.) Old Town’s number appears to be correct. Of course, as they say, your mileage may vary, but I’ve been very happy with the Penobscot.  It is my family’s first canoe, and we have had a lot of fun with it. And that, to me, is what it is all about. Happy paddline! Carl Seals Don’t take Old Town’s weights seriosly, it will be heavier than announced. When I said that, I meant specifically Old Town’s Discovery (polyethylene) boats.  The Penobscot is Royalex, so their weights for those boats may be accurate.  I’ve picked up Penobscots, and 65 lbs seems a reasonable amount (nicely designed boats too).  The 15-8 Discovery’s I’ve picked up are as difficult to lift as my friends wood-canvas boat (that is 80 lbs plus).  Old Town puts the weight of their Discovery’s much lower, about the same as their Royalex boats, even though the polyethylene is a much heavier material. — Delete all the occurences of the letter q to reply. — Andrew (no q) Gooding

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I am about to buy a new canoe and am looking at the following four canoes: Mad River- Tahoe 14 37 inch beam wt 55lbs OldTown- Camper 16 36 inch beam wt 59lbs Novacraft-Angler 15 37 inch beam wt 54 lbs Wenonah-Fisherman 14 39 inch beam wt 62lbs I am a fly fisherman so with these canoes am looking for stability and ease of lifting and carrying. I would very much appreciate any input anyone has on these canoes to assist me in making my choice. Regards Gene Rogers

Hi Gene; One thing I outta say as long as we are talking about opinions, is; Like an old guide told me once, learn to cast sitting down, don’t argue, just do it. He was right of course. Casting while kneeling is not such a big task and makes flyfishing from a canoe a lot safer and more enjoyable. That said, of the boats you mentioned, the only one I have first hand experience with is the Old Town. I notice that it is the longest. Superficially at least, this indicates that it may be the fastest, and you can always learn to turn a fast boat, but you can never make a slow boat fast. This quality is important for dealing with wind, attainments in current and such. This is also a truism and therefore not always the case. I note that all the boats you mention are within a few pounds of the Old Town, which to me, knowing only what you have presented, makes it my choice. Anyway, there are some opinions for you. Have fun :wq

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Mad River- Tahoe 14 37 inch beam wt 55lbs OldTown- Camper 16 36 inch beam wt 59lbs Novacraft-Angler 15 37 inch beam wt 54 lbs Wenonah-Fisherman 14 39 inch beam wt 62lbs

I bought an OldTown Pathfinder for much the same purpose (it’s a shorter version of the Camper) and it was fine until I got hooked on canoeing and less interested in fishing.  I still flyfish from my Mad River Explorer. Stability has never been a problem, but switching between the fly rod and the paddle can be a nuisance…

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Hello RBPers! I read this post just the other day, especially the part regarding Old Towns being heavier than announced, and decided to check for myself. So I weighed my 17′ Penobscot, advertised at 65 lbs, and whaddaya know? It weighed 65 pounds! So, at least in this particular instance (and assuming the scale was accurate, etc.) Old Town’s number appears to be correct. Of course, as they say, your mileage may vary, but I’ve been very happy with the Penobscot.  It is my family’s first canoe, and we have had a lot of fun with it. And that, to me, is what it is all about. Happy paddline! Carl Seals I’d get the boat in fiberglass, the Fisherman is, not sure about the NovaCraft.  Don’t take Old Town’s weights seriosly, it will be heavier than announced.  Plastic, whether polyethylene or Royalex, will be less abrasion resistant, heavier, less repairable and will not hold its shape like a good fiberglass boat, like the Wenonah.  They’re only good for dropping off buildings, running into with your SUV, or paddling whitewater.  A good fiberglass boat will last for years. — Delete all the occurences of the letter q to reply. — Andrew (no q) Gooding

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello RBPers! I read this post just the other day, especially the part regarding Old Towns being heavier than announced, and decided to check for myself. So I weighed my 17′ Penobscot, advertised at 65 lbs, and whaddaya know? It weighed 65 pounds! So, at least in this particular instance (and assuming the scale was accurate, etc.) Old Town’s number appears to be correct. Of course, as they say, your mileage may vary, but I’ve been very happy with the Penobscot.  It is my family’s first canoe, and we have had a lot of fun with it. And that, to me, is what it is all about. Happy paddline! Carl Seals

Don’t take Old Town’s weights seriosly, it will be heavier than announced.

When I said that, I meant specifically Old Town’s Discovery (polyethylene) boats.  The Penobscot is Royalex, so their weights for those boats may be accurate.  I’ve picked up Penobscots, and 65 lbs seems a reasonable amount (nicely designed boats too).  The 15-8 Discovery’s I’ve picked up are as difficult to lift as my friends wood-canvas boat (that is 80 lbs plus).  Old Town puts the weight of their Discovery’s much lower, about the same as their Royalex boats, even though the polyethylene is a much heavier material. — Delete all the occurences of the letter q to reply. — Andrew (no q) Gooding

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I’d get the boat in fiberglass, the Fisherman is, not sure about the NovaCraft.  Don’t take Old Town’s weights seriosly, it will be heavier than announced.  Plastic, whether polyethylene or Royalex, will be less abrasion resistant, heavier, less repairable and will not hold its shape                       ^^^^^^^ That’s not true, is it???

Yes, plastic, especially Old Town’s polyethylene as used in the Discovery series is the heaviest widely used canoe material.  Royalex is less so, but still heavy.  I’d try lifting the boats in question.  The 15-8 Discovery is listed at 72 lbs, but weighs closer to 85.  A Grumman 17′ is significantly lighter. — Delete all the occurences of the letter q to reply. — Andrew (no q) Gooding

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     I’m not sure I understand the context here but David asks if it is true that royalex canoes will be less abrasion resistant than glass boats.  Well, I am one abrasion producing mojo and,  having both a glass WW boat (an Edge) and a royalite Rival,  I am here to tell you that the Rival takes abuse that would put the Edge back on the sawhorses for a serious session of patch and curse.  I wish that weren’t true because I love the Edge (even though it is much less forgiving) but theroyalex/royalite will take the beating much better.      I agree that your Old Town plastic boat might weigh more than they say.  I also think that glasas takes hits better than many , dare I say it, New Schoolers, might think.  But, for the big whap, like after the boof where there turns out to be one inch rather than one foot of landing water, plastic is better.  For flat water though, no question, go with glass or kevlar.. Chris Kelly

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’d get the boat in fiberglass, the Fisherman is, not sure about the NovaCraft.  Don’t take Old Town’s weights seriosly, it will be heavier than announced.  Plastic, whether polyethylene or Royalex, will be less abrasion resistant, heavier, less repairable and will not hold its shape like a good fiberglass boat, like the Wenonah.  They’re only good for dropping off buildings, running into with your SUV, or paddling whitewater.  A good fiberglass boat will last for years. I feel that’s a little extreme.  He feels that weight is a problem. Being that most canoes are tandem and will be portaged and shuttled that way, an 85 pound canoe would be little problem to most folks. Weight is more of a consideration to individual kayakers.  Plastic or Royalex are good, sound choices; fiberglass is too breakable.

He’s not doing whitewater, he is using the canoe solo (I hope with a 14′ boat).  Usually one person gets the boat off the car, so heavy canoe are a problem.  Good fiberglass cloth layups (not chopper gun cheapies) are plenty strong.  A friend has been using his in whitewater for 10 years. To say they’re too "breakable" menas either you have little expereince with good fiberglass, or you are assuming the boat should be completely idiot proof, which I am not claiming. — Delete all the occurences of the letter q to reply. — Andrew (no q) Gooding

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I’d get the boat in fiberglass, the Fisherman is, not sure about the NovaCraft.  Don’t take Old Town’s weights seriosly, it will be heavier than announced.  Plastic, whether polyethylene or Royalex, will be less abrasion resistant, heavier, less repairable and will not hold its shape like a good fiberglass boat, like the Wenonah.  They’re only good for dropping off buildings, running into with your SUV, or paddling whitewater.  A good fiberglass boat will last for years.

I feel that’s a little extreme.  He feels that weight is a problem. Being that most canoes are tandem and will be portaged and shuttled that way, an 85 pound canoe would be little problem to most folks. Weight is more of a consideration to individual kayakers.  Plastic or Royalex are good, sound choices; fiberglass is too breakable.

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I am about to buy a new canoe and am looking at the following four canoes: Mad River- Tahoe 14 37 inch beam wt 55lbs OldTown- Camper 16 36 inch beam wt 59lbs Novacraft-Angler 15 37 inch beam wt 54 lbs Wenonah-Fisherman 14 39 inch beam wt 62lbs I am a fly fisherman so with these canoes am looking for stability and ease of lifting and carrying. I would very much appreciate any input anyone has on these canoes to assist me in making my choice. Regards Gene Rogers

 Gene,  My opinion kind of originates from the perspective of *do you want to be seated or kneeling?*…  With the comfortable knee_pads sold today, I would find the kneeling position much more stable a platform in which to throw line out of…IMHO…particularly in dealing with casting itself…much more comfortable too, thus ..IMHO..I’d stay away from the flat barges…and go with a well designed kevlar.  A well designed hull with rock-solid secondary stablility gives me infinitely more security than sitting in a Camper… where I had to stay as still as I could when sitting…staying still while sitting?…trying to throw line..???? It just never worked for me…With the sensitive area being your top-heavy sitting position…your arm/shoulder area becomes a focal point of solidity…..??  when trying to set a #22 baetis emerger with a tight arm..??? good luck… $.02, steve drossel

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I am about to buy a new canoe and am looking at the following four canoes: Mad River- Tahoe 14 37 inch beam wt 55lbs OldTown- Camper 16 36 inch beam wt 59lbs Novacraft-Angler 15 37 inch beam wt 54 lbs Wenonah-Fisherman 14 39 inch beam wt 62lbs I am a fly fisherman so with these canoes am looking for stability and ease of lifting and carrying. I would very much appreciate any input anyone has on these canoes to assist me in making my choice. Regards Gene Rogers Home Page URL: http://members.tripod.com/caddis1

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Gene, I own a Wenonah Spirit II in their Tuff-Weave material, basically reinforced fiberglass.  It is a very fine boat, and I would recommend Wenonah highly – though you didn’t say what material you were considering for the Fisherman.  I also like the OldTown Camper – in fact, I’m thinking of selling my Wenonah to buy a Camper, for both the added durability of Royalex, and because I can get the Camper in olive drab with stained seats and thwarts, which will be an advantage when duck hunting from it. One thing to watch out for – with the shorter, wider boats, you get more stability at the expense of paddling efficiency.  Personally, I wouldn’t go any wider than the 36 inch Camper, nor shorter than 16 feet, but then again, I’d give up some stability for paddling efficiency. Good Luck! Lou – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am about to buy a new canoe and am looking at the following four canoes: Mad River- Tahoe 14 37 inch beam wt 55lbs OldTown- Camper 16 36 inch beam wt 59lbs Novacraft-Angler 15 37 inch beam wt 54 lbs Wenonah-Fisherman 14 39 inch beam wt 62lbs I am a fly fisherman so with these canoes am looking for stability and ease of lifting and carrying. I would very much appreciate any input anyone has on these canoes to assist me in making my choice. Regards Gene Rogers Home Page URL: http://members.tripod.com/caddis1

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hi Eugene ,         i would also look at the Swift Algonquin series,probably the i6 ft. it will weigh less then these even in their swift tech and stronger. Check out                         www.swiftcanoe.com  Note that prices will be in canadian dollars.                                         Bo Sinanan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am about to buy a new canoe and am looking at the following four canoes: Mad River- Tahoe 14 37 inch beam wt 55lbs OldTown- Camper 16 36 inch beam wt 59lbs Novacraft-Angler 15 37 inch beam wt 54 lbs Wenonah-Fisherman 14 39 inch beam wt 62lbs I am a fly fisherman so with these canoes am looking for stability and ease of lifting and carrying. I would very much appreciate any input anyone has on these canoes to assist me in making my choice. Regards Gene Rogers Home Page URL: http://members.tripod.com/caddis1

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Which one felt best when you tried it? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am about to buy a new canoe and am looking at the following four canoes: Mad River- Tahoe 14 37 inch beam wt 55lbs OldTown- Camper 16 36 inch beam wt 59lbs Novacraft-Angler 15 37 inch beam wt 54 lbs Wenonah-Fisherman 14 39 inch beam wt 62lbs I am a fly fisherman so with these canoes am looking for stability and ease of lifting and carrying. I would very much appreciate any input anyone has on these canoes to assist me in making my choice. Regards Gene Rogers Home Page URL: http://members.tripod.com/caddis1

patrickatcyberhighwaydotnet

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I’d get the boat in fiberglass, the Fisherman is, not sure about the NovaCraft.  Don’t take Old Town’s weights seriosly, it will be heavier than announced.  Plastic, whether polyethylene or Royalex, will be less abrasion resistant, heavier, less repairable and will not hold its shape like a good fiberglass boat, like the Wenonah.  They’re only good for dropping off buildings, running into with your SUV, or paddling whitewater.  A good fiberglass boat will last for years. — Delete all the occurences of the letter q to reply. — Andrew (no q) Gooding

Response:

I’d get the boat in fiberglass, the Fisherman is, not sure about the NovaCraft.  Don’t take Old Town’s weights seriosly, it will be heavier than announced.  Plastic, whether polyethylene or Royalex, will be less abrasion resistant, heavier, less repairable and will not hold its shape

                      ^^^^^^^ That’s not true, is it??? like a good fiberglass boat, like the Wenonah.  They’re only good for dropping off buildings, running into with your SUV, or paddling whitewater.  A good fiberglass boat will last for years. — Delete all the occurences of the letter q to reply. — Andrew (no q) Gooding

David

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Question:

Does anyone know where i can order some caddis and/or mayfly larvae? thanks.

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Try contacting people that do trout streams, etc. Also Trout Unlimited may give you some names. If you dont need to many go to the nearest trout stream and pick them. Caddis larvae are easy to pick and they usually in large numbers. Good luck

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Does anyone know where i can order some caddis and/or mayfly larvae? thanks.

You can also look in Fly Fishing magazine in ads. People that do trout streams have ads there. ZB

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go to your nearest river or stream and try picking the nymphs and larvae off of the bottom of rocks.  I was wondering, do you want these to provide fish with a source of food?

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Does anyone know where i can order some caddis and/or mayfly larvae? thanks.

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Try contacting people that do trout streams, etc. Also Trout Unlimited may give you some names. If you dont need to many go to the nearest trout stream and pick them. Caddis larvae are easy to pick and they usually in large numbers. Good luck

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Does anyone know where i can order some caddis and/or mayfly larvae? thanks.

You can also look in Fly Fishing magazine in ads. People that do trout streams have ads there. ZB

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go to your nearest river or stream and try picking the nymphs and larvae off of the bottom of rocks.  I was wondering, do you want these to provide fish with a source of food?

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Question:

Question:

Greetings, I’m moving to southeastern S. Dakota in a couple of weeks.  Any good suggestionsfor flyfishing opportunities to start with?  I’m not much into big water walleye spin fishing that I hear so much of in that part of the country.  Any trout? thanks,        curt Curt Anderson Dept. of Biological Sciences Northern Arizona University Flagstaff, AZ  86011

I think that there are some nice small streams in the Black Hills. William Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA

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Curt, you’re along way from any trout.  Best try to find a good farm pond or small lake for some bluegills and bass.

How about trying Northeastern Nebraska. The State of Nebraska  has a page on fishing and hunting in the state. http:/adm-server.ngpc.state.ne.us/ I took a peek about six months ago and noticed that they stock streams in the northeastern part of Nebraska. Maybe South Dakota does somthing similar in tributaries to the Missouri?

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Greetings, I’m moving to southeastern S. Dakota in a couple of weeks.  Any good suggestionsfor flyfishing opportunities to start with?  I’m not much into big water walleye spin fishing that I hear so much of in that part of the country.  Any trout? thanks,         curt Curt Anderson Dept. of Biological Sciences Northern Arizona University Flagstaff, AZ  86011

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Question:

Question: In tying a prince nymph, what materials should be used in place of where the usual hackle would go? i.e. behind the eye of the hook. I’ve noticed two materials used on the fly, but I don’t know what they are. Your help would be much appreciated. –Scott in Arkansas or

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The original pattern called for brown hackle (2-3 turns) tied in shinny side forward and pulled back wet fly style. I have substituted both soft hen hackle and partridge. The partridge tied in beard style. No appreciable difference in effectiveness. **  Vic Brockett        <<<  I fish therefore I am ** **  Vic’s Fly-By-Night  <<<  Read "The River Why"   **

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Do you mean, "Over-dressed?"

Heck no, the dressing is fine. The problem here is having the flies shaped like pizza-chowing beer-guzzling yuppie american fly fishers. (‘;’) Thomas Gilg 2001

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Do you mean, "Over-dressed?" Heck no, the dressing is fine. The problem here is having the flies shaped like pizza-chowing beer-guzzling yuppie american fly fishers.

Send ‘em cross-country skiing… TC, R PS: What do they use to imitate the tobacco drool?  Of course, if they just imitate the female, is this "matching the snatch"?

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Remember that most flies for sale are tied "fat and juicy" to entice the buyer, and not necessarily the fish.

You very rarely see a real Sawyer pheasant tail, for example.

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Remember that most flies for sale are tied "fat and juicy" to entice the buyer, and not necessarily the fish. You very rarely see a real Sawyer pheasant tail, for example.

_____  True. There are also, a great number of ‘Commercial tied flies’ that use shortcuts that depict an ‘Adams’ for example, but the fly is tied incorrectly.  Again, for example some Adams have deer hair tails, others barred, etc. and many do NOT use Muskrat for the body dubbing as they should.  If its gray, that’s good enough, is the thinking. wrong. This is one of many reason its best to learn how to ‘roll your own,’ as I always say. — (C) George Gehrke 2001 http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html     fine bamboo flyrods & blanks

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This is one of many reason its best to learn how to ‘roll your own,’ as I always say.

Yes, yes. That would explain a lot.

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This is one of many reason its best to learn how to ‘roll your own,’ as I always say.

But in such cases, isn’t fatter better ? Thomas Gilg

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Remember that most flies for sale are tied "fat and juicy" to entice the buyer, and not necessarily the fish.  I have heard several fly-fishing/entomologist authors comment that the #1 problem with store bought flies is how fat they are. Thomas Gilg

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Remember that most flies for sale are tied "fat and juicy" to entice the buyer, and not necessarily the fish.  I have heard several fly-fishing/entomologist authors comment that the #1 problem with store bought flies is how fat they are. Thomas Gilg

_______  Do you mean, "Over-dressed?" — (C) George Gehrke 2001 http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html     fine bamboo flyrods & blanks

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I’m doing some tying for the spring.  I have a question about the prince nymph in sizes larger than a #14 hook: The store bought flies I have seen in the larger sizes seem rather robust in the body.  Is that from lead wire underbody, or is it just a pile of herl wrapped around the shank?  Easier asking here than to pick one apart! Peter Collin

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I’m doing some tying for the spring.  I have a question about the prince nymph in sizes larger than a #14 hook: The store bought flies I have seen in the larger sizes seem rather robust in the body.  Is that from lead wire underbody, or is it just a pile of herl wrapped around the shank?  Easier asking here than to pick one

apart! I have seen them done with both lead and dubbing underneath to help give them that "robust" look.  I actually tie them both ways depending on whether I need something to get down deep or something for shallower water.

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Question:

Hi gang: Since moving to Oregon I have been doing alot more fly fishing and I began to see the advantages of a drift boat or the like.  However Drift boats take up alot of space and require a trailer and cost$$$.  I have always enjoyed rafting and surf kyaking so it seemed logical to look at canoes.  What I need is something that can handle the equipment for fishing and camping for a few days and the ability to handle upto class III rapids. Am I dreaming?  Do any of you folks fish from a canoe and have some suggestions on what to look for.  I am willing to give up some initial stability for whitewater capability as most of the rivers I fish have at least a couple of class III and IV rapids. Thanx in advance! charles.

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Hey If you find one let me know..I love fishing bones in a canoe..use an electric troller… and I’m due for a new one.

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Canoes are great watercraft, but not the best fishing craft on streams.  I have a Mad River Explorer which I love, but it is quite difficult for a single person, i.e. stern paddler to manage the canoe in fast water and at the same time place the fisherman in the bow in optimal position to fish holding water.  This is particularly true if the canoe is loaded down with camping gear.  If fishing is you primary use, I would recommend a raft with rowing frame.  It takes up less space than a canoe or driftboat and you could probably pick up one at an end-of-season sale for little more than you’d spend for a canoe capable of negotiating whitewater safely.  On the other hand, if you mostly want to float and *stop* to fish likely areas, the canoe is faster and more fun.  Hope this helps.  One thing to remember is that you won’t stop at Class III if you’re like most of us.   Longspeer

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I fish from canoes quite a bit but in somewhat different waters (ozark streams). My  experience is  that flyfishing while solo paddling required a canoe with good tracking otherwise one ends up having to correct my course during almost every cast. However note that  to run class III rapids you will probably want a play boat with plenty of rocker unless you are exceptionally good on a canoe. I have no solution for this opposing requirements. For what is worth, I use a Mad River Malacite. RioSimpson.

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I used to have an Old Town Katahdin that I could stand in easily.  It has a 41" beam and is a good buy for the money!

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writes: Canoes are great watercraft, but not the best fishing craft on

streams.  I……Longspeer   I Have to Agree that a canoe of any type would be less than ideal for fishing in most faster water.  Rafts are much more stable and forgiving when your attention is on that HUGE trout you have on.  We used to count on going swimming if we took a canoe, and we were on pretty tame waters.  I usually fish from a drift boat, but have fished from rafts and, if set up right, they are great! Steve May

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Check out Aquaterra’s kayaks: Keowee, Keowee II and Gemini or Jocasse. I’ve had a Gemini, a two person 16′ kayak with a single 6′ opening, for six years or so. The big advantage over a canoe is that it’s less influenced by wind. It’s very stable and has a comfortable seating position. Downside: a little on the heavy side 65# and not very practical to carry overhead like a canoe but you can drag it just about over any type of terrain without worrying about damage. Glenn Lemke Manchester, VT

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I agre with Glenn on the advantage of a Sea Kayak over a canoe.  I have an Aquaterra Chinook, BUT–if you ever hook into the bow portion, and I’ve done it with a clumsey cast, you’re screwed!  For all around use in flatwater of 50acres or less–the float tube is probably the way to go.

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Charles: I’ve done considerable fishing from my Mad River "Courier" and it would be an excellent boat for what you want. It was designed to be an extended wilderness tripping boat. It is tough and handles rapids very well and has a semi-v bottom characteristic of Mad River canoes. The construction is of Royalex (or Mad River’s equivalent) so it will take a beating and keep on ticking. I use mine for camping, fishing and just tooting around. I would definitely buy another. Richard Warren Raleigh, NC

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I am the one that suggested a Mad Rive Courier canoe. I forgot to add that this is a solo canoe. Buy yourself one of those cheap short paddles about 24" long to correct your drift with. It is a lot easier than reaching for a long heavy paddle. Richard Warren Raleigh, NC

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