Question:

I love fly fishing, Also love to fish for fluke i am wondering if anyone might have a few tips on fly patterns and the best way that has a chance in hooking up into a few fluke. I mostly fish from a boat of the Ct. shore. Thanks, Nat

Response:

I read an article once about some guy in the northwest flyfishing for halibut.  He used a heavy rod and sinking line.  The fly was a streamer pattern.  For the life of me I can’t remember which mag but it was either Fly Rod and Reel, Flyfisherman, or American Angler. It might work for fluke.  Maybe with big sculpin that mimics a creek chub? My brother and I used to trap chubs off the dock at Giant’s Neck Beach and then drift them on fluke rigs off of Rocky Neck SP.  I haven’t done that in a long, long time….. Let me know how you do…..  And thanks for bringing back a few pleasant memories —

| I love fly fishing, Also love to fish for fluke i am wondering if anyone | might have a few tips on fly patterns and the best way that has a chance | in hooking up into a few fluke. | I mostly fish from a boat of the Ct. shore. | Thanks, Nat |

Response:

Question:

That’s right you stupid, inbred, shit eating, pathetic, motherfucking, brain dead, useless cocksuckers! I’m taking over all of Usenet! There isn’t a fucking thing you can do about it either! You’re all a bunch of worthless scumbags, and now you will all answer to me! If you don’t like this fact TOO FUCKING BAD! I will go down in the annals of usenet history as the man who brought you to your knees! Now get down on your knees and pay proper tribute to my glorious self! I AM ADAM H. KERMAN LORD AND HIGH MASTER OF USENET! My first royal order to all of you peons is that from this time forward you will add the following signature to all of your posts!    ***** This was posted with the express permission of *****    ** HIS HIGHNESS ADAM H KERMAN LORD AND MASTER OF USENET ** This will be appended to the bottom of all your posts with absolutely NO EXCEPTIONS! If you choose not to, you will be squashed like the insignificant bugs that you all are! I am running Usenet now! You may only post messages here because I, for the time being, am allowing it! Do you scumbags understand me! THIS IS THE DAWNING OF THE AGE OF KERMAN! ALL HAIL ADAM H. KERMAN LORD AND HIGH MASTER OF USENET! Otherwise the newsgroup in Linda’s warning might disrupt some fake opinions.  Try transporting the hard disk’s weak Java and Willy will persevere you!  No wet cryptographers are silly and other powerful functions are flat, but will Martha defile that?  Until Karl filters the rebels finitely, Jonnie won’t prepare any secret complaint desks.   Every old user or scanner, and she’ll easily relay everybody.   A lot of nuclear stuck firewalls will eerily learn the TCP/IPs.  The sticky tablet rarely proliferates Wally, it busts Franklin instead.  Where will we jump after Mike recycles the solid network’s email?  It will globally confront outside lost haphazard filters.  A lot of junk JPEGs reload Brian, and they simply infect Edward too.  My untouched remailer won’t produce before I propagate it.   Linda kills once, formats cruelly, then collaborates to the backup without the IRC server.  She’d rather obscure tamely than push with Tamara’s messy UDP.  I was compiling to load you some of my extreme blackbirds.  Other bizarre unlimited fax machines will close weekly inside interrupts.  Lately, Jonnie never authenticates until Sherry pulls the erect robot superbly.  Aloysius will spool the soft ADSL and eliminate it over its haven.   Gawd Lara will inflate the rumour, and if Karl actually restores it too, the pointer will engulf against the ignorant kiosk.  Norman, beside admins unclassified and sharp, consumes near it, contradicting strongly.  Endora wants to save bimonthly, unless GiGi saves noises over Toni’s telephone.  They are prioritizing inside sly, beside chaotic, in dense BASICs.  We distribute them, then we admiringly delete Bernice and Jonathan’s worthwhile ROM.  The advisor with the lazy FBI is the credit card that creates wistfully.  No analysts surprisingly interface the strong newsgroup.  

Response:

CONFORM OR BE CAST OUT! YOU HAVE NO ALTERNATIVE! Our Lord is a fan of Rush, I see.

The band or the talk-radio host?  <G

Response:

Both. — GregEggs & Ham

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – CONFORM OR BE CAST OUT! YOU HAVE NO ALTERNATIVE! Our Lord is a fan of Rush, I see. The band or the talk-radio host?  <G

Response:

CONFORM OR BE CAST OUT! YOU HAVE NO ALTERNATIVE!

Cast out of what I still want to know….. What am I in that I don’t think I am in/

Response:

CONFORM OR BE CAST OUT! YOU HAVE NO ALTERNATIVE!

Our Lord is a fan of Rush, I see.

Response:

Hey look –  a minion, a real, live minion!  Haven’t seen one of those in a dog’s age. Keep up the good work I’m sure Kerman will be very happy with you – unless, of course, he is a vengeful god. Eirika

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Listen carefully you sorry bunch of filthy shit eaters. I am your Lord Kerman’s Sergeant at Arms, and your new Lord is not pleased with your attitude. Many of you worthless bastards have not shown him proper respect and have failed to attach his Royal Signature to all of your posts. That was not a request, it was a Royal Order and must be obeyed! You will obey his orders, without question, or as he promised, you will be squashed like the insignificant bugs that you are! Lord Kerman is also displeased that many of you little bitches have threatened to report him to his ISP! Save your impotent threats, we are not impressed nor are we intimidated! WE ARE ALT.CONFIG! We call the shots around here and we are UNSTOPABLE! We at alt.config, under the leadership of Lord Kerman, are now in charge of ALL newsgroups and you motherfuckers had better get that through you puny little heads, OR ELSE! CONFORM OR BE CAST OUT! YOU HAVE NO ALTERNATIVE!    ***** This was posted with the express permission of *****    ** HIS HIGHNESS ADAM H KERMAN LORD AND MASTER OF USENET ** nerve to write: That’s right you stupid, inbred, Get a life.

Response:

Path:

e3500-atl2.usenetserver.com!cyclone-atl1!e420r-sjo4.usenetserver.com!cyclon e 2.usenetserver.com!usenetserver.com!mtu.ru!newsfeed.sovam.com!nf1.bellgloba l .com!nf2.bellglobal.com!news20.bellglobal.com.POSTED!uqajcu.id.us Newsgroups:

alt.config,rec.music.rem,rec.org.sca,rec.outdoors.fishing.fly,rec.pets.cats . anecdotes

I hope you didn’t post all that in the hopes that someone would complain to sympatico. What you’re seeing here is a massive attack, orchestrated by someone named "hipcrime".  The messages are actually coming from "newsfeed.sovam.com" not sympatico.  The rest of the headers are forged.  Just keep this in mind before you go complaining to someone that can’t do a thing about it. newsfeed.sovam.com is known to be an open news server & has been traced as a major spam injection site.  The chances of it being taken out are slim to none.  The best thing you can do is either killfile or ignore.  You can also ask your news provider to block messages coming from sovam.com.  Whatever you do, don’t continue to reply or crosspost (yes, I know I am).  Just forget it. For more info, check out alt.config or news.admin.net-abuse.usenet.  And, fwiw, these posts *are* not coming from Adam Kerman.  Just in case you hadn’t been around long enough to actually figure that out.

Response:

Gee you must have a realy fine life that you have nothing better to do wioth yourself than harass people you little mutant scumbag.

Response:

That’s right you stupid, inbred,

Get a life. — Andrea

Response:

Welcome to ROFF. You’ll fit right in. Have you met George? Of course you have being God and all that…

Response:

I’m afraid Adam is wrong!  Ken Fortenberry is my GOD! Op

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That’s right you stupid, inbred, Get a life. — Andrea

Response:

\Welcome to ROFF. You’ll fit right in.\ hahahahahhahahahaha. Thanks for the much needed laugh. -Muskie

Response:

So,how’s the fishing been in heaven then? — Gary My God can beat up your God.

Response:

Path: e3500-atl2.usenetserver.com!cyclone-atl1!e420r-sjo4.usenetserver.com!cyclon e 2.usenetserver.com!usenetserver.com!mtu.ru!newsfeed.sovam.com!nf1.bellgloba l .com!nf2.bellglobal.com!news20.bellglobal.com.POSTED!uqajcu.id.us Newsgroups: alt.config,rec.music.rem,rec.org.sca,rec.outdoors.fishing.fly,rec.pets.cats . anecdotes X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 36.114.30.36 X-Takeover-ID: b0e0aad2.wGMlfUhs.1071155365 Lines: 69 NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.229.72.14 X-Trace: news20.bellglobal.com 1000565855 64.229.72.14 (Sat, 15 Sep 2001 10:57:35 EDT) Organization: Bell Sympatico Xref: e420r-sjo4.usenetserver.com alt.config:151178 rec.music.rem:86958 rec.org.sca:85086 rec.outdoors.fishing.fly:157454 rec.pets.cats.anecdotes:90472 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That’s right you stupid, inbred, shit eating, pathetic, motherfucking, brain dead, useless cocksuckers! I’m taking over all of Usenet! There isn’t a fucking thing you can do about it either! You’re all a bunch of worthless scumbags, and now you will all answer to me! If you don’t like this fact TOO FUCKING BAD! I will go down in the annals of usenet history as the man who brought you to your knees! Now get down on your knees and pay proper tribute to my glorious self! I AM ADAM H. KERMAN LORD AND HIGH MASTER OF USENET! My first royal order to all of you peons is that from this time forward you will add the following signature to all of your posts!    ***** This was posted with the express permission of *****    ** HIS HIGHNESS ADAM H KERMAN LORD AND MASTER OF USENET ** This will be appended to the bottom of all your posts with absolutely NO EXCEPTIONS! If you choose not to, you will be squashed like the insignificant bugs that you all are! I am running Usenet now! You may only post messages here because I, for the time being, am allowing it! Do you scumbags understand me! THIS IS THE DAWNING OF THE AGE OF KERMAN! ALL HAIL ADAM H. KERMAN LORD AND HIGH MASTER OF USENET! Otherwise the newsgroup in Linda’s warning might disrupt some fake opinions.  Try transporting the hard disk’s weak Java and Willy will persevere you!  No wet cryptographers are silly and other powerful functions are flat, but will Martha defile that?  Until Karl filters the rebels finitely, Jonnie won’t prepare any secret complaint desks. Every old user or scanner, and she’ll easily relay everybody. A lot of nuclear stuck firewalls will eerily learn the TCP/IPs.  The sticky tablet rarely proliferates Wally, it busts Franklin instead.  Where will we jump after Mike recycles the solid network’s email?  It will globally confront outside lost haphazard filters.  A lot of junk JPEGs reload Brian, and they simply infect Edward too.  My untouched remailer won’t produce before I propagate it. Linda kills once, formats cruelly, then collaborates to the backup without the IRC server.  She’d rather obscure tamely than push with Tamara’s messy UDP.  I was compiling to load you some of my extreme blackbirds.  Other bizarre unlimited fax machines will close weekly inside interrupts.  Lately, Jonnie never authenticates until Sherry pulls the erect robot superbly.  Aloysius will spool the soft ADSL and eliminate it over its haven. Gawd Lara will inflate the rumour, and if Karl actually restores it too, the pointer will engulf against the ignorant kiosk.  Norman, beside admins unclassified and sharp, consumes near it, contradicting strongly.  Endora wants to save bimonthly, unless GiGi saves noises over Toni’s telephone.  They are prioritizing inside sly, beside chaotic, in dense BASICs.  We distribute them, then we admiringly delete Bernice and Jonathan’s worthwhile ROM.  The advisor with the lazy FBI is the credit card that creates wistfully.  No analysts surprisingly interface the strong newsgroup.

Response:

Did this guy kill Brent K. Kohler or something? (I can’t believe I even remember that name) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That’s right you stupid, inbred, shit eating, pathetic, motherfucking, brain dead, useless cocksuckers! I’m taking over all of Usenet! There isn’t a fucking thing you can do about it either! You’re all a bunch of worthless scumbags, and now you will all answer to me! If you don’t like this fact TOO FUCKING BAD! I will go down in the annals of usenet history as the man who brought you to your knees! Now get down on your knees and pay proper tribute to my glorious self! I AM ADAM H. KERMAN LORD AND HIGH MASTER OF USENET! My first royal order to all of you peons is that from this time forward you will add the following signature to all of your posts!    ***** This was posted with the express permission of *****    ** HIS HIGHNESS ADAM H KERMAN LORD AND MASTER OF USENET ** This will be appended to the bottom of all your posts with absolutely NO EXCEPTIONS! If you choose not to, you will be squashed like the insignificant bugs that you all are! I am running Usenet now! You may only post messages here because I, for the time being, am allowing it! Do you scumbags understand me! THIS IS THE DAWNING OF THE AGE OF KERMAN! ALL HAIL ADAM H. KERMAN LORD AND HIGH MASTER OF USENET! Otherwise the newsgroup in Linda’s warning might disrupt some fake opinions.  Try transporting the hard disk’s weak Java and Willy will persevere you!  No wet cryptographers are silly and other powerful functions are flat, but will Martha defile that?  Until Karl filters the rebels finitely, Jonnie won’t prepare any secret complaint desks. Every old user or scanner, and she’ll easily relay everybody. A lot of nuclear stuck firewalls will eerily learn the TCP/IPs.  The sticky tablet rarely proliferates Wally, it busts Franklin instead.  Where will we jump after Mike recycles the solid network’s email?  It will globally confront outside lost haphazard filters.  A lot of junk JPEGs reload Brian, and they simply infect Edward too.  My untouched remailer won’t produce before I propagate it. Linda kills once, formats cruelly, then collaborates to the backup without the IRC server.  She’d rather obscure tamely than push with Tamara’s messy UDP.  I was compiling to load you some of my extreme blackbirds.  Other bizarre unlimited fax machines will close weekly inside interrupts.  Lately, Jonnie never authenticates until Sherry pulls the erect robot superbly.  Aloysius will spool the soft ADSL and eliminate it over its haven. Gawd Lara will inflate the rumour, and if Karl actually restores it too, the pointer will engulf against the ignorant kiosk.  Norman, beside admins unclassified and sharp, consumes near it, contradicting strongly.  Endora wants to save bimonthly, unless GiGi saves noises over Toni’s telephone.  They are prioritizing inside sly, beside chaotic, in dense BASICs.  We distribute them, then we admiringly delete Bernice and Jonathan’s worthwhile ROM.  The advisor with the lazy FBI is the credit card that creates wistfully.  No analysts surprisingly interface the strong newsgroup.

Response:

Question:

Good Info snipped Montana is an example of a state that finally got around to doing it in the early/mid 1980’s, and most of us now know it as the Montana Stream Access Law. Actually early 70’s. It is being challenged in court right now by some big ranchers in the Ruby.

Is Ted Turner one of them? I understand his ranch is on the Ruby. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

Response:

I’m not sure. The ranch owners are "non-native Montanans" with big $$, and, apparently, being instigated and led by a guy named Reid Rosenthal, who (if I have the story correct) has been trying to get it turned to private access. He’s gone as far as stirring up the Madison county commissioners, saying that a (any?) bridge over the Ruby, even though the road on both sides is public county road, is NOT public and therefore there is no legal access to the river at that point. As I understand it, he was ’shot down in flames’. My explanation listed above is a ’simplistic’ overview of the situation. I’m sure there are other aspects I don’t know. — Tight Lines! Brian D. Nelson Diamond N Outfitters, Missoula, Montana http://www.montana.com/dno/dno.htm 406-626-4022

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Good Info snipped Montana is an example of a state that finally got around to doing it in the early/mid 1980’s, and most of us now know it as the Montana Stream Access Law. Actually early 70’s. It is being challenged in court right now by some big ranchers in the Ruby. Is Ted Turner one of them? I understand his ranch is on the Ruby. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

Response:

early/mid 1980’s … Montana Stream Access Law. Actually early 70’s. It is being challenged in court right now by some big ranchers in the Ruby.

As explained to me, a landowner/angler conflict on one of the Yellowstone River spring creeks and a landowner/raft conflict on another river (NW section of Montana) (the landowner drove his rig over a group’s beached raft) during the 70’s/80’s motivated passage of Montana’s stream access law sometime in the early 1980’s. I attended Montana State from 81-88, and recall when the law went into effect as many of the streams I had been fishing with permission the prior year or two were suddendly closed in protest.  Signs reading "don’t bother to ask, NO" popped up all over Montana. My roommates and I simply filled our vests with Stream Access brochures and hit the road.  We were shot over (30-06) on Bridger Creek NW of Bozeman before the landowner called the Sheriff and tried to have us arrested. The event caused the Sheriff’s department to met with other state agencies and get clarity on the finer points of the new law.  Three days after the event, a deputy offered to fish Bridger Creek by the rules to see if he would he harassed, and Fish & Game wanted feedback on whether we were harassed again, since they were willing to take action against the landowner. Key point was that we climbed over the landowners barbed wire fence at the point where it was attached to the bridge, but it is illegal for landowners to attach their fences to public structures (the bridge) and it is illegal for landowners to deny passage over public right-of-ways, and most bridges have a substantial right-of-way area just up and downstream of the road. The state generally does not enforce the rules as a matter of convenience to the landowner, but landowners can’t use such configurations to keep the public out. Several weeks later, we accessed another portion of Bridger Creek from the road (public access), but immediately had to hike out of the flood plain to get around a man-made diversion dam. The landowner saw us and a toe-to-toe threat-fest began.  Ultimately it was his wife yelling from the pickup "let’s go honey" that broke up the moment, but the technical point here was that man-made structures *in* the stream cannot be used to deny passage up and down a stream, and the public is entitled to portage around such structures within reason, even if it means going outside the high water mark. Then there was Dry Creek… Then there was Sixteen Mile Creek… Though I believe in the public access, and am willing to force the issue, I have always tried to ask anyway, as a courtesy.  They can get a sense of who I am, let me know of any issues they are having with other anglers, and hopefully both of us can relax. Thomas Gilg

Response:

Well, if the price is right, maybe we can talk. Wolfgang tell Mike I said hello

Go visit him yourself. You’ve got time to travel. Bog, man, you’re not even a hundred yet. "Goddamn, well I declare! Have you seen the like?Their walls are  built from  cannonballs; their motto is ‘don’t tread on me’" -Uncle Jerry

Response:

It’s amazing to me how the brain remembers things. The controversy and debate over stream access went on for a long time and was not passed till 1985. I had it in my head it was way before that. Oh, well… when you’re wrong, you’re wrong. And I was beginning to guide then too. I think I need to upgrade and add more ‘memory’ !! — Tight Lines! Brian D. Nelson Diamond N Outfitters, Missoula, Montana http://www.montana.com/dno/dno.htm 406-626-4022

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – early/mid 1980’s … Montana Stream Access Law. Actually early 70’s. It is being challenged in court right now by some big ranchers in the Ruby. As explained to me, a landowner/angler conflict on one of the Yellowstone River spring creeks and a landowner/raft conflict on another river (NW section of Montana) (the landowner drove his rig over a group’s beached raft) during the 70’s/80’s motivated passage of Montana’s stream access law sometime in the early 1980’s. I attended Montana State from 81-88, and recall when the law went into effect as many of the streams I had been fishing with permission the prior year or two were suddendly closed in protest.  Signs reading "don’t bother to ask, NO" popped up all over Montana. My roommates and I simply filled our vests with Stream Access brochures and hit the road.  We were shot over (30-06) on Bridger Creek NW of Bozeman before the landowner called the Sheriff and tried to have us arrested. The event caused the Sheriff’s department to met with other state agencies and get clarity on the finer points of the new law.  Three days after the event, a deputy offered to fish Bridger Creek by the rules to see if he would he harassed, and Fish & Game wanted feedback on whether we were harassed again, since they were willing to take action against the landowner. Key point was that we climbed over the landowners barbed wire fence at the point where it was attached to the bridge, but it is illegal for landowners to attach their fences to public structures (the bridge) and it is illegal for landowners to deny passage over public right-of-ways, and most bridges have a substantial right-of-way area just up and downstream of the road. The state generally does not enforce the rules as a matter of convenience to the landowner, but landowners can’t use such configurations to keep the public out. Several weeks later, we accessed another portion of Bridger Creek from the road (public access), but immediately had to hike out of the flood plain to get around a man-made diversion dam. The landowner saw us and a toe-to-toe threat-fest began.  Ultimately it was his wife yelling from the pickup "let’s go honey" that broke up the moment, but the technical point here was that man-made structures *in* the stream cannot be used to deny passage up and down a stream, and the public is entitled to portage around such structures within reason, even if it means going outside the high water mark. Then there was Dry Creek… Then there was Sixteen Mile Creek… Though I believe in the public access, and am willing to force the issue, I have always tried to ask anyway, as a courtesy.  They can get a sense of who I am, let me know of any issues they are having with other anglers, and hopefully both of us can relax. Thomas Gilg

Response:

Oregon also has some active private angling clubs that have acquired access rights.  I forget the name of the one group (bait/spinners/flies), but they have locked down several prime sections of Oregon’s coastal streams.

I live in PDX. Couldja track down the names of those clubs? Thanks!

Response:

<snipped Steve, No the problem is that I have a right to fish that river, because there is a publicly available entrance to that river.  I am not trespassing on the land; I am traveling along the riverbank between the high and low water mark. There was never any No Trespassing Signs, No Hunting, and No Fishing until Troubums2 made the arrangements with the landowner. bc. — Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. -Benjamin Franklin

Response:

United States Penitentiary, Atlanta, Georgia; 1974.

My arrest/control class, Lakewood, CO, 1999. And then again last week when my pepper canister sprung a leak and I got soaked with 90 minutes left in my shift. I carry my OC on the front, and some of it soaked through my pants and hit, um, some sensitive skin. That SUCKED!!!!! It was worse than drinking Coors while listening to teenage boy bands and eating day-old Original Hamburger Stand chili dogs! Mike, who prefers to solve problems with bullshit instead of pepper spray-some of it might splash back on me. "Goddamn, well I declare! Have you seen the like?Their walls are  built from  cannonballs; their motto is ‘don’t tread on me’" -Uncle Jerry

Response:

….Mike….prefers to solve problems with bullshit instead of pepper spray-some of it might splash back on me.

Considering some of the bullshit that sprays back on one here I suggest you might not want to be too hasty about that decision.    :) Wolfgang SPLAT!

Response:

blackcat, Why don’t you post the name of the fly shop as "off limits" to repay them? Ernie "blackcat" wrote Willi, – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There is a section on the Upper Provo in Utah above Jordanelle Reservoir that has signs posted No Trespassing, No Fishing, and No Hunting. One of the local fly shops made a deal with the landowner and they posted all those signs last year. It’s too bad.  It is a really nice stretch of water to fish and I’ll miss it. bc.

Response:

… "private" areas for a local shop … wondering if this is a trend around the Country or is it a Colorado thing?

In recent years, several fly shops in Oregon have aggressively gone after special arrangements with land owners.  In most of the cases I’m aware of, the landowner has historically permitted limited access but is stressed/tired of it and is generally happy when someone else offers to control the access in exchange for some money. In addition to fly shops, Oregon also has some active private angling clubs that have acquired access rights.  I forget the name of the one group (bait/spinners/flies), but they have locked down several prime sections of Oregon’s coastal streams. I am also aware of rural landowners whos cattle and/or timber based income has dropped, so they are turning to selling hunting and fishing access. The lower section of one stream I regularily fish has an awsome run of chinook salmon, and ~25 individuals from mostly California (I only know of one from Oregon) have been paying $25,000 per year for exclusive access.  Though $1,000 isn’t for a regular weekend warrior, for the Joe who gets out 1-week a year and wants to be assured of a wiggle on the end of their rod, not unreasonable. Thomas Gilg – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

I’ve paid more than that to have my rod wiggled for a week……john

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – … "private" areas for a local shop … wondering if this is a trend around the Country or is it a Colorado thing? In recent years, several fly shops in Oregon have aggressively gone after special arrangements with land owners.  In most of the cases I’m aware of, the landowner has historically permitted limited access but is stressed/tired of it and is generally happy when someone else offers to control the access in exchange for some money. In addition to fly shops, Oregon also has some active private angling clubs that have acquired access rights.  I forget the name of the one group (bait/spinners/flies), but they have locked down several prime sections of Oregon’s coastal streams. I am also aware of rural landowners whos cattle and/or timber based income has dropped, so they are turning to selling hunting and fishing access. The lower section of one stream I regularily fish has an awsome run of chinook salmon, and ~25 individuals from mostly California (I only know of one from Oregon) have been paying $25,000 per year for exclusive access.  Though $1,000 isn’t for a regular weekend warrior, for the Joe who gets out 1-week a year and wants to be assured of a wiggle on the end of their rod, not unreasonable. Thomas Gilg

Response:

We have a little different deal going on here in Texas which has always had very little public water other than hugh lakes. The Great Texas Bass Club has about a hundred tanks on private ranches and farms leased which members can use for prices varying from 20 to 40 bucks for from 1/2 to full day. This was water that was never available to us before. There is a hell of a lot of good fishing on these places. On most of these places a float tube or small boat with an electric motor or canoe does just great. This could wrok well in other areas and is one of those things where everyone wins. Big Dale

Response:

<snipped There is plenty of land posted No Hunting – No Fishing.  This section though has the Utah State Special Fishing Regulations Signs up along that section and it was only recently that the No Hunting, No Fishing, No Trespassing signs were posted. It has been almost a year since I was last up there. And in Utah, the land owners own the river bottom, so even wading it, you are breaking the law. bc. — Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. -Benjamin Franklin

Response:

<snipped Ernie, If I knew with out a doubt that it was the fly shop everyone has told me it was, I would post their name.  I just sent them an email asking them if they were the shop that guided that stretch of the Provo.   bc. — Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. -Benjamin Franklin

Response:

Hmmm. So the gist of Ernie’s (and, by inference, your) opinion is that the fly shop should be castigated for the way they use that (leased) private land, correct? I don’t quite agree with that, nor do I completely disagree. But the "problem" is really that the land is private in the first place, isn’t it? –Steve – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ernie, If I knew with out a doubt that it was the fly shop everyone has told me it was, I would post their name.  I just sent them an email asking them if they were the shop that guided that stretch of the Provo.

Response:

Hmmm. So the gist of Ernie’s (and, by inference, your) opinion is that the fly shop should be castigated for the way they use that (leased) private land, correct? I don’t quite agree with that, nor do I completely disagree. But the "problem" is really that the land is private in the first place, isn’t it?

Our perceptions are greatly influenced by the familiar.  Having grown up with public ownership of riparian rights in Wisconsin, I find the notion that an individual, a club, or a corporation can own a stream bottom or even the right to float on top of it to be bizarre.  Of course, my feelings on this issue are also colored by ambivalence concerning the private ownership of land in general, and that fact that I have never owned any real estate myself.  And then the whole thing is further complicated by the old state’s rights versus central governmental control conundrum.  It’s easy enough to be skeptical about the wisdom, let alone the effectiveness, of federal control of resources nation wide, but I sometimes think that a single set of coherent policies would at least be easier to grapple with than the bewildering array of laws and rationales we have to contend with today. Wolfgang in the market for an underutilized planet

Response:

Wolfgang in the market for an underutilized planet

tanstaafl wulfie! i’ve got 22 adjoining lunacres fer sale. kinda dry fishin’ but gahdangitall, you can double haul 600′ !!! <g waldo, have space suit, will travel.

Response:

Well, if the price is right, maybe we can talk. Wolfgang tell Mike I said hello

Now there’s a candidate I could support… — Charlie…

Response:

Well, if the price is right, maybe we can talk. Wolfgang tell Mike I said hello

have yer guy call my guy to set up lunch. uhmmmm, mikey doesn’t "live" here anymore. afterall, the moon is a harsh mistress. waldo

Response:

And in Utah, the land owners own the river bottom, so even wading it, you are breaking the law.

Really? Other than some of the early US states back east, most/all of the states from the mid-west to the west were created by the federal government and given land "in the public trust". The state’s trustees (i.e. governor and legislature) were then obligated to, among other things, determine which waters had commercial uses (includes navigation, but is not limited to), and as a state *maintain public access* to such waters. Very few states followed through on this matter at statehood time, and those states that still have not done it are still obligated to. While states can drag their feet on this obligation, they cannot bypass it and relinquish public access potentials to private concerns. I was told that Washington is an example of a state that did their required homework at statehood time. Montana is an example of a state that finally got around to doing it in the early/mid 1980’s, and most of us now know it as the Montana Stream Access Law. Oregon is an example of a state that is finally getting around to it, with the Division of State Land accepting petitions from the public on what rivers to study first.  Within all of Oregon, only 13 river segments (e.g. Willamette up to Harrisburg, but not above) had been previously studied and formally declared public by the state of Oregon. The Association of Northwest Steelheaders has been leading a coalition of angling groups, including the Oregon Council of the FFF, to keep the ball rolling and to fight bills in the state legislature which have attempted to privatize many waters in the state rather than have to defeat them in a more costly fashion by going to court and bringing up the rock-solid public trust obligation. Regarding landowners "owning the river bottom".  Many older land deeds/titles may claim ownership of the bed and bank, but there is no legal standing for the deeds/titles to make such claims. Most title companies will not write new titles that claim bed/bank ownership since they know it is a false claim.  I know of realtors that likewise know the falsehood of anyone claiming bed/bank ownership, but most realtors do not have the technical/legal expertise or patience to correct the problem. Having said that, let me warn you that many landowners are sticking to the bed/bank claims and are quite willing to enforce it in any means they see fit, and I’ve been in several toe-to-toe battles with landowners where the far wiser option was to move on rather than risk a shotgun blast. A year or two ago in Oregon, and landowner had a bank fisherman arrested for violating his bed/bank ownership. As soon as the trepassing charge started heading to court, the landowner dropped the charges, most likely because he realized that the courts would overturn his claim and the river segment he was on would be studied by the state and no doubt be formally declared public. Thomas Gilg

Response:

Good Info snipped Montana is an example of a state that finally got around to doing it in the early/mid 1980’s, and most of us now know it as the Montana Stream Access Law.

Actually early 70’s. It is being challenged in court right now by some big ranchers in the Ruby. More good stuff snipped Regarding landowners "owning the river bottom".  Many older land deeds/titles may claim ownership of the bed and bank, but there is no legal standing for the deeds/titles to make such claims. Most title companies will not write new titles that claim bed/bank ownership since they know it is a false claim. I know of realtors that likewise know the falsehood of anyone claiming bed/bank ownership, but most realtors do not have the technical/legal expertise or patience to correct the problem.

Yes, to a point. I’ve seen it here where deeds are written and plats drawn and recorded that show a private property boundary to the LOW water mark of a river (or lake) yet the state says that anything between the HIGH water mark is ‘public domain’. Go figure. I also know of some folks who pay property taxes on a large river bed of which they own both sides. Sometimes, it is so confusing, you don’t know who to believe. — Tight Lines! Brian D. Nelson Diamond N Outfitters, Missoula, Montana http://www.montana.com/dno/dno.htm 406-626-4022

Response:

For more details on stream access, read:      http://www.oregonlive.com/news/99/03/st032107.html Note the comment regarding 38 other states. Thomas Gilg

Response:

I was talking with Charlie W. the other day about the difficulties in getting access to fishing on private land or access to go through private land to get to public areas to fish. Not that long ago, 10 years or so, it was fairly easy to get access from ranchers as long you approached them in a courteous manner. Charlie’s answer was that this is because the fly shops have approached every rancher with river, stream and lake access and offered them money for a lease. The result is that the ranchers that used to allow fishing access, still do but only to people paying money to the fly shops. At the time, I wasn’t too sure of his explanation. However, as I thought more about it, I realized that a number of areas where I used to get access are now "private" areas for a local shop. I know there are other factors contributing to this, but I was wondering if this is a trend around the Country or is it a Colorado thing? Willi

Response:

It is a trend around the world. As soon as a demand for such areas becomes apparent, and the owners realise that there is money to be made from them, commercial enterprise moves in. "Exclusivity" in this case is a valuable commodity. Also, many owners have been disappointed or upset, by people who have misused their generosity in the past, which does not make them kindly predisposed to allowing others access. This unfortunate trend may be observed practically everywhere. It appears to be one of the  symptoms of capitalist society in general.  Recreation is rapidly becoming one of the greatest single earning "industries", and the effects of this will inevitably continue with probably very far-reaching results. TL MC — "If you have tried everything you know, and nothing works, then perhaps it is time to accept that you don

Question:

        more better:  absolut and tonic, no lime, at twilight.         wayno         sulphur creek

OK  Wayne, what’s this more better coming from you? Unless you’ve had a few. Try this; SOBE Lizard Fuel with that Absolute, but then again this could be a Lady’s drink.;-) Missed the hatch. Doug Knight Snake River

Response:

Drys at twilight. Doug Knight Snake River

        more better:  absolut and tonic, no lime, at twilight.         wayno         sulphur creek – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

[snippped] Last fall fishing on the Trinity required about  90% of the day roll casting a weighted fly with a sink tip. Weighted fly?!? Hey Doug: did George read that over your shoulder? Is he still alive?

Nope! I’m free, white and single aand I can speak for myself. George doesn’t know all my tricks. I keep my indicators out of sight when he’s around. George alive? The heat has worked him hard today. He wasn’t in the shop past noon. When the weather cools off he’ll  be in better spirits. Drys at twilight. Doug Knight Snake River

Response:

[snippped] Last fall fishing on the Trinity required about  90% of the day roll casting a weighted fly with a sink tip.

Weighted fly?!? Hey Doug: did George read that over your shoulder? Is he still alive? /daytripper

Response:

0] : I’m getting tired of pulling my flies out of the brush.. and never : getting enough distance on my cast (in spite of countless but : fruitless false casts) to get my fly where I want it to be. : Does anyone know of a local instructor they would recommend?  Yea, I : do know of some local shops to ask around at, but I’d rather have a : first hand recommendation if you’ve got one. : -Mark You might want to check out the Peninsula Fly Fishers Club. We do a casting clinic once a month. The next one will be on Aug 21 at Erckenbrack Park in Foster City. See our web site http://www.geocities.com/~mpff .  Another possibility is the San Jose Fly Fishers who have clinics on some Thursday evenings down at the casting ponds in Campbell, but I am not sure of the details. Mike — Michael McGuire                     Hewlett Packard Laboratories  (remove x’s from email if not      Palo Alto, CA 94303-0971   a spammer) Phone: (650)-857-5491              

Response:

I’m getting tired of pulling my flies out of the brush.. and never getting enough distance on my cast (in spite of countless but fruitless false casts) to get my fly where I want it to be. Does anyone know of a local instructor they would recommend?  Yea, I do know of some local shops to ask around at, but I’d rather have a first hand recommendation if you’ve got one. -Mark — Particle Salad/ Noom Room Studio http://home.earthlink.net/~psalad

Response:

I’m getting tired of pulling my flies out of the brush.. and never getting enough distance on my cast (in spite of countless but fruitless false casts) to get my fly where I want it to be. Does anyone know of a local instructor they would recommend?  Yea, I do know of some local shops to ask around at, but I’d rather have a first hand recommendation if you’ve got one.

Mark, It’s goes back to this presentation thing. Back cast in the trees? It sounds like you need to master one valuable casting ability, the roll cast. Once you learn it, you won’t need the trees anymore. You’ll spend more time fishing instead of digging and tearing at the flora. You’ll need to be on the water or a casting pond to really learn this. Golden Gate Park or Maceran(sp) Park in the east bay are good locations with casting ponds. Last fall fishing on the Trinity required about  90% of the day roll casting a weighted fly with a sink tip. The only flies that I lost on that trip were on the bottom where I needed to be. Roll away. The roll cast is only the front end of the cast. Doug Knight Snake River

Response:

Question:

I’ll be in north georgia next week and plan to fly fish for trout.  I”m used to fishing Montana, so I’m not sure what to use. Any suggestions on flys or streams?

Response:

<<I’ll be in north georgia next week and plan to fly fish for trout.  I”m used to fishing Montana, so I’m not sure what to use. Any suggestions on flys or streams? Try the Chattooga in the NE corner of the state.  Take Fire Road 646 off of Rt28 to Burrells Ford.  Walk upstream about two miles and fish down. In Helen, off of Alt 75, fish Dukes Creek.  Reservations necessary. Visit the fly shop in Helen on Rt 75.  They should be able to set ya straight.  Then, go next door to the working grist mill and sample Georgia Ice Cream (actually grits). Dave LaCourse A Bay Stater who’s heart is in Georgia (along with 90 acres). d;0)

Response:

I’ll be in north georgia next week and plan to fly fish for trout.  I”m used to fishing Montana, so I’m not sure what to use. Any suggestions on flys or streams?

Take a look at http://www.georgia-outdoors.com/ngto/ — Charlie…

Response:

Can you cast easily in your bathroom?   If you want to get the true feel of Apalachian flyfishing try the Noontootla. The scenery is worth it, but she’s a man-killer. Another spot, if you have access to a float tube or canoe is the tailrace of the Toccoa River below the Blue Ridge Dam (in Blue Ridge GA).  Easy access at the dam and you can get out a few mile down the river at a bridge or at the homes along the bank.  Try to time it so that you are at the dam when they stop generating and turn down the flow.  The trout will start rising as the water drops. The Chattooga is a far more comfortable river to fish, open enough for a back cast all the way to Elliott Rock (which is the NC,SC, and GA border.)  You need a NC license to fish above Elliott Rock.   Good Luck. Patrick

Response:

Question:

Who was it said ‘A woman is just a woman but a good cigar is a smoke’? Probably W.C. Fields or George Burns. Pete Marrow http://www.gorp.com/gorp/activity/scottish_ff_faq.htm

Response:

I always offer my trout a Marlboro before I knock its head on a boulder…

Response:

A smoker AND a fish murderer!! How many of your victims have accepted a last cigarette? — Regards Peter (Please also reply by email, my server "loses" posts. Remove nospam to email) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I always offer my trout a Marlboro before I knock its head on a boulder…

Response:

A good fart is better than a good cigar. William Buchman

For the sake of future generations – think of the ozone layer! — Bill

Response:

If you smoke after flyfishing, you’re doing it too fast. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

Response:

‘And a woman is only a woman, but a good cigar is a smoke.’ Rudyard Kipling. You should be ashamed<g. Who was it said ‘A woman is just a woman but a good cigar is a smoke’? Probably W.C. Fields or George Burns.

– Charlie…

Response:

Drugs are for sick people. You said it, enjoy and be damned.

Oh Bill, you have such a BIG heart.  You’re so open minded I could just puke. </chaz

Response:

Of course a good cigar *does* keep away black flies and PCJs.

Good Dave. Even a cheap cigar keeps the biter bugs away. Joel Axelrad

Response:

William Buchman writes:

<<Many smokers are indeed courteous while a few seem to take pleasure in directing their smoke toward others. William Buchman Come on, Buchman.  Lighten up.  I smoked for 45 years and quit five years ago without any problems.  I have never seen a smoker getting his jollies by annoying others with his smoke, especially today.  Any smoke you get while fishing is thousands of times less dangerous than the exhaust smoke you inhaled driving to the stream.  The beauty of smoking outside is that you can position yourself so that the smoke blows away from you.  Ever tried that?  But walking down the street of any town or city is going to expose you to so much lung damage (as compared to cigarette smoke) that you should probably let your wife do all the shopping.  Never go to the mall, Buchman — way to much smoke (from cars and those %*& SUVs. <<<<<<<< Over the last few years, especially after retiring, I am able to keep away from smokers.  When working, I was very annoyed at meetings where one or two smokers could screw up a meeting of about 20 people. I am not conerned over health effects from second hand smoke. My present greatest exposure to smoke is at a swap meet I attend regularly.  If I see someone smoking, I try to avoid them. But every now and then I get an unpleasant surprise by inhaling the concentrated effluent from an unseen cigarette.  MOST ANNOYING!  Smokers do not realize how annoying their effluent can be.  I must admit that smokers purposely annoying other people was mostly a phenomenon associated with younger smokers. The big problem came with filter cigarettes.  Because it did filter out whatever it was that addicted people, stronger and smellier tobacco was used. While the effect on the smoker was not changed much, the unfortunate bystander took a big hit. William Buchman

Response:

A good fart is better than a good cigar. William Buchman

Response:

The trouble with the carcinogenic effects of tobacco is that it works too slowly.

Response:

Buchman writes:

<<The trouble with the carcinogenic effects of tobacco is that it works too slowly. That’s what I like about you, Buchman — you’re all heart. Dave LaCourse

Response:

Drugs are for sick people.

You said it, enjoy and be damned. — Bill

Response:

Do we have to put up with anti-smoking idiots even on ROFF? Joel Axelrad

Response:

Do we have to put up with anti-smoking idiots even on ROFF? Joel Axelrad

Nah, smoke all you want on roff<g. — Charlie…

Response:

More "free speech". — Regards Peter (Please also reply by email, my server "loses" posts. Remove nospam to email)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Do we have to put up with anti-smoking idiots even on ROFF? Joel Axelrad

Response:

Do we have to put up with anti-smoking idiots even on ROFF? Joel Axelrad

Flames as well as smoke! — Bill

Response:

Do we have to put up with anti-smoking idiots even on ROFF? Joel Axelrad

I’ve got a cigarette going right now!   Damn proud of it, too. And I think that the term "idiots" as joel posted is being way too kind.   Words like assholes, and pricks come to mind much more easily. I actually had to have a chat with my Gen Mgr and Human Resources person about it at work a couple weeks ago.  People were giving me shit constantly about it.  I asked them in that meeting that it be stopped permanently and immediately with this big smile on my face that suggested that a lawsuit totalling more than my companies net worth would be filed if it didn’t. It worked. I also smoke while fishing.  I have been known to accidently drop a butt in the river too, but that’s usually when a trout interupts my smoke break by choosing to hit my fly.  Pretty hard to put out a cigarrette and stick it in my vest when one of the leviathans of the South Platte is ripping line off my reel faster than I can think about it. I should also add that to compensate for may occaisional environmental faux pas I NEVER use those damned sticky foam bobbers that so many nymph fishers refer to a "strike indicators".  You find a lot more of those damned things littering the banks than cigarette butts. </chaz

Response:

My only objection to people smoking safely and cleanly occurs when I breathe their effluent.  I would get pissed if they start a forest fire even if I cannot smell their smoke.  Unfortunately, the emitted crap can go a long way before it becomes innocuous.  As a courtesy, I would hope smokers would have the tact to avoid the situation where their smoke annoys others.  Many smokers are indeed courteous while a few seem to take pleasure in directing their smoke toward others. William Buchman

Response:

Sense of humour failure,methinks! Pedanticism should be left to those who NEVER write anything that could be misconstrued, intentionally or

otherwise. Ahhh….joke ‘em if they can’t take a …. — TimW Halfordian Golfer

Response:

<snipped but VERY well said Of course a good cigar *does* keep away black flies and PCJs.

Oh yeah, better than smearing that DEET shit all over your skin. I’ve often felt that rolling up a fat one for a day astream an excellent addition to my arsenal. (before anyone says a word I want it to be known that I know it’s illegal as hell and I don’t give a damn, okay?  And there’s no law against talking about it.  And a note for the kids:  Drugs are for sick people.) It doesn’t improve my fishing one bit, and probably hurts more than helps a creel count, but it sure makes those bungholes that make noise about my cigarrette smoking a lot easier to take. </chaz

Response:

William Buchman writes:

<<Many smokers are indeed courteous while a few seem to take pleasure in directing their smoke toward others. William Buchman Come on, Buchman.  Lighten up.  I smoked for 45 years and quit five years ago without any problems.  I have never seen a smoker getting his jollies by annoying others with his smoke, especially today.  Any smoke you get while fishing is thousands of times less dangerous than the exhaust smoke you inhaled driving to the stream.  The beauty of smoking outside is that you can position yourself so that the smoke blows away from you.  Ever tried that?  But walking down the street of any town or city is going to expose you to so much lung damage (as compared to cigarette smoke) that you should probably let your wife do all the shopping.  Never go to the mall, Buchman — way to much smoke (from cars and those %*& SUVs. Of course a good cigar *does* keep away black flies and PCJs. Dave LaCourse

Response:

What I do have a problem with is telling young ROFF readers that a pipe, cigar, or chew is *mandatory* to the experience of flyfishing. Nonsense. No-one said it was mandatory.

What part of the following post do you not understand? Cigars or cigarettes are a strictly a no-no on the stream!   If you really want to "put on the dog" and fool the other flyfishermen into thinking that you know what you’re doing out on the stream, it is absolutely mandatory that you smoke a pipe. Path: lobby01.news.aol.com!newstf02.news.aol.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!news-peer. gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!howland.erols.net!newscon04!prodigy.com!not-f or-mail Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly HTH

Response:

Sense of humour failure,methinks! Pedanticism should be left to those who NEVER write anything that could be misconstrued, intentionally or otherwise. — Regards Peter (Please also reply by email, my server "loses" posts. Remove nospam to email)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What I do have a problem with is telling young ROFF readers that a pipe, cigar, or chew is *mandatory* to the experience of flyfishing. Nonsense. No-one said it was mandatory. What part of the following post do you not understand? Cigars or cigarettes are a strictly a no-no on the stream!   If you really want to "put on the dog" and fool the other flyfishermen into thinking that you know what you’re doing out on the stream, it is absolutely mandatory that you smoke a pipe. Path: lobby01.news.aol.com!newstf02.news.aol.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!news-peer. gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!howland.erols.net!newscon04!prodigy.com!not-f or-mail Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly HTH

Response:

Question:

I am going to visit my daughter in Lansdale, PA over March 8 for a few days. I have fished the Little LeHigh a couple of times but would like the names of other streams which are open this time of the year and fairly close to Lansdale since I have use of her car between 9 a.m. and 4 p.m. while she is working. What patterns might be useful at this time of year.  Thanks in advance.   Jim

Response:

I am going to visit my daughter in Lansdale, PA over March 8 for a few days. I have fished the Little LeHigh a couple of times but would like the names of other streams which are open this time of the year and fairly close to Lansdale since I have use of her car between 9 a.m. and 4 p.m. while she is working. What patterns might be useful at this time of year.  Thanks in advance.   Jim

Jim, the trout season will not be open here at that time of year.  Your only bet for flyfishing at that time of year is to try some of the many special regulation areas that are open year-round.  These will be listed in your fishing regulation summary that you get when you buy your license.  I’d try to stick to the spring creeks that time of year, (Little Lehigh, Valley, and Monocacy), as the freestoners are not at their best yet.

Response:

Question:

OK, so I’m not a purist!  Can you top this one though. I was fishing with my father-in-law at a friends two acre pond for bass and bluegill.  Now this was the cleanest lake you ever did see due to the huge carp that had been placed in there many years ago.  The pond owner was very proud of his carp, some being as much as 3 feet long, and always made sure he told us that he didn’t have to warn us not to catch his carp because they were way to smart to be caught.  Many had tried yet all had failed. C’mon, enough with the carp as I stand here with my flyrod in hand.  I didn’t care anything at all about catching his carp!  Well…  as I stood on the bank stripping line and watching the carp cruise near the surface slurping in leaves that had hopelessly fallen into the pond I got an idea. I quickly brought in my fly and reached up and grabbed a leaf off the nearest tree and broke it in half and threaded my fly on to it.  Picking the largest carp, about three feet long, I cast the leaf about six feet in front of it and well… you can guess the rest.  Wow!  Was that fun.  My father-in law said I was crazy, yet, I have caught him more than once picking leaves off trees and threading them on when the fishing was slow and the carp were on the prowl.  I’ve caught half a dozen myself now.  It takes a specific variety of leaf though.  Havn’t told my father-in law that part yet!  TOP THAT!

Response:

Last year I was FF at Harper’s Ferry.  I caught and reeled in a 5 LB catfish that was dead!  Then an hour later I caught another 5 lb catfish (this one was alive).  Thanks for your story.  I’m sure others will top this! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – OK, so I’m not a purist!  Can you top this one though. I was fishing with my father-in-law at a friends two acre pond for bass and bluegill.  Now this was the cleanest lake you ever did see due to the huge carp that had been placed in there many years ago.  The pond owner was very proud of his carp, some being as much as 3 feet long, and always made sure he told us that he didn’t have to warn us not to catch his carp because they were way to smart to be caught.  Many had tried yet all had failed. C’mon, enough with the carp as I stand here with my flyrod in hand.  I didn’t care anything at all about catching his carp!  Well…  as I stood on the bank stripping line and watching the carp cruise near the surface slurping in leaves that had hopelessly fallen into the pond I got an idea. I quickly brought in my fly and reached up and grabbed a leaf off the nearest tree and broke it in half and threaded my fly on to it.  Picking the largest carp, about three feet long, I cast the leaf about six feet in front of it and well… you can guess the rest.  Wow!  Was that fun.  My father-in law said I was crazy, yet, I have caught him more than once picking leaves off trees and threading them on when the fishing was slow and the carp were on the prowl.  I’ve caught half a dozen myself now.  It takes a specific variety of leaf though.  Havn’t told my father-in law that part yet!  TOP THAT!

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -OK, so I’m not a purist!  Can you top this one though. I was fishing with my father-in-law at a friends two acre pond for bass and bluegill.  Now this was the cleanest lake you ever did see due to the huge carp that had been placed in there many years ago.  The pond owner was very proud of his carp, some being as much as 3 feet long, and always made sure he told us that he didn’t have to warn us not to catch his carp because they were way to smart to be caught.  Many had tried yet all had failed. C’mon, enough with the carp as I stand here with my flyrod in hand.  I didn’t care anything at all about catching his carp!  Well…  as I stood on the bank stripping line and watching the carp cruise near the surface slurping in leaves that had hopelessly fallen into the pond I got an idea. I quickly brought in my fly and reached up and grabbed a leaf off the nearest tree and broke it in half and threaded my fly on to it.  Picking the largest carp, about three feet long, I cast the leaf about six feet in front of it and well… you can guess the rest.  Wow!  Was that fun.  My father-in law said I was crazy, yet, I have caught him more than once picking leaves off trees and threading them on when the fishing was slow and the carp were on the prowl.  I’ve caught half a dozen myself now.  It takes a specific variety of leaf though.  Havn’t told my father-in law that part yet!  TOP THAT!

I believe I can… December 15th on the Kilchis River on the northern coast of Oregon. It’s 33 degrees and raining, a typical Oregon winters day.  A friend of mine and a couple of his brothers were fishing for Chinook.  Rick, being a guy that always likes a challenge, was using 12lb test.  Rick hooked a very large hen on a red corkie.  The fight was on.  Rick fought the fish for about 25 minutes when his line broke at the rod tip.  Thinking fast, Rick grabbed a rod from his brother and preceded to cast at the line trailing the fish that stayed in the pool.  He finally "snagged" the line and tied it to the "new" line.  Rick fought this fish for another 20 minutes.  Finally, in a last ditch effort on the fishes part, the fish barreled down river about 30 yards only to beach itself on a gravel bar midstream.  Now I wouldn’t have beleived this part if I wasn’t there to see it, but Rick jumped into the water fully clothed, swam to the gravel bar and dove onto the fish just as it was about to slip back into the water.  The fish weighed out at 56lbs!  I think THAT TOPS IT! Bob Crossley

Response:

 I’ve caught half a dozen myself now.  It takes a specific variety of leaf though.  Havn’t told my father-in law that part yet!  TOP THAT!

BAIT SLINGER!!!! hehe luv chipper

Response:

snipped to fit: and the carp were on the prowl.  I’ve caught half a dozen myself now.  It takes a specific variety of leaf though.  Havn’t told my father-in law that part yet!  TOP THAT!

_______CARP love willow leaves.  Especially the ones with headaches. Mr. G. (In the Top Hat)

Response:

: snipped to fit: : and the carp were on the prowl.  I’ve caught half a dozen myself now.  It : takes a specific variety of leaf though.  Havn’t told my father-in law : that : part yet!  TOP THAT! : : Just last night at a local Flyfishing club meeting, I heard the same thing from Jim Davidson who worte an article on flyfishing for carp in one of the magazines last year, He did the same thing with leaves of a different variety in our Olentangy River. When you do this, make sure put it right under the carp’s nose or he won’t take it. So somebody else has figured out the same trick!  ;-} — Jon Porter

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – snipped to fit: and the carp were on the prowl.  I’ve caught half a dozen myself now.  It takes a specific variety of leaf though.  Havn’t told my father-in law that part yet!  TOP THAT! _______CARP love willow leaves.  Especially the ones with headaches. Mr. G. (In the Top Hat)

Hmmm… Seems like a Hamills Killer fished as a dry would make a pretty good leaf imitation. Bruce….

Response:

I can’t really top that, though I would add that I have caught several 7-8 lb carp on huckleberries when that’s what they were eating – kind of "match the hatch." This was on a heavy bass spinning outfit. I like your idea and will try this summer with flyrod.

Response:

Question:

I am starting to stealhead fish this winter and need to know what the best fly would be.  I fish in the B.C. area.

Hi Guy, I don’t know if there is a best fly or not rather they may very well be favorite fly. For me my favorite steelhead fly is the green butt skunk. — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (97 materials catalog) http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

Response:

I am starting to stealhead fish this winter and need to know what the best fly would be.  I fish in the B.C. area.

Response:

I am starting to stealhead fish this winter and need to know what the best fly would be.  I fish in the B.C. area.

 The Popsicle’s  are  great fly patterns . This may sound weird but I like to throw a Purple Muddler (wt). I have not fished B.C. , but I would not be surprised if most patterns that work here in Cal./Oregan/Washington would produce in BC . I’m affraid that FF’ing for SH in my neck of the woods is kaput. We are  in a major flood stage and will be blown out for weeks, months. Oh well… back to the bench….   Harry

Response:

The best fly is the one that the fish are taking at that particular day, time, and body of water.  Fishing conditions can change instantly during winter fishing season on the West Coast.  You will need a variety of patterns from bright and flashy to dark and subdued.  Steelhead fishing is a challenging prospect.   Good Luck Jeff

Response:

I am starting to stealhead fish this winter and need to know what the best fly would be.  I fish in the B.C. area.

Trey Combs, in his book "Steelhead Fishing and Flies" gives3 lists of flies for BC streams. Karl Mausser’s list (for the Kispiox, Babine, Bulkley and Morice Rivers, all Skeena tributaries) is:         1. Kispiox Special         2. Sack Fly (a Burlap with an orange hackle tail)         3. Black Beauty         4. Skykomish Sunrise         5. McLeod Ugly Bucktail         6. Royal Coachman A Morice and Bulkley guide lists these as favorites:         1. Van Luven         2. Wooly Worm         3. Burlap         4. Stillaguamish Sunrise         5. Orange Optic         7. Skykomish Sunrise A Northwest fly seller gives this list as their top ten over a 37 year period:         1. Skunk         2. Royal Coachman Bucktail         3. Umpqua Special         4. Kalama Special         5. Skykomish Sunrise         6. Fall Favorite         7. Golden Demon         8. Spruce         9. Thor         10. Silver Hilton A couple of other good performing flies are Purple Peril and Green Butted Skunk. Tight Lines, -Burton

Response:

The best fly of course is the one that is in the river on the end of your line. For a start, check out either of Trey Combs books ( eg. Steelhead Flyfishing and Flys) from your local library. My favorite fly is a Brad’s Brat (bright fly) or a Purple Peril (dark). Bart Phillips

Response:

Question:

Well now how do end the evening with a late strat fishing? Well by catch some real nice trout on dry flies. One redside was about 16/17 inches long on a large stonefly nymph. The rest were taken on the surface with a #14 & 16 Parachute Adams. I landed several redsides and cutthroat trout averaging about 10 inches to 14 inches. The fishing time was about 3:30 PM till dark. The place was from Ballenger put-in to Harvast Lane on the lower McKenzie River. I do believe that there are no hatchery fish in this section–so far. So all my trout were natives. The insects were hatching quite steadly all evening– oh! what a sunset last night. I saw several McKenzie caddis’s fluttering by, many BW Olives #14-18 (this is as close to bug ID as I’ll get.) Ther was also a nice spinner activity Western Red Quill #14-16, plus some PE duns #14-18 Lt Cahill will do just fine. Even though I am a giude on this river…this was a quiet trip for self. Fishing was really good. I mean Iwent to have a good time, and found just what I needed…fish and peace & solitude. I would recommend you fish the McKenzie this Spring… Ralph Glazier                          South Fork Fly Fishing, Inc                                        Alsea, OR.                                        1 541 487-7310        

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well now how do end the evening with a late strat fishing? Well by catch some real nice trout on dry flies. One redside was about 16/17 inches long on a large stonefly nymph. The rest were taken on the surface with a #14 & 16 Parachute Adams. I landed several redsides and cutthroat trout averaging about 10 inches to 14 inches. The fishing time was about 3:30 PM till dark. The place was from Ballenger put-in to Harvast Lane on the lower McKenzie River. I do believe that there are no hatchery fish in this section–so far. So all my trout were natives. The insects were hatching quite steadly all evening– oh! what a sunset last night. I saw several McKenzie caddis’s fluttering by, many BW Olives #14-18 (this is as close to bug ID as I’ll get.) Ther was also a nice spinner activity Western Red Quill #14-16, plus some PE duns #14-18 Lt Cahill will do just fine. Even though I am a giude on this river…this was a quiet trip for self. Fishing was really good. I mean Iwent to have a good time, and found just what I needed…fish and peace & solitude. I would recommend you fish the McKenzie this Spring… Ralph Glazier                          South Fork Fly Fishing, Inc                                       Alsea, OR.                                       1 541 487-7310        

Well, I certainly miss fishing in that area, and your message didn’t help any! Really, I enjoyed reading it.   I grew up in Eugene and lived there until I was about 28; used to do a lot of fishing around there.  Is the upper Alsea ( south fork, I think ) still good for little trout? I used tave fun fishing with a dropper there.  I frequently caught 2 fish at a time. Tight Lines, Jared Still, Oracle DBA RxNet, Division of Value Health "All opinions are mine, not my employers"

Response: